--- Log opened Sat Sep 01 00:00:57 2018
2018-09-01T00:06:27 < Cracki> ethnoskate on water or what
2018-09-01T00:09:13 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-9febe155.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-01T00:14:49 < kakimir> ?
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2018-09-01T00:49:57 < catphish> finished my first reflow! https://imgur.com/a/lIE1f8y
2018-09-01T00:51:36 < Steffanx> cool cool, hot or or ..?
2018-09-01T00:52:23 < kakimir> GJ catphish 
2018-09-01T00:53:59 < catphish> thanks
2018-09-01T00:54:06 < catphish> its hard to take a photo of pins :(
2018-09-01T00:54:58 < catphish> as far as i can see, the ony bridge is between 3 pins that are shorted together anyway, maybe not coincidence, i don't know
2018-09-01T00:56:44 < Thorn> what is that big black thing near the button?
2018-09-01T00:56:52 < Steffanx> buzzer
2018-09-01T00:56:55 < catphish> buzzer
2018-09-01T00:56:57 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-01T00:58:14 < catphish> damn, found one short :(
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2018-09-01T00:58:57 < Laurenceb__> celebrate muh heritage
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2018-09-01T01:05:37 < catphish> reheated floated the IC around a bit, seems to have fixed it
2018-09-01T01:07:47 < Laurenceb__> I usually solve that problem by reheating pins with an iron
2018-09-01T01:08:08 < Laurenceb__> its much easier to reheat a dry joint after reflow that solder from scratch with an iron
2018-09-01T01:09:21 < catphish> i just reheated the whole board, pushed the component out of place, let it flow back into place, probably the best aproach with the tools i have to hand
2018-09-01T01:09:32 < catphish> hopefully i've not damaged anything else
2018-09-01T01:09:36 < catphish> time to turn it on i guess
2018-09-01T01:11:13 < Cracki> butts ahead https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1861/44346138471_6da9ceb7b5_b.jpg
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2018-09-01T01:31:18 < catphish> can i use a nucleo board as a usb uart?
2018-09-01T01:32:00 < Ultrasauce> you can drive a ferrari to the corner store
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2018-09-01T01:33:33 < karlp> catphish: yes, but in my experience it's not super reliable.
2018-09-01T01:34:17 < catphish> i couldnt see a jumper to decouple it from the on board stm32
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2018-09-01T01:34:25 < catphish> i'll check the manual
2018-09-01T01:35:14 < catphish> i think it's solder bridged, so won't work well
2018-09-01T01:36:59 < Laurenceb__> wtf
2018-09-01T01:37:13 < Laurenceb__> murican apprentice guy has bought a house
2018-09-01T01:37:32 < catphish> woo! nucleo programmer can talk to my device!
2018-09-01T01:37:42 < Laurenceb__> foreigners out
2018-09-01T01:37:48 < catphish> so some of my board works
2018-09-01T01:39:36 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/m0na87kv5/
2018-09-01T01:42:28 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/qmjegpbkx/
2018-09-01T01:45:57 < catphish> EHIC card made a good solder squeegee, not much use for anything else now :)
2018-09-01T01:48:03 < Cracki> "now"?
2018-09-01T01:48:07 < Cracki> something happened?
2018-09-01T01:48:31 < Cracki> (not sure what that part of my health insurance card was supposed to do anyway...)
2018-09-01T01:49:05 < tomeaton17> think it was a brexit joke
2018-09-01T01:49:09 < Cracki> looks a bit like routing codes for bank transfer, only for paying medical stuff
2018-09-01T01:49:13 < Cracki> oh well
2018-09-01T01:49:32 < Cracki> there are no borders, just come in and say you "fled a regime"
2018-09-01T01:49:46 < Cracki> you'll get pampered right away
2018-09-01T01:50:17 < catphish> it was a brexit joke
2018-09-01T01:50:26 < Cracki> I watched "star trek beyond" again... scotty says his grandma talked about "bundle of sticks" being stronger... that's literally fascism
2018-09-01T01:50:29 < catphish> in reality, i think those cards were superseded years ago
2018-09-01T01:50:55 < catphish> i'm way happy with this PCB
2018-09-01T01:50:56 < Cracki> in short, star trek means fascism
2018-09-01T01:51:01 < catphish> just hope the other parts of it work
2018-09-01T01:51:03 < Cracki> pics of gtfo
2018-09-01T01:51:48 < Thorn> are there any popular PLCs that use CAN instead of rs-485?
2018-09-01T01:52:07 < Cracki> uh
2018-09-01T01:52:16 < catphish> bettr pic from me :) https://i.imgur.com/Y9DFKbS.jpg
2018-09-01T01:52:22 < Cracki> isn't 485 the physical layer and CAN the medium access?
2018-09-01T01:52:39 < Thorn> no, CAN requires a wired-OR bus
2018-09-01T01:52:58 < Thorn> it can't work over rs-485
2018-09-01T01:53:23 < Cracki> hm
2018-09-01T01:53:51 < Cracki> anyway, I'm sure you can plug something into your fav PLC and have it speak canbus
2018-09-01T01:54:31 < Cracki> ah! 485 has an idle state and distinct mark and space
2018-09-01T01:54:41 < Cracki> canbus only has space=idle and mark
2018-09-01T01:56:20 < Cracki> at least if this waveform example on wikipedia is anything to go by
2018-09-01T01:57:25 < Thorn> in rs-485 if one node transmits 0 and another transmits 1 you get a short circuit and an indeterminate state, in CAN you get 0
2018-09-01T01:57:35 < Thorn> like spi vs. i2c
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2018-09-01T01:58:31 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-01T01:58:46 < Cracki> I haven't quite found how/when/why 485 does _not_ drive either line
2018-09-01T01:59:24 < Cracki> the wikipedia graphic is the only one I can find which shows a kind of "idle" state
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2018-09-01T02:00:22 < Thorn> rs-485 drivers have a "driver enable" pin which enables the transmitter a node asserts it while transmitting a frame
2018-09-01T02:01:01 < Cracki> so wikipedia lies again
2018-09-01T02:01:27 < Cracki> or they meant to imply a bias network, which isn't standardized for 485
2018-09-01T02:02:42 < Thorn> there is normally a bias network to bias the bus to a "1" state but it is not strictly required
2018-09-01T02:05:09 < karlp> (if you dont'ð do line biasing, it's jsut a mtter of time before it doesn't work)
2018-09-01T02:06:13 < karlp> most rs485 transceivers have separate enable lines too, you can turn off listening as well.
2018-09-01T02:27:33 < englishman> karlp: mi a2 arrived
2018-09-01T03:04:01 -!- codyps [~codyps@richard.einic.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-01T03:05:32 < Laurenceb__> muh 
2018-09-01T03:06:17 < Laurenceb__> a few months ago I was involved in the birth of the 30year old boomer meme
2018-09-01T03:06:21 < Laurenceb__> look where we are now
2018-09-01T03:06:33 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-01T03:12:34 < Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEo7-ivl8Ic
2018-09-01T03:12:47 < catphish> yay mcu and LED work, now just to see if the ST95HF works :)
2018-09-01T03:17:09 < catphish> would you like fries with that?
2018-09-01T03:18:09 < Laurenceb__> the memes
2018-09-01T03:19:43 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T03:22:43 < Laurenceb__> Dr of memetics
2018-09-01T03:24:30 < Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzSGvXXtRlw
2018-09-01T03:25:19 < Laurenceb__> kek
2018-09-01T03:25:24 < Laurenceb__> cant wait until 23rd
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2018-09-01T05:50:32 < jadew> old? https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/403/567/041.jpg
2018-09-01T05:52:10 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-01T05:52:28 < Sadale> which mastodon network is he in?
2018-09-01T05:52:43 < Sadale> In toki pona language, nasa means crazy or silly or stupid.
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2018-09-01T06:35:22 < jadew> that sucks
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2018-09-01T07:15:50 < englishman> hoyl fuck
2018-09-01T07:15:53 < englishman> terry davis is dead
2018-09-01T07:16:45 < englishman> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dl98AIpWsAEaIf4.jpg
2018-09-01T07:17:13 < englishman> http://i.4cdn.org/pol/1535763010977.jpg
2018-09-01T07:17:38 < englishman> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17889547
2018-09-01T07:23:37 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/wmEm7eq.png
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2018-09-01T08:07:14 < englishman> catphish: https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front/2017/06/01/new-evidence-that-lead-exposure-increases-crime/
2018-09-01T08:07:19 < englishman> leaded solder turns you into a chav
2018-09-01T08:21:32 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T08:26:26 < englishman> kakimir: https://media.monolithicpower.com/document/MP2639A_r1.0.pdf
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2018-09-01T08:48:48 < ColdKeyboard> Did anyone try using one phone to listen to BLE packets from certain device and then relay data through LTE to second phone that would then re-transmitt that information over BLE? Basically creating a BLE proxy?
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2018-09-01T09:08:40 < englishman> like a wevibe?
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2018-09-01T09:51:27 < MrMobius> haha, aliexpress is throttling my page views
2018-09-01T09:51:35 < MrMobius> seems like something a legit site would do
2018-09-01T09:54:17 < MrMobius> I have to type in captcha codes to go to the next page of <$3 substandard garbage
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2018-09-01T11:40:56 < Steffanx> Damn, got the blaxteritus englishman? So many (crap) links. Even 4chan -_-
2018-09-01T11:49:46 < Steffanx> Lo
2018-09-01T11:52:29 < dongs> is SDR# guy still pissy over licensing shit
2018-09-01T11:55:49 < Jak_o_Shadows> Time to do that thing y'all told me to do literally months ago
2018-09-01T12:02:42 < Jak_o_Shadows> As I recall it was: Read your buttons/etc in a regular tick, store in a buffer, then the usb device should ask the stm32 for stuff, then you send it. Rather than having sending each loop of your main loop
2018-09-01T12:11:56 < Jak_o_Shadows> Hmm. The SOF callback?
2018-09-01T12:13:45 < Jak_o_Shadows> nah
2018-09-01T12:14:34 < catphish> englishman: oh dear :(
2018-09-01T12:17:04 < Jak_o_Shadows> Literally just turn on an interrupt
2018-09-01T12:17:08 < Jak_o_Shadows> goddam I feel dumb
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2018-09-01T13:05:14 < karlp> #define configMAX_TASK_NAME_LEN 3
2018-09-01T13:05:17 < karlp> who the fuck would do that?
2018-09-01T13:05:21 < karlp> _why_
2018-09-01T13:05:33 < karlp> fuck stack corruption bullshit
2018-09-01T13:05:55 < Jak_o_Shadows> 3. 3 is a stupid nummber
2018-09-01T13:08:10 < qyx> haha
2018-09-01T13:08:58 < karlp> also, fuck freertos for nto using it's own configAssert crap to actually enforce that.
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2018-09-01T13:23:30 < dongs> FeeRTOS
2018-09-01T13:43:09 < jadew> sad to hear about Terry
2018-09-01T13:48:21 < jadew> he died
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2018-09-01T13:58:32 < Steffanx> i nominate stvn/crt/cpctr
2018-09-01T13:58:52 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-01T13:59:09 < Steffanx> i like your positive vibe today
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2018-09-01T14:10:57 < Steffanx> riglol
2018-09-01T14:11:11 < jadew> depends on the $$$
2018-09-01T14:11:26 < jadew> chinabox
2018-09-01T14:12:04 < Steffanx> siglent sdm uses stm32 :P
2018-09-01T14:13:02 < Steffanx>  \o/
2018-09-01T14:13:29 < Steffanx> will you get us more stm32 in crt made products?
2018-09-01T14:15:29 < Steffanx> aha
2018-09-01T14:16:09 < jadew> people here were happy with their keisght knock-offs
2018-09-01T14:16:11 < jadew> aka Siglent
2018-09-01T14:17:07 < jadew> https://www.siglent.eu/digital-multimeter.html
2018-09-01T14:17:19 < jadew> looks like they now have a 6.5 digit one
2018-09-01T14:18:05 < jadew> has more counts than my 33410A
2018-09-01T14:18:12 < jadew> 2.2M vs 1.1M
2018-09-01T14:21:47 < jadew> their claimed specs are better than the 34410A too
2018-09-01T14:22:10 < jadew> I guess it's worth considering
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2018-09-01T14:35:10 < Steffanx> claimed specs :P
2018-09-01T14:36:27 < jadew> yeah, it's siglent, they don't inspire confidence, but it's probably good enough
2018-09-01T14:37:48 < jadew> my PCBs got open at the customs
2018-09-01T14:38:16 < jadew> aside from my usual green ones, I ordered a black and a white batch, to see how it looks
2018-09-01T14:38:47 < jadew> and they're both cut (at least the top board got inspected)
2018-09-01T14:41:40 < jadew> wonder if they were curious or suspicious
2018-09-01T14:42:20 < Steffanx> or none of that and just randomly opened it
2018-09-01T14:42:47 < jadew> only the black and white ones?
2018-09-01T14:43:04 < jadew> (they were inside bubble wrap)
2018-09-01T14:43:04 < BrainDamage> how would they have known it was b&w
2018-09-01T14:43:10 < jadew> it's visible
2018-09-01T14:46:57 < jadew> http://86.121.139.51/stuff/20180901_144335.jpg
2018-09-01T14:47:29 < jadew> they didn't touch the green ones (had two more batches) in that box
2018-09-01T14:48:18 < mawk> why would a 0.47F cap be on a thermostat controller PCB ? 
2018-09-01T14:48:29 < jadew> crt, various tests
2018-09-01T14:48:54 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-01T14:48:55 < mawk> yeah but it's lame compared to a battery
2018-09-01T14:49:07 < mawk> it was disconnected this night and lost its date
2018-09-01T14:49:45 < mawk> pump what ?
2018-09-01T14:49:55 < Steffanx> mawk, we did that in a product at work as well, it easily survived a weekend unpowered
2018-09-01T14:50:06 < mawk> ah
2018-09-01T14:50:24 < mawk> why is it better than a battery if it's for backup ? just because you can recharge it ?
2018-09-01T14:50:26 < Steffanx> Which was like more than required anyway, requirement was just a few hours
2018-09-01T14:50:34 < mawk> I see
2018-09-01T14:50:45 < jadew> longer life maybe?
2018-09-01T14:50:56 < Steffanx> im not sure what's cheaper
2018-09-01T14:51:10 < Steffanx> and power outages are rather uncommon in the dutchland anyway
2018-09-01T14:51:29 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-01T14:52:02 < mawk> I'm still there, I don't wanna leave
2018-09-01T14:53:36 < Steffanx> on holiday mawk ?
2018-09-01T14:53:43 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-01T14:53:50 < mawk> but I'm looking for a job there also
2018-09-01T14:54:12 < Steffanx> South dutchland?
2018-09-01T14:54:26 < mawk> yes
2018-09-01T14:54:37 < mawk> my family is from north, near Drachten
2018-09-01T14:54:49 < mawk> they speak fries and all
2018-09-01T14:55:24 < Steffanx> Oh noes
2018-09-01T14:56:50 < Jak_o_Shadows> Wait, TempleOS Terry died?
2018-09-01T14:57:03 < Jak_o_Shadows> Also, my siglent scope is good enough for my needs.
2018-09-01T14:57:40 < Steffanx> Nah, ita not impossible since its been quiet for a while now
2018-09-01T14:57:43 < Steffanx> Hes*
2018-09-01T14:58:05 < Jak_o_Shadows> Fair
2018-09-01T14:58:11 < Jak_o_Shadows> Sad if he has.
2018-09-01T14:59:30 < Steffanx> I feel indifferent about it. :p
2018-09-01T15:05:20 < Steffanx> Will crt die next?
2018-09-01T15:05:26 < Steffanx> And be revived as tft
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2018-09-01T15:14:36 < Laurenceb__> RIP Terry
2018-09-01T15:14:57 < Laurenceb__> we will remember him with the TempleOS
2018-09-01T15:15:57 < dongs> waht happen
2018-09-01T15:16:26 < Laurenceb__> maybe we got trolled...
2018-09-01T15:16:53 < dongs> https://twitter.com/cthulhu20234/status/1035682925956788224?s=21
2018-09-01T15:16:58 < dongs> source: 4chan and twatter
2018-09-01T15:16:59 < dongs> y a, no
2018-09-01T15:19:48 < Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j085nO3kAI
2018-09-01T15:21:23 < dongs> self-portrait?
2018-09-01T15:36:45 < Laurenceb__> story of my lief
2018-09-01T15:51:12 < dongs> y, sold
2018-09-01T16:01:01 < Jak_o_Shadows> How the flip did I bugger up the ADC
2018-09-01T16:06:43 < Jak_o_Shadows> a) Trying to use it before initialising it. b) disconnected the analog thingys from the board
2018-09-01T16:47:13 < Thorn> are there pcb mount audio sockets with 4 contacts (trrs)?
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2018-09-01T17:02:04 < Thorn> yeah something like that
2018-09-01T17:28:06 < karlp> Thorn: digikey, https://www.digikey.com/products/en/connectors-interconnects/barrel-audio-connectors/434
2018-09-01T17:28:13 < karlp> you can get 4, 5, even 6 conductors
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2018-09-01T17:48:39 < Thorn> ok thx
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2018-09-01T18:49:40 < bitmask> boo
2018-09-01T18:49:46 < bitmask> had to give up on my pcb fab for now
2018-09-01T18:50:05 < bitmask> decided to just put the 7segment clock together with perfboard or whatever its called
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2018-09-01T18:51:56 < Steffanx> had to bitmask ?
2018-09-01T18:54:27 < bitmask> just having difficulty with the firmware, I wanna spend some time on it and didn't want to wait since I had the rest of the clock ready to go.  I'll work on it and get it ready for the anti-gravitator :)
2018-09-01T18:59:26 < Steffanx> so you chose to :P
2018-09-01T19:00:27 < bitmask> of course
2018-09-01T19:00:41 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/HkQwnPX
2018-09-01T19:00:55 < Steffanx> "had to" sounded a bit more dramatic
2018-09-01T19:01:45 < Sadale> bitmask, good job!
2018-09-01T19:01:58 < bitmask> thanks
2018-09-01T19:02:30 < Steffanx> the day before yesterday i figured out why i couldn't print with PETG well
2018-09-01T19:02:36 < bitmask> I didnt use his pcb so I just used some perfboard and my wiring could have been better, its a tight fit and the bows out a bit, gonna have to make it fit better
2018-09-01T19:02:45 < bitmask> I thought you always printed with petg well?
2018-09-01T19:02:48 < bitmask> you said thats all you use
2018-09-01T19:03:01 < Steffanx> no, most pla
2018-09-01T19:03:11 < Steffanx> and sometimes PETG
2018-09-01T19:03:19 < Steffanx> but i never got it to print as well as PLA
2018-09-01T19:03:20 < bitmask> yo ulied
2018-09-01T19:03:22 < bitmask> you lied
2018-09-01T19:03:29 < Steffanx> proof it
2018-09-01T19:03:53 < Steffanx> turned out to be the the PETG itself. Its just crap. Bought some other brand and its a good as the PLA.
2018-09-01T19:04:51 < Steffanx> same speeds etc. couldnt do that with the "old" PETG.
2018-09-01T19:07:37 < Steffanx> stop party pooping bitmask. You'll turn into a real ##stm32er
2018-09-01T19:08:04 < bitmask> :)
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2018-09-01T19:53:14 < Steffanx> wut, was baird here :p
2018-09-01T19:53:16 < Steffanx> :o
2018-09-01T19:55:24 < bitmask> baird?
2018-09-01T19:55:38 < bitmask> oh
2018-09-01T19:55:38 < bitmask> I see the leave
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2018-09-01T19:57:25 < bitmask> mmm this butterscotch peanut butter is good, not as good as cookie butter but close
2018-09-01T19:57:38 < Steffanx> yes, im not sure if you were around during the cjbaird times
2018-09-01T19:57:57 < bitmask> the name is familiar but thats about it
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2018-09-01T21:00:28 < Cracki> TIL: Bridget McCain
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2018-09-01T21:08:57 < Cracki> someone told me about this theme park where you have a rollercoaster that would hit a wall and pitch its cargo
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2018-09-01T21:14:46 < Steffanx> Sounds like this "someone" has been playing Rollercoaster tycoon too mcuh
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2018-09-01T21:16:34 < Cracki> nope, it's actually some weird kind of fanfiction. it's at least 70 years old
2018-09-01T21:18:47 < Cracki> same universe, someone was hiding in a wolf den, and in order to survive, was forced to eat wolf puke
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2018-09-01T21:57:09 < englishman> time for some stm32 lorawan, mqtt and protobuf innovations
2018-09-01T21:57:19 < englishman> all the tech ##stm32 has to offer
2018-09-01T21:58:35 < Laurenceb__> the absolute state
2018-09-01T21:59:33 < karlp> gotta be better than freertos
2018-09-01T21:59:43 < Steffanx> lol whats so wrong with freertos?
2018-09-01T21:59:53 < karlp> https://sourceforge.net/p/freertos/code/2567/
2018-09-01T22:00:01 < zyp> karlp is having a bad freertos day
2018-09-01T22:00:35 < karlp> been a bad week for software :)
2018-09-01T22:00:44 < karlp> last week was pretty good.
2018-09-01T22:01:23 < Steffanx> So they fixed something that broke... uh?
2018-09-01T22:01:33 < karlp> between astersik, freeswitch, and the abyssmal state of voip software, freertos has ben almost nice.
2018-09-01T22:01:36 < karlp> Steffanx: well, they broke it.
2018-09-01T22:01:45 < karlp> that patch hasn't exactly been released yet.
2018-09-01T22:01:50 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/9185j9cw1/
2018-09-01T22:02:03 < Laurenceb__> [F]
2018-09-01T22:02:27 < karlp> and somethign else is broken ever after manually applying it. some pointer format has changed, oocd tries to deref somewhere not in ram and fails 
2018-09-01T22:02:29  * karlp shrugs
2018-09-01T22:02:30 < Steffanx> You're only allowed to post shit again when it's been offcially confirmed Laurenceb__
2018-09-01T22:02:31 < englishman> is asterisk still relevant in 2018? serious question
2018-09-01T22:03:10 < Laurenceb__> tfw dont even know what asterix is
2018-09-01T22:03:15 < karlp> englishman: not sure what else to use, it's the one that's still being heavily worked on, and you can get hosted services
2018-09-01T22:03:27 < englishman> ah hosted ones are probably ok
2018-09-01T22:03:42 < Steffanx> Laurenceb__: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterisk_(PBX)
2018-09-01T22:03:45 < karlp> I'm led to believe the pay hosted services like 3cx are also cheap enough now too,
2018-09-01T22:03:49 < zyp> last I checked, people seemed to use either asterisk or freeswitch
2018-09-01T22:03:56 < englishman> cool that the project is still going and popular
2018-09-01T22:04:19 < karlp> it all works fine if I want to use udp on a lan.
2018-09-01T22:04:31 < karlp> it's completely busted if I want to use tls and certs though.
2018-09-01T22:04:57 < BrainDamage> what do you use asterix for? internal phone network?
2018-09-01T22:05:02 < karlp> decided to shelve that frustration and maybe try again with a preinstalled VM 
2018-09-01T22:05:12 < karlp> BrainDamage: nothing. can't get it (or freeswitch) to work :)
2018-09-01T22:05:25 < zyp> karlp, I looked at some premade docker images
2018-09-01T22:05:27 < BrainDamage> what would you use it for, then
2018-09-01T22:05:34 < zyp> before I realized I don't need a sip server
2018-09-01T22:05:44 < karlp> BrainDamage: http://false.ekta.is/2018/08/nitsuka-dx2e-office-phone-teardown/ has the general idea.
2018-09-01T22:06:23 < karlp> turns out the easiest way of doing it is probably to just stick a cheap android phone inside it....
2018-09-01T22:06:58 < zyp> karlp, what's the goal? why not just pick up a cheap sip phone?
2018-09-01T22:07:56 < Laurenceb__> wew murican are here
2018-09-01T22:08:02 < Laurenceb__> why some many murican in uk
2018-09-01T22:08:10 < Laurenceb__> like Canada 2.0 right now
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2018-09-01T22:09:16 < Laurenceb__> tfw moar muricans than muslims
2018-09-01T22:09:22 < Laurenceb__> inb4 murican rape gangs
2018-09-01T22:10:46 < Laurenceb__> aha they work for Star Citizen, I knew it
2018-09-01T22:12:18 < englishman> I love this grandstream
2018-09-01T22:12:45 < karlp> zyp: yeah, but that's buying new for it.
2018-09-01T22:12:58 < karlp> only idea was to use these I had lying around and maybe learn somethign in the process.
2018-09-01T22:13:04 < karlp> I mean, cmon, the hwole thing is dumb.
2018-09-01T22:13:09 < karlp> it's turning a phone into a phone 
2018-09-01T22:13:33 < karlp> englishman: so what do you have it talking to?
2018-09-01T22:14:11 < englishman> VoIP.ms
2018-09-01T22:14:43 < englishman> all my biz and personal stuff is with then
2018-09-01T22:14:45 < englishman> them
2018-09-01T22:17:24 < karlp> that's just general cheap desk to north america calling?
2018-09-01T22:17:38 < karlp> classic small office pbx replacement?
2018-09-01T22:18:08 -!- BoyHolthausen[m] [boyholthau@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-vvhshddhlbwqolcc] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-01T22:18:09 < Laurenceb__> lol the muricans are praying over their food
2018-09-01T22:19:14 < karlp> I'd probably actually get about as much mileage just using twilio/nexmo, but I was hoping to avoid paying for a monthly local phone number 
2018-09-01T22:19:50 < zyp> karlp, I'm sure you can pick up used sip phones on ebay too
2018-09-01T22:23:55 < englishman> that's where I got my ciscos
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2018-09-01T22:24:19 < englishman> it has a bunch of PBX features yeah
2018-09-01T22:25:39 -!- BoyHolthausen[m] [boyholthau@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-dokmvjlvpwcyswiz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-01T22:29:13 < emeb> https://imagebin.ca/v/4EEZqjMVvUor
2018-09-01T22:32:08 -!- BoyHolthausen[m] [boyholthau@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-udzodvrszejbvxsn] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T22:32:13 < Laurenceb__> I found some autism https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJP6WkD8bGg
2018-09-01T22:32:52 < Laurenceb__> emeb: tfw muh dad is from Florida
2018-09-01T22:35:05 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/3w6y1pzz5/
2018-09-01T22:40:11 -!- Rickta59 [~kimballr@unaffiliated/rickta59] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T22:42:44 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/3xlh8o1ep/
2018-09-01T22:47:11 < emeb> wat? Laurenceb__ is 1/2 'murican?
2018-09-01T22:47:55 < Laurenceb__> >being this new
2018-09-01T22:48:26 < Laurenceb__> why do you think I like the amurimutt memes
2018-09-01T22:53:14 < emeb> TIL
2018-09-01T22:53:35  * emeb is also "amerimutt" - US + DE
2018-09-01T22:53:45 < Laurenceb__> muh heritage
2018-09-01T22:54:04 < Cracki> know some german?
2018-09-01T22:54:25 < emeb> mother came here for college
2018-09-01T22:54:29 < Cracki> value your ancestors' languages
2018-09-01T22:54:39 < emeb> ja
2018-09-01T22:54:49 < Cracki> jawohl heißt das!
2018-09-01T22:55:16 < emeb> :)
2018-09-01T22:55:37 < emeb> my 'murican kbd has no ß
2018-09-01T22:55:46 < Cracki> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickelhaube
2018-09-01T22:55:57 < Cracki> in those times, they didn't either
2018-09-01T22:56:17 < Laurenceb__> tfw SY + DK + IT
2018-09-01T22:56:27 < Cracki> SY is syrian?
2018-09-01T22:56:28 < Laurenceb__> the amurimutt
2018-09-01T22:56:30 < Laurenceb__> yes
2018-09-01T22:56:33 < Cracki> how the fuck did that happen
2018-09-01T22:56:42 < Cracki> sounds like enrichment
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2018-09-01T22:57:00 < Laurenceb__> tfw u are a rapefugee
2018-09-01T22:57:41 < Cracki> son of a...
2018-09-01T22:58:04 -!- gnom [~aleksande@178.150.7.153] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T22:58:18 < Laurenceb__> kek
2018-09-01T22:58:24 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-01T22:58:50 < Cracki> mutts of european heritage turn out ok. mutts of european + other races often have no sense of belonging. they grow up to be mass shooters.
2018-09-01T22:58:56 < Laurenceb__> Coptic Christian so its all cool
2018-09-01T22:59:02 < Cracki> yeah right
2018-09-01T22:59:20 < Cracki> they call their sky daddy by a different name
2018-09-01T22:59:40 < kakimir> ##stm32-nightshift
2018-09-01T22:59:43 < Cracki> and get persecuted by the camel piss conoisseurs
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2018-09-01T23:01:33 < Laurenceb__> kakimir has been on 8chan
2018-09-01T23:01:36 < Laurenceb__> I can tell
2018-09-01T23:02:03 < kakimir> hello
2018-09-01T23:02:55 < Cracki> anyone got stats on the sleep patterns of certain people?
2018-09-01T23:03:34 < kakimir> based or ircs?
2018-09-01T23:04:05 < Cracki> whoever needs to be asleep for some relaxing banter around here
2018-09-01T23:04:32 < kakimir> aah
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2018-09-01T23:08:39 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/4qy31rkfl/
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2018-09-01T23:10:03 < Cracki> I wonder what the inevitable war will look like... will it be a paneuropean civil war, or will it be cucked+occupied nations attacking woke nations
2018-09-01T23:10:04 < karlp> zyp: yeah, buying a phone's really not the point either :)
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2018-09-01T23:27:22 < Laurenceb__> tfw ur Shaking up newborn ambulance transportation for a brighter future 
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2018-09-01T23:30:07 < Laurenceb__> nuking urself also leads to a brighter future
2018-09-01T23:30:55 < tpw_rules> move fast and break things
2018-09-01T23:31:13 < Cracki> the fastest growing population in the UK is...
2018-09-01T23:37:19 < tpw_rules> maccas
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2018-09-01T23:48:26 < Cracki> aussie term
2018-09-01T23:49:08 < Thorn> why is standard 4 layer board made with 1 core and 2 prepregs and not 2 cores and 1 prepreg?
2018-09-01T23:49:24 < Cracki> uh wat
2018-09-01T23:49:36 < Cracki> you have 4 coppers, three thingies between
2018-09-01T23:49:43 < Cracki> so you want a 1+3 board?
2018-09-01T23:49:55 < Cracki> you can have that, but seems to be uncommon
2018-09-01T23:50:49 < Cracki> not sure if two "cores" is "common" enough that manufacturers can handle the thickness
2018-09-01T23:51:11 < Thorn> https://aerospacepal.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Bitweenie-4-Layer-PCB-Stackup.png
2018-09-01T23:51:23 < Cracki> or do you mean copper, core, copper, foil, copper, core, copper?
2018-09-01T23:52:40 < Thorn> in the picture there is a double laminated core in the middle, and prepreg + a layer of copper on each side
2018-09-01T23:52:58 < Thorn> why couldn't you take 2 double laminated cores and join them with a prepreg
2018-09-01T23:53:14 < Cracki> maybe you could
2018-09-01T23:53:34 < Thorn> that way you could etch all layers at once
2018-09-01T23:53:37 < Cracki> it "just" has to be piled up and pressed like any board
2018-09-01T23:53:39 < Cracki> wat
2018-09-01T23:54:21 < Cracki> "etch all layers at once" is nonsensical
2018-09-01T23:54:59 < Thorn> you could take 2 cores and put both of them into a tank and then press them with a prepreg
2018-09-01T23:55:07 < Cracki> good luck keeping air bubbles out of that stackup
2018-09-01T23:55:18 < Thorn> to make the structure in the image you have to etch twice
2018-09-01T23:55:34 < Thorn> first the core, then the outer layers
2018-09-01T23:55:39 < Cracki> it's easy enough to glue layers on top of a core, but gluing two cores together, I imagine that's difficult
2018-09-01T23:56:02 < Cracki> afaik they don't etch the whole stackup, they etch the sheets
2018-09-01T23:57:13 < Cracki> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7S40GYESbY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIV0icM_Ujo
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--- Day changed Sun Sep 02 2018
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2018-09-02T00:04:11 < Cracki> I could be mistaken. my info is from their videos and their videos present the steps randomly
2018-09-02T00:15:25 < Thorn> is pre-laminated prepreg a thing?
2018-09-02T00:17:24 < Cracki> 7Q8paZcZ-v8
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2018-09-02T00:25:51 < Laurenceb__> shake the babby
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2018-09-02T01:19:43 < tomeaton17> https://i.redd.it/1yuo3f606oj11.png
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2018-09-02T01:24:37 < Cracki> truth.
2018-09-02T01:27:36 < tpw_rules>  that artwork offends me
2018-09-02T01:28:47 < Cracki> https://i.imgur.com/r247a.jpg
2018-09-02T01:29:19 < tomeaton17> haha
2018-09-02T01:29:30 < Cracki> there's no reason not to discriminate now. they started it.
2018-09-02T01:30:39 < tomeaton17> https://i.redd.it/hva1k2ly5nj11.jpg
2018-09-02T01:33:27 < Cracki> in media, I see LOTS of couples where the man is black and the woman is white, but NONE where the woman is ethnically jewish
2018-09-02T01:42:32 < vampi-the-frog> I see a lot of couples where the man is off topic in ##stm32
2018-09-02T01:43:17 < tpw_rules> bigotry is the only on topic subject here
2018-09-02T01:44:43 < vampi-the-frog> bigotry is gay
2018-09-02T01:45:01 < tomeaton17> +1
2018-09-02T01:47:50 < Cracki> I smell homophobes
2018-09-02T01:48:06 < vampi-the-frog> you smell
2018-09-02T01:48:10 < Cracki> bigot
2018-09-02T01:50:19 < vampi-the-frog> you're a soap-a-phobe
2018-09-02T01:50:29 < vampi-the-frog> get a bath
2018-09-02T01:52:28 < Cracki> Osmophobes hate odors... do you ever use public transport? do you hate the smelly people there? that's racist
2018-09-02T01:52:57 < Cracki> noticing patterns is hard, I know :P
2018-09-02T01:53:26 < vampi-the-frog> shut up you osmo
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2018-09-02T01:54:39 < Cracki> so you deny the pattern
2018-09-02T01:54:55  * vampi-the-frog opens a window to let the stank out
2018-09-02T01:55:17 < vampi-the-frog> defenestrate yourself, you stank
2018-09-02T01:55:24 < vampi-the-frog> woof
2018-09-02T01:55:47 < Cracki> you sound emotional
2018-09-02T01:55:51 < Cracki> are you emotional?
2018-09-02T01:56:31 < vampi-the-frog> emotions are for women
2018-09-02T01:57:01 < Cracki> did you just assume your own gender
2018-09-02T01:57:11 < Laurenceb__> Why did the mansplainer drown in the puddle? It was a well, actually.
2018-09-02T01:57:24 < vampi-the-frog> did you just assume that would be funny?
2018-09-02T01:57:25 < tomeaton17> haha based and redpilled
2018-09-02T01:57:43 < Cracki> mansplaining is a made up hate term
2018-09-02T01:58:20 < vampi-the-frog> finally talking some sense
2018-09-02T02:01:31 < Thorn> btw I got a Rotring pencil https://i.imgur.com/QpCXoKL.jpg
2018-09-02T02:01:54 < vampi-the-frog> nice Thorn 
2018-09-02T02:02:07 < vampi-the-frog> I have a set of isographs
2018-09-02T02:02:12 < vampi-the-frog> haven't used them in a while though
2018-09-02T02:02:14 < Thorn> not a 2 mm yet, waiting for those
2018-09-02T02:02:56 < Laurenceb__> JORDAN PETERSON
2018-09-02T02:03:11 < vampi-the-frog> he talks too much
2018-09-02T02:03:21 < Cracki> cleanyourroom is normie tier
2018-09-02T02:03:30 < Laurenceb__> he is personally responsible for the horrors of the patriarchy
2018-09-02T02:03:40 < Cracki> crt, what's the competition?
2018-09-02T02:04:13 < Cracki> panel looks a bit bare
2018-09-02T02:05:11 < Cracki> I'm used to the keysight my boss has
2018-09-02T02:05:15 < Cracki> depends on need
2018-09-02T02:05:31 < Cracki> that "popular" riglol starts at around 300 bucks
2018-09-02T02:05:45 < Cracki> my boss must have spent for figures
2018-09-02T02:06:07 < vampi-the-frog> get a DS1054Z fool
2018-09-02T02:06:54 < Thorn> you're going to spend more on probes if you get this scope
2018-09-02T02:07:26 < Cracki> probes for 1 ghz, that is
2018-09-02T02:07:38 < Cracki> perhaps diff probes, if you need them
2018-09-02T02:07:53 < Cracki> buy used, good idea.
2018-09-02T02:08:24 < Cracki> perhaps you can find off-ebay surplus stores. R&D places might get rid of that stuff...
2018-09-02T02:08:34 < Cracki> if the employees don't pull it out of the junk first
2018-09-02T02:09:24 < Cracki> TIL: google mail does OCR on attached pictures...
2018-09-02T02:12:44 < Cracki> what DO you want to do with it that happens at up to 1 ghz?
2018-09-02T02:13:10 < Cracki> chances are you'll need a diff probe
2018-09-02T02:18:12 < Cracki> working on "power" electronics?
2018-09-02T02:18:46 < Cracki> my boss doesn't have a current probe, I think, but he built himself a widget to turn motor coil currents into voltage
2018-09-02T02:19:13 < Cracki> so the scope doesn't know it's current, plots it as raw voltage
2018-09-02T02:19:53 < Cracki> gotta ask him if that widget does more than one channel... would love to look at an XY plot of stepper motor current
2018-09-02T02:20:40 < Cracki> kek that lecroy has windows 9x icons
2018-09-02T02:20:42 < Cracki> cute
2018-09-02T02:23:36 < Cracki> the abundance of "PCs" inside all kinds of devices (medical such as ultrasound too...) makes me think they just hack something up on a development machine, then put a box around it and call it done
2018-09-02T02:25:01 < karlp> not at all uncommon.
2018-09-02T02:25:07 < karlp> volumes are low, why bother doing anything else?
2018-09-02T02:27:33 < Cracki> do they do all the DSP on the cpu, or does that thing only send control commands to a proper board and DSP processor?
2018-09-02T02:27:47 < BrainDamage> the latter
2018-09-02T02:27:52 < Cracki> ah good
2018-09-02T02:28:38 < BrainDamage> it's just that making uis is a pain, and there's no need to reinvent the wheel when gen pourpose pc have all the facilities
2018-09-02T02:29:06 < BrainDamage> plus, *some* dsp can still be done in the cpu, provided it's not realtime
2018-09-02T02:29:35 < BrainDamage> so you end up with fpga / dsp for heavy lifting and the gen pourpose stuff for the 1-off tasks
2018-09-02T02:49:47 < Thorn> is there any standard / popular protocol for streaming audio over ethernet? something I could use if I wanted to make an 'ethernet audio card'
2018-09-02T02:50:38 < Thorn> s/over ethernet/over ip/
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2018-09-02T02:52:01 < Thorn> interesting, thanks
2018-09-02T02:56:59 < Laurenceb__> As a member of the patriarchy, I'm going to make myself some rape methylester, and biodiesel through esterification of rape oil
2018-09-02T03:01:50 < Cracki> I know our largest lecture hall building has an A/V matrix across all rooms... and the audio can be accessed over some ethernet ports using some windows program
2018-09-02T03:02:35 < Cracki> I would hope they use standards, if they exist
2018-09-02T03:06:15 < Laurenceb__> defeat the patriarchy with transesterification
2018-09-02T03:06:24 < Cracki> r u drunk
2018-09-02T03:08:19 < Cracki> crestron was the brand of audio stuff...
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2018-09-02T03:11:37 < Thorn> does stm32h7 or f7 have enough power to decode aac/mp3/even g.711 in real time?
2018-09-02T03:12:36 < karlp> istr people have done low bitrate stuff on avrs, so...
2018-09-02T03:13:03 < karlp> https://www.mikrocontroller.net/topic/391086
2018-09-02T03:13:13 < karlp> 12khz@64kbit
2018-09-02T03:14:06 < karlp> pretty sure it shouldn't be a problem on f7 :)
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2018-09-02T03:15:49 < karlp> heh, I thought I'd see that too, STM32-MP3NL/COD
2018-09-02T03:15:55 < karlp> st provides code for it.
2018-09-02T03:18:05 < Laurenceb__> Thorn: trivially
2018-09-02T03:18:14 < karlp> well, if I get a CD from a abnd, sure, I'm going to store it as flac, not mp3
2018-09-02T03:18:34 < Laurenceb__> I used flac for shake data
2018-09-02T03:18:37 < Laurenceb__> pre muh gui
2018-09-02T03:18:56 < Laurenceb__> worked on F1, but only 1.2ksps
2018-09-02T03:21:57 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/b8qmw4y81/
2018-09-02T03:22:10 < Laurenceb__> muh audiophool kit is audiophool 
2018-09-02T03:22:46 < Laurenceb__> Behring Brevik B-5 microphone ftw
2018-09-02T03:22:56 < Thorn> fascinating book https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/book/10.1002/9781118831373
2018-09-02T03:25:09 < karlp> it probably really is, but why are you reading it?
2018-09-02T03:25:38 < Thorn> I was googling prepreg + copper foil stuff and found it
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2018-09-02T03:29:32 < Thorn> Breivik microphone
2018-09-02T03:30:37 < Laurenceb__>  <0.05dB offset from the calibrated dBA meter O_o
2018-09-02T03:31:06 < Laurenceb__> the CM11B is called "omnidirectional"
2018-09-02T03:31:34 < Laurenceb__> looks like almost exactly 6dB from 90 degrees to straight on
2018-09-02T03:33:37 < Laurenceb__> https://www.amazon.co.uk/Behringer-B-5-Diaphragm-Condenser-Microphone/dp/B0002KZAM6
2018-09-02T03:33:39 < Laurenceb__> ftw
2018-09-02T03:34:53 < Laurenceb__> with my megabux I should do something really daft like make a DAMAS array with these things and MAYA44 usb cards
2018-09-02T03:35:47 < Laurenceb__> heh it would only cost ~10k to make a 64mic system
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2018-09-02T04:11:54 < cjbaird> sup nerds
2018-09-02T04:12:40 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/juyhu7k3l/
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2018-09-02T05:51:50 < bitmask> what kinda tweezers do you guys use
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2018-09-02T05:56:01 < Thorn> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/6PCS-Professional-Coated-Precision-Tweezer-Antistatic-Tweezers-Stainless-Steel-Tweezers-Non-Magnetic-wholesale-Dec-22/32783368479.html
2018-09-02T05:56:25 < bitmask> oh you dont need ceramic?
2018-09-02T05:56:35 < bitmask> I dont know why I assumed thats what people used
2018-09-02T05:56:53 < Thorn> ceramic is unsuitable for smd work
2018-09-02T05:57:06 < bitmask> thanks for saving me money
2018-09-02T05:58:34 < bitmask> ok, I'll just get a cheap assortment like that link thanks
2018-09-02T06:04:33 < bitmask> what about the reverse ones, do those ever come in handy?
2018-09-02T06:04:58 < bitmask> I wouldnt think so but just curious
2018-09-02T06:11:40 < bitmask> no its not
2018-09-02T06:16:50 < bitmask> been seeing how much it will cost to convert my pen plotter to a decent desktop cnc mill and stuff
2018-09-02T06:17:22 < bitmask> looks like $200 will get me pretty far but I needs a job 
2018-09-02T06:18:02 < bitmask> I just graduated so I'm gonna be looking for a real job for the first time
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2018-09-02T06:26:54 < bitmask> nope, if I can find a paid one I'd be willing to take a small salary to get some experience but I dont think I can afford to not get paid
2018-09-02T06:27:02 < bitmask> ahh gotta go, bbl
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2018-09-02T07:25:38 < dongs> oh what the fuck
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2018-09-02T07:26:03 < dongs> hey crt, release notes for altidumb has been posted finally
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2018-09-02T10:41:01 < Steffanx> cjbaird: is alive :o
2018-09-02T10:41:10 < Steffanx> Where has he been?
2018-09-02T10:43:39 < dongs> wat
2018-09-02T10:43:42 < dongs> wow
2018-09-02T10:54:37 < cjbaird> Good news: my ex didn't murder me.
2018-09-02T10:55:40 < cjbaird> Did a second around-Australia motorbike trip (20,000 kms, 5 months, Honda CT110), and pretty-much used Twitter for All My Internet Interaction Needs until recently.
2018-09-02T10:56:55 < cjbaird> Got my Amateur Radio ticket, and pulled the stm32 gear out to make a Morse trainer..
2018-09-02T11:00:02 < Steffanx> Sounds like you retired cjbaird 
2018-09-02T11:03:28 < cjbaird> At least I'm not a grandparent.. (I've got friends from high school who are :<)
2018-09-02T11:04:48 < Steffanx> One of them isnt. The one that lives in some embassy atm :P
2018-09-02T11:07:49 < cjbaird> ha
2018-09-02T11:11:26 < cjbaird> ACtually he does have a kid. From that 16 year-old Wife that he went The Shining on.
2018-09-02T11:17:09 < karlp> whee, baird's back!
2018-09-02T11:21:19 < cjbaird> You people have been idling here for like, 10 years? 
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2018-09-02T11:24:01 < dongs> yes
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2018-09-02T11:32:15 < cjbaird> You've all failed to stop Arduino being a thing, I'll note.
2018-09-02T11:32:49 < dongs> retarduino morphed into ESP1488
2018-09-02T11:32:56 < dongs> and became even more retarded
2018-09-02T11:44:31 < cjbaird> What I've been up to.. https://www.youtube.com/user/cejaybee/videos (CrazySmallCPU = 74LS 4-bitter, '2 dimension programming', that a mate and I went full-Aspergers and did a HLL compiler for..)
2018-09-02T11:50:35 < cjbaird> No more dickaday guy in the channel.
2018-09-02T11:52:02 < cjbaird> The furry has left too \o/
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2018-09-02T11:54:40 < Steffanx> Who was that cjbaird ?
2018-09-02T11:56:02 < cjbaird> hackkitten
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2018-09-02T12:03:28 < Steffanx> Was she ever here?
2018-09-02T12:04:32 < Thorn> what is the output impedance of a divider made of a resistor and a zener
2018-09-02T12:05:27 < Thorn> yes basically
2018-09-02T12:06:20 < Thorn> I want to power an opto led from it without an extra series resistor
2018-09-02T12:06:47 < antto> i'd quickly throw it into falstad to see what happens
2018-09-02T12:06:53 < antto> but i'm not "pro"
2018-09-02T12:07:27 < Thorn> that might be an option if you're not lazy
2018-09-02T12:07:49 < antto> if i'm not lazy i'd throw it into a moar scientifically correct simulator
2018-09-02T12:08:34 < antto> buffer the reference voltage with an opamp ;P~
2018-09-02T12:09:18 < antto> i think a simple lm358 should be able to drive a LED
2018-09-02T12:09:19 < BrainDamage> Thorn: impedance will be a function of the current because a zener is not a linear device
2018-09-02T12:09:27 < BrainDamage> ... which is the whole point
2018-09-02T12:14:03 < karlp> oh BrainDamage, finally cut open this norcia sausage I got the other day
2018-09-02T12:14:09 < karlp> the smell, oh my, so delish.
2018-09-02T12:17:07 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-02T12:17:47 < BrainDamage> ah, that one's iirc often cooked with cherry tomatoes and cabbages or mushrooms
2018-09-02T12:18:14 < karlp> this one just says salami with truffle or something, but very nice, regardless.
2018-09-02T12:18:39 < BrainDamage> oh, I mean to prepare yourself, not the salami itself
2018-09-02T12:20:13 < BrainDamage> I assume you didn't get the "donkey's ballsack" ? ( literal name )
2018-09-02T12:20:43 < karlp> no, we didn't have a lot of time, and it was really rather sad being there.
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2018-09-02T12:46:33 < Steffanx> Ty stvn
2018-09-02T13:16:45 < Thorn> wtf my global const object seems to be optimized away by the compiler
2018-09-02T13:24:28 < antto> __attribute__((used))
2018-09-02T13:32:47 < Steffanx> are you a fish too?
2018-09-02T13:33:54 < Steffanx> *capacitator
2018-09-02T13:38:50 < antto> capaciteteur
2018-09-02T13:43:31 < dongs> akku
2018-09-02T13:44:24 < Steffanx> ----)(----
2018-09-02T13:44:33 < dongs> hacckitten is dickgirl+furry now? i thought it wa just dickgirl
2018-09-02T13:45:06 < Steffanx> Repeating the same old "joke" doesnt make it more funny dongs.
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2018-09-02T14:02:36 < dongs> 8============D
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2018-09-02T14:09:06 < cjbaird> In an Internet where proprietary social media services can and do change their entire congress on the daily whim, IRC remains has it has for 30 years. Aww.
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2018-09-02T14:24:54 < Sadale> IRC shall remain forever. We have a solid community. Yet almost no one have heard of it :3
2018-09-02T14:25:25 < Sadale> I think IRC has been here even before the existance of www.
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2018-09-02T14:28:29 < tomeaton17> I would to see an age demographic of irc users
2018-09-02T14:28:55 < Steffanx> You are our youngest if that's what you want to know
2018-09-02T14:31:08 < tomeaton17> no I don't care about that, but what I think will happen is irc will die over time and then will die rapidly in a ten year period in about 40 years
2018-09-02T14:33:41 < Steffanx> We'll keep the spirit alive tomeaton17
2018-09-02T14:34:06 < tomeaton17> I am hoping I won't see it go 
2018-09-02T14:34:23 < tomeaton17> because its great
2018-09-02T14:34:24 < cjbaird> Aussie Government is in the RFC stage of blocking a lot more torrent sites than currently-- including the animu stuff. Really, really, not looking forward to using IRC distro bots again. :|
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2018-09-02T14:37:51 < Steffanx> animu is safu!
2018-09-02T14:39:35 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6T7KK-TVAek new Chase & Status
2018-09-02T14:40:52 < Steffanx> And another bit inside me died kakimir . Ty
2018-09-02T14:41:01 < Steffanx> *piece of me
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2018-09-02T14:48:17 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/l72equq8h/
2018-09-02T14:57:10 < Streaker> was it due to a sexually transmitted disease?
2018-09-02T14:59:27 < Laurenceb__> BLACKPILL4U.COM
2018-09-02T15:00:59 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eSAF_qT_FY
2018-09-02T15:05:03 < cjbaird> I'm safe because i runs openbsd
2018-09-02T15:08:26 < Steffanx> wasnt it some obscure via processor anyway?
2018-09-02T15:12:00 < kakimir> interesting thing about such via processor is that you can run risc code too
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2018-09-02T15:12:17 < kakimir> bypass x86 emulation with an instruction
2018-09-02T15:13:12 < cjbaird> Ha, VIA C3. Old-as. And I have about 4 Mini-ITX boards with that.
2018-09-02T15:13:42 < kakimir> but via still makes some those thing right?
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2018-09-02T15:20:53 < Jak_o_Shadows> The australian government is a bloody mess
2018-09-02T15:22:50 < Steffanx> what government isnt a mess?
2018-09-02T15:22:56 < vampi-the-frog> any idea how I can make a sort of AND gate, to just relay the input to a pin to another pin in real time?
2018-09-02T15:22:59 < vampi-the-frog> maybe with a timer?
2018-09-02T15:23:00 < Jak_o_Shadows> Fair
2018-09-02T15:29:42 < vampi-the-frog> oh and I want to be able to enable and disable the relaying
2018-09-02T15:29:53 < vampi-the-frog> so, like an AND gate basically
2018-09-02T15:30:17 < vampi-the-frog> the ref man seems to suggest that I can use BKIN http://img.vampi.tech/435f23b9.png
2018-09-02T15:30:20 < vampi-the-frog> at the bottom
2018-09-02T15:30:46 < vampi-the-frog> and then output it on TIMx_CH4
2018-09-02T15:31:08 < vampi-the-frog> has anyone done this?
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2018-09-02T15:33:26 < Jak_o_Shadows> My gut would be something like seeing if you can get an interrupt from the input?
2018-09-02T15:33:27 < Jak_o_Shadows> dunno
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2018-09-02T17:49:02 < Laurenceb__> http://www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/861/tudalen/86489
2018-09-02T17:49:13 < Laurenceb__> dey stole the babby shake idea... maybe
2018-09-02T17:49:21 < Laurenceb__> aint nobody can read dat shit
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2018-09-02T17:53:00 < Steffanx> I didnt know Welsh was such weird language Laurenceb__
2018-09-02T17:53:00 < Steffanx> interesting
2018-09-02T17:54:02 < dongs> yn dangos
2018-09-02T17:54:29 < Steffanx> And google seems to be perfectly able to translate it to englsih
2018-09-02T17:54:30 < dongs> welsh isnt that where zano is from
2018-09-02T17:54:32 < Steffanx> english
2018-09-02T17:55:42 < Steffanx> Torquing Group yes
2018-09-02T17:55:57 < dongs> < Steffanx> And google seems to be perfectly able to translate it to englsih < http://www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/861/page/86471 probly cuz there's an english apge
2018-09-02T17:57:07 < jadew> Laurenceb__, looks like an old project
2018-09-02T17:59:25 < Steffanx> 2016 is old indeed
2018-09-02T18:00:04 < jadew> unlreated to that, how do you know when to give up on a project and move on?
2018-09-02T18:00:11 < jadew> *unrelated
2018-09-02T18:01:00 < dongs> when your dickstarter for it fails
2018-09-02T18:01:13 < Steffanx> or when dongs tells you its impossible
2018-09-02T18:01:32 < Steffanx> So: When not using keil, windows etc.
2018-09-02T18:01:51 < jadew> not going to be a dickstarter, but I'm having trouble getting a working version that I'm happy with
2018-09-02T18:02:00 < Steffanx> anyway, is there really an answer to that question?
2018-09-02T18:02:27 < jadew> I'm sure there is
2018-09-02T18:02:42 < jadew> I think the best you can do is count the days you work on it
2018-09-02T18:03:00 < jadew> and put a price on that
2018-09-02T18:03:55 < Steffanx> Yes, but there are more reason that just the financial one
2018-09-02T18:05:14 < jadew> like what?
2018-09-02T18:06:12 < Laurenceb__> yn dangos ur dick
2018-09-02T18:06:27 < Laurenceb__> yn dangos tits or gtfo
2018-09-02T18:06:51 < jadew> what bumms me about this one is that I fixed the issues I had in earlier revisions only to find out there's another, deeper issue
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2018-09-02T18:08:04 < jadew> and the whole thing is so difficult to test and so sensitive to everything, it's just overwhelming to think that I have to redesign it
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2018-09-02T18:12:03 < Laurenceb__> lol Kraut&Tea just got b& from youtube
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2018-09-02T18:19:21 < Steffanx> Lost of interest is a good reason jadew 
2018-09-02T18:20:14 < Steffanx> And when in the financial reason a good one? It all depends on your situation. Can you afford it etc.
2018-09-02T18:20:22 < Steffanx> Do you expect to make money
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2018-09-02T18:21:07 < Steffanx> Do you have other projects?
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2018-09-02T18:24:31 < BrainDamage> Can it potentially wipe out the whole city? if not, it's too boring
2018-09-02T18:29:18 < karlp> man, nuttx first steps experience is pretty bad. follow the readme: /bin/sh: kconfig-conf: command not found
2018-09-02T18:36:49 < branjb> lol
2018-09-02T18:39:49 < Laurenceb__> https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/abstract/document/8438786/
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2018-09-02T18:41:20 < branjb> Laurenceb__ you ever used an IMU in a car to track whether it was accelerating or breaking?
2018-09-02T18:41:33 < Laurenceb__> no but I could
2018-09-02T18:41:39 < Laurenceb__> looks like the cited me
2018-09-02T18:41:43 < branjb> haha
2018-09-02T18:42:36 < branjb> is an generic IMU (mpu6050) sensitive enough to detect very slight accelerations, or only when flooring it?
2018-09-02T18:43:20 < catphish> branjb: the mpu6050 is astonishingly accurate in my experience
2018-09-02T18:43:49 < catphish> however you'd probably want the datasheet to clarify that into a number
2018-09-02T18:44:18 < branjb> gonna put together some logger and go drive around
2018-09-02T18:45:00 < Laurenceb__> the accel is a bit shit
2018-09-02T18:45:08 < Laurenceb__> but it depends what ur doing
2018-09-02T18:45:09 < catphish> i used it to build a quadcopter, that mostly meant using its gyro and using the accelerometer to measure gravity
2018-09-02T18:45:10 < BrainDamage> incel*
2018-09-02T18:45:28 < catphish> in hindsight, i have no idea what gravity has to do with acceleration
2018-09-02T18:45:35 < BrainDamage> they are equivalent
2018-09-02T18:45:40 < branjb> gravity is acceleration
2018-09-02T18:45:51 < catphish> it kind of isn't, it's a force
2018-09-02T18:46:00 < branjb> well
2018-09-02T18:46:05 < BrainDamage> except that GR says it differently
2018-09-02T18:46:05 < branjb> accelerometer measures net force
2018-09-02T18:46:22 < catphish> but if it's stationary, net force is zero
2018-09-02T18:46:31 < catphish> and yet it can still detect gravity
2018-09-02T18:47:00 < catphish> i think it's detecting the difference in force between the tethered case and an untethered internal component
2018-09-02T18:47:26 < BrainDamage> there's several ways to make accelerometers, tuning forks, etc
2018-09-02T18:47:32 < catphish> i'm not sure, but in any case it can detect gravity, which is a fairly large acceleration force
2018-09-02T18:47:37 < branjb> don't know how accurate it but someone described an IMU to me as imagine there is a ball suspended in a box with a string attached to each side.. the accelerometer tells you string tension
2018-09-02T18:48:17 < catphish> branjb: makes perfect sense, lines up with what i meant what i referred to an internal component that's free to move
2018-09-02T18:48:24 < catphish> *when
2018-09-02T18:48:47 < catphish> so yeah, the ball would be pulled by gravity, but also by acceleration of the external device
2018-09-02T18:49:07 < branjb> the real misleading one is that a mechanical gyroscope tells you orientation, but in terms of IC's a gyroscope tells you rate of change
2018-09-02T18:49:08 < catphish> branjb: anyway, i've only measured gravity with it, which is a pretty huge force, i don't know about small accelerations
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2018-09-02T18:49:33 < catphish> yeah i think of a gyro as measuring rotational velocity
2018-09-02T18:49:41 < catphish> (because i've only ever used an mpu6050)
2018-09-02T18:49:43 < BrainDamage> it measures rotational acceleration
2018-09-02T18:49:55 < BrainDamage> aka applied torque
2018-09-02T18:50:04 < catphish> well the mpu6050 returns rotational velocity
2018-09-02T18:50:13 < branjb> in a cockpit a mechanical gyroscope tells you things like your current pitch/roll angle
2018-09-02T18:50:50 < BrainDamage> the problem of all inertial measurement systems is that they rely on double integration to get to the position
2018-09-02T18:50:56 < BrainDamage> the errors accumulate fast
2018-09-02T18:51:01 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-02T18:51:02 < catphish> branjb: it's worth noting that the mpu6050 comes with a binary blob firmware that integrates the gyro and returns pitch/roll/yaw
2018-09-02T18:51:07 < BrainDamage> so your sensor need to be very low noise / low drift
2018-09-02T18:51:09 < branjb> then try to use accelerometer to compensate over time
2018-09-02T18:51:16 < catphish> branjb: this is the part that's impossibly accurate
2018-09-02T18:51:28 < catphish> yeah it uses the acceleromemeter to compensate
2018-09-02T18:51:40 < BrainDamage> there's multiple sensor fusion algos
2018-09-02T18:51:48 < BrainDamage> the most diffused one is kalman filter
2018-09-02T18:51:58 < branjb> interesting, the mpu6050 can return raw pitch/yaw/angle?  I thought you needed a magnometer to get an accurate yaw
2018-09-02T18:52:00 < catphish> yeah, theirs is amazing, at least by my fairly simple requirements
2018-09-02T18:52:18 < branjb> I've used the quartinon one or w/e it is called
2018-09-02T18:52:20 < branjb> magwicks?
2018-09-02T18:52:26 < catphish> branjb: i don't know if the yaw has absolute accuracy, probably not
2018-09-02T18:52:30 < BrainDamage> kalman is theoretically the correct one, but others promise similar results with lower computational costs
2018-09-02T18:52:46 < catphish> branjb: i think you can hook it up to a magnetometer if you want that
2018-09-02T18:52:50 < branjb> ah
2018-09-02T18:52:52 < BrainDamage> madgwicks
2018-09-02T18:52:52 < branjb> I don't
2018-09-02T18:53:03 < branjb> I only care about acceleration in the positive X direction
2018-09-02T18:53:14 < branjb> could technically do a 1 DOF accelerometer
2018-09-02T18:53:40 < catphish> branjb: i used mine for 2 things 1) the gyro, for instant pitch/roll compensation 2) the computed pitch/roll, for slow corrections to the same
2018-09-02T18:53:52 < catphish> i never used the raw accelerometer for anything
2018-09-02T18:54:11 < catphish> but i assume it's excellent based on everything else i saw from that IC
2018-09-02T18:54:41 < catphish> it's good enough to fly a multirotor with no external math :)
2018-09-02T18:54:45 < BrainDamage> branjb: http://www.olliw.eu/2013/imu-data-fusing/
2018-09-02T18:54:50 < catphish> which is what i wanted it for
2018-09-02T18:56:13 < catphish> branjb: just plug in the MPU6050, i doubt you'll be disapointed
2018-09-02T18:56:36 < catphish> wanna know if your car can out-accelerate gravity? :)
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2018-09-02T18:56:45 < branjb> I basically want a linear mapping of X acceleration to voltage via a DAC or PWM
2018-09-02T18:57:02 < branjb> wonder if using an analog accelerometer would be better
2018-09-02T18:57:07 < catphish> well you might be able to buy an alalog device, yeah
2018-09-02T18:57:11 < branjb> probably not, because I want to apply software filtering
2018-09-02T18:57:25 < catphish> but mpu6050 + any MCU will do the job
2018-09-02T18:57:29 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-02T18:57:38 < catphish> i used an arduino mega
2018-09-02T18:57:52 < branjb> I have some mpu6050's from other projects I'll just rig up a datalogger and get some data
2018-09-02T18:58:01 < catphish> perfect
2018-09-02T18:59:05 < BrainDamage> I doubt even a sports car can out-accelerate gravity
2018-09-02T18:59:21 < BrainDamage> consider that 0-100km/h  in 5s it's ~5.5m/s
2018-09-02T18:59:24 < catphish> tesla model S with the power upgrade can
2018-09-02T18:59:33 < catphish> i believe it's the only car that can
2018-09-02T18:59:45 < branjb> the mpu6050 gives you acceleration broken up into components though doesn't it?  so you get acceleration from x,y,z axis
2018-09-02T18:59:45 < BrainDamage> 5.5m/s^2, sorry
2018-09-02T18:59:55 < branjb> z will always show gravity but x should change when accelerating/breaking
2018-09-02T18:59:56 < catphish> i don't know up to what speed
2018-09-02T19:00:36 < BrainDamage> z won't always show gravity
2018-09-02T19:00:41 < BrainDamage> there's such thing as hills
2018-09-02T19:00:52 < BrainDamage> same applies for x
2018-09-02T19:00:58 < branjb> then it will just be cos(angle of incline) * gravity
2018-09-02T19:01:07 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-02T19:01:08 < catphish> this guy claims not: https://www.forbes.com/sites/chadorzel/2016/08/25/can-a-tesla-model-s-really-accelerate-faster-than-gravity/
2018-09-02T19:01:43 < BrainDamage> branjb: but you'll also get sin(angle) on the xy plane
2018-09-02T19:01:52 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-02T19:02:01 < BrainDamage> so don't naïvely assume that
2018-09-02T19:02:09 < branjb> at the moment I only care about acceleration on a flat street
2018-09-02T19:02:23 < branjb> uphill/downhill will be a different case
2018-09-02T19:02:45 < catphish> yeah this is only useful if you are perpendicular to gravity
2018-09-02T19:03:41 < catphish> i reckon my ninja 600 can't be far off gravity acceleration
2018-09-02T19:04:36 < BrainDamage> you need to be able to do 0-100km/h in 2.5s, I really doubt so
2018-09-02T19:04:40 < catphish> 9.81 m/s/s equates to 0-60 in about 3 seconds
2018-09-02T19:05:38 < catphish> 3.0 seconds for my particular bike, which is 9.26m/s/s
2018-09-02T19:05:41 < catphish> lame
2018-09-02T19:05:55 < catphish> i'll need to upgrade it
2018-09-02T19:06:08 < BrainDamage> you can always throw it out the window
2018-09-02T19:06:20 < catphish> i don't want to
2018-09-02T19:07:00 < Laurenceb__> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45389607
2018-09-02T19:07:08 < Laurenceb__> inb4 it was by Jordan Peterson
2018-09-02T19:07:32 < Laurenceb__> > private school sixth form 
2018-09-02T19:08:04 < Laurenceb__> kill it with fire https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/11E32/production/_103266237_cathynewmanschoolpic.jpg
2018-09-02T19:08:14 < vampi-the-frog> OMG she's so good at being a victim
2018-09-02T19:08:17 < vampi-the-frog> she should win the victim award
2018-09-02T19:08:18 < catphish> this ST95HF SPI is either very poorly documented, or i just haven't found the docs
2018-09-02T19:08:50 < vampi-the-frog> VICTIM
2018-09-02T19:11:44 < Laurenceb__> the face of autism 
2018-09-02T19:12:06 < Laurenceb__> if I was less lazy I'd meme that image as "the face of autism"
2018-09-02T19:12:27 < branjb> looks like daisy hogg
2018-09-02T19:12:29 < Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk1yAVOVJsg
2018-09-02T19:12:32 < vampi-the-frog> 2018 award for victimhood
2018-09-02T19:13:19 < Laurenceb__> escobari7 months ago >lobster mating dance
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2018-09-02T19:13:24 < Laurenceb__> irl lolling
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2018-09-02T19:23:00 < branjb> how buggy is the eclipse + cube plugin?
2018-09-02T19:23:29 < dongs> as bad as you expect
2018-09-02T19:24:47 < catphish> i'm still just using gcc and a text editor and importing constants, i should probably use a proper IDE
2018-09-02T19:25:42 < englishman> http://www2.keil.com/stmicroelectronics-stm32/mdk
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2018-09-02T19:44:40 < catphish> that looks like it might be nice
2018-09-02T19:44:48 < dongs> oh it is.
2018-09-02T19:45:09 < dongs> also if you can't get over editing files in vi, you might look at purchasing jlink-edu and using ozone
2018-09-02T19:45:18 < dongs> that thing is an amazing debuger
2018-09-02T19:45:31 < catphish> nah, i like nice graphical editors
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2018-09-02T19:45:49 < dongs> it has an editor but its not IDE, you have to build externally
2018-09-02T19:45:50 < catphish> what i don't like is reliance on libraries, especially ones that get imported into my source tree
2018-09-02T19:45:58 < dongs> wot
2018-09-02T19:46:00 < Thorn> ozone++
2018-09-02T19:46:20 < catphish> i like my source tree to contain nothing but a .S file to boot, and C files that i write
2018-09-02T19:46:38 < dongs> nobody is forcing you to add any external shit wtf
2018-09-02T19:46:43 < dongs> you must really like cube then
2018-09-02T19:46:48 < dongs> cuz it adds a bucketload of aids
2018-09-02T19:46:48 < catphish> i do not
2018-09-02T19:46:50 < dongs> into your project
2018-09-02T19:46:58 < catphish> that's why i don't use it
2018-09-02T19:47:40 < catphish> i like having access to device-specific constants, and an ASM boot file, that's pretty much it
2018-09-02T19:47:58 < catphish> everything else i prefer to do manually, i don't know why, i just don't like clutter
2018-09-02T19:48:40 < catphish> <dongs> nobody is forcing you to add any external shit wtf << i kinds feel like some tools like ST's do force you
2018-09-02T19:48:43 < catphish> *kinda
2018-09-02T19:48:52 < dongs> ive never been forced to add anything by ST
2018-09-02T19:49:03 < dongs> all my projects are standalone with no external headers/crap needed.
2018-09-02T19:49:08 < catphish> interesting
2018-09-02T19:49:08 < dongs> and I do use cmsis +stdperiphlib
2018-09-02T19:49:19 < catphish> what do you generate them with? if anything?
2018-09-02T19:49:24 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Quit: Quit]
2018-09-02T19:49:24 < dongs> nothing, i just write code
2018-09-02T19:49:34 < dongs> i could just use CMSIS + stm32fxxx header but thats retarded
2018-09-02T19:49:55 < catphish> i use the device specific header, that's all
2018-09-02T19:50:13 < catphish> but never found a good IDE to do this wit
2018-09-02T19:50:21 < dongs> too much wank, i'd end up writing half stdperiphlib everytime I wanted to do somethign
2018-09-02T19:50:24 < dongs> so why bother
2018-09-02T19:51:23 < branjb> have they added f7 to stdperiphlib yet?
2018-09-02T19:51:36 < dongs> they won't
2018-09-02T19:51:44 < dongs> and i won't be using any F7s
2018-09-02T19:51:51 < branjb> so that chip is useless without HAL
2018-09-02T19:51:56 < branjb> and cubez
2018-09-02T19:52:01 < dongs> or perhaps LL
2018-09-02T19:52:06 < dongs> which is also pretty gross
2018-09-02T19:52:09 < catphish> or write your own
2018-09-02T19:52:17 < dongs> we're not all autistic like you
2018-09-02T19:52:21 < dongs> some of us just wanna get shit done
2018-09-02T19:52:23 < catphish> lol
2018-09-02T19:52:26 < branjb> lol
2018-09-02T19:52:47 < dongs> i think aandrew actually loves cube
2018-09-02T19:52:56 < dongs> but he's a faggot who literally runs cube on macos
2018-09-02T19:53:07 < dongs> like, i don't think you could stoop lower than that really
2018-09-02T19:53:42 < BrainDamage> run linux in a virtual machine inside macos
2018-09-02T19:53:47 < catphish> i use cubemx to help me quickly choose pins, but i can't abide its output
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2018-09-02T19:54:34 < catphish> but i do have some kind of API autism
2018-09-02T19:54:35 < branjb> i just generated a Makefile project from cube, no user code in it, and it's like 5mb of binaries in the build directory
2018-09-02T19:54:38 < branjb> that's kind of amazing
2018-09-02T19:54:53 < catphish> lol
2018-09-02T19:55:16 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-02T19:55:20 < dongs> they force cube for F0 parts
2018-09-02T19:55:22 < dongs> with like 16k flash
2018-09-02T19:55:26 < dongs> and when you build a default while (1) cube
2018-09-02T19:55:31 < dongs> its like 10k .bin
2018-09-02T19:55:33 < dongs> ????
2018-09-02T19:55:41 < branjb> lol
2018-09-02T19:55:45 < dongs> thankfully stdperiph still exists for F0
2018-09-02T19:55:47 < dongs> i backported TSC
2018-09-02T19:55:53 < dongs> whcih is the only peripheral they didnt have
2018-09-02T19:55:55 < dongs> that I nwated to use
2018-09-02T19:56:06 < dongs> all other shit is similar/same
2018-09-02T19:56:10 < branjb> i stole upgrdman's f0 library crap
2018-09-02T19:56:17 < dongs> what did he write
2018-09-02T19:56:40 < branjb> just some wrappers for stdpl to make setup quicker
2018-09-02T19:56:49 < branjb> https://github.com/farrellf/Balancing_Robot_Firmware/tree/master/f0lib
2018-09-02T19:56:52 < dongs> so crap on top of crap
2018-09-02T19:57:01 < catphish> don't ST provide their own IDE, used it once, can't see it now
2018-09-02T19:57:16 < dongs> quickj glance at his shit looks like wrapper around cmsis header
2018-09-02T19:57:17 < branjb> sw4stm32
2018-09-02T19:57:18 < dongs> not stdperiph
2018-09-02T19:57:28 < branjb> oh
2018-09-02T19:57:30 < dongs> SW4STM32 got replaced by atollic shitstudio
2018-09-02T19:57:35 < dongs> since its free or whatever now
2018-09-02T19:57:38 < dongs> and tehy were basicall same shit anyway
2018-09-02T19:57:47 < catphish> yeah i'm probably thinking of SW4STM32
2018-09-02T19:57:49 < dongs> https://atollic.com/truestudio/
2018-09-02T19:57:58 < branjb> i don't know shit about cmsis header
2018-09-02T19:58:04 < branjb> is it generic header for ARM micros?
2018-09-02T19:58:18 < dongs> no, but its autogenerated from teh cmsis SVD hardware definition file
2018-09-02T19:58:29 < catphish> oh yeah, atollic
2018-09-02T19:58:35 < dongs> its the shit that defines stuff like TIM1->CCR1 etc
2018-09-02T19:58:43 < catphish> so, do i want atollic or mdk?
2018-09-02T19:58:52 < branjb> oh
2018-09-02T19:58:55 < dongs> depends what youre doing and how much time you wanna waste
2018-09-02T19:59:03 < dongs> is it F0? -> MDK
2018-09-02T19:59:12 < dongs> is it some other Fx thats not F0? -> atollic
2018-09-02T19:59:14 < catphish> not that i'm unhappy with my current gccsetup
2018-09-02T19:59:29 < branjb> what was the cmd line debugger you mentioned?  ozone?
2018-09-02T19:59:32 < catphish> i'll try mdk then :)
2018-09-02T19:59:35 < dongs> Atollic TrueSTUDIO for STM32 9.0.1 is released
2018-09-02T19:59:36 < dongs> By Mattias Norlander | 2018-04-24
2018-09-02T19:59:44 < dongs> doesnt look updated very often either
2018-09-02T20:00:25 < dongs> Note: TrueSTUDIO on Windows is only available as a 32-bit application.
2018-09-02T20:00:26 < dongs> gross
2018-09-02T20:00:33 < dongs> fuckin java
2018-09-02T20:00:56 < branjb> you can set ozone up with a stlink w/ jlink crap on it and openocd?
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2018-09-02T20:01:29 < dongs> you should be able to use it with stlink flashed with jlink firmware, yes
2018-09-02T20:01:39 < dongs> you dont need openocd for any of it
2018-09-02T20:01:48 < branjb> that's good
2018-09-02T20:01:55 < branjb> openocd was really slow last time i used it
2018-09-02T20:02:23 < dongs> thats beacuse its opensores shit
2018-09-02T20:02:30 < Thorn> fun fact: if someone tells you that range for can use .cbegin() /.cend() they are wrong, it always uses .begin() and .end()
2018-09-02T20:02:43 < dongs> haha C++
2018-09-02T20:06:15 < jpa-> like C, but with more ways to shoot yourself in the foot
2018-09-02T20:12:58 < catphish> To install the MDK-ARM Software... Right-click on MDK525.EXE and save it to your computer.
2018-09-02T20:13:05 < catphish> err, windows only?
2018-09-02T20:13:22 < dongs> are you for real
2018-09-02T20:13:42 < catphish> i am
2018-09-02T20:13:53 < catphish> i only see windows build
2018-09-02T20:14:14 < branjb> uh oh
2018-09-02T20:16:30 < Thorn> antto: __attribute__((used)) didn't help
2018-09-02T20:16:37 < Thorn> no idea what is going on
2018-09-02T20:16:44 < Thorn> I worked around it
2018-09-02T20:17:00 < catphish> i guess i'll look at atollic again then :)
2018-09-02T20:18:04 < branjb> why does cube generate a 430 line main.c without doing anything to it
2018-09-02T20:18:32 < catphish> because it hates you
2018-09-02T20:19:53 < catphish> did you check the "add pointless extra code" box?
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2018-09-02T20:25:19 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-02T20:26:36 < catphish> i'm going to use truestudio and it's going to be great and everyone is going to love me
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2018-09-02T20:31:39 < tcth> engage sexy times.
2018-09-02T20:32:31 -!- Dave_Elec [~Dave@197.156.95.247] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-02T20:33:21 < catphish> well it's nice, i'm happy enough
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2018-09-02T20:56:41 < englishman> turdstudio
2018-09-02T20:56:46 < Steffanx> works for me.
2018-09-02T20:57:00 < englishman> everyone else at your company quit
2018-09-02T20:57:24 < tomeaton17> µVision
2018-09-02T20:57:30 < Steffanx> I can say mean things i told you in semi-private as well englishman.
2018-09-02T20:57:42 < Steffanx> *you told me in semi-private
2018-09-02T20:58:45 < englishman> did you eat a big bowl of stm8 thismorning
2018-09-02T20:59:17 < Steffanx> yes, but only im multiples of 4.
2018-09-02T20:59:25 < Steffanx> *in
2018-09-02T20:59:50 < Steffanx> btw, they quiet because they had didnt use truestudio englishman.
2018-09-02T20:59:55 < Steffanx> Just eclipse or keil/uvision.
2018-09-02T20:59:56 < Steffanx> Your turn.
2018-09-02T21:00:00 < englishman> :o
2018-09-02T21:00:00 < Steffanx> *quit
2018-09-02T21:00:06 < Steffanx> damnit, learn to type.
2018-09-02T21:00:25 < englishman> were they expected to write pro software with vi and gcc
2018-09-02T21:01:12 < englishman> turdstudio was fine, for eclipse it seemed to work ok, at least now it is free
2018-09-02T21:01:24 < englishman> paying for eclipse just feels wrong
2018-09-02T21:01:40 < Steffanx> It was his own decision and he failed terribly. And i had to fix up GDB for him. So its not really a big loss.
2018-09-02T21:03:27 < Steffanx> Best thing about the keil use. It was actually just ARMCC with make files, because this german profinet library used some kind of make files.
2018-09-02T21:03:38 < Steffanx> which forced us to use that as well.
2018-09-02T21:04:41 < Thorn> 30 F1 03 01 05 02 42 43 2C 02 00 00 
2018-09-02T21:06:03 < Steffanx> Are you a number station now, Thorn ?
2018-09-02T21:06:57 < BrainDamage> He's russian, it checks out
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2018-09-02T21:08:15 < Thorn> no, a rs-485 device
2018-09-02T21:08:42 < Thorn> reporting its list of supported functions
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2018-09-02T21:23:19 < branjb> is the i2c TIMINGR register in f0 the same as the CCR register in f4?
2018-09-02T21:23:23 -!- Laurenceb__ [~laurence@host86-130-23-74.range86-130.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-02T21:30:51 < branjb> nvm looks like the peripheral is entirely different
2018-09-02T21:35:22 < Steffanx> returned one of those german weather agency probes this evening: https://www.vaisala.com/en/products/instruments-sensors-and-other-measurement-devices/soundings-products/rs41
2018-09-02T21:35:26 < Steffanx> its stm32 powered \o/
2018-09-02T21:35:35 < Steffanx> *returned from the field that is
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2018-09-02T21:37:42 < Thorn> btw lpc15xx is -40...+105°C
2018-09-02T21:41:04 < Steffanx> Happy birthday crt
2018-09-02T21:43:24 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-02T21:47:28 < kakimir> Steffanx: after quick teardown?
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2018-09-02T21:48:18 < Steffanx> yes, it wont be returned to zhe germans kakimir
2018-09-02T21:48:56 < BrainDamage> you're actually in range of faprenceb's balooons
2018-09-02T21:49:53 < Steffanx> LORAnceb doesnt do ballooning does he?
2018-09-02T21:49:58 < Steffanx> only his #highaltitude friends
2018-09-02T21:50:12 < BrainDamage> rockoons
2018-09-02T21:50:20 < Steffanx> thats just a myth
2018-09-02T21:50:24 < BrainDamage> true
2018-09-02T21:50:41 < BrainDamage> maybe he should use emdrive on his rockets
2018-09-02T21:51:05 < Steffanx> Yes, powered by that fusion thing?
2018-09-02T21:51:54 < BrainDamage> sure, might as well go full conspiracy
2018-09-02T21:52:05 < BrainDamage> paint a flat earth society logo on the side, since we're there
2018-09-02T21:52:40 < Steffanx> But how to explain the rockoon going around the earth then?
2018-09-02T21:53:01 < BrainDamage> It'll just go up, duh
2018-09-02T21:55:00 -!- codyps [~codyps@richard.einic.org] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-02T21:59:32 < Laurenceb__> >Two dates in the 1800s, or two dates in the 1900s, could be further apart than a one date in the 1800s and the other in the 1900s.
2018-09-02T21:59:45 < Laurenceb__> >There is no such thing as a century, it is a social construct
2018-09-02T22:00:36 < BrainDamage> have you considered professional autism faprenceb?
2018-09-02T22:00:48 < BrainDamage> you could start a twitch stream and receive donations
2018-09-02T22:01:15 < Laurenceb__> kek
2018-09-02T22:01:31 < Laurenceb__> I could be the next Millie B
2018-09-02T22:01:47 < kakimir> what is currently the cheapest tft display out there?
2018-09-02T22:02:08 < kakimir> in quantities
2018-09-02T22:02:12 < Laurenceb__> OMG THE LIBTARDS ARE AT IT AGAIN
2018-09-02T22:03:10 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/84x48-Nokia-LCD-Module-Blue-Backlight-Adapter-PCB-Nokia-5110-LCD-For-Arduino-NEW/262841242527 is it still this?
2018-09-02T22:03:18 -!- Streake_ [~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-02T22:05:27 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2ZibqM94bM encore
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2018-09-02T22:10:26 < catphish> can't get my SPI working :( gonna need a scope at this rate
2018-09-02T22:10:58 < Laurenceb__> I SPI with my little eye
2018-09-02T22:11:35 < Steffanx> You have no tiny little logic analyzer catphish ?
2018-09-02T22:11:51 < catphish> actually i do
2018-09-02T22:11:57 < catphish> what i don't have are test points :(
2018-09-02T22:12:11 < Steffanx> but you do have wire and a soldering iron
2018-09-02T22:12:14 < catphish> i should probably buy a test clip
2018-09-02T22:12:16 < Steffanx> and an ic with legs
2018-09-02T22:12:22 < catphish> yeah i'm not risking that
2018-09-02T22:12:56 < Steffanx> Take the risk or redo the pcb? ):
2018-09-02T22:12:56 < Cracki> scrape solder mask, solder bodge wires
2018-09-02T22:13:03 < Steffanx> or that
2018-09-02T22:13:07 < catphish> yeah no
2018-09-02T22:13:07 < Cracki> personally I prefer vias
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2018-09-02T22:14:00 < catphish> i prefer things that just work
2018-09-02T22:14:05 < Cracki> kek
2018-09-02T22:14:19 < Cracki> does your ic even have legs?
2018-09-02T22:14:30 < catphish> lol yes it does
2018-09-02T22:14:45 < Cracki> good, then get some leg clips
2018-09-02T22:14:59 < Cracki> for a minimum size of leg, they're quite handy
2018-09-02T22:15:03 < catphish> yeah that was my thought
2018-09-02T22:15:08 < catphish> i'll have a look for some
2018-09-02T22:15:14 < catphish> this is my board: https://i.imgur.com/Y9DFKbS.jpg
2018-09-02T22:15:19 < catphish> the STM32 at least has legs
2018-09-02T22:15:20 < Cracki> don't pay more than 2 bucks per clip
2018-09-02T22:15:42 < catphish> and i've put way too much love into this board to go at it with a soldering iron
2018-09-02T22:15:51 < Cracki> kill your darlings
2018-09-02T22:15:58 < catphish> lol
2018-09-02T22:16:24 < Cracki> wats with the 5 traces ducking under the one vcc?
2018-09-02T22:16:32 < Cracki> why not duck the vcc under all 5
2018-09-02T22:16:48 < Cracki> near the 6pin header
2018-09-02T22:17:09 < catphish> they're programming pins, i consider them less important than my power supply
2018-09-02T22:17:18 < catphish> also one of them heads off under the IC anyway
2018-09-02T22:17:18 < Cracki> fair point
2018-09-02T22:17:53 < Cracki> this is prolly why my boss does his vias without solder stop...
2018-09-02T22:18:00 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-02T22:18:33 < Cracki> that stm32 might be too small to get cheap clips on the legs
2018-09-02T22:19:14 < Cracki> .100" headers are easy, .050 works too, then it gets tighter
2018-09-02T22:20:00 < Cracki> you could get/print one of these "probe squids"
2018-09-02T22:20:17 < Cracki> gorillapod-like arms to position any kind of probe on your board
2018-09-02T22:20:53 < Cracki> then get some needles, solder some wires on, point them at the stm32 legs
2018-09-02T22:22:50 < Steffanx> Cracki means something like https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2427726 i assume?
2018-09-02T22:22:56 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-02T22:23:14 < Cracki> like a third hand, times 8
2018-09-02T22:23:51 < Cracki> the tips are grabby clips, but giving them some support with an arm can help... or just needle probes
2018-09-02T22:26:08 < karlp> catphish: you know you don't need to use assembly to boot right?
2018-09-02T22:26:29 < karlp> catphish: selling point of cortex-m was that startup can be written in C.
2018-09-02T22:26:45 < karlp> it's just legacy that the vendors ship assembly startup files.
2018-09-02T22:26:49 < catphish> karlp: someone tell that to ST
2018-09-02T22:27:34 < catphish> that's interesting, i'm not too bothered, but would be happy to get rid of my asm boot code
2018-09-02T22:27:44 -!- catphish [~catphish@unaffiliated/catphish] has left ##stm32 ["Leaving"]
2018-09-02T22:28:43 < Steffanx> bye.
2018-09-02T22:30:52 < karlp> hard to help people that leave.
2018-09-02T22:30:53 < kakimir> what is the cheapest micro sd card atm?
2018-09-02T22:30:57 < kakimir> reliable
2018-09-02T22:31:11 < Cracki> the most expensive brand?
2018-09-02T22:31:25 < kakimir> such thing could be glued and soldered to pcb
2018-09-02T22:31:37 < Cracki> uh
2018-09-02T22:31:45 < kakimir> in production device why not
2018-09-02T22:31:53 < zyp> I tend to pick up sandisk ultra
2018-09-02T22:32:01 < zyp> but I don't know if they are cheapest
2018-09-02T22:32:09 < kakimir> it doesn't need to be fast at all
2018-09-02T22:32:11 < Cracki> definitely not. cheapest is random shit from china.
2018-09-02T22:32:23 < zyp> Cracki, yeah, but they are not very reliable
2018-09-02T22:32:26 < zyp> and he said reliable
2018-09-02T22:32:34 < Cracki> perhaps you need to figure out if standalone flash chips would be an alternative
2018-09-02T22:32:41 < Cracki> he also said cheap :>
2018-09-02T22:32:44 < Cracki> which is kinda mutex
2018-09-02T22:32:46 < zyp> for soldering to a pcb, look at emmc
2018-09-02T22:32:53 < Cracki> ^
2018-09-02T22:32:59 < zyp> Cracki, no, he said cheapest
2018-09-02T22:33:05 < Cracki> even worse
2018-09-02T22:33:16 < zyp> even when looking only at expensive cards, one of them would be cheapest of the group
2018-09-02T22:33:43 < Cracki> that's where your threshold of "expensive" is
2018-09-02T22:33:55 < kakimir> oh I forget it needs to be removable
2018-09-02T22:34:01 < zyp> what the fuck
2018-09-02T22:34:07 < Cracki> soldered on and removable, alright
2018-09-02T22:34:11 < Steffanx> haha. :D
2018-09-02T22:34:15 < kakimir> oh yeah
2018-09-02T22:34:16 < zyp> how do you solder a card to a board while keeping it removable?
2018-09-02T22:34:25 < Cracki> consider using a "socket"
2018-09-02T22:34:29 < Steffanx> Have more requirements kakimir ? Better dump that all at once
2018-09-02T22:34:41 < Steffanx> minimum size 1TB? 
2018-09-02T22:34:53 < Cracki> retention 100 years
2018-09-02T22:35:06 < zyp> functional up to 500C
2018-09-02T22:35:32 < Steffanx> Should it do wifi too?
2018-09-02T22:35:46 < karlp> *** Execute 'make' to start the build or try 'make help'.
2018-09-02T22:35:50 < karlp> make: *** No rule to make target 'help'.  Stop.
2018-09-02T22:35:52 < sync> of course Steffanx 
2018-09-02T22:35:54 < karlp> totally pro.
2018-09-02T22:36:16 < sync> and BLE
2018-09-02T22:36:34 < Thorn> comes preloaded with porn
2018-09-02T22:36:43 < Cracki> I want BLE-Highspeed
2018-09-02T22:37:10 < Steffanx> Do you want the standard ##stm32 answer karlp ?
2018-09-02T22:37:19 < Cracki> but srsly, microsd slot and be done with it
2018-09-02T22:37:19 < Steffanx> "make" <= there is your issue.
2018-09-02T22:37:32 < Steffanx> "open sores"
2018-09-02T22:37:50 < Steffanx> i know right
2018-09-02T22:38:13 < Cracki> if that shit needs to be replaceable, make it field-replaceable, so uSD instead of soldered on
2018-09-02T22:38:28 < Cracki> even if you can live with soldering work
2018-09-02T22:39:00 < BrainDamage> replace the whole board, problem solved
2018-09-02T22:39:07 -!- catphish [~catphish@unaffiliated/catphish] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-02T22:39:17 < catphish> not sure how/why i left the channel :|
2018-09-02T22:39:26 < Cracki> have you tried alt+f4?
2018-09-02T22:39:31 < BrainDamage> I can think of few reasons why
2018-09-02T22:39:47 < Steffanx> #metoo
2018-09-02T22:40:01 < catphish> lol
2018-09-02T22:40:07 < Cracki> ^[box] [box]
2018-09-02T22:40:07 < karlp> catphish: https://github.com/libopencm3/libopencm3/blob/master/lib/cm3/vector.c#L62-L100 startup in C.
2018-09-02T22:40:23 < kakimir> every SD card in ebay is like too expensives
2018-09-02T22:40:25 < Steffanx> https://emojipedia.org/emoji/%F0%9F%A4%B3/
2018-09-02T22:40:32 < catphish> karlp: well that's cool, thanks
2018-09-02T22:40:33 < Steffanx> U+1F933
2018-09-02T22:40:39 < kakimir> I only need like 2GB
2018-09-02T22:40:49 < Cracki> my shit client doesn't resolve the unicode right, seems it maps to latin1 or whatever
2018-09-02T22:41:05 < catphish> wonder what i've missed, don't think my SPI is outputting a clock
2018-09-02T22:41:18 < catphish> so hopefully something obvious
2018-09-02T22:41:28 < Steffanx> did you enable hte peripheral clock?
2018-09-02T22:41:29 < Cracki> ref manual
2018-09-02T22:41:35 < Steffanx> Selected the right AF?
2018-09-02T22:41:44 < Steffanx> do you transmit anything?
2018-09-02T22:41:48 < catphish> Steffanx: i did enable the clock
2018-09-02T22:42:02 < catphish> i don't know what an AF is
2018-09-02T22:42:05 < Steffanx> Do you measure the right pin?
2018-09-02T22:42:11 < Cracki> AltFurry
2018-09-02T22:42:16 < catphish> oh, alt function
2018-09-02T22:42:25 < Steffanx> Yessir.
2018-09-02T22:42:30 < kakimir> actually it doesn't need to be removable
2018-09-02T22:42:35 < catphish> i shall double check thrice
2018-09-02T22:42:49 < kakimir> any really really cheap sub 1GB flash chips you know?
2018-09-02T22:42:50 < karlp> funny. nuttx defaults to assuming cygwin.
2018-09-02T22:42:53 < karlp> what a way to live.
2018-09-02T22:42:55 < karlp> not even msys.
2018-09-02T22:43:33 < Cracki> spi flash? sd/sdio flash?
2018-09-02T22:43:42 < Cracki> emmc flash?
2018-09-02T22:44:00 < kakimir> spi
2018-09-02T22:44:23 < kakimir> i2c
2018-09-02T22:44:46 < Cracki> I don't find spi flash chips for that much storage
2018-09-02T22:44:47 < Steffanx> No i2c is not an option
2018-09-02T22:44:53 < Cracki> but sd/emmc can do that
2018-09-02T22:45:03 < Cracki> sd at least can be talked to with SPI
2018-09-02T22:45:07 < Cracki> even single line
2018-09-02T22:45:47 < Cracki> just go with sd card slot lying on the pcb
2018-09-02T22:46:07 < Cracki> everything can talk to sd cards these days
2018-09-02T22:46:24 < Cracki> also a lot easier to fuck with the contents when you can stick it in your computer
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2018-09-02T22:59:07 < karlp> remember kids: "Only recent GCC toolchains have built-in support for the Cortex-M4 FPU."
2018-09-02T23:01:49 < Cracki> how recent
2018-09-02T23:02:15 < Cracki> I find that quote in ros2_embedded_nuttx
2018-09-02T23:02:25 < Cracki> last touched 2014
2018-09-02T23:03:04 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
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2018-09-02T23:05:29 < catphish> i didn't know that, always worked for me with ubuntu 16.04's gcc luckily
2018-09-02T23:05:58 < zyp> heh
2018-09-02T23:07:52 < Cracki> m4 announcement 2010 https://www.arm.com/about/newsroom/arm-launches-class-leading-cortex-m4-processor-for-high-performance-digital-signal-control.php
2018-09-02T23:08:00 < karlp> jsut commenting on how old some of nuttx's readmes are.
2018-09-02T23:08:08 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-02T23:08:08 < Cracki> that they are
2018-09-02T23:08:16 < karlp> not sure how much I trust projects that have this many files in them.
2018-09-02T23:08:40 < Steffanx> Ask how jpa-  survived it
2018-09-02T23:09:12 < karlp> just want to experiment.
2018-09-02T23:09:17 < karlp> it's always shit getting started
2018-09-02T23:12:47 < catphish> should the SPI clock always be transmitted? or is it only transmitted when data is being transferred? i had assumed the former so that data can be sent by the slave, is that right?
2018-09-02T23:13:43 < karlp> spi clock defines that data is being transferred
2018-09-02T23:13:54 < karlp> if you left it freerunning, you'd be continuously clocking data
2018-09-02T23:14:05 < karlp> either all 0s or all 1s, or whatever those pins are idling at...
2018-09-02T23:14:37 < Cracki> the slave doesn't transmit on its own
2018-09-02T23:14:53 < Cracki> it only speaks when spoken to, i.e. when the master has asserted chipselect and when the clock runs
2018-09-02T23:15:00 < catphish> oh, the slave transmits when spoken to, i understand
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2018-09-02T23:15:12 < Cracki> it's a SHIFT register protocol
2018-09-02T23:15:24 < Cracki> for every bit shifted in, you get a bit shifted out
2018-09-02T23:15:40 < catphish> yeah i see, i suspect i'm simply not initiating the reception then
2018-09-02T23:15:55 < Cracki> that's also why the slave responds with exaclty as many bits as were toggled in from the master
2018-09-02T23:16:01 < Laurenceb__> Cathy Newman
2018-09-02T23:16:03 < Laurenceb__> >man
2018-09-02T23:16:10 < Cracki> sounds dual citizen
2018-09-02T23:16:36 < Cracki> she's the one who held the severed head of her president
2018-09-02T23:16:53 < Cracki> or was that someone else
2018-09-02T23:17:11 < Cracki> ah, Kathy Griffin
2018-09-02T23:17:30 < Cracki> lol I'm right, cathy newman IS a dual citizen!
2018-09-02T23:17:33 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-02T23:17:37 < Cracki> I got a nose for that :>
2018-09-02T23:18:01 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-02T23:19:40 < vampi-the-frog> hey how about that cathy newman
2018-09-02T23:19:43 < vampi-the-frog> how about that stm32
2018-09-02T23:19:46 < vampi-the-frog> how about that off topic
2018-09-02T23:19:48 < vampi-the-frog> how about that on topic
2018-09-02T23:19:55 < catphish> so, how does one actually receive an SPI byte? do you have to transmit something?
2018-09-02T23:20:03 < zyp> you send an SPI byte
2018-09-02T23:20:04 < Cracki> and you're getting muted again, froggy
2018-09-02T23:20:19 < catphish> zyp: and the receive happens simultaneously?
2018-09-02T23:20:31 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-02T23:20:38 < BrainDamage> you send clock alongside the data
2018-09-02T23:20:43 < zyp> yes
2018-09-02T23:20:47 < vampi-the-frog> yes
2018-09-02T23:20:53 < BrainDamage> the receiver gets the bit and the clock, and samples the line on each clock transition
2018-09-02T23:20:55 < Cracki> the spi peripherl generates the clock on its own
2018-09-02T23:20:56 < catphish> that makes sense, thanks, so if i'm expecting a response, i just send 0x0?
2018-09-02T23:20:59 < Cracki> you send data to receive data
2018-09-02T23:21:05 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-02T23:21:10 < catphish> lovely, thanks
2018-09-02T23:21:17 < zyp> catphish, I assume this is what you want: https://cgit.jvnv.net/cardio/tree/main.cpp#n48
2018-09-02T23:21:19 < Cracki> what kinda device is that?
2018-09-02T23:21:43 < Cracki> usually, when you expect a response of N bytes, you send filler bytes. the data sheet of the slave device should illustrate this as well
2018-09-02T23:22:04 < zyp> and yes, my spi_transfer() sends 0x00 when you don't pass it anything else
2018-09-02T23:22:17 < catphish> so transfer_byte() sends and returns the data that was received?
2018-09-02T23:22:31 < zyp> https://cgit.jvnv.net/laks/tree/spi/spi.h#n27 <- yes
2018-09-02T23:22:33 < catphish> ideal, thanks
2018-09-02T23:22:35 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-02T23:24:22 < catphish> well then i've done something very wrong, because i'm transmitting lots of bytes, but SPI1->SR bit 0 is never set :(
2018-09-02T23:24:55 < zyp> feel free to compare SPI config to mine
2018-09-02T23:25:24 < catphish> thanks for the pointers, will do, it's not quite the same chip sadly, but worth checking what i may have missed
2018-09-02T23:25:25 < zyp> also, are you sure you're transmitting anything at all?
2018-09-02T23:25:31 < catphish> not at all
2018-09-02T23:25:46 < zyp> remembered to turn it on in RCC?
2018-09-02T23:26:36 < catphish> RCC->APB2ENR |= (1<<12); // Enable SPI1          SPI1->CR1 = SPI_CR1_MSTR | (2<<3);                  SPI1->CR1 |= SPI_CR1_SPE; // Enable SPI peripheral
2018-09-02T23:26:58 < catphish> that's the only init i'm doing, enable the clock, set master and clock divider, enable spi
2018-09-02T23:27:02 < zyp> https://cgit.jvnv.net/cardio/tree/main.cpp#n506
2018-09-02T23:27:37 < catphish> ah, those constants i did need :)
2018-09-02T23:27:46 < catphish> i was unsure of what settings to se
2018-09-02T23:27:49 < catphish> *use
2018-09-02T23:27:55 < zyp> SPI periph is more or less the same in every stm32
2018-09-02T23:28:09 < catphish> cool, well i'll try those settings
2018-09-02T23:28:24 < catphish> nothing else needed to enable it? just the one RCC flag?
2018-09-02T23:28:26 < zyp> just make sure you account for the input clock to your if it's different from the 36 MHz mine is getting
2018-09-02T23:29:04 < kakimir> anyone played a lot with op amp circuits?
2018-09-02T23:29:12 < catphish> i believe i'm running everything at 2MHz
2018-09-02T23:29:17 < kakimir> I'm making the ultimate generic amplified board
2018-09-02T23:29:20 < zyp> kakimir, wouldn't say a lot, but some
2018-09-02T23:29:23 < kakimir> amplifier
2018-09-02T23:29:31 < kakimir> I need some ideas what is important and what is not
2018-09-02T23:29:32 < catphish> kakimir: i have been playing with them this week, but probably still too much noob to be useful
2018-09-02T23:31:06 < Cracki> kakimir, what purpose?
2018-09-02T23:31:10 < catphish> zyp: is there any reason to set SSM and SSI? aren't they meaningless in master mode?
2018-09-02T23:31:12 < kakimir> I had brainfart in 2015 and trying to finish it now
2018-09-02T23:31:21 < catphish> zyp: i'm happy to copy your flags, but seems worth understanding
2018-09-02T23:31:37 < kakimir> Cracki: board that you can throw any most common 4ch op amp configuration you wish
2018-09-02T23:32:01 < Cracki> sounds too generic to cover *everyrthing* well
2018-09-02T23:32:32 < kakimir> it's basically a matrix of footprints
2018-09-02T23:32:41 < Cracki> perfboard :P
2018-09-02T23:33:07 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2GcdpJiNGfKNF9QajJZQVFMQjQ/view?usp=sharing
2018-09-02T23:33:22 < Cracki> so a breakout board for common 4ch opamp chips, plus supporting discretes?
2018-09-02T23:33:31 < Steffanx> no sma
2018-09-02T23:33:45 < Steffanx> and your kike logo is outside hte board, better fix that kakimir
2018-09-02T23:34:03 < Steffanx> oh sma is there
2018-09-02T23:34:07 < zyp> catphish, SSM and SSI is what keeps it in master mode
2018-09-02T23:34:08 < kakimir> where?
2018-09-02T23:34:11 < Steffanx> or isnt it
2018-09-02T23:34:12 < kakimir> no sma!
2018-09-02T23:34:17 < Steffanx> damn
2018-09-02T23:34:29 < BrainDamage> replace the IO with side mount SMA
2018-09-02T23:34:31 < catphish> zyp: oh, interesting
2018-09-02T23:34:36 < Steffanx> outX is just solder pads kakimir ?
2018-09-02T23:34:43 < zyp> catphish, without SSM and SSI set, it's in multimaster mode and can be switched to slave through the CS line
2018-09-02T23:34:48 < zyp> which you usually don't want
2018-09-02T23:34:58 < catphish> zyp: yeah, that is indeed not what i want
2018-09-02T23:35:06 < zyp> in other words, always set SSM and SSI unless you know better :p
2018-09-02T23:37:06 < catphish> also, my CR2 is nothing like yours i have nothing called FRXTH, and DS is in CR1
2018-09-02T23:37:20 < zyp> those got added in v2
2018-09-02T23:37:25 < zyp> if you don't have them, ignore them
2018-09-02T23:37:32 < zyp> although, I thought f0 had SPIv2
2018-09-02T23:38:01 < catphish> l0 (is that essentially the same)
2018-09-02T23:38:09 < zyp> oh
2018-09-02T23:38:15 < zyp> my code is also l0
2018-09-02T23:38:21 < catphish> i thought it was
2018-09-02T23:38:36 < zyp> l052, but that shouldn't be too different from l031
2018-09-02T23:38:46 < catphish> so... setting  SSM and SSI has brouguht it to life!
2018-09-02T23:38:52 < zyp> :)
2018-09-02T23:38:55 < catphish> thanks
2018-09-02T23:41:00 < kakimir> zyp: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kkgDC1yS8zC5GBLNhGIdsOpG1Y2zuRnf/view?usp=sharing any more components you would wish to have in it?
2018-09-02T23:41:25 < kakimir> I must have been on crack when I started this board
2018-09-02T23:41:37 < Steffanx> Cant you add more boxes?
2018-09-02T23:41:54 < kakimir> - boxes
2018-09-02T23:41:55 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-02T23:42:55 < Steffanx> I like how you labed your negative and positive supplies -V and +V, while you called the pins on the opamps V+ and V- 
2018-09-02T23:43:57 < kakimir> I think I need to double the pcb area to fit filter blocks in
2018-09-02T23:44:10 < kakimir> currently there is no filter blocks yet
2018-09-02T23:44:58 < Steffanx> And why you called all the resistors on the left "X"?
2018-09-02T23:45:31 < kakimir> because those can be any component
2018-09-02T23:45:44 < Steffanx> oh meh
2018-09-02T23:45:44 < kakimir> L, C, R, short
2018-09-02T23:45:54 < kakimir> F
2018-09-02T23:45:57 < kakimir> as ferrite
2018-09-02T23:46:42 < Steffanx> brainfart.
2018-09-02T23:46:56 < kakimir> if you wish
2018-09-02T23:47:18 < kakimir> I think I need testpoints too for jumper wires
2018-09-02T23:47:37 < Steffanx> isnt there finnish word for schematic?
2018-09-02T23:47:44 < kakimir> kytkentäkaavio
2018-09-02T23:47:51 < Steffanx> vahvistinlankku_[schematic]_[brainfart]
2018-09-02T23:48:36 < kakimir> let's focus on content
2018-09-02T23:48:53 < kakimir> I threw some caps in there like how you doing
2018-09-02T23:49:33 < kakimir> in feedback and ground points to inputs
2018-09-02T23:49:41 < kakimir> what do you think of those
2018-09-02T23:49:44 < kakimir> and do I need more?
2018-09-02T23:53:30 < kakimir> no input?
2018-09-02T23:53:50 < kakimir> hey crt
2018-09-02T23:54:06 < kakimir> you are good with analog stuffs
2018-09-02T23:54:42 < kakimir> only if those caps are expensive and sophisticated
2018-09-02T23:54:48 < kakimir> and look goood
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2018-09-02T23:56:09 < kakimir> should I add one serial component line to filter blocks
2018-09-02T23:56:24 < kakimir> after those connected to commons
2018-09-02T23:56:39 < kakimir> what would be cap after that
2018-09-02T23:57:24 < BrainDamage> you're trying to make a generic thing where there isn't one, eg you can't make a transdiode configuration with your pcb
2018-09-02T23:58:02 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-02T23:58:22 < kakimir> let's fix that
2018-09-02T23:58:27 < kakimir> with a pile of testpoints
2018-09-02T23:58:32 < catphish> my ST95 no respond, i sad now
2018-09-02T23:58:35 < kakimir> 3mm testpoints
2018-09-02T23:59:09 < BrainDamage> just put a smd cloverleaf protoboard matrix
2018-09-02T23:59:22 < BrainDamage> and the opamp in the center, with supply caps
2018-09-02T23:59:31 < kakimir> no man
2018-09-02T23:59:37 < kakimir> this madness must be done
2018-09-02T23:59:53 < BrainDamage> ok, don't pretend it'll be universal
--- Day changed Mon Sep 03 2018
2018-09-03T00:00:11 < kakimir> enough test points and it is
2018-09-03T00:00:16 < BrainDamage> however, most of the cases are just 4 components in the feedback branch
2018-09-03T00:00:19 < kakimir> when you add little hacks here and there
2018-09-03T00:00:31 < Steffanx> Real pros do air soldering on custom cut coper...
2018-09-03T00:01:10 < kakimir> BrainDamage: other things that my board can't do?
2018-09-03T00:01:36 < BrainDamage> stability compensations
2018-09-03T00:02:06 < branjb> anyone have an example of f4 i2c bare metal?
2018-09-03T00:03:13 < kakimir> BrainDamage: yes
2018-09-03T00:03:16 < kakimir> that is an issue
2018-09-03T00:05:24 -!- Dave_Elec [~Dave@197.156.103.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-03T00:07:23 < kakimir> that is the issue
2018-09-03T00:08:22 < catphish> zyp: i suddenly understand your point about not working with both unknown-working software and unknown-working hardware simultaneously
2018-09-03T00:10:37 < kakimir> that can take days
2018-09-03T00:11:29 < kakimir> to figure out what is wrong or pebcak
2018-09-03T00:11:53 < Steffanx> Whats the unknown working sw here? Youre sw catphish ?
2018-09-03T00:12:01 < Steffanx> -e
2018-09-03T00:12:16 < kakimir> "there is something wrong with the hardware!"
2018-09-03T00:12:24 < kakimir> "there is something wrong with the software!"
2018-09-03T00:12:45 < kakimir> "I'm never wrong"
2018-09-03T00:12:58 < Steffanx> Just add the test points next time or take the courage to solder to the board :P
2018-09-03T00:13:06 < kakimir> "Oh.. there was no issue actually"
2018-09-03T00:14:44 < kakimir> https://i.imgur.com/wKKrWu9.png sweet life
2018-09-03T00:16:15 < catphish> Steffanx: yes, the software and hardware are both my doing
2018-09-03T00:17:21 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-03T00:19:26 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/eiytk7izb/
2018-09-03T00:20:32 < Cracki> plot twist, not a girl
2018-09-03T00:21:36 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/lyy365rav/
2018-09-03T00:21:53 < Cracki> https://i.imgur.com/3girzXI.jpg
2018-09-03T00:22:03 < Cracki> she's a hero
2018-09-03T00:23:03 < Laurenceb__> *an hero
2018-09-03T00:23:15 < Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOtZXReNOBk
2018-09-03T00:23:22 < Laurenceb__> le rapper autiste
2018-09-03T00:23:54 < tomeaton17> https://i.redd.it/88msx4rptvj11.jpg
2018-09-03T00:24:55 < Laurenceb__> kek
2018-09-03T00:25:04 < Laurenceb__> I wonder if there is a millie B subreddit
2018-09-03T00:25:16 < Laurenceb__> seems autistic enough to get their attention
2018-09-03T00:25:47 < tomeaton17> the retarded fake grime girl?
2018-09-03T00:25:52 < Laurenceb__> yes
2018-09-03T00:25:58 < BrainDamage> maybe we should send tits or gtfo to Laurenceb__'s pm, after all, it's a female name in france
2018-09-03T00:26:07 < Laurenceb__> ikr
2018-09-03T00:26:16 < Laurenceb__> I get tits or gtfo pm's daily
2018-09-03T00:26:16 < tomeaton17> YvesSaintLaurenceb__
2018-09-03T00:26:40 < tomeaton17> what about soph aspin
2018-09-03T00:26:51 < Laurenceb__> too scared to google
2018-09-03T00:26:55 < Laurenceb__> expecting pure autism
2018-09-03T00:27:13 < Laurenceb__> oh wow wut
2018-09-03T00:27:24 < Laurenceb__> narcissism much
2018-09-03T00:27:42 < Laurenceb__> this is more cringe than drill music
2018-09-03T00:27:58 < kakimir> cringe totally
2018-09-03T00:28:15 < kakimir> she knows how internet works
2018-09-03T00:28:31 < Cracki> tits her https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQ5gol2wSw
2018-09-03T00:28:34 < Cracki> e
2018-09-03T00:28:50 < tomeaton17> its pretty old this fake grime kid beef
2018-09-03T00:30:26 < Laurenceb__> Cracki: (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
2018-09-03T00:30:36 < branjb> any way to see an undefined reference function's prototype on the linker line?
2018-09-03T00:30:46 < branjb> getting undefined reference but including the object
2018-09-03T00:31:27 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ;)
2018-09-03T00:31:44 < Cracki> uh... man ld?
2018-09-03T00:32:05 < branjb> on a winblows box at the moment.. guess I could google it
2018-09-03T00:32:11 < Cracki> it's possible the thing doesn't have the whole sig information at that point
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2018-09-03T00:32:21 < Cracki> windows... so msvc linker?
2018-09-03T00:32:23 < Cracki> or gcc?
2018-09-03T00:32:54 < branjb> gcc still
2018-09-03T00:34:20 < Cracki> it works on object files, so either the information is still in a readable format, or would have to be recovered from the code that implements the calling convention
2018-09-03T00:34:35 < Cracki> --demangle perhaps
2018-09-03T00:36:50 < Cracki> I wouldn't bet on the information still being there
2018-09-03T00:37:42 < branjb> the reference should be there, idgi
2018-09-03T00:37:56 < Cracki> reference yes, its type perhaps not
2018-09-03T00:38:20 < branjb> the function involves enum's, wondering if that is it
2018-09-03T00:38:28 < branjb> let me see if a simple void function is undefined
2018-09-03T00:40:22 < branjb> ah thanks, something wrong with the type
2018-09-03T00:40:46 < branjb> on lunix my gcc by default reports shit like:
2018-09-03T00:41:05 < branjb>  undefined reference to `(void)gpio_set_mode(int,int,int)'
2018-09-03T00:41:16 < branjb> but my gcc on windows just says:  undefined reference to `gpio_set_mode'
2018-09-03T00:41:47 < branjb> --demangle didn't seem to turn that on, but i don't see anything in gcc's linker options that would do so
2018-09-03T00:42:17 < zyp> branjb, this sounds like a C vs C++ thing
2018-09-03T00:43:28 < branjb> everything is being compiled with gcc
2018-09-03T00:44:13 < zyp> I mean, gpio_set_mode is a C symbol and as such doesn't have type information embedded, (void)gpio_set_mode(int,int,int) is a demangled C++ symbol
2018-09-03T00:44:17 < kakimir> I just remebered I needed to make seperate filter boards
2018-09-03T00:44:22 < branjb> ah
2018-09-03T00:44:32 < branjb> makes sense since I use g++ at work
2018-09-03T00:45:02 -!- sterna1 [~Adium@c-11b9d954.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-03T00:45:13 < Laurenceb__> https://i.redditmedia.com/xBc5N-dofo3X7Wc7klVwWJHEB5rl2GXb66D_Eg7qLFM.jpg?fit=crop&crop=faces%2Centropy&arh=2&w=640&s=3ef3f4599d67d388be3ed326b49c26e1
2018-09-03T00:45:18 < zyp> you should use g++ for .cpp files and gcc for .c files
2018-09-03T00:45:28 < Cracki> hm, must be an older gcc if there is a gcc with the feature
2018-09-03T00:45:48 < zyp> Cracki, what feature?
2018-09-03T00:45:56 < Cracki> type of undefined ref
2018-09-03T00:46:08 < zyp> did you miss what I just said?
2018-09-03T00:46:12 < zyp> it's C++
2018-09-03T00:46:13 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-03T00:46:15 < Cracki> :P
2018-09-03T00:46:18 < Cracki> I'm reading slowly
2018-09-03T00:46:19 < karlp> Cracki isn't always very good at reading or following along.
2018-09-03T00:47:58 < karlp> sounds like I'm hittin ghttps://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/nuttx/example$20to$20system%7Csort:date/nuttx/NyjejP6MGfw/gFa_ByJ9DAAJ with tagged releases.
2018-09-03T00:48:00 < karlp> good job nuttx.
2018-09-03T00:48:56 < karlp> yep. the defconfigs they ship don't match.
2018-09-03T00:49:01 < karlp> fucking. moronic.
2018-09-03T00:49:19 < zyp> branjb, Cracki, https://paste.jvnv.net/view/rzwI6
2018-09-03T00:49:22 < karlp> "All of the configurations in the repository have already been updated and I have verified that they all still build correctly."
2018-09-03T00:49:25 < karlp> like fuck 
2018-09-03T00:50:13 < Cracki> good to know
2018-09-03T00:50:13 < zyp> are you on a spree evaluating a bunch of rtoses lately?
2018-09-03T00:50:24 < branjb> zyp guess it was a gcc vs g++ thing.. any harm in compiling c sourcode with g++?
2018-09-03T00:50:40 < karlp> well, have been wanting to make some more demos with an rtos for libopencm3, some people had some freerots questions
2018-09-03T00:50:54 < zyp> branjb, well, it becomes C++ source code when you do so
2018-09-03T00:50:59 < karlp> was having nightmares with new freertos and openocd's rtos aware debugging being bsuted
2018-09-03T00:51:09 < karlp> and thought I'd have a quick look at the others they clai to support.
2018-09-03T00:51:20 < karlp> have tried chibi in the past and hated it.
2018-09-03T00:51:25 < karlp> but it did at least build.
2018-09-03T00:51:36 < zyp> C++ is mostly a superset of C, so you are fine for the most part, but there's some pitfalls
2018-09-03T00:52:06 < zyp> and there's no real reason to do so, so why would you want to?
2018-09-03T00:52:58 < karlp> oh, it's nuttx's braindead repo layout.
2018-09-03T00:52:58 < zyp> normally the only reason you would maintain code so it works both as C and C++ are library headers so that the library can be used by C and C++ code
2018-09-03T00:53:05 < karlp> apps are in a separate repo.
2018-09-03T00:53:08 < branjb> gcc compiles the project but g++ doesn't 
2018-09-03T00:53:09 < branjb> haha
2018-09-03T00:53:23 < karlp> so that got checked out at master, and the "main" bit got the latest stable.
2018-09-03T00:53:27 < karlp> and those conflict
2018-09-03T00:53:52 < zyp> branjb, well, there's some stuff that's allowed by C but not C++
2018-09-03T00:54:00 < branjb> enum isn't a c++ statement is it?
2018-09-03T00:54:13 < zyp> C++ is stricter on some points, and C got some new features after they diverged
2018-09-03T00:54:25 < zyp> enums exist in C++ too
2018-09-03T00:54:35 < branjb> but it exists in c right?
2018-09-03T00:54:38 < zyp> but C++ doesn't do separate namespaces for structs and enums the way C does
2018-09-03T00:54:54 < branjb> no idea why a function that contains some enum arguments will link with g++ but gcc says it is undefined
2018-09-03T00:55:23 < zyp> exactly, because in C++ they are in the global namespace, in C they are in a separate enum namespace
2018-09-03T00:55:32 < branjb> ah
2018-09-03T00:55:52 < zyp> so you need to declare the function like void foo(enum blah x);
2018-09-03T00:56:04 < zyp> or just typedef the enum to a global type
2018-09-03T00:56:09 < zyp> typedef enum blah blah;
2018-09-03T00:57:29 < zyp> whatever you want
2018-09-03T00:57:55 < branjb> i've got it, thanks
2018-09-03T00:58:06 < branjb> did not realize I needed to be explicit
2018-09-03T00:58:38 < zyp> tedious shit like that is part of why I prefer C++
2018-09-03T00:59:35 < zyp> half of C++ is like «let's fix that shit that's always been annoying about C» and the other half is «let's add a bunch of new shit that people can be annoyed about» :p
2018-09-03T01:03:36 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-03T01:03:44  * Cracki goes googling "embedded lisp"
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2018-09-03T01:24:14 < kakimir> R2COM is here!
2018-09-03T01:24:24 < kakimir> why so silent latelly?
2018-09-03T01:26:25 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-03T01:30:14 < kakimir> so much innovation
2018-09-03T01:37:37 < Laurenceb__> https://unbound.com/books/mansplaining-masculinity/
2018-09-03T01:39:25 < kakimir> tl;dr
2018-09-03T01:41:46 < catphish> i think i've exhausted all software debugging, really don't want it to be hardware [sadface]
2018-09-03T01:42:18 < kakimir> always have referrence board
2018-09-03T01:42:22 < kakimir> that works
2018-09-03T01:42:51 < kakimir> order disco
2018-09-03T01:43:07 < catphish> no such board exists though :(
2018-09-03T01:43:22 < kakimir> give your MCU part no
2018-09-03T01:43:40 < catphish> i'd have to build a breakout board for the ST95HF
2018-09-03T01:44:03 < catphish> but then how do i know i did that right :)
2018-09-03T01:44:04 < kakimir> do you have connection to your MCY?
2018-09-03T01:44:11 < kakimir> mcu
2018-09-03T01:44:16 < catphish> yeah, MCU works fin
2018-09-03T01:44:19 < catphish> *fine
2018-09-03T01:44:31 < kakimir> what seems to be the issue?
2018-09-03T01:44:52 < catphish> i'm trying to communicate with an ST95HF over SPI
2018-09-03T01:45:05 < catphish> and so far, it's ignoring my attempts
2018-09-03T01:45:22 < kakimir> do you have oscilloscope
2018-09-03T01:45:39 < kakimir> logic analyzer
2018-09-03T01:45:41 < kakimir> anything
2018-09-03T01:45:59 < catphish> logic analyser would be better here, but i will need a clip to get the leads onto the mcu
2018-09-03T01:46:14 < catphish> which reminds me, i should order that
2018-09-03T01:46:21 < kakimir> you didn't testpoint SPI?
2018-09-03T01:46:35 < catphish> i did not :( i'm new to all this :)
2018-09-03T01:47:44 < kakimir> you should testpoint all the busses out of fear by instinct
2018-09-03T01:47:52 < catphish> so yeah, i think the next step is to see if the mcu is actually sending the signals
2018-09-03T01:48:17 < catphish> was silly not to, this isn't even a final board
2018-09-03T01:48:41 < kakimir> any spot to scratch some mask off?
2018-09-03T01:48:48 < catphish> i'd prefer not to
2018-09-03T01:48:57 < kakimir> what do you have to lose?
2018-09-03T01:49:14 < catphish> well if the hardware turns out to be ok, i don't want to damage it
2018-09-03T01:49:20 < catphish> i can achieve what i need to with a clip
2018-09-03T01:49:32 < kakimir> you need to learn to abuse the prototype
2018-09-03T01:49:32 < catphish> (i hope)
2018-09-03T01:50:05 < kakimir> it's just a means to an end
2018-09-03T01:52:27 < catphish> do LQFP32 clips actually exist?
2018-09-03T01:52:31 < catphish> what are they called?
2018-09-03T01:52:31 < kakimir> and always concider first iteration a prototype
2018-09-03T01:52:59 < branjb> some of these clk enable macros (ie __HAL_RCC_I2C1_CLK_ENABLE() ) are all wrapped in a do {} while(0) bracket, what's the reasoning for that?
2018-09-03T01:53:03 < Cracki> what's the part number of the stm32?
2018-09-03T01:53:12 < Cracki> st95hf is the slave, master is interesting too
2018-09-03T01:53:23 < Cracki> branjb, that's so it's a single statement
2018-09-03T01:53:23 < catphish> this is indeed a prototype, but still a fair bit of time and love has to go into constructing it :)
2018-09-03T01:53:27 < Cracki> or rather expression
2018-09-03T01:53:41 < Cracki> it'll expand to something you can put a ; behind
2018-09-03T01:53:52 < Cracki> and it gives the macro a scope to mess around in
2018-09-03T01:54:10 < catphish> Cracki: it's a STM32L031K6
2018-09-03T01:54:15 < Cracki> it also lets you put it in the context of if (...) MACRO();
2018-09-03T01:54:21 < branjb> interesting.. you can't just put the macro in { } brackets?
2018-09-03T01:54:32 < kakimir> catphish: there is clamshell test sockets
2018-09-03T01:54:34 < Cracki> if it weren't a block/statement but something more complex (to the outside), the if would break apart
2018-09-03T01:54:41 < kakimir> and there is adapter boards / breakout boards
2018-09-03T01:54:50 < branjb> i see
2018-09-03T01:55:19 < Cracki> {...} without a while(0) might work, but there isn't supposed to be a ; after a {}
2018-09-03T01:55:28 < Cracki> it'd be a block, and then an empty statement
2018-09-03T01:55:52 < branjb> ah
2018-09-03T01:55:58 < kakimir> catphish: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=LQFP32+test&_sacat=0 you could get some of these and connect with thin wire
2018-09-03T01:56:38 < kakimir> wait 3weeks or so to get it
2018-09-03T01:56:48 < Cracki> and scratch the components off the board :P
2018-09-03T01:57:18 < catphish> ah, "micro test clips" are a thing
2018-09-03T01:57:36 < Cracki> lqfp32 is 0.8mm pin pitch... 
2018-09-03T01:57:50 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1s0hjf-f4HssX36AdDhpuH5BWjAb33v3j/view?usp=sharing work prototype
2018-09-03T01:58:10 < Cracki> you need a bunch of clips. the cheap ones might still work for 0.8mm but might also be too big
2018-09-03T01:58:58 < Cracki> 500 bucks for 10 of these https://www.all-spec.com/Catalog/Test-Measurement/Test-Leads-Connectors/Measuring-Probes/6442-19816
2018-09-03T01:59:09 < catphish> wow
2018-09-03T01:59:19 < Cracki> or ~1-2 bucks/pc for the "ordinary" kind
2018-09-03T01:59:27 < Cracki> that might work for 0.8mm but not much smaller
2018-09-03T01:59:58 < catphish> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5x-Micro-Probe-Grabber-Round-Mini-SMD-IC-Hook-Test-Clip-UK-Seller/273404958204?hash=item3fa83495fc:g:Wv4AAOSwZMNajcYG
2018-09-03T02:00:31 < kakimir> way too big
2018-09-03T02:01:24 < catphish> i'm looking for some with specs :)
2018-09-03T02:01:45 < Cracki> I have an arduino with 0.8mm pitch handy, and my 1.35 bucks/pc clips will short adjacent legs
2018-09-03T02:01:54 < Cracki> forget that
2018-09-03T02:02:03 < catphish> ah ok
2018-09-03T02:02:13 < Cracki> you'll need either an ic clamp or you get it over with and solder onto board or legs
2018-09-03T02:04:37 < catphish> more than likely i just have a short under my ST95HF somewhere
2018-09-03T02:05:06 < catphish> really should have added more test points, could have trivially checked that :(
2018-09-03T02:05:17 < catphish> i guess i'll learn
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2018-09-03T02:06:53 < kakimir> catphish: pic of the board?
2018-09-03T02:07:23 < catphish> not exactly microscope quality but https://i.imgur.com/Y9DFKbS.jpg
2018-09-03T02:07:35 < catphish> there are some vias i can work with
2018-09-03T02:08:18 < kakimir> how is your motor controller project?
2018-09-03T02:08:48 < kakimir> I think your chip might be floating
2018-09-03T02:08:59 < kakimir> how did you do this board catphish ?
2018-09-03T02:09:13 < kakimir> reflow
2018-09-03T02:09:15 < ColdKeyboard> Anyone have an example .jlink script on how to flash STM32 with JLink programmer?
2018-09-03T02:09:16 < catphish> stencil + hot plate reflow
2018-09-03T02:09:48 < kakimir> okay it's good
2018-09-03T02:11:04 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/4961vw9ef/
2018-09-03T02:11:50 < kakimir> weird memes Laurenceb__ 
2018-09-03T02:11:58 < catphish> kakimir: thanks, i'll do some closer investigation as far as i can, it at least partially works, i'm getting a high "no data available" signal from it, so it's powered, but otherwise can't get it to respond
2018-09-03T02:12:18 < catphish> still hoping it's a software error :)
2018-09-03T02:12:46 < kakimir> catphish: your version numbering is modest
2018-09-03T02:13:00 < catphish> lol
2018-09-03T02:13:42 < kakimir> is there any other ground pins to the pack than exposed pad catphish ?
2018-09-03T02:13:43 < catphish> kakimir: wrt my motor control, finished really, it works with my small motor, i lost the desire to build anything bigger
2018-09-03T02:14:11 < kakimir> you could measure all the pins with sharp probe
2018-09-03T02:14:17 < kakimir> if all are at VCC
2018-09-03T02:14:40 < kakimir> means no ground
2018-09-03T02:15:11 < kakimir> VCC or something like VCC - 0.3V or so
2018-09-03T02:15:24 < catphish> kakimir: https://i.imgur.com/jKuYLQf.png
2018-09-03T02:15:35 < catphish> i will try to measure all the pins as you say
2018-09-03T02:15:54 < catphish> see which are shorted to gnd and which to vcc
2018-09-03T02:16:06 < kakimir> many gnd pins
2018-09-03T02:16:12 < kakimir> shouldn't be a problem
2018-09-03T02:16:22 < catphish> most are NC pins, but ST connect them to gnd
2018-09-03T02:17:04 < kakimir> are all but pad NC or configuration pins?
2018-09-03T02:17:34 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjvTy2u9qxE nightshift mosiks
2018-09-03T02:17:43 < catphish> no, the pad is just for heat i think, there are 3 gnd pins i think
2018-09-03T02:18:46 < catphish> "dissipation pad must be connected to gnd", and 3 GND pins
2018-09-03T02:18:56 < catphish> each with independent functions
2018-09-03T02:19:19 < kakimir> where is your via for ground?
2018-09-03T02:20:12 < catphish> actually it's in a really poor place, connected but not very close
2018-09-03T02:20:32 < Cracki> catphish, do you have a multimeter to test (dis)continuity of the unpowered board?
2018-09-03T02:20:39 < Cracki> at least get that over with
2018-09-03T02:20:50 < catphish> https://i.imgur.com/EBKzUWv.png
2018-09-03T02:21:05 < catphish> Cracki: yeah just gonna do that now
2018-09-03T02:21:59 < kakimir> power paths to your chip are a bit meh
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2018-09-03T02:22:18 < kakimir> but you should still be able to initialize comms
2018-09-03T02:22:34 < kakimir> as it shouldn't draw too much current uninitialized
2018-09-03T02:22:42 < Cracki> pins might have shorts to other signal pins, not to ground or vcc
2018-09-03T02:22:48 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-03T02:22:52 < catphish> i'll check as many as i can
2018-09-03T02:22:59 < Cracki> check adjacent ones :P
2018-09-03T02:23:12 < kakimir> miso and vcc are next to each other
2018-09-03T02:23:35 < kakimir> irq miso actually
2018-09-03T02:24:27 < kakimir> you can use SPI pins in GPIO mode with pullups and pulldowns
2018-09-03T02:25:04 < kakimir> then read pin logic state
2018-09-03T02:26:50 < kakimir> compare result with datasheets
2018-09-03T02:28:40 < catphish> no shorts on the io pins, to each other, or power supplies
2018-09-03T02:28:47 < catphish> that's something
2018-09-03T02:32:27 < catphish> no way to test continuity to the IC though
2018-09-03T02:33:17 < catphish> well, dunno, maybe i damaged it, maybe my software is bad, maybe i'm just mildly retarded, i'll see if i can get a logic analyser attached
2018-09-03T02:33:48 < kakimir> have you cleaned flux from QFN pack?
2018-09-03T02:33:58 < kakimir> you know if it turns into this wax thing
2018-09-03T02:34:04 < kakimir> hard stuff
2018-09-03T02:34:12 < catphish> i have not
2018-09-03T02:34:25 < kakimir> it's really hard get contact with even sharp probe
2018-09-03T02:34:31 < kakimir> good contact
2018-09-03T02:35:03 < kakimir> acetone + toothbrush will do it
2018-09-03T02:35:23 < kakimir> I have not seen flux that doesn't surrender to acetone
2018-09-03T02:36:28 < Cracki> the solder stop and ic might...
2018-09-03T02:37:00 < kakimir> I would spare button and that plastic thing in left from acetone some plastics turn into mud
2018-09-03T02:37:21 < Cracki> let's crack the ref manual for that chip
2018-09-03T02:37:43 < Cracki> you are like a parrot
2018-09-03T02:38:29 < Cracki> ref https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/technical/document/reference_manual/21/bd/0f/bd/1c/88/40/f0/DM00108282.pdf/files/DM00108282.pdf/jcr:content/translations/en.DM00108282.pdf
2018-09-03T02:38:48 < Cracki> spi is 26
2018-09-03T02:39:37 < Cracki> prog https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/technical/document/programming_manual/18/b4/a2/d9/87/cd/4f/18/DM00104451.pdf/files/DM00104451.pdf/jcr:content/translations/en.DM00104451.pdf
2018-09-03T02:39:49 < Cracki> hm, not relevant
2018-09-03T02:44:30 < Cracki> that ref was not written by a native english speaker...
2018-09-03T02:45:00 < Cracki> 26.3.7 SPI configuration
2018-09-03T02:45:13 < Cracki> walk through that, see if you got everything
2018-09-03T02:46:38 < Cracki> there's also a code example
2018-09-03T02:50:54 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/rtrqajxs7/
2018-09-03T02:50:54 < Laurenceb__> atlastitrulysee.jpg
2018-09-03T02:50:54 < Laurenceb__> >when u see his muslim flag
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--- Log closed Mon Sep 03 02:50:54 2018
--- Log opened Mon Sep 03 02:51:02 2018
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2018-09-03T02:51:11 < Laurenceb__> my sides just went orbital
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2018-09-03T02:52:04 < Cracki> let me give you a taste of my shoe
2018-09-03T02:54:00 < catphish> kakimir: i do wonder if qfn float is a possibility here, hard for me to know :(
2018-09-03T02:54:11 < Cracki> stop worrying
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2018-09-03T02:54:21 < Cracki> start writing code to test the stm's I/O
2018-09-03T02:54:34 < Cracki> and goddamnit start soldering test wires onto that board
2018-09-03T02:54:58 < Cracki> or scratch the vias free so you can probe them
2018-09-03T02:54:59 < catphish> the stm IO is good, i can see the SPI signals on the vias :)
2018-09-03T02:55:04 < Cracki> good
2018-09-03T02:55:31 < Cracki> then it's maybe a matter of chip enable signal or cpol/cpha or max clock rate or whatever
2018-09-03T02:55:53 < catphish> you may be correct
2018-09-03T02:55:56 < Cracki> search for some arduino code for that slave chip, look at what they do
2018-09-03T02:56:18 < catphish> better, zyp wrote stm32 code for it :)
2018-09-03T02:56:39 < catphish> i'll recheck and recheck some more
2018-09-03T02:57:05 < catphish> alas his STM32 isn't my STM32, so i can't just run it )
2018-09-03T02:59:12 < catphish> thanks for the pointers by the way :)
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2018-09-03T03:13:07 < Laurenceb__> https://postimg.cc/image/yy9jjus9j/
2018-09-03T03:13:11 < Laurenceb__> om nom nom
2018-09-03T03:18:25 < branjb> the f0's i2c peripheral is way simpler than the f4
2018-09-03T03:19:46 < kakimir> lpc is the simplest
2018-09-03T03:22:03 < Thorn> why no Yiu book on cortex-m7
2018-09-03T03:22:38 < Thorn> branjb: also see f7, yet another completely different i2c core
2018-09-03T03:25:12 < branjb> haha
2018-09-03T03:26:32 < Thorn> but none of them are as sane as lpc
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2018-09-03T03:30:04 < dongs> https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41Lh0-5lIUL._SX425_.jpg any idea how to remove just the fan from this sorta shitcooler?
2018-09-03T03:30:18 < dongs> do i just pop the plastic part off somehow or is it attached/glued
2018-09-03T03:30:33 < dongs> some fuckwad brought a box in thats all rusted up and the fan is seized
2018-09-03T03:30:41 < dongs> but I dont wanna replace entire heatsink beacuse fuckit
2018-09-03T03:30:41 < karlp> Thorn: really? f7 has a v3 i2c periph?
2018-09-03T03:31:06 < kakimir> dongs: just pull
2018-09-03T03:31:10 < kakimir> it will break
2018-09-03T03:31:22 < Thorn> I was playing with v3 i2c and I don't have any H7 discovery boards, only F746
2018-09-03T03:31:33 < kakimir> it probs have some locking mechanism to sink with plastic hooks
2018-09-03T03:31:45 < Thorn> iirc
2018-09-03T03:32:26 < karlp> huh, I hadn't looked, what's new and improved in it?
2018-09-03T03:33:10 < Thorn> it's got byte counters
2018-09-03T03:33:16 < karlp> well, I got nuttx working, but oocd still just shows a single thread.
2018-09-03T03:33:26 < Thorn> you preload transfer size and it goes through the states by itself
2018-09-03T03:33:41 < Laurenceb__> Thomas goes to 4chan https://postimg.cc/image/5lnqxbwev/
2018-09-03T03:33:43 < Thorn> you don't need to worry about EV_* crap
2018-09-03T03:33:55 < Thorn> that's what I remember from months ago
2018-09-03T03:36:10 < branjb> somehow a lightning bolt caused my usb peripherals to disconnect and reconnect
2018-09-03T03:36:20 < karlp> Thorn: yeah, that's the "v2" peripheral
2018-09-03T03:36:31 < karlp> don't pay attention to how the ref man says i2crev3, that's something else
2018-09-03T03:37:04 < karlp> same as f0 and l0.
2018-09-03T03:38:27 < Thorn> could be, I don't think I've yet used I2C on F0 lol
2018-09-03T03:38:36 < Thorn> managed to avoid it for a long time
2018-09-03T03:38:41 < karlp> it is. I just compared teh regmaps, tjhey're identical.
2018-09-03T03:39:10 < Thorn> my last board with I2C sensors had lpc824 on it
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2018-09-03T03:44:43 < karlp> hrm, I see the appeal of nuttx.
2018-09-03T03:44:59 < karlp> it's enormous and I don't think I'd wantt o look closely at the board support,
2018-09-03T03:45:14 < karlp> copy/paste city, but it's interesting approahc
2018-09-03T03:45:47 < dongs> lols.
2018-09-03T03:46:50 < dongs> i forget , what project was nuttx originally made for?
2018-09-03T03:47:13 < Laurenceb__> autism
2018-09-03T03:47:46 < dongs> hey it runs on samA5
2018-09-03T03:47:49 < Laurenceb__> nuttx is so bad that chibios is better
2018-09-03T03:47:58 < dongs> i dont doubt it
2018-09-03T03:48:08 < Thorn> 2nd ed of Trevor Martin's book has chapters on m7, dsp and even armv8-m
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2018-09-03T03:48:43 < catphish> curiosity about my soldering was too much for me: https://imgur.com/a/go5pBSE
2018-09-03T03:49:26 < catphish> i can't imagine there's a problem there
2018-09-03T03:49:52 < dongs> lol nuttx supports nfs
2018-09-03T03:49:52 < karlp> lolrence, hae you actually used nuttx?
2018-09-03T03:49:52 < dongs> of course
2018-09-03T03:49:59 < dongs> fuckin autism
2018-09-03T03:51:07 < dongs> i take it you don't compile nuttx in keil eh
2018-09-03T03:51:15 < dongs> probably needs some autistic non-gnu-make build system
2018-09-03T03:51:17 < karlp> it seems to have support for iar,
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2018-09-03T03:51:49 < dongs> wut why is it hosted on sourceforge lloooool
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2018-09-03T03:57:30 < karlp> so many borked dependencies though
2018-09-03T03:57:38 < karlp> why use kconfig if you don't set all the deps
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2018-09-03T03:59:45 < dongs> it uses kconfig? of course heh
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2018-09-03T04:00:39 < karlp> well, bed. way too late for thsi sort of shit.
2018-09-03T04:01:13 < dongs> does F405 have DFU bootloader?
2018-09-03T04:01:23 < karlp> should try mucous 3
2018-09-03T04:01:28 < karlp> used mucous 2 in uni.
2018-09-03T04:01:35 < karlp> they have a "make:r" version now: https://www.micrium.com/makers/getmakers/
2018-09-03T04:01:55 < dongs> hah really
2018-09-03T04:02:58 < dongs> why not just use CMSIS-RTOS
2018-09-03T04:03:03 < dongs> and keil-rtx or wahtever
2018-09-03T04:03:04 < dongs> shit just works
2018-09-03T04:03:11 < dongs> unless you need lunix drivers or wahatever
2018-09-03T04:03:39 < dongs> heh no GUI in freetard version
2018-09-03T04:03:48 < dongs> or CANbugs
2018-09-03T04:03:57 < dongs> https://www.micrium.com/makers/about/
2018-09-03T04:04:09 < dongs> k time to foxconn some crap
2018-09-03T04:06:18 < karlp> dongs: so where do you _actuaLLy_ get rtx?
2018-09-03T04:06:22 < karlp> cmsis-rtos is just an api.
2018-09-03T04:06:35 < karlp> you get rtx with mdk, but only licensed for stm32f0
2018-09-03T04:07:11 < karlp> gonna go back to freertos probably, and just ignore oocd's busted support for it.
2018-09-03T04:07:27 < dongs> https://www.keil.com/demo/eval/rtx.htm
2018-09-03T04:07:35 < dongs> karlp: no, y ou just download it
2018-09-03T04:07:41 < dongs> the /eval/ is just bullshit, you just get full sores
2018-09-03T04:07:46 < dongs> that you can add to proj
2018-09-03T04:08:02 < dongs> interface is not bad also, its basically just does tasks / queues / whaetver. no extra bullshit
2018-09-03T04:08:27 < karlp> wat, that's so dumb. I was on another page earlier that said you got it as part of mdk
2018-09-03T04:08:36 < dongs> yeah they're retarded
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2018-09-03T04:41:59 < branjb> anyone used the f4 i2c peripheral?  I set start bit and then wait for the start bit set in the status register, but it never sets
2018-09-03T04:42:36 < branjb> if I look at the other i2c periph reg's, the start bit in CR1 is reset but stop bit is set
2018-09-03T04:42:45 < branjb> would be nice to have state machine diagrams or something
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2018-09-03T04:57:20 < dongs> which F4? i think some have different i2c periph
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2018-09-03T05:09:59 < branjb> f429
2018-09-03T05:10:13 < jadew> lol, Paris decided to act against the piss stench in the city... with open air urinals: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45174382
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2018-09-03T05:10:52 < bitmask> to wet your appetite: https://youtu.be/jXMKqOykN-A
2018-09-03T05:11:06 < bitmask> and then watch: https://youtu.be/acKDpIwAhnk
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2018-09-03T05:12:44 < dongs> you were doing pretty good until you decided to go full retard
2018-09-03T05:13:04 < bitmask> someone posted it in a facebook group, I couldn't resist
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2018-09-03T05:29:45 < jadew> https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-latin-america-45392407/national-museum-of-brazil-consumed-by-fire
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2018-09-03T05:38:02 < dongs> http://www.sase.com.ar/2013/files/2013/09/SASE2013-ARM_Trace.pdf
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2018-09-03T06:00:28 < jadew> I made an important discovery
2018-09-03T06:00:34 < dongs> you are a jew?
2018-09-03T06:00:40 < jadew> I'm not
2018-09-03T06:00:56 < jadew> but if I was, this would be bigger than that
2018-09-03T06:01:30 < jadew> you know how on aliexpress you can add pictures to your feedback?
2018-09-03T06:01:53 < dongs> i guess, i never used fagexpress so
2018-09-03T06:02:25 < jadew> well, turns out women add a lot of feedback for bikinis and other such clothing
2018-09-03T06:02:50 < dongs> gross
2018-09-03T06:02:55 < jadew> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2017-Sexy-Woman-badpak-Bikini-Bottoms-Swimwear-Swim-Shorts-Swimwear-Female-mayo-Beach-Wear-Lady-s/32803240213.html
2018-09-03T06:03:02 < jadew> check the feedback
2018-09-03T06:04:00 < dongs> actually i donno where feedback is
2018-09-03T06:04:15 < dongs> oh feedback tab?
2018-09-03T06:04:16 < jadew> next to the stars at the top (under the name of the article)
2018-09-03T06:04:23 < jadew> you can click there
2018-09-03T06:04:27 < jadew> and it takes you to feedback
2018-09-03T06:04:33 < jadew> then you can click "with pictures"
2018-09-03T06:04:37 < dongs> thats some awful shit
2018-09-03T06:05:01 < jadew> most of it, yeah
2018-09-03T06:05:29 < dongs> now i need to click feedback on arduino producs
2018-09-03T06:05:38 < dongs> to wash this shit out of my eyes
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2018-09-03T06:07:41 < dongs> cjbaird wouldprobly be interested
2018-09-03T06:07:45 < dongs> upgrdman signed off to fap
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2018-09-03T06:07:56 < dongs> emeb_mac probly too
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2018-09-03T06:20:11 < cjbaird> fuuuuuuuuuuuuuu. Friday arvo: "Your scooter-that's-be-at-the-mechanics-for-3-months just needs a test-ride before it's ready! Oh. It's pissing down rain." Monday: "Hey, let's piss down rain again after a weekend of great weather!"
2018-09-03T06:24:54 < englishman> hi baird
2018-09-03T06:25:08 < englishman> why would a guy like you take a scooter to a shop? what kind of scooter
2018-09-03T06:26:06 < dongs> i think he fucked it up after like 20k km ride
2018-09-03T06:26:19 < dongs> and it probably needed complete overhaul
2018-09-03T06:28:11 < cjbaird> 70,000 kms. It blew a sprag clutch (one-way clutch over the crankshaft), and being a Italian-made Piaggio, needed all the parts and tools imported, which took a month in itself.
2018-09-03T06:28:34 < cjbaird> This is the scoot I've had for 10 years..
2018-09-03T06:28:50 < dongs> you should get into ebikes
2018-09-03T06:28:52 < dongs> easier to maintain
2018-09-03T06:28:59 < dongs> instead of this crap you have
2018-09-03T06:29:47 < cjbaird> That's actually the plan for the 3rd Around-AU trip.. aka SunTrip solar-panels-on-trailer style.
2018-09-03T06:30:34 < cjbaird> Also bloody waiting on Honda to start selling that EV SuperCub that was supposed to be in the shop back in March..
2018-09-03T06:31:32 < englishman> i think even in australia solar panels won't produce enough electricity to pull their own weight
2018-09-03T06:31:39 < englishman> just find a plug
2018-09-03T06:32:29 < cjbaird> More that Solar Panels get you outted as a Communist here.
2018-09-03T06:34:30 < dongs> https://www.honda.co.jp/SUPERCUB/personal/60thspecial/ this is what japs release instead of EV version
2018-09-03T06:34:59 < cjbaird> Broken Hill, Outback Australia. pop. 25,000. 40C Heat and sunshine 364.25 days of the year. Electricity wired in from South Australia and like twice the NSW average price. Solar panels? COMMIE
2018-09-03T06:36:03 < cjbaird> Been using the CT110/Postie while the X7 was being repaired.
2018-09-03T06:38:40 < cjbaird> At least that 60th Honda has a real speedo, instead of smartdisplay crap.
2018-09-03T06:42:39 < cjbaird> Was a project here to replace the clock on the X7 with a ESP8266+OLED. Oscillator drift killed that idea (~30 seconds/hour), even if it could wirelessly NTP. 
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2018-09-03T06:59:47 < dongs> lmao esp1488 project
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2018-09-03T07:02:03 < cjbaird> Got one of those stamp-sized boards, that was just the right size to replace the clock module..
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2018-09-03T07:05:48 < cjbaird> Something I did finish was a Satellite ephemeris 'clock', done up for predicting AMSATs. MSP430F5510. GCC didn't support double-precision floats, so te big accomplishment was doing accurate modelling with single (that normally had ~30 second error). Used the Thall "float2" paper to make it happen.
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2018-09-03T08:15:35 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKald030bxU
2018-09-03T08:17:23 < englishman> rofl
2018-09-03T08:25:41 < dongs> lewl, altidumb was gonna hold a local 4day free seminar on advanced altidumb+solidworks
2018-09-03T08:25:46 < dongs> ... got delayed cuz nobody signed up
2018-09-03T08:27:16 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/6rG3bze.jpg
2018-09-03T08:27:31 < dongs> lool
2018-09-03T08:27:39 < dongs> that fucking apple watch
2018-09-03T08:27:41 < dongs> what a god damn faggot
2018-09-03T08:27:48 < englishman> someone may have found an altidumb course cert generator
2018-09-03T08:28:27 < dongs> but they can't generate cute presentrer chicks
2018-09-03T08:28:30 < dongs> presenter
2018-09-03T08:29:24 < englishman> good, i prefer the monotone of a skilled engineer in any case
2018-09-03T08:29:56 < dongs> i donno, if their last webinar is any example, the dude running it is just as clueless as R2COM
2018-09-03T08:30:32 < dongs> this faggot at dickstarterplace still insists using summer2003 or wahtever the fuck altidumb
2018-09-03T08:30:56 < dongs> and routes everything off-grid
2018-09-03T08:31:15 < dongs> and keeps sending me files with layers turned off and no 3d models/copypasted footprints, 
2018-09-03T08:31:24 < englishman> gross
2018-09-03T08:31:25 < dongs> one board I got had FOUR different 0603 cap footprints
2018-09-03T08:31:26 < dongs> motherfucker
2018-09-03T08:31:56 < englishman> i kinda like that, i can charge for 3-4 extra bom lines
2018-09-03T08:31:56 < dongs> and he bitches at me that my "bom" doens't include part numbers
2018-09-03T08:32:13 < dongs> except who teh fuck caresa bout part number for a 10K resistor
2018-09-03T08:32:26 < dongs> even in my machine i just have the shit registered as R610K
2018-09-03T08:32:43 < dongs> and i'll load wahtever 10k 1% is closet to me
2018-09-03T08:33:32 < dongs> NHK emailed me about an app I made for them in 2013
2018-09-03T08:33:39 < dongs> they wanted something changed.
2018-09-03T08:33:48 < dongs> i opened old .sln in vs2017 and rebuilt
2018-09-03T08:33:59 < dongs> apparently it made the fucking thing not runnable on XP
2018-09-03T08:34:14 < dongs> had to commit sudoku and retarded to XP
2018-09-03T08:34:19 < dongs> retarget rather
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2018-09-03T10:22:32 < day> cjbaird: thats why we are here. here in this world arduino doesn't exist :^)
2018-09-03T10:22:44 < day> ups not scrolled down
2018-09-03T10:25:22 < cjbaird> In this world there is more than 2 kilobytes of sram. goddam.
2018-09-03T10:28:29 < cjbaird> Got the phonecall from mechanic \o/ ... half-way through the conversation a cloudburst happens .. 30mins walking to busstop in cloudburst .. 40mins riding home through peak-hour traffic, 30m of that standing at lights.. in a cloudburst. fuuuuuuuuu
2018-09-03T10:33:45 < Steffanx> Awh
2018-09-03T10:34:03 < Steffanx> Where in the aussieland are you cjbaird 
2018-09-03T10:34:10 < Steffanx> Melbourne?
2018-09-03T10:34:33 < cjbaird> Newcastle. (Was Sydney 5 years ago.)
2018-09-03T10:36:35 < Steffanx> Hm thats a bit far then. Was gonna send you one a date with crt 
2018-09-03T10:39:58 < cjbaird> Can definitely recommend that Thall float2 work for fake double-precision. Performance wise there's 'only' a 5x slowdown compared to single float calc. http://andrewthall.org/papers/df64_qf128.pdf .. The guy has mad homepage skills, too.
2018-09-03T10:40:55 < cjbaird> Numerically stable, etc., as well.
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2018-09-03T11:04:13 < Hamilton> pfff...discord just disabled my account without a single warning 
2018-09-03T11:04:31 < Hamilton> I've used a disposable email, so I guess that made them angry
2018-09-03T11:04:49 < Hamilton> Earlier I used a legit email
2018-09-03T11:05:09 < Hamilton> Then after sometime it was asking me my phone number and I didn't give it to them
2018-09-03T11:05:23 < Hamilton> They said that's how things are and prevented to access my account
2018-09-03T11:05:29 < Hamilton> 2 times
2018-09-03T11:07:28 < Hamilton> The amount of Instagram generation kidz, complying with these requests is too damn high
2018-09-03T11:07:46 < Hamilton> I guess we  have become the minority :(
2018-09-03T11:08:37 < Hamilton> That's a hug?
2018-09-03T11:08:44 < Hamilton> lol
2018-09-03T11:19:43 < qyx> its leads are funny
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2018-09-03T12:28:13 < tomeaton17> https://www.quora.com/Is-online-Ear-Rape-a-crime
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2018-09-03T13:11:22 < kakimir> what kind of compensation circuit I may need with V/2 voltage buffer if any?
2018-09-03T13:12:19 < BrainDamage> none if the opamp is intrinsecally stable, which near the totality are
2018-09-03T13:13:54 < kakimir> this one is
2018-09-03T13:14:25 < kakimir> BrainDamage: MCP601
2018-09-03T13:14:30 < kakimir> cheap cheap
2018-09-03T13:15:52 < kakimir> also low power and whatnot
2018-09-03T13:17:17 < jpa-> depends also on the load, though
2018-09-03T13:17:34 < jpa-> some opamps are a bit annoyed if you put a lot of capacitance on the output
2018-09-03T13:17:43 < BrainDamage> yes, cap on the output can make it unstable
2018-09-03T13:17:46 < kakimir> I have done some tests
2018-09-03T13:18:03 < kakimir> I don't know how to properly tune op amp circuits
2018-09-03T13:18:15 < kakimir> all I know if I throw capacitance in there it goes into shit
2018-09-03T13:19:13 < jpa-> you can also try setting less than unity gain, it will also ruin stability
2018-09-03T13:19:34 < BrainDamage> the theoretical side requires you to understand pole and zeros are
2018-09-03T13:19:42 < BrainDamage> and loop gain
2018-09-03T13:19:59 < kakimir> should I add place for resistor in feedback?
2018-09-03T13:21:15 < kakimir> this is just prototype board so I can go to my mentor and he can show me tricks
2018-09-03T13:21:30 < kakimir> or I can do a little experiments myself
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2018-09-03T13:22:02 < kakimir> this is not "general amplifier board" I showed yesterday
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2018-09-03T13:22:21 < kakimir> this is little on cable board to work project
2018-09-03T13:22:36 < BrainDamage> there's multiple compensation systems, series resistor at output, snubber network, series resistor + capacitor in feedback, etc
2018-09-03T13:23:41 < BrainDamage> if you don't care to squeeze out performance, simple series resistor will suffice
2018-09-03T13:25:07 < BrainDamage> see AN2653, the formulas will be correct, just not the values
2018-09-03T13:25:25 < kakimir> I have 1meter wire between controller and this sensor side board
2018-09-03T13:25:44 < kakimir> there is 10k 100nF RC filter
2018-09-03T13:26:35 < kakimir> should I move some of the resistance to this side board?
2018-09-03T13:27:11 < kakimir> and there must be resistance on controller board to limit current to clamp in case of cable failure
2018-09-03T13:34:43 < karlp> heh, dongs always raving about how awesome windows is, running things, had to rebuid things for xp though
2018-09-03T13:35:56 < kakimir> thanks for tips BrainDamage. I think it will be oright - signal is already totally stable thru RC filter at least
2018-09-03T13:36:10 < kakimir> solid ADC value
2018-09-03T13:37:07 < kakimir> I just need to prepaire for EMI tests and shiets
2018-09-03T13:38:50 < kakimir> I have one that I never completed
2018-09-03T13:38:57 < jpa-> karlp: nuttx has been an interesting experience, but "copy-paste city" is 100% accurate description:)
2018-09-03T13:39:04 < kakimir> that is to be connected to rtl-sdr dongle!
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2018-09-03T13:42:56 < tctw> engage sexy times.
2018-09-03T13:43:22 < kakimir> o/
2018-09-03T13:44:00 < tctw> no need to thank me - I have been brought to this world to spread joy & happyness
2018-09-03T13:44:05 < jpa-> https://www.active.com/statesville-nc/camping/camp/2018-tctw-application-to-travel-2017    is this what tctw stands for?
2018-09-03T13:44:22 < tctw> exactly.
2018-09-03T13:44:39 < jpa-> and you're engaging sexy times on that tour?
2018-09-03T13:45:03 < tctw> I can neither confirm nor deny that.
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2018-09-03T13:48:37 < tctw> probably dayjobbing
2018-09-03T13:54:51 < zyp> tctw, sup?
2018-09-03T13:54:52 < karlp> jpa-: re nuttx, I see how nice it can be to write apps, but I'm a little confused how you're meant to use the hardware, 
2018-09-03T13:55:09 < karlp> is it just, "everything's a file, use system calls on it, we'll take care of the rest" ?
2018-09-03T14:01:37 < catphish> morning
2018-09-03T14:10:28 < jpa-> karlp: not sure how it's meant to be, but i usually write my own devices using the low-level interfaces
2018-09-03T14:10:54 < jadew> crt, did you build one of those?
2018-09-03T14:11:29 < karlp> what are the "low level interfaces" ?
2018-09-03T14:11:36 < jpa-> e.g. i'd have /dev/audio_in character device, which might internally use the SPI_SEND() etc. functions (which are quite similar to whatever function-based api in libopencm3 etc.)
2018-09-03T14:12:10 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-03T14:12:28 < jadew> how sensitive are they? (didn't read the article)
2018-09-03T14:12:29 < karlp> jpa-: so you add these yourself to your local copy of bnuttx/drivers?
2018-09-03T14:12:47 < jpa-> no, i keep them separate in my own dirs, and just link them in
2018-09-03T14:13:08 < karlp> hrm, not sure how far I want to go on this to see how it all fits together.
2018-09-03T14:13:23 < jadew> heh, wanted to save that article but it looks I already saved it in 2015
2018-09-03T14:13:27 < karlp> need to look at some more of the examplesx I guess.
2018-09-03T14:13:30 < jpa-> (I call register_driver() from a C++ static constructor in each driver class, actually)
2018-09-03T14:14:27 < karlp> I tried the modbus xamples yesterday and it hangs nsh when I try and start it.
2018-09-03T14:14:42 < karlp> not sure whether it's brokne, or whether the config is missing threading or what.
2018-09-03T14:14:51 < jpa-> quite common error mode if there is some conflict in configurations
2018-09-03T14:14:55 < karlp> the menuconfig dependency checking is.... compeltely absent.
2018-09-03T14:15:52 < jpa-> even after all these years, i'm not sure what to think about nuttx; on one hand, it is a big mess; on other hand, i'm still not sure what if any would have been better fit for the project i use it for
2018-09-03T14:15:55 < karlp> so do you have your own nuttx buildroot then? or do you use the g-a-e regular download?
2018-09-03T14:16:06 < jpa-> normal gcc-arm-embedded
2018-09-03T14:16:36 < jpa-> i just have "nuttx" and "apps" and "nxwidgets" subfolders inside my own git repo
2018-09-03T14:17:09 < catphish> zyp: thanks for the help last night, never did get the ST95HF to respond in any way, i'll either persist, or build a second board and hope it's a hardware issue :)
2018-09-03T14:17:14 < jpa-> which are mostly intact, except for some small patches that couldn't be done out of tree but are still too specific to upstream
2018-09-03T14:17:40 < zyp> catphish, you should probably consider getting a logic analyzer if you don't already have one
2018-09-03T14:19:50 < catphish> zyp: i do have one, my design lacks useful test points though, i was able to test vias and the signals from the MCU look as i'd expect
2018-09-03T14:22:36 < catphish> and the hardware *looks* ok, so i'm pretty baffled
2018-09-03T14:23:27 < catphish> best course of action is probably to design a new board with a ton of test points and start over
2018-09-03T14:24:52 < Cracki> have you started the software from scratch
2018-09-03T14:25:00 < catphish> yes
2018-09-03T14:25:13 < Cracki> have you probed the accessible lines with the LA?
2018-09-03T14:25:18 < catphish> yes
2018-09-03T14:25:29 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ you're cursed
2018-09-03T14:25:37 < catphish> they look as expected, signals from the MCU are good, nothing in response
2018-09-03T14:25:52 < Cracki> so the chip is dead or what
2018-09-03T14:25:55 < Cracki> any life signs?
2018-09-03T14:26:03 < catphish> it's plausible my solder isn't as good as i think, or i've screwed up some timing, or i've fried the IC
2018-09-03T14:26:29 < catphish> too many possibilities, i think i might as well start with a new board with better test points so i can LA all the lines at once
2018-09-03T14:26:52 < catphish> and simultaneously eliminate the (small) possibility that it's actually a dead IC
2018-09-03T14:27:09 < catphish> china dont take long to ship boards :)
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2018-09-03T14:47:50 < catphish> i finally got round to pushing the code, this is what i'm trying to do - https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/main.c
2018-09-03T14:49:15 < dongs> gross
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2018-09-03T14:51:12 < catphish> entirely
2018-09-03T14:56:28 < catphish> but the silly thing doesn't want to wake up :(
2018-09-03T14:57:40 < mawk> I cut my hands with a rusty metal-cutting saw
2018-09-03T14:57:49 < mawk> I'm going to die from tetanos
2018-09-03T14:57:50 < catphish> good idea
2018-09-03T14:58:01 < catphish> i died once
2018-09-03T14:59:25 < mawk> is the thing you're building advancing good ?
2018-09-03T15:00:58 < catphish> no
2018-09-03T15:01:02 < mawk> :(
2018-09-03T15:01:18 < catphish> i finished building a thing, the thing doesn't work, now i'm sad
2018-09-03T15:01:32 < catphish> and have learned a valuable lesson about test points on early prototypes
2018-09-03T15:01:37 < dongs> https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/main.c#L6
2018-09-03T15:01:40 < dongs> this surely cannot work as you expect
2018-09-03T15:01:43 < dongs> none of the shit is volatile
2018-09-03T15:01:49 < mawk> can't you just scratch of the mask ?
2018-09-03T15:02:01 < mawk> for the current révision
2018-09-03T15:02:41 < catphish> dongs: my busy loop? seems to work, the nop() is volatile i guess that's enough
2018-09-03T15:03:33 < dongs> catphish: is that your ENTIRE program
2018-09-03T15:03:42 < dongs> because you're not turning on any peripherals etc
2018-09-03T15:03:57 < dongs> or did you remove shit
2018-09-03T15:04:00 < dongs> like setup() or wahtever
2018-09-03T15:04:08 < catphish> dongs: setup here: https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/system.c
2018-09-03T15:04:16 < catphish> that's all of it
2018-09-03T15:04:37 < catphish> the serial port and LED work fine :)
2018-09-03T15:07:06 < catphish> anyway, i can't really debug it, or expect anyone else to do so without proper LA traces
2018-09-03T15:07:23 < catphish> maybe i'll try soldering to the MCU pins or scraping off mask
2018-09-03T15:07:33 < dongs> i did ST95 stuff too.. lemme see what my shit looked like
2018-09-03T15:07:35 < dongs> to peek/poke at it
2018-09-03T15:08:15 < catphish> the problem i have it that i get absolutely nothing, no signs of life apart from a high signal on the IRQ_OUT port
2018-09-03T15:09:14 < dongs> did you hookup wake pin?
2018-09-03T15:09:38 < catphish> i believe that's IRQ_IN, and yes
2018-09-03T15:10:04 < dongs> yea it is
2018-09-03T15:10:07 < catphish> https://nutty.tk/nfc10.pdf
2018-09-03T15:10:13 < catphish> that's the circuit
2018-09-03T15:15:37 < dongs> are you sure your wake logic isnt reversed
2018-09-03T15:16:26 < dongs> ah yeah
2018-09-03T15:16:47 < dongs> at power up you gotta low it for > 10us. and you back up. and youre doing that.
2018-09-03T15:18:52 < con3> so it looks like setting the transfercomplete callback for the dma when using spi does nothing?
2018-09-03T15:23:22 < catphish> dongs: thanks for checking
2018-09-03T15:23:54 < catphish> i realise the current code is extremely crude, it does everything slowly for testing
2018-09-03T15:24:29 < catphish> i'll just build a new board, new components, better test points, eliminate several mistakes / possible problems at once
2018-09-03T15:24:35 < zyp> catphish, did you remember to wake up the chip?
2018-09-03T15:24:40 < dongs> we just went through that
2018-09-03T15:24:43 < dongs> apparently he does
2018-09-03T15:24:44 < catphish> zyp: sadly yes
2018-09-03T15:24:51 < zyp> okay, I haven't been following
2018-09-03T15:24:53 < dongs> i dont trust his shitty delay code but I guess it works
2018-09-03T15:25:12 < dongs> https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/main.c#L18
2018-09-03T15:25:14 < dongs> thats his wakeup shit
2018-09-03T15:25:54 < catphish> the delay code absolutely works, as evidenced by the LED visibly blinking
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2018-09-03T15:28:12 < qyx> anyone into queues? freertos
2018-09-03T15:28:46 < qyx> I want to pass a structure to another task by reference
2018-09-03T15:29:02 < zyp> qyx, allocated where?
2018-09-03T15:29:20 < qyx> but I lso want a confirmation that the work on the structure is done so I can modify th structure
2018-09-03T15:29:48 < zyp> doesn't sounds like a queue is what you want
2018-09-03T15:30:14 < qyx> I assume it can be done with 2 semaphores too
2018-09-03T15:30:34 < zyp> how many different structures are this task supposed to work on?
2018-09-03T15:31:06 < qyx> lets say it is a worker which requires some resources
2018-09-03T15:31:16 < qyx> which have to be shared among multiple other tasks
2018-09-03T15:31:27 < qyx> so it has an "api" using some kind of ipc
2018-09-03T15:31:43 < qyx> every tasks has its own buffer & struct
2018-09-03T15:31:52 < qyx> and I want to pass it zero-copy style to the worker
2018-09-03T15:32:18 < qyx> but obviously when the work is passed to the worker, the task should not modify the structure if the work is not done
2018-09-03T15:33:00 < qyx> it would be super easy with queues which have copied contents
2018-09-03T15:33:02 < karlp> don't put on the queue then?
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2018-09-03T15:33:15 < qyx> it is not that easy with a queue and semaphore to confirm that the work is done
2018-09-03T15:33:19 < qyx> because race conditions
2018-09-03T15:34:25 < qyx> ok, but then every task has to consider stack usage of the worker
2018-09-03T15:34:32 < qyx> and thats the thing I would like to avoid
2018-09-03T15:34:38 < qyx> hence the decoupling with the ipc
2018-09-03T15:34:59 < zyp> hang on, let's try this again
2018-09-03T15:35:43 < zyp> you have a worker task, that can get work objects from multiple other tasks, you wanna pass these work objects as references through a queue, right?
2018-09-03T15:35:53 < qyx> xactly
2018-09-03T15:36:05 < zyp> the reference is a pointer to a struct of some standardized format
2018-09-03T15:36:09 < qyx> yes
2018-09-03T15:36:34 < zyp> in that case, I'd put a semaphore in the struct
2018-09-03T15:36:51 < qyx> then there is a problem
2018-09-03T15:37:09 < qyx> because righ after you do a queue_send, you should wait on a semaphore
2018-09-03T15:37:22 < qyx> but the worker may be faster
2018-09-03T15:37:38 < qyx> and after doing queue_receive it tries to signal the semaphore
2018-09-03T15:37:41 < qyx> but nobody waits
2018-09-03T15:37:43 < qyx> yet
2018-09-03T15:38:01 < zyp> is that a problem? shouldn't waiting for the semaphore just return if it's already set?
2018-09-03T15:38:22 < qyx> in freertos no apparently
2018-09-03T15:39:07 < zyp> let's see
2018-09-03T15:39:27 < zyp> owner calls xSemaphoreCreateBinary() when initializing the work
2018-09-03T15:39:35 < zyp> worker calls xSemaphoreGive() when it's done
2018-09-03T15:39:46 < zyp> owner calls xSemaphoreTake() when it's waiting
2018-09-03T15:40:12 < qyx> I though the same
2018-09-03T15:40:12 < qyx> but
2018-09-03T15:40:19 < qyx> Semaphores are implemented using queues. An error can occur if there is no space on the queue to post a message - indicating that the semaphore was not first obtained correctly.
2018-09-03T15:40:42 < qyx> it looks that you have to "take" it first in order to be able to "give" it
2018-09-03T15:40:59 < qyx> if not, xSemaphoreGive fails
2018-09-03T15:41:00 < zyp> hmm, you're right
2018-09-03T15:41:08 < zyp> "The semaphore must have previously been created with a call to xSemaphoreCreateBinary(), xSemaphoreCreateMutex() or xSemaphoreCreateCounting(), and obtained using sSemaphoreTake()."
2018-09-03T15:42:36 < zyp> well, in that case I guess you can just create a queue instead
2018-09-03T15:43:01 < zyp> one byte should be enough, worker just sends a finish token when it's done, owner waits for finish token
2018-09-03T15:43:45 < zyp> alternatively you could use the task notification api, just leave the owner task handle in the struct and send it a notification
2018-09-03T15:43:54 < zyp> but that might conflict if you're already using that for something else
2018-09-03T15:45:15 < qyx> yep, I saw the task notification api, it could be the solution
2018-09-03T15:45:53 < qyx> I'll try with the queue
2018-09-03T15:46:25 < zyp> I'm using task notifications to signal my tasks from ISRs
2018-09-03T15:47:08 < zyp> hmm
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2018-09-03T15:57:02 < qyx> I think there was a rtos which had primitives for that
2018-09-03T15:57:05 < qyx> mailboxes or whatever
2018-09-03T15:58:38 < srk> yeah, in recent versions
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2018-09-03T16:20:26 < kakimir> so deal with SOD123FL is that it sits in same footprint than SOD123?
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2018-09-03T16:33:15 < jadew> any good general purpose simulation software?
2018-09-03T16:33:31 < karlp> how long's a ball of string
2018-09-03T16:33:55 < jadew> I've been using proteus in the past, but I wonder if you can do better, since that thing is very old
2018-09-03T16:40:13 < kakimir> ltspice
2018-09-03T16:40:42 < englishman> minecraft
2018-09-03T17:18:56 < jadew> kakimir, thanks, already had ltspice but I'm not a big fan of the way it does schematic capture
2018-09-03T17:25:08 < Cracki> >schematic capture with minecraft
2018-09-03T17:25:32 < aandrew> lol
2018-09-03T17:25:41 < Cracki> if you want "general purpose" simulation, look at matlab/simulink/simscape
2018-09-03T17:26:25 < jadew> I forgot to also add "free" to the list of adjectives
2018-09-03T17:26:50 < Cracki> add another, the Triangle of Impossibility is dangling
2018-09-03T17:27:10 < Cracki> falstad circuitjs :P
2018-09-03T17:27:28 < jadew> was look at that 
2018-09-03T17:27:42 < jadew> I like the animated diagrams
2018-09-03T17:29:06 < jadew> I guess qucs it is
2018-09-03T17:29:58 < jadew> it's what I'm used to anyway, but I have no warm feelings for it either
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2018-09-03T17:41:23 < kakimir> which side of cable I should connect cable shield to ground and which side I need to use capacitor?
2018-09-03T17:41:34 < kakimir> controller side or sensor side?
2018-09-03T17:41:50 < kakimir> controller supplies voltage to sensor and sensor gives analog signal back
2018-09-03T17:42:47 < jadew> both if possible
2018-09-03T17:43:03 < jadew> you mean earth, right?
2018-09-03T17:43:09 < jadew> not actual ground?
2018-09-03T17:43:36 < Cracki> "both" implies both devices are properly grounded
2018-09-03T17:43:42 < Cracki> earthed*
2018-09-03T17:43:56 < Cracki> do you need any galvanic separation?
2018-09-03T17:44:15 < Cracki> what supplies the sensor?
2018-09-03T17:45:02 < jadew> you don't want to have return currents through the shield, so make sure you're not using it as a conductor
2018-09-03T17:45:04 < Cracki> uh... if controller supplies, just connect shield to controller's ground and shield to sensor's ground?
2018-09-03T17:45:17 < Cracki> hmhm
2018-09-03T17:46:12 < Cracki> makes sense. if current moves in the shield, that would affect signals inside the shield
2018-09-03T17:46:26 < tctw> time to update the altium
2018-09-03T17:46:32 < tctw> wish me luck
2018-09-03T17:47:44 < Cracki> analog is magic https://learnemc.com/identifying-current-paths
2018-09-03T17:48:35 < Cracki> https://learnemc.com/identifying-current-paths
2018-09-03T17:50:48 < tctw> always double link to ensure proper content delivery!
2018-09-03T17:52:04 < jadew> these guys seem to imply that for low frequency stuff it's no biggie: https://www.emcstandards.co.uk/bonding-cable-shields-at-both-ends-to-reduce-no
2018-09-03T17:53:01 < Cracki> uh, copying the link must have failed
2018-09-03T17:53:09 < Cracki> https://www.analogictips.com/faq-ground-rules-earth-chassis-signal-ground-faq/
2018-09-03T17:53:16 < Cracki> https://www.rane.com/note151.html
2018-09-03T17:53:30 < kakimir> no you don't want to connect both ends
2018-09-03T17:53:38 < kakimir> directly
2018-09-03T17:54:04 < kakimir> if you have seperate gnd conductor
2018-09-03T17:54:21 < kakimir> if you don't have then you have no choise
2018-09-03T17:54:27 < Cracki> chassis ground vs signal ground
2018-09-03T17:54:57 < kakimir> In controller end I have now only one ground
2018-09-03T17:55:12 < kakimir> and will have only one ground
2018-09-03T17:56:00 < kakimir> http://www.epanorama.net/documents/groundloop/cable_shielding.html
2018-09-03T17:56:01 < jadew> if I recall correctly (and I'm not sure about this), the proper way of connecting the shield is to connect it to the chasy (and it can be connected on both ends), while the chasy is earthed
2018-09-03T17:56:16 < kakimir> I have no earth
2018-09-03T17:56:17 < jadew> and then you connect your ground through a resistor (or maybe inductor?) to the earth connection
2018-09-03T17:56:24 < kakimir> and it's not mains device
2018-09-03T17:56:34 < kakimir> I have no chasy
2018-09-03T17:56:46 < kakimir> just piece of aluminum and plastic cover
2018-09-03T17:56:56 < kakimir> sensor side is all plastivc
2018-09-03T17:57:02 < Cracki> both ends of shield to chassis is also what I read in one of the links
2018-09-03T17:57:12 < Cracki> (and both chassis so earth or something)
2018-09-03T17:57:27 < Cracki> but that's with separate signal ground, or differential signals
2018-09-03T17:57:34 < jadew> yeah, because that makes sense, but what do you do when you don't have an earth connection?
2018-09-03T17:57:41 < kakimir> usually you then have capacitors from chasis to signal ground
2018-09-03T17:57:43 < jadew> I wouldn't connect it on the sensor side
2018-09-03T17:58:02 < Cracki> is the sensor/remote end grounded in any way, except to the controller?
2018-09-03T17:58:20 < kakimir> Cracki: totally sealed and not grounded any way
2018-09-03T17:58:23 < jadew> probably not, so the controller is the most likely to get grounded
2018-09-03T17:58:25 < Cracki> awesome
2018-09-03T17:58:52 < jadew> just the controller side, otherwise you'll compromise your signal's integrity
2018-09-03T17:59:29 < Cracki> connected on one side, so no current will flow through the shield?
2018-09-03T17:59:40 < kakimir> it says if you leave another end totally unconnected
2018-09-03T17:59:42 < Cracki> then you'd have a ground wire inside the shield, eh?
2018-09-03T17:59:49 < kakimir> you may make it wore
2018-09-03T17:59:53 < kakimir> worse
2018-09-03T18:00:06 < Cracki> all this advice is highly contextual
2018-09-03T18:00:23 < jadew> kakimir, where are you reading this?
2018-09-03T18:00:33 < jadew> Cracki, yeah
2018-09-03T18:00:37 < kakimir> http://www.epanorama.net/documents/groundloop/cable_shielding.html
2018-09-03T18:00:41 < jadew> yeah to the no current through the shield
2018-09-03T18:00:45 < kakimir> this is also what my guru told me
2018-09-03T18:01:02 < kakimir> and he says just connect both ends if there is no potential difference
2018-09-03T18:01:15 < kakimir> I assume ohmic loss with potential difference
2018-09-03T18:03:36 < kakimir> the thing is I don't understand downsides of shorting both sides to signal ground in this case
2018-09-03T18:03:40 < kakimir> or even generally
2018-09-03T18:04:19 < jadew> it's because the shield could have a lower resistance than the signal ground
2018-09-03T18:04:55 < jadew> so the current will flow through the shield instead
2018-09-03T18:05:08 < kakimir> I currently have both sides connected in prototype and it works.
2018-09-03T18:05:23 < jadew> it will work, but it will be prone to interference
2018-09-03T18:05:24 < kakimir> I just have luck & good guesstimation
2018-09-03T18:05:40 < kakimir> my sensor draws 10mA
2018-09-03T18:05:42 < jadew> for example, consider a twisted pair inside a shielded cable
2018-09-03T18:05:53 < jadew> doesn't matter how much current
2018-09-03T18:05:58 < kakimir> ok
2018-09-03T18:06:16 < jadew> the moment your signal goes through one of the inner cables and the shield, you no longer have a twisted pair
2018-09-03T18:06:25 < jadew> you have a bad coaxial cable
2018-09-03T18:06:29 < jadew> (unshielded)
2018-09-03T18:15:36 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-03T18:15:53 < kakimir> true
2018-09-03T18:17:30 < kakimir> signal ground and VCC will not be in balance
2018-09-03T18:17:44 < kakimir> but I don't really know if it's even a problem
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2018-09-03T18:18:14 < kakimir> I have twisted pair of 2 signals out of sensor
2018-09-03T18:18:42 < jadew> you mean two twisted pairs for each signal?
2018-09-03T18:19:00 < kakimir> one is VCC/2 buffer ratiometric output and another one is sensor ratiometric output with VCC/2 quescent voltage
2018-09-03T18:19:05 < kakimir> in one pair
2018-09-03T18:19:10 < kakimir> another pair is GND and VCC
2018-09-03T18:19:24 < jadew> that's not good
2018-09-03T18:19:40 < jadew> pair one of the signals with GND and the other with VCC
2018-09-03T18:19:46 < jadew> VCC is a sort of ground too
2018-09-03T18:19:51 < kakimir> why?
2018-09-03T18:20:22 < kakimir> idea of the buffer and pairing it's signal with sensor signal is to remove symmetric error in program code
2018-09-03T18:20:31 < jadew> because you want the ground (on the cable) to be as affected by noise as the signal line
2018-09-03T18:20:47 < jadew> that way, when both signals get to your controller, they will have the same noise on them
2018-09-03T18:20:54 < jadew> so the potential difference will be the same
2018-09-03T18:21:26 < kakimir> VCC current is another direction than GND
2018-09-03T18:21:38 < kakimir> but both buffer and sensor signal are in one direction only
2018-09-03T18:21:41 < jadew> doesn't matter, the noise will travel either way
2018-09-03T18:21:48 < invzim_> any rs485 pro's around?  what would be a rationale for putting 100ohm resistors in series on the datalines?!
2018-09-03T18:22:19 < kakimir> I don't understand jadew
2018-09-03T18:22:19 < jadew> invzim_, impedance matching?
2018-09-03T18:23:00 < jadew> the direction your current travels through the cable doesn't matter, the noise (as a wave) can travel in both directions
2018-09-03T18:23:13 < jadew> the important thing is that it's picked by both the signal line and the ground line
2018-09-03T18:23:19 < jadew> and they arrive at the same time to your board
2018-09-03T18:23:39 < jadew> that way, if the signal will have 1V extra potential, so will the ground
2018-09-03T18:23:53 < jadew> meaning that the difference between the two, will be what you originally put on the line
2018-09-03T18:23:59 < kakimir> there is 2 signals
2018-09-03T18:24:10 < kakimir> one is referrence level from buffer
2018-09-03T18:24:18 < kakimir> next to sensor
2018-09-03T18:24:20 < jadew> yeah, so you have to pair them with two different grounds
2018-09-03T18:24:24 < jadew> (ground wires)
2018-09-03T18:24:33 < jadew> you can consider VCC as ground here
2018-09-03T18:24:44 < jadew> and pair one of them with GND and the other one with VCC
2018-09-03T18:25:02 < jadew> and it will still work as a twisted pair is supposed to work
2018-09-03T18:25:40 < kakimir> so how many conductors I need?
2018-09-03T18:25:43 < kakimir> 4?
2018-09-03T18:25:45 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-03T18:25:50 < kakimir> how about the shield?
2018-09-03T18:25:56 < kakimir> what to do with it?
2018-09-03T18:26:14 < jadew> I guess do what your guru told you... he may be right
2018-09-03T18:26:27 < jadew> if I didn't have guidance, I would have tied it to the controller side
2018-09-03T18:26:50 < jadew> but you do, and you also linked that thing that basically said the same thing
2018-09-03T18:27:16 < jadew> kinda makes sense too
2018-09-03T18:27:31 < jadew> since your thing is floating anyway, it makes no sense to tie it to your ground
2018-09-03T18:27:41 < englishman> tctw: this K31 is pretty nice
2018-09-03T18:28:03 < kakimir> I'll ask my guru about that pairing thing
2018-09-03T18:28:18 < kakimir> if he can make any sense to it
2018-09-03T18:28:28 < jadew> you mean I didn't make sense? :)
2018-09-03T18:28:48 < Cracki> this audio stuff makes a bunch of sense to me https://www.rane.com/note151.html
2018-09-03T18:28:48 < kakimir> I didn't understand it
2018-09-03T18:28:59 < Cracki> also talks about currents and where you don't want them
2018-09-03T18:29:34 < Cracki> it doesn't talk about power supply through the line tho
2018-09-03T18:29:55 < kakimir> I should connect amp to my signals and listen them!
2018-09-03T18:30:01 < kakimir> with headphones
2018-09-03T18:30:04 < kakimir> interesting idea
2018-09-03T18:30:08 < Cracki> you should
2018-09-03T18:30:14 < jadew> are they so low frequency?
2018-09-03T18:30:16 < invzim_> jadew: yeah, but it's differential + I the sensible thing I've seen so far is to have a resistor between a/b lines, not in series on both a and b lines
2018-09-03T18:30:23 < invzim_> I'll read up and test a little more
2018-09-03T18:30:25 < kakimir> jadew: totally
2018-09-03T18:30:27 < Cracki> if they're above 20 khz, you can dsp them down :P
2018-09-03T18:30:41 < kakimir> sensor has under 10khz BW
2018-09-03T18:30:45 < Cracki> hearing 20 khz is better than not hearing at all
2018-09-03T18:31:15 < jadew> kakimir, if ithey're so low frequency it doesn't matter
2018-09-03T18:31:26 < Cracki> does any wire of the cable carry analog signal at all?
2018-09-03T18:32:21 < kakimir> 2 signals
2018-09-03T18:32:34 < jadew> the ground and the vcc :P
2018-09-03T18:32:41 < Cracki> I would figure to carry power supply outside of the shield
2018-09-03T18:32:50 < Cracki> so data is purely digital?
2018-09-03T18:32:56 < kakimir> purelly analog
2018-09-03T18:33:13 < kakimir> too expensive to convert digital
2018-09-03T18:33:24 < kakimir> like.. 80cents or whatever some mcu would cost
2018-09-03T18:33:32 < Cracki> jadew jadew telling lies :P
2018-09-03T18:33:52 < kakimir> + complexity to sensor I don't want
2018-09-03T18:34:00 < Cracki> how does the sensor turn supply into signal?
2018-09-03T18:34:10 < Cracki> is the signal sensitive to supply voltage?
2018-09-03T18:34:16 < kakimir> ratiometrically yes
2018-09-03T18:34:33 < Cracki> so you also need stable and noiseless supply...
2018-09-03T18:34:38 < englishman> lol this fucking gov tender
2018-09-03T18:34:46 < englishman> added an addendum 2 days before deadline
2018-09-03T18:35:04 < kakimir> Cracki: I still have the V/2 buffer right?
2018-09-03T18:35:05 < Cracki> does the sensor draw nearly "constant" current, i.e. impose "noise" on the supply line?
2018-09-03T18:35:06 < englishman> "please add an extra connector for 12awg for solar panel use and all associated hardware"
2018-09-03T18:35:13 < tctw> englishman, glad to hear that
2018-09-03T18:35:14 < kakimir> and I have RC filters to both signals
2018-09-03T18:35:30 < englishman> yes tctw it is probably my nicest riffle
2018-09-03T18:35:32 < Cracki> excellent
2018-09-03T18:35:33 < kakimir> Cracki: yes
2018-09-03T18:35:51 < Cracki> *doesn't impose
2018-09-03T18:36:10 < Cracki> so supply can be considered noiseless, ic ic
2018-09-03T18:36:17 < Cracki> supply and load
2018-09-03T18:36:55 < tctw> englishman, I am filled with proudness and happyness
2018-09-03T18:37:04 < englishman> as you should be, it is a fine rifle
2018-09-03T18:37:11 < englishman> like for real
2018-09-03T18:37:18 < Cracki> from that page on audio stuff I'd figure shield to chassis on master side, DISconnected on sensor side, and inside the cable, you have actual signal ground that is connected once on master side, NOT on sensor side
2018-09-03T18:37:19 < englishman> its not the best, not the most useful
2018-09-03T18:37:22 < englishman> but it's the nicest
2018-09-03T18:37:23 < tctw> englishman :)
2018-09-03T18:37:48 < Cracki> signal ground to chassis once on master side
2018-09-03T18:37:54 < Cracki> so no ground loops
2018-09-03T18:37:57 < englishman> id get the diopters for it but they cost more than the gun
2018-09-03T18:38:06 < tctw> I am still playing with the though of buying a jpa- rifle
2018-09-03T18:38:19 < tctw> that sako TRG-22 was awesome to work with when my friend let me use his
2018-09-03T18:38:32 < branjb> 5 hours of trying to get this dumb i2c periph to work, turns out gnd was connected to +5V
2018-09-03T18:39:06 < veverak> lol
2018-09-03T18:39:38 < qyx> is that much
2018-09-03T18:41:01 < kakimir> I can see led blinkin in controller in signals
2018-09-03T18:41:10 < kakimir> luckily it's pretty symmetric
2018-09-03T18:41:37 < kakimir> and small
2018-09-03T18:41:41 < kakimir> 0.3mV
2018-09-03T18:43:23 < tctw> englishman ^
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2018-09-03T18:57:44 < branjb> why does HAL i2c read not match the sequence diagram in the rm?
2018-09-03T18:58:17 < kakimir> how does phone side detect charger side in usb2.0 charger?
2018-09-03T18:58:34 < kakimir> is there pullups or downs too in phone
2018-09-03T18:59:04 < kakimir> how does charger side detect what phone is connected?
2018-09-03T18:59:21 < kakimir> does it ask?
2018-09-03T18:59:29 < kakimir> or just some analog tech
2018-09-03T18:59:31 < englishman> why does tctw go
2018-09-03T18:59:35 < englishman> he has the technical skills of a ceo
2018-09-03T19:05:30 < Steffanx> He does?
2018-09-03T19:06:12 < Steffanx> Do you feel like a CEO englishman ?
2018-09-03T19:06:20 < Steffanx> And a CFO?
2018-09-03T19:06:45 < englishman> no i dont own a ferrari. but i can keep an irc connection up
2018-09-03T19:07:05 < Steffanx> Oh lol.
2018-09-03T19:07:10 < Steffanx> Yes he does that a lot
2018-09-03T19:07:31 < Steffanx> Mr tct didnt drive a ferrari either
2018-09-03T19:10:04 < Steffanx> Im not sure if he owned one
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2018-09-03T19:17:13 < Cracki> kakimir, it's complicated
2018-09-03T19:17:33 < Cracki> usb 2.0 gives 100 mA, 500 mA upon request
2018-09-03T19:17:49 < Cracki> then there's the "200 ohm between D+ and D-" thingy
2018-09-03T19:18:03 < kakimir> it can give 1A 1.5A 2.1A and 2.4A too
2018-09-03T19:18:11 < Cracki> then there's USB PD, which "talks"
2018-09-03T19:18:22 < Cracki> USB PD can even vary voltage
2018-09-03T19:18:31 < Cracki> possibly to compensate for losses on the cable
2018-09-03T19:18:50 < Cracki> so... it's complicated
2018-09-03T19:23:22 < Thorn> is there a real world host that actually enforces that 100 mA limit though?
2018-09-03T19:23:40 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2018-09-03T19:23:50 < Cracki> power-constrained ones maybe
2018-09-03T19:25:28 < kakimir> less devices provide 100mA only than there is devices that abuse that limit
2018-09-03T19:32:17 < Thorn> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tps2540.pdf this one has programmable 2 current settings but I think it's for normal usb operation vs. charging
2018-09-03T19:32:28 < Thorn> *2 programmable current settings
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2018-09-03T19:33:01 < Thorn> not for 100 mA before enumeration and whatever is requeted in the descriptor 
2018-09-03T19:34:28 < englishman> Thorn: https://streamable.com/a6a2v
2018-09-03T19:34:53 < branjb> is i2c peripheral supposed to reset peripheral enable after a transaction?
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2018-09-03T19:36:00 < Thorn> is that your can englishman?
2018-09-03T19:36:03 < Thorn> nice kitteh
2018-09-03T19:37:25 < englishman> farm cat
2018-09-03T19:37:56 < Cracki> there are usb pd chips that handle all the shit
2018-09-03T19:38:09 < Cracki> awww kitteh
2018-09-03T19:38:39 < Cracki> branjb, i2c has no peripheral enable. i2c is a bus
2018-09-03T19:38:43 < Thorn> fun fact: pentel ain stein leads feel much smoother when writing than chinese ones
2018-09-03T19:39:17 < Thorn> one problem of i2c is that there is no way to reset a slave other than power cycling it
2018-09-03T19:39:17 < Cracki> is pentel japanese? i remember something like that
2018-09-03T19:39:25 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-03T19:39:35 < Cracki> or sending a soft reset :P
2018-09-03T19:39:49 < Cracki> which is what I did for that one time I used i2c for work
2018-09-03T19:40:04 < Thorn> if its state machine is fucked up it may not react to soft reset
2018-09-03T19:40:05 < branjb> Cracki i2c->CR1 bit 0 is peripheral enable/disable
2018-09-03T19:40:14 < Cracki> ah the host peripheral!
2018-09-03T19:40:18 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-03T19:40:46 < branjb> I have a multibyte read successfully happen, but when I do the next read PE is reset
2018-09-03T19:40:49 < Cracki> what controller family? ref man...
2018-09-03T19:40:52 < branjb> f4
2018-09-03T19:41:03 < Cracki> got the stop condition right?
2018-09-03T19:41:08 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-03T19:41:14 < branjb> wait
2018-09-03T19:41:20 < Cracki> is pe reset after the first, or before the second?
2018-09-03T19:41:28 < branjb> on a multibyte read the master sends the stop condition right?  not device?
2018-09-03T19:41:33 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-03T19:41:36 < branjb> ok
2018-09-03T19:41:40 < Cracki> the slave can send a nack
2018-09-03T19:41:47 < Cracki> but that's not the stop/start condition
2018-09-03T19:41:49 < branjb> let me check when it gets set to 0
2018-09-03T19:41:53 < Cracki> (iirc)
2018-09-03T19:43:21 < branjb> oh I see
2018-09-03T19:43:35 < branjb> straight from HAL code: //disable ack
2018-09-03T19:43:35 < branjb> 				i2c->CR1 &= I2C_CR1_ACK;
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2018-09-03T19:51:26 < englishman> Thorn, her brother got hit by a car on thursday
2018-09-03T19:51:29 < englishman> she's super lonely
2018-09-03T19:52:12 < Steffanx> All she wants is fooood
2018-09-03T19:56:41 < Ultrasauce> cat
2018-09-03T19:57:24 < Thorn> poor kitty :(
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2018-09-03T20:41:55 < Cracki> branjb, that's a bit brutal. i2c is supposed to run a state machine, where the master reacts to NACK. I see no reason to disable the i2c peripheral completely
2018-09-03T20:42:13 < Cracki> guess the HAL is a bit arduino-like in that regard :S
2018-09-03T20:43:12 < jpa-> stm32 i2c is a mess
2018-09-03T20:43:16 < jpa-> on the hardware level
2018-09-03T20:44:18 < Cracki> i heard... errata sheets
2018-09-03T20:45:10 < srk> newer gen is better (l4, f7)
2018-09-03T20:45:21 < srk> no longer requires you to run part of the state machine
2018-09-03T20:45:25 < Cracki> in addition to i2c itself being less than trivial
2018-09-03T20:45:32 < Cracki> wat dey do
2018-09-03T20:45:36 < srk> as like they IP got better
2018-09-03T20:46:12 < Cracki> you'd still need to influence the behavior of the automaton, or at least get ISRs
2018-09-03T20:47:46 < Cracki> uh.... i2c->CR1, is that the whole register? &...ACK should erase it all except the one bit sometimes
2018-09-03T20:48:25 < Cracki> I'm in a ref manual for some subset of stm32f4 and I2C_CR1 (27.6.1) has a bunch of flags
2018-09-03T20:48:42 < Cracki> Peripheral Enable is bit 0
2018-09-03T20:48:57 < Cracki> ACK is bit 10, so unrelated to enabling/disabling the peripheral
2018-09-03T20:49:37 < Cracki> >This bit is set and cleared by software and cleared by hardware when PE=0.
2018-09-03T20:50:07 < Cracki> reads to me like hw doesn't touch this at all?!
2018-09-03T20:50:19 < Cracki> sounds like a slave-only bit
2018-09-03T20:51:25 < Cracki> >i2c->CR1 &= I2C_CR1_ACK; // wtf is that supposed to do
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2018-09-03T20:52:20 < Cracki> I hope there's a ~ missing
2018-09-03T20:52:57 < Cracki> branjb, can you shed some light on this hal code...
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2018-09-03T20:58:41 < zyp> Cracki, maybe the register is classified as r_w1c
2018-09-03T20:59:07 < zyp> although in that case you might as well do CR1 = I2C_CR1_ACK
2018-09-03T20:59:46 < Cracki> can't say, didn't notice that in the ref
2018-09-03T21:00:11 < Cracki> it actually says software can r/w these bits, and hw clears it upon peripheral disable
2018-09-03T21:00:35 < zyp> which part is this?
2018-09-03T21:00:40 < zyp> and what's the RM number?
2018-09-03T21:00:50 < Cracki> he said F4, nothing more
2018-09-03T21:01:12 < zyp> oh, f4 has i2c v1
2018-09-03T21:01:14 < Cracki> I used google result #1
2018-09-03T21:01:21 < zyp> that one is cleared on read IIRC
2018-09-03T21:01:28 < Cracki> uh
2018-09-03T21:02:11 < Cracki> is there a table somewhere, detailing the fuckedness of i2c for each part number/family?
2018-09-03T21:02:13 < zyp> oh, CR1
2018-09-03T21:02:21 < zyp> nah
2018-09-03T21:02:32 < zyp> okay, nevermind what I said, that line is fucked up either way
2018-09-03T21:02:33 < Cracki> that would hurt their business, eh
2018-09-03T21:02:37 < Cracki> oy
2018-09-03T21:02:52 < Cracki> I'm asking for all of stm32
2018-09-03T21:07:09 < srk> Cracki: it's old line (F0, F1, F4) vs new line (F7, L4)
2018-09-03T21:07:22 < Cracki> *store*
2018-09-03T21:07:27 < srk> I have teh data but no means/time to render it
2018-09-03T21:07:41 < Cracki> dump it in a github
2018-09-03T21:08:00 < srk> https://github.com/sorki/data-stm32
2018-09-03T21:08:12 < Cracki> excellent
2018-09-03T21:08:44 < srk> tons of work on top of it pending
2018-09-03T21:09:03 < srk> waiting till srk has some free time 
2018-09-03T21:09:26 < srk> goal is to generate register definitions for ivory tower so it supports whole family (not only f4s) 
2018-09-03T21:09:45 < srk> and I can use the data to make a website with device / register browser as well
2018-09-03T21:10:09 < Cracki> where's the data
2018-09-03T21:10:12 < Cracki> didn't see any
2018-09-03T21:11:27 < srk> you download XMLs
2018-09-03T21:11:34 < srk> and use the library to get data
2018-09-03T21:11:36 < srk> :)
2018-09-03T21:12:09 < srk> then you can run 'svdparse STM32W108.svd'
2018-09-03T21:12:37 < srk> or mxmcu
2018-09-03T21:12:43 < srk> to parse cubemx mcu files
2018-09-03T21:12:55 < Cracki> is cubemx data trustworthy
2018-09-03T21:13:00 < srk> yeah
2018-09-03T21:13:08 < srk> seems less buggy than svd
2018-09-03T21:13:13 < srk> svd is wastly incomplete
2018-09-03T21:13:29 < srk> but you can identify different IPs according to their register maps
2018-09-03T21:13:52 < srk> (was playing with clustering according to that recently)
2018-09-03T21:14:18 < srk> stm32-reference-pdf:
2018-09-03T21:14:19 < srk> xD
2018-09-03T21:14:46 < srk> wanted to start parsing datasheets
2018-09-03T21:14:52 < srk> converted with pdf2text 
2018-09-03T21:15:03 < srk> to get register field contents descriptions :D
2018-09-03T21:15:44 < Cracki> sounds like fun
2018-09-03T21:16:03 < Cracki> afaik pdf contains glyph positions, but no logical order
2018-09-03T21:16:10 < Cracki> not necessarily anyway.
2018-09-03T21:16:39 < Cracki> which is why pdf readers and all kinds of dissection tools have to figure order from adjacency
2018-09-03T21:16:58 < Cracki> which can sometimes result in spaces inside of words/strings
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2018-09-03T21:27:46 < karlp> kakimir: for rs485, you _ideally_ have a/b/ref(ground) as three conductors, and shield is grounded at one end only.
2018-09-03T21:35:35 < Steffanx> srk, i did that too once. I just copied the text manually and "parsed" it.
2018-09-03T21:35:54 < Steffanx> worked pretty well, except for some quirks. Did require some manual editting in the end
2018-09-03T21:44:03 < Steffanx> hmm, cant find the pro python code i wrote for it.
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2018-09-03T22:05:08 < branjb> I have EXTI2_IRQHandler() defined in my user code, but keep hitting the void ((weak)) handler in startup_stm32f4.. is there another step I am missing?
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2018-09-03T22:10:46 < Cracki> order of linkage, branjb?
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2018-09-03T22:11:01 < Cracki> how is your handler defined in your code?
2018-09-03T22:11:20 < Cracki> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weak_symbol#Limitations
2018-09-03T22:11:30 < Cracki> order of linkage becomes more probable
2018-09-03T22:11:34 < branjb> I have a lib_exti.h where this is defined: void EXTI2_IRQHandler();
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2018-09-03T22:11:59 < branjb> ok, so order matters when linking the final binary?
2018-09-03T22:12:00 < Cracki> check link order
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2018-09-03T22:12:05 < Cracki> wikipedia says so
2018-09-03T22:12:06 < Cracki> :P
2018-09-03T22:12:25 < branjb> ie, I want lib_exti.o linked before startup_stm32f429xx.c which contains the weak definition?
2018-09-03T22:12:44 < Cracki> try things, I'm not an oracle :P
2018-09-03T22:13:46 < Cracki> http://infocenter.arm.com/help/index.jsp?topic=/com.arm.doc.faqs/ka15833.html
2018-09-03T22:14:07 < branjb> thanks
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2018-09-03T22:17:06 < Cracki> I would have thought strong overrides weak (or else there's little point to the weak attribute) but cba to dig into this
2018-09-03T22:20:59 < Cracki> it is interesting to see this effect ;)
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2018-09-03T22:38:02 < karlp> I like how cracki has become eau6 again, instant wiki expert.
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2018-09-03T22:43:34 < branjb> it wasn't a weak thing, I removed the preprocessor macro that defined the weak handlers.. now I just get the default handler
2018-09-03T22:48:04 < branjb> haha
2018-09-03T22:48:18 < branjb> was g++ vs gcc
2018-09-03T22:48:39 < branjb> the IRQ handler needs to be compiled as a C function
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2018-09-03T22:49:30 < Steffanx> Do the pros here use some kind of password manager?
2018-09-03T22:49:35 < Steffanx> or key or phone app or whatever?
2018-09-03T22:49:45 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-03T22:49:46 < Cracki> keepass has been decent to me
2018-09-03T22:49:58 -!- Jybz [~jibz@ip-37-201-7-27.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-03T22:50:13 < Cracki> google authenticator for those logins that ise it
2018-09-03T22:50:23 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-03T22:50:31 < catphish> so, being impatient, i constructed a second board, identical results, guess i have a software problem, or a really serious design flaw :)
2018-09-03T22:50:47 < Steffanx> what was it again catphish ?
2018-09-03T22:50:50 < Steffanx> still the spi thing?
2018-09-03T22:50:54 < Cracki> have you tried reversing the polarity?
2018-09-03T22:51:08 < catphish> yeah, trying to talk to a ST95HF, not getting anything back :)
2018-09-03T22:51:18 < Cracki> it's ded, jim
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2018-09-03T22:51:50 < catphish> they say it's insane to do the same thing twice and expect different results
2018-09-03T22:51:55 < catphish> but they also say practice makes perfect
2018-09-03T22:52:01 < catphish> who the hell am i supposed to listen to?
2018-09-03T22:52:08 < Cracki> and that you can't extrapolate from N=1
2018-09-03T22:52:08 < Steffanx> And you already check what youre actually sending using a scope/logic analyzer etc?
2018-09-03T22:52:29 < Steffanx> or is this still the wont solder/no clips thing? :P
2018-09-03T22:52:36 < Cracki> does the chip do anything at all?
2018-09-03T22:52:40 < catphish> yeah, it's sending, but because i don't have test points, i can only test one line at a time, not very useful
2018-09-03T22:52:47 < Cracki> does it give defined output voltages on any pins?
2018-09-03T22:52:52 < Cracki> I mean the slave
2018-09-03T22:53:00 < Cracki> you said you don't get a response
2018-09-03T22:53:01 < catphish> i'll check now
2018-09-03T22:53:05 < Cracki> is it even alive
2018-09-03T22:53:23 < Steffanx> you copied the schematic from zyp right? Care to share again?
2018-09-03T22:53:28 < catphish> scope doesn't know the difference between 0v and floating, LA doesn't know the difference between 3v3 and floating :)
2018-09-03T22:53:43 < Cracki> rig something up then
2018-09-03T22:53:54 < catphish> i copied the schematic from ST, but it's also identical to zyp's, i suspect he also copied ST's :)
2018-09-03T22:53:55 < Cracki> 100k resistor and multimeter probe
2018-09-03T22:54:34 < Steffanx> double checked the foot print etc. ? 
2018-09-03T22:54:36 < catphish> this is the schematic: https://nutty.tk/nfc10.pdf
2018-09-03T22:54:42 < Steffanx> oh .tk :D
2018-09-03T22:55:05 < catphish> lemme grab a pic of the layout
2018-09-03T22:57:42 < catphish> https://i.imgur.com/9jlfd7H.png
2018-09-03T22:57:47 < catphish> that's the layout
2018-09-03T22:58:51 < kakimir> is it reversed somehow?
2018-09-03T22:58:59 < catphish> i hope not
2018-09-03T22:59:02 < kakimir> oh it's mcu side
2018-09-03T22:59:17 < Steffanx> Are you also doing the low pulse on irq_in catphish ?
2018-09-03T22:59:23 < catphish> Steffanx: i am
2018-09-03T22:59:26 < Steffanx> ok
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2018-09-03T22:59:56 < catphish> https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/main.c / https://github.com/catphish/ocontrol/blob/master/system.c
2018-09-03T23:00:01 < kakimir> make another board
2018-09-03T23:00:04 < catphish> messy test code
2018-09-03T23:00:09 < kakimir> I mean
2018-09-03T23:00:11 < kakimir> same board
2018-09-03T23:00:19 < catphish> kakimir: i already did that :)
2018-09-03T23:00:22 < kakimir> build another
2018-09-03T23:00:27 < kakimir> same issue?
2018-09-03T23:00:30 < catphish> yes
2018-09-03T23:00:33 < catphish> identical result
2018-09-03T23:01:07 < catphish> i've checked all the things so many times, but clearly missed something :(
2018-09-03T23:01:09 < kakimir> did you use library part for QFN pack?
2018-09-03T23:01:13 < kakimir> in kicad
2018-09-03T23:01:18 < kakimir> or made it yourself?
2018-09-03T23:01:24 < catphish> kicad one
2018-09-03T23:01:48 < kakimir> it should have pretty good stencil % of pad area
2018-09-03T23:02:12 < catphish> on the second board i took a lot of paste off the pad
2018-09-03T23:02:52 < catphish> both reflowed badly and had to be moved repeatedly to get rid of bridges
2018-09-03T23:03:06 < kakimir> you add manually flux to it
2018-09-03T23:03:20 < catphish> i did not
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2018-09-03T23:03:22 < kakimir> if your flux is good it almost fixes itself
2018-09-03T23:03:27 < catphish> perhaps i should have done
2018-09-03T23:03:37 < kakimir> just poke it a little after adding flux all around it
2018-09-03T23:03:50 < kakimir> it aligns and sits down
2018-09-03T23:03:54 < catphish> i did that with just the solder and it did that anyway
2018-09-03T23:04:21 < kakimir> and also bridges are removed when you add flux and poke it carefully
2018-09-03T23:04:24 < catphish> although the pin spacing is to tight i aligned it to the wrong pins a couple of times
2018-09-03T23:04:31 < catphish> good to know
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2018-09-03T23:04:45 < catphish> how long can one realistically keep it in that state without doing damage?
2018-09-03T23:04:50 < kakimir> long time
2018-09-03T23:04:59 < catphish> oh good
2018-09-03T23:05:00 < kakimir> depends on your solder
2018-09-03T23:05:27 < branjb> where's upgrdman been?
2018-09-03T23:06:30 < Steffanx> doing sports and java coding
2018-09-03T23:06:36 < branjb> frisby golf?
2018-09-03T23:06:45 < branjb> didn't know that was a sport
2018-09-03T23:07:09 < Steffanx> cycling
2018-09-03T23:07:24 < branjb> ahh he probably has a train of 50 cars behind him trying to pass
2018-09-03T23:07:27 < kakimir> catphish: what is your solder paste compound type?
2018-09-03T23:07:59 < Steffanx> fuck cars in the bike lane branjb
2018-09-03T23:08:57 < branjb> where I live we have a mountain that is 1 lane each way, cyclists here like to go up and down it and see how many cars they can get behind them going 10 mph
2018-09-03T23:10:47 < catphish> kakimir: it's crappy and cheap, but seems to work - XG-Z40
2018-09-03T23:11:27 < catphish> i don't know much about it yet so i bought what was cheap and popular
2018-09-03T23:11:32 < kakimir> sn63 - it's okay
2018-09-03T23:12:23 < kakimir> no leadless bullshit
2018-09-03T23:14:30 < catphish> wanted to keep melting point low for my super-diy reflow process
2018-09-03T23:15:02 < kakimir> there is no benefits to use leadless in hobby projects or prototyping generally
2018-09-03T23:15:17 < catphish> that was my feeling on the subject too
2018-09-03T23:15:36 < catphish> although i should probably have washed my hands between reflow and dinner
2018-09-03T23:15:48 < kakimir> maybe if the product is made with leadless then you need to do reflow process with leadless to see if there is issues with the process
2018-09-03T23:16:00 < kakimir> but at phase when you are still poking around it's no use
2018-09-03T23:16:10 < kakimir> catphish: nope.
2018-09-03T23:16:20 < kakimir> it's all healthy
2018-09-03T23:16:37 < catphish> tasty tasty lead
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2018-09-03T23:16:58 < kakimir> and some fluoride compound flux
2018-09-03T23:18:21 < kakimir> good flux makes you puke
2018-09-03T23:18:31 < kakimir> when inhaled
2018-09-03T23:20:02 < kakimir> gases are or form neurotoxins in body and cause nausea and actually vomit a bit in mouth
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2018-09-03T23:22:09 < kakimir> I need to go to grill>
2018-09-03T23:22:42 < Steffanx> How long is your "wait a bit" time catphish ?
2018-09-03T23:22:47 < Steffanx> or how short 
2018-09-03T23:24:57 < catphish> Steffanx: reallt long, like 250ms
2018-09-03T23:25:03 < catphish> *really
2018-09-03T23:25:39 < Steffanx> oh ok
2018-09-03T23:34:54 < zyp> wait an eternity
2018-09-03T23:38:44 < catphish> i've never failed this hard at making something simple work
2018-09-03T23:40:37 < catphish> i should probably test with 0x55
2018-09-03T23:55:45 < srk> you can also use a debug timer for delays iirc
--- Day changed Tue Sep 04 2018
2018-09-04T00:07:48 < kakimir> BrainDamage: still up?
2018-09-04T00:08:23 < BrainDamage> I am in no condition to tak
2018-09-04T00:08:41 < kakimir> weird
2018-09-04T00:09:23 < kakimir> sounds like you are incapacitated to talk
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2018-09-04T00:17:31 < catphish> i'm still up if that helps
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2018-09-04T00:23:19 < kakimir> what is your next thing catphish?
2018-09-04T00:28:42 < karlp> jpa-: hjalp. I do make savedefconfig in one tree, cp defconfig to .config in new dir as it instructs, and make olddefconfig fails. *** No rule to make target '/home/karlp/src/oocd-rtos-locm3/nuttx-blink/nuttxconfigsdummydummy_kconfig'
2018-09-04T00:29:07 < karlp> doesn't work with the whole .config either.
2018-09-04T00:29:18 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-04T00:29:20 < karlp> silly thing
2018-09-04T00:31:37 < catphish> kakimir: maybe killing myself
2018-09-04T00:31:54 < BrainDamage> kakimir: I absolutely am
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2018-09-04T00:33:55 < Steffanx> When will you redo the pcb with test pads catphish ? :¶
2018-09-04T00:34:16 < kakimir> catphish: if you don't feel like your project is killing you - you are not doing anything
2018-09-04T00:34:17 < Steffanx> I didnt see something obviously wrong during my short check
2018-09-04T00:34:41 < Steffanx> I was only wondering why you connected all nc pins to gnd. They recommended that?
2018-09-04T00:35:18 < catphish> Steffanx: coppied from https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/technical/layouts_and_diagrams/schematic_pack/c0/27/b1/31/b5/06/4e/b2/EVAL-ST95HF_schematics.pdf/files/EVAL-ST95HF_schematics.pdf/jcr:content/translations/en.EVAL-ST95HF_schematics.pdf
2018-09-04T00:35:42 < catphish> that's the ST eval board for the ST95HF
2018-09-04T00:35:43 < Steffanx> Ah isee
2018-09-04T00:36:40 < catphish> although those connections aren't present on the PCB, so who knows
2018-09-04T00:37:24 < catphish> ST's layout is nice, i might borrow from that :)
2018-09-04T00:39:08 < catphish> Steffanx: i just don't get it, either it's soldered badly (repeatedly), or the pin connections are wrong, or my code is wrong
2018-09-04T00:39:16 < catphish> i feel like i've rules out everything
2018-09-04T00:39:34 < catphish> i really appreciate people's help
2018-09-04T00:39:44 < catphish> but ugh, totally baffled
2018-09-04T00:40:21 < kakimir> get eval kit
2018-09-04T00:41:01 < kakimir> have you cross checked with eval kit schematic?
2018-09-04T00:41:14 < catphish> i wonder if i can get a QFN32 to DIP adapter
2018-09-04T00:41:21 < kakimir> you can
2018-09-04T00:41:41 < catphish> then i can power it up and really debug the connectivity
2018-09-04T00:42:53 < catphish> socket is expensive, breakout board is cheap
2018-09-04T00:43:25 < kakimir> how many chips you have+
2018-09-04T00:43:43 < catphish> i have one left
2018-09-04T00:43:58 < catphish> but i can order in quantities of 5000 if i want to :)
2018-09-04T00:44:04 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-04T00:44:37 < kakimir> how quick / cheap you want your adapter?
2018-09-04T00:45:00 < catphish> very / very
2018-09-04T00:45:09 < catphish> i want it tonight, for free
2018-09-04T00:45:29 < kakimir> always have adapter boards
2018-09-04T00:45:44 < kakimir> I should actually order more
2018-09-04T00:46:20 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T00:46:23 < kakimir> ebay and amazon sellers ship from china
2018-09-04T00:46:35 < kakimir> you have option to order from .de or from states
2018-09-04T00:46:47 < catphish> the problem with a breakout board, i still have so solder the qfn
2018-09-04T00:47:03 < catphish> i might succeed, i might screw it up :)
2018-09-04T00:47:40 < kakimir> https://www.walmart.com/ip/10-x-SMD-QFN32-QFP32-0-65mm-to-0-8mm-IC-PCB-Board-Adapter-Socket-Plate-Board/190326112 walmart wtf
2018-09-04T00:47:55 < karlp> spin a new pcb with way more test points, send it off, and either work on the hsot software, or other projects all together.
2018-09-04T00:48:05 < catphish> yeah i see those on ebay
2018-09-04T00:48:25 < kakimir> oh wallmart is not selling those themself
2018-09-04T00:48:35 < kakimir> they are building their own ebay/ali
2018-09-04T00:48:35 < catphish> a board with test points is probably the next step
2018-09-04T00:48:40 < kakimir>  /amazon
2018-09-04T00:49:02 < kakimir> how much for eval kit?
2018-09-04T00:49:02 < catphish> i was just being impatient and thought i'd try rebuilding with the boards i have
2018-09-04T00:50:14 < catphish> £114 + tax
2018-09-04T00:50:19 < catphish> surprisingly expensive
2018-09-04T00:50:33 < catphish> possibly useful
2018-09-04T00:50:33 < kakimir> really
2018-09-04T00:50:40 < kakimir> most likelly
2018-09-04T00:51:00 < kakimir> have you checked eval kit demo code?
2018-09-04T00:51:42 < kakimir> load it from internets
2018-09-04T00:51:46 < catphish> i haven't, it's quite complicated, i might reread zyp's code though
2018-09-04T00:51:56 < kakimir> zyp has one working?
2018-09-04T00:51:59 < kakimir> same mcu?
2018-09-04T00:52:03 < kakimir> or same family?
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2018-09-04T00:54:55 < kakimir> take demo code
2018-09-04T00:55:02 < kakimir> then start writing it yourself
2018-09-04T00:55:14 < kakimir> explain to yourself all the steps
2018-09-04T00:55:43 < kakimir> throughly
2018-09-04T00:55:54 < kakimir> read datasheets
2018-09-04T00:55:57 < catphish> kakimir: same family
2018-09-04T00:56:27 < kakimir> I take demo code
2018-09-04T00:56:39 < kakimir> then I start writing it myself because I don't understand it or like it
2018-09-04T00:57:00 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-04T00:57:17 < kakimir> democode is just uncommented hex values set to registers
2018-09-04T00:57:42 < kakimir> I write every bit number do every mask a macro etc. name them
2018-09-04T00:58:01 < kakimir> or if it's HAL you don't even see what it does
2018-09-04T01:00:51 < kakimir> I don't know what use code has when it's dozen lines of undocumented hex values set to registers and comment is like //We did stuff.
2018-09-04T01:01:22 < kakimir> other than you have to write it again yourself and learn effectivelly when reading datasheet step by step
2018-09-04T01:02:27 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-04T01:07:05 < kakimir> catphish: can you run demo code directly on you platform?
2018-09-04T01:07:18 < kakimir> or with minor changes
2018-09-04T01:07:35 < kakimir> because: demo code always works - afaik
2018-09-04T01:08:11 < kakimir> do you have like tranceiver connected to your computer too?
2018-09-04T01:08:23 < zyp> my code relies on usb, catphish picked a mcu without usb
2018-09-04T01:08:33 < kakimir> well there
2018-09-04T01:08:42 < kakimir> plausable issue
2018-09-04T01:09:24 < zyp> well, I don't think he's trying to use my code as is
2018-09-04T01:09:55 < kakimir> if it realies on something if it's complex relation between 2 functions
2018-09-04T01:10:04 < kakimir> and not your code
2018-09-04T01:10:09 < kakimir> it's hard
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2018-09-04T01:10:41 < zyp> wtf are you talking about anyway?
2018-09-04T01:10:42 < catphish> i'm just scoping everything to get a feel for what's going on
2018-09-04T01:11:56 < zyp> catphish, maybe I should flash up a board with bootloader and all and send you
2018-09-04T01:12:06 < zyp> it's not like I don't have more spare prototypes
2018-09-04T01:12:30 < catphish> zyp: well if you have enough pity, i'd appreciate it :)
2018-09-04T01:13:03 < catphish> the tx signals from the stm32 are perfect, but the response lines are all totally dead
2018-09-04T01:13:12 < zyp> I just sent a batch of stuff this morning, so it'll probably be a couple of weeks before next time
2018-09-04T01:13:27 < zyp> but I can ask you then if you're still interested
2018-09-04T01:13:53 < catphish> yeah let me know, if i haven't got a working prototype built by then it might be super useful :)
2018-09-04T01:14:19 < zyp> alternatively if you haven't scrapped them yet, you could try soldering wires directly to the swd pins on the chip :p
2018-09-04T01:14:52 < catphish> i tried bridged them, gave up, scrapped them :(
2018-09-04T01:14:59 < zyp> aww
2018-09-04T01:15:13 < catphish> it was a bad day
2018-09-04T01:15:40 < zyp> what are you soldering with anyway? a clothes iron?
2018-09-04T01:15:56 < catphish> near enough
2018-09-04T01:16:09 < catphish> an electric hot plate and aluminium sheet
2018-09-04T01:16:30 < zyp> I was thinking for small stuff
2018-09-04T01:16:37 < zyp> i.e. attaching wires and shit
2018-09-04T01:16:55 < BrainDamage> soldering to Al means a world of hurt
2018-09-04T01:16:56 < catphish> oh, i have a decent iron, i think i was just being careless or using the wrong tip
2018-09-04T01:17:16 < BrainDamage> Al forms near instantly a passivation layer of oxide that solder won't stick to
2018-09-04T01:17:42 < BrainDamage> you'll need very powerful fluxes ( HCl or HF based ) or solder under a layer of oil
2018-09-04T01:17:50 < BrainDamage> both of which will make your lungs very sorry
2018-09-04T01:18:13 < zyp> fun fun
2018-09-04T01:19:02 < catphish> i might enable a pull up and/or pull down to my input pins to see if the st95hf is outputting anything, or k=just floating
2018-09-04T01:19:04 < BrainDamage> if possible, avoid entirely soldering to Al, and just crimp a connector that you'll solder to
2018-09-04T01:19:21 < zyp> BrainDamage, how about spot welding?
2018-09-04T01:19:33 < BrainDamage> spot welding works
2018-09-04T01:19:43 < BrainDamage> just not soldering
2018-09-04T01:19:47 < qyx> soldering Al works too
2018-09-04T01:19:52 < qyx> at 480°C
2018-09-04T01:19:54 < catphish> also, why does qfn exist, who wants this?
2018-09-04T01:19:58 < qyx> with AlSi5 :*
2018-09-04T01:20:01 < qyx> oh
2018-09-04T01:20:03 < qyx> :P
2018-09-04T01:20:10 < zyp> catphish, anything RF
2018-09-04T01:20:17 < catphish> i see
2018-09-04T01:20:31 < catphish> i guess microwave doesn't agree with legs
2018-09-04T01:20:35 < zyp> lack of legs = less degradation of the RF signal
2018-09-04T01:21:31 < BrainDamage> just imagine the package leads as plates of a capacitor or as an inductor
2018-09-04T01:21:41 < BrainDamage> and you'll realize why you want to avoid them at high freq
2018-09-04T01:25:02 < zyp> qfn may also save you some board area
2018-09-04T01:25:19 < zyp> although in practice the difference is usually not that big
2018-09-04T01:25:52 < zyp> qfn normally has a thermal pad restricting you from routing stuff under the chip, for a qfp you can do a bunch of the routing out under the chip itself
2018-09-04T01:26:17 < zyp> so even if the footprints have different sizes, the total space required to integrate it on a board might be comparable
2018-09-04T01:26:24 < BrainDamage> if you hand solder using hot air, you still want a bit clearance even with qfn
2018-09-04T01:26:49 < zyp> also, my experience with qfn is that it's very footprint sensitive
2018-09-04T01:27:06 < catphish> 99% hardware problem
2018-09-04T01:27:07 < zyp> if you use a shitty footprint, it's a pain to solder right
2018-09-04T01:27:22 < zyp> if you use a decent footprint, it'll get right every time
2018-09-04T01:28:27 < BrainDamage> pro audio dip ones
2018-09-04T01:28:47 < catphish> one of these boards the slave IRQ OUT line is high, the other it's low
2018-09-04T01:28:53 < Cracki> any specifics on "good" qfn footprints?
2018-09-04T01:29:36 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/QW7ZG.png <- I once made this, like 7 years ago or so, got two qfn parts on it; U8 in the middle of the board, and whatever that thing in the top left was called
2018-09-04T01:29:49 < zyp> note the pad length difference between those two footprints
2018-09-04T01:30:06 < catphish> clearly i just can't solder :(
2018-09-04T01:30:10 < zyp> U8 soldered correctly on 3 out of 3 boards I soldered
2018-09-04T01:30:19 < zyp> that thing in the top left failed on all 3
2018-09-04T01:30:30 < catphish> or i've damaged the ST95HFs
2018-09-04T01:31:01 < zyp> catphish, or there's something completely different that's wrong
2018-09-04T01:31:10 < zyp> hard to tell from the available information
2018-09-04T01:31:21 < catphish> zyp: well whatever it is varies between the 2 boards
2018-09-04T01:31:37 < zyp> yeah?
2018-09-04T01:31:55 < catphish> one one, the ST95HF IRQ OUT is high, on the other it's low
2018-09-04T01:31:58 < zyp> do you have any photos of it?
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2018-09-04T01:32:32 < catphish> here's a set i took last night on the first board: https://imgur.com/a/go5pBSE
2018-09-04T01:32:47 < catphish> not great photos
2018-09-04T01:33:04 < catphish> but it looks good to me :(
2018-09-04T01:33:15 < BrainDamage> catphish: put a magnifying glass if your camera can't focus so close up
2018-09-04T01:33:38 < zyp> fifth pin from the left on first photo looks a bit unreliable
2018-09-04T01:34:08 < catphish> i'll melt them both one more time and see if anything changes
2018-09-04T01:34:11 < zyp> possibly also fourth, sixth and seventh pin on second photo
2018-09-04T01:34:24 < BrainDamage> the soldering looks a bit cold, did you flood the area with gel flux before soldering?
2018-09-04T01:34:37 < catphish> i didn't, i'll flood it and melt it now
2018-09-04T01:35:37 < BrainDamage> normal soldering usually has so much solder that the flux inside the solder's core is sufficient, in smd it's either not enough or the tecniques makes so that the flux boils off before you finish working on the board
2018-09-04T01:35:44 < BrainDamage> so if in doubt, flood with flux
2018-09-04T01:36:14 < BrainDamage> when you see a solder join that's opaque or "dusty", it's often a sign of improper melting
2018-09-04T01:36:37 < zyp> or rohs solder :p
2018-09-04T01:37:01 < BrainDamage> >.>
2018-09-04T01:40:21 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/Kg4JE.JPG <- here's a soldering that failed on pins 1 and 4
2018-09-04T01:40:37 < zyp> or maybe 2 and 5 if they are numbered from the right, idk
2018-09-04T01:53:56 < englishman> For security reasons your IP has been blocked as you have exceeded the maximum number of requests per minute that can originate from one IP address.
2018-09-04T01:53:58 < englishman> FUCK
2018-09-04T01:54:07 < englishman> i was just scrolling thru transactions
2018-09-04T01:54:09 < englishman> using the down arrow
2018-09-04T01:54:14 < englishman> fucking shitty silicon valley companies
2018-09-04T01:55:04 < zyp> crt, reflow, connector wasn't pushed properly into the board so the legs are sitting higher than they should
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2018-09-04T01:57:11 < englishman> catphish looks alright for your first efforts
2018-09-04T01:57:27 < Cracki> zyp thx for the example! I'd figure the longer pads get more solder which can distribute more liberally to where it's needed
2018-09-04T01:58:03 < Cracki> will keep the long pads in mind for when I have to do my own designing :P
2018-09-04T01:58:25 < kakimir> englishman: even you?
2018-09-04T01:58:29 < englishman> ipc footprints exist for a reason, to give you decent paste deposition, that flows into a proper solder toe and heel
2018-09-04T01:58:39 < BrainDamage> keep in mind that bigger pads also mean more heat sink
2018-09-04T01:58:49 < invzim_> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xy40CgUh8Z31AK7XOQc3uC8Wu9enQuMh/view?usp=drive_open
2018-09-04T01:58:54 < kakimir> what is the deal with arrow
2018-09-04T01:58:58 < invzim_> anyone care to guess what 'PR1' is?
2018-09-04T01:59:02 < BrainDamage> for ics it hardly matter, but for bigger footprints, your iron has to match the dissipation
2018-09-04T01:59:16 < BrainDamage> and you'll find yourself having an hard time getting the solder to melt
2018-09-04T01:59:57 < BrainDamage> especially for shit connected to a plane
2018-09-04T02:00:00 < BrainDamage> or a pour
2018-09-04T02:01:53 < Cracki> altium says "IPC-7351 standard"
2018-09-04T02:01:56 < Cracki> fascinating
2018-09-04T02:02:41 < Cracki> all the shit http://www.ipc.org/TOC/IPC-7351B.pdf
2018-09-04T02:02:52 < Cracki> (toc :S)
2018-09-04T02:04:33 < BrainDamage> oh, and I forgot, if you use a preheater, you can forget the part about the heatsink, since the base temp will be high enough
2018-09-04T02:04:52 < BrainDamage> just make sure to not buy the jaden smith chink prehater with asbestos in it
2018-09-04T02:05:31 < Cracki> wats "jaden smith" got to do with electronics
2018-09-04T02:05:42 < Cracki> did he sit on a hotplate at one time?
2018-09-04T02:06:03 < BrainDamage> have a little bit of creativity and interpolate with the channel's nick list
2018-09-04T02:06:19 < Cracki> uhhhhh 133 people
2018-09-04T02:06:23 < BrainDamage> ¯\_( ͡°⌣ ͡°)_/¯ 
2018-09-04T02:06:55 < Cracki> striking, the similarity
2018-09-04T02:07:54 < Cracki> I remember the talk of asbestos in someone's heater they bought
2018-09-04T02:08:03 < catphish> zyp: afer reflowing 3 more times with flux, i think it's responding
2018-09-04T02:08:12 < catphish> why does it have to be so hard!
2018-09-04T02:08:24 < Cracki> >hard...ware
2018-09-04T02:08:46 < catphish> can't we just have software defined hardware?
2018-09-04T02:08:59 < Cracki> I want that too
2018-09-04T02:10:08 < Cracki> you could pay for pcba or find some poor sap from a local makerspace who's totally into baking boards to do this for you for free
2018-09-04T02:10:38 < Cracki> you wouldn't learn, but you wouldn't suffer either :D
2018-09-04T02:11:18 < Cracki> see the bright side! now you know one more thing that can go wrong, how to notice it, and how to fix it!
2018-09-04T02:11:23 < catphish> i just need one working copy to prove that the layout works
2018-09-04T02:11:36 < catphish> after that i have no problem paying china to fab a few
2018-09-04T02:13:22 < catphish> seems ridiculous just how hard it is to get one of these QFNs to stick down
2018-09-04T02:14:41 < Cracki> uneven solder paste?
2018-09-04T02:15:05 < Cracki> solder stuck in stencil instead of on pad?
2018-09-04T02:16:45 < Cracki> that's what I was told to pay attention to while operating the cheap chinese picknplace for that ridiculous production run the shop wasn't specialized for
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2018-09-04T02:21:34 < catphish> interesting
2018-09-04T02:21:40 < catphish> will keep that in mind
2018-09-04T02:25:35 < Cracki> if the thermal pad gets good paste, but the "legs" don't...
2018-09-04T02:26:15 < catphish> zyp kakimir Steffanx anyone else who cares, my ST95HF is indeed responding now! answers my SPI requests as it should
2018-09-04T02:26:28 < catphish> i just had so resolder it repeatedly
2018-09-04T02:26:55 < catphish> maybe if i'm lucky i also correctly sosldered all its antenna ports
2018-09-04T02:31:42 < dongs> cool
2018-09-04T02:31:51 < dongs> this is why normal people use stencils
2018-09-04T02:37:29 < Cracki> did he not use one?
2018-09-04T02:37:48 < Cracki> (or at least a syringe...)
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2018-09-04T02:46:17 < dongs> not from the looks of the soldering
2018-09-04T02:48:27 < catphish> i used a stencil
2018-09-04T02:48:39 < catphish> that's not to say i used it well
2018-09-04T02:49:02 < Thorn> can you fully fan out a 256 ball bga in 4 layers?
2018-09-04T02:49:12 < catphish> i can't
2018-09-04T02:50:34 < Cracki> 256 is 16x16 at least
2018-09-04T02:50:36 < dongs> depends how many balls
2018-09-04T02:50:41 < Cracki> that's 8 rings
2018-09-04T02:50:45 < dongs> are actually usable
2018-09-04T02:50:49 < Cracki> ^
2018-09-04T02:51:02 < Cracki> and how dense the grid
2018-09-04T02:51:07 < Thorn> 1 mm
2018-09-04T02:51:21 < Cracki> so that thing is at least 16x16 mm large
2018-09-04T02:51:26 < catphish> and i now have 2 working boards
2018-09-04T02:51:47  * catphish dances a weird success danc
2018-09-04T02:51:50 < Cracki> :P
2018-09-04T02:52:03 < Cracki> feels good eh
2018-09-04T02:52:20 < catphish> seems that flux is the magic ingredient in the secret sauce
2018-09-04T02:52:27 < Cracki> oh it is
2018-09-04T02:52:28 < catphish> i flooded both boards, heated them, and they worked
2018-09-04T02:52:51 < catphish> they now look rather brown and burned, they were shiny and pretty before
2018-09-04T02:53:00 < catphish> but they work, at least partially :)
2018-09-04T02:53:26 < catphish> i'm getting a device ID and ROM checksum back from both :)
2018-09-04T02:53:31 < Cracki> drownem in vodka later
2018-09-04T02:54:10 < catphish> is there any reason to clean no-clean flux, other than appearance?
2018-09-04T02:54:17 < catphish> because if not, meh
2018-09-04T02:54:54 < dongs> https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1140867 heh
2018-09-04T02:55:41 < Cracki> no reason
2018-09-04T02:56:08 < Cracki> the do-clean kind needs cleaning or else it'll eat all the metal
2018-09-04T02:57:27 < dongs> invzim_: did you figure it out
2018-09-04T02:58:35 < catphish> Cracki: goodo
2018-09-04T02:58:48 < catphish> well thanks to everyone for the assistance!
2018-09-04T02:58:56 < catphish> that was a special kind of hell
2018-09-04T02:59:10 < Cracki> crosspoint switch, interesting
2018-09-04T02:59:39 < catphish> but i'm grateful++ for the persisted help
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2018-09-04T03:19:01 < englishman> non noclean flux is conductive
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2018-09-04T03:19:32 < Laurenceb__> let me tell you about my heritage
2018-09-04T03:19:55 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o englishman] by ChanServ
2018-09-04T03:20:00 -!- mode/##stm32 [+q Laurenceb__!*@*] by englishman
2018-09-04T03:20:04 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o englishman] by ChanServ
2018-09-04T03:21:07 < dongs> haha
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2018-09-04T03:27:48 < Laurenceb_> lock her up, lock her up
2018-09-04T03:27:59 < Laurenceb_> can you guess what it is yet?
2018-09-04T03:28:47 < Laurenceb_> https://www.biofuelsdigest.com/bdigest/tag/kior/
2018-09-04T03:28:54 < Laurenceb_> ^seems I missed the last zano
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2018-09-04T04:20:48 < bitmask> I needs me fix Locke! I needs me fix...
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2018-09-04T04:40:48 < bitmask> can you dry a wool suit in the drier on lowest heat? 
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2018-09-04T08:31:24 < jpa-> karlp: never done such thing :P
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2018-09-04T09:10:10 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MJ5vcNMYbQ lol japs
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2018-09-04T09:12:10 < Steffanx> But rice is the only thing you eat right
2018-09-04T09:12:17 < Steffanx> Or something made of rice
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2018-09-04T09:12:40 < Steffanx> Like those deadly sticky ball you eat
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2018-09-04T10:56:14 < zyp> hmm, f042 can feed sysclk from HSI48
2018-09-04T10:56:19 < zyp> IIRC l0 can't do that
2018-09-04T10:56:48 < zyp> IIRC l0 has to run from HSI16 while USB block is fed from HSI48
2018-09-04T10:57:21 < zyp> ah, of course
2018-09-04T10:57:32 < zyp> l0 is 32 MHz sysclk max, l042 does 48 MHz
2018-09-04T10:57:43 < zyp> f042*
2018-09-04T11:03:36 < Jak_o_Shadows> crt: woo, spring!
2018-09-04T11:13:20 < cjbaird> The Fireweed is starting to flower.. Joy.
2018-09-04T11:13:36 < Steffanx> You also learnes about the "luke, im your father" quote crt. Way more important
2018-09-04T11:13:47 < Steffanx> Learned*
2018-09-04T11:25:10 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/7XjgERi.jpg found crt
2018-09-04T11:38:40 < zyp> hmm, f042 is pretty similar to l052, makes it easy to port my shit
2018-09-04T11:42:00 < dongs> im using f042 with stdperiph, works good
2018-09-04T11:43:31 < zyp> hey, this shit enumerated over usb on first attempt
2018-09-04T11:47:28 < dongs> are you praying for japan, zyp?
2018-09-04T11:47:58 < zyp> are you dying in the typhoon?
2018-09-04T11:48:17 < qyx> stms flying around
2018-09-04T11:49:28 < zyp> hmm
2018-09-04T11:50:30 < zyp> I'm making some shit to interface with debug shells over CAN, with a f042 to make a usb adapter for it
2018-09-04T11:50:56 < qyx> both usb and can?
2018-09-04T11:51:08 < zyp> now I'm wondering if I should throw a couple of virtual serial interfaces on the usb device, or just pass can packets over bulk
2018-09-04T11:51:49 < zyp> the latter needs some custom host software to talk to it, but on the other hand I'm more flexible in what I can do later
2018-09-04T11:52:29 < dongs> why would host care about additional interfaces that it can't understand
2018-09-04T11:52:51 < zyp> well, I'd do either or, not both
2018-09-04T11:54:46 < dongs> yeah but i mean you could have a composite device wiht a vendor thing to do your bulk can shit and then a normal usb serial 
2018-09-04T11:55:39 < zyp> I could, but then I'd have to write the code for both
2018-09-04T11:55:50 < zyp> maybe I'll do that eventually
2018-09-04T11:56:42 < dongs> that would be what, liek 2 extra lines of C++2018?
2018-09-04T11:56:56 < zyp> haha
2018-09-04T11:59:16 < Steffanx> F042 is what i used with laks, worked like a charm indeed zyp
2018-09-04T11:59:50 < Steffanx> Although im thinking about moving to L0something because the adc is a bit fancier
2018-09-04T12:01:52 < zyp> Steffanx, with usb?
2018-09-04T12:02:10 < Steffanx> Yessir
2018-09-04T12:02:21 < zyp> why haven't you contributed the code back? :p
2018-09-04T12:02:47 < Steffanx> Hmmm, good question :P
2018-09-04T12:04:40 < dongs> not enough stroopwaffles
2018-09-04T12:06:14 < zyp> Steffanx, but yeah, not a lot of changes, mostly just RCC config, and that ended up being only two register fields
2018-09-04T12:06:28 < zyp> turn on HSI48, switch to HSI48 for sysclk
2018-09-04T12:07:01 < zyp> then flash latency set to one wait state
2018-09-04T12:07:16 < zyp> apart from that both CRS and USB code worked directly from l0
2018-09-04T12:08:51 < zyp> remains to see now how much work CAN needs to get going
2018-09-04T12:09:18 < zyp> IIRC I were doing CAN on f1 when I were playing around with those ESCs I got from dongs 
2018-09-04T12:09:27 < qyx> not much, I did can on f042 using the libopencm3 code
2018-09-04T12:09:37 < qyx> worked on first try
2018-09-04T12:09:44 < zyp> so I think I already have register defs, and I expect they'll work without much change
2018-09-04T12:11:46 < qyx> btw I used queues in both directions
2018-09-04T12:12:02 < qyx> now I have a basic mqtt broker
2018-09-04T12:12:27 < qyx> topic filtering was a bit pain
2018-09-04T12:15:10 < zyp> in mqtt?
2018-09-04T12:16:38 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T12:16:45 < catphish> morning
2018-09-04T12:17:10 < zyp> o/
2018-09-04T12:17:15 < catphish> this is the mess i made last night https://i.imgur.com/SHByEql.jpg but both boards work now, at least on the digital side
2018-09-04T12:17:15 < qyx> https://github.com/iqyx/plumcore/blob/feature/plog-router/services/plog/plog_router.c#L67
2018-09-04T12:17:18 < qyx> yes
2018-09-04T12:17:35 < zyp> catphish, cool
2018-09-04T12:18:18 < catphish> hopefully at least one has contact on the crystal and antenna too
2018-09-04T12:18:18 < zyp> uh, do you have a ground plane on that board? :p
2018-09-04T12:18:18 < qyx> the conditions could be optimized a bit though
2018-09-04T12:18:44 < catphish> zyp: there is a ground plane on the rear only, it stops before the antenna
2018-09-04T12:19:21 < zyp> without having seen the bottom, it looks possibly a bit insufficient for a board containing RF stuff :)
2018-09-04T12:19:30 < catphish> zyp: https://imgur.com/a/iDU0znP
2018-09-04T12:19:33 < qyx> interesting, whats the pad spacing on the L0?
2018-09-04T12:19:41 < dongs> that looks like qfp32
2018-09-04T12:19:53 < dongs> 7x7
2018-09-04T12:19:55 < zyp> qfp32 is like 0.67 or something, isn't it?
2018-09-04T12:19:59 < zyp> or 0.75?
2018-09-04T12:20:02 < dongs> 0.65 yea
2018-09-04T12:20:11 < dongs> arduino-pitch
2018-09-04T12:20:18 < qyx> avr is 0.8
2018-09-04T12:20:20 < qyx> afaik
2018-09-04T12:20:41 < zyp> qfp32 footprint is pretty much exact same size as qfp48 footprint, just less dense
2018-09-04T12:20:50 < catphish> LQFP32 - 0.8mm
2018-09-04T12:21:11 < qyx> yes, they say 0.8 in the ds
2018-09-04T12:21:26 < qyx> I didn$'t know there are stm32 with such spacing
2018-09-04T12:21:46 < dongs> they stole thej package from STM8
2018-09-04T12:21:49 < zyp> and since qfp32 (for the parts I've used) is less available than qfp48 and doesn't save any space, I've just always used qfp48 even when I didn't need the extra pins
2018-09-04T12:22:26 < catphish> in other news, i got pricing from the distributor for the MAS6180B
2018-09-04T12:22:39 < qyx> I usually use qfn28 for small things
2018-09-04T12:22:41 < dongs> from that .fi scammer place?
2018-09-04T12:22:45 < dongs> how mcuh did they want for it
2018-09-04T12:23:28 < catphish> it's rather quantity dependent, minimum quantity comes in at 2.30 for the IC and 1.07 for the antenna
2018-09-04T12:23:47 < zyp> what's minimum qty?
2018-09-04T12:24:03 < dongs> is taht packaged or IC dies
2018-09-04T12:24:08 < catphish> 96 ICs, 1000 antennas
2018-09-04T12:24:20 < dongs> why would they even bother selling antenna
2018-09-04T12:24:34 < dongs> you mean ferrite core with shit wound on it?
2018-09-04T12:24:37 < catphish> so realistically, 1000 of each is 1.40 + 1.07
2018-09-04T12:24:41 < catphish> dongs: yes
2018-09-04T12:24:42 < dongs> that sounds like something you can get on aliexpress anyway
2018-09-04T12:25:00 < catphish> i don't really mind paying $1 for an antenna, but i doubt i'll be starting at 1000 units
2018-09-04T12:25:50 < qyx> interesting, couldn't you get a gps receiver for that price?
2018-09-04T12:25:53 < qyx> like $3 or what
2018-09-04T12:26:12 < catphish> 1) i don't think so 2) i'm worried about signal and power with that
2018-09-04T12:26:34 < catphish> though if i can get a gps receiver that cheap i'll give it a try
2018-09-04T12:26:48 < qyx> there were some quectels for 7e with low power modes
2018-09-04T12:26:59 < qyx> also you can sync once a day or so
2018-09-04T12:27:05 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-04T12:27:38 < catphish> https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/gps-modules/9084085/?cm_mmc=UK-PPC-DS3A-_-google-_-DSA_UK_EN_Computing_Peripherals-_-GPS+Modules-_-DYNAMIC+SEARCH+ADS&matchtype=b&dsa-397541782689&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5ejMnYSh3QIVAVXTCh3RDQPdEAAYASAAEgLEkPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
2018-09-04T12:27:59 < kakimir> is there anything in pcb process that would not allow me to place copper right to the edge of the board?
2018-09-04T12:28:18 < Jak_o_Shadows> I was going to say, cheapest I've ever seen a GPS receiver was about 10AUD
2018-09-04T12:28:31 < catphish> kakimir: manufacturer will tell you, but i believe it's not a good idea
2018-09-04T12:28:58 < catphish> i don't think i'm getting a gps for < $10 anyway
2018-09-04T12:29:26 < zyp> kakimir, having a plane all the way to the edge is fine, but then you end up with exposed copper when the board is cut
2018-09-04T12:29:36 < kakimir> normal chinashop does a lot of assumptions how the customer wants the board
2018-09-04T12:30:01 < zyp> having a trace close to the edge is problematic because the precision is not all that great when they cut the board
2018-09-04T12:30:06 < catphish> https://www.banggood.com/7M8M-Ublox-M8N-GPS-Module-for-APM-Pixhawk-CC3D-Naze32-F3-Flight-Control-p-1078657.html?rmmds=buy
2018-09-04T12:30:08 < kakimir> I have seen active adjustments at least once to my board
2018-09-04T12:30:09 < dongs> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/topgnaa/32813781151.html
2018-09-04T12:30:12 < zyp> so you normally need some margin there to avoid them cutting your edge
2018-09-04T12:30:15 < zyp> trace*
2018-09-04T12:30:35 < kakimir> if they thing you are doing something stupid they might manipulate the gerber
2018-09-04T12:30:38 < catphish> NEO-M8M costs 7.01 EUR
2018-09-04T12:30:42 < kakimir> think
2018-09-04T12:30:44 < qyx> catphish: https://www.sos.sk/products/quectel/l70r-m37-l70re-m37-163047
2018-09-04T12:30:52 < catphish> plus antenna
2018-09-04T12:31:08 < kakimir> zyp I have already exposed copper there
2018-09-04T12:31:10 < catphish> qyx: nice price, what about antenna?
2018-09-04T12:31:12 < dongs> my link has antenna
2018-09-04T12:31:14 < qyx> idk
2018-09-04T12:31:20 < dongs> and module.
2018-09-04T12:31:22 < qyx> use a long 45mm wire
2018-09-04T12:31:31 < qyx> *a 45mm long
2018-09-04T12:32:50 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWKJUmrpq6U Looool
2018-09-04T12:32:53 < qyx> also
2018-09-04T12:33:03 < qyx> there are gsm modules for $2 on ebay
2018-09-04T12:33:11 < qyx> are they able to get network time without registering?
2018-09-04T12:33:19 < qyx> I have never tried that
2018-09-04T12:33:25 < dongs> https://youtu.be/eWKJUmrpq6U?t=62 LoooL
2018-09-04T12:33:37 < zyp> qyx, never heard about anybody attempting that
2018-09-04T12:33:41 < catphish> qyx: i wondered about using GSM or RDS, but coverage isn't really guarenteed
2018-09-04T12:34:12 < catphish> good document about antennas here: https://www.u-blox.com/sites/default/files/products/documents/GPS-Antenna_AppNote_%28GPS-X-08014%29.pdf
2018-09-04T12:35:15 < kakimir> how do they resin mold electronics?
2018-09-04T12:35:52 < catphish> i assume it's a lot easier to receive 1 GPS signal than the number necessary to get a position lock
2018-09-04T12:35:54 < zyp> place electronics in mold, fill with resin?
2018-09-04T12:36:09 < kakimir> I have usb-rs232 adapter on my desk - it's afaik completelly molded shut all way to electronics
2018-09-04T12:36:22 < zyp> catphish, yes, getting a time fix requires a lot less
2018-09-04T12:36:28 < kakimir> just one piece of resin package
2018-09-04T12:37:01 < zyp> to get a position fix, the receiver needs to know the position of all the sats, and downloading that data takes a bunch of time
2018-09-04T12:37:12 < Streaker> My ublox unit picks up 5 satellites on the ground floor of a 7 floor apartment.
2018-09-04T12:37:16 < zyp> that's why gps receivers takes a long time to get a position fix
2018-09-04T12:37:22 < catphish> wow, my android phone can get a gps lock indoors with no trouble
2018-09-04T12:37:25 < Streaker> It's not supposed to work indoors...
2018-09-04T12:37:33 < catphish> that's impressive
2018-09-04T12:38:06 < zyp> phones gets the position data (almanac, ephemeris) online instead of waiting for it to get streamed from the satellites
2018-09-04T12:38:34 < Streaker> zyp: modules save that data in flash memory.
2018-09-04T12:38:42 < catphish> that's true, but still, getting a signal from enough satellites to get a lock is impressive
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2018-09-04T12:39:16 < catphish> so getting a time signal might not be too hard
2018-09-04T12:39:19 < Streaker> So they get a lock as fast as a phone. Except the very first time.
2018-09-04T12:39:48 < zyp> Streaker, caching helps, but it needs to be constantly updated
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2018-09-04T12:40:12 < Laurenceb_> 2+2=4 is a social construct
2018-09-04T12:40:38 < sync> Streaker: they are probably shipped with a current almanac
2018-09-04T12:40:44 < zyp> "The ephemeris is updated every 2 hours and is generally valid for 4 hours, with provisions for updates every 6 hours or longer in non-nominal conditions."
2018-09-04T12:40:47 < kakimir> now you are making a fool of yourself Laurenceb_ 
2018-09-04T12:41:16 < zyp> "The almanac is updated typically every 24 hours. Additionally, data for a few weeks following is uploaded in case of transmission updates that delay data upload."
2018-09-04T12:41:41 < catphish> that L70R-M37 is pretty cheap
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2018-09-04T12:41:48 < catphish> just need to choose an antenna
2018-09-04T12:43:21 < Streaker> Do you need the ephemeris for a lock? Doesn't the almanac give you all the data you need to get a fix?
2018-09-04T12:44:32 < zyp> the ephemeris is what tells you exactly where the sats are
2018-09-04T12:46:37 < catphish> gps is still dramatically more expensive than a 60kHz receiver, but it does seem that it can come in at under $10
2018-09-04T12:46:49 < Streaker> So it's needed for best accuracy. Not needed for a fix.
2018-09-04T12:48:19 < catphish> https://docs-emea.rs-online.com/webdocs/165d/0900766b8165d5cf.pdf + https://www.quectel.com/product/l70r.htm
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2018-09-04T12:49:48 < zyp> Streaker, as far as I understand, the almanac is mainly used to figure out which satellites to look for,
2018-09-04T12:50:42 < zyp> https://www.novatel.com/support/known-solutions/gnss-ephemerides-and-almanacs/
2018-09-04T12:50:53 < zyp> "The almanac helps out with fixing the satellites for the first time but that is about it. The ephemerides however are vital for positioning computation."
2018-09-04T12:52:58 < qyx> actually I am curious why the receiver cannot be done sdr style using the adc
2018-09-04T12:53:15 < qyx> but still meh
2018-09-04T12:53:34 < qyx> I am not sure if anyone uses dcf77 nowadays, I would check other alternatives
2018-09-04T12:54:23 < jpa-> DCF77 receiver using SDR?
2018-09-04T12:55:03 < catphish> qyx: which receiver? the DCF77 one?
2018-09-04T12:55:08 < jpa-> you can probably skip some parts by feeding to ADC and filtering digitally, but you still need to have the frontend resonating quite close to 77kHz to get enough sensitivity
2018-09-04T12:55:44 < catphish> one still needs the preamp and course filtering, the actual demodulation is trivial
2018-09-04T12:56:58 < catphish> i'm confused, is this a receiver? https://www.u-blox.com/sites/default/files/SAM-M8Q_DataSheet_%28UBX-16012619%29.pdf
2018-09-04T12:57:25 < catphish> they list it under antennas, but it looks to be a fully integrated receiver
2018-09-04T12:57:32 < qyx> why, simple lpf <100k, iq demod made from analol switch, internal opamp with gain and lpf <couple of Hz, feed to adc
2018-09-04T12:58:03 < catphish> qyx: you think the internal opamp will do the job?
2018-09-04T12:58:07 < qyx> idk
2018-09-04T12:58:13 < qyx> I would try
2018-09-04T12:58:37 < qyx> the gbw needed is small as the amplification is after iq demod
2018-09-04T12:59:02 < qyx> there are some amateur sdr receivers which do it this way
2018-09-04T12:59:15 < zyp> catphish, yeah, it's a complete module
2018-09-04T12:59:38 < catphish> zyp: that might be a decent option then at 8 EUR
2018-09-04T13:00:28 < catphish> then i don't have to to microwave design :)
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2018-09-04T13:03:32 < jpa-> qyx: i think if you just lpf <100k, you'll get low-frequency noise (like 50Hz line noise) that saturates the ADC long before the 77kHz signal becomes detectable
2018-09-04T13:03:45 < jpa-> ah
2018-09-04T13:03:47 < catphish> oh yeah, 50Hz will kill it
2018-09-04T13:03:55 < jpa-> demodulating on analog side, ok, that might work
2018-09-04T13:04:11 < jpa-> though not sure analog switch is any cheaper than plain old ferrite rod + capacitor
2018-09-04T13:04:13 < catphish> i'll have to look up how the stm32 opamp works, never used it
2018-09-04T13:04:38 < Jak_o_Shadows> Hmmm.
2018-09-04T13:04:41 < qyx> you still need the ferrite
2018-09-04T13:04:52 < Jak_o_Shadows> I wonder if it's good enough for bring up the doppler radar module to something sensible
2018-09-04T13:04:53 < catphish> well the ferrite + capacitor costs $1, so it's hard to beat, but if i can receive using only that and the STM, that's ideal
2018-09-04T13:05:05 < sync> qyx: lots of people use dcf77
2018-09-04T13:05:22 < qyx> catphish: and an analog switch
2018-09-04T13:05:36 < qyx> or maybe a couple of fets
2018-09-04T13:06:07 < catphish> so, that's the thing, a complete receiver that handles all that, and AGC costs 1.40
2018-09-04T13:06:28 < catphish> so is it really worth trying to design it?
2018-09-04T13:06:37 < qyx> idk
2018-09-04T13:06:41 < qyx> I would try that just for the lulz
2018-09-04T13:06:49 < catphish> i've run out of lulz
2018-09-04T13:06:58 < qyx> so not an option
2018-09-04T13:07:42 < catphish> but i will need to compare
2018-09-04T13:07:52 < catphish> gps with DCF77
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2018-09-04T13:15:21 < veverak> been thinking (I do that sometimes, it's always funny)
2018-09-04T13:15:43 < Steffanx> Auch.
2018-09-04T13:15:49 < Steffanx> Tch
2018-09-04T13:16:01 < veverak> got a device that sends a 'float' value from stm32 over CAN to Linux ARM device
2018-09-04T13:16:22 < veverak> are there any platforms that one can meet that does not use IEEE754 ?
2018-09-04T13:26:37 < Steffanx> Is it really an issue veverak? Just specify your message as it using ieee754 and let people use that ? :P
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2018-09-04T13:28:52 < veverak> propably not, and I believe it should not happend, I am just curious now
2018-09-04T13:28:54 < veverak> :)
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2018-09-04T14:10:54 < karlp> jpa-: so what do you have to do to have apps outside the ../apps path, can you have a _lsit_ of apps paths? or is this whole world based on fork and deal with merges later?
2018-09-04T14:14:40 < karlp> zyp: you didn't get caught out up hsi48 needing vrefint turned on?
2018-09-04T14:16:10 < BrainDamage> qyx: even SDR use filters
2018-09-04T14:16:30 < BrainDamage> that's because the adc of the radio doesn't have infinite dynamic range
2018-09-04T14:16:52 < karlp> qyx: nice null readme file :)
2018-09-04T14:17:46 < BrainDamage> you can do the downconversion in software, however, the filter will be almost always necessary when you account that disturbing signals can and often are 40-50dB stronger than your interested one
2018-09-04T14:17:52 < BrainDamage> case in point: SMPS
2018-09-04T14:19:01 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
2018-09-04T14:19:27 < qyx> BrainDamage: I know, hence the rough 100k lpf, the antenna is tuned to the desired freq too
2018-09-04T14:19:33 < qyx> karlp: no time for it :(
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2018-09-04T14:25:43 < zyp> karlp, doesn't seem to be a requirement on f0
2018-09-04T14:25:52 < zyp> I know it's required on l0, I got code for that
2018-09-04T14:25:59 < zyp> but f0 works without that part
2018-09-04T14:28:54 < zyp> also seems like I probably didn't need to turn on HSI48, seems like it's enabled automatically when USB is turned on
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2018-09-04T14:55:33 < karlp> dongs: what was this? https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1140867 urls not working for me.
2018-09-04T15:00:15 < dongs> hm weird
2018-09-04T15:00:24 < dongs> was ancient news about 256x256 sram-based crosspoint switch
2018-09-04T15:00:26 < dongs> from like 2005
2018-09-04T15:00:34 < dongs> url does work but takes like 30 seconds to load
2018-09-04T15:01:56 < dongs> no, 1999
2018-09-04T15:01:57 < karlp> zyp: oh, right, you were going from l0 tof0, not the other way around
2018-09-04T15:02:18 < karlp> qyx: lies. time to make a readme, but not even say a one line about what this repo is?
2018-09-04T15:02:34 < qyx> pure lies
2018-09-04T15:02:56 < karlp> dongs: just times out here and shows an error 
2018-09-04T15:03:21 < dongs> weird.
2018-09-04T15:03:25 < dongs> it took a while but opened here
2018-09-04T15:03:31 < dongs> maybne youre behind some proxy that gives up sooner
2018-09-04T15:03:38 < dongs> or the site is just full of trash
2018-09-04T15:04:32 < dongs> The MSX532 is due to sample just before Christmas, with production volumes due for the first quarter of 2000. The price is $799 each in lots of 1,000.
2018-09-04T15:04:35 < dongs> jesus
2018-09-04T15:05:05 < karlp> and what's that when it's at home?
2018-09-04T15:05:36 < karlp> what are you looking for?
2018-09-04T15:06:04 < dongs> ah no, i was just looking for some unrelated part and that datasheet came up when searching and i just thought it was weird device
2018-09-04T15:06:16 < dongs> i think anyone doing something like this now probably just uses a FPGA or someshit
2018-09-04T15:06:28 < dongs> or there's not even that many requirements for 256x256 switching matrix
2018-09-04T15:06:41 < dongs> like whats a nigga gonna do multiplexing that many inputs
2018-09-04T15:07:46 < dongs> i donno wtf you dudes are filing it
2018-09-04T15:07:47 < dongs> failing
2018-09-04T15:07:50 < dongs> it works fine here
2018-09-04T15:08:06 < dongs>  you must have not paid your eetimes365 subscription
2018-09-04T15:14:35 < Thorn> http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/116873845 what is this, vxworks?
2018-09-04T15:15:00 < dongs> tRootTask
2018-09-04T15:15:04 < dongs> maybe its iTroll
2018-09-04T15:15:34 < dongs> Thorn: but yeah troottask looks to be vxdongs
2018-09-04T15:16:24 < dongs> did ISS bluescreenb
2018-09-04T15:19:35 < karlp> qyx: so, what is plumcore?
2018-09-04T15:22:18 < qyx> it is a framwork/sys with freertos as a microkernel and a bunch of services with loose coupling
2018-09-04T15:22:21 < qyx> at least thats the idea
2018-09-04T15:22:31 < qyx> with dependency injection between services
2018-09-04T15:22:51 < qyx> it has a mikrotik-style cli
2018-09-04T15:23:10 < qyx> and it is semi-functional
2018-09-04T15:24:58 < qyx> for data logging, remote daq and mesh routing
2018-09-04T15:42:55 < jadew> Thorn, what are we looking at?
2018-09-04T15:44:14 < jadew> what crashed?
2018-09-04T15:44:53 < dongs> ISS crashed
2018-09-04T15:45:49 < jadew> morale of the story: don't use linux on a space ship
2018-09-04T15:46:36 < jadew> seriously tho, what exactly crashed and what are we looking at?
2018-09-04T15:46:48 < cjbaird> Was NetBSD-1.0 at some point controlling the orientation aspects..
2018-09-04T15:46:49 < jadew> why is that blue screen in the feed?
2018-09-04T15:47:40 < jadew> ok, that's boring
2018-09-04T15:47:41 < dongs> because government
2018-09-04T15:47:49 < dongs> everything they do is public domain
2018-09-04T15:47:56 < jadew> so my conclusion is that it's easier to just test circuits than simulate them
2018-09-04T15:48:04 < jadew> ltspice, tina-ti, etc, they all suck
2018-09-04T15:48:31 < jadew> probably some of the keysight tools would be decent, but who has money for that
2018-09-04T15:48:32 < jadew> not me
2018-09-04T15:49:04 < Thorn> jadew: Bob Pease agrees with you
2018-09-04T15:49:05 < qyx> I can see "PI camera"
2018-09-04T15:49:12 < dongs> gross
2018-09-04T15:49:30 < jadew> Thorn, in what regard? and who is Bob Pease?
2018-09-04T15:49:59 < Thorn> what do you mean who is Bob Pease
2018-09-04T15:50:23 < jadew> ah, I know that guy
2018-09-04T15:50:31 < jadew> (googled him and saw his picture)
2018-09-04T15:50:35 < jadew> yeah, he's cool
2018-09-04T15:51:06 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-04T15:56:31 < karlp> qyx: here you go :) https://github.com/iqyx/plumcore/pull/2
2018-09-04T16:00:36 < qyx> karlp: lol
2018-09-04T16:01:03 < karlp> see how easy that was? :)
2018-09-04T16:01:25 < qyx> looks like even travis works
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2018-09-04T16:03:38 < qyx> speaking of that project, I am doing a "packager" which collets multiple sensor values, packs them together, signs and publishes the result back to the queue
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2018-09-04T16:03:54 < qyx> and it seems that dongs beloved heatshrink library does a good job
2018-09-04T16:04:59 < qyx> it can compress a 30line log of values with time, topic and float written as a string from 1410 to 276 bytes
2018-09-04T16:06:43 < Cracki> turns it into binary values?
2018-09-04T16:06:54 < Cracki> or gzip/...?
2018-09-04T16:07:17 < qyx> it simply compresses the text
2018-09-04T16:07:22 < qyx> 197 bytes even
2018-09-04T16:07:24 < qyx> with different settings
2018-09-04T16:07:38 < qyx> thats 6.5bytes per value
2018-09-04T16:08:08 < qyx> I was about to serialize the values with protobufs and then compress
2018-09-04T16:08:23 < qyx> now I don't know it it is worth the effort
2018-09-04T16:12:33 < Cracki> and you get your original log lines out of it, no messing around
2018-09-04T16:12:37 < zyp> if you're only producing, not consuming, maybe not
2018-09-04T16:12:49 < zyp> but having to parse strings sounds annoying
2018-09-04T16:14:32 < qyx> thats another thing, good point
2018-09-04T16:18:02 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qthHlLyvplg BOC
2018-09-04T16:18:09 < kakimir> musiks
2018-09-04T16:24:52 < Steffanx> Be nice crt
2018-09-04T16:30:13 < cjbaird> EEVBlog? fuck off
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2018-09-04T16:41:02 < jpa-> karlp: i just have this kind of lines in the makefile for my own folder:   $(call REGISTER,selftest,SCHED_PRIORITY_DEFAULT,2048,selftest_main)
2018-09-04T16:41:18 < jpa-> which comes from   include $(APPDIR)/Make.defs
2018-09-04T16:48:19 < zyp> hmm
2018-09-04T16:48:33 < zyp> the ACK/retry mechanism in CAN is a bit annoying
2018-09-04T16:48:52 < zyp> if there's nobody listening, it retries forever
2018-09-04T16:50:15 < jpa-> no retry limit?
2018-09-04T16:50:21 < Sadale> wow. Interesting.
2018-09-04T16:50:27 < Sadale> That's dumb TBH :P
2018-09-04T16:50:32 < zyp> yeah, I wish there were a limit
2018-09-04T16:50:59 < Sadale> do it with software :P
2018-09-04T16:51:03 < zyp> preferably different limits for arbitration loss and NAK
2018-09-04T16:51:23 < Sadale> I think there's some way to stop retrying, right?
2018-09-04T16:51:26 < zyp> arbitration loss should be retried indefinitely, they are expected during normal use
2018-09-04T16:51:41 < zyp> but NAK retries are not so interesting
2018-09-04T16:53:56 -!- cjbaird [~cjb@ppp118-211-220-207.bras1.syd2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-04T16:53:58 < Steffanx> jpa- crt is trying to get your attention. Will you give him some?
2018-09-04T16:54:54 < Cracki> since when does CAN have a retry? you can do it, but I don't remember anything specified
2018-09-04T16:55:52 < jpa-> Steffanx: ok
2018-09-04T16:56:57 < qyx> jpa-: is there a way in nanopb to make "bytes" included in the message as a pointer to uint8_t[] for example?
2018-09-04T16:57:40 < qyx> I am using it like required bytes data = 2 [(nanopb).max_size = 8];
2018-09-04T16:58:53 < jpa-> you mean like   (nanopb).type = FT_POINTER   ?
2018-09-04T17:00:34 < jpa-> though that requires pointer to pb_bytes_array_t instead of to uint8_t[].. unless you're happy with fixed_length
2018-09-04T17:01:04 < jpa-> always possible with callbacks though
2018-09-04T17:01:14 < crt> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9u9Vy_peHM
2018-09-04T17:02:05 < qyx> jpa-: uh, I'll examine it, seems like exactly what I want
2018-09-04T17:02:47 < jpa-> yeah, main complication in any case is passing the array length
2018-09-04T17:03:25 < qyx> can't I set the .size accordingly?
2018-09-04T17:04:09 < jpa-> sure, but pb_bytes_array_t is annoying in that it has the array right after the length, and not through separate pointer indirection
2018-09-04T17:08:22 < catphish> how upset is a stm32 likely to be if i run it at 3.65v (rated at 1.65-3.60)?
2018-09-04T17:09:11 < jpa-> probably doesn't even notice
2018-09-04T17:10:49 < catphish> specificaly i want to use a Li-SOCl2 (ls14500), which is 3.5v but has an open circuit voltage of 3.65v, i figured it would be fine, but wondered if anyone knew for sure
2018-09-04T17:10:53 < Steffanx> Absolute max. Is specified as 4 iirc
2018-09-04T17:11:11 < Steffanx> 4V
2018-09-04T17:11:36 < catphish> Steffanx: it is but that comes with a warning " These are stress ratings only and functional operation of
2018-09-04T17:11:36 < catphish> the device at these conditions is not implied"
2018-09-04T17:11:50 < catphish> but i guess that means if it works, it's all good
2018-09-04T17:11:55 < jpa-> is this for single device or for manufacture?
2018-09-04T17:12:09 < catphish> manufacture, that's why i'm concerned
2018-09-04T17:12:27 < jpa-> just put the LDO there
2018-09-04T17:12:55 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-04T17:13:17 < zyp> aren't you a bit early to think too seriously about manufacturing?
2018-09-04T17:13:55 < catphish> zyp: i don't know, i have no idea how early one designs correctly :)
2018-09-04T17:14:08 < englishman> once it breaks
2018-09-04T17:14:16 < catphish> no point designing something that is known to be bad i'd say
2018-09-04T17:14:38 < catphish> ideally i'd like to shave a couple of hundred mV off that supply voltage
2018-09-04T17:14:39 < zyp> no point in overdesigning something you'll make 30 units of either
2018-09-04T17:14:43 < jpa-> nothing is universally bad or universally good
2018-09-04T17:15:15 < zyp> quick CAN question
2018-09-04T17:15:22 < catphish> perhaps i should just hook up a battery and a diode and just measure the voltage
2018-09-04T17:15:33 < catphish> it's very likely that it'll end up below 3.6v anyway
2018-09-04T17:15:42 < zyp> if I set up a filter matching my outgoing packet, I won't receive and ack it myself?
2018-09-04T17:16:09 < jpa-> catphish: your multimeter draws several µA, so it will definitely be below that then
2018-09-04T17:16:15 < englishman> put two stm32 in series so they each get vcc/2
2018-09-04T17:16:30 < catphish> jpa-: hmm yes
2018-09-04T17:17:10 < zyp> oh well, that's enough CAN for today
2018-09-04T17:17:53 < jpa-> connect the stm32 power to GPIO instead of VDD pin so you can use the integrated diode
2018-09-04T17:17:57 < zyp> USB works, CAN TX works, can't test CAN RX until I've done the other end, still need to write some code that pushes data between USB and CAN and some host code to interface with it
2018-09-04T17:19:11 < srk> :D
2018-09-04T17:19:14 < zyp> getting this stuff in place will be good, I'm tired of having to solder up wires to uart test points
2018-09-04T17:19:18 < zyp> :p
2018-09-04T17:19:38 < srk> just connect CANH to CANL
2018-09-04T17:19:44 < srk> and you have a loopback
2018-09-04T17:19:47 < zyp> good idea
2018-09-04T17:19:51 < srk> or you can set up internal loopback
2018-09-04T17:20:00 < catphish> will a linear voltage regulator work at 1uA?
2018-09-04T17:20:06 < srk> you probably also want SLCAN for UART->CAN
2018-09-04T17:20:18 < zyp> SLCAN?
2018-09-04T17:20:30 < srk> and of course CANOpen to not invent another standard for device control :D
2018-09-04T17:20:43 < zyp> oh, no, that's not my purpose at all
2018-09-04T17:20:50 < srk> https://github.com/distrap/can4disco/#slcan-usage
2018-09-04T17:21:11 < zyp> yeah, no, that's not relevant
2018-09-04T17:21:25 < srk> how come
2018-09-04T17:21:43 -!- day [~Unknown@unaffiliated/day] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-04T17:21:49 < zyp> I wanna do serial over can, not can over serial :p
2018-09-04T17:22:00 < srk> ah, ok :)
2018-09-04T17:22:40 < zyp> so I'm just gonna define a pair of can IDs for each serial link, one for tx and one for rx for each
2018-09-04T17:23:04 < srk> but why
2018-09-04T17:23:30 < zyp> because I have a device that I wrote a little command shell for last year
2018-09-04T17:23:42 < zyp> and I have several of these devices in a box
2018-09-04T17:23:50 < zyp> and I want access to them all from the outside
2018-09-04T17:24:10 < srk> right
2018-09-04T17:24:37 < zyp> it's simplifying a bit, but you get the point
2018-09-04T17:25:16 < srk> btw there's also internal loopback bit for bxcan
2018-09-04T17:25:18 < zyp> eventually there will probably also be other functions on the bus, that the shell traffic will coexist with
2018-09-04T17:25:31 < zyp> yeah, but that's not so interesting
2018-09-04T17:27:00  * srk hates linker scripts
2018-09-04T17:38:30 < Steffanx> Doesnt your IDE do it all?
2018-09-04T17:38:42 < englishman> https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2015/05/01/2015-10066/airworthiness-directives-the-boeing-company-airplanes
2018-09-04T17:38:55 < englishman> The software counter internal to the generator control units (GCUs) will overflow after 248 days of continuous power, causing that GCU to go into failsafe mode.
2018-09-04T17:39:02 < englishman> oops
2018-09-04T17:39:54 < Steffanx> Lolol.
2018-09-04T17:39:59 < Steffanx> Such classic.
2018-09-04T17:40:18 < srk> Steffanx: my IDE is vim
2018-09-04T17:50:33 < kakimir> waiting my prototype to overflow
2018-09-04T17:50:42 < kakimir> it takes like.. half a year of something
2018-09-04T17:53:21 < jpa-> i don't even bother designing for overflows, i just make my counters 64-bit
2018-09-04T17:55:42 < kakimir> I did
2018-09-04T17:56:03 < kakimir> all my counter system is overflow proof
2018-09-04T17:56:09 < kakimir> at least was at some point
2018-09-04T17:57:59 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@193.173.113.122] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-04T18:01:12 < Steffanx> So one day we'll have such notice that device x has to be power cycled each 584 554 530 years?  
2018-09-04T18:01:17 < Steffanx> Dont do that jpa- 
2018-09-04T18:01:47 < jpa-> well the flash will be bust in 30+ years anyway
2018-09-04T18:02:36 < englishman> y4k
2018-09-04T18:04:19 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-04T18:04:32 < kakimir> I should probs use 64bit counters but I'm too cheap to use such excessive measures against overflow
2018-09-04T18:06:39 < Steffanx> Excessive... 
2018-09-04T18:09:26 < kakimir> just check for overflow
2018-09-04T18:09:34 < kakimir> every cycle
2018-09-04T18:11:16 < kakimir> burn process time
2018-09-04T18:11:24 < kakimir> hey that 64bit thing is smart
2018-09-04T18:11:40 < kakimir> or wait
2018-09-04T18:11:53 < kakimir> it might actually use more processing time on 32bit system
2018-09-04T18:12:01 < kakimir> definitelly
2018-09-04T18:12:07 < englishman> better switch to stm64
2018-09-04T18:12:28 < catphish> seems like a pointless step, might as well upgrade to stm128
2018-09-04T18:13:13 < kakimir> I need to do one comparison per cycle
2018-09-04T18:13:28 < kakimir> if last stored value is bigger than counter value
2018-09-04T18:13:40 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-04T18:14:20 < kakimir> nothing but overflow or last stored value not updating can cause that condition to be true
2018-09-04T18:14:54 < kakimir> I have constraint system where last stored value can have only maximum difference to current value
2018-09-04T18:15:22 < kakimir> I need to check those macros
2018-09-04T18:15:38 < kakimir> as I have played with some delays if I have macro check in place
2018-09-04T18:16:02 < kakimir> if contraint acts before delay the delay condition is not ever reached
2018-09-04T18:16:07 < kakimir> *constraint
2018-09-04T18:16:33 < qyx> I am about to use 32bit counter for messages.
2018-09-04T18:18:50 < englishman> you mean like lorawan
2018-09-04T18:21:17 < qyx> sigfox
2018-09-04T18:21:27 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-04T18:21:27 < qyx> that would last to the end of the days
2018-09-04T18:25:53 < srk> why sigfox?
2018-09-04T18:26:02 < qyx> </troll>
2018-09-04T18:28:41 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T18:33:55 < kakimir> is there any like thick coating I could use instead of plastic case?
2018-09-04T18:34:13 < kakimir> just spray it over pcb in 4mm thick layer
2018-09-04T18:34:16 < kakimir> or so
2018-09-04T18:34:32 < kakimir> translucent
2018-09-04T18:35:17 < kakimir> or could I mold resin over the board?
2018-09-04T18:39:30 < kakimir> fuu I need to change default program for previewing images
2018-09-04T18:43:37 < kakimir> let's gerber this shiet
2018-09-04T18:45:04 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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2018-09-04T18:48:19 < kakimir> it could look interesting to somewhat see components inside
2018-09-04T18:48:26 < kakimir> no optics guide for led
2018-09-04T18:48:37 < kakimir> heat tranfer - optimal
2018-09-04T18:49:30 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-04T19:07:16 < bitmask> woot, added a light sensitive resistor to auto dim this clock: https://youtu.be/Zm8a92Djk4A
2018-09-04T19:08:27 < zyp> kakimir, I thought about encapsulating some usb adapter board in transparent resin
2018-09-04T19:08:54 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/BlWxx.png <- this sort of thing, then attach cable and pot it
2018-09-04T19:10:15 < Steffanx> Good fade is good bitmask 
2018-09-04T19:10:29 < bitmask> fade was actually built in
2018-09-04T19:10:44 < bitmask> I just had it change the color
2018-09-04T19:10:48 < Steffanx> Awh
2018-09-04T19:10:53 < bitmask> well it uses hsv so I changed the value
2018-09-04T19:13:33 < Steffanx> Ok, ill take my words back then
2018-09-04T19:14:03 < bitmask> :)
2018-09-04T19:14:31 < Steffanx> You actually used the esp foe it?
2018-09-04T19:14:37 < bitmask> yup
2018-09-04T19:15:07 < Steffanx> Meh
2018-09-04T19:15:12 < bitmask> $3, why not
2018-09-04T19:15:20 < bitmask> and a nice simple web app to adjust
2018-09-04T19:15:35 < Steffanx> Because ##stm32
2018-09-04T19:15:51 < bitmask> racist
2018-09-04T19:16:06 < bitmask> esp is cheap and useful, get over it
2018-09-04T19:16:07 < Steffanx> Ty
2018-09-04T19:16:31 < Steffanx> Tarduino is considered useful 
2018-09-04T19:16:52 < bitmask> for some things it may be, open your mind!
2018-09-04T19:16:54 < srk> nothing like arduiNO on ESP
2018-09-04T19:16:55 < srk> xD
2018-09-04T19:17:04 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-04T19:17:13 < srk> I've heard you like broken so we stacked broken on top of broken
2018-09-04T19:17:23 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T19:17:29 < bitmask> well it worked perfectly for this project so who cares?
2018-09-04T19:17:36 < bitmask> everyone just loves to complain
2018-09-04T19:17:41 < srk> stm32trolls do! 
2018-09-04T19:18:02 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-04T19:18:06 < Steffanx> Lol, you bite so easily bitmask :P
2018-09-04T19:18:11 < srk> :D
2018-09-04T19:18:34 < bitmask> people annoy me :P
2018-09-04T19:18:38 < Steffanx> Hah. Who?
2018-09-04T19:19:15 < Steffanx> Stm32 wouldve been nicer. Thats all
2018-09-04T19:19:16 < bitmask> everyone :P I guess you now too :)
2018-09-04T19:19:49 < bitmask> I'll get over it
2018-09-04T19:20:05 < Steffanx> 😊
2018-09-04T19:20:41 < jpa-> stm32 may be nice, but ##stm32 will never be :P
2018-09-04T19:20:53 < bitmask> truer words have never been said
2018-09-04T19:20:59 < Thorn> ^^ /topic
2018-09-04T19:22:04 < Steffanx> But iiiiiaiiii willll always loveee youuu. jpa- 
2018-09-04T19:22:48 < Steffanx> Whitney Houston did a better job at that song
2018-09-04T19:23:46 < englishman> even hating on your own channel
2018-09-04T19:23:50 < englishman> shameful
2018-09-04T19:24:11 < jpa-> this was never my channel :P
2018-09-04T19:24:29 < englishman> you've been here for 7 years
2018-09-04T19:24:30 < Steffanx> Part of the group.
2018-09-04T19:25:07 < Steffanx> So how is jpa-.
2018-09-04T19:25:29 < Steffanx> Hows self-employing and house dadding?
2018-09-04T19:25:56 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T19:25:58 < Steffanx> Is junior your irc side kick yet?
2018-09-04T19:28:00 < jpa-> nope
2018-09-04T19:28:29 < Steffanx> You should be come a teacher, only answering the last question asked
2018-09-04T19:28:51 < jpa-> would be the laziest teacher ever
2018-09-04T19:28:53 < englishman> what is the proper age to introduce children to internet trolling
2018-09-04T19:29:06 < Steffanx> Proper is never.
2018-09-04T19:29:21 < jpa-> depends on if "trolling" is rickroll or lb level
2018-09-04T19:29:26 < englishman> so you will teach abstinence
2018-09-04T19:30:27 < englishman> shall trolling be taught before or after stm32
2018-09-04T19:31:22 < Steffanx> Start small. Start with stm8, then stm32 and then there is no need for trolling
2018-09-04T19:31:36 < Steffanx> Because ##stm32 will be there
2018-09-04T19:31:57 < englishman> the best troll is to succeed without trolling at all
2018-09-04T19:32:29 < bitmask> I like that choice
2018-09-04T19:33:33 < englishman> time to order some lorawang proto pcbs
2018-09-04T19:34:05 < Steffanx> Done prototyping on the disco already?
2018-09-04T19:35:18 < englishman> the embedded side is necessairly simple
2018-09-04T19:35:40 < englishman> the influxdb stuff seems harder so i will procrastinate and make pcbs instead
2018-09-04T19:38:04 < Steffanx> Hire someone to do that part. Sounds like the most boring part
2018-09-04T19:39:50 < Cracki> you with the influxdb now too?
2018-09-04T19:39:57 < Cracki> hire the blax, he has experience :P
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2018-09-04T19:41:24 < Steffanx> Hah
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2018-09-04T20:06:43 < jadew> what's this thing about the blax
2018-09-04T20:07:05 < jadew> I keep seeing that word here but I don't know what it means
2018-09-04T20:08:14 < Steffanx> you do know the last name of mr laurence right?
2018-09-04T20:08:31 < jadew> ah, so it refers to him, got it
2018-09-04T20:08:47 < Steffanx> yes, hes been using that db for his mems data
2018-09-04T20:08:55 < jadew> yeah, makes sense now
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2018-09-04T20:09:32 < Steffanx> ;)
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2018-09-04T20:43:10 < kakimir> nightshift
2018-09-04T20:43:23 < jadew> any ideas on a circuit that: 1) can clip the lower part of a signal. 2) the clipping level is variable and can go down to 0. 3) works from a single polarity supply.
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2018-09-04T20:43:58 < kakimir> 431?
2018-09-04T20:44:03 < qyx> resistor and a zener?
2018-09-04T20:44:13 < jadew> qyx, not variable
2018-09-04T20:44:19 < qyx> (connected to the vcc)
2018-09-04T20:44:34 < qyx> you mean variable in runtime?
2018-09-04T20:44:37 < kakimir> opamp with power rail powered from another opamp
2018-09-04T20:44:37 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-04T20:44:46 < kakimir> rail-to-rail opamp
2018-09-04T20:45:08 < jadew> kakimir, that might work, thanks for the suggestion
2018-09-04T20:45:24 < kakimir> what you are trying to archive?
2018-09-04T20:45:39 < kakimir> cheap, precise, working, simple?
2018-09-04T20:46:08 < jadew> well, most importantly it has to be working hehe
2018-09-04T20:46:33 < jadew> the cascaded opamp would work, but I'll keep that as a last resort
2018-09-04T20:47:28 < kakimir> that is like the solid solution
2018-09-04T20:47:37 < kakimir> others are kindof hacky
2018-09-04T20:47:48 < jadew> doesn't seem solid to me
2018-09-04T20:48:02 < jadew> it will take a bit of extra circuitry to stabilize the output
2018-09-04T20:48:08 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-04T20:48:25 < kakimir> waitaminute
2018-09-04T20:48:31 < kakimir> fet boi
2018-09-04T20:48:33 < kakimir> use fet
2018-09-04T20:48:59 < jadew> for which part?
2018-09-04T20:49:24 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wopmEyZKnYo get inspirations from capacitor multiplier
2018-09-04T20:49:42 < kakimir> it's RC filter that is connected to fet gate
2018-09-04T20:50:22 < kakimir> *capacitance multiplier
2018-09-04T20:51:00 < kakimir> output follows gate voltage
2018-09-04T20:51:32 < jadew> precisely?
2018-09-04T20:51:47 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-04T20:51:54 < kakimir> see results in this video
2018-09-04T20:52:00 < jadew> I'll check it
2018-09-04T20:52:02 < kakimir> totally kills noise in the line
2018-09-04T20:52:34 < jadew> my ideal solution would be a vbe multiplier with close to 0 forward voltage
2018-09-04T20:52:46 < jadew> so... an ideal diode that's variable
2018-09-04T20:53:29 < kakimir> does it matter if there is offset between input and output?
2018-09-04T20:53:38 < jadew> no
2018-09-04T20:53:53 < kakimir> also fet will drift a bit
2018-09-04T20:54:35 < kakimir> is this some sort of test setup thing, prototype or something?
2018-09-04T20:55:06 < jadew> I'm trying to limit the output of an opamp
2018-09-04T20:55:27 < kakimir> for what?
2018-09-04T20:56:13 < jadew> an IC I'm working with, needs its voltage to be within a particular range
2018-09-04T20:56:39 < jadew> I'm prototyping something
2018-09-04T20:56:39 < kakimir> is that mcu or so?
2018-09-04T20:56:51 < jadew> no, analog crap
2018-09-04T20:57:01 < kakimir> does it have clamping to inputs?
2018-09-04T20:57:12 < jadew> if it did, I wouldn't need this :)
2018-09-04T20:57:13 < kakimir> or is the range smaller than supply voltage?
2018-09-04T20:57:32 < jadew> it's a window within the supply voltage
2018-09-04T20:57:33 < kakimir> something like 1.2V +- 10mV
2018-09-04T20:57:43 < jadew> something like 1 to 2 V
2018-09-04T20:57:51 < jadew> can't go lower nor higher
2018-09-04T20:58:06 < jadew> so what I'm feeding it has to be clipped
2018-09-04T20:58:10 < jadew> there are limiting opamps
2018-09-04T20:58:14 < jadew> but they're rather expensive
2018-09-04T20:58:58 < kakimir> https://youtu.be/wopmEyZKnYo?t=9m54s stuff begins at 10minutes or so
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2018-09-04T20:59:29 < jadew> I'm gonna watch the whole video, sounds interesting
2018-09-04T20:59:36 < kakimir> very interesting
2018-09-04T21:00:14 < kakimir> how fast signal you have?
2018-09-04T21:00:25 < jadew> it's slow, bw is not an issue
2018-09-04T21:00:44 < jadew> < 1 kHz
2018-09-04T21:00:57 < kakimir> why you need to adjust it when you have known levels?
2018-09-04T21:01:03 < kakimir> 1 and 2volts
2018-09-04T21:01:04 < kakimir> or so
2018-09-04T21:01:19 < jadew> tunning
2018-09-04T21:01:49 < jadew> they're just ballpark figures
2018-09-04T21:01:51 < kakimir> potentiometer?
2018-09-04T21:01:54 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-04T21:02:15 < kakimir> series resistor and 2pcs of 431
2018-09-04T21:02:46 < kakimir> another pulls down directly when threshold is reached
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2018-09-04T21:03:03 < kakimir> another would like.. use BJT transistor or something to pull line up
2018-09-04T21:03:25 < kakimir> simulate
2018-09-04T21:03:39 < jadew> I'll check it out, thanks
2018-09-04T21:04:17 < kakimir> tl lm 431 or whatever - shunt regulator
2018-09-04T21:04:35 < jadew> yeah, found the datasheet
2018-09-04T21:04:48 < kakimir> you familiar with 431?
2018-09-04T21:04:53 < jadew> no
2018-09-04T21:05:20 < kakimir> it's "adjustable zener"
2018-09-04T21:05:27 < jadew> yeah, looks interesting
2018-09-04T21:05:40 < kakimir> it's literally everywhere
2018-09-04T21:05:48 < kakimir> in PSUs mainly
2018-09-04T21:06:24 < jadew> unfortunately it only goes down to 2.5V
2018-09-04T21:06:34 < kakimir> well that
2018-09-04T21:07:03 < kakimir> forgot
2018-09-04T21:07:08 < kakimir> it has not been issue for me
2018-09-04T21:07:24 < jadew> still interesting
2018-09-04T21:07:26 < jadew> I'll order a few
2018-09-04T21:11:34 < kakimir> what voltage levels you have available in circuit?
2018-09-04T21:12:08 < jadew> don't know yet, but I want to avoid negative rails
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2018-09-04T21:17:28 < kakimir> how much current there will be out of the opamp?
2018-09-04T21:17:59 < jadew> very little
2018-09-04T21:18:07 < kakimir> and how much operating current of the opamp is?
2018-09-04T21:18:31 < jadew> you're going back to your opamp powered by another opamp? :)
2018-09-04T21:18:35 < kakimir> no
2018-09-04T21:18:42 < kakimir> I have simple solution for you
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2018-09-04T21:18:50 < jadew> I don't know, haven't even decided on an opamp yet
2018-09-04T21:19:04 < jadew> whatever it needs to be I guess
2018-09-04T21:19:40 < kakimir> is there limitation to total current consumption of the device?
2018-09-04T21:19:57 < jadew> no
2018-09-04T21:20:24 < kakimir> 2 pcs 1k or smaller potentiometers
2018-09-04T21:20:31 < kakimir> offset with resistors
2018-09-04T21:21:00 < kakimir> to about right minimum level
2018-09-04T21:21:05 < kakimir> of level
2018-09-04T21:21:06 < jadew> and power the opamp from that?
2018-09-04T21:21:10 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-04T21:21:19 < kakimir> directly from resistors!
2018-09-04T21:21:37 < kakimir> as in potentiometer + potential offset resistors
2018-09-04T21:21:43 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-04T21:21:50 < jadew> might actually work
2018-09-04T21:21:56 < kakimir> it would
2018-09-04T21:22:05 < kakimir> nasty but simple solution
2018-09-04T21:23:06 < kakimir> more offset resistors you use less total resitance your potentiometer should have
2018-09-04T21:23:20 < kakimir> idea is to put not all the heat in the potentiometer
2018-09-04T21:25:35 < Steffanx> powering a opamp like htat sounds like a terrible idea to me
2018-09-04T21:26:58 < jadew> can start oscillating for sure
2018-09-04T21:27:40 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-04T21:27:42 < kakimir> true
2018-09-04T21:32:10 < Steffanx> i dont even understand what you want jadew  :P clip the lower part of a signal?
2018-09-04T21:32:21 < kakimir> both directions
2018-09-04T21:32:25 < jadew> yeah, cuz I already took care of the upper part
2018-09-04T21:32:35 < kakimir> oh.. only lower
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2018-09-04T21:39:50 < Steffanx> and with the lower part you mean the negative part jadew ?
2018-09-04T21:40:52  * qyx @ hard time with nanopb
2018-09-04T21:41:42 < Steffanx> jpa- does paid nanopb support
2018-09-04T21:43:02 -!- Dave_Elec [~Dave@197.156.95.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-04T21:43:12 < Steffanx> or is it some signal with an (positive) offset and do you want to limit how low it can go?
2018-09-04T21:43:19 < jadew> Steffanx, no, positive, but only what's above a certain level should get through
2018-09-04T21:43:38 < qyx> dac output with a zener?
2018-09-04T21:44:51 < jadew> qyx, I could output the signal with a DAC, that's not a bad idea either
2018-09-04T21:45:20 < jadew> zeners wouldn't help here tho
2018-09-04T21:45:25 < qyx> wat
2018-09-04T21:45:30 < qyx> so clip it in softawre
2018-09-04T21:45:34 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-04T21:45:39 < jadew> I could do that
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2018-09-04T21:50:21 < kakimir> waas
2018-09-04T21:50:35 < kakimir> was software clipping and option whole the time?
2018-09-04T21:50:39 < kakimir> *an
2018-09-04T21:50:40 < jadew> no
2018-09-04T21:51:06 < jadew> but I'll keep it in mind too
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2018-09-04T22:34:43 < kakimir> irc megatrends
2018-09-04T22:35:06 < Steffanx> yet kakimir  makes no sense
2018-09-04T22:37:01 < kakimir> I need a program that can tell me the fuck my computer is doing and not telling me
2018-09-04T22:37:25 < jadew> it's sending telemetrics
2018-09-04T22:37:33 < jadew> which keys you're pressing and in what order
2018-09-04T22:37:56 < kakimir> that should not take that much power it would ruin my user experience!!!
2018-09-04T22:40:59 < Steffanx> "Run lunix and it wont do anything" 
2018-09-04T22:43:55 < jadew> lol
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2018-09-04T23:27:37 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qzi4Ps29lWT_s8o3jBCHMzi0u2YG00h2/view?usp=sharing what is such resin?
2018-09-04T23:27:51 < kakimir> or is it actually thermoplastic?
2018-09-04T23:29:32 < kakimir> aten uc232a is the device
2018-09-04T23:38:08 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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2018-09-04T23:47:11 < Cracki> would say plastic, not resin
2018-09-04T23:47:16 < Cracki> looks cheap
2018-09-04T23:47:30 < kakimir> what does resin mean?
2018-09-04T23:47:45 < kakimir> it means it goes through polymerizing process?
2018-09-04T23:48:05 < Cracki> no clue, sounds about right
2018-09-04T23:48:09 < kakimir> how come it doesn't ruin any electronics on board?
2018-09-04T23:48:23 < Cracki> not conductive?
2018-09-04T23:48:25 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-04T23:48:31 < kakimir> mechanically
2018-09-04T23:48:36 < kakimir> stresses involved
2018-09-04T23:48:40 < Cracki> no
2018-09-04T23:48:53 < Cracki> besides, I'd guess that "case" isn't poured, it's actually hollow
2018-09-04T23:49:19 < Cracki> can you squeeze it? does it look slid onto the metal connector?
2018-09-04T23:49:38 < kakimir> it cannot be squeezed
2018-09-04T23:49:39 < kakimir> it's solid
2018-09-04T23:49:43 < kakimir> totally
2018-09-04T23:49:57 < kakimir> and I would see if there was hollow volume inside
2018-09-04T23:49:58 < Cracki> hmmm that's good then
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2018-09-04T23:50:08 < Cracki> could be silicone
2018-09-04T23:50:14 < Cracki> silicone can be made quite hard
2018-09-04T23:50:49 < kakimir> really?
2018-09-04T23:51:05 < Cracki> and polymerizes at room temperature (faster if warmer)
2018-09-04T23:51:09 < kakimir> I think it might be polyurethane
2018-09-04T23:51:21 < Cracki> https://albrightsilicone.com/a-guide-to-shore-durometers/
2018-09-04T23:51:23 < Cracki> or that
--- Day changed Wed Sep 05 2018
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2018-09-05T00:04:16 < kakimir> it's really quite hard but not brittle at all
2018-09-05T00:04:54 < kakimir> also flexible - used in strain relief too
2018-09-05T00:05:12 < kakimir> I could throw it in a freezer
2018-09-05T00:05:32 < kakimir> that can be used to rule out if it's some pvc
2018-09-05T00:25:16 < englishman> https://cloud.google.com/iot-core/
2018-09-05T00:25:27 < englishman> might try this instead of incocksdb
2018-09-05T00:25:53 < vampi-the-frog> sorry, are we talking about your weiner, kakimir ?
2018-09-05T00:26:04 < vampi-the-frog> I just joined, sorry
2018-09-05T00:26:19 < vampi-the-frog> http://img.vampi.tech/2be6f966.png
2018-09-05T00:26:40 < BrainDamage> weaboochat spotted
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2018-09-05T00:39:43 < catphish> woo, nfc radio works
2018-09-05T00:40:14  * karlp hi5s jpa for 64bit counters
2018-09-05T00:42:24 < crt> welcome
2018-09-05T00:42:42 < crt> good morning jpa
2018-09-05T00:43:25 < crt> karlp: i think jpa should win stm32 of the year award
2018-09-05T00:44:48 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-05T00:52:23 < Steffanx> Cool catphish 
2018-09-05T00:53:13 < catphish> Steffanx: just figuring out the protocol now, don't think it's too complicated, but i also have whiskey, so it's happening at a sedate pace :)
2018-09-05T00:53:28 < Steffanx> Lol. 
2018-09-05T00:55:24 < kakimir> oh my god
2018-09-05T00:55:27 < kakimir> energy is rising
2018-09-05T01:01:02 < crt> JOULES
2018-09-05T01:01:05 < crt> MORE JOULES
2018-09-05T01:01:17 < crt> @ 1.21 nigger watts!
2018-09-05T01:02:20 < crt> AWTS
2018-09-05T01:26:26 < kakimir> nigawatts boi
2018-09-05T01:28:05 < crt> like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLdKRissmb8
2018-09-05T01:31:50 < Cracki> love the frying noises
2018-09-05T01:33:02 < crt> reminds me of my ex girlfriend
2018-09-05T01:35:55 < Cracki> how so, was she similarly pigmented?
2018-09-05T01:36:22 < crt> i don't know
2018-09-05T01:36:32 < crt> maybe it was the buzzing noise
2018-09-05T01:38:15 < Cracki> your ex was buzzing? sounds... mechanical
2018-09-05T01:39:17 < crt> 3dpd
2018-09-05T01:40:01 < Cracki> a big soft daki is all a man ever needs
2018-09-05T01:40:45 < crt> wut is daki
2018-09-05T01:41:32 < kakimir> don't ask
2018-09-05T01:42:14 < crt> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqDRA60AgNs
2018-09-05T01:43:08 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-05T01:44:48 < karlp> crt: is this enough? https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/README.md#L5
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2018-09-05T01:45:51 < crt> very good one karlp 
2018-09-05T01:45:59 < Cracki> excellent video
2018-09-05T01:46:51 < Cracki> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4CCYEzlYwA
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2018-09-05T02:10:51 < Laurenceb_> muh usb audio class
2018-09-05T02:11:03 < Laurenceb_> >connect maya44 to lunix pc
2018-09-05T02:11:16 < Laurenceb_> >lunix decides there is no input hardware mixer
2018-09-05T02:11:50 < Laurenceb_> >but sets gain to -9dB
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2018-09-05T02:14:22 < crt> good owkr
2018-09-05T02:16:34 < Laurenceb_> predicted what crt will look like in 2050 and it's beautiful https://postimg.cc/image/u2lj2jzmv/
2018-09-05T02:17:16 < Cracki> those must be gills
2018-09-05T02:20:11 < Laurenceb_> heh there is lots of rage on the forumz about this
2018-09-05T02:20:37 < Laurenceb_> and its a failure by the GERMans who wrong the maya44 firmware
2018-09-05T02:20:52 < Laurenceb_> somehow they managed to miss a byte in mixer descriptor
2018-09-05T02:21:30 < Laurenceb_> there is a kernel patch for this O_o
2018-09-05T02:24:18 < Laurenceb_> wew Behring B-5 max error was 0.023dB according to my megabux calibrated dBA meter
2018-09-05T02:24:25 < Laurenceb_> just looking over some test data
2018-09-05T02:24:54 < Laurenceb_> my audiophool gear is finally being audiophool grade
2018-09-05T02:26:00 < Laurenceb_> maya 44 -> 1.2k ohm 1:1 balun -> phantom power inject that actually delivers 48v -> B-5 mic
2018-09-05T02:26:16 < crt> smoking crack tonight
2018-09-05T02:26:17 < Laurenceb_> and its all working perfectly apart from lunix setting weird line in gain
2018-09-05T02:26:51 < Cracki> so.... firmware update possible to fix this?
2018-09-05T02:26:51 < Laurenceb_> I added traco power isolated dc-dc to run the phantom power off usb
2018-09-05T02:27:09 < Laurenceb_> I dont think there are any firmware updates for maya44...
2018-09-05T02:27:09 < jadew> any ideas on some good lectures/books on opamps?
2018-09-05T02:27:41 < Cracki> art of electronics, the standard book?
2018-09-05T02:27:48 < jadew> something more indepth
2018-09-05T02:27:53 < Laurenceb_> looks like traco power injects some noise
2018-09-05T02:28:00 < Laurenceb_> but mainly at <5hz, odd
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2018-09-05T02:28:39 < Laurenceb_> with the balun the whole mic system is isolated, not sure if thats good or bad
2018-09-05T02:36:55 < crt> come over here and shake that little pussy for me and the ranger
2018-09-05T02:38:38 < karlp> anyone doen much with interfacing 4-20mA stuff? the integrated stuff seems really pricy, surely there's cheaper stuff?
2018-09-05T02:38:47 < karlp> or is it just "industrial! pay up!"
2018-09-05T02:45:02 < kakimir> ?
2018-09-05T02:45:15 < kakimir> there is nothing complex about 4-20mA
2018-09-05T02:46:57 < kakimir> certainly no commercial solutions are needed just generic parts
2018-09-05T02:47:28 < kakimir> transmitter end or receiver end karlp?
2018-09-05T02:48:53 < karlp> both I'd expect
2018-09-05T02:49:03 < karlp> what do _you_ call "generic parts"
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2018-09-05T02:50:08 < karlp> dac7760? or building them out of op amps discretely?
2018-09-05T02:50:36 < kakimir> op amps
2018-09-05T02:50:43 < kakimir> few resistors
2018-09-05T02:51:00 < kakimir> I'd imagine it only takes 1 opamp per end
2018-09-05T02:51:28 < kakimir> transmitter end has resistor for current measurement
2018-09-05T02:51:34 < kakimir> and feedback
2018-09-05T02:51:49 < kakimir> opamp drives transistor that regulates current
2018-09-05T02:52:13 < kakimir> another end has load resistor and opamp buffer
2018-09-05T02:52:26 < kakimir> maybe diode
2018-09-05T02:52:44 < kakimir> Vf of diode wont matter
2018-09-05T02:53:18 < karlp> so yeah, build it from scratch
2018-09-05T02:53:30 < kakimir> what you concider pricy?
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2018-09-05T02:53:36 < kakimir> in this case
2018-09-05T02:56:29 < Cracki> is there a standard on this? how does this take care of ground/potentials?
2018-09-05T02:57:30 < kakimir> gnd wire connect transmitter and receiver
2018-09-05T02:57:40 < kakimir> only current matters at both ends
2018-09-05T02:57:56 < Cracki> ah, shared ground
2018-09-05T02:58:28 < kakimir> I suppose you can drive output as high voltage as is provided by receiver for sensor
2018-09-05T02:58:39 < kakimir> receiver powers sensor with third wire
2018-09-05T02:58:56 < Cracki> any max voltages specified? voltage on the line would depend on receiver side resistor
2018-09-05T02:59:23 < Cracki> since it's industrial stuff, I'd expect up to 24V. does that sound sensible?
2018-09-05T02:59:41 < kakimir> I have seen 120ohm load resistors in receiver diagrams
2018-09-05T02:59:45 < karlp> kakimir: well, things like dac8775 are ~$20 just for the ic.
2018-09-05T02:59:55 < karlp> I mean, sure it's 4 channels, but.... really?
2018-09-05T02:59:57 < Cracki> zefuk
2018-09-05T03:00:10 < kakimir> karlp: do you need accurate signal?
2018-09-05T03:00:10 < Cracki> perhaps superduper certified
2018-09-05T03:00:17 < kakimir> certainly
2018-09-05T03:00:20 < karlp> it's nicely integrated, you get 0/4-20, and 0-10V at the same time
2018-09-05T03:00:30 < karlp> but still seems $$
2018-09-05T03:00:30 < Cracki> resistor and in-controller ADC should be enough?
2018-09-05T03:00:48 < kakimir> 120ohm means that 20mA is 2.4volts
2018-09-05T03:00:52 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-05T03:01:07 < karlp> Cracki: for 4-20 there's 2wire (loop powered) 3-wire (self powerted, common ground) and 4-wire (self powered isolated) 
2018-09-05T03:01:18 < Cracki> perhaps a diode to protect against overvoltage...
2018-09-05T03:01:25 < Cracki> ic ic
2018-09-05T03:01:30 < kakimir> 4mA would be then 480mV
2018-09-05T03:01:50 < kakimir> I would also put a fuse in input
2018-09-05T03:02:01 < Cracki> yes, I'm aware that the remote side can use the 4 mA for powering itself
2018-09-05T03:02:23 < kakimir> hmm isolated option
2018-09-05T03:02:42 < kakimir> does it provide current from transmitter side to line?
2018-09-05T03:02:52 < Cracki> how does the isolated option work? receiver circuit loop-powered, then optocoupler or something for the signal?
2018-09-05T03:03:30 < kakimir> http://www.analog.com/-/media/analog/en/reference-circuits/images/cn0336-03-1024.gif?w=735&la=en
2018-09-05T03:03:40 < kakimir> simple simple
2018-09-05T03:03:45 < Cracki> eh, I'll google. easier than making people talk :P
2018-09-05T03:03:51 < kakimir> diode, 120ohms, RC filter and ADC
2018-09-05T03:04:15 < kakimir> karlp: can you see the pic?
2018-09-05T03:04:39 < kakimir> http://www.analog.com/en/design-center/reference-designs/hardware-reference-design/circuits-from-the-lab/cn0336.html#rd-commonvariations here is the page
2018-09-05T03:07:05 < karlp> kakimir: yeah
2018-09-05T03:07:29 < karlp> I don't get how multiple devices works.
2018-09-05T03:09:45 < crt> ty for the picture kakimir 
2018-09-05T03:10:19 < kakimir> karlp: multiple devices?
2018-09-05T03:10:25 < Cracki> hm right, the loop can be supplied with voltage from one device, and get current modulated by another...
2018-09-05T03:10:29 < kakimir> receiver has ports for all of them
2018-09-05T03:10:42 < kakimir> maybe seperate voltage outputs or not
2018-09-05T03:11:25 < kakimir> https://schematics.dapj.com/2009/02/current-source-for-resistance.html this is how you build simple current source
2018-09-05T03:11:55 < kakimir> with pnp transistor
2018-09-05T03:12:39 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-05T03:13:32 < karlp> yeah, Have just seen refernces to multiple deviceso n the loop, don't really get how that woudl work.
2018-09-05T03:13:56 < kakimir> it's not that simple if input voltage changes and you want to control that with mcu
2018-09-05T03:14:32 < Cracki> multiples that sense the current
2018-09-05T03:15:03 < Cracki> total resistance should be low enough for supply voltage
2018-09-05T03:15:20 < kakimir> yeah multiple receivers
2018-09-05T03:15:33 < kakimir> no problem
2018-09-05T03:15:43 < karlp> multiple receives soudns fine, but boring and why?
2018-09-05T03:16:09 < Laurenceb_> https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/crazy_rich_asians/ 93% how
2018-09-05T03:16:10 < kakimir> in industry you may want to feed that same signal to multiple boxes
2018-09-05T03:16:45 < Cracki> Laurenceb_, "critics" you know what it means
2018-09-05T03:16:53 < Laurenceb_> yeah
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2018-09-05T03:21:42 < kakimir> karlp: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Gyyqb_mrWXDo1UHeFWtfmodeGU1iuXh9/view?usp=sharing look at this
2018-09-05T03:22:15 < kakimir> 4-20mA loop with PWM input and output current sense line to adc
2018-09-05T03:22:57 < kakimir> hmm actually that is logic output to mcu
2018-09-05T03:23:37 < kakimir> but even this circuit doesn't look like it would work with altering input voltage
2018-09-05T03:24:06 < Cracki> seems to me the loop power supply is often separate from either sender or receivers
2018-09-05T03:24:32 < Cracki> so a sender takes applied voltage and modulates its 'resistance' to create 4-20
2018-09-05T03:25:07 < Cracki> this even seems to be the case when the sensor is _not_ feeding off the loop
2018-09-05T03:25:09 < kakimir> loop power supply is from transmitter side afaik
2018-09-05T03:25:38 < Cracki> not sure. most graphics I can find have explicit power supplies of fixed voltage
2018-09-05T03:26:07 < kakimir> internal regulation?
2018-09-05T03:26:10 < Cracki> then, transmitter and receivers sit on the loop, transmitter takes the voltage on the loop
2018-09-05T03:26:15 < kakimir> some 7815 there
2018-09-05T03:26:51 < karlp> kakimir: what did you snip that from?
2018-09-05T03:27:03 < kakimir> google image search
2018-09-05T03:27:09 < kakimir> to some pay site
2018-09-05T03:27:15 < karlp> ok, so... no, you don't, and I can do taht myself :)
2018-09-05T03:27:31 < karlp> I'm really not asking anyone else to just go and google it :)
2018-09-05T03:27:44 < kakimir> I'm interested
2018-09-05T03:28:12 < kakimir> but take note how open circuit is detected
2018-09-05T03:28:21 < kakimir> you can implement such in your version too
2018-09-05T03:32:09 < Thorn> 6 cent op amp https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Operational-Amplifiers_LMV321TP-TR_C90297.html
2018-09-05T03:32:10 < kakimir> karlp: see some 4-20mA sensors and read their datasheets
2018-09-05T03:32:37 < kakimir> Thorn: this site looks almost chinese
2018-09-05T03:32:47 < kakimir> is it good?
2018-09-05T03:33:33 < karlp> kakimir: yeah, that's what I was goign to do, I was only asking if anyone hadsome "here's the short cut version" didn't need anyone else to jsut go wikiing too
2018-09-05T03:33:36 < branjb> anyone used uart tx dma in f4/f7?
2018-09-05T03:33:51 < Thorn> lcsc? has been excellent so far (knock on wood)
2018-09-05T03:35:17 < kakimir> these specs look impressive for the price Thorn 
2018-09-05T03:35:34 < Cracki> dummy question: how well do opamps usually perform if the negative rail is just ground?
2018-09-05T03:35:57 < Cracki> I understand it's hard to reach either rail voltage
2018-09-05T03:35:59 < kakimir> negative voltage rail?
2018-09-05T03:36:03 < kakimir> supply?
2018-09-05T03:36:09 < Cracki> yes opamp supply
2018-09-05T03:36:21 < Cracki> instead of +12/-12, +12/0 or something
2018-09-05T03:36:43 < kakimir> +12/0?
2018-09-05T03:36:55 < kakimir> is 0 here GND
2018-09-05T03:37:01 < Cracki> yes?
2018-09-05T03:38:07 < Cracki> nvm, I'm reading https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/142293/op-amps-negative-power-supply-to-ground
2018-09-05T03:38:47 < kakimir> you know
2018-09-05T03:39:01 < kakimir> opamp cannot see what it's connected to
2018-09-05T03:39:13 < Thorn> Cracki: denends entirely on input signal actually
2018-09-05T03:39:22 < Thorn> it may be referenced to Vdd/2 for example
2018-09-05T03:39:27 < Thorn> and never reach ground
2018-09-05T03:39:32 < Cracki> sure
2018-09-05T03:39:33 < branjb> is there a gotcha with using dma with a uart tx on f4?  first transfer works, but no subsequent transfers work
2018-09-05T03:39:56 < Cracki> branjb, errata? :D
2018-09-05T03:39:56 < Thorn> if it can be ground you need a rail to rail or semi rail to rail op amp
2018-09-05T03:40:19 < branjb> possibly a flag that needs to be reset?  I followed the RM procedure though and it doesn't mention any flags except uart TC needing to be reset
2018-09-05T03:40:25 < branjb> nothing in errata
2018-09-05T03:40:29 < Thorn> branjb: do you reset all flags in the dma channel after it's done?
2018-09-05T03:40:37 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-05T03:40:56 < Cracki> uh... the opamp gets a + and - input, does it do more than use the difference between those? it has no reference for either input, so the voltages on the inputs, relative to +/- supply, shouldn't matter. or do they?
2018-09-05T03:41:46 < Thorn> Cracki: input common mode voltage range is a primary limitation
2018-09-05T03:41:55 < Cracki> hmmm
2018-09-05T03:42:38 < Thorn> Cracki: module 3 here https://training.ti.com/ti-precision-labs-op-amps
2018-09-05T03:43:04 < Cracki> *watching*
2018-09-05T03:44:11 < Cracki> still, common mode voltage relative to what potential?
2018-09-05T03:44:25 < Cracki> does it have to be roughly between supplies?
2018-09-05T03:46:45 < Cracki> ah, I guessed right
2018-09-05T03:46:59 < Thorn> it is measured relative to the negative power pin
2018-09-05T03:48:11 < Cracki> and the rest is data sheet, ic ic
2018-09-05T03:48:20 < Thorn> in some op amps (cmos) it can go slightly beyond power pins, in "normal" op amps it may be something like 0.5V...Vdd-1.5V (where Vdd is the positive power pin)
2018-09-05T03:48:40 < Thorn> so yes between the supply pins
2018-09-05T03:50:49 < kakimir> I thought 30cents for opamp was cheap
2018-09-05T03:52:29 < Thorn> kakimir: I'm buying 100 of them just in case
2018-09-05T03:52:37 < Thorn> now, a comparator
2018-09-05T03:53:15 < kakimir> I would need something that has offset bellow 2mV
2018-09-05T03:53:16 < kakimir> and
2018-09-05T03:53:28 < kakimir> less than 30eurocents /pc
2018-09-05T03:54:13 < Thorn> well that one in 0.1mV typ, 3.5mV max
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2018-09-05T03:54:57 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-05T03:55:04 < kakimir> bellow 2mV max
2018-09-05T03:57:59 < kakimir> I think my choise of using mcp601 is okay
2018-09-05T03:58:46 < kakimir> if I list sot23-5 opamps based on offset voltage mcp601 stands out with it price
2018-09-05T03:59:31 < kakimir> there is 3 pages of 2-3eur opamps, few +1eur and few sub 1eur
2018-09-05T04:00:20 < kakimir> and then mcp601 sub 40eurocents/1pc boom
2018-09-05T04:02:54 < kakimir> shit I need to sleep
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2018-09-05T04:09:31 < crt> goodnight kakimir 
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2018-09-05T04:22:10 < Thorn> so I'm protecting a mosfet from overcurrent with a shunt, op amp & comparator which pulls the gate down. how do I prevent the protection circuit from oscillating (switching off/on repeatedly)?
2018-09-05T04:22:16 < Thorn> I don't want a latch
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2018-09-05T04:23:21 < jadew> schmitt trigger
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2018-09-05T04:25:46 < branjb> Cracki: I'm dumb.  was reseting the dma flags instead of writing 1 to them to clear
2018-09-05T04:25:50 < branjb> that fixed it
2018-09-05T04:25:58 < Thorn> but it will switch the mosfet off completely
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2018-09-05T04:26:30 < jadew> Thorn, didn't you say you were using a comparator to pull the gate down?
2018-09-05T04:26:51 < Thorn> yes I did
2018-09-05T04:27:13 < jadew> so you want current limitting?
2018-09-05T04:27:19 < Thorn> and I can make a schmitt trigger from a comparator but how will than help
2018-09-05T04:27:33 < jadew> I thought you want to turn it off when such a condition occurs
2018-09-05T04:27:34 < Thorn> I want to fully switch the mosfet off
2018-09-05T04:27:58 < jadew> how do you turn it back on?
2018-09-05T04:28:09 < Thorn> it may overheat in linear mode
2018-09-05T04:28:29 < Thorn> I don't, the control signal on its gate will still be high
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2018-09-05T04:28:45 < jadew> if it's off, it won't be high
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2018-09-05T04:28:56 < Thorn> so the comparator pulls the gate down -> current goes to 0 -> comparator switches off -> gate is 1 again
2018-09-05T04:29:13 < jadew> that's going to oscillate
2018-09-05T04:29:19 < Thorn> exactly
2018-09-05T04:29:34 < jadew> so what's your question?
2018-09-05T04:29:47 < Thorn> if I feed the trip signal back to the MCU it will take another optocoupler
2018-09-05T04:29:58 < Thorn> the question is how not to oscillate
2018-09-05T04:30:23 < jadew> in this configuration, by not drawing more current than it can source
2018-09-05T04:30:55 < jadew> or more than you've set the comparator to trigger on
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2018-09-05T04:31:27 < jadew> you also said you don't want it to overheat, so there's nothing left
2018-09-05T04:31:32 < Thorn> I don't need the protection circuit at all then lol
2018-09-05T04:31:39 < jadew> heh
2018-09-05T04:32:17 < Thorn> if the condition which is supposed to trigger it never arises
2018-09-05T04:32:29 < Thorn> unfortunately the real world is not so ideal
2018-09-05T04:36:59 < Thorn> what about a peak detector
2018-09-05T04:37:08 < Thorn> I'm going to have an op amp anyway
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2018-09-05T05:19:30 < jadew> this capacitor shortage is super annoying
2018-09-05T05:19:49 < jadew> I don't understand how it's possible that we've ran out of caps
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2018-09-05T05:56:20 < crt> Terry Davis receives a posthumous GNAA gold card
2018-09-05T05:56:56 < branjb> he dead?
2018-09-05T05:58:17 < branjb> oh damn
2018-09-05T05:58:17 < branjb> RIP
2018-09-05T05:59:31 < crt> still dunno m8
2018-09-05T05:59:47 < branjb> his OS was pretty impressive for one dude
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2018-09-05T06:02:31 < crt> even moreso for a crazy fucker
2018-09-05T06:03:46 < branjb> got run over by a train
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2018-09-05T06:09:49 < crt> is that what happened?
2018-09-05T06:11:35 < branjb> supposedly
2018-09-05T06:12:06 < branjb> https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:C3AHzg1FppUJ:www.thedalleschronicle.com/news/2018/aug/13/train-death-reported-saturday/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
2018-09-05T06:12:35 < branjb> https://media.8ch.net/file_store/9d6cdd428a7b9646fb0779ea68e82440bedab7fb68e375a441fab7ea48976e3a.png
2018-09-05T06:13:42 < crt> heh fair enough
2018-09-05T06:14:53 < crt> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoTYV22qZTg
2018-09-05T06:14:58 < crt> for good old times
2018-09-05T06:15:39 < branjb> the amount of time/knowledge that went into his OS is crazy haha
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2018-09-05T06:34:44 < branjb> https://youtu.be/7uLzaKlZSQQ?t=508
2018-09-05T06:34:50 < branjb> lol
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2018-09-05T06:46:27 < Thorn> we need TempleRTOS for ARM
2018-09-05T06:47:03 < turnip420> lol
2018-09-05T06:48:46 < branjb> damn
2018-09-05T06:48:57 < branjb> youtube for "templeos" that man is a legend
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2018-09-05T07:16:03 < crt> Thorn: the sourcecode has always been available lol
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2018-09-05T07:20:59 < Ultrasauce> the source is written in "holy c" and the compiler is for x64 only crt
2018-09-05T07:29:17 < crt> holy c for stm32
2018-09-05T07:29:25 < crt> who do it
2018-09-05T07:29:26 < crt> lol
2018-09-05T07:29:37 < crt> kickstart holyC for stm32 
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2018-09-05T07:30:37 < dongs> is this niggerlicious
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2018-09-05T08:02:27 < crt> that is the question
2018-09-05T08:03:10 < crt> this guy deserves a feature film
2018-09-05T08:05:19 < crt> best quote ever "there was a nigger.... who came up with this idea..."
2018-09-05T08:06:12 < crt> cout <<  "lol" << endl;
2018-09-05T08:21:53 < dongs> holyC for STM32 sounds amazing
2018-09-05T08:22:01 < dongs> together with TempleRTOS
2018-09-05T08:22:07 < dongs> we need to get ohsix on this
2018-09-05T08:27:58 < crt> he should have it completed in 15 minutes
2018-09-05T08:31:40 < dongs> 15 years more like
2018-09-05T08:31:48 < dongs> jesus will be reborn
2018-09-05T08:31:54 < dongs> before o6 completes TempleRTOS
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2018-09-05T09:06:45 < crt> very good
2018-09-05T09:06:57 < crt> how did you manage to shut him up dongs ?
2018-09-05T09:09:02 < dongs> not sure
2018-09-05T09:09:04 < dongs> maybe he got an actual job
2018-09-05T09:09:09 < dongs> holding dicks, but at least a job
2018-09-05T09:09:18 < dongs> less autism, more dicks
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2018-09-05T09:22:42 < crt> maybe jlcpcb
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2018-09-05T10:05:23 < Steffanx> Did you know ohsix moved on dongs?
2018-09-05T10:05:32 < Steffanx> You should try too :P
2018-09-05T10:08:30 < day> he made a move on dongs? dawww :3
2018-09-05T10:10:10 < Steffanx> Yeah i forgot some important , 
2018-09-05T10:10:13 < Steffanx> Mr day :P
2018-09-05T10:10:27 < day> ;^)
2018-09-05T10:10:39 < Steffanx> I love you too
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2018-09-05T10:19:57 < upgrdman> no chatz? :/
2018-09-05T10:20:47 < Ultrasauce> no patience
2018-09-05T10:21:13 < upgrdman> true
2018-09-05T10:21:22 < Ultrasauce> be the change you wish to see in the world
2018-09-05T10:21:24 < upgrdman> im bored at work tho
2018-09-05T10:21:33 < upgrdman> getting impatient
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2018-09-05T10:56:24 < crt> upgrdman start doing drugs
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2018-09-05T11:51:13 < mitrax_> hi there
2018-09-05T11:51:33 < mitrax_> dongs: hey, what do you recommend when you have to deal with cut tapes instead of full reels and you can't just waste a few parts? (cause they're expensive and you don't want to manually place them). Do you use adhesive leaders / smt strips or whatever they're called?
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2018-09-05T12:06:09 < jpa-> mitrax_: peel the strip and put it on tray?
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2018-09-05T12:13:37 < mitrax_> jpa-: sure but say you don't have any room left in the tray area, i was just wondering if there were strips that worked well enough to avoid that. I got some but the machine guy says they're not convenient and don't stick enough 
2018-09-05T12:17:59 < hansP> Hi guys, is there a bit that indicates that a debugger is attached / the core is in debug mode that can be read by the firmware?
2018-09-05T12:18:10 < hansP> CM0/CM4
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2018-09-05T12:19:46 < mitrax_> CoreDebug->DHCSR & CoreDebug_DHCSR_C_DEBUGEN_Msk
2018-09-05T12:22:16 < hansP> mitrax_: thanks!
2018-09-05T12:23:23 < mitrax_> that works on CM3/CM4, not sure about CM0 though
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2018-09-05T12:30:56 < kakimir> can mouser run out of mlccs hmm
2018-09-05T12:31:55 < kakimir> I give pretty wide parameters + stocked
2018-09-05T12:32:06 < kakimir> get 3 different caps
2018-09-05T12:32:28 < kakimir> one of three is acceptable price
2018-09-05T12:37:08 < kakimir> one of them is with metal feet
2018-09-05T12:37:13 < kakimir> lifted package
2018-09-05T12:37:24 < kakimir> and one of them is 5times the price
2018-09-05T12:37:28 < kakimir> of others
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2018-09-05T12:37:43 < dongs> mitrax_: yeah, i have splice tape for smaller reels and splice join thingy with crimpers for larger reel
2018-09-05T12:38:42 < mitrax_> dongs: may i ask where you get them from? 
2018-09-05T12:38:51 < dongs> just random chinashit from chiangirl
2018-09-05T12:39:13 < dongs> smt splice clip is the copper thing
2018-09-05T12:39:19 < dongs> thats used for larger tape connecting
2018-09-05T12:40:17 < dongs> but yeah it depends if its really odball sized tape like very wide or something, I'll pull enough parts off so that it fits into feeder and manually place those at start or at end, and the rest run off the reel
2018-09-05T12:40:28 < dongs> but for tape-ish lookin shit, splice clip/splice tape works
2018-09-05T12:40:44 < mitrax_> okay cause the adhesive splice tape i got from zhong didn't seem to work well, was a box of 500x8mm super cheap generic stuff at $2, maybe the machine guy wasn't happy with the 12mm one though
2018-09-05T12:41:21 < mitrax_> err boxes of 500x8mm and 500x12mm
2018-09-05T12:41:47 < dongs> thats the tape stuff, it works for me
2018-09-05T12:41:59 < dongs> mabe try copper + splice tool?
2018-09-05T12:42:00 < mitrax_> i'll try the copper thing for larger tapes
2018-09-05T12:42:04 < dongs> is this paper reels or plastic
2018-09-05T12:42:10 < dongs> yeah you need copper for 16mm+
2018-09-05T12:42:10 < dongs> for sure
2018-09-05T12:42:15 < mitrax_> thanks!
2018-09-05T12:42:25 < dongs> copper and tape some on the bottom so it feeds through
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2018-09-05T13:00:02 < karlp> hrm, new orangepizeroplus doesn't power up.
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2018-09-05T13:00:18 < karlp> I know it claims to want a lot of power, but nothing here is even getting it to blink
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2018-09-05T13:15:16 < dongs> rip lunix
2018-09-05T13:17:24 < kakimir> what did you do to your lunux
2018-09-05T13:23:25 < kakimir> ?
2018-09-05T13:31:54 < karlp> hrm, I'm concerned this is DOA.
2018-09-05T13:32:10 < karlp> I can see 5V and 3v3 on it's expansions but no serial boot up and no leds
2018-09-05T13:33:27 < crt> damn
2018-09-05T13:35:14 < kakimir> what is?
2018-09-05T13:35:23 < kakimir> aa some pi
2018-09-05T13:35:36 < kakimir> yeah
2018-09-05T13:35:49 < kakimir> manuf. standards may not be so great for such 
2018-09-05T13:36:36 < crt> Orange Pi PC Plus is for anyone who wants to start creating with technology – not just consuming it. It's a simple, fun, useful tool that you can use to start taking control of the world around you.
2018-09-05T13:39:14 < friendofafriend> It's your PCB pal that's fun to be with!
2018-09-05T13:49:52 < cjbaird> Disappointed there doesn't look to be a generational jump in STM32 tech in the last 5 years, really..
2018-09-05T13:51:49 < jpa-> F7/H7 was a quite big jump
2018-09-05T13:53:14 < Steffanx> What jpa said
2018-09-05T13:53:19 < crt> hi jpa
2018-09-05T13:53:20 < cjbaird> What happened that was more than just scaling-up due to fabrication improvements..?
2018-09-05T13:53:37 < zyp> cortex-m7
2018-09-05T13:53:46 < zyp> which includes caches and shit
2018-09-05T13:53:55 < Steffanx> Dual core is a thing too now. The wireless stm32
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2018-09-05T13:55:16 < jpa-> cortex-m7 having efficient external memory interfaces makes it quite reasonable for running even bigger systems like something linux based - which seems like a nice alternative to the many poorly documented SoCs
2018-09-05T13:55:45 < jpa-> (* cortex-m7 in stm32f7 with ...; not every cortex-m7 has those interfaces)
2018-09-05T13:56:31 < zyp> running linux without a mmu still feels wrong though
2018-09-05T13:56:38 < karlp> hehe
2018-09-05T13:56:40 < Ultrasauce> an i2c peripheral that doesnt suck is a generational jump
2018-09-05T13:56:46 < Ultrasauce> also hello cjbaird
2018-09-05T13:56:48 < karlp> uclinux has been a thing since like linux 2.2 man
2018-09-05T13:56:57  * karlp did his thesis on uclinux
2018-09-05T13:57:20 < zyp> I'm quite aware it exists, but that's not the point
2018-09-05T13:57:51 < karlp> I know, but I think it's at least some evidence that your point is perhaps misguided
2018-09-05T13:58:05  * karlp shrugs
2018-09-05T13:58:21 < karlp> there's not many uiclinux platforms of interest left
2018-09-05T13:58:51 < Ultrasauce> considering that you can get cortex-a SoCs for cheaper than certain m7 mcus...
2018-09-05T13:59:58 < Jak_o_Shadows> huh. I knew that I had the NuttX tab somewhere.
2018-09-05T14:00:03 < Jak_o_Shadows> It's been open for a year at least.
2018-09-05T14:00:17 < jpa-> Ultrasauce: yeah, but they are good for very different purposes
2018-09-05T14:00:34 < catphish> zyp: my antenna setup worked :D i didn't do any range testing but it can read cards
2018-09-05T14:00:36 < jpa-> often you'd end up having the MCU anyway and the SoC ends up running only the gui
2018-09-05T14:01:43 < jpa-> IMO linux with or without mmu doesn't make that much difference for embedded systems, though MPU is nice to have
2018-09-05T14:04:10 < Ecco> That's an interesting topic
2018-09-05T14:04:26 < Ecco> Buying MCUs is rather straightforward: contact an ST reseller, ask for a quote, there you go
2018-09-05T14:04:40 < Ecco> Buying cheap Cortex-A seems a lot more difficult
2018-09-05T14:05:01 < Ecco> You have to source the SoC itself, probably from Allwinner, and AFAIK it's not easy to find a supplier
2018-09-05T14:05:08 < Ecco> Then you have to find Flash and RAM
2018-09-05T14:05:20 < Ecco> Which also seems difficult to source
2018-09-05T14:05:26 < jpa-> let alone having long availability; 10 years promise for many stm32 parts
2018-09-05T14:05:29 < Ecco> Maybe I just lack the know-how though
2018-09-05T14:05:55 < Ecco> Indeed, just one part to source, from a very reliable manufacturer that holds onto the lifetime guarantees it makes
2018-09-05T14:06:08 < karlp> you contact nxp and order imx6 parts.
2018-09-05T14:06:09 < Ecco> But even lifetime aside
2018-09-05T14:06:25 < catphish> Ecco: i've often wondered how one buys those allwinner chips, a search does show people in china selling them
2018-09-05T14:06:26 < Ecco> wouldn't imx6 be extremely expensive compared to similar Allwinner chips?
2018-09-05T14:06:42 < karlp> you wanted it to be a) purchasabel and b) supported and c) with lifetime?
2018-09-05T14:06:43 < Ecco> Also, you'd have only solved part of the problem
2018-09-05T14:06:49 < Ultrasauce> man $2.6 unit cost on aliexpress for the a13
2018-09-05T14:06:59 < Ecco> Actually, my first concern is only a)
2018-09-05T14:07:21 < karlp> https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/embedded-microprocessors/694?k=imx6
2018-09-05T14:07:40 < karlp> $10 in singles...
2018-09-05T14:07:43 < karlp> so...
2018-09-05T14:07:53 < catphish> i've only use the A20, people seem to sell it https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Hot-Sale-ALLWINNER-A20-Dual-core_60681100344.html?spm=a2700.7724838.2017115.31.29e549126UJr2L
2018-09-05T14:08:30 < Ecco> karlp: I see them at $30/unit
2018-09-05T14:08:36 < karlp> look better?
2018-09-05T14:08:36 < Ecco> But yeah, NXP has solid resellers
2018-09-05T14:08:43 < karlp> I cna't click the sort hedaers for you
2018-09-05T14:08:52 < Ecco> I did, but then it's by 10k units
2018-09-05T14:08:59 < karlp> so enter a quanity of 5
2018-09-05T14:09:00 < karlp> dude.
2018-09-05T14:09:00 < catphish> not seen that imx6 before, looks pricey
2018-09-05T14:09:02 < karlp> lurn to digikey
2018-09-05T14:09:37 < catphish> i wish suppliers had a way to set qty when searching
2018-09-05T14:10:00 < catphish> so you could sort by price for 10 units, or exclude those with MOQ 1000
2018-09-05T14:11:27 < catphish> oh, you can on digikey!
2018-09-05T14:11:29 < catphish> amazing
2018-09-05T14:11:35  * karlp facepalms
2018-09-05T14:11:55  * catphish learns to digikey
2018-09-05T14:12:01 < catphish> i use mouser, they don't have this :(
2018-09-05T14:12:31 < karlp> pretty sure they do too..
2018-09-05T14:12:36 < karlp> just not the same layout
2018-09-05T14:12:49 < karlp> ok, existance of spi flash is misleading.
2018-09-05T14:12:59 < catphish> 90% sure they don't :(
2018-09-05T14:13:02 < karlp> won't even give a bootlaoder serial trace without an uSD card
2018-09-05T14:13:13 < karlp> works just fine now that i've flashed some random crap on it.
2018-09-05T14:18:17 < catphish> with regard to PCB assembly services, how much guarentee does one get that the resulting product will be assembled correctly? ie do assembly houses check your pads and guarentee results, or do they just put it though a P+P and reflow with the CAM files given and hope for the best?
2018-09-05T14:18:49 < karlp> I've only had "pro" assembly, it has been better than 99.9% at least, probably higher
2018-09-05T14:19:03 < Ecco> catphish: depends. You'll need to end-test your boards and devices anyway
2018-09-05T14:19:04 < karlp> no idea about seeed fusion level assembly :)
2018-09-05T14:19:37 < catphish> Ecco: it wasn't so much failure rate i was worried about, more like a design error resulting in 100% failure rate in a particular joint
2018-09-05T14:20:09 < jpa-> even with pro services, i've seen short-circuits underneath QFN chips
2018-09-05T14:21:23 < catphish> my board worked after i DIY-reflowed my QFN about 5 times, obviously this is my incompetence, but i guess want some guarenteee that this isn't a design flaw and if i have someone else assemble it, they won't have the same problem
2018-09-05T14:21:52 < jpa-> check against datasheet specs, that is the best you can do
2018-09-05T14:22:14 < jpa-> and prepare for failures
2018-09-05T14:22:45 < catphish> makes sense, guess i can start with a high quality service and low quantities
2018-09-05T14:23:32 < catphish> and check the pad layouts against datasheet rather than just assuming the one i found in kicad libraries is correct
2018-09-05T14:23:42 < dongs> > kikecad libraries
2018-09-05T14:23:46 < dongs> theres your problem
2018-09-05T14:24:27 -!- chipant [~chipant@27.34.104.31] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-05T14:24:43 < kakimir> kikecad professional work
2018-09-05T14:24:48 < kakimir> you know what dongs
2018-09-05T14:24:56 < kakimir> I use kicad at work :)
2018-09-05T14:25:05 < dongs> you know what kakimir 
2018-09-05T14:25:07 < dongs> you don';t have a job
2018-09-05T14:25:12 < catphish> works for me :)
2018-09-05T14:25:35 < catphish> (mostly)
2018-09-05T14:28:45 < Jak_o_Shadows> Yeah, but you double check things at work
2018-09-05T14:49:02 < kakimir> I don't say it's good
2018-09-05T14:49:24 < kakimir> it just works well enough and result is close enough to what is needed
2018-09-05T14:56:41 < Cracki> you could provide the assembly people some way to test your board... a test rig, or a test firmware to flash, ...
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2018-09-05T14:59:01 < jpa-> you can also pay for xray check, but either option is usually needlessly expensive for non-critical stuff
2018-09-05T14:59:41 -!- cjbaird [~cjb@ppp118-211-220-207.bras1.syd2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-05T15:00:20 < Cracki> havem do a handful, test, if it works, multiply
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2018-09-05T15:01:06 < Cracki> if you pay thousands for a job, they're glad to use your test rig
2018-09-05T15:02:54 < karlp> I wonder what the spi flash is for if it doesn't boot anything without the sd card.
2018-09-05T15:03:02 < karlp> I get sunxi FEL mode, but nothing else
2018-09-05T15:03:06 < karlp> I thought that was rom
2018-09-05T15:03:07 < Cracki> pogo pins are very cheap. I got a bag of 100 for a few bucks. I could get a PCB with the right size holes, solder them in, test circuitry (controller, display/leds), some wooden or 3d printed frame around it, and you have a test rig
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2018-09-05T15:10:17 < zyp> for low volumes, I don't think there's much point in outsourcing testing
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2018-09-05T15:12:25 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-05T15:13:07 < Cracki> it *is* helping the assemblers correct problems as they occur
2018-09-05T15:13:21 < Cracki> if they occur
2018-09-05T15:17:44 < karlp> they shouldn't have problems
2018-09-05T15:19:52 < Cracki> spoken like a true idealist
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2018-09-05T16:04:39 < dongs> https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/thousands-of-compromised-mikrotik-routers-send-traffic-to-attackers/ oh thats why the mikrotik waerhouse got burned down few weeks ago
2018-09-05T16:07:55 < zyp> haha
2018-09-05T16:12:46 < kakimir> maybe it got burned
2018-09-05T16:12:54 < kakimir> not just ingited itself
2018-09-05T16:19:29 < karlp> heh, /me tried to build for aarch64 with arm-linux toolchain.
2018-09-05T16:33:16 < Lux> catphish: olimex from bulgaria sells allwinner stuff https://www.olimex.com/Products/Components/IC/
2018-09-05T16:33:32 < catphish> Lux: nice, sane pricing too
2018-09-05T16:34:08 < Lux> yeah iirc they buy directly from allwinner
2018-09-05T16:34:48 < catphish> i've only ever used them on dev boards so far, not had cause to build my own
2018-09-05T16:35:37 < Lux> probably for diy the v3s is the easiest to use if you want to go that route
2018-09-05T16:35:42 < Lux> it has integrated ram
2018-09-05T16:35:52 < Lux> but you'd have to source that from china
2018-09-05T16:36:36 < catphish> integrated RAM might be useful, depending on how much is available
2018-09-05T16:36:56 < Lux> or just go for a som module if you can afford it
2018-09-05T16:40:57 < karlp> http://www.nanopi.org/NanoPi-NEO-Core_Feature.html for instance
2018-09-05T16:44:51 < karlp> heh, spent time working on FEL boot mode,
2018-09-05T16:45:03 < karlp> then found that uboot doesn't support it yet on aarch64.
2018-09-05T16:48:48 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-05T16:51:40 < bitmask> wow, this trianglelab gt2 gates belt clone is awesome
2018-09-05T16:56:12 < bitmask> hmm maybe its not clone?
2018-09-05T16:56:42 < Thorn> I thought ~everybody on aliexpress sold the same belt
2018-09-05T16:57:02 < bitmask> this stuff actually has gates (r) 
2018-09-05T16:57:08 < bitmask> its really nice
2018-09-05T16:57:17 < bitmask> even if its a clone
2018-09-05T17:01:57 < Thorn> does it have a brown tint like in pictures?
2018-09-05T17:03:50 < Thorn> mine is unmark and the only brown is on the edges (but it's not from trianglelab)
2018-09-05T17:06:38 < kakimir> do anyone know if pins are provided with DT connectors ordered from mouser?
2018-09-05T17:06:49 < kakimir> I cannot see pins in associated products or so
2018-09-05T17:07:07 < karlp> DT connectors?
2018-09-05T17:08:59 < kakimir> DT06 and DT04
2018-09-05T17:09:06 < kakimir> deutsch
2018-09-05T17:09:08 < kakimir> automotive
2018-09-05T17:27:10 -!- Jak_o_Shadows [~Jak@unaffiliated/jak-o-shadows/x-0479135] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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2018-09-05T17:52:36 < jadew> are there any nuclear batteries for sale to the general public?
2018-09-05T17:53:49 < kakimir> ask igor
2018-09-05T17:54:58 < kakimir> there used to be such even on islands on baltic sea etc. operating radiobuoy for navigation
2018-09-05T17:55:24 < jadew> I know there are watches that use them
2018-09-05T17:55:31 < jadew> wrist watches
2018-09-05T17:56:15 < jadew> would be cool if they were widely available - could be useful for lots of projects
2018-09-05T17:56:32 < kakimir> those ones are out of service by now what were used as radiobuoy power supplies back in 70s
2018-09-05T17:57:07 < kakimir> funny thing they didn't keep record where and how many they put out there
2018-09-05T17:57:39 < jadew> shouldn't they still be working?
2018-09-05T17:58:02 < kakimir> too much decay for the pellet
2018-09-05T17:59:06 < kakimir> it uses thermopile to create electricity
2018-09-05T17:59:31 < jadew> yeah, I think the tritium ones are different tho
2018-09-05T17:59:47 < kakimir> those radiobuoy ones were plutonium
2018-09-05T18:00:04 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-05T18:00:19 < jadew> I just read an article saying that there's not much plutonium left for this
2018-09-05T18:01:07 < jadew> apparently the plutonium used in those was a byproduct of making nuclear bombs
2018-09-05T18:01:38 < kakimir> you could collect those plutonium pellets from some underground market and then process them in your garrage for higher isotope percentage!
2018-09-05T18:01:46 < jadew> the article was saying that NASA has only enough left for 3 more batteries
2018-09-05T18:02:42 < jadew> eh, I'd like to get my hands on one of those tritium batteries
2018-09-05T18:03:18 < jadew> they're very low power, but it should be enough to transmit data from time to time
2018-09-05T18:03:41 < kakimir> bolted to energy harvesting IC
2018-09-05T18:03:45 < kakimir> and stm32
2018-09-05T18:05:25 < jadew> yeah, they're great for mounting sensors in difficult to access places
2018-09-05T18:05:40 < jadew> for example, you could mount a sensor in a wall, when you're building the house
2018-09-05T18:06:02 < kakimir> you can still transmit energy to it by air
2018-09-05T18:06:08 < jadew> that's a good point
2018-09-05T18:06:26 < jadew> you could power somethign in the wall anyway
2018-09-05T18:06:45 < jadew> the point still stands tho
2018-09-05T18:07:22 < kakimir> if it's really low power you can use even like radiowaves to transmit energy to it
2018-09-05T18:08:21 < jadew> that's too involved and I don't think it would work that well if your sensor was more than a couple of meters away
2018-09-05T18:08:49 < jadew> maybe using light?
2018-09-05T18:09:11 < jadew> or, I know, uBeam!
2018-09-05T18:11:11 < jadew> what a stupid ad...
2018-09-05T18:11:23 < jadew> "Selif drone is putting drone companies out of business in Romania"
2018-09-05T18:11:28 < jadew> like we have any drone companies...
2018-09-05T18:11:47 < BrainDamage> human drones
2018-09-05T18:11:59 < jadew> that's more like it
2018-09-05T18:17:16 < bitmask> I just knocked my 62 drawer component organizer off the shelf...
2018-09-05T18:17:22 < bitmask> I'm smurt
2018-09-05T18:17:54 < kakimir> you are smurf
2018-09-05T18:17:59 < bitmask> yes, yes I am
2018-09-05T18:25:38 < kakimir> how does TVS breakdown voltage alter in function of temperature?
2018-09-05T18:25:38 < kakimir> and does aging alter it?
2018-09-05T18:25:38 -!- jpa- [jpa@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
--- Log closed Wed Sep 05 18:25:38 2018
--- Log opened Wed Sep 05 18:30:45 2018
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2018-09-05T18:58:56 < kakimir> recommend me silicone / polyurethane compound
2018-09-05T18:59:07 < kakimir> I want to place pcb inside heatshrink
2018-09-05T18:59:22 < kakimir> then shrink another end to cable
2018-09-05T18:59:36 < kakimir> put that goo in
2018-09-05T18:59:59 < kakimir> shrink rest of the shrink
2018-09-05T19:00:17 < kakimir> I usually do it with just whatever I have at hand
2018-09-05T19:00:37 < kakimir> hot snot, 2comp PUR etc.
2018-09-05T19:01:06 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-05T19:02:43 < Steffanx> Is this hobby grade kakimir ?
2018-09-05T19:02:55 < kakimir> market test production
2018-09-05T19:03:32 < Steffanx> Dont you have some local guy that can help you with some prototype stuff?
2018-09-05T19:03:42 < kakimir> no
2018-09-05T19:03:52 < kakimir> everyone does easy stuff
2018-09-05T19:03:55 < kakimir> like electronics
2018-09-05T19:04:24 < kakimir> but when it comes to put that all together to make a product - nobody
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--- Log opened Wed Sep 05 19:06:34 2018
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2018-09-05T19:10:29 < BrainDamage> karlp: I read mucous as snot for a while
2018-09-05T19:12:30 -!- ski7777 [~quassel@ip5b437013.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-05T19:20:10 < kakimir> englishman: is minimelf any problems to pick and placing process?
2018-09-05T19:20:28 < kakimir> or generally - tube shaped components
2018-09-05T19:20:35 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
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2018-09-05T19:29:21 < kakimir> wow
2018-09-05T19:29:44 < kakimir> mouser wanted me to click I'm not a bot button
2018-09-05T19:29:48 < kakimir> to continue
2018-09-05T19:32:06 < catphish> but you're a bot, so you can't :(
2018-09-05T19:32:13 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-05T19:33:00 < kakimir> I did anyhow
2018-09-05T19:33:16 < emeb> lying bots
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2018-09-05T20:17:49 < englishman> kakimir: yeah i think you need special nozzles
2018-09-05T20:18:14 < englishman> http://avipre.com/products/smt&tht/juki//Juki%20-%20Nozzle%20Catalogue-Rev-C3.pdf
2018-09-05T20:31:54 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@c-73-193-6-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
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2018-09-05T20:48:11 < kakimir> enough for me to avoid using such
2018-09-05T20:48:44 < kakimir> other kinky package types to avoid?
2018-09-05T20:49:15 < Steffanx> lol kakimir. it's not the question if englishman  can do it, but can your assembly do it...
2018-09-05T20:50:34 < Steffanx> *your assembler
2018-09-05T20:52:06 < Steffanx> unless englishman is the one, then it's totally relevant.
2018-09-05T20:52:20 < englishman> if i have to use special nozzles, kaks is going to pay for it
2018-09-05T20:52:31 < englishman> and if i charge kaks extra, a real shop will charge far more
2018-09-05T20:57:07 < Steffanx> perhaps.
2018-09-05T21:00:53 < Steffanx> still the question if its significant enough to matter
2018-09-05T21:05:14 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@adsl-130-227.dsl.init7.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-05T21:06:24 < jpa-> i'd charge kakimir extra, just because he's kakimir
2018-09-05T21:07:23 < Steffanx> Yes, irc tax
2018-09-05T21:07:37 < karlp> BrainDamage: speaking of snot, snót is one of the "approved" female names here. can't think of anything else when Isee it skimming the list.
2018-09-05T21:07:55 < Steffanx> I should stop being annoyed by kakimir-questions that he should ask "his guys" instead of irc guys :P
2018-09-05T21:15:14 < bitmask> alright, 3d printer rebuilt yet again
2018-09-05T21:17:22 < Steffanx> so time to print something at > 100mm/s  at get it ##stm32 approved.
2018-09-05T21:18:12 < bitmask> fixed the power switch mounted in the lack table, new fiberglass belts, new stepper shaft couplers, sd card extender, rebuilt the hot end with a new heat block, heater cartridge, thermistor and nozzle
2018-09-05T21:18:26 < bitmask> still gotta do some frame reinforcing
2018-09-05T21:20:21 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@c-73-225-161-124.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-05T21:23:23 < Steffanx> *at = and
2018-09-05T21:23:44 < bitmask> nothing is ever ##stm32 approved
2018-09-05T21:27:53 < Steffanx> Such negativity bitmask. Like a real ##stm32er
2018-09-05T21:28:01 < bitmask> :)
2018-09-05T21:28:57 < Steffanx> I still type r[tab] automatically. 
2018-09-05T21:32:44 < bitmask> I tried to change it back but it didn't save so you are gonna have to deal with your reflexes
2018-09-05T21:32:48 < bitmask> for now at least
2018-09-05T21:33:17 < Steffanx>   /Ban bitmask* something
2018-09-05T21:33:25 < bitmask> boo
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2018-09-05T22:34:28 < englishman> this pico logger has mad aliasing
2018-09-05T22:35:24 < Cracki> shit cock divider?
2018-09-05T22:36:59 < englishman> i think there is something weird wrt. sample rate vs chart data rate even tho i tried a couple combos
2018-09-05T22:36:59 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/rxx86x5.png
2018-09-05T22:37:19 < englishman> every 20s the differential drops to zero
2018-09-05T22:37:34 < Cracki> looks odd
2018-09-05T22:37:50 < Cracki> software shit?
2018-09-05T22:38:17 < Cracki> when they compute delta on blocks and don't handle block transitions right
2018-09-05T22:39:38 < Cracki> export, diy
2018-09-05T22:40:54 < Cracki> what is that curve? battery charging voltage?
2018-09-05T22:41:17 < Cracki> (hope not)
2018-09-05T22:42:52 < Cracki> zoom in and check if the data itself looks ok and it's just the differential (I'd bet it is)
2018-09-05T22:43:21 < Cracki> wait, that curve is from a reflow oven!
2018-09-05T22:43:38 < karlp> what do you think he wanted a wide temprange logger for :)
2018-09-05T22:44:10 < Cracki> I see no "soaking" plateau
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2018-09-05T22:49:54 < kakimir>  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBdB3G9Qvqs drones
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2018-09-05T22:57:01 < kakimir> actual practical use with practical vehicle
2018-09-05T22:58:56 < kakimir> spam to gmail tries to sell me a pickup truck
2018-09-05T23:00:56 < kakimir> I'm impressed
2018-09-05T23:01:17 < kakimir> algorithm thinks I have money - or can get loan
2018-09-05T23:12:51 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-05T23:14:52 < zyp> kakimir, have you played my summer car?
2018-09-05T23:14:59 < zyp> aka. finland simulator?
2018-09-05T23:15:24 < zyp> can you comment on the accuracy?
2018-09-05T23:17:14 < zyp> crt, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzPdPYtqBt0
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2018-09-05T23:17:50 < englishman> whoa
2018-09-05T23:21:51 < kakimir> no
2018-09-05T23:22:02 < kakimir> finland simulator
2018-09-05T23:22:16 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-05T23:22:42 < kakimir> actually finland 90's simulator
2018-09-05T23:25:26 < kakimir> toyota corola
2018-09-05T23:25:32 < kakimir> DX
2018-09-05T23:30:19 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbd0G3o9-to
2018-09-05T23:31:42 < jadew> kakimir, drone operator sounds like a minimum wage job
2018-09-05T23:31:57 < kakimir> in future yes
2018-09-05T23:33:29 < jadew> some of the clerks that will be jobless when wallmart starts using self checkout, will beocome drone operators
2018-09-05T23:33:51 < zyp> selv checkout is good shit
2018-09-05T23:33:58 < zyp> except when it's stupid, like in denmark
2018-09-05T23:34:14 < jadew> what's the problem with it?
2018-09-05T23:34:30 < zyp> danish system is slow as fuck
2018-09-05T23:34:52 < zyp> it has a scale that you hang your bag on
2018-09-05T23:35:10 < zyp> so you scan one item, put it in the bag, wait for the scale to confirm that the weight is sane, repeat
2018-09-05T23:35:43 < jadew> in here, they still have operators at the self checkout so it goes really fast
2018-09-05T23:36:00 < zyp> in norway, we have a bunch of stores with hand scanners
2018-09-05T23:36:19 < zyp> so you grab a scanner when you enter the store, scan shit as you grab it from the shelves, then just return the scanner and pay
2018-09-05T23:36:27 < zyp> saw that in germany also
2018-09-05T23:36:31 < jadew> the way it's done is that the clerk scans all your food and then you advance to the next area where you pay yourself, at a machine
2018-09-05T23:36:39 < zyp> haha, wtf
2018-09-05T23:36:43 < jadew> the machine gives you a ticket and with that ticket you can leave
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2018-09-05T23:37:19 < zyp> everybody pays with card here, so even at normal stores you kinda pay at a machine :p
2018-09-05T23:37:29 < zyp> that's not considered selv checkout
2018-09-05T23:37:40 < jadew> it's not, but it's the closest we got
2018-09-05T23:37:49 < jadew> and it's way faster than regular checkout
2018-09-05T23:38:34 < jadew> they have a couple of clerks and many machines where you can pay
2018-09-05T23:38:39 < englishman> the selfcheckouts are manned here
2018-09-05T23:38:42 < englishman> so you still have to talk to someone
2018-09-05T23:38:51 < englishman> amazon ftw
2018-09-05T23:38:52 < jadew> like 3 times as many as they have clerks
2018-09-05T23:40:37 < kakimir> are you socially awkward englishman?
2018-09-05T23:40:48 < englishman> this is irc right
2018-09-05T23:40:54 < jadew> haha
2018-09-05T23:41:07 < kakimir> no further questions
2018-09-05T23:41:38 < kakimir> how is sauna englishman?
2018-09-05T23:42:06 < englishman> idk i havent even had time to build this little shed i wanted to build
2018-09-05T23:42:09 < englishman> let alone a sauna.
2018-09-05T23:43:52 < kakimir> how good spas there is canada?
2018-09-05T23:44:04 < kakimir> where you have pools and saunas and shiet?
2018-09-05T23:44:44 < englishman> its not really a good place for a pool
2018-09-05T23:44:51 < englishman> but hot tubs are pretty popular
2018-09-05T23:45:16 < englishman> some people do temporary pools but it seems like a big hassle
2018-09-05T23:46:00 < kakimir> I mean kylpylä
2018-09-05T23:47:04 < englishman> like a resort?
2018-09-05T23:48:28 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/yIsAnUJ.png
2018-09-05T23:48:33 < englishman> i think this is the best i will get with 5 zone
2018-09-05T23:49:19 < englishman> same
2018-09-05T23:49:23 < Steffanx> Whats the grey line?
2018-09-05T23:49:33 < englishman> deg/sec
2018-09-05T23:57:27 < Cracki> upside down this time
--- Day changed Thu Sep 06 2018
2018-09-06T00:03:11 < Steffanx> Tvn
2018-09-06T00:05:09 < englishman> the registered altium expert
2018-09-06T00:06:06 < Steffanx> He has been trolliet englishman 
2018-09-06T00:06:31 < Steffanx> I heard hes dead.
2018-09-06T00:06:37 < Steffanx> Hit by a train
2018-09-06T00:07:47 < karlp> zyp: yeah, cheap grovery here started with self checkout with scales for your bags, just absurd "unexpected item in bagging area" or "please place item in bag" 
2018-09-06T00:08:02 < karlp> fuckkkkk that. I'm not goint do to their work for them unless they make it worth my while.
2018-09-06T00:09:13 < zyp> I really like the hand scanner system
2018-09-06T00:09:39 < Cracki> wtf scanners are reliable tech, what is this "unexpected item" bullshit
2018-09-06T00:09:47 < karlp> stupid sunxi.  PTP not supported by HW.
2018-09-06T00:09:52 < karlp> worthless crap.
2018-09-06T00:10:05 < zyp> Cracki, too sensitive scales, I figure
2018-09-06T00:10:20 < Cracki> the hardware store in town has self checkout with one clerk standing by to assist, you use a "hand gun" to beep all your shit and then you pay and you're outta there
2018-09-06T00:10:30 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-06T00:10:42 < zyp> ikea does that too
2018-09-06T00:11:12 < Cracki> high trust society
2018-09-06T00:11:34 < zyp> karlp, the biggest benefit of self checkouts is that there's usually not much of a line there, if at all, compared to the normal registers
2018-09-06T00:11:36 < Cracki> I'm sure they'll get security on any shady types
2018-09-06T00:11:50 < zyp> and not having to wait in line is worth scanning my own stuff for
2018-09-06T00:12:01 < Cracki> aye, never a line, it's awesome
2018-09-06T00:12:21 < zyp> the hand scanner store does spot checks
2018-09-06T00:12:32 < zyp> not very thorough though
2018-09-06T00:13:07 < Cracki> spot check like... dumping all your bags?
2018-09-06T00:13:18 < zyp> when I get flagged for a spot check, they come over with a hand scanner, pick some random items from my bag and scan them
2018-09-06T00:13:37 < zyp> system confirms I remembered to scan all of the random items and it's all fine, so I'm free to go
2018-09-06T00:13:44 < Cracki> do you look like someone I would wanna spotcheck, or do you look trustworthy?
2018-09-06T00:13:56 < zyp> idk, the latter I figure
2018-09-06T00:14:07 < zyp> but it's the computer randomly flagging users
2018-09-06T00:14:11 < Cracki> so it's security theater
2018-09-06T00:14:28 < zyp> it's connected to their loyalty card system, so I probably have a perfect record there
2018-09-06T00:14:32 < Cracki> oh well, they have to spot check shifty old grandmas too. they steal the most.
2018-09-06T00:14:46 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-13e0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-06T00:15:08 < zyp> store's a bit away, and I mostly just head that way around weekends, but I probably shop there more or less weekly
2018-09-06T00:15:11 < Cracki> some historic figure said "trust, but verify"
2018-09-06T00:15:55 < zyp> and I'm not interested in undermining the system by doing petty theft
2018-09-06T00:16:08 < zyp> it's a fucking grocery store, I can afford groceries, what's the point of stealing
2018-09-06T00:16:35 < Steffanx> The rush
2018-09-06T00:16:39 < jadew> the point of stealing is not working for the stuff you get
2018-09-06T00:17:42 < Steffanx> Being a kleptomaniac is a thing...
2018-09-06T00:17:48 < zyp> dude, I can go take a poop on company time and earn enough to buy groceries
2018-09-06T00:18:24 < jadew> some people don't have a job
2018-09-06T00:18:50  * jadew scratches head, looking the other way
2018-09-06T00:19:29 < zyp> then you probably have more pressing concerns than self checkout :p
2018-09-06T00:19:40 < jadew> hehe, I do
2018-09-06T00:20:44 < karlp> ikea self checkout works nicely.
2018-09-06T00:20:51 < karlp> the grovery store one is abominable
2018-09-06T00:21:16 < zyp> yeah, ikea is good
2018-09-06T00:21:20 < Steffanx> Where does the idea come from only poor people steel stucf
2018-09-06T00:21:22 < Steffanx> F
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2018-09-06T00:21:29 < zyp> but the hand scanners you carry around are even more convenient
2018-09-06T00:21:44 -!- BrainDamage [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
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2018-09-06T00:22:03 < jadew> Steffanx, from the assumption that people are good, so only desperate people would do it, strictly out of need
2018-09-06T00:22:10 < jadew> false assumption
2018-09-06T00:22:14 < Steffanx> Lol. Yeah
2018-09-06T00:22:46 < zyp> I'm not saying I don't steal, I just said I don't steal groceries :p
2018-09-06T00:23:11 < jadew> haha
2018-09-06T00:24:36 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@adsl-130-227.dsl.init7.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T00:25:45 < Cracki> stealing panties then
2018-09-06T00:28:41 < jadew> those are being handed to him
2018-09-06T00:28:50 < jadew> under threat
2018-09-06T00:30:22 < jadew> what's that called when you rob someone, under threat - does it have a name?
2018-09-06T00:31:16 < jadew> robbery doesn't imply that the victim is present or aware, isn't it?
2018-09-06T00:32:52 < Steffanx> Id say it is robbery
2018-09-06T00:33:16 < vampi-the-frog> I think burglary is when you enter a home?
2018-09-06T00:33:24 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-06T00:34:12 < Steffanx> And does imply force or using fear
2018-09-06T00:35:04 < karlp> jadew: pretty sure the definitions of those that you're thinking of are juridiction dependent, not internationally standard :)
2018-09-06T00:35:48 < jadew> karlp, I thought it has a specific meaning in english
2018-09-06T00:36:02 < jadew> I think we have differentiating words for that sort of stuff in romanian
2018-09-06T00:36:16 < karlp> probably in uk law, but also australian law, us law, canadian law, singapore law..... 
2018-09-06T00:36:39 < karlp> burglary vs robbery vs larceny vs.... more of them that I can't think of right now.
2018-09-06T00:36:58 < zyp> theft
2018-09-06T00:37:14 < jadew> right
2018-09-06T00:38:26 < jadew> "Robbery is the crime of taking or attempting to take anything of value by force, threat of force, or by putting the victim in fear."
2018-09-06T00:39:53 < Steffanx> The pedia.
2018-09-06T00:40:02 < Steffanx> ?
2018-09-06T00:40:11 < jadew> yep, at least that's what google says
2018-09-06T00:40:29 < jadew> it used it as a source
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2018-09-06T00:52:21 < mawk> what would be something looking like a big resistor marked "FR 123" on the silk screen, with the symbol being a resistor with a little squiggle at one end 
2018-09-06T00:52:37 < mawk> what's the F
2018-09-06T00:52:43 < jadew> fuse
2018-09-06T00:52:45 < jadew> ferite
2018-09-06T00:52:48 < zyp> fucking
2018-09-06T00:52:53 < zyp> it's a fucking resistor
2018-09-06T00:52:56 < jadew> haha
2018-09-06T00:53:28 < zyp> on a serious note, maybe it's a PTC or something
2018-09-06T00:53:40 < jadew> mawk, is it on a power rail?
2018-09-06T00:54:30 < jadew> the SMD ferrite beads look exactly like resistors
2018-09-06T00:54:43 < mawk> it's through hole
2018-09-06T00:54:43 < zyp> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:PTC-Resistor.svg <- squiggle like this?
2018-09-06T00:54:53 < mawk> it's just a big resistor, with color code and all
2018-09-06T00:55:04 < mawk> it was near the AC input I believe yes
2018-09-06T00:55:09 < mawk> from the transformer
2018-09-06T00:55:47 < jadew> what color is it?
2018-09-06T00:55:54 < mawk> grey
2018-09-06T00:56:20 < jadew> don't know then... could be a small inductor
2018-09-06T00:56:20 < mawk> gold gold at one end, black brown at the other
2018-09-06T00:56:42 < mawk> no zyp , a resistor symbol and a little wave attached to one end
2018-09-06T00:56:52 < mawk> let me find the pcb
2018-09-06T00:57:01 < jadew> you can always pull it out and measure it
2018-09-06T00:57:29 < zyp> color code says 0.1, maybe it's just a shunt for current measurement
2018-09-06T00:57:33 < zyp> or is that 1.0?
2018-09-06T00:57:52 < zyp> black brown gold gold or brown black gold gold?
2018-09-06T00:59:28 < mawk> brown black gold gold
2018-09-06T00:59:41 < zyp> so 1.0
2018-09-06T01:00:11 < mawk> https://pix.watch/queGm6/Tak2by.jpeg
2018-09-06T01:00:15 < mawk> here's the silk screen
2018-09-06T01:00:34 < zyp> second half looks like a fuse symbol
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2018-09-06T01:00:37 < jadew> could be a fuse
2018-09-06T01:00:38 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-06T01:00:47 < zyp> FR, fuse-resistor?
2018-09-06T01:00:49 < jadew> maybe fusible resistor?
2018-09-06T01:01:10 < jadew> there are such resistors, found them in some radios
2018-09-06T01:01:29 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-06T01:01:42 < mawk> it measures at around 8 ohms, but it keeps moving around
2018-09-06T01:02:09 < jadew> got a LCR meter?
2018-09-06T01:02:37 < mawk> just a multimeter that does RC meter also
2018-09-06T01:02:43 < mawk> so it's not very precise I guess
2018-09-06T01:03:31 < jadew> if it's an indcutor it would be 1 uH
2018-09-06T01:04:12 < mawk> ah they're packaged like resistors too ?
2018-09-06T01:04:17 < mawk> what a great idea
2018-09-06T01:04:42 < jadew> yeah, they're usually bulkier, but it's not a rule
2018-09-06T01:05:24 < jadew> http://coilmasterelectronics.com/comm/upimage/p_140214_04454.jpg
2018-09-06T01:06:29 < mawk> I see
2018-09-06T01:09:32 < englishman> the little wave is definitely a fuse symbol
2018-09-06T01:14:08 < kakimir> resistors are fuses
2018-09-06T01:14:14 < englishman> fuses are resistors
2018-09-06T01:14:17 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-06T01:15:04 < Thorn> PCB traces are fuses too
2018-09-06T01:15:20 < kakimir> true
2018-09-06T01:15:40 < englishman> the universe is a resistor
2018-09-06T01:16:27 < jadew> if you're an optimist, it's a conductor
2018-09-06T01:17:20 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43ljt9dx0NA it's a song
2018-09-06T01:18:12 < kakimir> I wonder if I have all that good musics as .flacs still in some harddrive
2018-09-06T01:18:29 < jadew> your ear is too good for mp3?
2018-09-06T01:18:49 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-06T01:19:08 < kakimir> can hear even 320kbps mp3 compared to flac
2018-09-06T01:19:24 < kakimir> or could - back then when I had hearing
2018-09-06T01:21:12 < kakimir> high pitch sounds have slight distortion in 320kbps mp3
2018-09-06T01:21:41 < kakimir> at least when there is abduntance of high area sound in the music
2018-09-06T01:23:00 < kakimir> and hey - it was the time when harddrive capacity price started really going down
2018-09-06T01:23:01 < jadew> I've never been pretentious regarding sound
2018-09-06T01:23:18 < jadew> when I was a kid, I was listening to radio on a one speaker radio
2018-09-06T01:23:44 < jadew> music on my PC came from a LPT DAC, so it was shit (I didn't have an audio card)
2018-09-06T01:24:08 < kakimir> "The difference between 320kbit and flac isn't noticeable to a normal person and would probably require high end headphones/speakers for an audiophile to spot the difference."
2018-09-06T01:24:09 < jadew> first time I had access to stereo was when I was 16 and it blew me away
2018-09-06T01:24:34 < kakimir> well I had headphone dac and reference level headphones
2018-09-06T01:24:36 < Cracki> there are things no human can perceive
2018-09-06T01:25:07 < Cracki> perhaps if they'd quantify the difference between original and 320k aac (?)...
2018-09-06T01:25:51 < Cracki> mp3 has noticeable lowpass
2018-09-06T01:27:02 < kakimir> without external DAC it was impossible to notice 320kbps mp3 and flac
2018-09-06T01:27:11 < kakimir> difference
2018-09-06T01:27:45 < kakimir> using same reference headphones
2018-09-06T01:27:49 < kakimir> both cases
2018-09-06T01:31:50 < kakimir> listening without dac is like having some sort of curtain placed over the sound
2018-09-06T01:32:14 < kakimir> connect to DAC and it's like wow I didn't know it could sound this good
2018-09-06T01:32:45 < Cracki> what do you call a dac?
2018-09-06T01:33:14 < Cracki> does "listening without dac" mean you read the bits off the screen with your eyes?
2018-09-06T01:35:28 < Thorn> does the dac has OCXO, rubidium clock or simply gps trained clock?
2018-09-06T01:35:35 < Thorn> *have
2018-09-06T01:36:21 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoBPNTAFZMo here MP3-320 (minus) FLAC operation done in audio editor
2018-09-06T01:37:02 < Cracki> lol he tries to align it sample-correct
2018-09-06T01:37:15 < Cracki> hm, does work :P
2018-09-06T01:38:10 < kakimir> no it's actually 192kbps
2018-09-06T01:38:22 < Cracki> well, the point of mp3 is to remove information a human wouldn't perceive
2018-09-06T01:38:47 < kakimir> 192kbps is already pain
2018-09-06T01:39:19 < kakimir> 240kbps is like meh
2018-09-06T01:39:47 < kakimir> 320kbps is like this will do if there is no flac
2018-09-06T01:41:49 < kakimir> Cracki: that noise sound he played - it's in the mp3 track compared to lossless track
2018-09-06T01:42:03 < Cracki> wrong
2018-09-06T01:42:06 < Cracki> it's the difference
2018-09-06T01:42:06 < jadew> which of these two items would you buy:
2018-09-06T01:42:13 < Cracki> it's not noise
2018-09-06T01:42:26 < kakimir> perceived noise
2018-09-06T01:42:29 < kakimir> *
2018-09-06T01:42:34 < jadew> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181866472102
2018-09-06T01:42:41 < jadew> or https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/332752169649
2018-09-06T01:42:41 < Cracki> it can be noise from the mp3, or noise from the original
2018-09-06T01:42:44 < Cracki> or both
2018-09-06T01:42:58 < kakimir> Cracki: it's not
2018-09-06T01:43:04 < Cracki> yes it is
2018-09-06T01:43:16 < kakimir> original is the reference
2018-09-06T01:43:18 < Cracki> the compression could have removed noise
2018-09-06T01:43:58 < Cracki> that's typical for video compression, removing shit that doesn't matter
2018-09-06T01:44:08 < kakimir> I meant *perceived noise played in the video = difference
2018-09-06T01:44:12 < Cracki> audio compression works the same
2018-09-06T01:45:01 < Cracki> jadew, wat you need it for
2018-09-06T01:46:06 < jadew> it's an extension for a frequency counter
2018-09-06T01:46:14 < jadew> which one would you buy?
2018-09-06T01:46:33 < jadew> (if you needed it)
2018-09-06T01:46:48 < Cracki> both are clones
2018-09-06T01:46:58 < jadew> just the first one is a clone
2018-09-06T01:47:02 < Cracki> no, both are
2018-09-06T01:47:07 < Cracki> see description
2018-09-06T01:47:28 < Cracki> or I'm reading this wrong
2018-09-06T01:47:36 < jadew> it's not original, but it's not a clone
2018-09-06T01:47:42 < jadew> the first one is an actual clone of the original
2018-09-06T01:47:48 < jadew> the second one is a redesign
2018-09-06T01:47:54 < Cracki> "cojotech made in romania" is supposed to be original?
2018-09-06T01:47:58 < Cracki> oh well
2018-09-06T01:48:01 < Cracki> clone/redesign ;)
2018-09-06T01:48:58 < Cracki> no clue. order both and compare?
2018-09-06T01:49:12 < jadew> if you were to choose tho, which one would you choose?
2018-09-06T01:50:25 < Cracki> til: google "flip a coin" does flip a coin
2018-09-06T01:50:51 < jadew> ok, the reason I'm asking is because one of them is my product :P
2018-09-06T01:50:59 < Cracki> I'd pick the one with the less "boring" pcb
2018-09-06T01:51:05 < jadew> ah ha!
2018-09-06T01:51:19 < Thorn> google 'askew'
2018-09-06T01:51:24 < Cracki> one of them shows a plain featureless pcb side first. that looks "OEM"
2018-09-06T01:51:24 < jadew> I thought that could be a thing
2018-09-06T01:51:41 < Cracki> yikes the resampling!
2018-09-06T01:53:28 < jadew> in fact, I made the first few revisions of the board equally non-borring for that reason, but gave up on that later on, because it really adds nothing and if the customers know their stuff, they might see it as a bad design decision
2018-09-06T01:53:32 < Cracki> that "folded over" trace from the coax, that's rf design stuff eh
2018-09-06T01:53:35 < jadew> *boring
2018-09-06T01:53:48 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-06T01:54:29 < kakimir> thing with FLAC vs mp3 320 was that - I could not tell which was which
2018-09-06T01:54:59 < jadew> the problem is that it doesn't sell, while the other one does and I'm not sure why
2018-09-06T01:55:06 < jadew> I even offer a 2-year warranty
2018-09-06T01:55:27 < jadew> and my board has much better specs + it's fully tested
2018-09-06T01:55:39 < Cracki> sensitivity table for comparison is good. I saw it as a picture, was wondering why the other offer has it in the description
2018-09-06T01:55:56 < Cracki> moar comparison charts maybe
2018-09-06T01:56:02 < jadew> I couldn't add the datasheet to the listing
2018-09-06T01:56:09 < jadew> maybe I'll put that stuff in the description too
2018-09-06T01:56:18 < Cracki> "HPO-030", is that your part number or a HP par tnumber?
2018-09-06T01:56:22 < jadew> it's mine
2018-09-06T01:57:10 < Cracki> say "made in germany", that usually sells xD
2018-09-06T01:57:20 < jadew> haha
2018-09-06T01:57:36 < kakimir> stm32 project: usb headphone dac
2018-09-06T01:58:28 < Cracki> perhaps it's not quite clear that your boards are redesigns instead of clones. a table comparing original specs to redesign specs perhaps?
2018-09-06T01:58:49 < jadew> that's not a bad idea
2018-09-06T01:59:36 < Cracki> also the "min/max" and "typical/worst" are unclear to me. perhaps they're clear to someone who knows what they're buying
2018-09-06T02:00:25 < kakimir> englishman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhnM7s4BQRE 17. Oct
2018-09-06T02:00:35 < jadew> it means the minimum sensitivity (typically)
2018-09-06T02:01:07 < jadew> and the worst, is what I guarantee to be the worst, considering the random yield
2018-09-06T02:01:30 < Cracki> meaning... a signal of this power is still accepted?
2018-09-06T02:02:43 < jadew> meaning that if a board has that sensitivity, is still considered ok, but if it has lower sensitivity, it won't be sold
2018-09-06T02:03:11 < Cracki> you have two axes there, "min/max" and "typ/worst"
2018-09-06T02:03:21 < Cracki> the combination of both categories is confusing me
2018-09-06T02:03:42 < Cracki> also what you call 'sensitivity'
2018-09-06T02:03:50 < jadew> well, it works across multiple powers
2018-09-06T02:04:02 < Cracki> as far as I understand, that thing takes a signal of some power, and determines frequency
2018-09-06T02:04:14 < Cracki> or what does it do
2018-09-06T02:04:23 < jadew> for example, at 1 GHz, it works from -53 dBm (typically) to 14
2018-09-06T02:04:34 < jadew> or -50 dBm (worst case scenario)
2018-09-06T02:04:53 < Cracki> not sure I'd call the upper range "sensitivity"
2018-09-06T02:05:10 < jadew> I couldn't test past it
2018-09-06T02:05:25 < jadew> so I have to assume it won't measure properly past that
2018-09-06T02:05:28 < Cracki> a signal with too much power would hit clipping effects or something?
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2018-09-06T02:06:04 < jadew> yeah, it's just not specced
2018-09-06T02:06:20 < jadew> and by sensitivity I mean the ability to get a reading with a 0.1 ppm accuracy
2018-09-06T02:06:59 < Cracki> I'd just leave that out of the table and note above the table "correct operation tested up to +14 dBm, limited by signal generator"
2018-09-06T02:07:20 < jadew> not a bad idea
2018-09-06T02:07:26 < Cracki> perhaps a plot
2018-09-06T02:07:29 < jadew> yeah, then I can remove Min. thing
2018-09-06T02:09:25 < Cracki> that stuff _is_ quite sensitive... less than microwatts
2018-09-06T02:11:45 < jadew> yeah, it's pretty good and it took a lot of effort to get it working properly
2018-09-06T02:13:20 < jadew> now I'm not even sure it was worth the effort
2018-09-06T02:13:40 < Cracki> compared to the clone... 10-20 dBm at least beyond 2 GHz
2018-09-06T02:14:01 -!- Cracki [~Cracki@unaffiliated/crackwitz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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2018-09-06T02:16:14 < jadew> is the price difference too big?
2018-09-06T02:16:23 < Cracki> both are ~75
2018-09-06T02:16:53 < jadew> no, mine is 77 gbp
2018-09-06T02:17:05 < jadew> that's $100
2018-09-06T02:17:19 < jadew> so 33% more
2018-09-06T02:18:25 < jadew> I'll make those changes to the datasheet, thanks
2018-09-06T02:20:27 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/HqcLpzh :P
2018-09-06T02:20:39 < Cracki> boobies
2018-09-06T02:20:42 < jadew> does it have a hole?
2018-09-06T02:20:46 < Cracki> ^
2018-09-06T02:21:13 < bitmask> the seam actually cracked in the crack so yes
2018-09-06T02:21:20 < jadew> is it one layer?
2018-09-06T02:21:29 < bitmask> yea vase mode
2018-09-06T02:21:39 < jadew> interesting
2018-09-06T02:21:43 < jadew> how long did it take to print?
2018-09-06T02:22:04 < bitmask> an hour
2018-09-06T02:22:09 < jadew> neat
2018-09-06T02:22:13 < bitmask> its barely any plastic
2018-09-06T02:22:26 < jadew> mostly hole, eh?
2018-09-06T02:22:31 < bitmask> hehe
2018-09-06T02:22:57 < bitmask> I had adaptive layer height on which is why there is the banding you can see, I might print another for the hell of it without adaptive
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2018-09-06T02:33:20 < Laurenceb_> muh error bars
2018-09-06T02:33:30 < Laurenceb_> >pls add error bars to ur graph
2018-09-06T02:33:34 < Laurenceb_> the absolute state
2018-09-06T02:33:56 < Laurenceb_> tiem for voodoo statistics
2018-09-06T02:37:00 < dongs> hokkaido needs some prayers
2018-09-06T02:38:59 < Laurenceb_> apparently Terry jumped in front of a train
2018-09-06T02:39:02 < Laurenceb_> literally an hero
2018-09-06T02:41:49 < jadew> that was the accident?
2018-09-06T02:42:05 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: proof?
2018-09-06T02:42:28 < Laurenceb_> 4chan...
2018-09-06T02:42:58 < Laurenceb_> they are reposting from faecesbook, but I'm not going to go there
2018-09-06T02:43:38 < kakimir> you are banned?
2018-09-06T02:43:43 < jadew> haha
2018-09-06T02:43:47 < Laurenceb_> kek I dont even have an account
2018-09-06T02:43:57 < Laurenceb_> I deleted my account in 2007
2018-09-06T02:44:38 < Laurenceb_> should have saved it lol as it was first account in uk
2018-09-06T02:45:04 < Laurenceb_> I have email exchange with cuckerberg saved somewhere...
2018-09-06T02:45:21 < kakimir> are you shitting us?
2018-09-06T02:45:39 < Laurenceb_> no, he emailed me to ask for marker research from uk in early 2005
2018-09-06T02:45:47 < Laurenceb_> *market
2018-09-06T02:45:52 < kakimir> are you pals?
2018-09-06T02:46:04 < Laurenceb_> I told him it was shit and retarded and muricans were weird
2018-09-06T02:46:05 < jadew> he flies him in weekly
2018-09-06T02:46:11 < kakimir> why he emailed you?
2018-09-06T02:46:32 < Laurenceb_> kakimir: I ran uni student webshite
2018-09-06T02:46:46 < kakimir> so effectivelly
2018-09-06T02:46:55 < Laurenceb_> he was thinking of it as a yearbook type thing at that point
2018-09-06T02:46:58 < Laurenceb_> for unis
2018-09-06T02:47:17 < Laurenceb_> I said nobody cared enough about shit like that in uk for it to take off
2018-09-06T02:47:35 < kakimir> and he took your feedback
2018-09-06T02:47:36 < Laurenceb_> shit maybe I convinced him to change the concept
2018-09-06T02:47:58 < jadew> 200 years from now, when they'll tell the story of Laurenceb from freenode, on VRTV, they'll say he was a pen pall with zukenberg
2018-09-06T02:47:59  * Laurenceb_ is responsible to faecesbook confirmed
2018-09-06T02:48:24 < kakimir> and you spreaded it into europe
2018-09-06T02:48:30 < Laurenceb_> heh
2018-09-06T02:48:31 < kakimir> by being first
2018-09-06T02:48:45 < Laurenceb_> tbh I think he ignored me, but he gave me a free account anyway
2018-09-06T02:48:57 < jadew> was meant to be paid?
2018-09-06T02:49:07 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-06T02:49:15 < Laurenceb_> he was still mass email random webmasters with his shit ideas for yearbook stuff several months later aiui
2018-09-06T02:49:25 < Laurenceb_> jadew: I think that was one of his ideas at the time
2018-09-06T02:49:55 < jadew> it's interesting he did so much research
2018-09-06T02:50:08 < Laurenceb_> how zuckerberg was successful: throw spaghetti at a wall with mass emails to people you think might have a clue until it sticks
2018-09-06T02:50:24 < jadew> looks like that plan works
2018-09-06T02:50:48 < Laurenceb_> yeah I was too friendly
2018-09-06T02:50:49 < jadew> I'm gonna use that
2018-09-06T02:51:22 < kakimir> and after that he started throwing questions to business what do you want
2018-09-06T02:51:23 < Laurenceb_>  "the book of faces"
2018-09-06T02:51:28 < kakimir> process never stoped
2018-09-06T02:51:29 < Laurenceb_> his early ideas were so lame
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2018-09-06T02:52:03 < jadew> nobody knew back then how self absorbed people really were
2018-09-06T02:52:17 < jadew> once they found out, they made instagram
2018-09-06T02:52:25 < Laurenceb_> tbh everyone was abusing friends reunited as a "social network" type site at that time
2018-09-06T02:52:42 < Laurenceb_> it was staring everyone in the face but they were too dumb to see it
2018-09-06T02:52:50 < jadew> yeah, facebook kinda killed that
2018-09-06T02:53:10 < jadew> well, there were several moderately successful attempts
2018-09-06T02:53:17 < jadew> I'm not sure what made facebook special
2018-09-06T02:53:22 < kakimir> narcissism is really good for business
2018-09-06T02:53:26 < Laurenceb_> and getting more normies onto the net just seemed kind of lame to anyone who was knowledgeable in 2005
2018-09-06T02:53:35 < jadew> kakimir, that's gold
2018-09-06T02:53:39 < kakimir> and different type of personality disorders
2018-09-06T02:53:42 -!- Cracki [~Cracki@unaffiliated/crackwitz] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T02:54:01 < kakimir> important thing is that worse you get - more you need buy things
2018-09-06T02:54:32 < Laurenceb_> I guess zuckerberg thought he could write nice emails to webmaster characters and some of them might respond with some good ideas for stuff they though was too lame to do themselves
2018-09-06T02:54:38 < Laurenceb_> cuz the normie cancer
2018-09-06T02:54:43 < kakimir> hey
2018-09-06T02:54:58 < kakimir> let's start spamming like emails where we ask like generally ideas
2018-09-06T02:55:05 < kakimir> just ideas
2018-09-06T02:55:09 < jadew> I should add this to my product description: "This product is only for the best people!"
2018-09-06T02:55:16 < Laurenceb_>  "they have to use their real names?? wtf man"
2018-09-06T02:56:01 < jadew> right, that's what was different
2018-09-06T02:56:04 < Cracki> jadew, perhaps get the text fleshed out by some native english speaker. it's a _little_ bit peculiar.
2018-09-06T02:56:27 < Laurenceb_> with his original idea you had to prove what high school/uni you went to
2018-09-06T02:56:33 < jadew> Cracki, you missed the convo, this was about narcissism and facebook
2018-09-06T02:56:40 < jadew> it was a joke
2018-09-06T02:56:51 < Cracki> I wasnt even paying attention to that :P
2018-09-06T02:57:04 < Cracki> but you could label your redesign as "for the best people only"
2018-09-06T02:57:23 < jadew> ", I don't sell to losers."
2018-09-06T02:57:31 < Laurenceb_> Cracki: can I read this text?
2018-09-06T02:57:36 < Cracki> wat text
2018-09-06T02:57:44 < Laurenceb_> I'm confused
2018-09-06T02:57:45 < Cracki> jadew's ebay offer?
2018-09-06T02:57:48 < Laurenceb_> oh
2018-09-06T02:57:53 < Laurenceb_> where?
2018-09-06T02:57:57 < Cracki> he redesigned a frequency counter addon board for some HP(?) thingies
2018-09-06T02:58:05 < Cracki> it's better in every way
2018-09-06T02:58:09 < Cracki> except 50 mhz :P
2018-09-06T02:58:37 < jadew> the counter goes up on the other channels to 250 MHz anyway, so that's not important
2018-09-06T02:58:47 < jadew> also, it's better than the original in that range too
2018-09-06T02:58:48 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-06T02:59:03 < jadew> it's just not better than the chinese one
2018-09-06T02:59:10 < Cracki> uh?
2018-09-06T02:59:10 < jadew> but after 500 MHz it rules them all
2018-09-06T02:59:49 < jadew> Cracki, the original had worse specs even than the chinese version
2018-09-06T03:00:01 < Cracki> lol
2018-09-06T03:00:10 < jadew> also, I don't really know what the chinese mean by sensitivity
2018-09-06T03:00:21 < Cracki> comparative marketing. "my shit is x dBm better than the competition"
2018-09-06T03:00:23 < jadew> it could mean that it shows something, but it doesn't necessarily means that it's accurate
2018-09-06T03:00:50 < Cracki> good, point that out by putting ?!?!?! in the comparison where the chinese version doesn't say clearly what it means
2018-09-06T03:01:45 < Cracki> imagine hawking it on some tv shopping channel where they bash frying pans against their heads to show durability
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2018-09-06T03:03:51 < jadew> I changed the datasheet
2018-09-06T03:06:05 < Laurenceb_> lul this muh Russia thing
2018-09-06T03:06:23 < Laurenceb_> >just walk straight through passport control using ur real name with the nerve agent
2018-09-06T03:06:55 < karlp> (I reckon you should drop the "made in romania" tag)
2018-09-06T03:07:06 < jadew> karlp, why?
2018-09-06T03:07:09 < karlp> no-one's going to buy that as a plus, and people will avoid it as a minus.
2018-09-06T03:07:14 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: ?
2018-09-06T03:07:17 < karlp> you don't see olimex saying made in bulgarian
2018-09-06T03:07:33 < Laurenceb_> uk news atm
2018-09-06T03:07:36 < jadew> karlp, well, I have to specify that, by law
2018-09-06T03:07:40 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-06T03:07:43 < Laurenceb_> police have issued arrest warrents
2018-09-06T03:07:45 < jadew> and I'd think it's better than made in China, no?
2018-09-06T03:08:20 < karlp> jadew: not in the silkscreen prominitently in your ebay imagery you don't
2018-09-06T03:08:39 < karlp> also, fwiw, your pcb looks empty.
2018-09-06T03:08:45 < karlp> the front is blank, the back is covered by a can.
2018-09-06T03:08:53 < karlp> I believe you that it works, but you can't see a damn thing.
2018-09-06T03:08:57 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: ?
2018-09-06T03:09:00 < MrMobius> where is R2COM? he knows about bulge-area
2018-09-06T03:09:02  * karlp shrugs
2018-09-06T03:09:15 < jadew> karlp, hmm
2018-09-06T03:09:19 < jadew> it needs the can tho...
2018-09-06T03:09:24 < kakimir> R2COM doesn't chat here anymore
2018-09-06T03:09:37 < karlp> why, cos your design was too shit to make it without? like the other one? ;)
2018-09-06T03:09:39 < MrMobius> did they cut the internet off to his village again?
2018-09-06T03:09:52 < Cracki> the pcb does look empty, but it has to fit the mounting screws, right?
2018-09-06T03:09:56 < karlp> I'm jus tsaying, it's a blank baord with "made in romania" on it,
2018-09-06T03:10:08 < Cracki> for the next batch, put some stuff on the silkscreen
2018-09-06T03:10:17 < Cracki> like performance specs and whatnot
2018-09-06T03:10:19 < jadew> karlp, yeah, it's a good point
2018-09-06T03:10:23 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: is there any real news site in uk?
2018-09-06T03:10:37 < kakimir> I mean with no news about kardashians
2018-09-06T03:10:43 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T03:10:44 < MrMobius> or maybe R2COM not take enough potato for make troll in IRC
2018-09-06T03:10:47 < jadew> Cracki, good idea
2018-09-06T03:10:59 < jadew> maybe I'll add a useless ground plane and poke it full of vias
2018-09-06T03:11:04 < kakimir> or uk reality stars
2018-09-06T03:11:06 < Cracki> ;) rice it
2018-09-06T03:11:20 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-06T03:12:31 < Cracki> toot your horn, say how you've been doing electrical engineering for centuries and you have plenty of experience with this shit, you did this and that and you even have a website, or dear valued customer, come check out the other listings in my "ebay shop"
2018-09-06T03:12:52 < Laurenceb_> kakimir: nope
2018-09-06T03:13:38 < Cracki> if you don't mind, talk about the very very premium parts used to make the module
2018-09-06T03:13:45 < Cracki> name dropping ;)
2018-09-06T03:14:21 < jadew> Cracki, ah, but I don't want to tell the chinese how to copy it :)
2018-09-06T03:14:36 < Cracki> then skip that :P
2018-09-06T03:15:10 < jadew> it wouldn't hurt to trash the competition a bit
2018-09-06T03:15:18 < Cracki> say... that folded over trace, the angle of that corner, should it be 45 degrees?
2018-09-06T03:15:35 < jadew> yeah, it's ok
2018-09-06T03:15:38 < Cracki> :P
2018-09-06T03:15:53 < jadew> another decent way is to have rounded corners
2018-09-06T03:16:04 < jadew> but this is better
2018-09-06T03:16:42 < jadew> and allows for much tighter changes in direction, with rounded corners they have to have a minimum radius
2018-09-06T03:16:49 < Cracki> ic ic
2018-09-06T03:17:28 < Cracki> mention the shield, seems the original and clone don't have that
2018-09-06T03:19:14 < jadew> unfortunately I've seen another shielded version, a chinese redesign, but I've seen what's in them and I think they only added the shield to conciel that there's nothing there
2018-09-06T03:19:38 < jadew> *conceal
2018-09-06T03:20:10 < Cracki> lol
2018-09-06T03:32:07 < dongs> Trans bank account frozen because 'sounded like man' on phone.
2018-09-06T03:32:21 < dongs> https://metro.co.uk/2018/09/05/transgender-womans-bank-account-frozen-because-she-sounded-like-a-man-on-phone-7915234/
2018-09-06T03:32:24 < dongs> lol
2018-09-06T03:32:26 < dongs> RIP brianna wu
2018-09-06T03:32:26 < jadew> lol
2018-09-06T03:33:47 < jadew> "a phone banking system identified her voice as a man’s"
2018-09-06T03:33:57 < jadew> that's a good piece of software
2018-09-06T03:34:12 < dongs> you dont need AI to identify that faggot as a dude
2018-09-06T03:34:15 < dongs> look at the pics
2018-09-06T03:34:28 < jadew> lol, didn't scroll down
2018-09-06T03:34:45 < jadew> yeah, I don't think he sounds too feminine
2018-09-06T03:36:26 < Cracki> oh good I just found that article on twitter and wanted to share :D
2018-09-06T03:39:05 < Cracki> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dgp9MPLEAqA
2018-09-06T03:39:17 < dongs> The last link has been flagged by IRC NANNY as "Possibly Unsuitable". Please find your parent(s) first and have them check the content before opening. [this channel protected by IrCNaNNY by SafeSoft v1.0b]
2018-09-06T03:40:14 < Cracki> wew
2018-09-06T03:41:36 < dongs> https://twitter.com/flibitijibibo/status/1037011978600898560?s=19
2018-09-06T03:41:39 < dongs> millenial coding
2018-09-06T03:41:50 < Cracki> neat
2018-09-06T03:42:33 < Cracki> "explicit branching considered harmful" // only use exception handling, if/loops/switch are dangerous
2018-09-06T03:43:18 < jadew> someone obviously had fun there
2018-09-06T03:43:42 < jadew> you don't need to branch from that
2018-09-06T03:43:42 < englishman> Pb93.5Sn5Ag1.5 should be good for soldering thermocouples to PCB, to measure reflow, right
2018-09-06T03:43:46 < jadew> you can just say a == b
2018-09-06T03:43:59 < englishman> 296-301C melt
2018-09-06T03:44:11 < Cracki> btw, your sensitivity for 2500 MHz looks off
2018-09-06T03:44:26 < Cracki> neighboring values are higher
2018-09-06T03:44:35 -!- mirage335 [~mirage335@mirage335-base.soaringindustries.space] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-06T03:44:41 < branjb> anyone ever thought of buying an RV and just parking it at work?
2018-09-06T03:44:50 < englishman> yes, rednecks
2018-09-06T03:45:14 < branjb> haha
2018-09-06T03:45:15 < jadew> Cracki, that's its sweet spot
2018-09-06T03:45:24 < Cracki> put your sleeping bag under your desk like a proper silicon valley slave
2018-09-06T03:45:27 < Cracki> ah!
2018-09-06T03:45:58 < MrMobius> you can park it at wal mart
2018-09-06T03:45:59 < branjb> you could make some decent money slavewaging away for 2-3 years and just live in the work parking lot, no rent, no utilities
2018-09-06T03:47:41 < jadew> can you shower in an RV?
2018-09-06T03:47:44 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-06T03:47:48 < jadew> and if yes, where do you throw the water?
2018-09-06T03:47:48 < branjb> shower at the gym
2018-09-06T03:47:57 < branjb> it usually has a tank that you have to refill
2018-09-06T03:47:58 < Cracki> find a water hookup and you're good, or keep filling the water tank
2018-09-06T03:47:59 < dongs> but then you have to shit at the office
2018-09-06T03:48:07 < branjb> you'll want to walk back into work to shower/poop/pee
2018-09-06T03:48:07 < jadew> branjb, looks like you thought this out hehe
2018-09-06T03:48:09 < Cracki> water the flowers :P
2018-09-06T03:48:18 < Cracki> poop at work, you get paid
2018-09-06T03:48:22 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-06T03:48:25 < branjb> never poop on your own time
2018-09-06T03:48:25 < MrMobius> dongs, dont pretend youve never shit on the clock before
2018-09-06T03:50:49 < branjb> I wonder if companies in SV have started making no overnight in the parking lot policies
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2018-09-06T03:52:21 < jadew> if you spend 10 minutes pooping, at a wage of $20/h, you make $8,700 in 10 years
2018-09-06T03:52:30 < Cracki> as soon as you show up with an RV, they will
2018-09-06T03:53:05 < englishman> maybe work on your 64bit ring0-only holy operating system at the same time
2018-09-06T03:53:40 < branjb> i'm surprised companies don't make employees clock out to go shit
2018-09-06T03:53:58 < MrMobius> heh, I wonder how hr would make them articulate that rule
2018-09-06T03:54:01 < branjb> at 100 employees over 10 years they are losing $870,000 to people just shitting
2018-09-06T03:55:18 < jadew> it's probably why many companies have that hour off in the middle of the day
2018-09-06T03:55:41 < branjb> I try to poop before/after lunch
2018-09-06T03:55:53 < Cracki> they lose more money allowing smokers their smoke breaks every hour
2018-09-06T03:55:55 < jadew> I never plan for it
2018-09-06T03:56:01 < branjb> I'll hold it
2018-09-06T03:57:40 < dongs> jadew: if you make $20./hr and spend 10 minutes daily investing, you would probably make > $8700 in a year
2018-09-06T03:57:52 < MrMobius> no way
2018-09-06T03:58:02 < branjb> invest while you poop
2018-09-06T03:58:14 < jadew> invest in what?
2018-09-06T03:58:19 < branjb> buttcoin
2018-09-06T03:58:24 < Cracki> toilet paper
2018-09-06T03:58:32 < jadew> is anyone here making any serious money from investing?
2018-09-06T03:58:40 < Cracki> I don't know how to invest
2018-09-06T03:58:47 < branjb> my 401k has done 2.1% this year
2018-09-06T03:58:51 < branjb> slightly below inflation
2018-09-06T03:58:52 < Cracki> (neither do I have money to play with)
2018-09-06T03:59:01 < jadew> me neither, but if it's something that is actually proffitable, I could learn
2018-09-06T04:00:52 < Cracki> I hear the trick is to put a constant amount of money into things/stocks/whatever, so when they're high, you get few of them, but when they're low, you get more of them
2018-09-06T04:01:05 < Cracki> so overall you have more stocks you bought cheap
2018-09-06T04:02:00 < Cracki> it also seems important not to be gouged by fees
2018-09-06T04:02:27 < Cracki> and that is what keeps me away from this shit. my bank is absolutely not transparent about this.
2018-09-06T04:02:46 < Cracki> they have no reason to tell me how to *not* give them money.
2018-09-06T04:02:51 < branjb> get lucky and buy a house at the right time, then sell it for twice as much in 8 years
2018-09-06T04:03:57 < jadew> buying one room apartments and becoming a landlord seems to be a thing too
2018-09-06T04:04:03 < Cracki> I don't count on luck
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2018-09-06T04:12:57 < jadew> isn't there a forum where people discuss which shares to sell and buy together?
2018-09-06T04:13:13 < karlp> many
2018-09-06T04:14:46 < jadew> know any?
2018-09-06T04:15:32 < jadew> what's that operation called (so I can google it)?
2018-09-06T04:15:50 < Laurenceb_> >share trading
2018-09-06T04:15:55 < Laurenceb_> just get a managed fund
2018-09-06T04:15:59 < Laurenceb_> its worth the teeny fee
2018-09-06T04:16:12 < karlp> the fees are incredibly varied
2018-09-06T04:17:08 < jadew> a managed fund is the same thing as an investment fund?
2018-09-06T04:20:18 < Laurenceb_> no
2018-09-06T04:20:29 < Laurenceb_> well depends on the terminology used in your country
2018-09-06T04:20:44 < Laurenceb_> I use managed funds with ~0.4% annual charged for muh magebux
2018-09-06T04:21:26 < jadew> I'll look into it
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2018-09-06T04:39:26 < dongs> https://finance.yahoo.com/news/elon-musk-works-many-hours-171951804.html
2018-09-06T05:14:40 < englishman> just replace "works" with "tweets" in that article
2018-09-06T05:14:58 < englishman> Business Insider spoke to 42 current and recent Tesla employees about what it's really like to tweet for one of the world's most ambitious and controversial companies.
2018-09-06T05:15:13 < englishman> Some people found this tweet ethic inspiring; others, not so much.
2018-09-06T05:28:50 < dongs> tweet ethic
2018-09-06T05:33:59 < dongs> god damn every fuckign time i do a F0 project i have to dig around everwehre for all the drivers i written for other shit
2018-09-06T05:34:10 < dongs> now looking for delay.c that uses hwtimer
2018-09-06T05:34:18 < dongs> instead of nonexistent CYCCNT
2018-09-06T05:34:24 < dongs> i know ive written it more than once
2018-09-06T05:34:35 < branjb> just use HAL
2018-09-06T05:34:42 < dongs> LOL
2018-09-06T05:34:43 < dongs> yeah no
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2018-09-06T05:35:41 < dongs> found.
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2018-09-06T05:52:31 < branjb> linux is such cancer
2018-09-06T05:52:49 < branjb> decided to try setting up an arm toolchain on it, using all default packages: /usr/lib/gcc/arm-none-eabi/6.3.1/../../../arm-none-eabi/bin/ld: error: /usr/lib/gcc/arm-none-eabi/6.3.1/../../../arm-none-eabi/lib/crt0.o: Conflicting CPU architectures 12/1
2018-09-06T05:53:12 < englishman> is your work making you use lunix
2018-09-06T05:53:17 < branjb> workaround is to remove those packages and manually install a different version
2018-09-06T05:53:34 < branjb> yes
2018-09-06T05:54:01 < branjb> even worse, i'm following 5 year old instructions from upgrdman's blog
2018-09-06T05:55:28 < englishman> which company is it so we can laugh at them
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2018-09-06T06:07:19 < branjb> not cypress
2018-09-06T06:10:34 < dongs> aids
2018-09-06T06:13:29 < dongs> F0 and F3 are same I2C periph?
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2018-09-06T06:51:58 < dongs> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=10-Reasons-Pass-RTX-20-Linux haha
2018-09-06T06:52:07 < dongs> > 10 Reasons Linux Gamers Might Want To Pass On The NVIDIA RTX 20 Series
2018-09-06T06:52:15 < dongs> who the fuck games on lunix
2018-09-06T06:52:22 < dongs> i don't think you need gtx2080 to play tuxracer
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2018-09-06T07:21:06 < branjb> where has upgrdman been
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2018-09-06T07:54:59 < dongs> one reason why lunix fags will pass on gtx2080: cuz its not free
2018-09-06T07:55:05 < dongs> and because its not 10 years old
2018-09-06T07:55:17 < dongs> requirements for lunix to supprot hardware: obsoleted by manufacturer, at least 10 yaers old
2018-09-06T07:55:30 < dongs> (thus can be obtained for free from the landfill)
2018-09-06T07:55:42 < branjb> it's even better if the driver doesn't support your kernel so you have to go into the driver source to tweak it
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2018-09-06T07:55:47 < branjb> that's a real adrenaline rush
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2018-09-06T07:56:10 < dongs> windows driver model must be absolute shit
2018-09-06T07:56:18 < dongs> i can take 32bit driver i wrote for win2k
2018-09-06T07:56:21 < dongs> and load it into 32bit win10
2018-09-06T07:56:24 < branjb> lol
2018-09-06T07:56:25 < dongs> 18 years later
2018-09-06T07:59:38 < branjb> wtf
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2018-09-06T07:59:46 < branjb> project compiles fine on windows
2018-09-06T07:59:52 < branjb> same compiler version except lunix
2018-09-06T07:59:58 < branjb> get random error
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2018-09-06T08:01:46 < branjb> libgpio.h: enum GPIO_PIN {shit here};  inline void gpio_high(enum GPIO_PIN) {shit here}  then in main.c: "gpio_high(PB7);"   gives me undefind reference
2018-09-06T08:02:22 < branjb> but if I do gpio_high(5); that works
2018-09-06T08:03:46 < dongs> what the nigger
2018-09-06T08:03:50 < dongs>  inline void gpio_high(enum GPIO_PIN)
2018-09-06T08:03:52 < dongs> is this actual code?
2018-09-06T08:04:05 < dongs> because thats missing the fucking variable?
2018-09-06T08:04:13 < branjb> no
2018-09-06T08:04:15 < dongs> void gpio_high(enum GPIO_PIN gaypin()
2018-09-06T08:04:18 < dongs> or wahtever
2018-09-06T08:04:23 < branjb> it's really inline void gpio_high(enum GPIO_PIN pin)
2018-09-06T08:04:27 < branjb> i figured it out
2018-09-06T08:04:40 < branjb> needed some gay -std=c99 shit
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2018-09-06T08:55:04 < upgrdman> pic24f pros: is there an equivalent for __disable/enable_irq() ?
2018-09-06T08:55:28 < upgrdman> a quick google isn't giving me a clear answer :/
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2018-09-06T08:58:21 < dongs> lol pic. 
2018-09-06T08:59:50 < branjb> pic toolchain is worse than linux
2018-09-06T09:00:05 < upgrdman> agreed
2018-09-06T09:00:29 < dongs> it puts the tool in toolchain
2018-09-06T09:00:40 < branjb> what's it called again?
2018-09-06T09:00:43 < branjb> mplab or something?
2018-09-06T09:00:45 < Steffanx> https://www.microchip.com/forums/m/tm.aspx?m=662638&p=1 ... First google result?
2018-09-06T09:01:16 < upgrdman> Steffanx, saw that, but wtf ipl do i need
2018-09-06T09:01:32 < upgrdman> more googling sounds like 7==disableirq, 0=enableirq -ish
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2018-09-06T09:01:53 < dongs> save wahtever's current
2018-09-06T09:01:59 < dongs> set to 7
2018-09-06T09:02:03 < dongs> restore whatever was current
2018-09-06T09:02:14 < dongs> but yeah pic sounds like cancer
2018-09-06T09:02:56 < Steffanx> They use move to avr uh?
2018-09-06T09:03:00 < Steffanx> Make pic obsolete
2018-09-06T09:06:21 < upgrdman> fuck yes. was able to get most of my code to fit in this shit pic24f. i was worried i'd have to shave bytes of SRAM and Flash, but i have like 20% free space in both
2018-09-06T09:06:47 < branjb> hey upgrdman do you know offhand how to update st-link fw from linux cmd line?
2018-09-06T09:06:56 < upgrdman> i dont
2018-09-06T09:07:14 < Steffanx> Is that even possible?
2018-09-06T09:07:20 < upgrdman> i took lazy route and VM -> stlink tool -> done
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2018-09-06T09:08:07 < upgrdman_> official stlink utility will pop up offering to update the stlink firmware
2018-09-06T09:08:31 < branjb> good idea
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2018-09-06T09:09:54 < branjb> i stole half your f0 lib and ported it to f4 periphs
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2018-09-06T12:13:20 < karlp> branjb: the official st stlink firmware package has a jar that runs happily on linux and updates stlinks
2018-09-06T12:14:40 < karlp> I don't know if it has a non graphical interface, but it works well at least.
2018-09-06T12:15:26 < dongs> i do not undertand st infatuation wiht java shit
2018-09-06T12:15:37 < dongs> it cant be for lunix support'
2018-09-06T12:15:44 < karlp> it's for mac _and_ linux support
2018-09-06T12:16:07 < dongs> mac isn't even on radar of any normal IC manufacturer
2018-09-06T12:17:10 < Steffanx> Oh there is the java thing too now indeed.
2018-09-06T12:17:36 < zyp> dongs, java is very enterprise
2018-09-06T12:19:16 < karlp> dongs: well, then it must have been for linux :)
2018-09-06T12:19:22 < karlp> and mac was just a free bonus.
2018-09-06T12:19:40 < karlp> but it went from being "we have windows tools" to "we have tools for all three"
2018-09-06T12:19:56 < dongs> or just to "we are tools"
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2018-09-06T12:24:56 < karlp> heh, orangepi has a shell script running perpetualy that "restarts cpus automatically if cooling state is below 3"
2018-09-06T12:25:21 < karlp> like, "we have no idea how to implement the thermal governors, we're just gonna let them overheat and restart them all the time
2018-09-06T12:27:06 < veverak> as shamed as I was, we actually did that to tool that fetches email from multiple boxes into local app
2018-09-06T12:27:21 < veverak> 'run as daemon, kill it every 24 hours'
2018-09-06T12:28:12 < dongs> karlp: sounds liek typical lunix
2018-09-06T12:37:45 < karlp> veverak: lots of people do it, it's not exactly the sort of thing that instils you with confidence
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2018-09-06T12:37:50 < zyp> karlp, did you figure out powering it up?
2018-09-06T12:37:53 < jadew> I had to deal with this issue on linux
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2018-09-06T12:38:13 < karlp> zyp: yeah, the two leds, marked power and status are both actually completely soft leds.
2018-09-06T12:38:20 < karlp> spi nor is empty shipped,
2018-09-06T12:38:22 < jadew> some program, which owned another program (this one written by me) was being restarted daily and was also killing my program
2018-09-06T12:38:26 < catphish> woo https://imgur.com/7Mc22m0
2018-09-06T12:38:29 < karlp> so without an sd card you just get FEL mode, and no lots,  no serial output
2018-09-06T12:38:32 < jadew> it's common place in linux
2018-09-06T12:38:56 < karlp> wrote their ubuntu build to an sdcard and it runs just fine.
2018-09-06T12:38:59 < zyp> ah, so it were powered, just didn't have anything to run
2018-09-06T12:39:10 < Laurenceb_> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-45425872
2018-09-06T12:39:15 < zyp> which model did you say this was?
2018-09-06T12:39:22 < Laurenceb_> e=mc^{patriarchy}
2018-09-06T12:39:29 < karlp> orange pi zero plus, so the h5 / cortex a53
2018-09-06T12:39:42 < karlp> unfortunately it's got one of the least supported wifi chipsets.
2018-09-06T12:40:01 < zyp> ah, right, that's what I've got too
2018-09-06T12:40:15 < zyp> I got one zero and one zero plus
2018-09-06T12:40:16 < karlp> I've got my openwrt buildroot up on it already, it's so fast compared to our old ar9331 device :)
2018-09-06T12:40:37 < karlp> I decided plus was ~as well supported upstream and more cpu/ram for home was more better.
2018-09-06T12:41:05 < zyp> the zero turned out to be pretty unstable, but the zero plus has worked well so far
2018-09-06T12:41:18 < zyp> I think it's been running stably for months now
2018-09-06T12:41:33 < karlp> what was unstable with the zero? it is just less cpu power so should be cooler, and a different wifi?
2018-09-06T12:41:50 < zyp> at the time I got it, there were no official build for it or anything, so I loaded up the armbian build for orangepi pc2 instead
2018-09-06T12:41:55 < zyp> which works but without wifi
2018-09-06T12:42:07 < zyp> dunno, it kept crashing or something
2018-09-06T12:42:12 < zyp> with a few days in between
2018-09-06T12:43:27 < zyp> 09:42:59 up 83 days, 17:41,  1 user,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
2018-09-06T12:43:37 < karlp> pretty sure this rootfs on sdcard is suboptimal
2018-09-06T12:44:26 < dongs> catphish: your shit is working?
2018-09-06T12:44:42 < catphish> dongs: it is :)
2018-09-06T12:44:58 < zyp> karlp, it's pretty overkill for what I'm having it do: https://paste.jvnv.net/view/wKD47
2018-09-06T12:45:06 < catphish> it reads cards, flashes its LED and beeeps a bit :)
2018-09-06T12:45:36 < zyp> catphish, cool stuff
2018-09-06T12:45:43 < dongs> fucking python
2018-09-06T12:45:50 < catphish> zyp: are you using something that's not rabbit as a message queue?
2018-09-06T12:46:02 < dongs> everytime i see that shit it just looks worse and worse
2018-09-06T12:46:04 < catphish> because i'm using rabbit and i hate it
2018-09-06T12:46:18 < zyp> catphish, rabbitmq is mainly amqp, I'm using mqtt
2018-09-06T12:46:19 < karlp> zyp: heh.
2018-09-06T12:46:52 < karlp> well, I'm trying to do apt ugprade and it's just sitting there chugging on IO waits
2018-09-06T12:47:00 < catphish> zyp: is there a server implementation of that which holds queued messages?
2018-09-06T12:47:21 < karlp> catphish: what are you actually trying to do?
2018-09-06T12:47:42 < karlp> and what's wrong with rabbit?
2018-09-06T12:47:44 < zyp> in general, amqp is way better than mqtt, it's just that mqtt has one feature that amqp lacks, that makes it suitable for shit like home control
2018-09-06T12:47:46 < catphish> i'm using ruby and there's no amqp client that doesn't suck, so always on the lookout for alternatives
2018-09-06T12:47:49 < zyp> retained messages
2018-09-06T12:48:01 < zyp> maybe you should stop using ruby :p
2018-09-06T12:48:05 < catphish> lol
2018-09-06T12:48:12 < zyp> pika for python is good 
2018-09-06T12:48:14 < karlp> amqp is way _more_ than mqtt, wouldn't necessariliy say better
2018-09-06T12:48:20 < karlp> amqp is just JMS spec.
2018-09-06T12:48:23 < srk> *popcorn time*
2018-09-06T12:48:24 < karlp> if you want all that, great.
2018-09-06T12:48:53 < catphish> i don't really need any features, just a queue that i can put stuff in and get it out
2018-09-06T12:48:58 < zyp> karlp, by better, I mean more flexible
2018-09-06T12:49:13 < karlp> "I don't need features, just need features"
2018-09-06T12:49:28 < srk> catphish: "just" is a most overloaded word in tech
2018-09-06T12:49:40 < srk> *the
2018-09-06T12:49:47 < catphish> rabbit seems ok (though maybe a bit overcomplicated for the minimal use case), but the ruby client for it is too buggy :(
2018-09-06T12:50:11 < zyp> if rabbitmq could do some sort of retained messages with amqp, I'd use that
2018-09-06T12:50:25 < zyp> that's the only thing mqtt has going for it
2018-09-06T12:50:25 < catphish> retained messages?
2018-09-06T12:50:54 < zyp> yeah, you can tell the broker to retain the last message on a topic
2018-09-06T12:51:06 < zyp> so that when a new client subscribes to the topic, it gets the retained message immediately
2018-09-06T12:51:14 < zyp> super useful for state topics
2018-09-06T12:51:19 < catphish> ah i see
2018-09-06T12:51:35 < zyp> i.e. my script sets tv/state to whether tv is on or off
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2018-09-06T12:51:51 < zyp> any client wanting to know whether tv is on or off just subscribes to it and is told
2018-09-06T12:52:02 < zyp> doesn't have to wait for another state change
2018-09-06T12:53:30  * karlp wonders if mqtt5 will get age limits for retained.
2018-09-06T12:54:35 < zyp> per message?
2018-09-06T12:55:47 < karlp> yeah
2018-09-06T12:55:55 < karlp> right now retained once is _for ever_
2018-09-06T12:56:01 < karlp> same with persistence clients :)
2018-09-06T12:56:16 < zyp> yeah, unless you have aging globally configured on the broker
2018-09-06T12:56:18 < karlp> mosquitto lets you specify an age limit for disconnected clients which is great for cleaning shit up
2018-09-06T12:56:34 < karlp> but I've not noticed any global aging for for retained msgs
2018-09-06T12:57:29 < karlp> oh, so dongs, you don't need to sign that mdk eval, its' all just here: https://github.com/ARM-software/CMSIS_5/tree/develop/CMSIS/RTOS2
2018-09-06T12:58:12 < karlp> or v1 in same directory depending on which you want to use
2018-09-06T12:59:21 < Thorn> so RTX is part of official CMSIS?
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2018-09-06T12:59:43 < karlp> yep, is now.
2018-09-06T13:00:03 < Thorn> and RTX releases match CMSIS releases? https://github.com/ARM-software/CMSIS_5/releases
2018-09-06T13:00:14 < Thorn> and even version numbers
2018-09-06T13:00:26 < karlp> looks like it, yes.
2018-09-06T13:01:04 < zyp> I would like a message broker that had a bit more data store functionality built into it, e.g. to hold config and stuff for the components that connects to it
2018-09-06T13:01:37 < zyp> I've done a lot of thinking on how to do it with mqtt and retained messages, but some of the stuff I wanna do ends up being pretty clunky
2018-09-06T13:01:45 < karlp> zyp: you're looking for kafka and lwm2m stuff then right?
2018-09-06T13:01:52 < karlp> mqtt is a pretty low level building block.
2018-09-06T13:01:59 < zyp> I've looked at redis, but that's not exactly what I want either
2018-09-06T13:02:14 < zyp> kafka and lwm2m I haven't looked at, will do
2018-09-06T13:02:26 < karlp> (the lw in lwm2m is a fucking lie)
2018-09-06T13:02:38 < karlp> it's lightweigth compared to.... jboss, as far as I can tell.
2018-09-06T13:03:18 < zyp> I'm a bit tempted to write my own thing
2018-09-06T13:03:59 < karlp> that's what everyone does
2018-09-06T13:04:09 < karlp> "our IP"
2018-09-06T13:05:00 < zyp> I figure I could build something on HTTP, kinda like a REST database
2018-09-06T13:06:24 < zyp> so url gives topics similar to MQTT, storing and updating data could be done with traditional GET/POST/PUT verbs, and in addition I could use SSE for subscriptions
2018-09-06T13:07:41 < zyp> alternatively some layer on top of websockets to make it easier to bundle a bunch of traffic in one connection
2018-09-06T13:08:26 < zyp> but if HTTP2 can do multiple SSE channels through one connection, that wouldn't be necessary
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2018-09-06T13:24:33 < Steffanx> Special clickware for englishman http://imgur.com/gallery/lBM5HTm  
2018-09-06T13:25:47 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-06T13:26:09 < karlp> ooh boy, the backend of rtx is... not going to be straightforward.
2018-09-06T13:27:33 < jadew> so how do I buy stock online with low fees? is there a platform you guys are using?
2018-09-06T13:27:52 < Steffanx> I dont do stocks
2018-09-06T13:28:23 < cjbaird> Still don't have a STM32 Mascot to do rule34s of.
2018-09-06T13:28:45 < jadew> Steffanx, what do you invest in?
2018-09-06T13:28:58 < Steffanx> Nothing
2018-09-06T13:29:13 < Steffanx> A house perhaps, sometime
2018-09-06T13:29:47 < jadew> I don't invest in anything either and I think that has to change
2018-09-06T13:30:48 < Steffanx> When you go http at least go CoAP zyp. Because "lightweight" and "well designed" (self claimed)
2018-09-06T13:41:33 < catphish> nice gun
2018-09-06T13:50:10 < zyp> Steffanx, lightweight isn't really a big design goal
2018-09-06T13:51:04 < zyp> Steffanx, what I wanna do is build a modular/distributed system for home control
2018-09-06T13:51:38 < karlp> this is why we have ~50 HA things already :)
2018-09-06T13:51:41 < zyp> where individual applications can connect to a sentral service and register their services/devices
2018-09-06T13:51:53 < karlp> I take it none of the otherones are in py3 asyncio? :)
2018-09-06T13:52:19 < karlp> heh, ubuntuupdate filled teh sdcard
2018-09-06T13:52:21 < karlp> nice one.
2018-09-06T13:52:28 < zyp> there probably are, but the point here is that I don't want a big blob of shit that does everything
2018-09-06T13:52:56 < zyp> I want small independent services that do one thing and do it well
2018-09-06T13:53:25 < zyp> I currently have stuff working like that, with mqtt in the middle
2018-09-06T13:53:41 < zyp> including that tv script I posted earlier
2018-09-06T13:54:08 < zyp> what I want to add to that is mechanisms for discovering other services
2018-09-06T13:55:34 < zyp> I thought about doing something like that by having each device publish a /metadata topic, and then device discovery could be done through subscribing to devices/+/+/metadata or something like that
2018-09-06T13:57:59 < karlp> homeie/hash and a few other things are doing this.
2018-09-06T13:58:14 < karlp> just as long as you void domoticz you should avoid the big blob thing 
2018-09-06T13:58:41 < zyp> what's homeie?
2018-09-06T14:00:01 < karlp> https://github.com/homieiot/convention
2018-09-06T14:03:39 < zyp> ah, yeah, that's similar to what I want to do, I think I've looked at it before
2018-09-06T14:04:47 < karlp> I think I've seen others, but it's not soemthing I look at much
2018-09-06T14:11:41 < zyp> the stuff they care about specifying isn't really all that interesting to me though
2018-09-06T14:17:39 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@193.173.113.122] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-06T14:24:44 < mawk> 20VAC hurts ?
2018-09-06T14:24:50 < mawk> with relatively dry hands
2018-09-06T14:25:18 < mawk> at 60Hz
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2018-09-06T14:50:39 < Ecco> Is there an easy way to tell what file/line a given symbol comes from?
2018-09-06T14:50:44 < Ecco> I know GDB does it
2018-09-06T14:50:54 < karlp> addr2line
2018-09-06T14:50:57 < Ecco> but is there a command-line I could use to do it for a bunch of symbols
2018-09-06T14:51:13 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T14:51:37 < cjbaird> It's the 21st Century. Why can't passive caps handle 30kV at 80A ..bwwn working a magnetic loop antenna
2018-09-06T14:51:40 < Thorn> you can also run gdb commands from command line
2018-09-06T14:51:49 < Ecco> Yeah I guess I could script gdb too
2018-09-06T14:52:18 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T14:52:22 < Thorn> gdb -ex "..." -ex "exit" image.elf
2018-09-06T14:53:07 < Ecco> yeah, I might as well do this, thanks
2018-09-06T14:53:14 < Ecco> addr2line seems like a good solution too
2018-09-06T14:53:16 < Ecco> thanks guys
2018-09-06T14:54:05 < Ecco> It gives very weird results (not consistent with nm…)
2018-09-06T14:54:10 < Ecco> (it = addr2line)
2018-09-06T14:56:57 < cjbaird> Jaycar have done something lame with their website.
2018-09-06T14:57:08 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-06T14:57:13 < Ecco> what?
2018-09-06T14:57:28 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T14:58:58 < cjbaird> Don't get started on poor unfortunate blow-$50000-on-tarduinosats-Oxer.
2018-09-06T15:00:34 < cjbaird> "waa waa Jaycar second-sourced a kit I sold for $90 that had $8 worth of parts in it and they let me sell for 5 years without a price reduction waa waa."
2018-09-06T15:00:40 < dongs> sounds like hackerspace allright
2018-09-06T15:00:42 -!- sandeepkr [~sandeepkr@188.166.127.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-06T15:01:40 < cjbaird> "Freetards: Open Source everything, except what I'm selling."
2018-09-06T15:04:28 -!- Tectu [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-06T15:09:27 < cjbaird> Baited my housemate gud this afternoon while working on the magloop. "What's that?" "I'll tell you after I'm finished and haven't killed myself." 
2018-09-06T15:10:06 < cjbaird> A magloop that can handle a 100 watts TX or so..  That'll be interesting if it fails.
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2018-09-06T15:23:40 < jadew> "The requested scope is invalid, unknown, malformed, or exceeds the scope granted to the client"
2018-09-06T15:23:44 < jadew> well, which the fuck is it?
2018-09-06T15:24:15 < dongs> get a faster scaope
2018-09-06T15:29:18 < Cracki> kek
2018-09-06T15:29:53 < Steffanx> The cpctr*
2018-09-06T15:32:30 < jadew> inside crt's mind: http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/resources/images/7754034.jpg?display=1&htype=0&type=responsive-gallery
2018-09-06T15:35:55 < jadew> I recognized one of the actors
2018-09-06T15:36:01 < jadew> the pink guy
2018-09-06T15:36:08 < jadew> he played in the IT crowd
2018-09-06T15:36:42 < jadew> what's this from?
2018-09-06T15:37:25 < Steffanx> Lol, thats soooo accurate jadew. The pic.
2018-09-06T15:38:58 < Ecco> Hmm, another ELF question: when I run "nm --line-numbers firmware.elf", some symbols are displayed without the corresponding source location
2018-09-06T15:39:11 < Ecco> for these symbols, if I do "info line my_symbol" in GDB, the source location is shown
2018-09-06T15:39:19 < Ecco> what could explain this behavior?
2018-09-06T15:40:17 < zyp> different ways of looking up the information?
2018-09-06T15:40:42 < Ecco> I guess, but… it's only in the DWARF data, isn't it?
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2018-09-06T15:46:25 < karlp> wht the hell is this: CMSIS_5/CMSIS/RTOS2/RTX/Source/GCC/irq_cm3.S:1: *** missing separator.  Stop.
2018-09-06T15:46:32 < karlp> why is it being treated as a makefile?!
2018-09-06T15:46:48 < zyp> hah
2018-09-06T15:47:41 < dongs> /gcc/ found problem
2018-09-06T15:50:12 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-06T15:58:38 < karlp> well, nothing wrong with the file, gcc happily ocmpiles it.
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2018-09-06T16:07:50 < catphish> hmm, looking at decoding DCF77, not quite as trivial as i thought, because one of the 60 bits is missing, not sure how to detect it
2018-09-06T16:09:51 < catphish> there's probably a ton of examples out there though
2018-09-06T16:10:05 < Cracki> why is it missing
2018-09-06T16:10:32 < Cracki> you get a bit per second, a message every minute
2018-09-06T16:10:54 < Cracki> iirc one "bit" does something different to mark the start of the minute
2018-09-06T16:12:00 < catphish> Cracki: there are 59 bits (one per second), and one second without a bit
2018-09-06T16:12:25 < catphish> it's missing to mark the end of the minute / sync to the start of the next
2018-09-06T16:13:48 < catphish> but because it's missing, a pwm timer won't measure it
2018-09-06T16:15:04 < catphish> oh, i can just invert it, measure the length of the "non-signals"
2018-09-06T16:15:07 < jpa-> measure "high" pulses instead of "low" pulses, then .. yeah
2018-09-06T16:15:36 < catphish> jpa-: yeah, i just got there, measuring the lengths of the high pulses will work :)
2018-09-06T16:15:37 < catphish> thanks
2018-09-06T16:16:59 < dongs> motherfucking chinks
2018-09-06T16:17:09 -!- mirage335 [~mirage335@mirage335-base.soaringindustries.space] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-06T16:17:52 < karlp> heh, sweet, got at least one task running in rtos2.
2018-09-06T16:17:59 < karlp> other one doesn't, which is ... od.
2018-09-06T16:18:03 < catphish> dongs: has anyone ever told you some of the things you say might be considered offensive?
2018-09-06T16:18:04 < karlp> well, used one task and one timer.
2018-09-06T16:18:16 < karlp> but it means my linking and systick impl are all ok.
2018-09-06T16:21:32 < karlp> ah, can't call timerStart before kernel is running.
2018-09-06T16:21:34 < karlp> fine, whatever.
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2018-09-06T16:32:16 < karlp> https://github.com/karlp/oocd-rtos-locm3/tree/master/cmsis-rtos-rtx for anyone playing at home.
2018-09-06T16:33:21 < Thorn> will it sound weird in some way if you say "secondary coil of the transformer" instead of secondary winding?
2018-09-06T16:33:39 < dongs> i've heard primary/secondary coil
2018-09-06T16:34:00 < Thorn> but it's not as common as winding?
2018-09-06T16:34:06 < dongs> i think same and/or more common
2018-09-06T16:34:18 < dongs> google 2x moer hits for coil vs winding
2018-09-06T16:35:04 < dongs> http://physicsnet.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/transformer.jpg Laurence/b/ calls it coil
2018-09-06T16:35:27 < Thorn> google says 2x more hits for "secondary winding" as "secondary coil" specifically but okic
2018-09-06T16:35:29 < Thorn> thanks
2018-09-06T16:36:14 < dongs> hmm
2018-09-06T16:36:18 < dongs> indeed, most coil hits are from uk
2018-09-06T16:36:38 < dongs> and some from jp
2018-09-06T16:37:44 < antto> coil can be a misspelled coin
2018-09-06T16:37:55 < dongs> transformer chain
2018-09-06T16:38:04 < Sadale> chain can be a mispelled china
2018-09-06T16:38:05 < dongs> buttchain
2018-09-06T16:38:18 < dongs> let's ICO
2018-09-06T16:40:33 < zyp> fucking half done TI HAL bullshit
2018-09-06T16:40:47 < karlp> should awritten your own :)
2018-09-06T16:40:49 < Sadale> zyp, What's wrong?
2018-09-06T16:41:00 < antto> and a coin can be a crypto coin
2018-09-06T16:41:14 < antto> and THAT has to do with some kinds of chains
2018-09-06T16:41:29 < zyp> the CAN HAL is shit, missing a bunch of stuff
2018-09-06T16:42:04 < zyp> it has a function to set the ID of a mailbox, but not to set the mask
2018-09-06T16:42:52 < zyp> only way to configure mask is to set it in the GUI that generates canInit()
2018-09-06T16:43:39 < zyp> I wanna decouple this shit so that code can just allocate the mailboxes it needs during runtime 
2018-09-06T16:45:58 < dongs> maleboxes
2018-09-06T16:46:25 < zyp> but, eh, doesn't seem too hard to write my own func to conf up a mailbox properly
2018-09-06T16:47:24 < Thorn> I'm being offered this stuff (apparently) http://www.3dface.jp/product.html for $30, do I need it
2018-09-06T16:48:37 < dongs> no
2018-09-06T16:48:53 < Sadale> I can't speak Japanese.
2018-09-06T16:50:26 < dongs> i can and my answer is no
2018-09-06T16:52:22 < Thorn> okthx
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2018-09-06T17:01:58 < dongs> fuckin weebs
2018-09-06T17:07:31 < Sadale> dongs, konbanwa! :p
2018-09-06T17:07:33 -!- ski7777 [~quassel@ip5b437013.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-06T17:08:31 < dongs> oh its you
2018-09-06T17:12:39 < day> dongs ha kowaii desuneeee
2018-09-06T17:12:53 < dongs> who are all these 3-letter nick crt copycat faggots
2018-09-06T17:14:36 < Sadale> calm down :3
2018-09-06T17:15:15 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T17:15:56 < englishman> oh no
2018-09-06T17:16:07 < englishman> even ebay has a hamburger menu web69.0 bubbly round interface now
2018-09-06T17:16:08 < englishman> fuck
2018-09-06T17:16:13 < dongs> lorf
2018-09-06T17:16:26 < dongs> which one, mobile site?
2018-09-06T17:16:30 < dongs> mobile has been hamburger for a while
2018-09-06T17:16:45 -!- ski7777 [~quassel@ip5b437013.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-06T17:17:53 < englishman> some hitemp solder and smt adhesive
2018-09-06T17:17:59 < englishman> should be good to test dis reflow
2018-09-06T17:18:53 < englishman> https://www.ebay.ca/itm/gluuuuuuuuuuueglueglue/321845571034
2018-09-06T17:19:02 < dongs> nice
2018-09-06T17:19:12 < dongs> i used to have a glue head for my machine
2018-09-06T17:19:13 < Sadale> this username.
2018-09-06T17:19:18 < dongs> sent it back in exchange for some more feeders
2018-09-06T17:19:22 < englishman> good
2018-09-06T17:19:25 < englishman> noone needs that shit
2018-09-06T17:19:27 < dongs> the programming interface for dispenser was so idiotic
2018-09-06T17:19:34 < dongs> i tried to figure it out once and gave up
2018-09-06T17:19:39 < englishman> digikey has Pb93.5Sn5Ag1.5 so i dont have to go to ebay for that
2018-09-06T17:20:07 < dongs> EFFECTIVE WORK
2018-09-06T17:21:39 < dongs> http://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/data-sheets/AD7682_7689.pdf god damn nice balls on last page
2018-09-06T17:22:03 < dongs> well one before last
2018-09-06T17:22:15 < englishman> got a coldcall from a smt equipment company
2018-09-06T17:22:18 < englishman> so much cheap stuff
2018-09-06T17:22:19 < dongs> you can tell that adc is FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAST cuz the balls make an arrow pattern
2018-09-06T17:22:19 < englishman> amaze
2018-09-06T17:23:58 < dongs> fucking everything getting outsourced to chinks
2018-09-06T17:24:45 < englishman> such as
2018-09-06T17:25:03 < dongs> like everything
2018-09-06T17:25:06 < dongs> including your jobs
2018-09-06T17:25:15 < englishman> isnt that why you live in a racist/xenophobic place
2018-09-06T17:25:22 < englishman> so you can still make MADE IN JAPAN
2018-09-06T17:25:48 < dongs> less and less niggers care about that tho
2018-09-06T17:26:36 < englishman> my 2015 leaf cells arrived
2018-09-06T17:27:10 < zyp> haha, fuck this shit
2018-09-06T17:27:25 < dongs> englishman: is 2015 leaf better than < 2015 leaf?
2018-09-06T17:27:30 < dongs> i forgot when they did model change for larger cells
2018-09-06T17:27:38 < zyp> was wondering why this shit doesn't work, turns out it's not executing the code I'm working on
2018-09-06T17:27:45 < englishman> yes they are
2018-09-06T17:27:51 < englishman> they changed batt chem in 2014
2018-09-06T17:27:58 < englishman> which is why i bought a 2014+
2018-09-06T17:28:10 < englishman> they arent larger, they degrade less slowly
2018-09-06T17:28:12 < englishman> err
2018-09-06T17:28:15 < dongs> ah
2018-09-06T17:28:17 < englishman> more slowly
2018-09-06T17:28:18 < dongs> different chemisty?
2018-09-06T17:28:19 < dongs> well,
2018-09-06T17:28:25 < dongs> tehre are also more of htem per pack then
2018-09-06T17:28:29 < englishman> no
2018-09-06T17:28:30 < zyp> dongs, how do I get ozone to do a mass erase?
2018-09-06T17:28:40 < dongs> zyp, you don't. you gotta do it from jflash/keil
2018-09-06T17:28:47 < englishman> the 2011-2013 batts were dropping to 70% capacity in a year
2018-09-06T17:28:49 < zyp> meh
2018-09-06T17:28:51 < dongs> ozone doesn't do erasing of any kind :(
2018-09-06T17:29:00 < dongs> only when it needs to ovewrite shit
2018-09-06T17:29:00 < englishman> so nissan had to warranty replace thousands of them
2018-09-06T17:30:46 < dongs> protip: when you assemble them, don't short leatherman pliers across the terminals
2018-09-06T17:30:46 < englishman> what specifically made china trigger you today
2018-09-06T17:31:07 < zyp> fuck yeah, when I actually execute the code I'm working on, it works
2018-09-06T17:31:21 < dongs> ah, some bullshit i assembled with chinachips that didn't provide a footprint (and its a gay non-standard thing), that got a bunch of solder bridges on xray inspection
2018-09-06T17:31:26 < zyp> (bootloader shit, didn't realize it kept jumping out of bootloader)
2018-09-06T17:31:38 < dongs> zyp, haha.
2018-09-06T17:32:28 < dongs> getting like 100% fail rate on a bunch of shit, looked on xray they're all shorted one way or another on the chinachip
2018-09-06T17:32:55 < dongs> its 0.4mm pitch stuff, so nothing special I assemble that shit all the fucking time without problems
2018-09-06T17:33:40 < dongs> https://twitter.com/NintendoUK/status/1037596477009346561?s=19 haha
2018-09-06T17:33:44 < zyp> china builds bridges in norway too
2018-09-06T17:35:08 < dongs> i was tryting to find that pic of some china bridge? or something that was made with fake shit inside
2018-09-06T17:35:29 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/9EMCYH4.jpg
2018-09-06T17:35:30 < zyp> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A5logaland_Bridge <- I was thinking about this shit
2018-09-06T17:35:46 < zyp> wikipedia doesn't seem to mention it, but IIRC it's being built by a chinese company
2018-09-06T17:36:05 < dongs> daym,
2018-09-06T17:37:45 < zyp> yeah: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sichuan_Road_and_Bridge_Group
2018-09-06T17:38:15 < englishman> szechuan sauce and bridge co
2018-09-06T17:40:03 < dongs> Awarded in 2013 a €93 million contract to build the steelwork for the 1553 meter long Hålogaland Bridge in Norway to be completed in 2017.[3]
2018-09-06T17:40:06 < dongs> so it s not completed?
2018-09-06T17:40:15 < dongs> looks like chinks are behind scehdule
2018-09-06T17:40:17 < zyp> what is ever finished on time?
2018-09-06T17:42:40 < zyp> according to last announcement a couple of weeks ago, they're expecting to have it done by the end of the year
2018-09-06T17:49:22 < englishman> Google wants websites to adopt AMP as the default approach to building webpages.
2018-09-06T17:50:20 < dongs> google can fuck off
2018-09-06T17:50:22 < dongs> fucking amp trash
2018-09-06T17:51:15 < Cracki> amphenol
2018-09-06T17:51:22 < day> day wants websites to adopt lynx compatibility
2018-09-06T17:51:22 < Cracki> wat else
2018-09-06T17:51:29 < Cracki> meow
2018-09-06T17:52:00 < Cracki> aha! "accelerated mobile pages"
2018-09-06T17:52:36 < Cracki> https://www.ampproject.org/learn/overview/
2018-09-06T17:53:20 < day> while talking mobile internet. is reddit purposely slowing down their mobilewebsite to promote the client?
2018-09-06T17:53:25 < Cracki> it will die within 2 years
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2018-09-06T17:53:33 < day> a fuckn loading screen ona web page? wtf
2018-09-06T17:53:57 < day> apple master race!
2018-09-06T17:55:07 < Cracki> wikipedia: >[...] is an open-source website publishing technology designed to improve the performance of web content AND ADVERTISEMENTS.
2018-09-06T17:55:09 < Sadale> I like the old reddit more.
2018-09-06T17:55:30 < Cracki> google is evil
2018-09-06T17:55:52 < day> Cracki: im loving adnauseam. blocking ads was nice, but creating monetary damage is awesome
2018-09-06T17:56:01 < Cracki> ;)
2018-09-06T17:56:36 < Cracki> I'd be ok with ads that don't waste my time
2018-09-06T17:57:02 < Cracki> but a lot of what they use is making mobile websites absolutely unusable
2018-09-06T17:57:32 < Cracki> popovers, pop-ins with animations (insert themselves between paragraphs!)
2018-09-06T17:57:32 < Rickta59> weather.com is completely unusable because of ads
2018-09-06T17:58:07 < Cracki> they must think it's effective... it just makes me close the fucking tab and never visit that site again
2018-09-06T17:58:49 < Rickta59> i find the noaa website most useful this time of year
2018-09-06T17:59:19 < Rickta59> all i'm watching is the hurricanes 
2018-09-06T17:59:44 < day> Cracki: google has an forecast on google.com that uses weather. "city + weather". The code actually has the next 14days :P
2018-09-06T17:59:46 < Rickta59> they all seem to aim at me :(
2018-09-06T17:59:51 < day> but they only show 5 or so
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2018-09-06T18:30:44 < friendofafriend> That's not Google's weather forecast, that's Google's weather schedule.
2018-09-06T18:31:43 < karlp> what the hell is with chibi's versioning? they have 3.x, 16.x 17.x and 18.x all with recent updates
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2018-09-06T19:13:43 < Steffanx> http://www.chibios.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=chibios:articles:update_chibios
2018-09-06T19:13:57 < Steffanx> Not that it makes it more clear
2018-09-06T19:14:35 < karlp> it was the _fastest_ to get a build workig on my board.
2018-09-06T19:14:43 < karlp> but it looks to eb the worst and using anywhere else.
2018-09-06T19:18:32 < jpa-> what do you mean by the second line?
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2018-09-06T19:37:25 < englishman> damn my boards look way better already
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2018-09-06T19:54:23 < karlp> It lookd very tedious to run outside it's own tree, and I remember how awkward it was to try and use chibios without chibihal last time so I didn't even try
2018-09-06T19:54:34 < karlp> whoel project started tot est openocd's rtos support anyway :)
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2018-09-06T20:04:45 < Steffanx> after the using the pro-tools aka pico logger englishman ?
2018-09-06T20:04:52 < englishman> oui oui
2018-09-06T20:05:23 < Steffanx> ah très bien
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2018-09-06T20:08:57 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/RD7CUXr.jpg
2018-09-06T20:09:15 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/LovButy.jpg
2018-09-06T20:10:00 < Steffanx> lovbuty.
2018-09-06T20:11:03 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-06T20:11:32 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/hXNJn6S.jpg
2018-09-06T20:11:45 < englishman> indoody
2018-09-06T20:12:03 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/DBwgXaS.jpg
2018-09-06T20:12:16 < Cracki> cute
2018-09-06T20:12:25 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/P7ykOZ4.jpg
2018-09-06T20:15:16 < Steffanx> awh
2018-09-06T20:15:51 < Steffanx> PCB manufacturer does have to find the center of the vias a bit more englishman
2018-09-06T20:16:14 < dongs> thats actually pretty good
2018-09-06T20:16:19 < englishman> it is well within spec
2018-09-06T20:16:26 < dongs> chinashit is 10x worse
2018-09-06T20:16:29 < Steffanx> But not perfect :P
2018-09-06T20:16:32 < englishman> oshpark is 50x worse
2018-09-06T20:16:44 < dongs> oshitpark is still in business?
2018-09-06T20:16:56 < englishman> why would he not be
2018-09-06T20:16:57 < dongs> fucking make:rs keeping it alive
2018-09-06T20:17:00 < englishman> he has zero overhead
2018-09-06T20:17:15 < englishman> with $0 in sales there is still no reason to stop
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2018-09-06T20:20:30 < dongs> ChibiOS has been developed for more than 10 years now and is a set of well balanced tools, adopting it as a whole can really make your life easier. Of course is also possible to just take bits and pieces, for example just the RT RTOS, and integrate it in your project to replace another RTOS, in this case you would not benefit from the rest of the ecosystem and you will need to take care of all integration 
2018-09-06T20:20:36 < dongs> details.
2018-09-06T20:20:53 < dongs> karlp: does running just rtos part of chibidongs require more than jsut adding a cople c/h files into your project?
2018-09-06T20:20:57 < dongs> the fuck is this "tree" shit
2018-09-06T20:21:03 < karlp> no idea,
2018-09-06T20:21:14 < dongs> well didnt you say you set this up recently
2018-09-06T20:21:19 < dongs> or did you use chibihal shit too
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2018-09-06T20:21:30 < karlp> they in theory have the OS portion (both RT and NIL) separately from the hal, but it certainly seems less easy to rip out that freertos/cmsis-rtx
2018-09-06T20:21:36 < karlp> rtx had a nice user api.
2018-09-06T20:21:56 < karlp> lookag looking at mucous3 now. used mucous2 in uni briefly.
2018-09-06T20:22:03 < karlp> we'll see how awesome dollarware is.
2018-09-06T20:22:13 < dongs> heh my pal signed up and got approved for make:r version
2018-09-06T20:22:55 < dongs> https://github.com/coocox/CoOS i used this too, but looks like it hasnt ben updated since 2014
2018-09-06T20:22:59 < dongs> not that its a bad thing, if it works it works
2018-09-06T20:23:07 < dongs> i donno if the version there has FP context saving on m4 tho
2018-09-06T20:23:19 < Steffanx> good old coocox. Haven heard that that in while.
2018-09-06T20:23:29 < Steffanx> only one using it was dongs probably :P
2018-09-06T20:23:33 < dongs> :p
2018-09-06T20:23:41 < dongs> thats another one where you just copy c/h to your project and done
2018-09-06T20:23:44 < dongs> no faggot shit needed
2018-09-06T20:23:46 < dongs> also; builds with keil
2018-09-06T20:24:23 < dongs> ah it does have fp save stuff.
2018-09-06T20:24:31 < dongs> so i geuss there's no reason to fuck with it cuz it just works.
2018-09-06T20:26:06 < dongs> hm their timer implementation is using a sorted list
2018-09-06T20:26:16 < dongs> my non-rtos timer shit I just loop entire thing
2018-09-06T20:27:13 < karlp> heh, I already don't want to use mucous
2018-09-06T20:27:19 < karlp> docs ar enice.
2018-09-06T20:27:43 < karlp> but fuck all these casts: https://doc.micrium.com/display/osiiidoc/Single+Task+Application
2018-09-06T20:28:26 < dongs> lolwut
2018-09-06T20:28:27 < dongs> wtf
2018-09-06T20:28:51 < dongs> uh...
2018-09-06T20:29:06 < dongs> AppTaskStartStk is CPU_STK          AppTaskStartStk[APP_TASK_START_STK_SIZE]
2018-09-06T20:29:21 < dongs> (CPU_STK    *)&AppTaskStartStk[0]
2018-09-06T20:29:23 < dongs> why the fuck would it cast it?
2018-09-06T20:29:26 < dongs> its already that type
2018-09-06T20:29:35 < dongs> just sounds like they're doing it for no rason
2018-09-06T20:29:44 < dongs> or some bullshit misra-c or wahtever faggotry reason
2018-09-06T20:30:15 < dongs> i think they just casted the shit for readability
2018-09-06T20:30:18 < karlp> yeah, it has a pile of medical and misra shit certs
2018-09-06T20:30:49 < karlp> rtx was full of special comments to turn off misra-c warnings :)
2018-09-06T20:31:49 < dongs> OS_ERR  err; 
2018-09-06T20:31:50 < dongs> (OS_ERR   *)&err);
2018-09-06T20:31:51 < karlp> "yeah, we read your docs, and we idsagree, so we granted ourselves exceptions: https://github.com/ARM-software/CMSIS_5/commit/bb78a8aa71384f2c7d909570d88d3cce3467ffe1#diff-d3ed9e54ec38a97258b88fb1bb695b4aR47
2018-09-06T20:33:27 < dongs> heh
2018-09-06T20:34:48 < Steffanx> Im still glad i never had to do misra-c
2018-09-06T20:38:53 < karlp> man, username and password for downloading the source don't work for downloading the examples.
2018-09-06T20:38:56 < karlp> wth micrium
2018-09-06T20:39:07 < dongs> do you need to request another one to get samples?
2018-09-06T20:39:36 < karlp> no idea.
2018-09-06T20:40:01 < karlp> yeah, no user registerd with that name.
2018-09-06T20:40:02 < karlp> nice one.
2018-09-06T20:40:04 < dongs> rip
2018-09-06T20:40:07 < dongs> no samples 4 u
2018-09-06T20:40:11 < dongs> just use that retardedly casted example
2018-09-06T20:40:54 < karlp> ah no, examples require registration via a free site login
2018-09-06T20:41:05 < karlp> for some reason not shared with the other one
2018-09-06T20:42:25 < Steffanx> so wtf is this mucuos you are referring to all the time karlp? 
2018-09-06T20:45:21 < karlp> µC/OS II and µC/OS III
2018-09-06T20:45:30 < Steffanx> oooh
2018-09-06T20:53:02 < Cracki> thanks for reminding me, I still have sample ICs I need to make breakout boards for
2018-09-06T20:58:52 < englishman> dongs got any pix of those leaf batts assembled
2018-09-06T20:59:00 < englishman> how did you connect them together and to the frame etc
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2018-09-06T22:50:55 < englishman> zyp found the perfect project for your new home (just make sure you have fire insurance) https://github.com/stuartpittaway/diyBMS
2018-09-06T22:51:25 < englishman> There are better more capable CPUs than the 8-bit Arduino however they lack user friendliness and the community to support and nuture the development of code
2018-09-06T22:51:33 < englishman> implying ##stm32 is unfriendly.
2018-09-06T22:51:35 < zyp> haha
2018-09-06T22:51:35 < englishman> faggot
2018-09-06T22:51:48 < Steffanx> ATTINY85V \o/
2018-09-06T22:52:37 < Steffanx> Is there a need to "imply" ##stm32 is unfriendly, englishman ?
2018-09-06T22:53:06 < Steffanx> ask crt, he knows
2018-09-06T22:59:35 < Cracki> where
2018-09-06T23:00:09 < Steffanx> In the aussie petshop
2018-09-06T23:03:54 < Thorn> you're measuring frequency f of a signal (square wave) sampled with frequency f_s. what is the error?
2018-09-06T23:04:29 < Thorn> for example f = 8 MHz, f_s = 24 MHz
2018-09-06T23:05:26 < zyp> depends how you are measuring
2018-09-06T23:06:18 < zyp> as long as you're sampling fast enough that you're not getting aliasing, all you have to do is count pulses over a period and divide by time
2018-09-06T23:06:27 < zyp> the longer the period is, the more accuracy you get
2018-09-06T23:07:00 < Thorn> so you have to count transitions basically?
2018-09-06T23:08:00 < zyp> well, yeah, you can't really time edges
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2018-09-06T23:14:06 < zyp> period is three samples long, so each pulse will be 1.5 samples long
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2018-09-06T23:31:25 < zyp> no, he's being very unfriendly today
2018-09-06T23:31:29 < Cracki> define "measuring"
2018-09-06T23:31:33 < Cracki> binary/logic signal?
2018-09-06T23:31:36 < Cracki> over what period?
2018-09-06T23:31:41 < Cracki> analog signal?
2018-09-06T23:31:47 < Cracki> adc bits?
2018-09-06T23:32:30 < Steffanx> Im never unfriendly.
2018-09-06T23:32:35 < Steffanx> bzzz Cracki
2018-09-06T23:32:36 < Steffanx> *crt
2018-09-06T23:32:37 < Steffanx> sorry!
2018-09-06T23:32:40 < Cracki> bzzz yourself
2018-09-06T23:32:48  * Cracki gets the cattle prod
2018-09-06T23:32:53 < zyp> yeah, sorry, I lied
2018-09-06T23:33:11 < zyp> I had a kanjers tonight
2018-09-06T23:33:16 < Steffanx> hah
2018-09-06T23:33:31 < Steffanx> You must have a sugur overdose then
2018-09-06T23:33:42 < zyp> nah, I'm spreading them out
2018-09-06T23:33:51 < zyp> I'm still not finished with the first pack
2018-09-06T23:34:07 < Steffanx> mrs zyp didnt eat them either?
2018-09-06T23:34:18 < zyp> not all of them
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2018-09-06T23:50:27 < Thorn> Cracki: the signal is digital
2018-09-06T23:51:20 < Cracki> what question do you really want to answer with this?
2018-09-06T23:51:54 < qyx> whats a kanjer
2018-09-06T23:52:51 < qyx> I though it is a stroopwafel
2018-09-06T23:53:00 < qyx> but google disagrees
--- Day changed Fri Sep 07 2018
2018-09-07T00:00:43 < Steffanx> ^
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2018-09-07T00:02:42 < Thorn> Cracki: some ardweeno programmer decided to measure maximum gpio switching frequency of his ardweeno. he doesn't have a scope or anything except a China saleae clone. "to measure correctly I need to set the sampling freq of the analyzer to 16MHz, same as the ardweeno clock frequency"
2018-09-07T00:02:52 < Cracki> lol
2018-09-07T00:03:00 < Thorn> the question is (1) how mad is he and (2) what would be the right way to do it
2018-09-07T00:03:30 < Cracki> timer with output generation, I'm sure you can switch every cycle
2018-09-07T00:04:05 < Cracki> atmegas are only up to 20 MHz or so (unless overclocked) and their outputs drive enough current
2018-09-07T00:04:20 < mawk> what would two big complementary power transistors for in a rectifier circuit
2018-09-07T00:04:31 < Cracki> well... matching could make sense, but not much
2018-09-07T00:04:35 < mawk> the PNP has a copper heatsink, but the NPN is just screwed to the case
2018-09-07T00:05:34 < Thorn> since he does while(1) { whateverWrite(1); whateverWrite(0); } I expect the duty cycle to be < 50% (loop test / jump only happens after write(0))
2018-09-07T00:05:50 < Cracki> the effect of matching sampling freq to atmega clock would be _no_ aliasing ideally, but you'll still see artefacts because the clocks are prolly off by a little
2018-09-07T00:05:52 < Cracki> also phase
2018-09-07T00:06:08 < Cracki> just sampling as fast as possible would give you more data, but the aliasing is obvious
2018-09-07T00:06:30 < Thorn> the phase is of course completely random
2018-09-07T00:06:34 < Cracki> if he does that, and it's arduino code, he'll get shit performance
2018-09-07T00:06:50 < Cracki> atmegas have a "clock out" fuse bit
2018-09-07T00:07:20 < Cracki> then you could trigger on that... but not sure if a saleae clone can use both edges of a clock signal
2018-09-07T00:07:36 < Cracki> the idea would be that the LA actually uses the clock signal to drive its sampling, not just trigger on it
2018-09-07T00:08:11 < Cracki> still, he won't get anything near 8-10 MHz (half of clock) with arduino's digitalWrite()
2018-09-07T00:08:45 < Cracki> that procedure does a ton of convenience shit such as turning off timer pwm generation on the pin in question
2018-09-07T00:09:46 < Cracki> if he samples long enough, say even just a fraction of a second, 16 or 24 MHz sampling makes little difference
2018-09-07T00:11:17 < Cracki> error of measured frequency would be proportional to interval between samplings, inversely proportional to number of "rotations" sampled
2018-09-07T00:12:36 < Cracki> so at 24MHz he'd be 50% better than at 16 MHz, but if you sample 10000 toggles, you're measuring clock differences
2018-09-07T00:13:07 < Cracki> he should look at the assembly generated
2018-09-07T00:14:03 < Cracki> arduino has a "systick" made from one of the atmega's timers. that will crap on your main loop... so the whole approach is rubbish (unless he clear the global interrupt enable bit using cli(); )
2018-09-07T00:14:32 < englishman> wont max switching freq of tarduino be far far far slower than 16MHz
2018-09-07T00:14:43 < Cracki> no
2018-09-07T00:14:53 < englishman> first, the max possible gpio freq would be 8MHz
2018-09-07T00:14:59 < englishman> then tehre is all the tarduino shit
2018-09-07T00:15:02 < Cracki> right
2018-09-07T00:15:18 < Cracki> but if you disable all the tarduino, you can toggle on every clock, i.e. 8 MHz
2018-09-07T00:15:22 < Cracki> and the output will look good.
2018-09-07T00:15:26 < Cracki> (if you scoped that)
2018-09-07T00:16:36 < Cracki> might overshoot or not, but you'll see decent edges
2018-09-07T00:16:40 < englishman> It takes around 2 microseconds for digitalWrite to change the state of a pin. 
2018-09-07T00:16:41 < englishman> lol
2018-09-07T00:16:49 < Cracki> that's ~32 instructions
2018-09-07T00:16:53 < Cracki> sounds about right :P
2018-09-07T00:17:04 < englishman> Thorn: just tell him to press play at 16MHz
2018-09-07T00:17:39 < Cracki> random google result: https://garretlab.web.fc2.com/en/arduino/inside/arduino/wiring_digital.c/digitalWrite.html
2018-09-07T00:18:35 < Cracki> it's user friendly. people using arduino who want to do better, often use registers directly
2018-09-07T00:21:07 < Cracki> https://github.com/arduino/ArduinoCore-avr/blob/master/cores/arduino/wiring_digital.c
2018-09-07T00:22:17 < Cracki> avrgcc has atomic blocks (macro wrappery that caches cpu status register, clears interrupts, reenables them)
2018-09-07T00:22:50 < Cracki> so their explicit SREG stuff is a _bit_ untidy
2018-09-07T00:25:15 < Thorn> englishman: https://www.instagram.com/p/BnTn_gYnnRA/
2018-09-07T00:25:28 < englishman> haha
2018-09-07T00:25:29 < englishman> ty
2018-09-07T00:26:43 < kakimir> is this my fetish?
2018-09-07T00:27:44 < Cracki> nuknuknuk
2018-09-07T00:28:21 < Steffanx> Your fetish is bad music, kakimir ;)
2018-09-07T00:28:51 < kakimir> is any of my musics good?
2018-09-07T00:29:19 < Steffanx> Sure 
2018-09-07T00:31:09 < kakimir> have you ever had those days that are so busy and packed you are totally beaten when you get home at 00:00?
2018-09-07T00:31:20 < kakimir> is this life?
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2018-09-07T00:32:10 < friendofafriend> is this just fantasy?
2018-09-07T00:33:49 < Steffanx> CRT Just killed a man
2018-09-07T00:34:19 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-45e1e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-07T00:36:46 < kakimir> spend 911eur today
2018-09-07T00:36:58 -!- sterna1 [~Adium@c-45e1e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-07T00:37:55 < kakimir> crazy
2018-09-07T00:38:09 < kakimir> and it wasn't one expensive thing
2018-09-07T00:39:23 < Thorn> moneyed westerners
2018-09-07T00:39:56 < kakimir> had to call to bank at 700eurs point because my card was not accepted anymore
2018-09-07T00:40:24 < kakimir> after we were done they wanted to give me credit/debit card
2018-09-07T00:40:30 < Steffanx> Whats did you buy me kakimir?
2018-09-07T00:40:40 < Steffanx> Thorn has no money?
2018-09-07T00:41:21 < kakimir> car parts, tools, yearly inspection, an engine - 550eur, fuel, light bulbs
2018-09-07T00:41:34 < englishman> using the vodka economic index, he makes more than almost anyone here
2018-09-07T00:42:13 < kakimir> my account balance was at 3eurs after day was complete
2018-09-07T00:42:18 -!- Kerr-A [~Kerr-A@2605:e000:1b05:c485:0:fb6f:14e9:ca8d] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-07T00:42:23 < kakimir> and got everything I needed
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2018-09-07T00:42:31 < Steffanx> An engine?!
2018-09-07T00:42:42 < englishman> i put my car on my creditcard
2018-09-07T00:42:49 < englishman> to get some promotional 3% cash back on purchases
2018-09-07T00:43:06 < kakimir> Steffanx: yes from some shady scrap metal seller
2018-09-07T00:43:20 < kakimir> needed to drive 150km in direction
2018-09-07T00:43:43 < Steffanx> Building a new car or did you destroy your engine?
2018-09-07T00:43:58 < kakimir> car is not fine but engine is not for car
2018-09-07T00:44:46 < Steffanx> Hm
2018-09-07T00:44:54 < kakimir> yamaha genesis 120, 3cyl, 1000cc
2018-09-07T00:46:12 < kakimir> tommorow I need to get transfer permit to move my car to repair place and then need to repair it and drive to inspection place for reinspection
2018-09-07T00:46:18 < Steffanx> Going for a motor cycle?
2018-09-07T00:50:26 < zyp> kakimir, so my summer car is actually right on point
2018-09-07T00:55:18 < kakimir> Steffanx: sled
2018-09-07T00:57:41 < Steffanx> Version 2.0 of that ice sled you showed last year?
2018-09-07T00:57:54 < Steffanx> Is it getting icey in finland already?
2018-09-07T00:58:16 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WBnRG6h-mef-rl8t7_MQK8Ot7s99toF_/view?usp=sharing
2018-09-07T00:59:12 < kakimir> fingers crossed it's the same engine
2018-09-07T00:59:36 < kakimir> and if it's one year off make year that they have not changed anything what is inside the block
2018-09-07T01:01:37 < kakimir> if I'm lucky it's actually running engine
2018-09-07T01:04:02 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-07T01:04:06 < kakimir> old tractor
2018-09-07T01:04:09 < kakimir> snowtractor
2018-09-07T01:13:41 < kakimir> trading is what pays
2018-09-07T01:37:13 < Thorn> can I trade a 470µF cap for 4700 100nF caps
2018-09-07T01:53:27 < kakimir> I have 2n2222
2018-09-07T01:53:31 < kakimir> in tin cans
2018-09-07T01:53:41 < kakimir> canned or whatever it's called
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2018-09-07T02:03:21 < karlp> to3?
2018-09-07T02:03:29 < karlp> jumbtron?
2018-09-07T02:05:22 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-07T02:05:27 < kakimir> to3 I think
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2018-09-07T02:05:53 < kakimir> I mean I have like 1kg of those
2018-09-07T02:06:08 < kakimir> only those 2n2222
2018-09-07T02:06:19 < karlp> is there some convetion for .s and .S?
2018-09-07T02:06:31 < karlp> is one of them fed to preprocessor and one isn't or something?
2018-09-07T02:09:34 < Thorn> yes, .S is preprocessed assembly
2018-09-07T02:09:48 < Thorn> in *nix land
2018-09-07T02:23:35 < karlp> anyone seen these stm32wb yet?
2018-09-07T02:23:41 < karlp> not the old w1, new part.
2018-09-07T02:23:43 < karlp> or newish
2018-09-07T02:23:52 < karlp> https://www.st.com/resource/en/product_presentation/stm32wb_press-pres.pdf
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2018-09-07T02:54:07 < branjb> is there a more efficient way for setting up all the clocks than to just go line by line in the RM? (that doesn't involve HAL)
2018-09-07T02:57:39 < Thorn> make cube use LL instead for HAL
2018-09-07T02:57:47 < branjb> no LL for f4
2018-09-07T02:57:48 < Thorn> LL clock setup code is rather readable
2018-09-07T02:57:58 < Thorn> wat
2018-09-07T02:58:03 < branjb> HAL clock setup is the worst horseshit of macros i've ever seen
2018-09-07T02:58:34 < branjb> i don't see a LL option for f4, am i missing it?
2018-09-07T02:58:40 < Thorn> I'm definitely using LL with f401
2018-09-07T02:59:00 < branjb> oh guess my cube might be outdated
2018-09-07T02:59:01 < branjb> updating it
2018-09-07T03:00:02 < Thorn> make sure to update actual code libraries too, they fix bugs in them
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2018-09-07T03:18:56 < branjb> i clicked LL for RCC but it seems to still be all the HAL shit in SystemClock_Config()
2018-09-07T03:19:42 < mawk> is using LL for other stuff than RCC a good idea ?
2018-09-07T03:28:15 < rcc> you're triggering me
2018-09-07T03:31:37 < karlp> you have a poor nick choice for teh subject material if that bothers you
2018-09-07T03:32:10 < karlp> man, porting mucous to not use hal is gross.
2018-09-07T03:33:31 < rcc> I like being triggered, that's why I watch so much youtube
2018-09-07T03:36:11 < branjb> the LL rcc stuff is better than HAL but still horrendous
2018-09-07T03:39:38 < branjb> an inline function that calls a macro to set a register.. why not just set the register?
2018-09-07T03:40:05 < karlp> not enough jobs created that way
2018-09-07T03:44:01 < dongs> englishman: since i had original leaf fullpack, i reused most of those parts
2018-09-07T03:44:05 < dongs> i.e. metal jumpers
2018-09-07T03:44:10 < dongs> from pack to pack
2018-09-07T03:44:14 < dongs> and orange plastic standoffs or whaetver
2018-09-07T03:44:21 < dongs> and balance leads
2018-09-07T03:44:33 < dongs> lemme see if shit is in my imgur somwehre
2018-09-07T03:45:32 < dongs> englishman: https://i.imgur.com/n18RoDP.jpg
2018-09-07T03:46:09 < dongs> oh and looks like it is 16s
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2018-09-07T03:46:34 < rcc> is that a battery pack?
2018-09-07T03:47:01 < englishman> oh neato thanks
2018-09-07T03:47:09 < englishman> then just strapped the shit into the frame?
2018-09-07T03:47:14 < englishman> rcc: yes nissan leaf cells
2018-09-07T03:47:24 < rcc> ah, got it
2018-09-07T03:47:30 < rcc> didn't know dongs had one too
2018-09-07T03:47:41 < englishman> i got some today https://i.imgur.com/9EMCYH4.jpg
2018-09-07T03:47:45 < englishman> he doesnt, just the batts
2018-09-07T03:48:07 < rcc> that's strange, but I'm not gonna comment
2018-09-07T03:48:11 < rcc> starting another fire maybe?
2018-09-07T03:48:22 < englishman> >internal combustion automobile
2018-09-07T03:48:28 < englishman> what century is it
2018-09-07T03:48:51 < Thorn> >Viewing Direction	No
2018-09-07T03:49:02 < englishman> no these will replace the lead-acid batts in my atv
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2018-09-07T03:53:25 < karlp> heh, sweet. mucous3 with libopencm3 instead of sthal
2018-09-07T03:53:51 < karlp> I wonder how shareable this is then, as it's a modified demo from their website, not even any of the code I got from them.
2018-09-07T03:59:28 < dongs> englishman: yes basically, with a strap wrench
2018-09-07T03:59:50 < dongs> well, kinda, not sure the right name. its belt with a lock thing
2018-09-07T03:59:56 < dongs> that you click to tighten
2018-09-07T04:00:29 < dongs> ttps://i.imgur.com/XtUqwvM.jpg it fit nicely into empty space for SLAs
2018-09-07T04:00:33 < englishman> does the frame not dig into them too much or did you put a little platform or something
2018-09-07T04:00:42 < dongs> i put them on a foam pad later
2018-09-07T04:00:52 < dongs> that was when i stuck it there to size up
2018-09-07T04:01:15 < englishman> cool doesn't look too hard
2018-09-07T04:01:16 < dongs> oh and i think that was when i had 7 cells
2018-09-07T04:01:19 < dongs> and found out it was shit
2018-09-07T04:01:25 < dongs> then took it bnack out and made it 8s
2018-09-07T04:01:35 < dongs> unless the pics are different order in imgur
2018-09-07T04:01:50 < dongs> but yeah they fit super nice
2018-09-07T04:02:23 < englishman> my BMS and shit should be here next week but it will be a winter project as it gets used every day
2018-09-07T04:03:06 < dongs> gonna reorder stencil to fix these 100% failure shits, maybe gonna try and narrow the stencil opening
2018-09-07T04:04:28 < dongs> anyway 2015 ceels look different based on the pics
2018-09-07T04:04:39 < dongs> oh hm or not so
2018-09-07T04:04:46 < dongs> i thought the screws in teh back were in corners too
2018-09-07T04:04:51 < dongs> but they're not
2018-09-07T04:06:01 < dongs> to tie them together i used Tee-nuts with the edgy bits flattened and long bolt to stick them together
2018-09-07T04:06:25 < dongs> tho i guess in 1st world country you can just buy them in flat version
2018-09-07T04:07:18 < dongs> https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51yprd3YthL.jpg i used this shit but looks like https://images.lowes.ca/img/p400/13173/008236709308_ca.jpg exists
2018-09-07T04:07:19 < englishman> idk what that is il just use redi-rod and washers
2018-09-07T04:07:25 < dongs> na thats gay
2018-09-07T04:07:31 < dongs> tee nut makes it nice and flat on both ends
2018-09-07T04:07:36 < englishman> ah
2018-09-07T04:07:39 < dongs> and nut doesnt stick out
2018-09-07T04:07:43 < englishman> flange nut
2018-09-07T04:07:59 < dongs> nope
2018-09-07T04:08:04 < englishman> the spiky ones?
2018-09-07T04:08:11 < englishman> speed nuts
2018-09-07T04:08:11 < dongs> both are teenuts
2018-09-07T04:08:21 < dongs> flange is the stuff that has a washer-like thing
2018-09-07T04:08:35 < dongs> tee goes into hole and leaves nothing on outside just a circle
2018-09-07T04:09:28 < englishman> I don't think I'm that autistic
2018-09-07T04:09:35 < englishman> but I'll see
2018-09-07T04:09:44 < englishman> maybe I am
2018-09-07T04:10:46 < englishman> blind nuts
2018-09-07T04:10:54 < englishman> I think that's what they are called
2018-09-07T04:11:20 < dongs> ya, that brings up similar shit.
2018-09-07T04:11:25 < dongs> pretty sure official name is Tee tho
2018-09-07T04:11:36 < englishman> they can pierce into the battery ok
2018-09-07T04:11:51 < dongs> thats why i said I bent the spikey shit
2018-09-07T04:11:55 < englishman> o
2018-09-07T04:11:58 < englishman> k
2018-09-07T04:12:08 < dongs> < dongs> to tie them together i used Tee-nuts with the edgy bits flattened and long bolt to stick them together
2018-09-07T04:12:21 < englishman> yeah good idea
2018-09-07T04:13:05 < dongs> blind nut looks kinda cool, but sounds like you'll need to cut the long bolt to size + compressed size before you finish tightening it
2018-09-07T04:13:51 < dongs> hm wtf ebay
2018-09-07T04:13:56 < dongs> its showing some mobile-looking site on desktop
2018-09-07T04:13:58 < dongs> for some items
2018-09-07T04:14:02 < dongs> with huge retarded buttons
2018-09-07T04:14:24 < dongs> is that the impending hamburger menu
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2018-09-07T04:20:26 < englishman> yes
2018-09-07T04:20:38 < englishman> i saw it this morning
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2018-09-07T05:22:46 < cjbaird> Ha, my old stm6502 project got mentioned in https://satoshinm.github.io/blog/180113_stm32_6502_pill_6502_8_bit_6502_cpu_and_6850_acia_emulation_on_the_stm32_blue_pill_to_run_microsoft_basic_from_1977.html ... The millenial Couldn't Into Makefiles and went with something else though. :/
2018-09-07T05:23:24 < Thorn> so I select f429 in qfp176, enable ltdc, sdram and ethernet and all the pins are evenly spread across the package :/ every peripheral has pins on all 4 sides
2018-09-07T05:23:34 < Thorn> has anyone used RA8875?
2018-09-07T05:26:51 < dongs> i tried to
2018-09-07T05:26:59 < dongs> then i found out there was no non-retarded way to blit a fucking bitmap into it
2018-09-07T05:27:04 < dongs> and trashed the board
2018-09-07T05:27:13 < dongs> the only way to draw a bitmap on it is either
2018-09-07T05:27:18 < dongs> 1) have it in external spi flash
2018-09-07T05:27:23 < dongs> 2) putpixel
2018-09-07T05:27:27 < dongs> (fuck either way
2018-09-07T05:28:52 < Thorn> a command per pixel? 
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2018-09-07T05:29:02 < dongs> yes
2018-09-07T05:29:14 < dongs> the bitmap in spi flash thing uses some internal shit to read it
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2018-09-07T07:37:09 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/c/powerfuljre/live
2018-09-07T07:37:14 < englishman> elon musk live
2018-09-07T07:40:00 < dongs> what is he digging
2018-09-07T07:40:13 < englishman> his own grave
2018-09-07T07:40:17 < dongs> lol
2018-09-07T07:42:04 < branjb> project compiled on windows, i2c works flawlessly.  compile same project on lunix, same compiler, same makefile, i2c locks up after ~20 transactions
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2018-09-07T07:52:34 < dongs> digidongs.com
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2018-09-07T07:54:43 < englishman> the only digikey package to arrive in australia this year
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2018-09-07T08:40:15 < cjbaird> Haha. A local ham tried flushing an ground wire down the toilet to see how it worked for his apartment. Not too bad. After the Morning Net though he realised it was the driven wire in the pipe. Dun dun duunnnn.
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2018-09-07T08:45:34 < cjbaird> I already have a boyfriend.
2018-09-07T08:50:26 < branjb> whatever happened to that lelani person
2018-09-07T08:53:16 < cjbaird> flyback is another MIA
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2018-09-07T09:38:49 < cjbaird> I've now got my landlord scared of the magloop. 
2018-09-07T09:40:03 < cjbaird> 3 of the 4 trannies I've known IRL have necked themselves. Reaching 40 and growing a middle-aged male body I suspect did it.
2018-09-07T09:43:25 < dongs> haha fucking stoners
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2018-09-07T10:04:25 < jadew> cjbaird, why do you know so many trannies?
2018-09-07T10:04:52 < dongs> haha the twitter question
2018-09-07T10:06:38 < jpa-> is there any nice visualizer for arm disassembly? for some optimization i'd like to easily see the loops etc. in compiler generated code
2018-09-07T10:06:56 < jadew> like in IDA?
2018-09-07T10:08:09 < jpa-> maybe, but i'm too cheap for IDA :P
2018-09-07T10:08:50 < jadew> they should have a free version
2018-09-07T10:08:55 < dongs> they do
2018-09-07T10:08:56 < jadew> not sure if it does ARM tho
2018-09-07T10:09:50 < cjbaird> jadew: Anime Club.
2018-09-07T10:10:06 < jadew> that explains it
2018-09-07T10:10:13 < dongs> jadew: https://binary.ninja/
2018-09-07T10:10:14 < dongs> err
2018-09-07T10:10:19 < dongs> jpa-: https://binary.ninja/
2018-09-07T10:10:44 < jadew> dongs, from the domain name, I thought it's related to the tranny discussion
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2018-09-07T10:11:23 < cjbaird> We need them back to help write a Code of Conduct for the channel
2018-09-07T10:11:29 < dongs> haha
2018-09-07T10:11:33 < dongs> which channel, this one?
2018-09-07T10:11:52 < cjbaird> I wondered why there isn't already a link to the CoC in the topic
2018-09-07T10:15:17 < dongs> be a cock
2018-09-07T10:15:26 < jadew> "Suicide attempts among trans men (46%) and trans women (42%)"
2018-09-07T10:15:37 < dongs> nice
2018-09-07T10:15:44 < jadew> "Cross-dressers assigned male at birth have the lowest reported prevalence of suicide attempts among gender  dentity groups (21%)"
2018-09-07T10:16:23 < jadew> that's some pretty grimm statistics
2018-09-07T10:16:43 < jadew> I'd say it's proof that it's not something to be encouraged
2018-09-07T10:17:28 < jadew> http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/AFSP-Williams-Suicide-Report-Final.pdf
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2018-09-07T10:18:54 < cjbaird> Got a mate who's a cross-dresser (..former coworker) He had to burn his Facebook account (which he had a bit of photograph business on) when the Burgers started bagging him with "Cross-dressing isn't a real Thing. You're /really/ a Tranny..."
2018-09-07T10:19:14 < jadew> "Prevalence of suicide attempts is elevated among those who disclose to everyone that they are transgender or  ender-non-conforming (50%) and among those that report others can tell always (42%) or most of the time (45%)  that they are transgender or gender non-conforming even if they don’t tell them."
2018-09-07T10:22:18 < cjbaird> A funny thing is he doesn't think I know. He's cool not being a drama queen over it.
2018-09-07T10:22:48 < jadew> he thinks you think he's a woman?
2018-09-07T10:25:01 < jadew> Chris Hyde, the director of ARIF, explained, "A large number of people who have [sex change] surgery remain traumatized – often to the point of committing suicide."
2018-09-07T10:25:21 < jadew> big surprise, having your dick cut off is stuff of nightmare
2018-09-07T10:25:45 < jadew> I bet most of them regret it in day 1
2018-09-07T10:27:50 < jadew> there's a site dedicated to it: http://www.sexchangeregret.com/
2018-09-07T10:27:52 < cjbaird> That's another American Cancer-- doing surgery.
2018-09-07T10:33:56 < cjbaird> Worthless American Meme #3: Tequila. Bigger waste of money than Gin.
2018-09-07T11:29:18 < zyp> TI HAL's canGetData() is also pretty useless
2018-09-07T11:29:37 < zyp> it gives you a bunch of bytes but doesn't tell you how many
2018-09-07T11:45:06 < dongs> HAL sounds liek amazing solution for *
2018-09-07T11:47:38 < zyp> yeah, this is crap
2018-09-07T11:47:52 < zyp> entire CAN controller seems a bit overengineered too
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2018-09-07T12:00:11 < dongs> https://www.southbendtribune.com/news/publicsafety/family-reveals-crash-video-details-south-bend-cop-ran-red/article_a1ebea41-070b-5179-8bd6-66f504da673c.html RIP ohsix
2018-09-07T12:01:55 < zyp> heh
2018-09-07T12:01:56 < zyp> "We recognize you are attempting to access this website from a country belonging to the European Economic Area (EEA) including the EU which enforces the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) and therefore access cannot be granted at this time. For any issues, contact webmaster@sbtinfo.com or call 574-235-6161."
2018-09-07T12:02:02 < zyp> wonderful
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2018-09-07T12:05:14 < Thorn> you need a North Korean proxy
2018-09-07T12:05:34 < day> i wonder when they realize that EEA people behind a proxy still have the same rights :^)
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2018-09-07T12:56:34 < dongs> of course its from thesun
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2018-09-07T13:16:12 < invzim> https://github.com/compuphase/minIni
2018-09-07T13:16:21 < invzim> anyone know of anything better than this?
2018-09-07T13:17:36 < jpa-> https://github.com/benhoyt/inih   i use this also
2018-09-07T13:17:51 < jpa-> minIni is simple and easy, but a bit slow and not very flexible
2018-09-07T13:18:55 < invzim> jpa-: but it doesn't do writing, right?
2018-09-07T13:19:45 < jpa-> no, inih is more like deserialize whole file and if you want to re-serialize it's up to you, and then you lose comments
2018-09-07T13:20:19  * karlp ahtes libs that throw away comments like that :|
2018-09-07T13:22:12 < zyp> don't blame the lib, blame the purpose
2018-09-07T13:22:32 < zyp> rewriting handwritten files is inherently stupid
2018-09-07T13:23:16 < zyp> with obvious exceptions for stuff like code linters, just in case anybody wants to get pedantic
2018-09-07T13:28:44 < karlp> I've started just making comments be legimate fields, that are simply unused
2018-09-07T13:28:49 < karlp> at least for json sample files :)
2018-09-07T13:36:51 < dongs> invzim: my HAL-loving pal used mininit.
2018-09-07T13:36:55 < dongs> recommends.
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2018-09-07T13:44:45 < zyp> karlp, in json you have other annoyances too
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2018-09-07T13:45:12 < zyp> like, the order of the keys in an object isn't necessarily static if you take a file, parse it and then regenerate it
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2018-09-07T14:52:40 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/rp1MjCf.jpg
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2018-09-07T15:44:59 < mawk> I burnt my finger with the soldering iron
2018-09-07T15:45:25 < mawk> right at the tip
2018-09-07T15:45:31 < mawk> I can't type on the keyboard with it anymore
2018-09-07T15:45:33 < Steffanx> Awh
2018-09-07T15:45:51 < Steffanx> RIP
2018-09-07T15:46:00 < mawk> somebody said I should piss on it, but I doubt the efficacy of that
2018-09-07T15:46:27 < Steffanx> Lolwut
2018-09-07T15:46:34 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-07T15:46:51 < mawk> his grandma used to say that when you burn yourself with the exhaust pipe of your motorcycle, you should pee on your hand
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2018-09-07T15:51:53 < cjbaird> Urea does have some cred for repairing damaged skin (old sailors trick). Although never heard about doing burns with it.
2018-09-07T15:52:19 < cjbaird> "Heel Balm" is magic. 
2018-09-07T15:53:35 < mawk> I've heard the pee thing for jellyfish stings
2018-09-07T15:53:43 < mawk> deactivating poison something something
2018-09-07T15:54:40 < cjbaird> vinegar is done here in killer-animal Australia
2018-09-07T15:55:25 < mawk> vomiting on the area would work then
2018-09-07T15:56:27 < cjbaird> A lot of Queensland beaches have the free 2 litre bottles of white vinegar thing happening.
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2018-09-07T16:12:04 < englishman> chrome stopped showing thumbnails on the new tab page
2018-09-07T16:12:07 < englishman> more whitespace
2018-09-07T16:12:09 < englishman> thx google
2018-09-07T16:13:49 < zyp> stopped as a bug or as a feature?
2018-09-07T16:14:06 < zyp> I installed an extension here to get rid of them
2018-09-07T16:14:50 < englishman> they weren't annoying and got clicked from time to time
2018-09-07T16:14:58 < englishman> now they are gone and replaced with whitespace
2018-09-07T16:17:02 < zyp> I found them annoying
2018-09-07T16:18:47 < zyp> distracting, mostly
2018-09-07T16:19:36 < zyp> the last few entries were changing often and tended to pick up some random shit I looked at last week or whenever
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2018-09-07T16:24:44 < jpa-> englishman: for me chrome does that after restart sometimes, then they reappear after some time
2018-09-07T16:25:36 < englishman> nice, so it could be a normal cockup
2018-09-07T16:25:42 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JivACPT4tcg how lithium batteries are made
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2018-09-07T16:37:32 < karlp> zyp: I don't care abotu that though, but comments 8and commented out alternatives, being removed is annoying.
2018-09-07T16:41:03 < dongs> more git faggotry.
2018-09-07T16:41:10 < dongs> i edited a file on one machine
2018-09-07T16:41:18 < dongs> i want to restore it from repository
2018-09-07T16:41:22 < dongs> git diff shows i made changes
2018-09-07T16:41:28 < dongs> git pull doesnt fucking do anything
2018-09-07T16:41:31 < dongs> just says its up to date
2018-09-07T16:41:33 < dongs>  waht the ngiger fuck
2018-09-07T16:41:39 < dongs> what kind of FAGGOT wrote this shitware
2018-09-07T16:41:40 < zyp> it's the wrong fucking command
2018-09-07T16:41:44 < dongs> ????????????
2018-09-07T16:42:01 < zyp> git pull syncs local history with remote history
2018-09-07T16:42:12 < zyp> you want git checkout
2018-09-07T16:42:27 < zyp> git checkout cock.c
2018-09-07T16:42:37 < zyp> will throw away changes in cock.c
2018-09-07T16:43:27 < zyp> if you're using some sort of gui browser, you can probably right click on the file in the change view and choose discard
2018-09-07T16:43:34 < zyp> at least that's what sourcetree calls it here
2018-09-07T16:44:25 < dongs> yeah sadly this trash is remote
2018-09-07T16:46:21 < PaulFertser> dongs: "git reset --hard" will restore all the changed files.
2018-09-07T16:47:08 < PaulFertser> (so beware, it's not just one file but everything you see in "git diff" will be discarded) 
2018-09-07T16:49:29 < vampi-the-frog> check out that cock.c
2018-09-07T16:49:47 < Thorn> when talking about git, "restore" often means "trash all your work"
2018-09-07T16:50:07 < vampi-the-frog> when working with git, make many backups
2018-09-07T16:50:16 < dongs> when talking about git, typing "git" usually means trashing all your work
2018-09-07T16:50:49 < englishman> why are you using a commandline
2018-09-07T16:50:55 < englishman> is someone making you use lunix
2018-09-07T16:51:15 < Thorn> GUIs are for those who can't read or write
2018-09-07T16:52:08 < Thorn> there were experiments where they taught monkeys to use a GUI
2018-09-07T16:54:29 < englishman> the humane society prevented them from teaching lunix
2018-09-07T16:54:42 < Thorn> attn englishman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__pleJcpHvg
2018-09-07T16:57:19 < dongs> englishman: https://i.imgur.com/rp1MjCf.jpg not sure if seen
2018-09-07T16:57:50 < englishman> so far thorn winning for best link of the day
2018-09-07T16:58:00 < englishman> and dongs firmly in last place with that awful content
2018-09-07T16:58:06 < dongs> https://money.cnn.com/2018/09/07/technology/elon-musk-joe-rogan/index.html context
2018-09-07T16:58:11 < dongs> sorry
2018-09-07T16:58:19 < englishman> i linked it live here last nite
2018-09-07T16:58:23 < dongs> lol okay
2018-09-07T16:58:24 < dongs> right
2018-09-07T16:58:28 < englishman> had to turn it off due to autism
2018-09-07T16:58:29 < dongs> but you didnt stay up to watch him get stoned
2018-09-07T16:59:50 < englishman> right i was busy being productive
2018-09-07T17:00:06 < dongs> bbut
2018-09-07T17:00:07 < dongs> thats what musk is
2018-09-07T17:00:13 < dongs> he likes being RPODUCTIVE
2018-09-07T17:00:23 < dongs> er PRODUCTIVE too.
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2018-09-07T17:32:11 < Thorn> stm32f750 supports can fd
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2018-09-07T17:32:21 < Thorn> *h750
2018-09-07T17:44:16 < karlp> dongs: is this awesome and all your chinapals are uysing it? https://www.rt-thread.org/
2018-09-07T17:47:24 < dongs> It starts up at power-on, starts at millisecond level, and 
2018-09-07T17:47:24 < dongs> really waits for booting.
2018-09-07T17:47:29 < dongs> karlp: never fucking heard of it
2018-09-07T17:47:35 < dongs> waiting for your shithub test proj
2018-09-07T17:48:40 < dongs> lol uses kconfig what
2018-09-07T17:48:55 < dongs> and scons
2018-09-07T17:48:57 < dongs> yea nothanks
2018-09-07T17:49:05 < dongs> cancer, in chinese
2018-09-07T17:50:55 < dongs> https://github.com/RT-Thread/rt-thread/blob/master/components/drivers/hwtimer/hwtimer.c
2018-09-07T17:50:58 < dongs> uhhh
2018-09-07T17:51:00 < dongs> in MY hardwaretimer?
2018-09-07T17:51:03 < dongs> floats???
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2018-09-07T18:29:31 < PaulFertser> How is performance for floats compared to int32_t on Cortex-M4F?
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2018-09-07T18:34:54 < dongs> i dont know, but that shit claims to work on F0
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2018-09-07T18:36:42 < Sadale> I guess it's wise to avoid float. :P
2018-09-07T18:36:50 < Sadale> But your mcu supports floating point operation. So I don't know :3
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2018-09-07T18:44:43 < vampi-the-frog> just write a test and see, sheesh
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2018-09-07T18:55:08 < Steffanx> Hi vampi-the-frog how are you today?
2018-09-07T19:02:41 < vampi-the-frog> I am working on another USB audio project
2018-09-07T19:03:00 < vampi-the-frog> I'm modding my line 6 pod pro so I can record the guitar input ADC and the output DAC too
2018-09-07T19:03:29 < vampi-the-frog> so it shows up as two audio recording sources
2018-09-07T19:04:40 < mawk> I have one zener and a bunch of transistor, and I want to make a symetric reference voltage
2018-09-07T19:04:43 < mawk> how do I sort this puzzle out
2018-09-07T19:04:56 < mawk> Vzener on one side, -Vzener on the other
2018-09-07T19:05:22 < vampi-the-frog> how about you Steffanx 
2018-09-07T19:13:53 < Cracki> PaulFertser, there was a table of cycle times somewhere in the stm32 docuemntation
2018-09-07T19:14:41 < Cracki> use floats if you need floats. even softfloats are better than the headache.
2018-09-07T19:16:15 < vampi-the-frog> has anyone used the DSP instructions?
2018-09-07T19:16:15 < Cracki> oy vey floats in a timer function... unnecessary
2018-09-07T19:18:33 < jpa-> http://infocenter.arm.com/help/index.jsp?topic=/com.arm.doc.ddi0439b/CHDDIGAC.html   here's the table
2018-09-07T19:18:47 < jpa-> vampi-the-frog: sure
2018-09-07T19:19:03 < vampi-the-frog> were they useful to you jpa- ?
2018-09-07T19:19:16 < jpa-> yes
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2018-09-07T19:19:43 < vampi-the-frog> what was the project?
2018-09-07T19:19:58 < jpa-> some image processing in work stuff
2018-09-07T19:20:26 < vampi-the-frog> interesting
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2018-09-07T19:21:37 < BrainDamage> mawk: I'm a bit rusty, but https://awwapp.com/b/uxgyiqbi6/
2018-09-07T19:22:20 < BrainDamage> actually, sec, I've misread you, I need to tweak it slightly
2018-09-07T19:23:06 < jpa-> vampi-the-frog: http://paste.dy.fi/Zoz
2018-09-07T19:23:40 < jpa-> (to compute sum-of-squared-differences)
2018-09-07T19:23:54 < vampi-the-frog> cool
2018-09-07T19:24:03 < vampi-the-frog> do you know if there's an instruction that flips bits to bytes?
2018-09-07T19:24:14 < jpa-> what does that mean?
2018-09-07T19:24:15 < vampi-the-frog> like I have 8 bytes and I want bit 0 of each byte to become a new byte
2018-09-07T19:24:21 < vampi-the-frog> and bit 1 of each byte to become the next byte
2018-09-07T19:24:33 < vampi-the-frog> so put the 8 bytes on top of each other and you get an 8x8 bit table
2018-09-07T19:24:37 < vampi-the-frog> and just flip it diagonally
2018-09-07T19:24:41 < Cracki> that operation is called transpose
2018-09-07T19:24:44 < vampi-the-frog> ok
2018-09-07T19:24:49 < vampi-the-frog> is there an instruction for transpose?
2018-09-07T19:24:56 < jpa-> not directly
2018-09-07T19:26:05 < BrainDamage> mawk: fixed
2018-09-07T19:27:19 < vampi-the-frog> I am capturing 33 bytes that have bit 0 and bit 1 of serial data
2018-09-07T19:27:28 < vampi-the-frog> oh wait it's 128 bytes
2018-09-07T19:27:33 < vampi-the-frog> but I'm doing it 33 times
2018-09-07T19:27:51 < BrainDamage> mawk: if you need to draw significant current from the output, you'll need to buffer the resistors
2018-09-07T19:27:56 < vampi-the-frog> so the first 24 bytes of the 128 bytes contain data in bit 0 and bit 1, and I need to extract those as two 24-bit values
2018-09-07T19:28:06 < vampi-the-frog> I am currently doing it with a loop and it's fine
2018-09-07T19:28:52 < jpa-> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/2243985/bitwise-transpose-of-8-bytes
2018-09-07T19:29:18 < jpa-> ah, you only need the bottom two bits?
2018-09-07T19:29:41 < jpa-> yeah, loop is probably close to optimal
2018-09-07T19:29:52 < jpa-> at most you can get 4x parallelism there by tricks
2018-09-07T19:36:04 < mawk> I see BrainDamage 
2018-09-07T19:36:10 < mawk> thanks
2018-09-07T19:36:12 < vampi-the-frog> hm ok
2018-09-07T19:36:14 < mawk> pieces of the construction have a special name ?
2018-09-07T19:36:26 < mawk> like the top thing looking like a mirror of some sort
2018-09-07T19:38:45 < BrainDamage> the name is a current mirror
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2018-09-07T19:39:06 < BrainDamage> you could even do away with the zener, and use a transistor's Vbe as reference
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2018-09-07T19:39:26 < BrainDamage> it's not as precise wrt thermal stability, but for 90% of the things, it doesn't matter
2018-09-07T19:42:20 < c10ud^> alright, those chinese giving themselves a western name should really stop, here's what I just got: "
2018-09-07T19:42:20 < c10ud^> Because of some pesonal reason,I have left <company-name> team And Swallow will following up your job in the future."
2018-09-07T19:45:44 < Cracki> http://infocenter.arm.com/help/index.jsp?topic=/com.arm.doc.dui0489i/CIHDIAGH.html
2018-09-07T19:45:57 < Cracki> in case anyone wants to shuffle some bits
2018-09-07T19:46:39 < BrainDamage> mawk: oh, and if you buffer the output, then the "power waste" requirement goes down to 1/100th, but you'll also need 2 more transistors
2018-09-07T19:49:37 < BrainDamage> mawk: why the single zener requirement, out of curiosity?
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2018-09-07T19:59:01 < mawk> BrainDamage I'm trying to build a symmetrical power supply from parts I got from a symmetrical power supply
2018-09-07T19:59:12 < mawk> dating from 1990 or something
2018-09-07T20:00:10 < mawk> now I've got unregulated ±15V, and was trying to do a series regulator from an emitter follower and a zener reference tension
2018-09-07T20:00:19 < mawk> but there's only one zener on the circuit
2018-09-07T20:05:31 < mawk> no ICs, no oscillator, just that diode and a bunch of bipolar transistors
2018-09-07T20:05:42 < BrainDamage> mawk: I've added another circuit which only uses 2 NPN, but it's much less precise
2018-09-07T20:05:47 < mawk> and two big complementary power transistors
2018-09-07T20:06:15 < BrainDamage> it's a negative feedback loop unbuffered current source
2018-09-07T20:06:59 < BrainDamage> if your load is symmetrical, it should work equally well
2018-09-07T20:11:28 < mawk> I take this circuit wouldn't perform well under temperature unless the transistors are on the same silicon right ?
2018-09-07T20:12:57 < mawk> in either case the cost of not using a second matched zener isn't justified
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2018-09-07T20:13:20 < mawk> so I must find how they derived their reference tension in the module
2018-09-07T20:13:31 < BrainDamage> neither does, however, the first only differential heating matters, so if your transistors go mismatched in temp then the output differs
2018-09-07T20:14:13 < BrainDamage> the second has the same problem, and at the same time, the absolute temp will affect the output voltage
2018-09-07T20:14:33 < BrainDamage> as well as it's less robust vs output current drain
2018-09-07T20:14:55 < BrainDamage> consider that I tried to be skimpy and use less transistors possible
2018-09-07T20:15:05 < BrainDamage> you can make both way more robust if you add feedback
2018-09-07T20:15:10 < BrainDamage> then temperature won't matter
2018-09-07T20:15:19 < BrainDamage> but it also means more components
2018-09-07T20:16:30 < mawk> yeah
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2018-09-07T20:25:03 < mawk> my first idea was to use a differential pair, almost like in an opamp
2018-09-07T20:25:19 < mawk> but if the transistors aren't on the same silicon I doubt it will work much
2018-09-07T20:25:32 < BrainDamage> it's not *that* critical
2018-09-07T20:25:54 < BrainDamage> discrete differential pairs have been used since always, same applies to current mirrors
2018-09-07T20:26:10 < BrainDamage> you just have to add degeneration resistors to make it less dependent on the thermal voltage
2018-09-07T20:30:58 < mawk> I see
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2018-09-07T21:00:44 < englishman> new musics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxU3bC40vn4
2018-09-07T21:23:00 < Steffanx> Group Therapy heh
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2018-09-07T22:12:22 < Steffanx> englishman, cant you tell the guy to stop talking. The music isnt too bad, but the talking is annoying. Fuck shout outs.
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2018-09-07T22:30:17 < englishman> karlp: you mentioned that all mqtt brokers always have client functionality, but i have yet to find one that does, do you have any examples?
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2018-09-07T22:40:55 < qyx> englishman: do you need the client? for embedded stuff?
2018-09-07T22:41:07 < englishman> ttn is a broker
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2018-09-07T22:45:00 < englishman> maybe i should use loraserver isntead
2018-09-07T22:49:42 < Steffanx> what kind of client functionality does the englishman  need?
2018-09-07T22:50:51 < englishman> connect, subscribe, publish
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2018-09-07T22:54:21 < Steffanx> oh i guess i dont understand what you want then :P
2018-09-07T22:56:51 < englishman> i clearly dont understand something as well
2018-09-07T22:59:28 < Steffanx> just have tnn push the data to you using the rest api and forget about mqtt? :P
2018-09-07T23:00:03 < englishman> where is this rest api
2018-09-07T23:00:13 < Steffanx> i mean the http post function
2018-09-07T23:00:14 < Steffanx> not rest api
2018-09-07T23:00:17 < englishman> right.
2018-09-07T23:00:28 < Steffanx> sorry!
2018-09-07T23:00:50 < englishman> i was doing that, but it is too basic to use with google app engine
2018-09-07T23:01:30 < englishman> i have no idea why ttn wants to be a mqtt broker
2018-09-07T23:01:34 < englishman> it seems so backwards
2018-09-07T23:04:30 < englishman> https://console.cloud.google.com/marketplace/details/occam-public/occamsmart-network-server-stack-for-lorawan
2018-09-07T23:05:23 < Steffanx> $25.35/month  uh
2018-09-07T23:05:37 < englishman> it also acts as a broker in the end, there is clearly something i don't get
2018-09-07T23:06:36 < Steffanx> Your tools cant be a client?
2018-09-07T23:06:46 < englishman> none of the online tools can
2018-09-07T23:07:00 < englishman> thingspeak, app engine, that other one that qyx mentioned
2018-09-07T23:12:53 < qyx> because they are not meant to be clients apparently
2018-09-07T23:13:03 < englishman> right
2018-09-07T23:13:10 < englishman> but ttn is also not a client
2018-09-07T23:13:14 < qyx> what do you want?
2018-09-07T23:13:19 < qyx> whats a ttn
2018-09-07T23:13:21 < englishman> information out of ttn and into whatever
2018-09-07T23:13:24 < qyx> i am not into iot much
2018-09-07T23:13:26 < englishman> thethingsnetwork
2018-09-07T23:13:31 < englishman> it's a lorawan server
2018-09-07T23:13:38 < Steffanx> You dont want to use TTN anyway englishman . One of the guys behind it is an arsehole.
2018-09-07T23:13:44 < englishman> typical swiss
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2018-09-07T23:14:15 < qyx> do you want to get data from a lora node to the web?
2018-09-07T23:14:21 < englishman> yes
2018-09-07T23:14:23 < englishman> sounds simple
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2018-09-07T23:15:15 < qyx> if the lora gw is capable enough, just do http post as Steffanx says
2018-09-07T23:15:32 < englishman> thethingsnetwork can do that yes
2018-09-07T23:15:41 < englishman> will probably stick with that for now
2018-09-07T23:16:07 < englishman> https://www.resiot.io/en/features/
2018-09-07T23:16:09 < englishman> also interesting
2018-09-07T23:16:11 < qyx> probably I should look up what ttn is
2018-09-07T23:16:49 < karlp> englishman: no, I said bridging is done by being a client.
2018-09-07T23:16:58 < englishman> ah.
2018-09-07T23:17:11 < qyx> but this android gadget makes me lazy
2018-09-07T23:17:12 < Steffanx> i googled and people do seem to do some python stuff on google apps engine that acts as a mqtt subscriber/client
2018-09-07T23:17:18 < englishman> right.
2018-09-07T23:17:29 < englishman> mqttbox on desktop does that too with a couple clicks
2018-09-07T23:18:32 < Steffanx> Wonder what the advantage of the thingsnetwork is. I never tried it, but is there any advantage using it?
2018-09-07T23:18:39 < karlp> if you want to get data out of a mqtt broker that you pushed it to, you either need to subscribe again yourself, or have them bridge it to your own broker, and then subscribe there.
2018-09-07T23:18:41 < Steffanx> its just a mqtt broker and some basic http publisher?
2018-09-07T23:18:44 < englishman> it's easy to set up
2018-09-07T23:18:49 < karlp> I don't really follow what you're stuck with right now sorry
2018-09-07T23:18:58 < karlp> I'll be back in ~45 or so, kids to bed time here.
2018-09-07T23:19:01 < englishman> no prob
2018-09-07T23:20:02 < Steffanx> if you need a server to run the ttn stuff anyway, why not run something that can just as well publish it it your own broker.
2018-09-07T23:20:17 < englishman> well ttn does all the lorawan stuff
2018-09-07T23:20:33 < englishman> so it is super simple to get up and running in that regard
2018-09-07T23:20:36 < Steffanx> but does their server do that or the local app?
2018-09-07T23:20:46 < Steffanx> the gateway or wahtever you call it
2018-09-07T23:20:46 < englishman> there's a couple things going on
2018-09-07T23:21:23 < englishman> the gateway gets its config from and pushes messages to the ttn broker
2018-09-07T23:26:03 < Steffanx> hm
2018-09-07T23:27:01 < Steffanx> Cant that lorawan server you posted do that as well? 
2018-09-07T23:27:36 < englishman> yes exactly
2018-09-07T23:27:52 < englishman> and it is supposed to run fine on the big cloud providers
2018-09-07T23:27:58 < englishman> http://docs.resiot.io/Connector_MQTTClient/
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2018-09-07T23:42:20 < PaulFertser> Cracki: how about https://github.com/johnmcfarlane/cnl ?
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2018-09-07T23:57:13 < Thorn> typical German music [NSFW] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbdipkXctQA
--- Day changed Sat Sep 08 2018
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2018-09-08T00:07:37 < Cracki> interesting
2018-09-08T00:07:41 < Cracki> (both)
2018-09-08T00:09:51 < Cracki> the dude painted to look like a cultural enricher says "ach, wie gut, dass niemand weiß, dass ich Rumpelstilzchen heiß!"
2018-09-08T00:11:44 < Cracki> thanks for the cnl tip
2018-09-08T00:11:45 < Steffanx> Yay.
2018-09-08T00:13:16 < karlp> englishman: still stuck on sthi?
2018-09-08T00:16:01 < karlp> from cmsis-rtos2, it says, "Defines maximum number of user threads that can be active at the same time. Applies to user threads with system provided memory for control blocks. Default value is 1. Value range is [1-1000]."
2018-09-08T00:16:18 < karlp> is that like, concurrently _running_ ?
2018-09-08T00:16:37 < englishman> karlp: nah moved on, google app engine is far too advanced for what i want right now. telegraf appears to support a normal-ass mqtt client
2018-09-08T00:16:38 < karlp> is that like, set this equal to your core countÐ
2018-09-08T00:16:48 < karlp> g-a-e is pretty specialized
2018-09-08T00:16:54 < karlp> it's great if it does what  you want, the way you want,
2018-09-08T00:17:14 < karlp> and useless and (at least int he past) pricy if you were trying to force it to your will
2018-09-08T00:17:22 < karlp> haven't even looked at it in years.
2018-09-08T00:17:29 < karlp> I thought all the cool kids were using dynamo stuff on aws now
2018-09-08T00:17:56 < Thorn> karlp: probably max # of threads that exist (have been created) at the same time
2018-09-08T00:18:19 < karlp> yeah, but that seems like a) an absurd default and b) I've had two threads, but one exited, and I didn't change any settings?
2018-09-08T00:18:27 < karlp> might have to make some more, see what happens.
2018-09-08T00:18:47 < Thorn> karlp: >max
2018-09-08T00:19:20 < Thorn> it's better to have 2 control block and 1 thread than vice versa lol
2018-09-08T00:19:34 < Thorn> *blocks
2018-09-08T00:19:42 < karlp> I don't follow
2018-09-08T00:20:24 < karlp> http://www.keil.com/pack/doc/CMSIS/RTOS2/html/config_rtx5.html
2018-09-08T00:20:36 < karlp> ther's also number of threads with user stack size?!
2018-09-08T00:23:35 < karlp> hrm, more interestingly, can I use aliases to avoid https://github.com/karlp/oocd-rtos-locm3/blob/master/cmsis-rtos-rtx/os_systick_locm3.c#L75-L77 ?
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2018-09-08T00:25:08 < karlp> rtx_os.h just defines them as extern.
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2018-09-08T00:26:14 < karlp> void sys_tick_handler(void) __attribute__ ((alias ("SysTick_Handler")));
2018-09-08T00:26:32 < karlp>  just givces me "aliased to undefined symbol "SysTick_Handler"
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2018-09-08T00:32:39 < karlp> flatten doesn't do it either
2018-09-08T00:53:56 < Cracki> i
2018-09-08T01:04:58 < karlp> hrm, certainly no problems having two running tasks, it must be something else
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2018-09-08T01:17:51 < bitmask> jesus, I'm transfering 2 3d prints to a sd card and its 900 MB
2018-09-08T01:20:08 < bitmask> what the stl? I got it on thingiverse
2018-09-08T01:20:14 < Cracki> dat poly count
2018-09-08T01:21:35 < bitmask> https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2955930
2018-09-08T01:21:55 < Cracki> so you're printing a sphere
2018-09-08T01:22:01 < bitmask> yup
2018-09-08T01:22:51 < Cracki> earth has ~10 km mountains and trenches, with a radius of 6370 km, so 0.15% surface deviation
2018-09-08T01:23:14 < bitmask> you know this isn't earth right?
2018-09-08T01:23:20 < Cracki> but I figure that moon's transparency is modulated by thickness of wall, eh?
2018-09-08T01:23:20 < bitmask> its called the moon
2018-09-08T01:23:21 < bitmask> :)
2018-09-08T01:23:35 < bitmask> yea
2018-09-08T01:23:35 < Cracki> the moon is not gonna be a mandelbulb in space
2018-09-08T01:24:12 < Cracki> I'm curious how that print will turn out
2018-09-08T01:24:26 < Cracki> put yellow lighting in it. cheesy, I know, but...
2018-09-08T01:24:41 < bitmask> me too, I'm decided on 0.12 or attempting 0.08mm layer height
2018-09-08T01:24:47 < bitmask> deciding*
2018-09-08T01:53:26 < jadew> somone in need of a girlfriend? https://www.fiverr.com/stablesales/be-your-online-girl-friend
2018-09-08T02:00:55 < catphish> she sounds nice :)
2018-09-08T02:02:18 < catphish> why is everything a rabbit hole? i started investigating more seriously some low cost gps receivers, there are so many possibilities
2018-09-08T02:09:17 < Thorn> why do you ever need MII?
2018-09-08T02:09:36 < Thorn> didn't RMII basically make it obsolete?
2018-09-08T02:09:36 < karlp> because rmii and rgmii haven't been invented yet? and it's better than AUI?
2018-09-08T02:10:16 < karlp> if you have the space, it does give you lower speed signalling rhough right? you use twice as many lines at half the speed for mii vs rmii?
2018-09-08T02:10:31 < karlp> I'm sure some people find that worthwhile for emi and immunity reasons?
2018-09-08T02:11:07 < Thorn> how come you even know about AUI lol
2018-09-08T02:11:26 < karlp> my first professional job was at cisco :)
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2018-09-08T02:15:23 < catphish> how would you connect up your ethernet without AUI?
2018-09-08T02:16:01 < englishman> MQTT Consumer, connection error - Network Error : dial tcp: lookup tcp on 1.1.1.1:53: no such host
2018-09-08T02:16:02 < englishman> wut
2018-09-08T02:16:09 < englishman> dns is working fine
2018-09-08T02:16:49 < catphish> syntax error, it's trying to look up 1.1.1.1:53 in dns?
2018-09-08T02:16:57 < catphish> or maybe its trying to look up 1.1.1.1 in dns?
2018-09-08T02:17:03 < catphish> both will fail :)
2018-09-08T02:17:14 < englishman> idk i just downloaded this lunix aids
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2018-09-08T02:17:52 < Laurenceb_> wtf I'm volcel now
2018-09-08T02:18:09  * Laurenceb_ just went out on the town
2018-09-08T02:18:12 < Laurenceb_> bad idea
2018-09-08T02:34:14 < englishman> okey mqtt is feeding crap into infuxdb
2018-09-08T02:34:25 < englishman> lorawan ftw
2018-09-08T02:38:48 < Laurenceb_> I just cut a thots hair off
2018-09-08T02:38:57 < Laurenceb_> after she vommed over me
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2018-09-08T02:45:32 < Laurenceb_> such is the lobster mating ritual
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2018-09-08T03:07:56 < kakimir> hello NIGHTCREW
2018-09-08T03:09:10 < kakimir> fixed my car in 3hours
2018-09-08T03:09:20 < kakimir> and drove to inpection at 01:30
2018-09-08T03:09:24 < kakimir> AM
2018-09-08T03:09:29 < Laurenceb_> loicense
2018-09-08T03:10:02 < kakimir> benefits of having friend to own inspection place
2018-09-08T03:14:47 < Laurenceb_> need to fix the oil leak on my car
2018-09-08T03:15:05 < kakimir> inspection when
2018-09-08T03:16:33 < kakimir> but you are Laurence "Money" B.. you could just fix issue by throwing money at it
2018-09-08T03:17:00 < kakimir> be it repairwork or new wheels
2018-09-08T03:17:45 < Laurenceb_> its worth about £50
2018-09-08T03:17:48 < Laurenceb_> the whole car
2018-09-08T03:17:52 < Laurenceb_> inspection in Jan
2018-09-08T03:17:54 < Laurenceb_> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/04/19/barber-gave-boy-humiliating-haircut-sent-jail/
2018-09-08T03:17:59 < Laurenceb_> sheet I'm in jail
2018-09-08T03:18:11 < kakimir> just drive it
2018-09-08T03:18:47 < Laurenceb_> lul moar thots got pwnd
2018-09-08T03:19:19 < Laurenceb_> https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/320/cpsprodpb/A369/production/_103333814_cutter_jones.jpg
2018-09-08T03:19:27 < Laurenceb_> left b& me from 8chan
2018-09-08T03:19:33 < kakimir> plan for you Laurenceb_: do no repairwork
2018-09-08T03:20:33 < kakimir> 50 britcoin car is not worth any effort
2018-09-08T03:21:27 < Laurenceb_> ikr
2018-09-08T03:21:38 < kakimir> inspection costs more than your car
2018-09-08T03:21:38 < Laurenceb_> but I'm too lazy to get new
2018-09-08T03:21:47 < Laurenceb_> also it has towbar and roof rack
2018-09-08T03:22:27 < kakimir> britland has cars
2018-09-08T03:22:36 < kakimir> to buy with any accesories you wish
2018-09-08T03:23:03 < Laurenceb_> it has about ukp300 of accessories
2018-09-08T03:23:42 < kakimir> you bought them?
2018-09-08T03:24:35 < Laurenceb_> yes
2018-09-08T03:24:54 < Laurenceb_> guess I could ebay them
2018-09-08T03:26:26 < kakimir> https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0927/1436/products/DSC_0802.jpg?v=1515092684 waa
2018-09-08T03:26:49 < kakimir> does this car have like spare engine on that tail rack
2018-09-08T03:27:14 < Laurenceb_> yay I'm unb& on 8chan
2018-09-08T03:27:27 < kakimir> ?
2018-09-08T03:27:32 < Laurenceb_> new mod after the previous one got sent to jail
2018-09-08T03:27:51 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-08T03:28:10 < kakimir> for what?
2018-09-08T03:28:19 < Laurenceb_> tbh she deserved it, nasty youtube comments troll who tried to get ppl banned
2018-09-08T03:28:22 < Laurenceb_> terrorism
2018-09-08T03:28:52 < Laurenceb_> she was supposedly gunna blow up some muslims or something...
2018-09-08T03:29:37 < Laurenceb_> https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/320/cpsprodpb/A369/production/_103333814_cutter_jones.jpg
2018-09-08T03:29:41 < Laurenceb_> her on the left
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2018-09-08T03:29:55 < englishman> what kind of car do you have kaki
2018-09-08T03:30:05 < kakimir> still that a4
2018-09-08T03:30:10 < Laurenceb_> wew nice car
2018-09-08T03:30:14 < kakimir> 2001
2018-09-08T03:30:18  * Laurenceb_ has shitty 1994 car
2018-09-08T03:30:21 < kakimir> AVB engine
2018-09-08T03:30:25 < englishman> nice
2018-09-08T03:30:35 < kakimir> that means the slowest 1.9TDI
2018-09-08T03:30:47 < Laurenceb_> heh same on my shitcar
2018-09-08T03:31:00 < kakimir> 84kw or was it even 84horsepowers!
2018-09-08T03:31:07 < kakimir> can't remember
2018-09-08T03:31:22 < Laurenceb_> sounds about right
2018-09-08T03:31:30 < Laurenceb_>  84hp i'd guess
2018-09-08T03:32:26 < kakimir> Pumpe Düse
2018-09-08T03:32:31 < Laurenceb_> lol /cow/ has found her lewds
2018-09-08T03:32:47 < Laurenceb_> she posted her vagoo on /b/
2018-09-08T03:32:49 < Laurenceb_> nasty
2018-09-08T03:33:24 < Laurenceb_> ywlts incels fapping to female Brevik
2018-09-08T03:33:32 < kakimir> did you?
2018-09-08T03:34:07 < Laurenceb_> no I'm volcel
2018-09-08T03:34:21 < kakimir> speak simplified english
2018-09-08T03:34:42 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-08T03:34:59 < Laurenceb_> wew /cow/ found her webshite https://hyperboreanart.bigcartel.com/
2018-09-08T03:37:10 < Laurenceb_> the amazing atheist has a lot to answer for
2018-09-08T03:37:37 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Audi-VW-Skoda-1-9TDi-Turbo-Diesel-Engine-Code-AVB-/252785946961 I see my car engine costs peanuts
2018-09-08T03:38:12 < Laurenceb_> and I'm guessing it doesnt spew oil everywhere
2018-09-08T03:38:22 < kakimir> it eats it
2018-09-08T03:38:30 < kakimir> it eats it's own oil
2018-09-08T03:38:50 < kakimir> also it eats it's own shit like my friend says
2018-09-08T03:39:04 < kakimir> EGR
2018-09-08T03:40:45 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: get A4 B6
2018-09-08T03:41:07 < Laurenceb_> what mpg does it get
2018-09-08T03:41:16 < Laurenceb_> or litres/km whatever
2018-09-08T03:42:04 < kakimir> untuned 1.9TDI is like 4.5litres/100km
2018-09-08T03:42:16 < kakimir> ecotuned is like.. maybe under 4
2018-09-08T03:46:52 < kakimir> I did calculations and it's actually like 5.5l/100km
2018-09-08T03:47:20 < kakimir> and if you drive only highway it's 4.5l/100km
2018-09-08T03:48:32 < kakimir> rust starts eating <2010 VAGs
2018-09-08T03:49:57 < kakimir> in monday I need to go get driver side front panel changed
2018-09-08T03:53:07 < kakimir> Laurenceb_: why brits use miles?
2018-09-08T03:54:41 < Laurenceb_> cuz they are americans in disguise
2018-09-08T03:55:14 < Laurenceb_> wow better mpg than my shitbox
2018-09-08T03:55:33 < Laurenceb_> opel corsa is about 4.3l/100km on highway
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2018-09-08T04:01:11 < kakimir> I once went under 4litres
2018-09-08T04:01:22 < kakimir> hypermiling or whatever it's called
2018-09-08T04:02:46 < kakimir> https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201808269867289?model=A4&transmission=Manual&quantity-of-doors=4&colour=Blue&maximum-badge-engine-size=2.0&advertising-location=at_cars&radius=1500&price-to=5000&maximum-mileage=125000&fuel-type=Diesel&make=AUDI&body-type=Saloon&sort=sponsored&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&postcode=m24wu&year-from=2001&page=1 literally my car
2018-09-08T04:03:33 < kakimir> it's even pissing fuel like mine but apparently at far faster rate judged by size of the pool
2018-09-08T04:08:18 < kakimir> btw. it really sucks to install electrical harness for towbar - basically remove interior to run the wires
2018-09-08T04:09:22 < kakimir> including backseats, one front seat and trunk interior
2018-09-08T04:10:02 < englishman> now how do i get a nice frontend for this influxdb
2018-09-08T04:11:06 < englishman> i guess this is where grafana comes in
2018-09-08T04:14:20 < Laurenceb_> kakimir: yeah I need towbar to move shit
2018-09-08T04:14:26 < Laurenceb_> englishman: lul influxdb
2018-09-08T04:14:36 < Laurenceb_> my influxdb died, its fucking dead
2018-09-08T04:14:47 < Laurenceb_> after about 10^11 datapoints
2018-09-08T04:15:03 < englishman> thats not a lot
2018-09-08T04:15:06 < englishman> how small is your hd
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2018-09-08T04:19:58 < Laurenceb_> 10TB
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2018-09-08T04:21:10 < Laurenceb_> I took one look at grafana and realised it was created by autists who dont know how the real work works
2018-09-08T04:21:21 < Laurenceb_> as if the name wasnt enough of a clue
2018-09-08T04:21:38 < Laurenceb_> like what if I want to process the data
2018-09-08T04:22:20 < Laurenceb_> >all the chicoms will get whats coming to them one day
2018-09-08T04:22:24 < Laurenceb_> t alex jones
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2018-09-08T04:23:32 < englishman> yeah ihave not seen a lot of data processing in all these softwarez
2018-09-08T04:23:36 < englishman> only data storage and viewing
2018-09-08T04:23:42 < englishman> thinkspeak was interesting for that
2018-09-08T04:24:40 < Laurenceb_> or just use a proper programming language
2018-09-08T04:25:20 < Laurenceb_> or methlab if you want lame hacks
2018-09-08T04:25:49 < Laurenceb_> or labview if you want to get (((hacked)))
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2018-09-08T04:26:41 < englishman> google compute engine was also interesting for that
2018-09-08T04:26:51 < branjb> what is this cancer with companies rolling a shitty version of eclipse and selling it for $1k+
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2018-09-08T04:43:57 < branjb> matlab?
2018-09-08T04:44:16 < branjb> or mplab
2018-09-08T04:45:01 < karlp> mplabx is netbeans rebadged at least, not eclipse
2018-09-08T04:45:11 < karlp> no idea about original mplab, thought that was custom
2018-09-08T04:45:29 < karlp> companies have been selling eclipse plugins for decades
2018-09-08T04:46:11 < branjb> xilinx SDSoC is a $1k eclipse IDE
2018-09-08T04:46:27 < branjb> eclipse is such a cancer IDE
2018-09-08T04:53:11 < branjb> lol looking at some chinaboards and they all list memory in gigabit instead of mb
2018-09-08T04:53:17 < branjb> 4 GIGABIT
2018-09-08T04:53:44 < branjb> (256M * 16)
2018-09-08T04:56:44 < branjb> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Xilinx-FPGA-Development-Board-ZYNQ-XC7Z015-Embed-Arm-Coretex-A9-PCIE-HDMI-AX7015/253562886409?epid=3018098938&hash=item3b09869909:g:X-UAAOSwuehbRu5u not a terrible price if it actually works
2018-09-08T04:57:09 < branjb> supposedly comes with working OS drivers and PCIe AXI IP core
2018-09-08T04:58:44 < branjb> 0 reviews anywhere on the web
2018-09-08T04:58:49 < branjb> prob is DOA
2018-09-08T05:11:36 < branjb> oh it's a scam
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2018-09-08T06:53:38 < dongs> We want a language that’s open source, with a liberal license. We want the speed of C with the dynamism of Ruby. We want a language that’s homoiconic, with true macros like Lisp, but with obvious, familiar mathematical notation like Matlab. We want something as usable for general programming as Python, as easy for statistics as R, as natural for string processing as Perl, as powerful for linear algebra 
2018-09-08T06:53:44 < dongs> as Matlab, as good at gluing programs together as the shell. Something that is dirt simple to learn, yet keeps the most serious hackers happy. We want it interactive and we want it compiled.
2018-09-08T07:39:57 < jpa-> is it php?
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2018-09-08T08:05:02 < emeb_mac> lol @ language wants - no one can do all that.
2018-09-08T08:05:24 < emeb_mac> except maybe assembly. :P
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2018-09-08T08:11:39 < emeb_mac> see dongs quotes back ~1hr
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2018-09-08T08:19:39 < englishman> can't get otaa to work
2018-09-08T08:19:47 < englishman> abp working fine
2018-09-08T08:19:59 < englishman> no some lorawan shit
2018-09-08T08:20:16 < englishman> it pairs and gateway passes packets but application fails
2018-09-08T08:20:22 < englishman> betting it's the swiss
2018-09-08T08:20:44 < englishman> zero way to debug
2018-09-08T08:26:53 < englishman> just needs a little fix
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2018-09-08T10:10:30 < Steffanx> Hello welcome stvn
2018-09-08T10:12:59 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-08T10:14:10 < Steffanx> Good morning superbia 
2018-09-08T10:17:31 < Steffanx> Hows waking up in the mountains?
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2018-09-08T10:28:24 < Steffanx> My day hasnt really started yet
2018-09-08T10:29:16 < Steffanx> Lol
2018-09-08T10:29:21 < Steffanx> Philips.
2018-09-08T10:29:54 < Steffanx> Work for me
2018-09-08T10:31:23 < Steffanx> Woeks*
2018-09-08T10:31:30 < Steffanx> Damnit
2018-09-08T10:31:33 < Steffanx> Works*
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2018-09-08T10:59:46 < dongs> molecular autism
2018-09-08T11:33:25 < Steffanx> Atomic
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2018-09-08T15:36:24 < dongs> Musk's SpaceX provides services for the Air Force, with multiple high-value contracts. Marijuana use is prohibited for someone with a government security clearance, Fox Business reported, and is the central issue in the Air Force's inquiry.
2018-09-08T15:36:28 < dongs> lmaooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
2018-09-08T15:36:29 < dongs> RIP spacex
2018-09-08T15:37:30 < tomeaton17> it was just one hit
2018-09-08T15:37:43 < dongs> doesnt matter
2018-09-08T15:37:46 < dongs> stoner is stoner
2018-09-08T15:38:04 < tomeaton17> nothing will happen
2018-09-08T15:38:10 < tomeaton17> he has lost the plot anywayu
2018-09-08T15:38:42 < dongs> In particular, sources told the publication that Musk's use of sleeping aid Ambien may be having a negative effect, causing him to ramble on Twitter.
2018-09-08T15:39:33 < tomeaton17> https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/730627568756383746?lang=en
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2018-09-08T15:47:38 < karlp> you all give him wayyyy too much attention.
2018-09-08T15:58:17 < antto> they wanna b rich like him, so they watch his every step
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2018-09-08T16:42:38 < bitmask> where can you download free music for videos? I will probably be putting it on youtube which is why legality matters
2018-09-08T16:44:52 < tomeaton17> bitmask, https://incompetech.com/ is good
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2018-09-08T16:45:16 < Steffanx> bitmask use the youtube music?
2018-09-08T16:45:37 < Steffanx> And i believe the Two Steps From Hell music is free-ish for that purpose as well.
2018-09-08T16:45:38 < Steffanx> at least it was
2018-09-08T16:45:42 < Steffanx> creative commons blabla
2018-09-08T16:45:52 < Steffanx> The website no longer seems to mention it
2018-09-08T16:46:05 < bitmask> I tried youtube's and it wasnt easy finding the category I was lookin for but i'll have to look again
2018-09-08T16:47:28 < Steffanx> Time to get some fruityloops skills? :D
2018-09-08T16:48:51 < PaulFertser> bitmask: you can also consider buying on Jamendo
2018-09-08T16:52:22 < bitmask> not worth it for this hah
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2018-09-08T17:01:31 < vampi-the-frog> I can show you reaper, Steffanx 
2018-09-08T17:06:22 < jadew> https://www.bento.de/images/00000000-0003-0004-0000-000001261856_w910_r1.5166666666666666_fpx50_fpy50.jpg
2018-09-08T17:13:39 < Sadale> ... What's that.
2018-09-08T17:13:52 < Sadale> What sort of art it is O_o
2018-09-08T17:14:07 < Sadale> and what idea does it convey?
2018-09-08T17:18:18 < vampi-the-frog> woof
2018-09-08T17:18:43 < Steffanx> oh idk that vampi-the-frog
2018-09-08T17:18:57 < vampi-the-frog> that statue is only attractive to sailors who have been at sea for months
2018-09-08T17:19:17 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-08T17:19:36 < Sadale> I have a feeling that this statue has some meaning in behind.
2018-09-08T17:19:56 < vampi-the-frog> well there's a lot of behind
2018-09-08T17:20:19 < Steffanx> do you often have feelings Sadale ?
2018-09-08T17:20:31 < Steffanx> *have feelings often
2018-09-08T17:20:35 < Sadale> by feeling I meant hunch.
2018-09-08T17:20:41 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-08T17:21:06 < Sadale> :3
2018-09-08T17:32:06 < Cracki> that statue is meant to disgust normal warmblooded males
2018-09-08T17:40:50 < Steffanx> whats normal?
2018-09-08T17:46:48 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dmc-uAnVsAAWds7.jpg:orig
2018-09-08T17:47:04 < Cracki> if you have to ask, you aren't.
2018-09-08T17:47:22 < Steffanx> its not something ##stm32 taught me
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2018-09-08T17:48:39 < vampi-the-frog> disgusting
2018-09-08T17:49:03 < antto> i'm sure there are folks who prefere moar thick women
2018-09-08T17:49:03 < Steffanx> is this vampi-the-frog  trying to be "normal"?
2018-09-08T17:51:47 < Cracki> the composition of this shot reminds me of The Last Supper https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmWaA_PXoAUs9of.jpg:orig
2018-09-08T17:52:25 < Steffanx> i guess i have no clue what that image is about or what the last supper is supposed to be
2018-09-08T17:53:36 < Cracki> heretic!
2018-09-08T17:54:38 < Steffanx> i dont give a damn about this jones guy
2018-09-08T17:54:53 < Steffanx> and i expect the last supper to be a reference to some unknown meme, not the painting 
2018-09-08T17:55:38 < Steffanx> *expected
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2018-09-08T17:56:53 < tomeaton17> Cracki, I know which I would rather
2018-09-08T17:57:01 < Steffanx> so i turns out i did have a slight clue, but didnt bother to think about it.
2018-09-08T17:57:38 < Steffanx> i did spot quite a few hipsters though. The glasses, the "fancy" watch with buttons
2018-09-08T17:57:44 < Cracki> don't overthink it. just do it™.
2018-09-08T17:58:16 < Cracki> the shot's quality is how each individual tells a tale.
2018-09-08T17:58:55 < Steffanx> heh true
2018-09-08T17:58:56 < Cracki> the police officer standing there all tough. the jackass in the middle trying to look respectable. alex jones trying to get a word in.
2018-09-08T17:59:10 < Steffanx> best is the guy on the right, in the door opening. Doesnt seem to give a damn
2018-09-08T17:59:44 < antto> teh reporters filming with their smart(ass)phones
2018-09-08T18:00:23 < tomeaton17> https://i.redd.it/1z6k4w2zdxk11.jpg
2018-09-08T18:00:32 < Cracki> jack trying to look like a hipster bronstein
2018-09-08T18:00:44 < Cracki> heh
2018-09-08T18:00:48 < friendofafriend> That Casio watch is killing me.
2018-09-08T18:01:07 < englishman> its the google glass that weirds me out
2018-09-08T18:01:18 < Cracki> gotta have that calculator on hand
2018-09-08T18:01:23 < Cracki> smartphones can't calculate
2018-09-08T18:01:42 < mawk> indeed englishman 
2018-09-08T18:01:43 < friendofafriend> Yeah, Johnny Mnemonic needs to give it a rest.
2018-09-08T18:02:07 < friendofafriend> Where's the Yakuza, when you need them?
2018-09-08T18:02:19 < Steffanx> what bothers me is how all the non-white guys seems to do the hard work
2018-09-08T18:02:29 < Steffanx> one has to lift that heavy camera and the other one is a cop.
2018-09-08T18:03:18 < Cracki> guess what, democrats are raycis
2018-09-08T18:04:12 < Cracki> otoh giving the shit jobs to whites would mean no jobs at all for minorities
2018-09-08T18:04:52 < friendofafriend> This guy popped up in ##networking.  https://i.imgur.com/yO0dfx3.png
2018-09-08T18:05:35 < Cracki> kek
2018-09-08T18:06:18 < Cracki> >creation of a geographical state
2018-09-08T18:06:23 < Cracki> you have a whole fucking continent!
2018-09-08T18:07:39 < friendofafriend> It's been solid comedy gold, 00:25 < audioburn> could the internet also be called a "website network"?
2018-09-08T18:08:06 < Cracki> nothing is stopping that nutjob from getting a plane ticket to wakanda and making tin can telephones
2018-09-08T18:08:40 < friendofafriend> Tin can telephones, can you say "upgrade"?
2018-09-08T18:08:52 < Cracki> ok use optical fiber instead of string
2018-09-08T18:09:37 < Cracki> I'm sure it can transmit longitudinal mechanical vibration
2018-09-08T18:10:08 < Cracki> can probably be enhanced with... VIBRANIUM!
2018-09-08T18:10:28 < friendofafriend> inb4 "burn the witch"
2018-09-08T18:10:57 < Cracki> they don't burn witches.
2018-09-08T18:11:07 < Cracki> they use burning tires and call them "necklaces".
2018-09-08T18:11:30 < Cracki> also, bald people have gold in their skulls. just off them and crack open.
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2018-09-08T18:13:35 < friendofafriend> You mean there's a place where I can do in my rivals by saying they have gold in their skulls?  Is it... heaven?
2018-09-08T18:14:56 < Cracki> you have to shave their heads first, then send them to a special place where the population is that superstitious
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2018-09-08T19:20:52 < markus-k> are these ebay st-link cheapies any good? I'm currently using the stlink on my f3disco with openocd and its getting a bit annoying to have this bare board flipping around here
2018-09-08T19:21:13 < vampi-the-frog> markus-k: I am using one of those white coffin-shaped ones and it works fine
2018-09-08T19:21:41 < vampi-the-frog> markus-k: I've also tried one of those little sticks and a j-link and they both worked
2018-09-08T19:21:50 < vampi-the-frog> though the stick seems to have stopped working
2018-09-08T19:21:56 < vampi-the-frog> so just buy two of each so you have a spare
2018-09-08T19:23:30 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/XsM9F2K.png
2018-09-08T19:23:32 < bitmask> interesting first layer
2018-09-08T19:23:32 < markus-k> okay
2018-09-08T19:25:17 < Steffanx> even a jlink edu mini is only $19 ( a real one)
2018-09-08T19:25:34 < mawk> cut out the stlink from the board markus-k 
2018-09-08T19:27:04 < markus-k> it's not one of those cuttable ones, and I still need the board :)
2018-09-08T19:27:30 < markus-k> but an jlink edu mini sounds interesting too, gotta look into thta
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2018-09-08T19:36:41 < Lux> get a couple of those chinese st-links
2018-09-08T19:36:47 < Lux> cheap and works
2018-09-08T19:37:32 < Thorn> aliexpress j-link clone > any st-link
2018-09-08T19:37:41 < vampi-the-frog> yeah they're fine
2018-09-08T19:37:41 < Thorn> unless you need stm8 support
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2018-09-08T19:50:57 < Cracki> why do you say jlink clones are above any stlink?
2018-09-08T19:51:28 < vampi-the-frog> I say just get a bunch of them, they all work
2018-09-08T19:51:36 < Cracki> there widgets from ST that cost a lot, but they are really fast and have tons of capabilities
2018-09-08T19:51:36 < vampi-the-frog> the one with the full 20 pin connector seems to do reset properly
2018-09-08T19:51:45 < vampi-the-frog> plus it's just sturdier
2018-09-08T19:52:16 < Cracki> ah nvm, stlink is st, jlink is segger. didn't parse that right.
2018-09-08T19:52:55 < Cracki> segger stuff is indeed powerful. dunno any stlink stuff that compares.
2018-09-08T19:52:58 < Steffanx> and segger is german and germany über alles right? :P
2018-09-08T19:53:14 < Cracki> *Deutschland pls
2018-09-08T19:53:30 < Steffanx> nah
2018-09-08T19:53:46 < Cracki> and now you have to sing all three stanzas
2018-09-08T19:54:07 < Steffanx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLHGTJjHXLo (The following content has been identified by the YouTube community as inappropriate or offensive to some audiences.) 
2018-09-08T19:54:09 < Steffanx> LOLOLOL.
2018-09-08T19:54:30 < Cracki> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Maas_memel_etsch_belt.svg
2018-09-08T19:56:03 < Cracki> that stanza _is_ obsolete.
2018-09-08T19:57:25 < Cracki> the first that is
2018-09-08T19:57:35 < Cracki> the second... I see no problem with. it triggers shitlibs.
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2018-09-08T20:11:44 < branjb> why are there so many pajets in fpga work?
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2018-09-08T20:26:05 < drozdziak1> I'm looking at the STM32F411VET6 datasheet. but I can't quite find which registers I need to poke with to change the PA0 pin to input mode
2018-09-08T20:26:11 < drozdziak1> Any protips?
2018-09-08T20:26:33 < branjb> the reference manual?
2018-09-08T20:27:20 < drozdziak1> branjb Looks like exactly what I want, thank you
2018-09-08T20:28:10 < branjb> https://imgur.com/a/Ftessts
2018-09-08T20:29:04 < branjb> iirc there is no individual #define for each GPIO port, you have to take the base address register and apply an offset to get the port you want
2018-09-08T20:30:14 < branjb> check gpio_set_mode() here: https://github.com/lostangles/HelloWorld/blob/master/inc/lib_gpio.h
2018-09-08T20:30:48 < drozdziak1> branjb: I'm doing baremetal Rust, all the registers are mapped from the SVD file for that MCU
2018-09-08T20:31:07 < branjb> lol I have to use rust for stm32 at work
2018-09-08T20:31:13 < branjb> it's horrible
2018-09-08T20:31:43 < drozdziak1> branjb What's wrong? And which crates are you using?
2018-09-08T20:32:01 < branjb> looks like input mode is the default state of GPIO pins anyway
2018-09-08T20:35:47 < Thorn> branjb: you *have* to use rusf for stm32 at *work*? what is it, a startup founded by game developers?
2018-09-08T20:37:21 < branjb> no it's compsci retards taking over engineering with their evangelical beliefs that rust is a ~safe~ language for ~safety critical shit~ and that if we use rust it means our code won't suck
2018-09-08T20:41:12 < Thorn> those MIT idiots, programming the Apollo GC in assembly
2018-09-08T20:42:00 < branjb> basically instead of addressing that people write shitty code that breaks things and delays projects by months, they think switching languages will solve that
2018-09-08T20:43:52 < branjb> it's as dumb as it sounds
2018-09-08T20:44:22 < Cracki> they should hire smarter people
2018-09-08T20:44:41 < Cracki> or switch to go. go was made for dumb people. that was the explicit design goal.
2018-09-08T20:44:43 < Thorn> dump people can only hire smart people by accident
2018-09-08T20:44:50 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-08T20:44:52 < Thorn> *dumb
2018-09-08T20:46:05 < branjb> they relocated me here and if I leave before the 1 year mark I have to pay back the relocation expenses and my sign on bonus.  soon as that 1 year is up time to start looking elsewhere
2018-09-08T20:46:48 < Cracki> hehe
2018-09-08T20:46:59 < Cracki> why not start looking right now
2018-09-08T20:47:07 < Cracki> start negotiating
2018-09-08T20:47:14 < jpa-> what's so wrong about rust on stm32?
2018-09-08T20:47:20 < branjb> it's a meme
2018-09-08T20:47:22 < jpa-> it seems more like the workplace sucks otherwise
2018-09-08T20:47:38 < Cracki> like communism, rust's ideas are good, but impractical
2018-09-08T20:47:41 < branjb> ^
2018-09-08T20:47:56 < branjb> i am casually looking
2018-09-08T20:47:58 < Cracki> a hundred million people died
2018-09-08T20:48:50 < Cracki> tbh I haven't played with rust that much. I know they inverted "const", so you have "mut" (opposite of const)
2018-09-08T20:49:07 < Cracki> and the idea of ownership sounds interesting, but... eh
2018-09-08T20:49:34 < Cracki> I'm more of a "everyone owns everything" (unprotected flat memory) kinda guy
2018-09-08T20:49:43 < branjb> me too
2018-09-08T20:49:50 < Cracki> they failed at implementing communism
2018-09-08T20:49:56 < Cracki> perhaps they'll succeed next time
2018-09-08T20:50:09 < PaulFertser> branjb: what specifically do you dislike about Rust btw?
2018-09-08T20:50:19 < Cracki> new language means tons of reinventing the wheel (libraries)
2018-09-08T20:50:33 < jpa-> he hates that the compiler rejects his programs
2018-09-08T20:51:29 < Cracki> rust has an academic type system
2018-09-08T20:51:34 < branjb> it's not even the rust thing that bothers me, it's that a lot of the senior engineers are kind of dumb, and that might sound arrogant but i'm not really getting a lot of experience/learning out of the job
2018-09-08T20:51:38 < Cracki> academic isn't bad, but it's only academic
2018-09-08T20:52:00 < jpa-> branjb: well that i can see, many workplaces suck
2018-09-08T20:52:06 < branjb> i don't like rust because in the end it's used exactly the same as C, but takes more work
2018-09-08T20:52:27 < jpa-> that sounds like it is being used wrong
2018-09-08T20:52:41 < jpa-> or then you aren't yet experiences in the ways that C can really fuck up :P
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2018-09-08T20:52:54 < branjb> well
2018-09-08T20:52:58 < Cracki> the seniors are dumb, guess why they don't grasp the true philosophy of an academic language
2018-09-08T20:53:17 < Cracki> "magic bullet" thinking.
2018-09-08T20:53:35 < branjb> the shit we have that works shitty is because the overall architecture/algorithms are bad, not the language
2018-09-08T20:54:01 < branjb> the language is just an excuse for not acknowledging that
2018-09-08T20:54:09 < jpa-> is it safety critical stuff?
2018-09-08T20:54:15 < branjb> no comment
2018-09-08T20:56:12 < karlp> he already said it was.
2018-09-08T20:56:50 < Cracki> >[...] their evangelical beliefs that rust is a ~safe~ language for ~safety critical shit~ [...]
2018-09-08T20:57:14 < branjb> it eventually works but ends up having major delays because of architecture/algorithms, not because of something that switching to rust will fix
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2018-09-08T20:58:19 < branjb> like Cracki said it's just a "magic bullet" that can be shown to be something being done just long enough for people to move on to something else
2018-09-08T20:58:24 < jpa-> to me that is just about their belief.. "this language is soooo good it will fix our stuff also"
2018-09-08T20:58:42 < Cracki> that's what I got from the line too
2018-09-08T20:59:03 < Cracki> let's use ada, rockets are programmed with ada, our website will be rocket-grade!
2018-09-08T20:59:12 < branjb> we use ada too
2018-09-08T20:59:17 < Cracki> how do you fare with ada?
2018-09-08T20:59:35 < Thorn> ada is great, except there are no free compilers left
2018-09-08T20:59:44 < branjb> i'm not doing any projects involving ada at the moment, but the folks that do seem to like it
2018-09-08T20:59:45 < jpa-> to me rust is nice like C#, it allows to manage larger projects without messing stuff up; C doesn't make it easy, and C++ is not very good at it either
2018-09-08T20:59:57 < Cracki> aye, that's what kept me from ada too...
2018-09-08T21:00:29 < branjb> no piratebay ada compilers?
2018-09-08T21:01:02 < jpa-> isn't gnat still gpl?
2018-09-08T21:01:07 < Cracki> it should be
2018-09-08T21:01:25 < Thorn> jpa-: you have to GPL all your code or pay something exorbitant
2018-09-08T21:01:29 < Cracki> but try to look for libraries for real applications...
2018-09-08T21:01:40 < Thorn> cadence / mentor graphics level prices
2018-09-08T21:03:10 < jpa-> Thorn: hum, wikipedia still says there is runtime library exception so you don't need to gpl your own code
2018-09-08T21:03:24 < jpa-> but yeah, probably most of adacore libraries are not available then
2018-09-08T21:04:04 < Thorn> I remember reading their website months ago, and IIRC they never mentioned any exceptions
2018-09-08T21:04:07 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-08T21:04:07 < jpa-> ah, the version with runtime library exception is "FSF GNAT" now
2018-09-08T21:04:21 < jpa-> while adacore's GNAT-GPL is without the exception
2018-09-08T21:04:29 < Thorn> looks like it
2018-09-08T21:04:49 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@107.241.9.32] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-08T21:06:21 < englishman> jpa-: spotted nanopb in a swiss proj
2018-09-08T21:06:25 < englishman> its everywhere
2018-09-08T21:06:38 < jpa-> yeah, i don't understand why
2018-09-08T21:06:48 < englishman> really
2018-09-08T21:06:54 < englishman> it's so ez
2018-09-08T21:06:54 < jpa-> it's also on every android device
2018-09-08T21:07:04 < Cracki> all this ada stuff seems dressed in marketing speak... like there's not a single engineer making any decisions about it
2018-09-08T21:07:17 < englishman> sure if gooogle released a c library you wouldn't need nanopb
2018-09-08T21:07:30 < englishman> but yours does everything that protobufs need to do 
2018-09-08T21:07:59 < jpa-> i'd probably still have needed nanopb; there was protobuf-c but it was too big and needed malloc
2018-09-08T21:08:11 < englishman> yeah awful
2018-09-08T21:08:26 < jpa-> though i still don't use nanopb myself
2018-09-08T21:09:26 < jpa-> last time i needed protobuf, i wrote this: http://paste.dy.fi/ZjB
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2018-09-08T21:10:42 < Steffanx> Do i have to remove android entirely to get rid of nanopb jpa- ?
2018-09-08T21:11:01 < jpa-> Steffanx: you can also downgrade to android 4
2018-09-08T21:11:12 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@107.241.9.32] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-08T21:11:24 < Steffanx> nah joking, just curious. It's really part of android nowadays? (why?)
2018-09-08T21:11:43 < jpa-> i don't know why, but it is in the license info screen
2018-09-08T21:11:59 < Steffanx> hm
2018-09-08T21:12:16 < Steffanx> checking
2018-09-08T21:12:22 < Thorn> they put it there so that jpa- can say "my code is in every phone" to prospective clients
2018-09-08T21:13:21 < bitmask> 2 hours into the moon lamp print
2018-09-08T21:14:19 < Cracki> the moon lamp is a hoax!
2018-09-08T21:14:33 < bitmask> its made of cheese
2018-09-08T21:15:39 < Steffanx> i dont see no libnanopb, but might not be looking good enough.
2018-09-08T21:15:39 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has quit [Quit: Get up on outta here!]
2018-09-08T21:15:45 < Steffanx> pics bitmask ?
2018-09-08T21:15:53 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@107.241.9.32] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-08T21:15:57 < jpa-> Steffanx: it's called libprotobuf-c-nano for some reason
2018-09-08T21:16:26 < Steffanx> ah i see
2018-09-08T21:16:37 < Steffanx> "libprotobuf-c-nano-enable-malloc" ..heh
2018-09-08T21:16:58 < jpa-> https://github.com/aosp-mirror/platform_hardware_ril/blob/c136355b057e2e4b97381c340790e02aef02d982/libril/sap_service.cpp   this is apparently atleast something android uses it for
2018-09-08T21:20:00 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/xVgFEmL
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2018-09-08T21:20:38 < Steffanx> Looks almost like they included it because it was a dependency for another project. Since they also include some of their own libs.
2018-09-08T21:20:42 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-08T21:21:07 < Steffanx> 2nd one is after 2 hours bitmask ?
2018-09-08T21:21:13 < bitmask> yup...
2018-09-08T21:21:22 < bitmask> sloooow
2018-09-08T21:21:33 < Steffanx> Im still sad you removed the camera.
2018-09-08T21:21:55 < bitmask> haha
2018-09-08T21:21:57 < bitmask> took me a sec to realize what you meant
2018-09-08T21:23:08 < bitmask> cinnamon toast crunch is easily the best cereal ever invented
2018-09-08T21:23:19 < jpa-> Steffanx: libril is developed by android project; but it looks it used to have some custom "binder" serialization format and then they switched to protobuf with nanopb  https://android.googlesource.com/platform/frameworks/native/+/de8c80692b0b2fcef705ba9b417477d2bba81e75/libs/binder/Parcel.cpp
2018-09-08T21:23:39 < Steffanx> Anyway, im happy to know part of you is often in my pants :)
2018-09-08T21:23:49 < jpa-> it was my hope all along
2018-09-08T21:24:01 < bitmask> how do I get in your pants
2018-09-08T21:24:07 < jpa-> now i only wish my code was involved with the camera and not with the sim card
2018-09-08T21:24:34 < Steffanx> bitmask, write something id get on my androind phone unwillingly
2018-09-08T21:24:49 < bitmask> heh
2018-09-08T21:25:02 < PaulFertser> I found out to print some smaller ABS part to avoid lifting off bed I need to lower the bed temp, down to 90C but I apply a thin layer of PVA glue to the bed. And it's good for many prints, no need to reapply.
2018-09-08T21:25:06 < jpa-> bitmask: print a belt buckle and mail it to steffanx
2018-09-08T21:25:23 < Steffanx> i dont need a belt.
2018-09-08T21:25:25 < Steffanx> yet.
2018-09-08T21:25:34 < bitmask> I use pva on glass too
2018-09-08T21:25:38 < bitmask> works great
2018-09-08T21:26:00 < jpa-> some people at hacklab use salt, but i like PVA also
2018-09-08T21:26:31 < bitmask> interesting, never heard that before
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2018-09-08T21:31:55 < bitmask> Steffanx did you see my boobies?
2018-09-08T21:32:08 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/hrjJTji.png
2018-09-08T21:32:35 < bitmask> I need better steppers to get rid of this salmon skin
2018-09-08T21:32:36 < Steffanx> heh, the fruit complete sit
2018-09-08T21:32:38 < Steffanx> it
2018-09-08T21:32:39 < bitmask> haha
2018-09-08T21:33:15 < Steffanx> is this the "nsfw" thingiverse thats in the most popular prints?
2018-09-08T21:34:32 < bitmask> yea
2018-09-08T21:34:42 < bitmask> I liked it because well its boobies, but also vase mode
2018-09-08T21:36:36 < Steffanx> dont u have a gf for that?
2018-09-08T21:36:49 < bitmask> yea, I just wanted to try something in vase mode
2018-09-08T21:37:03 < bitmask> and see my different filaments print the same thing
2018-09-08T21:37:11 < Thorn> I thought it was some kind of custom fleshlight
2018-09-08T21:37:20 < Cracki> bitmask, consider trinamic tmc2130, they have sine tables. tuning those is involved though
2018-09-08T21:37:41 < Cracki> you'd need a high resolution encoder or something to measure true position
2018-09-08T21:37:43 < bitmask> yea I dont have money for that right now, thats on the to buy list
2018-09-08T21:37:55 < Cracki> tmc2130 thingies cost 10 bucks/pc
2018-09-08T21:38:03 < Cracki> watterott.com
2018-09-08T21:38:03 < bitmask> yea but Id need a new board to use them
2018-09-08T21:38:08 < Cracki> hm prolly
2018-09-08T21:38:13 < Cracki> stepstick compatible, more or less
2018-09-08T21:38:14 < bitmask> no not prolly, definitely
2018-09-08T21:38:22 < Cracki> hmhm
2018-09-08T21:38:37 < bitmask> and Id like to upgrade to a 32 bit board if I'm gonna go that route
2018-09-08T21:38:52 < Cracki> makes sense
2018-09-08T21:39:07 < Cracki> you know... finer microstepping need not give finer steps as such.
2018-09-08T21:39:14 < Cracki> stepper motors still have some detent torque
2018-09-08T21:39:32 < bitmask> I want to get 400 step motors
2018-09-08T21:39:35 < Cracki> so when you tune a micrpstep sine table, you tune it to the motor as well :P
2018-09-08T21:39:48 < Cracki> 400 step motors? hm, that's a halving
2018-09-08T21:40:11 < Cracki> you could use different pulleys
2018-09-08T21:40:23 < Cracki> like a larger diameter pulley on the stepper, smaller on the rods
2018-09-08T21:40:26 < bitmask> yea 
2018-09-08T21:41:00 < Cracki> I did 8:1 on some other thing I made, the larger gear had 128 teeth and a diameter of about 5-10 cm
2018-09-08T21:41:15 < Cracki> 81mm diameter
2018-09-08T21:41:28 < bitmask> before I get better quality motors/steppers id want to build an alu extrusion frame too, otherwise its probably not worth it
2018-09-08T21:41:33 < Cracki> so there's a limit to that approach
2018-09-08T21:41:39 < Cracki> makes sense
2018-09-08T21:41:39 < bitmask> so its just monies I need to save up and do it all at once
2018-09-08T21:41:55 < bitmask> frame + 32bit board + tmc
2018-09-08T21:42:08 < bitmask> and steppers, forgot the steppers
2018-09-08T21:42:21 < Cracki> the bluish opaque lady got the best skin. what's different to the other two?
2018-09-08T21:42:32 < bitmask> I do have steppers but they are in my pen plotter which I want to convert to a desktop cnc mill
2018-09-08T21:42:45 < Cracki> looks like thinner layers
2018-09-08T21:42:55 < bitmask> blue is petg
2018-09-08T21:43:07 < bitmask> problem in that one is I used adaptive layer height so you see the banding
2018-09-08T21:43:09 < Cracki> the light blue that is, not the center one
2018-09-08T21:43:13 < Cracki> hmhm
2018-09-08T21:43:13 < bitmask> ohh
2018-09-08T21:43:19 < bitmask> thats this silky pla
2018-09-08T21:43:24 < Cracki> hmmmm
2018-09-08T21:43:29 < bitmask> prints pretty cool
2018-09-08T21:43:55 < bitmask> makes lines seem to blend together. used same layer height as the others
2018-09-08T21:43:58 < Steffanx> what was the speed bitmask ?
2018-09-08T21:44:03 < Cracki> wow
2018-09-08T21:44:05 < bitmask> uhh 60 I think
2018-09-08T21:46:19 < bitmask> actually no
2018-09-08T21:46:35 < bitmask> since it was vase mode the layer time is so low that it auto slowed it down to probably 20-30
2018-09-08T21:49:40 < Steffanx> hm
2018-09-08T21:52:45 < mawk> yesterday I spent half the day in fumes of leaded solder and flux, and now I have a severe headache; could it be related ?
2018-09-08T21:52:57 < bitmask> you have cancer
2018-09-08T21:53:00 < mawk> :(
2018-09-08T21:53:06 < mawk> I prefer cancer than lead poisoning
2018-09-08T21:53:09 < bitmask> I had cancer, it isnt fun
2018-09-08T21:53:10 < mawk> I wanna keep my IQ intact
2018-09-08T21:53:26 < mawk> even though when my step-father had cancer the chemo lowered his IQ
2018-09-08T21:53:36 < mawk> that or I can't understand why my mom was with him at the beggining
2018-09-08T21:53:38 < bitmask> I didnt need chemo, just radiation
2018-09-08T21:53:42 < mawk> I see
2018-09-08T21:53:46 < mawk> and you've fully recovered ?
2018-09-08T21:53:58 < Steffanx> lead poisening is not something you get from a day of soldering
2018-09-08T21:54:03 < Steffanx> the flux is worse i think
2018-09-08T21:54:08 < bitmask> yea it was a very curable form of cancer luckily
2018-09-08T21:54:10 < jpa-> you don't get much lead from fumes, but you can get allergic reaction to flux
2018-09-08T21:54:31 < bitmask> they just chopped one of my balls off
2018-09-08T21:54:42 < mawk> and the other one is still fertile ?
2018-09-08T21:54:43 < bitmask> and sprinked me with radiation for a month
2018-09-08T21:54:47 < Steffanx> So what did you learn from it mawk? Dont solder with all the windows/doors closed.
2018-09-08T21:54:48 < bitmask> yea
2018-09-08T21:54:56 < bitmask> althought I dont want kids anyway
2018-09-08T21:55:04 < mawk> I had a window open and a fan pushing the fumes out of the window Steffanx 
2018-09-08T21:55:09 < mawk> but apparently it doesn't suffice
2018-09-08T21:55:29 < Steffanx> dear rob235 didnt you learn not to be so open about stuff like this in ##stm32, you'll get it back one day.
2018-09-08T21:55:42 < bitmask> meh who cares
2018-09-08T21:55:45 < Steffanx> Same with the drugs and vaping :P
2018-09-08T21:55:55 < bitmask> hah the vaping was the worst
2018-09-08T21:56:26 < Steffanx> stopped doing that?
2018-09-08T21:56:28 < jpa-> bitmask: but where will you get your mini-me's then?
2018-09-08T21:56:42 < bitmask> I stopped vaping like a year ago
2018-09-08T21:56:53 < mawk> vaping weed or vaping ecig ?
2018-09-08T21:57:04 < Steffanx> ecig
2018-09-08T21:57:06 < bitmask> both but I was getting ripped on for cig
2018-09-08T21:57:20 < mawk> speaking of drugs even the strongest opiate I have at hand doesn't cure my headache
2018-09-08T21:57:31 < bitmask> I'll create clones straight from my dick meat
2018-09-08T21:57:35 < mawk> I'll burn my hand to make a diversion
2018-09-08T21:57:40 < bitmask> what opiate is that?
2018-09-08T21:57:43 < bitmask> that was my doc
2018-09-08T21:57:51 < Steffanx> i dont speak that language, sorry
2018-09-08T21:57:57 < mawk> methadone
2018-09-08T21:58:03 < bitmask> ahh thats what I have too
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2018-09-08T21:58:49 < mawk> even though it's like the highest level of narcotics here in france, and the prescription are secured with a watermark and stuff, the pharmacist still managed to give me too much
2018-09-08T21:58:52 < mawk> so I have plenty extra
2018-09-08T21:59:12 < mawk> the pharmacist need to keep the methadone/heroine/morphine/etc in a safe, and is controlled on a regular basis by health authorities
2018-09-08T21:59:14 < Steffanx> it could also be not related to the soldering
2018-09-08T21:59:15 < bitmask> I have to go every day to the clinic, well I started earning take homes but I still have to go 4 days a week
2018-09-08T21:59:21 < mawk> to check the stocks with the actual amount in the safe
2018-09-08T21:59:22 < Steffanx> Try it again and you
2018-09-08T21:59:24 < Steffanx> ll know :P
2018-09-08T21:59:27 < mawk> lol
2018-09-08T21:59:37 < Steffanx> C'est tres bien, superbia
2018-09-08T21:59:41 < mawk> it was my worst headache since years
2018-09-08T21:59:42 < Steffanx> or something
2018-09-08T21:59:42 < mawk> so no thanks
2018-09-08T21:59:49 < mawk> yes Steffanx 
2018-09-08T21:59:59 < mawk> modulo some accents
2018-09-08T22:00:12 < bitmask> france has heroin at the pharmacy?
2018-09-08T22:00:12 < mawk> è for you, ç for superbia 
2018-09-08T22:00:18 < Steffanx> i know, but lazy.
2018-09-08T22:00:34 < mawk> hospital pharmacy for sure, regular pharmacy dunno, bitmask 
2018-09-08T22:00:41 < Steffanx> dead keys is the key.
2018-09-08T22:00:44 < mawk> they give it for very painful fractures like hip bone fracture
2018-09-08T22:00:47 < Steffanx> 'c, `e
2018-09-08T22:00:48 < mawk> they call it diamorphine
2018-09-08T22:01:47 < Steffanx> señor :P
2018-09-08T22:01:49 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-08T22:02:18 < Steffanx> It was good enough süpùrbíâ
2018-09-08T22:02:30 < Steffanx> *é
2018-09-08T22:02:47 < Steffanx> you bicycled with some friends
2018-09-08T22:03:18 < Steffanx> Wouldnt a bad thing only make it a better day for me superbia ?
2018-09-08T22:03:35 < mawk> sŭpərbīå
2018-09-08T22:04:02 < Steffanx> you forgot the ẞ
2018-09-08T22:04:09 < mawk> ß ?
2018-09-08T22:04:15 < mawk> you managed to make a fatty eszett
2018-09-08T22:04:33 < Steffanx> hah, i copied it from google.
2018-09-08T22:04:54 < Steffanx> ill be there, maybe, superbia
2018-09-08T22:05:21 < mawk> if my application is accepted I'll work in Eindhoven
2018-09-08T22:05:30 < Steffanx> after seeing tct and mr zyp it cant be much worse.
2018-09-08T22:06:01 < Steffanx> im not even close the eindhoven,  for dutch standard
2018-09-08T22:06:04 < Steffanx> s
2018-09-08T22:06:48 < jpa-> when are you coming to finland?
2018-09-08T22:07:09 < mawk> I've heard it's a pretty ugly city
2018-09-08T22:07:19 < mawk> eindhoven, not amsterdam
2018-09-08T22:07:28 < karlp> i wouldn't say it's ugly.
2018-09-08T22:07:32 < karlp> I thought it was quite nice.
2018-09-08T22:07:51 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@107.241.9.32] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-08T22:07:57 < Steffanx> there are no ugly cities in dutchland :P
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2018-09-08T22:09:46 < mawk> I'll need to resume my learning of dutch
2018-09-08T22:10:16 < mawk> using what I already learnt and what I know about english and german it should be easy
2018-09-08T22:10:46 < mawk> fool your brain superbia1
2018-09-08T22:10:56 < mawk> tell it she's your sister, she's not attractive, something like that
2018-09-08T22:11:10 < mawk> and you can talk to her
2018-09-08T22:12:41 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-08T22:12:57 < mawk> some people date for sex, not for making couples
2018-09-08T22:13:55 < bitmask> can you calculate the least amount of current an LED needs to turn on?
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2018-09-08T22:14:16 < bitmask> I have these 10W COB panels that I want closer to 1-2W
2018-09-08T22:14:45 < mawk> what do you mean by calculate ? "turn on" seem pretty subjective to me
2018-09-08T22:15:05 < bitmask> whys that
2018-09-08T22:15:30 < bitmask> I think I have 1W too but I was just curious what would work
2018-09-08T22:16:27 -!- Steffanx [~steffanx@unaffiliated/steffanx] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-08T22:17:57 < jpa-> bitmask: afaik the usually isn't any minimum current
2018-09-08T22:18:06 < bitmask> ok
2018-09-08T22:18:08 < jpa-> there is minimum voltage, though
2018-09-08T22:18:18 < bitmask> yea voltage is fine
2018-09-08T22:18:58 < bitmask> I think I just gotta play around with what I have, wrapping a stick with 5050 white led strip might even work best
2018-09-08T22:19:55 < bitmask> not sure how much light you need for a lithophane
2018-09-08T22:20:40 < bitmask> the 1W dome light replacement panel is probably easiest
2018-09-08T22:24:29 < Steffann>  mawk, crt can learn you some dutch. Just ask him when he's back.
2018-09-08T22:25:10 < mawk> ah he's dutch too ?
2018-09-08T22:25:11 < mawk> nice
2018-09-08T22:25:23 < Steffann> No, he's australian
2018-09-08T22:51:20 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@2a02:8070:a19d:2500:80c4:9e3c:4950:255d] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-08T22:56:49 < Thorn> 12-Bit, 10.25 GSPS ADC http://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/data-sheets/ad9213.pdf 
2018-09-08T22:57:18 < Thorn> (ENOB is ~8 bits)
2018-09-08T22:58:15 < englishman> neat
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2018-09-08T23:07:52 < zyp> finally continuing on the EVSE shit
2018-09-08T23:07:54 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/zXWTF.png
2018-09-08T23:08:26 < zyp> ripped out the edison, preparing to fit in ethernet instead
2018-09-08T23:09:27 < zyp> still need to figure out what to do with the signals that were on the RMII pins, need to do some clever rearranging I guess
2018-09-08T23:10:02 -!- exit [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
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2018-09-08T23:10:34 < zyp> tempted to throw out the CAN, seems kinda redundant to have both ethernet and can
2018-09-08T23:10:49 -!- exit [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-08T23:12:15 < zyp> could be useful for other shit though, e.g. remote display if controller is hidden away inside an electrical panel or something
2018-09-08T23:14:45 < Steffann> yeah, i'd keep CAN for some more internal-ish bus. And imho ethernet is still "so-so" when it's not a full blown ethernet stack (running on linux).
2018-09-08T23:15:02 < Steffann> CAN is much easier.
2018-09-08T23:15:17 < zyp> could always just run your own L3 directly on ethernet
2018-09-08T23:15:31 < zyp> that's how my bootloader protocol for workproject works :p
2018-09-08T23:15:48 < zyp> ethertype 0xb007 or something
2018-09-08T23:17:17 < Steffann> Or will it also come with usb, rs232, rs485 and the whole shebang?
2018-09-08T23:18:02 < zyp> yeah, I do have usb
2018-09-08T23:20:36 < Thorn> anyone played with CAN FD yet?
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2018-09-08T23:42:34 < bitmask> nice, this warm white cob light at 2W looks like it should be great for the moon
2018-09-08T23:43:35 < bitmask> staying nice and cool so far too
2018-09-08T23:43:45 < Cracki> Thorn, haven't really. it's not a big deal tbh. you get faster data rates, it's interoperable.
2018-09-08T23:44:01 < bitmask> HAHAHA FUCK ME!
2018-09-08T23:44:05 < bitmask> oh man
2018-09-08T23:44:10 < branjb> why does for(i=0;i<1000;i++); in arm break down into putting 1000 in r3 and subtracting 1 from it until it is 0?  is it because it is easier to check the zero flag?
2018-09-08T23:44:11 < bitmask> the moon stopped printing...
2018-09-08T23:44:14 < bitmask> it clogged
2018-09-08T23:44:15 < Cracki> framing stays the same, so nothing on the bus will freak out, but payload is transmitted faster
2018-09-08T23:44:20 < bitmask> grrrr
2018-09-08T23:44:28 < Cracki> branjb, jup.
2018-09-08T23:44:49 < Cracki> comparing to 1000 would need a subtraction, right?
2018-09-08T23:45:03 < Cracki> poor moon
2018-09-08T23:50:07 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BneV_4gHrDm/
2018-09-08T23:53:28 < Cracki> you can even teach cats not to claw you when you pet their belly
2018-09-08T23:53:42 < Cracki> they don't know that it hurts
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2018-09-08T23:56:48 < friendofafriend> Cracki: But then, why would you pet their bellies?
2018-09-08T23:57:06 < Cracki> are you a masochist?
--- Day changed Sun Sep 09 2018
2018-09-09T00:02:31 < Cracki> if you want to listen to a drunk dude talk at elon musk... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycPr5-27vSI
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2018-09-09T00:33:29 < mawk> in a totally symmetrical configuration, my PNP transistor heats more than the NPN
2018-09-09T00:33:40 < mawk> is it expected ?
2018-09-09T00:34:04 < mawk> in an emitter follower configuration, unloaded
2018-09-09T00:34:27 < mawk> almost unloaded, loaded by an opamp input
2018-09-09T00:40:49 < Cracki> "totally symmetrical" is hard when the transistors are DIFFERENT TYPES
2018-09-09T00:44:44 < englishman> branjb: yes there is a single "Compare and Branch if Zero" instruction CBZ
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2018-09-09T00:45:15 < englishman> so it's much faster to run that single instruction 1000 times than have two registers, one as a counter and one as your target, which also uses more registers / memory
2018-09-09T00:46:27 < englishman> try to rewrite it in asm for the increment version of the same thing and see what you come up with
2018-09-09T00:54:03 < Cracki> reversing loop iteration is a common optimization. depends on whether the body's data dependence allows it
2018-09-09T00:57:46 < mawk> symmetrical doesn't mean identical
2018-09-09T00:58:25 < mawk> but yeah it's a symmetrical configuration, NPN has 15V at collector, 5.5V at base; PNP has -15V at collector and -5.5V at base
2018-09-09T00:58:39 < mawk> both as emitter followers
2018-09-09T01:09:46 < branjb> I didn't dig into it two much but with -O2 for(i=0;i<1000;i++); was optimized to a point where it never actually left the loop.  reducing optimization fixed it
2018-09-09T01:10:05 < branjb> it was i<10000000 for a ghetto delay while I was testing something
2018-09-09T01:10:14 < branjb> two=too
2018-09-09T01:19:03 < zyp> rearranging shit is a fucking time sink
2018-09-09T01:19:42 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/mh2zj.png
2018-09-09T01:20:16 < zyp> got all the signals that got displaced by RMII sorted out
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2018-09-09T01:20:51 < branjb> just autoroute it
2018-09-09T01:20:52 < zyp> ended up sacrificing SWO to free up a SPI pin
2018-09-09T01:21:24 < zyp> I've never really used SWO anyway, can't be that bad :p
2018-09-09T01:21:57 < zyp> also, I wonder if this RJ45 jack is actually gonna fit in the enclosure
2018-09-09T01:23:03 < zyp> I suspect it might be too tall
2018-09-09T01:33:54 < Cracki> branjb, overflow?
2018-09-09T01:34:11 < Cracki> if it turned that into a while(true); something must have happened.
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2018-09-09T02:03:15 < BrainDamage> mawk: perfectly normal
2018-09-09T02:03:35 < branjb> I don't think so, unless int is not 32 bit
2018-09-09T02:03:49 < mawk> also I notice a 0.3V offset between the two
2018-09-09T02:03:53 < BrainDamage> mawk: holes have 2/3 the conducibility of electrons, so the complementary P of a N transistor will perform worse
2018-09-09T02:03:59 < mawk> their base voltage is set using an opamp
2018-09-09T02:04:02 < mawk> oh, I see
2018-09-09T02:04:30 < BrainDamage> a complementary transistor has more area, but in turn that means less hfe, etc
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2018-09-09T02:04:51 < mawk> I'm doing a simulation to see if the offset is due to the PNP transistor or the the wobbly breadboard contacts or something
2018-09-09T02:05:26 < mawk> BrainDamage: so that's why the PNP was heatsinked but the NPN just screwed to the case, I guess
2018-09-09T02:05:34 < mawk> from the place I got these parts
2018-09-09T02:06:32 < BrainDamage> there's more to that, consider the potential that the case sits at
2018-09-09T02:06:42 < mawk> it had an isolation sheet
2018-09-09T02:07:03 < mawk> considering that particular case has the collector connected to the transistor case, not using isolation would make a short circuit I believe
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2018-09-09T02:07:45 < mawk> at least that's what I can read from the half-chinese half-english datasheet
2018-09-09T02:12:14 < mawk> that's the circuit I built: http://tinyurl.com/y7jjz4sc
2018-09-09T02:12:33 < mawk> the "simulation" shows no offset, so I guess it comes from the bad breadboard or something
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2018-09-09T02:15:40 < Cracki> branjb, int can be 16 bit
2018-09-09T02:15:54 < Cracki> (e.g. on platforms that aren't 32 bit)
2018-09-09T02:16:01 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-09T02:16:24 < branjb> i am using arm-gcc in f4 env though
2018-09-09T02:16:29 < branjb> would have assumed it was 32
2018-09-09T02:16:34 < Cracki> hmmm
2018-09-09T02:16:45 < Cracki> then something else is going on
2018-09-09T02:16:51 < Cracki> nothing you said would explain it
2018-09-09T02:17:21 < branjb> like i said, -02 it never left the for loop, -O1 it did
2018-09-09T02:17:31 < Cracki> compiler bug maybe
2018-09-09T02:17:47 < branjb> i didn't realize i had -O2 as a flag
2018-09-09T02:17:47 < Cracki> I had some trouble with O2 that I didn't have with O1 or O3 (!)
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2018-09-09T02:18:30 < branjb> i generally try to avoid more than -O1 because sometimes it seems registers you have to read to reset a flag get optimized out if that value isn't used
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2018-09-09T02:18:38 < Cracki> hehe
2018-09-09T02:18:54 < branjb> and i think those macros that read and then pretend to use it look dumb
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2018-09-09T02:19:07 < Cracki> volatile/register the stuff that has sideeffects
2018-09-09T02:19:27 < branjb> volatile won't get optimized out if it is not used?
2018-09-09T02:19:47 < Cracki> volatile means the compiler isn't allowed to cache that memory location in a register
2018-09-09T02:19:58 < Cracki> i.e. all changes MUST be written to ram, also read from ram
2018-09-09T02:20:33 < branjb> but can it still see that the value it is read to is never used and then discard the entire instruction?
2018-09-09T02:20:48 < Cracki> not sure if it's allowed to cache a read when you read it twice in a row... maybe function blocks serve as borders
2018-09-09T02:20:54 < Cracki> uh...
2018-09-09T02:21:15 < Cracki> I think as soon as something writes to a volatile pointer, it can't be optimized away
2018-09-09T02:21:22 < branjb> ok
2018-09-09T02:21:45 < Cracki> example: some flags that's written by ISR, read by main loop
2018-09-09T02:22:01 < Cracki> main loop can just get stuck "reading" its cached value from a register, no matter what the ISR does
2018-09-09T02:22:09 < Cracki> so tag it volatile, all good
2018-09-09T02:23:55 < Cracki> "register" (to force a variable into registers for its whole lifetime) is something I haven't needed ever. gcc has been good enough with register allocation :P
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2018-09-09T02:24:25 < Cracki> that might just be a hint to the compiler anyway... like "inline" is
2018-09-09T02:30:36 < jadew> damn... there's so much electronics content on youtube
2018-09-09T02:32:03 < jadew> and everyone seems to want a piece of the ardutard pie, because they're almost exclusively geared towards arduino
2018-09-09T02:32:21 < mawk> using higher values for the feedback resistors seems to solve the problem
2018-09-09T02:34:11 < jadew> my son asked me to see how one of those ultrasonic distance sensors work, so I set up a little experiment for him and wondered if it would be worth to make a video about it
2018-09-09T02:34:35 < jadew> searched for the model number and there are so many, I can't get to the bottom of the search results
2018-09-09T02:36:38 < Steffanx> Hedde?
2018-09-09T02:36:40 < Cracki> meaning how to talk to that sensor, or how sonar itself works?
2018-09-09T02:36:56 < Cracki> you could take a speaker and a microphone, hook them up to a scope, and send chirps into the thing
2018-09-09T02:37:24 < Cracki> not sure if common ultrasound distance sensors use chirps or just register with a threshold...
2018-09-09T02:37:40 < jadew> Cracki, he wanted to know everything about it, I only explained how the wave gets reflected back, but I showed him on the scope the signal that comes back
2018-09-09T02:37:49 < Cracki> =)
2018-09-09T02:37:52 < Cracki> is it a chirp?
2018-09-09T02:38:08 < Cracki> or just on-off fixed freq?
2018-09-09T02:38:27 < jadew> not sure what that is, I'm not that familiar with the technology, it's just one of those cheap modules
2018-09-09T02:38:32 < jadew> HC-SR04
2018-09-09T02:38:43 < jadew> what does a chirp do?
2018-09-09T02:39:13 < Cracki> chirp is a signal with rising frequency. it's a lot easier to locate in space.
2018-09-09T02:39:25 < jadew> no, it's fixed freq
2018-09-09T02:39:36 < Cracki> with correlation, you get EXACT delay. with a constant frequency, you get "locks" at wavelength delay intervals
2018-09-09T02:39:38 < Cracki> ic ic
2018-09-09T02:39:45 < Cracki> radar works with chirps afaik
2018-09-09T02:40:14 < jadew> Steffanx, what's hedde?
2018-09-09T02:43:19 < mawk> HC-SR04 sends a series of 8 pulses at 40 kHz
2018-09-09T02:43:26 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-09T02:44:15 < bitmask> those 7seg display buck converters are handy
2018-09-09T02:44:23 < jadew> crt, yeah... cuz I don't know if that question was directed at me or not
2018-09-09T02:45:21 < jadew> haha
2018-09-09T02:45:51 < Laurenceb_> muh
2018-09-09T02:46:01 < Laurenceb_> muh eestor
2018-09-09T02:46:17 < Laurenceb_> nope
2018-09-09T02:46:37 < Laurenceb_> they didnt know how 2 series capacitors
2018-09-09T02:48:02 < Laurenceb_> muh talk https://www.ukhrv2018.uk/
2018-09-09T02:49:05 < Cracki> there is a fucking conference on that?
2018-09-09T02:49:21 < Cracki> and it's the fifty third one!
2018-09-09T02:49:31 < Laurenceb_> Cracki: yeah and I'm talking -  check the program
2018-09-09T02:49:43 < Laurenceb_> I'll try not to fall asleep
2018-09-09T02:50:05 < Laurenceb_> crt: they tried to make a capacitor consisting of aluminia coated in barium titanate
2018-09-09T02:50:42 < Laurenceb_> they modelled it incorrectly, thought they could get high dielectric strength and permittivity at the same time
2018-09-09T02:50:58 < Laurenceb_> when I was v bored I actually find the errors in their patent
2018-09-09T02:51:27 < Laurenceb_> found
2018-09-09T02:51:33 < Laurenceb_> how do i english
2018-09-09T02:52:48 < jadew> sounds like it's catered for millenials
2018-09-09T02:52:59 < jadew> (for very short attention spans)
2018-09-09T02:53:10 < Laurenceb_> eestor is still less lame than emdrive
2018-09-09T02:53:12 < jadew> all talks are 15 minutes long
2018-09-09T02:53:26 < Laurenceb_> 4 years and nasaspaceflight crew still havent managed to make any hardware
2018-09-09T02:53:37 < Laurenceb_> jadew: yeah ikr, can't cover much in that time
2018-09-09T02:54:02 < Laurenceb_> at least they have food
2018-09-09T02:54:15 < Laurenceb_> I just have to not die of boredom
2018-09-09T02:54:30 < jadew> Laurenceb_, you should just offer a taste of what you have to say and end with "for more information, you can find my book on amazon"
2018-09-09T02:54:36 < Laurenceb_> heh
2018-09-09T02:55:21 < jadew> is it possible that they have so many speakers because they're also the attendees?
2018-09-09T02:55:48 < jadew> if they didn't have enough, the room would look empty
2018-09-09T02:56:06 < Laurenceb_> jadew: yes, everyone who attends is presenting
2018-09-09T03:00:22 < Laurenceb_> its so boring that nobody would attend voluntarily
2018-09-09T03:00:31 < Laurenceb_> so its just something to put on your cv
2018-09-09T03:00:49 < jadew> I'm surprised there are so many people attending
2018-09-09T03:01:02 < jadew> I thought it's a very narrow niche
2018-09-09T03:01:47 < branjb> does M4 not have a DWT register?
2018-09-09T03:07:02 < karlp> branjb: and this is why you see old code that was even written as for (i=1000; i; i--) because it was from before the compiler could rearrange things for you
2018-09-09T03:07:56 < karlp> and yes, m4 should definitely have dwt.
2018-09-09T03:08:08 < karlp> it's probably theoretically optional, but not sure i've ever seen it missing.
2018-09-09T03:09:06 < branjb> I copypasta'd DWT stuff from another project into my current one and CYCCNT doesn't increment
2018-09-09T03:09:17 < branjb> pretty sure i enabled it right it's only like 2 steps
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2018-09-09T03:58:44 < Thorn> nice, tft display datasheet does not specify supply current
2018-09-09T03:59:27 < Cracki> gief shiet
2018-09-09T04:04:12 < Thorn> https://www.buydisplay.com/download/manual/ER-TFT070-4_Datasheet.pdf
2018-09-09T04:08:05 < Cracki> so far: vdd +3.0v
2018-09-09T04:08:19 < Thorn> (actually 3.3)
2018-09-09T04:08:37 < Cracki> supply 3.0 to 3.6v
2018-09-09T04:08:45 < bitmask> backlight 40mA dont see anything else
2018-09-09T04:08:53 < Cracki> not sure what you're looking for... section 4.2 absolute max
2018-09-09T04:09:11 < Thorn> 3.0 is minimum (section 4.2)
2018-09-09T04:09:17 < Cracki> 4.3 for normal operation
2018-09-09T04:09:31 < Thorn> I'm looking for supply current @ 3.3V in mA
2018-09-09T04:09:31 < Cracki> 4.4 backlight voltage
2018-09-09T04:09:51 < Cracki> ah you wanna know what it's gonna draw? hm
2018-09-09T04:10:41 < Cracki> indeed I don't see current or power either
2018-09-09T04:11:04 < Cracki> maybe it's negligible
2018-09-09T04:11:20 < Thorn> I've had 2 of these displays laying around for 4 years lol and now I'm finally ready to use them
2018-09-09T04:11:21 < Cracki> it's just 800x480
2018-09-09T04:11:49 < Thorn> maybe I should look a the controller datasheet
2018-09-09T04:12:52 < Cracki> I see 24 lines for rgb, clock, hsync vsync, ... prolly not too smart, that thing
2018-09-09T04:13:36 < Cracki> enough to hm wait, it at least needs circuitry to turn the 8 bit digital representation into analog voltage
2018-09-09T04:14:37 < Thorn> it also seems to have a boost converter on the FPC
2018-09-09T04:14:43 < Cracki> k so three dacs, some counters to run through the select line...
2018-09-09T04:15:08 < Cracki> boost? why? backlight from 3.3v?
2018-09-09T04:15:18 < Cracki> backlight is ~1 watt
2018-09-09T04:15:42 < Thorn> controller says 10mA digital + 12mA analog (10V)
2018-09-09T04:15:58 < Cracki> hm
2018-09-09T04:16:10 < Thorn> I assume it's for 10V analog. you're supposed to supply backlight
2018-09-09T04:16:51 < Cracki> yes
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2018-09-09T04:20:43 < Thorn> yes there's a tssop8, inductor, diodes, caps
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2018-09-09T04:53:34 < dongs> can some lunix faggot tell me the size of their /usr/lib32/libc.so if you have 32shit support installed on 64butt lunix
2018-09-09T04:56:16 < MrMobius> ya
2018-09-09T04:56:18 < MrMobius> the size?
2018-09-09T04:56:24 < MrMobius> about 9 inches
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2018-09-09T05:49:57 < englishman> http://i.imgur.com/P0aFbDv.jpg
2018-09-09T05:51:54 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/Q1MeLkT.png
2018-09-09T05:51:55 < bitmask> sooooo slow :/
2018-09-09T05:52:22 < dongs> thats a lot of jews
2018-09-09T05:53:44 < Cracki> burnt offering
2018-09-09T05:53:50 < Cracki> it's written in the magic book
2018-09-09T05:54:15 < Cracki> bitmask, why is that moon not printed as two halves
2018-09-09T05:54:31 < Cracki> all that support must be shit for surface quality
2018-09-09T05:54:56 < bitmask> you can if you want but it will screw up the lithophane
2018-09-09T05:55:05 < Cracki> does the slicer (by accident) put support where the wall is thicker/opaque at least?
2018-09-09T05:55:54 < bitmask> the support actually wont affect this print, it creates a support surface interface that peels right off
2018-09-09T05:56:04 < Cracki> fake news
2018-09-09T06:12:22 < friendofafriend> I heard they found a red heifer.  Pretty rare when your breeding program involves sacrifice.
2018-09-09T06:18:32 < bitmask> can you make something like float with just neodymium magnets positioned around it and a base?
2018-09-09T06:18:37 < bitmask> like = light
2018-09-09T06:19:54 < bitmask> I know you can actually, I'm just not sure how to go about it with positioning and number
2018-09-09T06:20:20 < Cracki> uh...
2018-09-09T06:20:35 < Cracki> as long as the floating magnet doesn't flip around...
2018-09-09T06:20:48 < Cracki> wanna try superconductors?
2018-09-09T06:21:59 < Cracki> or you could take sections of a sphere, magnetize them all radially in the same direction, then glue them together... I wonder how the field lines would look
2018-09-09T06:22:15 < bitmask> I wanted the moon lamp to be able to spin :)
2018-09-09T06:22:32 < Cracki> moar control loop magic then
2018-09-09T06:22:47 < Cracki> that maglev thing was based on attraction
2018-09-09T06:22:57 < Cracki> because that's stable
2018-09-09T06:23:10 < Cracki> you can "invert the pendulum", but then you'll need more than one electromagnet
2018-09-09T06:24:01 < Cracki> glue a magnet to the moon's bottom, then 3 electromagnets should be able to push this around in space, try to keep it upright
2018-09-09T06:24:17 < Cracki> or spin that point around, which should translate to rotation of the moon itself
2018-09-09T06:25:37 < Cracki> sensing... you'd have to sense not just the position of the magnet, but the whole axis of the moon
2018-09-09T06:26:39 < Cracki> or... big maglev pulling rig, but with 3 coils. then it's just hanging there
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2018-09-09T07:17:27 < Thorn> are there parallel to dvi/hdmi converters?
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2018-09-09T07:17:43 < Thorn> that can be used with ltdc
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2018-09-09T08:25:32 < dongs> Thorn: of course?
2018-09-09T08:25:35 < dongs> anything basically
2018-09-09T08:25:44 < dongs> will take 24bit rgbsync etc.
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2018-09-09T09:07:40 < dongs> is that like #stoner32 version of developers developers developers
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2018-09-09T09:25:36 < dongs>  no
2018-09-09T09:25:45 < dongs> 1) its retarded 2) its retarded
2018-09-09T09:38:48 < dongs> not much 
2018-09-09T09:38:52 < dongs> been dicknplacing last few days
2018-09-09T09:39:03 < dongs> catching up on lack of innovation in the last 2 months
2018-09-09T09:52:26 < dongs> yeah nobody sane can agree that shitty student-edition cuckcad is better than professional PCB software like Altium
2018-09-09T09:52:50 < dongs> like, i think $999 orcad/allegro lets you make 2L boards
2018-09-09T09:52:58 < dongs> which is what he has
2018-09-09T09:54:03 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfIu4juBaOw why does this exist
2018-09-09T09:54:14 < dongs> who the fuck thought it was a good idea
2018-09-09T09:57:48 < cjbaird> Someone disappointed by the lack of FaceRig Furry porn.
2018-09-09T09:58:25 < cjbaird> PS: sub-nanofarad adjustment of a magloop's capacitor now shits me.
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2018-09-09T10:00:03 < cjbaird> After today, I'll be doing the VK3YE trick of using RG6 and PCB scraps and only bothering with single-band loops
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2018-09-09T13:49:28 < Steffanx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=0&v=QBSELrm2-g0 ty for the tribute Thorn 
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2018-09-09T14:22:30 < Laurenceb_> https://postimg.cc/image/b5xinagpz/
2018-09-09T14:23:17 < Sadale> lol I've seen this one on reddit
2018-09-09T14:26:45 < Laurenceb_> not sure if shop
2018-09-09T14:26:49 < Laurenceb_> >Reddit
2018-09-09T14:31:19 < Sadale> It's an airport.
2018-09-09T14:31:37 < Sadale> here you go: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/sep/07/denver-airport-construction-conspiracy-lizard-people
2018-09-09T15:02:56 < BrainDamage> cjbaird: http://www.lz1aq.signacor.com/docs/wsml/wideband-active-sm-loop-antenna.htm
2018-09-09T15:07:04 < BrainDamage> cjbaird: also, you should add cjbeard to the highlight list
2018-09-09T15:09:50 < Steffanx> i pronounce his name as cj beard ( as well )
2018-09-09T15:13:00 < cjbaird> BrainDamage: Rx-only antenna, seemingly.. But I have a mate with a KiwiSDR how'll probably be interested.
2018-09-09T15:13:12 < BrainDamage> yes, rx-only
2018-09-09T15:13:31 < BrainDamage> impedance matching on a non-resonant antenna is just insane
2018-09-09T15:13:52 < BrainDamage> with rx you get away with some signal loss, with tx you end up with a burned frontend
2018-09-09T15:14:19 < cjbaird> "Baird, as in John Logie Inventor of Fucking Television Baird..."
2018-09-09T15:14:37 < BrainDamage> he should've gone for the glass razor instead
2018-09-09T15:15:01 < BrainDamage> also, you'll still be cjbeard here
2018-09-09T15:17:07 < cjbaird> This arvo had me thinking "a Collins rig with valves would be fantastic right now" a lot. I'd tune the magloop to ~1.3:1, but 15 minutes later it'd be at 3:1 for some reason. (Valves being a bit more tolerent of mismatch)
2018-09-09T15:17:44 < BrainDamage> orr, stop giving a fuck and use a spark gap transmitter
2018-09-09T15:20:05 < cjbaird> Did LAZORS a while back-- made a 
2018-09-09T15:20:55 < cjbaird> Did LAZORS a while back-- made a PWM'ing audio link and with fresnel lenses made it across the property here.
2018-09-09T15:21:43 < cjbaird> Current tetrahertz record is a cloudbounce from Tas to Melbourne, so still a while to go.
2018-09-09T15:22:06 < dongs> how much did that cost you vs just buying https://www.eurodk.com/en/products/mt-lhg/wireless-wire-dish
2018-09-09T15:22:58 < cjbaird> magloop used $12 gas pipe from Bunnings.. 
2018-09-09T15:23:42 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/ScDxl.png got some ethernet up in this shit
2018-09-09T15:24:23 < cjbaird> Wonder about that 60GHz band it wants to use.. 
2018-09-09T15:24:23 < dongs> err, what was tehre before?
2018-09-09T15:24:30 < dongs> cjbaird: what about it
2018-09-09T15:24:39 < dongs> its not like youre gonna get vanned in teh middle of nowhere, australia
2018-09-09T15:24:41 < dongs> for using 60ghz
2018-09-09T15:24:59 < zyp> dongs, https://bin.jvnv.net/file/BKkr8.png
2018-09-09T15:25:04 < cjbaird> ITU-3 bandplans are funky. 
2018-09-09T15:25:08 < dongs> oh edickson
2018-09-09T15:25:09 < dongs> right
2018-09-09T15:25:23 < Laurenceb_> https://postimg.cc/image/wia2ihron/ what the
2018-09-09T15:25:25 < zyp> just copied ethernet schematic from LL board
2018-09-09T15:25:47 < BrainDamage> dongs: magloops are for low freq communication, typically voice or extremely slow data, intercontinental ranges
2018-09-09T15:25:48 < dongs> Laurenceb_: Hi! It looks like you're engaging in activity not directly related to STM32 or electronics. May I suggest you tweet about it instead? Or perhaps make a stumble.upon? Or even better, just /msg ohsix directly? Thank you!
2018-09-09T15:26:00 < Laurenceb_> stumble upon
2018-09-09T15:26:03 < Laurenceb_> I remeber that
2018-09-09T15:26:08 < BrainDamage> dongs: pretty much things that only hams care about
2018-09-09T15:26:20 < BrainDamage> or spies, to listen to number stations
2018-09-09T15:27:28 < dongs> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StumbleUpon oh wow it was still around until 2018 june
2018-09-09T15:27:40 < cjbaird> Nup, AU doesn't have a ~60GHz ISM or the like.
2018-09-09T15:27:51 < dongs> good so sounds like its free to use
2018-09-09T15:28:09 < Laurenceb_> my homies https://postimg.cc/image/bzf6d9lfb/
2018-09-09T15:28:15 < zyp> dongs, you don't happen to have any 4L protos coming up any time soon? :p
2018-09-09T15:28:41 < cjbaird> Would need a Fixed ACMA licence..
2018-09-09T15:28:58 < dongs> zyp nothing right now but could change
2018-09-09T15:29:05 < dongs> ill keep tweeting if theres space
2018-09-09T15:29:11 < zyp> cool
2018-09-09T15:29:36 < zyp> I still need to get a buzzer on this thing
2018-09-09T15:29:37 < BrainDamage> I tought there was ~nobody in straya, if a radio transmiter sends in a fore and there's no one to receive, is it still illegal?
2018-09-09T15:29:55 < zyp> or maybe I should just put the buzzer on the display board
2018-09-09T15:30:09 < zyp> might make more sense
2018-09-09T15:31:27 < dongs> BrainDamage: that was my point
2018-09-09T15:31:42 < dongs> donno why hes even caring
2018-09-09T15:32:21 < Steffanx> is that the date o6 died dongs? :P
2018-09-09T15:32:41 < dongs> which one
2018-09-09T15:32:45 < dongs> when stumbleupon shutdown?
2018-09-09T15:32:58 < Steffanx> yeah
2018-09-09T15:32:58 < Steffanx> yea
2018-09-09T15:33:16 < BrainDamage> was he the only user?
2018-09-09T15:33:29 < Steffanx> wasnt he mr stumble upon?
2018-09-09T15:33:58 < BrainDamage> I have no idea, I stopped bothering reading this chat years ago
2018-09-09T15:34:03 < BrainDamage> his*
2018-09-09T15:37:08 < cjbaird> There's a whole heap of ways a transmission can get mixed and appear on non-harmonic frequencies, and if one of those is a VIP/Defense, you're in the shit.
2018-09-09T15:39:06 < cjbaird> (magloops are for low freq communication) -- very popular with the WSPR digital mode. Intercontinental on 100mW..
2018-09-09T15:39:32 < dongs> well i thought you were solving a problem or something
2018-09-09T15:39:37 < dongs> thats why I recommended a working solution
2018-09-09T15:39:44 < dongs> but if its jsut for autism yeahg knock youself outy
2018-09-09T15:43:43 < cjbaird> 1500m LoS links are so 1999
2018-09-09T15:44:24 < cjbaird> Mesh networking, brah
2018-09-09T15:47:27 < cjbaird> Would probably be good if it were legal here.. Got neighbours with fibre-to-the-premises NBN, whereas I have 4 kilometres of copper to go through because of some virtual boundary.
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2018-09-09T15:48:58 < dongs> my pal in au is running 5ghz microtik sxt shit for bouncing neighbor fiber.
2018-09-09T15:50:00 < dongs> fiber link is only 100mbit so it can saturate it just fine
2018-09-09T15:50:01 < cjbaird> We gdo have the 5.8GHz band at least.
2018-09-09T15:50:38 < dongs> https://www.eurodk.com/en/products/mt-sxt/sxt-sa5-ac
2018-09-09T15:51:53 < cjbaird> Internet's not really something I'm fussed paying monies for these days anyway. Teenage ASMR girlies on Youtube is about it for me.
2018-09-09T15:51:54 < dongs>  https://www.eurodk.com/en/products/mt-sxt/sxt-5-ac or maybe this, one of those shits anyway.
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2018-09-09T16:06:54 < zyp> dongs, I'm a little tempted to pick up one of these later: https://www.eurodk.com/en/products/24-ports/cloud-router-switch-328-24p-4s-rm
2018-09-09T16:09:25 < zyp> I don't really need that many ports, but I want something that got both PoE ports and SFP+ ports
2018-09-09T16:11:29 < cjbaird> That first dish, from a local dealer bond by consumer laws: https://shop.duxtel.com.au/product_info.php?products_id=536&osCsid=ff6l7vgpt8dgtjdsl6m6d1p8a0
2018-09-09T16:12:48 < cjbaird> yeah nah https://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:License#License_Levels .. L3 on that dish, only allows a single active user.
2018-09-09T16:13:38 < dongs> ??????????????
2018-09-09T16:13:43 < dongs> "user" of what?
2018-09-09T16:13:50 < dongs> they're just dumb lan>wifi bridges
2018-09-09T16:13:59 < dongs> i have tons of computers on both ends with no issues
2018-09-09T16:14:03 < dongs> wtf crack are you smoking
2018-09-09T16:14:33 < dongs> zyp: uh i think ih ave that.. hm no mine was only 150-something
2018-09-09T16:14:42 < dongs> is that the poe version?
2018-09-09T16:14:42 < dongs> ah
2018-09-09T16:14:50 < zyp> yeah, it's fairly new
2018-09-09T16:15:33 < zyp> I don't really need that many PoE ports, but I need some, and I don't want to have one switch for PoE and one switch for 10 GbE
2018-09-09T16:16:50 < BrainDamage> cjbaird: "RouterBOARD devices come preinstalled with a RouterOS license, if you have purchased a RouterBOARD device, nothing must be done regarding the license."
2018-09-09T16:17:06 < BrainDamage> cjbaird: you need to pay for a license only if your want to install the os on your shit
2018-09-09T16:17:35 < dongs> cjbaird: eurodk ships internationally, my AU pal receievd the shit without any issues.
2018-09-09T16:17:49 < dongs> whats that reseller gonna do, get in trouble if you block some milspec transmissions?
2018-09-09T16:23:51 < cjbaird> Yep. Ask the guys who got reamed importing Baofengs..
2018-09-09T16:24:56 < BrainDamage> you're mixing things, for ISM bands the responsibility is on the seller
2018-09-09T16:25:05 < BrainDamage> for ham radio equipment, the responsibility is on the buyer
2018-09-09T16:25:26 < BrainDamage> for ISM equipment, the equipment is type-accepted by going through regulation approval
2018-09-09T16:25:34 < BrainDamage> for ham radio, it's self policing
2018-09-09T16:25:45 < cjbaird> 60GHz isn't ISM here.
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2018-09-09T16:27:10 < tctw> innowaiterz
2018-09-09T16:34:02 < tctw> dongs, when I have a hierarchical sheet in my altidongs schematic, and I renamed a port inside of the child sheet, how do I update the port name on the hierarchical green box?
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2018-09-09T16:48:43 < dongs> tctw: same way, right click ports update or osmeshit, its pretty self-explasnatory there
2018-09-09T16:48:47 < dongs> i think tis called sync ports or someshit
2018-09-09T16:54:55 < tctw> dongs, didn't find anything like that hence I asked
2018-09-09T16:54:57 < tctw> still couldn't find it
2018-09-09T16:55:04 < zyp> look better :p
2018-09-09T16:59:56 < dongs> tctw: are you blind, right click sheet symbol actions / sycnronize bla bla
2018-09-09T17:00:06 < dongs> i dont have any design with renamed shit but im pretty sure thats wehre it pops up a thing to rename them
2018-09-09T17:00:24 < dongs> you rightclick the green box in main sheet etc.
2018-09-09T17:01:27 < tctw> got it
2018-09-09T17:01:31 < tctw> was clicking the port all the time
2018-09-09T17:01:32 < tctw> thanks!
2018-09-09T17:01:57 < zyp> what'cha innovating?
2018-09-09T17:02:06 < tctw> wireless charging
2018-09-09T17:02:08 < tctw> very innovative
2018-09-09T17:02:11 < zyp> heh
2018-09-09T17:02:11 < dongs> heh
2018-09-09T17:02:18 < dongs> i did 10W stuff using some NXP shit.
2018-09-09T17:02:24 < zyp> I innovated some ethernet today
2018-09-09T17:02:36 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/ScDxl.png
2018-09-09T17:02:36 < tctw> I need <1 W
2018-09-09T17:02:38 < dongs> copypasted reference design, sold like 20k boards
2018-09-09T17:02:50 < tctw> space is the main concern here
2018-09-09T17:03:06 < tctw> using bq51013b and bq24050
2018-09-09T17:03:10 < tctw> pretty much reference design as well, tho
2018-09-09T17:05:33 < tctw> doing BGA the first time
2018-09-09T17:05:41 < zyp> fun fun
2018-09-09T17:05:52 < tctw> BQ51013BYFPT is small af
2018-09-09T17:06:15 < tctw> like they didn't even try to make it big enough to handle it manually
2018-09-09T17:07:02 < vampi-the-frog> just get a breakout board and stop complaining, chompsky-honk
2018-09-09T17:07:37 < tctw> as established earlier in this conversation space is the main concern here. so a breakout board is a no-no
2018-09-09T17:07:56 < tctw> also, this is expected to sell in 50k quantits
2018-09-09T17:08:24 < karlp> yet you're moaning abot it being small.
2018-09-09T17:08:31 < karlp> you're hard to please arenðt you :)
2018-09-09T17:08:39 < tctw> you guys must not understand how sarcasm works
2018-09-09T17:08:43 < tctw> maximum autism detected
2018-09-09T17:08:45 < tctw> call the blaxter
2018-09-09T17:08:45 < karlp> no, you're just bad at it.
2018-09-09T17:08:52 < tctw> lol :d
2018-09-09T17:09:01 < vampi-the-frog> chompsky-honk dweeb
2018-09-09T17:16:02 < Laurenceb_> le château autiste
2018-09-09T17:17:55 < vampi-the-frog> Life. You could say it started when I was a kid. Like most folks, I've always been different. But not like the others.
2018-09-09T17:18:12 < vampi-the-frog> Other kids could be cruel. They'd call me names. Dweeb. Chimp. Honkey. Dweeby chimp. Honkey dweeb. And worst of all, chompskey honk.
2018-09-09T17:18:20 < vampi-the-frog> Did you know there's over 87 combinations of those soul scalding words? I found out the hard way. Life.
2018-09-09T17:18:42 < Laurenceb_> kek wut
2018-09-09T17:24:27 < vampi-the-frog> http://www.adultswim.com/videos/xavier-renegade-angel/what-life-d-d-doth/
2018-09-09T17:25:32 < friendofafriend> Noam Chompskey-Honk?
2018-09-09T17:26:29 < vampi-the-frog> now is not the best time, but your brother died of a shameful lifestyle choice
2018-09-09T17:30:18 < tctw> so in altium, when I have a mosfet that has multiple physical pins connected to the same logical one, how do I do that in altium, dongs? I thought I can just have  "4,5,6" as designator, but then only the last pin is used when I look at the component on the PCB
2018-09-09T17:32:21 < dongs> you can just have multiple pins naemd same
2018-09-09T17:32:30 < dongs> i.e. G, DDD, SSSS
2018-09-09T17:32:38 < dongs> for 8-pin mosfet footprint
2018-09-09T17:33:03 < tctw> but I need one pin in the component schematic per pad then?
2018-09-09T17:33:10 < tctw> and just hide the ones that suck?
2018-09-09T17:33:20 < dongs> you only need 3 pins in schematic
2018-09-09T17:33:23 < dongs> G, D, S
2018-09-09T17:33:39 < englishman> name them all the same
2018-09-09T17:33:45 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/gIM6lrf.png here's my PowerSO or someshit footprint
2018-09-09T17:33:50 < tctw> dongs, and now I have SOIC-8 footprint where D is on pin 5 and 6
2018-09-09T17:33:51 < englishman> or hire a professional
2018-09-09T17:34:13 < dongs> tctw: copy it and rename it to SO8-MOSFET or something and rename pins.
2018-09-09T17:34:13 < tctw> dongs, but how does your schematic symbol look like?
2018-09-09T17:34:20 < zyp> duplicate footprint, rename pins from 1-8 to GSD
2018-09-09T17:34:22 < tctw> ah
2018-09-09T17:34:29 < tctw> I don't want to do that :p
2018-09-09T17:34:30 < tctw> seems silly
2018-09-09T17:34:35 < englishman> regular MOSFET in schematic
2018-09-09T17:34:36 < tctw> it's SOIC after all
2018-09-09T17:34:45 < dongs> wut
2018-09-09T17:34:49 < tctw> so how do you map ONE PIN in the schematic to TWO PADs in the footprint?
2018-09-09T17:34:54 < dongs> therels like several diffefent variants of just SO-8
2018-09-09T17:34:58 < dongs> the wide/narrow etc shit
2018-09-09T17:35:03 < zyp> tctw, by giving them the same designator
2018-09-09T17:35:05 < dongs> why the fuck care about having more than one name for it
2018-09-09T17:35:07 < englishman> I think this might be too complex
2018-09-09T17:35:23 < dongs> tctw: you don't, it just does it automatically, negro
2018-09-09T17:35:33 < dongs> pin with 'D" in schematic will map to all the Ds in PCB layout
2018-09-09T17:35:48 < englishman> start by renaming the pins the same like you were told 3x and go from there
2018-09-09T17:35:51 < tctw> yes, which means that I need a special/separate footprint for just that shitty mosfet, right?
2018-09-09T17:35:59 < zyp> yep
2018-09-09T17:36:02 < tctw> and then I end up with 1284 different SOIC footprints
2018-09-09T17:36:12 < zyp> so what?
2018-09-09T17:36:15 < dongs> well, my current PCB library has liek 4 SO8 variants
2018-09-09T17:36:16 < dongs> so what
2018-09-09T17:36:41 < englishman> the footprints are different, these are shorted together
2018-09-09T17:37:21 < englishman> do you really have any powerSO or whatever with different pin assignment
2018-09-09T17:37:29 < englishman> it's not an soic
2018-09-09T17:38:29 < tctw> I see
2018-09-09T17:40:57 < dongs> the above footprint i have works fine with 3-pin GDS mosfet symbol in schematic.
2018-09-09T17:41:06 < dongs> even tho theres like 3 D pins.
2018-09-09T17:41:17 < dongs> er, 3 S pins
2018-09-09T17:47:05 < karlp> "I want to use parts with different footprints, but I don't want to make footprints for them"
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2018-09-09T17:58:28 < englishman> I again suggest that you hire a professional
2018-09-09T17:58:51 < englishman> or maybe try Arduino. maybe electronics are not for you
2018-09-09T18:01:26 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/iNyqJ4c.png
2018-09-09T18:01:29 < bitmask> 15 hours in
2018-09-09T18:01:30 < bitmask> guess 25 hours was a low estimate :/
2018-09-09T18:02:10 < karlp> that's the moon again right?
2018-09-09T18:02:22 < bitmask> yea, attempt #2
2018-09-09T18:02:34 < karlp> can't even imagine trying to leave somthing like that running here.
2018-09-09T18:02:42 < bitmask> kids?
2018-09-09T18:02:45 < karlp> yeah
2018-09-09T18:02:48 < bitmask> ahh
2018-09-09T18:03:16 < bitmask> you would need a room with biometric locks :)
2018-09-09T18:03:21 < karlp> not enough space either really. I've got a desk which is nice, but if it needs more than jumperwire it's gotta get taken into work.
2018-09-09T18:04:45 < bitmask> I don't have much room either but no kids to worry about.  My bed is my work desk except soldering is done on this crappy 3 tier drawer thing at the moment.  staying at gf's parents doesnt leave many options
2018-09-09T18:07:01 < karlp> yeah, I can always go into the office so I don't try real hard to "make a system" of any sort at home
2018-09-09T18:09:11 < Steffanx> You need a "karlp" shed in the backyard
2018-09-09T18:09:19 < karlp> yeah, next house maybe.
2018-09-09T18:10:02 < bitmask> I'm glad I went with the 5 inch moon, looks like a good size
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2018-09-09T18:22:30 < zyp> karlp, you could do like jpa- and fence off part of the living room :p
2018-09-09T18:22:42 < karlp> hah
2018-09-09T18:22:45 < karlp> no, too small.
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2018-09-09T19:10:06 < Laurenceb_> how do you extinguish patriarchy?
2018-09-09T19:10:18 < Laurenceb_> using empowered female firefighters
2018-09-09T19:12:34 < Laurenceb_> why did the mansplainer drown in a puddle?
2018-09-09T19:12:39 < Laurenceb_> it was a well actually
2018-09-09T19:24:41 < karlp> anyknow if any of those usb current /voltage monitors can be spoken to? to get the data out, or just via the lcd display?
2018-09-09T19:25:59 < karlp> like these https://www.banggood.com/RUIDENG-UM24UM24C-USB-2_0-Color-LCD-Display-Tester-Voltage-Current-Meter-p-1240574.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN
2018-09-09T19:26:06 < karlp> says it has an app, so I guess the data is available one way or another
2018-09-09T19:26:16 < dongs> o yeah those are all over
2018-09-09T19:26:27 < dongs> various clones, by XYZstudio or wahtever other places too
2018-09-09T19:26:34 < dongs> they usually just have jewtooth
2018-09-09T19:26:37 < dongs> BLE or whatever
2018-09-09T19:26:40 < dongs> and some chinky app
2018-09-09T19:26:56 < dongs> YZXStudio
2018-09-09T19:27:17 < karlp> not real excited about running their apps 
2018-09-09T19:27:18 < dongs> i see a BT module inside of mine between pcbs
2018-09-09T19:27:53 < karlp> yeah, the ruideng oens have an option for bt or not.
2018-09-09T19:28:01 < karlp> there seems to be rx/tx pins exposed too,
2018-09-09T19:28:05 < karlp> whatever that means.
2018-09-09T19:28:28 < karlp> yzx is way more $
2018-09-09T19:28:32 < karlp> I wonder what the differences really are
2018-09-09T19:28:44 < dongs> no clue
2018-09-09T19:28:55 < dongs> mine looks similar to that ruideng shit
2018-09-09T19:29:01 < dongs> side usb port, bt module inside
2018-09-09T19:30:56 < dongs> what do you need to log anyway
2018-09-09T19:31:49 < dongs> haha this usb-c one i have is assembled backwards
2018-09-09T19:32:06 < dongs> teh back PCB labels are reversed, there's a HID label next to usb port
2018-09-09T19:32:10 < dongs> but its on the opposite side
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2018-09-09T19:33:03 < karlp> nothing in particular, but have this little allwhiner board that I wouldn't mind watching it in different modes, 
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2018-09-09T19:33:48 < dongs> well this thing is a scam
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2018-09-09T19:33:51 < dongs> USB port doesnt do shit
2018-09-09T19:33:56 < dongs> not HID or anything.
2018-09-09T19:33:57 < dongs> :)
2018-09-09T19:34:14 < mawk> if it's mounted backwards maybe something else is
2018-09-09T19:34:31 < mawk> they mounted backwards the mcu too maybe
2018-09-09T19:34:41 < dongs> nah it works with onscreen stuff
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2018-09-09T19:36:30 < dongs> hah it uses some EFM trash
2018-09-09T19:37:22 < karlp> yeah, I'm not buying one that I can't talk to.
2018-09-09T19:37:41 < karlp> (not another one anyway)
2018-09-09T19:39:27 < dongs> oh waht lo
2018-09-09T19:39:31 < dongs> its GD32 
2018-09-09T19:39:32 < dongs> not EFM
2018-09-09T19:39:37 < dongs> GD32F150G8U6
2018-09-09T19:39:48 < dongs> STM clonez
2018-09-09T19:39:58 < mawk> stm clone
2018-09-09T19:40:07 < mawk> I thought stm was already cheap
2018-09-09T19:40:13 < mawk> and was the thing used to clone other stuff
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2018-09-09T19:40:40 < dongs> http://cn.gigadevice.com/product-series/16.html?locale=en_US
2018-09-09T19:40:47 < dongs> they even stole ST's shitty parametric table javascript
2018-09-09T19:41:11 < mawk> what's that terrible right-alignment
2018-09-09T19:41:41 < dongs> well that part is $0.66 in singles on taobao apparently
2018-09-09T19:41:44 < dongs> so yeah, its cheaper than ST
2018-09-09T19:41:53 < dongs> QFN28 version of F0-something is way more
2018-09-09T19:41:56 < dongs> and this is M3
2018-09-09T19:42:01 < dongs> @ 72mhz, 64k flash
2018-09-09T19:42:57 -!- Rickta59 [~kimballr@unaffiliated/rickta59] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-09T19:44:49 < mawk> http://cn.gigadevice.com/article/detail/80.html?locale=en_US
2018-09-09T19:45:30 < mawk> even dodgy clones companies are inventing new things
2018-09-09T19:45:41 < mawk> or rather, people inventing new things are willing to work for dodgy clone companies
2018-09-09T19:46:00 < dongs> gigadevice is an official arm IP licensor tho
2018-09-09T19:46:04 < dongs> they're listed on arm.com adn shit.
2018-09-09T19:46:07 < dongs> so they're far from dodgy
2018-09-09T19:46:16 < dongs> they just hapepend to borrow some ST IP from somewhere.
2018-09-09T19:46:24 < mawk> I see
2018-09-09T19:46:46 < mawk> the terrible css layout and the disabling of right-click looked dodgy to me
2018-09-09T19:47:02 < BrainDamage> one of my friends accidentally found an effect in PCM because their setup was incredibly shit and was running the cells at such slow speed nobody else bothered with
2018-09-09T19:47:04 < dongs> thats just typical chinashit site
2018-09-09T19:47:31 < dongs> pcm?
2018-09-09T19:47:40 < BrainDamage> phase change memory
2018-09-09T19:48:11 < dongs> o
2018-09-09T19:53:47 < jpa-> karlp, zyp: heh, i've been also thinking about getting a office instead of a corner in living room :)
2018-09-09T19:53:52 < Rickta59> with the stm32f1 series, is there a priority for which alternate function is used ... I was trying to initialize all my peripheral clocks in one swoop .. but it that fails for me if i have a pin that has both a timer and a i2c feature .. can i only turn on the peripheral clock for one of them at a time?
2018-09-09T19:54:45 < Rickta59> i see that there is an order in the reference manual, is that the order of alt io used?
2018-09-09T19:55:04 < jpa-> f1 is a mess in that respect
2018-09-09T19:55:19 < Rickta59> yeah the newere ones are much nicer in that regard
2018-09-09T19:56:31 < Rickta59> take PB10 for instance, it shows I2C2_SCL/
2018-09-09T19:56:33 < Rickta59> USART3_TX(9)
2018-09-09T19:57:11 < Rickta59> i was having a problem getting USART3 to work and then i didn't enable the i2c2 peripheral clock and it then worked
2018-09-09T19:58:24 < Rickta59> is that how it works?
2018-09-09T19:58:43 < Rickta59> either i2c or usart3 .. i mean it would make sense
2018-09-09T19:59:13 < Rickta59> i certainly like the newer way of picking a specific alternate function
2018-09-09T19:59:28 < Rickta59> most chips i've worked on took that approach
2018-09-09T20:04:09 < mawk> I'm looking at transceivers/MCUs for 802.15.4/6LoWPAN
2018-09-09T20:04:55 < mawk> so either I use a mcu (and I don't want to) and then I have the terribly complicated 802.15.4 radio code already at hand, either I use a plain sub-GHz transceiver with the proper modulation and do 802.15.4 myself
2018-09-09T20:05:09 < mawk> both alternatives look bad
2018-09-09T20:06:20 < mawk> I did nothing for 5 months, now I have to deliver this for december
2018-09-09T20:06:32 < mawk> I hope I won't have to implement the full 802.15.4 thing myself
2018-09-09T20:25:07 < englishman> tctw: so
2018-09-09T20:25:09 < englishman> what you can do
2018-09-09T20:25:19 < englishman> is make one sch pin for each real pin
2018-09-09T20:25:25 < englishman> put them on top of each other in sch
2018-09-09T20:25:34 < englishman> hide the number for the one underneath
2018-09-09T20:25:45 < englishman> and make the text label say like 4,5,6
2018-09-09T20:25:55 < tctw> englishman, well you can just hide the entire pin too
2018-09-09T20:26:00 < tctw> no need for stacking workaround
2018-09-09T20:26:03 < englishman> would the line still connect?
2018-09-09T20:26:07 < tctw> ah
2018-09-09T20:26:08 < tctw> no idea
2018-09-09T20:26:11 < englishman> when you draw a trace to it
2018-09-09T20:26:26 < tctw> doesn't matter anymore, decided to go with csd75207w15 instead
2018-09-09T20:26:30 < englishman> nice
2018-09-09T20:26:33 < tctw> (not due to this question from earlier)
2018-09-09T20:27:10 < englishman> 1.5x1.5mm
2018-09-09T20:27:49 < tctw> yep, a bit more compact than an SOIC-8
2018-09-09T20:28:42 < englishman> a bit yeah
2018-09-09T20:28:50 < englishman> and not too bad thermal performance
2018-09-09T20:29:22 < englishman> still multiple drain pins
2018-09-09T20:29:31 < englishman> but no copypaste soic8 footprint
2018-09-09T20:30:16 < tctw> it takes like 3 minutes to make that footprint (already done)
2018-09-09T20:30:40 < englishman> as it should
2018-09-09T20:30:46 < englishman> probably 30 in kikecad
2018-09-09T20:30:53 < englishman> by editing textfiles or something
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2018-09-09T20:36:07 < Steffanx> Why so hateful today mr englishman. Did the cat do something bad to you?
2018-09-09T20:36:53 < englishman> i dont hate, its bad for health
2018-09-09T20:37:16 < tctw> also alcohol
2018-09-09T20:37:43 < Steffanx> https://time.is/Canada seems like a perfect alcohol time to me indeed
2018-09-09T20:38:03 < englishman> ah yes that canadian standard time
2018-09-09T20:38:28 < Steffanx> Do they have a wife beater beer in canada?
2018-09-09T20:38:31 < tctw> that clock seems of, it's 19:38
2018-09-09T20:38:43 < Steffanx> https://time.is/Tectuland seems like a perfect alcohol time to me indeed
2018-09-09T20:38:58 < tctw> I'm actually sipping on a whiskey
2018-09-09T20:39:35 < Steffanx> its time for coffee
2018-09-09T20:55:35 < BrainDamage> you should have absinth
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2018-09-09T20:57:58 < Steffanx> why sir mr BrainDamage ?
2018-09-09T20:59:21 < BrainDamage> because absinth is swiss ofc
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2018-09-09T21:38:55 < tctw> are you talking about alcohol? Please keep in mind that minors may be attending this chat room.
2018-09-09T21:40:57 < karlp> mawk: what are you oding 802.15.4 with subgig? that's a wild garbage frontier
2018-09-09T21:41:05 < karlp> all proper 802.15.4 is 2.4gig like god intended
2018-09-09T21:54:11 < qyx> fuk 2.4gig
2018-09-09T21:54:38 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-09T21:54:44 < qyx> I would do sub-1GHz 6lowpan if I could
2018-09-09T21:54:58 < zyp> slowpan
2018-09-09T21:55:13 < qyx> anyway, has anyone seen a develboard with L4+ and that hyperram/hyperflash?
2018-09-09T21:55:43 < qyx> it looks cool
2018-09-09T21:55:47 < qyx> although bga only
2018-09-09T21:56:04 < qyx> 1mm pith 5x5 balls, so doable
2018-09-09T21:58:11 -!- tctw [~tctw@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-09T21:59:34 < englishman> i fear tectu may self-harm over this footprint thing
2018-09-09T21:59:47 < Laurenceb_> 2.4ghz is the javascript of rf
2018-09-09T22:00:59 < Steffanx> At least it's not LORA.
2018-09-09T22:01:18 < Steffanx> lol, backstabber englishman. Talking behind his back.
2018-09-09T22:01:38 < englishman> lorawan has been rock-solid since friday night
2018-09-09T22:01:59 < Steffanx> Found a solution for your TNN->whatever you now use?
2018-09-09T22:02:11 < Steffanx> if yes, what
2018-09-09T22:02:20 < englishman> incucksdb
2018-09-09T22:02:30 < englishman> the telegraf plugin is a mqtt client
2018-09-09T22:02:43 < Steffanx> did you hire Laurenceb_ like someone suggested?
2018-09-09T22:03:05 < englishman> no it was super e z like 1h to set everything up including installing ubuntu
2018-09-09T22:04:43 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/A2XfrI9.png
2018-09-09T22:04:47 < englishman> per device rssi logs
2018-09-09T22:05:08 < qyx> your graphs are dark
2018-09-09T22:05:16 < qyx> wehats that, graphite or grafana?
2018-09-09T22:05:22 < Laurenceb_> w e w
2018-09-09T22:05:23 < englishman> chronograf
2018-09-09T22:05:27 < englishman> the default crap
2018-09-09T22:05:34 < englishman> idk why ALL these modern graphy things are dark
2018-09-09T22:05:47 < Laurenceb_> >chronograf, >graphana, mqtt > telegraph > influxdb
2018-09-09T22:05:51 < Laurenceb_> the absolute state
2018-09-09T22:06:00 < englishman> all the ##stm32 meme tech
2018-09-09T22:06:04 < Steffanx> dark graphs are the best graphs
2018-09-09T22:06:07 < englishman> plus protobufs for config stuff to another program
2018-09-09T22:06:25 < Laurenceb_> not gnu-octave and latex then emailed pdfs
2018-09-09T22:06:33 < englishman> emailed postscript
2018-09-09T22:06:44 < Laurenceb_> the way to do it
2018-09-09T22:07:22 < Laurenceb_> since when are the users qualified to scroll though shitty barely processed data
2018-09-09T22:07:38 < englishman> now i can add metrics like time-since-last-packet and have an alert sent to an irc bot
2018-09-09T22:07:52 < englishman> to alert all of YOU to lorawan's failing
2018-09-09T22:07:56 < englishman> which won't happen of course
2018-09-09T22:08:10 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@2a02:8070:a19d:2500:895:9bd2:93ed:3afb] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-09T22:08:13 < Laurenceb_> they can read an autogenerated pdf once a month when something actually happens
2018-09-09T22:11:57 < Laurenceb_> memetech uni guy has funding to do more shit with his led growlamps with zigbee and shit
2018-09-09T22:12:03 < Laurenceb_> the absolute state
2018-09-09T22:13:16 < englishman> the same led growlamps with no heatsinking
2018-09-09T22:13:31 < Laurenceb_> yes
2018-09-09T22:13:36 < englishman> from years ago
2018-09-09T22:13:45 < Laurenceb_> yeah
2018-09-09T22:14:00 < qyx> he should migrate to btle
2018-09-09T22:14:04 < englishman> well your axsem suggestion has made me behind schedule by 2 years
2018-09-09T22:14:11 < qyx> lol
2018-09-09T22:14:19 < englishman> so i can see how things might move slowly
2018-09-09T22:14:54 < qyx> are you chronographing for your soil sensors?
2018-09-09T22:15:02 < englishman> kinda
2018-09-09T22:15:12 < Laurenceb_> kek I trolld englishman
2018-09-09T22:15:19 < Laurenceb_> why didnt u email axsemi
2018-09-09T22:15:24 < englishman> they dont exist
2018-09-09T22:15:47 < englishman> theres some shit now with the local university and tdr soil humidity sensors
2018-09-09T22:16:01 < qyx> like real tdr?
2018-09-09T22:16:08 < englishman> since they have the funding for 3g everything i might ditch lorawan altogether, until they find how poor 3g coverage is
2018-09-09T22:16:08 < qyx> not cust capsensing?
2018-09-09T22:16:10 < englishman> yeah
2018-09-09T22:16:30 < englishman> they have some hueg 6L board with all the innovations on it
2018-09-09T22:17:10 < qyx> are they able to measure the full profile with it?
2018-09-09T22:17:18 < qyx> I mean along the sensing wire
2018-09-09T22:17:30 < qyx> deep under the ground surface
2018-09-09T22:17:41 < Laurenceb_> I was thinking of making led growlamps as a business
2018-09-09T22:17:53 < Laurenceb_> then I work out the economics and its pointless
2018-09-09T22:18:02 < qyx> once I was investigating if it is possible to do such tdr with stm32
2018-09-09T22:18:07 < Laurenceb_> payback time for users would be decades
2018-09-09T22:18:15 < Laurenceb_> by which time leds would be dead
2018-09-09T22:19:08 < englishman> idk tbh
2018-09-09T22:19:12 < englishman> in negotiations
2018-09-09T22:19:29 < catphish> morning stm32 humans
2018-09-09T22:19:56 < Laurenceb_> the only way to sell led growlamps would be with memetics
2018-09-09T22:20:04 < Laurenceb_> le epin led is da future dude
2018-09-09T22:20:05 < BrainDamage> Laurenceb_: as long as they buy them, it doesn't matter
2018-09-09T22:20:10 < Laurenceb_> yeah
2018-09-09T22:20:52 < zyp> I've got some led growlamps
2018-09-09T22:20:55 < zyp> what are we talking about?
2018-09-09T22:21:25 < zyp> catphish, you here now?
2018-09-09T22:21:32 < catphish> i am technically here now
2018-09-09T22:21:45 < zyp> cool, I wanted to ask you about the buzzer you used
2018-09-09T22:23:08 < catphish> zyp: PKMCS0909E4000
2018-09-09T22:23:15 < englishman> yeah hid are far cheaper
2018-09-09T22:23:53 < catphish> zyp: it resonates at 4kHz, it's quite audible but not loud enough for my application
2018-09-09T22:25:34 < zyp> how do you drive it?
2018-09-09T22:26:42 < catphish> with a square wave out of an stm32 gpio, now that you mention it, i have no idea if it's being limited by the GPIO current supply capability
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2018-09-09T22:26:56 < qyx> voltage rather
2018-09-09T22:27:04 < zyp> how does it respond to other freqs than 4kHz?
2018-09-09T22:27:17 < zyp> qyx, power rather, if we're being pedantic
2018-09-09T22:28:00 < catphish> zyp: actually, it resonates at 8kHz - see datasheet page 3 for frequency response https://www.murata.com/en-us/api/pdfdownloadapi?cate=&partno=PKMCS0909E4000-R1
2018-09-09T22:28:24 < zyp> looking at it
2018-09-09T22:28:45 < zyp> looks like you can feed it all sort of freqs
2018-09-09T22:28:47 < catphish> i drive it at 4kHz using stm32 GPIO, it seems to be more audible at that frequency, i don't know if it's being limited by the GPIO current limit
2018-09-09T22:28:57 < catphish> yeah, it works at pretty much any audible frequency
2018-09-09T22:29:14 < catphish> but i fount it to be the most audible at 4kHz in my brief testing
2018-09-09T22:29:51 < Steffanx> your ears are broken?
2018-09-09T22:29:59 < catphish> yes
2018-09-09T22:30:07 < catphish> probably, i'm a meat sack
2018-09-09T22:30:11 < zyp> I figure I'd buffer it with a n-fet
2018-09-09T22:30:21 < catphish> yes, i likely should do that
2018-09-09T22:30:27 < Steffanx> anyway, 72dB  isnt THAT much (i think) especially not for something you plan to use outside.
2018-09-09T22:30:43 < qyx> mhm, you should be able to pull ~20mA from a gpio pin
2018-09-09T22:30:49 < zyp> catphish, any particular reason you picked that buzzer in particular?
2018-09-09T22:30:53 < catphish> it's enough for indoor use, but i want to use it outdoors, not enough for that
2018-09-09T22:31:44 < catphish> zyp: i looked at it because it was in the standard kicad library, it seemed like a good place to start, it was cheap
2018-09-09T22:31:59 < Streaker> the datasheet says 65dB at 1.5V 
2018-09-09T22:32:14 < Streaker> how is it not loud enough?
2018-09-09T22:32:27 < Steffanx> lol catphish, dont let the english guy know you picked something because it had a foot print in kicad.
2018-09-09T22:32:35 < catphish> lol
2018-09-09T22:33:17 < catphish> i picked it more as a starting point than a final part, but now i'm annoyed because i dont know if it's being limited by its own design, or by the current supply of the GPIO
2018-09-09T22:33:47 < catphish> i suspect the former
2018-09-09T22:34:17 < zyp> put a scope to the gpio, look at the waveform
2018-09-09T22:34:48 < catphish> the voltage will be telling?
2018-09-09T22:35:08 < zyp> you know how current limiting works?
2018-09-09T22:35:26 < catphish> i do
2018-09-09T22:35:28 < zyp> well, strictly it's not even current limiting
2018-09-09T22:35:38 < zyp> but the more you load it, the more the voltage drops
2018-09-09T22:35:50 < catphish> yeah, i suppose i know that :)
2018-09-09T22:35:52 < zyp> and when the voltage drops, current tends to too, so power squared drops
2018-09-09T22:36:15 < catphish> i'll look at that then before i make a decision about the part
2018-09-09T22:37:36 < zyp> hmm, wonder if a n-fet alone is sufficient, or if it needs to be driven both ways
2018-09-09T22:38:20 < Steffanx> that's not what they do in the recommended circuit in the datasheet
2018-09-09T22:38:43 < karlp> can't you get little buzzers that just have an on/off and the buzz themselves?
2018-09-09T22:38:44 < zyp> ah, right, the recommended circuit is using a npn
2018-09-09T22:38:47 < catphish> they just drive it one way in the datasheey
2018-09-09T22:39:03 < zyp> karlp, I want to be able to choose the freq
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2018-09-09T22:39:12 < karlp> fair enough.
2018-09-09T22:39:32 < karlp> need those chiptunes and phone app modem mnoise decodign for field debug rite?
2018-09-09T22:39:48 < zyp> haha, my laundry machine has that
2018-09-09T22:39:50 < catphish> it's not at all clear to me if it would benefit from more voltage, or being driven both ways
2018-09-09T22:40:10 < zyp> catphish, well, you are driving it both ways
2018-09-09T22:40:53 < catphish> sort of, i drive it both ways between +3v3 and 0v
2018-09-09T22:41:04 < catphish> but not to a negative voltage
2018-09-09T22:41:24 < zyp> well, neither do the example circuit
2018-09-09T22:41:29 < zyp> but it's transistor buffered
2018-09-09T22:41:30 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-09T22:41:38 < zyp> so that's probably a good idea
2018-09-09T22:41:46 < catphish> they drive it to 0v with a 1k resistor
2018-09-09T22:41:47 < Steffanx> No npn transistor/n-fet in the house and a power supply catphish? Just solder some wires to your board and try it?
2018-09-09T22:41:52 < catphish> which makes me thing it doesn't need much current
2018-09-09T22:42:04 < catphish> *think
2018-09-09T22:42:12 < zyp> I suggest what Steffanx suggests
2018-09-09T22:42:18 < zyp> second*
2018-09-09T22:42:45 < catphish> the 1k resistor suggests to me it only needs a couple of mA
2018-09-09T22:42:59 < zyp> I want to use this in my own design, but I want to know it can be made to work satisfyingly before I design it in :)
2018-09-09T22:43:19 < catphish> how loud do you need it?
2018-09-09T22:43:20 < Steffanx> Doesnt dongs say he uses it as well?
2018-09-09T22:43:26 < Steffanx> *didnt
2018-09-09T22:43:32 < catphish> for an indoor confirmation of a card read, my setup is plenty
2018-09-09T22:44:30 < catphish> on the other hand, one doesn't want to risk damaging the GPIO pin, so i should check it's not current limited by the STM32
2018-09-09T22:44:34 < zyp> Steffanx, dunno, when?
2018-09-09T22:44:48 < Steffanx> weeks ago, when catphish mentioned what he used
2018-09-09T22:44:59 < zyp> oh, okay
2018-09-09T22:45:02 < zyp> gonna look that up
2018-09-09T22:45:11 < catphish> zyp: https://i.imgur.com/dhR39jW.mp4 << turn on the sound
2018-09-09T22:45:40 < catphish> i realise this isn't terribly useful, but it's what i've got
2018-09-09T22:47:05 < Steffanx> Whoa that's terrible. Compared to the background noise
2018-09-09T22:48:18 < catphish> yeah, it's loud enough to be indicative indoors, but no more :(
2018-09-09T22:48:35 < Steffanx> http://static6.arrow.com/aropdfconversion/9db1e0a310a6ff1fe6bb2ccedda44bb858fd3e78/42865889783995536f-hcw06-lf.pdf use something like that. I have real life experience iwht it, and its awful P
2018-09-09T22:48:48 < catphish> and that's driving to +3v3 and 0v using GPIO
2018-09-09T22:49:02 < Steffanx> but not fancy pants smd
2018-09-09T22:49:02 < zyp> for my application, I need it to be audible at a couple of meters outdoor
2018-09-09T22:49:17 < catphish> zyp: same here
2018-09-09T22:49:26 < Steffanx> with awful i mean: awfully loud
2018-09-09T22:49:43 < branjb> is it just me or is the usb connection on nucleo boards extremely finicky?
2018-09-09T22:49:52 < branjb> seems like if you look at it wrong it becomes disconnected
2018-09-09T22:50:18 < Steffanx> not my experience
2018-09-09T22:50:54 < catphish> i need it to be clearly audible at 1m range outdoors while enlosed in a plastic case
2018-09-09T22:51:35 < Steffanx> there is so many more to pick from if you want something a bit more loud
2018-09-09T22:51:56 < catphish> the current setup isn't good enough for that, i'm wondering if i should try 8kHz, the datasheet shows it shoud be MUCH louder at that frequency, maybe i didn't read it and test at that frequency before
2018-09-09T22:52:00 < Steffanx> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/pui-audio-inc/AI-1223-TWT-5V-5-R/668-1458-ND/5011393 is pretty loud and annoying too. (also real life experience), but that was mainly in a office.
2018-09-09T22:52:13 < Steffanx> *an
2018-09-09T22:52:18 < Steffanx> and "only" 5V
2018-09-09T22:53:38 < catphish> i'll test at 8kHz in a min
2018-09-09T22:54:18 < Steffanx> you can always ask crt  to make you an amplifier.
2018-09-09T22:58:22 < zyp> Steffanx, you're right
2018-09-09T22:58:23 < zyp> 17:49:16 < dongs> hey its same beeper im using
2018-09-09T22:58:47 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/zCrcW1d
2018-09-09T22:58:49 < mawk> lol karlp 
2018-09-09T22:58:51 < catphish> yeah, that beeper is much less loud (to my human ears) at 8kHz
2018-09-09T22:58:53 < bitmask> 20 hours in and halfway done
2018-09-09T22:58:59 < mawk> yeah I intend to play with both
2018-09-09T22:59:13 < mawk> but sub-ghz seemed like the most "iot"ish to me
2018-09-09T22:59:21 < mawk> longest range, lower bitrate, etc
2018-09-09T23:01:21 < Thorn> Telstar 18 VANTAGE launch T-7h30min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Apw3xqwsG1U
2018-09-09T23:02:43 < catphish> i'm currently trying to get my head around GPS
2018-09-09T23:03:34 < mawk> my last small job was at a company that does ultra-high precision geoloc
2018-09-09T23:03:37 < catphish> i decided during testing that trying to receive DCF77 requires way too much luck, even with an ASIC
2018-09-09T23:03:42 < Steffanx> isnt nothing more than, power on, read nmea strings right?
2018-09-09T23:03:46 < catphish> so i want to use GPS to receive a timestamp
2018-09-09T23:04:02 < mawk> using gps, magneto-inertial sensors, accelerometers, etc
2018-09-09T23:04:28 < mawk> with contracts with the french military and SWAT and stuff
2018-09-09T23:04:48 < mawk> but I only got to do shit sysadmin stuff
2018-09-09T23:05:02 < catphish> lol
2018-09-09T23:05:49 < catphish> i've ordered a https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm to play with
2018-09-09T23:06:16 < karlp> mawk: remember if youdo subgig 802.15.4 you dont' get to interoprate with any of the "real" 802.15.4 stuff.
2018-09-09T23:06:28 < mawk> yes karlp 
2018-09-09T23:06:32 < karlp> I dont' care that they wrote down a spec for subgig and called it 802.15.4 it's all lies
2018-09-09T23:06:35 < Steffanx> catphish, i think the only gps ##stm32 approved is: ublox something.
2018-09-09T23:06:37 < mawk> but even with 2.4 GHz stuff there are a lot of modulation and channel settings no ?
2018-09-09T23:06:45 < mawk> so even with 2.4 there is an interoperability issue
2018-09-09T23:06:55 < mawk> but thanks for the advice, I thought both bands were equivalent
2018-09-09T23:07:01 < englishman> need to log in to download hardware guide and see the recommended groundplane size
2018-09-09T23:07:11 < catphish> Steffanx: there's a good ublox option too, but it's more expensive :(
2018-09-09T23:07:16 < karlp> mawk: also, with sub gig you get to deal with the 868/916 euro/us split.
2018-09-09T23:07:23 < mawk> yes
2018-09-09T23:07:31 < catphish> ST also have a GPS receiver, but i couldn't find any prices at all
2018-09-09T23:07:41 < catphish> or anyone actually selling them
2018-09-09T23:07:54 < catphish> ublox are pretty ubiquitous
2018-09-09T23:09:39 < catphish> at its simplest, i think i need to turn on the GPS receiver, wait until it has a lock, then read the time from NMEA
2018-09-09T23:10:08 < qyx> turn on, always read and parse
2018-09-09T23:10:22 < qyx> if the gps has ~correct clock, it outputs it
2018-09-09T23:10:44 < catphish> my worry is that it might output an incorrect clock from its own RTC
2018-09-09T23:10:52 < Steffanx> jadew do you really want to know the "hedde" thing?
2018-09-09T23:11:01 < jadew> yes
2018-09-09T23:16:33 < Steffanx> it is known crt
2018-09-09T23:16:38 < vampi-the-frog> looks like you're printing delicious vanilla icecream, bitmask 
2018-09-09T23:17:00 < bitmask> hah
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2018-09-09T23:18:02 < catphish> the documentation i've found seems very vague about how the gps startup process works, but i *think* there's an internal RTC
2018-09-09T23:18:22 < catphish> i don't know why, given that a clock can be read from satellite in an instant
2018-09-09T23:18:36 < catphish> but i don't want to confuse the two
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2018-09-09T23:20:08 < catphish> qyx: do you have any reason to believe only a correct clock would be output by any particular gps device? if so, that'd be lovely
2018-09-09T23:26:09 < catphish> i think waiting for a fix is the safest option
2018-09-09T23:27:49 < zyp> catphish, I think you normally get an accuracy estimate along with the value
2018-09-09T23:28:32 < catphish> zyp: that would be ideal, there's a ton of nmea messages, the protocol is a mess, i'll read through them and see
2018-09-09T23:28:56 < zyp> if you're getting an ublox device, you can also use the UBX protocol
2018-09-09T23:29:24 < catphish> i might look at ublox, right now i'm looking at this cheaper device: https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm
2018-09-09T23:30:41 < catphish> i would prefer a proprietary format with one copy of genuinely useful information tough
2018-09-09T23:30:43 < catphish> *though
2018-09-09T23:36:52 < catphish> this seems like a decent choice too https://www.u-blox.com/en/product/sam-m8q-module
2018-09-09T23:36:58 < catphish> people do seem to like ublox
2018-09-09T23:37:17 < catphish> but twice the price :(
2018-09-09T23:37:33 < zyp> ublox manual says «By default the receiver will not output invalid data. In such cases, it will output empty fields.»
2018-09-09T23:38:18 < zyp> An invalid position fix (but time valid) is reported as follows:
2018-09-09T23:38:18 < zyp> $GPGLL,,,,,124924.00,V,N*42
2018-09-09T23:39:01 < zyp> so if you're getting a message containing a timestamp, you can assume it's valid
2018-09-09T23:39:09 < catphish> i think the best way to be sure is to sabotage the receiver with a faraday cage and see what it outputs
2018-09-09T23:39:24 < zyp> sure, just throw it in your microwave
2018-09-09T23:42:05 < qyx> catphish: there is a data valid/invalid indication in some sentences
2018-09-09T23:42:18 < qyx> and as zyp says
2018-09-09T23:43:12 < catphish> qyx: sounds good, i see this: https://i.imgur.com/GoVl8fF.png
2018-09-09T23:43:18 < Lux> ublox is definetly the way to go
2018-09-09T23:43:31 < catphish> ublox is pricey though :(
2018-09-09T23:43:37 < Lux> but i wouldn't expect too much from a 15x15mm antenna though
2018-09-09T23:44:00 < Lux> still worth it
2018-09-09T23:44:00 < qyx> I am able to get fix indoors using a piece of wire
2018-09-09T23:44:16 < Lux> and you can get cheap chinese modules with ublox too
2018-09-09T23:44:53 < qyx> you have to be lost in a valley or an underground garages or what
2018-09-09T23:44:57 < qyx> to get no fix
2018-09-09T23:45:39 < qyx> even when only a small portion of the sky is visible, the modules usually outputs time all the time
2018-09-09T23:45:46 < zyp> data quality is a nice thing to know, not all systems care about that
2018-09-09T23:45:47 < qyx> *valid time
2018-09-09T23:45:58 < zyp> like this map thing on a flight I were on: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/NOK1F.jpg
2018-09-09T23:46:02 < qyx> and adjust it occasionally when fix is available
2018-09-09T23:47:05 < qyx> looks like mr putin is messing with the data
2018-09-09T23:47:50 < zyp> probably
2018-09-09T23:48:23 < englishman> haha
2018-09-09T23:54:21 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-09T23:55:36 < catphish> qyx: thanks, you're absolutely correct, when my device can't get a signal it outputs a timestamp with an "invalid" flag
2018-09-09T23:56:26 < catphish> even inside my house under a sheet of aluminium, this ublog got a lock after a minute or so
2018-09-09T23:57:28 < catphish> it only reports as valid once it has a lock, but that's not a big problem
2018-09-09T23:59:31 < zyp> are you sure the time is not valid either way?
--- Day changed Mon Sep 10 2018
2018-09-10T00:00:15 < catphish> i really don't know :(
2018-09-10T00:24:16 < Steffanx> Anything not lt would be cheaper crt
2018-09-10T00:25:01 < Steffanx> Fuck LT with their "a part for everything, but good luck getting it or its expensive as hell"-chips
2018-09-10T00:42:56 < Steffanx> The vandalism.
2018-09-10T00:45:26 < catphish> zyp: might try this one: https://www.murata.com/en-eu/api/pdfdownloadapi?cate=&partno=PKLCS1212E40A1-R1 85dB @ 4kHz
2018-09-10T00:46:37 < catphish> that should be obnoxiously loud
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2018-09-10T00:48:14 < catphish> although there's some 90-100dB ones from other manufacturers
2018-09-10T00:48:46 < Steffanx> I know what id use
2018-09-10T00:49:16 < Steffanx> 90-100dB. Dont underestimated your noisy environment
2018-09-10T00:49:25 < catphish> this thing means business: http://www.puiaudio.com/pdf/SMT-0931-S-R.pdf
2018-09-10T00:49:54 < zyp> small footprint also
2018-09-10T00:49:57 < catphish> 80mA @ 3.6V, 95dBA
2018-09-10T00:50:14 < zyp> that's @ 5cm
2018-09-10T00:50:25 < Laurenceb_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4ZJo8cR5jQ&feature=youtu.be
2018-09-10T00:50:40 < zyp> the murata is @10cm
2018-09-10T00:51:12 < catphish> zyp: good point
2018-09-10T00:52:21 < zyp> I believe a doubling/halving of distance equals a 6dB difference
2018-09-10T00:52:35 < Steffanx> Y
2018-09-10T00:52:36 < catphish> well i know how loud the 72dB murata device is, so i guess their 84dB device will be 4 times louder
2018-09-10T00:52:38 < Steffanx> S
2018-09-10T00:52:41 < zyp> at least that's how it is for RF, audio shouldn't be all that different
2018-09-10T00:53:43 < zyp> how much is that pui thing?
2018-09-10T00:53:48 < catphish> i hate working in decibels
2018-09-10T00:54:08 < zyp> pff, decibels are nice :)
2018-09-10T00:54:36 < catphish> zyp: 1.77 GBP for one :( or 0.84 for 1k
2018-09-10T00:55:17 < zyp> hmm, I think I'll put the buzzer on the display board, makes more sense to have it be a part of the UI than the controller board
2018-09-10T00:55:27 < zyp> in that case I don't need to pick one now
2018-09-10T00:56:02 < zyp> and display board is cheaper to redesign if I pick wrong, 2L is cheaper to prototype than 4L
2018-09-10T00:56:12 < Steffanx> Why dont you buy a few and try a few catphish?
2018-09-10T00:57:13 < catphish> personally i'm inclined to try the 84dB murata first
2018-09-10T00:57:39 < catphish> oh, here's the non-automotive version https://www.murata.com/en-us/api/pdfdownloadapi?cate=cgsubSounders&partno=PKLCS1212E4001-R1
2018-09-10T00:57:57 < Steffanx> For $2 each its not a big loss to buy 10 different ones :P
2018-09-10T00:58:14 < catphish> also true
2018-09-10T00:58:16 < Steffanx> (not that you should buy 10, but...)
2018-09-10T00:58:35 < catphish> PKLCS1212E4001-R1 comes in at £1 each for 10
2018-09-10T01:00:19 < Steffanx> Damn is the pound that low nowadays. 1 pound = 1.12 euro
2018-09-10T01:00:40 < catphish> yep, we fucked it
2018-09-10T01:01:29 < Steffanx> Euro-dollar isnt much better, so we fucked too
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2018-09-10T01:03:18 < catphish> i can't find a better device than PKLCS1212E4001-R1 at my price point
2018-09-10T01:03:46 < Steffanx> It has to be smd?
2018-09-10T01:03:48 < catphish> i'd rather 90+dB but 84 is probably worth a try
2018-09-10T01:04:05 < Steffanx> Smt
2018-09-10T01:04:21 < catphish> i was preferring sm, but i guess it's not critical
2018-09-10T01:05:56 < catphish> even if i include legged devices, nothing much better comes up at 3v3
2018-09-10T01:06:17 < catphish> it's between the PKLCS1212E4001-R1 and PUI SMT-0931-S-R 
2018-09-10T01:06:40 < catphish> one's 84dB @ 10cm and the other 95dB @ 5am
2018-09-10T01:06:43 < catphish> *cm
2018-09-10T01:07:27 < catphish> this has been a pretty low priority in my design so far
2018-09-10T01:07:37 < catphish> more worries about this time thing :)
2018-09-10T01:20:49 < Thorn> what is inside the blue round thing? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKj12hfqrZQ
2018-09-10T01:24:40 < kakimir> joe rogan + elon musk is pretty interesting
2018-09-10T01:37:09 < Steffanx> 0-20mA "converter" it seems Thorn 
2018-09-10T01:37:42 < Thorn> well yes but what is it made of, is there any active electronics
2018-09-10T01:38:26 < Steffanx> Oh i misread your question. Its sleepy time
2018-09-10T01:40:15 < Cracki> *4-20
2018-09-10T01:41:02 < Cracki> "Voltabe" label
2018-09-10T01:43:04 < Cracki> Thorn, something that gets the 24 volts from the psu, reads that sensor, and then modulates its own conductance/resistance to create the 4-20 mA current. the arduino catches that.
2018-09-10T01:45:12 < Cracki> About 5,040 results (0.24 seconds) 
2018-09-10T01:46:52 < Cracki> here they kill the ldo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-_AgqpjOiU
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2018-09-10T02:23:57 < Cracki> a ballmer chimping out? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRm0NDo1CiY
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2018-09-10T03:16:52 < Cracki> I am floored. http://www.unz.com/akarlin/stupid-people/
2018-09-10T03:24:19 < branjb> you in the US Cracki?
2018-09-10T03:24:33 < Cracki> no
2018-09-10T03:24:35 < Cracki> germoney
2018-09-10T03:24:37 < branjb> o
2018-09-10T03:24:48 < Cracki> values are 15-16 year olds
2018-09-10T03:24:53 < Cracki> we live in a bubble.
2018-09-10T03:25:03 < branjb> was gonna say that article does not surprise me at all.  All you need to do is go out in public in the US to see how retard the average person is
2018-09-10T03:25:05 < bitmask> hit the 24 hour mark: https://imgur.com/a/xVgFEmL
2018-09-10T03:25:17 < Cracki> everyone around me, offline, has managed to survive a semester of computer science at a good uni
2018-09-10T03:26:07 < Cracki> but then I see what pajeets ask for help on irc...
2018-09-10T03:26:15 < branjb> lol
2018-09-10T03:26:25 < Cracki> they managed to show up at least
2018-09-10T03:26:59 < Cracki> I regularly use public transport. I know how plebes look like, what they talk about, how they *stink*
2018-09-10T03:27:10 < branjb> i know at least 3 people from college who used to pay people in india $20/assignment to do their homework
2018-09-10T03:27:19 < Thorn> bitmask: did you restart the print or did you start from scratch?
2018-09-10T03:27:59 < bitmask> start from scratch, it sliced real weird and caused lots of problems the first time around so I changed some things and resliced it
2018-09-10T03:28:18 < Thorn> how much filament is it going to take
2018-09-10T03:28:25 < Cracki> I could classify body odor in three categories: undetectable (civilized), natural (uncivilized and oblivious), smells like a gallon of perfume (uncivilized, but knows it)
2018-09-10T03:28:36 < bitmask> quarter of a roll, 250g
2018-09-10T03:28:49 < Cracki> 20 bucks per assignment, and you get absolute bullshit back
2018-09-10T03:28:56 < bitmask> probably half just for the supports
2018-09-10T03:29:09 < Thorn> that's not too bad
2018-09-10T03:29:20 < Cracki> owo dat moon
2018-09-10T03:29:39 < branjb> Cracki they were too dumb to realize it was bullshit.. but the best part is it was stupid as shit assignments like "write quick sort" or "write a big integer calculator"
2018-09-10T03:29:42 < bitmask> nah, should be a cool print, been wanting to do a lithophane for a while now and liked it
2018-09-10T03:29:54 < bitmask> I also got this roll of white pla for $1 as a promotion
2018-09-10T03:29:56 < Cracki> moneyed nitwits
2018-09-10T03:30:02 < branjb> they ironically are all currently looking for jobs a year after graduating
2018-09-10T03:31:03 < Cracki> to be expected
2018-09-10T03:32:09 < Thorn> I've got 9 kg of filament + a 22 color * 10 m sampler and haven't built my printer yet lol
2018-09-10T03:32:44 < branjb> i haven't printed anything in awhile
2018-09-10T03:33:16 < branjb> i need some brackets for a prototype but too lazy to CAD them up
2018-09-10T03:33:45 < Cracki> make a sketch
2018-09-10T03:33:56 < Cracki> i gotta model something for the boss anyway
2018-09-10T03:34:25 < Cracki> too amateur to wield the autodesk properly (how to model tolerances?!) but good enough for 3d printing :P
2018-09-10T03:41:36 < Cracki> last answer, if anyone cares https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/inventor-forum/inventor-3d-printing-project-tolerance-issue/td-p/6870295
2018-09-10T03:42:03 < Cracki> https://youtu.be/5ZVWkC2mONQ?t=105
2018-09-10T03:42:51 < Thorn> inventor has the same microsoftian toolbar as solidworks?
2018-09-10T03:49:02 < Cracki> I think so
2018-09-10T03:49:22 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-10T03:49:39 < branjb> inventor and solidworks are p similar
2018-09-10T03:49:43 < branjb> to the point the hotkeys are all the same
2018-09-10T03:53:20 < branjb> Shanghai 31% answer level 6 correct
2018-09-10T03:53:20 < branjb> haha
2018-09-10T03:53:35 < branjb> USA 2% rip
2018-09-10T03:53:41 < Cracki> they either kill their dumb people or keep them from taking the test
2018-09-10T03:53:55 < Cracki> eugenics would be smart...
2018-09-10T03:54:50 < Cracki> no reproduction permit if you're dumb as fuck
2018-09-10T03:55:08 < branjb> do you have a loicense for that sperm
2018-09-10T03:55:24 < Cracki> forced reproduction for smart people
2018-09-10T03:55:56 < Cracki> or... incentives
2018-09-10T03:56:38 < branjb> >Even so, even at this very elementary level, only 65% of Brazilians and not much more than half of Indonesians and Peruvians can be expected to get it right.
2018-09-10T03:57:07 < Cracki> something I wonder about these questions: you have a 25% chance to get it right by *guessing*.
2018-09-10T03:57:29 < Cracki> so if a population gets scores below 25%... they are good at guessing wrong
2018-09-10T03:57:38 < Cracki> or the scores are adjusted for that...
2018-09-10T03:58:05 < branjb> not sure how you'd accurately adjust for that
2018-09-10T03:58:09 < Cracki> simple
2018-09-10T03:58:23 < branjb> you'd have to know who was guessing vs who checked a wrong answer thinking it was right
2018-09-10T03:58:28 < Cracki> "smart" ones have 100% chance of getting it right, "dumb" ones have 25% chance of getting it right
2018-09-10T03:58:42 < Cracki> then you look at how many got it right, and map that to expected "mix" of smart and dumb
2018-09-10T03:58:55 < Cracki> so when you get 25% raw, you can assume 100% guessed it
2018-09-10T03:59:09 < branjb> how does that take into account people who just randomly fill in bubbles?
2018-09-10T03:59:32 < Cracki> I think you can even go wilder with some Bernoulli stuff
2018-09-10T03:59:40 < Cracki> THAT is what I said
2018-09-10T03:59:53 < Cracki> randomly filling in gets you 25% lucky winners
2018-09-10T04:00:11 < branjb> that level 3 question was easier than number 1 and 2
2018-09-10T04:00:13 < Cracki> and that's the baseline
2018-09-10T04:00:16 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-10T04:00:29 < Cracki> the one with the decimal numbers?
2018-09-10T04:00:33 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-10T04:00:33 < branjb> lol
2018-09-10T04:00:38 < Cracki> it checks if you understand how decimal numbers work
2018-09-10T04:01:03 < branjb> does it say what year level these questions are?
2018-09-10T04:01:09 < Cracki> 15-16yos
2018-09-10T04:01:13 < branjb> wow
2018-09-10T04:01:27 < branjb> There is not a single country where more than 80% got it right.
2018-09-10T04:01:29 < Cracki> ~16yo is the age you can start apprenticeships in germany
2018-09-10T04:02:34 < Cracki> iq 85 and below is ~16%
2018-09-10T04:03:00 < Cracki> I would imagine a lot of people got it wrong because they have no need for decimal numbers
2018-09-10T04:03:08 < Cracki> (beyond 1/100 for money)
2018-09-10T04:03:51 < branjb> so is being able to set up a clock from a reference manual basically godlike in brazil?
2018-09-10T04:04:05 < Cracki> probably
2018-09-10T04:04:15 < branjb> damn
2018-09-10T04:04:20 < branjb> stm32cubemx is god in brazil
2018-09-10T04:04:25 < Cracki> if by "godlike" you mean top 1-2% iq-wise
2018-09-10T04:04:53 < Cracki> that's still 10k per million people
2018-09-10T04:05:25 < Cracki> or... a dozen students given an average-sized high school
2018-09-10T04:05:51 < Cracki> that matches with the size of "computer clubs" you find at schools
2018-09-10T04:06:23 < cjbaird> The list comes across as "Spot the Country that's full of Catholics"
2018-09-10T04:06:43 < branjb> what do catholics have to do with it?
2018-09-10T04:07:20 < Cracki> I don't see the connection either
2018-09-10T04:07:44 < cjbaird> The South American countries I noticed with the 0%-level scores at stage 4 are all Cathlotic societies
2018-09-10T04:08:20 < cjbaird> (Columbia, etc.)
2018-09-10T04:09:18 < cjbaird> Got ..introduced to that lot from Columbian housemates a few years ago. Can't even get Xmas on the right day. :P
2018-09-10T04:10:43 < Cracki> incidental
2018-09-10T04:11:05 < Cracki> what they were taught to believe in is irrelevant to the cognitive capacity of their brains
2018-09-10T04:11:38 < branjb> Some countries where a big fat 100% (rounded up) were unable to do this problem: Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Indonesia, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Malaysia, Mexico, Peru, Qatar, Tunisia, Uruguay.
2018-09-10T04:12:00 < Cracki> the pattern is "continents"
2018-09-10T04:12:01 < branjb> sounds like drugs prevent you from doing math
2018-09-10T04:12:06 < Cracki> *meth
2018-09-10T04:12:21 < Cracki> they can do agriculture
2018-09-10T04:12:51 < Cracki> poppy fields are the most lucrative
2018-09-10T04:13:54 < Cracki> TIL: voting isn't anonymous in sweden. If you want to vote for SD or AFS, you have to get a colored ballot specifically for them in front of everyone. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmrZTHfWwAErA9y.jpg:orig
2018-09-10T04:14:34 < branjb> if you take an AFS one do they give you some wrongthink correction on the way out?
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2018-09-10T04:17:29 < Cracki> apparently you can take slips from every pile, to keep your choice secret... but that in itself is suspicious
2018-09-10T04:18:05 < branjb> any swedes in ##stm32?
2018-09-10T04:18:56 < cjbaird> Nuts. Just noticed after several years that the waifu I've been stalking has puncture scars on her left elbow.
2018-09-10T04:20:07 < Cracki> nogo zone rinkeby https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmrZKxAX0AEPYdP.jpg:orig
2018-09-10T04:20:21 < Cracki> she's a druggie?
2018-09-10T04:20:33 < Cracki> those are easier to control
2018-09-10T04:21:15 < Cracki> (rinkeby: 77% socialists... no more natives there)
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2018-09-10T04:24:09 < branjb> lol: "The problem with Level 6 Math is that the correct answer as given is 28 whereas the actual one is 28.3(3)"
2018-09-10T04:25:24 < cjbaird> Find a local girl, a real one w/ two X chromosomes, that's into Linux, and over 30.. and then that happens. Meh.
2018-09-10T04:25:54 < branjb> why is being into Linux a good trait in women?
2018-09-10T04:26:06 < branjb> I'm much happier my wife is into cooking than linux
2018-09-10T04:27:41 < cjbaird> No need for 24/7 Windows/Mac support. 
2018-09-10T04:28:59 < cjbaird> And amusement when she knocks back her sister and family wanting windows help.
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2018-09-10T04:37:51 < cjbaird> Visited the linux-using girlfriend from 20 years ago after I left Sydney. She plays the Banjo and Mandolin now, being into the whole Bluegrass scene. Dodged that one.
2018-09-10T04:44:24 < Cracki> branjb, level 6... that's 4+3=7 km in 9+6=15 minutes, that's 7/0.25 = 28 km/h
2018-09-10T04:44:30 < Cracki> who figured 28.3(3)?
2018-09-10T04:44:37 < branjb> someone in the comments
2018-09-10T04:45:03 < Cracki> smoothbrain
2018-09-10T04:45:10 < Cracki> or overthinking
2018-09-10T04:45:40 < Cracki> combining averages of parts of the journey takes some thinking
2018-09-10T04:46:00 < Cracki> weigh them by distance, or by time? I don't know, but I could derive it
2018-09-10T04:47:21 < Cracki> besides, the revolving door question is only exact if you assume the door is "filled" with people at t=0
2018-09-10T04:49:14 < branjb> lol
2018-09-10T04:49:32 < branjb> grade school standardized testing was terrible
2018-09-10T04:50:33 < Cracki> btw, the math is right if you weigh the individual rates (4km/9min=26.7 km/h and 3km/6min=30 km/h) by time
2018-09-10T04:51:16 < Cracki> weighing by time results in (distance + distance) / (total time)
2018-09-10T04:52:48 < Cracki> someone said "harmonic mean". I LOATHE these names. so arbitrary and imprecise.
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2018-09-10T04:58:03 < Thorn> Telstar 18v Mission T - 90 min
2018-09-10T04:58:15 < dongs> is that by StonerX?
2018-09-10T04:58:24 < Thorn> yes
2018-09-10T04:59:40 < dongs> https://globalnews.ca/news/4436992/elon-musk-security-clearance-us-air-force/
2018-09-10T04:59:45 < dongs> apparently it was fake news
2018-09-10T05:00:23 < Thorn> or, in original German, die Lügenpresse
2018-09-10T05:00:37 < branjb> i guess security clearances for the average joe and important people work different
2018-09-10T05:02:34 < Cracki> the smoke didn't even enter his lung
2018-09-10T05:04:09 < Cracki> very telling, when the rabid crazy deranged nutjobs lose their shit over this non-issue
2018-09-10T05:04:24 < cjbaird> "Yes, I inhailed. That was the point."
2018-09-10T05:05:03 < Cracki> go burn some maga hats
2018-09-10T05:08:51 < Cracki> fall is about to start and I'm still shedding...
2018-09-10T05:09:12 < branjb> you a dog m8?
2018-09-10T05:09:47 < Cracki> cat
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2018-09-10T05:19:51 < cjbaird> WorthlessFact: Australia's Microbee computers were mostly assembled by Retards wih IQs 30-60. Their output was about 20% of a regular factory (of IQ 90 Aussies) but wasn't a problem due to the small market.. 
2018-09-10T05:22:09 < cjbaird> They were also paid about 20% of the award.. So that's why it was viable. Couldn't do that today.
2018-09-10T05:29:43 < Cracki> iq 30, where do you find that? even aborigines are 50+
2018-09-10T05:30:18 < jadew> lol
2018-09-10T05:30:39 < jadew> some of the smartest monkeys have an IQ of 30 (in human IQ)
2018-09-10T05:31:11 < Cracki> that is 5.7 standard deviations below the human average
2018-09-10T05:31:14 < Cracki> *4.7
2018-09-10T05:32:17 < Thorn> how did they test it? the iq test requires you to understand instructions
2018-09-10T05:32:46 < jadew> Thorn, obviously those monkeys did
2018-09-10T05:33:11 < jadew> to the extent someone with an IQ of 30 can understand instructions
2018-09-10T05:33:36 < cjbaird> The teaching process basically turns the instructions into a list of 5-second operations.. which they can manage.
2018-09-10T05:34:15 < cjbaird> Scored a heap of old computer magazines from a mate the other day, and a writeup about Applied Technologies' use of sheltered workshops was in one.
2018-09-10T05:34:29 < jadew> what's amazing about this is that there are people that are closer to monkeys in intellect, than to an average human
2018-09-10T05:35:12 < Cracki> to you romanians maybe, but go visit any western city center
2018-09-10T05:35:32 < Cracki> you'll see what pretends to be human
2018-09-10T05:38:41 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ihC6QHS_m0
2018-09-10T05:40:23 < jadew> that's a gorilla that can talk btw (through sign language)
2018-09-10T05:41:16 < Cracki> btw, P(IQ <= 30) = 1.53063 * 10^-6
2018-09-10T05:41:25 < Cracki> so about 1.5 in a million
2018-09-10T05:41:57 < jadew> how about <= 50?
2018-09-10T05:42:05 < jadew> how do you calculate this?
2018-09-10T05:42:24 < Thorn> normal distribution probably
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2018-09-10T05:43:03 < jadew> [05:42.02] <jadew> how about <= 50?
2018-09-10T05:43:03 < jadew> [05:42.09] <jadew> how do you calculate this?
2018-09-10T05:43:12 < Cracki> uh, mathematica
2018-09-10T05:43:18 < jadew> what's the formula?
2018-09-10T05:43:23 < Cracki> I take the CDF of the normal distribution with mu=100, sigma=15
2018-09-10T05:43:32 < Cracki> the formula involves magic functions
2018-09-10T05:43:40 < Cracki> http://mathworld.wolfram.com/NormalDistribution.html
2018-09-10T05:44:18 < jadew> can you plug in 50?
2018-09-10T05:44:21 < Cracki> http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=CDF%5BNormalDistribution%5B100,15%5D,+100%5D
2018-09-10T05:44:23 < Cracki> you do it ;)
2018-09-10T05:44:45 < Cracki> it's symmetric, so if you wanted to know 150 and above, ask for 50 and below
2018-09-10T05:45:19 < Thorn> 0.043%?
2018-09-10T05:45:24 < Cracki> if it won't tell you a small number, try this http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=N%5BCDF%5BNormalDistribution%5B100,15%5D,+50%5D%5D
2018-09-10T05:45:29 < Cracki> looks like it
2018-09-10T05:45:32 < jadew> CDF[NormalDistribution[100,15], 50] * 1e6
2018-09-10T05:45:41 < jadew> that gives 429
2018-09-10T05:45:48 < jadew> that's a lot of stupid people
2018-09-10T05:45:54 < Cracki> alpha isn't made to understand mathematica language, but it seems to
2018-09-10T05:46:06 < Cracki> one in 2000
2018-09-10T05:46:37 < Cracki> that's about how many you have in... what's it called where they put the retards to do arts and crafts?
2018-09-10T05:47:03 < jadew> college?
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2018-09-10T05:47:26 < Cracki> gender studies degrees aye
2018-09-10T05:48:24 < jadew> anyone here measured their IQ with one of those reliable tests?
2018-09-10T05:48:35 < Cracki> I did when I was ~10
2018-09-10T05:48:36 < dongs> don't worry, you're dumb.
2018-09-10T05:48:54 < jadew> dongs, I'd be afraid to know for sure tho
2018-09-10T05:48:55 < cjbaird> From the Dec 1984 issue of 'Your Computer' with the Sheltered Workshop article: https://imgur.com/a/pZj5thq .. Got about 20 mags to PDF.
2018-09-10T05:48:58 < Cracki> actual psychodude administered it. took an hour.
2018-09-10T05:49:16 < Cracki> anything above 2 std deviations is gonna be noisy as fuck
2018-09-10T05:49:28 < Cracki> dumb people devise these tests and smart people overthink
2018-09-10T05:50:11 < Cracki> the pattern recognition part of your brain can come up with any pattern, but the test expects _their_ pattern
2018-09-10T05:50:19 < Cracki> and you can't explain it to a website
2018-09-10T05:51:21 < Cracki> live in 68 minutes https://www.spacex.com/webcast
2018-09-10T05:51:34 < cjbaird> Did that ~hour test as well. Got called out for wanting to make the problems easier to solve (rotating the puzzles, etc.)
2018-09-10T05:51:43 < Cracki> (liftoff that is)
2018-09-10T05:51:52 < Cracki> wat
2018-09-10T05:52:05 < Cracki> rotating the puzzles should be allowed
2018-09-10T05:52:22 < Cracki> (does make some easier :P)
2018-09-10T05:53:34 < jadew> I only took an intelligence test when they called me to enlist into the army
2018-09-10T05:53:54 < jadew> I think I nailed it, cuz they called me in
2018-09-10T05:54:13 < Cracki> I remember the one vocabulary question... "what's this called?" and he points at the prong of a power plug. I didn't know. I could have wildly associated...
2018-09-10T05:54:23 < Cracki> heh
2018-09-10T05:55:08 < Cracki> you know which end of the gun is the business end? good enough
2018-09-10T05:55:17 < jadew> the other people there were so dumb
2018-09-10T05:55:33 < jadew> the guy next to me was trying to copy my answers lol
2018-09-10T05:55:48 < dongs> wait waht the fuck
2018-09-10T05:55:54 < dongs> cjbaird> From the Dec 1984 issue of 'Your Computer' with the Sheltered Workshop article: https://imgur.com/a/pZj5thq .. G
2018-09-10T05:55:55 < jadew> some of them couldn't even read
2018-09-10T05:55:57 < dongs> it says Cracki there
2018-09-10T05:56:02 < dongs> Cracki: confirm/deny
2018-09-10T05:56:06 < jadew> haha
2018-09-10T05:56:10 < jadew> it does
2018-09-10T05:56:11 < jadew> lol
2018-09-10T05:56:31 < Cracki> wat
2018-09-10T05:56:35 < jadew> lmfao, I can't stop laughing
2018-09-10T05:56:37 < dongs> under the photo caption
2018-09-10T05:56:50 < dongs> we need that jpeg into #stm32 photo gallery
2018-09-10T05:56:52 < Cracki> I have shorter hair
2018-09-10T05:56:59 < Cracki> and wouldn't be caught dead in that shirt
2018-09-10T05:57:02 < englishman> explains a lot
2018-09-10T05:57:11 < jadew> so that's how you got into electronics, eh?
2018-09-10T05:57:22 < Cracki> I also dislike mechanical switch keyboards
2018-09-10T05:57:26 < englishman> 58 years old and still in college
2018-09-10T05:57:26 < Cracki> I hate the noise
2018-09-10T05:57:31 < Cracki> as all proper autists should
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2018-09-10T05:58:59  * cjbaird fondles his morse straight key
2018-09-10T05:59:33 < Cracki> brb photoshopping that picture...
2018-09-10T06:00:04 < jadew> I think it's perfect the way it is
2018-09-10T06:00:32 < cjbaird> Respect the Artist, asshole.
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2018-09-10T06:05:09 < Thorn> https://twitter.com/haya2e_jaxa/status/1038117430487265280
2018-09-10T06:06:01 < Cracki> https://imgur.com/a/qMiTIQF :D
2018-09-10T06:06:14 < dongs> nice try
2018-09-10T06:06:32 < Thorn> superior work
2018-09-10T06:07:40 < Cracki> i'm too much of a photoshop noob, or I'd have controlled glyph spacing and whatnot
2018-09-10T06:15:56 < Thorn> target launch time now 0400UTC, T-45 min
2018-09-10T06:17:59 < Cracki> so they'll start blabbing in about half an hour
2018-09-10T06:19:05 < Cracki> I still haven't seen a "shot grouping" of the exact landing positions on the pads
2018-09-10T06:19:13 < Cracki> ... or anyone who'd take bets on that
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2018-09-10T06:26:05 < Thorn> delayed by 30 mins again
2018-09-10T06:26:32 < Cracki> 4h launch window, so let's hope
2018-09-10T06:29:22 < dongs> they jut want to launch it into WTC
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2018-09-10T06:49:09 < Thorn> delay 15 min
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2018-09-10T06:58:47 < dongs> is the jewtube stream for it live or wat
2018-09-10T06:59:20 < dongs> ah just a static countdown
2018-09-10T06:59:23 < dongs> meh
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2018-09-10T07:23:53 < dongs> its live
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2018-09-10T07:31:55 < Thorn> now it's live
2018-09-10T07:32:32 < dongs> yes
2018-09-10T07:33:07 < dongs> watch it go boom cuz a ground mechanic was smoking weed
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2018-09-10T07:44:09 < dongs> any of you turds used hardware scrolling on ILI9341
2018-09-10T07:44:17 < dongs> lookin at you, tctu
2018-09-10T07:44:41 < dongs> T-:30
2018-09-10T07:45:35 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/TgExoPI.png
2018-09-10T07:45:39 < bitmask> 28 hours in
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2018-09-10T07:54:04 < jadew> :/ lost the launch?
2018-09-10T07:54:21 < dongs> no, it landed
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2018-09-10T09:58:29 < jadew> lmfao, I thought this is slang: https://www.ebay.com/bhp/wife-beater
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2018-09-10T10:38:39 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/JlGLiai.jpg
2018-09-10T10:39:06 < zyp> haha
2018-09-10T10:39:14 < zyp> hardcore debugging
2018-09-10T10:39:18 < dongs> it gets fucking HOT at 168MHz
2018-09-10T10:42:06 < dongs> segger is not in picture
2018-09-10T10:43:03 < Steffanx> Wut.
2018-09-10T10:43:24 < Steffanx> Lol why a battery?
2018-09-10T10:43:58 < Steffanx> I mean: why a battery in a programmer
2018-09-10T10:44:24 < dongs> yeah im not sure maybe it keeps a RTC
2018-09-10T10:46:03 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/vaPGJEP.jpg @crt
2018-09-10T10:47:01 < dongs> = fucking PRO
2018-09-10T10:47:16 < dongs> no, the PRO'ness gets cancelled out
2018-09-10T10:50:33 < dongs> recent directx web isntallers try to bundle "bing bar"
2018-09-10T10:50:41 < dongs> fcking microsoft
2018-09-10T10:53:09 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-10T11:07:35 < Steffanx> Did you mean: FUCKING TWAT?
2018-09-10T11:09:50 < dongs> if google keeps up their shit with fucking AMP
2018-09-10T11:09:56 < dongs> bing might be the only reasonable search choice
2018-09-10T11:10:02 < dongs> followed by duckduckgo
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2018-09-10T12:08:01 < day> dongs: what is that 64GB package in the back?
2018-09-10T12:27:13 < dongs> day: jsut a shitty cheap USB flash drive thing
2018-09-10T12:29:39 < day> looks like some fancy prototype on the photo :>
2018-09-10T12:29:47 < dongs> haha no .just trash
2018-09-10T12:30:48 < dongs> https://www.ramcity.com.au/data-storage/external-ssd-brands/mydigitalssd-otg-superspeed/MDMS-OTG-064
2018-09-10T12:30:51 < dongs> this trash its garbage
2018-09-10T12:31:18 < dongs> except not OTG version
2018-09-10T12:33:08 < dongs> lewl the internet completely lacks pics of previous version
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2018-09-10T12:46:32 < karlp> cjbaird: nice pic of cracki ;)
2018-09-10T12:49:45 < karlp> what's that cortexm trace reference board dongs?
2018-09-10T12:50:30 -!- mirage335 [~mirage335@mirage335-base.soaringindustries.space] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-10T12:51:05 < cjbaird> "with skill and concentration" -- my nomination for channel motto
2018-09-10T12:52:16 < karlp> and why does it need so much heatsinking?
2018-09-10T12:56:15 < Laurenceb_> with graphana I too can create graphs of random shit that appear on a screen
2018-09-10T12:56:24 < Laurenceb_> surely this will solve all my problems
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2018-09-10T12:57:39 < Laurenceb_> with enough streams of random unprocessed shit the meaning of life the universe and everything will be clear
2018-09-10T13:04:16 < veverak> lol
2018-09-10T13:07:05 < karlp> has anyone seen a part that doesn't have WFE? http://www.keil.com/support/docs/3591.htm
2018-09-10T13:07:14 < karlp> what targets were that broken?
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2018-09-10T13:08:44 < Laurenceb_> how graphana works https://regmedia.co.uk/2012/10/11/activity_system.png
2018-09-10T13:09:23 < jpa-> karlp: maybe "Cortex-M3 devices prior silicon revision r2p1"
2018-09-10T13:09:47 < jpa-> ah, but yeah, it also says some devices don't have WFE at all, not just that it is buggy
2018-09-10T13:09:52 < karlp> yeah, 
2018-09-10T13:10:41 < jpa-> i don't really understand the difference of WFE vs. WFI there, somehow related to irq occurring right before the sleep?
2018-09-10T13:10:49 < karlp> like, 1. only matters if you odn't have wfe,
2018-09-10T13:10:59 < karlp> unless i'm reading it wrong still.
2018-09-10T13:11:52 < karlp> the page that linked there jsut uses wfe, and says, "The alternative using __WFI() has other issues, please take note of..."
2018-09-10T13:14:01 < karlp> where do the datasheets mention the revisions again. I can't find it
2018-09-10T13:14:14 < jpa-> so it seems that the problem is that if an interrupt completes before WFI, but wakes a thread, the RTOS will still execute WFI and go to sleep until next interrupt; but with WFE, even though the interrupt is completed, WFE should be a NOP as long as event register remains set
2018-09-10T13:15:07 < jpa-> i can see WFE being unusable atleast if events are being used for some other purpose in the system
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2018-09-10T13:17:41 < karlp> l1 is r2p0, iirc f1 is r1px. 
2018-09-10T13:18:36 < karlp> f1 is r1p1.
2018-09-10T13:24:15 < Laurenceb_> https://archive.is/Ma8Kc
2018-09-10T13:26:00 < Laurenceb_> >exhibitions of toxic masculinity
2018-09-10T13:26:22 < Laurenceb_> the patriarchy broke WFE
2018-09-10T13:36:56 < englishman> updating a client project done in diptrace, what a blast from the past
2018-09-10T13:40:12 < Laurenceb_> inb4 eagle
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2018-09-10T13:47:31 < Steffanx> EAGLE CAD.
2018-09-10T13:48:15 < invzim> tf, cap prices are off the charts
2018-09-10T13:48:24 < Steffanx> Whats new?
2018-09-10T13:48:57 < Steffanx> That had been going for quite a while now invzim 
2018-09-10T13:49:09 < invzim> I know, but now it seems there is actual shortage
2018-09-10T13:49:31 < englishman> yeah
2018-09-10T13:49:43 < englishman> i was quoted like >1c for 0402 0.1u 50v
2018-09-10T13:50:04 < invzim> my standard 10uf is 0805 25V x5r
2018-09-10T13:50:06 < englishman> in reel
2018-09-10T13:50:25 < invzim> https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Multilayer-Ceramic-Capacitors-MLCC-SMD-SMT_SAMSUNG_CL21A106KAYNNNE_10uF-106-10-25V_C15850.html
2018-09-10T13:50:59 < invzim> now this doesn't seem terrible to me, except Guangdong Fenghua Advanced  is probably not samsung :)
2018-09-10T13:51:23 < Thorn> lcsc has op amps for that price
2018-09-10T13:51:29 < englishman> heh
2018-09-10T13:51:37 < Thorn> even slightly cheaper
2018-09-10T13:52:55 < englishman> the days of frivolously decoupling are over
2018-09-10T14:02:57 < karlp> heh, code "osRtxErrorStackUnderflow" description ... "Stack overflow"
2018-09-10T14:03:23 < zyp> are they calling it underflow because it grows downward or what?
2018-09-10T14:03:47 < karlp> no, I think it's jsut a name that got stuck with and can't rbeak compat now or something
2018-09-10T14:03:58 < karlp> https://www.keil.com/pack/doc/CMSIS/RTOS2/html/group__rtx5__specific__functions.html#gaf1745a88f9cc60b609ab1c8076bd346d
2018-09-10T14:04:10 < karlp> turns out freertos default stacks are enough for the locm3 gadget0 stuff.
2018-09-10T14:04:25 < karlp> but it immediately crashes on rtos2 with stack overflow. (or is that underflow...)
2018-09-10T14:05:18 < zyp> sure, but somehow they came up with underflow in the first place
2018-09-10T14:05:48 < karlp> yeah.
2018-09-10T14:06:09 < karlp> but they stuck with it, that's what's seems silly to me.
2018-09-10T14:07:21 < karlp> right, freertos defaults to 128*4 bytes of stack, rtos2 defaults to 200 bytes.
2018-09-10T14:20:18 < dongs> feertos
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2018-09-10T14:22:09 < dongs> 10uF 25V 0805 is pretty crappy price anyway
2018-09-10T14:22:14 < dongs> why do you need 25V
2018-09-10T14:22:21 < dongs> i would have used 1206 for that voltage
2018-09-10T14:22:37 < dongs> its like you can get 0402 10uF 
2018-09-10T14:22:42 < dongs> but you usually don't want to
2018-09-10T14:29:29 < invzim> Just bulk input capacitance for 5v stuff
2018-09-10T14:29:41 < invzim> I used to do 1206, but figured meh
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2018-09-10T14:55:39 < jpa-> eh.. i have 50 kB of C++ vtables in my binary :P
2018-09-10T14:57:08 < Thorn> I hope it's not a firmware image
2018-09-10T14:58:42 < jpa-> of course it is
2018-09-10T14:59:10 < jpa-> it wouldn't bother me if it was just a desktop app :)
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2018-09-10T15:01:34 < zyp> jpa-, how do you manage that? templated polymorphic classes that recursively inherit themselves?
2018-09-10T15:05:04 < jpa-> looks like a lot of it is from lambdas
2018-09-10T15:05:15 < jpa-> 36 bytes for each std::function callback i bind to a lambda
2018-09-10T15:05:50 < zyp> and you have a thousand of them?
2018-09-10T15:07:08 < jpa-> umm.. no.. hmm :)
2018-09-10T15:08:08 < jpa-> 406 vtables in total and 40 lambdas only, so actually not so much from them
2018-09-10T15:09:20 < zyp> so 406 class variants with on average around 30 virtual functions in each, what the fuck are you doing? :p
2018-09-10T15:09:32 < jpa-> 216 bytes for each nuttx gui application and i have 24 of those, so 5kB from there
2018-09-10T15:10:04 < zyp> haha
2018-09-10T15:10:32 < jpa-> 52 bytes for each component in my signal processing framework, and 63 components there; but that is just 3kB also
2018-09-10T15:10:36 < jpa-> i guess it builds up
2018-09-10T15:12:48 < jpa-> 4kB for the NXWidgets library
2018-09-10T15:14:24 < jpa-> i think i should try out the gold linker, maybe it can eliminate some identical ones
2018-09-10T15:16:03 < jpa-> a lot of it is crap like this   http://paste.dy.fi/lGf/plain
2018-09-10T15:45:56 < dongs> you should try keil
2018-09-10T15:54:44 < jpa-> it's not freetard enough for me
--- Log closed Mon Sep 10 16:09:51 2018
--- Log opened Mon Sep 10 16:44:59 2018
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2018-09-10T16:44:59 -!- Irssi: ##stm32: Total of 139 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 138 normal]
2018-09-10T16:45:41 < Thorn> are optocouplers suitable for analog signals? with CTR range like 50...200% it doesn't appear to be the case
--- Log closed Mon Sep 10 16:51:01 2018
--- Log opened Mon Sep 10 17:09:38 2018
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2018-09-10T17:09:38 -!- Irssi: ##stm32: Total of 139 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 138 normal]
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2018-09-10T17:10:49 < jpa-> hm, gnu gold reduced binary size from 906 kB to 886 kB
2018-09-10T17:10:59 -!- Irssi: Join to ##stm32 was synced in 88 secs
2018-09-10T17:11:07 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-10T17:11:10 < jpa-> but it still can't eliminate all duplication because it cannot handle mutually recursive references between vtable and functions
2018-09-10T17:12:14 < dongs> wtf is gnu gold
2018-09-10T17:12:23 < dongs> paid version of 'ld'?
2018-09-10T17:12:37 < jpa-> no, their "new" linker
2018-09-10T17:12:54 < dongs> 886k is a shitload for embedded firmware
2018-09-10T17:13:01 < dongs> wtf are you running that on?
2018-09-10T17:13:02 < jpa-> gold is in development since 2008 and still beta
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2018-09-10T17:13:13 < jpa-> stm32f407
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2018-09-10T17:13:27 < dongs> cool
2018-09-10T17:13:46 < jpa-> and nuttx :P
2018-09-10T17:13:51 < dongs> heh
2018-09-10T17:15:13 -!- jpa-_ [jpa@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-10T17:17:45 < jpa-> 66klines of c++ code in this project
2018-09-10T17:17:58 < srk> nuttz!
2018-09-10T17:18:06 < jpa-> (of project-specific code, then all the nuttx etc. libraries on top)
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2018-09-10T17:29:38 < Laurenceb_> wtf are u making?
2018-09-10T17:30:44 < jpa-> vibration monitors for horses, of course
2018-09-10T17:31:06 < BrainDamage> aandrew: a bit late, but if you have dual optos ( that is, 1 led and 2 phototransistors ), you can create a feedback loop at the source and get pretty decent reliability
2018-09-10T17:31:31 < BrainDamage> the output error becomes "just" the silicon mismatch, which is generally small
2018-09-10T17:33:30 < jpa-> for AC signals, you can also regulate based on the DC level; e.g. add a known bias current on input, and then you can calculate CTR on the output side by comparing against the DC level
2018-09-10T17:34:19 < Laurenceb_> a vibration horse monitor with graphana
2018-09-10T17:34:24 < Laurenceb_> combine all the things
2018-09-10T17:44:17 < Steffanx> Muh gui?!
2018-09-10T17:49:06 < aandrew> dongs: that's 886k of rust bullshit
2018-09-10T17:49:31 < aandrew> BrainDamage: yep that is true
2018-09-10T17:49:41 < aandrew> finished the layout for the linear sensor board
2018-09-10T17:49:50 < aandrew> pretty simple. the big fucker is the digitizer board
2018-09-10T17:50:12 < aandrew> 10M08, stm32f7, shitload of diffio and analog shits
2018-09-10T17:53:21 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/SRCfkGj
2018-09-10T17:56:50 < jpa-> some photodiode array?
2018-09-10T17:57:14 < aandrew> no, 4096x1 linear sensor
2018-09-10T17:57:55 < aandrew> take 5 of those boards and connect them via flex cable to a badass motherfucker to digitize the shit
2018-09-10T17:58:00 < aandrew> spit the data over gig-e
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2018-09-10T18:17:08 < jpa-> linear sensor of what, if not photodiodes?
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2018-09-10T18:26:21 < Laurenceb_> pwnd by Steffanx
2018-09-10T18:28:52 < Laurenceb_> muh gui is >1meg
2018-09-10T18:33:15 < Laurenceb_> I'm supposed to add "real time display" by next month
2018-09-10T18:33:16 < Laurenceb_> reeee
2018-09-10T18:34:07 < Cracki> realtime
2018-09-10T18:34:13 < Cracki> does your db allow that?
2018-09-10T18:35:05 < Laurenceb_> nah its all going to be in qt
2018-09-10T18:35:08 < Cracki> perhaps switch backend to mqtt or ROS, attach "db" to store only
2018-09-10T18:35:16 < Laurenceb_> I'm not going to run the database on the laptop
2018-09-10T18:35:22 < Laurenceb_> it'll be on a server
2018-09-10T18:35:24 < Cracki> all data sources spew into mqtt, then you can decide what to do with it
2018-09-10T18:35:36 < Cracki> such as request a certain stream
2018-09-10T18:35:41 < Laurenceb_> kek mqtt
2018-09-10T18:35:46 < Cracki> and send packetized binary data over it
2018-09-10T18:35:56 < Cracki> not sure how much bw mqtt can do...
2018-09-10T18:36:12 < Laurenceb_> I'll just spawn the real time display as a thread and pipe raw data into it
2018-09-10T18:36:20 < Cracki> pipe it from where?
2018-09-10T18:36:32 < Laurenceb_> the main gui
2018-09-10T18:36:51 < Cracki> are the sensors attached to the system that also runs the gui?
2018-09-10T18:36:58 < Cracki> or does that go over a network?
2018-09-10T18:37:24 < Cracki> >reeeetime
2018-09-10T18:37:43 < aandrew> jpa-: well ok I guess technically photodiodes
2018-09-10T18:37:56 < aandrew> it's a cmos linear array, very much exactly like a cmos image sensor but only one pixel high
2018-09-10T18:38:12 < aandrew> "photodiode array" doesn't usually describe that
2018-09-10T18:39:28 < Laurenceb_> Cracki: everything is plugged into a laptop inside a wambulance
2018-09-10T18:39:40 < Cracki> good good
2018-09-10T18:39:44 < Laurenceb_> it doesnt have any internet access until it gets back to base
2018-09-10T18:40:09 < Laurenceb_> so I'm saving to a wav file then using fileshare to stick the file on the server
2018-09-10T18:40:19 < Laurenceb_> then bash script loads it into the database
2018-09-10T18:40:42 < englishman> can you have a 3d model of a horse with big red vibratory hot spots
2018-09-10T18:40:43 < Cracki> aye
2018-09-10T18:40:49 < Cracki> lol show
2018-09-10T18:40:52 < Laurenceb_> kek
2018-09-10T18:40:55 < Cracki> show shakky hoars
2018-09-10T18:40:56 < Laurenceb_> the absolute state
2018-09-10T18:41:09 < Laurenceb_> nothing about this shitshow makes any sense
2018-09-10T18:41:15 < Cracki> do you get paid
2018-09-10T18:41:26 < Laurenceb_> >someone is going to sit in a wambulance and look at random realtime shit
2018-09-10T18:41:38 < englishman> https://static1.bigstockphoto.com/5/6/1/large2/165537413.jpg
2018-09-10T18:41:42 < Laurenceb_> the pay is the only reason I do it
2018-09-10T18:41:45 < englishman> show me where on the doll it vibrates
2018-09-10T18:41:46 < Cracki> "men who stare at goats"
2018-09-10T18:41:50 < Cracki> only it's bits
2018-09-10T18:42:15 < Cracki> rawr
2018-09-10T18:42:47 < Cracki> give the 3d horse some vaporwave background
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2018-09-10T18:50:53 < Cracki> or fashwave...
2018-09-10T18:52:39 -!- sterna [~Adium@h-90-120.A137.corp.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-10T18:53:54 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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2018-09-10T19:30:40 < Laurenceb_> you have no chance to survive make your time
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2018-09-10T19:59:57 < Laurenceb_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_vacuum#Existential_threat
2018-09-10T19:59:59 < Laurenceb_> my sides
2018-09-10T20:00:11 < Laurenceb_> just popped out of existence
2018-09-10T20:00:36 < Laurenceb_> > They argue that due to observer selection effects, we might underestimate the chances of being destroyed 
2018-09-10T20:03:22 < Laurenceb_> this shit is to physics as sjw patriarchy publications are to sociology
2018-09-10T20:05:15 < Laurenceb_> we should combine the two
2018-09-10T20:06:00 < Laurenceb_> >patriarchy induced vacuum decay
2018-09-10T20:10:46 < mawk> I plugged a dip-14 socket into my thumb
2018-09-10T20:10:54 < mawk> now I have 14 holes in it and it bleeds a lot
2018-09-10T20:11:44 < Ultrasauce> what's the pinout
2018-09-10T20:20:49 < Laurenceb_> lulwut
2018-09-10T20:20:51 < Laurenceb_> how
2018-09-10T20:21:01 < Laurenceb_> inb4 emo
2018-09-10T20:22:42 -!- fc5dc9d4_ [~quassel@p5B3A8C38.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
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2018-09-10T20:27:32 < mawk> it's not on purpose Laurenceb_
2018-09-10T20:27:41 < mawk> I don't enjoy pain, I'm no leftist
2018-09-10T20:27:56 < mawk> I was trying to plug something in the socket and I pushed a bit too hard
2018-09-10T20:32:06 < zyp> haha, good one, Ultrasauce 
2018-09-10T20:33:42 -!- catphish [~catphish@unaffiliated/catphish] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-10T20:43:57 < catphish> ahoyhoy
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2018-09-10T20:49:25 < Steffanx> Ay, Welcome Mate!
2018-09-10T20:51:20 < Steffanx> Gutentag superbia 
2018-09-10T20:52:01 < Steffanx> Regex 4 ever
2018-09-10T20:52:41 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-10T20:54:35 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-10T20:56:43 -!- mirage335 [~mirage335@64.79.53.118] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-10T20:57:22 < Steffanx> You use nim to generate js?
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2018-09-10T21:01:14 < Steffanx> So its more useful to compile to c/c++?
2018-09-10T21:01:28 < Steffanx> Have you done some nim for stm32 yet?
2018-09-10T21:01:51 < Steffanx> Heh
2018-09-10T21:13:41 < catphish> nimwhat?
2018-09-10T21:20:59 < zyp> good thing you had two
2018-09-10T21:21:02 < zyp> redundancy
2018-09-10T21:21:45 < bitmask> moon lamp failed 30+ hours in :(
2018-09-10T21:21:47 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/B3HIq1W.png
2018-09-10T21:21:53 < bitmask> I think this is one of those rare cases where it looks better in photograph than real life: 
2018-09-10T21:22:04 < zyp> superbia, are you in america? if not, why are you surprised?
2018-09-10T21:22:05 < bitmask> not sure I want to go through printing it again
2018-09-10T21:26:49 < catphish> never pay anything for treatment here
2018-09-10T21:27:47 < catphish> that's probably inadvisable
2018-09-10T21:28:59 < jpa-> why are there so many programming languages
2018-09-10T21:29:31 < zyp> so people get something to argue about instead of doing useful stuff
2018-09-10T21:29:43 < jpa-> you only need 2 or 3 for that
2018-09-10T21:41:16 < catphish> i agree there are too many, we should just create one standard language that incorporates the best parts of all the other languages
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2018-09-10T21:56:54 < catphish> fuck you ST, the ST95HF has an IRQ_OUT pin that is active low when an event occurs, and the STM32 has WKUP pins that wake up the device on a rising edge
2018-09-10T21:58:21 < jpa-> isn't the current usage of ST95HF high enough that you can just leave the STM32 in a state where you can wake it up with any EXTI pin rise/fall
2018-09-10T21:59:19 < catphish> i'm hoping in tag detection mode, no
2018-09-10T21:59:58 < catphish> my intention was to leave he st95hf running continuously in tag detection mode, with the STM32 shut down
2018-09-10T22:00:05 < catphish> so i'm hoping in that mode its power consumption is minimal
2018-09-10T22:00:18 < jpa-> hoping? what does the datasheet say?
2018-09-10T22:01:25 < jpa-> for me, it says 50µA usage; not sure which STM32 you are using, but e.g. STM32L1 is about 1µA in stop mode where it can wake from EXTI
2018-09-10T22:01:29 < emeb> what's so hard about an active low EXTI?
2018-09-10T22:01:47 < jpa-> emeb: lowest power sleep (standby) doesn't support it
2018-09-10T22:02:03 < catphish> 50uA in tag detection mode with 4 detection pulses per second
2018-09-10T22:02:29 < emeb> jpa-: ah.
2018-09-10T22:02:32 < catphish> and the stm32 is... 0.35 µA Stop mode
2018-09-10T22:02:50 < catphish> so yeah, you're quite right, i don't need Standby mode
2018-09-10T22:03:16 < emeb> I've got a battery-powered project that uses EXTI from a button that's been running for about 1/2 a year now off two AAs. 
2018-09-10T22:03:40 < emeb> don't see that much difference between the mode I use and the absolute lowest I guess.
2018-09-10T22:04:11 < jpa-> the big difference is in software side, standby mode resets the whole CPU when you wake up
2018-09-10T22:04:30 < jpa-> (though also, if it has a lot of RAM, it saves quite some power to turn of the ram)
2018-09-10T22:04:58 < catphish> i'm aiming for 1-2 years runtime on 1AH
2018-09-10T22:05:18 < emeb> full reset wasn't a feature I wanted anyway
2018-09-10T22:05:32 < catphish> at 50uA draw, i'll get 2 years
2018-09-10T22:06:03 < catphish> although i also need to wake up sometimes to receive a gps signal, that will be expensive but brief
2018-09-10T22:06:30 < emeb> my project is an L432 + spi LCD. Current in power-down is > 10uA total.
2018-09-10T22:06:42 < emeb> most of that is the standby of the LCD
2018-09-10T22:06:44 < jpa-> catphish: put a button there :P
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2018-09-10T22:12:09 < catphish> i've considered it, and doing so would basically make battery life infinite, but prefer to avoid it
2018-09-10T22:12:22 < catphish> it would suck for UX
2018-09-10T22:13:13 < jpa-> you can put a microswitch in the tag detection area so the UX would be basically unchanged, and if you light up immediately on button press it might even seem more reliable to users than slowish tag read
2018-09-10T22:13:13 < Thorn__> catphish: just add a pnp inverter
2018-09-10T22:13:30 < jpa-> but it wouldn't make battery life infinite, at most you can get 10 years or so
2018-09-10T22:13:30 -!- Thorn__ is now known as Thorn
2018-09-10T22:15:56 < catphish> jpa-: one option would be to make the whole case press against a microswitch, so pressing a card against the reder will activate the switch
2018-09-10T22:16:18 < jpa-> (if you press hard enough)
2018-09-10T22:16:22 < catphish> these batteries are rated for really really long life, but yeah 10 years is about the limit
2018-09-10T22:18:43 < Steffanx> lolwut superbia1, broke a leg?
2018-09-10T22:18:48 < Steffanx> bicycling is not for superbia1 ?
2018-09-10T22:19:01 < jpa-> if it were always used in daylight, you could also use a phototransistor to wake it up
2018-09-10T22:22:05 < catphish> jpa-: probably too unpredictable, and i'd quite like dark usage
2018-09-10T22:22:27 < catphish> i also considered magnetic switches, but would like it to work with standard ntag cards
2018-09-10T22:22:52 < catphish> so really, i think it's going to be either always-on, or a microswitch
2018-09-10T22:23:48 < jpa-> a sensitive piezo could wake up on the touch of a card, but it will probably also trigger for lots of other noises etc.
2018-09-10T22:24:00 < catphish> interesting
2018-09-10T22:35:20 < Steffanx> 1Ah/year is like 110uA on average. Are you sure that is realistic for what you want catphish ?
2018-09-10T22:36:19 < jpa-> https://jpa.kapsi.fi/stuff/pix/piezo.webm
2018-09-10T22:36:32 < englishman> hello crt
2018-09-10T22:36:44 < Steffanx> welcome stvn
2018-09-10T22:36:58 < catphish> Steffanx: i think so, idle current is 50uA, so i think it's realistic, depending on how much time is spend drawing higher currents
2018-09-10T22:37:01 < Steffanx> did you know it's only 5:56 in the aussieland
2018-09-10T22:37:12 < englishman> dongs found a friend of yours https://twitter.com/toym4ker
2018-09-10T22:37:34 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-10T22:37:38 < catphish> i'm also rather hoping i can reduce that idle current to less, will need to do some testing with the st95hf though to see what can be achieved
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2018-09-10T22:42:05 < catphish> there is no cat
2018-09-10T22:42:48 < Steffanx> How long is it in "reader" mode with field on usually, any clue catphish ?
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2018-09-10T22:43:37 < catphish> at a total guess, maybe 100ms, but i've not timed it
2018-09-10T22:43:58 < Steffanx> and how often do you expect people to use it?
2018-09-10T22:44:01 < Steffanx> 60 times/hour?
2018-09-10T22:44:11 < Steffanx> is it your foot superbia1 ? 
2018-09-10T22:44:16 < Steffanx> Then its ##stm32
2018-09-10T22:44:17 < Steffanx> ware
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2018-09-10T22:45:11 < catphish> Steffanx: this is a lot of guesswork, maybe 100 activations (so 10s) per week
2018-09-10T22:45:18 < Steffanx> ooh
2018-09-10T22:45:22 < Steffanx> i expected a lot more
2018-09-10T22:45:33 < Steffanx> im waiting superbia1 D
2018-09-10T22:45:34 < Steffanx> :D
2018-09-10T22:45:41 < Steffanx> In the mean time you can explain what you did superbia1
2018-09-10T22:46:23 < catphish> Steffanx: then there's the gps receiver cost, maybe 10 seconds per day @ 20mA, that may even be the biggest power expense
2018-09-10T22:46:36 < catphish> Steffanx: plus there's the cost of beeping the beeper and flashing the LED on each activation
2018-09-10T22:46:56 < catphish> Steffanx: i can calculate all this, but i haven't done so yet
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2018-09-10T22:51:30 < Steffanx> oh, i expected much worse
2018-09-10T22:52:18 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-10T22:52:38 < catphish> i'm also that colour
2018-09-10T22:54:26 < Steffanx> so what did you do?
2018-09-10T22:54:29 < BrainDamage> catphish: you need more than 10s per day with gps, since you need to download the ephemeris
2018-09-10T22:54:54 < BrainDamage> and since your system is offline, it can only come from sat
2018-09-10T22:55:10 < BrainDamage> iirc the broadcast interval is 10 min, but I forgot the broadcast time extent
2018-09-10T22:55:27 < BrainDamage> bur iirc it's several minutess
2018-09-10T22:56:01 < BrainDamage> even so, your gps refresh interval only has to be depenent on your oscillator's drift
2018-09-10T22:56:21 < BrainDamage> assuming the box's physical location doesn't move
2018-09-10T22:56:39 < BrainDamage> just mandate that the user power cycles the board upoon relocation
2018-09-10T22:56:47 < BrainDamage> and have a cold start at boot
2018-09-10T22:57:11 < catphish> BrainDamage: you have to redownload even if you always warm start?
2018-09-10T22:57:33 < BrainDamage> no, but eventually the data becomes obsolete
2018-09-10T22:57:50 < catphish> BrainDamage: i see, so one has to redownload from time to time?
2018-09-10T22:57:54 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-10T22:58:04 < BrainDamage> either from the sats or from the interwebs
2018-09-10T22:58:25 < catphish> BrainDamage: i'd actually prefer to hack a gps receiver to just receive the first timestamp it can with no regard for location
2018-09-10T22:58:36 < catphish> BrainDamage: but i suspect that's not going to be possible
2018-09-10T22:58:50 < BrainDamage> there's gps that allow access to the raw data iirc
2018-09-10T22:58:53 < BrainDamage> but those are rare
2018-09-10T22:59:06 < BrainDamage> how much time precision do you need?
2018-09-10T22:59:14 < catphish> 1 second
2018-09-10T22:59:23 < BrainDamage> 1 second over how much time?
2018-09-10T22:59:36 < catphish> always
2018-09-10T22:59:49 < catphish> i mean actual time +/- 0.5s always
2018-09-10T23:00:26 < BrainDamage> consider this, your run out the mill TCXO will have few ppm error
2018-09-10T23:00:36 < BrainDamage> that's about 1s drift every 10 days
2018-09-10T23:01:01 < BrainDamage> you could get a OCXO, with 0.1ppm, but those are much more power hungry
2018-09-10T23:01:19 < BrainDamage> so with a TCXO, you only have to reset the clock every ~5 days or so
2018-09-10T23:01:33 < catphish> that seems reasonable
2018-09-10T23:01:39 < BrainDamage> pretty sure you can turn on the gps for 10min every 5 days and still have a negligible duty cycle
2018-09-10T23:01:50 < BrainDamage> with a cold start
2018-09-10T23:02:14 < catphish> that's certainly one option, does it really need 5 days?
2018-09-10T23:02:29 < catphish> *10 minutes
2018-09-10T23:03:02 < BrainDamage> it's to be sure to catch an ephemeris download with a run-out-the-mill chip
2018-09-10T23:03:36 < BrainDamage> remember one thing though, you need position to know your time
2018-09-10T23:03:46 < catphish> well i can just do a warm start right? and run it until i get a lock
2018-09-10T23:03:48 < BrainDamage> because the time arrives late compared to the sat
2018-09-10T23:03:56 < catphish> the time it takes to do so will vary
2018-09-10T23:04:05 < Steffanx> go with lora and publish the time :P
2018-09-10T23:04:08 < catphish> but as soon as it succeeds, i can just turn it off, right?
2018-09-10T23:04:13 < BrainDamage> warm start implies you have ephemeris data cached so you can get a lock fast
2018-09-10T23:04:23 < Steffanx> or sigfox because Laurenceb_  likes that, or isnt it fast enough. not sure how that works.
2018-09-10T23:04:30 < BrainDamage> but again, that eventually invalidates
2018-09-10T23:04:46 < catphish> BrainDamage: right, but when it does, it'll just take longer to warm-start right?
2018-09-10T23:04:54 < catphish> there's no benefit in intentionally erasing it is there?
2018-09-10T23:05:11 < Steffanx> take care mr superbia1
2018-09-10T23:05:26 < BrainDamage> no benefit in erasing, but your use case will be that most/the totality of the refresheses will be in cold start
2018-09-10T23:05:57 < BrainDamage> once the cache is invalidated, you need to wait until you get the ephemeris data
2018-09-10T23:06:04 < Steffanx> lolwhat superbia1 ?
2018-09-10T23:06:18 < BrainDamage> it's not like you can poll faster to keep the cache hot
2018-09-10T23:06:38 < catphish> BrainDamage: yeah  i see, do turning on for 5 seconds per day won't help
2018-09-10T23:06:41 < catphish> *so
2018-09-10T23:06:47 < BrainDamage> you can poll as fast as you want *while* the ephemeris cache is valid
2018-09-10T23:06:58 < BrainDamage> once it's invalid, you'll need to wait until you get it
2018-09-10T23:07:44 < BrainDamage> so if your poll rate is slow enough to be comparable to the ephemeris cache validation time, your limit is not the cache itself, rather the oscillator's stability
2018-09-10T23:07:44 < catphish> BrainDamage: so i can turn on and sync the clock super fast as long as the data is valid, and once it's not, it'll just take longer to get a lock
2018-09-10T23:08:05 < catphish> but on all occasions, i can turn it off as soon as it does, right?
2018-09-10T23:08:13 < BrainDamage> sure, but you get no particular gain
2018-09-10T23:08:19 < BrainDamage> your clock will be more accurate
2018-09-10T23:08:39 < BrainDamage> but if your goal is ~1s, meh
2018-09-10T23:09:07 < catphish> well my plan was to use a 20ppm xtal, then use the stm32's compensation mechanism to improve upon that using the gps data
2018-09-10T23:09:19 < PaulFertser> catphish: you do not need almanac data with modern GNSS receivers as their correlators allow to "listen" to all the possible sats at once.
2018-09-10T23:09:55 < PaulFertser> catphish: ephemeris are valid for 2-3 hours anyway, and it takes 30 seconds (in ideal condition) to receive new from the sats.
2018-09-10T23:10:08 < BrainDamage> I would check one thing
2018-09-10T23:10:19 < catphish> PaulFertser: well that's cool, this receiver claims 15 second cold start
2018-09-10T23:10:20 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-10T23:10:22 < BrainDamage> how much misalignment you have if you don't compensate for position
2018-09-10T23:10:49 < BrainDamage> because if it's less than 1s, you could just get away with the first time you receive, and that's it
2018-09-10T23:10:49 < PaulFertser> catphish: and btw, with the protocol as deployed by the majority of GPS sats the receiver can't know the UTC-TAI offset and it can take up to 25 minutes to get it!
2018-09-10T23:11:28 < PaulFertser> catphish: 15 seconds sounds impossible, the transmit cycle is 30 seconds. Probably that's with ephemeris downloaded out-of-band?
2018-09-10T23:11:32 < BrainDamage> oh, and let's not forget one nightmare thing
2018-09-10T23:11:34 < catphish> PaulFertser: well that's mad, this gps receiver claims cold start with data takes 15 seconds, and cold start without it 35 seconds
2018-09-10T23:11:47 < BrainDamage> gps time doesn't include leap seconds
2018-09-10T23:11:52 < catphish> when i say with data, i mean it's internal data, not assisted
2018-09-10T23:11:55 < BrainDamage> while most human time does
2018-09-10T23:12:08 < PaulFertser> BrainDamage: UTC-TAI is exactly the problem with leap seconds. And it's broadcasted once in 25 minutes :(
2018-09-10T23:12:30 < PaulFertser> catphish: internal recent ephemeris is not cold start then.
2018-09-10T23:12:30 < Steffanx> what was the issue with dcf77 again catphish ?
2018-09-10T23:12:32 < catphish> i don't care about leap seconds, it doesn't matter if all my devices are wrong, as long as they're equally wrong
2018-09-10T23:12:43 < PaulFertser> catphish: you never know with gps...
2018-09-10T23:13:17 < catphish> Steffanx: i tested it, it's just messy, sometimes i get a clean signal, sometimes i consistently get noise, i don't really know how to decode it under these unreliable conditions
2018-09-10T23:13:35 < BrainDamage> catphish: dcf77 depends on propagation conditions
2018-09-10T23:13:48 < catphish> it does indeed
2018-09-10T23:13:49 < BrainDamage> generally, you want nighttime skywave to have reliabile test
2018-09-10T23:14:06 < BrainDamage> most "radio alarm clock" devices sync around ~3 am
2018-09-10T23:14:16 < catphish> and frankly, gps just seemed like a get out of fail free card, dedicated ASIC does everything
2018-09-10T23:14:20 < BrainDamage> this to both avoid the DST issues and the propagation issues
2018-09-10T23:15:37 < catphish> there's also the matter of geographic reliability, gps should work everywhere
2018-09-10T23:15:57 < catphish> though i need to test my cheap receiver works under cover, and check its power consumption
2018-09-10T23:16:05 < PaulFertser> catphish: you can probably count on your stm32 clock and if you see a PPS that's close enough, align to that?
2018-09-10T23:17:06 < catphish> PaulFertser: well i will definitely be tuning the internal 32,768 oscillator to be as accurate as the stm32 allows
2018-09-10T23:17:37 < PaulFertser> catphish: but I mean instead of actually getting time from GNSS you can probably just use its PPS for drift compensation.
2018-09-10T23:18:18 < catphish> PaulFertser: i don't really understand that, how does the pps align itself?
2018-09-10T23:18:35 < zyp> it doesn't
2018-09-10T23:18:49 < PaulFertser> catphish: pps signal is emitted by receiver once a second, and it's aligned by the reciever to the signals it receives from the sats.
2018-09-10T23:19:06 < qyx> if I dare to ask
2018-09-10T23:19:25 < catphish> so, it's not particularly useful to sync a clock to unless it's always on?
2018-09-10T23:19:26 < qyx> catphish: what precision do you need 
2018-09-10T23:19:29 < zyp> PaulFertser, but you still need to get a time fix for it to be useful
2018-09-10T23:19:43 < qyx> do you really need a sub-second accuracy?
2018-09-10T23:19:46 < catphish> no
2018-09-10T23:19:51 < catphish> i need 1-second accuracy
2018-09-10T23:19:53 < BrainDamage> no, he said 1s absolute
2018-09-10T23:20:02 < qyx> so no 1pps
2018-09-10T23:20:06 < qyx> why the fuck 1pps
2018-09-10T23:20:08 < catphish> yeah 1-second absolute at all times
2018-09-10T23:20:12 < qyx> forget about it
2018-09-10T23:20:14 < zyp> the point of the PPS signal is to be able to sync precisely, i.e. more precise than what message timing allows
2018-09-10T23:20:16 < qyx> just read nmea time
2018-09-10T23:20:33 < PaulFertser> zyp: depends on the precision requirements, I'd expect it to be about right even before any fix is reported.
2018-09-10T23:20:38 < catphish> yes, my current plen is to power on and use nmea time once a day
2018-09-10T23:20:39 < qyx> and no complicated adjusting algos
2018-09-10T23:20:48 < zyp> PaulFertser, from a cold start?
2018-09-10T23:20:50 < qyx> when a fix is available, step-adjust the internal clock
2018-09-10T23:21:01 < catphish> PaulFertser: i don't understand what it would be aligned with
2018-09-10T23:21:03 < PaulFertser> zyp: yes, I'd expect it to.
2018-09-10T23:21:05 < BrainDamage> yup, the time between nmea reads is only limited by the internal Lo stability
2018-09-10T23:21:17 < PaulFertser> catphish: with exact start of a second.
2018-09-10T23:21:23 < BrainDamage> the better the LO, the longer the intervals and the less the power consumption
2018-09-10T23:21:25 < BrainDamage> that's it
2018-09-10T23:21:38 < catphish> PaulFertser: how could it know where the start of a second is without a gps lock>
2018-09-10T23:21:39 < catphish> *?
2018-09-10T23:21:47 < zyp> you're overcomplicating stuff, just do what qyx said
2018-09-10T23:22:04 < catphish> zyp: i think my original idea is exactly what qyx is proposing
2018-09-10T23:22:06 < zyp> catphish, it doesn't, unless it has its own internal RTC
2018-09-10T23:22:20 < PaulFertser> qyx: the problem is that NMEA can report _wrong_ time for _minutes_ while having a 3D fix and there's no way to tell right from wrong!
2018-09-10T23:22:34 < zyp> PaulFertser, uh, how so?
2018-09-10T23:22:35 < catphish> real the nmea once a day, measure difference with RTC and adjust both the absolute time and the drift compensation
2018-09-10T23:22:49 < qyx> PaulFertser: there is a validity indicator for time & fix
2018-09-10T23:22:49 < BrainDamage> catphish: with 20pmm you need more than once a day btw
2018-09-10T23:22:51 < PaulFertser> zyp: the receiver can't know current UTC-TAI offset.
2018-09-10T23:23:05 < catphish> BrainDamage: once a day was my target, but may be less, i'm not sure
2018-09-10T23:23:14 < BrainDamage> catphish: with 20ppm you get a 1s drift on average every 13h
2018-09-10T23:23:15 < PaulFertser> qyx: there is but it's not reliable.
2018-09-10T23:23:19 < BrainDamage> so you should aim for 6
2018-09-10T23:23:29 < qyx> how can it be not reliable?
2018-09-10T23:23:31 < qyx> test, check, done
2018-09-10T23:23:35 < qyx> if not, find another way
2018-09-10T23:23:36 < catphish> what PaulFertser says is a fear of mine, i don't know if nmea will contain a stale timestamp, but once it has a lock, it should be correct
2018-09-10T23:23:45 < BrainDamage> so you'll have 4 updates per day
2018-09-10T23:23:56 < BrainDamage> the receiver reports if it has a lock
2018-09-10T23:24:03 < BrainDamage> just discard timestamp until it does
2018-09-10T23:24:05 < zyp> PaulFertser, surely you can just read out TAI then
2018-09-10T23:24:06 < PaulFertser> qyx: it just reports wrong data even with valid fix. Because it can't be sure about current UTC-TAI if it didn't receive it.
2018-09-10T23:24:13 < PaulFertser> zyp: not with NMEA :(
2018-09-10T23:24:42 < catphish> that 20ppm is consistent though, right? so once i've run it for a couple of days, i can adjust the compensation and get it down to 1ppm?
2018-09-10T23:24:53 < BrainDamage> no it's not consistent
2018-09-10T23:24:56 < BrainDamage> temperature will change it
2018-09-10T23:25:08 < Laurenceb_> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45473433
2018-09-10T23:25:10 < BrainDamage> it'll have a deterministic and a non deterministic component
2018-09-10T23:25:12 < Laurenceb_> ppl of walmart
2018-09-10T23:25:12 < catphish> interesting, hence the suggestions of a TCXO
2018-09-10T23:25:14 < zyp> PaulFertser, UBX does
2018-09-10T23:25:19 < BrainDamage> you can compensate only the deterministic part
2018-09-10T23:25:42 < PaulFertser> BrainDamage: I've seen proper receiver reporting a lock with wrong time offset. Because if it knows the exact 3d position it's enough for the usual navigational purposes.
2018-09-10T23:25:49 < zyp> PaulFertser, NAV-TIMEGPS UBX message has a «valid leap seconds» flag
2018-09-10T23:26:10 < zyp> along with a number of leap seconds
2018-09-10T23:26:26 < catphish> the product i'm trying to copy has no clock sync at all, the advertise 20s/month drift, but i want to avoid the user having to manually sync every day they want to use it
2018-09-10T23:26:49 < PaulFertser> zyp: that's nice if a ubx receiver can be used, plus ubx binary protocol decoder is available.
2018-09-10T23:27:02 < Laurenceb_> protip: never use gpsd
2018-09-10T23:27:11 < catphish> the ubx binary stuff sounds cool, but ubx is too costly :(
2018-09-10T23:27:20 < PaulFertser> Laurenceb_: come on, I've used it many times, worked fine for me.
2018-09-10T23:27:29 < zyp> catphish, and a TCXO is not?
2018-09-10T23:27:31 < Laurenceb_> until it doesnt
2018-09-10T23:27:42 < catphish> zyp: i wasn't intending to use either
2018-09-10T23:27:52 < PaulFertser> Laurenceb_: I can fix when it doesn't, but so far there was no need.
2018-09-10T23:28:16 < catphish> ultimately it's all going to be a matter of juggling power consumption
2018-09-10T23:28:49 < catphish> if i can power on for 5 seconds every 12 hours, and longer every several days, i might be ok
2018-09-10T23:28:59 < catphish> but this will need testing
2018-09-10T23:29:16 < BrainDamage> pretty sure after 12h your sat cache is old
2018-09-10T23:29:32 < BrainDamage> so you'll have to account for cold start every time
2018-09-10T23:30:12 < PaulFertser> zyp: I've read the official GPS frame description document, it really is TAI that's broadcasted, and UTC-TAI is given only in one subframe so once every 25 minutes. And shitty NMEA standard decided to use UTC. So it's really fucked up.
2018-09-10T23:30:24 < zyp> PaulFertser, yeah
2018-09-10T23:31:08 < BrainDamage> catphish: more than 1s precision, what's your requirement on power consumption?
2018-09-10T23:31:11 < catphish> ah, so that's why one can't just instantly get a timestamp
2018-09-10T23:31:15 < zyp> the sane solution is to use a receiver that tells you whether it's actually telling you TAI or UTC
2018-09-10T23:31:24 < PaulFertser> BrainDamage: I'd do a live test, it'd not be surprising if PPS becomes "about right" in 5s or so.
2018-09-10T23:31:26 < BrainDamage> while "more is better", do you have a target?
2018-09-10T23:32:07 < PaulFertser> (otoh some receivers might just inhibit PPS until 3d lock)
2018-09-10T23:32:57 < catphish> i need 1s precision, with regard to power, less is better, i want to use < 100uA, half of that is taken by my NFC reader, leaving 50uA for time reception
2018-09-10T23:33:04 < qyx> I did some testing and the mediatek I use outputs 1pps after a 2d fix is known
2018-09-10T23:33:18 < qyx> and it is precise
2018-09-10T23:33:39 < catphish> i'd love a receiver that just blindly outputs the frst timestamp it receives from a satelite with no regard for UTC or fix
2018-09-10T23:33:43 < BrainDamage> 100uA average?
2018-09-10T23:33:49 < qyx> I use it in a gpsdo with a tcxo
2018-09-10T23:33:59 < catphish> BrainDamage: yeah, ie 1AH per year
2018-09-10T23:34:56 < BrainDamage> then you can easily meet it
2018-09-10T23:35:08 < PaulFertser> SiRF $GPZDA field description: "Either using valid IONO/UTC or estimated from default leap seconds." Are you fucking kidding...
2018-09-10T23:35:22 < BrainDamage> with 10mA drain on cold start and 30s lock time, you can call a cold start every 3000s aka 50 min to get 100uA average
2018-09-10T23:35:41 < BrainDamage> 6h is more than 6 times that, so you'll be fine
2018-09-10T23:36:04 < catphish> BrainDamage: the receiver i'm using claims worst case 25mA acquisition, acquisition time 35s
2018-09-10T23:36:07 < BrainDamage> so just use your normal shitty XO and reset it every 6h on the first time you get
2018-09-10T23:36:41 < catphish> BrainDamage: honestly that is probably what i will do, at least for initial tests
2018-09-10T23:37:08 < catphish> BrainDamage: it's also very likely it will get a lock much faster then 30s most of the time
2018-09-10T23:37:15 < PaulFertser> qyx: good to know
2018-09-10T23:37:16 < BrainDamage> that would make for 9000s, aka 2h30min
2018-09-10T23:37:29 < BrainDamage> 6h is still twice that
2018-09-10T23:37:50 < BrainDamage> well, you do your estimations for the worst case conditions
2018-09-10T23:38:49 < Laurenceb_> crt: willies and bums
2018-09-10T23:38:55 < PaulFertser> catphish: yes, if you will be turning it on every 50 minutes, you'll get the lock much faster. But if you will turn it off right after that, you won't update ephemeris data, so they'll get stale in few hours and then the lock will take more than 30s.
2018-09-10T23:39:19 < Laurenceb_> https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/media/images/80081000/jpg/_80081758_elliottspencerandstephenfryrexfeatures.jpg
2018-09-10T23:39:41 < qyx> are you doing some outdoor game support device? cap ^
2018-09-10T23:39:46 < BrainDamage> for the 4th time, just assume cold start every time, his update rate is so long that the cache will be invalidated ~always
2018-09-10T23:40:01 < qyx> catphish: ^
2018-09-10T23:40:10 < Laurenceb_> just use longwave time stations
2018-09-10T23:40:23 < qyx> he has been there
2018-09-10T23:40:32 < Cracki> did he get the tshirt?
2018-09-10T23:41:00 < BrainDamage> the bound on the update rate is just the XO stability, and given the 20ppm XO it means ~6h, which is still comparable with the cache lifetime
2018-09-10T23:41:11 < catphish> one of the datasheets has specific advice on this, just looking for it
2018-09-10T23:41:16 < BrainDamage> you could get some hot hits, some cold, but best to estimate your consumption with every cold hit
2018-09-10T23:41:58 < BrainDamage> and with the rough calc of every cold hit and his datshit spec, it gives a max update rate of 2h30min to meet his deadlines, 6h is more than twice that, so no problem at all
2018-09-10T23:43:15 < PaulFertser> BrainDamage: good points, I do not argue that.
2018-09-10T23:43:43 < zyp> hmm, ublox even has a time mode
2018-09-10T23:43:44 < zyp> «Time Mode is a special stationary GPS receiver mode where the position of the receiver is known and fixed and
2018-09-10T23:43:48 < zyp> only the time is calculated using all available satellites. This mode allows for maximum time accuracy as well as
2018-09-10T23:43:51 < zyp> for single-SV solutions.»
2018-09-10T23:45:31 < catphish> these are the specs for the gps receiver i'm looking at: https://i.imgur.com/NPJHpYo.png
2018-09-10T23:45:37 < Laurenceb_> crt: he was last seen with Steven Fry
2018-09-10T23:46:04 < Laurenceb_> willies and bums is now a meme
2018-09-10T23:46:37 < catphish> but it also says it should run for 5 minutes to get all the data necessary though, so i have no idea what's going on
2018-09-10T23:46:43 < catphish> i think i'll just test it
2018-09-10T23:47:04 < Laurenceb_> attn crt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7G4e0CRRdw
2018-09-10T23:48:10 < Cracki> I was promised willies and bums, yet I see none
2018-09-10T23:48:47 < catphish> zyp: time mode sounds interesting, i'd prefer a rougher time mode, but doesn't seem to exist much
2018-09-10T23:49:14 < catphish> i get the impression that the ST GPS modules are programmable, but found absolutely no information about them, or how to buy them
2018-09-10T23:49:38 < Laurenceb_> you have to be a special person
2018-09-10T23:50:00 < Laurenceb_> only one of the chosen people
2018-09-10T23:50:12 < BrainDamage> are they as available as the stm32W?
2018-09-10T23:50:19 < Laurenceb_> kek
2018-09-10T23:50:40 -!- [1]MrMobius is now known as MrMobius
2018-09-10T23:50:48 < Laurenceb_> shame cuz stm32w with the libraries was kind of epin
2018-09-10T23:51:59 < Laurenceb_> crt: thebumbumking is the lord of the N33T5
2018-09-10T23:52:05 < Cracki> >chosen people
2018-09-10T23:52:12 < Cracki> inb4 lucifer
2018-09-10T23:52:17 < catphish> for starters, ST seem to split their GNSS into 2 classes: https://www.st.com/en/positioning.html
2018-09-10T23:52:26 < catphish> it's not totally clear what the difference is
2018-09-10T23:52:56 < zyp> the difference between an IC and a module is unclear?
2018-09-10T23:53:06 < catphish> yes
2018-09-10T23:53:46 < catphish> i guess the module contains oscillator, and other necessary supporting parts
2018-09-10T23:53:52 < zyp> yes.
2018-09-10T23:54:16 < zyp> a module is generally a «power it up and go» part
2018-09-10T23:54:34 < zyp> getting just the IC means you'd have to build up the whole support circuitry around it yourself
2018-09-10T23:54:42 < catphish> it also says "A flexible firmware solution makes it easy to download new firmware and updates." but i guess that doesn't mean you can easily write your own, even if you have the skills, which i probably do not
2018-09-10T23:55:06 < englishman> catphish: why dont you just sync up all the receptors before the race as part of the setup instructions
2018-09-10T23:55:07 < BrainDamage> getting just the IC means you have to reimplement the module yourself, more space efficiency and better cost for your own personal efforts
2018-09-10T23:55:21 < englishman> then the rtc should be good for a few days
2018-09-10T23:55:25 < catphish> englishman: that's how competing-product works
2018-09-10T23:55:33 < Laurenceb_> just use the general atomics nuclear explosion detect ic
2018-09-10T23:55:35 < BrainDamage> with 20ppm it won't be good for a few days
2018-09-10T23:55:36 < englishman> cloned
2018-09-10T23:55:41 < catphish> englishman: but i wanted this one to work with less maintenance
2018-09-10T23:55:43 < Laurenceb_> then detonate a nuke at the start of the race
2018-09-10T23:55:45 < BrainDamage> more like a day
2018-09-10T23:55:56 < catphish> englishman: they claim 20s per month drift
2018-09-10T23:56:15 < englishman> probably using stm32 and the stm32 nfc sensor too
2018-09-10T23:56:22 < BrainDamage> catphish: can you describe exactly your problem?
2018-09-10T23:56:36 < BrainDamage> maybe you can broadcast local time between the devices
2018-09-10T23:56:37 < catphish> englishman: that's ok if you use them only for organized races, but i was hoping they could be left outside semi-permenently too
2018-09-10T23:56:38 < vampi-the-frog> can you describe your major malfunction?
2018-09-10T23:56:41 < BrainDamage> lora comes to mind
2018-09-10T23:56:51 < englishman> lora to the rescue
2018-09-10T23:57:11 < Laurenceb_> do the runners have smartpones
2018-09-10T23:57:13 < englishman> steffy suggested that 6 hours ago, could have spun up a prototype by now
2018-09-10T23:57:14 < Laurenceb_> kek vampi
2018-09-10T23:57:25 < catphish> Laurenceb_: no
2018-09-10T23:57:31 < Laurenceb_> what do they use?
2018-09-10T23:57:38 < catphish> ntag216
2018-09-10T23:57:51 < Laurenceb_> oh wow ok
2018-09-10T23:58:03 < Laurenceb_> didnt realise those sort of rfid readers were so low power
2018-09-10T23:58:07 < catphish> keeps the tags cheap :)
2018-09-10T23:58:11 < vampi-the-frog> I almost ate a whole bag of pistachio and I can't stop
2018-09-10T23:58:32 < zyp> Laurenceb_, field detection is pretty low power
2018-09-10T23:58:34 < vampi-the-frog> it would be fine if it wasn't so expensive
2018-09-10T23:58:42 < Laurenceb_> isnt there any way to have the tags send the time to the devices?
2018-09-10T23:58:55 < zyp> haha, no
2018-09-10T23:59:03 < Laurenceb_> hmf
2018-09-10T23:59:04 < BrainDamage> tags generally just send id
2018-09-10T23:59:07 < catphish> this will use tag detection, which basically puts a pulse into the antenna and measures how long it takes the resonant signal to decay
2018-09-10T23:59:29 < catphish> tags can store data, but that's all
2018-09-10T23:59:42 < BrainDamage> if you want more than ID, you want nfc, which implies some sort of logic on the other side
2018-09-10T23:59:55 < Laurenceb_> can data be sent to the tags?
2018-09-10T23:59:56 < catphish> a master device could be carried around to sync the times, this is how other products work
2018-09-10T23:59:59 < BrainDamage> and cost raises significantly
--- Day changed Tue Sep 11 2018
2018-09-11T00:00:01 < catphish> but i want less maintenance
2018-09-11T00:00:21 < Laurenceb_> yeah a master device sounds like a pita
2018-09-11T00:00:51 < catphish> basically there's a master device, before an event someone scans it against all the devices to sync their clocks
2018-09-11T00:01:08 < catphish> it works, but i want something that can just be used on a whim
2018-09-11T00:01:25 < catphish> ie semi-permenant installation
2018-09-11T00:01:49 < Laurenceb_> so DCF77
2018-09-11T00:02:27 < catphish> Laurenceb_: that was plan A, but i hated it when i attempted to decode it
2018-09-11T00:02:37 < BrainDamage> why
2018-09-11T00:02:58 < catphish> the problem was that somteimes i get a sane signal, sometimes just noise
2018-09-11T00:03:01 < BrainDamage> throw data in circular buffer and slide window until it matches
2018-09-11T00:03:07 < Laurenceb_> thats kind of expected
2018-09-11T00:03:10 < BrainDamage> if it doesn't. discard and wait for sane data
2018-09-11T00:03:13 < Laurenceb_> you need to sanity check it
2018-09-11T00:03:30 < catphish> i suppose i could try, just let it run until the circular buffer is sane
2018-09-11T00:04:05 < Laurenceb_> there are guidelines for sanity checking those pwm outputs
2018-09-11T00:04:17 < Laurenceb_> ignore stuff thats too short or too long for a start
2018-09-11T00:04:37 < Laurenceb_> k I have to go
2018-09-11T00:05:03 < catphish> have fun
2018-09-11T00:05:51 < catphish> this is power-expensive too though, got to run the receiver for minimum 60 seconds per attempt
2018-09-11T00:06:25 < englishman> broadcast your own dcf77 locally
2018-09-11T00:06:25 < catphish> although only 66uA run power
2018-09-11T00:06:28 < BrainDamage> pretty sure dcf77 receivers consume nothing
2018-09-11T00:06:33 < BrainDamage> exactly
2018-09-11T00:06:47 < BrainDamage> you could let it run indefinetly, and still meet your power budget
2018-09-11T00:06:56 < catphish> BrainDamage: 66uA, so i guess not a big deal, can run it pretty much indefinitely until it gets a sync
2018-09-11T00:07:18 < BrainDamage> even after a sync
2018-09-11T00:07:22 < catphish> not quite indefinitely, 100uA needs to be split between NFC and time, but yeah, close
2018-09-11T00:07:27 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-11T00:07:27 < Steffanx> Lora time syncing seems to be a thing too.
2018-09-11T00:07:59 < BrainDamage> actually, if there's a thing like a distributed NTP, I'd be curious
2018-09-11T00:08:17 < BrainDamage> one that doesn't have a central authority but instead frequency pulls on the average of the times
2018-09-11T00:08:25 < englishman> the current time is whatever time it is
2018-09-11T00:08:47 < BrainDamage> welcome to cyclostationary solutions, there's no absolute reference for time
2018-09-11T00:09:00 -!- Laurenceb_ [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-11T00:09:18 < BrainDamage> if there was, time keeping wouldn't be such a bitch
2018-09-11T00:11:18 < catphish> i can use this: https://www.mas-oy.com/portfolio/mas6180b/
2018-09-11T00:12:00 < catphish> a local area transmission sounds cool too, but then you still have to elect a master and sync it somehow
2018-09-11T00:12:37 < catphish> so yeah, either i jump ship to GPS, make things easy and power hungry, or i persist with DCF77
2018-09-11T00:12:58 < Steffanx> Why only 1Ah btw?
2018-09-11T00:13:12 < catphish> i hadn't really realised, gps is 500x more power
2018-09-11T00:13:31 < englishman> maybe put a fine swiss mechanical timepiece in every sensor
2018-09-11T00:14:23 < Steffanx> Even some AA energizer batteries do like 3Ah.
2018-09-11T00:14:59 < englishman> https://youtu.be/VNuuZ2-2b0U?t=11m22s
2018-09-11T00:15:15 < englishman> this thing only has a dumb can inside it, how can it keep time for 5y?
2018-09-11T00:15:44 < catphish> Steffanx: i intend to use a LS14500, it has a capacity of 2.5AH
2018-09-11T00:16:02 < karlp> oh, cool, kerry wong
2018-09-11T00:16:07 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLcdm6gB6eE
2018-09-11T00:16:15 < karlp> he's someone I used to read back when google still allowed rss on the internet
2018-09-11T00:16:15 < catphish> Steffanx: so 1AH per year budget for decent lifespan
2018-09-11T00:16:37 < BrainDamage> englishman: TOTP tokens need 30s absolute precision
2018-09-11T00:16:41 < Steffanx> You need energy harvestinf
2018-09-11T00:16:52 < englishman> 30s over 5y is much better than 20s/month
2018-09-11T00:17:05 < BrainDamage> ofc
2018-09-11T00:17:20 < BrainDamage> but they are also not using 20ppm dirt cheap XO
2018-09-11T00:17:35 < catphish> that's a good question, how are those things so accurate, and moderately chea
2018-09-11T00:17:35 < englishman> well catphish is talking about buying $7 gps for each one
2018-09-11T00:17:59 < BrainDamage> a TXCO and themostat control can increase precision a lot
2018-09-11T00:18:04 < catphish> any timekeeping solution at $5 is good with me
2018-09-11T00:18:09 < englishman> it does look like a dirt cheap xo tho
2018-09-11T00:18:12 < englishman> 2 pin
2018-09-11T00:18:26 < BrainDamage> dirt cheap XO can still be TCXO
2018-09-11T00:18:42 < englishman> hmm rly
2018-09-11T00:18:56 < BrainDamage> TCXO is just in the design, not the components
2018-09-11T00:19:01 < englishman> https://www.microsemi.com/product-directory/clocks-frequency-references/3824-chip-scale-atomic-clock-csac
2018-09-11T00:19:10 < englishman> now in RoHS
2018-09-11T00:19:17 < catphish> i used to have one of those RSA device, they're incredible, i wonder what they do have in there
2018-09-11T00:19:37 < BrainDamage> if it's bragging pourposes, I do have a Ru clock with 10^-12 allan deviation
2018-09-11T00:19:46 < BrainDamage> which is master clock for all my instrumentation
2018-09-11T00:20:00 < englishman> < 120mW power consumption
2018-09-11T00:20:00 < englishman> lol
2018-09-11T00:20:14 < BrainDamage> compared to the 10W of mine, that's tiny
2018-09-11T00:20:20 < karlp> we finally scrapped fucking tokens for banking here.
2018-09-11T00:20:34 < Steffanx> Just a phone app?
2018-09-11T00:20:38 < karlp> wife's "business" account still uses a soft token phone app,
2018-09-11T00:20:48 < englishman> for all banking? the one i have is just for large transfers
2018-09-11T00:20:50 < karlp> all individual stuff is using a digitial id on the sim.
2018-09-11T00:22:14 < englishman> there are zero 2pin tcxo at digikey
2018-09-11T00:22:21 < englishman> i thought the whole point was that they were powered
2018-09-11T00:22:24 < englishman> and had a little oven
2018-09-11T00:22:29 < BrainDamage> that's OCXO
2018-09-11T00:22:42 < jadew> yeah, TCXO means it just compensates for the ambient temperature
2018-09-11T00:22:43 < BrainDamage> oven controlled crystal oscillator
2018-09-11T00:23:16 < BrainDamage> you can have a TCXO by having an external temp sensor
2018-09-11T00:23:16 < jadew> OCXOs heat up above the ambient temperature so there's not much fluctuation
2018-09-11T00:23:31 < englishman> o right
2018-09-11T00:23:39 < BrainDamage> likely in the ic of the bonded bullshit
2018-09-11T00:23:54 < catphish> so what is that RSA device using?
2018-09-11T00:24:07 < BrainDamage> a regular XO and a temp sensor in the chip
2018-09-11T00:24:24 < catphish> i guess their accuracy doesn't have to be *that* good, they can use minutes over their lifetime
2018-09-11T00:24:31 < catphish> *lose
2018-09-11T00:24:31 < BrainDamage> nope, 30s
2018-09-11T00:24:42 < BrainDamage> that's the interval on TOTP
2018-09-11T00:24:51 < catphish> those aren't TOTP, they're proprietary
2018-09-11T00:25:15 < catphish> but they may publish the drift they allow
2018-09-11T00:25:28 < catphish> *not standard TOTP anyway
2018-09-11T00:25:42 < BrainDamage> the update rate is still 30s
2018-09-11T00:25:51 < BrainDamage> source: I have one
2018-09-11T00:25:57 < englishman> same
2018-09-11T00:25:58 < catphish> yeah, i've used them too
2018-09-11T00:26:08 < catphish> but update rate says nothing about the allowed drift
2018-09-11T00:26:17 < jadew> is that one of those things that generates a key every now and then?
2018-09-11T00:26:21 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-11T00:26:25 < catphish> i mean, there's no reason not to accept a range of 10 diffrent codes, as long as they've not already been used
2018-09-11T00:26:57 < jadew> on the banking ones, where they read your card, they have a sequence and they're synchronized
2018-09-11T00:26:57 < catphish> my implementation of TOTP accepts 3 codes (the right one, and one each side)
2018-09-11T00:27:02 < jadew> and you can screw up like 100 or so
2018-09-11T00:27:10 < jadew> and if you get one right, it re-syncs
2018-09-11T00:27:26 < catphish> yeah, that was my thought, it doesn't need to be perfectly accurate
2018-09-11T00:28:42 < englishman> +- 3min according to rsa
2018-09-11T00:28:51 < englishman> still better than 20s/month
2018-09-11T00:29:20 < catphish> 1ppm oscillators are hilareously expensive :(
2018-09-11T00:29:29 < catphish> englishman: that's true
2018-09-11T00:29:46 < BrainDamage> add your own temp sensor and compensate yourself
2018-09-11T00:29:53 < englishman> broadcasting your own timesource probably isnt the worst idea
2018-09-11T00:29:57 < BrainDamage> I hope you're paid really well for this
2018-09-11T00:30:03 < jadew> you can get better performance cheaply, but not on a batter powered device
2018-09-11T00:30:05 < englishman> probably not
2018-09-11T00:30:21 < jadew> who's building it?
2018-09-11T00:30:22 < englishman> he's using kikacd after all
2018-09-11T00:30:33 < BrainDamage> yeah, broadcasting time is probably one of the most sane solutions
2018-09-11T00:30:44 < catphish> BrainDamage: i'm paid pretty well, i don't know who's building it yet :)
2018-09-11T00:30:58 < englishman> depends, if you are running a marathon, then you need 24 miles range in an urban setting at surface level
2018-09-11T00:31:27 < catphish> i don't fancy the idea of a local broadcast
2018-09-11T00:31:28 < jadew> you're not talking about that USB dongle anymore, are you?
2018-09-11T00:31:37 < catphish> means electing a master, and still having to sync that
2018-09-11T00:31:38 < englishman> this is all to save users from tapping one thing against another once per week
2018-09-11T00:32:13 < catphish> hmm, https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/Kyocera-Electronic-Components/KT2520K26000ACW18TAS?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtldj7qu1ydrV4BlHWfqgxIV5AtP8SEtEV9e%2fSS7t4xhg%3d%3d
2018-09-11T00:32:18 < catphish> 0.5PPM
2018-09-11T00:33:00 < catphish> that's more like 1 second per month
2018-09-11T00:33:23 < BrainDamage> 1s every 23d
2018-09-11T00:33:36 < BrainDamage> which means you'd need an update rate of once every 15 days
2018-09-11T00:33:59 < catphish> Ultra low supply current 800μA typ
2018-09-11T00:34:48 < catphish> yeah that's a HF xtal, i'm tired
2018-09-11T00:36:19 < catphish> best i can get in a timekeeping xtal is 5ppm
2018-09-11T00:37:26 < jadew> can you fit one of these in? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/FE-5650A-10MHZ-rubidium-atomic-clock/32895381775.html
2018-09-11T00:37:27 < catphish> realistically, i'm going to either 1) let people sync it manually 2) get a gps fix once a day 3) use DCF77
2018-09-11T00:37:34 < jadew> 0.005 ppm / 10 year stability :)
2018-09-11T00:37:51 < catphish> jadew: nice, i'll make it an optional extra
2018-09-11T00:38:18 < catphish> along with a generator to power it
2018-09-11T00:38:34 < jadew> it only takes 3A
2018-09-11T00:38:38 < jadew> @ 12 V
2018-09-11T00:38:58 < BrainDamage> pff, my module only uses 30W during startup for 10 min
2018-09-11T00:39:02 < BrainDamage> after it's only 10
2018-09-11T00:39:13 < jadew> I think you're right
2018-09-11T00:39:16 < jadew> mine is the same
2018-09-11T00:40:26 < catphish> so realistically, MSF60/DCF77 is the better option, it's a hassle from the perspective of building in a giant antenna, and parsing the signal, but must power power-effective
2018-09-11T00:40:49 < BrainDamage> it also has the limitation that you need a different one for each market
2018-09-11T00:40:50 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-71e0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-11T00:40:56 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-11T00:41:02 < catphish> gps just seems cleaner
2018-09-11T00:41:04 < BrainDamage> if you plan to sell it abroad, you need a different filter and a different decoder
2018-09-11T00:41:30 < BrainDamage> you couuuld use DAB time clock
2018-09-11T00:41:35 < zyp> how many units are you planning to make again?
2018-09-11T00:41:36 < BrainDamage> but it's deployment is really limited
2018-09-11T00:42:02 < catphish> zyp: i have literally no idea, i'm not even going to bother assessing the market until i know it works
2018-09-11T00:42:10 < catphish> maybe none, maybe some
2018-09-11T00:42:25 < zyp> you're spending a lot of time cost optimizing
2018-09-11T00:42:48 < BrainDamage> o_O, then go with gps
2018-09-11T00:42:50 < zyp> I'd just drop in that ublox and call it a day
2018-09-11T00:42:58  * karlp hi5s zyp
2018-09-11T00:43:32 < Steffanx> Are you dying?
2018-09-11T00:43:34 -!- Kerr-A [~Kerr-A@2606:6000:4fc0:17:34b2:77df:4a6f:4ec9] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-11T00:43:35 < catphish> zyp: that's a definitely maybe
2018-09-11T00:43:48 < BrainDamage> literally dying, he can't even
2018-09-11T00:43:51 < zyp> catphish, I think you said it was <$10
2018-09-11T00:44:11 < zyp> and $10 ± on the BOM in low qty is pretty irrelevant
2018-09-11T00:44:12 < catphish> zyp: the ublox is a bit more expensive in anything but huge quantities
2018-09-11T00:44:38 < englishman> id just buy the competitior's product and put your own sticker on it, maybe a nice white plastic case and paper box so people can make unboxing videos
2018-09-11T00:44:39 < BrainDamage> well, you offer one thing that the competitor doesn't
2018-09-11T00:44:57 < catphish> zyp: https://i.imgur.com/xJaFmir.png
2018-09-11T00:44:58 < BrainDamage> you can make that 7$ be 30$ on the product's final cost
2018-09-11T00:45:08 < zyp> catphish, consider how much time you're spending on evaluating options and how much that time is worth
2018-09-11T00:45:43 < Steffanx> Time is free.
2018-09-11T00:45:51 < Steffanx> If its just hobby time.
2018-09-11T00:46:00 < catphish> i will make a brief evaluation of https://www.u-blox.com/en/product/sam-m8q-module vs https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm
2018-09-11T00:46:05 < BrainDamage> also if it's drunk time
2018-09-11T00:46:14 < catphish> it's mostly hobby time indeed
2018-09-11T00:46:36 < catphish> it's complicated (TM)
2018-09-11T00:46:53 < englishman> oh, happy birthday dongs!
2018-09-11T00:46:56 < BrainDamage> get the one with the castellated connector, since the other day you complained you were soldering impaired
2018-09-11T00:47:21 < catphish> i can solder both of those, they're huge
2018-09-11T00:47:21 < Steffanx> Nine-eleven -_-
2018-09-11T00:47:54 < BrainDamage> happy 9/11, throw a paper airplane at someone you love
2018-09-11T00:48:32 < BrainDamage> I wrote that on a paper airplane and threw it at some asshole american student few years ago, he was fuming
2018-09-11T00:48:50 < jadew> lol
2018-09-11T00:50:32 < catphish> is it common for people to prototype with parts that they then find aren't commercially viable in a saleable product? isn't this a sucky approach?
2018-09-11T00:50:51 < catphish> i guess i'm a bit needlessly anal about optimizing everything upfront
2018-09-11T00:51:11 < Cracki> *prototype*
2018-09-11T00:51:17 < Cracki> make it work, then optimize
2018-09-11T00:52:30 < jadew> that's the rule for software, not sure it always applies to hw
2018-09-11T00:52:34 < Cracki> "commercially viable" can mean a lot. plan to sell a million copies of it? plan to sell hand-made uniques to someone who needs it and doesn't care about cost?
2018-09-11T00:52:38 < jadew> doesn't even apply to sw all the time
2018-09-11T00:53:04 < BrainDamage> prototype in hw costs lot more time and money than software
2018-09-11T00:53:07 < Cracki> sure you need to plan... but prototypes are for exploring the solution space
2018-09-11T00:53:36 < BrainDamage> even software you try to pick some solutions beforehand such as API, because refactoring those is a pain
2018-09-11T00:53:54 < BrainDamage> granted, what he's doing right now counts as premature optimization
2018-09-11T00:54:11 < BrainDamage> but the amount of eyeballing necessary in hw is much stricter than sw
2018-09-11T00:54:26 < catphish> my company has a long history of overengineering things and never selling them
2018-09-11T00:54:26 < BrainDamage> even more so if you're hobby and your budget is 0
2018-09-11T00:54:34 < Cracki> the question conflates two separate things: "commercially viable parts" and "optimizing everything upfront"
2018-09-11T00:55:10 < jadew> usually commercially viable and cheap are part of the specs
2018-09-11T00:55:12 < BrainDamage> commercially viable is meaningless when you don't have budget
2018-09-11T00:56:01 < catphish> basically, i just want something that works, but given several options, i will choose the one that cheaper for small runs
2018-09-11T00:56:20 < BrainDamage> see eg sync's idea of hobby involving vacuum pumps costing 2.5k€
2018-09-11T00:57:22 < karlp> ref for those not playing along: https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/budgets
2018-09-11T00:57:31 < catphish> and it's mentally unpleasant to spend $15 for one component on top of a $10 BOM :)
2018-09-11T00:59:04 < catphish> nb: i'm not really struggling with this decision, i ordered a https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm and i'll put it in a prototype and hope for the best, i also have a https://www.mas-oy.com/portfolio/mas6180b/ in another prototype already built
2018-09-11T00:59:14 < catphish> i will compare and see what works
2018-09-11T00:59:58 < catphish> but i think the gps will make for a better product
2018-09-11T01:00:33 -!- Rickta59 [~kimballr@unaffiliated/rickta59] has quit [Quit: leaving]
2018-09-11T01:02:08 < englishman> shoutout to englishman 
2018-09-11T01:02:23 < catphish> shootout?
2018-09-11T01:02:32 < catphish> ahoyhoy englishman
2018-09-11T01:02:37 < Steffanx> Fuck shout outs
2018-09-11T01:02:52 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/3h3aAU8.jpg
2018-09-11T01:02:54 < Steffanx> Did you order from ARROW again englishbot englishbot ?
2018-09-11T01:03:03 < englishman> i'm doing ordering now
2018-09-11T01:03:07 < englishman> i hope not.
2018-09-11T01:03:27 < catphish> englishman: ha
2018-09-11T01:03:30 < englishman> talked with a company today that makes door systems for metro cars
2018-09-11T01:03:37 < englishman> they want a project with ragepberripi in it
2018-09-11T01:03:42 < englishman> super pro
2018-09-11T01:03:42 < Steffanx> Good
2018-09-11T01:03:48 < catphish> that sick child thing was a bit embarassing for my country
2018-09-11T01:03:51 < englishman> at least it is not edison
2018-09-11T01:04:15 < Steffanx> Will lunix hang and the doors wont open?
2018-09-11T01:04:25 < englishman> i hope so
2018-09-11T01:04:29 < BrainDamage> just make your security system fail open
2018-09-11T01:04:31 < BrainDamage> easy as that
2018-09-11T01:04:46 < englishman> ivan reedman will not be touching any security
2018-09-11T01:05:16 < BrainDamage> I wonder if his retirement plan was sponsored by mips
2018-09-11T01:05:26 < englishman> you also didnt click my link did you
2018-09-11T01:05:33 < BrainDamage> ofc I did
2018-09-11T01:05:40 < Steffanx> Fake twatter is fake
2018-09-11T01:05:49 < englishman> https://securityintelligence.com/media/x-force-red-in-action-spotlight-on-hardware-testing-and-ivan-reedman/
2018-09-11T01:06:01 < BrainDamage> oh, not that one
2018-09-11T01:06:19 < englishman> steffanx forgot the "verify" part of "distrust, but verify"
2018-09-11T01:06:48 < Cracki> >DIS?-trust, but verify
2018-09-11T01:07:03 < englishman> this is a pessimistic channel
2018-09-11T01:07:23 < Steffanx> I didnt bother to loom futher than my nose is long, englishman 
2018-09-11T01:07:32 < Steffanx> Hate is much easier than love
2018-09-11T01:07:53 < Steffanx> Look*
2018-09-11T01:08:01 < BrainDamage> meh, the real issue is that people are trying to wire shit to internet for little gain
2018-09-11T01:08:12 < BrainDamage> IoT, the S stands for secure
2018-09-11T01:08:19  * karlp laughs
2018-09-11T01:08:30 < Cracki> >nose
2018-09-11T01:08:32 < Cracki> oy vey
2018-09-11T01:09:08 < Cracki> why do people still insist on calling it IoT? it's internet of shit
2018-09-11T01:09:35 < BrainDamage> T stands for toilets, I have no problems with
2018-09-11T01:10:22 < englishman> damn you found out about my lorawan-enabled bidet
2018-09-11T01:10:49 < Steffanx> Is it poop?
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2018-09-11T01:13:21 -!- Ultrasauce [~sauce@142.163.117.67] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-11T01:19:05 -!- Ultrasauce [~sauce@142.163.117.67] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T01:19:07 < englishman> i love that you can put digikey part numbers into mouser
2018-09-11T01:21:10 < zyp> haha
2018-09-11T01:22:05 < zyp> not here
2018-09-11T01:22:08 < englishman> their prices are lower than arrow now
2018-09-11T01:22:16 < zyp> digikey paid ad comes first here
2018-09-11T01:22:26 < catphish> i'm enjoying mouser at the moment
2018-09-11T01:23:15 < catphish> i wish i knew what this was https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/Broadcom/BCM4752IFBGT?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsjLMBIknjmkr7UcSbxhsyWsPQ4SmKstL7hkXjkk9ZC8A%3d%3d
2018-09-11T01:23:46 < catphish> are you supposed to just buy it and not know what to do with it?
2018-09-11T01:24:01 < catphish> i'm not sure you can
2018-09-11T01:24:16 < catphish> i mean, it'll look like an IC
2018-09-11T01:24:20 < catphish> but i can't find any data
2018-09-11T01:24:59 < Steffanx> I found the issue: Broadcom
2018-09-11T01:25:08 < catphish> hmm indeed
2018-09-11T01:25:19 < MrMobius> if you have to ask, you dont need it
2018-09-11T01:26:28 < catphish> lol
2018-09-11T01:26:42 < zyp> if you have to ask, they'll say no
2018-09-11T01:28:01 < zyp> go ask her if you can have the clippings
2018-09-11T01:28:15 < zyp> report back
2018-09-11T01:28:21 < BrainDamage> do it while chewing on your own nail clips
2018-09-11T01:30:04 < MrMobius> she is probably harvesting them to sell in a japanese vending machine
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2018-09-11T02:12:30 < friendofafriend> You should file your nails, also.
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2018-09-11T02:12:50 < sync> BrainDamage: pls, my vacuum pumps are much more if you bought them new
2018-09-11T02:13:20 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LrBAkxX1KbQQqEUlIk-vgBqfioEL5Ffn/view?usp=drivesdk
2018-09-11T02:13:38 < kakimir> diesel cooler
2018-09-11T02:13:43 < kakimir> repaired
2018-09-11T02:15:05 < sync> that sounds like PD shit
2018-09-11T02:15:11 < kakimir> cleaned it then a bit of grinding then put it on hot plate and poked 2comp polyuretane in it
2018-09-11T02:15:25 < kakimir> heat makes it flow
2018-09-11T02:16:07 < sync> it is interesting that vw never changed anything
2018-09-11T02:16:09 < kakimir> poked it until I was sure it has gone deep enough
2018-09-11T02:16:27 < sync> they had an issue where the PD units were running over 165°C diesel temp inside of them
2018-09-11T02:16:43 < BrainDamage> that url asks me to login
2018-09-11T02:17:43 < kakimir> cooler starts warming up instantly when cae is started
2018-09-11T02:17:52 < kakimir> car
2018-09-11T02:18:13 < kakimir> it therefore does something
2018-09-11T02:18:40 < BrainDamage> a piece of scrap would too
2018-09-11T02:52:56 < jadew> damn... GIMP is still garbage
2018-09-11T02:53:30 < jadew> they made it look a bit better, but it just sucks when it comes to functionality
2018-09-11T02:53:33 < friendofafriend> GIMP's OK, they just scored some funds.  Now OpenShot, that's garbage.
2018-09-11T02:53:45 < jadew> it's far from OK
2018-09-11T02:53:53 < jadew> it's far from decent
2018-09-11T02:54:35 < friendofafriend> Crop the image, flip it around, some ugly text, save it as a PNG.  Does enough for most, right?
2018-09-11T02:54:48 < jadew> when I select new colors for text, I can't preview them... I have to open the dialog every time, select a color and hit OK in order to see what it looks like
2018-09-11T02:55:03 < jadew> the font family can be selected from 3 places
2018-09-11T02:55:30 < jadew> one from a box on top of the text (which is a text input, not a dropdown, and doesn't have auto completion)
2018-09-11T02:55:49 < jadew> the other one is from the tool view, which is also a text input with the same issue
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2018-09-11T02:56:46 < jadew> and a third one, is something that seems unrelated and always available (even when the text tool is not selected), which is a LIST (not a dropdown, a list!), docked on the other side of the screen, together with some other settings
2018-09-11T02:56:54 < jadew> if this is not retarded, I don't know what is
2018-09-11T02:57:48 < friendofafriend> But you survived it.  I know what you mean, but at least it's an open source image editor and there's nothing else close.
2018-09-11T02:58:13 < jadew> then there's the fact that any effect you want to apply to a text layer, gets applied after the layer is resterized, so trying to change the text after the fact, reverts all the changes
2018-09-11T02:58:30 < jadew> close to what? it's unusable...
2018-09-11T02:58:53 < friendofafriend> There's no alternative.  TuxPaint?
2018-09-11T02:59:05 < jadew> I don't know, I'll have to do a google
2018-09-11T02:59:50 < friendofafriend> If you're new to TuxPaint, hold onto your neckbeard and prepare to be blown away.
2018-09-11T03:00:35 < jadew> that looks fantastic, yes
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2018-09-11T03:01:07 < friendofafriend> Not only is it free, it's also award-winning.
2018-09-11T03:01:07 < jadew> I don't understand why nobody is making a worthwhile photoshop alternative
2018-09-11T03:01:16 < englishman> i like that the windows executable download is at the top of the download page
2018-09-11T03:01:20 < jadew> I'd pay $200 for a good piece of software
2018-09-11T03:02:38 < friendofafriend> Oh, further you scroll, the better.  "Hey kid, Dad got you a computer.  That?  It's called OS/2 Warp."
2018-09-11T03:03:48 < englishman> 2006 release date
2018-09-11T03:04:06 < friendofafriend> You don't upgrade perfection.
2018-09-11T03:04:51 < sync> jadew: well then buy photochop
2018-09-11T03:05:08 < jadew> sync, photoshop is a rip-off
2018-09-11T03:05:15 < jadew> fuck 'em
2018-09-11T03:05:23 < englishman> lol
2018-09-11T03:05:36 < friendofafriend> I guess it works pretty well under WINE.
2018-09-11T03:08:45 < jadew> thing is, I don't even want a free alternative, I just want something poerful that I don't have to pay every time I want to use it
2018-09-11T03:09:27 < jadew> I guess the bar is set above smart objects and effect layers
2018-09-11T03:09:41 < jadew> anything that has that will probably be a good candidate against photoshop
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2018-09-11T03:42:09 < dongs> lol dongs
2018-09-11T03:58:22 < englishman> ✈ ▌▌ / ¦҉▌▌ / ▄ ▌ / ▄✈▌ / ▄ ¦҉▌ / ▄ ▄
2018-09-11T04:04:24 < kakimir> oh shit
2018-09-11T04:04:31 < kakimir> it's 911
2018-09-11T04:22:40 < Thorn> do I need a Variscite SOM with AM4378? (SO-DIMM form factor)
2018-09-11T04:23:00 < Thorn> not sure if it comes with any motherboard or not
2018-09-11T04:23:12 < dongs> sup zano followers
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2018-09-11T04:30:49 < emeb> grinding away on a Zynq design
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2018-09-11T04:34:19 < dongs> < emeb> grinding away on a Zano design
2018-09-11T04:34:23 < dongs> thats what I saw
2018-09-11T04:34:58 < branjb> https://imgur.com/a/5uGdhIy
2018-09-11T04:40:08 < kakimir> https://imgur.com/gallery/cDjn90h
2018-09-11T04:43:15 < englishman> kakism
2018-09-11T04:52:47 < dongs> R2COm are you still advocating cuckcad
2018-09-11T04:56:11 < emeb> Zynq/Zano/Zyno/Zanq/Danq/Donq/Dong
2018-09-11T04:56:32 < dongs> perfect.
2018-09-11T04:56:40 < Thorn> I want a zynq board :/
2018-09-11T04:56:53 < emeb> they're fun
2018-09-11T04:56:54 < dongs> get that PLUTO SDR thing
2018-09-11T04:56:57 < dongs> that has a zync on it.
2018-09-11T04:57:04 < emeb> yeah, but...
2018-09-11T04:57:06 < dongs> you'll also get a SDR
2018-09-11T04:57:31 < emeb> it's a bit harder to get at - no onboard JTAG ifc
2018-09-11T04:57:42 < dongs> hm really?
2018-09-11T04:57:43 < branjb> didn't microzed company make a pcie sdr with a zynq on it?
2018-09-11T04:57:45 < dongs> i thought pluto was opensores
2018-09-11T04:57:46 < emeb> Minized is nicer - has the USB/JTAG already
2018-09-11T04:57:56 < dongs> oh you mean no usb jtag, just header probly
2018-09-11T04:58:02 < emeb> yep
2018-09-11T04:58:23 < emeb> not even soldered on - needs 0.05" header (not included)
2018-09-11T04:58:25 < Thorn> I have a platform cable clone
2018-09-11T04:59:09 < branjb> http://microzed.org/product/picozed-sdr-development-kit + http://zedboard.org/product/picozed-fmc-carrier-card-v2
2018-09-11T04:59:21 < emeb> true, but $$$
2018-09-11T04:59:43 < branjb> it's still pretty cheap when it comes to fpga's on a pcie card
2018-09-11T04:59:49 < emeb> http://zedboard.org/product/minized - $90 with all the goodies
2018-09-11T04:59:51 < branjb> ~$700 USD all said and done
2018-09-11T05:00:07 < emeb> includes wifi/BTLE module
2018-09-11T05:00:26 < emeb> and USB/JTAG + USB/Serial onboard
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2018-09-11T06:37:53 < branjb> ne1 have a favorite 50 pin connector
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2018-09-11T08:21:49 < branjb> this is the mfg recommended pad size + their step file, is it just me or are these pads too wide? https://imgur.com/a/905Bl60
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2018-09-11T08:29:13 < jpa-> well, it kind-of may hold the pads better to the pcb
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2018-09-11T10:02:42 < zyp> that doesn't look wrong to me, assuming you have enough clearance between the pads that this is actually manufacturable with standard specs
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2018-09-11T10:03:04 < zyp> it's not like you could fit traces in between there anyway
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2018-09-11T10:27:09 < Steffanx> Lolol.
2018-09-11T10:27:22 < zyp> haha
2018-09-11T10:27:31 < zyp> wtf
2018-09-11T10:27:35 < Steffanx> Someone got some shady source of its caps?
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2018-09-11T10:55:25 < day> i can already see the next capacitor scam. 0201 nF capacitors soldered into 0805 cases, sold as 20µF caps ^.^
2018-09-11T10:56:25 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-11T10:58:17 < Steffanx> Sue them crt.
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2018-09-11T12:12:13 < kakimir> mouser takes a piss.. I ordered stuff in thursday
2018-09-11T12:12:36 < kakimir> now checking my email and they have just sent the stuff
2018-09-11T12:12:57 < dongs> hello pros
2018-09-11T12:13:19 < dongs> branjb: way too wide.
2018-09-11T12:16:16 < invzim> jlcpcb @ 85%, final inspection & packaging to go - place yer bets on if it's going to be here before the weekend :)
2018-09-11T12:19:41 < invzim> 2 layer simplestuff
2018-09-11T12:19:50 < invzim> https://irkenlabs.com/39-more-jammafiers
2018-09-11T12:20:08 < invzim> next rev of this one, now with connectors china can supply
2018-09-11T12:21:04 < invzim> I'm 2 or 3 sales short of having enough revenue to do this stuff in my company name, which will make things a lot easier
2018-09-11T12:22:02 < karlp> I like how jade's using gimp to do text.
2018-09-11T12:26:01 < karlp> huh, that minized board is quite cheap relatively
2018-09-11T12:34:23 < dongs> waht minimized board
2018-09-11T12:35:42 < dongs> oh
2018-09-11T12:35:55 < dongs> the zano trash
2018-09-11T12:38:04 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/RSgZxU4.jpg filth
2018-09-11T12:39:54 < zyp> invzim, does that thing run the entire game on the mcu?
2018-09-11T12:40:14 < dongs> no, i think that just plugs into console and converts analolg to VGA wiht some filtering in between
2018-09-11T12:40:49 < karlp> it's to run emulators with the screen and buttons and controllers of an old console isn't it?
2018-09-11T12:40:55 < karlp> jamma is the harness in the old cabinet?
2018-09-11T12:41:01 < zyp> ah, of course, it plugs into a jamma board
2018-09-11T12:41:14 < dongs> man that oled screen
2018-09-11T12:41:17 < zyp> I pictured it the other way around
2018-09-11T12:41:54 < zyp> karlp, no, that's what I also thought
2018-09-11T12:43:07 < karlp> The Jammafier is a device that enables you to play older Jamma PCB's in a JVS only cabinet, like the Sega Naomi Universal.  It handles controls, power and audio - but does not touch the video signals.
2018-09-11T12:43:20 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-11T12:43:49 < dongs> ah so thats different, teh shit i was thikning was the 'retro scaler'
2018-09-11T12:44:51 < dongs> https://irkenlabs.com/images/news/2018-05-11-retro-scaler-13-proto.JPG this shit
2018-09-11T12:44:52 < zyp> karlp, so the point is to get an older board to work with newer IO
2018-09-11T12:46:02 < invzim> zyp: nah, itæs just a converter from jamma
2018-09-11T12:46:20 < zyp> I see that now
2018-09-11T12:47:03 < invzim> the ones available are crap, so I made my own
2018-09-11T12:47:22 < dongs> the market for that shit must be a niche inside a niche
2018-09-11T12:47:28 < invzim> yup
2018-09-11T12:48:19 < invzim> not so much competition(zero), slow long-tail sales
2018-09-11T12:48:58 < invzim> if you come across a naomi with a tosh crt with no burn-in, I would jump on it
2018-09-11T12:49:06 < dongs> heh
2018-09-11T12:49:18 < zyp> I could have used one of those boards when I were dicking around with this shit some years ago: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/oinyZ.JPG
2018-09-11T12:49:35 < dongs> i think ive probably seen that pic
2018-09-11T12:49:44 < zyp> probably
2018-09-11T12:50:01 < dongs> i see one of those uh
2018-09-11T12:50:07 < invzim> xrgb3 \o/
2018-09-11T12:50:08 < dongs> blackmagics
2018-09-11T12:51:58 < invzim> I think so, something about an essential part being end-of-sale/life
2018-09-11T12:52:06 < dongs> framenigger
2018-09-11T12:52:14 < dongs> powered by TempleRTOS
2018-09-11T12:53:17 < cjbaird> I could make usez of it, too.. https://twitter.com/Chris_J_Baird/status/732632205797687296
2018-09-11T13:08:27 < cjbaird> Met a Hardcore Pro during my wandering-- a guy named Karl whose company did the vacuum automation products for foundaries. Got to squizz at his current work for 450mm wafers. Also, his first job as an Engineer was F1 car engines for Jack Brabham. Just someone random in the middle of the Australia Desert...
2018-09-11T13:11:43 < Steffanx> What happened with your clean desk policy zyp?
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2018-09-11T13:12:00 < Steffanx> Oh its old
2018-09-11T13:12:04 < zyp> what policy?
2018-09-11T13:12:11 < zyp> clean desks are for people who don't work
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2018-09-11T13:35:25 < Steffanx> I remember pics with amuch cleaner desk
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2018-09-11T13:43:15 < Steffanx> Bur that might have been the other side of the same desk :]
2018-09-11T13:44:11 < BrainDamage> clean desk pics are for new installations
2018-09-11T13:45:41 < invzim> I enjoy a clean desk and strive to keep it that way
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2018-09-11T14:02:41 < catphish> one gps ready to test :) https://i.imgur.com/IeT0Zlc.jpg
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2018-09-11T15:38:41 < invzim> catphish: looks tiny
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2018-09-11T15:38:46 < invzim> can  you reflowthose things?
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2018-09-11T15:39:09 < dongs> they're castellated you can just handsolder
2018-09-11T15:39:19 < dongs> but yeah shit like ublox you can so i dont see why not this one
2018-09-11T15:48:02 < dongs> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/09/10/boffins_bash_google_translate_for_sexist_language/ lol
2018-09-11T15:49:23 < catphish> yeah it can be reflowed i'm sure
2018-09-11T15:51:46 < catphish> but super easy to hand solder too
2018-09-11T16:13:06 < zyp> when shit comes in cut tape, naturally it's designed for reflowing
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2018-09-11T16:58:33 < englishman> I've been to that statue, don't know how that photo was taken because when I was there it was mobbed with fat loud hooligan tourists
2018-09-11T16:59:09 < englishman> also it's now surrounded by concrete anti-murder barriers
2018-09-11T17:15:32 < kakimir> hello englishman
2018-09-11T17:16:09 < englishman> hello kakimir 
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2018-09-11T17:25:23 < kakimir> centauri
2018-09-11T17:31:40 < Steffanx> Hows mr kakimir 
2018-09-11T17:35:46 < kakimir> tired
2018-09-11T17:40:47 -!- boB_K7IQ [boB_K7IQ@c-73-193-6-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-11T17:46:18 < Steffanx> Are you winter proof yet?
2018-09-11T17:46:35 < kakimir> I'm wearing shorts
2018-09-11T17:46:42 < kakimir> and on diet
2018-09-11T17:46:45 < kakimir> so no
2018-09-11T17:47:05 < kakimir> fat = warm
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2018-09-11T17:49:17 < kakimir> tell me about mcus with build in buck regulator
2018-09-11T17:49:27 < dongs> they're out there
2018-09-11T17:50:11 < kakimir> cortex m0
2018-09-11T17:52:13 < Cracki> Vbat or something?
2018-09-11T17:52:56 < kakimir> no just integrated buck regulator
2018-09-11T17:53:10 < kakimir> mcu just controlling it
2018-09-11T17:53:30 < kakimir> I want like 2Amps out
2018-09-11T17:54:17 < Cracki> uh...
2018-09-11T17:54:27 < dongs> > 2amps lol
2018-09-11T17:54:28 < Thorn> stm32 have adc and pwm, add external switch, diode, inductor, caps -> switch mode converter
2018-09-11T17:54:47 < Cracki> that is still not "mcus with build in buck regulator"
2018-09-11T17:54:52 < Cracki> but way more sensible
2018-09-11T17:55:04 < kakimir> I want integrated solution
2018-09-11T17:55:10 < dongs> only exists on SoCs
2018-09-11T17:55:14 < kakimir> integrated switch
2018-09-11T17:55:15 < dongs> as far as I've seen
2018-09-11T17:55:19 < dongs> definitely not on m0
2018-09-11T17:55:25 < Cracki> you want a lollipop too?
2018-09-11T17:55:28 < kakimir> interesting
2018-09-11T17:55:31 < dongs> i.e. I.MX23 stuff has such.
2018-09-11T17:55:35 < kakimir> what are those bucks for?
2018-09-11T17:55:42 < dongs> power supply around teh chip
2018-09-11T17:55:45 < dongs> vcore etc.
2018-09-11T17:55:53 < dongs> so you don't need extra parts to use it
2018-09-11T17:56:02 < kakimir> not for external loads I think?
2018-09-11T17:56:06 < dongs> i think ith as liek 3 outputs
2018-09-11T17:56:10 < dongs> so you need 3 coils + shit around
2018-09-11T17:56:25 < dongs> dont know
2018-09-11T17:56:59 < Cracki> how integrated do you want it? do you want all the energy stores in the package?
2018-09-11T17:57:00 < dongs> according to datasheet its like 100/400mA current limits
2018-09-11T17:57:11 < kakimir> Cracki: no
2018-09-11T17:57:12 < dongs> so its just for internal shit
2018-09-11T17:57:51 < Cracki> do you want it to be a special-purpose peripheral inside an MCU?
2018-09-11T17:58:12 < kakimir> I want buck regulator with built in mcu
2018-09-11T17:58:24 < kakimir> not other way around
2018-09-11T17:58:27 < Cracki> so... a donkey with built in air plane
2018-09-11T17:58:41 < kakimir> and it has to have them amps
2018-09-11T17:59:26 < BrainDamage> make a buck regulator with a mcu, the fires are fun
2018-09-11T18:03:03 < dongs> kakimir: youre not gonna get it with built in 2A FET
2018-09-11T18:03:04 < dongs> for sure
2018-09-11T18:03:15 < dongs> a controller maybe for external fet, but even then it'll be a niche within a niche
2018-09-11T18:04:15 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-11T18:04:22 < kakimir> I tell what I need to do
2018-09-11T18:04:32 < kakimir> adaptive current lipo charger
2018-09-11T18:04:49 < kakimir> for different size cells up to 18650
2018-09-11T18:05:05 < kakimir> charger board needs to be size of a coin
2018-09-11T18:05:11 < kakimir> smallish coin
2018-09-11T18:05:18 < Cracki> so? that sounds like a buck converter with programmable voltage limit and current limit
2018-09-11T18:05:24 < Cracki> *needs to be*?
2018-09-11T18:05:30 < Cracki> who needs it to be this? why?
2018-09-11T18:05:32 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T18:05:44 < kakimir> it's an update to product
2018-09-11T18:05:55 < kakimir> that is with fixed 0.5A current
2018-09-11T18:06:05 < kakimir> that product is size of a coin
2018-09-11T18:06:11 < Cracki> so take some small cortex-m and build what you need
2018-09-11T18:06:37 < kakimir> I think I will 8bit it
2018-09-11T18:06:42 < Cracki> or that
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2018-09-11T18:12:17 < kakimir> optionally it detects from usb how much amps it has to consume from usb
2018-09-11T18:13:41 < kakimir> :) current board diameter 18,5mm
2018-09-11T18:14:32 < dongs> get fucked
2018-09-11T18:14:39 < Thorn> either a smart watch or a smart dildo
2018-09-11T18:14:54 < zyp> smart bottlecap
2018-09-11T18:16:49 < dongs> kikemir confirmed trolling for batteroo
2018-09-11T18:17:17 < dongs> https://www.batteroo.com/
2018-09-11T18:18:32 < dongs> https://www.batteroo.com/technology
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2018-09-11T18:25:51 < kakimir> isn't this a scama?
2018-09-11T18:25:57 < dongs> of course lol
2018-09-11T18:26:01 < dongs> isnt it obvious
2018-09-11T18:26:13 < dongs> there's a fucking buckboost right after battery in any decent device
2018-09-11T18:26:29 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-11T18:29:50 < kakimir> fuck
2018-09-11T18:31:22 < kakimir> I think I can pull this off
2018-09-11T18:31:50 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Quit: Quit]
2018-09-11T18:32:17 < BrainDamage> it's the kind of device that would've made sense 15-20 years ago
2018-09-11T18:33:02 < kakimir> batteroo?
2018-09-11T18:33:33 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-11T18:33:56 < englishman> isnt that a mintyboost clone
2018-09-11T18:34:17 < dongs> no
2018-09-11T18:34:21 < dongs> its just a retardo thing
2018-09-11T18:34:24 < dongs> with a dickstarter
2018-09-11T18:34:30 < Sadale> doubt that the battery booster would work.
2018-09-11T18:34:36 < dongs> no way really?????????????
2018-09-11T18:34:42 < dongs> < dongs> there's a fucking buckboost right after battery in any decent device
2018-09-11T18:34:47 < dongs> so of course it wouldnt work
2018-09-11T18:34:53 < dongs> the device itself already does same shit the fucking sleeve does
2018-09-11T18:35:02 < dongs> at potentially higher efficiency too
2018-09-11T18:35:06 < Sadale> I see.
2018-09-11T18:35:10 < englishman> so it's a mintyboost clone
2018-09-11T18:35:19 < Sadale> ah. I get the idea. Some older device doesn't have buckboost chip.
2018-09-11T18:35:22 < dongs> no because it doesnt boost to5V
2018-09-11T18:35:28 < dongs> only to 1.5V
2018-09-11T18:35:35 < dongs> Sadale: right, like the only thing is maybe a remote control
2018-09-11T18:35:38 < Sadale> This booster would work for the devices that just use a voltage regulator.
2018-09-11T18:35:46 < englishman> oh i thoguht thats what mintyboost did
2018-09-11T18:36:06 < dongs> for $19.50 mintyboost better suck you off
2018-09-11T18:36:13 < dongs> fucking aidsfruit
2018-09-11T18:36:38 < englishman> pretty sure that is aidsfruit first product from 2004-2005
2018-09-11T18:38:31 < englishman> 40k sqft in soho manhattan, wow
2018-09-11T18:38:36 < englishman> thats a lot of ws2812b
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2018-09-11T18:43:45 < dongs> when you assemble in china and have 1000% markup, that happens
2018-09-11T18:44:39 < karlp> dongs: still shittons of devices that don'thave buckboost after battery.
2018-09-11T18:46:21 < dongs> well, batteroo dickstarter is -> that way
2018-09-11T18:46:26 < dongs> feel free to throw your money away ^_-
2018-09-11T18:47:37 < karlp> yeah, I'm still not feeling a need to buy it.
2018-09-11T18:48:06 < karlp> my old gps actually had a menu item to choose nimh or alkaline, so it knew how to draw the battery graph
2018-09-11T18:48:16 < karlp> it definitelyt was just running til it stopped unregulated.
2018-09-11T18:49:57 -!- e3ef13f4ff44 [~e3ef13f4f@unaffiliated/e3ef13f4ff44] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T18:50:01 < e3ef13f4ff44> hello
2018-09-11T18:50:16 < e3ef13f4ff44> how can i soft restart stm32f1 using HAL?
2018-09-11T18:50:30 < dongs> well, NVIC_SystemReset() works and thats CMSIS
2018-09-11T18:50:35 < dongs> i donno if HAL has something.
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2018-09-11T18:51:42 < e3ef13f4ff44> and it should work dongs?
2018-09-11T18:53:23 < dongs> why wouldnt it?
2018-09-11T18:53:26 < dongs> it just generates a system reset
2018-09-11T18:53:33 < dongs> its same across all cortex-m shits.
2018-09-11T18:54:19 < kakimir> I will use attiny10
2018-09-11T18:54:33 < kakimir> just the right number of IO
2018-09-11T18:54:36 < kakimir> 4
2018-09-11T18:55:31 < Cracki> masochist
2018-09-11T18:56:09 < kakimir> and in 2x2mm pack
2018-09-11T18:56:34 < kakimir> I mean.. there will be no space left on the board when it's done
2018-09-11T18:57:47 < kakimir> I'll have 32bytes of ram
2018-09-11T18:58:06 < kakimir> and a whole kilobyte of flash
2018-09-11T18:58:20 < zyp> e3ef13f4ff44, *(unsigned*)(0xa9e429ce^0x49e4c4c2)=0xa5742181^0xd955aa8c^0x79db8b09; should work
2018-09-11T18:58:58 < e3ef13f4ff44> heh
2018-09-11T18:58:58 < dongs> heh
2018-09-11T18:58:59 < e3ef13f4ff44> XD
2018-09-11T18:59:10 < dongs> 0xe000ed0c, isn't that waht NVIC_reset pokes anyway
2018-09-11T18:59:13 < dongs> by setting a flag there
2018-09-11T18:59:16 < zyp> ssh
2018-09-11T18:59:18 < e3ef13f4ff44> xDD
2018-09-11T18:59:32 < kakimir> do you seriously remember hex?
2018-09-11T18:59:45 < e3ef13f4ff44> xDD what a guy
2018-09-11T19:00:03 < zyp> e3ef13f4ff44, did it work?
2018-09-11T19:00:15 < e3ef13f4ff44> i'll know in 30minutes
2018-09-11T19:02:22 < dongs> is that how long it takes you to punch the program in via front panel toggle switches?
2018-09-11T19:03:02 < e3ef13f4ff44> nope, there is a timer
2018-09-11T19:03:10 < e3ef13f4ff44> i reset cpu after 30minutes
2018-09-11T19:03:17 < karlp> you seriously need a better test environment
2018-09-11T19:03:17 < dongs> oh its one of those things
2018-09-11T19:03:17 < e3ef13f4ff44> because it hangs because dunno why
2018-09-11T19:03:23 < dongs> LOL
2018-09-11T19:03:26 < dongs> uh
2018-09-11T19:03:29 < e3ef13f4ff44> stm32f1 with lwip
2018-09-11T19:03:30 < dongs> have you ever heard of "watchdog"
2018-09-11T19:03:33 < e3ef13f4ff44> blue pill
2018-09-11T19:03:45 < e3ef13f4ff44> yup, but i never used it
2018-09-11T19:03:49 < karlp> does it hang because you're trying to use "extra" flash?
2018-09-11T19:03:50 < dongs> tho of course watchdog isnt the solution for broken shit
2018-09-11T19:03:58 < karlp> dongs: sure it is.
2018-09-11T19:04:55 < e3ef13f4ff44> karlp: idk if it hangs
2018-09-11T19:05:00 < e3ef13f4ff44> but it doesnt respond to pings
2018-09-11T19:05:10 < e3ef13f4ff44> so enc28j60 can hang too
2018-09-11T19:05:19 < e3ef13f4ff44> i reset both and it works
2018-09-11T19:05:25 < e3ef13f4ff44> :P
2018-09-11T19:05:31 < dongs> great solution
2018-09-11T19:05:41 < dongs> im gonna guess in 30 minutes you';ll have same locked up board
2018-09-11T19:05:47 < dongs> do you even debug?
2018-09-11T19:06:09 < dongs> like, that sounds like something that would be solved by attaching debugger and crashing it
2018-09-11T19:08:23 < dongs> bedtime
2018-09-11T19:18:42 < Steffanx> Are you using the enc28i60 e3ef13f4ff44 ?!?!?!
2018-09-11T19:18:50 < e3ef13f4ff44> yup :D
2018-09-11T19:18:54 < Steffanx> Is that chip still alive?
2018-09-11T19:19:01 < e3ef13f4ff44> idk
2018-09-11T19:19:06 < Steffanx> Isnt it 10mbit?
2018-09-11T19:19:26 < e3ef13f4ff44> yup
2018-09-11T19:19:41 < Steffanx> Id rather wiznet it or something. Or go with something with a mac :P
2018-09-11T19:19:51 < dongs> well, considering he's using F103
2018-09-11T19:19:58 < dongs> from like $3 chinaboard
2018-09-11T19:20:05 < Steffanx> But the enc28j60 should die.
2018-09-11T19:20:09 < Steffanx> Hard.
2018-09-11T19:20:13 < dongs> theres not much choices other than SPI/whatever to ethernet aids
2018-09-11T19:20:15 < dongs> oh, i dont doubt it
2018-09-11T19:21:50 < Steffanx> I one i know of is wiznet. But i never bothered to look into it
2018-09-11T19:21:55 < Steffanx> Only*
2018-09-11T19:22:10 < Steffanx> Sleep well dongs ;)
2018-09-11T19:22:49 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-11T19:23:58 < e3ef13f4ff44> okay it works :D
2018-09-11T19:24:06 < e3ef13f4ff44> nvic systemreset
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2018-09-11T19:25:06 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-11T19:27:27 < bitmask> nice, sold a 7seg 3d printed clock for $45 :P
2018-09-11T19:28:53 < Steffanx> \o/
2018-09-11T19:29:18 < Steffanx> Commercially totally unviable, but .. who cares if you have fun uuh?
2018-09-11T19:29:26 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Client Quit]
2018-09-11T19:29:51 < bitmask> :)
2018-09-11T19:30:52 < Steffanx> Dont you like my optimistic pessisism, bitmask?
2018-09-11T19:31:08 < zyp> the stroop
2018-09-11T19:31:09 < bitmask> its a step in the right direction, I like your ambition
2018-09-11T19:31:14 < zyp> I think I'm addicted now
2018-09-11T19:31:22 < zyp> I had a whole two stroopwafels today
2018-09-11T19:31:28 < Steffanx> Oh noes. Dont get the diabetus
2018-09-11T19:32:02 < bitmask> hmm, how do I want to store through hole resistors
2018-09-11T19:32:09 < zyp> in the trashcan
2018-09-11T19:32:11 < bitmask> hah
2018-09-11T19:32:15 < Steffanx> I had a stack i planned to ship to someone, but then i started to eat them myself.
2018-09-11T19:32:30 < bitmask> I thought you meant resistors for a sec there
2018-09-11T19:32:41 < zyp> I suspect I might hit you up for a subscription once I run out :p
2018-09-11T19:32:46 < Steffanx> Nah, rob235
2018-09-11T19:32:49 < Steffanx> Hah
2018-09-11T19:32:51 -!- bitmask is now known as Rob235
2018-09-11T19:32:54 < Rob235> boo
2018-09-11T19:33:13 -!- Rob235 is now known as rob235
2018-09-11T19:33:15 < rob235> boo again
2018-09-11T19:34:59 < Steffanx> I store my tht resistors in one of those cabinets with my tiny drawers
2018-09-11T19:35:11 < Steffanx> With many*
2018-09-11T19:35:42 < rob235> I may have to print something :)
2018-09-11T19:36:12 < Steffanx> A trashcan?
2018-09-11T19:37:11 < rob235> I have had a box of 5% for like 10 years and just ordered/received 1%, 30 qty of 30 popular values for like $3
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2018-09-11T19:50:03 < Cracki> tht resistors... they have a shelf live
2018-09-11T19:50:04 < Cracki> *life
2018-09-11T19:50:25 < Cracki> I saw some that must have been 10+ years old and they just disintegrated on touch
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2018-09-11T20:05:30 < Cracki> 10 minutes and no maymays...
2018-09-11T20:07:01 < Steffanx> Had to google to know what "maymays" means -_-
2018-09-11T20:07:04 < Steffanx> ty
2018-09-11T20:07:09 < Cracki> yw
2018-09-11T20:10:09 < emeb> keeping current w/ interweb culture.
2018-09-11T20:10:17 < rob235> Cracki my 10+ year olds look brand new
2018-09-11T20:10:23 < emeb> although one might argue that using IRC is the opposite of "current"
2018-09-11T20:13:20 < Steffanx> its current enough emeb
2018-09-11T20:13:37 < Cracki> we are the balcony muppets, we heckle the modern shit technologies that won't be around in 5 years
2018-09-11T20:14:11 < Cracki> discord rats its users out to hate organizations (ADL, SPLC)
2018-09-11T20:14:32 < Cracki> slack is for NEETs who want to pretend differently
2018-09-11T20:14:51 -!- ski7777 [~quassel@ip5b437013.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-11T20:14:52 < Cracki> matrix, gitter, whatever, that's just a fad
2018-09-11T20:14:56 < Cracki> just like jabber was
2018-09-11T20:14:58 < emeb> Steffanx: not saying that I find any value in "current" of course. :)
2018-09-11T20:15:11 < Steffanx> cats is all you need right?
2018-09-11T20:19:46 < Cracki> big cats, more to pet
2018-09-11T20:20:40 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dmz9EbAV4AAbUew.jpg
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2018-09-11T20:23:43 -!- rob235 [~bitmask@pool-100-35-64-150.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Gone to sleep...]
2018-09-11T20:26:35 < Laurenceb_> why did I go to the south
2018-09-11T20:26:37 < Laurenceb_> bad idea
2018-09-11T20:26:55 < Laurenceb_> >everything smells of pine resin
2018-09-11T20:27:04 < Laurenceb_> >everyone drives a black range rover
2018-09-11T20:27:18 < Laurenceb_> >posh bastards everywhere
2018-09-11T20:29:13 < Steffanx> Welcome home Laurenceb_
2018-09-11T20:29:17 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-11T20:30:01 < Laurenceb_> why is everyone blond yet swarthy
2018-09-11T20:30:09 < Laurenceb_> almost as they they are... GERM-man
2018-09-11T20:30:20 < Laurenceb_> *if
2018-09-11T20:30:27 < Laurenceb_> gas the south, race war now
2018-09-11T20:30:52 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@73.109.61.110] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-11T20:30:55 < Laurenceb_> tow south uk back to germany
2018-09-11T20:31:20 < Laurenceb_> why are there so many stinging insects
2018-09-11T20:31:32 < Laurenceb_> why is it so hot
2018-09-11T20:31:39 < Cracki> germany never planned to invade the UK. the UK just wanted war because they had a chip on their shoulder.
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2018-09-11T20:32:16 < Cracki> the UK had to hand all its gold over to the USA in exchange for the USA coming to save their asses.
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2018-09-11T21:16:22 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQhHd1v6wyM gold please
2018-09-11T21:20:33 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_LIKxqSB2I back to psytrance
2018-09-11T21:21:14 < BrainDamage> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZChzKnCVx0
2018-09-11T21:21:54 < qyx> any kawaii buck regulator 5V->3.3V with low Iq?
2018-09-11T21:21:58 < qyx> whats in zypsnips
2018-09-11T21:23:12 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T21:23:19 < kakimir> is money any concern?
2018-09-11T21:23:25 < kakimir> and how low Iq?
2018-09-11T21:23:58 < kakimir> BrainDamage: you actually like musics I pasted earlier?
2018-09-11T21:24:55 < kakimir> qyx: also - how many amps?
2018-09-11T21:25:02 < kakimir> input voltage range?
2018-09-11T21:25:18 < Steffanx> i go for BrainDamage's music today, kakimir .
2018-09-11T21:26:28 < kakimir> qyx: http://www.ti.com/product/TPS62172 17µA
2018-09-11T21:26:32 < kakimir> + dividers
2018-09-11T21:27:34 < kakimir> they have pin compatible 1A chips too irc. and maybe fixed output versions
2018-09-11T21:27:56 < Steffanx> Crt did you know ita 4:27?
2018-09-11T21:28:14 < emeb> kakimir: something better -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Up8fo2EotyM
2018-09-11T21:30:11 < kakimir> qyx: but there is dozens and dozens of 5.5V input range step-down converters from multiple manufacturers because those are literally everywhere
2018-09-11T21:30:44 < kakimir> I think if you filter those in you fav distributor you get like +1000 chips you can choose from
2018-09-11T21:31:01 < qyx> thats the reason I am asking
2018-09-11T21:31:17 < qyx> I used to use LM3671MF-ADJ
2018-09-11T21:31:25 < qyx> but it became quite boring
2018-09-11T21:31:32 < qyx> I am looking for something more cool
2018-09-11T21:32:06 < kakimir> sot23 meh
2018-09-11T21:32:15 < qyx> also not on stock on farnell
2018-09-11T21:33:45 < jadew> karlp, I was making a logo
2018-09-11T21:33:49 < jadew> ended up using inkscape
2018-09-11T21:35:47 < Steffanx> Good morning then, crt.
2018-09-11T21:38:12 < kakimir> qyx: how many amps?
2018-09-11T21:38:16 < kakimir> 0.6A?
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2018-09-11T21:39:30 < kakimir> http://www.ti.com/product/tps62821
2018-09-11T21:40:34 < qyx> no, under 100mA
2018-09-11T21:41:22 -!- Ultrasauce [~sauce@142.163.117.67] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
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2018-09-11T21:43:09 < kakimir> http://www.ti.com/product/tps62740
2018-09-11T21:44:10 < kakimir> 1.79 yankee dollars / 1pc
2018-09-11T21:44:38 < Steffanx> damn it, windows. Why my sound is suddenly "cracking" and "popping" :S
2018-09-11T21:45:10 < kakimir> anyone done headphone DAC with stm32?
2018-09-11T21:45:27 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T21:45:42 < kakimir> and does it make any sense?
2018-09-11T21:46:13 < BrainDamage> not particularly when there's chips that do everything for you
2018-09-11T21:46:25 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T21:46:44 < BrainDamage> if you were to just use a dac's output, you'd need to buffer it
2018-09-11T21:46:49 < kakimir> I think I would like to have separate amplifier though
2018-09-11T21:47:15 < kakimir> I actually did research year or 2 back
2018-09-11T21:47:32 < BrainDamage> yes, you need a 12ax7 tube driven by 120V
2018-09-11T21:47:46 < kakimir> how many watts?
2018-09-11T21:47:46 < BrainDamage> encased in a 10kg block, for vibration dampening
2018-09-11T21:48:06 < BrainDamage> 3-6 for the filament, depending on the drive
2018-09-11T21:48:28 < BrainDamage> output will be few douzens mW, a hundred at best
2018-09-11T21:50:09 < kakimir> not enough
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2018-09-11T21:51:11 < Steffanx> Just ask what crt would do. He's into amplification
2018-09-11T21:54:05 < BrainDamage> if you want super pro solution that no audiophile would ever approve, get an ADSL line driver
2018-09-11T21:54:35 < BrainDamage> their current capability, slew rate and distortion figures beat all headphone shit hands down
2018-09-11T21:54:38 < BrainDamage> and they cost 2$
2018-09-11T21:55:26 < englishman> https://ms-paint-i.de/
2018-09-11T21:55:27 < Steffanx> hehe
2018-09-11T21:55:31 < Steffanx> @ BrainDamage
2018-09-11T21:55:54 < Ultrasauce> i bet they have a pretty narrow soundstage tho
2018-09-11T21:57:09 -!- rajkosto [~Rajko@cable-178-149-121-199.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T21:57:27 < emeb> not oxygen-free copper. *plonk*
2018-09-11T21:59:15 < Cracki> green copper best copper
2018-09-11T22:00:02 < Cracki> wear something nice, then ok
2018-09-11T22:01:10 < Steffanx> morphine is great superbia
2018-09-11T22:01:52 < BrainDamage> he's probably competiting with italian carpenters in switzerland
2018-09-11T22:02:00 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWSi8gYJXsA utah saints
2018-09-11T22:02:41 < Cracki> the fucking piece of shit that got rich off oxycontin addicts, has now *patented* the treatment for the addiction https://www.cbsnews.com/news/oxycontin-maker-receives-patent-for-drug-to-treat-opioid-addiction/
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2018-09-11T22:04:00 < kakimir> MDMA - is it any good?
2018-09-11T22:04:09 < Steffanx> no clue.
2018-09-11T22:04:46 < kakimir> when you were young boi Steffanx did you ever go to rave party?
2018-09-11T22:04:49 < Steffanx> Sugar and caffeine is the only drug i use.
2018-09-11T22:04:55 < Steffanx> (d)
2018-09-11T22:05:12 < Steffanx> fuck drugs kakimir
2018-09-11T22:05:21 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T22:05:42 < Cracki> fuck-drugs, taken for fucking
2018-09-11T22:05:52 < kakimir> Cracki knows
2018-09-11T22:07:29 < kakimir> I did a bit of research 2 years back about low power audio amplifiers
2018-09-11T22:07:39 < Steffanx> did you go digital?
2018-09-11T22:07:47 < kakimir> found one that consumed only like 300mW in idle
2018-09-11T22:08:06 < kakimir> can't find anything in archive
2018-09-11T22:08:27 < Steffanx> an amplifier shouldnt be idle.
2018-09-11T22:08:38 < kakimir> it should be blasting
2018-09-11T22:08:42 < Steffanx> hell yeah
2018-09-11T22:08:54 < BrainDamage> idle or active doesn't change much
2018-09-11T22:09:08 < BrainDamage> amplifier class determines the maximum power transfer to the load
2018-09-11T22:09:18 < BrainDamage> but also the distortion figure
2018-09-11T22:09:53 < kakimir> of course it was some bad class amplifier
2018-09-11T22:10:00 < kakimir> those new ones
2018-09-11T22:10:29 < kakimir> that does all kind of steps and linear regulations
2018-09-11T22:13:29 < kakimir> G class maybe
2018-09-11T22:17:39 < kakimir> why not just drive headphones with opamps?
2018-09-11T22:21:50 < Steffanx> why is it not plastered superbia1 ?
2018-09-11T22:22:23 < Steffanx> or casted
2018-09-11T22:22:26 < Steffanx> not sure what hte right english term is
2018-09-11T22:22:47 < kakimir> how you are broken superbia1?
2018-09-11T22:23:44 < Steffanx> didnt you say it was broken?
2018-09-11T22:24:43 < Steffanx> That was because i expected something more bloody as you said it would be a terrible photo or something
2018-09-11T22:25:50 < Steffanx> yes, beheadings are worse. Anyway, it wasnt broken enough for a cast?
2018-09-11T22:26:23 < Steffanx> or "i show you photo pre" means it was a photo pre-casting
2018-09-11T22:29:05 < kakimir> BrainDamage: how many volts are enough for headphones?
2018-09-11T22:30:03 < kakimir> I know that my headphones are barelly breaking sweat when I connect them to my laptop
2018-09-11T22:30:17 < kakimir> I don't hear the loudness of the musics
2018-09-11T22:30:55 < kakimir> it's almost silence
2018-09-11T22:31:17 < kakimir> yes so I need volts
2018-09-11T22:31:37 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-11T22:32:05 < Steffanx> your ears, headphonese or headphone output is broken..
2018-09-11T22:32:11 < Steffanx> or indeed your sw is broken
2018-09-11T22:33:21 < Steffanx> ^ install windows
2018-09-11T22:33:52 < BrainDamage> I actually use pulse on my phone
2018-09-11T22:34:01 < BrainDamage> I stream audio from/to it directly
2018-09-11T22:34:07 < BrainDamage> yes, pulseaudio
2018-09-11T22:35:38 < BrainDamage> I don't like mpd, it transcodes shit
2018-09-11T22:35:47 < BrainDamage> I just use a file server and play as necessary
2018-09-11T22:36:20 < BrainDamage> nope, mpd streaming transcodes shit on the fly to a fixed format
2018-09-11T22:36:28 < kakimir> alsaconfig
2018-09-11T22:36:55 < BrainDamage> well, it should've been part of the config, you have to chose the codec, etc
2018-09-11T22:37:24 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T22:37:40 < kakimir> those were the days
2018-09-11T22:38:48 < kakimir> launching wolfenstein enimy territory to free x server to save resources
2018-09-11T22:38:54 < kakimir> no desktop
2018-09-11T22:39:13 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@50-46-202-255.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-11T22:40:36 < kakimir> hey
2018-09-11T22:40:38 < kakimir> that was a thing
2018-09-11T22:41:11 < kakimir> coolest looking desktop with coolest widgets and animu wallpapers
2018-09-11T22:41:48 < kakimir> and huge display resolution too
2018-09-11T22:41:59 < kakimir> make newbs cry
2018-09-11T22:42:43 < BrainDamage> the reason for those setups is not the weight
2018-09-11T22:42:54 < BrainDamage> it's because tiling manager workflows
2018-09-11T22:43:01 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T22:43:09 < BrainDamage> that being said, I'd never get used to one
2018-09-11T22:43:18 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-11T22:43:37 < kakimir> I have a friend that uses like full screen tiling manager all the time
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2018-09-11T22:45:20 < kakimir> there is like terminals - a lot of them filling the whole screen
2018-09-11T22:45:47 < kakimir> it looks all fine until he needs to use browser or anything
2018-09-11T22:46:40 < Steffanx> A real lunix pro :)
2018-09-11T22:47:14 < kakimir> arch linux
2018-09-11T22:47:42 < kakimir> I think he didn't use internets with graphical browser until recently
2018-09-11T22:49:04 < Steffanx> i spotted stvn
2018-09-11T22:49:19 < kakimir> middle
2018-09-11T22:49:20 < Steffanx> Why your head is so small compared to your body crt ?
2018-09-11T22:49:29 < jadew> lol
2018-09-11T22:49:50 < Steffanx> ah, ty
2018-09-11T22:51:09 < jadew> their first mistake was that they used hot chicks, everybody knows that in the history of electronics, no hot chick has ever handled a hot soldering iron
2018-09-11T22:51:25 < Thorn> the superbia1 song [NSFW] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i63cgUeSsY0
2018-09-11T22:52:59 < englishbot> Unable to locate query.
2018-09-11T22:53:56 < kakimir> BrainDamage: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5760md.pdf 
2018-09-11T22:54:35 < BrainDamage> kakimir: 1W will melt your headphones
2018-09-11T22:55:00 < Steffanx> awh superbia1.
2018-09-11T22:55:10 < Steffanx> a ibm kb
2018-09-11T22:56:09 < Steffanx> must have one somewhere here. but some key is missing
2018-09-11T22:57:15 < kakimir> BrainDamage: yes
2018-09-11T22:57:20 < kakimir> 200mW is maximum
2018-09-11T22:58:31 < kakimir> fuu fuu it has full bridge outputs
2018-09-11T22:59:06 < kakimir> it's better for me to watch a movie now and not start any project
2018-09-11T23:00:11 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-11T23:00:29 < kakimir> soft porn
2018-09-11T23:00:45 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-11T23:00:51 < karlp> jadew: good, inkscape is what you should have been using for that :)
2018-09-11T23:06:32 < kakimir> nah maybe chess.com
2018-09-11T23:07:03 < Steffanx> does it do 3d chess kakimir ?
2018-09-11T23:07:18 < kakimir> chess.com superbia1 
2018-09-11T23:07:28 < Steffanx> this is ##stm32. only pros come here. So 3d chess it is
2018-09-11T23:07:59 < kakimir> blitz score 414
2018-09-11T23:08:00 < BrainDamage> I want 4d chess where the pieces shift in time
2018-09-11T23:08:15 < kakimir> rapid score 766
2018-09-11T23:09:08 < kakimir> queen thing
2018-09-11T23:09:17 < Steffanx> 2a-4a ofcourse. what else?
2018-09-11T23:09:26 < zyp> chess match coming up?
2018-09-11T23:09:26 < Steffanx> or a2-a4 whatever you prefer.
2018-09-11T23:11:26 < kakimir> I love how the game describes my game with names of different moves and patterns and their variations
2018-09-11T23:11:50 < kakimir> ending up to be just ridiculous
2018-09-11T23:11:53 < Steffanx> so when is superbia1 vs kakimir  starting?
2018-09-11T23:12:07 < kakimir> so I need lichess account superbia1?
2018-09-11T23:12:07 < Steffanx> ill get some popcorn.
2018-09-11T23:12:27 < kakimir> why lichess?
2018-09-11T23:12:30 < zyp> I wanna watch too
2018-09-11T23:12:46 < kakimir> the thing is I'm really bad at chess
2018-09-11T23:12:56 < kakimir> I just like to play it
2018-09-11T23:13:35 < zyp> same
2018-09-11T23:13:40 < kakimir> because sometimes there is a real struggle between me and opponent
2018-09-11T23:13:56 < zyp> I like playing against people who are equally shitty
2018-09-11T23:14:38 < kakimir> you will chessmate me in 14moves?
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2018-09-11T23:16:18 < kakimir> engine is like a computer aid or what?
2018-09-11T23:16:46 < kakimir> what is yours?
2018-09-11T23:17:16 < kakimir> lets play
2018-09-11T23:17:18 < kakimir> already
2018-09-11T23:17:49 < BrainDamage> put webcan behind you so we can check you don't cheat
2018-09-11T23:18:11 < kakimir> chess hustler!
2018-09-11T23:18:13 < kakimir> whaat
2018-09-11T23:18:20 < BrainDamage> I'm not serious._.
2018-09-11T23:19:12 < kakimir> superbia1: are you preparing your engine now?
2018-09-11T23:19:27 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-22e0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-11T23:19:44 < kakimir> I think one irc friend actually played against me with engine
2018-09-11T23:19:48 < Steffanx> damn, no kakimir vs superbia1  today
2018-09-11T23:19:51 < kakimir> it was just too perfect
2018-09-11T23:20:13 < kakimir> I didn't have any foothold at any moment in the game
2018-09-11T23:20:24 < kakimir> it was just raep
2018-09-11T23:20:41 < Steffanx> just played one match at lichess, lost. My random moves didnt work.
2018-09-11T23:22:21 < kakimir> I like to play 20/20min superbia1 
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2018-09-11T23:22:37 < kakimir> my 10minute game is bad
2018-09-11T23:24:02 < Steffanx> i did 5 min :P
2018-09-11T23:24:14 < Steffanx> was more than enough to loose
2018-09-11T23:24:41 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-22e0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T23:24:44 < kakimir> I can't even play time
2018-09-11T23:25:04 < kakimir> superbia1: I'm online
2018-09-11T23:25:56 < BrainDamage> link to game please
2018-09-11T23:26:00 -!- sterna1 [~Adium@2a02:aa1:1008:6688:c5e:694c:abcb:2708] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-11T23:26:46 < kakimir> superbia1 would take care of that I'm new to this page
2018-09-11T23:27:42 < kakimir> let's do other way around
2018-09-11T23:29:59 < kakimir> 20minute game too long?
2018-09-11T23:30:01 < kakimir> 20/20?
2018-09-11T23:31:23 < Steffanx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRl7Q9xc_-Y yw
2018-09-11T23:32:13 < kakimir> well fuu
2018-09-11T23:32:19 < kakimir> I cannot play because of my score
2018-09-11T23:32:35 < kakimir> that is 0
2018-09-11T23:34:05 < zyp> so anyway, are you guys gonna play?
2018-09-11T23:34:08 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-11T23:34:27 < Cracki> are they any good?
2018-09-11T23:34:51 < Cracki> if they have the brain for decent chess, they can use that brain for better paying work
2018-09-11T23:35:09 < kakimir> superbia1: cannot invite you in game in lichess
2018-09-11T23:35:19 -!- boB_K7IQ [boB_K7IQ@c-98-247-192-179.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-11T23:35:19 < zyp> https://lichess.org/XZM33EQK
2018-09-11T23:35:23 < zyp> can't you just do this?
2018-09-11T23:35:37 < Steffanx> lol who's playing?
2018-09-11T23:35:47 < zyp> also curious
2018-09-11T23:36:05 < Thorn> lol a3
2018-09-11T23:36:07 < kakimir> interesting
2018-09-11T23:36:34 < zyp> who am I playing? :p
2018-09-11T23:36:55 < Steffanx> not me.
2018-09-11T23:37:06 < Steffanx> awh, combo-breaker, zyp
2018-09-11T23:39:51 < Steffanx> Whats this opening called? The Triangle Wave?
2018-09-11T23:40:07 -!- invzim [~perole@2a02:7b40:d418:6708::1] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-11T23:42:21 < Steffanx> god save the queen \o/
2018-09-11T23:42:36 < Steffanx> ty
2018-09-11T23:51:31 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-11T23:51:31 -!- sandeepkr [~sandeepkr@2a03:b0c0:2:d0::cac:7001] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-11T23:58:13 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: do you know Canada is a separate (from the UK) "kingdom" but somehow they got the same Queen? :)
--- Day changed Wed Sep 12 2018
2018-09-12T00:00:52 < Steffanx> Yeah 
2018-09-12T00:04:50 < zyp> so, who did I play?
2018-09-12T00:04:51 < Steffanx> Awh zyp
2018-09-12T00:04:53 < Steffanx> Lol.
2018-09-12T00:04:59 < zyp> you?
2018-09-12T00:05:26 < Steffanx> No wasnt me
2018-09-12T00:05:34 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/AojJVoOW
2018-09-12T00:06:00 < Steffanx> So kaki vs zyp?
2018-09-12T00:06:29 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-12T00:06:37 < zyp> now it's kaki vs somebody
2018-09-12T00:06:43 < Steffanx> Aha
2018-09-12T00:06:53 < zyp> whoever clicked the link first
2018-09-12T00:08:35 < zyp> so anyway, I wanna know who I played against? nobody wants to admit the loss? :p
2018-09-12T00:08:54 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-22e0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T00:09:48 < Steffanx> It was Cracki 
2018-09-12T00:10:06 < Cracki> dog shave the queef
2018-09-12T00:10:40 < Cracki> last time I "played" chess was over 20 years ago
2018-09-12T00:10:46 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-12T00:10:55 < zyp> three years for me, I think
2018-09-12T00:11:10 < zyp> and that was a single friendly game
2018-09-12T00:11:15 < Cracki> didn't click any links but if I did, I'd have lost in a handful of moves for sure
2018-09-12T00:11:38 < zyp> I did some good fuckups too, so it took me a while to win
2018-09-12T00:11:49 < zyp> like throwing away that second queen, that was not my intention :p
2018-09-12T00:12:09 < sync> lel
2018-09-12T00:13:13 < Steffanx> Hm. The secret losers.
2018-09-12T00:13:15 < Steffanx> -s
2018-09-12T00:16:22 < zyp> looks like kakimir got this
2018-09-12T00:17:01 < Steffanx> I did like The Triangle Wave opening vs zyp
2018-09-12T00:18:05 < zyp> I don't know any opening theory, I tend to just do random shit to open up
2018-09-12T00:18:27 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/D1Pl9fak next one
2018-09-12T00:18:46 < kakimir> 10min
2018-09-12T00:19:09 < Steffanx> Hah.
2018-09-12T00:19:15 < kakimir> stef
2018-09-12T00:19:17 < kakimir> hit the link
2018-09-12T00:19:30 < Steffanx> I dont play chess
2018-09-12T00:19:36 < kakimir> somebody did
2018-09-12T00:20:08 < Steffanx> Must be crt. He became awfully quiet since the gamus started
2018-09-12T00:20:20 < zyp> haha
2018-09-12T00:22:56 < kakimir> chess addiction is bad
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2018-09-12T00:28:35 < zyp> haha, nice one
2018-09-12T00:28:58 < zyp> wtf
2018-09-12T00:31:22 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T00:31:23 < zyp> kakimir, you had a mate in one, why didn't you take it?
2018-09-12T00:31:35 < kakimir> idk
2018-09-12T00:32:07 < kakimir> I like to clean out the board first
2018-09-12T00:32:20 < zyp> 14. Qf2 would have won the game
2018-09-12T00:32:37 < Cracki> facebook must have decided I'm a serial killer or something. I'm getting a dozen "friend suggestions" _every single day_
2018-09-12T00:34:09 < kakimir> zyp: oh I see
2018-09-12T00:34:23 < kakimir> I just get too much satisfaction of the ground work
2018-09-12T00:34:30 < zyp> also, 17. Nxg3 would have cost you the queen and possibly the game :p
2018-09-12T00:35:30 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T00:35:32 < kakimir> I see
2018-09-12T00:35:38 < kakimir> how come you lost?
2018-09-12T00:35:54 < zyp> wasn't me
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2018-09-12T00:36:57 -!- Kerr-A [~Kerr-A@2605:e000:1b05:c485:0:fb6f:14e9:ca8d] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T00:37:10 < kakimir> ye my queen was right there
2018-09-12T00:39:29 < kakimir> I'm too tired to play smart
2018-09-12T00:40:17 < kakimir> just intimidate, make that push
2018-09-12T00:42:31 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-12T00:42:37 < kakimir> nice games
2018-09-12T00:44:24 < kakimir> shiieet
2018-09-12T00:44:26 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-12T00:44:32 < kakimir> let me take a sip
2018-09-12T00:44:48 < Steffanx> Twice?
2018-09-12T00:44:50 < kakimir> 2 games
2018-09-12T00:45:08 < Steffanx> Command & Conquer.
2018-09-12T00:45:16 < kakimir> engines are for lamers
2018-09-12T00:45:30 < kakimir> enlighten me
2018-09-12T00:46:11 < kakimir> couldn't these sites integrate it in them
2018-09-12T00:46:46 < kakimir> "hey.. it seems your opponent has non-human score in this came"
2018-09-12T00:46:48 < kakimir> game
2018-09-12T00:48:14 < Thorn> apparently I am getting a few of these for $3 after all https://www.variscite.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/VAR-SOM-AM43_Product_Brief.pdf
2018-09-12T00:48:25 < kakimir> superbia1: 
2018-09-12T00:48:28 < kakimir> are you ready
2018-09-12T00:48:59 < Steffanx> $3 Thorn ?
2018-09-12T00:49:00 < kakimir> quick then
2018-09-12T00:49:16 < kakimir> cannot wait to lose
2018-09-12T00:49:24 < Thorn> knock on wood
2018-09-12T00:49:39 < kakimir> I have my battle song on
2018-09-12T00:49:46 < Steffanx> Aliexpress or what Thorn
2018-09-12T00:50:41 < Steffanx> Damn, you couldve written an engine in Nim already..
2018-09-12T00:50:47 < kakimir> superbia1: ready?
2018-09-12T00:51:13 < Thorn> Steffanx: no, local recycling company. they get paid to crush stuff and throw it in garbage
2018-09-12T00:52:20 < Steffanx> Joking me superbia1 
2018-09-12T00:52:28 < Steffanx> Ah cool Thorn 
2018-09-12T00:52:44 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/KmrVHzfR
2018-09-12T00:53:03 < kakimir> waiting you to say you are ready
2018-09-12T00:53:24 < kakimir> is it you now?
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2018-09-12T01:02:15 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T01:02:41 < kakimir> confirmed
2018-09-12T01:03:03 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-12T01:04:56 < kakimir> I have seen this pattern before
2018-09-12T01:05:17 < kakimir> lets play another?
2018-09-12T01:05:44 < kakimir> you would still win
2018-09-12T01:06:11 < kakimir> I don't counter
2018-09-12T01:06:18 < kakimir> I just change things
2018-09-12T01:06:56 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/rytapLXF
2018-09-12T01:07:09 < Steffanx> Dis you loose kakimir ?
2018-09-12T01:07:23 < kakimir> badly
2018-09-12T01:07:52 < Steffanx> Lose.
2018-09-12T01:08:01 < kakimir> badly
2018-09-12T01:08:06 < kakimir> me too
2018-09-12T01:08:46 < kakimir> me
2018-09-12T01:08:48 < kakimir>  
2018-09-12T01:08:50 < kakimir> too
2018-09-12T01:09:06 < kakimir> tommorow
2018-09-12T01:09:08 < kakimir>  
2018-09-12T01:09:10 < kakimir> we play
2018-09-12T01:10:02 < kakimir> okay - I will look it up
2018-09-12T01:11:24 < Steffanx> B
2018-09-12T01:12:19 < Laurenceb_> wew the south
2018-09-12T01:12:35 < Laurenceb_> I met ppl from Porton Down in the local bar
2018-09-12T01:12:42 < Laurenceb_> irl trolling ends badly
2018-09-12T01:12:58 < Laurenceb_> I told them that the novichok was prob fake
2018-09-12T01:13:00 < emeb> shocking!
2018-09-12T01:13:14 < emeb> irl is not the same as irc
2018-09-12T01:13:31 < emeb> did they punch you?
2018-09-12T01:13:33 < Thorn> chess commentary channel https://www.youtube.com/user/AGADMATOR/videos
2018-09-12T01:18:40 < Cracki> that fischer dude knows his tribe
2018-09-12T01:19:43 < Cracki> chess dude
2018-09-12T01:20:03 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T01:20:05 < Cracki> no but I think he'd appreciate good smells
2018-09-12T01:21:15 < Cracki> 8-12 mm feed, depending on package
2018-09-12T01:22:43 < Cracki> I know you're fond of open source so I'll try not to offend you
2018-09-12T01:23:29 < Cracki> I am fond of armed robbery too
2018-09-12T01:24:30 < Cracki> depends. if you do either often enough, you will lose with mathematical certainty.
2018-09-12T01:25:04 < Cracki> the banks won't mind. they'll get bailed out.
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2018-09-12T01:27:10 < Cracki> anyway, I'm content with arm gcc and openocd and all that
2018-09-12T01:27:49 < Cracki> I tried nxp's rebranded eclipse once. it was SHIT.
2018-09-12T01:27:57 < Cracki> not the ide, but the integration of debug facilities
2018-09-12T01:28:13 < emeb> +1 for arm gcc + openocd etc
2018-09-12T01:28:25 < emeb> Works for Me (TM)
2018-09-12T01:28:38 < Cracki> I actually requested a free student license of arm/keil mdk once... never actually used it
2018-09-12T01:29:06 < emeb> I used Keil MDK for an STM32 project once
2018-09-12T01:29:21 < emeb> managed to get it to fit into the codesize limit
2018-09-12T01:30:29 < emeb> I was amused the the limit is applied prior to optimization
2018-09-12T01:30:48 < emeb> so my code came in close to the limit but then after linking it was about 1/2 the size
2018-09-12T01:30:56 < Cracki> I can think of something to fill the flash... numerical tables... but then, that's what you gotta do on puny AVRs that have a 2-cycle 8x8 bit multiply and NOTHING ELSE, no fpu, nada
2018-09-12T01:31:13 < Cracki> oh nose
2018-09-12T01:31:15 < _unreal_> is there a channel that does pic chips?
2018-09-12T01:31:24 < Cracki> #pic? ##pic?
2018-09-12T01:31:28 < Cracki> ##cancer
2018-09-12T01:31:29 < _unreal_> tried
2018-09-12T01:31:37 < Cracki> ##embedded perhaps
2018-09-12T01:31:37 < _unreal_> oh didnt try cancer
2018-09-12T01:31:46 < Cracki> can't recommend ##electronics tho
2018-09-12T01:31:56 < Cracki> they're snowflakes
2018-09-12T01:32:09 < _unreal_> hehe
2018-09-12T01:32:25 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T01:32:29 < _unreal_> ya I'm just looking to do a simple program..... I suck at arduino and I'm worse at pic
2018-09-12T01:33:01 < Cracki> you only get booted? I seem to have been awarded with a lifetime ban
2018-09-12T01:33:16 < Cracki> perhaps you're smarter about it than me
2018-09-12T01:33:24 < Cracki> >suck at arduino
2018-09-12T01:33:25 < Cracki> wat
2018-09-12T01:33:30 < Cracki> impossibru!
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2018-09-12T01:33:46 < Cracki> accuse the ops of being bigots
2018-09-12T01:33:48 < Cracki> that'll work
2018-09-12T01:35:15 < Cracki> > you will be astonished at how he recoils, how injured he is, how he suddenly shrinks back: “I've been found out.”
2018-09-12T01:35:35 < _unreal_> @#$@#$@ phone
2018-09-12T01:35:53 < Cracki> shoulda put a PIC in it
2018-09-12T01:36:40 < Cracki> "se" sounds like budget version for nigeria
2018-09-12T01:37:00 < Cracki> smart, they won't rob you then
2018-09-12T01:39:10 < Cracki> I dread having to replace my current one... only the battery needs replacing, new one on its way, but it's so old and shitty
2018-09-12T01:42:29 < _unreal_> Omg omg omg..... phone
2018-09-12T01:42:48 < _unreal_> ok so my father calls, staying at his house with my daughter currently.....
2018-09-12T01:43:03 < _unreal_> he and I setup some of the new polls for the fence on the side of the house....
2018-09-12T01:44:12 < _unreal_> so working on rebilding the thing, we set 2 last night in cement. he calls me to tell me not to go and shake them there not setup fully yet.. and need more cement on some of them because we dug around them deep because where re-doing the pavers on that side of the house as well. the tree pulls a lost of the side walk way up during irma
2018-09-12T01:44:24 < _unreal_> OMG.... just kept going and going on the phone.
2018-09-12T01:46:00 < tpw_rules> i'm glad for your irc-based reenactment
2018-09-12T01:46:17 < zyp> was there a point or are you still getting to it?
2018-09-12T01:46:30 < _unreal_> ok crt and Cracki the simple program i'm looking to to do is take a PIC chip. and set it to have one IO be in, 5 I/O's be outputs.. the input must recive a 12.5khz digital signal. and it sets ALL 5 outputs high... if not 12.5khz signal all outputs low
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2018-09-12T01:47:05 < tpw_rules> that's easy, assuming the PIC has competent peripherals
2018-09-12T01:47:06 < _unreal_> he wouldnt get off the phone and WHY would I go and shake a fence post that we just setup last night in cement
2018-09-12T01:47:10 < Cracki> bandpass, envelope, done.
2018-09-12T01:47:21 < tpw_rules> oh i would just use a timer
2018-09-12T01:47:25 < Cracki> or that
2018-09-12T01:47:44 < Cracki> or get a pic with dsp and do a hilbert transform for the envelope
2018-09-12T01:48:08 < _unreal_> 12c509's I believe
2018-09-12T01:48:32 < zyp> _unreal_, better go shake some fence posts just to be sure
2018-09-12T01:48:39 < _unreal_> heh
2018-09-12T01:48:40 < Cracki> what's it called, input capture? as long as the period between edges is right, do this, if too short/long, do that
2018-09-12T01:48:50 < Thorn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goertzel_algorithm
2018-09-12T01:48:53 < Cracki> shaking someone's fence pole, eh
2018-09-12T01:48:59 < _unreal_> Cracki, thats more or less all i'm looking to do
2018-09-12T01:49:20 < Cracki> goertzel... sounds like fourier transform for a single frequency or what
2018-09-12T01:49:59 < Thorn> something like that
2018-09-12T01:50:05 < _unreal_> shit. he just got here. have to go out and pull the last old poll dig out the old hole and set the last post... 
2018-09-12T01:50:23 < _unreal_> !!!! maybe I'll shake the old pole out of the ground
2018-09-12T01:51:15 < Cracki> stupid wikipedia, says it's all real valued, but then I see exp(-j...) in there
2018-09-12T01:53:29 < _unreal_> ! I thought he was here. dog was freaking out
2018-09-12T01:53:34 < _unreal_> dog faked me out
2018-09-12T01:55:03 < Cracki> not sure how pics perform with floats (soft/hard)... 12.5 kHz might be tricky, or might not
2018-09-12T01:55:31 < Cracki> dude, is that the frequency it's supposed to respond to, or the sampling frequency?
2018-09-12T01:55:51 < zyp> why the fuck are you sampling
2018-09-12T01:55:52 < Cracki> timer is likely the cheapest method
2018-09-12T01:55:55 < zyp> it's a digital signal
2018-09-12T01:56:02 < Cracki> someone said goertzel algorithm
2018-09-12T01:56:05 < Cracki> that works on samples
2018-09-12T01:56:14 < Cracki> it's overly complicated if you have a timer with input capture
2018-09-12T01:56:20 < Cracki> so don't rip my head off pls
2018-09-12T01:56:20 < zyp> either use input capture or pulse counting depending on latency and accuracy needs
2018-09-12T01:57:14 < zyp> you don't even need a timer, it's cheaper to bitbang shit than to do any form of DFT
2018-09-12T01:58:32 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2018-09-12T01:58:56 < Cracki> I wouldn't bitbang the input of this, but sure that's a diy timer then
2018-09-12T02:04:46 < _unreal_> I dont think I can even do what I was thinking about with the chips I have on hand
2018-09-12T02:04:54 < _unreal_> they are 12c508a's
2018-09-12T02:08:16 < _unreal_> https://www.edaboard.com/showthread.php?86341-How-can-I-implement-a-software-PWM
2018-09-12T02:08:54 < englishman> very helpful
2018-09-12T02:09:38  * karlp regrets reading scrollback.
2018-09-12T02:09:56 < Cracki> it has a TMR0 that looks like it's good enough
2018-09-12T02:10:17 < _unreal_> karlp, some people just never learn
2018-09-12T02:10:18 < _unreal_> ;)
2018-09-12T02:11:07 < Cracki> just throw these pics away. they're an awful architecture.
2018-09-12T02:12:04 < Cracki> I'm not sure I'm reading this right... they store program code in 12-bit words, and the EPROM storage is 512-1024 words of that?
2018-09-12T02:12:43 < Cracki> that's less than I am forced to work with for a bootloader with some crypto stuff
2018-09-12T02:13:18 < emeb> heh - PICs
2018-09-12T02:13:37 < emeb> one of my old bosses worked at MCHP before working w/ me.
2018-09-12T02:13:40 < Cracki> the 508A has 8 pins total, 6 general purpose/usable
2018-09-12T02:13:49 < emeb> in the design group back in the 90s
2018-09-12T02:13:58 < Thorn> in one of his videos Dave bragged about a PIC project from his youth (OSD for analog TV or something like that?) where he used every word in the PIC
2018-09-12T02:14:06 < Cracki> emeb, euthanize him
2018-09-12T02:14:29 < Cracki> OSD for analog tv, meaning inject/override the signal with correct timing?
2018-09-12T02:14:37 < emeb> They fired him because he wanted them to use modern tools. he said that for PICs they designed them all by hand in the GDSII editor.
2018-09-12T02:14:45 < Cracki> lol
2018-09-12T02:14:54 < emeb> and just kept spinning the masks until they worked
2018-09-12T02:14:55 < Cracki> did him a favor
2018-09-12T02:15:26 < Thorn> I hope their editor was at least graphical lol
2018-09-12T02:15:46 < emeb> Yeah - GDSII looked like an old color CRT video game.
2018-09-12T02:15:59 < emeb> like designing a chip in Robotron.
2018-09-12T02:16:34 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-12T02:17:00 < emeb> s/GDSII/Calma/
2018-09-12T02:17:06 < Cracki> so... set TMR0 to timer mode, then tight loop read the input, on edge read and clear the timer value, act on the value
2018-09-12T02:17:33 < _unreal_> This is exatly what I'm trying to do https://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/125k-charge-pump-code-working-dont-know-why
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2018-09-12T02:17:52 < Cracki> >charge pump
2018-09-12T02:17:54 < Cracki> uh
2018-09-12T02:17:57 < Cracki> ok
2018-09-12T02:18:03 < _unreal_> its a safety for my cnc machine
2018-09-12T02:18:29 < _unreal_> if it gets a 12.5khz it turns mains on. NO 12.5khz everything is off
2018-09-12T02:18:46 < _unreal_> and it cant turn on unless it gets that signal
2018-09-12T02:18:52 < Cracki> what is charge-pumpy about this
2018-09-12T02:19:22 < Cracki> charge pump is a term used with step-up switching regulators
2018-09-12T02:19:34 < Cracki> (among other things... certainly not safety mechanisms)
2018-09-12T02:20:02 < _unreal_> they use to use a hardware level version. where you hit it with a frequency. from PWM and at a certain freq it would output a voltage that the competitor like an lm393 would signal and turn on.
2018-09-12T02:20:05 < _unreal_> the output
2018-09-12T02:20:16 < Cracki> ic
2018-09-12T02:20:25 < Cracki> that's a bandpass filter then, not a charge pump
2018-09-12T02:20:34 < Cracki> web boards are cancer
2018-09-12T02:20:40 < Cracki> only offliners there
2018-09-12T02:21:19 < _unreal_> they use to be big when more people where using parallel ports to drive motor controllers for cncs
2018-09-12T02:21:51 < _unreal_> do to the PAR port changing random states during booting or crashing.
2018-09-12T02:22:23 < Cracki> the only use I can think of for "charge pump" + "parallel port" is the PPT outputs too little voltage (5V?), and something needs more... but a PPT can't have that much current source/sink capability
2018-09-12T02:22:32 < Cracki> so what would need more voltage, but not much current?
2018-09-12T02:23:59 < Cracki> http://www.cnc4everyone.com/safety/charge-pump-watchdog-timer/
2018-09-12T02:24:05 < Cracki> cancer.
2018-09-12T02:25:52 < Cracki> more cancer. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?About_Charge_Pumps
2018-09-12T02:28:42 < _unreal_> cancer?
2018-09-12T02:29:12 < Cracki> so you want to use that pic
2018-09-12T02:29:22 < Cracki> got a dev environment setup and working?
2018-09-12T02:29:35 < Cracki> (tbh using an arduino would be easier...)
2018-09-12T02:31:02 < Cracki> https://www.arduino.cc/reference/en/language/functions/advanced-io/pulsein/
2018-09-12T02:31:17 < Cracki> use that with a timeout, if it runs into the timeout, you have the failure condition
2018-09-12T02:31:34 < tpw_rules> or if it ends before the timeout
2018-09-12T02:31:45 < Cracki> that of course.
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2018-09-12T02:34:05 < Cracki> higher input frequency (shorter pulse length) might mean the controlling pc suddenly runs faster
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2018-09-12T02:35:53 < Cracki> that PIC confuses me... it says 1 us per instruction as if it actually enforces that in case of higher clock...
2018-09-12T02:37:51 < Cracki> ah! from a 4 MHz clock it generates four 1 MHz clocks shifted by 90 degrees
2018-09-12T02:37:58 < Cracki> quaint
2018-09-12T02:40:53 < emeb> oldskool
2018-09-12T02:41:37 -!- CygniX [~CygniX@opensuse/member/CygniX] has left ##stm32 ["Konversation terminated!"]
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2018-09-12T02:44:26 < Cracki> inb4 keyhole for hand crank on the underside
2018-09-12T02:48:34 < karlp> goddamnit
2018-09-12T02:49:08 < Thorn> https://imgur.com/gallery/hvBXPS0
2018-09-12T02:49:42 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
2018-09-12T02:51:45 < Thorn> do you like my discrete input circuit https://imgur.com/a/1kFrwpt
2018-09-12T02:51:59 < karlp> wrong fuckign clock config 
2018-09-12T02:52:19 < karlp> was chasing usb descriptions and thinking the rtos handlers were busted but no, just had the wrong goddamn clock config pasted in.
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2018-09-12T03:03:04 < karlp> huh, calling yield from a higher priority thread in rtos2 won't allow lower priority tasks to run.
2018-09-12T03:04:04 < karlp> am I meant to call my usbd handling thread lowest priority? seems weird.
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2018-09-12T03:06:53 < Cracki> freertos only allows lower priorities to run if no higher priority can run
2018-09-12T03:07:04 < Cracki> that also means if a task yields, it might immediately get scheduled again
2018-09-12T03:07:27 < karlp> yeah, I ugess that's the same thing
2018-09-12T03:07:36 < Cracki> interrupts can cause tasks to not just be interrupted, but also preempted if a higher prio task now can run
2018-09-12T03:07:38 < karlp> so "run everything at the same prioirty"
2018-09-12T03:08:30 < Cracki> if you want something else to run, put on same prio, or use synchronization (semaphores, queues) or "sleep" i.e. block until time x
2018-09-12T03:08:41 < karlp> no, this is different.
2018-09-12T03:08:45 < karlp> freertos "works"
2018-09-12T03:09:03 < karlp> I can have usbd thead at priority idle + 2, and two blinkers at idle +1, and they all still run
2018-09-12T03:09:20 < karlp> iwth cmsis-rtos2, if I have usbd thread at priority above normal, the other two tasks _never run_
2018-09-12T03:09:37  * karlp checks to make sure preemption is enabled
2018-09-12T03:13:22 < karlp> annnnd I can't reproduce that now.
2018-09-12T03:13:28 < Cracki> that and the task needs to block on something to be sent waiting
2018-09-12T03:13:42  * karlp should go to bed,
2018-09-12T03:13:45 < karlp> wasn't testing the right code
2018-09-12T03:14:35 < karlp> yep, higherprior tasks in rtos2 will never let other tasks run. ever
2018-09-12T03:14:49 < karlp> unless you forcible suspend your own task, and then ahve to manually resume them later.
2018-09-12T03:15:25 < karlp> ame thing in freertos will run all of them, with the higher priority occcasionaly having to wait.
2018-09-12T03:24:10 < Cracki> uh
2018-09-12T03:24:14 < Cracki> not to my knowledge
2018-09-12T03:24:20 < Cracki> maybe you can configure this now...
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2018-09-12T03:24:48 < Cracki> freertos actually promises you that a task will only run if no higher prio task can
2018-09-12T03:25:02 < Cracki> do you do busy looping in there or what
2018-09-12T03:25:14 < Cracki> tasks are meant to block on something
2018-09-12T03:26:22 < karlp> yeah, I wanted premption.
2018-09-12T03:26:25 < Cracki> an RTOS isn't Realtime anymore if it lets a task be preempted by a lower prio task
2018-09-12T03:26:41 < karlp> well, something's letting them run on freertos, but not on cmsis-rtos2
2018-09-12T03:26:52 < Cracki> not the fault of freertos
2018-09-12T03:26:59 < Cracki> (yes, I'm saying user error)
2018-09-12T03:27:03 < karlp> sure,
2018-09-12T03:27:13 < karlp> I'mn just saying that for the "same" setup, one behaves one way, one the other.
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2018-09-12T03:27:53 < karlp> it's always user error anyway, computers are perfect waifus
2018-09-12T03:29:00 < karlp> https://github.com/karlp/libopencm3-tests/tree/master/tests/freertos-spi-slave/host vs https://github.com/karlp/libopencm3-tests/tree/master/tests/rtos2-spi-slave/host
2018-09-12T03:31:31 < catphish> i got the tag detection in this st95hf working, and it sucks :( i assume because my antenna isn't tuned properly
2018-09-12T03:31:33 < Cracki> usbd_poll(), line 288 in the first link, does that block?
2018-09-12T03:31:47 < Cracki> if not, that's a busy loop and bound to hog the core
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2018-09-12T03:37:46 < Cracki> wew max_priorities 2
2018-09-12T03:37:53 < Cracki> I'm sure that does something
2018-09-12T03:38:06 < Cracki> yep that it does
2018-09-12T03:38:09 < Cracki> idle prio is 0
2018-09-12T03:38:13 < Cracki> 0+2 % 2 is 0
2018-09-12T03:38:19 < Cracki> that means the usbd task is idle prio
2018-09-12T03:38:33 < Cracki> your freertos test needs to be adjusted
2018-09-12T03:39:10 < Cracki> also perhaps don't call the usb's poll() in a loop, but rather hook it up with an interrupt
2018-09-12T03:41:11 < karlp> yup, using blinkers at idle, and usbd at idle+1 makes it run exclusively
2018-09-12T03:41:16 < karlp> shitty freertos config files.
2018-09-12T03:41:20 < karlp> weird defaults
2018-09-12T03:42:11 < Cracki> or just set max_priorities higher
2018-09-12T03:42:19 < Thorn> I sure hope the idle task never preempts anything lol
2018-09-12T03:42:26 < Cracki> not infinitely high. I think it creates a run list for each level
2018-09-12T03:42:35 < Cracki> the idle task shares time with all prio 0 tasks
2018-09-12T03:42:54 < Cracki> it isn't blocking on anything, so it can't unblock out of the blue
2018-09-12T03:43:10 < Cracki> there's a software timer task which usually runs at nonzero :P
2018-09-12T03:44:07 < Cracki> iirc freertos can do prio inversion, i.e. when some high prio task blocks on a lock, whatever low prio task holds the lock gets boosted to that prio so it can finish and hand unblock the important task
2018-09-12T03:44:26 < karlp> right, they both behave consistentyly now, and yes, starving the rest does seem like the only sane interpretation of higher priority
2018-09-12T03:44:27 < Cracki> -hand
2018-09-12T03:44:47 < Cracki> hard realtime requires this
2018-09-12T03:45:20 < Cracki> any other scheme that attempts to distribute time, might make sense on a real computer, but not for control :)
2018-09-12T03:45:39 < Thorn> well there's also monotonic sheduling
2018-09-12T03:45:44 < Cracki> I'm sure someone has implemented some exponential allocation scheme for queues...
2018-09-12T03:46:15 < Cracki> sounds like earliest deadline first?
2018-09-12T03:46:26 < Cracki> >The static priorities are assigned according to the cycle duration of the job, so a shorter cycle duration results in a higher job priority.
2018-09-12T03:46:39 < Cracki> ya, dats EDF
2018-09-12T03:47:26 < Thorn> IIRC the curiosity rover team had to hack a monotonic scheduler into vxworks for some reason
2018-09-12T03:48:25 < Cracki> simple round robin (no prios) of course loses in comparison to anything that considers importance
2018-09-12T03:48:41 < karlp> well mine was just that max priorities was 2, so setting higher priroity wasn't...
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2018-09-12T03:52:42 < Cracki> *prio inversion is the problem of a higher task getting blocked, prio INHERITANCE is the solution
2018-09-12T03:52:49  * Cracki reads wikipedia
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2018-09-12T03:58:14 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dm1qocHU8AEojXE.jpg:orig
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2018-09-12T04:02:24 < karlp> hrm, events and mq from irqs aren't enumerating yet. enough for tonight
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2018-09-12T04:21:43 < _unreal_> I'm back finally
2018-09-12T04:24:54 < Cracki> save some poles, cement your dad in the ground
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2018-09-12T04:33:53  * _unreal_ rolling eyes, so we only pulled the last 2 verticals. and dug out the cement.. freaking retarded. So who ever built it before. they make a cement base that was like a large donut, with about 10" of pole in the ground 90% in the cement. No wonder it failed. The wood was holding water and just racheted back and forth till it was very loose
2018-09-12T04:37:53 < Cracki> 10" isn't much
2018-09-12T04:38:06 < Cracki> how deep do you plant them
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2018-09-12T04:58:08 < _unreal_> 2 feet
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2018-09-12T04:59:31 < Cracki> https://twitter.com/flatearthvape/status/1038713748486152192
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2018-09-12T06:46:47 < englishman> A remote code execution vulnerability exists when Windows does not properly handle specially crafted image files. An attacker who successfully exploited the vulnerability could execute arbitrary code.
2018-09-12T06:46:48 < englishman> To exploit the vulnerability, an attacker would have to convince a user to download an image file.
2018-09-12T06:47:05 < englishman> CVE-2018-8475
2018-09-12T06:48:34 < branjb> lol
2018-09-12T06:48:38 < branjb> rip 4chan
2018-09-12T06:49:57 < branjb> but then you go read the details and realize it's really dumb and under extremely strict conditions you can maybe launch javascript
2018-09-12T06:50:30 < englishman> yeah cuz javascript is completely bug free
2018-09-12T06:51:15 < branjb> idk just seems like most of them have really strict conditions and you have to have some of those conditions line up like stars to elevate access
2018-09-12T06:51:30 < branjb> like "this exploit affects users with chrome who still have netscape installed"
2018-09-12T06:51:53 < englishman> heh
2018-09-12T06:52:02 < englishman> well, a chain is only as strong as its weakest link
2018-09-12T06:52:18 < englishman> like, a plane doesnt crash because a single thing went wrong, 10+ things have to go wrong. and planes still crash
2018-09-12T06:54:36 < branjb> w/e i have plane insurance
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2018-09-12T07:09:03 < dongs> just like fuckclown stuff
2018-09-12T07:09:06 < dongs> overblown garbage
2018-09-12T07:09:20 < dongs> i disable all meltdown/sceptre trash because it has ZERO effect on single user machines
2018-09-12T07:10:12 < dongs> i get more fail from these FUCKING DELL MONITORS going to sleep than I get from anything else on windows
2018-09-12T07:10:49 < cjbaird> F00FC7C8
2018-09-12T07:14:18 < dongs> https://www.gearbest.com/rc-quadcopters/pp_568643.html?wid=1859758&lkid=10315376
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2018-09-12T07:14:36 < englishman> lol
2018-09-12T07:14:39 < englishman> fuck gearbest tho
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2018-09-12T10:34:48 < Steffanx> Lo
2018-09-12T10:47:40 < cjbaird> One of the women at Bunnings (hardware store) has figured out I've got some kind of bizarre project going on, as I'm down there every arvo buying unrelated things.. 
2018-09-12T10:48:12 < cjbaird> Haven't seen the cute girl there I've been crushing on for a few weeks now. crap. 
2018-09-12T10:57:55 < mitrax> ahaha
2018-09-12T10:58:04 < mitrax> crt: hi 
2018-09-12T10:59:25 < cjbaird> easy done-- lots of hydrogen peroxide. AU Federal police are still watching for wannabes trying 'Mother of Satan' for epic lolz.
2018-09-12T11:02:22 < cjbaird> I actually got questioned by a pharmasist why a guy with thinning hair was buying a litre of H2O2 "30" hair bleach.. Giving her the full autism of the chemistry of how retr0brite works did the trick.
2018-09-12T11:03:37 < zyp> I've bought hydrogen peroxide for pcb etching, didn't get any questions
2018-09-12T11:04:19 < cjbaird> Been a few jihadis in NSW who've been busted trying it.
2018-09-12T11:06:13 < zyp> hydrogen peroxide and hydrochloric acid is a good etchant :p
2018-09-12T11:06:48 < zyp> and acetone is nice for wiping the photoresist from the pcb after etching
2018-09-12T11:07:16 < zyp> I mean, last I bothered with home etching, that's how I did it
2018-09-12T11:07:40 < zyp> eight years or something, I guess
2018-09-12T11:09:33 < cjbaird> Had lots of fun when I was 14 playing with Ammonium Nitrate fertilizer. Can't have those days back again..
2018-09-12T11:10:27 < PaulFertser> Talking about chemistry, what is the proper way of cleaning the insides of leather motorbike gloves?
2018-09-12T11:11:15 < dongs> by throwing them in the trash
2018-09-12T11:12:27 < cjbaird> Mould? I don't have any leather riding gear, as I'm a crazy vegan.
2018-09-12T11:13:31 < cjbaird> Most moulds should shift with a good dose of good-purity isopropyl, although I have zero idea how that'll affect the leather (not as bad as water?)
2018-09-12T11:13:39 < PaulFertser> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Motorcycle-Gloves-Racing-Furygan-ANTS-AFS18-Genuine-leather-White-Full-Finger/292638933756?hash=item4422a3c2fc:m:mZpHSWC6CwuSlYvZqkpoHfQ not exactly disposable I'd say.
2018-09-12T11:14:58 < cjbaird> The gloves I have now are neoprene..
2018-09-12T11:15:09 < PaulFertser> cjbaird: I would prefer something without leather too, but alas, couldn't find anything like that for reasonable price. And I got those for about 1.5x less the price last winter.
2018-09-12T11:17:17 < PaulFertser> I tried to find something long and with adequate protection, those furygans seemed to be the best option. About 4k kms later, no considerable wear noticed.
2018-09-12T11:17:18 < cjbaird> Goggles seems to say that isopropyl on leather is actually a good idea..
2018-09-12T11:19:07 < cjbaird> Using it with a leather conditioner seems to be a good way to make the conditioner seep into the materal better, too.
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2018-09-12T11:21:20 < cjbaird> I can guess-- PaulFertser's gloves got wet, he tried wearing them to dry them out, and a day later he has official FunkyGloves that smell like toejam. :)
2018-09-12T11:23:20 < PaulFertser> cjbaird: hehe, not yet :) Actually, those furygan survived rains much better (no visible signs of any damage) than my previous "Five" pair.
2018-09-12T11:24:30 < PaulFertser> But it's kinda obvious if you wear the gloves for long enough they'll eventually start to smell.
2018-09-12T11:25:05 < PaulFertser> So would be nice to learn a nice trick how to deal with that in advance.
2018-09-12T11:30:39 < PaulFertser> I guess I'll just try a regular laundry detergent with enzymes on them once I need that. If they can handle heavy rains they should be able to handle some water with detergent as well I guess.
2018-09-12T11:31:34 < PaulFertser> cjbaird: if you have any suggestions wrt non-leather gloves similar in protection to what I got I'm all ears.
2018-09-12T11:33:09 < cjbaird> For my nylon (and neoprene) gloves, I've mostly been washing them in hot water with a little detergent, and a lot of lavender oil.. Those can be just hung up to dry, unlike leather.
2018-09-12T11:35:02 < PaulFertser> Another topic, just heard 80% EU folks want to cancel DST. Why is that? Is there some scientific evidence to support the idea? I'm personally not to happy with not having DST here in ru.
2018-09-12T11:37:03 < cjbaird> With the laundry detergent, I'd wash them as little as possible to do the job, and then rinse and dry immediately..
2018-09-12T11:37:10 < PaulFertser> crt: surprise
2018-09-12T11:37:50 < PaulFertser> cjbaird: I do not think it makes much sense given I might be going for hours in the rain when actually using them.
2018-09-12T11:39:42 < cjbaird> I thought I had Nazi RAM technology for a second: https://imgur.com/a/ZIKOPxm
2018-09-12T11:39:50 < PaulFertser> crt: fake news, fake elections, insane foreign policy, highly inefficient economics policy, corrupt courts, corrupt everything...
2018-09-12T11:40:23 < dongs> lol @ A00LF
2018-09-12T11:43:59 < dongs> adolf without a D
2018-09-12T11:48:29 < PaulFertser> Yeah, I can def recommend https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hot-Sale-Professional-MotoGP-Racing-Gloves-Furygan-ANTS-AFS18-Motorcycle-Gloves-Genuine-LeatherBreathable-Gloves/32870015165.html haven't crash-tested them though but feels sturdy enough.
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2018-09-12T11:57:40 < kakimir> how do I detect in usb2.0 how many amps charging port can provide?
2018-09-12T11:57:55 < dongs> there's like 10 different standards
2018-09-12T11:58:15 < kakimir> shiiet
2018-09-12T11:58:18 < dongs> passive shit by measuring D+/D- pullup/down voltage, active stuff like QC etc
2018-09-12T11:58:38 < kakimir> yes but that pullup down thing doesn't tell the amperes right?
2018-09-12T11:59:06 < kakimir> just that it's charging downstream port or decicated charging port right?
2018-09-12T11:59:16 < kakimir> so I need to enumerate?
2018-09-12T12:01:03 < dongs> wut
2018-09-12T12:01:08 < dongs> no thres no USB involved at all
2018-09-12T12:01:10 < dongs> its all analog
2018-09-12T12:01:17 < PaulFertser> kakimir: I think what universally applies is that you can get 100mA no matter what, then either if you enumerate or if you sense D+ is shorted with D- then you can draw 500mA.
2018-09-12T12:01:23 < dongs> the active ones like QC are just some pulses in some encoding
2018-09-12T12:01:39 < kakimir> I don't need QC
2018-09-12T12:02:41 < PaulFertser> (if you enumerate and the host allows you 500mA there of course)
2018-09-12T12:04:27 < kakimir> I will not even ask for 500mA I will just take it
2018-09-12T12:04:39 < kakimir> but for 1.5A I need to do something smarter
2018-09-12T12:04:52 < kakimir> before I switch more power to output
2018-09-12T12:07:27 < PaulFertser> What USB2.0 "charging ports" are you going to use for that?
2018-09-12T12:08:26 < kakimir> wall bricks
2018-09-12T12:08:29 < kakimir> car chargers
2018-09-12T12:08:33 < kakimir> computers
2018-09-12T12:09:50 < kakimir> does DCP or CDP btw. promise 1Amps minimum?
2018-09-12T12:10:31 < kakimir> https://www.diodes.com/assets/Datasheets/PI3USB9281.pdf page 8 nice flowchart
2018-09-12T12:14:28 < zyp> kakimir, how much power do you need?
2018-09-12T12:18:47 < zyp> the basic charging spec is "draw as much current as you want, just monitor vbus and make sure it doesn't drop below x volts"
2018-09-12T12:19:14 < zyp> so you don't get told how much current you can draw, you just monitor vbus to make sure you're not drawing too much
2018-09-12T12:19:38 < zyp> in practice you can just say fuck it and draw whatever you need
2018-09-12T12:19:53 < zyp> any type of source port should have current limiters that protects the port
2018-09-12T12:29:13 < kakimir> I just want my device to operate smoothly
2018-09-12T12:30:04 < zyp> how does your power requirement look? can you regulate it based on power availability?
2018-09-12T12:30:29 < zyp> or is it that when you need 1.5A, your device will only work if it can get 1.5A?
2018-09-12T12:47:39 < PaulFertser> "Now listen to my advice in the MP3 format: do not wait to get older, die faster! Too bad your parents were not childfree. Burn in hell, in hell you burn." <- from popular russian song
2018-09-12T12:50:27 < karlp> things I didn't expect bangood to sell: https://www.banggood.com/2L-Electric-Ewe-Milking-Machine-Vacuum-Pump-Milker-Double-Head-EUUSAU-Plug-p-1344662.html
2018-09-12T12:51:03 < zyp> don't put your penis in it
2018-09-12T12:52:32 < Thorn> there is a genre of porn where they use these on women
2018-09-12T12:52:33 < Steffanx> Try it karlp 
2018-09-12T13:00:08 < kakimir> zyp: I have modes of 500mA and 1.5A
2018-09-12T13:00:17 < kakimir> output to lipo cell
2018-09-12T13:00:41 < kakimir> because of step down charger actual numbers are slightly less
2018-09-12T13:01:09 < kakimir> I have 2 shunts paraller in charger
2018-09-12T13:01:39 < kakimir> another one has fet in series with it
2018-09-12T13:02:06 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T13:02:25 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T13:04:01 < Steffanx> In your pink dress?
2018-09-12T13:04:45 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T13:05:09 < kakimir> zyp: should I add 1A step to charging?
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2018-09-12T13:22:25 < Steffanx> Fuck you Laurenceb_ 
2018-09-12T13:22:36 < Steffanx> You put the word "muh" in my head.
2018-09-12T13:22:39 < Steffanx> Get it out.
2018-09-12T13:22:44 < jpa-> meh
2018-09-12T13:22:49 < Laurenceb_> kek
2018-09-12T13:23:00 < jpa-> "get out of muh hed" says steffie
2018-09-12T13:24:27 < Steffanx> What jpa- said
2018-09-12T13:25:06 < Steffanx> Hows the day jpa- 
2018-09-12T13:25:23 < jpa-> should start working
2018-09-12T13:25:43 < jpa-> i'll have to make a projection when we'll cross the 1024kB flash size and what to do about it
2018-09-12T13:25:49 < Steffanx> Nah, almost anothet 0.5 day remaining
2018-09-12T13:25:55 < zyp> jpa-, f427? :p
2018-09-12T13:26:04 < zyp> been there, done that
2018-09-12T13:26:12 < Steffanx> Get qspi fladh
2018-09-12T13:26:15 < Steffanx> Flash
2018-09-12T13:26:27 < jpa-> probably F7 if we end up upgrading the hardware.. but with the installed base that we need to support, i don't think that is happening
2018-09-12T13:26:47 < Steffanx> Dont you HAL?
2018-09-12T13:26:59 < zyp> f427 is a drop in replacement
2018-09-12T13:27:09 < zyp> apart from that stupid errata in early revs
2018-09-12T13:27:41 < jpa-> i mean, "provide this new cool feature for the old hardware" - and if all the new features push the binary size above what the old hardware has..
2018-09-12T13:28:07 < Laurenceb_> jpa-: wtf are you making
2018-09-12T13:28:14 < Laurenceb_> embedded lunix?
2018-09-12T13:28:32 < jpa-> same old stuff, with nuttx :P
2018-09-12T13:28:51 < zyp> in my case we had unassembled boards, didn't want to redesign
2018-09-12T13:29:58 < kakimir> I need fet with lower or equal Rds(on) with smaller package than AO3401 has
2018-09-12T13:30:03 < kakimir> any ideas?
2018-09-12T13:30:34 < kakimir> http://www.aosmd.com/pdfs/datasheet/AO3401.pdf
2018-09-12T13:30:49 < karlp> I thought that was already a pretty winning fet.
2018-09-12T13:30:53 < kakimir> it's quite a chunk of hardware this
2018-09-12T13:31:17 < karlp> what sort of fet packagexs are you looking at?
2018-09-12T13:31:31 < karlp> and/or hoping to find?
2018-09-12T13:31:33 < jpa-> only a single fet? you can often save a bit of space by using dual fets
2018-09-12T13:31:42 < kakimir> dual would be ideal
2018-09-12T13:32:03 < jpa-> so fire up the digikey, mouser etc. searches
2018-09-12T13:32:08 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-12T13:32:10 < karlp> have you tried looking at AO's own product list?
2018-09-12T13:32:15 < kakimir> let's see
2018-09-12T13:32:53 < kakimir> with dual I could implement 4 shunt levels
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2018-09-12T13:42:50 < kakimir> http://www.aosmd.com/res/data_sheets/AON4805L.pdf
2018-09-12T13:42:51 < kakimir> yjrtr
2018-09-12T13:42:53 < kakimir> there
2018-09-12T13:43:52 < kakimir> that will do
2018-09-12T13:48:38 < Thorn> there're dual N ch mosfets in SO8 with 1/2 Rds(on), e.g. FDS9926A
2018-09-12T13:49:53 < karlp> dual n is kinda different to dual p...
2018-09-12T13:51:10 < karlp> so8 is what, twice the size too?
2018-09-12T13:51:15 < karlp> sot23 was too big.
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2018-09-12T13:53:48 < kakimir> everybody
2018-09-12T14:05:28 < Thorn> I'm using ao3400/3401 as my default small logic level mosfets
2018-09-12T14:06:39 < Thorn> same as irlml2502/6402 etc.
2018-09-12T14:07:28 < Thorn> if you need to switch > 100-200mA and don't want it to get hot
2018-09-12T14:13:51 < karlp> crt read zypsnips :)
2018-09-12T14:14:37 < karlp> https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/fets.loldongs
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2018-09-12T14:23:21 < Thorn> why are there children in his office
2018-09-12T14:24:19 < Steffanx> Why are you in an office with children?
2018-09-12T14:28:27 -!- Laurenceb_ [~laurence@86.111.164.110] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-12T14:31:54 < Thorn> wtf 400 kV https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-DC-3V-6V-bis-400kV-400000V-Boost-Step-up-Power-Module-High-Voltage-Generator/612195_32755013751.html
2018-09-12T14:36:50 < BrainDamage> ebay had those since a coupleof years
2018-09-12T14:36:52 < zyp> reminds me of when I was a kid and me and my dad made an electric "launchpad" for fireworks
2018-09-12T14:36:53 < BrainDamage> "new"
2018-09-12T14:37:03 < zyp> with a neon light transformer to light the fuse
2018-09-12T14:37:46 < BrainDamage> I butchered a piezoelectric gas lighter and wired 2 mains wires to it
2018-09-12T14:38:03 < BrainDamage> worked ok-ish, sometimes took a couple of attempts
2018-09-12T14:46:39 < BrainDamage> crt: australia: https://youtu.be/hRF-pgMWpwQ?t=31
2018-09-12T15:07:30 < day> loldongs is a nice file format
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2018-09-12T16:25:43 < dongs> so uh
2018-09-12T16:25:52 < dongs> how does a nigga use 4bit ETM trace AND swo at same time?
2018-09-12T16:25:53 < dongs> does that work?
2018-09-12T16:27:09 < karlp> you dont, aiui
2018-09-12T16:27:19 < karlp> swo is one bit etm.
2018-09-12T16:30:26 < dongs> not quite but yeah lets see what stdperiph does
2018-09-12T16:30:36 < dongs> if its same register with exclusive bits to do SWO or ETM that would explain things
2018-09-12T16:30:40 < zyp> that was my impression also
2018-09-12T16:31:17 < dongs> where is this even set
2018-09-12T16:31:31 < zyp> by the debugger, presumably
2018-09-12T16:31:41 < dongs> oh hm
2018-09-12T16:31:49 < dongs> cube has a shit to turn on ETM
2018-09-12T16:31:51 < dongs> or SWO
2018-09-12T16:31:53 < dongs> (but not both)
2018-09-12T16:31:58 < dongs> but i realyl dont feel like generating the code...
2018-09-12T16:32:49 < zyp> the way I understand it, you have various modules that can generate trace data, and the data is fed to an output module that can either stream it out via the SWO pin or the trace pins
2018-09-12T16:33:17 < karlp> and swo pin is bit 0 of the trace pins...
2018-09-12T16:33:18 < zyp> doing both at the same time wouldn't make sense unless you could stream different events to each, and I don't think that's possible
2018-09-12T16:34:13 < zyp> if you want to do ITM (e.g. printf trace) along with function tracing or something, I'd expect both to be interleaved over the trace interface
2018-09-12T16:34:14 < karlp> you can send itm trace to the etm formatter though I think,...
2018-09-12T16:34:36 < karlp> you probably just need to turn on the extra wrapper to give it a source id.
2018-09-12T16:35:10 < karlp> you just randomly assign it a tpiu number and it costs you a little bandwidth iirc
2018-09-12T16:40:28 < dongs> < karlp> and swo pin is bit 0 of the trace pins...
2018-09-12T16:40:33 < dongs> actaulyl not on this H7 trash im looking at
2018-09-12T16:40:36 < dongs> SWO is like PB3
2018-09-12T16:40:41 < dongs> and trace 4 bits are on teh corner of the chip
2018-09-12T16:40:49 < dongs> and PB3 is the only AF for SWO
2018-09-12T16:40:58 < dongs> but yeah, whatever, looks like it prints over ETM too
2018-09-12T16:41:02 < dongs> using ITM_SendChar
2018-09-12T16:41:07 < dongs> nothing needs to be done, just works
2018-09-12T16:41:17 < dongs> maybe its keil
2018-09-12T16:41:20 < dongs> being awesome
2018-09-12T16:45:17 < PaulFertser> dongs: so what are you tracing? Some tricky ISR race condition?
2018-09-12T16:46:14 < zyp> don't be so racist
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2018-09-12T16:47:17 < PaulFertser> Yeah, nothing extra needs to be enabled, when you enable trace it implies enabling TPUI formatter and it prepends proper ID to data from ITM automatically.
2018-09-12T16:47:26 < dongs> cool
2018-09-12T16:47:35 < dongs> does "openocd" even do trace?
2018-09-12T16:47:39 < dongs> just curious
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2018-09-12T16:51:27 < PaulFertser> With jlink it currently supports only trace via "async uart" swo. When using external LA you can configure and capture parallel trace though, I think. That's for ARM-v7M only.
2018-09-12T16:52:06 < jpa-> openocd supports configuring tracing, but i think it doesn't do much about decoding the trace data
2018-09-12T16:52:52 < PaulFertser> Indeed, decoding is out of scope for the project.
2018-09-12T16:54:11 < PaulFertser> https://github.com/orbcode/orbuculum is promising in this area
2018-09-12T16:55:35 < zyp> interesting
2018-09-12T16:56:27 < PaulFertser> ice40HX8K is cheap and common, so that makes capturing fast speed parallel trace available to the masses.
2018-09-12T16:56:36 < dongs> what does it turn it into
2018-09-12T16:56:45 < dongs> more paralell?
2018-09-12T16:57:21 < PaulFertser> orbtop looks cool too
2018-09-12T16:57:53 < PaulFertser> dongs: they're providing means to use that ice40 board to capture the parallel trace from cortex-m.
2018-09-12T17:00:08 < dongs> i bet they chose ice40 cuz its opensores 
2018-09-12T17:01:55 < dongs> and the board is probably subsidized
2018-09-12T17:01:57 < dongs> and cheap
2018-09-12T17:03:21 < PaulFertser> Yes, all valid reasons for a cool project.
2018-09-12T17:07:50 < Steffanx> Ice40 open source? Some non-official stuff maybe..
2018-09-12T17:08:06 < dongs> yeah super non-official
2018-09-12T17:08:11 < dongs> and probably buggy/broke
2018-09-12T17:08:14 < dongs> like typiel opensores
2018-09-12T17:08:22 < Steffanx> I love you too, dongs.
2018-09-12T17:08:27 < dongs> amirite or amirite
2018-09-12T17:08:44 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/
2018-09-12T17:09:16 < dongs>  fully open source 
2018-09-12T17:09:18 < Steffanx> Yeah, i was referring to that. 
2018-09-12T17:09:23 < Steffanx> They should do vhdl
2018-09-12T17:10:29 < Steffanx> The official tools are terrible as well dongs
2018-09-12T17:12:12 < dongs> i dont doubt it
2018-09-12T17:12:17 < dongs> but there's one thing about them
2018-09-12T17:12:19 < dongs> they actually wokr :p
2018-09-12T17:15:28 < Steffanx> They do some terrible fuckery with license files
2018-09-12T17:15:47 < Steffanx> Where the license file of family x fucks up the license stuff of abother
2018-09-12T17:15:50 < Steffanx> Another
2018-09-12T17:16:30 < dongs> ever since xilinx shit stopped running on win8 or wahtever i jsut run all fpga trash in a VM anyway
2018-09-12T17:32:45 < dongs> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/09/11/python_purges_master_and_slave_in_political_pogrom/ looooooooooool
2018-09-12T17:32:46 < PaulFertser> "actually work"
2018-09-12T17:33:07 < Cracki> wat
2018-09-12T17:33:24 < Cracki> that's kinkphobic
2018-09-12T17:33:41 < dongs> wait until they find out about I2C and SPI
2018-09-12T17:33:54 < dongs> they';ll found #metoo themselves into their own asses
2018-09-12T17:34:28 < Cracki> they should try inventing a bus protocol that works with CONSENSUS
2018-09-12T17:34:38 < Cracki> helicopter rides for the lot of them
2018-09-12T17:34:51 < PaulFertser> Theregister remembers PATA days and jumpers, heh.
2018-09-12T17:35:00 < Cracki> article pretends slavery was american. it wasn't.
2018-09-12T17:35:30 < Cracki> LOL the one who started the bullshit is, OF COURSE, from redhat
2018-09-12T17:35:49 < Cracki> the fuckfaces should stick to systemd
2018-09-12T17:36:02 < englishman> this not just in: python solves slavery
2018-09-12T17:36:10 < dongs> whats this usbconnect pin
2018-09-12T17:36:27 < zyp> what usbconnect pin?
2018-09-12T17:36:36 < zyp> probably some bullshit to control external pullup
2018-09-12T17:37:39 < PaulFertser> Cracki: "the words remind some people of America's peculiar institution" is that what you call pretends slavery was american?
2018-09-12T17:37:47 < dongs> oh never mind this was some shit leftover from LPC
2018-09-12T17:37:47 < Cracki> yes
2018-09-12T17:37:49 < dongs> dude was stoned
2018-09-12T17:37:58 < Cracki> slavery wasn't *america's* peculiar institution
2018-09-12T17:38:19 < Cracki> they act like the whole world didn't do slavery back then
2018-09-12T17:38:24 < Cracki> retards
2018-09-12T17:38:56 < dongs> I tend to find that when an organisation reaches the point where such things become a consideration rather than, say, concentrating on achieving the product/service they provide, that's the point where things start to go downhill.
2018-09-12T17:38:57 < PaulFertser> Cracki: _some_ people think about America's institution, _some others_ about slavery happening in other countries.
2018-09-12T17:39:00 < dongs> People literally have too much time on their hands if they care about a terminology such as this. What next, blacklist/whitelist being racist? Male/female connectors not including an intersex variant?
2018-09-12T17:39:04 < dongs> Just code the damn thing, nobody's actually bothering to writing code that's both functional and yet subtly racist
2018-09-12T17:39:07 < dongs> ahahahaha
2018-09-12T17:39:18 < PaulFertser> And _some_ do not think about slavery at all when seeing this in programming language context.
2018-09-12T17:39:27 < karlp> re trace: I use orbuculum for the software, even just with stlink and oocd, you don't need their fpga solution to use that software
2018-09-12T17:39:30 < Cracki> whites should be called "Persons of Light"
2018-09-12T17:39:53 < veverak> PaulFertser: I believe that most of them
2018-09-12T17:40:02 < Cracki> most think about kinky shit
2018-09-12T17:41:22 < englishman> i'm offended pay attention to meeeeee
2018-09-12T17:41:32 < PaulFertser> Cracki: of all the people that get reminded of slavery when reading seeing master/slave in Python docs, I'd bet the majority would be thinking about the USA history. So the article doesn't seem to be misguiding in this regard.
2018-09-12T17:42:00 < dongs> imagine a black person writing master python module
2018-09-12T17:42:02 < dongs> mind: blown
2018-09-12T17:42:09 < Cracki> I will not debate sjw insanity
2018-09-12T17:42:19 < dongs> master.py
2018-09-12T17:42:54 < PaulFertser> Cracki: I'm not debating sjw, I'm debating your interpretation of the article ;)
2018-09-12T17:43:15 < karlp> this is far from the firs ttime master/slave has been removed.
2018-09-12T17:43:34 < karlp> mysql replication and backups were changed a few years ago
2018-09-12T17:43:48 < Steffanx> It makes me cry.
2018-09-12T17:43:52 < Steffanx> Stop.
2018-09-12T17:43:57 < dongs> i hope this actually kills python
2018-09-12T17:43:58 < Cracki> the lunatic switched master/slave to terms evocative of terms for practices that exploit the working class... as if that's not a dog whistle to all his commie friends
2018-09-12T17:44:00 < dongs> as a language
2018-09-12T17:44:13 < Cracki> it won't die
2018-09-12T17:44:15 < BrainDamage> you know that ranting about this puts you in the same ballpark, right?
2018-09-12T17:44:22 < Cracki> but maybe they'll strangle the fucktards eventually
2018-09-12T17:44:28 < Cracki> people of light are waking up
2018-09-12T17:44:45 < Steffanx> What would ##stm32 be without the rants BrainDamage ?
2018-09-12T17:46:19 < Steffanx> What i love about it most is:
2018-09-12T17:46:21 < Steffanx> merged 1 commit into python:master
2018-09-12T17:46:51 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-12T17:46:51 < karlp> it's mostly about getting rid of slave, not master.
2018-09-12T17:47:20 < Cracki> removing the concept of "slave" is slave mentality
2018-09-12T17:47:48 < karlp> why aren't we talking about these instead: https://www.st.com/en/evaluation-tools/stm8-mcu-eval-boards.html?querycriteria=productId=LN1644$$1=nucleo*
2018-09-12T17:47:54 < Cracki> they should work on fighting IMPERATIVE programming languages. imperialism is bad, m'kay
2018-09-12T17:48:01 < Cracki> stm8 kek
2018-09-12T17:48:09 < Cracki> go ahead
2018-09-12T17:48:29 < dongs> stm8 is great
2018-09-12T17:48:48 < catphish> great like tooth pain that painkillers have no impact on?
2018-09-12T17:48:52 < karlp> this is the best bit dongs: https://www.st.com/content/ccc/fragment/product_related/rpn_information/board_photo/group1/a2/f1/b8/b2/f8/3a/4c/46/nucleo-8l152r8/files/nucleo-8l152r8.jpg/jcr:content/translations/en.nucleo-8l152r8.jpg
2018-09-12T17:49:01 < karlp> "to work with win10, make sure to wait for the stlink update we haven't done yet"
2018-09-12T17:49:18 < Steffanx> Does keil do stm8?
2018-09-12T17:49:19 < dongs> pfft
2018-09-12T17:49:26 < dongs> Steffanx: no, ST's free STVD does
2018-09-12T17:49:26 < karlp> also, when did nucleos change to microusb?
2018-09-12T17:49:33 < dongs> thy've always been micro?
2018-09-12T17:49:37 < Steffanx> No you have to get this other IDE with commercial french compiler
2018-09-12T17:49:38 < karlp> no.
2018-09-12T17:49:51 < dongs> Steffanx: oh right, STVD + french compiler
2018-09-12T17:50:05 < Steffanx> With a license you get by email, after what it seems, verified by hand
2018-09-12T17:50:10 < Steffanx> -_-
2018-09-12T17:50:10 < dongs> correct
2018-09-12T17:50:21 < dongs> submit when its morning in france, and all is good
2018-09-12T17:50:49 < catphish> zyp: remind me, how did you tune your antenna? my reader seems to work great but when i try to use tag detection mode it's garbage :(
2018-09-12T17:51:04 < Steffanx> He used a vna catphish 
2018-09-12T17:51:14 < Steffanx> And changed the capacitance
2018-09-12T17:51:20 < Steffanx> Sorry, my name isnt zyp
2018-09-12T17:51:56 < englishman> karlp: fuck yeah, modern stm8 devboards
2018-09-12T17:51:58 < catphish> Steffanx: that's true, it's not, but i recall him mentioning that
2018-09-12T17:52:00 < catphish> sounds expensive
2018-09-12T17:52:43 < englishman> minivna is $500 or something
2018-09-12T17:52:48 < englishman> a great investment
2018-09-12T17:54:23 < catphish> 350 of my british pounds for the "tiny" version
2018-09-12T17:55:06 < englishman> i thought you said you were a well paid and funded person
2018-09-12T17:55:27 < englishman> you should have already added to cart
2018-09-12T17:55:43 < catphish> paid yes, funded rarely
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2018-09-12T17:56:19 < catphish> i still consider it toys until i have a working product :)
2018-09-12T17:56:23 < englishman> kicad, dcf77, not buying the cheapest vna that exists because it is too expensive
2018-09-12T17:56:26 < Steffanx> catphish != tct, englishman 
2018-09-12T17:56:38 < englishman> this is never going to be an actual product at this rate
2018-09-12T17:56:48 < Steffanx> The negativity.
2018-09-12T17:56:51 < englishman> the reality.
2018-09-12T17:57:18 < catphish> i don't think dcf77 costs money
2018-09-12T17:57:21 < Steffanx> Where is your ferrari?
2018-09-12T17:57:26 < catphish> nor do any of its competitors
2018-09-12T17:57:31 < englishman> i would never buy that trash
2018-09-12T17:57:50 < Steffanx> Status is important for the rich.
2018-09-12T17:58:11 < Steffanx> You need at least 5 fancy cars
2018-09-12T17:58:16 < catphish> lol
2018-09-12T17:58:17 < englishman> status is important for the vain
2018-09-12T17:59:18 -!- stukdev [~quassel@unaffiliated/stukdev] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
2018-09-12T17:59:27 < catphish> but yeah, my background is in software, the tools are essentially free, spending money on tools for high risk projects is simply not a concept we're comfortable with
2018-09-12T17:59:38 < Steffanx> Yet.
2018-09-12T18:00:02 < catphish> should a time come when we're sccessfully delivering electronics projects, i'm sure that'll change
2018-09-12T18:00:02 < Cracki> these tools don't cost money because someone is greedy. they cost money because they're worth it.
2018-09-12T18:00:16 < Steffanx> Lets find englishman's first eagle project on the web
2018-09-12T18:00:16 < englishman> the first true thing that Cracki has ever said in this chan
2018-09-12T18:00:25 < Cracki> I am offended
2018-09-12T18:00:31 < catphish> but as long as it's an experimental side project, i will continue to be tight
2018-09-12T18:00:41 < Cracki> your english police is very interested in offensive speech
2018-09-12T18:00:54 < englishman> Steffanx: does not exist. in diptrace there is likely a lot
2018-09-12T18:01:02 < Steffanx> The freeware?
2018-09-12T18:01:18 < englishman> yes until i scammed the educational version
2018-09-12T18:01:25 < Cracki> often, these tools are bought because you can't do the work with less
2018-09-12T18:01:37 < englishman> the minivna i bought for hobbies
2018-09-12T18:02:42 < catphish> i might have to try eagle, if only so i can stop listening to people moan that i use kicad
2018-09-12T18:02:54 < catphish> plus it appears to be free for my requirements
2018-09-12T18:03:03 < Steffanx> Diptrace ?
2018-09-12T18:03:16 < dongs> kikecad to eagle isnt an upgradee lol
2018-09-12T18:03:43 < Steffanx> Diptrace is ##stm32 approved.
2018-09-12T18:03:49 < englishman> im using it today
2018-09-12T18:03:57 < Steffanx> Dont die.
2018-09-12T18:04:03 < karlp> catphish: ignore the haters on kicad.
2018-09-12T18:04:17 < englishman> yes stick your fingers in your ears and go la la la
2018-09-12T18:04:23 < catphish> tbh it works pretty well for me, a couple of routing features lacking, but it works
2018-09-12T18:04:23 < Steffanx> Ignore the haters*
2018-09-12T18:04:28 < englishman> most opensource devs do
2018-09-12T18:04:35 < dongs> the linux way of life
2018-09-12T18:04:39 < dongs>  /ignore constructive feedback
2018-09-12T18:04:43 < dongs> ive seen it on irc millions of times
2018-09-12T18:04:53 < karlp> when the only sertious alternative is altium for x grand a year? yeah, 
2018-09-12T18:04:59 < Steffanx> I like how many of you actually depend on the stuff  they hate so kuch
2018-09-12T18:05:01 < Steffanx> Much
2018-09-12T18:05:14 < dongs> i depend on lunix???
2018-09-12T18:05:16 < dongs> do tell
2018-09-12T18:05:18 < Steffanx> You*
2018-09-12T18:05:39 < Steffanx> Your irssi runs on windows?
2018-09-12T18:05:57 < dongs> i don't think i depend on chat
2018-09-12T18:06:04 < dongs> when i'm actually dickstarting im hardly even here
2018-09-12T18:06:34 < Steffanx> Hows your windows or iphone doing?
2018-09-12T18:06:47 < Steffanx> Windows phone*
2018-09-12T18:07:35 < catphish> wow eagle routing is cool, it'll move things out of your way
2018-09-12T18:07:49 < karlp> doesn't kicad have that too?
2018-09-12T18:07:52 < catphish> no
2018-09-12T18:07:59 < Steffanx> Yes
2018-09-12T18:08:14 < catphish> maybe i've never turned it on
2018-09-12T18:08:26 < Steffanx> Its what cern added iirc
2018-09-12T18:09:20 < catphish> looks like it does! i really should try that
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2018-09-12T18:09:50 < dongs> lol push n shove routing yeah thats old news
2018-09-12T18:10:05 < dongs> happy to see opensores are on the leading edge of technology
2018-09-12T18:10:34 < veverak> there is one thing that bothers me here
2018-09-12T18:10:42 < dongs> in this channel? just one thing?
2018-09-12T18:10:53 < veverak> dongs: how do you express yourself when something is actually a piece of shit?
2018-09-12T18:10:59 < veverak> I mean, you say that about something every other sentence
2018-09-12T18:11:03 < veverak> hence the words lose their ... meaning :)
2018-09-12T18:11:15 < dongs> well, i could probly talk all night about you
2018-09-12T18:12:36 < veverak> or ... nah, I know people that do this rarely , so when they do it has some meaning ,with the guys that do that every other sentence I usually end up ignoring them in that matter ...
2018-09-12T18:12:56 < dongs> feel free! you'll be the 2nd irc'er after Fleck to ignore me
2018-09-12T18:13:00 < dongs> you won't miss anything at all
2018-09-12T18:13:19 < dongs> getting ignored on irc is like achievement unlocked feeling
2018-09-12T18:13:25 < veverak> lo
2018-09-12T18:13:27 < veverak> l
2018-09-12T18:13:29 < veverak> :)
2018-09-12T18:13:53 < dongs> i'll go to mom and be like "omg this chatter ignored me, what can i doooooooooooooooooooo"
2018-09-12T18:14:13 < veverak> dongs: I said that only in the 'curse' matter, meaning that my brain will translate your sentence "Technology X is pece of shit!" to "Technology X is"
2018-09-12T18:14:15 < veverak> hmm
2018-09-12T18:14:26 < veverak> yeah, I think that is what usually happens
2018-09-12T18:14:34 < dongs> a large portion of technology IS fucking garbage
2018-09-12T18:14:46 < dongs> i mean this is why Internet of Shit exists
2018-09-12T18:15:09 < veverak> yeah
2018-09-12T18:15:09 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-12T18:15:27 < veverak> it's human made, what do you expect? :)
2018-09-12T18:16:16 < dongs> ABOUT THIS GROUP
2018-09-12T18:16:17 < dongs> The aim of this group is to share experience and get help on the STM23 microcontrollers.
2018-09-12T18:16:22 < dongs> 1,205 members
2018-09-12T18:20:07 < catphish> gotta get this new setup laid out: https://nutty.tk/nfc11.pdf
2018-09-12T18:20:18 < catphish> and tune the antenna :(
2018-09-12T18:20:40 < dongs> so youdumped DCF77 shit and switched to gps?
2018-09-12T18:20:47 < catphish> most likely yes
2018-09-12T18:20:52 < PaulFertser> veverak: don't you have that feeling that most things around you are irrecoverably shitty, one way or the other?..
2018-09-12T18:22:33 < dongs> i hacev that feeling whenever I join #stonertronics
2018-09-12T18:22:41 < PaulFertser> And you can't do anything about it, as even your best efforts provide only marginally improvements considering the whole picture?
2018-09-12T18:22:47 < dongs> irrecoverably shitty, i fucking like that
2018-09-12T18:22:57 < catphish> i think everything's pretty great
2018-09-12T18:22:58 < veverak> PaulFertser: I know it
2018-09-12T18:23:09 < veverak> I do not let it affect my feelings
2018-09-12T18:23:38 < veverak> And just focus on making better as that makes me feel good
2018-09-12T18:25:21 < sync> > 2018
2018-09-12T18:25:23 < sync> > feeling good
2018-09-12T18:27:16 < veverak> PaulFertser: to put it simply: why the fuck the fact that people are assholes should made _my_ day any worse? :)
2018-09-12T18:28:17 < PaulFertser> veverak: you often depend on people like that, that's why.
2018-09-12T18:52:59 < kakimir> chess night today?
2018-09-12T18:53:11 < kakimir> not now but in few hours
2018-09-12T18:59:13 < Steffanx> Nein kakimir 
2018-09-12T18:59:57 < kakimir> oh stef
2018-09-12T19:00:20 < kakimir> we will play
2018-09-12T19:02:01 -!- drzacek [~drzacek@b941c009.business.dg-w.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-12T19:07:14 < Steffanx> No i dont chess
2018-09-12T19:07:53 < Steffanx> I mean: its a lost game before we've startes
2018-09-12T19:08:02 -!- stukdev_ [~quassel@host179-9-static.10-188-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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2018-09-12T19:17:04 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-12T19:17:10 < kakimir> it's not even fun then
2018-09-12T19:20:49 < jadew> https://www.theverge.com/2018/9/12/17849868/eu-internet-copyright-reform-article-11-13-approved
2018-09-12T19:23:40 < PaulFertser> So, EUers, what do you think about DST? Do you want to cancel it in your country?
2018-09-12T19:23:52 < dongs> daylight savings time?
2018-09-12T19:24:09 < dongs> japan is way ahead of everyone by not even having it
2018-09-12T19:24:12 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-12T19:24:50 < jadew> PaulFertser, yeah, I don't want it
2018-09-12T19:25:17 < Steffanx> Yes. Get rid of it PaulFertser 
2018-09-12T19:25:26 < Steffanx> Im not sure about what time to keep
2018-09-12T19:26:57 < PaulFertser> Is there any scientific evidence to support this notion?
2018-09-12T19:27:18 < jadew> what notion?
2018-09-12T19:27:24 < PaulFertser> That DST is bad.
2018-09-12T19:27:42 < jadew> it was introduced for reasons that no longer apply
2018-09-12T19:27:55 < PaulFertser> I personally have experience living both with and without for years. And I'd prefer with. But that's not supported by anything substantial either.
2018-09-12T19:27:57 < jadew> also, our biological clock always gets messed up by the change
2018-09-12T19:28:04 < jadew> I think that's reason enough to get rid of it
2018-09-12T19:28:35 < PaulFertser> I do not like waking up while it's still dark.
2018-09-12T19:29:12 < Steffanx> But.. in even with winter time i wake up in the dark
2018-09-12T19:29:41 < jadew> PaulFertser, there's no way around it
2018-09-12T19:29:44 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-12T19:29:56 < jadew> it's not that the morning starts later, the entire day part gets shorter
2018-09-12T19:30:07 < jadew> so you get both more dark in the morning and more dark in the night
2018-09-12T19:30:22 < jadew> if we didn't have clocks, you'd still wake up at the same time, in the dark
2018-09-12T19:30:25 < PaulFertser> What if normal time is shifted in a way to allow me not to wake up in the dark? And to not waste the daylight in the summer add DST to that?
2018-09-12T19:30:32 < jadew> because you'd be awake for about the same number of hours
2018-09-12T19:30:48 < jadew> but you're not wasting daylight
2018-09-12T19:30:48 < PaulFertser> I agree to spend more of the day in the dark. But at the end of the day.
2018-09-12T19:31:00 < jadew> so talk to your employer :)
2018-09-12T19:31:50 < jadew> you could have a clause in your contract: start hour: 100 lumens + 1h, end hour, 100 lumens + 9h
2018-09-12T19:32:28 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-12T19:32:34 < Steffanx> 9h?!
2018-09-12T19:32:42 < Steffanx> 7H
2018-09-12T19:32:55 < jadew> for an 8h work-day
2018-09-12T19:32:57 < Steffanx> 6 hour work days are the best
2018-09-12T19:33:07 < PaulFertser> jadew: yeah, well, that would work if I wasn't needed by other people there.
2018-09-12T19:33:44 < Steffanx> did they make you that important PaulFertser /
2018-09-12T19:34:29 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: when I was lecturing few years ago it kinda was important to arrive on time, yes.
2018-09-12T19:34:39 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-12T19:34:48 < jadew> not important enough tho, otherwise everyone would make their schedule after PaulFertser's sleep pattern
2018-09-12T19:35:29 < PaulFertser> Indeed
2018-09-12T19:35:55 < Steffanx> Russia doesnt do dst PaulFertser ?
2018-09-12T19:36:06 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: for like 5 years
2018-09-12T19:36:29 < Steffanx> Did all your clock based tools break?
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2018-09-12T19:37:34 < jadew> they only have mechanical clocks, so nothing happened
2018-09-12T19:37:53 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-12T19:38:17 < dongs> mechanical cocks
2018-09-12T19:38:40 < jadew> PaulFertser, you could talk to your employer and propose they follow DST
2018-09-12T19:39:15 < PaulFertser> jadew: last winter I was mostly not going to work at all so meh.
2018-09-12T19:39:23 < jadew> I get what you're saying and I'd probably be ok with it
2018-09-12T19:40:05 < jadew> ah, I thought the reason it bothered you was because you had to go to work during the night
2018-09-12T19:41:09 -!- sterna [~Adium@h-90-120.A137.corp.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-12T19:42:39 < jadew> PaulFertser, are people generally happy with the change?
2018-09-12T19:43:16 < PaulFertser> jadew: idk, I guess they just do not care as there's plenty of other more important issues.
2018-09-12T19:43:44 < jadew> I'd care
2018-09-12T19:44:24 < jadew> in fact, I'd celebrate every year when we would have had to switch to summer time
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2018-09-12T20:02:21 < Steffanx> That's one issue with the EU btw PaulFertser . People have no clue whats going on
2018-09-12T20:02:48 < Steffanx> @ linky
2018-09-12T20:06:17 -!- Laurenceb [~laurence@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
2018-09-12T20:07:17 < dongs> wow tim cooks hands are shaking
2018-09-12T20:07:20 < dongs> badly
2018-09-12T20:07:20 < dongs> lol
2018-09-12T20:09:08 < Steffanx> oh is it taht time of the year again
2018-09-12T20:09:37 < dongs> ya
2018-09-12T20:10:58 < Steffanx> Needs moar applaus.
2018-09-12T20:13:23 < dongs> stocks and heart rate
2018-09-12T20:13:26 < dongs> yeah, thats totally related
2018-09-12T20:14:27 < karlp> oh noes, gae2018q2 is 4bytes bigger than 2017q4
2018-09-12T20:14:59 < Steffanx> "GCC" right?
2018-09-12T20:15:34 < karlp> on another project it's like ~200 bytes bigger!
2018-09-12T20:15:54 < Steffanx> Isnt it bad that eventhough dongs didnt comment yet, i "see" what he would say?
2018-09-12T20:16:17 < invzim> PROS..  MULTICORE / LOCTITE solder wire any good?  Need something beefier than 0.8mm, and farnell doesn't have the usual kester stuff I use in stock
2018-09-12T20:16:30 < invzim> pth stuff..
2018-09-12T20:18:03 < dongs> wow, apple watch can detect a fall
2018-09-12T20:18:11 < dongs> a m a z e
2018-09-12T20:18:20 < dongs> because... accelerometers havent been doing this
2018-09-12T20:18:21 < dongs> for years
2018-09-12T20:19:07 < englishman> will it move the write head off its internal hard drive
2018-09-12T20:19:17 < dongs> no it will call 911 for you
2018-09-12T20:19:27 < dongs> <applause>
2018-09-12T20:19:27 < englishman> if you drop your watch
2018-09-12T20:19:29 < dongs> fucking faggots.
2018-09-12T20:19:30 < dongs> god damn
2018-09-12T20:19:55 < Steffanx> Are you being away for this mr dongs?
2018-09-12T20:19:59 < Steffanx> *awake
2018-09-12T20:20:00 < Steffanx> damnit
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2018-09-12T20:20:12 < dongs> i wanted to sleep but i lazied out
2018-09-12T20:20:14 < dongs> and then it was time
2018-09-12T20:23:02 < dongs> why the fuck are tehy adding all this shit
2018-09-12T20:23:08 < dongs> are they planning all apple users to like die or something
2018-09-12T20:24:28 -!- Laurenceb [~laurence@tae100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-12T20:24:41 < dongs> fibriwhatthefuck
2018-09-12T20:25:06 < invzim> too bad I don't wear a watch
2018-09-12T20:25:11 < dongs> how about: dont eat 5 american-sized meals a day
2018-09-12T20:25:21 < dongs> then you don't need a crapple watch
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2018-09-12T20:28:36 < dongs> lol 18 hour battery life
2018-09-12T20:29:32 < dongs> why do they redesign and reingeneer everything every year
2018-09-12T20:29:53 < kakimir> what?
2018-09-12T20:31:54 < dongs> fucking gay
2018-09-12T20:32:01 < kakimir> what is concidered high enough voltage in VBUS in DCP mode?
2018-09-12T20:32:07 < kakimir> that should be maintained
2018-09-12T20:32:35 < aandrew> who's the dude presenting?
2018-09-12T20:32:36 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@2a02:8070:a19d:2500:9da2:5265:4862:c608] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-12T20:32:38 < aandrew> just tuned in
2018-09-12T20:32:52 < dongs> some faggot
2018-09-12T20:32:55 < dongs> jeffa or something
2018-09-12T20:33:08 < aandrew> I just want to see if they'll release a laptop worth buying
2018-09-12T20:33:14 < dongs> not on this event
2018-09-12T20:33:25 < aandrew> oh, closing the window then I guess
2018-09-12T20:33:46 < dongs> 500 bucks lol
2018-09-12T20:33:53 < dongs> and you NEED an ifaggot to use it
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2018-09-12T20:34:19 < aandrew> I have an apple watch, it is actually useful
2018-09-12T20:34:24 < dongs> youre a faggot
2018-09-12T20:34:27 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-12T20:34:28 < dongs> so no surprise there
2018-09-12T20:34:38 < dongs> i have a dumb watch, its great
2018-09-12T20:34:45 < aandrew> I had one, never wore it
2018-09-12T20:35:05 < dongs> oh another fucking faggot video
2018-09-12T20:35:07 < aandrew> what I actually use it for is notifications. phone is always nowhere I cna see/hear it
2018-09-12T20:35:26 < aandrew> the sleep tracking bit is useful too, but the rest of the garbage? bleh
2018-09-12T20:35:48 < dongs> nice diversity
2018-09-12T20:35:49 < dongs> holy shit
2018-09-12T20:35:59 < dongs> i think they're including every type of nigger in this shit
2018-09-12T20:36:26 < aandrew> wtf was that stupid video
2018-09-12T20:37:19 < dongs> ~innovative technologies~
2018-09-12T20:37:20 < dongs> haha
2018-09-12T20:37:24 < dongs> what a fucking faggot
2018-09-12T20:37:33 < dongs> isn't huawei #1
2018-09-12T20:37:36 < dongs> not a pple lol
2018-09-12T20:37:49 < dongs> 98% satisfaction, once a faggot always a faggot
2018-09-12T20:38:11 < dongs> the most advanced ipohone we have EVER created haha
2018-09-12T20:38:37 < dongs> oh did they lose the notch
2018-09-12T20:39:11 < aandrew> isn't EVERY phone the most advanced phone a company has made?
2018-09-12T20:39:13 < dongs> 10 ass
2018-09-12T20:39:26 < aandrew> heh all about diversity yet every single speaker is an old white guy
2018-09-12T20:39:31 < dongs> oh there's the notch
2018-09-12T20:39:53 < markus-k> but its the most advanced notch on the market
2018-09-12T20:40:03 < aandrew> lol
2018-09-12T20:40:18 < aandrew> that's not a bad rating
2018-09-12T20:40:34 < aandrew> that's one thing sony had for a while was waterproof too
2018-09-12T20:40:44 < dongs> ~super retina~ haha 
2018-09-12T20:40:52 < dongs> "on an ios device"
2018-09-12T20:40:55 < dongs> i'm glad he clarified that
2018-09-12T20:41:26 < dongs> fucking notch everywhere lol
2018-09-12T20:41:35 < aandrew> yeah that notch is so fucking stupid
2018-09-12T20:41:55 < aandrew> hahaha they have to keep making phablets
2018-09-12T20:42:31 < dongs> haha Max
2018-09-12T20:42:33 < dongs> fucking gay
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2018-09-12T20:42:49 < aandrew> hahaha cinematic
2018-09-12T20:42:56 < dongs> rite?
2018-09-12T20:42:59 < dongs> more like faggotmatic
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2018-09-12T20:52:16 < dongs> ok this is actally fucking boring
2018-09-12T20:52:18 < dongs> lol siri
2018-09-12T20:53:46 < dongs> 'turn your surroundings into aquarium'
2018-09-12T20:53:49 < englishman> just what i always wanted
2018-09-12T20:53:50 < dongs> fuck yes just what i wanted to do
2018-09-12T20:54:06 -!- Laurenceb_ [~laurence@86.111.164.110] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-12T20:54:27  * emeb longs for a "neural engine" in every appliance.
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2018-09-12T20:55:27 < dongs> what are they gonna show, fallout shelter?
2018-09-12T20:55:34 < dongs> fucking fags
2018-09-12T20:55:45 -!- Laurenceb [~laurence@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-12T20:56:05 < dongs> oh fucking stoner scrolls
2018-09-12T20:56:06 < dongs> garbage
2018-09-12T20:57:11 < dongs> goatse widening
2018-09-12T20:58:07 < englishman> are they showing off a 7 year old game
2018-09-12T20:58:25 < dongs> the game looks retarded as hell
2018-09-12T20:59:27 < dongs> > basketball training
2018-09-12T20:59:29 < dongs> w h a t
2018-09-12T20:59:43 < dongs> niggers can't afford an iphone x superShitty
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2018-09-12T21:00:50 < dongs> why is this even needed???
2018-09-12T21:01:14 < qyx> what are you commenting on
2018-09-12T21:01:23 < qyx> apples business?
2018-09-12T21:02:10 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-12T21:03:34 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/6Zx6q74.png
2018-09-12T21:03:36 < englishman> hhrrrnnggg
2018-09-12T21:03:38 < englishman> government website
2018-09-12T21:03:49 < aandrew> englishman: lol
2018-09-12T21:03:58 < dongs> canada government
2018-09-12T21:04:20 < aandrew> stereo widening was around on the old GUS MAX
2018-09-12T21:08:13 -!- Laurenceb [~laurence@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-12T21:08:30 < dongs> facial landmarking and segregation
2018-09-12T21:13:32 < dongs> did apple reinvent blurring
2018-09-12T21:13:44 < dongs> or am i missing somehting
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2018-09-12T21:15:02 < englishman> wasnt there a dickstarter camera that did that
2018-09-12T21:15:35 < englishman> Lytro
2018-09-12T21:15:39 < englishman> didnt you buy one
2018-09-12T21:16:25 < dongs> 30minutes more haha
2018-09-12T21:16:32 < englishman> Lytro ceased operations in early 2018.
2018-09-12T21:16:40 < englishman> In June 2011, Apple Inc CEO Steve Jobs purportedly met with Ng to discuss improvements for the iPhone camera.
2018-09-12T21:17:11 < englishman> HTC One (M8) mobile phone released in April 2014 mimics Lytro's depth-sensing functionality through the use of a second camera and stereoscopic post processing.
2018-09-12T21:17:35 < dongs> wow apple invented dual sim
2018-09-12T21:18:07 < dongs> yes
2018-09-12T21:18:35 < mawk> by invented you mean patented ?
2018-09-12T21:20:39 < Steffanx> imagine you live in a country where it's 4:20.
2018-09-12T21:21:21 < dongs> i have never in my life made a 'facetime video call'
2018-09-12T21:21:23 < kakimir> hello curt
2018-09-12T21:21:41 < kakimir> apple dual sim
2018-09-12T21:21:45 < kakimir> bullshit
2018-09-12T21:21:45 < Steffanx> no
2018-09-12T21:21:48 < Steffanx> fuck rigol
2018-09-12T21:21:59 < kakimir> rigol sucks
2018-09-12T21:22:03 < dongs> riglol
2018-09-12T21:22:07 < kakimir> I have 2
2018-09-12T21:22:18 < Steffanx> wanna buy my rigol crt ?
2018-09-12T21:22:23 < kakimir> both suck but kinda get work done
2018-09-12T21:25:21 < Steffanx> imho 800x480 might be a bit low 
2018-09-12T21:26:00 < dongs> ONE MORE IPHONE
2018-09-12T21:26:18 < dongs> iphone ghetto max
2018-09-12T21:27:12 < dongs> AEROSPACE GRADE ALUMINUM
2018-09-12T21:27:15 < dongs> ahah is this an apple dickstarter
2018-09-12T21:27:42 < kakimir> I would still buy rigol though
2018-09-12T21:28:01 < Steffanx> dongs: Hi! It looks like you're engaging in activity not directly related to STM32. May I suggest you tweet about it instead? Or perhaps make a stumble.upon? Or even better, just /msg ohsix directly? Thank you!
2018-09-12T21:28:29 < kakimir> because bang for the buck
2018-09-12T21:28:31 < dongs> ahahaha 720p panel
2018-09-12T21:28:37 < dongs> on a 2018 Q4 phone
2018-09-12T21:28:38 < dongs> l m a o
2018-09-12T21:28:42 < englishman> riglol is great
2018-09-12T21:28:45 < englishman> why you gotta hate
2018-09-12T21:28:54 < englishman> wait 720p really
2018-09-12T21:28:57 < dongs> yes
2018-09-12T21:29:02 < dongs> 1792x820 lol
2018-09-12T21:29:22 < englishman> it better be $69
2018-09-12T21:29:59 < englishman> 1792x828
2018-09-12T21:30:40 < englishman> its gonna be $600
2018-09-12T21:30:50 < dongs> they havent even announced prices
2018-09-12T21:30:53 < dongs> for any of the shit
2018-09-12T21:32:23 < englishman> guess it doesnt matter
2018-09-12T21:32:46 < dongs> retards are gonna buy it anyway
2018-09-12T21:33:15 < englishman> im 3d printing parts for the leaf cells
2018-09-12T21:33:31 < dongs> what is this fucking hour and a half more shit
2018-09-12T21:33:39 < dongs> is it so embarassing they cant tell how long it lasts
2018-09-12T21:33:46 < dongs> is ifag8 like 8 hours battery
2018-09-12T21:33:47 < englishman> isnt there typically an awkward music show
2018-09-12T21:36:53 < aandrew> altium, wtf. I can't have a repeat for a sheet starting at zero
2018-09-12T21:37:03 < aandrew> so that means all my fucking buses must also start from 1
2018-09-12T21:37:06 < aandrew> so stupid
2018-09-12T21:38:01 < Steffanx> Arrays start at 1 you know.
2018-09-12T21:38:10 < Steffanx> fuck you sw engineer.
2018-09-12T21:39:09 < dongs> The iPhone XR comes in 6finishes, at 64, 128 and 256GB starting at $749
2018-09-12T21:39:10 < dongs> l o l
2018-09-12T21:39:14 < dongs> jesus
2018-09-12T21:39:21 < dongs> how much is the ifaggot X[ASS] then
2018-09-12T21:39:46 < dongs> The iPhone XS in 64GB, 256GB and 512GB starting at $999 and the XS Max starting at $1099
2018-09-12T21:39:49 < dongs> ahahhahaha
2018-09-12T21:39:53 < dongs> f u c k o f f
2018-09-12T21:39:55 < Steffanx> dongs: Hi! It looks like you're engaging in activity not directly related to STM32. May I suggest you tweet about it instead? Or perhaps make a stumble.upon? Or even better, just /msg ohsix directly? Thank you!
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2018-09-12T21:40:39 < Steffanx> welcome Laurenceb. Better enjoy watching dongs sperging over the new apple gadgets.
2018-09-12T21:41:36 < dongs> Tim's got a boner
2018-09-12T21:41:54 < dongs> ok bedtime
2018-09-12T21:42:09 < englishman> is XR the 720p one
2018-09-12T21:42:15 < englishman> $750
2018-09-12T21:42:16 < englishman> wow
2018-09-12T21:43:36 < aandrew> love how colour schemes are big news
2018-09-12T21:53:03 < Steffanx> akker
2018-09-12T22:08:10 < Steffanx> is it over?
2018-09-12T22:19:58 < Steffanx> lol 1.6k euro for a phone.
2018-09-12T22:24:27 < friendofafriend> That's great fun.
2018-09-12T22:24:35 < englishman> digikey ruler thread gauge to the rescue
2018-09-12T22:25:09 < englishman> (it's M6x1)
2018-09-12T22:28:15 < Steffanx> ty
2018-09-12T22:29:51 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/XcoCVGFX
2018-09-12T22:40:13 < kakimir> canceled
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2018-09-12T22:48:59 < Steffanx> awh
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2018-09-12T22:57:25 < Steffanx> movie recommendation kakimir : https://www.imdb.com/title/tt8235966/
2018-09-12T23:05:59 < Lux> so bad it's good again ?
2018-09-12T23:06:34 < Lux> https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6499752/
2018-09-12T23:06:40 < Lux> can recommend this
2018-09-12T23:06:52 < Steffanx> yeah, me too
2018-09-12T23:06:57 < Lux> best you don't watch the trailer, as it contains spoilers imo
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--- Day changed Thu Sep 13 2018
2018-09-13T00:00:12 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, 
2018-09-13T00:01:27 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-13T00:04:06 < Steffanx> tomeaton17,
2018-09-13T00:04:36 < englishman> dicktrace has this cool thing where it searches for 3d models and fits them to footprints automagically
2018-09-13T00:04:42 < englishman> diptrace > altium
2018-09-13T00:04:45 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, how are you
2018-09-13T00:04:50 < tomeaton17> englishman, nice meme
2018-09-13T00:04:53 < Steffanx> Good me eaton
2018-09-13T00:04:55 < Steffanx> Mr*
2018-09-13T00:04:57 < kakimir> time to watch movie
2018-09-13T00:05:00 < englishman> no meme
2018-09-13T00:05:03 < Steffanx> There?
2018-09-13T00:05:17 < kakimir> or is it Steffanx vs. kakimir 
2018-09-13T00:05:20 < Steffanx> No
2018-09-13T00:05:31 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, glad to hear. nice evening
2018-09-13T00:06:16 < Steffanx> And how was your day mr eaton?
2018-09-13T00:06:32 < Steffanx> Are you 18 yet?
2018-09-13T00:06:53 < tomeaton17> I was alright. I saw my father.
2018-09-13T00:07:01 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, I have been 18 for a while
2018-09-13T00:07:57 < Steffanx> Seeing your father is a special thing? Or was it your father in heaven. Aka church visit.
2018-09-13T00:08:14 < tomeaton17> well  my parents are divorced so yeah
2018-09-13T00:09:18 < tomeaton17> but thanks for taking me seriously Steffanx.
2018-09-13T00:09:27 < Steffanx> Englishman dont you just add the 3d model to your foot print? Would it really be faster to do that automagically?
2018-09-13T00:09:42 < Steffanx> Your welcome tomeaton17
2018-09-13T00:09:46 < englishman> yeah, diptrace does that part automatically
2018-09-13T00:09:57 < tomeaton17> s/your/you're
2018-09-13T00:10:08 < Steffanx> Yes youre.
2018-09-13T00:10:09 < englishman> as soon as you click "3d model" it is already there and correctly oriented and offset
2018-09-13T00:10:14 < tomeaton17> k
2018-09-13T00:10:24 < tomeaton17> stop trolling my age
2018-09-13T00:11:08 < Steffanx> Would be perfect if it also downloaded it automagically englishman. THAT would save time
2018-09-13T00:11:20 < englishman> yes that would be far too easy
2018-09-13T00:11:30 < englishman> fucking keystone requires manual authentication
2018-09-13T00:11:33 < englishman> of your name and email
2018-09-13T00:11:34 < englishman> fuck. off.
2018-09-13T00:11:54 < BrainDamage> better than DNS
2018-09-13T00:13:00 < englishman> Las Vegas professor shot himself in arm to protest Trump
2018-09-13T00:13:08 < englishman> orange man is bad! grrr!
2018-09-13T00:13:31 < BrainDamage> well, you heard about him, it worked
2018-09-13T00:13:36 < tomeaton17> drumpf is bad haha
2018-09-13T00:13:56 < Steffanx> President Eaton. Sounds nice uh?
2018-09-13T00:14:04 < englishman> Tomothy
2018-09-13T00:14:09 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@2a02:8070:a19d:2500:e405:7ee4:8e5c:750d] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-13T00:14:13 < tomeaton17> https://i.redd.it/vxxii1ei6sl11.jpg
2018-09-13T00:14:27 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, would prefer prime minister
2018-09-13T00:21:15 < Steffanx> Got a spot in front of local apple store reserved yet, tomeaton17 ?
2018-09-13T00:21:44 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, I am not a hipster please..
2018-09-13T00:22:55 < jadew> tomeaton17, that's not entirely true
2018-09-13T00:23:01 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-13T00:23:16 < tomeaton17> jadew, please give examples
2018-09-13T00:23:26 < jadew> I was talking about what the yellow girl is saying
2018-09-13T00:23:35 < Steffanx> -_-
2018-09-13T00:23:48 < tomeaton17> ok
2018-09-13T00:23:51 < jadew> tomeaton17, I'd like to start with this: https://youtu.be/cN1DICOnxCs?t=158 (only the first couple of seconds)
2018-09-13T00:24:18 < tomeaton17> i like the clothing jadew 
2018-09-13T00:24:21 < jadew> and I'm going to continue by saying that gay people do marry other sexes
2018-09-13T00:24:28 < tomeaton17> but what is the relation to tomeaton17
2018-09-13T00:24:31 < jadew> tomeaton17, what I'm showing you is not the clothing tho
2018-09-13T00:24:51 < tomeaton17> oh ok I got distracted jadew
2018-09-13T00:25:02 < jadew> not distracted enough
2018-09-13T00:25:11 < jadew> the commenter who found that timestamp said "I think I see it"
2018-09-13T00:25:14 < Steffanx> Boobies, tomeaton17 ?
2018-09-13T00:25:35 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, yes I like those.
2018-09-13T00:26:41 < jadew> so yeah.. they don't rely entirely on straight people
2018-09-13T00:27:34 < Steffanx> Im curious about that printer
2018-09-13T00:27:44 < tomeaton17> yeah they rely on lesbians also jadew
2018-09-13T00:27:47 < jadew> which printer is that?
2018-09-13T00:28:06 < jadew> ah, that's a new printer from creality?
2018-09-13T00:28:10 < Steffanx> Yes
2018-09-13T00:28:21 < englishman> wtf
2018-09-13T00:28:24 < englishman> blocked by digikey
2018-09-13T00:28:38 < tomeaton17> ok
2018-09-13T00:28:40 < jadew> looks nice indeed
2018-09-13T00:28:43 < jadew> very compact
2018-09-13T00:28:57 < Steffanx> ARROW it is then mr english
2018-09-13T00:29:04 < englishman> :((((((((((((
2018-09-13T00:29:27 < tomeaton17> what about mouser
2018-09-13T00:30:03 < jadew> nobody mentions farnell around here
2018-09-13T00:30:06 < jadew> why is that?
2018-09-13T00:30:21 < tomeaton17> expensive
2018-09-13T00:30:22 -!- bitmask [~bitmask@pool-100-35-64-150.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-13T00:30:28 < Steffanx> Does farnell.us exist?
2018-09-13T00:30:33 < jadew> Steffanx, yeah
2018-09-13T00:30:33 < Steffanx> Oh it does
2018-09-13T00:30:35 < jadew> it's called newark
2018-09-13T00:30:37 < bitmask> wut wut in the butt
2018-09-13T00:30:39 < Steffanx> I know it does.
2018-09-13T00:30:45 < tomeaton17> newark lol
2018-09-13T00:30:58 < Steffanx> Its the 25 euro shipping costs stuff
2018-09-13T00:31:16 < Steffanx> That shows up too often
2018-09-13T00:31:27 < bitmask> oh baby youuuuu, youuu got what I neeeeedd
2018-09-13T00:31:28 < jadew> what are you talking about?
2018-09-13T00:31:30 < Steffanx> I like farnell for small studd
2018-09-13T00:31:42 < jadew> 25 eur on farnell?
2018-09-13T00:31:50 < Steffanx> Oh some products are US stock. You have to pay for that
2018-09-13T00:31:56 < jadew> oh, right
2018-09-13T00:32:04 < jadew> yeah, I only buy stuff from europe when I use them
2018-09-13T00:32:06 < Steffanx> Pay extra*
2018-09-13T00:32:22 < jadew> and I only use them when TME doesn't have what I'm after and I need it fast
2018-09-13T00:32:22 < tomeaton17> bitmask, https://i.redd.it/9svbzgdaozk11.jpg
2018-09-13T00:32:40 < Steffanx> How high are you bitmask?
2018-09-13T00:32:43 < bitmask> I dun get it
2018-09-13T00:32:51 < englishman> ah digiJEW is down
2018-09-13T00:32:53 < englishman> mouser it is
2018-09-13T00:32:58 < englishman> probably cheaper anyway
2018-09-13T00:33:02 < bitmask> hah I'm not, I'm just happy.  I think I'm getting my $330 graduation fee waived
2018-09-13T00:33:12 < Steffanx> So are you officially done with school now?
2018-09-13T00:33:15 < bitmask> yup
2018-09-13T00:33:31 < tomeaton17> englishman, did the goy drop a sheckel
2018-09-13T00:33:34 < jadew> congrats
2018-09-13T00:33:37 < bitmask> 3.9 gpa
2018-09-13T00:33:43 < Steffanx> As in. Got the score for your final project etc?
2018-09-13T00:33:49 < bitmask> yup, all As
2018-09-13T00:33:52 < tomeaton17> I have officially started with school on the 17th
2018-09-13T00:34:00 < tomeaton17> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7gzBF9MYTI
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2018-09-13T00:34:14 < Steffanx> 3.9 out of 5?
2018-09-13T00:34:17 < bitmask> 4
2018-09-13T00:34:26 < Steffanx> Hm
2018-09-13T00:34:33 < bitmask> 4.0 is an A
2018-09-13T00:34:46 < Steffanx> And A+
2018-09-13T00:34:47 < Steffanx> ?
2018-09-13T00:34:49 < bitmask> doesnt exist
2018-09-13T00:34:52 < Steffanx> Awh.
2018-09-13T00:35:09 < tomeaton17> ok
2018-09-13T00:36:09 < Steffanx> So when is the party bitmask?
2018-09-13T00:36:23 < Steffanx> Ill bring the stroopwafels
2018-09-13T00:36:51 < tomeaton17> do you have anything more exciting Steffanx 
2018-09-13T00:36:56 < bitmask> woot woot, I'll wait until I get a job to start the party :P
2018-09-13T00:37:13 < bitmask> I cant drink, cant smoke, what good is a party :/
2018-09-13T00:37:24 < Steffanx> I can bring black pudding, tomeaton17 
2018-09-13T00:37:30 < bitmask> well I could... 
2018-09-13T00:37:33 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, I love that.
2018-09-13T00:37:40 < tomeaton17> bitmask, why not?
2018-09-13T00:37:43 < Steffanx> Its fucking awful
2018-09-13T00:38:01 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, its delicious.
2018-09-13T00:38:02 < bitmask> because me and drugs/alcohol don't go well together, I can never stop
2018-09-13T00:38:47 < tomeaton17> bitmask, do you have addiction issues
2018-09-13T00:38:53 < bitmask> yup
2018-09-13T00:39:04 < tomeaton17> ok sorry
2018-09-13T00:39:13 < bitmask> hah its ok
2018-09-13T00:40:53 < bitmask> hmm what to do now, work on this 3d printed clock I've been commissioned for or keep cleaning
2018-09-13T00:41:16 < tomeaton17> cleaning
2018-09-13T00:41:23 < BrainDamage> what's the thesis? 3d printed cocks with size matching for maximum stretching?
2018-09-13T00:41:25 < tomeaton17> lucky I dont struggle with that
2018-09-13T00:42:11 < jadew> tomeaton17, getting stretched by 3d printed cocks?
2018-09-13T00:42:26 < bitmask> yea what do you mean by that
2018-09-13T00:42:38 < bitmask> my thesis was kinda bullshi
2018-09-13T00:43:04 < tomeaton17> jadew, no with addiction. I AM NOT GAY.
2018-09-13T00:43:34 < BrainDamage> don't worry, we won't judge
2018-09-13T00:43:42 < BrainDamage> it's not gay if balls aren't touching
2018-09-13T00:43:46 < bitmask> dont let your boyfriend see you say that
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2018-09-13T00:45:04 < tomeaton17> have never touched a penis apart from mine in my life and intend to keep it that wy.
2018-09-13T00:45:09 < tomeaton17> s/wy/way
2018-09-13T00:46:04 < BrainDamage> you deny it so vehemently that it almost sounds like you're in the closet, also, you don't have to touch it
2018-09-13T00:46:12 < bitmask> I'm gonna put my dick on your face while you are sleeping one night.  wakey wakey
2018-09-13T00:46:14 < tomeaton17> ok mate.
2018-09-13T00:46:43 < bitmask> on that note, back to cleaning
2018-09-13T00:48:09 < Steffanx> No boy child for the eaton?
2018-09-13T00:48:57 < Steffanx> It doesnt clean itself at such young age
2018-09-13T00:49:13 < englishman> ah yes, child cocks chat
2018-09-13T00:49:22 < Thorn> I've got an idea for a new PLC language. it's going to be stack based like forth but with compile time stack usage analysis and other safety features
2018-09-13T00:49:28 < englishman> exactly what i expect from ##stm32 evening chat crew
2018-09-13T00:49:29 < Thorn> do you think I can make millions
2018-09-13T00:49:45 < Steffanx> Lol englishman. Your dirty mind is not helping
2018-09-13T00:50:06 < Steffanx> PLCs will be obsolete soon.
2018-09-13T00:50:15 < BrainDamage> PLC will be replaced by arduinos
2018-09-13T00:52:06 < Steffanx> Hedde?
2018-09-13T00:55:09 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, stop trolling my age its rude.
2018-09-13T00:55:18 < Steffanx> Wut?
2018-09-13T00:55:41 < Steffanx> I think you're getting self-trolled here
2018-09-13T00:56:20 < tomeaton17> im not.
2018-09-13T00:56:38 < tomeaton17> Steffanx, "It doesnt clean itself at such a young age" is age trolling
2018-09-13T00:57:42 < Steffanx> I wasnt referring to you, but a possible tomeaton junioe
2018-09-13T00:57:47 < Steffanx> Junior
2018-09-13T00:58:04 < tomeaton17> oh give it rest of course you were.
2018-09-13T00:58:13 < Steffanx> Yessir
2018-09-13T00:58:30 < tomeaton17> the trolling didn't work Steffanx 
2018-09-13T00:58:58 < Steffanx> It wasnt trolling.
2018-09-13T00:59:22 < tomeaton17> ok.
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2018-09-13T01:00:16 < Steffanx> You said you would never touch one, i gave you a situation where it might be neccessary to do it. Even if you dont want it
2018-09-13T01:00:42 < Steffanx> Unless you force a feature wife/gf to clean up
2018-09-13T01:01:08 < Steffanx> And as a wise man once said: never say never
2018-09-13T01:01:34 < tomeaton17> Yes the future wife/gf was the plan but wouldnt force
2018-09-13T01:01:42 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-13T01:02:12 < BrainDamage> non-gay situations where it's acceptable to touch someone else's dick
2018-09-13T01:02:19 < tomeaton17> yes.
2018-09-13T01:02:38 < BrainDamage> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhvPlzelj9I
2018-09-13T01:03:18 < BrainDamage> nope, I left before the night
2018-09-13T01:04:23 < BrainDamage> they keep talking about couch sexy times though, so I guess it must've been at least memorable
2018-09-13T01:04:33 < Steffanx> I cannot confirm nor deny without the secretary's approval
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2018-09-13T01:05:06 < tomeaton17> very strange
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2018-09-13T01:16:07 < BrainDamage> oxygen free, gold plated capacitors
2018-09-13T01:17:04 < Thorn> how do you ceramics without oxygen
2018-09-13T01:17:53 < Cracki> substitute oxygen, perhaps sulphur or selenium
2018-09-13T01:18:08 < Cracki> not sure what comes out :P
2018-09-13T01:18:36 < Cracki> do carbides count as ceramics?
2018-09-13T01:19:01 < BrainDamage> scientifically yes, for those people no
2018-09-13T01:19:51 < Cracki> oh the topic is audiophile-grade capacitors!
2018-09-13T01:20:32 < BrainDamage> http://www.altmann.haan.de/tubeolator/
2018-09-13T01:20:50 < Cracki> kek
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2018-09-13T01:22:03 < BrainDamage> https://www.lessloss.com/blackbody-p-200.html
2018-09-13T01:22:52 < BrainDamage> https://www.lessloss.com/firewall-module-p-216.html
2018-09-13T01:23:06 < BrainDamage> no coils, no caps
2018-09-13T01:23:09 < rcc> tomeaton17, this is the queer police. Please identify!
2018-09-13T01:24:42 < BrainDamage> fun fact, actually police here can force you to identify, which includes present a valid id
2018-09-13T01:24:58 < BrainDamage> but after that, that's it, no further action done
2018-09-13T01:25:36 < BrainDamage> https://www.lessloss.com/firewall-module-p-216.html
2018-09-13T01:25:37 < BrainDamage> ops
2018-09-13T01:25:41 < BrainDamage> https://www.lessloss.com/images/firewall_module/black/gallery/LessLoss-FW-USB-3221-1000px.jpg
2018-09-13T01:26:00 < BrainDamage> https://www.lessloss.com/images/firewall_module/black/gallery/LessLoss-USB-FW-_FON3444-1000px.jpg
2018-09-13T01:26:03 < rcc> BrainDamage, what's that? audiophool stuff?
2018-09-13T01:26:08 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-13T01:26:17 < BrainDamage> literally a piece of scrap iron
2018-09-13T01:26:44 < BrainDamage> for which skin effect losses aren't even relevant for less than ~10MHz
2018-09-13T01:28:18  * rcc is jadew
2018-09-13T01:36:22 < Cracki> ;_; my display is dying. odd fault pattern. backlight flickers between full and some defined level, very rectangular but irregular in time, worst when starting cold
2018-09-13T01:36:50 < BrainDamage> did you burn-in a porn pic?
2018-09-13T01:36:54 < rcc> haha
2018-09-13T01:37:00 < rcc> Cracki: caps are failing
2018-09-13T01:37:05 < Cracki> has anyone revived their display by just switching out caps?
2018-09-13T01:37:19 < rcc> either that or if it's a CCFL one, maybe one of the tubes
2018-09-13T01:37:22 < BrainDamage> no, nearly everyone values their time more
2018-09-13T01:37:30 < Cracki> last time I saw someone do that, the caps had to endure certain voltages I don't have handy
2018-09-13T01:37:48 < Cracki> huh! it could be one of the tubes. that'd explain how this looks
2018-09-13T01:38:01 < Cracki> also implies it'll keep working at reduced brightness...
2018-09-13T01:38:07 < BrainDamage> no
2018-09-13T01:38:17 < rcc> it implies that at one point it will stop working
2018-09-13T01:38:18 < Cracki> my time isn't that valuable yet
2018-09-13T01:38:19 < BrainDamage> because if it doesn't start, it won't work at lower brightness
2018-09-13T01:38:36 < BrainDamage> ignition is independent of post-discharge current
2018-09-13T01:38:39 < Cracki> _one of the tubes_ that is
2018-09-13T01:38:44 < rcc> I'd open it up, check the caps (at least visually if you don't have a LCR meter)
2018-09-13T01:38:59 < rcc> then order them
2018-09-13T01:39:41 < rcc> it won't take more than an hour
2018-09-13T01:39:50 < Cracki> that I realize
2018-09-13T01:40:35 < Cracki> I should fix my old 1600x1200 first... to have a spare
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2018-09-13T02:41:05 < englishman> oh boy a ragepberripi compute module project
2018-09-13T02:45:46 < Cracki> who
2018-09-13T02:45:47 < Cracki> where
2018-09-13T02:45:50 < Cracki> why
2018-09-13T02:49:39 < englishman> hmm it doesnt have ethernet
2018-09-13T02:50:15 < englishman> good opportunity to try LAN9514
2018-09-13T02:55:10 < Laurenceb_> https://imgoat.com/uploads/5e00132373/145499.jpg
2018-09-13T02:55:38 < Laurenceb_> lost at Elena Roger
2018-09-13T02:58:32 < Cracki> so close to elliot rodger
2018-09-13T02:59:00 < Cracki> just a g missing
2018-09-13T02:59:07 < Cracki> kek tugger
2018-09-13T02:59:22 < Cracki> "tucker" would work too...
2018-09-13T03:09:44 < Laurenceb_> I have so many questions https://imgoat.com/uploads/5e00132373/145506.png
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2018-09-13T03:15:36 < Cracki> googlers piss their panties when trump got elected https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2018/09/12/leaked-video-google-leaderships-dismayed-reaction-to-trump-election/
2018-09-13T03:18:37 < Laurenceb_> 165mm iphone wtf
2018-09-13T03:19:03 < Cracki> for those who want to say "look at my gigantic schlong"
2018-09-13T03:20:48 < branjb> that video is gr8
2018-09-13T03:22:49 < Cracki> they WANT to radicalize their employees
2018-09-13T03:23:02 < Cracki> push out the sane ones, attract the insane ones
2018-09-13T03:23:23 < Cracki> leftism is a deadly disease.
2018-09-13T03:24:36 < branjb> similar to cancer
2018-09-13T03:25:31 < Cracki> I urge people to notice coincidences
2018-09-13T03:26:13 < rcc> leftism as it is today is unavoidable
2018-09-13T03:26:19 < rcc> and it will get worse
2018-09-13T03:27:14 < Cracki> it's like they want repercussions
2018-09-13T03:28:14 < branjb> this video is amazing, the fact that this video even exists is one of the reasons trump got elected
2018-09-13T03:28:15 < rcc> the new generations, no matter how well prepared, no matter how ethusiastic, when they enter adult life they'll be met by a lot of disappointment
2018-09-13T03:28:46 < rcc> and funnily enough, that's largely a result of globalization, which is what they love
2018-09-13T03:29:32 < rcc> and once that happens they'll start pointing fingers and they'll point it at the people who are not disappointed by the system and to the system itself
2018-09-13T03:29:39 < rcc> I think we'
2018-09-13T03:30:03 < rcc> I think we're going to see new communist countries
2018-09-13T03:30:33 < rcc> in fact, I think communism will rise again, until it works
2018-09-13T03:32:02 < branjb> if my company made me sit through a meeting like this I would probably put in my two weeks
2018-09-13T03:32:11 < rcc> haha
2018-09-13T03:34:13 < englishman> Laurenceb_: wait til you see the 720p iphone
2018-09-13T03:36:23 < Cracki> >until it works
2018-09-13T03:36:35 < Cracki> pinochet_laughing.jpg
2018-09-13T03:37:02 < Cracki> don't put in your two weeks, just start calling new places
2018-09-13T03:37:36 < Cracki> you can get out of that hellhole instantly if you get fired
2018-09-13T03:37:43 < branjb> at my company now if you put in your two weeks you immediately turn in your shit and get escorted off the property, but still get to collect pay for 2 weeks
2018-09-13T03:37:44 < branjb> p good deal
2018-09-13T03:38:01 < Cracki> how about severance when they kick you out
2018-09-13T03:38:11 < branjb> prob not
2018-09-13T03:38:26 < branjb> the old timers are grandfathered in and get severence if they quit/get fired
2018-09-13T03:38:33 < branjb> but not anyone who was hired after ~2008
2018-09-13T03:38:38 < Cracki> hm
2018-09-13T03:39:13 < branjb> >googlers
2018-09-13T03:39:18 < branjb> do they really call themselves googlers?
2018-09-13T03:40:01 < Cracki> they do
2018-09-13T03:40:27 < Cracki> my spidey sense is getting a workout since 2015
2018-09-13T03:41:08 < Cracki> I seriously hope things become so bad that we correct course once and for all time
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2018-09-13T03:42:20 < branjb> yeah i think accelerationism is the only way to fix everything
2018-09-13T03:42:35 < Cracki> we have to be thorough
2018-09-13T03:42:44 < branjb> just vote for the absolute worst politicians and policy till it burns down and can be rebuilt
2018-09-13T03:42:57 < Cracki> we have to teach this shit to new generations or they'll succumb to the same bullshit
2018-09-13T03:43:01 < rcc> Cracki, things were already bad
2018-09-13T03:43:25 < rcc> and then they got fixed, but as you can see, it doesn't hold
2018-09-13T03:43:33 < Cracki> i see no fixes
2018-09-13T03:43:51 < branjb> burn it all
2018-09-13T03:43:55 < Cracki> so much I learn about history tells me I've been lied to.
2018-09-13T03:45:38 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dm66Fi1XcAI39cQ.jpg:orig
2018-09-13T03:45:54 < Cracki> ^ that is because local govt FAILED to distribute the shit the feds brought them
2018-09-13T03:47:00 < rcc> maybe they didn't need water...
2018-09-13T03:48:38 < branjb> >27:55 "Lesbians who tech"
2018-09-13T03:48:39 < branjb> lol
2018-09-13T03:48:57 < Cracki> soy and estrogen https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dm5RMKXU4AASOND.jpg:orig
2018-09-13T03:50:16 < rcc> for every type of woman, you have to play a different game
2018-09-13T03:51:29 < Cracki> not interested in games.
2018-09-13T03:51:48 < rcc> if you want to get laid, you better be
2018-09-13T03:52:09 < Cracki> either the bullshit stops or there will be babies made in test tubes
2018-09-13T03:52:36 < Cracki> bullshit must not procreate
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2018-09-13T04:18:40 < Cracki> my pronouns are flammenwerfer and hubschrauber
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2018-09-13T04:37:01 < aandrew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Uzu58N-Sso&feature=youtu.be&t=154
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2018-09-13T04:43:09 < Cracki> 1:07
2018-09-13T04:46:28 < rcc> I like this better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fG3whNsg4MI
2018-09-13T04:51:38 < Cracki> 0:14
2018-09-13T04:51:43 < Cracki> perfect number
2018-09-13T04:54:04 < Cracki> hahah "this is programmer"
2018-09-13T04:54:13 < dongs> https://www.crowdsupply.com/arsenijs/zerophone omfg
2018-09-13T04:54:17 < dongs> someone fucking kill these people
2018-09-13T04:54:29 < rcc> hah
2018-09-13T04:54:37 < englishman> surprised you didnt see that before
2018-09-13T04:54:40 < Cracki> >.../arsejizz/...
2018-09-13T04:54:58 < Cracki> looks bricky
2018-09-13T04:55:39 < Cracki> cute, but... a pi, an esp, and an arduino? potent mix
2018-09-13T04:58:57 < aandrew> dongs: sounds like something trn would be in to
2018-09-13T05:00:20 < englishman> 512gb in an iphone
2018-09-13T05:00:32 < englishman> a $2k phone
2018-09-13T05:00:42 < dongs> nobody caresa bout $2k one
2018-09-13T05:00:52 < dongs> its about 720p phone in Q4 2018 costing $730 
2018-09-13T05:00:53 < dongs> lol
2018-09-13T05:01:03 < dongs> and retards are still gonna buy it
2018-09-13T05:01:19 < englishman> im keeping my $AAPL
2018-09-13T05:01:21 < englishman> thats for sure
2018-09-13T05:01:26 < englishman> brilliant minds there
2018-09-13T05:01:43 < aandrew> dongs: yep that is awesome
2018-09-13T05:01:52 < dongs> i bet you already preordered
2018-09-13T05:01:53 < aandrew> it's like the macbook with a 480p camera in 2016
2018-09-13T05:01:55 < dongs> you filthy faggot
2018-09-13T05:02:02 < aandrew> who me?
2018-09-13T05:02:07 < dongs> so you can get your iTunes fix
2018-09-13T05:02:08 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-13T05:02:48 < aandrew> no, I'm rocking a pink 6s+ I got from my wife when she got the 8+
2018-09-13T05:04:15 < dongs> gross
2018-09-13T05:05:30 < aandrew> better than anything android that's for sure
2018-09-13T05:17:20 < dongs> bet the new ifaggot still doesn't support WPS
2018-09-13T05:17:21 < dongs> lol
2018-09-13T05:18:16 < aandrew> who the fuck needs wps
2018-09-13T05:18:29 < dongs> normal people?
2018-09-13T05:18:33 < aandrew> lol
2018-09-13T05:19:25 < aandrew> not once in 20 years have I ever used or even heard of anyone using WPS
2018-09-13T05:21:46 < branjb> I used it once
2018-09-13T05:21:52 < branjb> it was cumbersome and shitty
2018-09-13T05:22:13 < dongs> yes pressing a button while visiting some faggot instead of asking them for a password is cumbersome and shitty
2018-09-13T05:22:25 < dongs> maybe ipone IS for you
2018-09-13T05:22:28 < branjb> oh
2018-09-13T05:22:31 < dongs> since you're too much of a faggot to understand the use
2018-09-13T05:22:36 < branjb> mistake that acronym for WPF
2018-09-13T05:24:14 < aandrew> yes because everyone has their routers nearby to press some fucking button while you futz aroudn
2018-09-13T05:24:35 < aandrew> sane people with sane passphrases are 10x easier
2018-09-13T05:33:12 < dongs> using ifaggot and talkin about sane people
2018-09-13T05:33:50 < englishman> is asking for a password socially awkward in japan
2018-09-13T05:35:11 < rcc> people there would rather sleep with a pillow than meet actual people and you're asking if password sharing is socially awkward?
2018-09-13T05:35:33 < dongs> haha
2018-09-13T05:35:40 < dongs> i read it as "people here" first
2018-09-13T05:35:43 < dongs> as in, in t his channel
2018-09-13T05:36:32 < rcc> I think this channel is pretty healthy
2018-09-13T05:37:21 < rcc> japan on the other hand...
2018-09-13T05:38:32 < rcc> alright... managed to compile some 3 years old code
2018-09-13T05:38:38 < rcc> took me only a couple of hours
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2018-09-13T05:39:09 < rcc> and I realized I forgot to push some changes to a library (3 years ago) and now I have to merge them :/
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2018-09-13T05:48:30 < dongs> must be gcc code
2018-09-13T05:48:47 < dongs> I can compile my windows software I written years ago with zero issues
2018-09-13T05:50:39 < rcc> iy is
2018-09-13T05:50:45 < rcc> it is
2018-09-13T05:56:50 < Thorn> it won't run on xp unless you install an old sdk (including compiler with barely any c++11 support)
2018-09-13T05:58:23 < rcc> not true, you can just compile it as a static executable and it'll just work
2018-09-13T05:58:50 < rcc> oh, you mean the libraries have changed
2018-09-13T05:58:56 < rcc> nah... not like they change on linux
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2018-09-13T06:12:03 < rcc> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQXcfxh3w6g
2018-09-13T06:12:12 < rcc> 4 million views
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2018-09-13T06:12:43 < rcc> how much money is that?
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2018-09-13T10:12:30 < jadew> how much is a btc?
2018-09-13T10:12:46 < jadew> hah, the bubble popped
2018-09-13T10:13:42 < jadew> and look at that, it had the same curve like we discussed
2018-09-13T10:13:54 < jadew> we must have talked about it right when the crash started
2018-09-13T10:15:02 < jadew> it's still crashing tho
2018-09-13T10:26:05 < jadew> check this out, you know how I was lamenting about my board not selling?
2018-09-13T10:26:46 < jadew> turns out that the ones that do sell (my competitor's), are not even tested
2018-09-13T10:26:59 < jadew> in fact, the guy making them has never seen that board working past 120 MHz
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2018-09-13T10:27:52 < jadew> I don't hold it against him, but buyers behaviour is really weird
2018-09-13T10:28:04 < jadew> that's what intrigues me
2018-09-13T10:28:11 < jadew> crt, not much
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2018-09-13T10:28:17 < jadew> I guess I'm preparing to go to bed
2018-09-13T10:29:14 < jadew> https://cojotech.com/hpo-030
2018-09-13T10:29:48 < jadew> for now just that
2018-09-13T10:29:51 < jadew> there's more in the oven
2018-09-13T10:30:00 < Steffanx> Lol ita time to wake up, not time to bes, jadew 
2018-09-13T10:30:32 < jadew> crt, yeah
2018-09-13T10:30:57 < jadew> Steffanx, I know, but I'm working hard these days
2018-09-13T10:31:01 < Steffanx> Cojotech = jadew ?
2018-09-13T10:31:06 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-13T10:31:49 < Steffanx> Made in Romania :)
2018-09-13T10:32:21 < jadew> yeah, the one I seem to be competing with is made in germany, so I suppose it instills more confidence
2018-09-13T10:34:00 < jadew> I'm getting a deja-vu now
2018-09-13T10:34:02 < Steffanx> Whats the difference between -N and not N?
2018-09-13T10:34:20 < jadew> Steffanx, you're trolling me?
2018-09-13T10:34:45 < Steffanx> Im really not seeing it, jadew 
2018-09-13T10:34:56 < Steffanx> Pics and text on that page look the same to me
2018-09-13T10:35:09 < jadew> ah, ok, thought you read the datasheet and just wanted me to repeat :P
2018-09-13T10:35:22 < jadew> yeah, they're virtually the same in one regard
2018-09-13T10:35:35 < jadew> -N is less sensitive, but doesn't trigger continuously
2018-09-13T10:35:35 < Steffanx> Oh no, didnt come to that yet.
2018-09-13T10:35:57 < Steffanx> Come one. Irc is first ask, then google. (Or look further)
2018-09-13T10:35:59 < Steffanx> On*
2018-09-13T10:36:04 < jadew> I find the non-N version to be the best
2018-09-13T10:36:23 < jadew> since you can immediately tell if it's displaying garbage or not
2018-09-13T10:37:37 < Steffanx> Ah
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2018-09-13T10:47:53 < jadew> since I put that for sale I started really questioning the way I do things
2018-09-13T10:48:34 < jadew> I tend to put too much time into it and around it
2018-09-13T10:49:46 < jadew> and it doesn't seem to work - there are no visible benefits to doing things like that
2018-09-13T10:50:43 < zyp> jadew, last I checked, I was still up
2018-09-13T10:51:11 < zyp> on BTC, compared to what I bought for
2018-09-13T10:51:35 < Steffanx> It is still "up"
2018-09-13T10:51:53 < jadew> yeah, it still seems to be holding
2018-09-13T10:52:15 < Steffanx> That other one is dying it seems. Ethereum?
2018-09-13T10:52:27 < zyp> is it?
2018-09-13T10:52:45 < zyp> I don't have any money in anything else, so I haven't been following
2018-09-13T10:52:59 < jadew> yeah, that one seems to have popped completely
2018-09-13T10:53:18 < jadew> I didn't even know about it
2018-09-13T10:53:41 < Steffanx> Ive no money in any of it.
2018-09-13T10:53:50 < jadew> me neither
2018-09-13T10:54:16 < zyp> Steffanx, that's just because you gave it to me :p
2018-09-13T10:54:20 < Steffanx> I refuse to do that. Except for whe. I have to buy a opensubtitles subscription
2018-09-13T10:54:39 < Steffanx> zyp: i had those for ^ that reason
2018-09-13T10:54:45 < zyp> hehe
2018-09-13T10:55:24 < Steffanx> I dont think so. He didnt have his first stroopwafel of the day yet
2018-09-13T10:55:29 < jadew> I don't think ETH will completely die out
2018-09-13T10:55:41 < jadew> it may be a good investment opportunity once it bottoms out
2018-09-13T10:56:39 < Steffanx> Yes, but i refuse to do so.
2018-09-13T10:57:16 < zyp> I had some toy money in bitcoin in 2011, bought in at $8, sold a bunch at $30, then «the bubble popped» and I sold most of the rest at $14 before it fell all the way to below $2
2018-09-13T10:57:36 < Steffanx> Hehe
2018-09-13T10:57:59 < zyp> if I hadn't sold any, that would have been $115k today
2018-09-13T10:58:03 < zyp> or thereabouts
2018-09-13T10:58:20 < jadew> it's impossible to predict these things
2018-09-13T10:58:29 < zyp> but I figured after it fell to $2, it would never rise again
2018-09-13T10:58:39 < zyp> so I'm not inclined to do that mistake again :p
2018-09-13T10:58:56 < jadew> you took the right decision tho
2018-09-13T11:00:17 < jadew> crt, the kind that gambles on the exchange rate daily
2018-09-13T11:01:30 < zyp> jadew, right how? I could have afforded to lose those $150 or whatever I originally put in
2018-09-13T11:01:55 < zyp> or after it fell <$2 I could have put in like $10 or whatever
2018-09-13T11:02:09 < jadew> zyp, not knowing that it's going to blow up (which you couldn't have known), it was the best decision, because you saved your money
2018-09-13T11:02:15 < jadew> otherwise it would have been a gamble
2018-09-13T11:02:38 < zyp> it was a gamble from the start, I never knew it would rise from $8 to $30 either
2018-09-13T11:03:29 < jadew> any ideas on how to buy stock?
2018-09-13T11:03:58 < jadew> I've done a bit of searching, but I get the feeling that most articles are trying to sell me an overpriced product
2018-09-13T11:04:02 < zyp> how?
2018-09-13T11:04:18 < zyp> uh, you just find something you want and buy it? :p
2018-09-13T11:04:33 < jadew> zyp, don't you need an account somewhere?
2018-09-13T11:04:49 < zyp> yeah, you probably need to sign up for some trading platform
2018-09-13T11:04:56 < jadew> haha crt
2018-09-13T11:05:06 < zyp> my online banking have stock trading integrated, I've just used that before
2018-09-13T11:05:26 < jadew> zyp, I should check mine
2018-09-13T11:05:58 < Steffanx> Can i get one AUD, crt? Is it a coin?
2018-09-13T11:06:15 < Steffanx> I invest in theepots
2018-09-13T11:08:01 < jadew> my bank only has a service for investment funds
2018-09-13T11:08:16 < zyp> jadew, yeah, mine got that too
2018-09-13T11:09:54 < Steffanx> Ill trade it for klompen crt. Does cjbaird need a pair too?
2018-09-13T11:12:27 < PaulFertser> jadew: do you plan to buy TSLA?
2018-09-13T11:13:06 < jadew> PaulFertser, don't know, seems a bit too late
2018-09-13T11:13:50 < jadew> could be a good investment long term
2018-09-13T11:14:28 < PaulFertser> I've just read about crappy crypto they used for a key. What a shame!
2018-09-13T11:16:34 < PaulFertser> https://www.wired.com/story/hackers-steal-tesla-model-s-seconds-key-fob/
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2018-09-13T11:21:41 < PaulFertser> crt: no, that's unrelated
2018-09-13T11:22:24 < PaulFertser> Would be fun though if it was possible to FPV drive a stolen car, agreed.
2018-09-13T11:24:48 < jadew> I'm reading that there's an app where you can trade stock for free
2018-09-13T11:25:03 < jadew> and on their site they have a banner where they say they do crypto too
2018-09-13T11:25:57 < jadew> http://robinhood.com
2018-09-13T11:25:58 < PaulFertser> Not sure if you're serious.
2018-09-13T11:26:03 < jadew> I am
2018-09-13T11:26:13 < jadew> read about it here: https://www.forbes.com/sites/karlkaufman/2018/02/18/how-to-trade-stocks-for-free/#37e0defd9680
2018-09-13T11:26:18 < PaulFertser> That really sounded like sarcasm.
2018-09-13T11:26:46 < jadew> it's valued at 1.something billions
2018-09-13T11:28:42 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIrLfXVFBrk
2018-09-13T11:29:05 < jadew> and no minimum investment
2018-09-13T11:29:32 < jadew> can't wait to wake up, I have a lot of reading to do on investment
2018-09-13T11:29:59 < jadew> anyone else willing to try it?
2018-09-13T11:30:00 < dongs> lol crypto
2018-09-13T11:30:02 < dongs> lol free trading
2018-09-13T11:30:02 < PaulFertser> "Robinhood is currently available to legal US residents over 18 years of age only."
2018-09-13T11:30:07 < dongs> jadew: better just go sleep
2018-09-13T11:30:09 < jadew> ah fuck
2018-09-13T11:30:16 < jadew> PaulFertser, that sucks...
2018-09-13T11:30:40 < PaulFertser> Not sure if I understood it properly, it's just one sentence out of many in the site footer.
2018-09-13T11:32:21 < jadew> you are... it's not for us
2018-09-13T11:32:25 < jadew> https://support.robinhood.com/hc/en-us/articles/202844889-Account-Opening-Requirements
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2018-09-13T11:36:29 < zyp> I wonder how tesla's gonna do once other car makers starts getting serious about EVs
2018-09-13T11:36:45 < dongs> they'll be fucked, what else
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2018-09-13T11:36:50 < dongs> they have absolutely nothign normal people want
2018-09-13T11:36:52 < dongs> except the battery
2018-09-13T11:36:58 < dongs> everything else they do is 200% inferior
2018-09-13T11:37:08 < PaulFertser> How about "swarm intellegence"?
2018-09-13T11:37:35 < zyp> I used to think their charging infrastructure was their largest advantage, they have a pretty decent head start there
2018-09-13T11:38:04 < jadew> I think tesla will be a leader in the field simply because they invested a lot in adiacent technology
2018-09-13T11:38:40 < jadew> they'll win on the smart-car front, rather than the electric car one
2018-09-13T11:39:03 < zyp> but now I'm starting to think that catching up to tesla's infrastructure might go pretty quickly once the will to invest is there
2018-09-13T11:40:13 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/Eo5rD.jpg <- I mentioned earlier the six 350kW chargers I encountered in .dk this summer
2018-09-13T11:40:27 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/o5YEM.jpg
2018-09-13T11:41:07 < jadew> damn... 516 A
2018-09-13T11:41:14 < zyp> I found out the other day that Ionity are currently building their first location in Norway, like 30km away from where I live
2018-09-13T11:42:10 < zyp> apparently it was originally planned for six chargers there too, expandable to 24, but apparently they changed their minds and are going for 12 right away
2018-09-13T11:42:31 < zyp> tesla just opened like 20 chargers in the same lot
2018-09-13T11:42:57 < zyp> jadew, yeah, that shit is pretty hard core
2018-09-13T11:43:05 < zyp> the cables and stuff is watercooled
2018-09-13T11:43:44 < jadew> zyp, was wondering how hot they get
2018-09-13T11:44:31 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/Qx1ou.jpg <- chargers are located in closets next to the parking lot, separate closet for the radiators that cools everything
2018-09-13T11:44:50 < zyp> and then there's a cooling loop in each cable all the way out to the plug that goes in the car and back
2018-09-13T11:45:08 < PaulFertser> Where does 480V 3P come from, and why 480 when there's 400V 3P everywhere available?
2018-09-13T11:45:31 < dongs> probly 480 cuz its 240*2?
2018-09-13T11:45:36 < dongs> norgay is probly 240V
2018-09-13T11:45:42 < zyp> PaulFertser, yeah, I was wondering too, and discussing with a couple of my friends
2018-09-13T11:45:51 < zyp> dongs, doesn't work like that
2018-09-13T11:46:10 < PaulFertser> dongs: 230V is 1P to N, 400V is 1P to another P.
2018-09-13T11:46:11 < jadew> maybe they needed to squeeze some extra power through the cables?
2018-09-13T11:46:24 < zyp> norway is 230V, and 230V wye is 400V phase to phase
2018-09-13T11:46:27 < PaulFertser> dongs: 3P 120\deg separated, so it doesn't multiply.
2018-09-13T11:46:47 < zyp> but then I found some documents the other day
2018-09-13T11:48:33 < zyp> apparently those chargers doesn't have galvanic separation internally
2018-09-13T11:48:50 < zyp> instead, they rely on a galvanically isolated supply
2018-09-13T11:49:22 < zyp> which is combined with the step down from the grid
2018-09-13T11:50:01 < zyp> so they're using a special transformer for that, with a 24kV primary, six 480V secondaries and a 400V secondary for utilities
2018-09-13T11:50:33 < dongs> oh well no idea
2018-09-13T11:50:36 < dongs> my jappu 3phase is like 200V
2018-09-13T11:52:02 < PaulFertser> zyp: thank you, thank makes sense now :)
2018-09-13T11:52:41 < zyp> PaulFertser, if you read norwegian, here's the application for permission to build the transformers they sent: http://webfileservice.nve.no/API/PublishedFiles/Download/201800974/2407387
2018-09-13T11:52:51 < zyp> and the approval: http://webfileservice.nve.no/API/PublishedFiles/Download/201800974/2425141
2018-09-13T11:54:10 < zyp> tesla's chargers also run on 480V, they also got their own substation right next to this one
2018-09-13T11:54:21 < zyp> my understanding is that 480V is common in US
2018-09-13T11:55:25 < zyp> and since tesla puts up enough chargers at each location to justify a new substation anyway, I guess it doesn't make sense to design a 400V variant of the chargers
2018-09-13T11:55:35 < cjbaird> <zyp> I wonder how tesla's gonna do once other car makers starts getting serious about EVs --- Tesla are only 4% of the EV Car sales. You only hear of them because they spend big on social media.
2018-09-13T11:56:08 < cjbaird> Like 80% of the EVs here in AU are Nissan Leaf.
2018-09-13T11:56:25 < zyp> cjbaird, the number is closer to 15% in Norway
2018-09-13T11:56:44 < Steffanx> No teslas in the train crt?!?
2018-09-13T11:56:53 < Steffanx> Damnit
2018-09-13T11:57:02 < zyp> nissan leaf make up just under 25% of the norwegian EVs
2018-09-13T11:57:12 < cjbaird> I wanna know were the fucking Honda EV SuperCubs are... Supposed to be on sale already./
2018-09-13T11:58:28 < cjbaird> Norways a freak country still spending its Nokia money; it's not very prepresentive of the global average. :)
2018-09-13T11:58:38 < cjbaird> *representative
2018-09-13T11:59:23 < zyp> well, sure, if you look globally, you've got the BYD e6, but I'm not sure that even exists outside china
2018-09-13T12:00:33 < cjbaird> I'm going to get a sticker printed saying "One Less Tesla" for the EVCub and/or solar touring bicycle..
2018-09-13T12:01:06 < zyp> cjbaird, anyway, my point is that tesla has invested a lot in infrastructure
2018-09-13T12:01:15 < cjbaird> (To explain the joke for crt, because he always bloody needs it: "One Less Car" is a popular Crtical Mass bicycle sticker)
2018-09-13T12:02:53 < cjbaird> ...that're incompatible with the real vehicle charging standards
2018-09-13T12:03:09 < zyp> cjbaird, two years ago, I were at what then was norway's largest charging locations
2018-09-13T12:03:16 < zyp> here's the tesla chargers: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/jPRl7.jpg
2018-09-13T12:03:35 < zyp> and here's the chargers for other EVs: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/QAKYw.jpg
2018-09-13T12:03:46 < zyp> check the difference in numbers
2018-09-13T12:04:00 < Steffanx> Bo tesla to be seen. Only a vw
2018-09-13T12:04:04 < Steffanx> No
2018-09-13T12:04:07 < zyp> every location is like that, to some degree or another
2018-09-13T12:04:59 < zyp> Steffanx, there's one on the highway in the background
2018-09-13T12:05:02 < Steffanx> Or is that a tesla on the road
2018-09-13T12:05:11 < Steffanx> Yes, i just noticed
2018-09-13T12:05:31 < cjbaird> The word for today is "Loss-leader".   Clueless Consumer: "Oh wow! That must mean Tesla is the Biggest Player in the Ev car market!?"  .. No, it's the exact-same bogus shit Musk did with PayPal, giving away money with new accounts & etc. 
2018-09-13T12:05:51 < Steffanx> We have a musk hater in the house?
2018-09-13T12:06:12 < cjbaird> A bit harder for him to make a Criminal-friendly company this time around..
2018-09-13T12:06:36 < zyp> I'm not talking about biggest player in the market, I'm talking about having the infrastructure in place
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2018-09-13T12:10:13 < zyp> there's like 27k teslas and 153k other EVs in norway
2018-09-13T12:10:27 < dongs> what really
2018-09-13T12:10:34 < zyp> when a location got 24 spots for tesla and 4 spots for other cars, guess which spots gets crowded first
2018-09-13T12:10:35 < dongs> i wonder how many there's in jp
2018-09-13T12:11:18 < dongs> http://ev-sales.blogspot.com/search/label/Japan
2018-09-13T12:12:00 < zyp> I don't count PHEVs, just all electric
2018-09-13T12:12:10 < cjbaird> We'ver got Tesla wnakers over here constantly trying to push the "Tesla are so great because you can drive around Australia!" ..only because they fool outback rouadhouses into given them free electricity, unaware that they're taking about 20 times more energy than a grey nomad's aircon (that the GN has to pay $40/night for). https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/sep/12/how-much-does-it-cost-to-power-an-electric-car-around-
2018-09-13T12:12:12 < cjbaird> australia-150
2018-09-13T12:12:31 < dongs> gay nigger aircon
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2018-09-13T12:13:14 < dongs> why/no/mare
2018-09-13T12:13:15 < dongs> oh fuck
2018-09-13T12:13:21 < dongs> whats git gonna do with a utf-16 file
2018-09-13T12:13:24 < cjbaird> Roadhouses are on diesel generators, playing like $10 per kW/h
2018-09-13T12:13:24 < dongs> merge-wise
2018-09-13T12:13:51 < zyp> cjbaird, how much is power normally in .au?
2018-09-13T12:14:04 < catphish> people use utf-16?
2018-09-13T12:14:22 < zyp> dongs, treat it as binary and leave it the fuck alone?
2018-09-13T12:14:23 < cjbaird> $0.30-$0.50 per kW/h
2018-09-13T12:14:31 < zyp> AUD?
2018-09-13T12:14:49 < catphish> dongs: diff can't handle it, apparantly you can use an alternative diff tool that can
2018-09-13T12:15:18 < dongs> CONFLICT (content): Merge conflict in text_strings.h
2018-09-13T12:15:19 < dongs> fuck.
2018-09-13T12:15:20 < cjbaird> yep. 1AUD=0.62Euro
2018-09-13T12:15:27 < zyp> cjbaird, that's 2-3 times as much as here
2018-09-13T12:15:44 < catphish> dongs: i imagine it's going to be a manual job
2018-09-13T12:15:57 < catphish> merge it manually, replace the file
2018-09-13T12:16:03 < dongs> i think ill just wipe it and replace from upstream
2018-09-13T12:16:20 < dongs> error: path 'text_strings.h' is unmerged
2018-09-13T12:16:20 < dongs> Completed with errors, see above.
2018-09-13T12:16:21 < dongs> ...
2018-09-13T12:16:23 < cjbaird> Not surprised. Ask as about our Ethanol excise..
2018-09-13T12:16:23 < dongs> discard doesnt work
2018-09-13T12:16:25 < dongs> here goes git faggotry again
2018-09-13T12:16:30 < zyp> I used to pay well below 1 NOK per kWh
2018-09-13T12:16:32 < catphish> yeah, that's basically what i meant, get a clean copy of the file, merge in the changes manually
2018-09-13T12:16:39 < catphish> and stop using UTF-16
2018-09-13T12:16:56 < zyp> right now it's a little higher because the water reserves are lower than normal because this summer was unusually dry
2018-09-13T12:17:00 < dongs> there's no other way  to get unicode into wchar_t
2018-09-13T12:17:05 < catphish> dongs: you mark merges as complete with git add
2018-09-13T12:17:12 < dongs> i dont use command line
2018-09-13T12:17:33  * catphish shrugs
2018-09-13T12:17:38 < catphish> right-click, git-add?
2018-09-13T12:17:56 < zyp> but still, electricity costs around 1/5 per km compared to what gasoline costs here, so I'm perfectly happy to pay for the electricity my car is using
2018-09-13T12:19:53 < cjbaird> I think I mentioned this years ago, but a mate from high-school has the best EV Car /ever/ :D .. https://twitter.com/Chris_J_Baird/status/656674340591669248 (my Learner plates on the car..)
2018-09-13T12:20:21 < zyp> nice
2018-09-13T12:21:10 < zyp> what battery capacity does it have?
2018-09-13T12:21:18 < cjbaird> He started and owners one of the bigger Solar Installation companies here-- domestic and industrial (mining) work.
2018-09-13T12:21:30 < catphish> i have MAS timecode receives, not sure i actually want them now, but i have them :) https://i.imgur.com/SoGLVYZ.jpg
2018-09-13T12:21:36 < dongs> lol that is nice
2018-09-13T12:21:43 < dongs> only problem isnt delorean fucking heavy
2018-09-13T12:22:00 < cjbaird> His car-conversation websight: https://www.elmofo.com.au/
2018-09-13T12:22:06 < zyp> doesn't matter, it'll be fucking heavy once you add the batteries anyway
2018-09-13T12:22:33 < dongs> correct, but if the start was "only a little heavy" then adding batteries won't be "really fucking heavy"
2018-09-13T12:22:34 < catphish> those are some nice vehicles, want this https://www.elmofo.com.au/electric-delorean-dmcev
2018-09-13T12:22:44 < zyp> cjbaird, 22kWh, not bad
2018-09-13T12:23:26 < cjbaird> Converting the DMC12 actually improved the performance over the 1970s ?Lotus 6-cyl..
2018-09-13T12:23:36 < dongs> no doubt
2018-09-13T12:24:00 < catphish> nice, 100S battery pack
2018-09-13T12:24:18 < zyp> shame there's no fast charging
2018-09-13T12:24:40 < cjbaird> His house (and cars..) are all charged off-grid, too.
2018-09-13T12:24:42 < zyp> not being able to go on trips longer than 130km sounds pretty limiting, even for a toy car
2018-09-13T12:24:43 < catphish> 7 hours is probably fine
2018-09-13T12:24:54 < zyp> catphish, no, it's useless
2018-09-13T12:25:25 < catphish> zyp: depends how far you need to travel i guess, i never travel more than about 50km, so meh
2018-09-13T12:25:29 < zyp> catphish, imagine you wanna go somewhere 200km away and you have to make a 7 hour stop somewhere on the road
2018-09-13T12:25:30 < catphish> more than that i get a train
2018-09-13T12:26:21 < catphish> or, just use an ICE car for long journeys
2018-09-13T12:27:09 < catphish> that's an insanely powerful vehicle
2018-09-13T12:27:18 < cjbaird> Want the EV Supercub to take over from my Postie.. That is, local travel stuff. The 250cc Scooter would still do the Newcastle-Sydney runs (300km)
2018-09-13T12:27:25 < catphish> at least for a DIY EV
2018-09-13T12:29:27 < catphish> those PMAC motors are sexy too
2018-09-13T12:41:47 < karlp> you guys were chatty last night.
2018-09-13T12:41:58 < catphish> not me
2018-09-13T12:42:04 < zyp> not me
2018-09-13T12:43:52 < catphish> i was busy doing a new ST95HF layout: https://i.imgur.com/kD8KaSt.png
2018-09-13T12:44:41 < catphish> i noticed in ST's design, they put the antenna as close as possible to the RX lines and put the TX components out of the way, my design did the opposite
2018-09-13T12:44:51 < catphish> doing it ST's way is much neater
2018-09-13T12:45:01 < zyp> how was your old design?
2018-09-13T12:45:32 < zyp> here's mine for reference: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/KmWnr.png
2018-09-13T12:46:03 < zyp> looks like your new design is doing the opposite of mine
2018-09-13T12:46:17 < catphish> zyp: my old design was more like yours - https://i.imgur.com/HRDflqG.png
2018-09-13T12:46:43 < zyp> anything wrong with that?
2018-09-13T12:46:49 < catphish> but the new design prioritizes the RX lines, which i think is a better idea (and what ST do)
2018-09-13T12:46:57 < catphish> it also takes up less space
2018-09-13T12:47:22 < zyp> hmm, I'm not sure about that
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2018-09-13T12:48:24 < catphish> zyp: this is the ST eval board: https://i.imgur.com/fr7QMis.png
2018-09-13T12:49:07 < catphish> zyp: interestingly in that photo i think they have a resistor installed across the antenna, i'm not sure why
2018-09-13T12:49:41 < zyp> q factor adjustment possibly
2018-09-13T12:50:25 < c10ud> did you fill the top layer with gnd?
2018-09-13T12:50:29 < catphish> anyway, i realised that the tx lines are just digital, it's the rx where the precision is needed, so i concluded their design was better
2018-09-13T12:50:44 < catphish> i didn't ST do
2018-09-13T12:51:04 < zyp> also, I think the ST design I referenced were designed like mine
2018-09-13T12:51:23 < c10ud> well I guess you could be picking up lots of noise
2018-09-13T12:51:27 < catphish> the only ST design i'm aware of is the eval board, but maybe i'ce missed one
2018-09-13T12:51:52 < catphish> yeah might be worth flooding the top of the board with GND for the sake of it, i think zyp did so too
2018-09-13T12:52:03 < zyp> hmm, this is different again
2018-09-13T12:52:08 < zyp> https://gerber-viewer.easyeda.com/showcase/?#!id=dad4a9d5b73a11e899d9026a86b9cae7&type=overall&layer_list=1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10
2018-09-13T12:52:11 < zyp> does this work?
2018-09-13T12:52:38 < catphish> oh yeah, that is indeed different again
2018-09-13T12:52:56 < zyp> I don't really think that's what matters anyway
2018-09-13T12:53:06 < catphish> probably not
2018-09-13T12:53:13 < catphish> i like my new design though, seems neater
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2018-09-13T12:53:38 < zyp> getting the antenna resonance freq correct is probably the largest issue
2018-09-13T12:53:58 < catphish> yeah, i was just complaining yesterday that my antenna is probably not well tuned :(
2018-09-13T12:54:13 < catphish> it reads cards fine, but the card detection is garbage :(
2018-09-13T12:54:24 < zyp> if you want, you could send me a board and I could hook it up and test it
2018-09-13T12:54:25 < catphish> which suggests it's not resonating well
2018-09-13T12:54:38 < zyp> I haven't tried card detection on my board
2018-09-13T12:54:41 < Steffanx> Any reason your antenna traces are so much smaller than STs or zyps?
2018-09-13T12:54:52 < Steffanx> Like half the width
2018-09-13T12:55:05 < catphish> not really, i throw it in a calculator that's what came out
2018-09-13T12:55:24 < zyp> still, that was a tag calculator, not a reader calculator
2018-09-13T12:55:32 < catphish> afaik it's the same
2018-09-13T12:55:56 < catphish> i imagine zyp has a lot less inductance than me with the small size and thick traces, hence the large capacitor
2018-09-13T12:56:37 < zyp> you say that, but most stuff I've seen got more loops on the tag side than the reader side
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2018-09-13T12:56:53 < catphish> i'm aiming for 100pf cap, 1.37uH insuctance
2018-09-13T12:57:30 < catphish> i use the ST eDesignSuite, basically just gives you the inductance for a loop
2018-09-13T12:57:30 < zyp> anyway, if you have a spare board, assemble the matching network and send it to me, and I'll hook it up to the VNA and measure
2018-09-13T12:58:08 < zyp> no need for the chip itself, VNA connects to the signals going to the chip
2018-09-13T12:58:09 < catphish> zyp: i'm just designing my v2 board, with gps and new larger antenna, i'll send one over when it's done :)
2018-09-13T12:58:31 < catphish> with just the passives on
2018-09-13T12:58:34 < catphish> thanks!
2018-09-13T12:59:10 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/uNgNm.JPG <- I only had assembled boards, so I actually cut the tx traces with a scalpel before hooking onto the signals
2018-09-13T12:59:15 < catphish> i considered buying a vna, but even the minivna is a little pricey
2018-09-13T12:59:34 < zyp> after first ruining the board trying to solder to that signal I forgot on the qfn :p
2018-09-13T12:59:39 < catphish> lol nice mess :)
2018-09-13T12:59:40 < zyp> (notice the missing pad)
2018-09-13T13:00:07 < zyp> a bit pricy, sure
2018-09-13T13:00:33 < zyp> but I had a guy wanting to buy 100 readers when I were working on it, so it was easy enough to justify
2018-09-13T13:00:44 < catphish> ideal
2018-09-13T13:01:49 < zyp> oh, and if you're sending me a board, throw in a tape of some suitable small value caps that I can stack to adjust the matching too :)
2018-09-13T13:02:11 < catphish> just looking at https://bin.jvnv.net/file/KmWnr.png - that antenna definitely doesn't have much inductance? what cap value did you end up using?
2018-09-13T13:02:20 < catphish> sure :)
2018-09-13T13:02:29 < zyp> IIRC 180p in addition to what I started out with
2018-09-13T13:02:53 < catphish> yeah that sounds about right, i was aiming for 100 total, which explains the large difference
2018-09-13T13:03:04 < catphish> i was really unsure what the practical difference was, do you know?
2018-09-13T13:03:19 < zyp> yeah, original was 82p, plus another 180p
2018-09-13T13:03:26 < zyp> so 262p in total
2018-09-13T13:03:39 < zyp> and no, I'm not good enough on RF to tell :)
2018-09-13T13:03:53 < catphish> i'll aim to just do the same as ST then :)
2018-09-13T13:04:09 < catphish> they use...
2018-09-13T13:04:23 < zyp> I think I ran some numbers later and found out my inductance was a bit less than recommended, due to the small area
2018-09-13T13:04:24 < catphish> 82p
2018-09-13T13:04:36 < catphish> so i'm aiming for 100
2018-09-13T13:04:39 < zyp> yeah, that's probably where I got the number from
2018-09-13T13:05:02 < catphish> but it ends up needing a huge antenna, or lots of turns, or very thin lines
2018-09-13T13:05:12 < catphish> i tried to compromise on all three
2018-09-13T13:05:46 < catphish> anyway, thanks, i'll send you a device as soon as i have one with the new layout
2018-09-13T13:05:53 < zyp> I think you can kinda do whatever and just tune it to match, as long as you don't go too far out
2018-09-13T13:06:44 < catphish> yeah the important thing is making it resonant if you want decent range / card detection
2018-09-13T13:07:02 < catphish> i have a ton to do on my new layout :( https://i.imgur.com/rqQwzn8.png
2018-09-13T13:07:20 < zyp> looks mostly done already :p
2018-09-13T13:08:16 < catphish> lol, some way
2018-09-13T13:08:44 < zyp> first 90% is done, now you just have to do the remaining 90%
2018-09-13T13:09:57 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-13T13:10:29 < catphish> it's partly a matter of how much i try to cram everything in neatly vs how much i say it's a prototype and better to leave things spread out
2018-09-13T13:10:46 < catphish> the GPS is messy :(
2018-09-13T13:15:34 < zyp> isn't it mostly self contained?
2018-09-13T13:15:57 < zyp> give it power and hook up serial, maybe decouple power a bit, done
2018-09-13T13:16:00 < zyp> no?
2018-09-13T13:22:45 < karlp> zyp: heh, "summer was unusually dry"
2018-09-13T13:22:53 < karlp> you're importing _grass_ from _iceland_ it was that dry :)
2018-09-13T13:24:15 < zyp> karlp, yes, I'm understating it
2018-09-13T13:24:17 < catphish> zyp: yeah, when i say mess, i mostly just mean big
2018-09-13T13:24:18 < zyp> it was extreme
2018-09-13T13:24:28 < catphish> it takes up a big portion of the PCB
2018-09-13T13:24:47 < zyp> catphish, it takes the space it takes
2018-09-13T13:24:57 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-13T13:25:04 < zyp> also, have you checked layout guidelines for it?
2018-09-13T13:25:21 < catphish> yeah, it wants some margin
2018-09-13T13:25:28 < catphish> nothing too tricky though
2018-09-13T13:25:38 < zyp> what about ground plane size?
2018-09-13T13:26:34 < zyp> RF on small boards is a bit tricky, ground plane is part of the board, so it needs to be accounted for
2018-09-13T13:27:50 < catphish> i'll have to check
2018-09-13T13:28:42 < zyp> a gps module I used once looped the antenna signal out of the module and back in again, so I could add a small matching network in case the antenna needed to be tuned for board shape
2018-09-13T13:29:53 < catphish> zyp: https://i.imgur.com/KuMMTMK.png
2018-09-13T13:30:34 < zyp> looks easy enough
2018-09-13T13:30:41 < catphish> i thought so
2018-09-13T13:31:15 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/sTW8U.JPG <- here's the board I refer to, matching network is the three pairs of unpopulated pads between module and the qfn
2018-09-13T13:32:09 < zyp> that module doesn't use a patch antenna though, guess patch antennas might be less sensitive
2018-09-13T13:32:11 < catphish> oh, i had another question
2018-09-13T13:32:19 < catphish> what size do you make your vias?
2018-09-13T13:32:26 < zyp> 10/20 usually
2018-09-13T13:32:32 < catphish> mils?
2018-09-13T13:32:35 < zyp> yes
2018-09-13T13:32:54 < zyp> depends what your fab can do on standard specs though
2018-09-13T13:33:37 < zyp> unless you're doing special stuff, there's no point in paying for better than standard specs
2018-09-13T13:33:41 < catphish> makes sense, smallest drills i can do on standard pcb fab is 0.3mm, so i geuss i'll do 0.3/0.4 which isn't much bigger than 10/20
2018-09-13T13:33:47 < catphish> *0.3/0.6
2018-09-13T13:34:29 < catphish> they can do  0.25mm drills if you pay more, but doesn't seem much point
2018-09-13T13:34:34 < zyp> dongs, what was it you said once, all the stuff I keep designing with 10/20 actually ends up as 12/20 or what?
2018-09-13T13:34:51 < catphish> 0.3mm is 12 mil
2018-09-13T13:35:02 < catphish> so yeah, 12/20 or 12/24 i guess
2018-09-13T13:35:04 < zyp> yeah, 0.3/0.6 is 12/24
2018-09-13T13:35:27 < catphish> what about traces / clearance?
2018-09-13T13:35:59 < catphish> i'm mostly using 10mil traces
2018-09-13T13:36:08 < zyp> most fabs does 6/6 nowadays, but I think I usually design with 8mil wide traces
2018-09-13T13:36:23 < catphish> thanks :)
2018-09-13T13:36:52 < catphish> oh yeah, fab house says 6/6, i prob don't need to go that small
2018-09-13T13:37:22 < zyp> I usually put in 6/6 in design rules but do 8mil traces, so in practice I end up with 8/6 or so
2018-09-13T13:37:33 < catphish> seems sensible
2018-09-13T13:38:09 < zyp> for vias I always just use smallest
2018-09-13T13:38:37 < catphish> i'll try 8/8 and 12/20 for now then i think
2018-09-13T13:38:38 < zyp> no point in going up in size, better to just add more if one is not enough
2018-09-13T13:41:38 < karlp> I somtimes use bigger if theyr'e going to double as probe points,
2018-09-13T13:41:58 < karlp> if I didn't feel like explicitly making "test points" for them in the schematic
2018-09-13T13:42:29 < zyp> I always use tented vias too
2018-09-13T13:46:23 < catphish> i don't really know what to do for test points
2018-09-13T13:49:39 < karlp> "have some" is a good rule
2018-09-13T13:50:00 < karlp> got dead space? place some pads/vias that you can probe or even solder to if necessary.
2018-09-13T13:50:10 < karlp> got spare pins? pull some of them out
2018-09-13T13:50:21 < karlp> especially at prototype stage
2018-09-13T13:50:55 < karlp> pull out an extra uart, pull out i2c, pull out spi, now you can even repurprose your boards.
2018-09-13T13:52:26 < zyp> I specified that on the workstuff that design got outsourced for
2018-09-13T13:52:35 < zyp> but I'm bad at doing that in my own designs :p
2018-09-13T13:54:55 < catphish> yeah i always pull out a uart for basic debugging, i will expose other things i guess if there's space
2018-09-13T14:00:27 < catphish> i should probably do some dayjob now
2018-09-13T14:00:38 < catphish> pesky customers wanting stuff
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2018-09-13T14:37:24 < dongs> zyp, holes?
2018-09-13T14:37:29 < dongs> 0.3/0.5 is ok
2018-09-13T14:39:40 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-13T14:40:11 < zyp> all the designs I've sent you over the years have 10/20 in the gerbers, and I think you once told me that fabs actually drill it to 12 rather than 10
2018-09-13T14:40:20 < dongs> right yeah
2018-09-13T14:40:30 < dongs> unless it was paneled with something highspec
2018-09-13T14:41:17 < zyp> doesn't really matter to me anyway, diameter is 20 and as long as hole somehow fits in there I'm happy
2018-09-13T14:41:24 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-13T14:42:52 < catphish> ideal
2018-09-13T14:49:24 < dongs> what the hell can one do on a $2k iphone: [x] browse facebook [x] listen to apple music [x] take mediocre fuzzy photos [x] turn your face into talking poop [x] pay for more apple shit using apple pay [x] sync with your series 4 apple watch [x] ???? 
2018-09-13T14:50:05 < dongs> did i miss anything groundbreaking and innovative
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2018-09-13T14:51:14 < Thorn> control a smart dildo
2018-09-13T14:57:37 < mawk> no Thorn , the iphone controls it for you
2018-09-13T14:57:41 < mawk> you just have to shove it up your ass
2018-09-13T15:02:35 < mawk> I hope you didn't think one of the innovations was the ability to control anything
2018-09-13T15:08:56 < dongs> zyp, ever seen something like a NFC multiplexer?
2018-09-13T15:09:27 < zyp> in what sense?
2018-09-13T15:09:35 < dongs> like... x antennas to single reader
2018-09-13T15:09:47 < zyp> no, what do you need that for?
2018-09-13T15:09:58 < dongs> http://www.ti.com/lit/an/sloa231/sloa231.pdf huh apparently it exists
2018-09-13T15:10:11 < zyp> I imagine it'd be easier to just throw one reader chip on each antenna and put them all on the same SPI bus
2018-09-13T15:10:28 < catphish> dongs: NFC supports multiplexing multiple cards with the same reader
2018-09-13T15:10:39 < zyp> that's a different thing :p
2018-09-13T15:10:59 < catphish> ie scan for cards in range and activate them one at a time
2018-09-13T15:11:10 < catphish> but not really multiplexing
2018-09-13T15:11:29 < dongs> zyp, is it?
2018-09-13T15:11:37 < zyp> dongs, what is?
2018-09-13T15:11:43 < dongs> 'thats a different thing'
2018-09-13T15:11:51 < zyp> multiple cards on one reader?
2018-09-13T15:12:00 < zyp> yes, that's a protocol handshake thing
2018-09-13T15:12:06 < dongs> ah
2018-09-13T15:13:26 < dongs> i wonder how reasonable would simple RF switch be
2018-09-13T15:13:35 < dongs> for scanning
2018-09-13T15:13:37 < zyp> different protos do that a little bit differently, but basically they treat the RF medium as a broadcast bus, and then do something like a binary search to find card ids when there's more of them at the same time
2018-09-13T15:13:56 < zyp> IIRC a bit similar to how you enumerate devices on an 1-wire bus
2018-09-13T15:14:24 < catphish> zyp: i didn't really understand how they multiplex the replies
2018-09-13T15:14:25 < zyp> dongs, why would you want more than one antenna?
2018-09-13T15:14:41 < dongs> zyp, not for cards. but NFC-tagged "stuff".
2018-09-13T15:14:44 < catphish> my application is strictly one-card :)
2018-09-13T15:14:46 < zyp> catphish, probably some sort of recessive/dominant
2018-09-13T15:14:49 < dongs> they want to detect if a stuff is sitting on a given antenna or not
2018-09-13T15:14:55 < dongs> apparently scanning speed is not an issue
2018-09-13T15:15:07 < dongs> i.e. if it detects antenna#3 is empty or has a tag within 0.1s or something
2018-09-13T15:15:12 < zyp> how many antennas are we talking? what distance are we talking?
2018-09-13T15:15:31 < dongs> apparently 8
2018-09-13T15:15:35 < catphish> seems like it'd always be easier just to install 8 readers
2018-09-13T15:15:51 < dongs> considering the cost of a 8-way RF splitter, probably
2018-09-13T15:15:51 < catphish> and multiplex the SPI
2018-09-13T15:15:53 < zyp> I guess technically you could use any RF switch that handles the frequencies
2018-09-13T15:16:09 < zyp> but I still think 8 reader chips on a bus is the simplest solution
2018-09-13T15:16:19 < catphish> i also think this
2018-09-13T15:17:01 < zyp> or do it like that panasonic charger and add some motors that moves a single antenna around to probe the 8 spots
2018-09-13T15:17:06 < dongs> ahaha
2018-09-13T15:25:22 < jpa-> catphish: did you see this? http://e2e.ti.com/cfs-file/__key/communityserver-discussions-components-files/667/0624.Low-Cost-HF-RFID-Multiplexer-Examples.pdf
2018-09-13T15:26:01 < zyp> it's dongs who's asking
2018-09-13T15:26:06 < jpa-> oh
2018-09-13T15:26:49 < jpa-> everyone is doing nfc nowadays :P
2018-09-13T15:30:17 < catphish> jpa-: lol indeed, i've not had to deal with this
2018-09-13T16:33:18 < kakimir> not me
2018-09-13T16:41:42 < karlp> I wonder at what point I want to use a hash table rather than loop iteration for ~400 strings.
2018-09-13T16:52:19 < zyp> at the point when iterating the loop is starting to have a non-negligible cost
2018-09-13T16:52:47 < zyp> i.e. when you actually have a need to make the lookups go faster
2018-09-13T17:05:23 < karlp> yeah, so I'm going to have to measure it, which is boring.
2018-09-13T17:05:32 < karlp> I think I'll just use a linear list.
2018-09-13T17:08:32 < zyp> as long as the lazy way works, do it the lazy way
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2018-09-13T17:31:36 < englishman> for dongs https://www.automotivelinux.org/
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2018-09-13T18:02:54 < Thorn> lol https://i.imgur.com/ZD5i8kr.jpg
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2018-09-13T18:13:35 < dongs> https://www.monolithicpower.com/pub/media/document/MP2403_r1.0.pdf check this shit out
2018-09-13T18:13:42 < dongs> page 12
2018-09-13T18:13:46 < dongs> C4, softstart cap
2018-09-13T18:13:49 < dongs> goes to GND in schematic
2018-09-13T18:13:53 < dongs> to VIN on layout
2018-09-13T18:14:27 < dongs> Soft-start Control Input. SS controls the soft-start period. Connect a capacitor from SS
2018-09-13T18:14:30 < dongs> to GND to set the soft-start period. A 0.1μF capacitor sets the soft-start period to 15ms.
2018-09-13T18:14:33 < dongs> To disable the soft-start feature, leave SS unconnected. 
2018-09-13T18:20:42 < englishman>  nice
2018-09-13T18:21:07 < karlp> does vin count as unconnected in their mind?
2018-09-13T18:21:14 < dongs> must be
2018-09-13T18:21:14 < englishman> ss is 6v max too
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2018-09-13T18:21:36 < dongs> all the shits with SS pin have always been going to GND
2018-09-13T18:22:42 < englishman> yeah thats the point
2018-09-13T18:23:05 < englishman> connecting it to vin will ensure a hard start
2018-09-13T18:23:10 < dongs> haha
2018-09-13T18:28:21 < Lux> i guess if vin is allready on and you turn it on via enable it doesn't matter, but still weird
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2018-09-13T18:39:52 < kakimir> how to select good boostrap cap value?
2018-09-13T18:40:17 < kakimir> datasheet say that I can throw anything between 0.1µ to 1µ in there
2018-09-13T18:40:40 < kakimir> I have 100nF currently
2018-09-13T18:40:42 < kakimir> works ok
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2018-09-13T18:57:28 < kakimir> recommendations for bootstrap capacitor sizing?
2018-09-13T18:57:35 < dongs> anything works
2018-09-13T18:57:40 < dongs> 0.1uf/0402 works
2018-09-13T18:57:45 < dongs> check what voltage is on bs pin..
2018-09-13T18:58:16 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BnqwzaXn2GD/
2018-09-13T18:58:20 < kakimir> what should I see there dongs ?
2018-09-13T18:58:29 < dongs> cunt
2018-09-13T18:58:39 < dongs> kakimir: the voltage of capacitor you should use
2018-09-13T18:58:42 < kakimir> I'm using MP2315
2018-09-13T19:01:01 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deG4NxkouGM
2018-09-13T19:01:04 < englishman> hurricanecam
2018-09-13T19:02:49 < kakimir> my rigol is hurricane
2018-09-13T19:07:02 < kakimir> can I look bootstrap circuit with scope and see if it needs improvements
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2018-09-13T19:07:37 < Thorn> look how fast it discharges
2018-09-13T19:08:17 < kakimir> hmm square wave with some ringing
2018-09-13T19:08:50 < englishman> turn the bandwidth on the scope down until it goes away
2018-09-13T19:09:18 < Cracki> ya, reducing bandwidth (applying lowpass) certainly will remove any ringing :P
2018-09-13T19:12:53 < kakimir> okay I need 50VDC cap
2018-09-13T19:14:08 < kakimir> highest voltage of the circuit appears to be between bootstrap cap terminals
2018-09-13T19:15:14 < dongs> zyp: do you re member the hd camera SoC that was in chinkcopeter?
2018-09-13T19:15:18 < dongs> it was Hi3xxx someshit
2018-09-13T19:15:20 < dongs> the BGA/wahtever
2018-09-13T19:15:22 < dongs> on the camera board
2018-09-13T19:15:28 < dongs> i think youhaz pics
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2018-09-13T19:30:57 < rcc> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glibc/+bug/1613067
2018-09-13T19:31:12 < rcc> reported for 2 years, nobody gives a shit
2018-09-13T19:31:40 < rcc> that's a crash in getaddrinfo()
2018-09-13T19:34:04 < Steffanx> Awh
2018-09-13T19:38:11 < dongs> Thread 3 "drone" received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
2018-09-13T19:38:14 < dongs> stopped reading here
2018-09-13T19:38:46 < Cracki> ubuntu on a drone?!
2018-09-13T19:38:59 < rcc> don't know what that guy was doing
2018-09-13T19:39:06 < rcc> but the bug is in glibc
2018-09-13T19:39:13 < dongs> https://images01.military.com/sites/default/files/styles/full/public/2018-02/eagledrone1800x1200.jpg?itok=NIP1GKE- this is a drone
2018-09-13T19:39:14 < rcc> it affects everything that's statically linked
2018-09-13T19:39:20 < dongs> what the bug most likely is about, is a chink shitcopter
2018-09-13T19:39:31 < Cracki> ah, "drone ci" and golang
2018-09-13T19:39:48 < Cracki> https://drone.io/
2018-09-13T19:39:52 < dongs> haha, what fucking trash
2018-09-13T19:39:58 < Cracki> these fucktards don't believe that words have meanings...
2018-09-13T19:40:04 < dongs> well, tehy ARE using go
2018-09-13T19:40:09 < dongs> so already beyond saving
2018-09-13T19:41:08 < Cracki> <gdb> [...] addresses that were not mapped in the inferior's process address space [...]
2018-09-13T19:41:13 < Cracki> it's been SJWed too
2018-09-13T19:41:17 < rcc> ah, it must be one of those automated test systems
2018-09-13T19:41:30 < rcc> they're fucking awful
2018-09-13T19:42:00 < rcc> what they should do is speed up development, in the idea that developers would push and keep working, while that thing runs tests
2018-09-13T19:42:24 < rcc> what really happens is that they push and then wait on that shit to run all the fucking tests, even for things that were not touched in years
2018-09-13T19:42:50 < BrainDamage> that's procedure for you
2018-09-13T19:43:28 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-13T19:43:31 < rcc> it's one of the things that pissed me off the most at my old job and part of why I quit
2018-09-13T19:44:40 < rcc> actually, the real reason it became another reason to quit was because I couldn't talk them out of it
2018-09-13T19:45:07 < Cracki> ceremony is important, m'kay
2018-09-13T19:45:11 < rcc> that's when I realized there's nothing else for me there
2018-09-13T19:45:14 < Cracki> don't be a heretic
2018-09-13T19:45:29 < Cracki> you will be burned at the stake if you continue thinking like this
2018-09-13T19:45:46 < Cracki> or stoned to death or something
2018-09-13T19:46:12 < Cracki> smoothbrains
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2018-09-13T19:49:07 < rcc> oh well, I guess I'll just have to dynamically link and make sure every system I deploy this to has the same damn libraries
2018-09-13T19:52:43 < aandrew> oh altium crashes, how I've not missed you
2018-09-13T19:55:29 < kakimir> kicad never crash
2018-09-13T19:55:39 < kakimir> I can't remember when it last time did
2018-09-13T19:57:30  * karlp likes not having to manually test.
2018-09-13T19:57:38 < karlp> if your tests are bad, just fix your tests
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2018-09-13T19:58:18 < karlp> fuck your static linked bullshit
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2018-09-13T20:00:02 < karlp> seems to be pretty heavily a g o problem. https://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=19341
2018-09-13T20:01:16 < rcc> karlp, tests are not the issue, when you have lots of things that go together, they just come with a lot of tests
2018-09-13T20:01:24 < rcc> testing on some of the projects took 20+ minutes
2018-09-13T20:01:31 < rcc> also, you don't have to manually run your tests
2018-09-13T20:01:35 < rcc> but you can run them locally
2018-09-13T20:01:50 < rcc> which means you can make your test system only run certain tests
2018-09-13T20:01:51 < karlp> and you got upset that ests were being run and quit.  nice.
2018-09-13T20:02:27 < rcc> karlp, tests were being run and you had to wait for the result
2018-09-13T20:02:52 < rcc> it's rare when you can code, delegate the test and then continue coding
2018-09-13T20:03:09 < rcc> you're always waiting for feedback on your code, otherwise you can't continue (most of the time)
2018-09-13T20:03:15 < karlp> still don't see why that's something that would make you quit your job
2018-09-13T20:03:25 < rcc> not to mention that it's very distracting to continue and learn your previous code failed the test
2018-09-13T20:03:40 < rcc> it's the fact that I couldn't impose my will anymore
2018-09-13T20:04:23 < rcc> afk
2018-09-13T20:10:11 < Cracki> >waiting 20 minutes for every commit
2018-09-13T20:10:17 < Cracki> >why would you quit your job?
2018-09-13T20:11:06 < Cracki> >why would you struggle against abuse?
2018-09-13T20:14:13 < jpa-> rcc: usually you would have two sets of tests, the stuff that catches most bugs quickly in a minute or two, and then the second set that you can leave running automatically and rarely fails
2018-09-13T20:14:44 < jpa-> the second set would usually include stuff like fuzztests that can take weeks to run
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2018-09-13T20:15:34 < karlp> no, they weren't interested.
2018-09-13T20:19:21 < rcc> jpa-, it wasn't possible
2018-09-13T20:19:56 < rcc> incompetence manifests itself on all levels
2018-09-13T20:20:12 < rcc> things were so intertwined, you couldn't have done it any other way
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2018-09-13T20:24:37 < rcc> that wasn't everything tho, I just didn't feel ok working with b-grade developers, let alone being told what to do by one
2018-09-13T20:24:56 < englishman> go is great
2018-09-13T20:25:06 < englishman> you can compile for webasm now
2018-09-13T20:25:35 < jpa-> rcc: you don't even need such elaborate reasons to switch places, "i wanted something new" is enough
2018-09-13T20:25:56 < jpa-> but just blaming it all on "automatic tests are awful" is false
2018-09-13T20:26:21 < rcc> I'm not blaming it all, it was just part of the drop that filled the glass
2018-09-13T20:26:48 < rcc> and I run automatic tests too, just not like that
2018-09-13T20:27:25 < rcc> when the new CTO got hired, he came up with his own team and changed basically everything
2018-09-13T20:28:59 < zyp> dongs, yeah?
2018-09-13T20:29:43 < zyp> dongs, https://bin.jvnv.net/file/eCZis.jpg
2018-09-13T20:29:58 < Cracki> nobody said "automatic tests are awful"
2018-09-13T20:30:06 < Cracki> claiming that is ingenious
2018-09-13T20:30:31 < Cracki> dis-
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2018-09-13T20:34:13 < jpa-> Cracki: well, "automatic test systems" "they're fucking awful" is a direct quote from rcc - and true, that's different than just automatic tests, but even claiming that automatic test systems in general are awful is false
2018-09-13T20:34:27 < Cracki> selective quotes.
2018-09-13T20:35:06 < jpa-> doesn't seem too selective to me
2018-09-13T20:35:15 < Cracki> don't defend something that wasn't criticized.
2018-09-13T20:35:25 < jpa-> what's the point of quoting if you don't select part that you quote? :D
2018-09-13T20:35:31 < Cracki> he criticized shit practices.
2018-09-13T20:35:57 < Cracki> to quote you: "automatic test systems in general are awful"
2018-09-13T20:36:07 < Cracki> see how that can be done? :)
2018-09-13T20:36:19 < jpa-> he *should have* criticized shit practices, he *did* criticize a lot of other stuff that is not to blame
2018-09-13T20:36:39 < jpa-> meh, now you're just being plain stupid
2018-09-13T20:36:44 < Cracki> can't help you with that impression
2018-09-13T20:36:48 < jpa-> fortunately i have a cure for that
2018-09-13T20:36:57 < rcc> jpa-, they may not be to blame, but I wouldn't employ them in my company, simply because I know what they lead to
2018-09-13T20:37:19 < rcc> I recognized why they were made and why they're supposed to be useful
2018-09-13T20:37:27 < rcc> but in reality, they're not, they're constantly misused like that
2018-09-13T20:37:58 < rcc> and again, I'm using automated testing too, just that I do my tests before I commit, not after
2018-09-13T20:38:03 < jpa-> rcc: how would you manage running long-taking tests then?
2018-09-13T20:38:04 < rcc> I think that's where the flaw is
2018-09-13T20:38:16 < jpa-> of course you must *also* have a quick set that you can run before commit
2018-09-13T20:38:51 < jpa-> but there are a lot of tests like long regression test suites and fuzz testing that will always take a long time and there is not much you can do about it
2018-09-13T20:38:53 < rcc> jpa-, you're saying (and I'm sure you'd do it too) because you're not stupid
2018-09-13T20:38:58 < rcc> but that's not the case with everyone
2018-09-13T20:39:28 < rcc> most teams are largely incompetent code monkeys
2018-09-13T20:39:30 < jpa-> yeah, but then the problem is the lack of short test suite, not the existence of long test suite + automatic runner
2018-09-13T20:39:39 < rcc> that's the truth across the entire industry
2018-09-13T20:39:52 < jpa-> "everything is shit" - true across the entire galaxy
2018-09-13T20:39:56 < rcc> that's why you need lead devs on each team (someone has to be wiser)
2018-09-13T20:40:21 < rcc> jpa-, I agree, that's not the problem
2018-09-13T20:40:46 < rcc> but in the current state of affairs, that's the catalist for shitty practices
2018-09-13T20:41:03 < rcc> and lots of wasted time (money)
2018-09-13T20:41:29 < jpa-> at most it is an enabler - but i think without the automatic test runners, shitty teams would just have some even more horrible procedure
2018-09-13T20:42:12 < rcc> jpa-, I disagree, everyone is annoyed that they have to wait for tests to finish
2018-09-13T20:42:22 < rcc> I think even shitty teams, if they're forced to run tests, will try to optimize
2018-09-13T20:42:42 < jpa-> how would you force them?
2018-09-13T20:43:06 < rcc> jpa-: please run the full stack of tests for every release
2018-09-13T20:43:17 < jpa-> lack of test runner just leads to commiting without testing, of course
2018-09-13T20:43:19 < rcc> then they'd figure out that it's a good idea to run it in the middle as well
2018-09-13T20:43:33 < rcc> and they can decide on the frequency and coverage of the tests
2018-09-13T20:44:07 < rcc> that, IMO, is the best approach, rather than relying on some automated test system that does it every time, like you'd expect a stupid machine to do it
2018-09-13T20:44:19 < jpa-> but yeah, i got bored of this discussion already
2018-09-13T20:44:27 < rcc> jpa-, yes, committing without testing is fine
2018-09-13T20:44:35 < rcc> they can decide how often they have to test
2018-09-13T20:44:58 < rcc> if the test takes 2 hours, screw it, just run the program see it does what it does and run the test every couple of days or something
2018-09-13T20:45:09 < rcc> the point is that it should be up to the developer how he does these things
2018-09-13T20:45:19 < jpa-> .. and how was it not?
2018-09-13T20:45:21 < rcc> otherwise it's just going to be another bottleneck
2018-09-13T20:45:38 < jpa-> you did say you *could* run tests before commiting if you wanted to
2018-09-13T20:45:42 < rcc> jpa-, it was automatic and run way more tests than necessary
2018-09-13T20:45:50 < rcc> no, I said I AM doing that
2018-09-13T20:46:08 < rcc> with this system you relied entirely on the test system for it
2018-09-13T20:46:22 < jpa-> what was stopping you from running some of the tests locally?
2018-09-13T20:46:46 < rcc> jpa-, you couldn't run just some of the tests
2018-09-13T20:46:55 < jpa-> what made it impossible?
2018-09-13T20:47:27 < rcc> the architecture of the whole thing + the procedure
2018-09-13T20:47:39 < rcc> it was mandated that all tests (that included the ones for the frameworks) to be run all the time
2018-09-13T20:47:59 < rcc> this was the procedure, you committed, everything got tested from scratch
2018-09-13T20:48:18 < rcc> that meant databases being deployed for each test, full framework set-up, etc
2018-09-13T20:48:54 < jpa-> architecture is for you to fix, the procedure probably didn't forbid running smaller test suite locally
2018-09-13T20:50:17 < rcc> jpa-, no, that's what we were told to do and I don't know anyone that ran smaller tests on those projects
2018-09-13T20:50:29 < rcc> I refused to work on them and could run things my own way
2018-09-13T20:50:38 < rcc> but I was being pressured towards that thing too
2018-09-13T20:51:16 < jpa-> yeah, so all fault elsewhere than in automatic runners
2018-09-13T20:51:49 < rcc> yeah, I guess this is very similar to the guns discussion
2018-09-13T20:52:02 < rcc> the fault is not with the guns
2018-09-13T20:52:10 < jpa-> it is just wishful thinking that those "b-class developers" would suddenly make things smarter if there weren't automatic runners, when *you* didn't make them smarter even though you knew there was a better way
2018-09-13T20:52:21 < rcc> it's just that they have the possibility of inflicting a lot of damage, in the wrong hands
2018-09-13T20:52:32 < rcc> my point is that there are a lot of wrong hands out there
2018-09-13T20:53:20 < jpa-> you just think so, it could be that the automatic test runners in that place actually saved them a lot of time compared to fixing failed releases in the field after *nobody* ran the tests
2018-09-13T20:54:35 < rcc> jpa-, possibly, but my team worked just fine before that
2018-09-13T20:55:02 < rcc> I have to run, ttyl
2018-09-13T20:55:41 < rcc> and no, they didn't save time, they wasted it, that was my grief with it
2018-09-13T20:56:20 < rcc> everyone wasting, sometimes, upwards of 2h/day was just stupid
2018-09-13T20:56:33 < rcc> anyway, really have to go, ttyl
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2018-09-13T22:07:19 < qyx> farnell down?
2018-09-13T22:07:56 < rcc> nope
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2018-09-13T22:44:46 < kakimir> anyone chess?
2018-09-13T22:47:20 < kakimir> not much
2018-09-13T22:47:27 < kakimir> it's same in everything
2018-09-13T22:47:39 < kakimir> first you get to base level
2018-09-13T22:47:51 < kakimir> after that improvements are harder and harder
2018-09-13T22:49:40 < kakimir> but I was pretty intrigued
2018-09-13T22:49:58 < kakimir> some flow in the games
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2018-09-13T22:54:37 < jadew> kakimir, where do you play?
2018-09-13T22:54:42 < kakimir> chess.com
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2018-09-13T22:55:03 < kakimir> jadew: do you want game link to lichess?
2018-09-13T22:55:14 < kakimir> no registering required
2018-09-13T22:55:38 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-13T22:55:41 < jadew> sure, but not atm
2018-09-13T22:55:42 < kakimir> unless
2018-09-13T22:55:47 < kakimir> you log in
2018-09-13T22:55:52 < kakimir> and I give you link
2018-09-13T22:55:59 < kakimir> then there is nicks and flags
2018-09-13T22:56:12 < kakimir> and others can spectate
2018-09-13T22:56:43 < catphish> how do you people do electronics, it's just so hard
2018-09-13T22:57:02 < jadew> catphish, we don't, we find distractions, like online chess
2018-09-13T22:57:09 < kakimir> catphish: time
2018-09-13T22:57:10 < catphish> i mean, where do all those electrons even go
2018-09-13T22:57:11 < jadew> lol crt
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2018-09-13T22:58:14 < jadew> kakimir, how fast can you beat me? I just know the rules, don't know any strategies
2018-09-13T22:58:32 < catphish> no time for chess :(
2018-09-13T22:58:45 < jadew> that's why I want a quick game
2018-09-13T23:00:05 < kakimir> jadew: 5-10min
2018-09-13T23:00:13 < jadew> ok, let's do it
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2018-09-13T23:07:48 < Steffanx> Uh superbia1?
2018-09-13T23:09:52 < Steffanx> Ok
2018-09-13T23:10:13 < jadew> kakimir?
2018-09-13T23:13:46 < kakimir> sorry jadew I was chatting
2018-09-13T23:13:51 < kakimir> just a sec
2018-09-13T23:14:15 < jadew> ok, give me a sec to wash my hands
2018-09-13T23:15:11 < englishman> another quality install https://i.imgur.com/CYHUST9.jpg
2018-09-13T23:16:24 < kakimir> ready jadew ?
2018-09-13T23:16:25 < jadew> back
2018-09-13T23:16:27 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-13T23:16:49 < kakimir> DM
2018-09-13T23:17:09 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/LRFdUydW
2018-09-13T23:17:14 < jadew> I'm in
2018-09-13T23:17:16 < kakimir> spectate url
2018-09-13T23:27:25 < jadew> I am
2018-09-13T23:28:52 < kakimir> should have moved king to side and block with that thing that does 45
2018-09-13T23:29:03 < kakimir> not let that tower in there
2018-09-13T23:29:24 < jadew> brb 1 min
2018-09-13T23:29:26 < jadew> it's your turn
2018-09-13T23:30:25 < jadew> back
2018-09-13T23:30:36 < kakimir> yes I had enought time to make another big mistake
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2018-09-13T23:31:22 < kakimir> I resign
2018-09-13T23:31:33 < jadew> why?
2018-09-13T23:32:47 < jadew> did you resign?
2018-09-13T23:33:04 < jadew> I thought I lost a couple of moves ago
2018-09-13T23:33:27 < kakimir> jadew: you were winning whole the time
2018-09-13T23:33:27 < jadew> what do I do now?
2018-09-13T23:33:36 < kakimir> let's play another
2018-09-13T23:33:46 < jadew> I thought I had a good start, but after that I felt I did a poor job
2018-09-13T23:34:04 < jadew> sure, give me a sec, I have to pour some water into a soup that's cooking
2018-09-13T23:34:12 < zyp> I can play one
2018-09-13T23:34:19 < kakimir> okay zyp
2018-09-13T23:34:34 < kakimir> DM
2018-09-13T23:34:42 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/7bW7Wrkm spec
2018-09-13T23:38:32 < kakimir> luckily only superbia1 is watching this mess
2018-09-13T23:38:42 < jadew> I'm watching too, but I didn't catch
2018-09-13T23:38:47 < jadew> what did you trade your queen for?
2018-09-13T23:39:39 < kakimir> nothing.
2018-09-13T23:39:42 < jadew> lol
2018-09-13T23:51:48 < zyp> :)
2018-09-13T23:51:52 < jadew> gg
2018-09-13T23:51:58 < kakimir> gg
2018-09-13T23:52:04 < zyp> that was fun
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2018-09-13T23:52:29 < jadew> you do have some tricks up your sleeve zyp :)
2018-09-13T23:53:05 < jadew> on that last few moves, I would have taken the turn (what's that piece called that goes straight?)
2018-09-13T23:53:08 < jadew> roock?
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2018-09-13T23:53:23 < englishman> rook
2018-09-13T23:53:27 < jadew> thanks
2018-09-13T23:53:39 < jadew> I would have taken it with the one that goes diagonally
2018-09-13T23:53:46 < englishman> bishop
2018-09-13T23:53:50 < jadew> yes, thank you
2018-09-13T23:53:55 < zyp> yeah, I sacrificed it
2018-09-13T23:53:58 < jadew> would have given you a better chance
2018-09-13T23:54:11 < jadew> you = kakimir
2018-09-13T23:54:35 < zyp> I expected the rook to be captured, I sacrificed it to take the bishop
2018-09-13T23:54:39 < zyp> with my bishop
2018-09-13T23:55:07 < jadew> yeah, I figured that's what you wanted but leaving it there was more dangerous than playing along
2018-09-13T23:55:40 < zyp> according to analysis, it was a win even before that move
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2018-09-13T23:56:52 < jadew> I didn't hit the analysis button on my game
2018-09-13T23:57:05 < jadew> what does it do?
2018-09-13T23:57:19 < zyp> I like looking at analysis after the game
2018-09-13T23:57:27 < zyp> you get a computer evaluation of each position
2018-09-13T23:57:40 < jadew> sounds useful
--- Day changed Fri Sep 14 2018
2018-09-14T00:01:09 < zyp> another, anyone?
2018-09-14T00:01:43 < kakimir> zyp: you engine too?
2018-09-14T00:01:47 < jadew> I have some stuff to do, so maybe later or tomorrow
2018-09-14T00:01:50 < zyp> not while playing
2018-09-14T00:02:09 < jadew> + it looks like I have train before playing you
2018-09-14T00:02:22 < zyp> engine would defeat the entire point
2018-09-14T00:02:32 < kakimir> now I have lost to everyone today
2018-09-14T00:02:36 < kakimir> time to watch a movie
2018-09-14T00:02:36 < jadew> lol
2018-09-14T00:02:39 < zyp> aww
2018-09-14T00:02:42 < kakimir> even at chess.com
2018-09-14T00:02:46 < kakimir> but one draw!
2018-09-14T00:02:50 < zyp> I'm still wondering who I played yesterday
2018-09-14T00:02:55 < jadew> that's not a loss!
2018-09-14T00:03:00 < kakimir> mysteryman zyp 
2018-09-14T00:03:06 < jadew> ah, you guys are playing regularly
2018-09-14T00:03:14 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-14T00:03:20 < kakimir> ##chess32
2018-09-14T00:03:39 < zyp> not sure if two rounds yesterday and one today counts as regularly
2018-09-14T00:03:53 < kakimir> it's begin
2018-09-14T00:03:55 < jadew> well, I've only played a little online, a bit more than 10 years ago
2018-09-14T00:04:13 < jadew> and before that, only as a kid
2018-09-14T00:04:28 < zyp> I've just played casual games with friends, mostly as a kid
2018-09-14T00:04:33 < jadew> so, I should be easily tricked
2018-09-14T00:04:53 < zyp> I don't know any opening theory or that sort of stuff
2018-09-14T00:04:58 < jadew> you made some moves that I didn't forsee, so I would have lost too
2018-09-14T00:05:04 < jadew> me neither
2018-09-14T00:05:06 < zyp> :)
2018-09-14T00:05:26 < zyp> I don't think I'm looking very far ahead
2018-09-14T00:05:31 < zyp> couple of moves, maybe
2018-09-14T00:06:11 < jadew> I think the trick is to remember there's an entire table, not just an area of interest (that seemed to be my weak spot)
2018-09-14T00:06:48 < zyp> yeah
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2018-09-14T00:20:22 < rcc> you know what's a better game? worms reloaded
2018-09-14T00:20:39 < zyp> I played that as a kid too
2018-09-14T00:21:09 < rcc> you probably played the original, which was also nice
2018-09-14T00:21:11 < zyp> hmm, not reloaded, one of the older ones
2018-09-14T00:21:22 < rcc> reloaded is very well done
2018-09-14T00:21:32 < rcc> and it's funny
2018-09-14T00:21:53 < zyp> I'm thinking of worms armageddon
2018-09-14T00:22:09 < rcc> right, that was is also very popular, but I didn't enjoy it that much
2018-09-14T00:22:18 < zyp> but yeah, I played a few of the other ones around that age too
2018-09-14T00:22:19 < rcc> reloaded is much more dynamic
2018-09-14T00:23:00 < Steffanx> i played worms 2. best imho :P
2018-09-14T00:23:19 < Steffanx> or wasnt it 2
2018-09-14T00:23:36 < zyp> onceupona timetherewere …
2018-09-14T00:23:42 < zyp> was that worms 2?
2018-09-14T00:23:48 < rcc> I think both worms 1 and 2 were DOS games, no?
2018-09-14T00:23:48 < Steffanx> it  was worms. no addition
2018-09-14T00:23:57 < Steffanx> 1995
2018-09-14T00:24:08 < rcc> I own most of them on steam
2018-09-14T00:24:12 < BrainDamage> wroms 2 had a windows gui
2018-09-14T00:24:14 < Steffanx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ckbNvrM83A <3
2018-09-14T00:24:20 < BrainDamage> and the best weapon editor
2018-09-14T00:24:23 < Steffanx> still love the tune.
2018-09-14T00:24:39 < BrainDamage> worms armageddon was the third, best overall game, but not as good weapon editor
2018-09-14T00:24:51 < Steffanx> vs pc was waaaay to hard
2018-09-14T00:25:02 < Steffanx> the perfect shots with a bazooka 
2018-09-14T00:25:14 < BrainDamage> with all the wind
2018-09-14T00:25:26 < Steffanx> yeah
2018-09-14T00:26:00 < kakimir> anyone done charger detetion with GPIOs and ADC pins?
2018-09-14T00:26:27 < Steffanx> kamikazeeeeeee, fuck you. bye bye.
2018-09-14T00:26:40 < Steffanx> oh dear
2018-09-14T00:27:17 < Steffanx> i downloaded it from steam once. it was much better in my memory.
2018-09-14T00:27:43 < rcc> you should get worms reloaded, then I'd have someone to play with
2018-09-14T00:27:55 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KE2XtQaMb5I this is nice game
2018-09-14T00:28:04 < kakimir> liero means "worm"
2018-09-14T00:28:59 < Steffanx> best funnish game is that my summer car or something
2018-09-14T00:29:07 < Steffanx> the funnish drunk driving game
2018-09-14T00:29:18 < BrainDamage> be extreemly careful about liero
2018-09-14T00:29:29 < kakimir> why?
2018-09-14T00:29:34 < BrainDamage> I've played it once with a friend, ended up staying up to 3am
2018-09-14T00:29:44 < BrainDamage> it's even more addictive than worms
2018-09-14T00:29:54 < kakimir> it's real time action
2018-09-14T00:29:54 < rcc> it sure looks fun
2018-09-14T00:29:56 < rcc> it's real time
2018-09-14T00:29:58 < rcc> yeah
2018-09-14T00:30:13 < kakimir> we had problem back in the days with nkey limit
2018-09-14T00:31:11 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsoxweJZVqA
2018-09-14T00:31:13 < BrainDamage> http://www.openlierox.net/
2018-09-14T00:31:16 < kakimir> morel liero
2018-09-14T00:31:28 < kakimir> internets game!
2018-09-14T00:31:36 < kakimir> windows
2018-09-14T00:31:41 < kakimir> this is fantastic
2018-09-14T00:31:55 < zyp> I remember one of the groups in my C++ uni class were making a networked liero clone for their project
2018-09-14T00:32:21 < kakimir> heavy compared to original
2018-09-14T00:32:25 < kakimir> 83M zip
2018-09-14T00:33:01 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-14T00:33:13 < zyp> crt, oh btw, I saw we got some EV chargers from you
2018-09-14T00:33:36 < rcc> that works over the internet?
2018-09-14T00:33:42 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/G1kED.jpg
2018-09-14T00:34:05 < rcc> let's play
2018-09-14T00:34:55 < Steffanx> no u235?
2018-09-14T00:35:26 < Steffanx> crt is a known u235 fan
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2018-09-14T00:39:30 < jadew> kakimir, if you want a rematch let me know
2018-09-14T00:39:32 < jadew> I'm available now
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2018-09-14T00:40:00 < jadew> as for worms, even if I'm busy, I can make time :P
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2018-09-14T00:42:36 < Steffanx> I still have the tune in my head. Love it :)
2018-09-14T00:45:41 < kakimir> some time has passed since I had worms installed
2018-09-14T00:45:57 < jadew> I wanted to see which versions I have and I don't remember my steam password
2018-09-14T00:46:20 < kakimir> do you have still your registed email address?
2018-09-14T00:46:36 < jadew> yeah, I can recover it
2018-09-14T00:47:21 < kakimir> keepassxc
2018-09-14T00:47:27 < jadew> remembered it
2018-09-14T00:48:20 < jadew> I have the first one and 5 more, but not worms 2
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2018-09-14T00:48:41 < jadew> anyway, if anyone wants to play worms reloaded, let me know
2018-09-14T00:50:15 < Steffanx> Pass
2018-09-14T00:51:29 < jadew> are you bringing?
2018-09-14T00:51:35 < kakimir> I have beer
2018-09-14T00:52:21 < kakimir> and it's not Vick!
2018-09-14T00:53:36 < Steffanx> vb?
2018-09-14T00:53:53 < jadew> ok, now I want a beer
2018-09-14T00:54:10 < Steffanx> beer for breakfast.. sure thats a good idea/
2018-09-14T00:54:12 < Steffanx> ?
2018-09-14T00:54:43 < Steffanx> youre not 18 anymore
2018-09-14T00:54:49 < kakimir> it's "Rainbow"
2018-09-14T00:55:57 < kakimir> generic brand
2018-09-14T00:57:23 < kakimir> ##drunk32
2018-09-14T00:57:31 < jadew> made myself some juice from syrup
2018-09-14T01:03:17 < karlp> stupid cmsis rtos.  uses uints for all return values, but says, "error return values have highest bit set" and all error codes are actually just -1, -2, -3, -4
2018-09-14T01:03:23 < karlp> "just call it a damn int you losers!"
2018-09-14T01:04:16 < karlp> zyp: those are more from my old hood than from crt's hood (the ev charger)
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2018-09-14T02:10:11 < catphish> hopefully this'll do: https://imgur.com/a/m3pybtp
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2018-09-14T02:19:03 < catphish> i'm literally doing that exact thing now, just remembered
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2018-09-14T03:33:26 < catphish> slightly more better: https://i.imgur.com/tokAxKM.png
2018-09-14T03:39:18 < aandrew> catphish: you should not line your vias up like that
2018-09-14T03:39:28 < aandrew> you create a slot in the ground layer
2018-09-14T03:39:36 < aandrew> (northwest of the U1 designator)
2018-09-14T03:40:02 < branjb> but it looks nice
2018-09-14T03:40:06 < branjb> that's the important part
2018-09-14T03:40:10 < catphish> it does looks nice :(
2018-09-14T03:40:27 < catphish> they're really just test points, they don't need to be drilled at all
2018-09-14T03:41:06 < branjb> those are some nicely lined up caps i must say
2018-09-14T03:41:10 < aandrew> I'm about to embark on a pretty crazy layout
2018-09-14T03:41:45 < aandrew> I'm actually surprised
2018-09-14T03:41:51 < catphish> branjb: i do like the antenna matching network, it's the only part of this board that isn't a mess really
2018-09-14T03:42:01 < aandrew> I could switch one vault component for another with the select similar and pasting the new vault id
2018-09-14T03:42:15 < aandrew> it fucked up the positioning of the normally hidden value but I'm surprised
2018-09-14T03:42:22 < branjb> what are you doing with GPS and NFC?
2018-09-14T03:42:26 < aandrew> I now have 200 0402 100nF instead of 90 0603 and 110 0402 :-)
2018-09-14T03:42:36 < aandrew> branjb: he wants to know where he tagged in :-)
2018-09-14T03:42:46 < catphish> branjb: sports timing device
2018-09-14T03:42:53 < branjb> ahh
2018-09-14T03:43:07 < catphish> aandrew: where and more importantly when :)
2018-09-14T03:43:48 < aandrew> hm, only 9 schematic symbols without a footprint, I was expecting a lot more
2018-09-14T03:44:56 < catphish> branjb: i've been bothing people here for help with this for a couple of weeks now :) hopefully i'm nearly there with a working prototype
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2018-09-14T03:45:42 < branjb> yeah I caught some of the pcb antenna stuff
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2018-09-14T03:52:19 < catphish> undrilled, and unaligned, to maximize the clearance: https://i.imgur.com/VHJ5t6c.png
2018-09-14T03:52:38 < catphish> hopefully i won't need them
2018-09-14T03:54:08 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/SRCfkGj that's what I was working on
2018-09-14T03:54:15 < aandrew> 5 of those go with this monster board I'm now working on
2018-09-14T03:54:33 < catphish> neat :)
2018-09-14T03:54:41 < Thorn> ugh wat https://www.spacex.com/webcast
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2018-09-14T04:17:58 < branjb> catphish what gps are you using?
2018-09-14T04:20:51 < catphish> https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm
2018-09-14T04:21:28 < branjb> >login to view datasheet
2018-09-14T04:21:37 < catphish> mostly because it's the cheapest device i could find, and it takes care of the antenna
2018-09-14T04:21:46 < branjb> what pins are you using on it?  I notice there is more than 4 being used
2018-09-14T04:22:25 < branjb> v+,gnd,tx,rx ?  
2018-09-14T04:22:27 < catphish> "spec download" no login needed
2018-09-14T04:23:12 < catphish> i'm using gnd, gnd, tx, rx, vcc, v_backup
2018-09-14T04:23:16 < branjb> o
2018-09-14T04:24:00 < Thorn> what do I do with LPC1549, I bought 10 of them
2018-09-14T04:24:07 < catphish> enough to power it via a mosfet switch, maintain the data when it's off, and communicate
2018-09-14T04:24:33 < catphish> buy an stm32 instead?
2018-09-14T04:24:34 < Thorn> CAN + SCTimer implies some motor control application
2018-09-14T04:25:14 < dongs> hi dongs
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2018-09-14T05:00:52 < branjb> ran out of gas going 80 on my motorcycle today
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2018-09-14T05:22:08 < aandrew> how does that work, just immediate slowdown or more of a coast?
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2018-09-14T05:24:47 < dongs> head over handlebars
2018-09-14T05:36:03 < englishman> your motor blows the fuck up due to lean condition and puts a piston through your jaw
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2018-09-14T06:14:22 < cjbaird> Magnetic Loop antenna done. Seems to have a bandwidth of about 10-15 kHz at 21Mhz.. that'll be interesting trying to do 3kHz-wide voice on.. (designed for CW tho)
2018-09-14T06:16:26 < cjbaird> Takes about 20 rotations of the reduction gear input to sweep across the SWR bandwidth, a bit high, but better than too low..
2018-09-14T06:33:50 < cjbaird> Just in time for the Radio Club meeting tonight. Those are exactly like Anime Club, except with guys older than 60. The first meet I went too had someone banned from the local Echolink node because he only used it from his iPhone, and he spazzed out just like a Furry being banned from SomethingAwful. Aww.
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2018-09-14T06:44:21 < Ultrasauce> all it took was hitting my local vhf repeaters a few times for me to lose all interest in actually, yknow, talking to people in the hobby
2018-09-14T06:45:59 < englishman> cant talk with your hands over the radio
2018-09-14T06:46:44 < englishman> oh nvm i mistook you with barindamage again. you are the same colour
2018-09-14T06:46:55 < Ultrasauce> i am paler tbh
2018-09-14T06:47:25 < cjbaird> Same. Made three attempts, and each time got shat on/over. Tried a callback after a local weekly news broadcast, another guy kept pumping 50W into the FM repeater wiping my attempts to call out. Another time got told I was playing 'silly buggers with the repeater', ...
2018-09-14T06:47:28 < englishman> potato diet vs tomato diet
2018-09-14T06:48:17 < ds2> what's the difference? they are from the same family 
2018-09-14T06:48:59 < cjbaird> On top of that, it took over a year just to get assessed for the licence in the first place-- and that involved going somewhere else 200 kms away, because the local guys were cunts.
2018-09-14T06:49:35 < cjbaird> Looking at repeating that for the licence upgrade, too. 
2018-09-14T06:49:37 < ds2> cjbird: where is this?
2018-09-14T06:52:35 < cjbaird> VK2, NSW Australia.
2018-09-14T06:53:43 < cjbaird> 30 years ago, local hams were doing Analogue TV.. 15 years ago, Digital Modes.. Today.. 4WD owners giving Driveway Proximity Updates. :/
2018-09-14T06:55:54 < cjbaird> Local cuntism: Was looking around the historical exhibits in the Westlakes/VK2ATZ clubhouse.. and the club Secretary loses it, thinking I'm scoping the place out for stuff to steal.
2018-09-14T06:56:48 < cjbaird> And then I became 'a person of interest' when someone's 1Tb portable HDD disappeared. "I have like 20 of those, dickhead."
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2018-09-14T07:58:37 < cjbaird> stm32 project idea-- the cw mate has done a arduino/DSS SWR meter. Could use emeb's speech synthesizer to have something that reports the SWR while you're up on the roof..
2018-09-14T07:59:17 < cjbaird> *DDS
2018-09-14T08:01:10 < Thorn> there was some device that even transmits the synthesized speech over some walkie talkie band 
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2018-09-14T08:02:33 < cjbaird> Yep, know of it.
2018-09-14T08:04:35 < cjbaird> Just a simple FM transmitter/exciter onto the audio would get you that.
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2018-09-14T10:53:11 < catphish> boards ordered - https://imgur.com/a/b5Yb8Gu - zyp i'll send you a couple with a pile of extra caps in a week or so :)
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2018-09-14T10:55:34 < catphish> this board uses PKLCS1212E4001-R1 - i will report in its noisiness
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2018-09-14T11:40:10 < jadew> Laurenceb, did you exchange all your english money into other money yet?
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2018-09-14T11:40:41 < jadew> I hear a no-deal brexit is on the horizon
2018-09-14T11:40:59 < jadew> that's gonna suck big time
2018-09-14T11:44:23 < friendofafriend> Ah, you'll be fine.
2018-09-14T11:44:55 < jadew> I'm looking forward to see where farnell is going to relocate
2018-09-14T11:45:06 < dongs> china
2018-09-14T11:45:58 < friendofafriend> I guess you it'd go smoother if you posed a threat to Germany, then they'd just angle to get you out like they did France.
2018-09-14T11:46:29 < friendofafriend> And leave Green and Spain on.  It's so totally the Fourth Reich.
2018-09-14T11:46:36 < friendofafriend> Greece**
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2018-09-14T11:53:41 < catphish> jadew: i hope farnell will locate to somewhere with faster servers
2018-09-14T11:53:58 < jadew> that would be romania
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2018-09-14T12:20:00 < Steffanx> Is Laurenceb alive, do you know, crt?
2018-09-14T12:20:10 < Steffanx> Hes been quiet lately
2018-09-14T12:20:18 < dongs> https://www.thestar.com/news/cannabis/2018/09/13/canadians-who-smoke-marijuana-legally-or-work-or-invest-in-the-industry-will-be-barred-from-the-us-customs-and-border-protection-official.html bad news for englishman 
2018-09-14T12:20:37 < dongs> hi crt
2018-09-14T12:20:39 < dongs> im innovating
2018-09-14T12:22:21 < dongs> more ilke PPAP
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2018-09-14T12:24:28 < Steffanx> Seems i need the urban dict. again to have a clue what you two are on
2018-09-14T12:24:42 < dongs> .google PPAP is not hard
2018-09-14T12:24:56 < dongs> or PP4l for that matter
2018-09-14T12:25:23 < catphish> i'm still baffled why my country is so committed to outlawing marijuana
2018-09-14T12:25:29 < Steffanx> Yes, urban dictionary it is.
2018-09-14T12:25:35 < dongs> its fucking awful thats why
2018-09-14T12:25:51 < dongs> should switch to singapore way of handing weed
2018-09-14T12:25:55 < dongs> death penalty if found
2018-09-14T12:26:06 < catphish> my only problem with weed is it doesn't seem to have any worthwhile effect on me :(
2018-09-14T12:26:14 < Steffanx> You are welcome in the netherlands catphish 
2018-09-14T12:26:25 < dongs> is stfn a stoner
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2018-09-14T12:26:37 < catphish> i go from 0 to sick with nothing pleasant in between :(
2018-09-14T12:27:17 < catphish> Steffanx: i must revisit ams some time
2018-09-14T12:27:39 < catphish> beautiful canals innit
2018-09-14T12:27:49 < c10ud> why the fuck HAL+embOS uart receive on interrupt fucks so hard when NrtosTasks > 1 ?
2018-09-14T12:27:55 < c10ud> in b4: HAL+embOS
2018-09-14T12:28:24 < Steffanx> Lol no dongs. I dont do drugs
2018-09-14T12:28:53 < catphish> i do alcohol quite a lot
2018-09-14T12:29:15 < catphish> best drug fo sho
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2018-09-14T12:30:18 < catphish> gay, the datasheet for this buzzer calls for a current limiting resistor, i didn't add one, hope it doesn't explose
2018-09-14T12:30:45 < zyp> haha
2018-09-14T12:30:58 < dongs> ive used same buzzer, it s quiet as shit even in the buzzing frequency range
2018-09-14T12:31:28 < catphish> i upgraded from the 70db one to the 85db one
2018-09-14T12:31:33 < catphish> will see if it's better
2018-09-14T12:32:26 < catphish> i also didn't decouple my gps module, it'll probably forgive me
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2018-09-14T12:33:33 < tcth> did somebody order a tectu?
2018-09-14T12:33:36 < dongs> yes
2018-09-14T12:33:48 < tcth> how are you doing, dongs?
2018-09-14T12:33:53 < dongs> something about hardware scrolling on ILI9341 or wahtever
2018-09-14T12:34:12 < dongs> should I rip the scroll code from uguuFx or it doesnt exist there
2018-09-14T12:34:31 < dongs> i was bored the other day and made a 5x7 terminal
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2018-09-14T12:34:40 < dongs> that i can printf to
2018-09-14T12:36:27 < catphish> how pleasant
2018-09-14T12:36:34 < zyp> what about powershell?
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2018-09-14T12:42:06 < Steffanx> Better get better tcth 
2018-09-14T12:42:30 < tcth> dongs, well you´d violate the license
2018-09-14T12:42:42 < tcth> Steffanx, thanks
2018-09-14T12:43:02 < dongs> can't violate if the code isnt there, right?
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2018-09-14T12:45:56 < tcth> dongs, ask blaxter, he knows how to violate stuff
2018-09-14T12:46:17 < dongs> crt, i have penisbird.png
2018-09-14T12:46:35 < tcth> time to fly to the office
2018-09-14T12:46:36 < tcth> cu folkz
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2018-09-14T12:47:04 < dongs> rip
2018-09-14T12:53:25 < karlp> catphish: what's the big black box underneath D1/r3/r4?
2018-09-14T12:53:57 < catphish> karlp: PKLCS1212E4001-R1
2018-09-14T12:55:06 < catphish> (4kHz 84dB buzzer)
2018-09-14T12:55:28 < zyp> is it transistor buffered now?
2018-09-14T12:56:07 < karlp> aandrew: what are j1/j2 on your board? are those board to board connectors?
2018-09-14T12:56:22 < catphish> zyp: no, given that they recommend a 1k resistor in series, i can't imagine it's necessary
2018-09-14T12:57:06 < catphish> crt: i'm using allpcb for prototyping because cheap, if i need to build more, i don't know much about options
2018-09-14T12:57:46 < catphish> allpcb don't :)
2018-09-14T12:58:08 < catphish> google image search suggests that someone does :)
2018-09-14T12:59:17 < emeryth> just order white boards and use a pink highliter
2018-09-14T12:59:46 < catphish> http://dirtypcbs.com/store/panels/details/1/mystery_color
2018-09-14T13:00:10 < catphish> i guess these people can, but on their order page, the custom mask colour selector is greyed out, i don't know why
2018-09-14T13:01:27 < karlp> catphish: thanks.
2018-09-14T13:02:08 < catphish> zyp: kinda silly forgetting those resistors, but i'll see how loud it is at least :)
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2018-09-14T13:29:13 < PaulFertser> crt: why do not you share more content of your own? E.g. I remember you used to paste some funny broken sound equipment pics. 
2018-09-14T13:29:32 < Steffanx> i know why.
2018-09-14T13:29:58 < Steffanx> it this a way to say "fuck off crt, im annoyed by your crap" PaulFertser ?
2018-09-14T13:32:04 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: no, I'm honestly interested in more diversity in this channel, but for that some more elaborate content is needed, the crt's running gags ("where's my brother stvn") is getting too repetitive.
2018-09-14T13:32:27 < Steffanx> heh.
2018-09-14T13:33:46 < Steffanx> in ##stm32 that is no excuse crt
2018-09-14T13:34:17 < Ultrasauce> anime was a mistake
2018-09-14T13:34:34 < PaulFertser> According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autism_spectrum DSM-5 doesn't define "severe autism".
2018-09-14T13:34:59 < Ultrasauce> the dsm is a bible of oppression
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2018-09-14T13:37:29 < PaulFertser> crt: I would be glad if you provided more insights into the things you're busy with.
2018-09-14T13:38:40 < PaulFertser> Is it really more boring than random chit-chat?
2018-09-14T13:39:37 < Steffanx> PaulFertser, i think crt  is just too happy with his job that he doesnt want it ruined by ##stm32 negativity
2018-09-14T13:39:39 < PaulFertser> I mean, I'm guilty of "random" myself, I do not deny that. But I think topics I'm trying to discuss have at least some substance. 
2018-09-14T13:42:15 < PaulFertser> crt: well, you could share you tricks for other EEs. Probably you're using some new way of SPICE-modelling your amps. Or probably you've tried all the new ways and found that old ways work better. Probably you liked OrCAD's integrated SPICE sim but now switched to something else in Altium. Probably you're doing heat flow modelling with some nice external tool that integrates well with Altium, or
2018-09-14T13:42:21 < PaulFertser> possibly you wished you could use Mentor PADs and related tools for that. There're so many really useful topics to discuss...
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2018-09-14T13:43:35 < PaulFertser> Probably you can share some advice where to look first when your hardware that should be just fine according to ltspice is not working in real life. Etc etc. 
2018-09-14T13:46:29 < PaulFertser> Nice one, is there some justification probably? Performance data, pics, price?
2018-09-14T13:46:30 < karlp> who's _actually_ plugging legacy arduino shields into this stuff? https://eenews.cdnartwhere.eu/sites/default/files/styles/inner_article/public/sites/default/files/images/ublox_6.jpg?itok=bKuI1OYp
2018-09-14T13:48:19 < zyp> nice vertical usb port
2018-09-14T13:48:47 < zyp> I've been here for hours, just don't feel I have much to add to conversation
2018-09-14T13:49:26 < zyp> I've yet to be involved in EMC testing
2018-09-14T13:50:15 < Steffanx> http://imgur.com/a/IlFlhaA awh, why didnt you place those parts for me rigol :(
2018-09-14T13:50:33 < zyp> you didn't pay $2k extra
2018-09-14T13:50:35 < zyp> or whatever it is
2018-09-14T13:51:17 < Steffanx> yessir
2018-09-14T13:53:06 < Steffanx> its a dsa815 spectrum analyzer without the TG part, sadly
2018-09-14T13:53:16 < PaulFertser> If the parts are readily available it looks like that can be hand-assembled in half a day probably?
2018-09-14T13:53:21 < karlp> whats TG?
2018-09-14T13:53:39 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-14T13:53:50 < Steffanx> some rigols have it, some dont.
2018-09-14T13:54:02 < Steffanx> i mean, some rigols bought without the TG option, still have the hw
2018-09-14T13:54:27 < invzim> Siglent SSA3021X is the SA to get these days?
2018-09-14T13:55:00 < invzim> think I read it can be software hacked to 3.2
2018-09-14T13:55:08 < Steffanx> is it hackable to 3.2Ghz, invzim ?
2018-09-14T13:55:13 < invzim> think so
2018-09-14T13:55:20 < Steffanx> oh you just said that lol
2018-09-14T13:55:54 < Steffanx> you dont trust me opening up this thing crt ?
2018-09-14T13:56:05 < Steffanx> i enabled the option, but the hw is missing crt  :P
2018-09-14T13:56:28 < invzim> not sure I need an SA tho, I don't do radio and I don't do emc stuff
2018-09-14T13:57:06 < Steffanx> me neither, but 2nd hand cheap.
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2018-09-14T13:57:58 < Steffanx> Mar 11 2016
2018-09-14T13:58:40 < Steffanx> remove the .jpg from the url
2018-09-14T13:59:38 < Steffanx> what were you ham radioing there?
2018-09-14T13:59:54 < karlp> englishman: wasn't is the sx1276 that lolrence was trying to get you to use, that was too hard?
2018-09-14T13:59:56 < karlp> https://os.mbed.com/blog/entry/Making-tomatoes-smart-at-Data-Science-Af/
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2018-09-14T14:06:34 < Steffanx> :)
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2018-09-14T14:23:53 < Thorn> hdd in my mac is failing :/
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2018-09-14T14:26:21 < Steffanx> hdd as in spinning rust Thorn ?
2018-09-14T14:26:53 < Thorn> dunno about rust but atm it's still spinning (knock on wood)
2018-09-14T14:26:54 < BrainDamage> it's a mac, it gets tainted if it's non apple approved® parts
2018-09-14T14:27:21 < Steffanx> my mac didnt complain
2018-09-14T14:27:26 < Thorn> I just returned from a computer store with a wd blue and a kingston ssd
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2018-09-14T14:34:00 < Thorn> Taurusavenue 5, 2132 LS Hoofddorp NL
2018-09-14T14:35:25 < Thorn> oh shit what is that sculpture
2018-09-14T14:35:31 < Thorn> gorilla taking a dump?
2018-09-14T14:37:37 < Steffanx> let me take a look
2018-09-14T14:37:55 < Steffanx> oh its waht they call art.
2018-09-14T14:39:11 < Steffanx> its supposed to be a giant baby, Thorn
2018-09-14T14:39:31 < Thorn> that's even more weird
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2018-09-14T15:27:25 < Steffanx> Some ##stm32 history. The awakening of a pumper: https://pastebin.com/8nkfqYzF and nothing has changed in 5 years.
2018-09-14T15:28:27 < dongs> someone like crt
2018-09-14T15:28:29 < dongs> who pumps
2018-09-14T15:29:31 < Steffanx> lol actually dongs never gave a proper definition
2018-09-14T15:30:19 < Steffanx> must be either 3 or 4 https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Pumper
2018-09-14T15:41:47 < Thorn> apparently nrf52832 has gained some BLE 5 features, like 2Mbps data rate and extended advertisements
2018-09-14T15:41:58 < Thorn> with s132 v5+
2018-09-14T15:42:04 < dongs> so now i'll get spammed with ads even during keiling?
2018-09-14T15:42:08 < Thorn> (current seems to be v6)
2018-09-14T15:42:30 < dongs> non-skippable advertisements in keil
2018-09-14T15:46:53 < Steffanx> oh noes
2018-09-14T15:47:07 < Steffanx> what if you had to move to open source
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2018-09-14T15:54:09 < Steffanx> ..
2018-09-14T15:54:26 < englishman> karlp: it was an AXSEM
2018-09-14T15:54:49 < englishman> took the last 47 chickens to get murdered
2018-09-14T15:56:23 < Steffanx> do you have 94 chicken wings for the party now?
2018-09-14T16:01:32 < kakimir> how does usb A 2.0 to usb-c work?
2018-09-14T16:01:40 < kakimir> when charging phone?
2018-09-14T16:02:00 < zyp> fucking windows
2018-09-14T16:02:01 < zyp> OSError: [WinError 10038] an operation was attempted on something that is not a socket
2018-09-14T16:02:13 < Steffanx> fuck a bad programmer?
2018-09-14T16:02:19 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-14T16:02:23 < englishman> dongs, the new weed law also introduced roadside saliva testing. but pot stays in your blood for like 2 weeks. so stoners cant drive for 2 weeks after getting stoned
2018-09-14T16:02:33 < dongs> great
2018-09-14T16:02:39 < englishman> ikr
2018-09-14T16:02:43 < zyp> Steffanx, no, it's windows that's missing sane APIs
2018-09-14T16:03:03 < BrainDamage> is pot illegal there?
2018-09-14T16:03:08 < dongs> it is now
2018-09-14T16:03:22 < englishman> until October yes
2018-09-14T16:03:54 < zyp> I've got some shit that I want to feed data between usb and some tcp sockets
2018-09-14T16:04:23 < zyp> but this shit can't do any sort of select() loop across that
2018-09-14T16:06:01 < Ultrasauce> kakimir: it's quite simple, just consult the 500 page usb PD spec
2018-09-14T16:06:36 < englishman> good evening curt
2018-09-14T16:06:39 < BrainDamage> I wish that was an euphemism
2018-09-14T16:07:02 < Ultrasauce> https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/sales_and_marketing/presentation/product_presentation/group0/5a/b1/8e/6c/2b/0d/46/3c/Apec/files/APEC_2016_USB_Power.pdf/_jcr_content/translations/en.APEC_2016_USB_Power.pdf
2018-09-14T16:07:24 < Ultrasauce> that is the wrong link
2018-09-14T16:07:29 < Ultrasauce> http://www.usb.org/developers/powerdelivery/USB_PD_R3_0_V1.0a_20160325.pdf
2018-09-14T16:09:57 < zyp> dongs, have you worked any with winusb?
2018-09-14T16:11:22 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-14T16:11:29 < dongs> just bulk + control tho
2018-09-14T16:11:44 < zyp> how do I receive data asynchronously?
2018-09-14T16:12:06 < zyp> say I have a usb device and a tcp socket, and I want to wait for data from either of those
2018-09-14T16:12:13 < zyp> is that even possible?
2018-09-14T16:12:24  * karlp laughs
2018-09-14T16:12:39 < kakimir> Ultrasauce: I throw my work pals iphone X at it
2018-09-14T16:12:44 < dongs> zyp, yeah
2018-09-14T16:12:47 < zyp> how?
2018-09-14T16:12:49 < dongs> one sec i had code somewhere.
2018-09-14T16:12:53 < dongs> its not select() thats for sure lol
2018-09-14T16:13:02 < kakimir> charger is detected!
2018-09-14T16:13:12 < kakimir> charging at 1.8Amps
2018-09-14T16:13:26 < zyp> Cracki, like what?
2018-09-14T16:13:45 < dongs> OVERLAPPED struct and GetOverlappedResult etc
2018-09-14T16:14:03 < dongs> lol libusb
2018-09-14T16:14:10 < zyp> Cracki, guess how I got winerror 10038
2018-09-14T16:14:37 < dongs> then its jsut shitty coding
2018-09-14T16:16:52 < dongs> you can do IOCP wiht sockets too...
2018-09-14T16:17:06 < dongs> but anyway the code will look nothing like lunix select/etc shit
2018-09-14T16:17:09 < dongs> so it wont be portable
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2018-09-14T16:17:58 < zyp> Cracki, I already went over all that, none of that shit works on windows
2018-09-14T16:18:23 < zyp> if you're using libusb on windows, you're stuck calling libusb_handle_events() in a loop
2018-09-14T16:18:47 < zyp> well, duh
2018-09-14T16:18:59 < zyp> guess why I'm asking about winusb now
2018-09-14T16:19:17 < dongs> zyp, bulk?
2018-09-14T16:19:24 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-14T16:20:08 < zyp> although I'm starting to lean towards "fuck this shit" and just do CDC ACM instead, putting more logic in the firmware
2018-09-14T16:20:09 < dongs> so like i said, make overlapped event , call WinUsb_ReadPipe with pointer to the overlapped struct of that, and handle your buffer pushing/popping once event is set
2018-09-14T16:20:31 < zyp> looking at that now
2018-09-14T16:20:34 < dongs> in my code i have a linked list of the shit
2018-09-14T16:23:07 < zyp> looks doable, but too much work
2018-09-14T16:23:27 < dongs> it is non-trivial
2018-09-14T16:23:31 < dongs> setup and stuff is a lot of work for it.
2018-09-14T16:24:01 < zyp> CDC ACM it is then
2018-09-14T16:24:19 < dongs> zyp, hve you considered following the blaxter way and doing USB Audio class
2018-09-14T16:24:43 < dongs> CDC ACM still needs gay drivers on windows unless you take over ST's VID/PID
2018-09-14T16:24:47 < zyp> no, but I've considered usb ethernet and just wrap shit in ethernet frames
2018-09-14T16:24:57 < dongs> that would probly work too :)
2018-09-14T16:25:24 < zyp> some other time, maybe, ACM code I've already got
2018-09-14T16:40:11 < zyp> there, ACM loopback works, with windows driver and all
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2018-09-14T17:08:17 < bitmask> goooood morning
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2018-09-14T17:09:44 < BrainDamage> it's neither good, nor a morning
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2018-09-14T17:10:00 < Steffanx> Hello Welcome BrainDamage
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2018-09-14T17:33:30 < zyp> okay, shit works \o/
2018-09-14T17:34:11 < Steffanx> CDC you mean?
2018-09-14T17:34:23 < zyp> yeah, with CAN
2018-09-14T17:34:30 < Steffanx> time to call it a day and celebrate the weekend
2018-09-14T17:35:59 < zyp> this stuff needs some more polish everywhere, but for now I have a working implementation of shell over can and adapter from that to cdc acm
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2018-09-14T17:36:34 < zyp> TI API is a bit retarded, so for now it's only sending or receiving one byte per can packet
2018-09-14T17:36:55 < zyp> which means that if a packet with more than one byte arrives, the additional ones are thrown away
2018-09-14T17:37:15 < zyp> but eh, I can solve that next week
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2018-09-14T17:38:32 < Steffanx> TI API = ?
2018-09-14T17:39:23 < zyp> their HAL shit
2018-09-14T17:39:33 < zyp> from HALCoGen
2018-09-14T17:39:41 < Steffanx> oh texas instruments
2018-09-14T17:39:49 < Steffanx> crap
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2018-09-14T17:40:19 < zyp> apparently it expects me to preconfigure the mailbox sizes in the HALCoGen GUI, which means API doesn't support messages with varying sizes
2018-09-14T17:40:50 < zyp> which means it doesn't even tell me how many bytes I've received when I get a rx match
2018-09-14T17:40:53 < Steffanx> wut.
2018-09-14T17:41:01 < zyp> yup
2018-09-14T17:42:53 < zyp> https://paste.jvnv.net/view/JMd7a
2018-09-14T17:43:34 < zyp> it copies the received number of bytes, but it doesn't return it
2018-09-14T17:45:12 < zyp> but yeah, weekend sounds like a good idea now
2018-09-14T17:45:37 < dongs> what is this approved trash lol
2018-09-14T17:45:46 < dongs> is that some misraC filth
2018-09-14T17:46:03 < zyp> probably hints for some static analyzer
2018-09-14T17:46:23 < zyp> "this looks unsafe" "no, it's ok"
2018-09-14T17:46:29 < Steffanx>   
2018-09-14T17:46:40 < Steffanx>  /* USER CODE BEGIN (11) */ <3
2018-09-14T17:46:46 < zyp> hate that shit
2018-09-14T17:47:33 < zyp> when I need to fuck with HAL functions, I just replicate them outside the generated code tree instead now
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2018-09-14T17:49:00 < dongs> yeah fuck hal
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2018-09-14T18:02:47 < Steffanx> TI hals are the best
2018-09-14T18:08:19 < englishman> hal is gr8 you dont have to do any coding it does it all for you. then you just copypaste stuff from arduino sketches and stackexchange.
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2018-09-14T18:53:20 < aandrew> eh
2018-09-14T18:53:53 < aandrew> the STM32 HAL isn't bad, makes use of weak functions instead so you don't actually touch their code
2018-09-14T18:54:59 < veverak> aandrew: you just have to read it 
2018-09-14T18:57:38 < aandrew> veverak: yes, the HAL code is not the most pleasant at all
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2018-09-14T19:08:08 < karlp> oh boy, winning. fatal: reference is not a tree: d3d28982088ca86c123688a2912316590d30dcb1
2018-09-14T19:08:17 < karlp> forgot to push something ~ two years ago or more :)
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2018-09-14T19:18:49 < jadew> karlp, so same issue I had yesterday
2018-09-14T19:19:07 < jadew> except there were several commits for me
2018-09-14T19:19:29 < jadew> it was a bitch to merge, because that library went through extensive changes since then
2018-09-14T19:28:14 < englishman> murata requires manual account approval to download datasheets
2018-09-14T19:28:14 < englishman> wtf
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2018-09-14T19:34:08 < jadew> so get them directly from mouser
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2018-09-14T19:59:28 < catphish> i was pretty disapointed by my first attempt to use eagle
2018-09-14T19:59:43 < catphish> no sign of a library containing the stm32 i'm using
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2018-09-14T20:00:00 < jadew> kicad is better
2018-09-14T20:00:24 < catphish> i'm pretty happy with kicad, but i don't mind trying out other things
2018-09-14T20:00:34 < catphish> to me though, it's all about the libraries
2018-09-14T20:00:37 < branjb> eagle is terrible, and not free
2018-09-14T20:01:12 < jadew> catphish, are you using that many parts that you can't make them yourself if you have to?
2018-09-14T20:01:23 < catphish> i will pretty much use whatever has the components i want to use, becuse making components seems like more hassle than most tasks
2018-09-14T20:01:37 < catphish> jadew: i can make parts, i just don't really want to :(
2018-09-14T20:01:47 < jadew> it takes 5-10 minutes to make a symbol for an IC
2018-09-14T20:01:56 < jadew> and you can then reuse it in all your projects
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2018-09-14T20:02:17 < catphish> i often find that i need to make a symbol for an IC, but kicad has the footprint
2018-09-14T20:02:39 < catphish> i assume eagle has a similar thing to match a new symbol to a standard footprint
2018-09-14T20:03:13 < catphish> but since it had none of my ICs in its library, and none of my ICs downloadable, i got disheartened
2018-09-14T20:03:29 < jadew> in my experience, I spend a lot more time on layout & PCB than on footprints, so that aspect is more important to me
2018-09-14T20:03:34 < catphish> but i will probably try it again some time, it's nice to see how different tools compare
2018-09-14T20:03:50 < jadew> so eagle could have all the components in the world and I still wouldn't use it
2018-09-14T20:03:55 < catphish> yeah, to be honest, layout has ended up taking 99% of the time anyway
2018-09-14T20:06:35 < Steffanx> it looks hard to make parts catphish, but in the end its really not 
2018-09-14T20:06:53 < jadew> yeah, you draw a box and then name all the pins
2018-09-14T20:07:05 < catphish> Steffanx: yeah you're right, i've yet to make a mistake, but i'm paranoid about doing so, particularly in footprints
2018-09-14T20:07:19 < catphish> it doesn't even take that long once you start
2018-09-14T20:08:36 < branjb> wouldn't it be nice if there was a standard footprint format and mfg's provided it?
2018-09-14T20:08:57 < branjb> instead of a shitty drawing in a PDF
2018-09-14T20:09:12 < Steffanx> hehe, many people know the feeling catphish
2018-09-14T20:09:15 < catphish> lord yes
2018-09-14T20:09:17 < Steffanx> and got over it :P
2018-09-14T20:09:19 < englishman> always make your own footprints
2018-09-14T20:09:28 < englishman> 1) they will be correct, the first time
2018-09-14T20:09:35 < Steffanx> or not.
2018-09-14T20:09:39 < englishman> 2) you will have only yourself to blame if they are not
2018-09-14T20:09:45 < branjb> englishman unless you routinely fuck things up
2018-09-14T20:09:49 < englishman> 3) it takes zero time once you know what you are doing
2018-09-14T20:10:13 < Steffanx> hmm, im going to hire englishman for foot prints. zero times many = 0 :D
2018-09-14T20:10:16 < englishman> brilliant observation branjey
2018-09-14T20:10:29 < englishman> as you can see this is a self-correcting scheme
2018-09-14T20:10:37 < branjb> the problem I always have are with headers that have pegs, and the drawings are shitty at giving dimensions/offsets for peg location
2018-09-14T20:10:48 < Steffanx> indeed.
2018-09-14T20:10:55 < branjb> IC's are easy
2018-09-14T20:10:57 < catphish> i'd like to say i don't routinely fuck things up, though this schematic does have 3 errors listed in its notes, after ordering the pcb :)
2018-09-14T20:11:02 < englishman> for that i have an actual casio on my desk
2018-09-14T20:11:05 < englishman> for maths
2018-09-14T20:11:27 < Steffanx> there goes your zero time.
2018-09-14T20:12:02 < Steffanx> sorry, ill not take your words so literally englishman. Sorry!
2018-09-14T20:12:11 < Steffanx> forgive me for my sins.
2018-09-14T20:12:23 < englishman> like zero calorie cooking spray, rounding down is OK
2018-09-14T20:12:50 < catphish> isn't that stuff literally made of oil?
2018-09-14T20:15:10 < branjb> englishman what would you reference C against in this drawing? https://imgur.com/a/zPv82lG
2018-09-14T20:15:28 < englishman> ugh what is this "live highlighting only when shift key down"
2018-09-14T20:15:34 < branjb> the Y is easy, middle of the two headers
2018-09-14T20:15:38 < branjb> but how to align X?
2018-09-14T20:16:11 < englishman> it is underdefined
2018-09-14T20:16:20 < englishman> so you assume it's in the middle then verify against some stolen footprint somewhere
2018-09-14T20:16:27 < branjb> lol
2018-09-14T20:16:34 < branjb> yeah that's the kind of stuff i fuck up
2018-09-14T20:16:48 < branjb> then i have to cut the pegs off on prototypes so the header can mount
2018-09-14T20:17:06 < englishman> so you screwed it up?
2018-09-14T20:17:13 < branjb> not this specific one
2018-09-14T20:17:24 < branjb> but in the past, yeah
2018-09-14T20:17:34 < englishman> or you made the holes actually 0.8 and 1.2 not accounting for tolerance
2018-09-14T20:17:49 < branjb> holes were fine, the alignment with the pads was off
2018-09-14T20:18:58 < englishman> looks like i will get this shitberrypi compute module project
2018-09-14T20:19:35 < Steffanx> damn, dongs got himself a brother in the form of a canadian? Same grumpy attitude, same use of words.
2018-09-14T20:20:03 < bitmask> NOOOOOOOOOOOO
2018-09-14T20:20:05 < bitmask> :P
2018-09-14T20:20:25 < Steffanx> i know right.
2018-09-14T20:21:15 < englishman> i'm much better looking than dongs
2018-09-14T20:22:26 < Steffanx> that happens with brothers.
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2018-09-14T20:31:32 < karlp> well, fixed my two year old git repo refs, they were jsut outdated
2018-09-14T20:31:43 < karlp> but two year old code doesn't run against two years into the future cloud api :)
2018-09-14T20:31:52 < karlp> thanks blynk
2018-09-14T20:35:50 < branjb> if you were trying to align two 100 pin headers, would you make a single footprint/symbol with both headers on it, or just make a single sch/footprint for the 100pin header and align it in the pcb layout?
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2018-09-14T21:28:29 < qyx> farnell down again?
2018-09-14T21:28:46 < qyx> their web is even worse than the ST's one
2018-09-14T21:30:15 < invzim> https://no.farnell.com/ seems to work here
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2018-09-14T21:40:22 < Steffanx> qyx its even slower for sure, yes
2018-09-14T21:40:30 < Steffanx> their filter DAAAAMN
2018-09-14T21:42:55 < qyx> they promised consistent performance in the last newsletter
2018-09-14T21:43:04 < qyx> probably consistently slow
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2018-09-14T21:55:21 < bitmask> blah, I want to improve my plotter but its not really worth it without some new frame material
2018-09-14T21:56:21 < Steffanx> you can improve it by letting use draw
2018-09-14T21:56:21 < Steffanx> live.
2018-09-14T21:56:32 < Steffanx> ill pay you a dollar :P
2018-09-14T21:56:33 < bitmask> haha, maybe I should work on the software
2018-09-14T21:57:13 < bitmask> I kinda fux0red everything when trying to get pcb shit working, I need a bit of an overhaul
2018-09-14T21:59:13 < bitmask> I can actually make a good side arm with what I have.  instead of framing the whole work area just do what axidraw did in a stable way
2018-09-14T22:01:36 < bitmask> or I can just wait until I have some monies to get some 4020 extrusion.  probably the better option
2018-09-14T22:05:03 -!- kuldeep [~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-14T22:05:22 < bitmask> I think I'm gonna convert my plotter to use gcode, I'm gonna have to give in, its too useful
2018-09-14T22:06:05 < bitmask> the dark side has won
2018-09-14T22:06:06 < Steffanx> hehe
2018-09-14T22:06:52 < bitmask> I will change my svg reader to convert to gcode and maybe add a gerber converter too, but I think gcode in the end is most useful since so many programs convert various formats to it
2018-09-14T22:10:15 -!- bitmask is now known as rob235
2018-09-14T22:10:31 < rob235> fight the power
2018-09-14T22:12:19 < rob235> maybe I'll start actually learning ee now that I have some free time
2018-09-14T22:15:05 < rob235> practical electronics for inventors
2018-09-14T22:15:33 < BrainDamage> needs a maker tag
2018-09-14T22:16:12 < branjb> when oshpark says min trace clearance 5mil, does that apply to clearance between pads too?
2018-09-14T22:16:15 < rob235> 1337sk111z
2018-09-14T22:24:40 < rob235> practical electronics for inventors vs art electronics
2018-09-14T22:24:41 < rob235> go
2018-09-14T22:24:46 < rob235> art of
2018-09-14T22:24:55 < rob235> sorry, jack is catching up with me
2018-09-14T22:33:18 < BrainDamage> both horribly compromise a deeper understanding given by a bottom-up pedagogic strategy for a shallow immediate reward top-down teaching
2018-09-14T22:33:45 < Steffanx> if you want cheap 4 layer, id recomend jlcpcb branjb. As in: work greatly for me.
2018-09-14T22:34:05 < BrainDamage> they'll only give you the illusion of intuition, the shallow one that makes people go in the physics channel and say that SR is wrong because it disagrees with their view of the world
2018-09-14T22:34:29 < rob235> SR?
2018-09-14T22:34:42 < branjb> what's the turnaround time?
2018-09-14T22:35:04 < Steffanx> 4-5 days + shipping time
2018-09-14T22:35:11 < branjb> not bad
2018-09-14T22:35:30 < Steffanx> which was 3+days for me, because DHL for like $5 ( but that might no longer be the case)
2018-09-14T22:35:36 < Steffanx> *+3
2018-09-14T22:35:52 < BrainDamage> SR = special relativity
2018-09-14T22:36:02 < rob235> ahh
2018-09-14T22:37:58 < Steffanx> but you still have to start somewhere.. 
2018-09-14T22:38:31 < rob235> yes, book will still get read
2018-09-14T22:38:55 < rob235> so much to do, so little time
2018-09-14T22:39:31 < Steffanx> little time?
2018-09-14T22:40:52 < rob235> I have dozens of edx courses downloaded, multiple books to read, gotta get ready to start looking for a job, and then work takes up crazy time :(
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2018-09-14T22:41:35 < Laurenceb_> sup trolls
2018-09-14T22:41:49 < Steffanx> www.electronics-tutorials.ws didnt look to bad either rob235
2018-09-14T22:42:05 < rob235> thanks, i'll check it out
2018-09-14T22:42:05 -!- vampi-the-frog [~vampirefr@unaffiliated/vampirefrog] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-14T22:43:37  * Laurenceb_ has been in London
2018-09-14T22:43:46  * rob235 no one cares
2018-09-14T22:43:51  * rob235 leaves london
2018-09-14T22:43:56 < rob235> :)
2018-09-14T22:44:08 < Laurenceb_> I went through soho
2018-09-14T22:44:24 < Laurenceb_> too many restaurants
2018-09-14T22:44:31 < Laurenceb_> I found a tranny nighclub
2018-09-14T22:46:24 < Laurenceb_> no sign of Tectu
2018-09-14T22:46:35 < rob235> Jack Daniels has left the building
2018-09-14T22:50:45 < Laurenceb_> I went into a strip club for the lulz and got trolled epic style
2018-09-14T22:51:24 < BrainDamage> you paid to have sex and they said "too small"
2018-09-14T22:51:29 < Laurenceb_> walked in the door, guy behind desk and it's all dark with some neon lights
2018-09-14T22:51:35 < Steffanx> Then you woke up in your own puke and noticed the empty bottle on your left.
2018-09-14T22:51:50 < Laurenceb_> guy looks me up and down "I don't recognise your face"
2018-09-14T22:52:00 < Steffanx> and you lived happily ever after
2018-09-14T22:52:06 < Laurenceb_>  "do you have a reservation?" me "wait wut"
2018-09-14T22:52:24 < BrainDamage> you know that nobody ever believes what you say, right?
2018-09-14T22:52:30 < Laurenceb_>  "actually we are a mexican restaurant"
2018-09-14T22:52:35 < BrainDamage> when 99.9999% of the things are made up on the spot
2018-09-14T22:52:38 < rob235> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCI3B5eT9NA
2018-09-14T22:53:17 < BrainDamage> without even a lot of fantasy, or likelyhood
2018-09-14T22:54:42 < Laurenceb_> so nyways I asked him why the sign says "xxx girls"
2018-09-14T22:54:56 < rob235> who goes into a strip club for the lulz
2018-09-14T22:54:58 < rob235> stupid shit
2018-09-14T22:55:03 < Laurenceb_> and he tells me its just to get people into his mexican restaurant
2018-09-14T22:55:09 < rob235> ok a stupid joke
2018-09-14T22:55:20 < Laurenceb_> I was very drunk at the time
2018-09-14T22:55:31 < rob235> no you werent, it didint happen
2018-09-14T22:56:45 < Laurenceb_> by that time my eyes had adjusted and I could just make out all the strippers laughing at me getting trolled epic style
2018-09-14T22:56:54 < Laurenceb_> so embarrasing :(
2018-09-14T22:57:23 < rob235> so disappointing
2018-09-14T22:58:46 < invzim> ahaa, non-blocking oled menu stuff werks
2018-09-14T22:59:21 < invzim> been procrastinating writing it for ages, wasn't that messy or hard once I sat down
2018-09-14T22:59:38 < rob235> nothing ever is
2018-09-14T22:59:48 < Steffanx> no?
2018-09-14T23:00:14 < invzim> I've been doing some vhdl stuff that is pretty damn hard :), still doesn't work 100%
2018-09-14T23:00:26 < rob235> statefulness
2018-09-14T23:01:51 < vampi-the-frog> nice job invzim 
2018-09-14T23:03:45 < invzim> assembling 15 boards next week and actually looking forward to it
2018-09-14T23:04:14 < rob235> can you get high on ferric chloride? I need to open it up
2018-09-14T23:04:34 < invzim> louis jizz in the paste made everything good
2018-09-14T23:04:39 < rob235> I'm abou tto just bare a whole aboard for shits and giggles
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2018-09-14T23:05:02 < rob235> ohhh oh my typing has gone
2018-09-14T23:05:04 < BrainDamage> add citric acid to make an edimburgh etch
2018-09-14T23:05:11 < rob235> whats that do
2018-09-14T23:05:38 < BrainDamage> it precipitates the copper chloride dissolved forming insoluble copper salts
2018-09-14T23:05:58 < BrainDamage> so the etch rate is not a function of the dissolved copper in the solution
2018-09-14T23:06:39 < rob235> meh, ok, whatever :)
2018-09-14T23:08:07 < BrainDamage> you'll see the "meh"
2018-09-14T23:08:31 < BrainDamage> you'll find that the board barely etches at the beginning, then once it's halfway, it'll etch up incredibly fast
2018-09-14T23:08:48 < BrainDamage> and the last part you'll have a minute or two tolerance before it eats up the fine traces
2018-09-14T23:09:14 < rob235> I will fail on my own thank you
2018-09-14T23:09:52 < Steffanx> yw
2018-09-14T23:10:02 < rob235> alchol gone
2018-09-14T23:10:15 < rob235> I think I forgot a syllabul there
2018-09-14T23:10:38 < rob235> time to start soldering
2018-09-14T23:12:53 < zyp> which etchant are we talking about?
2018-09-14T23:13:02 < rob235> ferric chloride
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2018-09-14T23:20:23 < zyp> ferric chloride and incredibly fast doesn't really fit together
2018-09-14T23:21:34 < englishman> branjb: yes
2018-09-14T23:22:15 < rob235> oh shit, fight fight fight
2018-09-14T23:22:31 < Steffanx> come on outside. 1 on 1 , rob235
2018-09-14T23:22:34 < Steffanx> no guns
2018-09-14T23:22:40 < rob235> :)
2018-09-14T23:22:47 < BrainDamage> zyp: only in the final part
2018-09-14T23:24:25 < rob235> are there such things as electroplated blades?
2018-09-14T23:25:38 < rob235> actually is that how all blades (face) are made?
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2018-09-15T00:10:44 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/nsW9Lhf
2018-09-15T00:11:05 < aandrew> finally resolved all my connectivity "issues" -- turns out they're altium stupidities, not mine
2018-09-15T00:11:20 < aandrew> 1) a bus is ONLY a GUI element. It doesn't actually mean a fucking thing to connectivty
2018-09-15T00:11:27 < aandrew> 2) ditto for harnesses
2018-09-15T00:12:10 < aandrew> 3) if you have (HARNESS)===(HARNESS) the two are NOT connected. you have to hang a port symbol off it for it to connect things, even though it's on the same sheet
2018-09-15T00:12:36 < aandrew> 4) if you have two harnesses of the same type on a sheet but connected to two different areas, it *does* try to connect them, a direct fucking violation of #3
2018-09-15T00:12:57 < aandrew> to resolve #4, you put a net label on the harness "rope" to name it, even though the sheet entry is already differently named
2018-09-15T00:13:26 < aandrew> it's fucking clear that Altium is just a bunch of ancient Pascal code wrapped in C++ and held together with snot
2018-09-15T00:13:35 < aandrew> but, surprisingly, it's one of the better EDA packages.
2018-09-15T00:14:28 < Steffanx> none of this is documented?
2018-09-15T00:16:16 < aandrew> not really
2018-09-15T00:16:21 < aandrew> and altium's doc site is garbage
2018-09-15T00:16:42 < aandrew> it's made for those getting started, not those who have been using it and have a weird fucking issue like any of those above
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2018-09-15T00:18:59 < zyp> haha
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2018-09-15T00:25:41 < invzim> any of you use orcad/allegro?
2018-09-15T00:26:14 < invzim> guess it's next-level expensive, but is it better than altium?
2018-09-15T00:34:52 < englishman> no
2018-09-15T00:34:54 < englishman> its fucking awful
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2018-09-15T00:38:43 < karlp> UsageFault due to a bad EXC_RETURN value
2018-09-15T00:38:47 < karlp> that's a new one for me.
2018-09-15T00:39:46 < zyp> EXC_RETURN got pushed to the stack and then you overflowed a buffer and corrupted it?
2018-09-15T00:40:49  * karlp shrugs.
2018-09-15T00:41:00 < zyp> or an RTOS thread that didn't get the context initialized correctly?
2018-09-15T00:41:14 < karlp> I bet something like that, it's stack trace is in rtx guts
2018-09-15T00:42:06 < karlp> don't see what though
2018-09-15T00:42:18 < karlp> this is what you get for trying to use rtos's
2018-09-15T00:42:25 < zyp> :)
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2018-09-15T00:43:04 < karlp> osRtxErrorNotify->osRtxThreadStackCheck
2018-09-15T00:43:06 < karlp> yeah, guess so
2018-09-15T00:48:48 < aandrew> orcad actually has very competitive pricing with alitum, trying to bust into that market
2018-09-15T00:50:40 < invzim> orcad==allegro?
2018-09-15T00:52:12 < aandrew> I started out in orcad PCB/SDT386+
2018-09-15T00:52:15 < aandrew> before windows
2018-09-15T00:52:22 < aandrew> then they came out with a windows version and crapped it all up
2018-09-15T00:52:34 < aandrew> then cadence bought them I think and turned it to utter shit that only large enterprises like
2018-09-15T00:52:40 < aandrew> they're kind of coming back to that shit windows stage
2018-09-15T00:53:08 < aandrew> went from orcad to eagle where I stayed for like 20y, and then finally got fed up with them and went altium
2018-09-15T00:53:14 < aandrew> from here I'll probably go kicad and never leave it
2018-09-15T00:53:30 < invzim> I wonder what asus/gigabyte/msi etc are using, churning out different motherboards all the time
2018-09-15T00:53:43 < englishman> copy and paste
2018-09-15T00:54:33 < invzim> would make sense, a sign would be if the ram slots are pretty much the same position relative to the cpu
2018-09-15T00:58:00 < rob235> oh god
2018-09-15T00:58:05 < rob235> its over
2018-09-15T00:58:26 < rob235> I'm drunk, gf gonna end it :)
2018-09-15T00:59:10 < Steffanx> uhm what. end you rob235?
2018-09-15T00:59:11 < rob235> yea I'm speechless too
2018-09-15T00:59:29 < rob235> that and us, she breaks up with me every other day
2018-09-15T00:59:48 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-15T00:59:50 < rob235> tired of it
2018-09-15T00:59:51 < invzim> sho she's just throwing a fit like they all do..
2018-09-15T01:00:06 < Steffanx> dont drunk rob235
2018-09-15T01:00:10 < Steffanx> its bad. you cant handle it
2018-09-15T01:00:14 < rob235> too ltate 
2018-09-15T01:00:14 < Steffanx> (your words)
2018-09-15T01:00:34 < rob235> i type so fast that t came outta nowhere
2018-09-15T01:00:54 < Steffanx> try /quit
2018-09-15T01:01:13 < rob235> no thanks, I'm solid, I'm looking forward to this fight
2018-09-15T01:01:35 < Steffanx>  you remember you live in her parents house?
2018-09-15T01:01:40 < rob235> I graduated, I got a degree in comp sci, what she got, a degree in psychology?
2018-09-15T01:01:50 < rob235> haha shhh stop being logical
2018-09-15T01:02:02 < rob235> ok you are right fuck
2018-09-15T01:02:14 < rob235> ok i'll calm down
2018-09-15T01:02:15 < rob235> she wont even know
2018-09-15T01:02:15 < Steffanx> nah, 3d printing under a bridge doesnt work out well. at least i dont think it does
2018-09-15T01:03:02 < Steffanx> yw
2018-09-15T01:03:25 < rob235> hows it going? I'm calm rob
2018-09-15T01:03:42 < Steffanx> better be bitmask again, he was better
2018-09-15T01:03:52 < rob235> thats unfortunate isnt it?
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2018-09-15T01:04:08 < Steffanx> affirmative
2018-09-15T01:04:14 < bitmask> hello sir
2018-09-15T01:04:20 < bitmask> how goes it
2018-09-15T01:04:41 < Steffanx> good good.
2018-09-15T01:04:42 < Steffanx> there?
2018-09-15T01:04:48 < bitmask> splendid
2018-09-15T01:05:03 < bitmask> (thats a great word btw)
2018-09-15T01:06:14 < bitmask> I will just start soldering, aint no questions when soldering is going on
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2018-09-15T01:48:33 < Steffanx> stac
2018-09-15T01:51:13 < emeb> felidae
2018-09-15T01:54:52 < emeb> hola crt
2018-09-15T01:56:02 < emeb> anyone here ever used stm32 touch sense?
2018-09-15T01:57:20 < emeb> In his house at R'lyeh, dongs waits dreaming.
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2018-09-15T02:13:50 < Steffanx> 15 zeniers in the recitifier, crt
2018-09-15T02:25:38 < Laurenceb_> nobody believes anything I say any more :(
2018-09-15T02:26:06 < Laurenceb_> even when its about how I got irl ltrolled epic style
2018-09-15T02:29:47 < Laurenceb_> epic style
2018-09-15T02:30:53  * veverak wanted to write: who gives a f***?, but that seems too rude
2018-09-15T02:32:04 < Laurenceb_> and everybody clapped
2018-09-15T02:33:08 < Laurenceb_> the troll's name? albert Einstien
2018-09-15T02:43:46 < Laurenceb_> getting high
2018-09-15T02:43:56 < Laurenceb_> yesterday I went to soho
2018-09-15T02:45:38 < Laurenceb_> does ausland have a red light district?
2018-09-15T03:00:14 < Laurenceb_> I hurd abbywinters.com got deported
2018-09-15T03:09:09 < Laurenceb_> kek
2018-09-15T03:16:45 < Laurenceb_> feminists dont know about muh fun and easy way to get laid
2018-09-15T03:18:31 < Laurenceb_> I went to a sex shop yesterday, it was like 90% grrrls in there
2018-09-15T03:19:18 < Laurenceb_> some were complaining at the counter liek O tech support
2018-09-15T03:19:23 < Laurenceb_> kekked hard
2018-09-15T03:19:59 < Laurenceb_> we need moar red light districts for moar lulz
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2018-09-15T03:24:35 < Laurenceb_> def fewer shitty restaurants
2018-09-15T03:24:45 < Laurenceb_> londonistan is full of them
2018-09-15T03:27:43 < Laurenceb_> hipsters and TED talk tier bullshitters
2018-09-15T03:30:28 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnUwDOoBo2I musics time machine back to 2010
2018-09-15T03:31:04 < kakimir> did you miss me Laurenceb_?
2018-09-15T03:50:47 -!- Chris_M [~Chris_M@ppp118-209-79-126.bras1.mel11.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-15T03:51:22 < Laurenceb_> > Jameela Jamil explains why she thinks the Kardashians are "double agents for the patriarchy", in the latest Ways to Change the World podcast.
2018-09-15T03:51:28 < Laurenceb_> meanwhile on uk tv
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2018-09-15T03:55:02 < kakimir> "double agents for patriarchy"
2018-09-15T03:55:46 < kakimir> when will you evac from UK Laurenceb_ ?
2018-09-15T03:58:53 < Laurenceb_> I think just build a wall around London
2018-09-15T04:01:56 < Laurenceb_> kek
2018-09-15T04:02:10 < Laurenceb_> I should buy him a backpack hot air balloon
2018-09-15T04:02:26 < Laurenceb_> he could probably fly far enough to reach a waiting russian submarine
2018-09-15T04:04:37 < Laurenceb_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_New_Kind_of_Science when u divide the bullshit by zero
2018-09-15T04:05:56 < Laurenceb_> my train
2018-09-15T04:06:10 < Laurenceb_> my sentient train
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2018-09-15T04:06:33 < Laurenceb_> go away
2018-09-15T04:06:50 -!- laurence_ is now known as Guest95185
2018-09-15T04:13:01 < Laurenceb_> https://twitter.com/rbstrachan
2018-09-15T04:13:24 < Laurenceb_> not sure if troll
2018-09-15T04:13:54 < Laurenceb_> ywlts gay scottish muslims
2018-09-15T04:14:52 < Laurenceb_> dat thot tier filter
2018-09-15T04:16:55 < Laurenceb_> lurn to internet
2018-09-15T04:17:02 < Laurenceb_> you will live to see
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2018-09-15T05:47:32 < jadew> saw this listing and thought it said "compact" in the title: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Analyseur-reseau-vectoriel-HP8510C-complet-VNA-20GHz-/302883538927
2018-09-15T05:49:45 < jadew> that actually doesn't look bad at all
2018-09-15T05:50:44 < jadew> I like the colors
2018-09-15T06:00:01 < branjb> is that a spec A?
2018-09-15T06:00:16 < jadew> VNA
2018-09-15T06:01:04 < jadew> at the bottom it's a signal generator, on top of it the test set, on top of that the control unit and on top of that the display unit
2018-09-15T06:02:04 < jadew> they don't make them like that anymore
2018-09-15T06:02:12 < jadew> some are still made out of two units tho
2018-09-15T06:02:22 < jadew> but most of them are single unit these days
2018-09-15T06:08:48 < jadew> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/09/11/python_purges_master_and_slave_in_political_pogrom/
2018-09-15T06:12:00 < friendofafriend> Needs a fork.
2018-09-15T06:13:16 < friendofafriend> Just like FreeBSD after its new code of conduct.  https://github.com/Ybalrid/FreeHugsBSD
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2018-09-15T06:29:20 < friendofafriend> "Master" and "African-American"?
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2018-09-15T07:13:51 < friendofafriend> Is it the yiffing hour, already?
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2018-09-15T09:28:40 < jadew> which one is that?
2018-09-15T09:30:47 < jadew> crt?
2018-09-15T09:36:19 < jadew> I've been trying to find a good spot to put a discout code input on my site for more than an hour and I just can't find it
2018-09-15T09:36:25 < jadew> it ruins the feng-shui
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2018-09-15T10:20:34 < dongs> sup dongs
2018-09-15T10:45:21 < dongs> https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/184324186284621824/490423262812307466/1536989174222.gif
2018-09-15T10:45:26 < dongs> attn englishman 
2018-09-15T11:11:50 < zyp> haha
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2018-09-15T11:38:03 < dongs> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lmr62014.pdf thanks, TI
2018-09-15T11:38:07 < dongs> 'connection diagram
2018-09-15T11:38:35 < dongs> http://www.ti.com/general/docs/datasheetdiagram.tsp?genericPartNumber=LMR62014&diagramId=27820
2018-09-15T11:38:39 < dongs> waot. newaot. netter ;oml
2018-09-15T11:38:49 < dongs> errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
2018-09-15T11:38:52 < dongs> i mean, better link
2018-09-15T11:47:39 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ_71rROxcs
2018-09-15T11:50:19 < Steffanx> Ty
2018-09-15T11:50:46 < jadew> you're welcome
2018-09-15T11:56:21 < dongs> grpss
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2018-09-15T12:11:40 < Thorn> Delta II T-3h https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0
2018-09-15T12:13:28 < dongs> wahts in it
2018-09-15T12:14:09 < Thorn> https://spaceflightnow.com/2018/09/14/delta-2-icesat-2-mission-status-center/
2018-09-15T12:15:06 < dongs> ah icesat
2018-09-15T12:15:11 < dongs> flatearhters will sabotage it
2018-09-15T12:35:12 < karlp> nice mbed, list new boards you've added, and use your own codename for them that don't exist anywhere else on the internet: https://os.mbed.com/blog/entry/mbed-os-597-released/
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2018-09-15T12:35:45 < PaulFertser> karlp: considering actually using mbed for the next project?
2018-09-15T12:36:23 < karlp> been considering it for a while, 
2018-09-15T12:36:35 < karlp> still a bit grumpy that they don't have usb device though
2018-09-15T12:36:49 < karlp> read the emails to see whats' goign on there at least.
2018-09-15T12:36:51 < Thorn> next step after mbed: adrweeno
2018-09-15T12:37:14 < PaulFertser> karlp: I mean it feels like mbed API is some kind of a joke, arduino style.
2018-09-15T12:38:51 < karlp> what do you mena?
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2018-09-15T12:41:55 < PaulFertser> I've recently needed to attach a servo to stm32f1. Decided on the pins (all power and pwm output adjucent on the nucleo board header). Started reading about pin remapping (as for this specific pin I had to both disable full jtag and enable alternate AF remap), then about different timer modes, and multiple outputs per timer, then got one pwm example from libopencm3-examples, changed it to my
2018-09-15T12:42:01 < PaulFertser> liking, figured I mixed up the output number, finally made servo work, then took some uart code (to control it via stlink acm), it made my stlink session hang completely, figured I had to enable both Tx and Rx, finally I could control servo via serial. Took no less than 2 hours. Call me stupid.
2018-09-15T12:44:14 < Steffanx> Did you go to the mbed forum and ask some cryptic question PaulFertser ?
2018-09-15T12:44:20 < PaulFertser> So who sane would prefer to use very limited arduino or mbed HAL/API to controlling the hardware properly? I guess somebody who needs to get something working fast. Even if it would require unoptimal wiring etc.
2018-09-15T12:44:28 < Steffanx> Or is there #mbed?
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2018-09-15T12:46:08 < PaulFertser> Steffanx: I had a look at the mbed API and it seemed like they hide too much of the hardware, I had an impression it basically misses most of the features and reduces STM32 peripherals to something very similar to arduino. So I wonder how come karlp is considering it. OTOH I had some relatively bad experience with stm32 just few days ago (outlined before).
2018-09-15T12:52:49 < karlp> I've never tried it at all on any project so far, but now that they're pushing it out to support actual build environments, and all of arm's cloud support, I just presume they must be intending it to be used for more than just cloud brwoser compiler people 
2018-09-15T12:53:06 < karlp> I'm completely ok with losing some things if it's actually easy to use and _works_
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2018-09-15T12:59:45 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Quit: My Mac Mini has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
2018-09-15T13:01:37 < gnom> https://imgur.com/gallery/4ygkqYa
2018-09-15T13:04:01 < PaulFertser> But that's not a cat.
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2018-09-15T13:16:32 < gnom> raccoon very amusing raccoon, but is overfed
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2018-09-15T13:18:01 < cjbaird> Very fat raccoon
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2018-09-15T14:10:55 < Steffanx> dongs is this how you push a car? https://media.dumpert.nl/tablet/c10eb002_VID_20180914_WA0014.mp4.mp4.mp4
2018-09-15T14:11:21 < dongs> enough mp4s in that filename?
2018-09-15T14:12:07 < Steffanx> yessir, not my url
2018-09-15T14:12:23 < Steffanx> (and lol, people comment on that EVERY time :D )
2018-09-15T14:26:23 < jadew> I saved it too: c10eb002_VID_20180914_WA0014.mp4.mp4.mp4.mp4
2018-09-15T14:26:45 < dongs> only on lunix would that filename end up getting more mp4s at the end
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2018-09-15T14:38:49 < Steffanx> ty
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2018-09-15T14:52:58 < dongs> Experience designing circuits to drive inductive loads such as solenoids, motors and pumps.
2018-09-15T14:53:01 < dongs> attn crt
2018-09-15T14:54:38 < Steffanx> crt is dead. Can i forward a message?
2018-09-15T14:54:46 < Steffanx> sounds like freelancer project.
2018-09-15T14:55:01 < dongs> oh he is
2018-09-15T14:55:25 < dongs> no its a job opening at coca cola frestyle engineering
2018-09-15T14:55:31 < Steffanx> heh
2018-09-15T14:55:34 < dongs> Our team develops many custom electronic designs using Altium Designer as well as specifying and integrating latest off-the-shelf hardware technologies. We also support and enhance existing designs already released to the field.
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2018-09-15T15:06:11 < Thorn> Delta II launch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0
2018-09-15T15:17:24 < gnom> https://imgur.com/gallery/tseHNaz
2018-09-15T15:22:20 < Steffanx> Hello gnom, thank you very much.
2018-09-15T15:22:43 < Steffanx> What can we do for you today?
2018-09-15T15:22:50 < gnom> hello
2018-09-15T15:25:34 < gnom> i have received on 103c8t6 40 fps for an oscilloscopee, on dot piont a line
2018-09-15T15:26:15 < Guest95185> University announces “White Awake” safe space for white students
2018-09-15T15:26:15 < Guest95185> The University of Maryland at College Park announced Friday a new diversity support group to create a “safe space” for white students to discuss their feelings about “interactions with racial and ethnic minorities.”
2018-09-15T15:26:27 < gnom> but for the present it is necessary to correct him as enough bugs there
2018-09-15T15:58:44 < Thorn> T - 4 min
2018-09-15T15:59:52 < dongs> link
2018-09-15T16:00:00 < dongs> nvm
2018-09-15T16:02:29 < gnom> http://178.150.7.153/dl/o/0397.jpg
2018-09-15T16:02:31 < gnom> also depends on filling
2018-09-15T16:15:47 < Steffanx> Oh, you're doing some scope thingy. I didnt understand that part gnom
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2018-09-15T16:21:47 < dongs> damn, they have freaking laser beams on it
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2018-09-15T17:03:05 < Laurenceb123> sup
2018-09-15T17:03:26 < Laurenceb123> >mandatory trans training day
2018-09-15T17:03:33 < Laurenceb123> the absolute state of uk
2018-09-15T17:04:07 < jadew> they'll teach you how they have both boobs and a dick?
2018-09-15T17:09:05 < Laurenceb123> >our vision is of a world where people are no longer constrained by narrow perceptions and expectations of gender, and where diverse gender expressions are visible and valued
2018-09-15T17:09:26 < Laurenceb123> tfw even trannies are buzzword bullshit
2018-09-15T17:09:53 < Steffanx> Laurenceb123 talking about trannies again? Makes you wonder.
2018-09-15T17:10:17 < Laurenceb123> projection
2018-09-15T17:10:19 < Steffanx> Not judging, just observering
2018-09-15T17:11:11 < Steffanx> *observing
2018-09-15T17:18:32 < antto> i know where you can get cheap hosting for your observer
2018-09-15T17:21:01 < jadew> anyone else had these in their childhood? https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ef/Guma_Turbo.jpg
2018-09-15T17:21:45 < jadew> afk
2018-09-15T17:22:34 < kakimir> recommend me a camera that can go in those tight places?
2018-09-15T17:22:45 < kakimir> snake camera
2018-09-15T17:22:54 < kakimir> budget: under 100eur
2018-09-15T17:23:52 < Steffanx> doesnt look familiar jadew
2018-09-15T17:24:13 < Steffanx> endoscope kakimir?
2018-09-15T17:24:46 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-15T17:24:49 < Steffanx> ebay them from under $20
2018-09-15T17:24:53 < kakimir> no
2018-09-15T17:24:55 < Steffanx> quality. unknown
2018-09-15T17:24:55 < kakimir> I want better
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2018-09-15T17:25:03 < kakimir> I know the quality
2018-09-15T17:25:25 < kakimir> sub 20 is not worth buying unless some blurry shapes and colors do
2018-09-15T17:26:53 < Steffanx> cant help you
2018-09-15T17:27:01 < englishman> sorry that was not in the original demand
2018-09-15T17:27:12 < englishman> $20 eBay endoscope it is
2018-09-15T17:27:16 < Steffanx> i get the idea anything <100 is crappy
2018-09-15T17:27:40 < Steffanx> 3 second ebay query showed me its either < 20 or > 100
2018-09-15T17:27:54 < kakimir> I have seen some 50eur cameras too
2018-09-15T17:27:58 < dongs> l0de merch at 3 seconds in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRdl0gIDi1Y
2018-09-15T17:27:59 < kakimir> or 50-100
2018-09-15T17:28:16 < englishman> haha
2018-09-15T17:29:03 < kakimir> he is using arm of micrometer. clever man
2018-09-15T17:34:07 < zyp> the ebay one I bought a couple of years ago was fine
2018-09-15T17:35:17 < zyp> I paid 10.17 GBP
2018-09-15T17:35:32 < karlp> yeah, in the sea of low end ones I imagine some are decent.
2018-09-15T17:36:06 < kakimir> now I just need to select how many leds, what connection type, what diameter and what cable length
2018-09-15T17:36:21 < zyp> mine got 6 leds and 7m cable
2018-09-15T17:36:32 < kakimir> 7meter :o
2018-09-15T17:36:38 < zyp> yeah?
2018-09-15T17:36:39 < kakimir> what do you do actually with it
2018-09-15T17:36:41 < kakimir> ?
2018-09-15T17:37:07 < kakimir> there is wifi type endoscopes now
2018-09-15T17:37:16 < zyp> I bought it to look inside the whatever it's called where I ran a cable
2018-09-15T17:37:39 < kakimir> aa
2018-09-15T17:37:40 < zyp> let me see if I got any pics
2018-09-15T17:37:45 < kakimir> cable tubing?
2018-09-15T17:37:52 < zyp> no
2018-09-15T17:38:00 < zyp> although I've done that too
2018-09-15T17:38:05 < kakimir> I plan to look inside engines
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2018-09-15T17:38:42 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/7vbMe.JPG <- I ran this cable
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2018-09-15T17:39:28 < zyp> there's a ventilation pipe coming out there, that pipe runs inside a wooden box in the corner between the wall and the ceiling along the room, for 5m or so
2018-09-15T17:39:36 < Steffanx> So hows the house going zyp ?
2018-09-15T17:39:47 < Steffanx> no update in a while
2018-09-15T17:40:18 < zyp> haven't snapped any new photos recently, thinking about heading over later today since the weather is nice
2018-09-15T17:40:34 < kakimir> do these borescopes use some common standard for video?
2018-09-15T17:40:42 < zyp> they got the roof tiles on the other day, and they've started building the balcony
2018-09-15T17:40:44 < kakimir> I don't want to install bullshit to any of my devices
2018-09-15T17:40:55 < zyp> kakimir, the one I got is standard UVC
2018-09-15T17:41:03 < zyp> I expect most USB ones are
2018-09-15T17:41:18 < karlp> can't imagine them doing anythign custom. only way to be cheap is to be uvc
2018-09-15T17:41:45 < zyp> not really much point in doing anything else either
2018-09-15T17:42:17 < zyp> I think UVC is designet to cover more or less all video over USB-usecases
2018-09-15T17:42:35 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/HD-1600-1200-1080P-2IN1-6LED-Micro-USB-Android-Endoscope-IP67-Inspection-Camera/262389202798
2018-09-15T17:42:56 < kakimir> 1600 rite..
2018-09-15T17:43:07 < zyp> that's what mine also said
2018-09-15T17:43:20 < kakimir> this is your endoscope?
2018-09-15T17:43:21 < zyp> so, what are you planning to look for?
2018-09-15T17:43:37 < kakimir> stuff it inside engine
2018-09-15T17:43:43 < kakimir> from holes available
2018-09-15T17:43:49 < zyp> sure, but what are you going to look for in there?
2018-09-15T17:44:03 < jadew> Steffanx, must have been an eastern european thing
2018-09-15T17:44:36 < kakimir> mechanical failure, rust, wear, scratches, coloring
2018-09-15T17:46:45 < kakimir> bigger head diameter is is better zyp?
2018-09-15T17:46:51 < kakimir> for video quality
2018-09-15T17:46:52 < englishman> is it small enough to swallow
2018-09-15T17:46:56 < zyp> dunno
2018-09-15T17:47:07 < zyp> englishman, wouldn't recommend
2018-09-15T17:47:34 < englishman> your opinion is appreciated and will not be considered
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2018-09-15T17:49:06 < Steffanx> englishman does assemblying make your grumpy?
2018-09-15T17:49:14 < Steffanx> or at least more grumpy
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2018-09-15T17:49:26 < Steffanx> -r
2018-09-15T17:49:34 < zyp> hmm, maybe I'll go take some photos for Steffanx 
2018-09-15T17:49:39 < englishman> i wanted to know if it's small enough or swallow, not if i should or should not swallow it
2018-09-15T17:49:53 < zyp> probably possible
2018-09-15T17:49:55 < englishman> of course i shouldnt swallow it
2018-09-15T17:50:02 < englishman> but can i?!?!
2018-09-15T17:50:05 < englishman> cool
2018-09-15T17:50:07 < kakimir> butt it in your butt
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2018-09-15T17:50:39 < kakimir> endoscope is good for teeth inspection
2018-09-15T17:50:48 < jadew> I bought one of those
2018-09-15T17:50:50 < kakimir> got to try one once
2018-09-15T17:50:55 < jadew> the ones in the ebay link
2018-09-15T17:51:02 < jadew> went straight into trash
2018-09-15T17:51:03 < kakimir> first thing is that my mouth opened
2018-09-15T17:51:07 < kakimir> then endoscope went in
2018-09-15T17:51:18 < kakimir> then friend came to see
2018-09-15T17:51:30 < kakimir> then he put it inside his mouth
2018-09-15T17:51:30 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/gx81E4a.jpg
2018-09-15T17:51:39 < Steffanx> best year.
2018-09-15T17:51:52 < jadew> kakimir, if you find a good endoscope, let me know, I'm looking for one too
2018-09-15T17:52:16 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-15T17:52:31 < jadew> not for Ceausescu
2018-09-15T17:52:46 < karlp> anyone know what the high prio/low prior usb interrupts mean?
2018-09-15T17:52:51 < karlp> having a hard time finding in l1 manual
2018-09-15T17:55:32 < karlp> ok, nvm
2018-09-15T17:55:34 < karlp> "Triggered only by a correct transfer event
2018-09-15T17:55:36 < karlp> for isochronous and double-buffer bulk transfer to reach the highest possible
2018-09-15T17:55:38 < karlp> transfer rate."
2018-09-15T17:55:47 < karlp> so no iso, or double buffer mode, hp irq is not used
2018-09-15T17:58:37 < karlp> heh, I broke gdb's busted stack detection
2018-09-15T17:59:00 < karlp> https://zerobin.net/?9d5d64bd20b56810#cHyhbQKgNY0fm/nSpKzjIKY/V1IepvfRHpdHoNFtQ+0=
2018-09-15T17:59:27 < invzim> meh, that feeling when you discover someone has already implemented your fantastic idea and is 2 years ahead
2018-09-15T17:59:33 < invzim> https://dekunu.tech/dekunu-one/#one
2018-09-15T18:02:17 < jadew> it's worse when it happens in reverse
2018-09-15T18:02:37 < jadew> you have the idea, don't do anything about it and years later someone else has great success with it
2018-09-15T18:10:05 < Steffanx> invzim do it better
2018-09-15T18:12:30 < invzim> be first, be smarter etc..  The other stuff on the market is not fantastic, but this thing looks good
2018-09-15T18:12:44 < invzim> and it's a small market
2018-09-15T18:13:55 < invzim> biggest, by far, player does about 2.5mn usd, and has military contracts which prob make up the bulk of it
2018-09-15T18:14:47 < invzim> but yeah, may have a little play just for the engineering fun of it - was thinking epaper displays
2018-09-15T18:15:11 < invzim> as they are getting cheap, available and you got models that work sub-zero
2018-09-15T18:15:23 < karlp> don't they have too slow refresh for this sort of application?
2018-09-15T18:16:13 < mawk> do I need some kind of protection if I want to use a mosfet as a source-follower from an opamp output
2018-09-15T18:16:28 < mawk> startup time will be "slow", but I don't see why dynamic gate currents could happen
2018-09-15T18:18:25 < mawk> 3µs to fill the gate capacity
2018-09-15T18:21:16 < invzim> karlp: you fall about 200ft pr second, and most people use analog stuff anyway which is inherently not super accurate.  Haven't looked into it in detail, but if you can get about 5hz update, it should be ok
2018-09-15T18:21:31 < Laurenceb123> mawk: just work out the peak current, should be easy to work out
2018-09-15T18:21:58 < Laurenceb123> something that has always confused me is how much you can overdrive outputs for very short intervals
2018-09-15T18:22:16 < jadew> so first is the splash and then the refresh
2018-09-15T18:22:35 < Laurenceb123> aiui working out the output junction volume, energy dissipation and heat capacity of silicon is a good first order approx
2018-09-15T18:22:51 < Laurenceb123> so if temperature difference of the output is >100C you have a problem
2018-09-15T18:23:28 < mawk> isn't the energy I should measure Laurenceb123 ?
2018-09-15T18:23:30 < mawk> rather than the current
2018-09-15T18:23:34 < Laurenceb123> yes
2018-09-15T18:23:38 < mawk> ah
2018-09-15T18:23:48 < Laurenceb123> work out how much energy in joules is dissipated
2018-09-15T18:25:35 < mawk> max peak current of the opamp is 40 mA, but it's like for less than 10s
2018-09-15T18:25:43 < mawk> if it's for less than 1µs I hope it's much higher no ?
2018-09-15T18:25:58 < mawk> the datasheet say it's not current limited
2018-09-15T18:28:04 < Laurenceb123> erm
2018-09-15T18:28:11 < Laurenceb123> 10s != 1µs
2018-09-15T18:28:14 < mawk> yes
2018-09-15T18:28:35 < mawk> for <10s it's 40mA, so for <1µs it should be higher than 40mA
2018-09-15T18:28:44 < Laurenceb123> but by how much?
2018-09-15T18:29:02 < Laurenceb123> and what is the likely voltage drop on the output driver?
2018-09-15T18:29:45 < Laurenceb123> I got bitten by overstressing ESD protection over microseconds on F103
2018-09-15T18:29:56 < mawk> ah
2018-09-15T18:29:58 < mawk> I see
2018-09-15T18:30:02 < Laurenceb123> it worked fine on hundreds of boards, some running for years
2018-09-15T18:30:05 < mawk> well I thought 1 µs was small enough
2018-09-15T18:30:26 < Laurenceb123> then ST switched to a new fab and it broke in minutes on every board
2018-09-15T18:30:37 < Laurenceb123> back of the envelope might help you
2018-09-15T18:30:51 < Laurenceb123> how many ma is it for the first µs  ?>
2018-09-15T18:31:47 < mawk> well I set that value myself I guess
2018-09-15T18:32:09 < mawk> otherwise it doesn't look limited by something else that the traces or the wires
2018-09-15T18:32:52 < mawk> so overall some kind of driver between should work more consistently
2018-09-15T18:34:35 < mawk> but yeah that current isn't limited but I thought that this was so brief that it didn't do anything
2018-09-15T18:35:01 < mawk> but if even µs overcurrents can damage things, let's use something else
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2018-09-15T18:36:44 < Laurenceb123> so you are driving a fet with an opamp?
2018-09-15T18:37:10 < mawk> yes
2018-09-15T18:37:17 < mawk> as source-follower
2018-09-15T18:37:25 < mawk> so everything should be flat DC everywhere
2018-09-15T18:37:40 < mawk> so in theory only at startup there will be that gate charging current
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2018-09-15T18:53:56 < Laurenceb123> what is the gate capacitance?
2018-09-15T18:54:41 < mawk> gate charge is less than 43 nC
2018-09-15T18:56:09 < Laurenceb123> and whats the voltage?
2018-09-15T18:56:41 < mawk> at most 15V
2018-09-15T18:58:37 < Laurenceb123> hmm yeah that might be enough to blow an output driver if its made using a small process geometry ~1µm scale
2018-09-15T18:58:48 < Laurenceb123> I'd just add a current limiting resistor
2018-09-15T18:59:32 < zyp> Steffanx, https://bin.jvnv.net/file/FVANz.jpg https://bin.jvnv.net/file/tlMub.jpg
2018-09-15T19:00:35 < mawk> so the 3µs startup delay isn't concerning I guess
2018-09-15T19:00:36 < mawk> thanks
2018-09-15T19:13:50 < Steffanx> cool cool zyp, getting there.
2018-09-15T19:13:59 < Steffanx> Whats this thing on the roof? The house next to yours has it too
2018-09-15T19:14:12 < Steffanx> oh, snow "racks" or something?
2018-09-15T19:14:21 < Steffanx> *stoppers
2018-09-15T19:15:37 < Steffanx> Did you actually get the plans from your neighbours or is this like force. When you build there you have to go for that exact house?
2018-09-15T19:15:44 < Steffanx> *forced
2018-09-15T19:15:51 < zyp> yeah, snow stoppers
2018-09-15T19:22:28 < Laurenceb123> zyp lives in a shed
2018-09-15T19:25:37 < zyp> houses are pre-designed
2018-09-15T19:25:45 < zyp> but interior is customizable
2018-09-15T19:26:07 < zyp> also location of windows and stuff
2018-09-15T19:26:56 < Steffanx> projection Laurenceb123 ?
2018-09-15T19:28:15 < Laurenceb123> I live in a brick building
2018-09-15T19:28:28 < Laurenceb123> it is 300 years old and still standing fine
2018-09-15T19:28:31 < Laurenceb123> unlike a shed
2018-09-15T19:29:32 < Laurenceb123> >>Lyndsey Scott is an actress and a former Victoria’s Secret and Calvin Klein model, as well as a successful programmer
2018-09-15T19:29:43 < Laurenceb123> brogrammers on suicide watch
2018-09-15T19:31:58 < Steffanx> You shouls hire her to do some Qt UI
2018-09-15T19:33:13 < friendofafriend> Yeah, that noose is staying cold.
2018-09-15T19:33:19 < Steffanx> Java and C++ are in the list too Cracki 
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2018-09-15T19:39:46 < Laurenceb123> stick that dongle in that port
2018-09-15T19:40:53 < jadew> Laurenceb123, the article forgot to list that she's black
2018-09-15T19:41:20 < jadew> ah, it's right there on wikipedia, second sentence
2018-09-15T19:41:24 < Laurenceb123> kek
2018-09-15T19:41:37 < Laurenceb123> muh heritage the article
2018-09-15T19:42:35 < jadew> she's doable
2018-09-15T19:42:40 < jadew> I bet her code is crap
2018-09-15T19:43:36 < Steffanx> That's what every programmer says about another programmers code.
2018-09-15T19:44:05 < jadew> and it's usually true
2018-09-15T19:44:28 < Steffanx> conclusion: All code is bad.
2018-09-15T19:45:19 < jadew> not all, I did see code that made me think "ok, this is cool, it's better than how I do it"
2018-09-15T19:46:02 < jadew> not proof that the code was good, but it was better than mine
2018-09-15T19:46:59 < Steffanx> Awh, damnit. I already fell into the negativity trap again. Should stop doing that.
2018-09-15T19:48:21 < jadew> several people told me I'm negative and I think many more see me like that
2018-09-15T19:48:28 < jadew> but I'm really not
2018-09-15T19:48:58 < Steffanx> i think that's because you sometimes seem to base your opinion on.. idk. At least not facts
2018-09-15T19:49:05 < Steffanx> (like everyone does, but .. :P )
2018-09-15T19:49:57 < jadew> I'll keep an eye on that
2018-09-15T19:50:33 < jadew> I assumed it was because I shut down their ideas
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2018-09-15T19:50:57 < jadew> but as I tried to explain to them, it was not because I'm negative, it was because their ideas were stupid
2018-09-15T19:51:46 < Steffanx> i mean "I bet her code is crap" is based on nothing and can be interpreted as just negativity.
2018-09-15T19:52:09 < vampi-the-frog> women coding
2018-09-15T19:52:11 < jadew> that was more of a joke than anything
2018-09-15T19:52:11 < vampi-the-frog> what a joke
2018-09-15T19:52:29 < vampi-the-frog> code me a sandwich
2018-09-15T19:52:32 < jadew> but I can make a case for why I think it's very likely to be crap
2018-09-15T19:52:51 < jadew> 1) most code is crap. 2) she's pretty, so she had better things to do than to become an expert programmer.
2018-09-15T19:53:03 < vampi-the-frog> > write code
2018-09-15T19:53:04 < vampi-the-frog> > suck cock
2018-09-15T19:53:20 < Steffanx> You're not funny vampi-the-frog .
2018-09-15T19:53:21 < jadew> 3) everyone seems to be an iOS programmer these days, so it's a high chance that she's not even programming
2018-09-15T19:53:29 < jadew> maybe she linked two pieces of code
2018-09-15T19:53:39 < vampi-the-frog> Steffanx: at least I'm not a woman.
2018-09-15T19:53:50 < Steffanx> Im not convinced
2018-09-15T19:53:51 < jadew> so, while not a known fact, I think it's an extremely good educated guess
2018-09-15T19:54:02 < Steffanx> "i think" ty :P
2018-09-15T19:54:07 < jadew> hehe
2018-09-15T19:58:05 < jadew> I'm willing to bet $1000 vs $10, that's how sure I am
2018-09-15T19:58:16 < jadew> but we can't place that bet, because there's no way to settle it
2018-09-15T19:58:19 < vampi-the-frog> never try to prove anything, jadew 
2018-09-15T19:58:47 < jadew> waiting for the reason
2018-09-15T19:58:56 < vampi-the-frog> there's never a reason for a man to prove anything to anyone
2018-09-15T19:59:23 < jadew> what about when you want a job?
2018-09-15T19:59:30 < jadew> or when you want to sell a product?
2018-09-15T19:59:39 < jadew> or when you want to get laid?
2018-09-15T19:59:52 < vampi-the-frog> especially when you want to get laid
2018-09-15T20:00:05 < jadew> or, most importantly, when you have an argument over the internet?
2018-09-15T20:00:47 < vampi-the-frog> an argument means you're trying to prove something
2018-09-15T20:01:42 < jadew> what's wrong with that?
2018-09-15T20:01:51 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o Steffanx] by ChanServ
2018-09-15T20:01:53 -!- vampi-the-frog was kicked from ##stm32 by Steffanx [Meh]
2018-09-15T20:02:00 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o Steffanx] by Steffanx
2018-09-15T20:02:10 < Steffanx> lol, gotta beat him with his own argument.
2018-09-15T20:03:17 < jadew> I like contradictory discussions, they're very constructive
2018-09-15T20:03:22 < jadew> especially when you lose
2018-09-15T20:06:54 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o Steffanx] by ChanServ
2018-09-15T20:07:11 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o Steffanx] by Steffanx
2018-09-15T20:21:39 < Steffanx> I actually expected him to auto-rejoin, but .. he didnt. Who doesnt have that on irc?
2018-09-15T20:22:46 < zyp> Laurenceb123, can you elaborate on shed?
2018-09-15T20:22:46 -!- Laurenceb123 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-15T20:22:50 < zyp> ok, no
2018-09-15T20:29:46 < Steffanx> i can only assume because it's made of wood. and not from bricks.
2018-09-15T20:31:41 < Steffanx> and shed shaped.
2018-09-15T20:32:54 < zyp> ah, I can actually see that, if you've grown up somewhere all houses are made from bricks
2018-09-15T20:33:14 < zyp> most houses in norway are made from wood
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2018-09-15T20:33:42 < zyp> easy to fill with thermal insulation
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2018-09-15T20:39:29 < Steffanx> how long does an average norwegian house last?
2018-09-15T20:39:38 < Steffanx> to be honest im not sure why its all brick here
2018-09-15T20:41:19 < zyp> dunno what the average is
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2018-09-15T20:47:46 < Steffanx> no estimate for yours?
2018-09-15T20:49:52 < zyp> not that I know
2018-09-15T20:50:26 < zyp> yeah, autorejoin have always been frowned upon
2018-09-15T20:50:31 < Steffanx> never heard of such channel. not in my irc life at least.
2018-09-15T20:50:32 < catphish> morning
2018-09-15T20:50:48 < Steffanx> Yes totally.
2018-09-15T20:51:31 < catphish> this channel is odd at times
2018-09-15T20:51:48 < emeb> "at times" hah!
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2018-09-15T20:52:51 < Steffanx> < 30 but > 25 is old fag right?
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2018-09-15T21:04:52 < Steffanx> Does that make you an oldfag?
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2018-09-15T21:21:03 < branjb> jadew: i inherited code from a program that had two digital designers, one man one women, i can tell who wrote what based on how shitty/certain logic blocks just locking up or not working
2018-09-15T21:28:16 < branjb> ffs why are the rmii outputs on stm32f4 spaced out around the IC as far as possible
2018-09-15T21:28:23 < branjb> why can't they be nicely grouped together?
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2018-09-15T21:29:15 < Steffanx> you can ask the same about the FMC pins
2018-09-15T21:29:52 < branjb> wouldn't you think that similar functionaltiy would be going to the same place internal to the IC?
2018-09-15T21:33:41 < branjb> is that crazy talk?
2018-09-15T21:38:03 < Steffanx> id say no, but .. no expert in the field
2018-09-15T21:38:26 < branjb> there must be some vlsi reason for it
2018-09-15T21:40:15 < qyx> I just meh'd and routed them
2018-09-15T21:40:21 < qyx> but yes, I asked the same thing
2018-09-15T21:46:56 < qyx> anyone did a multicell liion design?
2018-09-15T21:47:25 < qyx> wtf there is nearly no feasible single-chp monitoring and balancing solution
2018-09-15T21:47:49 < qyx> not counting $$$ linear/analog parts
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2018-09-15T22:34:07 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IRjpfxSH0w-xhqk6F-1JCtvXsKDP7ITQ/view?usp=sharing work projects
2018-09-15T22:34:30 < kakimir> had to make decent phone charger with 6-18V input
2018-09-15T22:34:54 < kakimir> it works all way down to 6volts with 2.4A output
2018-09-15T22:37:47 < kakimir> just don't go cheap on every major component for shaving a penny and it has great performance and efficiency
2018-09-15T22:40:39 < branjb> why are all recruiters indians?
2018-09-15T22:40:59 < branjb> is recruiting outsourced a lot?  seems like the are US based recruiting agencies
2018-09-15T22:45:43 < englishman> nice irony there
2018-09-15T22:46:05 < branjb> US company that outsources finding people to indians
2018-09-15T22:46:54 < branjb> idk, it just seems every recruiter email is always from "Tarak Ram" or Priyanka Yadav" or "Srikanth Sankabudhhi"
2018-09-15T22:47:31 < branjb> but their emails usually list US based addresses
2018-09-15T22:49:05 < mawk> Laurenceb: for driving a mosfet faster I can use a bipolar transistor in between and that'll take care of the rising speed; but what about the currents returning from the gate ? for an inductive load or something
2018-09-15T22:49:25 < mawk> what should I use
2018-09-15T22:49:34 < mawk> i.e. what's inside typical a mosfet driver
2018-09-15T22:50:18 < kakimir> question one: why you avoid using gate driver?
2018-09-15T22:50:42 < mawk> because I'm not drawing circuits for practical purposes kakimir 
2018-09-15T22:50:45 < mawk> just for learning
2018-09-15T22:50:51 < mawk> so I like to only use discrete components
2018-09-15T22:51:17 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-15T22:51:22 < kakimir> basic electronics skills
2018-09-15T22:51:32 < kakimir> circuit design
2018-09-15T22:53:39 < mawk> well it's more for testing some elements than designing particular circuits
2018-09-15T22:54:14 < mawk> currently I'm trying opamps
2018-09-15T22:54:28 < mawk> even though it's not a very discrete element
2018-09-15T23:00:02 < qyx> design an opamp from discrete transistors
2018-09-15T23:03:08 < Steffanx> interesting kind of fun
2018-09-15T23:10:04 < aandrew> man I've been procrastinating making this layout
2018-09-15T23:10:09 < aandrew> but my schematic is amaze
2018-09-15T23:12:33 < Steffanx> im proud of you aandrew
2018-09-15T23:12:48 < aandrew> thanks Steffanx, means a lot
2018-09-15T23:12:57 < aandrew> it's a video digitizer
2018-09-15T23:13:10 < aandrew> 5x digitizers connected to an FPGA and STM32, shitting out ethernet
2018-09-15T23:13:26 < aandrew> 11 B-size schematic pages
2018-09-15T23:13:45 < Steffanx> Something F7?
2018-09-15T23:15:13 < aandrew> H7 yes, F746 I think
2018-09-15T23:15:17 < aandrew> have the ipc footprint thing up atm
2018-09-15T23:18:57 < aandrew> F756
2018-09-15T23:19:11 < aandrew> STM32F756IGK6 and 10M08DAF256C8G
2018-09-15T23:19:28 < aandrew> have to do some last minute calcs to see if I should put DDR instead of SDR on this though
2018-09-15T23:35:33 < Steffanx> who was it that posted that usb wall hooks?
2018-09-15T23:35:37 < Steffanx> Here a review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ze8jifMh034
2018-09-15T23:35:47 < Steffanx> was karlp iirc, where is he?! :o
2018-09-15T23:37:57 < Steffanx> do you want dave instead?
2018-09-15T23:38:58 < Steffanx> ok
2018-09-15T23:39:19 < Steffanx> #negative24
2018-09-15T23:39:20 < Steffanx> i mean 32
2018-09-15T23:41:42 < Steffanx> He opens it up later on and does a complete circuit "tear down"
2018-09-15T23:41:54 < Steffanx> [spoiler alert]
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--- Day changed Sun Sep 16 2018
2018-09-16T00:14:45 -!- Laurenceb123 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-16T00:14:48 < Laurenceb123> my sides @ the scrollback
2018-09-16T00:14:54 < Laurenceb123> the absolute state of vampi
2018-09-16T00:15:01 < Laurenceb123> mgtow confirmed
2018-09-16T00:15:23 < branjb> lol
2018-09-16T00:19:19 < Laurenceb123> vampi-the-frog> women coding <vampi-the-frog> what a joke vampi-the-frog> > write code <vampi-the-frog> > suck cock Steffanx> You're not funny vampi-the-frog .vampi-the-frog> Steffanx: at least I'm not a woman.
2018-09-16T00:19:29 < branjb> vampi mgtow about womyn coders and Steffanx white knighted for them
2018-09-16T00:19:59 < Laurenceb123> inb4 branjb b&
2018-09-16T00:20:03 < branjb> rip
2018-09-16T00:20:55 < branjb> doing smps is so tedious
2018-09-16T00:21:06 < branjb> too many equations why no reference sch
2018-09-16T00:21:15 < Steffanx> Pic a different ic
2018-09-16T00:21:26 < branjb> tempted
2018-09-16T00:21:33 < Steffanx> Pick*
2018-09-16T00:21:39 < Laurenceb123> branjb: which is why you copypasta a reference design or use spice
2018-09-16T00:22:55 < Laurenceb123> https://www.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=mgtow&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gl=uk
2018-09-16T00:23:04 < Laurenceb123> my sides @ people also search for
2018-09-16T00:24:38 < karlp> damn, does it have to be 12 minutes?!
2018-09-16T00:27:45 < Steffanx> Hah yes karlp
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2018-09-16T00:35:13 < englishman> http://i.imgur.com/ih3RLPB.jpg
2018-09-16T00:35:33 < englishman> http://i.imgur.com/XWymL08.jpg
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2018-09-16T00:35:50 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-16T00:35:51 < karlp> nice!
2018-09-16T00:36:45 < englishman> no he was scared of them
2018-09-16T00:37:23 < Steffanx> Lol
2018-09-16T00:41:28 < branjb> those are some weird looking peppers
2018-09-16T00:42:14 < Steffanx> Does Pepper beer exist?
2018-09-16T00:42:19 < branjb> yeah
2018-09-16T00:42:40 < branjb> it's pretty good, you only taste the pepper in the aftertaste
2018-09-16T00:43:58 < branjb> https://www.totalwine.com/beer/specialty-styles/chili-beer/scuttlebutt-jalepeno-triple-7/p/140412226?s=1001&igrules=true
2018-09-16T00:44:35 < emeb_mac> hippity hop
2018-09-16T00:44:56 < Steffanx> Scuttlebutt heh
2018-09-16T00:45:23 < emeb_mac> used to get this locally https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/677/2213/
2018-09-16T00:45:37 < emeb_mac> *awful*
2018-09-16T00:46:17 < branjb> it's ratings reflect that
2018-09-16T00:48:31 < emeb_mac> one of my electronics pals actually did a bit of work for that company - a microwave liquid level sensor for the beer vats.
2018-09-16T00:49:12 < Laurenceb123> https://imgoat.com/uploads/7d1e990583/147254.png
2018-09-16T00:50:44 < emeb_mac> "primitive"
2018-09-16T00:51:23 < emeb_mac> Steffanx: why does crt: not appear in the log?
2018-09-16T00:51:53 < Laurenceb123> Jordung Peterstone very wise shaman
2018-09-16T00:52:10 < emeb_mac> just a figment of our imaginations - doesn't really exist
2018-09-16T00:52:44 < emeb_mac> a ghostly presence
2018-09-16T00:53:11 < emeb_mac> lol
2018-09-16T00:53:19 < emeb_mac> that's not a bug that's a feature
2018-09-16T00:54:54 < Steffanx> Yeah, because jpa is the logger everyone ignored by him wont show up
2018-09-16T00:58:13 < Steffanx> Im still surprised by that crt
2018-09-16T01:00:13 < Steffanx> No one opted in
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2018-09-16T01:11:28 < emeb_mac> asian women + guns = https://twitter.com/amberbladejones/status/1039970721592573952
2018-09-16T01:12:00 < kakimir> nice
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2018-09-16T01:20:01 < kakimir> you are not the only one
2018-09-16T01:20:20 < kakimir> there is a lot of conversations with ghost nicks
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2018-09-16T01:23:42 < kakimir> what is there to criticise jpa about?
2018-09-16T01:24:02 < Steffanx> ice cold finlander
2018-09-16T01:24:31 < Steffanx> like raikkonen
2018-09-16T01:25:00 < kakimir> automated test systems?
2018-09-16T01:25:15 < kakimir> why don't you show me
2018-09-16T01:25:22 < kakimir> I lazy
2018-09-16T01:26:04 < kakimir> timestamp
2018-09-16T01:31:03 < kakimir> 2018-09-13T20:52:10
2018-09-16T01:32:59 < kakimir> I don't understand what this shit is even about
2018-09-16T01:33:40 < kakimir> and why you and jpa would be so pumped about it
2018-09-16T01:34:33 < Steffanx> i do. :P
2018-09-16T01:36:01 < kakimir> Steffanx: you do know what cracki means or you understand what jpa and Cracki where so much pumped about?
2018-09-16T01:36:22 < englishman> /ignore is cheating
2018-09-16T01:36:51 < Steffanx> both kakimir
2018-09-16T01:38:02 < Steffanx> and its ones good right to use that.
2018-09-16T01:39:50 < Steffanx> Yes, enjoy.
2018-09-16T01:41:10 < kakimir> true
2018-09-16T01:44:29 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJXRyWQgOY4
2018-09-16T01:45:46 < englishman> depends
2018-09-16T01:46:04 < karlp> Cracki: maybe take jpa blockign you as an idea to reconsider some or all of what you say, rather than an invitation to continue on your current path
2018-09-16T01:46:16 < englishman> lol'd when the guy said that nanopuff can do 130C tho.
2018-09-16T01:46:49 < englishman> i agree Cracki chats are weak and at times harmful, but it's easy to skip over such chats
2018-09-16T01:46:58 < englishman> hobbyking nanotech
2018-09-16T01:47:54 < englishman> i like my batteries https://i.imgur.com/xetQG2k.jpg
2018-09-16T01:47:59 < englishman> the bms gets here monday
2018-09-16T01:50:11 < karlp> well, this is fun.  spent a while testing rtoss, decide on a couple to push more.  can't get either of them to run the gadget0 tests yet.
2018-09-16T01:50:37 < karlp> follow freertos textbook code, and it just asserts https://www.freertos.org/deferred_interrupt_processing.html
2018-09-16T01:50:41 < karlp> luvverly.
2018-09-16T01:50:52 < karlp> I bet they're upset at interrupt priroties again.
2018-09-16T01:51:26 < karlp> well, I'm back on freertos because rtx is crashing on the same thing
2018-09-16T01:51:37 < karlp> so now I've got broken pieces in two places :)
2018-09-16T01:52:02 < karlp> gonna hack and slash a bit instead I reckon
2018-09-16T01:53:05 < karlp> yeh, I'm probably missing something "obvious" by only working in it in little bits in the evenings now I'm back at work.
2018-09-16T01:54:27 < Steffanx> englishman is working on more batteries for in his car, or local storage?
2018-09-16T01:54:47 < Steffanx> and i see you got into 3d printing
2018-09-16T01:57:27 < branjb> >boot0 and boot1 opposite sides of IC
2018-09-16T01:57:34 < branjb> why
2018-09-16T01:57:46 < karlp> because no-one usesx boot1?
2018-09-16T01:57:50 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-16T01:57:52 < karlp> and they don't go together anyway?
2018-09-16T01:58:17 < branjb> fine
2018-09-16T01:58:52 < Thorn> lol I'm planning to do s project with fmc, ltdc and ethernet (qfp-176). they all are on all 4 sides of the package
2018-09-16T02:00:58 < Steffanx> Back to the real issues: Why so many apps on windows still have issues with different dpi settings?
2018-09-16T02:01:26 < Steffanx> different as in: the stuff windows does at 150%.
2018-09-16T02:03:07 < branjb> because windows source code is based on 30+ years of garbage that just keeps building on itself?
2018-09-16T02:06:49 < Steffanx> just compensate with some good overclocking
2018-09-16T02:06:56 < Steffanx> i love you too Cracki
2018-09-16T02:08:34 < Steffanx> not sure if zeptobars made more pics of other stm32s
2018-09-16T02:10:00 < englishman> Steffanx: its for the atv
2018-09-16T02:10:08 < englishman> and i got my 3dicker in 2014 iirc
2018-09-16T02:11:13 < englishman> also Steffanx because the vast majority of computers sold are 720p laptops ;(
2018-09-16T02:12:56 < Steffanx> sure, but 4k screens and stuff and 1080 in 13" or so, isnt THAT uncommon
2018-09-16T02:13:09 < Steffanx> even windows surface stuff does it
2018-09-16T02:13:26 < englishman> some dumb apps still use the winxp file picker
2018-09-16T02:13:44 < englishman> or whatever that old one is that doesnt show you the path
2018-09-16T02:14:31 < Steffanx> hah, dont you love it
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2018-09-16T02:15:16 < Steffanx> Its a folder picked..
2018-09-16T02:15:22 < Steffanx> Picket
2018-09-16T02:15:26 < Steffanx> Picker. Damnit
2018-09-16T02:15:57 < englishman> whats going on at steffantown at 1am on a saturday night
2018-09-16T02:16:00 < englishman> innovation?
2018-09-16T02:16:25 < Steffanx> nah, just some reading, youtubeing. ircing
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2018-09-16T02:16:53 < englishman> an excellent idea
2018-09-16T02:17:04 < Steffanx> lol englishman even knows who billy is.
2018-09-16T02:18:03 < englishman> tonight i'm going to sort my socks by temperature
2018-09-16T02:18:12 < englishman> and get rid of the singles
2018-09-16T02:18:23 < Steffanx> and trash those with holes in it
2018-09-16T02:18:31 < Steffanx> i mean those with more than one hole.
2018-09-16T02:18:36 < englishman> you've used that pic a lot. time for an update on billy.
2018-09-16T02:18:58 < englishman> socks with holes are removed from circulation immediately, which leaves the singles
2018-09-16T02:19:13 < Steffanx> Wake it up, play with it.
2018-09-16T02:19:15 < Steffanx> make it happy.
2018-09-16T02:19:21 < Steffanx> it look a bit sad on the photo
2018-09-16T02:19:29 < Steffanx> looks
2018-09-16T02:19:45 < Steffanx> hah. cool :)
2018-09-16T02:19:54 < englishman> hitler cat in an image named IMG_1488
2018-09-16T02:19:55 < englishman> well done
2018-09-16T02:20:15 < Steffanx> lb is that you?
2018-09-16T02:20:15 < englishman> also the signs cannot be read
2018-09-16T02:22:45 < Steffanx> Id add a sign "Dont leave your cat here if you dont want it to be disturbed"
2018-09-16T02:22:45 < englishman> kids, on the other hand
2018-09-16T02:22:47 < englishman> problem
2018-09-16T02:23:33 < Steffanx> is a dog wash a common thing in the aussieland?
2018-09-16T02:23:49 < Steffanx> just as common as a car wash?
2018-09-16T02:25:49 < Steffanx> is a cat wash also a thing?
2018-09-16T02:25:59 < Steffanx> why wash your dog and not your cat?
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2018-09-16T02:26:57 < Steffanx> even a cat can be trained.
2018-09-16T02:27:29 < Steffanx> lol that cat, the poor cat.
2018-09-16T02:28:04 < Steffanx> looks like a huge CRT with a cat in it.
2018-09-16T02:28:50 < emeb_mac> what is it with Russians and large undomesticated cats?
2018-09-16T02:28:52 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/tIPCBLN.jpg
2018-09-16T02:29:02 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/o3KKNXn.jpg
2018-09-16T02:29:17 < englishman> ty
2018-09-16T02:29:55 < englishman> after this experience, they never stank again
2018-09-16T02:29:59 < englishman> good smelling kittos
2018-09-16T02:30:48 < emeb_mac> damp englishcats
2018-09-16T02:31:22 < emeb_mac> gotta say that automated pet wash seems like a good way to traumatize animals.
2018-09-16T02:31:53 < Steffanx> i think crt is traumatized as wel now.
2018-09-16T02:32:17 < emeb_mac> how can you tell?
2018-09-16T02:33:33 < emeb_mac> this!
2018-09-16T02:34:06 < Steffanx> Cat Related Trauma, emeb_mac
2018-09-16T02:35:24 < emeb_mac> spent too much time in those places already. hoping to never need one.
2018-09-16T02:36:32 < Steffanx> Just safe enough money and go for a home-carer.
2018-09-16T02:36:34 < Thorn> what are you supposed to do with usb shield on a connector? I've always connected it directly to gnd but now people are saying you need a small cap (a few nF) in // with 1MΩ to gnd
2018-09-16T02:37:18 < emeb_mac> Steffanx: if you live long enough that your life and basic dignity is in the hands of a bunch of teenage girls who could barely finish high-school then you've lived too long.
2018-09-16T02:37:23 < englishman> you can connect it to gnd but im pretty sure the cap and resistor is in usb2 spec and up
2018-09-16T02:37:36 < englishman> might want to double check usb spec
2018-09-16T02:38:14 < Thorn> and the cap should apparently be rated for several kV
2018-09-16T02:38:17 < Steffanx> emeb_mac, in dutchland those people actually have some sort of degree/certificate/whatever you call it.
2018-09-16T02:38:20 < Thorn> what is the purpose
2018-09-16T02:38:48 < emeb_mac> Steffanx: that's better. Here in the libertarian paradise those jobs go to the lowest bidder.
2018-09-16T02:39:28 < emeb_mac> Thorn: ESD control w/o creating a shorting hazard.
2018-09-16T02:40:45 < Thorn> I would say shorting it to gnd would effectively eliminate the shorting hazard in a way lol
2018-09-16T02:42:35 < emeb_mac> Thorn: yes but the RC snubber is more likely to leave the equipment still functioning :)
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2018-09-16T03:13:09 < kakimir> shield is shield
2018-09-16T03:33:14 < dongs> so apparently new chrome is now forcing auto-sign in'
2018-09-16T03:33:23 < dongs> into their fucking gay account
2018-09-16T03:33:32 < dongs> and when I logged out, it c leared all my gmail/corp gmail cookies too
2018-09-16T03:33:49 < dongs> time to switch to a browser that isnt retarded maybe
2018-09-16T03:34:08 < englishman> i noticed that i have to re sign in to gmail a fucking lot these days
2018-09-16T03:36:46 < dongs> what what fucking nonsense
2018-09-16T03:36:57 < dongs> there's no way to unlink any of that shit now
2018-09-16T03:37:44 < kakimir> edge
2018-09-16T03:37:56 < Ultrasauce> chromium
2018-09-16T03:38:03 < kakimir> that
2018-09-16T03:39:10 < kakimir> I still nees to learn how to install it to windows
2018-09-16T03:40:38 < branjb> anyone use altium on linux?
2018-09-16T03:41:21 < dongs> .
2018-09-16T03:43:43 < branjb> does it crash as often as windows?
2018-09-16T03:44:14 < dongs> altium rarely crashes on me
2018-09-16T03:44:39 < dongs> i spent like ~20 hours laying out a 4L board over last few days and it hasnt crashed once
2018-09-16T03:44:55 < branjb> I always seem to crash compiling libraries
2018-09-16T03:45:06 < dongs> compiling whats/
2018-09-16T03:45:10 < dongs> 'cc'?
2018-09-16T03:45:46 < branjb> no the integrated library shit
2018-09-16T03:47:36 < dongs> what the fuck is that I have never in my life had to "compile" any libraries
2018-09-16T03:47:47 < dongs> what is your workflow where this is needed or causes a crash
2018-09-16T03:48:39 < dongs> < Ultrasauce> chromium
2018-09-16T03:48:48 < dongs> k and where's guarantee it won't start happening there too?
2018-09-16T03:48:58 < branjb> combining .pcblib/.schlib into .intlibs
2018-09-16T03:48:58 < dongs> chromium just looks like beta versions of chrome
2018-09-16T03:50:10 < dongs> branjb: yeah but for what? i just have a personal .schlib and a few .pcblib (common, rarely used, customer-specific, etc type stuff) that's linked from all projects as-needed, i don't know why I would ever need a intlib or whatever shit made
2018-09-16T03:50:45 < branjb> i don't know i just work here
2018-09-16T03:50:58 < branjb> all sch/footprints used in a design need to be in one .intlib file
2018-09-16T03:51:05 < branjb> and that shit always crashes
2018-09-16T03:51:36 < dongs> man that sucks. also if you actually work there, tell them to give you a fuckign windows 10 machine
2018-09-16T03:53:19 < Ultrasauce> chromium = chrome - google
2018-09-16T03:53:42 < dongs> The key benefits of compiling into an integrated library are:
2018-09-16T03:53:43 < dongs> All component information is available in a single, portable file - since all models are packaged into the integrated library, only one file needs to be available to the project, or moved when the project is relocated. This portability is priceless if you divide your work among different workstations, or want to share your designs with others.
2018-09-16T03:53:59 < dongs> Ultrasauce: `but the UI looks same. and there's that fucking 'YOU' button
2018-09-16T03:54:09 < dongs> that used to be on the title bar
2018-09-16T03:54:17 < dongs> and got replaced by whatever fucking button on the address abr now
2018-09-16T03:58:07 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/gx81E4a.jpg
2018-09-16T04:01:21 < dongs> AAC, H.264, and MP3 Support. Chrome includes licensed codecs for these proprietary media formats, giving you acess to a wider variety of media content—particularly sites using HTML5 video to stream H.264 videos. Both browsers include the basic, free codecs: Opus, Theora, Vorbis, VP8, VP9, and WAV.
2018-09-16T04:01:26 < dongs> haha
2018-09-16T04:02:13 < dongs> You should note that while it’s not Google-branded, Chromium is still very Google-centric. For example, Chromium contains the same sync features found in Chrome, allowing you to log in with a Google account and sync your data.
2018-09-16T04:02:27 < dongs> yeah, whats to stop them from making you auto-login next time
2018-09-16T04:03:07 < Ultrasauce> shrug. never used that feature
2018-09-16T04:03:19 < dongs> what fucking feature
2018-09-16T04:03:22 < Ultrasauce> the login
2018-09-16T04:03:24 < dongs> if you open fucking gmail and log into it
2018-09-16T04:03:30 < dongs> it automatically fucking "signs you into chrome?
2018-09-16T04:03:41 < Ultrasauce> not in chromium, that's why I suggested it
2018-09-16T04:03:54 < dongs> yes, but my point is, whats stopping them from doing same in chromium
2018-09-16T04:04:26 < Ultrasauce> what's stopping it from wiping your harddrive
2018-09-16T04:13:08 < emeb_mac> dongs: you've done touchsense on stm32?
2018-09-16T04:13:16 < dongs> y
2018-09-16T04:13:19 < dongs> on F0
2018-09-16T04:13:24 < dongs> but i think peripheral is same on all of htem
2018-09-16T04:13:32 < dongs> whats up?
2018-09-16T04:13:45 < emeb_mac> Oh, just thinking of trying it out for giggles.
2018-09-16T04:13:48 < emeb_mac> on F3
2018-09-16T04:13:50 < dongs> its very fun
2018-09-16T04:13:59 < emeb_mac> used the HAL driver?
2018-09-16T04:14:04 < dongs> also simpler than other (atmel) impl cuz it doessnt need a cap per each sense thing
2018-09-16T04:14:08 < dongs> well, i ported HAL to stdperiph haha
2018-09-16T04:14:14 < emeb_mac> hrhr
2018-09-16T04:14:31 < emeb_mac> anything special to do on layout?
2018-09-16T04:14:47 < Laurenceb123> the instructions are awful
2018-09-16T04:14:54 < dongs> nope! i followed the appnotes about track clearance / ground plane clearance and shit just worked
2018-09-16T04:14:56 < Laurenceb123> weird mesh ground plane
2018-09-16T04:15:10 < dongs> that didnt seem to have a lot of effect actually
2018-09-16T04:15:15 < dongs> whether its mesh or whatever stuff.
2018-09-16T04:15:22 < emeb_mac> OK - will study that appnote
2018-09-16T04:15:25 < dongs> actually wait, i did do one with F3 as well
2018-09-16T04:15:42 < dongs> F0 was a toy/proof of concept and on f3 i did it wiht backlit leds in center of buttons
2018-09-16T04:15:44 < emeb_mac> seems f0 and f3 are about the same
2018-09-16T04:16:54 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/8o2yvxq.png this is in my TSC appnote folder
2018-09-16T04:17:38 < emeb_mac> cool ty
2018-09-16T04:17:52 < dongs> should be able to google up those filenames, they're all ANxxx someshits related to touch
2018-09-16T04:17:58 < dongs> 1st one is from NXP, i forgot why i cached it
2018-09-16T04:18:28 < emeb_mac> ok
2018-09-16T04:20:07 < Ultrasauce> cloning make noise pressure points? :D
2018-09-16T04:20:18 < emeb_mac> Ultrasauce: nah
2018-09-16T04:20:50 < emeb_mac> besides MN stuff uses some silly resistive sense
2018-09-16T04:22:17 < emeb_mac> even their new version of Rene still has funky sense pads with two contacts.
2018-09-16T04:22:42 < emeb_mac> but they did put multi-color LEDs behind them at least
2018-09-16T04:27:20 < dongs> the way I did sample was interrupt + state machine in systick. main() starts sampling w/IT, once it gets EOA flag in TSC_IRQ, i set a flag for systick + set state to read touch groups, once systick hits it reads those and sets state to discharge, ticks until discharge done, then clears sampledone flag and re-starts sampling.
2018-09-16T04:42:52 < emeb_mac> makes sense. systick is where I always do all my UI stuff for debounce, encoders, etc. 
2018-09-16T04:43:27 < emeb_mac> and TSC_IRQ is the only sensible thing - polling something so slow would be silly
2018-09-16T04:44:50 < dongs> yea, and you need to discharge before the next measurement cycle, thats why the states in systick
2018-09-16T04:44:58 < dongs> measure -> read -> discharge -> repeat
2018-09-16T04:46:24 < dongs> crt are you pumping the kitty
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2018-09-16T05:02:57 < Ultrasauce> pats are a form of pumping
2018-09-16T05:03:44 < aandrew> that's the capsense shit?
2018-09-16T05:03:44 < aandrew> did some of that with cypress
2018-09-16T05:03:55 < aandrew> they also had weird grid 
2018-09-16T05:04:34 < dongs> before going with ST i also did atmel capsense wiht AT42QT1110
2018-09-16T05:04:39 < dongs> worked as well but felt super filthy
2018-09-16T05:04:44 < dongs> i think there's an avr inside of that shit
2018-09-16T05:04:57 < dongs> cuz it had a bunch of retarded restrictions like "spi speed of 4mhz" or someshit
2018-09-16T05:07:34 < aandrew> lol
2018-09-16T05:07:39 < aandrew> "felt super filthy"
2018-09-16T05:30:57 < branjb> you probably touched the avrdude
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2018-09-16T05:51:16 < Thorn> is f429 too slow for a 800x480 display (using ltdc)?
2018-09-16T05:52:23 < branjb> don't think so
2018-09-16T05:53:10 < branjb> haven't used it for display but iirc the datasheet said something about 1024x768 display
2018-09-16T05:54:31 < Thorn> I mean how many FPS can you realistically get out of it
2018-09-16T05:55:01 < Thorn> the ltdc freq is 180/4 = 45MHz
2018-09-16T05:55:54 < Thorn> 8.5 ms / frame
2018-09-16T05:56:25 < Thorn> (without porches)
2018-09-16T05:58:38 < branjb> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyjokUTBt4k
2018-09-16T05:59:04 < branjb> dunno fps but looks reasonable
2018-09-16T05:59:19 < Thorn> might be a windowed update
2018-09-16T05:59:48 < branjb> also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGMXHxBtGaE
2018-09-16T06:00:21 < branjb> "I made the next step with my VGA output on the STM32F429 with LTDC. V-Sync, triple buffering and dual layer is enabled, a frame counter is added in the upper right corner. Compared with the first performance test, the framerate went up from 18 to 30 fps, both at 800x480 pixel @ 16bit colour. The framebufer consumes more than half of the 8 MByte SDRAM of the discovery board. Also the memory 
2018-09-16T06:00:21 < branjb> bandwith is on its limits. Feeding 2 Layers to the LTDC and using DMA to draw new pictures into the videobuffer exhaust the memory channels.  But at constant 30fps, fluid animation is possible as you can see in the video. DMA2D is still not in use, this will be done in the next step. Search the project site for more info and project sources : "
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2018-09-16T06:09:44 < branjb> Torch have you thought about using a PSoC?
2018-09-16T06:11:23 < branjb> Thorn
2018-09-16T06:12:17 < Thorn> I've been thinking about using a spartan-6
2018-09-16T06:12:29 < Thorn> but that is a lot of work
2018-09-16T06:12:49 < Thorn> does PSoC have a lot of bandwidth?
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2018-09-16T06:28:42 < branjb> what kind of display you trying to do?  i saw an example of someone using a PSoC w/ vga that was using >1% of the CPU
2018-09-16T06:29:23 < branjb> https://hackaday.com/2015/12/27/psoc-vga-on-a-10-development-board/
2018-09-16T06:32:46 < Thorn> well >fixed pattern
2018-09-16T06:37:16 < aandrew> https://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/programmable/us/en/pdfs/literature/ds/ep53a8xqi_03651.pdf page 19
2018-09-16T06:37:37 < aandrew> is the left-right center to center distabce 3mm, and hte top/bottom 2.5mm?
2018-09-16T06:38:24 < Thorn> looks like it
2018-09-16T06:38:38 < Thorn> why does intel make dc/dc
2018-09-16T06:38:42 < aandrew> the package itself though is 3mm square
2018-09-16T06:38:57 < aandrew> they bought enpirion
2018-09-16T06:40:31 < Thorn> it's not a center-to-center dimension horizontally
2018-09-16T06:40:42 < Thorn> it's simply package width
2018-09-16T06:42:02 < aandrew> ahh
2018-09-16T06:42:04 < aandrew> yes I see it now
2018-09-16T06:42:05 < aandrew> fuck
2018-09-16T06:42:11 < aandrew> ok so I am going to assume 2.5 let/right as well
2018-09-16T06:42:13 < aandrew> left/right
2018-09-16T06:42:58 < Thorn> the pad length outside the outline would be (3.4-3)/2 mm long
2018-09-16T06:43:08 < Thorn> and the full pad width is 0.55 typ
2018-09-16T06:43:37 < aandrew> yeah
2018-09-16T06:43:51 < aandrew> I fucking hate when they make the recommended footprints require calculus to dimension
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2018-09-16T06:44:55 < englishman> thats why you keep a casio on the desktop
2018-09-16T06:45:27 < aandrew> oh trust me I have like 3 bc windows open :-)
2018-09-16T06:45:30 < englishman> (3.4/2)-(.55/2)=your pad centerline
2018-09-16T06:46:41 < aandrew> yep
2018-09-16T06:46:51 < aandrew> I was thrown off because it looked like that 3 was pad centers
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2018-09-16T06:56:11 < jadew> https://youtu.be/mdDBkzCm4bM?t=269
2018-09-16T06:56:14 < jadew> what language is that?
2018-09-16T06:56:39 < jadew> is it german?
2018-09-16T06:59:29 < Thorn> Norwegian probably
2018-09-16T06:59:40 < jadew> yeah, sounds similar
2018-09-16T06:59:49 < jadew> or finnish
2018-09-16T07:02:16 < aandrew> 207 010nF 04042s, tha'ts not too much
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2018-09-16T07:25:28 < aandrew> 1000 components to place and lay out on six layers... 
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2018-09-16T08:01:02 < dongs> cool
2018-09-16T08:01:05 < dongs> start up livestream
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2018-09-16T08:19:47 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/WyV1WSO I guess that doesn't look TOO bad
2018-09-16T08:20:15 < aandrew> board will be approx 60mm x 300mm
2018-09-16T08:21:30 < dongs> lol rooms
2018-09-16T08:21:43 < dongs> are you actyualyl going to use htem
2018-09-16T08:21:49 < dongs> i hope there's a ton of repeating shit
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2018-09-16T08:38:00 < Thorn> RM0090 リファレンスマニュアル
2018-09-16T08:38:32 < dongs> jap manual
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2018-09-16T09:06:40 < jadew> any tricks on how to be more efficient when selecting the componentns for manual pick & place?
2018-09-16T09:07:15 < jadew> the way I do it now is that I go to the BOM, enter the number of boards I need and then I select and cut strips of that many components
2018-09-16T09:07:51 < jadew> and then stick them on a sticky tape on a board
2018-09-16T09:08:16 < jadew> the whole thing takes ~30 minutes or more and that's for small boards
2018-09-16T09:09:13 < jadew> a component counter could be useful
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2018-09-16T09:25:32 < Thorn> tricks: (1) after picking stuff up don't drop it (2) don't sneeze
2018-09-16T09:36:46 < dongs> judew, what the hell
2018-09-16T09:36:49 < dongs> why would you even cut strips
2018-09-16T09:36:57 < dongs> have reels /whatever nearby
2018-09-16T09:37:08 < dongs> drop down x parts as needed by unreeling
2018-09-16T09:37:10 < dongs> pick and place them
2018-09-16T09:37:19 < dongs> lol counting
2018-09-16T09:37:28 < dongs> ifits a lot (like 50 0603 caps needed
2018-09-16T09:37:31 < dongs> drop what you think is 50
2018-09-16T09:37:35 < dongs> if not enough, add more when empty
2018-09-16T09:37:40 < dongs> if too much ,blow excess away
2018-09-16T09:37:41 < dongs> doen
2018-09-16T09:40:54 < jadew> dongs, 0603 caps are expensive
2018-09-16T09:41:36 < jadew> would be cool if I could have the whole thing mounted in some sort of manual dispenser and just leave it there between assembly sessions
2018-09-16T09:42:26 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JmVeJWhQmo
2018-09-16T09:42:39 < dongs> jadew: CNC cut a manual tape feeder then 
2018-09-16T09:42:57 < dongs> anyway, for <= 20 or so its super simple to just count stuff as you peel it off the tapel.
2018-09-16T09:43:07 < dongs> its been so long since i manually counted caps tho
2018-09-16T09:43:16 < dongs> i will load shit into dicknplace even if its like 30 parts on the board
2018-09-16T09:43:34 < jadew> isn't that taking a lot of time (that's what I hear)
2018-09-16T09:43:37 < jadew> ?
2018-09-16T09:43:56 < dongs> i have enough spare reel feeders now that most of them already have parts i need on them
2018-09-16T09:44:23 < dongs> so most jobs is just loading parts list to match wahtever currrent feeder config is, or shuffling around a few pre-loaded feeders to match the design
2018-09-16T09:44:28 < jadew> https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:7291
2018-09-16T09:45:00 < dongs> that looks like cancer
2018-09-16T09:46:21 < jadew> it has several problems
2018-09-16T09:46:31 < dongs> 1st one being that its 3d printed filth
2018-09-16T09:46:32 < jadew> height being one of them
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2018-09-16T09:54:09 < jadew> I'll try this out: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:386738
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2018-09-16T10:23:07 < jadew> came out nice
2018-09-16T10:23:07 < jadew> I'
2018-09-16T10:23:10 < jadew> I'll make more
2018-09-16T10:25:16 < jadew> me too, I'll put all my tapes in them and leave them like that
2018-09-16T10:25:43 < jadew> doesn't work for other thicknesses, but it's fine for resistors and capacitors
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2018-09-16T10:53:08 < Steffanx> Welcome
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2018-09-16T12:07:07 < Steffanx> Looks handy, but id need a vacuum tooly as well jadew 
2018-09-16T12:07:36 < Steffanx> Oh, now i think about it. I have such tooly somewhere. Lol
2018-09-16T12:08:30 < jadew> yeah, I have one
2018-09-16T12:08:41 < jadew> made it from an aquarium pump
2018-09-16T12:09:23 < jadew> you can get a ready made one from ebay, for $17 or so
2018-09-16T12:17:23 < Steffanx> Can always ask crt to pump
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2018-09-16T15:26:18 < jadew> man... my day turned from bad to ok just by reflowing a component
2018-09-16T15:32:47 < jpa-> reflow another one
2018-09-16T15:35:05 < antto> satisfaction overload
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2018-09-16T16:37:43 < Laurenceb123> muh
2018-09-16T16:43:39 < zyp> buh
2018-09-16T16:43:59 < dongs> anything interesting happening
2018-09-16T16:44:03 < dongs> i cant wait for 17th
2018-09-16T16:44:06 < zyp> Laurenceb123, can you elaborate what you meant by that shed comment yesterday? I'm genuinely curious
2018-09-16T16:44:21 < dongs> < Laurenceb123> zyp lives in a shed
2018-09-16T16:44:35 < dongs> this one?
2018-09-16T16:44:37 < zyp> ya
2018-09-16T16:47:16 < dongs> if thats true, Laurence/b/ lives in a trailer park
2018-09-16T17:02:06 < Steffanx> whats happening on the 17th dongs?
2018-09-16T17:03:30 < jpa-> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/7vbMe.JPG   <-- maybe laurence thought that this picture is from indoors? :)
2018-09-16T17:03:49 < dongs> is tha fiber
2018-09-16T17:04:37 < zyp> no, power for EV charging place I lived when I bought the car
2018-09-16T17:07:37 < jpa-> though it seems that Laurenceb123 just doesn't like wood buildings
2018-09-16T17:08:54 < Steffanx> it was just a try to be funny
2018-09-16T17:09:41 < karlp> https://imgur.com/a/2iSZbO6
2018-09-16T17:11:38 < jpa-> uh.. $260 MP3 player.. without a phone?
2018-09-16T17:12:03 < jpa-> and it even comes with FM radio
2018-09-16T17:12:17 < Steffanx> but it comes with a real fpga
2018-09-16T17:12:51 < karlp> oh, you should see the rest of it. they have them up to $650 
2018-09-16T17:12:56 < karlp> runs cutting edge android 5.1
2018-09-16T17:12:58 < karlp> without a phone
2018-09-16T17:13:11 < dongs> is that the toblerone-shaped retardo-player?
2018-09-16T17:13:25 < dongs> that had a dickstarter for some millions
2018-09-16T17:13:44 < dongs> oh fiio
2018-09-16T17:13:47 < dongs> yeah they're dumb
2018-09-16T17:13:56 < dongs> audiophool crap
2018-09-16T17:13:59 < Thorn> the 3d designer has never seen an IC https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1JA9sd8yWBuNkSmFPq6xguVXaG.jpg
2018-09-16T17:14:22 < dongs> An SoC
2018-09-16T17:14:24 < dongs> an Hero
2018-09-16T17:14:31 < Thorn> wtf is that picket fence around the package
2018-09-16T17:14:39 < Thorn> inverted picket fence
2018-09-16T17:17:22 < englishman> whats on 17th dongs
2018-09-16T17:17:26 < englishman> rtx280 ships?
2018-09-16T17:17:38 < dongs> no, reviews get posted
2018-09-16T17:17:47 < englishman> of rtx?
2018-09-16T17:17:47 < dongs> 280 ships on or before 20th
2018-09-16T17:17:51 < englishman> with gaytracing?
2018-09-16T17:17:52 < dongs> ti has been pushed back a week lol
2018-09-16T17:17:57 < dongs> yes
2018-09-16T17:18:19 < karlp> heh, mqtt for robots..... https://github.com/eclipse/mosquitto/issues/961#issuecomment-421006686
2018-09-16T17:18:33 < karlp> "oit's ok, 3 seconds of wildly flainling about is ok apparently"
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2018-09-16T17:19:48 < karlp> using a protocol that straight up doesn't support finer resolution than seconds.
2018-09-16T17:19:50 < karlp> nice one
2018-09-16T17:20:55 < englishman> kind of like using can-bus for automotive motor control right
2018-09-16T17:22:46 < karlp> do people do things on can by saying, "take this failsafe action if it's been more than X seconds" ?
2018-09-16T17:23:44 < dongs> https://pastebin.com/y77wm4p2 ;p;
2018-09-16T17:23:47 < dongs> lol ^
2018-09-16T17:24:32 < Steffanx>  you're scrwed
2018-09-16T17:24:41 < dongs> totally
2018-09-16T17:24:46 < dongs> he missed one small part tho
2018-09-16T17:24:52 < dongs> none of my computers have a webcam
2018-09-16T17:25:24 < Thorn> but all your smartphones have 2
2018-09-16T17:25:31 < jpa-> they got me last week, but i thought that Tectu and Steffanx have seen worse already so i have nothing to lose
2018-09-16T17:26:41 < dongs> whoi's they?
2018-09-16T17:26:48 < dongs> stroopwaffel police?
2018-09-16T17:27:32 < jpa-> that
2018-09-16T17:28:55 < Steffanx> still have to ship the package to finland
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2018-09-16T17:40:00 < Thorn> 299 orders? srsly? https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Bundle-Sale-of-FiiO-Android-based-WIFI-Bluetooth-APTX-Lossless-DSD-Music-Player-with-32G-X5iiiWith/1473108_32853286528.html
2018-09-16T17:40:25 < dongs> thorn, Fiio has been high end audiophool trash for ages
2018-09-16T17:40:31 < dongs> forumfags drool all over that shit
2018-09-16T17:40:52 < Thorn> someone found their niche lol
2018-09-16T17:40:57 < dongs> yea totally
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2018-09-16T17:46:10 < dongs> holy shit. TESLA is an anagram of STEAL
2018-09-16T17:46:20 < dongs> attn englishman 
2018-09-16T17:49:48 < englishman> breaking news
2018-09-16T17:51:13 < englishman> these crêpe are intense 🥞
2018-09-16T17:52:38 < BrainDamage> 🔥🔥🔥
2018-09-16T17:52:52 < Steffanx>  did you use enough maple syrup englishman ?
2018-09-16T17:54:55 < englishman> yes opened a new can
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2018-09-16T18:28:02 < dongs> http://www.thedrive.com/tech/23599/tesla-stolen-from-mall-of-america-using-only-a-smartphone
2018-09-16T18:32:09 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-16T18:33:08 < jadew> next up: Tesla owner accused of hit & run. He says he was at home, sleeping.
2018-09-16T18:33:59 < englishman> lol entering a pin to start the car
2018-09-16T18:35:28 < jadew> this didn't used to be a problem when I was a kid
2018-09-16T18:35:39 < jadew> back then, only the owner knew exactly what it took to start the car
2018-09-16T18:37:23 < jadew> and even for them, it didn't always work
2018-09-16T18:39:05 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHu-3w3H1XE some amazing pro shit here guys
2018-09-16T18:40:06 < jadew> it's a troll video for sure
2018-09-16T18:41:38 < jadew> he's wearing the wireless anti-static bracelet lol
2018-09-16T18:42:08 < dongs> yeah that shit was amazing
2018-09-16T18:42:12 < dongs> i wonder who sold him taht shit
2018-09-16T18:42:27 < jadew> I don't think it's for real
2018-09-16T18:42:32 < jadew> (the video)
2018-09-16T18:42:47 < dongs> oh it very much is
2018-09-16T18:43:01 < dongs> its the verge, not the onion
2018-09-16T18:43:20 < aandrew> jadew: when I hand populat boards I tend to do one side at a time. usually MLCCs and Rs and Ls and Ds and Qs in that order
2018-09-16T18:43:32 < aandrew> I organize my BOM per-side and do one value at a time
2018-09-16T18:44:18 < aandrew> I then put a bit of solder on one of the pads for each cap I'm going to populate
2018-09-16T18:44:45 < aandrew> then I'll take the strip and drop 30 caps on the table, then populate them by melting the solder, sticking the cap there, then moving on
2018-09-16T18:44:54 < englishman> why not outsource your gay assembly to canada
2018-09-16T18:44:57 < aandrew> so I'll then have 30 caps half soldered
2018-09-16T18:45:20 < aandrew> I then finish them off, I count the parts as I'm soldering them as a cross check
2018-09-16T18:45:37 < aandrew> englishman: 99% of the time it's very low volume and it's been a real hassle to get low volume assembly 
2018-09-16T18:45:40 < dongs> yeah really, handsoldering caps? fuck off
2018-09-16T18:45:47 < dongs> aandrew: englishman does low volume assembly
2018-09-16T18:45:50 < aandrew> dongs: not all of us have personal PNP machines 
2018-09-16T18:45:55 < englishman> I've done as low as 2 boards
2018-09-16T18:46:11 < catphish> i think i just realised why i had so much trouble with soldering my QFNs: https://imgur.com/a/uIcvKDk
2018-09-16T18:46:13 < aandrew> dongs: yeah I know, I am actually thinking of talking to you about this panel once I'm done. it's got a couple BGAs on it too
2018-09-16T18:46:20 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/WyV1WSO
2018-09-16T18:46:32 < dongs> how goes layout of that
2018-09-16T18:46:33 < dongs> where's livestream
2018-09-16T18:46:36 < aandrew> catphish: haha
2018-09-16T18:46:41 < aandrew> dongs: I'm just starting it now
2018-09-16T18:47:07 < catphish> i have no idea what data they used to make that stencil, but not my paste data :(
2018-09-16T18:47:40 < catphish> this time i ordered the stencil separately and provided *only* the paste data file
2018-09-16T18:47:47 < aandrew> most stencil places take your gerbers and fuck with them
2018-09-16T18:47:49 < englishman> it's a single command in cam350 to take a block array and turn it into a single block of same area
2018-09-16T18:48:12 < dongs> yeah i generally leaev stencil stuff to people who know what tehy're doing
2018-09-16T18:48:20 < dongs> if t hey modify my paste layer, its for a reason
2018-09-16T18:48:27 < aandrew> yep that is why they modify it
2018-09-16T18:48:33 < dongs> your kikecad ep pattern is too big anyway
2018-09-16T18:48:39 < aandrew> they enlarge things to make sure the paste ends up how the gerber states it
2018-09-16T18:48:46 < catphish> aandrew: i think they probably didn't realise i'd provided a paste file, and instead combined my copper and mask layers to guess where i wanted paste
2018-09-16T18:48:49 < aandrew> although in catphish's case it looks like they may have fucked it up
2018-09-16T18:49:17 < dongs> if you are making a proto, its wise to extend the pads for QFNs and shit so you can hand-touch them later
2018-09-16T18:49:19 < englishman> that was already far too much paste under ep
2018-09-16T18:49:25 < jadew> aandrew, I used to do the same for one offs, but now I'm just using a paste dispenser
2018-09-16T18:49:35 < englishman> clearly didn't follow mfg recommend paste layer
2018-09-16T18:49:41 < aandrew> I've yet to like paste for small run stuff
2018-09-16T18:49:47 < englishman> probably due to copy paste footprint
2018-09-16T18:49:51 < dongs> paste is awesome.
2018-09-16T18:49:56 < dongs> combined wiht my dickstarter printer
2018-09-16T18:50:00 < dongs> you';ll never go back to hand soldering
2018-09-16T18:50:03 < dongs> even if you hand-place that shit.
2018-09-16T18:50:07 < englishman> why the fuck would you not paste even for qty1
2018-09-16T18:50:09 < aandrew> most of the time where I'm hand assembling it's the first ones and I like being able to really get a good idea of how close things are or what needs moved for the real boards
2018-09-16T18:50:09 < catphish> yeah it's a generic footprint, maybe i should have made a specific one :(
2018-09-16T18:50:22 < aandrew> dongs: what dickstarter printer is that
2018-09-16T18:50:22 < catphish> but hopefully at least using the generic one properly will help
2018-09-16T18:50:23 < englishman> you were warnes
2018-09-16T18:50:25 < englishman> warned
2018-09-16T18:50:32 < aandrew> having a real paste printer might be nice though
2018-09-16T18:50:43 < aandrew> not having to fuck around with screens and squeegees and shit
2018-09-16T18:50:43 < catphish> paste printer is a thing?
2018-09-16T18:50:44 < catphish> i want that
2018-09-16T18:50:55 < englishman> wut
2018-09-16T18:51:11 < englishman> screen +squeegee = paste printer
2018-09-16T18:51:19 < dongs> paste printer is stencil stretched on frame/pneumatic shit and a squeegee.
2018-09-16T18:51:22 < dongs> so you cant realyl avoid that last part
2018-09-16T18:51:26 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-16T18:51:34 < catphish> oh ok
2018-09-16T18:51:34 < aandrew> no I mean like a FDM printer where you squirt paste down where you want instead of having a screen and worrying about pressure and all that shit
2018-09-16T18:51:40 < dongs> no that shit doesnt work
2018-09-16T18:51:46 < catphish> i was thinking you could use a 3d print head to put it in
2018-09-16T18:51:53 < catphish> that would be awesome
2018-09-16T18:51:53 < englishman> all pro shit is screened
2018-09-16T18:51:56 < dongs> you need auger valves to properly dispese dots of paste and that shit is $3k per head
2018-09-16T18:52:02 < aandrew> yeah the problem is that paste needs pressure to stick right, which is why everyone screens it
2018-09-16T18:52:20 < aandrew> and real assemblers have a nice frame with proper pressure plates etc
2018-09-16T18:52:24 < catphish> i use a stencil and a credit card, it seems to go on really well
2018-09-16T18:52:25 < englishman> all your samsung and ifruit phones are screened
2018-09-16T18:52:26 < aandrew> the local assembly house I used to =work with had all that
2018-09-16T18:52:34 < dongs> aandrew: my printer has a nice frame with pneumatic stretcher
2018-09-16T18:53:02 < dongs> so you don't need to order / store framed stencils
2018-09-16T18:53:07 < dongs> but have all the same benefits
2018-09-16T18:53:15 < aandrew> dongs: wow nice
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2018-09-16T18:53:24 < englishman> paste deposition might have worked in 1995 when the smallest SMT component was plcc
2018-09-16T18:53:29 < jadew> dongs how does that work?
2018-09-16T18:53:32 < jadew> got a pic?
2018-09-16T18:53:38 < dongs> som,ewehre in my imgur im sure
2018-09-16T18:53:41 < englishman> don't bother he won't sell it
2018-09-16T18:53:42 < dongs> l;ets see if I jewtube'd it
2018-09-16T18:53:46 < dongs> also that
2018-09-16T18:53:52 < englishman> I've asked him like 900x
2018-09-16T18:54:17 < catphish> i don't think the datasheet for this st95hf provides any advice on solder paste, but clearly filling the whole center pad is dumb
2018-09-16T18:55:26 < catphish> hardware engineering sucks, in software one can fix something and learn a lesson in about 5 minutes :(
2018-09-16T18:55:44 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEqovFp5HOU jadew 
2018-09-16T18:55:52 < catphish> hardware costs me like 2 weeks per iteration
2018-09-16T18:56:07 < dongs> and pcb goes in center on standoffs
2018-09-16T18:56:16 < dongs> with a sheet under it to align x/y
2018-09-16T18:56:33 < dongs> once its centered, can do bunch of paste iterations and it remains in same position
2018-09-16T18:56:47 < jadew> neat
2018-09-16T18:56:56 < aandrew> dongs: why does that stencil holder have such a long z travel?
2018-09-16T18:57:14 < dongs> lol beacuse it uses a cheap aliexpress pneumatic actuator thingy
2018-09-16T18:57:19 < aandrew> ahh
2018-09-16T18:57:21 < dongs> but also so i can put my hand inside and chage pcb'
2018-09-16T18:57:27 < dongs> without releasing top stencil
2018-09-16T18:57:29 < aandrew> you built this or got it off kickstarter?
2018-09-16T18:57:33 < catphish> beats my method of holding down the stelcil with one hand and pasting with the other
2018-09-16T18:57:37 < dongs> built, was gonna dickstart but lazy
2018-09-16T18:57:41 < aandrew> aha
2018-09-16T18:57:43 < dongs> probly some MAKE:R supply is a better place 
2018-09-16T18:57:52 < aandrew> that looks like something I should build up
2018-09-16T18:57:55 < dongs> i'd expect a stencil printer for maker:s to be a niche within a niche
2018-09-16T18:58:04 < aandrew> yeah it'd be low volume for sure
2018-09-16T18:58:34 < aandrew> the "fingers" grabbing the stencil to pull it back is a really neat trick. that looks like that part may have been tricky to get right though
2018-09-16T18:58:47 < dongs> works pretty good, and stretches it real nice
2018-09-16T18:59:08 < aandrew> how much force are those fingers exerting to pull the stencil tight? 
2018-09-16T18:59:21 < aandrew> too much I expect it'd damage the stencils pretty easily
2018-09-16T18:59:34 < dongs> enough to keep it stretched similarly to framed
2018-09-16T18:59:39 < dongs> never had issues with tearing stuff
2018-09-16T19:00:10 < dongs> im using same air feed as goes to my dicknplace
2018-09-16T19:00:35 < dongs> and there's a regulator valve to turn it down a bit
2018-09-16T19:00:46 < aandrew> are they just rectangular pins in a solid tube of steel that is rotated to stretch/release?
2018-09-16T19:01:05 < dongs> no there's a bit of smarts there but if I told you then what use is my dickstarter gonna be :P
2018-09-16T19:01:24 < aandrew> well you'll never dickstarter it anyway so what's the harm?
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2018-09-16T19:03:40 < aandrew> that is a nice machine though
2018-09-16T19:04:21 < aandrew> the table top looks really "deep" -- does that gray plate actually hold a different piece that the bare PCB sits in (likely with tooling holes?)
2018-09-16T19:05:07 < dongs> yea standoffs for holding/aligning pcb
2018-09-16T19:05:09 < aandrew> looks really nicely built though. did you give some metalshop 3d files and let them make the pieces?
2018-09-16T19:05:20 < dongs> standoffs are like 3cm tall or so, so i can do doublesided shit if needed
2018-09-16T19:05:28 < dongs> no, its all made by ghettocnc locally
2018-09-16T19:05:38 < aandrew> yes that's smart thinking I bet I'd fuck that up on a first prototype :-)
2018-09-16T19:05:39 < dongs> if I dickstart i'd probly get it done proper
2018-09-16T19:06:41 < kakimir> have you used dickstarter a lot dongs ?
2018-09-16T19:06:45 < dongs> no
2018-09-16T19:06:52 < dongs> ive only got scammed on disckstartert
2018-09-16T19:06:55 < dongs> still waiting for my FPS1000
2018-09-16T19:07:02 < dongs> meanwhile my phoen can already do 960fps
2018-09-16T19:07:16 < kakimir> I have not been scammed
2018-09-16T19:07:34 < kakimir> 1/1 successful dickstarters
2018-09-16T19:07:36 < jadew> I got my money back
2018-09-16T19:07:58 < jadew> I backed the matchstick
2018-09-16T19:08:06 < dongs> matchstickarm??
2018-09-16T19:08:07 < dongs> really?
2018-09-16T19:08:14 < dongs> oh nvm that was matchboxarm
2018-09-16T19:08:22 < jadew> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/matchstick/matchstick-the-streaming-stick-built-on-firefox-os
2018-09-16T19:08:23 < jadew> this
2018-09-16T19:08:30 < dongs> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1883701526/matchboxarm
2018-09-16T19:08:41 < jadew> when they ran their campaign, they made it seem like it was backed by mozzila
2018-09-16T19:09:07 < aandrew> yeah I almost backed that
2018-09-16T19:09:12 < jadew> *mozilla
2018-09-16T19:09:19 < dongs> i have no fucking idea what is the appeal of hdmi "sticks"
2018-09-16T19:09:25 < aandrew> I'm so far 100% on my kickstarters. One *did* come in like 5 years late though
2018-09-16T19:09:26 < dongs> i could never see a usecase for it
2018-09-16T19:09:35 < aandrew> so totally useless for my kid, maybe for my first grandkid now
2018-09-16T19:09:50 < aandrew> dongs: I love the chromecast
2018-09-16T19:09:50 < jadew> dongs, easy streaming to the TV
2018-09-16T19:09:54 < jadew> from your TV or phone
2018-09-16T19:09:56 < aandrew> it's our primary way of watching tv actually
2018-09-16T19:10:04 < dongs> ?
2018-09-16T19:10:07 < aandrew> use any phone/tablet/laptop to select what to watch and cast it. simple
2018-09-16T19:10:19 < dongs> yes, i can do that to my TV without any fucking "stick"
2018-09-16T19:10:24 < dongs> but the shit is so annoying to use that why bother
2018-09-16T19:10:25 < aandrew> I only wish I could use it ot extend my laptop to a big screen wirelessly without the lag
2018-09-16T19:10:40 < BrainDamage> aandrew: lunix?
2018-09-16T19:10:47 < Thorn> lcsc lpc824 price increased by 20% :/
2018-09-16T19:10:52 < dongs> like, i could play jewtube and press "cast to shit jap tv", it will switch to youtube player and play it but meh
2018-09-16T19:10:57 < aandrew> dongs: your tv has the feature built in; I prefer it not in the tv. my smart tv has no access to anything
2018-09-16T19:11:06 < aandrew> BrainDamage: osx, but linux/osx/win all have the same problem
2018-09-16T19:11:15 < BrainDamage> I know a solution for lunix
2018-09-16T19:11:16 < aandrew> intel has acceleration to help but it's still too laggy for my work
2018-09-16T19:11:17 < BrainDamage> using miracast
2018-09-16T19:11:26 < BrainDamage> but it'll hijack your wifi card
2018-09-16T19:11:39 < aandrew> dongs: yes, exactly the same thing. you're doing it with what the tv has built in, I'm using chromecast. same shit
2018-09-16T19:11:46 < jadew> dongs, yeah, now they're of no use
2018-09-16T19:12:07 < aandrew> BrainDamage: ah, yeah I heard of that
2018-09-16T19:12:23 < BrainDamage> aandrew: miracast connects the devices directly
2018-09-16T19:12:36 < dongs> aandrew: i did it like once and the UX was so awful i never bothered again.
2018-09-16T19:12:47 < dongs> jewtube looks like trash on 4K tv too
2018-09-16T19:12:54 < aandrew> what ux? you hit cast, sleect the tv, done. there's no ui
2018-09-16T19:13:15 < dongs> yeah but seeking in video or just having it re-buffer back on tv etc
2018-09-16T19:13:37 < dongs> apparently sometimes you can seek on phone and it changes shit on tv but sometimes not etc
2018-09-16T19:13:43 < dongs> anyway, it looked very useless
2018-09-16T19:13:46 < aandrew> dongs: *shrugs* it's really no different than seeking when displaying on the phone screen
2018-09-16T19:14:00 < Thorn> nice layout https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DnHH0pMU4AABIia.jpg
2018-09-16T19:14:32 < dongs> surprised tehy used a 4L board
2018-09-16T19:15:09 < Thorn> did they fail to fit both hdmi and ddr into the board without rotating the ICs?
2018-09-16T19:15:11 < Thorn> or what
2018-09-16T19:15:56 < jadew> why else would you do that?
2018-09-16T19:16:17 < Thorn> dunno, "self-expression"
2018-09-16T19:16:22 < jadew> haha
2018-09-16T19:16:49 < BrainDamage> for that, you draw hentai pictures on the silkscreen
2018-09-16T19:17:28 < Thorn> is that ddr2 or 3 btw
2018-09-16T19:18:28 < dongs> ddr3
2018-09-16T19:19:16 < dongs> i can't tell if the angles between DDR and H5 are same
2018-09-16T19:19:34 < dongs> if so, its possible they just took reference layout from allwhiner and rotated it until it fit into the rest of thier pcb
2018-09-16T19:19:55 < dongs> like leaving it flat would have made the board too long/whatever
2018-09-16T19:20:14 < zyp> it's either that or a PR stunt
2018-09-16T19:20:24 < zyp> in the latter case, it's working
2018-09-16T19:20:38 < dongs> well i aint buying another shitty allwhiner board
2018-09-16T19:20:42 < dongs> just cuz it has some rotated DDR3
2018-09-16T19:20:45 < dongs> so no, its not working
2018-09-16T19:20:56 < zyp> still made you look :p
2018-09-16T19:21:24 < Thorn> yeah the diagonal of the allloser is parallel to ddr ics
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2018-09-16T19:25:44 < Steffanx> Waking up at 2.00 is trippy crt  :P
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2018-09-16T19:32:12 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgosYeAymUw more disco
2018-09-16T19:35:58 < kakimir> Steffanx: I'm eating some "The Dutch Captain's Liquorice Boats"
2018-09-16T19:36:12 < Thorn> If you suffer from characteristic impedance a while ago God 's domain is different now Whether it is quick and somewhat quick to analyze by pencil rolling and flashing
2018-09-16T19:36:12 < Steffanx> doesnt sound familiar
2018-09-16T19:36:21 < kakimir> Lidl stuff
2018-09-16T19:37:46 < Thorn> what is the difference between MIPI DSI and simply "LVDS"
2018-09-16T19:38:30 < kakimir> LVDS is physical bus standard?
2018-09-16T19:38:35 < kakimir> idk
2018-09-16T19:39:10 < kakimir> Steffanx: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_ug55UeUnrpmQzATatXfCdJOCMkNObRq/view?usp=sharing I cannot possibly stop eating these
2018-09-16T19:39:17 < Thorn> there are displays with "lvds interface" and then there are some with DSI
2018-09-16T19:39:33 < Steffanx> Soft sweet "drop" is the best kakimir  <3
2018-09-16T19:39:54 < kakimir> texture and sweetness
2018-09-16T19:40:10 < kakimir> it's unresistable
2018-09-16T19:40:11 < Thorn> surely both use lvds as physical layer but in this case "lvds" must also assume some high level protocol
2018-09-16T19:40:37 < kakimir> funlander liquorice is usually hard
2018-09-16T19:41:03 < dongs> Thorn: completely different
2018-09-16T19:41:22 < kakimir> I should remeber to pay your stroopwaffles back by sending you a reindeer Steffanx 
2018-09-16T19:41:55 < Steffanx> i like irc when people use google to answer questions. Especially when the asker could've done it just as easily :D
2018-09-16T19:41:55 < kakimir> not pay back but do my turn to say
2018-09-16T19:42:36 < kakimir> I asked easy questions before it was cool
2018-09-16T19:42:52 < Steffanx> hah, kakimir. except its not allowed to ship tat
2018-09-16T19:43:04 < Steffanx> *except = saldy
2018-09-16T19:43:13 < kakimir> like 10years back
2018-09-16T19:43:46 < kakimir> all technical questions can be answered with varying level of studying the subject
2018-09-16T19:44:13 < kakimir> sometimes actually with practical testing if information provided is not enough
2018-09-16T19:45:01 < Thorn> that article doesn't mention DSI
2018-09-16T19:45:53 < Thorn> I checked all 3 parts
2018-09-16T19:46:06 < zyp> Thorn, my take is that MIPI DSI is a complete standard across multiple layers, LVDS strictly just specifies the signalling layer, which vendors throws various shit on top of
2018-09-16T19:47:04 < Thorn> there are parallel rgb to lvds converter ICs that don't seem to be vendor specific
2018-09-16T19:47:51 < zyp> I think LVDS is pretty much parallel rgb over differential lanes
2018-09-16T19:48:15 < zyp> probably with some interleaving of data to reduce lane number too
2018-09-16T19:49:38 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-16T19:49:39 < Thorn> I googled lvds data and there are diagrams with 3, 4, 5 data lanes and different interleaving
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2018-09-16T19:50:26 < dongs> Thorn: DSI is a closed standard
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2018-09-16T19:50:31 < dongs> used mostly in mobile phone screens
2018-09-16T19:50:53 < Thorn> iirc there're some stm32 that support it?
2018-09-16T19:51:09 < dongs> Thorn: yeah, they do. good luck buying panels that can work with it tho.
2018-09-16T19:51:58 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XX12dJRRRhJdOreJlAx0KETROc7WGUNB/view?usp=sharing tip for VAG owners. Compress spring and drop that mounting triangle from chasis and bolt comes out and new one goes in
2018-09-16T19:52:20 < dongs> i got a flat tire in my car and swapped it in 5 mins
2018-09-16T19:52:25 < dongs> yesterday
2018-09-16T19:53:06 < kakimir> dongs: show inspirational projects!
2018-09-16T19:53:50 < dongs> bedtime
2018-09-16T19:54:06 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IRjpfxSH0w-xhqk6F-1JCtvXsKDP7ITQ/view?usp=sharing I did small stuff at works
2018-09-16T19:54:07 < zyp> «5 mins» doesn't sound like it includes getting out the tools
2018-09-16T19:54:20 < kakimir> he was prepared
2018-09-16T19:54:55 < Thorn> he got the tools ready before driving over the nail
2018-09-16T19:55:04 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-16T19:55:09 < Thorn> it's a tradition in Japan
2018-09-16T19:57:08 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-16T19:59:07 < kakimir> can i make youtube to buffer more?
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2018-09-16T20:02:30 < Steffanx> google knows :P
2018-09-16T20:05:15 < kakimir> third party addon
2018-09-16T20:05:23 < kakimir> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/smartvideo-for-youtube/lnkdbjbjpnpjeciipoaflmpcddinpjjp
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2018-09-16T20:09:43 < kakimir> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/magic-actions-for-youtube/abjcfabbhafbcdfjoecdgepllmpfceife
2018-09-16T20:09:52 < kakimir> maybe this does it too
2018-09-16T20:10:13 < kakimir> but all are AIDS
2018-09-16T20:10:25 < kakimir> 5stars or not
2018-09-16T20:11:10 < Steffanx> ok
2018-09-16T20:14:02 < aandrew> hm is it not possible to redefine a room shape and then say "make room components fit in shape" ?
2018-09-16T20:14:05 < aandrew> I can do it manually
2018-09-16T20:19:37 < kakimir> I love to stuff pcbs
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2018-09-16T20:20:26 < aandrew> altium
2018-09-16T20:22:02 < kakimir> I use 0.01mm grid casually
2018-09-16T20:24:13 < aandrew> no I don't want permanent placement
2018-09-16T20:24:22 < aandrew> 'm just reorganizing things since altium loves making long skinny rooms
2018-09-16T20:24:26 < kakimir> how many components?
2018-09-16T20:24:27 < aandrew> and I prefer squarer ones
2018-09-16T20:24:29 < aandrew> about 1000
2018-09-16T20:24:46 < kakimir> okay.. pretty much
2018-09-16T20:27:07 < kakimir> everything is easy when you know constraints
2018-09-16T20:27:12 < kakimir> exactly
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2018-09-16T20:27:54 < aandrew> no you misunderstand
2018-09-16T20:27:59 < aandrew> I'm not being very clear
2018-09-16T20:28:07 < aandrew> I'm just rearranging things before I actually start real placement
2018-09-16T20:28:19 < aandrew> but I take a loooong rectangular room and adjust it so it's more square
2018-09-16T20:28:39 < aandrew> but the components that are part of that room don't move, so now I manually have to move those components back into the new room dimensions
2018-09-16T20:28:45 < aandrew> it would be nice if altium just did that 
2018-09-16T20:28:51 < aandrew> and if I ask it to place the room it probably would
2018-09-16T20:33:40 < aandrew> I bet that is it
2018-09-16T20:33:42 < aandrew> let me see
2018-09-16T20:34:09 < aandrew> yep that's it
2018-09-16T20:34:23 < kakimir> if I know constraints I don't usually do any transitions between sizes
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2018-09-16T20:34:38 < jadew``> https://m.imgur.com/gallery/8SUPfTf
2018-09-16T20:35:00 < kakimir> I start visioning stuff on provided area and maybe do 2 or more variations before one starts to stick
2018-09-16T20:35:08 < kakimir> initial placements
2018-09-16T20:35:25 < Steffanx> im happy for you Cracki.
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2018-09-16T20:47:13 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/Em9qF57 rearranged
2018-09-16T20:49:31 < kakimir> fuufuuu
2018-09-16T20:49:57 < qyx> I cannot see any SMAs
2018-09-16T20:51:15 < Thorn> why couldn't ST do a generic lvds host instead of DSI?
2018-09-16T20:56:19 < aandrew> you can do LVDS with FMC can't you?
2018-09-16T20:56:24 < aandrew> or do you mean like a pixel pusher
2018-09-16T20:59:17 < qyx> he probably means without a discrete serdes or what
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2018-09-16T21:05:47 < aandrew> for a 6 layer board the arrangement is usually sig-gnd-sig-sig-pwr-sig; the blind vias usually go between the outer and inner signals (e.g. 1-3 and 4-6 in my example) with your normal through hole ones
2018-09-16T21:05:55 < aandrew> I thnk that's how I've broken it out before
2018-09-16T21:06:11 < aandrew> basically you want to be able to get diff pairs to the inner layers without creating stubs
2018-09-16T21:16:09 < catphish> i waste a LOT of time trying to choose capacitors, is it reasonable just to choose a generic capacitor and use it for everything (like murata GRM)? if so, what are the chances it will be in stock and sanely priced?
2018-09-16T21:17:13 < catphish> even with murata GRM, there's a ton of variables :(
2018-09-16T21:18:15 < catphish> it's not often i need a high voltage or a high accuracy device, so just want a way to really quickly buy generic parts
2018-09-16T21:21:48 < catphish> does the world really need 223,183 MLCCs :|
2018-09-16T21:26:48 < catphish> looks like yes, this approach works, narrow by mfgr, size, voltage, tolerance, termination, and one gets a list of devices with reasonable values, not the most cost effective way to buy, but much easier
2018-09-16T21:28:02 < aandrew> catphish: I do not pay any attention whatsoever to capacitors: any vendor's X5R or X7R MLCC, use tant poly (ONLY!) if space is important and you need big capacitance or SMD or TH electrolytics otherwise
2018-09-16T21:28:10 < aandrew> and if you can find a cap in C0G go for it
2018-09-16T21:28:35 < aandrew> if there's a specific need for something more interesting I will pay attention to it but in general that's my capacitor selection process
2018-09-16T21:30:21 < catphish> i think it's just the time it takes to choose them from a supplier website, when there's so much choice it seems to end up time consuming
2018-09-16T21:31:15 < catphish> it's hard to explain, it shouldn't be hard, but it sees to take me forever to fill a basket with half a dozen sizes of capacitor
2018-09-16T21:31:35 < aandrew> like I said, I don't bother with any of that. pick size (0805, 0402 whatev) and as long as it's X5R or X7R I don't care who makes it
2018-09-16T21:32:45 < catphish> i think a lot of the frustration comes from using farnell, where removing the value field, then adding a different value field takes more than a minute
2018-09-16T21:33:31 < catphish> today i just narrowed it to a specific mfgr / voltage / tolerance, and in stock, and all the values i need are on one page, a huge time saving
2018-09-16T21:33:48 < catphish> it's silly, just a personal annoyance
2018-09-16T21:37:10 < catphish> i take it back, that failed miserably, half the devices didn't have enough stock
2018-09-16T21:37:21 < zyp> you're overthinking it
2018-09-16T21:37:26 < zyp> where are you buying parts?
2018-09-16T21:37:33 < catphish> right now, mouser
2018-09-16T21:37:38 < zyp> okay
2018-09-16T21:38:05 < zyp> choose value, size and tolerance, sort by price, pick the cheapest, done
2018-09-16T21:38:19 < catphish> yeah, that's what i was doing before, guess i'll do that again
2018-09-16T21:38:28 < catphish> it'll probably be more tolerable on mouser
2018-09-16T21:38:40 < zyp> for common shit like 100n, just grab a reel
2018-09-16T21:38:58 < catphish> i really should, i keep ordering them
2018-09-16T21:39:28 < zyp> I did
2018-09-16T21:39:33 < catphish> what's "termination" by the way? standard vs flexible/sof
2018-09-16T21:39:43 < zyp> what?
2018-09-16T21:39:50 < aandrew> zyp: yep I've started buying entire reels 
2018-09-16T21:40:16 < aandrew> when you need 100 10k and it's only $5 more expensive for 5000 of them, it makes it kind of easy :-)
2018-09-16T21:40:19 < catphish> "what?" indeed, caps have a specification: "termination", it's either standard, or flexible/soft
2018-09-16T21:40:33 < aandrew> catphish: 99% of the time you don't give a shit for soft term
2018-09-16T21:40:35 < zyp> aandrew, yeah
2018-09-16T21:40:57 < catphish> aandrew: both will work fine?
2018-09-16T21:41:09 < zyp> idk what that spec is, I guess some of them are rated to not break when used on a flex pcb or something?
2018-09-16T21:41:11 < aandrew> that's for boards which have some flex (i.e. you probably didn't think of the mounting) or you placed them poorly (along a long edge of an unsupported board which will flex)
2018-09-16T21:41:28 < zyp> makes sense
2018-09-16T21:41:30 < catphish> ah ok
2018-09-16T21:41:36 < catphish> i'll ignore that spec then
2018-09-16T21:41:47 < aandrew> but yeah 95% of the time you sort by price and pick the cheapest
2018-09-16T21:42:26 < catphish> zyp: what tolerance do you use for your antenna matching caps?
2018-09-16T21:42:39 < catphish> that's the only cap where i care about any spec other than value
2018-09-16T21:43:11 < zyp> idk, whatever dongs assembled them with
2018-09-16T21:43:28 < zyp> I just specced value
2018-09-16T21:43:52 < catphish> he built them for you?
2018-09-16T21:43:55 < catphish> what a nice man
2018-09-16T21:43:55 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-16T21:44:04 < zyp> well, I paid for it
2018-09-16T21:44:25 < catphish> oh, not a nice man at all then
2018-09-16T21:46:07 < catphish> i can imagine 10% would be enough to produce a pretty poor result, but dunno
2018-09-16T21:49:18 < catphish> zyp: you're right, it's much easier if i just stop stressing about the details, or trying to use a consistent mfgr or anything like that
2018-09-16T21:49:28 < catphish> choose value, sort price, win
2018-09-16T21:51:09 < catphish> when do you guys send me the bill for tuition?
2018-09-16T21:52:24 < zyp> can do that any time, do you prefer paying by paypal or bitcoin?
2018-09-16T21:52:44 < jpa-> if you pay by bitcoin, maybe zyp will finally have enough of them to buy a dinner
2018-09-16T21:52:47 < Steffanx> Just pay with something awfully british catphish .
2018-09-16T21:52:56 < Steffanx> Black pudding, bacon in the morning etc.
2018-09-16T21:54:09 < catphish> mouser really is so much more tolerable than farnell
2018-09-16T21:54:35 < Steffanx> At least the filtering isnt so awfully slow
2018-09-16T21:54:41 < Steffanx> digikey is next?
2018-09-16T21:55:29 < catphish> digikey is the ultimate destination i suppose
2018-09-16T21:55:37 < catphish> dunno why i looked at mouser first
2018-09-16T21:55:50 < catphish> but they've been doing well for me so far
2018-09-16T21:55:50 < Steffanx> ARROW is the ultimate.
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2018-09-16T21:58:45 < Steffanx> fyi: ARROW isnt the ultimate. For me it never went wrong, but a certain guy has a lot of issues with them.
2018-09-16T21:59:33 < kakimir> why to bother?
2018-09-16T21:59:53 < Steffanx> uh kakimir
2018-09-16T22:00:41 < zyp> farnell doesn't even allow private customers in norway to order, only companies
2018-09-16T22:00:56 < Steffanx> Not even when you email them?
2018-09-16T22:01:05 < Steffanx> That's how it work(ed) here. 
2018-09-16T22:01:07 < zyp> I did order some stuff after I got my own company though
2018-09-16T22:01:29 < zyp> then they sent the product to me and the invoice to a different and totally unrelated company
2018-09-16T22:01:51 < Steffanx> Best thing is, they even accept a screenshot of the payment of proof you paid. So they will ship immediatly.
2018-09-16T22:01:59 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVoZbEH0b-E more epic tunes
2018-09-16T22:02:23 < Steffanx> "epic" > trash.
2018-09-16T22:02:25 < zyp> Steffanx, I think in my case it shipped before it was paid
2018-09-16T22:03:01 < Steffanx> Yes, they do that for companies, but not for private customers.
2018-09-16T22:03:24 < zyp> idk if I could email them
2018-09-16T22:03:42 < zyp> but I figure if I have to beg them to do business with me, I don't really want to do business with them
2018-09-16T22:03:55 < Steffanx> Anyway, nowadays we have this guy that does this service, where his company orders with your address as shipping address. Works like a charm.
2018-09-16T22:04:15 < zyp> haha, war
2018-09-16T22:04:16 < zyp> wat
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2018-09-16T22:04:29 < Steffanx> Just for a small fee and probably all automated.
2018-09-16T22:04:42 < zyp> I signed up for a norwegian webstore the other week
2018-09-16T22:05:13 < zyp> some business that apparently only deals with companies, they don't show prices unless you have an approved account, and you need a company number to sign up
2018-09-16T22:05:38 < Steffanx> Yes. You just copy the csv cart into some other website. Pay and a few days later you have a package for company x. Where company x is the guys company.
2018-09-16T22:05:45 < zyp> so I filled out the form, got an email back the next day «is this a personal request or on behalf of a company?»
2018-09-16T22:06:06 < zyp> I thought it was pretty obvious by the fact that I entered my company number
2018-09-16T22:06:58 < Steffanx> but you used some random @gmail email address?
2018-09-16T22:07:08 < Steffanx> or zyp.no
2018-09-16T22:09:31 < Steffanx> I can imagine they that too when i email from @waffle.express
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2018-09-16T22:15:08 < kakimir> https://lichess.org/yTpcLrDP Steffanx 
2018-09-16T22:15:50 < kakimir> okay anyone can click
2018-09-16T22:16:46 < kakimir> suddenly so silent here
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2018-09-16T22:18:19 < Steffanx> lol, not going to play kakimir
2018-09-16T22:18:54 < kakimir> abuse your authority to find me an opponent
2018-09-16T22:19:46 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o kakimir] by ChanServ
2018-09-16T22:19:52 < Steffanx> Us your authority.
2018-09-16T22:19:57 < Steffanx> use
2018-09-16T22:19:59 <@kakimir> swwet
2018-09-16T22:20:38 <@kakimir> I won't but lets keep it this way
2018-09-16T22:21:11 <@kakimir> benefits: I can take all the flak
2018-09-16T22:21:24 < Steffanx> dont show mr Cracki. He has issues with authority
2018-09-16T22:21:27 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/sBTCYQB
2018-09-16T22:21:32 < aandrew> that's about as far as I got today
2018-09-16T22:21:40 < aandrew> gotta go get other shit done now
2018-09-16T22:21:59 < aandrew> I gotta get these individual digitizer layouts as dense as is reasonable though
2018-09-16T22:22:11 <@kakimir> SMA spoted
2018-09-16T22:22:14 < aandrew> not looking forward to the FPGA/STM fanout and wiring, that looks like ass
2018-09-16T22:22:17 < aandrew> yes, lots of them
2018-09-16T22:22:25 < aandrew> I may swap them out to MCX, not sure yet
2018-09-16T22:22:28 < aandrew> SMA is awfully big
2018-09-16T22:22:43 <@kakimir> it is
2018-09-16T22:27:23 < invzim> u.fl
2018-09-16T22:27:38 < invzim> if you only need to connect/disconnect a few times
2018-09-16T22:29:41 < invzim> https://github.com/compuphase/minIni
2018-09-16T22:29:41 < invzim> rocks
2018-09-16T22:29:43 < invzim> too easy
2018-09-16T22:29:55 < invzim> I'm not used to pulling stuff off github and have it just work
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2018-09-16T22:35:15 <@kakimir> MCX is kaki approved
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2018-09-16T23:08:33 < Steffanx> lol, déjà vu?
2018-09-16T23:15:42 < Steffanx> welcome crt
2018-09-16T23:21:22 < Steffanx> say hi to charlie for me will you?
2018-09-16T23:29:11 < Steffanx> he must have a good reason for that then
2018-09-16T23:40:05 < gnom> https://i.imgur.com/M2WRtTp.mp4
2018-09-16T23:40:11 < gnom> hi all
2018-09-16T23:40:43 < gnom> nice fish
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--- Day changed Mon Sep 17 2018
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2018-09-17T00:48:30 < Tectu> people
2018-09-17T00:48:32 < Tectu> I have arrived
2018-09-17T00:48:38 < zyp> welcome
2018-09-17T00:49:01 < Tectu> how´s life?
2018-09-17T00:49:15 < antto> surrounded by death
2018-09-17T00:49:59 < Steffanx> How comes this hasnt been posted in ##stm32? https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/16/167
2018-09-17T00:50:58 < Steffanx> " I need to change some of my behavior, and I want to apologize to the people that my personal behavior hurt and possibly drove away from kernel development entirely."
2018-09-17T00:51:19 < Steffanx> april fools is early this year
2018-09-17T00:52:24 < Steffanx> "I am going to take time off and get some assistance on how to understand people’s emotions and respond appropriately."
2018-09-17T00:53:21 < Steffanx> i wonder when this will happen to dongs. 
2018-09-17T00:54:06 < Tectu> lol
2018-09-17T00:54:12 < Steffanx> No, jpa- is reasonable and friendly.
2018-09-17T00:54:15 < Tectu> hi crt
2018-09-17T00:54:23 < Tectu> +1 @ jpa review
2018-09-17T00:54:54 < Tectu> nobody likes pumps
2018-09-17T01:01:32 < Steffanx> And hello welcome Tectu
2018-09-17T01:01:44 < Tectu> noooo, don´t do that Steffanx xD
2018-09-17T01:02:09 < Steffanx> what?
2018-09-17T01:02:15 < Tectu> brainmemorytrigger
2018-09-17T01:03:07 < Tectu> yes, very
2018-09-17T01:03:22 < Steffanx> hm, i dont know why Tectu
2018-09-17T01:03:39 < Tectu> Steffanx, the ¨hello welcome¨ asia chick video
2018-09-17T01:03:52 < Steffanx> where is your ' and " ?
2018-09-17T01:04:00 < Tectu> in hell
2018-09-17T01:04:05 < Tectu> next to my dignity
2018-09-17T01:04:06 < Steffanx> i cant even ¨
2018-09-17T01:04:22 < antto> i blame unicode
2018-09-17T01:04:25 < Tectu> do you member the video?
2018-09-17T01:04:26 < BrainDamage> he doesn't have a physical keyboard, therefore can't type them
2018-09-17T01:04:46 < Steffanx> He has to steel your bluetooth kb BrainDamage
2018-09-17T01:05:08 < Tectu> still didn´t oder one
2018-09-17T01:05:14 < Tectu> ordered a lenovo p1 tho
2018-09-17T01:05:17 < Steffanx> *steal
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2018-09-17T01:09:29 < Steffanx> btw Tectu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdCfuJZxWy8 this guy has a tip for you. Your eyes wont fall out.
2018-09-17T01:10:39 < Tectu> thanks
2018-09-17T01:10:41 < Tectu> will bookmark
2018-09-17T01:11:58 < Steffanx> just watch 15 seconds from there: https://youtu.be/OdCfuJZxWy8?t=3m37s
2018-09-17T01:21:11 < Steffanx> Lol. What?
2018-09-17T01:21:42 < Steffanx> Yes wonderful uh?
2018-09-17T01:22:19 < Steffanx> iPhag CSS 🙄
2018-09-17T01:22:51 < Steffanx> Ikr
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2018-09-17T02:11:01 < catphish> stupid question: where am i supposed to put this guy's decoupling capacitors? https://i.imgur.com/bS51o6G.png
2018-09-17T02:38:32 < karlp> it's a module, I would presume it has decoupling onboard?
2018-09-17T02:38:42 < karlp> what does it say itself?
2018-09-17T02:40:15 -!- Laurenceb123 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T02:40:16 < Laurenceb123> ARE YOU ENJOYING YOUR FRESHERS WEEKEND?ARE YOU ENJOYING YOUR FRESHERS WEEKEND?
2018-09-17T02:43:23 < catphish> karlp: i assumed that too, but for some reason no :( https://i.imgur.com/RUAm92G.png
2018-09-17T02:44:14 < Laurenceb123> well guess what its over and now you have to do some work
2018-09-17T02:45:27 < catphish> Laurenceb123: i refuse
2018-09-17T02:45:35 <@kakimir> thank you for using direct link to image
2018-09-17T02:46:20 < catphish> i don't like imgur links, unless they're albums
2018-09-17T02:46:50 < catphish> c20 and q1 are looking a little lost right now https://i.imgur.com/gwqspWk.png
2018-09-17T02:47:01 < Laurenceb123> >not pretending to be 18 for evar
2018-09-17T02:47:26 < aandrew> invzim: no these connectors are meant for debugging, not for final use (they'll be DNP)
2018-09-17T02:47:30 <@kakimir> hmm
2018-09-17T02:47:32 < catphish> i will forever be an overgrown manchild
2018-09-17T02:47:37 <@kakimir> gps and nfc
2018-09-17T02:47:44 < aandrew> so it's SMA or MCX/MMCX. I like SMA because it's threaded meaning the fucking things won't fall out, but they're big
2018-09-17T02:48:21 < aandrew> u.fl is great for production
2018-09-17T02:48:28 < catphish> kakimir: that is correct, how did you guess?
2018-09-17T02:48:38 <@kakimir> catphish: remember that such GPS module sips power in big chunks I assume
2018-09-17T02:49:05 < catphish> kakimir: that seems plausible, datasheet says it needs up to 100mA at once
2018-09-17T02:49:17 <@kakimir> at least transmitting radio modules can peak like amps range
2018-09-17T02:49:51 < catphish> gps is no transmit :)
2018-09-17T02:50:12 <@kakimir> and then stuff doesn't work when there is no addequate bypass caps and traces to module
2018-09-17T02:50:35 < catphish> yeah makes sense, i probably need to beef up my vcc traces
2018-09-17T02:51:04 < catphish> but still, only 100mA max
2018-09-17T02:51:21 <@kakimir> https://www.saturnpcb.com/pcb_toolkit.htm
2018-09-17T02:51:28 <@kakimir> nice toolki
2018-09-17T02:52:55 < catphish> but still, this gps "please don't use this 30mm x 30mm box thing is confusing, i guess best option is to put the caps outside that area and connect with XL traces
2018-09-17T02:53:30 <@kakimir> google image search the module
2018-09-17T02:53:40 <@kakimir> then see what others have done
2018-09-17T02:53:45 < catphish> smart
2018-09-17T02:53:56 <@kakimir> practical engineerin
2018-09-17T02:54:39 < catphish> this person didn't give one solitary fuck what the datasheet said: https://www.dx.com/p/geekworm-usb-port-gps-l80-39-gps-module-for-raspberry-pi-3-model-b-441230#.W57tJi1KiV4
2018-09-17T02:55:09 < catphish> they put a huge metal connector right next to it
2018-09-17T02:55:56 < catphish> and again: https://3.imimg.com/data3/PO/CM/MY-2311786/gps-with-embedded-patch-antenna-500x500.jpg
2018-09-17T02:56:38 <@kakimir> dx.com and raspberry pi module.. what is there to say
2018-09-17T02:57:30 < catphish> https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/N6YAAOSwGwlaNNXY/s-l1600.jpg
2018-09-17T02:57:45 < catphish> someone else put the caps well inside the zone
2018-09-17T02:58:05 < branjb> i imagine this is how laurence gets to work: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00UB1Z2GA?ref_=pfb_e69mjld0jk6lhg742ki6j07bkang&tag=hydfbook0e-20&ascsubtag=pfb-P11-V01-O3-rtdzf3-KNH8GI
2018-09-17T02:58:23 < catphish> that's awesome
2018-09-17T02:58:33 < Laurenceb123> lol those modules
2018-09-17T02:58:43 < aandrew> catphish: yeah there are a LOT of shit boards out there. I think 75% of layout is reading, 20% placement and the last amount actual routing
2018-09-17T02:58:52 <@kakimir> catphish: those zones are just suggestions
2018-09-17T02:59:17 < aandrew> although you have to admit, most of these modules are really quite resilient and all the nasty careful work is done on them anyway
2018-09-17T02:59:48 < catphish> the datasheet did say "whenever possible" so definitely more of a suggestion than hard requirement
2018-09-17T02:59:52 <@kakimir> when you use external antenna you don't need to bother with that zone at all or how is it?
2018-09-17T03:00:13 < catphish> correct, this is all for the benefit of the internal antenna
2018-09-17T03:00:41 <@kakimir> the last photo looks most decent to me
2018-09-17T03:01:07 < catphish> kakimir: yeah i'll go with that, put the bypass caps in the zone but nothing else
2018-09-17T03:01:22 < catphish> and hopefully as far from the modules as possible
2018-09-17T03:01:32 <@kakimir> it will work
2018-09-17T03:02:36 < catphish> this is why i wanted to use one with integrated antenna, not too many ways to screw up the design
2018-09-17T03:02:53 <@kakimir> did you resolve NFC and why there is now GPS introduced?
2018-09-17T03:03:03 <@kakimir> you are making some geotag system?
2018-09-17T03:03:17 < catphish> yes, my nfc works, the gps is 90% for timekeeping
2018-09-17T03:03:40 < catphish> but it will write geo coordinates to nfc tags as a nice bonus
2018-09-17T03:04:14 < catphish> the main aim is to write an accurate timestamp to passive nfc tags
2018-09-17T03:04:23 <@kakimir> hmm
2018-09-17T03:04:52 < catphish> i looked at other timekeeping options, but gps is coming out the winner, as long as power consumption is manageable
2018-09-17T03:05:15 <@kakimir> you could periodically correct your RTC with GPS
2018-09-17T03:05:25 < catphish> that is indeed the plan
2018-09-17T03:05:29 <@kakimir> but definitelly not all the time if the thing is battery powered
2018-09-17T03:05:41 < catphish> hopefully i only need to power it a few seconds a couple of times a day
2018-09-17T03:06:00 <@kakimir> depends on precision rating of RTC crystal
2018-09-17T03:06:37 < catphish> indeed, i believe with a normal xtal, i'll be looking at powering on 1-2 times a day for 1 second accuracy
2018-09-17T03:06:53 <@kakimir> something like that
2018-09-17T03:06:58 < catphish> maybe less if i can use the ppm compensation
2018-09-17T03:07:14 < catphish> and/or maybe a tcxo
2018-09-17T03:07:19 <@kakimir> but your crystal is not termperature compensated
2018-09-17T03:07:27 <@kakimir> also that is a factor
2018-09-17T03:07:31 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-17T03:08:17 <@kakimir> I wonder if temperature coefficient could be also compensated
2018-09-17T03:08:45 < catphish> only if i had a thermometer
2018-09-17T03:10:00 <@kakimir> you do automatic calibration for crystal so that individual differences between crystal initial frequency accuracy wont matter?
2018-09-17T03:10:11 < catphish> i'm not totally sure i understand what a 20ppm crystal actually means
2018-09-17T03:10:29 < catphish> is that a manufacturing accuracy? or accuracy over a particular temperature range?
2018-09-17T03:10:48 <@kakimir> what crystal you are looking at?
2018-09-17T03:10:55 < catphish> kakimir: that's my plan, yes
2018-09-17T03:11:13 < catphish> do a couple of gps readings, apply compensation
2018-09-17T03:11:48 < catphish> this is the current crystal i'm using: https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/815-ABS0716632.768KT
2018-09-17T03:12:27 <@kakimir> wow
2018-09-17T03:12:36 < catphish> ah yes, frequency tolerance is at exactly 25C
2018-09-17T03:12:39 <@kakimir> I have that stocked
2018-09-17T03:13:11 <@kakimir> or ABS07
2018-09-17T03:13:15 <@kakimir> my fav
2018-09-17T03:14:06 < catphish> i liked this one for its power consumption / load capacitance too
2018-09-17T03:15:13 < catphish> the one i linked *is* ABS07
2018-09-17T03:16:06 <@kakimir> it's nice little project inside project to implement stabile feedback loop from GPS timestamp to RTC
2018-09-17T03:16:25 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-17T03:17:01 < catphish> hopefully i can just calculate the error and add that back to the compensation in the stm32
2018-09-17T03:17:34 < catphish> temperature might be a big problem though, may been a tcxo instead
2018-09-17T03:18:30 <@kakimir> is there rtc tcxo?
2018-09-17T03:18:42 <@kakimir> can you input it to stm32 rtc somehow?
2018-09-17T03:19:36 < catphish> very likely yes
2018-09-17T03:19:45 < catphish> but i've not looked into it
2018-09-17T03:20:20 <@kakimir> me neather
2018-09-17T03:20:54 < catphish> maybe https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/SiTime/SiT1552AI-JF-DCC-32768E?qs=sGAEpiMZZMt8oz%2fHeiymAJMEKQP0X73b3t2fhPTw%252bL7UaXg%2fdmfhvw%3d%3d
2018-09-17T03:21:31 < Laurenceb123> <kakimir> is there rtc tcxo?
2018-09-17T03:21:34 < Laurenceb123> how new r u
2018-09-17T03:22:11 < catphish> and i would hope the stm32 will allow an active clock input
2018-09-17T03:22:22 < Laurenceb123> you just use a cap in the middle
2018-09-17T03:22:37 < Laurenceb123> the input will float to ~vcc/2
2018-09-17T03:22:46 < Laurenceb123> due to the built in biassing
2018-09-17T03:23:18 < catphish> handy
2018-09-17T03:23:35 < catphish> thie tcxo datasheet mentions ac coupling the output
2018-09-17T03:24:06 < catphish> frankly, i might as well go right ahead and upgrade to this thing
2018-09-17T03:24:23 < catphish> it's not expensive
2018-09-17T03:26:36 <@kakimir> Laurenceb123: still wet behind ears
2018-09-17T03:27:09 < catphish> 5ppm at -40°C to +85°C
2018-09-17T03:27:56 <@kakimir> World’s smallest TCXO in a 1.5 x 0.8 mm CSP
2018-09-17T03:31:43 <@kakimir> fun to solder
2018-09-17T03:32:46 < dongs> why is kikemir opped
2018-09-17T03:33:02 < catphish> because he's important
2018-09-17T03:33:15 <@kakimir> to rule
2018-09-17T03:34:43 <@kakimir> dongs: did you sleep?
2018-09-17T03:34:56 <@kakimir> I should sleep 5hours soon
2018-09-17T03:35:09 < dongs> of course i slept
2018-09-17T03:35:14 < catphish> dongs: <catphish>      zyp: what tolerance do you use for your antenna matching caps? <zyp>   idk, whatever dongs assembled them with
2018-09-17T03:35:24 < catphish> any chance you know thw answer to that?
2018-09-17T03:36:03 < dongs> catphish: for his NFC shit? i think it was wahtever he quoted. what is "tolerance"? you mean like +- 10% 20% etc shit?
2018-09-17T03:36:15 < dongs> in that case its whatever chinaspecial shit i had on stock that matched value
2018-09-17T03:36:20 < catphish> yes that :)
2018-09-17T03:36:34 < dongs> and it seems to work, so it probably doesnt matter that much.
2018-09-17T03:36:39 < catphish> ok i guess nobody specified :)
2018-09-17T03:36:42 < dongs> yep
2018-09-17T03:37:18 < catphish> i think in his case it doen't matter much at all, my initial prototypes were totally unmatched and the basic functionality worked
2018-09-17T03:37:40 < catphish> though i'm sure they're much better matched than my guesswork version
2018-09-17T03:39:03 < catphish> thanks
2018-09-17T03:42:22 <@kakimir> what was nfc issue catphish ?
2018-09-17T03:42:34 <@kakimir> why it didn't initially work?
2018-09-17T03:43:18 < catphish> the main problem i had was that my qfn nfc IC didn't solder properly
2018-09-17T03:43:35 < catphish> after reflowing it a couple more times it worked
2018-09-17T03:44:12 < catphish> also, my antenna is badly matched, so functioanlity relying on antenna resonance work really badly, but i expected that
2018-09-17T03:45:14 < catphish> these are my first prototypes, can see where i flooded the qfns with flux to make them solder properly https://i.imgur.com/SHByEql.jpg
2018-09-17T03:45:52 < catphish> also, i think i now know WHY they didn't solder, other than my inexperience...
2018-09-17T03:46:28 < catphish> the stencil i designed, vs the one i got: https://imgur.com/a/uIcvKDk
2018-09-17T03:46:50 < catphish> there's probably twice as much paste on there as there's supposed to be
2018-09-17T03:46:59 <@kakimir> interesting
2018-09-17T03:47:52 <@kakimir> they just change it just like that
2018-09-17T03:48:01 < catphish> i've asked the fab house why, and ordered my next prototype a different way (only providing the bare solder paste gerber)
2018-09-17T03:49:23 < catphish> previously i just asked them to make one based on my board that i ordered at the same time, and i think they disregarded the fact that the board design included a gerber for solder paste and designed it based on the pad locations instead
2018-09-17T03:49:39 < catphish> but i'll see what they say
2018-09-17T03:49:48 < catphish> and hopefully the nest one will be right
2018-09-17T04:02:28 < Laurenceb123> > what is "tolerance"?
2018-09-17T04:02:40 < Laurenceb123> not being bigoted a racist like you of course
2018-09-17T04:08:12 <@kakimir> mkay
2018-09-17T04:11:46 < dongs> Digi-KeyのKiCadシンボル＆フットプリントライブラリで設計に着手
2018-09-17T04:11:49 < dongs>  
2018-09-17T04:11:52 < dongs> KiCadフリーオープンソースElectronic Design 
2018-09-17T04:11:54 < dongs> Automation（EDA）ツールを使用して構築された、Digi-KeyのKiCadシンボルおよびフットプリントライブラリは、BOMの作成を簡素化します。Digi-Keyの技術者陣が、指定されたフットプリントを含め、よく策定され視覚的に一貫性のある部品のライブラリを作成しました。各部品には、Digi-Keyのウェブサイトにある追加
2018-09-17T04:12:00 < dongs> 情報があらかじめロードされているので、設計に必要な部品を簡単に注文することができます。
2018-09-17T04:12:03 < dongs> lol @ digijew providing kikecad footprints for japs
2018-09-17T04:12:18 < aandrew> who there dongs
2018-09-17T04:12:23 < aandrew> you went all moon language on us
2018-09-17T04:12:30 < dongs> https://github.com/digikey/digikey-kicad-library
2018-09-17T04:13:31 < Laurenceb123> aandrew confirmed as newfag too
2018-09-17T04:13:40 < aandrew> oh? what confirmed that?
2018-09-17T04:16:51 < Laurenceb123> u didnt know where dongs is from
2018-09-17T04:17:01 < aandrew> um, I know exactly where dongs is from
2018-09-17T04:17:17 < Laurenceb123>  (((dongs)))
2018-09-17T04:17:22 < dongs> i could paste some hebrew if that makes you faster
2018-09-17T04:17:57 < dongs> err
2018-09-17T04:17:58 < dongs> faster?
2018-09-17T04:17:59 < dongs> what the fuck
2018-09-17T04:18:01 < dongs> was i typing
2018-09-17T04:18:05 < dongs> i meant feel better
2018-09-17T04:18:27 < dongs> because jews are awesome
2018-09-17T04:22:43 < aandrew> yay altium, internet blipped for about 30m and now you're confused as fuck
2018-09-17T04:22:53 < aandrew> as soon as my busy cursor goes away I'll save and restart
2018-09-17T04:23:10 < aandrew> I swear everything is doing its best to ensure I'm not productive tonight
2018-09-17T04:23:27 < dongs> yeah the board i was laying out few days ago was made with some retarded mix of vault components and other garbage, and doing cc (compile sch) would take up to a minute
2018-09-17T04:23:31 < englishman> didnt you see those hairy knuckles in that stencil printer video
2018-09-17T04:23:33 < englishman> 100% hebrew
2018-09-17T04:23:34 < dongs> fucking aids
2018-09-17T04:23:52 < dongs> i hate working with other people schematics/layout
2018-09-17T04:23:56 < aandrew> yeah, I'm using vault because i"m lazy and now it's biting me in the ass
2018-09-17T04:24:10 < aandrew> need to build a library from sch/lib and tell vault to go fuck itself
2018-09-17T04:24:22 < aandrew> every fucking time I think I should use the cloud it bites me in the ass
2018-09-17T04:24:24 < aandrew> every time, no fail
2018-09-17T04:26:00 < Laurenceb123> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODS2Fc_d1iw
2018-09-17T04:26:06 < Laurenceb123> wtf did I just watch
2018-09-17T04:26:38 < aandrew> don't know but now you're asking us to
2018-09-17T04:28:20 < englishman> never had a reason to use vault
2018-09-17T04:28:29 < englishman> in the time it takes to find a good footprint you can make one
2018-09-17T04:28:34 < englishman> a better one
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2018-09-17T04:32:56 < aandrew> englishman: yeah I keep falling into the "oh it's just right there" trap
2018-09-17T04:32:59 < aandrew> I'm an idiot
2018-09-17T04:33:01 < aandrew> that's all
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2018-09-17T04:46:21 < aandrew> one of the nicest things about altium is that it remembers the order you selected components
2018-09-17T04:46:31 < aandrew> select a bunch in sch editor, go to layout, reposition selected components
2018-09-17T04:46:34 < aandrew> awesomeness
2018-09-17T04:46:37 < aandrew> always liked this 
2018-09-17T05:00:52 < dongs> https://www.cnet.com/news/galaxy-note-9-reportedly-catches-fire-in-womans-purse/  Lol
2018-09-17T05:08:43 < aandrew> pretty sure the battery was already upset
2018-09-17T05:19:44 < aandrew> interesting, I would have thought water would be bad for lithium based tech
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2018-09-17T06:17:25 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/Em9qF57 progress
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2018-09-17T06:25:05 < englishman> Why aren't you streaming this on twitch
2018-09-17T06:51:30 < aandrew> englishman: I have a little script running that is capturing the screen every 30s, I'll make a vid since you're all so hard up for entertainment
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2018-09-17T08:53:33 < Steffanx> Did you process the torvald news yet, crt?
2018-09-17T08:53:41 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/vVUnwIp pretty much done this section. just have to put the power planes down which is what most of that ratsnest is 
2018-09-17T08:56:58 < upgrdman> wtf. pic24f rtc is so fucking gay.
2018-09-17T08:56:59 < upgrdman> To limit the register interface, the RTCC Timer and
2018-09-17T08:56:59 < upgrdman> Alarm Time registers are accessed through corre-
2018-09-17T08:56:59 < upgrdman> sponding register pointers. The RTCC Value register
2018-09-17T08:56:59 < upgrdman> window (RTCVALH and RTCVALL) uses the
2018-09-17T08:56:59 < upgrdman> RTCPTR<1:0> bits (RCFGCAL<9:8>) to select the
2018-09-17T08:57:00 < upgrdman> desired Timer register pair (see Table 23-1).
2018-09-17T08:57:45 < upgrdman> only 1 register, but you have to set a register to tell it what to expose in that 1 register
2018-09-17T08:58:21 < Steffanx> Same as earlier today
2018-09-17T09:13:11 < upgrdman> ya but this is wtf-level
2018-09-17T09:13:40 < upgrdman> oh well, at least their shit config utility gives functions that abstract this away
2018-09-17T09:14:37 < jpa-> Steffanx: are you defending me every night? :)
2018-09-17T09:17:34 < emeb_mac> eh  - dsPIC and PIC24 have some nice features.
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2018-09-17T09:18:19 < emeb_mac> pretty old though. dsPIC was just about to be released when I interviewed there about 15 yrs ago.
2018-09-17T09:18:33 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-17T09:18:54 < aandrew> cut my teeth on pic16c54a, first pro design used 16c74 then 77 then 877
2018-09-17T09:19:55 < emeb_mac> what was it - the 16c84 that was the first true EEPROM-based PIC?
2018-09-17T09:20:04 < aandrew> yes windowed
2018-09-17T09:20:12 < aandrew> then f77 and f877 were flash
2018-09-17T09:20:24 < emeb_mac> nah - electrically erasable
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2018-09-17T09:21:19 < jpa-> C types were window, F types flash/eeprom
2018-09-17T09:21:38 < emeb_mac> oh ok. got the wrong letter then
2018-09-17T09:21:57 < emeb_mac> yeah - UV erasing is a PITA
2018-09-17T09:22:10 < aandrew> yep
2018-09-17T09:22:49 < emeb_mac> did a few projects with F84 back then - encoders and 4-bit Hitachi LCDs driving ADI DDS chips for clock generator in a BER meter.
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2018-09-17T09:26:44 < emeb_mac> heh. rather use an STM32F030F4
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2018-09-17T09:47:12 < invzim> aandrew: I recently put u.fl on a bunch of supply rails, DNF, on buttom of a PCB - turned out pretty useful.  Got some u.fl->sma pigtails, then smc-bnc -> scope
2018-09-17T09:48:26 < dongs> aandrew: whats up wiht so many via in pad
2018-09-17T09:50:23 < aandrew> dongs: I always do via in pad
2018-09-17T09:50:39 < aandrew> 0.2mm via is no problem, there is no leaking of the solder through the via
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2018-09-17T09:51:08 < aandrew> invzim: yes I have a bunch of pigtails too
2018-09-17T09:51:17 < aandrew> but ufl is not meant for many reconnections
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2018-09-17T09:53:12 < invzim> iknow :)  I was just extremely happy to get effortless probing 'for free' 
2018-09-17T09:53:49 < upgrdman> invzim, i like the "free" way: two 0.1" header holes, 0.4" apart. then you can just use a scope probe with ground spring
2018-09-17T09:54:12 < dongs> https://www.zdnet.com/article/linus-torvalds-takes-a-break-from-linux/ is lunix toreballs gonna write a Code of Conduct 
2018-09-17T09:54:15 < dongs> for the lunix kernel
2018-09-17T09:54:19 < upgrdman> like this  http://www.farrellf.com/temp/scope_probe_hi_freq.jpg
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2018-09-17T09:56:56 < dongs> sup upgrdman__ are you living in china now
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2018-09-17T10:07:23 < Thorn> I fixed weird behavior of my lpc824 by enabling BOD
2018-09-17T10:07:46 < Thorn> it is disabled by default for some reason
2018-09-17T10:10:17 < Thorn> lol >By default, BOR is off. in stm32 too
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2018-09-17T10:10:59 < Thorn> but it is set through option bytes which is smarter
2018-09-17T10:11:38 < upgrdman> dongs, ya, currently china'd
2018-09-17T10:12:13 < Thorn> btw whatever I connect to my devices (ftdi uart, j-link, rs-485) there is parasitic voltage on Vdd
2018-09-17T10:12:19 < dongs> nice
2018-09-17T10:12:42 < Thorn> it's just stm32 don't seem to care (but lpc do)
2018-09-17T10:13:59 < dongs> acebook is proud to be an Equal Opportunity and Affirmative Action employer. We do not discriminate based upon race, religion, color, national origin, sex (including pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions), sexual orientation, gender, gender identity, gender expression, transgender status, sexual stereotypes, age, status as a protected veteran, status as an individual with a disability, or 
2018-09-17T10:14:06 < dongs> other applicable legally protected characteristics. 
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2018-09-17T10:20:45 < dongs> did he immediately hang up
2018-09-17T10:21:21 < dongs> wasnt riglol making agilent scopes at some point
2018-09-17T10:21:24 < dongs> and keysight = agilent
2018-09-17T10:22:20 < invzim> I'm looking at updating my ancient 1052e to Siglent SDS1204X-E
2018-09-17T10:22:38 < invzim> or porb Siglent SDS1104X-E with sw hack
2018-09-17T10:22:40 < invzim> prob
2018-09-17T10:28:37 < friendofafriend> dongs: https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/commit/?id=8a104f8b5867c682d994ffa7a74093c54469c11f
2018-09-17T10:28:52 < friendofafriend> It's over, Loonix is cancelled.
2018-09-17T10:29:34 < friendofafriend> Migrating to TempleOS this very moment.
2018-09-17T10:30:51 < friendofafriend> "pledge to making participation in our project and
2018-09-17T10:31:04 < dongs> friendofafriend: hahahaha
2018-09-17T10:31:09 < friendofafriend> Ack.   "Body size."
2018-09-17T10:31:57 < friendofafriend> This is awful.  Maybe Torvalds was blackmailed.
2018-09-17T10:32:09 < friendofafriend> Sorry, "African-Americanmailed".
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2018-09-17T10:32:36 < Thorn> can you still hack siglent to enable protocol decoding?
2018-09-17T10:33:02 < dongs> TempleRTOS can still happen
2018-09-17T10:33:16 < dongs> let's fork kawaiiOS and fix it
2018-09-17T10:33:36 < friendofafriend> Terry will live in our hearts forever.  Not like this Loonix commie.
2018-09-17T10:35:00 < friendofafriend> Ain't no damn Hannah Montana TempleOS distro.  http://hannahmontana.sourceforge.net/ 
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2018-09-17T10:40:26 < invzim> upgrdman: shenzhen?
2018-09-17T10:40:34 < upgrdman> shanghai
2018-09-17T10:40:42 < dongs> no i think hes been in shanghai all the other times
2018-09-17T10:40:44 < dongs> probly still there
2018-09-17T10:41:50 < invzim> never been, would love to see it.
2018-09-17T10:42:15 < upgrdman> it's interesting, but after a while i miss being in the first world.
2018-09-17T10:42:48 < invzim> Been back in first world for 2 years, hate the weather
2018-09-17T10:42:58 < invzim> and expensive restaurants/beer
2018-09-17T10:43:10 < upgrdman> weather in shanghai sucks ass compared to so cal
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2018-09-17T10:49:17 < upgrdman> hmm. just noticed that a version of PacketSender i have laying around contains an rsa PRIVATE key in its folder.
2018-09-17T10:49:27 < upgrdman> wonder if that was a "lol, oops"
2018-09-17T10:49:28 < dongs> whats a packetsender
2018-09-17T10:49:41 < upgrdman> tools for listening and sending udp packets, etc
2018-09-17T10:50:01 < upgrdman> nice for ethernet debugging/fuckery
2018-09-17T10:50:52 < upgrdman> there's also a public cert, which i would expect. but why the private key, lol
2018-09-17T10:51:23 < dongs> probably for ssl haxing
2018-09-17T10:52:08 < upgrdman> hmm. latest version still has the private key file. maybe it is intentional
2018-09-17T10:57:49 < dongs> im gonna guess its example for ssl shit.
2018-09-17T10:59:17 < upgrdman> k
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2018-09-17T11:26:12 < zyp> heh, found a nice inconsistency in my usb stack
2018-09-17T11:26:56 < zyp> on f4, I can call read() multiple times in the rx callback, to process a message block by block, since it's stored in a FIFO
2018-09-17T11:27:50 < zyp> tried doing the same on f0, and since f0 got a buffer ram, I keep reading from the start of the buffer each time read() is called
2018-09-17T11:32:50 < zyp> also, I copied the TI HAL function for reading out a CAN buffer and modified it to return read length, still only got one byte per packet
2018-09-17T11:33:16 < zyp> stumped me for a few minutes until I set a breakpoint in the function and never hit it
2018-09-17T11:33:26 < zyp> found out I forgot to change the calling code to call my func instead
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2018-09-17T11:41:59 < zyp> I probably also need to increase the rx buffer size of the shell on the mcu
2018-09-17T11:42:28 < zyp> currently it's 16B and I've never managed to overflow it with the uart
2018-09-17T11:43:06 < zyp> (theoretically it takes around 1.4 ms to fill, which is plenty of time to schedule the shell task to start consuming from it)
2018-09-17T11:43:44 < zyp> CAN fills it in about 0.22 ms
2018-09-17T11:45:34 < zyp> not a concern for typing, but sometimes I'm copypasting commands into it
2018-09-17T12:10:41 < Steffanx> Hah :)
2018-09-17T12:12:25 < qyx> mhm libraries not having const in their api
2018-09-17T12:12:51 < qyx> dongs beloved heatshrink for example
2018-09-17T12:14:25 < dongs> yeh i ended up fixing a bunch of stuff there
2018-09-17T12:14:42 < dongs> and wrote a zero-copy version so that I could const the shrinked data in flash
2018-09-17T12:15:45 < qyx> what are you saying that the non-const input buffer is really modified inside?
2018-09-17T12:21:18 < dongs> no, its just constantly copied to a useless buffer
2018-09-17T12:21:20 < dongs> just to be fed from it
2018-09-17T12:21:42 < dongs> when you push() or wahetver your const buffer, there's a ptr and internal buffer where its copied and processed, then repeat etc
2018-09-17T12:21:51 < dongs> waste of ram + time
2018-09-17T12:22:54 < qyx> fuck the copy
2018-09-17T12:23:00 < dongs> that was my reasoning.
2018-09-17T12:23:05 < qyx> I mean
2018-09-17T12:23:14 < qyx> it doesnt matter if they copy it
2018-09-17T12:23:18 < dongs> sure it does
2018-09-17T12:23:20 < qyx> but why the hell is the input buffer nonconst then
2018-09-17T12:23:20 < dongs> its waste of ram
2018-09-17T12:23:23 < dongs> and time
2018-09-17T12:30:51 < zyp> because people don't give a shit about const correctness
2018-09-17T12:31:05 < qyx> uint8_t * const data
2018-09-17T12:31:07 < qyx> wtf
2018-09-17T12:31:25 < qyx> he uses const pointer to a data instead of a pointer to a const data
2018-09-17T12:31:36 < zyp> yeah, TI's canReadData() does that too
2018-09-17T12:31:52 < karlp> aandrew: I would imagine for a contained source with limited total output, drowning a battery fire would be a suitable last resort because it contains it reasonably well, even if it has no way of putting out the fire itself.
2018-09-17T12:32:00 < qyx> is it intention or is he just crazy
2018-09-17T12:32:03 < zyp> which is fair, canReadData() fills a buffer, so nonconst is expected
2018-09-17T12:32:31 < zyp> karlp, what's the context?
2018-09-17T12:32:33 < qyx> or const uint16_t
2018-09-17T12:32:46 < dongs> heatshrink code was written by a millenial coder operating under a Code of Conduct
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2018-09-17T12:42:57 < karlp> zyp: faa guidelines are that exploding phones can be put in a bucket of water.
2018-09-17T12:43:21 < karlp> krak and anndrew were thinking that a bucket of water would be a bad idea for a battery fire.
2018-09-17T12:43:34 < karlp> (they don't say it's first choice to put it in a bucket of water)
2018-09-17T12:43:58 < zyp> ah
2018-09-17T12:44:33 < zyp> AFAIK the recommandation for EV battery fires is also lots of water
2018-09-17T12:44:48 < zyp> the point being to cool off the battery to stop the chain reaction
2018-09-17T12:45:06 < karlp> ev battery fires have much more stored energy than a phone though,
2018-09-17T12:45:26 < zyp> yes, and "lots of water" would refer to a lot more than a bucket :)
2018-09-17T12:45:44 < sync> here they mostly let EVs 420blazeit until they go out
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2018-09-17T12:47:21 < zyp> if you throw a phone fire in a bucket, that seems to me like a reasonable way of dissipating the energy from the fire
2018-09-17T12:48:24 < zyp> since it takes quite a lot of energy to boil a bucket of water
2018-09-17T12:50:10 < qyx> having a 10Wh battery, thats about 36000J, thats about 7.5°C temperature rise of the bucket has 1L volume
2018-09-17T12:50:23 < zyp> yeah, exactly
2018-09-17T12:50:28 < qyx> if I am calculating correctly
2018-09-17T12:54:01 < Laurenceb123> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/09/17/makers_academy_tries_to_tempt_women_to_coding_with_free_course/
2018-09-17T12:54:07 < Laurenceb123> >Makers academy
2018-09-17T12:55:22 < Laurenceb123> >free coding classes in Ruby
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2018-09-17T13:03:32 < Steffanx> Because no one believed/s him
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2018-09-17T13:43:28 < jpa-> throwing the phone into water is probably ok, throwing water on the phone might cause sudden boiling and just spread the burning electrolyte further (like putting out oil fires with water, AFAIK the electrolyte is a flammable hydrocarbon liquid)
2018-09-17T13:43:58 < catphish> got an answer back about https://imgur.com/a/uIcvKDk - apparently the spacing is < 0.4mm so they merged them, will need to make the pads a little smaller next time
2018-09-17T13:44:44 < catphish> in the meantime i guess i'll have to manually remove some paste
2018-09-17T13:45:03 < zyp> jpa-, yeah
2018-09-17T13:45:12 < zyp> I believe that's the case for EVs also
2018-09-17T13:45:38 < zyp> it's recommended to use lots of water on the battery, but I think that's only if lots of water is available
2018-09-17T13:45:46 < zyp> otherwise, no water is better than some water
2018-09-17T13:45:50 < catphish> if cells are split, water does seem like a bad idea
2018-09-17T13:46:12 < catphish> everyone's seen lithium-water reaction :)
2018-09-17T13:47:08 < zyp> catphish, but once it has reacted, the energy is released
2018-09-17T13:47:26 < zyp> and if you have lots of water, it can absorb a lot of energy
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2018-09-17T13:47:52 < catphish> yeah that makes sense, but as you say, like a fat fire, you need to make sure the force doesn't simply spread the fire
2018-09-17T13:48:08 < catphish> rather, that the steam doesn't spread the burning material
2018-09-17T13:48:26 < jpa-> i think that the litium is not particularly important compared to the electrolyte
2018-09-17T13:48:46 < catphish> i don't know much about the elctrolyte they use
2018-09-17T13:49:24 < jpa-> AFAIK it's similar to gasoline in flammability, and it is liquid so it comes out of the battery first
2018-09-17T13:49:37 < catphish> that sounds unpleasant
2018-09-17T13:52:08 < jpa-> besides, there is not much metallic lithium in li-ion batteries, but i'm not sure how the compounds (LiMn2O4) react with water)
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2018-09-17T13:54:06 < jpa-> (compared with non-rechargeable lithium batteries, which do have metallic lithium)
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2018-09-17T15:30:02 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/rRlz7pT.jpg
2018-09-17T15:39:07 < zyp> good they're being consistent
2018-09-17T15:49:51 < Steffanx> .
2018-09-17T15:50:01 < Steffanx> Why this linus news isnt breaking?
2018-09-17T15:50:08 < dongs> oh its breaking allright
2018-09-17T15:50:11 < dongs> breaking the LUNIX KERNEL
2018-09-17T15:50:13 < dongs> INTO PIECES
2018-09-17T15:50:17 < veverak> it does not sound suprising
2018-09-17T15:50:21 < veverak> dongs: as it should long time ago
2018-09-17T15:50:22 < dongs> <trn> Torvalds is a retard faggot cishet WHITE AF snownigger living at 1316 SW Corbett Hill Circle
2018-09-17T15:50:25 < dongs> <trn> I guess I can't use Linux anymore.
2018-09-17T15:50:29 < veverak> these big kernels... microkernel would be better :)
2018-09-17T15:51:24 < karlp> yeah, those have been super successful
2018-09-17T16:21:03 < karlp> c++ people, if I did strdup, how am I meant to free it?  free() errors on const void * vs void *, and deelte gives me valgrind errors on mismatched free / delete?
2018-09-17T16:22:22 < dongs> on lunix at least strdup returns malloc'd stuff, so free is correct.
2018-09-17T16:22:29 < dongs> maybe you overwrote something that makes it different?
2018-09-17T16:23:04 < karlp> guess so.
2018-09-17T16:23:12 < dongs> what is this const void shit?
2018-09-17T16:23:24 < dongs> can you not just do free((void *)gaystr);?
2018-09-17T16:23:34 < karlp> hrm, it's because it's a const char*, 
2018-09-17T16:23:43 < Sadale> just remove the const :P
2018-09-17T16:23:48 < dongs> how is it const if you strduped it
2018-09-17T16:24:03 < Sadale> There's no help. You have to remove the const to put it into a function that doesn't accept const.
2018-09-17T16:24:11 < Sadale> what dongs said :3
2018-09-17T16:24:25 < karlp> well, the rest of the api wants to treat it as const,
2018-09-17T16:24:32 < karlp> strdup and leave it.
2018-09-17T16:25:05 < dongs> char *ptr = strdup(stuff); const char *gayptr = ptr;
2018-09-17T16:25:15 < dongs> then pass it over to api or somshit.
2018-09-17T16:25:21 < dongs> and free ptr;
2018-09-17T16:25:22 < karlp> yeah, but I was tryign to free gayptr later.
2018-09-17T16:25:42 < dongs> cache both since youre using a gay language that doens't let you override if you know what youre doing
2018-09-17T16:25:58 < dongs> or amybe zyp has some trick from C++2018
2018-09-17T16:26:15 < karlp> yeah, btu that's horrific, I'm hopign there's a "c++ right way" otherwise this is just c with headaches
2018-09-17T16:27:37 < dongs> anyway, strdup() does not return const
2018-09-17T16:27:42 < dongs> so the problem is actually you.
2018-09-17T16:27:51 < dongs> however you wanna work around it is not C++ specific tho
2018-09-17T16:27:51 < karlp> yeah, but why can't I treat it as const immediately
2018-09-17T16:32:12 < dongs> what could compiler possibly optimize by making it const
2018-09-17T16:32:32 < karlp> if I try and modify it?
2018-09-17T16:32:44 < dongs> so you mean just to get a warning?
2018-09-17T16:34:02 <@kakimir> how much would you supply from usb charger if you made one?
2018-09-17T16:34:09 <@kakimir> idle voltage
2018-09-17T16:34:16 <@kakimir> would you violate standard?
2018-09-17T16:34:34 <@kakimir> 5.15V lameness
2018-09-17T16:34:38 < karlp> would depened why I was making one, but I'd imagine, yes, 
2018-09-17T16:34:39 < dongs> most chargers ive seen do aroudn 5.1-5.2V
2018-09-17T16:34:48 < zyp> karlp, you're doing something like const char* foo = strdup(bar); and then compiler complains about free(foo);?
2018-09-17T16:34:49 < dongs> to cover up for the gross voltage drop that shit garbage cables provide
2018-09-17T16:34:55 < karlp> zyp: yes.
2018-09-17T16:34:56 < dongs> zyp: yea
2018-09-17T16:35:05 <@kakimir> lets do 5.15V initial with tolerances to both directions
2018-09-17T16:35:25 < zyp> karlp, so, what exactly do you expect?
2018-09-17T16:35:45 < dongs> garbage in, garbage out
2018-09-17T16:35:58 <@kakimir> good thing about this regulator is that when it heats up it's FB threshold actually rises
2018-09-17T16:36:14 <@kakimir> so it outputs more voltage working as kind of cable compensation
2018-09-17T16:36:24 < zyp> free() is naturally non-const since it actually modifies the thing you pass a pointer to, and strdup() returns a non-const pointer
2018-09-17T16:36:25 < karlp> so, what's the "right" way? not use strdup? save it as a char *, and use c++ & or something?
2018-09-17T16:36:56 < karlp> using two vars, one for freeing, and one fo internal use to say, "no-one is allowed to modify this" seems ugly too
2018-09-17T16:37:16 < zyp> why?
2018-09-17T16:37:37 < karlp> that's really what people do? keep two variables?
2018-09-17T16:38:04 < karlp> I feel like I'm doign it wrong, but doing it right seems just as bad.
2018-09-17T16:38:08 < zyp> I'm not sure why you're insisting on making it const in the first place
2018-09-17T16:38:09 < karlp> there's gotta be a better right.
2018-09-17T16:38:34 < dongs> apparently wahtever hes passing it to expects a const all the way thgouh
2018-09-17T16:38:36 < dongs> through
2018-09-17T16:38:47 < zyp> no, it doesn't work like that
2018-09-17T16:38:48 < dongs> can't you just cast it as you pass (ugly but..0
2018-09-17T16:38:57 < zyp> non-const can always be implicitly casted to const
2018-09-17T16:38:59 < dongs> crapApi((const char *)dupedshit);
2018-09-17T16:39:23 < dongs> or yeah even impllicit, just pass the shit and it hsould work right?
2018-09-17T16:39:28 < zyp> yes
2018-09-17T16:40:17 < zyp> IMO the proper way to handle this is that whoever is responsible for deleting the object keeps a non-const variable to pass to free()
2018-09-17T16:40:58 < zyp> the rest of the code can treat it as const if it likes, it makes no difference
2018-09-17T16:41:02 <@kakimir> is there any stuff that could be easily applied to protect divider from moisture?
2018-09-17T16:41:16 < jpa-> karlp: the c++ way would be just to declare    std::string mycopy(foobar);   and then use  mycopy.c_str()  like you would the strdup() result
2018-09-17T16:41:32 < zyp> kakimir, set it on fire, the fire will dry up any moisture
2018-09-17T16:41:37 <@kakimir> it wouldn't be nice if moisture offsets divider from 5volt output to 10volts
2018-09-17T16:42:23 <@kakimir> TVS close to divider will dry up the divider
2018-09-17T16:42:33 <@kakimir> good plan
2018-09-17T16:42:42 < zyp> karlp, if you for whatever reason insist on just keeping a const variable, you could always const_cast it to turn it back to a char* to pass to free(), but I don't understand why you want to do that
2018-09-17T16:44:50 < karlp> jpa's example looks more like what I want honestly.
2018-09-17T16:46:06 < zyp> that doesn't have anything to do with constness though
2018-09-17T16:46:55 < zyp> well, .c_str() returns a const char*, so you might argue otherwise :p
2018-09-17T16:47:48 < zyp> but that's not fundamentally different from storing a char* and deriving a const char* from it whenever you would have called .c_str()
2018-09-17T16:48:04 <@kakimir> have you experienced any divider offset ever by moisture+
2018-09-17T16:48:06 <@kakimir> ?
2018-09-17T16:48:14 < jpa-> in C, you can't get very const-correct anyway if you want reusable code.. because stuff like    T* find_first_character(T *mylist)   etc. have to be either const or non-const and you'll need to cast the result or the parameter often
2018-09-17T16:48:35 < jpa-> zyp: only fundamental difference is not forgetting the free() :)
2018-09-17T16:48:59 < zyp> RAII is nice
2018-09-17T16:49:10 < dongs> kikemir, no
2018-09-17T16:50:13 <@kakimir> have you experienced moisture in your divider?
2018-09-17T16:50:30 < jpa-> kakimir: if you get that much moisture, you should probably apply conformal coating for the whole PCB
2018-09-17T16:50:46 <@kakimir> there is no rating for this device
2018-09-17T16:50:48 < jpa-> also, finally we have a sensible and responsible channel operator here!
2018-09-17T16:51:00 <@kakimir> but I'm neurotic about output voltage
2018-09-17T16:51:01 < zyp> hah
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2018-09-17T16:51:26 < dongs> finally
2018-09-17T16:51:27 < kakimir> no
2018-09-17T16:51:34 < kakimir> I'm mortal again
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2018-09-17T16:56:42 < karlp> easiest way of fixing this is to not run valgrind....
2018-09-17T16:56:59 < Sadale> why?
2018-09-17T16:57:03 < zyp> haha
2018-09-17T16:57:04 < Sadale> What's wrong with running valgrind?
2018-09-17T16:57:08 < karlp> it's static leaks from config, so it will never grow, and process management with reclaim it if it exists.
2018-09-17T16:57:22 < Sadale> ah. I get it
2018-09-17T16:57:25 < dongs> man you're autisming this stuff way out of proportion
2018-09-17T16:57:25 < karlp> it would be nice to be valgrind clean just so it would be easier to spot dynamic leaks,
2018-09-17T16:57:36 < dongs> just do any of the 3-4 solutions you were told
2018-09-17T16:57:40 < dongs> i like the cstring one
2018-09-17T16:58:02 < zyp> karlp, seriously, if you want to just store a const char* and free it, just do free(const_cast<char*>(foo));
2018-09-17T16:58:19 < karlp> yeah, that's the way I'll probably go, but other portions of this code have other problems getting to valgrind clean.
2018-09-17T16:58:32 < karlp> so there's no point even _attempting_ to free things "properly"
2018-09-17T16:58:36 < dongs> zyp what the hell is that fuckery
2018-09-17T16:58:43 < karlp> RAII at the process level.
2018-09-17T16:58:54 < karlp> I'll malloc and strdup as much as I want and teh OS can free it all for me.
2018-09-17T16:59:00 < zyp> dongs, turns a const char* into a char*
2018-09-17T17:00:57 < karlp> dongs: autism also hoping to learn a bit more about how c++ destructors should be used properly.
2018-09-17T17:01:36 < dongs> free() doesnt sound like a C++ destructor
2018-09-17T17:01:52 < karlp> indeed, but that's because I used strdup instead of jpa's string copy thing
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2018-09-17T17:06:36 < karlp> wew, using std::string makes lots of changes.
2018-09-17T17:06:39 < karlp> ok, I'm done.
2018-09-17T17:06:41 < karlp> this is enough
2018-09-17T17:06:58 < dongs> good changes or bad changes?
2018-09-17T17:08:03 < karlp> maybe better, but more far reaching than I want to do.
2018-09-17T17:08:10 < karlp> time for lunch and to get to the real work, not this crap
2018-09-17T17:08:37 < dongs> zyp's free() mod is a one-liner
2018-09-17T17:08:40 < dongs> just go with that then.
2018-09-17T17:08:58 < karlp> free((void*)blah) is even simpler, and just as good.
2018-09-17T17:09:14 < dongs> oh you can still do that?
2018-09-17T17:09:55 < catphish> fucking DHL, just phoned me asking to pay a £24.18 tax bill, the actual tax is £7.61 :|
2018-09-17T17:10:00 < jpa-> karlp: you could generate a suppressions file for valgrind   https://stackoverflow.com/questions/28370148/valgrind-suppress-one-time-memory-leaks
2018-09-17T17:10:18 < catphish> that's a seriously steep "fuck you" charge
2018-09-17T17:10:41 < zyp> catphish, but pretty common
2018-09-17T17:10:56 < dongs> yeah fucking fedex JP used to add 500 yen "transfer" chargfe
2018-09-17T17:11:03 < karlp> jpa-: I actually thought of that, not far enough to look at what the files look like, and the project is too small to realllly warrant that
2018-09-17T17:11:06 < dongs> when sending me a paper bill
2018-09-17T17:11:09 < catphish> they say on their site the charge is £11, which is bad enough as it is, but they also seem to have miscalculated
2018-09-17T17:11:18 < dongs> BUT bitched when I transferred to tehm and used "fee paid by recipient"
2018-09-17T17:11:36 < catphish> i really need to find out how to pay my own VAT
2018-09-17T17:11:48 < jpa-> but yeah, free((void*)blah) is what i'd do
2018-09-17T17:12:42 < dongs> bedtime
2018-09-17T17:21:17 < catphish> on a related note, delivery timescales from china are getting seriously fast, PCB ordered friday, dispatched saturday, due for delivery to me today :|
2018-09-17T17:28:23 < Steffanx> Sadale is alive \o/. Not blown away?
2018-09-17T17:28:31 < Sadale> I'm safe.
2018-09-17T17:28:39 < Sadale> I stayed at home during the typhoon.
2018-09-17T17:28:50 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o jpa-] by ChanServ
2018-09-17T17:29:05 < Sadale> Those news report always report the worst happened. In fact almost all of us here are safe.
2018-09-17T17:29:15 < Steffanx> <jpa-> also, finally we have a sensible and responsible channel operator here!
2018-09-17T17:29:28 < Sadale> jpa-, o7
2018-09-17T17:32:41 < catphish> -ChanServ- You are not authorized to (de)op catphish on ##stm32.
2018-09-17T17:32:43 < catphish> :(
2018-09-17T17:32:50 < catphish> chanserv sucks
2018-09-17T17:38:53 -!- cjbaird [~cjb@ppp121-44-225-146.bras2.syd2.internode.on.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T18:01:51 -!- drzacek [~drzacek@b941c009.business.dg-w.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-17T18:09:37 < day> Hi safe! Can you save me?
2018-09-17T18:10:44 < day> Sadale: wups thought its ##anime ^.^
2018-09-17T18:11:16 < Sadale> day, lol It's stm32
2018-09-17T18:14:09 < day> thus my beaky line + subtle grammar correction did not work :P
2018-09-17T18:14:31 < day> how much wind did you have btw? (speed wise)
2018-09-17T18:16:24 < day> Cracki: someone joins a channel says "I'm tired." and he writes "Hi tired. I'm beaky" ^.^
2018-09-17T18:18:35 < englishman> fucking new digikey is SO slow
2018-09-17T18:19:40 < day> people scrap digikey?
2018-09-17T18:20:39 < day> nvm.
2018-09-17T18:26:15 < Sadale> What do you guys use digikey for? Do you use it for prototyping or production?
2018-09-17T18:26:43 < Sadale> I don't quite understand why the cost of stuffs in digikey/mouser/rs are so expensive.
2018-09-17T18:27:32 < Sadale> Is it Steffanx who has a startup in Canada?
2018-09-17T18:29:02 < mawk> it's the 20€ shipping cost that's the worst on these sites
2018-09-17T18:29:10 < mawk> for stuff that weigh less than a gram
2018-09-17T18:29:28 < Sadale> aww right.
2018-09-17T18:29:41 < mawk> if your goal is prototyping
2018-09-17T18:29:44 < Sadale> I appreciate living in China I guess :3
2018-09-17T18:30:20 < Sadale> electronics in taobao is very cheap. cheap shipping (compared with digikey), short lead time, and cheap components.
2018-09-17T18:30:42 < mawk> and you're comfortable ordering say batteries ?
2018-09-17T18:30:43 < mawk> like lipos
2018-09-17T18:30:57 < mawk> or you order these expensive or abroad
2018-09-17T18:37:13 < englishman> digikey/arrow/mouser often has parts that china doesnt have
2018-09-17T18:37:16 < englishman> or they are cheaper in uysa
2018-09-17T18:37:26 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-17T18:37:29 < englishman> plus they are delivered in 17 hours, china cannot do that
2018-09-17T18:37:59 < zyp> depends where you want them delivered
2018-09-17T18:38:20 < zyp> of course shopping locally tends to be faster, but locally is subjective
2018-09-17T18:38:23 < Sadale> oh
2018-09-17T18:38:31 < Sadale> wow. That's fast.
2018-09-17T18:38:42 < Sadale> I didn't know that digikey/arrow/mouser were that fast.
2018-09-17T18:39:03 < englishman> if i lived 200km south it would be like 10h
2018-09-17T18:39:11 < englishman> but there's an additional truck to where i am
2018-09-17T18:39:37 < englishman> cutoff is 9pm local time, too (8pm their time)
2018-09-17T18:42:49 < Steffanx> No, im😄🤣
2018-09-17T18:42:54 < Steffanx> Im not canafian sadele
2018-09-17T18:43:30 < Steffanx> Its the guy that spoke before me
2018-09-17T18:46:10 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ra6FtdXrH4Q
2018-09-17T18:46:35 < qyx> fuk the clock, it turns around at 01:11:34
2018-09-17T18:46:44 < qyx> whys that
2018-09-17T18:47:00 < qyx> oh 2^32 microsecond overflow
2018-09-17T18:47:14 < qyx> I failed
2018-09-17T18:47:22 < Steffanx> Hehe
2018-09-17T18:48:19 < Steffanx> day, is beaky still alive?!
2018-09-17T18:48:27 < Steffanx> I miss that guy.
2018-09-17T18:49:07 -!- sterna [~Adium@h-90-120.A137.corp.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-17T18:54:24 < kakimir> lets invite him
2018-09-17T18:55:04 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T18:59:21 < Sadale> Steffanx, I'm confused. So you are, or you arne't?
2018-09-17T19:03:33 < MrMobius> did he ever finish his 1mhz switching power supply?
2018-09-17T19:03:48 < Steffanx> Im not canafian
2018-09-17T19:04:04 < MrMobius> youre canuckistani
2018-09-17T19:04:10 < Steffanx> Hah, ethernet controlled MrMobius 
2018-09-17T19:04:41 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o Steffanx] by ChanServ
2018-09-17T19:04:59 < MrMobius> what happened to R2COM?
2018-09-17T19:05:14 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o Steffanx] by Steffanx
2018-09-17T19:05:14 < Steffanx> Isk
2018-09-17T19:05:16 < Steffanx> Idk
2018-09-17T19:05:22 < MrMobius> speaking of worthless channelmates
2018-09-17T19:05:55 < Steffanx> Talking about MrMobius?
2018-09-17T19:06:27 < englishman> since he's using orscab he has no time to chat
2018-09-17T19:06:42 < englishman> all us altium users have a ton of free time due to efficiency
2018-09-17T19:07:14 -!- boB_K7IQ [boB_K7IQ@c-73-193-6-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-17T19:08:04 < Steffanx> Déjà vu
2018-09-17T19:08:12 < Steffanx> Hello Welcome \o
2018-09-17T19:08:41 < Steffanx> Welcome back beaky. Hows the smps?
2018-09-17T19:08:50 < Steffanx> Ethernet controlled*
2018-09-17T19:08:57 < MrMobius> englishman, oh cool, I didnt know they ported orcad to the BK-0010
2018-09-17T19:09:45 < Steffanx> Whyy
2018-09-17T19:12:42 < Steffanx> So what are you up to nowadays beaky ?
2018-09-17T19:14:13 < Steffanx> Hm, still being prince beaky all day long? No need to work?
2018-09-17T19:14:59 < Steffanx> Will it get your hand dirty? Dont you have a servant to clean em all day long?
2018-09-17T19:15:10 < Steffanx> Hands*
2018-09-17T19:20:25 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T19:41:28 < kakimir> I have a quetion
2018-09-17T19:41:38 < kakimir> why cap footprints are bigger
2018-09-17T19:41:39 < kakimir> than
2018-09-17T19:41:41 < kakimir> resistor
2018-09-17T19:41:45 < kakimir> same size
2018-09-17T19:41:49 < kakimir> different footprint
2018-09-17T19:45:44 < emeb> oooh - good guess.
2018-09-17T19:45:59 < emeb> (not that I know the answer - just that sounds plausible)
2018-09-17T19:56:14 < Steffanx> and googled well :P
2018-09-17T20:01:57 < kakimir> I assumed correctly
2018-09-17T20:02:02 < kakimir> kicad is god tier
2018-09-17T20:02:57 < kakimir> https://thedailywtf.com/articles/No_Need_to_Change_It!_
2018-09-17T20:04:44 < Thorn> spacex press conference T - 8h https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu7WJD8vpAQ
2018-09-17T20:06:24 < Thorn> I read some cobol books, it's pretty nice for what it did (assuming no gui/web), certainly more so than java. recent RPGLE is even better
2018-09-17T20:06:51 < Thorn> Cracki: someone bought a flight around the moon in a BFR + redesigned BFR
2018-09-17T20:07:45 -!- cjbaird [~cjb@ppp121-44-225-146.bras2.syd2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-17T20:07:55 < Thorn> unless you're talking to a liberal in which case it's 'big falcon rocket'
2018-09-17T20:08:14 -!- e3ef13f4ff44 [~e3ef13f4f@unaffiliated/e3ef13f4ff44] has left ##stm32 ["WeeChat 1.9.1"]
2018-09-17T20:22:43 < friendofafriend> They tasted better.
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2018-09-17T20:36:10 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mf76yyTY7Ss running competition
2018-09-17T20:36:36 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2018-09-17T20:37:25 < kakimir> friend was across mediterrian and in port city it was the same thing
2018-09-17T20:37:51 < kakimir> they had truck for their race car
2018-09-17T20:47:20 < kakimir> they can be but one that was 17 had little bit of hessitation saying he is 17
2018-09-17T20:47:48 < kakimir> so probably 18 - at least
2018-09-17T20:48:45 < kakimir> at least they don't grow a beard yet
2018-09-17T20:51:58 < kakimir> here we had some hilarious cases of isis veterans - full grown men with beard and all passing as 17year olds
2018-09-17T20:54:29 < kakimir> there was like some newspaper article with picture of 17years old refugee with a social worker
2018-09-17T20:54:50 < kakimir> caption said something like that
2018-09-17T20:55:47 < kakimir> later his social media content with beheadings or other stuff was revealed and he was something like mid 20s
2018-09-17T20:56:36 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-17T20:58:32 < kakimir> Cracki: but there definitelly is difference between teenager beard and grown man beard
2018-09-17T21:02:18 < kakimir> T?
2018-09-17T21:02:38 < kakimir> I shaved my neckbeard this morning
2018-09-17T21:02:54 < kakimir> had kept it for a week almost
2018-09-17T21:03:22 < kakimir> also full chin beard needed to go
2018-09-17T21:05:52 < kakimir> secret: I'm compensating my bald head with a beard
2018-09-17T21:06:38 < kakimir> or complementing it
2018-09-17T21:06:45 < kakimir> how ever you look the thing
2018-09-17T21:09:23 < kakimir> but jeez I had big beard in winter 16-17.. when I think about it now it seems kind of extreme
2018-09-17T21:10:12 < kakimir> hay bale attached to face
2018-09-17T21:24:07 < kakimir> maybe
2018-09-17T21:28:35 < Steffanx> i was scared
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2018-09-17T21:40:42 < Steffanx> No they meant "Tonnen Fisch" huge amount.
2018-09-17T21:43:14 < zyp> a ton of fish
2018-09-17T21:43:20 < Steffanx> Yeah
2018-09-17T21:43:57 < zyp> only time I've had tuna pizza is when I visited jpa- 
2018-09-17T21:44:11 < zyp> I rather prefer salmon pizza
2018-09-17T21:45:03 < Steffanx> Hows the foot mr superbia 
2018-09-17T21:46:44 < zyp> superbia, why not?
2018-09-17T21:51:10 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1UtzO0Mfh0sXrRx83bBBy8g1HPXT2EAwf/view?usp=sharing working with mechanical constraints
2018-09-17T22:00:31 <@jpa-> i've never had salmon pizza
2018-09-17T22:00:59 < kakimir> we have reindeer pizza
2018-09-17T22:01:04 < kakimir> best pizza
2018-09-17T22:01:19 < kakimir> rudolf tastes good
2018-09-17T22:03:03 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-17T22:03:03 < Steffanx> No we dont have stroopwafel pizza
2018-09-17T22:03:07 < Steffanx> (i hope we dont.. )
2018-09-17T22:03:24 < kakimir> you must have
2018-09-17T22:03:45 < zyp> this is kinda like rule 34
2018-09-17T22:03:46 < zyp> https://twitter.com/henryblokhuis/status/299571028152156160
2018-09-17T22:04:22 < Steffanx> oh no.
2018-09-17T22:04:26 < Steffanx> kill it with fire.
2018-09-17T22:04:34  * emeb experiences nausea
2018-09-17T22:05:10 < Steffanx> Googled it too, didnt find it. I guess google doesnt want me to see it zyp  :P
2018-09-17T22:05:23 < zyp> haha
2018-09-17T22:06:26 < kakimir> Steffanx: I said it
2018-09-17T22:06:40 < kakimir> pizza with extra diabetus is reald
2018-09-17T22:12:22 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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2018-09-17T22:15:20 < catphish> i think i overcooked my stm32 :( https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Nh8JRbbv99/
2018-09-17T22:16:03 < Steffanx> texane?
2018-09-17T22:16:38 < Steffanx> people still use that?
2018-09-17T22:18:46 < qyx> such logs
2018-09-17T22:19:48 < englishman> i was recommended by this channel to use texane on lunix
2018-09-17T22:19:51 < englishman> less than 1 year ago
2018-09-17T22:20:04 < Steffanx> who was it?
2018-09-17T22:20:04 < englishman> check your lunix privileges 
2018-09-17T22:20:19 < Steffanx> was it by someone using keil as well?
2018-09-17T22:20:41 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T22:20:50 < englishman> i think his nick rhymed with geffanx
2018-09-17T22:21:38 < englishman> iirc it was a lot simpler than figuring out openocd
2018-09-17T22:22:19 < qyx> lol
2018-09-17T22:24:05 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-17T22:24:15 < catphish> works nicely fer me
2018-09-17T22:24:34 < catphish> well, except today, it doesn't work well with bad hardware
2018-09-17T22:28:48 < Steffanx> no way it was me englishman
2018-09-17T22:30:10 < Steffanx> i wouldnt recommend, maybe noting its possible to use it.
2018-09-17T22:42:49 -!- Jybz [~jibz@ip-37-201-7-19.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-17T22:54:46 < catphish> lol more cooking can't make it worse :)
2018-09-17T22:58:18 < catphish> lol
2018-09-17T22:58:54 < catphish> the programmer's taking to the chip, the chip is being shit
2018-09-17T23:03:14 < Steffanx> do you need some cat love crt ?
2018-09-17T23:04:42 < Steffanx> That doesnt move you get the love you need from em.
2018-09-17T23:06:40 < Steffanx> I see. Poor crt.
2018-09-17T23:07:21 < Steffanx> Special one for you crt https://youtu.be/t8kZ7h4xZDY
2018-09-17T23:07:31 < Steffanx> itll feel you less lonely
2018-09-17T23:07:39 < Steffanx> *make you feel
2018-09-17T23:08:30 < qyx> mhm, #if defined() doesn't work for enum members?
2018-09-17T23:08:48 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-a0e1e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has joined ##stm32
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2018-09-17T23:16:05 < catphish> just swapped the ic, same error
2018-09-17T23:16:07 < catphish> baffled
2018-09-17T23:17:08 < catphish> nah, it's definitely hardware, same procedure worked with the same IC on a different board
2018-09-17T23:18:34 < catphish> i'll find out when this cat gets off me
2018-09-17T23:19:06 < kakimir> anyone interested in collab project?
2018-09-17T23:21:31 < Steffanx> make it a ##stm32 project kakimir
2018-09-17T23:21:34 < Steffanx> What will we do?
2018-09-17T23:22:30 < kakimir> it won't need testing
2018-09-17T23:22:43 < kakimir> it will be only used in airplanes
2018-09-17T23:23:40 < Steffanx> Testing is lethal?
2018-09-17T23:23:45 < qyx> Cracki: true.
2018-09-17T23:24:11 < Steffanx> #if is preprocessor.
2018-09-17T23:24:18 < kakimir> Steffanx: maybe
2018-09-17T23:24:31 < kakimir> I don't know.. i'll test it myself
2018-09-17T23:24:41 < Steffanx> :P
2018-09-17T23:24:49 < qyx> Steffanx: true.
2018-09-17T23:25:33 < Steffanx> lol, i was just repeating Cracki's words. Not quoting, because quoting is bad.
2018-09-17T23:25:47 < kakimir> so it would have like 1 absolute pressure sensor and one differential pressure sensor
2018-09-17T23:26:05 < kakimir> one rs232 type interface
2018-09-17T23:26:14 < kakimir> and bluetooth serial output
2018-09-17T23:26:20 < Steffanx> did you use # and ##, which is "forbidden" by misra-c?
2018-09-17T23:26:40 < kakimir> is macros banned in misra?
2018-09-17T23:27:03 < Steffanx> !ub plebes
2018-09-17T23:27:27 < kakimir> so this device takes data from flarm display connector wire
2018-09-17T23:27:53 < kakimir> rj11
2018-09-17T23:28:03 < kakimir> and passes it then thru to display unit
2018-09-17T23:28:20 < kakimir> but it also sends it out via bluetooth
2018-09-17T23:29:08 < kakimir> what pressure sensors do is overwrite barometer sensor data with more accurate data from onboard sensor
2018-09-17T23:29:33 < kakimir> then add sentence for pitot tube pressure to messaging
2018-09-17T23:29:38 < kakimir> for airspeed
2018-09-17T23:36:55 < kakimir> boring
2018-09-17T23:39:59 < kakimir> problem is that I don't even have the device to develop the system with
2018-09-17T23:46:01 < qyx> do you mean the plane?
2018-09-17T23:50:16 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omGZnuq8xng
2018-09-17T23:51:04 < BrainDamage> much like kekmir did few years ago
2018-09-17T23:51:08 < Steffanx> He gave up on that.
2018-09-17T23:51:23 < Steffanx> Beakimir.
2018-09-17T23:51:30 < BrainDamage> beakmir or kaky?
2018-09-17T23:52:00 < kakimir> I found 2MHz 4ch half bridge
2018-09-17T23:52:15 < BrainDamage> you can even do 10MHz full bridge
2018-09-17T23:52:41 < kakimir> BrainDamage: really?
2018-09-17T23:52:53 < BrainDamage> sure, really, the question is if it's optimal
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2018-09-17T23:53:11 < BrainDamage> In my case it wasn't, but I didn't care /that/ much about losses
2018-09-17T23:53:45 < BrainDamage> instead of an arbitrary number, you should pick your frequency so that driving losses = reactive components losses
2018-09-17T23:54:24 < kakimir> wait it was only 500khz
2018-09-17T23:54:25 < kakimir> http://www.ti.com/product/DRV8412
2018-09-17T23:55:09 < kakimir> I wont do mcu controlled regulator now
2018-09-17T23:55:10 < BrainDamage> you can buffer any driver with a geometrical series progression of mosfet buffers to increase the drive capability
2018-09-17T23:55:41 < BrainDamage> the italian name would translate as "the trumpet"
2018-09-17T23:56:00 < BrainDamage> it optimizes latency and drive strength sacrifying power consumption
2018-09-17T23:56:17 < kakimir> BrainDamage: show me
2018-09-17T23:56:37 < BrainDamage> no homo sorry
2018-09-17T23:57:03 < Steffanx> Lol
2018-09-17T23:57:41 < catphish> wow, the problem was in my program, i had no idea it was possible for a bug in a program to break the bootloader / programming process :(
2018-09-17T23:59:32 < catphish> so, i made a new board, updated my program to use new pin modes suitable for the new layout
2018-09-17T23:59:42 < kakimir> what is bootloader
2018-09-17T23:59:56 < catphish> programmed it, it programmed once, then after that all further attempts to program the chip failed
--- Day changed Tue Sep 18 2018
2018-09-18T00:00:20 < catphish> assumed it was a hardware problem, so i tested programming the code to known working hardware, same problem
2018-09-18T00:00:21 < kakimir> SWD?
2018-09-18T00:00:26 < catphish> yeah SWD
2018-09-18T00:00:37 < catphish> i guess i changed the port mode of the SWD port
2018-09-18T00:00:38 < kakimir> so you need to always expose ISP pin
2018-09-18T00:00:52 < catphish> but i thought that didn't matter if you were using a progrmmer with a reset function
2018-09-18T00:01:14 < catphish> i'm just using st-write, i don't know its process :(
2018-09-18T00:02:17 < catphish> my wife thinks it's because the transistors were's transisting
2018-09-18T00:02:50 < catphish> yep
2018-09-18T00:04:43 < catphish> works fine now, fuck :)
2018-09-18T00:06:25 < catphish> actually i misspoke
2018-09-18T00:06:40 < catphish> there's no bootloader, just a "flash loader", i don't know how this gets executed
2018-09-18T00:06:50 < catphish> it's just what st-flash write does
2018-09-18T00:07:41 < catphish> wow, that new beeper is loud :)
2018-09-18T00:07:48 < kakimir> stm32 world is so complicated
2018-09-18T00:08:12 < catphish> i find the stm32 pretty simple really
2018-09-18T00:08:40 < catphish> though i must admit, i don't understand this flash process
2018-09-18T00:09:21 < catphish> i thought it reset the chip, and did swd programming during early boot, meaning the pin config in your own code didn't amtter
2018-09-18T00:09:34 < catphish> *matter
2018-09-18T00:10:07 < BrainDamage> if you use the hw bootloader then no, your code doesn't matter
2018-09-18T00:10:36 < BrainDamage> just respect the address ranges and that's it
2018-09-18T00:17:03 < catphish> i think i know what's happening!
2018-09-18T00:17:34 < catphish> i think it's using the hardware reset and programming successfully, then booting into the program, and doing the verify from there
2018-09-18T00:17:45 < catphish> but not certsin
2018-09-18T00:17:56 < catphish> anyway, fixed my code, happy now
2018-09-18T00:20:15 < catphish> actually no, it's not that, becuse the first flash with the good program failed too
2018-09-18T00:20:27 < catphish> so i'm baffled
2018-09-18T00:20:45 < catphish> i tried both ways, same result
2018-09-18T00:26:14 < zyp> catphish, when you're done messing around with stlink, buy a blackmagic probe :)
2018-09-18T00:26:18 < zyp> (or build one)
2018-09-18T00:26:23 < zyp> (or five)
2018-09-18T00:26:50 < Steffanx> Or jlink. And windows
2018-09-18T00:26:54 < catphish> that looks pretty cool
2018-09-18T00:27:18 < catphish> zyp: that reminds me, my final board's almost certainly going to use tag-connect, need to buy one of those
2018-09-18T00:27:56 < BrainDamage> you can flash the blackmagic firmware into a discovery board
2018-09-18T00:28:01 < BrainDamage> you just need another serial
2018-09-18T00:28:06 < BrainDamage> and some board surgery
2018-09-18T00:28:39 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/n71NA.JPG <- here's my collection
2018-09-18T00:29:05 < catphish> that is indeed a collection
2018-09-18T00:29:20 < catphish> i got a bit more aggressive on my next (hopefully final) layout https://i.imgur.com/AjXZdFM.png
2018-09-18T00:29:31 < zyp> one original v1, modified with a 10-pin adapter, and five of emeb's design
2018-09-18T00:30:28 < catphish> i'm getting on fine with my nucleo for now
2018-09-18T00:30:34 < BrainDamage> what does your board do exactly? you've talked to great extent about timing, but I don't think I've ever heard about what it /should do/
2018-09-18T00:31:09 < catphish> BrainDamage: it maintains an internal RTC, and writes a timestamp onto passive NFC tags that are presented to it
2018-09-18T00:31:37 < BrainDamage> that's pretty specific, what's the general problem it tries to solve?
2018-09-18T00:31:45 < BrainDamage> geocaching?
2018-09-18T00:31:51 < catphish> it's an orienteering control
2018-09-18T00:31:58 < catphish> very similar to geocaching, but competitive :)
2018-09-18T00:32:19 < zyp> why two tag connects?
2018-09-18T00:33:18 < catphish> zyp: standard TC2030-TCX for programming, but i need another connector for serial console
2018-09-18T00:33:21 < BrainDamage> dumb question, if you were to hold a phone, can it still support the protocol?
2018-09-18T00:33:47 < catphish> my nfc protocol?
2018-09-18T00:33:50 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-18T00:33:50 < zyp> BrainDamage, yes
2018-09-18T00:33:55 < catphish> yes, a phone should be able to communicate with it
2018-09-18T00:34:12 < BrainDamage> does the string also contain an unique id?
2018-09-18T00:34:14 < catphish> i will likely use an android app for end users to do configuration changes
2018-09-18T00:34:21 < zyp> you can either put the phone into card emulation mode, which might let you get away without firmware changes
2018-09-18T00:34:35 < BrainDamage> you know, to prevent cheating
2018-09-18T00:34:36 < zyp> or you could do p2p mode when talking to the phone
2018-09-18T00:34:46 < catphish> BrainDamage: nobody cheats at orienteering
2018-09-18T00:34:59 < BrainDamage> I'll take it as a no
2018-09-18T00:35:05 < zyp> haha
2018-09-18T00:35:09 < invzim> mjeh, heisenberg strikes
2018-09-18T00:35:19 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-a0e1e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-18T00:35:21 < invzim> error only occurs when SD card is not inserted=no debug log
2018-09-18T00:35:31 < invzim> insert SD, error goes away
2018-09-18T00:35:33 < catphish> but no, there's no crypto, the devices write their (probably predictable) serial number, a timestamp, and maybe a gps location
2018-09-18T00:35:52 < zyp> if you're worried about cheating, you could do some sort of PKI where each node has a private key to sign its entry
2018-09-18T00:36:08 < catphish> zyp: the TC seems a bit excessive just for a uart, but not sure of a better option
2018-09-18T00:36:34 < zyp> catphish, well, you could put it on test points :p
2018-09-18T00:36:45 < catphish> yeah the control could easily write a sha that includes a PSK along with the data
2018-09-18T00:36:54 < zyp> but that goes for swd too
2018-09-18T00:37:00 < catphish> but i really don't think there's a need for security
2018-09-18T00:37:31 < zyp> on the other hand, you'd use swd during first time programming of all boards, you'd only use the uart for development
2018-09-18T00:37:40 < catphish> well i need a reliable way to program them, i guess its not that hard to build a proprietary bed of nails
2018-09-18T00:37:46 < BrainDamage> I'd still reserve a space in the written string for the code, there might be no need now, but you might want to add in the future
2018-09-18T00:37:49 < day> Steffanx: he is still going strong :^). learning japanese atm
2018-09-18T00:38:12 < catphish> but since it's currently 90% hobby project, most boards will be hooked up semi-permenantly on my bench :)
2018-09-18T00:38:20 < Steffanx> Hea here now day. I invited him back into here
2018-09-18T00:38:28 < Steffanx> He is*
2018-09-18T00:38:39 < day> :D
2018-09-18T00:38:42 < catphish> "bench" being a coffee table in my living room right now :)
2018-09-18T00:40:25 < catphish> here's v2 that i just built tonight: https://i.imgur.com/zPX0ZWk.jpg
2018-09-18T00:40:35 < catphish> still super grateful for the unending help
2018-09-18T00:41:50 < catphish> zyp: impressed with this new buzzer by the way :) might be enough for outdoor use
2018-09-18T00:41:54 < Steffanx> Secret qr codes and numbers on your mail catphish ?
2018-09-18T00:42:07 < catphish> lol no idea, scan it
2018-09-18T00:42:15 < BrainDamage> that's not a QR code
2018-09-18T00:42:16 < zyp> catphish, nice
2018-09-18T00:42:28 < catphish> it's a health insurance letter :)
2018-09-18T00:42:34 < BrainDamage> it looks closer to datamatrix
2018-09-18T00:42:35 < Steffanx> Whatever BrainDamage :P
2018-09-18T00:43:01 < BrainDamage> you can distinguish the type from the alignment structures
2018-09-18T00:43:08 < BrainDamage> mail actually uses those here
2018-09-18T00:50:53 -!- Kerr-A [~Kerr-A@cpe-98-145-147-132.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-18T00:56:27 < catphish> it's a whole matrix of data
2018-09-18T00:58:01 < Steffanx> Horror mate
2018-09-18T00:58:44 < BrainDamage> could you please stop talking like a retard for once?
2018-09-18T00:59:42 < Steffanx> Its his outlet BrainDamage 
2018-09-18T00:59:53 < BrainDamage> I am drunk and my tolerance treshold is considerably lowered
2018-09-18T01:00:10 < Steffanx> Pre and post work madness
2018-09-18T01:00:41 < BrainDamage> I came home drunk
2018-09-18T01:02:23 < Steffanx> Why you go to sleep before 2.00?
2018-09-18T01:03:10 < Steffanx> Hi tired
2018-09-18T01:03:22 < Steffanx> Who are you now?
2018-09-18T01:07:06 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
2018-09-18T01:17:33 < Steffanx> cracki is skinhead?
2018-09-18T01:17:58 < Steffanx> Army boots?
2018-09-18T01:18:21 < emeb> is white a color?
2018-09-18T01:22:16 < day> i think one of my ram sticks is dying :(
2018-09-18T01:23:12 < day> no tons of crashs, all the time :P
2018-09-18T01:23:23 < day> i dont think im in ecc land anymore
2018-09-18T01:24:43 < day> work with 8gb
2018-09-18T01:26:17 < day> some games need more these days~
2018-09-18T01:28:13 < day> the steam hardware survey is shocking. 37% have more than 12GB of ram. seeing that the scala stops at 12GB im guessing most of those have 16GB
2018-09-18T01:29:33 < day> im on haswell 
2018-09-18T01:30:45 < day> ah the 3digit ones.
2018-09-18T01:31:13 < day> back then i was rocking a phenom II tricore cpu :P
2018-09-18T01:32:27 < day> i was hoping my rig survives till 7nm comes out
2018-09-18T01:33:11 < day> 14 i believe
2018-09-18T01:33:33 < day> nah apparently next year
2018-09-18T01:33:56 < day> i mean theres already hardware that uses 9 i believe. its just that the current cpus are on 14
2018-09-18T01:34:24 < day> whos left at the bleeding edge? o.o
2018-09-18T01:35:00 < day> they do 7nm
2018-09-18T01:35:16 < day> yeah thats what i thought :(
2018-09-18T01:37:01 < day> ah right samsung. but i think they focus on memory
2018-09-18T01:38:24 < day> i wonder if 5 and 3 become even financially viable. 7 afaik already needs insanely expensive light sources for the litho process
2018-09-18T01:41:25 < day> iirc euvl generation burns through some rather expensive materials
2018-09-18T01:41:53 < day> thats what i remember too, but i forgot what type of metal ^.^
2018-09-18T01:42:26 < day> dont think that was it
2018-09-18T01:42:50 < day> the lenses would be a one time investment, i doubt thats going to break the bank
2018-09-18T01:43:59 < day> yeah found it as well. 
2018-09-18T01:44:19 < day> guess i remembered something wrong :/
2018-09-18T01:46:08 < day> its crazy how small the amount of companies is that work on something like that
2018-09-18T01:46:37 < day> and one of them is in the netherlands it seems \o/ ASML
2018-09-18T01:47:19 < day> no idea. i believe mirrors work over a larger spectrum, but if it reaches that far? idk
2018-09-18T01:47:59 < day> its not really about splitting the knowhow, the entrybarrier is simply insanely high
2018-09-18T01:48:44 < day> one doesnt simply open a company that build euvl light sources good enough for 7nm chip production :p
2018-09-18T01:50:07 < day> yeah, i think it simply gets worse in both directions from the visible light
2018-09-18T01:50:48 < day> you need rather expensive lenses for IR
2018-09-18T01:50:51 < day> o0
2018-09-18T01:51:04 < day> yeah
2018-09-18T01:51:43 < day> and the lower the frequency goes the bigger your contraptions need to be 
2018-09-18T01:52:19 < Ultrasauce> laser cutting is photolithography prove me wrong
2018-09-18T01:52:58 < day> that being said im not sure if mirrors work for far infrared. at least ive never seen a thermo camera with a mirror system
2018-09-18T01:53:55 < day> yes they radiate, but do they focus?
2018-09-18T01:54:29 < emeb> don't they use bulk silicon to make IR lenses?
2018-09-18T01:54:43 < emeb> ds2 would know. He messes around with that stuff.
2018-09-18T01:54:48 < day> euv is different. it has a high frequency
2018-09-18T01:55:27 < day> hm seems to work https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5DC_ydwtUs
2018-09-18T01:56:20 < day> i think its a telescope mirror
2018-09-18T01:56:43 < day> which have the reflective coating on the front
2018-09-18T01:57:15 < day> yeah the glas would absorb the IR
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2018-09-18T02:02:40 < laurence_> arrrggg muh gui
2018-09-18T02:02:55 -!- laurence_ is now known as Laurenceb124
2018-09-18T02:03:23 < kakimir> you do so boring stuff
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2018-09-18T02:14:02 < mawk> is the 555 a bad design ?
2018-09-18T02:14:20 < mawk> in everything I calculate about this thing I see ugly non-linear things
2018-09-18T02:19:12 < Laurenceb124> kakimir: ikr
2018-09-18T02:19:20 < Laurenceb124> I have to add "realtime display"
2018-09-18T02:19:44 < Laurenceb124> nobody knows what the means
2018-09-18T02:20:06 < Laurenceb124> atm I'm writing standalone application that plots binary data from stdin
2018-09-18T02:20:11 < Laurenceb124> with csv header
2018-09-18T02:20:59 < Laurenceb124> couldnt find an off the shelf application that would do exactly what I think is needed
2018-09-18T02:21:21 < Laurenceb124> multichannel scrolling graph with clickable channel buttons and configurable channel names
2018-09-18T02:21:41 < Laurenceb124> such a shit jerb
2018-09-18T02:23:03 < mawk> when using the control pin, the threshold level gets from Vcc/3 to R/(2R+R||Z) * (R||Z) * (Vcc/R + x/Z) with x the voltage at the control pin and Z the impedance at this pin
2018-09-18T02:23:40 < mawk> by using proper values of Z you can """cancel out""" most ugliness but it is an approximation
2018-09-18T02:23:43 < mawk> therefore ugly
2018-09-18T02:23:46 < Laurenceb124> https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201809181068115828-russian-plane-syria-base-disappear/
2018-09-18T02:23:47 < Laurenceb124> wew
2018-09-18T02:24:45 < mawk> the google home news feed always presents me with news from sputnik
2018-09-18T02:24:50 < mawk> and RT
2018-09-18T02:27:42 < Laurenceb124> ywnb as autastic as albawhitewolf
2018-09-18T02:28:03 < day> my god ubeam. i had never heard of it
2018-09-18T02:28:06 -!- BrainDamage_ [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T02:28:09 < day> guys lets do a kickstarter
2018-09-18T02:28:12 < Laurenceb124> keeek
2018-09-18T02:28:18 < Laurenceb124> the new emdrive
2018-09-18T02:28:41 < Laurenceb124> oh my god nasaspaceflight.com
2018-09-18T02:28:50 < Laurenceb124> they finally built their emdrive
2018-09-18T02:28:55 < Laurenceb124> after >5 years
2018-09-18T02:29:01 -!- BrainDamage [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-18T02:29:03 -!- BrainDamage_ is now known as BrainDamage
2018-09-18T02:29:05 < day> wasnt it already debunked?
2018-09-18T02:29:15 < Laurenceb124> and its doesnt work
2018-09-18T02:29:29 < Laurenceb124> they have actually agreed that it is bunk on the forum
2018-09-18T02:29:34 < day> who would have thought :P
2018-09-18T02:29:40 < Laurenceb124> unironically shocking
2018-09-18T02:29:53 < Laurenceb124> thought they would argue over it until the heat death of the universe
2018-09-18T02:30:16 < day> i remember two reports from german labs that didnt measure anythings. the chinese ofc. managed to get it to 'work' in the lab kek
2018-09-18T02:30:24 < Laurenceb124> kek <20nN
2018-09-18T02:30:31 < Laurenceb124> at least their measurements are pro
2018-09-18T02:30:51 < day> i got shit from my prof when i wrote down a measurement of 3.123324934343V :(
2018-09-18T02:32:14 < Laurenceb124> oh my god https://imgoat.com/uploads/2217062e9a/148471.jpg
2018-09-18T02:32:42 < day> Cracki: ofc not, that was the reason he gave me shit for it :P
2018-09-18T02:32:42 < Laurenceb124> wonder if he gave her the d
2018-09-18T02:32:52 < Laurenceb124> imagine how autistic the babby would be
2018-09-18T02:33:22 < Laurenceb124> kek
2018-09-18T02:33:24 < day> what is that image o0
2018-09-18T02:33:32 < day> i dont understand
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2018-09-18T02:34:00 < Laurenceb124> >>920536 That poor dog's expression says it got the d first tbh.
2018-09-18T02:34:04 < Laurenceb124> irl kekkd
2018-09-18T02:34:30 < Laurenceb124> day: u dont know who alba and grayling are?
2018-09-18T02:34:39 < day> no
2018-09-18T02:34:53 < Laurenceb124> meatspace autists
2018-09-18T02:35:32 < day> oh got i have that picture open just now
2018-09-18T02:35:38 < Laurenceb124> irl kekking at that name
2018-09-18T02:36:04 < Laurenceb124> her artwork looks like chris-chan
2018-09-18T02:36:17 < day> well i guess she can only be eugirl till next march 
2018-09-18T02:36:20 < day> thank god
2018-09-18T02:36:59 < day> you are german too? 
2018-09-18T02:37:04 < day> fuck this place man
2018-09-18T02:39:59 < Laurenceb124> I saw some cool inductive proximity sensor design using 555
2018-09-18T02:40:05 < Laurenceb124> it prob still has uses
2018-09-18T02:42:10 < mawk> yes Cracki 
2018-09-18T02:42:19 < mawk> well I'm not even talking about stability
2018-09-18T02:42:22 < mawk> but just the design
2018-09-18T02:42:31 < Laurenceb124> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnsspEP3IBI
2018-09-18T02:42:32 < Laurenceb124> kek
2018-09-18T02:42:47 < mawk> if you want to use the control pin to control frequency it introduces a ton of non-linearity/approximations (one of the two)
2018-09-18T02:43:39 < mawk> no I just wanted to calculate the thing
2018-09-18T02:43:43 < Laurenceb124> 555 and input capture with stm32 :P
2018-09-18T02:43:45 < mawk> to see if it is easily controlled
2018-09-18T02:43:46 < mawk> and it isn't
2018-09-18T02:43:50 < Laurenceb124> QUACK
2018-09-18T02:43:52 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/2217062e9a/148474.jpg
2018-09-18T02:44:39 < mawk> no, because of the internal design
2018-09-18T02:44:55 < mawk> the control pin is just tied to one end of a comparator, which is also tied to Vcc through a resistor
2018-09-18T02:45:13 < mawk> so when the control pin is anything else than floating you have to compute the result of those two inputs
2018-09-18T02:45:17 < mawk> which isn't very linear
2018-09-18T02:45:56 < mawk> if the impedance of the thing tied to the control pin is much lower than the internal R impedance value, you could approximate your way through something simple
2018-09-18T02:46:00 < mawk> but it's an approximation
2018-09-18T02:47:20 < mawk> yes
2018-09-18T02:47:33 < mawk> there is one wire to the control wire, and another wire with a resistance to Vcc
2018-09-18T02:47:41 < mawk> https://pix.watch/KyaHXg/RjTenr.png
2018-09-18T02:49:00 < mawk> yes
2018-09-18T02:49:24 < mawk> yeah with a low enough impedance
2018-09-18T02:49:30 < mawk> but I don't like that
2018-09-18T02:49:34 < mawk> it's just an approximation
2018-09-18T02:49:46 < mawk> but anyway using a capacitor for timing is just approximations all the way I guess
2018-09-18T02:50:50 < mawk> well you could make it so that the biggest undeterminate is the value of the components 
2018-09-18T02:51:00 < mawk> but that state of mind doesn't look suited to physics
2018-09-18T03:01:26 < mawk> error terms look like z/r pretty much all throughout calculations
2018-09-18T03:01:45 < mawk> so for a 10³ magnitude distance you get millivolt errors
2018-09-18T03:01:55 < mawk> that may or may not be big
2018-09-18T03:02:31 < mawk> but that only adds to the big pile of uncertainties
2018-09-18T03:08:39 < catphish> how annoying, there's nothing in these nmea messages to tell me when the time is correct :(
2018-09-18T03:09:36 < catphish> the device updates its clock quite fast, but doesn't tell me it's done so :(
2018-09-18T03:24:12 < catphish> i don't think so, i'll have to  double check though
2018-09-18T03:24:17 < catphish> nmea is awful
2018-09-18T03:33:11 -!- emeb [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-18T03:34:48 < Thorn> spacex press conference T - 25 min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu7WJD8vpAQ
2018-09-18T03:35:27 -!- emeb_mac [~ericb@ip68-3-245-224.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T03:36:13 < dongs> https://imgur.com/gallery/SiaqbOX
2018-09-18T03:37:46 < Laurenceb124> inb4 mars colonisation cancelled due to twatter stupidity
2018-09-18T03:38:07 < dongs> due to smoking weed
2018-09-18T03:38:09 < Thorn> spent 3 hours chasing a SPI problem in lpc824. RXRDY wasn't setting after a transfer
2018-09-18T03:38:26 < emeb_mac> yay
2018-09-18T03:38:54 < Thorn> ozone was showing 0s in all config registers but transmission was still working
2018-09-18T03:39:24 < Thorn> finally found a reset(SPI0) call in another file where I2C is supposed to be initialized lol
2018-09-18T03:39:51 < emeb_mac> heh
2018-09-18T03:39:54 < emeb_mac> hate those
2018-09-18T03:40:25 < dongs> did you wrote both?
2018-09-18T03:40:53 < Thorn> of course
2018-09-18T03:41:07 < Laurenceb124> musk should stay on 4chan
2018-09-18T03:41:38 < catphish> my thing works :D now i just need to write miles of code
2018-09-18T03:42:18 < Thorn> looks like lpc is finally operating wtf-free, after BOD was enabled and SPI fixed
2018-09-18T03:42:35 < aandrew> why did you use NXP on that project?
2018-09-18T03:42:52 -!- boB_K7IQ [boB_K7IQ@c-98-247-192-179.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-18T03:43:06 < Thorn> also the SPI core is much smarter than stm32. it has 4 slave selects, hardware delays, etc.
2018-09-18T03:43:07 < aandrew> I mean NXP, STM, SAM etc are all more or less the same
2018-09-18T03:43:26 < aandrew> SAM has some very fucking inexpensive parts that compete very well with STM
2018-09-18T03:43:31 < MrMobius> aandrew, peripherals more or less the same too?
2018-09-18T03:43:39 < aandrew> NXP's parts seem decent (Kinetis etc) but I can't stand their docu
2018-09-18T03:43:42 < aandrew> MrMobius: more or less yes
2018-09-18T03:44:20 < Thorn> aandrew: I also got 10 lpc1549 to do something with. they have USB, CAN and bigger sctimer
2018-09-18T03:44:43 < aandrew> *nods*
2018-09-18T03:46:46 -!- catphish [~catphish@unaffiliated/catphish] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-18T03:47:06 < Thorn> lpc824 was ~$0.78/piece qty 30 on lcsc but now price is up 20%
2018-09-18T03:48:58 < dongs> kinetis is gross as fuck
2018-09-18T03:49:11 < Laurenceb124> https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=45824
2018-09-18T03:49:18 < Laurenceb124> wew they gave up
2018-09-18T03:50:29 < branjb> lol
2018-09-18T03:50:56 < Laurenceb124> So let me ask: If the unconventional force as claimed for the EM-Drive exists, why no one else is able to reproduce it in respect / beside to the dominant effects like thermal or magnetic reasons/forces? 
2018-09-18T03:51:06 < Laurenceb124> hmm I wonder why this could be
2018-09-18T03:52:54 < Laurenceb124> >ppl still think steorn orbo was real
2018-09-18T03:53:12 < Laurenceb124> kek Qanon got b& from reddit
2018-09-18T03:53:13 < branjb> weren't they supposed to do some actual experiment in space a few years ago?
2018-09-18T03:53:26 < jadew> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/09/06/transgender-person-accused-rape-remanded-female-prison-sexually/
2018-09-18T03:53:30 < Laurenceb124> branjb: ikr, total waste of time bullshitters
2018-09-18T03:53:33 < jadew> lmfao
2018-09-18T03:53:48 < branjb> lmao
2018-09-18T03:53:57 < Laurenceb124> >when ur CIA controlled opposition operation gets b& from reddit
2018-09-18T03:54:03 < Laurenceb124> my sides
2018-09-18T03:54:15 < branjb> q predikted dis
2018-09-18T03:54:22 < Laurenceb124> heh
2018-09-18T03:55:57 < Laurenceb124> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steorn#Orbo_phone_charger
2018-09-18T03:56:02 < Laurenceb124> >Orbo cube
2018-09-18T03:57:14 < jadew> Laurenceb123, I remember you said you launched rockets from a balloon?
2018-09-18T03:57:24 < jadew> is that correct?
2018-09-18T03:57:35 < Laurenceb124> yeah
2018-09-18T03:57:41 < Laurenceb124> its my emdrive project
2018-09-18T03:57:55 < Laurenceb124> only it doesnt break the laws of physics
2018-09-18T03:58:01 < Laurenceb124> I'm just too busy to work on it
2018-09-18T03:58:13 < jadew> do you have some resources for hobby rocketry?
2018-09-18T03:58:34 < jadew> maybe some tips on where to buy stuff from?
2018-09-18T03:58:55 < Laurenceb124> are u in Romania?
2018-09-18T03:58:59 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-18T03:59:09 < Laurenceb124> you can probably buy from Germany
2018-09-18T03:59:17 < Laurenceb124> they have some good suppliers
2018-09-18T03:59:59 < jadew> got any links I could start with?
2018-09-18T04:01:22 < Laurenceb124> prob http://www.europerocketry.com/
2018-09-18T04:01:27 < Laurenceb124> but I'm no expert
2018-09-18T04:01:43 < jadew> thanks
2018-09-18T04:01:54 < jadew> well, you know more about this than I do
2018-09-18T04:03:33 < dongs> musk is busy smoking weed
2018-09-18T04:03:40 < dongs> getting that final toke
2018-09-18T04:05:35 < jadew> I'm not familiar with that story, what happened?
2018-09-18T04:05:57 < dongs> something something musk comes to halp rescue some kids in thailand
2018-09-18T04:06:02 < dongs> and some pedo-looking guy shows up
2018-09-18T04:06:04 < dongs> and he calls him a pedo
2018-09-18T04:06:07 < dongs> because thailand, geddit
2018-09-18T04:06:13 < jadew> hah
2018-09-18T04:07:55 < jadew> so why was he there?
2018-09-18T04:08:09 < Thorn> stream is live
2018-09-18T04:08:09 < dongs> to touch dix
2018-09-18T04:08:46 < Laurenceb124> jadew: imo amateur rocketry is mega lame
2018-09-18T04:08:56 < jadew> Thorn, link?
2018-09-18T04:09:00 < Laurenceb124> jadew: I hope to make it less lame with balloon launch
2018-09-18T04:09:14 < jadew> Laurenceb123, my son wants to launch rockets, so we're doing it
2018-09-18T04:09:29 < jadew> he's been bugging me about it constantly for the past two months
2018-09-18T04:11:10 < jadew> Cracki, sounds dangerous
2018-09-18T04:11:23 < Laurenceb124> jadew: sounds fun
2018-09-18T04:11:32 < Laurenceb124> but amateur stuff only goes up ~100m
2018-09-18T04:11:40 < Laurenceb124> unless its balloon launched of course :PO
2018-09-18T04:11:49  * Laurenceb124 zzz
2018-09-18T04:11:57 < jadew> Laurenceb123, sounds good
2018-09-18T04:12:14 < jadew> why did you launch them from a bloon tho? to get over a particular altitude?
2018-09-18T04:12:30 < jadew> Cracki, ah, interesting
2018-09-18T04:12:40 < jadew> I'll look into that too
2018-09-18T04:12:46 < jadew> I thought it involved a lot more pressure
2018-09-18T04:13:39 < dongs> is that musks new shuttle
2018-09-18T04:14:18 < dongs> garbage audio
2018-09-18T04:14:23 < dongs> oh tehre it goes
2018-09-18T04:14:25 < dongs> someone found the mixer
2018-09-18T04:14:42 < dongs> its tony stark
2018-09-18T04:15:00 < dongs> is BFR = big fucking rocket?
2018-09-18T04:15:28 < dongs> wow he really does fail at talking
2018-09-18T04:15:47 < jadew> what are you watching?
2018-09-18T04:16:12 < branjb> is musk high?
2018-09-18T04:16:21 < jadew> that's what I was going to say, he looks stoned
2018-09-18T04:16:22 < jadew> lol
2018-09-18T04:16:29 < jadew> probably just tired
2018-09-18T04:16:33 -!- Laurenceb124 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-18T04:18:29 < jadew> he wants to go to the moon?
2018-09-18T04:19:00 < Thorn> painful to watch
2018-09-18T04:19:34 < jadew> Laurenceb123, are you watching that stream?
2018-09-18T04:19:39 < Thorn> Kennedy was much more exciting in 1962
2018-09-18T04:19:53 < jadew> that's pretty much what I want to do
2018-09-18T04:22:28 < dongs> fucking nerd
2018-09-18T04:22:45 < dongs> HHGTTG is fucking unfunny garbage
2018-09-18T04:23:05 < jadew> yeah, I didn't enjoy it either
2018-09-18T04:23:11 < MrMobius> no, its just british humor
2018-09-18T04:23:13 < MrMobius> *humour
2018-09-18T04:23:17 < MrMobius> wait those are the same
2018-09-18T04:24:03 < MrMobius> is that like the soggy cracker?
2018-09-18T04:27:35 < branjb> gravity turns off if you have EM drive
2018-09-18T04:27:36 < branjb> duh
2018-09-18T04:27:58 < dongs> nice dong
2018-09-18T04:28:15 < jadew> was going to say the same thing, looks a lot like a dick
2018-09-18T04:29:46 < branjb> not like an airplane yeah
2018-09-18T04:33:07 < branjb> why is musk going to the moon?
2018-09-18T04:33:12 < branjb> moon rocks?
2018-09-18T04:33:27 < jadew> wants to drop a car there
2018-09-18T04:33:41 < branjb> lol
2018-09-18T04:34:14 < branjb> spacex has never even done manned missions yet have they?
2018-09-18T04:34:59 < jadew> I don't think so
2018-09-18T04:35:11 < Thorn> no not yet
2018-09-18T04:35:31 < jadew> who's that guy?
2018-09-18T04:35:56 < branjb> it's dongs
2018-09-18T04:35:58 < jadew> dongs
2018-09-18T04:35:59 < jadew> lol
2018-09-18T04:36:13 < branjb> dongs going to the moon
2018-09-18T04:36:40 < dongs> lmao
2018-09-18T04:37:01 < jadew> ok... so they want to send this guy in that rocket?
2018-09-18T04:37:53 < jadew> they'll shoot him if he makes it back, to protect all those secrets
2018-09-18T04:39:49 -!- upgrdman [~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T04:41:07 < Thorn> that's some professional crew
2018-09-18T04:41:10 < jadew> ok, this mission makes sense now
2018-09-18T04:41:15 < jadew> they're going to kill all the useless people
2018-09-18T04:41:17 < Thorn> what if somrthing happens
2018-09-18T04:41:38 < dongs> Thorn: lmao
2018-09-18T04:41:57 < dongs> wait arent they all dead
2018-09-18T04:42:03 < Thorn> who's going to troubleshoot
2018-09-18T04:42:05 -!- rajkosto [~Rajko@cable-178-149-113-218.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T04:42:33 < jadew> cuz they made it all possible
2018-09-18T04:42:49 < dongs> fucking hashtags
2018-09-18T04:42:50 < dongs> fucking
2018-09-18T04:42:51 < dongs> nigger
2018-09-18T04:43:25 < dongs> of course
2018-09-18T04:44:18 < dongs> hahaha
2018-09-18T04:47:45 < dongs> right
2018-09-18T04:49:10 < jadew> and he plans to go up in flames
2018-09-18T04:50:04 -!- turnip420 [~machinehu@ip-142-232-162-32.ptr.bcit.ca] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T04:50:07 < turnip420> Hi!
2018-09-18T04:50:19 < turnip420> So what's with the #stm32 channel?
2018-09-18T04:50:47 < turnip420> Apprently you need an invite? All the rejects just come to ##stm32?
2018-09-18T04:50:52 < dongs> what
2018-09-18T04:50:55 < turnip420> whatup rejects
2018-09-18T04:51:05 < dongs> ## is some feenode bullshit
2018-09-18T04:51:12 < dongs> to define 'unofficial' channel or osomeshit
2018-09-18T04:51:18 < Thorn> ##stm32-rejects
2018-09-18T04:51:23 < turnip420> ^
2018-09-18T04:54:24 < jadew> the message: show me the money
2018-09-18T04:54:38 < dongs> yeah lol
2018-09-18T04:55:12 < turnip420> */join ##stm32-rejects
2018-09-18T04:55:17 < turnip420> get in here
2018-09-18T04:55:36 < turnip420> That's allowed.
2018-09-18T04:56:37 < dongs> haha
2018-09-18T05:04:57 < dongs> haha
2018-09-18T05:06:52 < dongs> 4400 tons of what?
2018-09-18T05:07:05 < branjb> lol freenode micromanages the number of #'s?
2018-09-18T05:07:18 < dongs> yeah this irc network is absolute bullshit
2018-09-18T05:07:54 < branjb> sounds like something a sjw would do
2018-09-18T05:08:13 < branjb> who cares
2018-09-18T05:08:31 < dongs> its fucking irc
2018-09-18T05:08:34 < branjb> someone actually used brain power to make thaht decision?
2018-09-18T05:08:35 < branjb> lol
2018-09-18T05:08:36 < dongs> it doesn't need a code of conduct
2018-09-18T05:11:00 < dongs> you're a bit late
2018-09-18T05:11:07 < dongs> lunix toreballs just committed a code of conduct for lunix
2018-09-18T05:11:14 < dongs> and there was one for free bsd few months back
2018-09-18T05:11:40 < branjb> i bet i am violating that code of conduct whatever it is
2018-09-18T05:12:43 < dongs> THE VERGE
2018-09-18T05:12:52 < MrMobius> what does ### mean?
2018-09-18T05:13:06 < turnip420> Triple rejects
2018-09-18T05:13:16 < turnip420> Their they rejects of the reject channel
2018-09-18T05:13:22 < turnip420> they're*
2018-09-18T05:13:25 < turnip420> the*
2018-09-18T05:13:40 < Thorn> in the middle of the press conference: "ah fuck it I'm gonna use an interpreter"
2018-09-18T05:13:54 < turnip420> <dabs>
2018-09-18T05:14:39 < jadew> yeah...
2018-09-18T05:14:47 < dongs> ahha what a dumb cunt
2018-09-18T05:14:52 < dongs> he literally jus answered that
2018-09-18T05:16:10 < branjb> musk is def high
2018-09-18T05:16:18 < branjb> dude we should have a base on the moon
2018-09-18T05:16:20 < branjb> and go there a lot
2018-09-18T05:16:33 < turnip420> 420bluntit
2018-09-18T05:16:35 < dongs> musk is the new ellen feiss
2018-09-18T05:16:52 < MrMobius> linus takes time off to learn empathy
2018-09-18T05:16:58 < MrMobius> did they find the cure for autism or something?
2018-09-18T05:17:01 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GxC4kKD9qA
2018-09-18T05:17:19 < turnip420> People at work were asking about automotive parts. I tolk them Musk bought them all, 420 weeks lead time.
2018-09-18T05:17:25 < turnip420> No one got the joke.
2018-09-18T05:17:43 < branjb> nsa forced him to develop systemd
2018-09-18T05:17:53 < turnip420> ^
2018-09-18T05:18:02 < turnip420> confirmed centralised
2018-09-18T05:18:19 < turnip420> initDABS
2018-09-18T05:19:48 < dongs> getting stoned: high priority
2018-09-18T05:23:24 < dongs> haha
2018-09-18T05:23:26 < dongs> japs are tricky
2018-09-18T05:27:22 < dongs> <musk> i don't wanna kill myself
2018-09-18T05:29:53 < dongs> Patricia, who runs the Portland branch of "Guerrilla Feminism", affirms the need for "safe spaces" in the Open Source community
2018-09-18T05:29:56 < dongs> lol
2018-09-18T05:30:09 < dongs> I think this applies well to attracting and maintaining a talented and diverse mix of contributors: Safe spaces are important. I have seen the misogynistic and racist comments made in some open source communities, and subsequent dismissals when people point out the issues. I think that in maintaining a professional community there have to be strong standards on what constitutes harassment or inappropriate 
2018-09-18T05:30:15 < dongs> conduct.
2018-09-18T05:30:23 < branjb> why do contributors need to be diverse?
2018-09-18T05:30:39 < branjb> why is that good?
2018-09-18T05:30:57 < branjb> what does that have to do with the quality of a project?
2018-09-18T05:31:19 < branjb> so is the goal of a project no longer to be as successful as possible?
2018-09-18T05:31:27 < branjb> o ok
2018-09-18T05:32:21 < MrMobius> wait, what is professional about making software for free?
2018-09-18T05:32:31 < branjb> communism
2018-09-18T05:32:45 < branjb> actually yeah that's true
2018-09-18T05:32:59 < branjb> my company pays hundreds of thousands to red hat each year for "support"
2018-09-18T05:33:45 < MrMobius> maybe they should create a separate fork for people who need safe spaces
2018-09-18T05:34:02 < MrMobius> and have a different linux for people who want to say whatever they want
2018-09-18T05:34:58 < MrMobius> we need a safe space for people to be unsafe
2018-09-18T05:35:03 < branjb> >Linus Torvalds is known for plain speaking and for being blunt to the point of being rude. However, it seems that until now he hadn't realized the negative effect this had on those around him.
2018-09-18T05:35:03 < branjb> Now, it seems he has had a change of heart and wants time off in which to:
2018-09-18T05:35:03 < branjb> get some assistance on how to understand people's emotions and respond appropriately.
2018-09-18T05:35:05 < branjb> o boy
2018-09-18T05:35:29 < branjb> lol linus going to get kicked out of his own OS
2018-09-18T05:35:37 < MrMobius> they are gonna fix his autism
2018-09-18T05:37:18 < dongs> ##lunix_without_fags
2018-09-18T05:38:18 < MrMobius> ya just name it something super offensive and thats all the filter you need
2018-09-18T05:38:47 -!- Cracki_ [~Cracki@unaffiliated/crackwitz] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T05:42:11 < dongs> we pumping this up
2018-09-18T05:42:31 < dongs> does it explode in his face or what
2018-09-18T05:44:02 < dongs> She is passionate about engineering, computing, and feminism. 
2018-09-18T05:44:07 < dongs> https://www.aspirations.org/users/patricia-33995
2018-09-18T05:44:08 < upgrdman> is https://obsproject.com/download down for you guys too?
2018-09-18T05:44:24 < dongs> obs? no its only down for china
2018-09-18T05:44:30 < dongs> i should update mine
2018-09-18T05:44:31 < dongs> its ancient
2018-09-18T05:44:49 < upgrdman> hmm
2018-09-18T05:44:52 < upgrdman> brb
2018-09-18T05:44:53 -!- upgrdman [~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-18T05:45:07 < dongs> ya just downloaded latest in like 3 seconds
2018-09-18T05:45:23 < dongs>  hope opensores fucks figured out how to upgrade in place
2018-09-18T05:45:42 < dongs> lmao, 64bit installer for obs goes into C:\Program Files (x86)\obs-studio
2018-09-18T05:45:44 < dongs> good job
2018-09-18T05:46:31 < dongs> allright at least it kept my settings
2018-09-18T05:47:10 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU30cStyKp0
2018-09-18T05:47:58 < jadew> notice the proper protection gear that guy is wearing
2018-09-18T05:49:10 < dongs> what the fuck is he even trying to do there
2018-09-18T05:49:18 < dongs> the engine fired wrong way
2018-09-18T05:49:19 < jadew> dongs, test an engine
2018-09-18T05:49:34 < jadew> yeah, that's how you test its thrust
2018-09-18T05:58:14 < jadew> comment on a DIY rocket video: "How far can 10 of these carry a corpse? Just curious"
2018-09-18T06:01:30 < dongs> opensores corpse
2018-09-18T06:01:47 -!- upgrdman [~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T06:02:30 < upgrdman> obs trolling me. they seem to be blocking ip's belonging to digitalocean, and i was using a vpn i made on my Droplet
2018-09-18T06:03:30 < dongs> lol'd
2018-09-18T06:03:37 < dongs> do you want me to cache you an exe
2018-09-18T06:03:51 < upgrdman> no i using my home vpn to get it, but thanks
2018-09-18T06:03:54 < upgrdman> used*
2018-09-18T06:03:55 < dongs> ok
2018-09-18T06:04:03 < dongs> what do you need obs for in china
2018-09-18T06:04:07 < dongs> you gonna livestream your altium pro'ism?
2018-09-18T06:04:30 < upgrdman> i need to hand-hold one of my coworkers who was confused as fuck about how to do something. 
2018-09-18T06:04:57 < upgrdman> but i gave up while waiting for the download anyway. low tech: cell phone video was good enough, if horribly inefficient
2018-09-18T06:09:07 < englishman> hello stoners
2018-09-18T06:09:15 < englishman> i see there have been no innovation chats tonight
2018-09-18T06:10:39 < dongs> as usual
2018-09-18T06:10:49 < dongs> musk innovated some jap on the moon
2018-09-18T06:15:31 < englishman> https://youtu.be/Gev4vWTGzVo?t=30s
2018-09-18T06:15:38 < englishman> this guy too
2018-09-18T06:17:42 < dongs> lol @ chink rolling
2018-09-18T06:20:16 -!- fc5dc9d4_ [~quassel@p5B3A8352.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T06:24:13 -!- fc5dc9d4 [~quassel@p5B3A845A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-18T06:32:44 < aandrew> dongs: do you do anything unusual for 1mm bga fanout?
2018-09-18T06:32:52 < aandrew> or do you just let altium do it
2018-09-18T06:33:26 < englishman> dongs how often do you order from ZOZOTOWN
2018-09-18T06:33:28 < dongs> uh it honestly depends on BGA, i never used teh automatic fanout that jsut adds a bunch of vias to shit.
2018-09-18T06:33:38 < turnip420> lazer vias
2018-09-18T06:34:02 < dongs> cuz there's power/gnd rails etc
2018-09-18T06:34:13 < dongs> englishman: daily
2018-09-18T06:34:24 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/hIB0Udc
2018-09-18T06:34:26 < englishman> pumping that rocket
2018-09-18T06:34:32 < aandrew> closing in on those BGAs
2018-09-18T06:34:35 < aandrew> lots of swapping gonna happen
2018-09-18T06:34:50 < dongs> stop trying to clone USRP
2018-09-18T06:35:07 < dongs> also where the fuck is livestream
2018-09-18T06:35:14 < dongs> these static screenshots are boring as fuck
2018-09-18T06:35:20 < aandrew> lol this is not an SDR
2018-09-18T06:35:25 < turnip420> Christ have fun
2018-09-18T06:35:45 < turnip420> DSP.exe has stopped working.
2018-09-18T06:35:49 < englishman> AAndrew Aurenheimer plays Altium Designer
2018-09-18T06:35:58 < turnip420> DXF.exe?
2018-09-18T06:36:07 < dongs> dxp.exe
2018-09-18T06:36:08 < englishman> welcome stoner turnip
2018-09-18T06:36:12 < dongs> tho version 18 is X2.exe
2018-09-18T06:36:15 < aandrew> layoutshots andrew$ ls -1 | wc -l
2018-09-18T06:36:16 < aandrew>     1622
2018-09-18T06:36:19 < turnip420> That's the one.
2018-09-18T06:36:20 < aandrew> it's coming
2018-09-18T06:36:27 < dongs> wut
2018-09-18T06:36:35 < dongs> fucking lunix filth
2018-09-18T06:36:39 < turnip420> I'm machinehum incongnito.
2018-09-18T06:36:40 < aandrew> actually it's even better
2018-09-18T06:36:42 < englishman> he's doing some dumb timelapse
2018-09-18T06:36:46 < turnip420> Sup fuckers.
2018-09-18T06:36:47 < englishman> instead of livestreaming like a millenial
2018-09-18T06:36:50 < aandrew> $ uname -a
2018-09-18T06:36:51 < aandrew> Darwin officeosx.local 17.4.0 Darwin Kernel Version 17.4.0: Sun Dec 17 09:19:54 PST 2017; root:xnu-4570.41.2~1/RELEASE_X86_64 x86_64
2018-09-18T06:36:58 < dongs> darwin award kernel
2018-09-18T06:37:03 < aandrew> hahaha
2018-09-18T06:37:17 < aandrew> I gotta rename this machine to award just for that
2018-09-18T06:37:27 < aandrew> yeah I'm not gonna livestream
2018-09-18T06:37:30 < aandrew> it'll be timelapse
2018-09-18T06:37:34 < dongs> boring
2018-09-18T06:37:38 < aandrew> I'm not a millennial. not even a gen-xer
2018-09-18T06:37:46 < aandrew> 42, not sure what that makes me
2018-09-18T06:39:30 < englishman> useless
2018-09-18T06:39:46 < dongs> unemployable
2018-09-18T06:39:48 < aandrew> I wish there was an altium shortcut to jump between layers (not when routing)
2018-09-18T06:39:57 < aandrew> dongs: I very likely am unemployable
2018-09-18T06:40:03 < dongs> aandrew: there is, its the +/- keys on numpad
2018-09-18T06:40:04 < aandrew> I could not fathom working for someone as an employee
2018-09-18T06:40:09 < dongs> whcih I bound to side mouse buttons
2018-09-18T06:40:09 < aandrew> dongs: while not routing?
2018-09-18T06:40:11 < dongs> yes
2018-09-18T06:40:15 < aandrew> son of a bitch
2018-09-18T06:40:17 < dongs> it goes up/down layer
2018-09-18T06:40:29 < aandrew> how the fuck did I not know that
2018-09-18T06:40:30 < dongs> i dont have +- on my tenkeyless so i used logitech mouse shit to bind them
2018-09-18T06:40:41 < aandrew> wtf is tenkeyless
2018-09-18T06:40:57 < dongs> a keyboard without numpad
2018-09-18T06:41:14 < englishman> sounds as useless as a 42 year old millenial
2018-09-18T06:41:26 < aandrew> haha
2018-09-18T06:41:36 < englishman> is it for lunix compatibility?
2018-09-18T06:41:38 < dongs> https://www.logitechg.com/assets/64981/pro-tenkeyless-gaming-keyboard.png
2018-09-18T06:41:44 < englishman> as lunix does not support numpad
2018-09-18T06:41:53 < aandrew> I'm just using some microsoft wireless one, it's got a keypad
2018-09-18T06:50:00 < dongs> but yeah +/- are amazingly useful
2018-09-18T06:50:19 < dongs> what do you use to change layer while routing? L or something?
2018-09-18T06:51:18 < aandrew> yeah that sounds right
2018-09-18T06:51:27 < englishman> *
2018-09-18T06:51:36 < englishman> on my
2018-09-18T06:51:38 < englishman> numpad
2018-09-18T06:51:55 < dongs> does that swap top/bottom?
2018-09-18T06:51:56 < dongs> or wat
2018-09-18T06:52:03 < dongs> what does it do on multilayer
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2018-09-18T06:52:09 < dongs> i dont have * either
2018-09-18T06:52:12 < dongs> :D
2018-09-18T06:53:53 < aandrew> yeah * does some toggle not sure to what
2018-09-18T06:54:08 < aandrew> 99% of the time it doesn't work for me so I use L
2018-09-18T06:54:35 < englishman> it cycles thru routing layers
2018-09-18T06:55:11 < dongs> ya ok
2018-09-18T06:55:46 < englishman> maybe macs dont support * either
2018-09-18T07:06:38 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-18T07:06:41 < aandrew> I'm not running it on a mac
2018-09-18T07:06:55 < aandrew> my altium machine is a vm on an esxi server
2018-09-18T07:08:21 < aandrew> oh I know why I hate * now
2018-09-18T07:08:37 < aandrew> so I'm routing... u,i for a diff pair for example
2018-09-18T07:09:08 < aandrew> la de da de da... now I want to switch layers, I hit 2 to place a via, which I place, then * to jump to a layer... altium places ANOTHER via
2018-09-18T07:09:18 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-18T07:09:23 < aandrew> I know it's my own fault, I should just u,i, then *, but my brain doesn't work that way
2018-09-18T07:09:34 < aandrew> 2 is "place via and stay on current layer" and * is "place via and jump to new layer"
2018-09-18T07:09:37 < dongs> i was wondering what was up wiht that and i just gave up switching layers while routing
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2018-09-18T07:41:50 < dongs> fgt
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2018-09-18T08:48:29 < englishman> https://v.redd.it/nxwmycipcsm11/DASH_9_6_M
2018-09-18T08:48:42 < dongs> google
2018-09-18T08:50:20 < englishman> lunix
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2018-09-18T09:27:09 < aandrew> sweet scope
2018-09-18T09:28:40 < qyx> astigmatism
2018-09-18T09:28:54 < dongs> autism
2018-09-18T09:28:59 < qyx> was about to say
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2018-09-18T10:04:14 < Steffanx> Lol crt
2018-09-18T10:05:08 < Steffanx> Welcome
2018-09-18T10:05:10 -!- sterna [~Adium@h-90-120.A137.corp.bahnhof.se] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T10:05:39 < Steffanx> U235?
2018-09-18T10:08:00 < Steffanx> Im glad the keithey guy came up with a good deal
2018-09-18T10:14:16 < day> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADE_651 lol how have i never heard of that scam. 
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2018-09-18T10:50:15 < zyp> I hope so too
2018-09-18T10:53:26 < zyp> aww
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2018-09-18T11:10:28 < Steffanx> Work mate
2018-09-18T11:28:48 < dongs> > ATSC
2018-09-18T11:29:00 < dongs> Advanced Television Systems Committee
2018-09-18T11:53:48 < dongs> fucking retarded jasp
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2018-09-18T12:28:09 < dongs> retarded shit
2018-09-18T12:28:10 < dongs> is waht
2018-09-18T12:34:59 < Laurenceb124> y do u exist
2018-09-18T12:35:45 < Laurenceb124> ftw muh gui makes me want to seppuku
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2018-09-18T12:49:47 < kakimir> funny
2018-09-18T12:50:09 < kakimir> can you show us what you are doing Laurenceb124?
2018-09-18T12:56:03 < dongs> bipolar
2018-09-18T12:56:10 < dongs> another made up mental condition
2018-09-18T12:56:43 < jadew> that's depression, right?
2018-09-18T12:56:51 < jadew> don't think it's made up
2018-09-18T12:57:17 < kakimir> bipolar is not depression
2018-09-18T12:57:46 < catphish> sometimes it is, sometimes it's sheer joy :)
2018-09-18T12:58:16 < cjbaird> one of the 'polar' states usually includes it, though
2018-09-18T12:59:07 < catphish> i have so much stm32 programming ahead of me now my hardware works
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2018-09-18T13:00:47 < catphish> mostly learning how to make all my components spend 99.9% of their time switched off
2018-09-18T13:01:18 < qyx> premature optimization is the root of all evil
2018-09-18T13:01:20 < qyx> as someone said
2018-09-18T13:02:07 < catphish> nothing premature about that
2018-09-18T13:05:03 < jadew> I just realized something
2018-09-18T13:05:10 < jadew> computer viruses are not a thing anymore
2018-09-18T13:05:19 < catphish> if only that were truew
2018-09-18T13:05:26 < jadew> maybe only NSA ones, but those don't hog up resources
2018-09-18T13:05:38 < jadew> catphish, they are?
2018-09-18T13:05:59 < catphish> yes, connect a linux box with ssh to the internet with an insecure password and observe
2018-09-18T13:06:42 < BrainDamage> considering the botnet market is worth billions, you're flat wrong
2018-09-18T13:06:50 < catphish> they don't spread by floppy disk any more, i guess they're what would traditionally be called worms
2018-09-18T13:06:55 < catphish> but definitely viruses
2018-09-18T13:07:26 < catphish> they spread by remotely exploitable vulnerabilities in network code now
2018-09-18T13:07:30 < BrainDamage> people making viruses just realized there's no economic return in randomly deleting your shit
2018-09-18T13:07:51 < jadew> well, there was this one incident with the encrypted files
2018-09-18T13:07:53 < BrainDamage> instead they either encrypt it and hold it ransom, or repourpose your machine for others
2018-09-18T13:07:56 < catphish> and as BrainDamage says, they do less immediate damage, but serve to profit their creators
2018-09-18T13:08:00 < catphish> look at randomware too
2018-09-18T13:08:04 < jadew> my dad's wife got that
2018-09-18T13:08:19 < catphish> yeah the encrypted files thing is a good example of a more traditional virus
2018-09-18T13:08:47 < catphish> i think originally viruses were just pranks, but these days they're serious business :(
2018-09-18T13:09:25 < cjbaird> nVIR-B was best virus
2018-09-18T13:09:56 < BrainDamage> also, thousand of shitty 'embedded' systems makes for easy targets
2018-09-18T13:10:04 < catphish> yep
2018-09-18T13:10:08 < BrainDamage> identical configuration, no updates, unattended operation
2018-09-18T13:10:13 < BrainDamage> IoT, the S stands for secure
2018-09-18T13:10:23 < jadew> heh
2018-09-18T13:10:55 < zyp> when I was a kid, I found out a bunch of people on the same subnet as I had from my ISP had dreamboxes with exposed shells with default passwords
2018-09-18T13:10:58 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-18T13:11:05 < zyp> so I hijacked a bunch of them
2018-09-18T13:11:12 < catphish> lol
2018-09-18T13:11:48 < catphish> i remember in the days of windows 2000, huge numbers of internet connected hosts had no administrator password and one could just browse their disks by smb
2018-09-18T13:11:55 < zyp> my ISP still had download quotas at the time, but that was tracked on their router, so subnet-internal traffic didn't count
2018-09-18T13:12:16 < zyp> so I routed traffic through those to get around that
2018-09-18T13:12:33 < catphish> the blaster worm was when the world realised they really needed firewalls and security against internet attacks against regular PCs
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2018-09-18T13:14:02 < cjbaird> That was the one which infected 90% of all Internet-connected Windows2000 systems within 45 minutes, I recall..
2018-09-18T13:14:12 < cjbaird> That /was/ impressive.
2018-09-18T13:14:22 < zyp> we had a case in norway recently where a schoolkid found an unsecured list of logins including admins for the school network or something
2018-09-18T13:14:23 < catphish> was mostly windows xp by then
2018-09-18T13:14:29 < catphish> and yes, it was horiffic
2018-09-18T13:15:00 < zyp> apparently he reported it earlier this year, and when nothing didn't happen for months he decided to abuse it to spam people or something to get attention to it
2018-09-18T13:15:01 < catphish> there was a bug in SMB, every windows PC was vulnerable to remote code execution
2018-09-18T13:15:19 < catphish> and it spread like mad, infecting everything on the LAN first, then scanning the internet
2018-09-18T13:15:55 < zyp> people in charge tried to deflect blame away from their poor security practices, making the boy a scapegoat instead
2018-09-18T13:16:05 < zyp> which got quite some backlash
2018-09-18T13:16:34 < BrainDamage> I have a friend in canada which works for a company that made quite a similar mistake
2018-09-18T13:17:03 < BrainDamage> they are in charge of handing FOIA docs, and they put both the private and the public in the same folder of the http server
2018-09-18T13:17:09 < BrainDamage> and no rules to distinguish
2018-09-18T13:17:25 < BrainDamage> a kid downloaded the whole thing and found himself with confidential data
2018-09-18T13:17:34 < BrainDamage> they raided his house and treated him as a criminal
2018-09-18T13:18:17 < jadew> that's a weird situation tho
2018-09-18T13:18:24 < jadew> in a way, the data was public
2018-09-18T13:18:35 < jadew> in another way, is like stealing from a house, just because the door is unlocked
2018-09-18T13:18:57 < BrainDamage> no it's not, the tool can't know the data is private before downloading
2018-09-18T13:19:22 < jadew> if he did it unknowingly, then yeah, he should be safe
2018-09-18T13:19:41 < jadew> but if he knew what he was doing and that the info was left there by mistake, then it was theft
2018-09-18T13:19:49 < jadew> or whatever they call this sort of shit
2018-09-18T13:20:53 < BrainDamage> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/freedom-of-information-request-privacy-breach-teen-speaks-out-1.4621970
2018-09-18T13:25:02 < karlp> dongs nice drone "table cloth" pull trick
2018-09-18T13:38:05 < cjbaird> Nuts, fibre optic cable is generally only available with up to 2 fibres. Want 4.
2018-09-18T13:39:49 < qyx> how so?
2018-09-18T13:39:55 < Thorn> lpc8xx i2c is so much more sane than the one in stm32f1/f4
2018-09-18T13:40:09 < Thorn> and not overengineered unlike f0/f7/h7
2018-09-18T13:40:20 < qyx> cjbaird: search for lowcost ftth cables
2018-09-18T13:40:40 < karlp> what's so "overengineered" about the v2 i2c periph?
2018-09-18T13:41:57 < dongs> nothin, its pretty good
2018-09-18T13:43:58 < Thorn> no byte counters, several times less flags / registers
2018-09-18T13:45:27 < cjbaird> qyx: better yet, 2am tonight, I walk over to the next street over that has FTTP NBN and get cut'in
2018-09-18T13:46:44 < cjbaird> > Minimum Order Quantity :   2 KM 
2018-09-18T13:46:46 < cjbaird> :|
2018-09-18T13:47:02 < dongs> cjbaird: havent you ordered that wirelessfiber thing yet.
2018-09-18T13:47:24 < cjbaird> Ah, that ftth stuff has steel support wires inside.. Not going to be useful with the magloop
2018-09-18T13:48:08 < cjbaird> 2pro4me
2018-09-18T13:50:40 < qyx> wat are you going to use it for
2018-09-18T13:50:47 < cjbaird> The magloop did well on the weekend-- it covers 17-35 Mhz, the top-half of HF, like I wanted. The manual butterfly capacitor adjuster was a PITA; going to replace it with a motor. Alreayd done the MSP430 and stepper side of things.
2018-09-18T13:51:20 < qyx> are you going to transmit magloop signal over fiber?
2018-09-18T13:51:45 < cjbaird> qyx: currently using a single-fibre Toslink to a MSP430G2231 to control the remote motor-- with 4-fibre, could get rid of the uP
2018-09-18T13:52:10 < qyx> and the motor and stuff is battery operated?
2018-09-18T13:52:27 < qyx> I did consider similar design for my vlf receiver
2018-09-18T13:52:50 < qyx> but I wanted to use 2.8mm industrial plastic fiber for that
2018-09-18T13:53:03 < qyx> there are analol transmitters/receivers available for low cost
2018-09-18T13:53:11 < qyx> 2.8mm or 2mm or what was the diameter
2018-09-18T13:53:15 < cjbaird> Did a signal-to-optical project a while back, but pushing a ~20 MHz sample through it would be a bit pro
2018-09-18T13:53:42 < qyx> I considered analog transceivers, not digital
2018-09-18T13:53:57 < qyx> and avoid digital ic near the antenna/lna
2018-09-18T13:54:50 < cjbaird> The big lump of steel around the MSP430 that'll be mounted on the antenna will be a bug. Muh Q-factor.
2018-09-18T13:57:04 < qyx> http://i-fiberoptics.com/single-core-fiber-cable.php
2018-09-18T13:57:07 < qyx> this kind of fiber
2018-09-18T13:59:00 < catphish> single core seems like a silly number of cores
2018-09-18T13:59:08 < qyx> and this kind of transceivers https://www.mouser.sk/ProductDetail/Broadcom-Avago/AFBR-1529Z?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsn8wIhgY8aVeOCAgkPk643rv31BJzS%2fgE%3d
2018-09-18T13:59:17 < catphish> fiber is so thin, why not put in a bunch just in case
2018-09-18T13:59:54 < qyx> it depends
2018-09-18T14:00:08 < qyx> thats not a 50/62.5 or 9um singlemode
2018-09-18T14:00:16 < qyx> those fibers have ~1mm core
2018-09-18T14:00:22 < qyx> for industrial usage
2018-09-18T14:00:28 < catphish> ah i guess that makes sense
2018-09-18T14:00:39 < qyx> also totally different use cases
2018-09-18T14:00:45 < catphish> yeah, i see, those are huge cores
2018-09-18T14:00:53 < catphish> i'm used to SM for comms use
2018-09-18T14:01:47 < cjbaird> toslink audio-spec cable is fine for things here...
2018-09-18T14:02:01 < zyp> can I run 10gbe over toslink cable?
2018-09-18T14:02:14 < catphish> probably
2018-09-18T14:02:23 < zyp> cool
2018-09-18T14:02:33 < zyp> where do I get toslink SFP+ transceivers?
2018-09-18T14:02:38 < catphish> it's just light :) as long as you don't want to run it far
2018-09-18T14:02:38 < BrainDamage> using an incandescent lightbulb as tx
2018-09-18T14:02:49 < cjbaird> attenuation is something like 0.25dB/metre with this stuff.
2018-09-18T14:03:36 < cjbaird> probably like plastic, rather than glass fibre
2018-09-18T14:03:59 < BrainDamage> it's plastic and it's giant, calling it multimode is an euphemism
2018-09-18T14:04:24 < cjbaird> ..but that that's useful too, being less prone to damage
2018-09-18T14:04:39 < BrainDamage> your speed will be severely impacted by intersymbolic interference and the propagation speed of each mode
2018-09-18T14:06:22 < qyx> cjbaird: so are you doing usart over tosling transceivers,
2018-09-18T14:08:25 < cjbaird> even simpler-- dit=change direction, dah=spin
2018-09-18T14:09:42 < BrainDamage> why are you using fiber and not use a simple cable?
2018-09-18T14:10:22 < cjbaird> magnetic loop antenna-- 40,000 volts, 300A currents.. gives you a lot of eddy heating
2018-09-18T14:11:14 < BrainDamage> you're transmitting 12MW? ... with a magloop?
2018-09-18T14:11:24 < karlp> qyx: datasheet link is broken there.
2018-09-18T14:11:25 < BrainDamage> is this magloop mountain-sized?
2018-09-18T14:13:03 < cjbaird> Admittedly I'll be QRP/6 watts, and only like 1/100 of that, but still, dangling wires from points of the loop with high voltage is to be avoided
2018-09-18T14:13:14 < qyx> karlp: true.
2018-09-18T14:13:50 < qyx> I didn't check
2018-09-18T14:14:25 < cjbaird> https://www.nonstopsystems.com/radio/frank_radio_antenna_magloop.htm .. RF burns will still be a thing at low power.
2018-09-18T14:28:59 < invzim> yay farnell, you can change your VAT id etc on their website, but it doesn't actually do anything in their billing system
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2018-09-18T14:58:43 < BrainDamage> jpa-: https://i.imgur.com/EL2dWgH.jpg ( laurenceb-grade link )
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2018-09-18T15:17:27 <@jpa-> it's not false
2018-09-18T15:17:39 <@jpa-> also  https://satwcomic.com/art/it-s-organic.png
2018-09-18T15:19:30 < zyp> reminds me of this classic: http://i.imgur.com/nitna.jpg
2018-09-18T15:30:19 < englishman> lol
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2018-09-18T16:12:15 < Steffanx> Opper jpa- you can ban the blaxter immitator you know :P
2018-09-18T16:12:22 < Steffanx> 4 life.
2018-09-18T16:12:56 <@jpa-> i'll let him dig his own grave first..
2018-09-18T16:13:51 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-18T16:14:07 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/Z34zXYo.jpg
2018-09-18T16:15:01 <@jpa-> but soviet russia never tweeted anything
2018-09-18T16:17:57 < qyx> if I set my RTC to 2018, one piece of MY code reads it as 2018, the other one as 2008
2018-09-18T16:18:01 < qyx> and they are copypasted
2018-09-18T16:24:02 < Ecco> Hi! I'd like to mimic low stack space on a PC. How would you guys do it?
2018-09-18T16:24:11 < dongs> wa
2018-09-18T16:24:12 < dongs> t
2018-09-18T16:24:18 < zyp> Ecco, for what purpose?
2018-09-18T16:24:39 < qyx> ok the new code works better
2018-09-18T16:25:23 <@jpa-> Ecco: ulimit -s 1
2018-09-18T16:26:29 < Ecco> ok jpa-, I tried doing this, and as a result my terminal immediatly closes
2018-09-18T16:27:16 <@jpa-> maybe 1 kilobyte is too small for you :)
2018-09-18T16:27:21 < qyx> probably because of a limited stack space
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2018-09-18T17:58:44 < englishman> this guy marked the anode side of all his LEDs in silkscreen
2018-09-18T17:58:50 < englishman> should i install all of them backwards?
2018-09-18T18:04:36 < catphish> are some people here full time electronic design engineers?
2018-09-18T18:05:13 < catphish> or all just over-learned hobbyists?
2018-09-18T18:06:07 < karlp> quite a few of us work professionally in or around embedded systems, yes.
2018-09-18T18:06:30 < englishman> some of us work unprofessionally in or around embedded systems, too
2018-09-18T18:07:00 < karlp> I'm using pro just to mean we get paid, no matter how incompetent we may be.
2018-09-18T18:08:09 < englishman> here's some of mouser's proness https://i.imgur.com/y8b5sv2.jpg
2018-09-18T18:08:52 < karlp> are you implying that tooth and cogs are sensitive devices and don't like to feed that? :)
2018-09-18T18:09:58 < catphish> i'd like my work to be professional, just haven't found a market yet :(
2018-09-18T18:10:34 < catphish> so for now i will hobby away
2018-09-18T18:11:17 < catphish> that's some nice tape you got there, be a shame if someone bent it
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2018-09-18T18:36:05 < catphish> i just discovered that liteplacer exists, and i want one
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2018-09-18T18:41:18 < catphish> ooo also http://openpnp.org/hardware/
2018-09-18T18:44:49 < mawk> Cracki: as a followup for the 555, I've calculated what the frequency and duty cycle becomes when you shift around the threshold levels; and it's not pretty
2018-09-18T18:45:10 < mawk> when you shift frequency with the control voltage (that's what this control voltage is all about, after all) it also shifts the duty cycle
2018-09-18T18:45:20 < mawk> it looks like something like this: http://maths.serveur.io/AQoJjqMu
2018-09-18T18:45:31 < mawk> which boils down to the classical formulas when you put 2/3 for alpha_s
2018-09-18T18:46:25 < mawk> it needs a whole microcontroller to be able to change one variable independently
2018-09-18T18:46:35 < mawk> and then you might as well just use the mcu alone
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2018-09-18T18:47:55 < dongs> what the hell
2018-09-18T18:48:07 < mawk> you don't like my fine latex dongs ?
2018-09-18T18:48:10 < dongs> these chinks are using SWD pins (pa13/14) as a power button for this wheel motor controller
2018-09-18T18:48:12 < mawk> ah
2018-09-18T18:48:26 < dongs> i guess there's no hope of debugging the shit
2018-09-18T18:48:43 < mawk> on my chinese arduino nano counterfeit they used the RTC pins for the user led
2018-09-18T18:48:46 < mawk> but it's not as bad
2018-09-18T18:49:49 < karlp> it's an arduino nano and you were going to use the rtc?
2018-09-18T18:49:56 < karlp> arduino nano's don't even have rtc?
2018-09-18T18:50:01 < mawk> it's an arduino nano counterfeit
2018-09-18T18:50:04 < mawk> with a stm32 as the chip
2018-09-18T18:50:10 < mawk> stm32f4something
2018-09-18T18:50:12 < dongs> ah those
2018-09-18T18:50:21 < dongs> youer not even suposed to drive leds off those pins
2018-09-18T18:50:25 < dongs> cuz they have like 2mA current capability
2018-09-18T18:50:31 < dongs> chinks never fuckign read datasheets
2018-09-18T18:50:35 < mawk> lol
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2018-09-18T18:50:47 < dongs> because they go through analog switch inside the IC
2018-09-18T18:53:00 < emeb> "it worked OK on the prototype so.. eh."
2018-09-18T19:11:17 < veverak> #itBlinksItShips
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2018-09-18T19:53:43 < englishman> Attackers might be trying to steal your information from www.amphenolcanada.com (for example, passwords, messages, or credit cards). Learn more
2018-09-18T19:53:43 < englishman> NET::ERR_CERT_COMMON_NAME_INVALID
2018-09-18T19:53:57 < englishman> ffff
2018-09-18T19:54:14 < englishman> anyone used amphenol RJMG ethernet+mags
2018-09-18T19:54:57 < day> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXYje2B04xE dayum
2018-09-18T19:56:54 < day> its funny that he just tears them down in his home office.
2018-09-18T19:58:09 < englishman> windows vista? or did they upgrade, for $1.3m
2018-09-18T19:58:42 < day> ttps://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2935714-pn-UXR1102A/110-ghz-2-channel-uxr-series-real-time-infiniium-oscilloscope?pm=op&nid=-31885.1247193&cc=CA&lc=eng
2018-09-18T19:58:45 < englishman> how much are the probes
2018-09-18T19:58:51 < day> checkout the 'upgrade options'
2018-09-18T20:03:22 < day> spends 1.3mil. cant decode rs232. makes you wonder what they charge for the protocols. charging a few hundred bucks would be laughable
2018-09-18T20:03:40 < karlp> "standard priceing"
2018-09-18T20:08:18 < Steffanx> imagine it's 3am and you watch videos on youtube.
2018-09-18T20:08:59 < day> well, the alternative would be youporn. he's not yet rock bottom!
2018-09-18T20:09:10 < Steffanx> True true.
2018-09-18T20:10:24 < day> but dont worry we're all strapped into the dongs express
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2018-09-18T20:24:11 < kakimir> recommend 3d printing service?
2018-09-18T20:24:29 < kakimir> laser sintering
2018-09-18T20:24:36 < kakimir> few pieces
2018-09-18T20:24:55 < day> is this affordable for hobby projects these days?
2018-09-18T20:25:17 < kakimir> I hope so
2018-09-18T20:25:25 < karlp> shapeworks?
2018-09-18T20:25:35 < karlp> or protolabs
2018-09-18T20:25:56 < karlp> not shapeworks, what werethe called
2018-09-18T20:26:12 < karlp> shapeways
2018-09-18T20:26:37 < kakimir> I need steel part
2018-09-18T20:26:40 < karlp> iirc we've used both shapeways and protolabs here.  (definitely protolabs)
2018-09-18T20:26:41 < kakimir> stainless steel
2018-09-18T20:26:50 < day> protolabs seems to have that
2018-09-18T20:26:56 < day> https://www.protolabs.co.uk/materials/comparison-guide/?filter=metal-materials
2018-09-18T20:27:02 < karlp> protolabs are really good.
2018-09-18T20:27:38 < kakimir> I need something simple and inexpensive like ordering PCBs
2018-09-18T20:27:51 < Steffanx> inexpensive.. doesnt sound like an option
2018-09-18T20:27:59 < karlp> are you after cnc milled? or just laser cut?
2018-09-18T20:28:00 < Steffanx> get something printed in wax and do the casting yourself then :P
2018-09-18T20:28:06 < kakimir> karlp: doesn't matter
2018-09-18T20:28:07 < karlp> protolabs _is_ pretty cheap really.
2018-09-18T20:28:11 < karlp> no, it does matter.
2018-09-18T20:28:15 < karlp> veryyyy different tooling
2018-09-18T20:28:27 < karlp> https://www.sculpteo.com/en/lasercutting/laser-cutting-materials/stainless-steel-material/ will do flat shit but they won't mill you a 3d design
2018-09-18T20:28:34 < kakimir> I had laser sintered part at work
2018-09-18T20:28:49 < day> karlp: what is 'cheap'?
2018-09-18T20:28:50 < karlp> though they say they can do laser sintered stainless too
2018-09-18T20:29:00 < karlp> day: use their online thing, it tells you prices.
2018-09-18T20:29:15 < kakimir> so many stainless steels
2018-09-18T20:29:36 < Steffanx> indeed, just dump your design into shapeways or protolabs and get your price kakimir .
2018-09-18T20:30:07 < Steffanx> it cant get more easy then that. Except for letting someone else do itall for you
2018-09-18T20:31:08 < day> is 3d sintering generally cheaper than milling?
2018-09-18T20:31:16  * karlp shrugs
2018-09-18T20:31:24 < day> assuming a cheap material like steel/aluminium
2018-09-18T20:31:25 < karlp> I'd guess that would depend on the vendor really.
2018-09-18T20:31:38 < karlp> one's going to charge based on volume, one's going to charge based on time.
2018-09-18T20:31:45 < karlp> or distance or whatever.
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2018-09-18T20:33:02 < Steffanx> what do you need it for karlp ?
2018-09-18T20:33:04 < Steffanx> *kakimir
2018-09-18T20:35:02 < kakimir> so there is this kind of sponsored project for my friend where we use prototypes of current products collecting dust in corners
2018-09-18T20:36:12 < kakimir> but company policy is not to give actual resources, sellable items or prototypes/samples we need at the moment
2018-09-18T20:36:30 < kakimir> so I pile of small adapters made of stainless steel
2018-09-18T20:37:17 < kakimir> thing is there is only 2 samples of these adapters and both are in use
2018-09-18T20:39:18 < kakimir> mass produced series is allegedly comming 18.10 and friend need the stuff 25.10 so there is about 0% chance for my friend gets production series units at time
2018-09-18T20:39:52 < catphish> kakimir: did you have some kind of project? i wasn't paying attention when you were asking about collaberating on stuffs
2018-09-18T20:40:55 < englishman> head down to the local smithy
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2018-09-18T20:44:53 < kakimir> nah I don know
2018-09-18T20:45:05 < kakimir> I wish to manipulate flarm data and send it out with bluetooth
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2018-09-18T20:47:27 < catphish> i don't know what a flarm is
2018-09-18T20:48:42 < zyp> hobby grade aircraft anticollision stuff
2018-09-18T20:49:50 < kakimir> so it's data ports spit out all kind of useful data
2018-09-18T20:50:04 < kakimir> gps, other trafic, barometer
2018-09-18T20:50:17 < kakimir> traffic
2018-09-18T20:51:18 < kakimir> so I want to modify and add sentences to data and then send it via bluetooth serial to phone
2018-09-18T20:54:55 < kakimir> good pitot tube pressure data would help calculate accurate wing
2018-09-18T20:55:34 < kakimir> *wind
2018-09-18T20:56:26 < kakimir> gps + airspeed combo - "gliding computer" will do the math
2018-09-18T20:57:52 < kakimir> good barometer data would give more accurate and responsive variometer and "heatmap"
2018-09-18T20:58:02 < catphish> do you have a plane?
2018-09-18T20:58:04 < ds2> what do you need that has to be sintered?
2018-09-18T20:58:24 < kakimir> ds2: sample was sintered
2018-09-18T20:58:45 < ds2> but do you need some specific property of sintered materials?
2018-09-18T20:58:51 < kakimir> it has thin areas
2018-09-18T20:58:58 < kakimir> actually
2018-09-18T20:59:06 < ds2> are all the surfaces accessible?
2018-09-18T20:59:16 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-18T20:59:32 < kakimir> it doesn't have any mounting surface though
2018-09-18T20:59:36 < kakimir> and it's really small
2018-09-18T20:59:49 < ds2> CNC may be doable
2018-09-18T20:59:50 < kakimir> size of thumb to first joint
2018-09-18T21:00:01 < ds2> don't seem too bad
2018-09-18T21:00:17 < ds2> what type of stainless?
2018-09-18T21:00:23 < ds2> 416? 304?
2018-09-18T21:00:59 < kakimir> I don't even know
2018-09-18T21:01:22 < ds2> is there a property of stainless you need?
2018-09-18T21:01:33 < ds2> 416 is easy to machine
2018-09-18T21:01:33 < kakimir> tensile strengt
2018-09-18T21:01:58 < ds2> odd that you want tensile strength but also call out sintered
2018-09-18T21:02:08 < kakimir> I don't know
2018-09-18T21:02:17 < kakimir> it has thin part that takes all the stress
2018-09-18T21:02:24 < ds2> sintering gives you a structure that looks like a bunch of BB's being welded together
2018-09-18T21:02:31 < kakimir> aa
2018-09-18T21:02:38 < kakimir> it was not like that
2018-09-18T21:02:55 < ds2> no, the structure... not the size of the bits
2018-09-18T21:02:56 < kakimir> but it was clearly rough surface all over
2018-09-18T21:03:23 < kakimir> it was like really fine foam
2018-09-18T21:03:29 < ds2> sintering is taking powder metal and heating it enough so the bits of powder weld together (not melt)
2018-09-18T21:03:53 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-18T21:04:40 <@jpa-> day: in my experience, 3D metal sintering is cheaper only for complex shapes (like if it has a big bounding box and lot of material to cut away).. but on the other hand it is getting cheaper all the time
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2018-09-18T21:06:39 < kakimir> cnc made has better physical properties compared to 3d printed always?
2018-09-18T21:07:00 <@jpa-> for same material, i'd say yes
2018-09-18T21:07:22 <@jpa-> 3D printed template + lost wax casting is cheaper than sintering, but still more expensive than CNC usually
2018-09-18T21:07:33 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-18T21:07:42 < kakimir> it could be lost was casting
2018-09-18T21:07:47 < kakimir> the sample
2018-09-18T21:07:59 < kakimir> it has "sandy" surface
2018-09-18T21:08:48 <@jpa-> that doesn't really tell much, it can occur from variety of processes; and also sintered models can be dipped in filler metal so that no holes remain
2018-09-18T21:09:03 < kakimir> interesting
2018-09-18T21:09:39 < kakimir> can thin parts be made in lost wax casting?
2018-09-18T21:10:01 <@jpa-> depends on "thin", but shapeways seems to have no problems with 1mm diameter wires
2018-09-18T21:10:20 < kakimir> shapeways does lost wax stuff?
2018-09-18T21:11:26 < kakimir> well this has like.. 2mm channels that are 4mm wide
2018-09-18T21:11:33 < ds2> jpa-: The real killer for 3D printed sintered stuff is - in accessible surfaces
2018-09-18T21:11:40 <@jpa-> yeah, their silver, gold, bronze, brass etc. are lost wax castings
2018-09-18T21:11:57 < ds2> you can do your own gold/silver sintering at home
2018-09-18T21:12:00 < kakimir> how about stainless?
2018-09-18T21:12:28 <@jpa-> kakimir: shapeways' stainless+bronze is sintered
2018-09-18T21:12:28 < ds2> @#$@#$@$ oxygen makes it hard to sinter other metals
2018-09-18T21:12:33 < kakimir> ds2: are you codyslab?
2018-09-18T21:12:40 < ds2> kakimir: eh?
2018-09-18T21:12:59 <@jpa-> ds2: filling some box with nitrogen doesn't sound too difficult
2018-09-18T21:13:17 < kakimir> dude that plays with gold and silver and mines his own and collects platinum from road dust
2018-09-18T21:13:23 < ds2> jpa-: well... except you need to keep it in AND raise the temperature to like 1200F
2018-09-18T21:13:36 < ds2> kakimir: oh... nope...that sounds interesting
2018-09-18T21:14:01 < kakimir> infortainment channel in youtubes
2018-09-18T21:14:04 < ds2> you can get gold and silver clay. shape that anyway you want. dry it and fire it
2018-09-18T21:14:32 < ds2> kakimir: I don't do much (last thing was >8 yrs ago) on YT
2018-09-18T21:15:28 < ds2> jpa-: One technique that works is to fire it with lots of charcoal so it is in a CO atmosphere w/extra C to consume any O2 that gets in
2018-09-18T21:15:53 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bt2BDCwu18U most expensive foil ball in youtubes I think
2018-09-18T21:16:01 < kakimir> when foil balls were a thing
2018-09-18T21:16:12 < kakimir> like 5months ago
2018-09-18T21:17:49 < ds2> materials science is lots of fun
2018-09-18T21:19:26 < kakimir> cody is type of guy that melts that anvil, hammer, that towel and 2squaremeters of concrete to get back gold he lost in the process
2018-09-18T21:19:54 < ds2> hehe
2018-09-18T21:20:17 < ds2> probally more gold in most chips then that
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2018-09-18T21:29:48 < kakimir> what should I put in company field in protolabs
2018-09-18T21:30:05 < kakimir> this is personal account :<
2018-09-18T21:30:29 < BrainDamage> kakilabs
2018-09-18T21:32:15 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-18T21:32:18 < kakimir> kakilabs
2018-09-18T21:33:07 < kakimir> if I had money laying around I would register kakilabs oy
2018-09-18T21:33:27 <@jpa-> you can also just put your own name there, like you would if you were doing business without a separate registered company name
2018-09-18T21:34:17 < kakimir> good idea
2018-09-18T21:34:22 < kakimir> they wont know
2018-09-18T21:34:30 < kakimir> if they don't ask my VAT code
2018-09-18T21:42:19 < kakimir> keepassxc is really nice
2018-09-18T21:42:27 < kakimir> I have like 6passwords already
2018-09-18T21:42:38 < kakimir> I almost remember the main password to access them
2018-09-18T21:43:12 < kakimir> some day I will forget
2018-09-18T21:44:57 <@jpa-> 6? i have over 200 passwords in my password manager
2018-09-18T21:45:34 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@37.201.5.188] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-18T21:47:57 < Steffanx> and what password manager does jpa-  use?
2018-09-18T21:48:23 <@jpa-> kedpm
2018-09-18T21:49:33 -!- barthess [~barthess@nat-16-metro-pool-1-ip-2.cosmostv.by] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2018-09-18T21:49:54 < Steffanx> KedPM is written in pure python
2018-09-18T21:49:54 < Steffanx> yeah
2018-09-18T21:51:20 < kakimir> :<
2018-09-18T21:53:16 < Steffanx> i want something that works on all oses and a shared db over multiple pcs
2018-09-18T21:53:22 < Steffanx> still have to look for something
2018-09-18T21:53:55 <@jpa-> i just keep the db on the server and login via ssh; and rsync for backup to home pc
2018-09-18T21:54:04 < Steffanx> meh
2018-09-18T21:54:37 < kakimir> keepassxc wont do for you Steffanx?
2018-09-18T21:55:06 < Steffanx> idk
2018-09-18T21:56:58 < Steffanx> hmm, using a db in nextcloud or sometihng might work
2018-09-18T22:11:29 < kakimir> keepass will create lock file
2018-09-18T22:25:40 < englishman> notepad.exe and github
2018-09-18T22:26:08 < Getty> teampass
2018-09-18T22:27:33 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-18T22:28:06 < Steffanx> i only have to share it between Steffan and me, Getty.
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2018-09-18T22:38:59 < qyx> anyone encountered troubles initializing the rtc?
2018-09-18T22:39:02 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2018-09-18T22:39:15 < qyx> it works if lsi is enabled and selected as clock source
2018-09-18T22:39:31 < qyx> if I enable the lse and select it as a clock source, initialization fails
2018-09-18T22:39:37 < qyx> but
2018-09-18T22:39:43 < qyx> if I initialize the rtc using lsi
2018-09-18T22:40:03 < qyx> and then just selects lse, it counts correctly
2018-09-18T22:41:45 < qyx> RTC_ISR_INITF is not set
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2018-09-18T23:36:02 < aandrew> balls, I didn't realize I selected a 0.65mm pitch STM32
2018-09-18T23:36:18 < aandrew> I changed it to the 208 ball 0.8mm pitch and now I have to reassign all the fucking signals
2018-09-18T23:46:02 < Steffanx> Whops
2018-09-18T23:48:30 < kakimir> small balls you have
2018-09-18T23:51:12 < kakimir> are you doing your balling yourself aandrew ?
2018-09-18T23:51:52 < aandrew> hm?
2018-09-18T23:51:55 < aandrew> "doing the balling myself" 
2018-09-18T23:51:56 < aandrew> ?
2018-09-18T23:52:54 < aandrew> man cubemx is slow as fuck
2018-09-18T23:53:20 < emeb> Java!
2018-09-18T23:54:48 < aandrew> wtf 21-23" 4k monitor is $420? fuck that shit
2018-09-18T23:54:58 < kakimir> 420
2018-09-18T23:55:04 < aandrew> stoner
2018-09-18T23:55:27 < kakimir> stoning deal
2018-09-18T23:59:48 < aandrew> $250 for a 27" IPS $250 on amazon
--- Day changed Wed Sep 19 2018
2018-09-19T00:03:20 < Steffanx> LG 24UD58-B
2018-09-19T00:03:21 < Steffanx>  Is like $290 here aandre
2018-09-19T00:03:30 < Steffanx> w
2018-09-19T00:03:42 < Steffanx> No way its more expensive in the us
2018-09-19T00:03:56 < Steffanx> Oh you said 23" not 24 :P
2018-09-19T00:04:11 < Steffanx> I didnt say anything
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2018-09-19T00:09:34 < BrainDamage> small balls and 23"
2018-09-19T00:10:19 < Steffanx> I like my 24" screenies
2018-09-19T00:10:47 < BrainDamage> "it has to fit on the diagonal"
2018-09-19T00:12:08 < Steffanx> ikr. 
2018-09-19T00:12:39 < Steffanx> On the other hand. On its side my 24" is larger than yoy :P
2018-09-19T00:12:40 < Steffanx> U
2018-09-19T00:13:30 < Steffanx> *24" screen
2018-09-19T00:18:43 < englishman> link aandrew ?
2018-09-19T00:19:15 < englishman> eww 27"
2018-09-19T00:19:28 < englishman> of course they are 250 the pixels are as big as your hand
2018-09-19T00:19:45 < englishman> by Sceptre Technologies, Inc
2018-09-19T00:19:49 < englishman> paying for the name too
2018-09-19T00:25:34 < aandrew> hm, what is "input capture indirect" ; direct I understand, when the pin changes it captures the timer value
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2018-09-19T00:50:02 < Laurenceb124> <kakimir> can you show us what you are doing Laurenceb124?
2018-09-19T00:50:12 < Laurenceb124> no longer muh gui
2018-09-19T00:50:26 < Laurenceb124> now I have to wurk on muh influxdb webshite
2018-09-19T00:50:41 < Laurenceb124> tomorrow it will prob change again
2018-09-19T00:57:56 < Steffanx> Website?
2018-09-19T00:58:01 < Steffanx> Poooor Laurenceb123 
2018-09-19T00:58:05 < kakimir> you will make somebody very rich someday Laurenceb124 
2018-09-19T00:58:07 < Steffanx> And Laurenceb124 
2018-09-19T00:58:14 < Steffanx> I can feel your pain
2018-09-19T00:58:29 < kakimir> I mean you just pro it all
2018-09-19T00:58:33 < Laurenceb124> the https is already broken
2018-09-19T00:58:53 < kakimir> I read "the https is always broken"
2018-09-19T00:59:59 < kakimir> I talk with my friend like we were grandpas
2018-09-19T01:00:55 < kakimir> we talk about pains, about death, how things were back in the days
2018-09-19T01:01:53 < kakimir> one day I was bunking in his place and my alarm rang for 1hour straight and I didn't move an inch
2018-09-19T01:02:25 < Steffanx> The joint kicked in hard...
2018-09-19T01:02:26 < kakimir> he said later "I thought now it had happend"
2018-09-19T01:03:02 < kakimir> we are in our 20s
2018-09-19T01:08:59 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-19T01:09:03 < kakimir> that is what we need
2018-09-19T01:10:46 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149435.png
2018-09-19T01:10:53 < Laurenceb124> northfags on suicide watch
2018-09-19T01:11:38 < Laurenceb124> norf versus south fc
2018-09-19T01:11:48 < Laurenceb124> long running chan cartoon series
2018-09-19T01:12:20 < Laurenceb124> ppl from north uk and south take it in turn to troll each other
2018-09-19T01:12:53 < Laurenceb124> >kids in kebab
2018-09-19T01:14:12 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149436.png
2018-09-19T01:15:11 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149437.png
2018-09-19T01:16:42 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149438.png
2018-09-19T01:18:09 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-b4e3e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-19T01:19:41 < Laurenceb124> ftw https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149441.jpg
2018-09-19T01:21:28 < Laurenceb124> nope
2018-09-19T01:21:38 < Laurenceb124> kek @ the google watermarks in everything
2018-09-19T01:21:48 < Laurenceb124> its all taken from streetview
2018-09-19T01:22:45 < catphish> Laurenceb124: this "uk" sounds shit
2018-09-19T01:23:12 < Laurenceb124>  /britfeel/ ftw
2018-09-19T01:23:35 < Laurenceb124> oh shit they memed too hard and its becoming real https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149444.jpg
2018-09-19T01:28:01 < kakimir> I need wired remote controller with 2 momentary buttons
2018-09-19T01:29:26 < kakimir> ideally buttons have these tiles you can put a piece of paper inside
2018-09-19T01:30:13 < kakimir> that is for symbols or text crt 
2018-09-19T01:30:18 < kakimir> to indicate function of the button
2018-09-19T01:30:53 < kakimir> however you like it
2018-09-19T01:34:20 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149449.jpg
2018-09-19T01:35:05 < kakimir> maybe I get pedal controller
2018-09-19T01:35:25 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@37.201.5.188] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2018-09-19T01:37:24 < Laurenceb124> 2 esoteric 4 me https://imgoat.com/uploads/ef605fc8db/149450.png
2018-09-19T01:43:39 < Laurenceb124> http://www.artnews.com/2014/08/04/ebay-bidder-buys-4chan-screenshot-as-art-for-90k/
2018-09-19T01:56:23 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-19T02:00:04 < johntramp> any ideas what would be causing a reset line to be pulling low after boot, causing a continuous boot-loop?  externally it's just a 1k pullup and 100nf to gnd
2018-09-19T02:00:54 < johntramp> same firmware on a different board works fine, the difference between these boards is only adding 100uf bulk capacitor to the 3v3 rail on the one which is glitching
2018-09-19T02:12:09 < catphish> johntramp: got a scope on it, does it actually go low? is it high sometimes?
2018-09-19T02:13:53 < johntramp> catphish: yeah I am just doing that, she's not pretty ...
2018-09-19T02:14:03 < johntramp> it's almost like there is coupling from the spi bus on the reset pin
2018-09-19T02:14:27 < kakimir> Brooklyn Nine-Nine
2018-09-19T02:14:38 < catphish> is this just on one board, or reroducible?
2018-09-19T02:14:42 < kakimir> have you watched this series?
2018-09-19T02:14:48 < catphish> simple bridged connection?
2018-09-19T02:14:59 < johntramp> catphish: only on one board
2018-09-19T02:15:01 < catphish> kakimir: it's probably the best series ever made
2018-09-19T02:15:14 < catphish> johntramp: i'd check all the connections, maybe something's just shorted
2018-09-19T02:16:04 < johntramp> yeah, likely caused when adding another cap
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2018-09-19T02:39:01 < johntramp> yeah 
2018-09-19T02:39:06 < johntramp> i dunno ... I don't see why tho
2018-09-19T02:39:17 < johntramp> looking at the board I see no shorts anywhere
2018-09-19T02:39:51 < johntramp> the rail looks good,  it is using a boost converter
2018-09-19T02:40:25 < johntramp> yes
2018-09-19T02:41:00 < johntramp> i added this to try prevent brownout when the board is jolted, I get a momentary disconnect from the battery terminals
2018-09-19T02:42:34 < johntramp> also, just to make things worse, it is intermittent ... sometimes it works fine and others it is stuck in the boot loop
2018-09-19T02:42:34 < catphish> i don't see why it would cause problem beyond the first time, once it's charged it shouldn't do much should it?
2018-09-19T02:42:56 < catphish> :( i'm unquanified to help much
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2018-09-19T03:19:04 < branjb> https://postmeritocracy.org/
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2018-09-19T03:51:37 < englishman> i got a contract to route out a raspberry pi CM3 board in altium, but i don'
2018-09-19T03:51:53 < englishman> t have the time. it's about 15-20 hours work for a skilled altidumb person. i'll subcontract it to a pro IRCer
2018-09-19T03:51:57 < englishman> pm me for info
2018-09-19T03:52:12 < branjb> weren't you excited about that like 2-3 days ago
2018-09-19T03:52:18 < englishman> yeah
2018-09-19T03:52:21 < englishman> now i got the PO
2018-09-19T03:52:25 < englishman> and like 5 other POs at the same time
2018-09-19T03:52:47 < branjb> that's always how it seemed to go at the small shop i used to work at
2018-09-19T03:52:57 < branjb> no POs for like a week then 5 at once
2018-09-19T03:53:15 < englishman> yeah and some crazy large contracts too
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2018-09-19T04:35:36 < aandrew> man I wish there was a way to toggle masking in altium
2018-09-19T04:36:22 < aandrew> I want the mask (e.g. inNetClass('dongs') but if I have to temporarily turn it off to move somethign else out of the way or route something I see that isn't in that class, I have to go back to the tab and hit enter again
2018-09-19T05:00:02 < Thorn> what battery do I use for.a device which needs 120+mA current bursts? cr2450 etc. seem to be rated @ 10-15mA max and li-ion has 10%/month self-discharge
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2018-09-19T05:07:34 < Thorn> a discharged cap is basically a short circuit for a battery
2018-09-19T05:08:05 < Thorn> it's probably not going to like that
2018-09-19T05:11:42 < Thorn> dunno yet but it could be several seconds at a time
2018-09-19T05:11:45 < Thorn> or even more
2018-09-19T05:12:38 < Thorn> a few times / hour up to once a minute 
2018-09-19T05:13:12 < Thorn> probably
2018-09-19T05:14:20 < Thorn> I'm looking at iBeacons with cr2477 sitting on my desk but they have only 4dbm max radiated power
2018-09-19T05:18:48 < Thorn> lol
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2018-09-19T05:20:08 < Thorn> better than trump university
2018-09-19T05:22:35 < englishman> Thorn maybe consider one of those new solid state lipos
2018-09-19T05:23:03 < englishman> ceramic whatevers
2018-09-19T05:23:20 < englishman> the no-splode technology
2018-09-19T05:23:40 < Thorn> englishman: big day today, i_am_puma met with bobcat tv https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vmp6lnFYELE
2018-09-19T05:25:12 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/V668i7i
2018-09-19T05:25:28 < aandrew> RAM to FPGA and FMC/RMII  between FPGA and STM routed, not yet length matched
2018-09-19T05:25:45 < aandrew> that's not the half of it
2018-09-19T05:26:13 < aandrew> I'm only 35% done
2018-09-19T05:26:25 < aandrew> 2700 connections, 956 complete
2018-09-19T05:26:37 < aandrew> lol I'm not gonna live stream
2018-09-19T05:26:43 < aandrew> but I am going ot try a timelapse
2018-09-19T05:26:47 < aandrew> still shit
2018-09-19T05:26:47 < Getty> live stream! live stream! :D
2018-09-19T05:27:38 < Getty> haha
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2018-09-19T05:27:54 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/4QwnDjn that's what the whole board looks like presently
2018-09-19T05:29:32 < aandrew> yep
2018-09-19T05:29:39 < aandrew> that is the ONLY reason I have rooms in this
2018-09-19T05:29:45 < aandrew> I usually route without them
2018-09-19T05:29:58 < aandrew> but in this case I have five "subcircuits" which I want to be indentical
2018-09-19T05:30:50 < Thorn> not enough SMAs
2018-09-19T05:31:19 < aandrew> actually those are MCX I was mistaken
2018-09-19T05:31:34 < aandrew> and yeah those are only for the proto
2018-09-19T05:31:40 < aandrew> want to be able to easily monitor some of the signals
2018-09-19T06:00:11 < branjb> ><aandrew> I'm only 35% done
2018-09-19T06:00:19 < branjb> false the last 10% is more work than the previous 90%
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2018-09-19T07:10:26 < branjb> we've got a chinaman here
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2018-09-19T07:46:18 < Thorn> are say sx127x and cc1101 compatible if you configure both for the same modulation etc.?
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2018-09-19T08:38:59 < upgrdman> fuck, PIC24 is trolling me again
2018-09-19T08:39:10 < upgrdman> if i #define a number, it defaults to an int, right?
2018-09-19T08:39:24 < upgrdman> how can i #define something to a long? fooL?
2018-09-19T08:40:09 < upgrdman> can i L an expression? like #define FOO  (BAR*1234)L
2018-09-19T08:40:54 < upgrdman> ahh fuck it, i'll just use const uint32_t FOO ... make my life easier
2018-09-19T08:45:30 < englishman> there are a lot of people on fiverr that are asking way more than $5
2018-09-19T08:46:26 < qyx> #define FOO 123UL
2018-09-19T08:46:29 < qyx> should do
2018-09-19T08:47:22 < qyx> does pic24 defaults to a 16bit int?
2018-09-19T08:47:26 < upgrdman> qyx, ya but what if its an equation
2018-09-19T08:47:35 < upgrdman> like #define FOO BAR*123
2018-09-19T08:47:42 < qyx> the BAR*123UL
2018-09-19T08:47:43 < upgrdman> qyx, ya
2018-09-19T08:47:46 < upgrdman> k
2018-09-19T08:48:06 < qyx> 123 is a literal, UL makes it long
2018-09-19T08:48:14 < qyx> the other one may be anything
2018-09-19T08:48:31 < qyx> you also need #define BAR 34UL or whatever
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2018-09-19T08:52:02 < qyx> but in this case it doesn't matter
2018-09-19T08:54:23 < qyx> hm, wait
2018-09-19T08:54:35 < qyx> seems like the preprocessor uses different logic
2018-09-19T08:57:28 < qyx> ok, const uint32_t looks more promising
2018-09-19T08:58:11 < qyx> my rtc keeps time but doesn't count
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2018-09-19T09:08:10 < qyx> in flash
2018-09-19T09:08:45 < qyx> if you specify them as const, they are in the .text section
2018-09-19T09:08:57 < qyx> but this is no avr-gcc
2018-09-19T09:09:03 < qyx> oh, its mips24
2018-09-19T09:09:46 < qyx> idk, upgrdman_ knows
2018-09-19T09:10:32 < upgrdman_> i just said fuck it and got rid of the #defines
2018-09-19T09:13:43 < upgrdman_> dont know, dont care. it sucks.
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2018-09-19T09:21:51 < dongs> PIC24 is just PIC, garbage
2018-09-19T09:22:44 < dongs> < upgrdman> can i L an expression? like #define FOO  (BAR*1234)L
2018-09-19T09:22:50 < dongs> that sounds fucking TERRIBLE anyway
2018-09-19T09:23:03 < dongs> par for the course tho, being pic and all
2018-09-19T09:23:09 < upgrdman_> lol ya
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2018-09-19T09:28:42 < dongs> stm32 headers do all sorts of horseshit wiht #dfines and adding/math on them
2018-09-19T09:28:54 < dongs> when they #define APB_BASE 0x40000 or wahtever 
2018-09-19T09:29:00 < dongs> and then add all the peripheral offsets and shit to them
2018-09-19T09:29:24 < dongs> but thy're compiled on a proper 32bit system
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2018-09-19T09:32:33 < emeb_mac> PIC24 is a completely different CPU architecture from the old 8-bitters. It's actually a pretty nice machine.
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2018-09-19T09:33:08 < emeb_mac> and dsPIC is similar - same basic arch with the DSP stuff grafted on.
2018-09-19T09:33:17 < dongs> dSPIC
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2018-09-19T09:34:52 < emeb_mac> but they don't really scale well beyond 16 bits & 40MIPs so that's why PIC32
2018-09-19T09:42:45 < ds2> the biggest problem with the PICS/AVRS/etc is the 2352912394208409231849023840923849023840 different programming methods
2018-09-19T09:43:42 < upgrdman> emeb_mac, some of the pic24 stuff is fucking weird tho. they'll spend >100 registers on the ADC, but for the RTC you have to set bits to tell it what you want to read from the one register for y/m/d/h/m/s
2018-09-19T09:44:00 < dongs> thats what you get when you steal IP
2018-09-19T09:44:09 < upgrdman> also, the year is an 8bit number. wtf, they couldn't spare 12 bits or 16 bits for the year!?
2018-09-19T09:44:44 < dongs> Y2K ready
2018-09-19T09:45:05 < emeb_mac> upgrdman: yes - every damned peripheral in PIC24/dsPIC seems to have been designed with a different set of assumptions.
2018-09-19T09:45:15 < upgrdman> yup :(
2018-09-19T09:45:40 < emeb_mac> it's like they don't have an overall architecture group setting standards
2018-09-19T09:46:01 < upgrdman> and the ICD4 is gay as fuck. what asshole designed a programmer/debugger shaped like a circle, and with an electrically-conductive case
2018-09-19T09:46:21 < upgrdman> i want to put that guy's testicles in a vise
2018-09-19T09:47:09 < emeb_mac> I know a lot of ppl who've worked there (HQ is like 5 miles from my house). None have anything good to say about their internal processes
2018-09-19T09:47:13 < qyx> year on stm32 is a bcd coded 8 bit number
2018-09-19T09:48:02 < qyx> probably even worse
2018-09-19T09:48:05 < emeb_mac> I *almost* got a job there 15 yrs ago :P
2018-09-19T09:48:33 < emeb_mac> interviewed, got an offer but went to Intel instead.
2018-09-19T09:48:53 < upgrdman> how many backdoors did you design for intel cpus?
2018-09-19T09:49:10 < emeb_mac> lol - didn't work in CPUs.
2018-09-19T09:49:19 < upgrdman> :)
2018-09-19T09:49:20 < emeb_mac> worked on WiMAX chipsets
2018-09-19T09:49:31 < emeb_mac> there's a dead end... 
2018-09-19T09:50:13 < upgrdman> that was supposed to be long range wifi, right?
2018-09-19T09:50:20 < upgrdman> like neighborhood-level?
2018-09-19T09:50:22 < emeb_mac> yeah
2018-09-19T09:50:23 < dongs> wimax is very much used in many places
2018-09-19T09:50:30 < dongs> maybe not the garbage emeb was working on but
2018-09-19T09:50:36 < dongs> its all over japan, korea, etc
2018-09-19T09:50:37 < emeb_mac> MAN - metro area network
2018-09-19T09:50:55 < dongs> gooks have their own shit called wibro but its ~similar to wimax
2018-09-19T09:51:02 < emeb_mac> yep
2018-09-19T09:51:06 < upgrdman> dongs, just mesh'd wifi, or actually different hardware?
2018-09-19T09:51:16 < dongs> different hardware different protocols etc
2018-09-19T09:51:19 < upgrdman> k
2018-09-19T09:51:28 < emeb_mac> yep
2018-09-19T09:51:35 < dongs> wifi is 802.11 and wimax shit is .16 iirc
2018-09-19T09:51:44 < dongs> so completely different set of stanrdards
2018-09-19T09:51:48 < emeb_mac> correct
2018-09-19T09:51:51 < upgrdman> any idea why?
2018-09-19T09:52:08 < emeb_mac> OFDMA with way different MAC layer to support many users
2018-09-19T09:52:10 < dongs> cuz tehy wanted to call something a MAN
2018-09-19T09:52:20 < dongs> stick it to all these newfag #metoo feminists
2018-09-19T09:55:03 < zyp> I picked up a laptop in jp once that came with wimax
2018-09-19T09:55:18 < emeb_mac> cool
2018-09-19T09:55:19 < zyp> including free trial of uq wimax for a couple of weeks
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2018-09-19T09:55:55 < emeb_mac> any idea what kind of bandwidth it had?
2018-09-19T09:56:25 < emeb_mac> IIRC the stuff I worked on topped out around 70Mbps for the entire sector
2018-09-19T09:56:33 < dongs> 2018年7月末時点の440Mbps対応エリア
2018-09-19T09:56:34 < dongs> wimax2
2018-09-19T09:56:35 < zyp> dunno, but I remember getting >10Mb/s sitting on a moving train
2018-09-19T09:56:45 < emeb_mac> I'd hope they've pushed beyond that by now.
2018-09-19T09:56:46 < dongs> looks like 440 max
2018-09-19T09:56:49 < zyp> this was in 2010, so at the time I only had 10Mb/s
2018-09-19T09:56:54 < zyp> at home
2018-09-19T09:57:03 < emeb_mac> sounds about right
2018-09-19T09:57:36 < emeb_mac> the important thing was I had an onion on my belt
2018-09-19T09:58:40 < emeb_mac> and in those days nickels had pictures of bumblebees
2018-09-19T09:59:03 < dongs> they still ahve retarded limits tho
2018-09-19T09:59:07 < dongs> 10gb/3days rolling average
2018-09-19T09:59:21 < dongs> so if you use > 10 it slows down to shit
2018-09-19T09:59:29 < emeb_mac> keeps ppl from saturating the pipes w/ porn
2018-09-19T09:59:31 < dongs> to 1mbps
2018-09-19T09:59:33 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-19T10:00:09 < c10ud> sup pros , how do you handle your flash r/w needs in IAR?
2018-09-19T10:00:15 < dongs> by not using IAR
2018-09-19T10:00:21 < emeb_mac> gn
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2018-09-19T10:00:32 < c10ud> yeah, that's what I thought too, the fucking linker script and PRAGMAS
2018-09-19T10:00:39 < dongs> wait what?
2018-09-19T10:00:43 < dongs> what are you trying to do exactly
2018-09-19T10:01:08 < c10ud> put some bytes in flash and rw them at runtime
2018-09-19T10:01:21 < dongs> you dont need dicker script for any of that
2018-09-19T10:01:31 < dongs> i mean, you CAN trim end of flash in y our linker shit if you really care but
2018-09-19T10:01:37 < dongs> just get address of last flash page
2018-09-19T10:01:43 < dongs> and use it with FLASH_* stuff in stdperiphlib
2018-09-19T10:01:48 < dongs> FLASH_ErasePage etc.
2018-09-19T10:01:56 < dongs> you have to unlock writes first
2018-09-19T10:02:00 < c10ud> yeah I did that in the past, I wanted to use a PROer function though
2018-09-19T10:02:07 < dongs> like whaT?
2018-09-19T10:02:11 < dongs> thats how you do it
2018-09-19T10:02:24 < c10ud> like properly defining the region so there's no chance you will get into it with flash code
2018-09-19T10:02:36 < c10ud> not that this is the case though...the program is very small
2018-09-19T10:02:55 < dongs> so just edit flash size in link script
2018-09-19T10:03:00 < dongs> or in GUI i presume IAR has something
2018-09-19T10:03:07 < dongs> in keil its under project properties, you can specify length of flash region
2018-09-19T10:03:17 < dongs> should be something similar in iar
2018-09-19T10:03:29 < dongs> just make it 2-4k less than flash size and done
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2018-09-19T10:05:01 < c10ud> yea I was searching just for that 
2018-09-19T10:05:13 < c10ud> the gcc version was easier though
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2018-09-19T10:05:52 < upgrdman> hmm i wonder if mpfag x has an option to make int behave like a 32bit int. getting warnings about lots of other shit, and i need to share some of this code with an ARM project too, so i'd rather not dirty it up too much for the PIC
2018-09-19T10:06:33 < c10ud> btw dongs I need 36k bytes that's why I was looking into the less hacky stuff
2018-09-19T10:06:49 < c10ud> (I'm on F4 with 1M flash tho)
2018-09-19T10:11:32 < dongs> well, its not hacky really
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2018-09-19T10:14:13 < c10ud> alright, fuck it, I will just get the last sector 
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2018-09-19T11:59:46 < c10ud> isn't there a define for base address of flash sector?
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2018-09-19T12:29:07 < c10ud> oh fuck, hardfault while writing.. :)
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2018-09-19T12:43:17 < c10ud> ah maybe shitty scanf code..
2018-09-19T12:49:18 < Laurenceb124> wew 4chan just got b& in uk
2018-09-19T12:54:54 < Laurenceb124> luckily I have vpn
2018-09-19T12:58:08 < jadew> why did it get banned?
2018-09-19T12:58:20 < zyp> so Laurenceb124 can focus on other stuff
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2018-09-19T13:07:45 < kakimir> show your shiet Laurenceb123
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2018-09-19T13:27:22 < kakimir> I need to make really small footprint current source
2018-09-19T13:27:33 < kakimir> also it needs to be 3v3 referenced or clamped
2018-09-19T13:27:44 < kakimir> my mcu and everything else is at 5volts
2018-09-19T13:27:59 < kakimir> I need just hundreds of microamps
2018-09-19T13:28:18 < kakimir> maybe few different current levels
2018-09-19T13:28:22 < cjbaird> zener
2018-09-19T13:28:34 < kakimir> I need current source
2018-09-19T13:28:41 < kakimir> not voltage source
2018-09-19T13:28:51 < kakimir> it's for usb charger detection
2018-09-19T13:32:58 < kakimir> maybe I could use some resistors
2018-09-19T13:33:01 < kakimir> RC filter
2018-09-19T13:33:04 < kakimir> zener
2018-09-19T13:33:13 < kakimir> then I PWM out
2018-09-19T13:33:50 < kakimir> ADC pin used as feedback
2018-09-19T13:34:22 < kakimir> because there is resistance - I'll know the current too
2018-09-19T13:34:42 < kakimir> it's a bit hacky but maybe it will work
2018-09-19T13:42:28 < qyx> there are ics for usb charger detection
2018-09-19T13:50:25 < karlp> yeah, but it's kakimir
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2018-09-19T14:00:59 < kakimir> I need 2.2µH inductor
2018-09-19T14:01:02 < kakimir> small
2018-09-19T14:01:25 < kakimir> output current is 1.5A
2018-09-19T14:02:13 < kakimir> well.. if there were one that was small and did the job
2018-09-19T14:02:24 < kakimir> and cheap
2018-09-19T14:03:01 < kakimir> I'm looking at total cost of components under 1usd atm.
2018-09-19T14:03:20 < kakimir> so if I throw 2usd detector there?
2018-09-19T14:03:32 < karlp> IoT getting started: The images being created are currently 4 Gb in size. The current memory used for testing is 1 Gb of RAM
2018-09-19T14:03:34 < karlp> well done....
2018-09-19T14:03:57 < kakimir> images?
2018-09-19T14:04:12 < karlp> disk images
2018-09-19T14:04:23 < kakimir> qyx: recommend me one
2018-09-19T14:04:26 < kakimir> i2c
2018-09-19T14:04:36 < kakimir> small
2018-09-19T14:04:40 < kakimir> cheap
2018-09-19T14:04:41 < kakimir> modern
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2018-09-19T14:05:43 < qyx> I think kakimir is reinventing something
2018-09-19T14:05:53 < kakimir> I am
2018-09-19T14:05:56 < qyx> looks like a cheap ass chinese power bank
2018-09-19T14:06:05 < kakimir> I already did it
2018-09-19T14:06:36 < kakimir> and it's not cheap - I put extra 20cents on that to make it actually perform
2018-09-19T14:10:15 < kakimir> now I'm making a device that actually consumes power from usb2.0
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2018-09-19T14:44:27 < aandrew> < branjb> false the last 10% is more work than the previous 90% very true
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2018-09-19T14:52:41 < zyp> "first you do the first 90% of the work, and then you do the remaining 90% of the work"
2018-09-19T15:02:59 < karlp> that's my favourite one, 90+90
2018-09-19T15:05:05 < karlp> cocomo says 80% done in 20% of time, remaining 20% in remaining 80%, but that assumes that your project was pefectly budgeted. hah
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2018-09-19T15:35:03 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-19T15:35:16 < Sadale> so true
2018-09-19T15:35:25 < dongs> especially if lunix is invovled
2018-09-19T15:35:25 < Sadale> The last 10% is 90%.
2018-09-19T15:35:37 < dongs> then youre just fucked
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2018-09-19T15:47:35 < Thorn> there is always an option  of doing a half-assed job on time and within budget lol
2018-09-19T15:48:36 < karlp> that's called "agile"
2018-09-19T15:49:00 < zyp> so, what's your opinion of scrum?
2018-09-19T15:58:14 < qyx> doable either fully or not
2018-09-19T15:58:31 < qyx> people have to fully conform to the rules
2018-09-19T15:58:52 < qyx> or it is poitless
2018-09-19T16:00:01 < qyx> fuk pyqt on windows
2018-09-19T16:01:42 < zyp> yeah, I remember I once had a project that were supposed to be done with scrum, and a project manager that apparently didn't understand scrum
2018-09-19T16:03:28 < qyx> one anarchist in a team and it is totally screwed
2018-09-19T16:03:42 < qyx> the same applies for gitflow and such things
2018-09-19T16:03:52 < zyp> the daily standup turned into a hour long sit-down meeting because he for whatever reason insisted on going through every single ticket to check the progress
2018-09-19T16:03:59 < zyp> most of which were "no change since yesterday"
2018-09-19T16:04:28 < zyp> ah, people tried pushing gitflow on that project also, that just seems ridiculous
2018-09-19T16:05:06 < zyp> scrum seems reasonable enough to me, gitflow is pretty bullshit
2018-09-19T16:06:18 < karlp> gitflow looked stupid,
2018-09-19T16:06:44 < karlp> scrum and agile are ok to a point, but like qyx said, you've reallllly got to have full team buyin, and have a project manager who can actually setup roadmaps
2018-09-19T16:07:11 < karlp> seems to fall apart quickly with smaller teams with strong expertises differences too.
2018-09-19T16:07:22 < zyp> scrum has worked well on other projects I've been on
2018-09-19T16:07:29 < karlp> seems well designed for mid sizes teams of generically interchangeable people
2018-09-19T16:07:51 < zyp> although I still hate time estimating :p
2018-09-19T16:08:00 < karlp> I currently like kanban-ish. "here's the prioritized list.  only work on things at the top"
2018-09-19T16:09:07 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-19T16:16:41 < qyx> pyqt is unable to load svg icons on windows
2018-09-19T16:16:45 < qyx> anyone faced similar problem?
2018-09-19T16:16:47 < qyx> zyp: ^
2018-09-19T16:17:00 < zyp> dunno, haven't tried loading svg icons
2018-09-19T16:17:24 < qyx> maybe I should just yolo and convert them to png all
2018-09-19T16:18:33 < zyp> https://forum.qt.io/topic/3563/no-icons-when-deploy-application-using-svg-files <- something like this maybe?
2018-09-19T16:18:46 < zyp> tl;dr: make sure you've got all deps
2018-09-19T16:21:31 < qyx> looks like it
2018-09-19T16:22:39 < zyp> try QtGui.QImageReader.supportedImageFormats(), check if it lists svg
2018-09-19T16:22:41 < zyp> it does here
2018-09-19T16:23:13 < jadew> should I get this or the siglent? https://www.keysight.com/en/pdx-2935714-pn-UXR1102A/110-ghz-2-channel-uxr-series-real-time-infiniium-oscilloscope?cc=US&lc=eng
2018-09-19T16:23:30 < dongs> you can tell who subscribes to retarded jewtubers
2018-09-19T16:23:34 < dongs> just by the links they paste
2018-09-19T16:23:41 < jadew> hah
2018-09-19T16:23:47 < jadew> someone pasted it before?
2018-09-19T16:23:54 < dongs> like a week ago yes
2018-09-19T16:24:30 < jadew> 1.3 million, that's how much it costs
2018-09-19T16:26:16 < jadew> I'll wait until they get dumped on ebay for 2k a piece
2018-09-19T16:26:50 < zyp> fuck pdfs with hundreds of pages and no toc
2018-09-19T16:33:02 < dongs> must be a mac problem
2018-09-19T16:33:07 < dongs> i have no issues wiht them on acrobat
2018-09-19T16:33:14 < dongs> infact I cant think of any time i actually used a toc
2018-09-19T16:33:17 < Thorn> only 2 channels? amateur hour
2018-09-19T16:33:22 < dongs> is that the shit that comes up on the side?
2018-09-19T16:33:26 < Thorn> there is acrobat for mac
2018-09-19T16:33:37 < zyp> dongs, I'm using windows now, don't see how that's relevant
2018-09-19T16:33:47 < dongs> what retarded reader are you using then
2018-09-19T16:33:51 < dongs> that its giving you problems
2018-09-19T16:33:55 < qyx> it doesnt matter
2018-09-19T16:34:07 < qyx> if a pdf lacks toc I am unable to navigate properly
2018-09-19T16:34:27 < qyx> like I am not willing to find a page manually or clicking on a toc inside
2018-09-19T16:34:47 < dongs> ctrlF works... and is way faster
2018-09-19T16:34:50 < zyp> it's not about readers, it's about the pdf
2018-09-19T16:35:11 < dongs> toc is not searchable... the one inside PDF on the other hand, is
2018-09-19T16:36:01 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/qM9Vbw1.png you talkin about this?
2018-09-19T16:36:14 < zyp> yes
2018-09-19T16:36:21 < dongs> yeah i've never used it
2018-09-19T16:36:26 < dongs> if PDF opens it by default its the first thing I close
2018-09-19T16:36:31 < zyp> haha
2018-09-19T16:37:13 < kakimir> what is the cheapest mcu you know with i2c?
2018-09-19T16:37:21 < zyp> stm32h7
2018-09-19T16:37:30 < kakimir> yeah
2018-09-19T16:38:35 < englishman> stm8s003
2018-09-19T16:39:04 < kakimir> is i2c any fun in 8bit avr?
2018-09-19T16:39:19 < dongs> anything with 2 gpio
2018-09-19T16:39:52 < zyp> kakimir, worked well enough last time I did it
2018-09-19T16:40:01 < zyp> although 8bit avr isn't much fun overall
2018-09-19T16:40:35 < kakimir> how much the i2c base code took about of the flash?
2018-09-19T16:40:42 < dongs> wut
2018-09-19T16:40:49 < dongs> its literally like 2? or 3 registers
2018-09-19T16:40:57 < kakimir> I mean program code
2018-09-19T16:41:00 < zyp> yeah, I just poked at a few registers
2018-09-19T16:41:04 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-19T16:41:07 < zyp> didn't take much code
2018-09-19T16:41:10 < Thorn> kakimir: lpc8xx should be < $1 and has i2c drivers in rom
2018-09-19T16:41:24 < kakimir> I hate them rom drivers
2018-09-19T16:41:31 < zyp> IIRC it has some sort of state machine in hardware, seemed to work pretty reliably
2018-09-19T16:41:35 < kakimir> and also lpc8xx is big iirc
2018-09-19T16:41:36 < Thorn> and up to 4(!) i2c cores, no idea why so many
2018-09-19T16:41:41 < Thorn> qfn
2018-09-19T16:41:59 < Thorn> and tssop
2018-09-19T16:42:02 < karlp> because it's a serial engine? is it just four serial periphs, no matter what you use them for?
2018-09-19T16:42:02 < zyp> so anyway, are you doing slave or master?
2018-09-19T16:42:18 < Thorn> no they are dedicated i2c
2018-09-19T16:42:32 < Thorn> spi and uarts are separate
2018-09-19T16:43:37 < Thorn> 3 uarts, 2 spi, 4 i2c (one is FM+ with dedicated pins)
2018-09-19T16:43:41 < Thorn> in lpc824
2018-09-19T16:44:20 < karlp> bleh, strcmp(null, x) is undefined.
2018-09-19T16:45:33 < zyp> like any other function expecting you to pass a valid pointer
2018-09-19T16:45:55 < karlp> fuck that, now I've got to handle it all, I just want it to return false :)
2018-09-19T16:46:35 < zyp> I didn't think strcmp returns false, just equal, lower, higher
2018-09-19T16:46:51 < karlp> lower or higher would be fine.
2018-09-19T16:46:56 < kakimir> is 0.4mm balling doable?
2018-09-19T16:46:57 < karlp> segfault not so desireable
2018-09-19T16:47:04 < dongs> wjat'
2018-09-19T16:47:07 < dongs> s a ball
2018-09-19T16:47:09 < kakimir> I'm looking at balled attiny20
2018-09-19T16:47:24 < kakimir> ???‘?""??#***????#;&?!!?+?????&#*?~?!!?
2018-09-19T16:47:24 < kakimir> ???????&#;&?!!???????j;???>??????????????k??
2018-09-19T16:47:29 < zyp> you'll just ball it up
2018-09-19T16:47:38 < kakimir> fucking pdf
2018-09-19T16:48:58 < kakimir> 12-ball 1.555 x 1.403 0.40mm pitch 4x6 staggered array
2018-09-19T16:49:13 < dongs> thats huge
2018-09-19T16:49:14 < zyp> sounds like "go fuck yourself"
2018-09-19T16:51:30 < zyp> I don't understand what "1.555 x 1.403" is supposed to mean
2018-09-19T16:51:49 < dongs> size in mm
2018-09-19T16:51:50 < dongs> obviosuly
2018-09-19T16:51:50 < zyp> can't be body in mm, you're not gonna fit 4x6 balls under there
2018-09-19T16:51:54 < dongs> it is
2018-09-19T16:51:57 < dongs> at 0.4mm you sure can
2018-09-19T16:52:12 < dongs> they're staggered
2018-09-19T16:52:28 < zyp> 6*0.4 is 2.4
2018-09-19T16:52:46 < zyp> uh
2018-09-19T16:53:08 < dongs> its 3x4 apparently
2018-09-19T16:53:23 < karlp> it's 4x3 balls on 6 virtual ball positions
2018-09-19T16:53:25 < karlp> yeah
2018-09-19T16:53:27 < dongs> yeah that
2018-09-19T16:53:34 < karlp> 12 balls, not 4x6 balls.
2018-09-19T16:53:41 < dongs> they count each stagger as empty ball space
2018-09-19T16:53:43 < karlp> 4x6 array positions
2018-09-19T16:53:56 < karlp> A5,3,1 B6,4,2
2018-09-19T16:54:08 < zyp> ah, found the DS
2018-09-19T16:54:14 < dongs> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/Atmel-8235-8-bit-AVR-Microcontroller-ATtiny20_Datasheet_Summary.pdf page 13
2018-09-19T16:54:17 < Thorn> half of the balls on the bottom, other half on top
2018-09-19T16:54:17 < dongs> didn't even need a TOC
2018-09-19T16:54:21 < dongs> been looking at it for last minute+
2018-09-19T16:55:02  * karlp went straight to the ToC :)
2018-09-19T16:55:17 < dongs> i pressed end and pgup like 3 times
2018-09-19T16:55:19 < dongs> and i was at the darwing
2018-09-19T16:55:25 < dongs> drawing, too
2018-09-19T16:55:47 < zyp> 3x4 is easy enough, there's only two inner pads
2018-09-19T16:56:13 < zyp> gnd is one of those though, but you can just run gnd through one of the bordering pads
2018-09-19T16:56:30 < zyp> and not bother with vias at all
2018-09-19T16:57:59 < jadew> that's a neat little chip
2018-09-19T17:16:47 < aandrew> lol @ "empty ball space"
2018-09-19T17:17:35 < kakimir> and those GPIOs can drive 20mA led
2018-09-19T17:17:38 < kakimir> if needed
2018-09-19T17:17:44 < aandrew> most MCUs can do that
2018-09-19T17:17:49 < kakimir> nah man
2018-09-19T17:17:58 < aandrew> just be careful - most devices can do 20mA per pin, but have a max current well under that per PORT
2018-09-19T17:18:07 < kakimir> most mcus can use some of their pins to do that
2018-09-19T17:18:14 < aandrew> e.g. 20mA per pin, but the 8 bit port can olnly source/sink 100mA or something
2018-09-19T17:18:24 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-19T17:18:27 < kakimir> it is in the datasheet
2018-09-19T17:18:30 < aandrew> kakimir: maybe I'm just old, but every PIC/AVR has been able to do heavy current on its I/O
2018-09-19T17:18:43 < kakimir> that is what I mean
2018-09-19T17:19:08 < kakimir> and also that you need to try a little to actually destroy one
2018-09-19T17:19:28 < kakimir> it's build like a tank
2018-09-19T17:19:58 < kakimir> friend said he accidentally powered AVR with 8-9volts or so and it survived
2018-09-19T17:20:09 < kakimir> 12v it didn't
2018-09-19T17:20:53 < aandrew> dongs: totally offtopic: http://climalocsolutions.com/solutions/garage-door/cf20168/ look at the line drawing at the bottom. see that "snap in" cover that hides the channel where you screw the hting to the wall? think I can find a chinacorp to make that snap in cover in clear plastic?
2018-09-19T17:21:22 < kakimir> and he said he casually powers AVRs with 5v +-1.5V just throw some voltage at it and start working
2018-09-19T17:22:30 < dongs> i doubt it
2018-09-19T17:22:36 < dongs> why do you awent it clear
2018-09-19T17:22:40 < dongs> to see wires inside or something?
2018-09-19T17:22:49 < aandrew> I want to run a strip of ws2812 led strip down that channel 
2018-09-19T17:22:57 < dongs> got a better idea
2018-09-19T17:23:13 < dongs> screw it in, lay the leds in, and fill that shit up with sillycoon
2018-09-19T17:23:19 < dongs> and done
2018-09-19T17:23:37 < aandrew> well my LED strip is IP67 so it's already protected from environment
2018-09-19T17:23:45 < dongs> sure, but thats not what its for
2018-09-19T17:23:46 < aandrew> I'm just looking more to make it look less of a hack
2018-09-19T17:24:22 < dongs> from the drawing it looks like if yo udon't care about actually latching it, you could jsut lay a narrow strip of acrylic/whatever over it
2018-09-19T17:24:43 < aandrew> that is an even better idea
2018-09-19T17:24:59 < aandrew> just a 1" strip of any kind of clear plastic 
2018-09-19T17:25:05 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-19T17:25:19 < aandrew> I bet I could even find clear plastic that is the right thickness to slide into the rail that this clips in to
2018-09-19T17:25:25 < aandrew> damn that is brilliant
2018-09-19T17:30:02 < aandrew> https://www.eplastics.com/ACR-250X1-000 something like that in fact
2018-09-19T17:30:44 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-19T17:41:27 < englishman> aandrew those seals are extruded so you will have to get a mould and buy like 50k feet prolly
2018-09-19T17:41:59 < aandrew> yeah I know it's extruded, I was just loking for something similar to fit, dongs put me on the right path
2018-09-19T17:42:05 < englishman> hotglue
2018-09-19T17:42:37 < aandrew> no it has to look good at the end, a strip of translucent (not even clear) UV safe plastic will work
2018-09-19T17:42:45 < aandrew> so that's plexiglass/acrylic or PC
2018-09-19T17:43:08 < karlp> this is a flap on the outside of what, a gararage door that pivots or a roller or what? I don't get it.
2018-09-19T17:43:16 < karlp> obviosuly not enough garages in my life.
2018-09-19T17:43:20 < aandrew> karlp: it's weather stripping for a garage
2018-09-19T17:43:24 < englishman> looks like it could snap right in
2018-09-19T17:43:37 < aandrew> it goes on the outside and just keeps the wind from getting in around the garage edges
2018-09-19T17:43:40 < aandrew> door edges
2018-09-19T17:43:49 < aandrew> think of regular weatherstripping on any normal exterior door
2018-09-19T17:43:55 < aandrew> englishman: yes exactly
2018-09-19T17:44:08 < karlp> yeah, when I've dealt with it, it' sbeen part of the door.
2018-09-19T17:44:20 < karlp> I don't get this screed to the frame on a garage door
2018-09-19T17:44:23 < aandrew> the extruded piece does snap in, but I can actually slide it in from the top "under" the lip that the real piece snaps in to
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2018-09-19T17:47:17 < englishman> >hi i need pricing for x and for 10x pcs
2018-09-19T17:47:26 < englishman> >ok here is your pricing for 10x and 50x pieces
2018-09-19T17:48:09 < englishman> ublox USA is so slow i have china-market modules in hand before they even confirm reception of PO
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2018-09-19T17:50:08 < aandrew> englishman: yep I find that a lot
2018-09-19T17:50:13 < aandrew> man 
2018-09-19T17:50:14 < aandrew> thank you dongs
2018-09-19T17:50:31 < aandrew> I am now looking for frosted PC or plexiglass strips, so much easier to find this shit
2018-09-19T17:58:24 < englishman> just get sheet and rip them on a tablesaw with a thin blade
2018-09-19T18:04:22 < karlp> is this for christmas light animation stuff? this is going up the left/right/top sides of your door?
2018-09-19T18:08:00 < englishman> he wants to illuminate all the shit in his garage in RGB to make it easier for niggers to steal his shit
2018-09-19T18:12:32 < Thorn> TIL about Morsun, e.g. https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Power-Modules_B0505LS-1WR3_C131035.html
2018-09-19T18:12:44 < aandrew> englishman: yeah there's a company in toronto (plasticworld.ca) that looks like they can do it for me
2018-09-19T18:13:06 < Thorn> englishman: video from the other channel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hN7ElUijKkU
2018-09-19T18:13:15 < aandrew> just asking them for a quote and what frosted plastic they'd recommend in 1.25-2.5mm thickness and able to withstand direct sunlight without turning to shit
2018-09-19T18:13:42 < dongs> Thorn: morsun is oldschool
2018-09-19T18:13:47 < englishman> ty Thorn 
2018-09-19T18:13:49 < aandrew> wtf is it with russians and pumas
2018-09-19T18:13:53 < dongs> those isolated 5V>5V shits are very common
2018-09-19T18:14:03 < dongs> and cloned by everyone
2018-09-19T18:15:21 < Thorn> well it's one of the cheapest @ lcsc 
2018-09-19T18:15:50 < Thorn> and it's not no-name
2018-09-19T18:16:00 < aandrew> oh this plasticworld.ca has all kinds of shit I want
2018-09-19T18:16:08 < aandrew> acetone, CA, nice
2018-09-19T18:16:23 < Thorn> apparently even genuine st-link ISOL has a morsun in it
2018-09-19T18:21:26 < Thorn> what is the topology in these modules? flyback?
2018-09-19T18:21:46 < dongs> flycack
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2018-09-19T18:36:19 < Thorn> are there china digital isolators similar to e.g. adum32xx?
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2018-09-19T18:40:10 < karlp> silabs are way cheaper.
2018-09-19T18:40:29 < karlp> I feel like we've had this conversation before...
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2018-09-19T18:51:29 < ds2> ~~
2018-09-19T18:52:52 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/2lzegVC
2018-09-19T18:55:26 < Thorn> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Immersion-gold-5V-TTL-to-RS485-isolation-module-485-TO-TTL-module-ADI-ADUM3201-chip-MORNSUN/32845096943.html
2018-09-19T18:56:10 < Thorn> aandrew: and LTDC, and RMII
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2018-09-19T19:00:19 < karlp> whatðs the hc04 for?
2018-09-19T19:00:51 < karlp> sneaky leds on the isolated side?
2018-09-19T19:01:49 < karlp> oh, they're doing auto direction change too.
2018-09-19T19:01:54 < Thorn> dunno but there is no external direction signal 
2018-09-19T19:01:58 < Thorn> yeah
2018-09-19T19:02:49 < Thorn> what is the big white thing to the right of the polyfuses?
2018-09-19T19:03:09 < dongs> cap
2018-09-19T19:03:27 < Thorn> why cap between A and B
2018-09-19T19:03:48 < karlp> what are the bel727? aren't those polyfuses? too?
2018-09-19T19:04:22 < Thorn> tvs?
2018-09-19T19:04:32 < karlp> yeah, guess.
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2018-09-19T19:16:21 < Thorn> I need an isolated usb-uart board
2018-09-19T19:16:50 < Thorn> where is my altium disaster
2018-09-19T19:16:53 < karlp> Thorn: same shop you found that rs485 isolated module has a bunch of other isolated stuff
2018-09-19T19:17:20 < karlp> those stairs look rad superbia 
2018-09-19T19:18:49 < karlp> people who will use them for hanging out areas,
2018-09-19T19:18:53 < karlp> I take it this is a school?
2018-09-19T19:19:37 < Thorn> yanking a leopard's tail https://www.instagram.com/p/Bn6Z4unFXGW/
2018-09-19T19:25:04 < aandrew> oh yeah, rmii si all over too
2018-09-19T19:25:10 < aandrew> I haven't done LTDC on STM32
2018-09-19T19:25:47 < Thorn> I wonder how it simplifies chip layout if at all lol
2018-09-19T19:29:07 < dongs> yeah i hafev no idea why periperhals are at such random places 
2018-09-19T19:29:14 < dongs> SDRAM, LDTC are all fucking over the place
2018-09-19T19:29:15 < dongs> garbage
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2018-09-19T19:39:48 < Thorn> <Thorn>	what is the big white thing to the right of the polyfuses?
2018-09-19T19:39:55 < Thorn> maybe http://www.littelfuse.com/products/gas-discharge-tubes/squared-gdt.aspx ?
2018-09-19T19:43:22 < Sadale> What's Gas Discharge Tubes?
2018-09-19T19:43:46 < Sadale> I think I've also seen it in some boards. But I have no idea on what it does
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2018-09-19T19:52:19 < Streaker> Same as a TVS diode
2018-09-19T19:52:36 < karlp> Streaker: so why they got both?
2018-09-19T19:53:18 < Streaker> No idea. GDTs are an older technology. They're also much more rugged.
2018-09-19T19:54:45 < Streaker> Just looked at that ali link. That's not a GDT.
2018-09-19T19:54:45 < Thorn> fig. 2 https://www.mornsun-power.com/uploads/pdf/TD521S485H.pdf
2018-09-19T19:55:22 < Thorn> 3 TVS + a GDT
2018-09-19T19:55:54 < Thorn> and a common mode choke
2018-09-19T20:01:37 < Streaker> One reason why you might use a GDT is when you don't want to load the signal you are protecting.
2018-09-19T20:01:51 < karlp> Thorn: that's pretty cute module, what's that costing?
2018-09-19T20:01:52 < Streaker> GDTs have extremely low capacitance.
2018-09-19T20:02:14 < Streaker> But paralleling them with TVS diodes negates that.
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2018-09-19T20:11:40 < aandrew> GDTs are nice but slow
2018-09-19T20:11:50 < aandrew> use them in addition to low-capacitance TVSes to take the edge off
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2018-09-19T20:21:10 < invzim> whoa, new scope from keysight
2018-09-19T20:21:18 < invzim> UXR1104A Infiniium UXR-Series Oscilloscope: 110 GHz, 4 Channels 
2018-09-19T20:22:08 < invzim> what kind of tech would you need this for, radar stuff?
2018-09-19T20:22:11 < karlp> damn man.
2018-09-19T20:22:17 < karlp> you're numbe 3 this week
2018-09-19T20:23:45 < dongs> lol
2018-09-19T20:23:47 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-19T20:23:49 < dongs> fucking aids
2018-09-19T20:24:24 < dongs> i wish youtube would fucking go away
2018-09-19T20:24:38 < invzim> I wish I could turn off the annoying miniplayer
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2018-09-19T20:29:46 < catphish> great noob question, is there a timer in the stm32 that's always running that i can use for simple delay loops?
2018-09-19T20:30:02 < catphish> without having to set up a separate timer
2018-09-19T20:30:38 < englishman> dongs, does your shitty china bms have bluetooths hit
2018-09-19T20:31:19 < kakimir> catphish: tick?
2018-09-19T20:31:41 < kakimir> you need to configure it though
2018-09-19T20:32:27 < catphish> SysTick? that sounds appropriate
2018-09-19T20:32:41 < kakimir> it has quite limited configurability
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2018-09-19T20:54:30 < icee> Has anyone had any luck with servicing USB by polling instead of an interrupt?
2018-09-19T20:54:41 < icee> calling the IRQ handler once per millisecond doesnt' seem good enough
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2018-09-19T21:06:11 < catphish> kakimir: systick timer does the job perfectly :)
2018-09-19T21:06:19 < catphish> thanks
2018-09-19T21:06:38 < catphish> Cracki: i went simple and just count cpu cycles
2018-09-19T21:09:16 < catphish> gives me up to 8 seconds of sleep which is more than enough
2018-09-19T21:22:25 < kakimir> why would my USB A plug using device need 30V vbus tolerance?
2018-09-19T21:23:16 < kakimir> these usb charger detecting usb switches advertise about 28V or 30V tolerance in VBUS and OVP functionality
2018-09-19T21:23:44 < kakimir> something about usb3 or so
2018-09-19T21:23:49 < kakimir> do I need to care?
2018-09-19T21:24:02 < emeb> chargers have crappy regulation
2018-09-19T21:24:05 < kakimir> TVS
2018-09-19T21:24:36 < emeb> w/ no load they can go pretty high, so the first component that sees them needs to be able to handle that overshoot until the load pulls it down.
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2018-09-19T21:28:25 < Ultrasauce> and yeah 20V usb charging is a thing now
2018-09-19T21:28:37 < Ultrasauce> kakimir are you telling me you didnt read that 500 page spec yet? get on it
2018-09-19T21:28:50 < kakimir> but you know
2018-09-19T21:29:07 < kakimir> usb2.0 devices should not be 20v tolerant or should they?
2018-09-19T21:29:21 < kakimir> I mean legacy and all
2018-09-19T21:29:24 < ds2> USB3 has special charger pins
2018-09-19T21:29:37 < ds2> for those pesky power hogging laptops
2018-09-19T21:29:51 < kakimir> my device has USB A plug
2018-09-19T21:29:54 < kakimir> and
2018-09-19T21:30:00 < kakimir> not usb3
2018-09-19T21:34:43 < ds2> look at the USB2 specs?
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2018-09-19T21:51:42 < catphish> Cracki: the systick is 24 bit, and i'm running at 2MHz
2018-09-19T21:52:28 < catphish> i'm running a l0 and minimizing power use, but 2MHz is just the default clock config :)
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2018-09-19T22:47:14 < kakimir> movie recommds?
2018-09-19T22:47:23 < kakimir> anyone else sick?
2018-09-19T22:48:25 < kakimir> seasonal flu
2018-09-19T22:48:30 < emeb> ugh
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2018-09-19T22:51:04 < kakimir> Steffanx: have you seen "terminator bridge"?
2018-09-19T22:55:46 < effractur> a/win 25
2018-09-19T22:56:12 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRiduhtiV38
2018-09-19T22:57:14 < kakimir> I think the idea might to be usefulness in road to bridge conversion
2018-09-19T22:57:42 < kakimir> it takes just a day or so to remove solid bridge
2018-09-19T22:58:04 < kakimir> while that thing is already installed earlier
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2018-09-19T23:01:02 < Steffanx>    lol no kakimir
2018-09-19T23:01:07 < Steffanx> i never come in that part of dutchland
2018-09-19T23:02:41 < englishman> whoa that bridge is cool as hell
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2018-09-19T23:03:27 < Steffanx> money wasting art project
2018-09-19T23:04:38 < englishman> as if you were going to do anything cooler with that money
2018-09-19T23:05:03 < Steffanx> that bridge is not cool so.. cant be hard to do something cooler
2018-09-19T23:05:07 < Steffanx> but keil for example
2018-09-19T23:05:09 < Steffanx> *buy
2018-09-19T23:05:18 < BrainDamage> so you'd rather spend the money separately on art and bridges?
2018-09-19T23:05:34 < BrainDamage> get a mundane bridge, and say a  fancy statue
2018-09-19T23:05:57 < Steffanx> perhaps
2018-09-19T23:06:30 < kakimir> Steffanx: I think I saw one that spinned that part of road it was holding
2018-09-19T23:07:23 < BrainDamage> i think the main annoyance is that it's slow, otherwise, meh
2018-09-19T23:08:02 < Steffanx> lol BrainDamage.
2018-09-19T23:08:10 < Steffanx> just check what wikipedia says about it "A tail bridge can quickly and efficiently be raised and lowered from one pylon (instead of hinges). This quickly allows water traffic to pass while only briefly blocking road traffic."
2018-09-19T23:08:43 < englishman> sounds like all problems are solved
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2018-09-19T23:09:08 < englishman> engineering and artistic victory
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2018-09-19T23:09:10 < Steffanx> welcome englishman, how is your day so far
2018-09-19T23:09:26 < englishman> that big square will fit a swastika nicely when germany invades you again, too
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2018-09-19T23:09:32 < BrainDamage> that's the generic advantage, not that specific one
2018-09-19T23:09:43 < englishman> doing great steffy how about yourself
2018-09-19T23:09:44 < BrainDamage> also, it seems to me the baseplate rotates
2018-09-19T23:10:00 < Steffanx> good, but its almost over
2018-09-19T23:10:08 < Steffanx> nah its specificly mentions it for this bridge BrainDamage
2018-09-19T23:10:30 < Steffanx> the dutch version even says it a bit differently. As if this bridge goes super fast.
2018-09-19T23:10:41 < BrainDamage> I don't see how single hinge makes it faster
2018-09-19T23:10:47 < BrainDamage> if anything, it should be the opposite
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2018-09-19T23:10:57 < englishman> some other guys are quoting 4-5 weeks leadtime on this dumb project
2018-09-19T23:10:58 < BrainDamage> double hinge means the motors only need to handle half the load
2018-09-19T23:11:08 < englishman> 50 boards for like $10k
2018-09-19T23:11:17 < englishman> i can do it in 2 weeks
2018-09-19T23:11:18 < BrainDamage> it's night here
2018-09-19T23:11:26 < BrainDamage> not to mention, not good
2018-09-19T23:11:47 < englishman> why the fuck arent you good BrainDamage
2018-09-19T23:12:04 < BrainDamage> because my life is a pile of shit eversince I was born
2018-09-19T23:12:14 < englishman> that simply not true tho
2018-09-19T23:12:16 < Steffanx> lol, its what you make of it sir BrainDamage
2018-09-19T23:12:34 < englishman> when was the last time you bombed down some steep ass italian mountain on your bicycle
2018-09-19T23:12:36 < Steffanx> locally they like table bridges much BrainDamage . Which sucks arse because they tend to get stuck all the time.
2018-09-19T23:12:41 < Steffanx> but that might be just bad dutch engineering
2018-09-19T23:12:53 < BrainDamage> ah yes, all you have to do is is magically make your father not an abusive asshole that beats you and your mother to blood
2018-09-19T23:13:09 < Steffanx> im sorry BrainDamage
2018-09-19T23:13:12 < englishman> jesus BrainDamage
2018-09-19T23:13:34 < englishman> thats some heavy shit for afternoon irc
2018-09-19T23:13:42 < englishman> did you get the fuck out
2018-09-19T23:13:43 < BrainDamage> sorry, I am drunk
2018-09-19T23:14:15 < englishman> maybe it is time for a months-long introspective vacation in a warm place
2018-09-19T23:26:33 < aandrew> dont' think I have to length match the SDRAM (SDR) traces
2018-09-19T23:26:45 < aandrew> nothing about it in the datasheet and the min setup is 0.8ns
2018-09-19T23:27:07 < aandrew> it takes around 5.9ps to travel a mm, so 0.8ns means I ahve about 135mm of trace length difference before it becomes an issue
2018-09-19T23:27:10 < aandrew> I'm at 18mm
2018-09-19T23:29:09 < BrainDamage> single or double edge?
2018-09-19T23:32:12 < aandrew> SDR not DDR
2018-09-19T23:34:03 < BrainDamage> then yes, you have plenty of margin
2018-09-19T23:36:42 < aandrew> that's what I thought -- and that's not ocunting the delay that the FPGA can add to any of those signals to compensate
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2018-09-20T02:16:36 < aandrew> tct?
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2018-09-20T03:05:13 < englishman> all my reflow problems are GONE
2018-09-20T03:05:19 < englishman> thanks to Steffanx and Pico Technologies
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2018-09-20T03:22:30 < Laurenceb124> loicense https://imgoat.com/uploads/8f15eda80c/150003.png
2018-09-20T03:38:31 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/8f15eda80c/150012.jpg
2018-09-20T03:43:10 < aandrew> wtf altium, so many things but no differential pair impedance based routing
2018-09-20T03:43:14 < aandrew> have to do it manually and plug it in
2018-09-20T03:44:32 < jadew> Laurenceb123, is there something we're supposed to see there?
2018-09-20T03:44:56 < jadew> or it's just the dick craving chick?
2018-09-20T03:46:31 < jadew> aandrew, just like kicad
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2018-09-20T03:55:13 < Laurenceb124> jadew: nazi alba
2018-09-20T03:55:24 < Laurenceb124> someone shopped it
2018-09-20T03:55:38 < Laurenceb124> Chris Hanson .gif  https://imgoat.com/uploads/8f15eda80c/150025.jpg
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2018-09-20T04:12:54 < jadew> what's the difference between VDFN and VQFN?
2018-09-20T04:13:01 < jadew> DFN = leads only on two sides?
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2018-09-20T04:33:52 < englishman> dual flat no-lead
2018-09-20T04:33:53 < englishman> yes
2018-09-20T04:33:56 < englishman> q = quad
2018-09-20T04:36:55 < jadew> thanks
2018-09-20T04:46:23 < Laurenceb124> when u look up some conference proceedings and the conference was at the same conference center as the emdrive convention
2018-09-20T04:46:26 < Laurenceb124> my sides
2018-09-20T04:48:14 < jadew> didn't you say the emdrive was killed?
2018-09-20T04:51:11 < Laurenceb124> yes
2018-09-20T04:51:29 < Laurenceb124> Estes park, the home of wacky shit
2018-09-20T04:54:19 < Laurenceb124> wew Jordan Peterson is on bbc again
2018-09-20T04:54:51 < Laurenceb124> sold 150k copied of his book just in england
2018-09-20T04:55:49 < Laurenceb124> he must be multimillionare just from book sales
2018-09-20T04:55:55 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-20T04:56:53 < Laurenceb124> setting record for longest time in top 10 book list
2018-09-20T04:57:15 < Laurenceb124> britbongs confirmed as alt-right
2018-09-20T04:58:43  * Laurenceb124 zzz
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2018-09-20T05:17:20 < jadew> lmfao, I changed my mind on an action that needed confirmation in kicad and the cancel button doesn't do anything
2018-09-20T05:17:58 < jadew> nor does the X button, my only option is to kill it or go ahead with the action (re-assigning all references)
2018-09-20T05:20:55 < aandrew> my favourite is when I am trying to delete a track and it selects the part and I end up deleting the fpga or something
2018-09-20T05:21:02 < aandrew> done that a half dozen times so far
2018-09-20T05:22:15 < jadew> at least it's not eagle
2018-09-20T05:51:37 < englishman> why not lock the part when it's places
2018-09-20T05:51:41 < englishman> placed
2018-09-20T05:51:48 < englishman> or disable component selection
2018-09-20T05:51:59 < englishman> super ez in new side menu
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2018-09-20T06:58:35 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/KnGpHbi 42% done, I think the absolute worst of it is behind me now
2018-09-20T06:58:38 < aandrew> the FPGA and STM32 are more or less completely fanned out, might have some fun trying to get some of those remainign signals out now, but they're all the low frequency/low change kind of signals so they can be stupid
2018-09-20T07:00:26 < aandrew> it does look like I'll be able to reduce the length of the board by 2-4cm
2018-09-20T07:12:33 < jadew> aandrew, are those boards the same?
2018-09-20T07:12:47 < aandrew> that is one board
2018-09-20T07:12:52 < aandrew> 5 subcircuits
2018-09-20T07:12:55 < jadew> ah, got it
2018-09-20T07:13:18 < jadew> looks the same tho
2018-09-20T07:13:39 < jadew> same subcircuit?
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2018-09-20T07:14:11 < jadew> cuz if you're routing them all at the same time and it's the same thing, I think there's an easier way of doing it
2018-09-20T07:14:36 < aandrew> yes, identical
2018-09-20T07:14:37 < jadew> I remember seeing exactly this scenario in an altium presentation, where they just routed one subcircuit and then multiplied it
2018-09-20T07:14:43 < aandrew> those 5 red boxes are rooms
2018-09-20T07:14:52 < aandrew> you lay out one, then copy the position and routing to the other four
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2018-09-20T07:18:29 < jadew> what I'd want from kicad is a way to copy layout from one project to another
2018-09-20T07:19:20 < jadew> or at least save land patterns by themselves and with footprints
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2018-09-20T07:27:21 < jadew> looks like you can copy layouts from other boards :D
2018-09-20T07:31:23 < englishman> kicad: for cloners
2018-09-20T07:32:49 < Thorn> my rs-485 isolation ckt costs $2.5
2018-09-20T07:38:06 < englishman> aka the price of a 0402 ceramic in 2025
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2018-09-20T08:47:59 < Steffanx>  \o/ englishman 
2018-09-20T08:48:17 < Steffanx> Dont forget your great ebuy bargain
2018-09-20T08:48:52 < englishman> no more bargains from that guy so far :(
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2018-09-20T09:27:53 < zyp> aandrew, what's that?
2018-09-20T09:28:03 < zyp> and is that SMAs?
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2018-09-20T09:59:40 < Thorn> how do I flyback
2018-09-20T09:59:46 < Thorn> 30->5V 1A cheap
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2018-09-20T10:40:20 < Thorn> what is "output current (min)" in the "Selection Guide" table https://www.mornsun-power.com/uploads/pdf/B05_LS-1WR3.pdf ?
2018-09-20T10:40:52 < Thorn> does it mean I need a resistor // to the load?
2018-09-20T11:07:26 < qyx> usually such modules don't have any feedback
2018-09-20T11:07:39 < qyx> if you do not load them the voltage rises
2018-09-20T11:08:55 < qyx> I saw a zener in one appnote
2018-09-20T11:10:04 < qyx> eg. 6V2 for 5V output.. but adjust it to not destroy the rs485 driver if it goes into some low power mode
2018-09-20T11:10:08 < qyx> or what are you doing
2018-09-20T11:11:41 < qyx> btw if there is a mcu available, I would just use two complementary timer outputs, 2 n-mosfets and a cheap transformer
2018-09-20T11:12:45 < qyx> I tried those modules, a dedicated transformer driver a was not satisfied with either one
2018-09-20T11:12:50 < qyx> *and
2018-09-20T11:16:37 < Thorn> hmmmmm
2018-09-20T11:18:48 < Thorn> of course a rs-485 driver will eat < 10 mA in RX mode, not to mention any low power modes
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2018-09-20T12:13:29 < karlp> Thorn: is that the mornsun isolated module? not bad price.
2018-09-20T12:14:04 < Thorn> https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Power-Modules_B0505LS-1WR3_C131035.html
2018-09-20T12:18:27 < karlp> why do you need a second isolated supply?
2018-09-20T12:23:19 < zyp> presumably for the remote side of an isolated RS485 transceiver, so it doesn't have to be supplied externally
2018-09-20T12:23:30 < jadew> I found LeelooMinai
2018-09-20T12:23:59 < Thorn> yes for isolated rs-485
2018-09-20T12:24:58 < jadew> she's alive
2018-09-20T12:29:53 < qyx> on .ro?
2018-09-20T12:30:21 < jadew> no, found her commenting on a recording of a live eevblog stream
2018-09-20T12:32:03 < karlp> Thorn: wasns't that module you linked yesterday already isolated? 
2018-09-20T12:32:43 < Thorn> lcsc has those modules listed but with very low stock levels
2018-09-20T12:33:21 < karlp> so, are you going to find out from mornsun or others if that's a problem, or are you just going ot redesign it without even checking?
2018-09-20T12:34:28 < karlp> heh, nfc tag eval, needs a battery: https://www.mouser.com/new/stmicroelectronics/stm-steval-smartag1-board/?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=elq-18.0920-stmicro-nfcsensortag-supplier-emea-en&utm_source=eloqua&subid=68f4054d1ed94a7890120bc664f503ed&utm_content=6740119
2018-09-20T12:34:48 < karlp> target applications, "Batteryless sensing"
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2018-09-20T14:22:21 < jadew> maybe they meant senseless
2018-09-20T14:27:19 < zyp> from what I can see, it can work both with and without battery
2018-09-20T14:27:52 < zyp> for an evalboard that can be used for various application, I don't see having both possibilities as contradictions
2018-09-20T14:30:31 < karlp> no, I know, I'm just teasing 
2018-09-20T14:30:43 < karlp> theyv'e got allsorts on that board that you don't need for all applications
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2018-09-20T15:47:14 < Laurenceb124> https://i.imgur.com/LAA7bGk.jpg
2018-09-20T15:47:30 < Thorn> looks like mouser doesn't sell stm32 with hw crypto in Europe either (tried .nl and .no proxies)
2018-09-20T15:48:07 < Thorn> fun fact: f7/h7 value lines (750 etc.) all have hw crypto lol
2018-09-20T15:58:24 < kakimir> I'm having my first sick day of in my life
2018-09-20T16:15:24 < kakimir> I don't get work hours though
2018-09-20T16:15:55 < kakimir> because few years back sick day offs were changed so that first day is not covered
2018-09-20T16:31:03 < Steffanx> Hah
2018-09-20T16:31:13 < Steffanx> Here all sick hours are paid 
2018-09-20T16:31:37 < Steffanx> No effect on vacation days either
2018-09-20T16:31:53 < Steffanx> Better, when you get sick during your holidays you can call in sick
2018-09-20T16:32:08 < Steffanx> No not was holidays with sickness
2018-09-20T16:33:22 < aandrew> zyp: it digitizes five linear arrays and no, they're MCX
2018-09-20T16:36:13 < karlp> Thorn: sucks, mouser used to do some of the ones that digikey wouldn't
2018-09-20T16:36:33 < karlp> so outdated, who the fuck do they think i sstill on an encryption export control list?!
2018-09-20T16:36:37 < karlp> farnell/rs?
2018-09-20T16:38:11 < zyp> aandrew, ah
2018-09-20T16:39:26 < zyp> Steffanx, same here
2018-09-20T16:40:41 < zyp> maybe I should have made use of that when I got sick during easter vacation some years back
2018-09-20T16:41:36 < zyp> but formally you need a doctor's note to claim your vacation days back, and fuck dealing with that
2018-09-20T16:43:31 < sync> just step into the doctor and get the thing?
2018-09-20T16:44:28 < zyp> I don't have a "the doctor", but yeah
2018-09-20T16:47:27 < sync> I don't have one as well but in the university district there are enough doctors that know what is up
2018-09-20T16:49:24 < zyp> norway has this system where you get a specific doctor assigned for any general stuff, I never bothered getting a new doctor assigned after I moved away from my hometown
2018-09-20T16:49:42 < zyp> and the one I used to have there retired some years ago, so I currently don't have any assigned
2018-09-20T16:50:45 < zyp> I should probably fix that some time, but I haven't had a need to see a doctor in probably 15 years or so, so I keep not bothering
2018-09-20T17:10:24 < Laurenceb124> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNso4aCVrHE
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2018-09-20T19:21:46 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/wGVoYrq.jpg
2018-09-20T19:22:06 < Steffanx> Awh.
2018-09-20T19:22:50 < emeb> lol
2018-09-20T19:23:31 < emeb> We need those at state borders here in the US now.
2018-09-20T19:25:39 < qyx> Thorn: farnell does
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2018-09-20T19:28:49 < englishman> stm32f2 has usb dfu in rom bootloader but only on some chip revisions
2018-09-20T19:28:54 < englishman> sounds aggravating
2018-09-20T19:30:45 < emeb> When the STM32F373 first came out it was supposed to have a USB DFU bootloader but the early datecodes didn't have it.
2018-09-20T19:31:16 < emeb> Seems someone at the factory was putting in the wrong system flash image.
2018-09-20T19:32:02 < emeb> ST actually ended up buying some of those parts back apparently.
2018-09-20T19:34:09 < englishman> ha, cool
2018-09-20T19:34:51 < englishman> no mention of that in AN2606 or errata
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2018-09-20T19:42:59 < emeb> http://ebrombaugh.studionebula.com/embedded/stm32f373breakout/index.html
2018-09-20T19:43:10 < emeb> scroll down to the Bootloader heading.
2018-09-20T19:43:21 < emeb> zyp, dongs and I were looking at that stuff back then.
2018-09-20T19:44:53 < englishman> (01-04-13) We've conducted a disassembly of the STM32F373 system memory and confirmed that the bootloader in that device does not support USB DFU mode.
2018-09-20T19:44:56 < englishman> is that mm-dd-yy
2018-09-20T19:45:00 < englishman> or dd-yy-mm
2018-09-20T19:45:05 < englishman> or dd-mm-yy
2018-09-20T19:45:20 < emeb> there's no way to know!
2018-09-20T19:45:33 < englishman> further on down you have mm-dd-yy
2018-09-20T19:45:36 < emeb> mm-dd-yy
2018-09-20T19:45:57 < BrainDamage> ym-md-dy
2018-09-20T19:46:02 < englishman> but i have several receipts from this week that have dd-mm-yy on the inventory part of the receipt and mm-dd-yy on the transaction part of the receipt
2018-09-20T19:46:07 < englishman> so i cannot trust anything
2018-09-20T19:46:31 < englishman> not to mention this Government of Canada webshite from last week https://i.imgur.com/6Zx6q74.png
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2018-09-20T19:47:23 < englishman> Checking the IDs in the USART1 mode shows BID 5.0 which is not detailed in the AN2606 Bootloader appnote at the time of this writing (12-12-12).
2018-09-20T19:47:29 < englishman> the only date that is fully defined ^
2018-09-20T19:48:20 < englishman> excellent lols on that page thank you for linking
2018-09-20T19:58:15 < emeb> all part of the service. :)
2018-09-20T20:04:52 < englishman> Nikola Tesla died January 7 1943. He had claimed to have built and tested a death ray. The FBI seized all of his possessions John George Trump, electrical engineer and MIT professor, paternal uncle of current US president Donald Trump, and technical aide to the FBI, released a report concluding that there was nothing among Tesla's possessions which would constitute a hazard in unfriendly hands.
2018-09-20T20:04:52 < englishman> My friends, Donald Trump has the death ray.
2018-09-20T20:04:52 < englishman> Sweet dreams.
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2018-09-20T20:05:59 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUBd35sBMqc
2018-09-20T20:06:23 < kakimir> englishman: and time machine
2018-09-20T20:06:37 < emeb> hmm... has a cab for human. not really a robot.
2018-09-20T20:07:05 < kakimir> yeah
2018-09-20T20:07:38 < kakimir> I used to get annoyed about devices with no level of autonomy being called robots
2018-09-20T20:08:56 < emeb> "someone on the internet is wrong"
2018-09-20T20:09:16 < kakimir> yeah..
2018-09-20T20:09:35 < kakimir> just major part of users
2018-09-20T20:10:30 < englishman> is that Ultrasauce's kickstarter
2018-09-20T20:10:50 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVoZbEH0b-E musics
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2018-09-20T20:11:49 < Ultrasauce> nah mine's gonna be better than that one
2018-09-20T20:15:56 < kakimir> anyone done those glass pcbs?
2018-09-20T20:22:04 < kakimir> is electronic test in 2layer boards just to test if vias work?
2018-09-20T20:22:41 < kakimir> I bet imaging type of device can see if there is issue with visible layers
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2018-09-20T20:39:58 < kakimir> laxatives into school food?
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2018-09-20T21:02:13 <@jpa-> kakimir: thin shortcircuits can be quite invisible
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2018-09-20T21:27:36 < qyx> anyone into scons? I want to split the project into multiple modules
2018-09-20T21:28:02 < qyx> every module to have its own sconscript to build it as a static library
2018-09-20T21:28:08 < qyx> and also to define dependencies on other modules
2018-09-20T21:28:36 < qyx> ant then in the sconstruct to build the program from those collected dependencies (static libraries)
2018-09-20T21:31:16 < kakimir> night of innovation
2018-09-20T21:32:55 <@jpa-> qyx: i use scons
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2018-09-20T21:34:28 < qyx> I cannot come up with a nice way of doing it :S
2018-09-20T21:34:48 <@jpa-> https://github.com/nanopb/nanopb/blob/master/tests/basic_buffer/SConscript   i guess you could do something similar to this, i use stuff like "$COMMON/pb_encode.o" from other subdirectory, you could similarly use foobar.a or similar
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2018-09-20T21:40:51 < monode> what boards are out there with ethernet? It seems most STM32 have a PHYtter but development boards rarely implement it. I found one from olimex I think
2018-09-20T21:43:38 < Steffanx> some nucleos come with it monode
2018-09-20T21:44:05 < Steffanx> https://www.st.com/en/evaluation-tools/stm32-mcu-nucleo.html?querycriteria=productId=LN1847 check some of the 144 boards
2018-09-20T21:45:26 < Steffanx> and there are some discoveries too, mainly for the f4/f7 family
2018-09-20T21:48:39 < monode> thank you
2018-09-20T21:59:37 < aandrew> hm
2018-09-20T21:59:42 < aandrew> my 6yo is destined to be a pumper
2018-09-20T21:59:45 < aandrew> "When I grow up I am going to wear my glasses upside down, my hair spiky, no shirt or pants, and drive a motorcycle"
2018-09-20T22:00:30 < Steffanx> haha aandrew. At least he/she knows what he/she wants
2018-09-20T22:02:33 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-20T22:02:36 < aandrew> oh he's a he for sure
2018-09-20T22:03:16 < sync> I can understand the appeal of motobrapping without pants or a shirt, but my scars say that it is a bad idea
2018-09-20T22:04:38 < aandrew> Lol
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2018-09-20T22:09:55 < Steffanx> So in the end it doesnt matter where you start.
2018-09-20T22:10:48 < Steffanx> not sure where the glasses up side down comes from aandrew . What have you been feeding the kid?
2018-09-20T22:11:18 < Steffanx> *goede avond :)
2018-09-20T22:11:46 < Steffanx> bună seară superbia1
2018-09-20T22:12:02 < Steffanx> blame google translate when its not proper romanian
2018-09-20T22:12:58 < Steffanx> Why dutch superbia1 ?
2018-09-20T22:13:40 < Steffanx> nah, for someone not german or dutch, yeah. 
2018-09-20T22:14:24 < Steffanx> otherwise, its still quite a bit different.
2018-09-20T22:15:34 < sync> ik drück auf de knöppje
2018-09-20T22:16:42 < Steffanx> ich druk op der knoppen, sync ?
2018-09-20T22:17:05 < Steffanx> what the hell is knöppje
2018-09-20T22:17:16 < sync> that is how it sounds to a german speaker
2018-09-20T22:17:22 < sync> it is from a comedy sketch
2018-09-20T22:17:28 < Steffanx> oh lol
2018-09-20T22:17:32 < sync> where the guy argued that the dutch would make bad terrorists
2018-09-20T22:18:01 < Steffanx> lol whokay. link?
2018-09-20T22:19:55 < sync> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjIQ4rLi89A
2018-09-20T22:19:59 < monode> can you opt out of the xob.kaps.fi logs? it seems not to log what everyone is saying
2018-09-20T22:20:36 < monode> you seem to be not logged, though
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2018-09-20T22:21:41 < monode> no, literally, what are you saying right now is not added
2018-09-20T22:21:58 < monode> if you look at the end of this file there's only me talking to myself: http://xob.kapsi.fi/~jpa/stm32/2018-09.log
2018-09-20T22:22:26 < Ultrasauce> maybe it's time to finally adopt solipsism
2018-09-20T22:22:47 < monode> I found NUCLEO-F756ZG, NUCLEO-F439ZI, NUCLEO-H743ZI, NUCLEO-F767ZI on farnell, not sure what the major differences are between the platforms but they all seem priced at the same range. I guess price is not a good indicator of performance and peripherals
2018-09-20T22:22:51 < Steffanx> monode, haha. do you want to opt out?
2018-09-20T22:23:11 < Steffanx> All you have to do is annoy jpa- . When you get annoying enough you will be removed from the logs.
2018-09-20T22:23:21 < monode> lol
2018-09-20T22:23:26 < monode> that's his private log?
2018-09-20T22:23:33 < Steffanx> idk, it seems jpa-
2018-09-20T22:23:38 < monode> makes sense, why did I think it was like a public log
2018-09-20T22:23:43 < Steffanx> thought so, superbia1
2018-09-20T22:23:57 < Steffanx> it's a public log, but its his client logging.
2018-09-20T22:24:12 < monode> rephrasing: secondary client logging :)
2018-09-20T22:24:12 < Steffanx> idk, might be something from your past superbia1 .
2018-09-20T22:24:42 < Steffanx> if you want to be in the logs, sure :)
2018-09-20T22:24:44 < monode> yep, this is what i'm going to
2018-09-20T22:24:55 < Steffanx> serbia.. meh
2018-09-20T22:25:02 < monode> new to the family stm32 family, trying to learn the ropes
2018-09-20T22:25:39 < monode> hm, ar merge, desi prefer engleza. more of a technical language
2018-09-20T22:26:17 < Steffanx> hah sync, first issue was him watching Harry potter in something else than the original spräche
2018-09-20T22:26:17 < monode> port some of my stuff from lpc2000/avr to stm32, in the long term
2018-09-20T22:27:08 < monode> what's the romanian guy's channel?
2018-09-20T22:27:23 < monode> some industrial automation, mostly motion controllers and some dedicated stuff
2018-09-20T22:27:43 < monode> I don't think it matters, though.
2018-09-20T22:28:48 < monode> I've been working for a while in the embedded world, but thanks :) LPC I think is the old pre-cortex architecture
2018-09-20T22:29:40 < monode> ah no, still cortex.
2018-09-20T22:31:06 < monode> it's arm, but i'm not sure if it's cortex
2018-09-20T22:31:12 < monode> was googling, I think only the newer series are cortex
2018-09-20T22:32:01 < monode> suprebia1: what's the channel of the romanian guy?
2018-09-20T22:33:07 < monode> Cracki: some custom (read: in-house) 4 DOF arms, a lot of cnc stuff with milling and nichrome cutting
2018-09-20T22:33:37 < monode> I mostly want to learn the a new architecture, eventually hoping to port everything, but porting ain't critical
2018-09-20T22:34:09 < sync> Cracki: you don't really need timers for motion planning
2018-09-20T22:35:05 < sync> > pulse generation
2018-09-20T22:35:08 < sync> god forbid
2018-09-20T22:35:11 < sync> it is 2018
2018-09-20T22:35:47 < monode> My actual solution ain't that elegant - using a few 90pwm3B that I sync together. A different one uses the lpcs in a while loop to generate pulses, not the most elegant solution
2018-09-20T22:35:50 < sync> for servos you only need a single timer if you don't deal with the pwm or feedback directly
2018-09-20T22:35:51 < monode> thanks
2018-09-20T22:36:15 < sync> those or the ST stuff
2018-09-20T22:36:36 < monode> for steppers (and many times servos) you need pulses to control position/speed/acceleration, and Cracki is right
2018-09-20T22:36:54 < sync> or something that talks through a link that does not crash your machine when one wire falls off
2018-09-20T22:37:11 < monode> servo drivers (at least the industrial grade stuff) have exactly the same interface as steppers: step + dir
2018-09-20T22:37:39 < sync> no, they usually use analog or some kind of digital link
2018-09-20T22:37:50 < sync> or quadrature
2018-09-20T22:38:21 < sync> I wouldn't think that siemens/heidenhain/festo/berger lahr are not industrial grade
2018-09-20T22:38:34 < monode> yeah, in-house ones. you don't want in-house
2018-09-20T22:38:49 < monode> ah. don't those come as a "complete" solution? fanuc and such
2018-09-20T22:40:03 < sync> monode: you usually get a set with drive and servo, but at least festo and berger lahr advertise their drives to be universal
2018-09-20T22:40:31 < sync> Cracki: of course there are other solutions, but I deal quite a bit with motion control and those are the solutions I see
2018-09-20T22:42:43 < sync> I built my own servodrive and multichannel stepper driver that is controlled through ethernet or serial link
2018-09-20T22:42:58 < monode> hm
2018-09-20T22:43:11 < monode> how do you talk with it for motion planning?
2018-09-20T22:43:50 < sync> monode: motion planning is happening externally in some regular dextop pc
2018-09-20T22:44:20 < monode> I always thought given how much smarts go into one of those drivers, a better interface can be built, like sending some values per axis to describe starting speed and acceleration curves for each line
2018-09-20T22:44:28 < monode> sync: yeah, of course
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2018-09-20T22:44:36 < monode> but how do you transmit it over to your servodrive?
2018-09-20T22:44:42 < sync> ethernet
2018-09-20T22:44:49 < monode> oook
2018-09-20T22:44:53 < monode> what do the ethernet frames contain
2018-09-20T22:45:06 < sync> a position
2018-09-20T22:45:08 < monode> rephrasing: how do you describe the motion that you computed?
2018-09-20T22:45:25 < sync> but yes, you could transmit more information about the move you want to make
2018-09-20T22:45:56 < monode> that's... pretty cool
2018-09-20T22:46:00 < sync> currently I it is just position data per servo cycle
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2018-09-20T22:46:18 < sync> and feedback is position and some other stuff
2018-09-20T22:46:20 < Thorn> what os are they using
2018-09-20T22:46:35 < monode> sync: ah, so you're doing acceleration ramps on your computer? and just update position in the loop, to keep up with the ramp?
2018-09-20T22:46:44 < sync> yes
2018-09-20T22:47:15 < sync> it is not the most ideal way to do it but for most mechanical systems it works just fine
2018-09-20T22:47:24 < monode> ethercat is nice
2018-09-20T22:47:45 < sync> I think if you had some very accel sensitive application you would want to transmit that info as well
2018-09-20T22:48:37 < monode> sync: nah, that's cool. I remember 10 years ago or so, when mach3 was all the hype, they did it over a paraport (so a similar loop likely figured out acceleration profiles and how to generate them)
2018-09-20T22:49:32 < sync> well, using the parport is fine, it's just that step/dir is very inefficient
2018-09-20T22:49:37 < monode> Cracki: I haven't messed with ethercat much, how is support over desktop OSes
2018-09-20T22:49:37 < sync> and inherently dangerous
2018-09-20T22:50:01 < monode> open-loop usually is
2018-09-20T22:50:30 < sync> well, no
2018-09-20T22:50:44 < sync> it can be, but step/dir is more dangerous than say quadrature
2018-09-20T22:51:13 < monode> yep, pretty much
2018-09-20T22:51:47 < monode> you have a packet or a jumbo packet, data goes around in a ringn network, each slave has two NICs, and each slave has some special position in the packet that they read/write from
2018-09-20T22:52:21 < sync> if the dir wire in your step dir setup falls off it will crash your machine
2018-09-20T22:52:38 < sync> but if the A wire in a quadrature setup breaks, it will only wiggle between two steps
2018-09-20T22:52:47 < sync> and you get 4 times the bandwidth
2018-09-20T22:53:30 < monode> and quadrature still needs only two pins
2018-09-20T22:53:48 < monode> but I think the sudden stop is what's going to crash your tool 
2018-09-20T22:54:19 < monode> true
2018-09-20T22:54:36 < monode> that's a cat over ethernet
2018-09-20T22:55:56 < monode> I think the fur counts as shielding
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2018-09-20T22:57:15 < Steffanx> welcome.
2018-09-20T22:57:58 < monode> I've been reading about the whole family of STM32, care to share your general opinions from every perspective you've had issues with? PCB design (I like how the pins match "up" between higher pincounts and the family nbaming), toolchain (stm32 seems to support gcc and arm peripheral libs), maybe simulation (I'm a fan of isis proteus, pardon the naming)?
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2018-09-20T23:01:14 < aandrew> lol
2018-09-20T23:01:44 < Thorn> I've never seen a functional stm32 simulator
2018-09-20T23:01:54 < aandrew> me either
2018-09-20T23:02:06 < aandrew> I keep wanting to play with qemu but -ENOTIME
2018-09-20T23:02:19 < Thorn> you can simulate the cortex-m core but what use is it
2018-09-20T23:03:01 < monode> well, it is "isis proteus" and i said pardon the naming. don't take the part you like out of context :p
2018-09-20T23:03:11 < monode> yeah, I guess it's really pointless without having peripherals
2018-09-20T23:04:33 < aandrew> monode: you must be new here
2018-09-20T23:04:40 < Thorn> unless you're debugging a compiler or something like that
2018-09-20T23:04:51 < aandrew> I thought qemu had a somewhat decent stm32f0 emulated from the old pebble watch
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2018-09-20T23:07:20 < monode> ooooh... small comunity
2018-09-20T23:07:22 < monode> yeah makes sense
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2018-09-20T23:09:05 < monode> checking berger-lahr, their products are seriously heavy stuff
2018-09-20T23:09:12 < Steffanx> i know you dont give a damn about cats, but it turns out the city cat we met in Groningen has its own facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/avonturen.van.nemo/ :P
2018-09-20T23:09:31 < monode> servo synchros/AC up to 50kW.. I mean wow
2018-09-20T23:09:51 < Steffanx> @ zyp
2018-09-20T23:10:13 < monode> can't really imagine tuning the motor that controls the mechanical parts hooked up to it
2018-09-20T23:10:18 < aandrew> I used to work in an industry where 200kw was more or less the minimum
2018-09-20T23:10:24 < monode> (that was redundant...)
2018-09-20T23:10:40 < monode> huh
2018-09-20T23:10:42 < monode> mining?
2018-09-20T23:10:46 < aandrew> no
2018-09-20T23:11:03 < aandrew> we supplied mines and forestry and agriculture and aggregate and ... pretty much everything
2018-09-20T23:11:15 < aandrew> I used to design industrial soft starters and VFDs
2018-09-20T23:11:34 -!- ohsix [ohsix@72.35.144.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2018-09-20T23:11:43 < emeb> Steffanx: TIL Groningen has a city cat
2018-09-20T23:12:04 < Steffanx> Yes, emeb  D
2018-09-20T23:12:05 < Steffanx> :D
2018-09-20T23:12:16 < Steffanx> i know you like facebook cats.
2018-09-20T23:12:47 < emeb> Steffanx: I love *anything* on FB. In every possible way.
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2018-09-20T23:13:36 < Steffanx> Even the complaining house wifes?
2018-09-20T23:13:52 < emeb> Steffanx: especially those. They're the best.
2018-09-20T23:16:46 < monode> do the nucleo boards come with debuggers?  I'm really taking to nucleo-h743zi
2018-09-20T23:17:02 < emeb> debugger?
2018-09-20T23:17:20 < monode> or do you need a separate jtag probe to flash/debug it and the nicely placed USB port is just for OTG?
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2018-09-20T23:17:29 < monode> evening
2018-09-20T23:17:30 < emeb> Nucleos have a USB -> SWD port which can be used for flashing & debugging
2018-09-20T23:18:11 < monode> ah, awesome
2018-09-20T23:20:20 < emeb> It's a basic ST-Link interface. Supported by free tools from ST as well as openocd
2018-09-20T23:21:16 < monode> I was reading that many years ago, people could dump the flash via some exploits, even if the read-protect bits were set. is this still the case?
2018-09-20T23:21:41 < monode> Not talking about SEM grade exploits, but just messing with jtag and (iirc?) the brownout detection
2018-09-20T23:22:33 < emeb> AFAIK ST hasn't changed anything to address these vulns.
2018-09-20T23:22:52 < emeb> OTOH they're not universally successful exploits either.
2018-09-20T23:25:39 < emeb> But if you've got serious concerns about security and/or IP protection you probably shouldn't be considering consumer-grade hardware like STM32. If your IP is valuable enough to warrant cracking attempts like these then there are very few technologies that you can use to stop it.
2018-09-20T23:25:55 < emeb> Figure anything you put out there *can* be cracked / REd
2018-09-20T23:26:11 < monode> yeah, if there's somebody with enough money and time, everything can be cracked
2018-09-20T23:26:13 < monode> yeah, exactly
2018-09-20T23:26:18 < emeb> Question comes down to whether it's worth it for the adversary.
2018-09-20T23:26:43 < Thorn> new stm32s seem to have some crypto based flash protection
2018-09-20T23:29:09 < monode> I'm not _that_ serious, but I'm expecting what lockbits say to do, if I stick a devboard into something, the next guy shouldn't just run some scripts and dump the flash
2018-09-20T23:29:30 < monode> yes, I know sticking devboards into products, even prototypes, is a bad idea - what is ST's position regarding this?
2018-09-20T23:31:59 < monode> crypto sounds very neat for a mcu this size
2018-09-20T23:32:36 < monode> thanks
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2018-09-20T23:41:51 < Steffanx> Cool.
2018-09-20T23:41:59 < Steffanx> Did he sell crt?
--- Day changed Fri Sep 21 2018
2018-09-21T00:02:24 < Steffanx> bonjour bienvenue
2018-09-21T00:23:28 < Thorn> >1M PT100 Thermocouple Probe 5mm x 50mm
2018-09-21T00:23:40 < Thorn> >PT100 Thermocouple
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2018-09-21T00:39:20 < zyp> sup? everybody fell asleep already?
2018-09-21T00:39:50 < zyp> Steffanx, haha, nice
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2018-09-21T00:42:20 < englishman> google G suite email migration is chugging along at about 5 emails per minute
2018-09-21T00:42:24 < englishman> pro soft
2018-09-21T00:43:12 < zyp> got access to the house today and told go ahead with the network installation
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2018-09-21T00:44:15 < englishman> nice
2018-09-21T00:44:40 < zyp> so I went and bought supplies for $300-ish (conduit, boxes, etc)
2018-09-21T00:45:07 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/vIHR7.jpg <- got the rack cabinet up, but I didn't get so much more done today
2018-09-21T00:46:30 < zyp> mostly planning how I'll run the conduit and where I want the outlets
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2018-09-21T01:06:12 < englishman> zyp's house by the end of the weekend https://v.redd.it/bu9ez3o6bdn11/DASH_4_8_M
2018-09-21T01:06:46 < zyp> haha
2018-09-21T01:07:02 < BrainDamage> I want to hook up a water hose to the conduits
2018-09-21T01:07:40 < zyp> I wish I had water heating in the floors
2018-09-21T01:08:05 < englishman> https://www.privacyfly.com/articles/ncix_breach/
2018-09-21T01:08:06 < englishman> There were also three hundred eighty-five thousand names, serial numbers with dates of purchase, addresses, company names, email addresses, phone numbers, IP addresses and unsalted MD5 hashed passwords. The database also contained full credit card payment details in plain text for two hundred and fifty-eight thousand users between various tables.
2018-09-21T01:08:07 < zyp> but that weren't in the original plans, and it's too late to add it now (and wouldn't fit my budget anyway)
2018-09-21T01:08:07 < BrainDamage> my sister has it, it's so much better
2018-09-21T01:08:12 < englishman> canadian security
2018-09-21T01:08:31 < zyp> BrainDamage, better than what?
2018-09-21T01:08:40 < BrainDamage> wall radiators
2018-09-21T01:08:46 < zyp> fair
2018-09-21T01:08:59 < zyp> I've got electric floor heating instead, in some rooms
2018-09-21T01:09:11 < zyp> and the others probably won't need much
2018-09-21T01:09:16 < englishman> one local guy put in-floor eating elements in his ceiling
2018-09-21T01:09:20 < englishman> very interesting effect
2018-09-21T01:09:25 < englishman> ...heating elements
2018-09-21T01:09:33 < zyp> electric or water?
2018-09-21T01:09:39 < englishman> electric
2018-09-21T01:09:55 < zyp> my parents have that in their living room, idk why
2018-09-21T01:10:23 < zyp> I've heard of people running water in the ceiling too, seems useful for cooling in the summer
2018-09-21T01:20:43 < johntramp> https://i.imgur.com/4hW4p4Z.jpg   here in green I am getting (SMPS?) noise on the 3v3 rail followed by a drop out on the RESET pin (yellow).  Any ideas what would cause this?
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2018-09-21T01:42:33 < kakimir> how is NXP?
2018-09-21T01:42:45 < kakimir> still safe from Qualcomm?
2018-09-21T01:43:01 < kakimir> NXP <3
2018-09-21T01:45:08 < kakimir> johntramp: it's pretty hard to tell based on details you have told about the system in case
2018-09-21T01:46:10 < kakimir> would that spike down be chip reseting with some internal reset mechanism and glitch in pullup
2018-09-21T01:46:18 < kakimir> of reset pin
2018-09-21T01:47:08 < kakimir> or then there is external reset circuit
2018-09-21T01:47:30 < johntramp> there is only external pullup and decoupling cap on the reset pin
2018-09-21T01:47:42 < johntramp> so I assume it must be something internal driving it down
2018-09-21T01:48:46 < kakimir> fault
2018-09-21T01:48:50 < johntramp> this is an efr32 (cortex m4) mcu
2018-09-21T01:49:03 < kakimir> or
2018-09-21T01:49:06 < kakimir> BOR
2018-09-21T01:49:21 < johntramp> the reset cause is said to be reset pin, not brown out
2018-09-21T01:49:56 < kakimir> internal reset would not be driving the pin
2018-09-21T01:50:08 < kakimir> I think
2018-09-21T01:50:31 < johntramp> would that level of noise typically be an issue for the mcu? it isn't dropping very low
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2018-09-21T01:50:53 < kakimir> it doesn't look too good
2018-09-21T01:51:11 < kakimir> what makes that noise in the signal?
2018-09-21T01:51:22 < johntramp> i am assuming its from the boost converter
2018-09-21T01:51:39 < kakimir> why it suddenly starts?
2018-09-21T01:51:43 < kakimir> and
2018-09-21T01:51:51 < johntramp> possibly increase in current draw??
2018-09-21T01:51:57 < kakimir> is that reset thing repeatable?
2018-09-21T01:52:07 < kakimir> does it happen same way every time?
2018-09-21T01:52:09 < johntramp> yeah it sits there in a boot loop
2018-09-21T01:52:14 < johntramp> about 1hz 
2018-09-21T01:52:52 < kakimir> does the chip require external pullup to reset?
2018-09-21T01:53:47 < johntramp> it has internal pullup too according to the datasheet
2018-09-21T01:54:28 < kakimir> do you have multiple such devices?
2018-09-21T01:54:38 < johntramp> yes, and it is just happening on one board 
2018-09-21T01:55:08 < kakimir> flash while(0) in there
2018-09-21T01:55:15 < kakimir> see if it happens
2018-09-21T01:55:22 < johntramp> yeah good idea 
2018-09-21T01:56:51 < kakimir> my hypothesis is that code does have a part in this - with maybe some some hardware issue like short circuit in some GPIO or something
2018-09-21T01:58:30 < johntramp> yes you're right ...
2018-09-21T01:58:43 < kakimir> if there is no noise or reset with while(0) you know what to do
2018-09-21T01:58:52 < kakimir> if you have spare GPIO
2018-09-21T01:59:15 < johntramp> let me drag the while(1); down the code until it starts resetting again 
2018-09-21T01:59:53 < kakimir> I mean while(1)
2018-09-21T02:00:46 < kakimir> johntramp: interesting.. you don't need even GPIO
2018-09-21T02:01:01 < kakimir> you have watchdog in your code? remember to disable it
2018-09-21T02:02:05 < johntramp> yeah i'm doing  while(1) WDOG_Feed(); 
2018-09-21T02:03:16 < kakimir> jeez
2018-09-21T02:04:06 < kakimir> you are smarter than I took you for - that is really nice way to do that without forgeting WDOG disabled
2018-09-21T02:05:30 < johntramp> haha
2018-09-21T02:06:25 < kakimir> I have my prototype in field with WDOG disabled
2018-09-21T02:06:25 < johntramp> so it looks like it's once i start up the SPI bus
2018-09-21T02:06:52 < kakimir> my code is perfect though
2018-09-21T02:06:57 < kakimir> it has ran for a month now
2018-09-21T02:07:19 < kakimir> forgot the wdog - got excited
2018-09-21T02:07:28 < johntramp> part of my init is checking the reset cause, and if it is a wdog reset then it bricks,  so I always have the watchdog enabled but know when it is triggered
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2018-09-21T02:08:49 < kakimir> I also forgot all the development parameters into that code - minimal delays for development purposes - I want to see stuff happen like right at the moment
2018-09-21T02:09:49 < johntramp> you mean like uart logging etc
2018-09-21T02:10:06 < kakimir> that also
2018-09-21T02:10:16 < kakimir> sometimes I plug my laptop into it
2018-09-21T02:11:14 < jadew> johntramp, are you averaging the capture on the scope?
2018-09-21T02:11:35 < jadew> if that noise is higher than it looks, it might trigger the brownout detect circuit
2018-09-21T02:11:39 < jadew> which will reset the IC
2018-09-21T02:11:57 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-21T02:12:05 < kakimir> and also - there is something wrong
2018-09-21T02:12:16 < jadew> the noise can obviously be generated by a short or a component out of spec (maybe a shorted cap? reverse polarity cap, etc)
2018-09-21T02:12:43 < jadew> if it doesn't happen right away, it might mean that some part of your code is activating that circuitry at some point, so look for that
2018-09-21T02:12:47 < jadew> start disabling parts of the code
2018-09-21T02:13:21 < jadew> for example, if it doesn't happen with the while(1) loop, then it's related to a piece of the code
2018-09-21T02:13:27 < johntramp> ahh  looks like it is when i clear the spi CS pin
2018-09-21T02:14:13 < johntramp> hah and look who is right next to CS,  is RESET
2018-09-21T02:14:52 < jadew> weak pull up?
2018-09-21T02:15:17 < jadew> had that happen once, but I don't remember on what IC, I also relied on the internal pull up
2018-09-21T02:15:42 < johntramp> pullup on CS?
2018-09-21T02:15:47 < jadew> on reset
2018-09-21T02:16:08 < johntramp> 1k pullup
2018-09-21T02:16:32 < jadew> then there's no reason it would be affected without a direct connection
2018-09-21T02:17:09 < johntramp> yeah I am guessing a short under there
2018-09-21T02:17:46 < kakimir> you made the boards yourself?
2018-09-21T02:17:52 < johntramp> 63ohm between CS and RESET
2018-09-21T02:17:59 < johntramp> no it came from seeed fusion
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2018-09-21T02:19:00 < johntramp> but i have hacked at the board a bit, adding some test leads etc
2018-09-21T02:23:14 < jadew> that still doesn't explain the noise, which is equally worrying
2018-09-21T02:23:54 < johntramp> correct, but I don't think the noise is causing the reset
2018-09-21T02:25:10 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-21T02:32:05 < johntramp> that noise when zoomed in is clearly triangular from the SMPS
2018-09-21T02:32:19 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/8JCRDFCp
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2018-09-21T02:49:03 < Laurenceb124> what the fuuuuu
2018-09-21T02:49:15 < Laurenceb124> Jordung Peterstien is on bbc news again
2018-09-21T02:49:27 < Laurenceb124> inb4 he is their new presenter
2018-09-21T02:57:44 < sync> Trollenceb420, why are you even watching the bbc?
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2018-09-21T04:11:18 < englishman> my 96" aluminum bar arrived from amazon
2018-09-21T04:11:21 < englishman> very well packaged
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2018-09-21T06:03:27 < aandrew> englishman: heh did you get that amazon prime?
2018-09-21T06:03:38 < englishman> yeah and they keep extending it
2018-09-21T06:03:52 < englishman> every late package = another free month
2018-09-21T06:03:54 < aandrew> holy fuck it's taken me all fucking day to get nordic sdk15 UART untangled
2018-09-21T06:03:59 < aandrew> nice
2018-09-21T06:04:04 < aandrew> I've had prime for a few years now, it's awesome
2018-09-21T06:04:10 < aandrew> well worth the $80/yr or whatever it is
2018-09-21T06:04:18 < englishman> yeah they actually have shit to sell now
2018-09-21T06:04:54 < englishman> i signed up in 2005 and they had like 3 romance novels
2018-09-21T06:05:09 < aandrew> and you got them too because hey, free shipping right?
2018-09-21T06:05:23 < englishman> not in 2005.
2018-09-21T06:08:26 < englishman> so i was ordering this 4oz project
2018-09-21T06:08:58 < englishman> and i was wondering why one fab had 4oz service no prob, fast turnaround, etc for the last year or so i've been ordering it
2018-09-21T06:09:12 < englishman> and another shoppe had 4oz at a very high price with ~weeks build time
2018-09-21T06:09:30 < englishman> it turns out, the former shop is taking 2oz and plating up to 4oz
2018-09-21T06:09:40 < englishman> and the latter was quoting 4oz clad
2018-09-21T06:09:55 < englishman> the difference is, plating is not even over the entire panel
2018-09-21T06:10:16 < englishman> the edges plate about 20% faster than the center of the panels
2018-09-21T06:11:08 < englishman> now i want to go thru my boards and see if they are giving me "average 4oz" which could mean some boards are 3.6oz
2018-09-21T06:11:18 < englishman> or "minimum 4oz" which means some boards are 4.4oz
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2018-09-21T06:18:05 < aandrew> oh nice catch
2018-09-21T06:18:11 < aandrew> 4oz copper? that's pretty heavy
2018-09-21T06:18:23 < englishman> yes
2018-09-21T06:18:47 < englishman> lso
2018-09-21T06:18:49 < englishman> also
2018-09-21T06:18:58 < englishman> i found this coloured FR4
2018-09-21T06:19:08 < englishman> so the FR4 itself is matte black
2018-09-21T06:19:38 < englishman> going to make biz cards with the new company name on 10 or 12 mil substrate
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2018-09-21T06:19:52 < englishman> not sure whether to get ENIG, or bare copper with clear soldermask
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2018-09-21T06:20:35 < aandrew> with black?
2018-09-21T06:20:42 < aandrew> ENIG would look sharp as hell
2018-09-21T06:20:47 < englishman> yes
2018-09-21T06:20:56 < englishman> but the fr4 would scuff easily
2018-09-21T06:20:59 < upgrdman> ENIG or GTFO
2018-09-21T06:21:03 < aandrew> I want you to send me one of those if you make some up
2018-09-21T06:21:10 < englishman> will do
2018-09-21T06:21:15 < aandrew> well clear soldermask with ENIG would be pretty good
2018-09-21T06:21:22 < englishman> true
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2018-09-21T06:21:28 < englishman> il send you some syrup too
2018-09-21T06:21:44 < englishman> anyway, tomorrow is friday, my transfer payment cheque will be here
2018-09-21T06:22:41 < upgrdman> ppl still mail checks?
2018-09-21T06:23:01 < englishman> yeah english people are slow
2018-09-21T06:24:32 < upgrdman> does anyone fax you too?
2018-09-21T06:25:00 < englishman> no, that's for japs, the slowest people of all
2018-09-21T06:25:18 < aandrew> yeah this nrf contract sends cheques from the us
2018-09-21T06:25:25 < aandrew> I mean they're NICE cheques and biweekly
2018-09-21T06:25:31 < aandrew> but fuck man, just e-transfer the shit
2018-09-21T06:27:17 < cjbaird> Hey, it's like Millenials have no concept of "receipts"... ("huur don't worry, a record is kept on /our/ computers.")
2018-09-21T06:27:49 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-21T06:27:53 < aandrew> I scan all my receipts
2018-09-21T06:27:55 < aandrew> fuck paper
2018-09-21T06:28:00 < englishman> same
2018-09-21T06:28:05 < englishman> scansnap
2018-09-21T06:28:11 < englishman> 2nd best investment of the year
2018-09-21T06:28:12 < aandrew> scannerpro for me (ios)
2018-09-21T06:28:24 < englishman> what is ios
2018-09-21T06:28:35 < aandrew> dongs favourite mobile operating system
2018-09-21T06:28:44 < englishman> you have a scanner that plugs into your iphone?
2018-09-21T06:28:46 < cjbaird> The bank I used to pay my landlord decided to go basically receiptless. But /I/ fucking need a proof of deposit..
2018-09-21T06:29:16 < englishman> how can you make fun of millenials, but at the same time, rent
2018-09-21T06:29:37 < cjbaird> Quasi-nomadic Master Race.
2018-09-21T06:29:54 < aandrew> plugs in?
2018-09-21T06:30:22 < englishman> do you just take iphone picture .jpgs of your receipts
2018-09-21T06:30:46 < aandrew> fuck that
2018-09-21T06:31:12 < aandrew> I take a pic of the receipt, it dewarps/OCRs and creates a searchable PDF
2018-09-21T06:31:30 < aandrew> then it uploads to anywhere I want (dropbox for now, but I have a DAV server it could sent to too)
2018-09-21T06:32:02 < aandrew> that's why I got it -- the scans are actually useful and they don't try to lock me in to some proprietary cloud bullshit
2018-09-21T06:32:09 < cjbaird> A few more years, and I'll be living out of a white van that travels around the country, creeping on them youngie backpackers girls. \o/
2018-09-21T06:32:36 < englishman> the output of my scanscap desktop scanner goes to the recycle bin directly
2018-09-21T06:33:15 < englishman> >proprietary cloud bullshit
2018-09-21T06:33:16 < englishman> >iphone
2018-09-21T06:36:27 < aandrew> englishman: yeah I hear you
2018-09-21T06:36:39 < aandrew> but it's miles ahead of any android crap I've ever used, which is why I use it
2018-09-21T06:36:43 < aandrew> I really wanted to like android
2018-09-21T06:36:53 < aandrew> but it's *exactly* like linux on the desktop, except way shittier
2018-09-21T06:41:11 < aandrew> yes, but a lot are shit
2018-09-21T06:41:36 < aandrew> I like how this app will dewarp the image, clean it up, OCR it and give me something useful
2018-09-21T06:44:31 < englishman> btw aandrew did you order from ncix in the last 15 years
2018-09-21T06:45:11 < englishman> https://web.archive.org/web/20180920161348/https://vancouver.craigslist.ca/rch/sys/d/ncix-database-servers/6677293677.html
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2018-09-21T06:45:37 < englishman> https://www.privacyfly.com/articles/ncix_breach/
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2018-09-21T07:47:37 < branjb> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/3VOGONPM/IMG_1090.JPG
2018-09-21T07:50:14 < branjb> my wife doesn't get it
2018-09-21T07:51:46 < branjb> lol
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2018-09-21T08:59:15 < Steffanx> Good morning this morning superbia1 
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2018-09-21T10:26:52 < cjbaird> I put 10 bux down that a demand for a name and branding change happens next week, because the current one being based on a Male name is Patriarcy.
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2018-09-21T10:40:13  * day eye rapes crt 
2018-09-21T10:40:28  * day apologizes to crt
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2018-09-21T12:01:11 < PaulFertser> Cracki: have you seen Owon?
2018-09-21T12:03:32 < PaulFertser> Hm, doesn't look too ugly on their website but it was kinda shocking when I saw it for the first time.
2018-09-21T12:04:20 < PaulFertser> http://owon.com.hk/Upload/upload/20173/24/d5a902be-05b8-4b6d-8f41-9d7b0e25ddcc.png
2018-09-21T12:09:20 < day> Cracki: :O but girls with green hair can look cool. e.g. miss monique :3
2018-09-21T12:12:56 < PaulFertser> Those colours...And how the different parts of the UI fit in...
2018-09-21T12:13:14 < PaulFertser> It's hard to believe riglol is worse than that.
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2018-09-21T12:13:30 < cjbaird> I get Motif flashbacks
2018-09-21T12:16:42 < PaulFertser> https://www.ics.com/sites/default/files/images/cde-screenshot1.png
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2018-09-21T12:22:38 < day> rigol is shit tier now?
2018-09-21T12:24:58 < cjbaird> Anything shilled by Dave Jones. That should be a red flag. The guy's a shallow terp.
2018-09-21T12:25:02 < cjbaird> *twerp
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2018-09-21T12:34:10 < cjbaird> Protip: Anyone who fakes up a 'Steve Irwen of anything' persona is instantly hated by regular Australians. (excluding teenagers who like their smartphone memes and swallow any bullshit)
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2018-09-21T13:13:06 < cjbaird> If T'so gets kicked out, they'll need to find someone with 1337 filesystem skills to replace him. Maybe Reiser, he's eligible for parole in 2020.
2018-09-21T13:13:17 < zyp> haha
2018-09-21T13:17:27 < Steffanx> Lol cjbaird 
2018-09-21T13:22:55 < cjbaird> For the first few years of Linux, it was really T'so-x, as he was doing most of the devel work of the subsystems like fs, vm, etc. I'm guessing Greenhair is seriously lacking knowledge of the history.
2018-09-21T13:23:11 < cjbaird> Well, not a guess...
2018-09-21T13:25:11 < cjbaird> T'so is really to blame for the GPL licence, too. Linus: "Here's Freax, rofl." T'so: "Here's a better filesystem without that 14-character Minix crap, but it has to be GPL'd." Linus: "rofl okay."
2018-09-21T13:26:32 < cjbaird> Nothing in my Lease says I can't play with 18650s on the bedroom carpet..
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2018-09-21T16:48:54 < englishman> PaulFertser: i have an owon
2018-09-21T16:48:57 < englishman> 100% do not buy
2018-09-21T16:49:14 < jadew> owon what?
2018-09-21T16:49:16 < jadew> scope?
2018-09-21T16:49:41 < englishman> yes
2018-09-21T16:49:57 < englishman> the only good thing about it, is that it can be battery powered
2018-09-21T16:50:07 < englishman> but i've never used it like this, because it is a total piece of shit
2018-09-21T16:50:17 < jadew> how so?
2018-09-21T16:50:21 < jadew> what's wrong with it?
2018-09-21T16:50:46 < englishman> the switches are shit and randomly press or don't press or for the rotary switches, rotate in the wrong direction randomly
2018-09-21T16:50:59 < englishman> it's slower than a handspring visor trying to load a webpage
2018-09-21T16:51:18 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_Bb-IWqnKM
2018-09-21T16:51:24 < jadew> I see they're copying rigol big time
2018-09-21T16:52:21 < Steffanx>  Siglent 4 presidente
2018-09-21T16:52:42 < jadew> I have the same rotary encoder issue on my korad power supply
2018-09-21T16:53:16 < jadew> I guess they used the cheapest encoders they found that day at the local parts mall
2018-09-21T16:53:44 < jadew> haven't had issues with my 1052e
2018-09-21T16:54:01 < jadew> but I only used it a couple of years
2018-09-21T16:54:13 < jadew> huh?
2018-09-21T16:54:14 < mawk> I added a few things to the 555 timers to have a linear control on frequency and duty cycle, how can I improve this probably bad design ? http://tinyurl.com/y88wy5d8 
2018-09-21T16:56:27 < englishman> mawk: can you remove all that crap and use an stm8s003?
2018-09-21T16:56:52 < jadew> Haohmaru, you made me curious, let me check on the 1000Z series how it's done, because I think it's the same
2018-09-21T16:57:53 < mawk> no englishman that's cheating
2018-09-21T16:58:00 < mawk> but yeah that was my ultimate goal
2018-09-21T16:58:04 < jadew> so... if I turn the V/div knob, clock wise, it makes the waveform bigger (lower V / div) - sounds good to me
2018-09-21T16:59:56 < jadew> Haohmaru, you'd like it if it was the other way around?
2018-09-21T17:01:07 < jadew> can't find a setting to change the behaviour
2018-09-21T17:01:48 < qyx> englishman: yeah the rotary switches work somehow randomly
2018-09-21T17:02:23 < jadew> Haohmaru, I think I turn it the other way sometimes too, but I immediately correct myself
2018-09-21T17:02:30 < jadew> I don't think I'd care either way
2018-09-21T17:02:38 < jadew> if it changed randomly every day, I don't think I'd notice
2018-09-21T17:02:57 < qyx> it changes randomly while you turn it
2018-09-21T17:03:16 < jadew> qyx, we're talking about the rigol, not the owon :)
2018-09-21T17:03:25 < qyx> ah
2018-09-21T17:03:28 < jadew> but yeah, I know what it's like when you have a shitty encoder
2018-09-21T17:03:41 < jadew> the good part is that you can replace them all for $1
2018-09-21T17:05:44 < englishman> my riglol has been fine, it's just slow as molasses
2018-09-21T17:05:50 < englishman> the owon collects dust
2018-09-21T17:06:08 < jadew> englishman, you have the 4000 series, right?
2018-09-21T17:11:21 < jadew> I'm hoping some price reductions on those, since they overlap with the 7000 series
2018-09-21T17:22:10 < BrainDamage> mawk: yes, ditch the 555 :P
2018-09-21T17:22:20 < BrainDamage> mawk: seriously that's a lot of complexity to just give a current ramp to a cap
2018-09-21T17:22:40 < BrainDamage> mawk: take an opamp and put the cap into the feedback path, then drive it with a symmetrical waveform
2018-09-21T17:23:02 < BrainDamage> then you'll have a pretty decent integrator
2018-09-21T17:23:20 < BrainDamage> now, add a voltage comparator, and you've made a classical triangle-square oscillator
2018-09-21T17:26:50 < PaulFertser> Haohmaru: tek scope, turn the volts/div clockwise and you get less volts/div (and hence bigger signal): https://i.stack.imgur.com/eYEE3.jpg , just as jadew says. Does your 'scope really inverts this logic?
2018-09-21T17:28:35 < jadew> all this oscilloscope talk made me look for firmware updates for mine - there is one
2018-09-21T17:28:55 < jadew> I wonder what new features and bugs are there
2018-09-21T17:31:22 < Thorn> I'd be very surprised if it worked in any other way
2018-09-21T17:31:46 < Thorn> turn the knob clockwise to 'zoom in', counterclockwise to 'zoom out'
2018-09-21T17:31:47 < jadew> I think the UI is more about the waveform, with the V/div being a property, not the central aspect
2018-09-21T17:32:11 < Thorn> every scope in the world should be like that
2018-09-21T17:32:54 < PaulFertser> Same with the time scale.
2018-09-21T17:50:54 < dongs> hello dongs
2018-09-21T17:51:08 < dongs> what was me and emeb looking at
2018-09-21T17:52:02 < dongs> ah, found
2018-09-21T17:52:06 < dongs> 373 ghttobootloader stuff
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2018-09-21T18:12:25 < jadew> possibly a great deal: https://www.ebay.com/itm/LECROY-WAVERUNNER-104Xi-10GHz-OSCILLSCOPE-POWER-TESTED-NO-PROBES-/302892392733
2018-09-21T18:12:43 < jadew> (for someone in the US)
2018-09-21T18:12:49 < dongs> its not
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2018-09-21T18:12:57 < dongs> i had that, and lecroy is garbage (that series too)
2018-09-21T18:13:00 < dongs> its cheap for a reason
2018-09-21T18:13:09 < jadew> ah
2018-09-21T18:13:15 < dongs> (reason being its like those cheap riglol with shared channel bandwidth
2018-09-21T18:13:16 < Steffanx> XP is great though
2018-09-21T18:13:59 < jadew> dongs, that would still give it 2.5 GSmps, which would be enough for 1 GHz bandwidth
2018-09-21T18:14:33 < jadew> other than that an OK scope?
2018-09-21T18:14:40 < aandrew> that's a hell of a deal
2018-09-21T18:14:45 < aandrew> the waverunners are really nice scopes
2018-09-21T18:14:56 < dongs> ^ obviously a lecroy shill
2018-09-21T18:15:01 < aandrew> damn right
2018-09-21T18:15:07 < aandrew> I used to love tektronix
2018-09-21T18:15:10 < aandrew> and still do for their low end scopes
2018-09-21T18:15:17 < aandrew> but tek high end scopes are awful
2018-09-21T18:15:34 < aandrew> 10GHz... that does not look like a 10GHz front end scope
2018-09-21T18:15:37 < aandrew> in fact
2018-09-21T18:15:44 < dongs> the pic says 1ghz
2018-09-21T18:15:45 < aandrew> the pic of the scope even says 1GHz
2018-09-21T18:15:45 < dongs> lmao
2018-09-21T18:15:50 < aandrew> was gonnas say
2018-09-21T18:16:00 < dongs> judew has been trolled again
2018-09-21T18:16:04 < aandrew> the 4GHz one I used at aircell had completely different front-end circuits
2018-09-21T18:16:19 < aandrew> still, 4ch 1GHz is decent for that price
2018-09-21T18:16:24 < aandrew> especially since it's a real scope not some rigol bs
2018-09-21T18:16:27 < dongs> its not 4ch 1ghz tho
2018-09-21T18:16:30 < dongs> its shared / 4
2018-09-21T18:16:34 < dongs> if you use more than one
2018-09-21T18:16:42 < jadew> aandrew, 10 GS/s
2018-09-21T18:16:43 < dongs> thats what the gayrunner that we had was
2018-09-21T18:16:46 < aandrew> dongs: no, the analog bandiwdth I bet is 1GHz simultaneiously
2018-09-21T18:16:50 < aandrew> it's the sample rate that'll get cut
2018-09-21T18:17:17 < jadew> yeah, and the sample rate gets shared, but 2.5 GS/s is still enough for 1 GHz signals
2018-09-21T18:17:50 < aandrew> I don't think that's an MSO
2018-09-21T18:18:14 < englishman> 1.0GHz osciloscope
2018-09-21T18:18:43 < englishman> comes with FREE stuxnet
2018-09-21T18:19:08 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-21T18:19:11 < aandrew> well it is running xp
2018-09-21T18:20:28 < dongs> fuck the new gmail interface is godawful
2018-09-21T18:20:37 < dongs> my corp account just got switched
2018-09-21T18:20:56 < aandrew> wonder how hard it is to hack all the options into a lecroy
2018-09-21T18:21:04 < jadew> why do you use your mail from the browser, like a granny?
2018-09-21T18:21:20 < dongs> aandrew: probly as hard as on tek
2018-09-21T18:21:22 < dongs> which is super ez
2018-09-21T18:22:05 < aandrew> this is also just power on tested which doesn't prove a damn thing
2018-09-21T18:22:11 < jadew> the problem is that the seller is a muggle and has no idea what he's selling
2018-09-21T18:22:12 < aandrew> someone coudl have seriously raped the inputs
2018-09-21T18:22:13 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-21T18:22:31 < dongs> pls
2018-09-21T18:22:41 < englishman> the problem is someone might actually buy a $1k lecroy on ebay and think they are getting a functioning scope
2018-09-21T18:22:43 < jadew> dongs, yeah...
2018-09-21T18:23:05 < jadew> I got some awesome deals like that
2018-09-21T18:23:42 < jadew> but yeah, it smells fishy
2018-09-21T18:23:54 < dongs> MDK526.EXE (915,212K) 
2018-09-21T18:23:55 < dongs> Monday, September 10, 2018
2018-09-21T18:24:05 < dongs> they couldn't wait another day to deliver it on 9/11
2018-09-21T18:25:58 < jadew> the warranty void sticker seems broken, is it not ?
2018-09-21T18:26:14 < jadew> https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/s~sAAOSwKsdbpQXz/s-l1600.jpg
2018-09-21T18:26:28 < dongs> ur mom is broken
2018-09-21T18:26:36 < dongs> its just a shitty scope man let it go
2018-09-21T18:26:40 < dongs> 1ghz probes for this will cost more than $1000
2018-09-21T18:26:42 < dongs> for all 4
2018-09-21T18:27:08 < jadew> I could plug shit in directly
2018-09-21T18:27:32 < jadew> but yeah, it's too much of a risk
2018-09-21T18:29:26 < dongs> it also doesnt ship to communist romania
2018-09-21T18:30:05 < jadew> there are ways, but that just increases the risk
2018-09-21T18:43:40 < dongs> lol which one of you cunts bought it
2018-09-21T18:43:47 < dongs> probly aaJEWdrew
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2018-09-21T18:46:23 < englishman> This listing is for experienced techs only
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2018-09-21T18:48:07 < Sadale> jadew, isn't that a computer?
2018-09-21T18:48:37 < Sadale> jadew, is that a oscillscope that's built with a PC motherboard?
2018-09-21T18:48:47 < dongs> yes, thats how any modern scope is made
2018-09-21T18:48:57 < dongs> they literally just stick a miniitx board in there and some pcie daq card
2018-09-21T18:49:10 < Sadale> wow
2018-09-21T18:49:18 < Sadale> Just wow.
2018-09-21T18:49:25 < dongs> they even run windows
2018-09-21T18:49:31 < dongs> like XP, or 7 embedded
2018-09-21T18:49:39 < dongs> i donno if tek's newer shit runs 10 embedded
2018-09-21T18:49:45 < Sadale> why tho? Couldn't raspberry pi or something alike be used?
2018-09-21T18:49:48 < Sadale> That'd be far cheaper
2018-09-21T18:49:53 < aandrew> lol I did not buy it
2018-09-21T18:49:53 < dongs> n i g g e r p l s
2018-09-21T18:50:08 < jadew> dongs, was sure it would get bought in minutes
2018-09-21T18:50:22 < jadew> I didn't buy it either
2018-09-21T18:50:25 < aandrew> Sadale: wtf why
2018-09-21T18:50:31 < englishman> jesus Sadale
2018-09-21T18:50:51 < englishman> shitberreypi and lunix in a pro oscope?
2018-09-21T18:50:57 < englishman> maybe something for $100 on sparkfun
2018-09-21T18:51:01 < Sadale> I meant raspberry pi + custom data acquiration hardware could be far cheaper to build than a oscilliscope based on Windows OC.
2018-09-21T18:51:03 < Sadale> PC*
2018-09-21T18:51:10 < dongs> not even close
2018-09-21T18:51:10 < aandrew> Sadale: and be woefully underpowered
2018-09-21T18:51:17 < Sadale> why?
2018-09-21T18:51:31 < aandrew> Sadale: the amount of data processing that goes on in modern scopes is insane
2018-09-21T18:51:33 < englishman> https://www.picotech.com/oscilloscope/2000/picoscope-2000-overview
2018-09-21T18:51:37 < englishman> plug that into a shitberrypi
2018-09-21T18:51:41 < englishman> and post results
2018-09-21T18:51:44 < aandrew> that 5GHz MSO I used was tasking a quad core i7
2018-09-21T18:51:53 < aandrew> and that is AFTER all the fancy DSP shit already had a crack at it
2018-09-21T18:52:05 < Sadale> I see.
2018-09-21T18:52:18 < aandrew> tasking? taxing
2018-09-21T18:52:20 < aandrew> wtf brain
2018-09-21T18:52:27 < Sadale> englishman, if you fund the project I'd be happy to test it for you :P
2018-09-21T18:52:32 < englishman> right.
2018-09-21T18:52:42 < Sadale> englishman, It's just GBP 99 + shipping
2018-09-21T18:52:46 < englishman> its already out of your budget
2018-09-21T18:53:05 < Sadale> more like I don't need scope at home yet :p
2018-09-21T18:53:26 < Sadale> It's a good-to-have. But I don't have the space to place it. My room's overcrowded >_<
2018-09-21T18:54:19 < Sadale> Anyway I don't think raspberry pi 3 would have any problem with handling that. That's just my guess.
2018-09-21T18:54:25 < Sadale> But I can't verify that personally, unfortunately :c
2018-09-21T18:54:29 < englishman> does anyone here have a picoscope
2018-09-21T18:54:32 < englishman> i should get one
2018-09-21T18:54:35 < dongs> i can personally verify that you're a fucking tool
2018-09-21T18:54:36 < englishman> i like the temp logger
2018-09-21T18:55:13 < aandrew> Sadale: you don't know what you're talking about
2018-09-21T18:55:42 < Sadale> The weakest model is just 10 Mhz.
2018-09-21T18:56:02 < aandrew> I can get a rigol that can handle 10x that for peanuts
2018-09-21T18:56:07 < aandrew> why piss around with rpi
2018-09-21T18:56:23 < Sadale> because it's cheap :P
2018-09-21T18:56:28 < aandrew> rpi has *no* high bandwidth I/O
2018-09-21T18:56:42 < aandrew> it can run a camera or a display and that's about it
2018-09-21T18:56:43 < Sadale> 480Mbit/s for USB2.0, shared with LAN.
2018-09-21T18:56:50 < aandrew> oh fuck
2018-09-21T18:56:53 < aandrew> 480mbps is nothing
2018-09-21T18:57:17 < Sadale> 480Mbit/s would be 60MB/s
2018-09-21T18:57:23 < aandrew> but if all you want is a few MHz, why not just tie an analog input to an stm32
2018-09-21T18:57:24 < BrainDamage> Sadale: the cheapest riglol scope is 2x1Gbit/s
2018-09-21T18:57:29 < aandrew> Sadale: lol no
2018-09-21T18:57:29 < BrainDamage> @8bit
2018-09-21T18:57:34 < BrainDamage> that's 2GByte/s
2018-09-21T18:57:40 < Sadale> BrainDamage, I see.
2018-09-21T18:57:46 < aandrew> Sadale: not all of those 480Mbps are for your data payload
2018-09-21T18:57:51 < Sadale> aandrew, true
2018-09-21T18:57:52 < aandrew> and USB has a lot of protocol overhead and latency
2018-09-21T18:57:56 < Sadale> aandrew, true.
2018-09-21T18:58:07 < Sadale> And it's shared with LAN.
2018-09-21T18:58:10 < BrainDamage> don't forget to account that usb is half duplex
2018-09-21T18:58:16 < aandrew> Sadale: and if that's what you want -- go get a cheap hantek USB scope
2018-09-21T18:58:22 < Sadale> BrainDamage, I see. That's why they use PCIe with miniitx mobo
2018-09-21T18:58:25 < BrainDamage> so you'll need isochron transfer and all the insanity that follows
2018-09-21T18:58:52 < aandrew> they also have cheap handheld ARM based scopes everywhere
2018-09-21T18:58:57 < aandrew> they're cheap and they're shit
2018-09-21T18:59:09 < Sadale> aandrew, :o
2018-09-21T18:59:12 < aandrew> but really -- if you want a scope for hobby use... anything will do
2018-09-21T18:59:17 < Sadale> I see.
2018-09-21T18:59:24 < Sadale> I don't even have a scope >_<
2018-09-21T18:59:29 < Sadale> Not in my home.
2018-09-21T18:59:37 < BrainDamage> if you want super-cheap, get something used
2018-09-21T18:59:50 < aandrew> my day to day scope here in my office is a hantek mso5074fg. it's terrible but 99% of the time I'm just looking at slow stuff
2018-09-21T18:59:52 < BrainDamage> or riglol, it's acceptable for what they cost
2018-09-21T19:00:09 < aandrew> when I am trying to debug high speed systems (which is very rare) I get the people paying me to do it to rent a scope
2018-09-21T19:00:21 < aandrew> I keep my eye out for a 2-5GHz 4ch scope on ebay but they're very rare
2018-09-21T19:00:42 < Sadale> Anyway, if raspberry pi worked, those manufactures would have gone for it. :P
2018-09-21T19:00:47 < aandrew> almost every piece of equipment I own and use was purchased used
2018-09-21T19:00:49 < BrainDamage> Sadale: anything you get, make sure it has at least 10Mhz bandwith
2018-09-21T19:01:06 < aandrew> no, they wouldn't have used an rpi even if it worked
2018-09-21T19:01:07 < BrainDamage> mostly to see square waves not too distorted
2018-09-21T19:01:14 < aandrew> they'd ahve taken any cortex-a and put it on their own board
2018-09-21T19:01:14 < Sadale> BrainDamage, I see.
2018-09-21T19:01:14 < BrainDamage> 100MHz would be better
2018-09-21T19:01:15 < englishman> picoscope 3000 series looks cool
2018-09-21T19:01:17 < englishman> 4ch + mso
2018-09-21T19:01:26 < dongs> fuck me the fucking sidebar properties/whatever the fuck dialogs in altidum 18 are really FUCKIGN ANNOYING
2018-09-21T19:01:34 < dongs> the more i fucking try using that shit the more retareded annoying it is
2018-09-21T19:01:39 < Sadale> fortunately there isn't a real nee for me to use a scope for my hobby yet. :P
2018-09-21T19:01:41 < BrainDamage> Sadale: before scope though, buy a logic analyzer
2018-09-21T19:01:43 < Sadale> need*
2018-09-21T19:01:50 < dongs> i wonder what cunt at altidumb thought HEY LETS STOP USING DIALOGS AND SWITCH TO THIS DUMB SHIT
2018-09-21T19:01:52 < Sadale> BrainDamage, I already have it. Never used it for now, tho
2018-09-21T19:02:02 < aandrew> yep I don't know why the world has suddenly gone dark theme crazy, but moreso I don't know why this is being rolled out as a MAJOR FEATURE
2018-09-21T19:02:07 < Sadale> I have an el cheap logic analyzer. The 8 channel one.
2018-09-21T19:02:16 < dongs> aandrew: thankfully they do have white theme in optons.
2018-09-21T19:02:21 < dongs>  thats fisrt thing i disabled
2018-09-21T19:02:24 < aandrew> I just stick wtih altium 17
2018-09-21T19:02:25 < dongs> that and the new 'floating bar" shit
2018-09-21T19:02:29 < aandrew> saw no compelling reason to upgrade
2018-09-21T19:02:30 < dongs> fuckign faggot trash
2018-09-21T19:02:31 < englishman> apparently new sublime text is light theme, with paid dark theme
2018-09-21T19:02:39 < dongs> lmao, good biz
2018-09-21T19:02:44 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-21T19:02:46 < englishman> altium 18 is amazing
2018-09-21T19:02:49 < englishman> everything is so fast
2018-09-21T19:02:49 < Sadale> I like light theme.
2018-09-21T19:02:51 < englishman> zero popups
2018-09-21T19:03:02 < dongs> yes so fast except actualyl using it
2018-09-21T19:03:04 < BrainDamage> pretty sure I'm not paying to switch theme in sublime
2018-09-21T19:03:04 < englishman> :o
2018-09-21T19:03:07 < englishman> 19 beta is out
2018-09-21T19:03:09 < BrainDamage> also, check sublime merge
2018-09-21T19:03:17 < dongs> yeah i got email from japco
2018-09-21T19:03:24 < aandrew> englishman: lol srs? pay for theme? fuck that
2018-09-21T19:03:24 < englishman> dongs are you going to route my shit
2018-09-21T19:03:26 < dongs> tellnig me there's a seminar for a19
2018-09-21T19:03:27 < englishman> if not il do it sunday
2018-09-21T19:03:32 < dongs> yes, thats what im setting up
2018-09-21T19:03:35 < englishman> o rly
2018-09-21T19:03:36 < dongs> will be done before sunday probly
2018-09-21T19:03:39 < englishman> ok
2018-09-21T19:03:51 < englishman> im out of town but il be able to chat
2018-09-21T19:04:00 < dongs> thats fine, it looks pretty straightforward
2018-09-21T19:04:01 < englishman> i should send you that footprint too
2018-09-21T19:04:06 < dongs> which one
2018-09-21T19:04:12 < englishman> the ethernet to change out
2018-09-21T19:04:15 < dongs> oh
2018-09-21T19:04:23 < dongs> ah right the magjack
2018-09-21T19:04:28 < englishman> RJMG1BD3B8K1ANR
2018-09-21T19:05:20 < dongs> Your connection is not private
2018-09-21T19:05:20 < dongs> Attackers might be trying to steal your information from www.amphenolcanada.com (for example, passwords, messages, or credit cards). Learn more
2018-09-21T19:05:24 < dongs> gg
2018-09-21T19:05:32 < englishman> sent
2018-09-21T19:05:34 < englishman> lol yeah
2018-09-21T19:05:56 < Sadale> It's 2018. Why there're still sites not using https?
2018-09-21T19:06:10 < englishman> this is verified vs. datasheet and one i saw on snapEDA feel free to re-verify
2018-09-21T19:06:21 < dongs> i dont even have a snapgEDA account
2018-09-21T19:06:28 < englishman> same i used bugmenot
2018-09-21T19:06:29 < dongs> i would never trust anything from that make:R place
2018-09-21T19:06:31 < englishman> same for 3dconentcentral
2018-09-21T19:06:37 < englishman> 3dcoontentcentral
2018-09-21T19:07:56 < dongs> > components cannot move
2018-09-21T19:07:59 < dongs> > components LITERALLY cannot move
2018-09-21T19:08:12 < dongs> wtf how did you lock that shit, its note the usual select->all->locked thing
2018-09-21T19:08:53 < dongs> i can only select it via cross-select
2018-09-21T19:08:55 < dongs> then it works.
2018-09-21T19:09:00 < dongs> what fucking cuntery
2018-09-21T19:12:40  * Steffanx checks clock....
2018-09-21T19:12:49 < Steffanx> Oooh rage o'clock
2018-09-21T19:25:51 < Sadale> superbia, good evening :3
2018-09-21T19:25:52 < Steffanx> Welcome superbia 
2018-09-21T19:26:35 < Sadale> superbia, a nice one! :3
2018-09-21T19:29:42 < Steffanx> Meh
2018-09-21T19:29:53 < dongs> have buttpirate in drawer
2018-09-21T19:29:56 < dongs> never used it
2018-09-21T19:30:36 < englishman> dongs: click on selectable items in the sidebar
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2018-09-21T19:31:33 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/RnqLqLz.png
2018-09-21T19:50:44 < aandrew> lol when computing average, remember to zero the accumulators after you've averaged
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2018-09-21T19:58:04 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/tzpg2L0.png
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2018-09-21T20:03:36 < Steffanx> 19 :o
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2018-09-21T20:16:32 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/TWI5D.jpg <- ceiling spot for wlan AP in place
2018-09-21T20:19:25 < jadew> where the power plug is?
2018-09-21T20:19:42 < emeb> poe
2018-09-21T20:20:25 < aandrew> zyp: euro build?
2018-09-21T20:21:58 < mawk> BrainDamage: the complexity is because I wanted to control both rise and fall times with a control voltage
2018-09-21T20:22:23 < mawk> so two voltage-controlled current sources
2018-09-21T20:24:13 < aandrew> that does seem awfully complicated for a linear charge/discharge
2018-09-21T20:24:19 < aandrew> interesting though
2018-09-21T20:24:34 < mawk> I'm sure there are ICs for the two squares
2018-09-21T20:24:37 < mawk> that lowers complexity
2018-09-21T20:24:44 < Adluc> Altium? nice, but will it break bank? :D
2018-09-21T20:24:53 < aandrew> no, I'm just thinking of how I did it, and yeah it's just an integrator
2018-09-21T20:25:09 < aandrew> put the cap in the feedback path of an op-amp and your control voltage is the input to the integrator
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2018-09-21T20:26:21 < mawk> the input would need to be a square wave no ?
2018-09-21T20:26:28 < aandrew> no
2018-09-21T20:26:30 < aandrew> think analog math
2018-09-21T20:26:47 < aandrew> put 0.5v on the input and the opamp will integrate that 
2018-09-21T20:26:48 < mawk> well to get a ramp you need to integrate a constant
2018-09-21T20:26:56 < aandrew> put -0.375v on the input and the opamp will integrate that
2018-09-21T20:27:06 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-21T20:27:10 < aandrew> those would give you two different rates of integration
2018-09-21T20:27:19 < aandrew> up/down I mean
2018-09-21T20:29:51 < mawk> and for the discharge ?
2018-09-21T20:30:00 < mawk> I'd need something like the 555 too
2018-09-21T20:30:19 < mawk> ie two comparators, a current sink
2018-09-21T20:30:24 <@jpa-> zyp: you forgot to build walls
2018-09-21T20:34:14 < aandrew> not sure what you mean
2018-09-21T20:34:27 < aandrew> if you integrate a negative voltage the voltage across the cap will go down 
2018-09-21T20:34:30 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-21T20:34:34 < mawk> but who's putting that negative voltage
2018-09-21T20:34:37 < mawk> another oscillator ?
2018-09-21T20:34:41 < aandrew> you are
2018-09-21T20:34:47 < mawk> yeah that was my problem
2018-09-21T20:34:48 < aandrew> you're controlling the rate of charge and discharge with two pots
2018-09-21T20:34:58 < mawk> I want to assert a constant control voltage for the frequency, another for the duty cycle
2018-09-21T20:35:00 < mawk> and that's all
2018-09-21T20:35:06 < aandrew> oh
2018-09-21T20:35:26 < aandrew> just use your 555 output on another opamp to invert the control voltage :-)
2018-09-21T20:35:31 < mawk> well maybe a bit tweaked, like it's not the frequency but the period, but it stays pretty simple
2018-09-21T20:36:00 < aandrew> basically one opamp to integrate, and another to *1/*-1 the control voltage
2018-09-21T20:36:13 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-21T20:36:45 < mawk> but to invert the control voltage I need to know when
2018-09-21T20:36:57 < mawk> yeah ok
2018-09-21T20:37:27 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-21T20:38:17 < aandrew> https://pastebin.com/Vr0zH6bb
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2018-09-21T20:38:34 < aandrew> why the fuck is the compiler optimizing out the if block on line 13??
2018-09-21T20:38:44 < mawk> so instead of using a current source to control the rise rate I'll use an integrator with a constant voltage and that'll amount to the same
2018-09-21T20:39:18 < aandrew> with 1/4 the opamps, yes
2018-09-21T20:39:43 < aandrew> possibly 1/8 the opamps if you want to do something clever to invert the control signal 
2018-09-21T20:39:46 < mawk> because it stays always 0 aandrew 
2018-09-21T20:39:48 < mawk> in your code
2018-09-21T20:39:55 < mawk> you can never enter the if block
2018-09-21T20:40:03 < aandrew> where? 
2018-09-21T20:40:08 < mawk> best_rssi can't change its value
2018-09-21T20:40:13 < aandrew> line 15?
2018-09-21T20:40:23 < mawk> its initial value is 0 so the best_rssi > avg[best[i]] condition is always false
2018-09-21T20:40:33 < mawk> line 13
2018-09-21T20:40:37 < aandrew> aha!
2018-09-21T20:40:37 < mawk> no matter the contents of the if block
2018-09-21T20:40:44 < aandrew> I knew I had a logic problem, I just could not see it
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2018-09-21T20:46:40 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcxcNbkea6w musics
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2018-09-21T21:05:11 < aandrew> hm
2018-09-21T21:05:38 < aandrew> how do I go about finding the best (lowest rssi) rf channels out of 125?
2018-09-21T21:05:46 < aandrew> it seems a sort would do it
2018-09-21T21:07:54 < mawk> if you want just the lowest value you just browse the list linearly
2018-09-21T21:08:08 < mawk> it will always be better than a sort
2018-09-21T21:08:39 < mawk> you maintain a variable that holds the minimum values, and you do a comparison for each value in the list
2018-09-21T21:09:08 < aandrew> yes, I want the lowest 4 values
2018-09-21T21:09:48 < aandrew> there's also another rule I want to apply (later) is that the lowest 4 cannot be within 5 channels of each other
2018-09-21T21:09:56 < mawk> so a list of 125 ?
2018-09-21T21:10:02 < mawk> I believe 4 linear searches are better
2018-09-21T21:10:14 < mawk> you can start to do a sort for around 7 values
2018-09-21T21:10:26 < mawk> depends on the sorting algorithm and all
2018-09-21T21:10:49 < aandrew> i.e. if the rssi is 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10, the lowest four indexes are obvious 0,1,2,3 but that's useless. you'd want 0,5,10 (and 15) 
2018-09-21T21:11:16 < aandrew> hm, maybe four linear searches are better
2018-09-21T21:11:32 < mawk> you take min_rssi = 1; then you browse the list to find a better minimum
2018-09-21T21:11:42 < aandrew> yeah
2018-09-21T21:20:35 < mawk> that'll take you 490 comparisons, while a sorting algorithm will take you almost twice that
2018-09-21T21:57:10 < BrainDamage> mawk: I cba to read all the backlog, but you're fucking doing it wrong
2018-09-21T21:57:28 < BrainDamage> the charge constant is Vc=C*V/R
2018-09-21T21:57:46 < BrainDamage> you can chose asymmetrical voltage supplies to the integrator
2018-09-21T21:57:55 < BrainDamage> or asymmetrical resistors
2018-09-21T21:58:08 < BrainDamage> and the way you're using the 555 is not even as a comparator
2018-09-21T21:58:14 < BrainDamage> rip that garbage out
2018-09-21T21:58:43 < BrainDamage> the 555 is nothing more than a overly glorified window comparator with a flip flip at the output
2018-09-21T21:59:41 < BrainDamage> and you're not even using the comparator
2018-09-21T22:00:49 < mawk> why ?
2018-09-21T22:01:09 < mawk> it's the 555 that's comparing the condensator voltage to 1/3 Vcc and 2/3 Vcc
2018-09-21T22:01:13 < mawk> toggling the output
2018-09-21T22:01:29 < BrainDamage> discard that shit and you can use arbitrary tresholds
2018-09-21T22:01:36 < qyx> aandrew: a single linear search, 4 value fifo
2018-09-21T22:01:47 < BrainDamage> then you can have freedom of choice on asymmetrical charge
2018-09-21T22:02:06 < qyx> for i in channels:  if rssi(i) and i > last + 5: put_fifo(i)
2018-09-21T22:02:27 < qyx> and last = i (in the if)
2018-09-21T22:03:18 < qyx> oh and you have to check the rssi value
2018-09-21T22:03:21 < qyx> uh, maybe not that easy
2018-09-21T22:07:24 < mawk> what's about the charge constant thing BrainDamage ?
2018-09-21T22:07:52 < BrainDamage> look, the capacitor just integrates charge
2018-09-21T22:08:01 < mawk> i = Cu', by providing a constant current I made a ramp
2018-09-21T22:08:04 < BrainDamage> which means that charge constant depends on the current you throw in it
2018-09-21T22:08:09 < mawk> yes
2018-09-21T22:08:20 < mawk> it's two constant-current sources
2018-09-21T22:08:23 < BrainDamage> a simple resistor is problematic, because the current is a function of Vr which changes
2018-09-21T22:08:31 < BrainDamage> your solution is an overly complicated one
2018-09-21T22:08:55 < BrainDamage> you can use an opamp's virtual ground to fix a cap and a resistor's potential to do the same
2018-09-21T22:09:21 < BrainDamage> a simple banal opamp integrator has a charge constant of Vin/R * C
2018-09-21T22:09:33 < BrainDamage> and you can chose 2 different Vins
2018-09-21T22:09:40 < BrainDamage> or 2 different tresholds top operate one
2018-09-21T22:09:44 < BrainDamage> -e
2018-09-21T22:10:17 < BrainDamage> you're trying to shoehorn the 555 when you can use whatever you want
2018-09-21T22:10:27 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-21T22:10:31 < BrainDamage> you're already using 2 opamps, you've already wasted the 555 advantage
2018-09-21T22:10:33 < mawk> well at start is was just an exercise
2018-09-21T22:10:41 < mawk> try to linearize a bit the 555
2018-09-21T22:10:52 < mawk> because it has a control voltage but it yields horrible expressions
2018-09-21T22:11:06 < BrainDamage> ignore the 555 and just build shit from scratch
2018-09-21T22:11:16 < BrainDamage> the constraints you're putting yourself are just silly
2018-09-21T22:11:24 < BrainDamage> the 555 is almost meaningless there
2018-09-21T22:12:55 < kakimir> anyone have iperf running in some server?
2018-09-21T22:13:04 < mawk> in a sec yes if you want
2018-09-21T22:13:07 < kakimir> with 100megs hose at least
2018-09-21T22:13:10 < BrainDamage> I do, but not exposed to the internet
2018-09-21T22:13:19 < kakimir> naturally
2018-09-21T22:14:10 < PaulFertser> Installed printed oldham Z-couplers on my anet. Doesn't seem to make any meaningful difference wrt the vertical walls' quality.
2018-09-21T22:14:15 < mawk> you want special options to iperf kakimir ?
2018-09-21T22:15:53 < kakimir> I don't know even how to use it
2018-09-21T22:15:57 < kakimir> iperf3?
2018-09-21T22:16:22 < kakimir> I have done some tests with it but i think I want duplez
2018-09-21T22:16:26 < kakimir> duplex
2018-09-21T22:16:32 < kakimir> or 2 direction
2018-09-21T22:16:49 < kakimir> maybe we will do only TCP
2018-09-21T22:18:21 < mawk> actually my hosting provider has an iperf server
2018-09-21T22:18:30 < mawk> http://ping.online.net/
2018-09-21T22:18:38 < mawk> you can use it directly instead of going through my server
2018-09-21T22:18:45 < kakimir> where is that?
2018-09-21T22:18:47 < mawk> it's a 10 Gbps server
2018-09-21T22:18:49 < kakimir> ye
2018-09-21T22:19:03 < mawk> just ping.online.net on port 5200 for instance
2018-09-21T22:19:36 < kakimir> germany
2018-09-21T22:19:39 < kakimir> close enough
2018-09-21T22:20:00 < mawk> there's one in amsterdam also
2018-09-21T22:20:08 < mawk> at ping-ams1.online.net
2018-09-21T22:20:23 < Steffanx> dont ping the amsterdam \o/
2018-09-21T22:25:33 < kakimir> same results than with speedtest
2018-09-21T22:25:43 < kakimir> starts with like 30M
2018-09-21T22:25:49 < kakimir> then throttles to 10M
2018-09-21T22:26:29 < kakimir> my operator says 100M yes
2018-09-21T22:26:47 < kakimir> I said 100M no, restart my router?
2018-09-21T22:27:11 < kakimir> they said reset your router, press button long time
2018-09-21T22:27:34 < kakimir> I pulled my switch and wlan router
2018-09-21T22:29:41 < kakimir> now I used raspi connected to switch that is connected right to upstream connector in my electric box
2018-09-21T22:30:11 < kakimir> I don't even need 100M
2018-09-21T22:31:22 < PaulFertser> Raspi has shitty ethernet going through usb.
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2018-09-21T22:36:41 < PaulFertser> For 100M I think you can run iperf on your router itself, even a shitty one should be powerful enough for that iperf throughput. You can be checking top via another ssh session to see CPU utilisation.
2018-09-21T22:38:31 < kakimir> is there any command in linux to renew IP
2018-09-21T22:39:08 < PaulFertser> dhclient -1 -v -d eth0 (if you have dhclient installed)
2018-09-21T22:39:21 < PaulFertser> It's a userspace command, not Linux though.
2018-09-21T22:46:03 -!- tctw [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-21T22:46:38 < kakimir> tried many times
2018-09-21T22:46:52 < kakimir> isp doens't give me new ip
2018-09-21T22:47:23 < PaulFertser> It's not supposed to give you a new ip, its dhcp server is free to hand you your old ip.
2018-09-21T22:47:32 < PaulFertser> You need to change MAC to get new IP.
2018-09-21T22:47:51 < BrainDamage> generally the cache for old ip is ~24h
2018-09-21T22:48:03 < BrainDamage> so same mac asking for a new lease gets old ip if it's within 24
2018-09-21T22:48:19 < BrainDamage> it's actually a feature, so that when you reconnect fast enough the sockets can re-estabilish
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2018-09-21T23:01:00 < catphish> BrainDamage: there's more to it than that, for starters, clients can request a specific IP
2018-09-21T23:01:17 < kakimir> does switches have IP addresses?
2018-09-21T23:01:18 < catphish> and even expired leases are very likely to be reassigned to the same host
2018-09-21T23:01:21 < kakimir> I think no
2018-09-21T23:01:32 < catphish> kakimir: in theory no, a switch doesn't need an IP
2018-09-21T23:01:48 < catphish> kakimir: though in real life lots of switches have IP addresses for management purposes
2018-09-21T23:05:07 < BrainDamage> the switch itself no, the controller it can have one
2018-09-21T23:12:38 < tctw> I started testing edge (by just starting using it instead of chrome shit)
2018-09-21T23:12:43 < tctw> I have to say it's actually doing pretty great
2018-09-21T23:13:31 < Steffanx> lol go away tctw . 
2018-09-21T23:13:50 < Steffanx> Even Laurenceb does better trolls :P
2018-09-21T23:14:35 < tctw> lol
2018-09-21T23:14:38 < tctw> I'm being serious tho
2018-09-21T23:17:02 < BrainDamage> you're not trolling if you're paid for
2018-09-21T23:17:06 < BrainDamage> or in denial
2018-09-21T23:18:22 < Steffanx> Does this mean you no longer run templos, terry will turn in his grave tctw.
2018-09-21T23:19:02 < tctw> I never ran templeos, Steffanx
2018-09-21T23:19:22 < Steffanx> Did you know he died. For real
2018-09-21T23:19:40 < tctw> wait, what?!
2018-09-21T23:19:51 < tctw> when? where? why? how?
2018-09-21T23:19:58 < tctw> and most importantly: because of what?
2018-09-21T23:20:03 < tctw> also why.
2018-09-21T23:20:21 < PaulFertser> Trains are too fast and too stiff...
2018-09-21T23:20:26 < Steffanx> hit by a train
2018-09-21T23:20:37 < BrainDamage> voluntarily or not?
2018-09-21T23:20:40 < PaulFertser> He was alone so who knows.
2018-09-21T23:40:04 -!- tctw [~Tectu@82-197-160-105.init7.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
--- Day changed Sat Sep 22 2018
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2018-09-22T00:56:19 < kakimir> could anyone iperf my box?
2018-09-22T00:56:30 < kakimir> i have server running
2018-09-22T00:59:13 < kakimir> i have no remote client or mobile device that could give me reliable results
2018-09-22T01:00:29 < kakimir> mawk, still up?
2018-09-22T01:03:58 < kakimir> BrainDamage?
2018-09-22T01:04:40 < kakimir> steffi
2018-09-22T01:04:45 < Steffanx> welcome kakimir
2018-09-22T01:04:49 < Steffanx> hows the sickness
2018-09-22T01:04:54 < kakimir> iperf my box
2018-09-22T01:05:07 < kakimir> ?
2018-09-22T01:05:22 < kakimir> sickness is good
2018-09-22T01:05:36 < kakimir> feeling goos
2018-09-22T01:05:50 < Steffanx> nah im on wifi, not sure if thats doing well
2018-09-22T01:05:55 < Steffanx> but what box?
2018-09-22T01:06:12 < kakimir> raspi
2018-09-22T01:06:49 < kakimir> i removed all unnecessary things and raspi is no directly connected to upstream port
2018-09-22T01:06:53 < kakimir> now
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2018-09-22T01:08:00 < kakimir> I removed one switch and one cable from equation
2018-09-22T01:09:02 < kakimir> how bad is your wifi?
2018-09-22T01:09:38 < kakimir> is your house steel and concrete?
2018-09-22T01:11:21 < Steffanx> muh wifi isnt that bad 150/20mbit
2018-09-22T01:11:51 < emeb> kakimir: what do I need to do to help you iperf?
2018-09-22T01:12:04 < kakimir> steff did
2018-09-22T01:12:08 < emeb> kk
2018-09-22T01:12:35 < kakimir> thanks stef and emeb
2018-09-22T01:21:59 < kakimir> http://www.speedtest.net/result/7655797646 it fixed itself
2018-09-22T01:22:30 < kakimir> typical internets in finland crt 
2018-09-22T01:22:47 < kakimir> <20eur
2018-09-22T01:23:01 < kakimir> also includes 50M 4G sim
2018-09-22T01:23:12 < kakimir> unlimited
2018-09-22T01:23:20 < kakimir> bundle
2018-09-22T01:24:01 < emeb> that's about what I get for $85/mo
2018-09-22T01:24:53 < emeb> internet only - no mobile included of course
2018-09-22T01:25:58 < kakimir> thing is that 10M connection comes with rent
2018-09-22T01:26:17 < kakimir> and 100M is 15,90eur update to it so actually I pay more
2018-09-22T01:26:46 < kakimir> maybe half of the price is in the rent and 15,90 for the update and 4G sim
2018-09-22T01:27:04 < Steffanx> music for crt https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXFg5QsTcLQ
2018-09-22T01:27:25 < Steffanx> good morning crt
2018-09-22T01:28:23 < Steffanx> did you bookmark that?
2018-09-22T01:29:07 < Steffanx> nah they got out somehow
2018-09-22T01:31:50 < kakimir> :)
2018-09-22T01:35:52 < kakimir> but they are pretty
2018-09-22T01:36:46 < kakimir> it would be shame to keep them all in kitchen
2018-09-22T01:38:34 < mawk> you still need an iperf kakimir ?
2018-09-22T01:38:58 < mawk> I have 1gbps at home
2018-09-22T01:39:02 < mawk> or something like that
2018-09-22T01:39:08 < kakimir> problem fixed itself
2018-09-22T01:39:11 < kakimir> perfect mystery
2018-09-22T01:39:17 < mawk> but you could also take a public iperf server and give the -R flag
2018-09-22T01:39:18 < mawk> for reverse
2018-09-22T01:39:22 < mawk> and the server will send stuff to you
2018-09-22T01:39:22 < kakimir> see result above
2018-09-22T01:39:26 < mawk> or the reverse
2018-09-22T01:39:39 < mawk> ah, nice
2018-09-22T01:39:44 < kakimir> wait - I could have loged in my raspi via phone
2018-09-22T01:39:56 < kakimir> then iperf
2018-09-22T01:40:25 < kakimir> I removed switch and one cable from equation
2018-09-22T01:40:28 < kakimir> no effect
2018-09-22T01:40:42 < kakimir> stef confirmed
2018-09-22T01:41:03 < kakimir> isp side stuff is glitchy
2018-09-22T01:47:28 < Steffanx> did you ask crt to learn you some dutch yet, mawk?
2018-09-22T01:48:21 < mawk> no, not yet
2018-09-22T01:48:44 < mawk> I kinda tried with some books some years ago, but it didn't go very far
2018-09-22T01:50:21 < mawk> I know some words, but not enough grammar or synta
2018-09-22T01:50:22 < mawk> x
2018-09-22T01:50:58 < mawk> ik wil graag beschuit met hagelslaag
2018-09-22T01:51:01 < mawk> en boter
2018-09-22T01:51:53 < Steffanx> hagelslag ;)
2018-09-22T01:52:05 < mawk> ah yes
2018-09-22T01:52:17 < mawk> I ate those when I was like 3 and lived in the netherlands
2018-09-22T01:52:28 < Steffanx> chocolade hagelslag/
2018-09-22T01:52:34 < mawk> no, the fruits one
2018-09-22T01:52:37 < Steffanx> ah
2018-09-22T01:52:58 < mawk> vruchten hagel
2018-09-22T01:53:18 < Steffanx> https://www.deruijter.nl/en/products/suikerhagel/products/vruchtenhagel the one and only
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2018-09-22T01:53:34 < mawk> now every time I come back I buy a box of these
2018-09-22T01:53:39 < mawk> yeah these ones
2018-09-22T01:53:42 < Steffanx> the amount of suger in there,, damn
2018-09-22T01:54:00 < Steffanx> *sugar
2018-09-22T01:59:14 < emeb> Heh - we can get that druijter stuff here too.
2018-09-22T02:00:01 < emeb> but the chocolate hagel is more common than the fruit flavor
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2018-09-22T02:07:44 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gc1zz5bl8I volvo does tesla
2018-09-22T02:07:55 < kakimir> but goes further
2018-09-22T02:10:38 < emeb> clever swedes
2018-09-22T02:11:12 < kakimir> I see potential
2018-09-22T02:11:43 < kakimir> autonomous, electric, used in restricted area
2018-09-22T02:12:26 < kakimir> there is private road in finnish lapland that is used by autonomous lorries
2018-09-22T02:12:45 < kakimir> moving between mine and refinery or something
2018-09-22T02:12:52 < emeb> makes sense
2018-09-22T02:12:58 < kakimir> maybe volvo is doing tests in there
2018-09-22T02:13:38 < kakimir> when technology gets better it is migrated to smaller operations
2018-09-22T02:13:57 < kakimir> eventually it drives on roads
2018-09-22T02:14:40 < kakimir> then they add little box where humanoids are stored during drive
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2018-09-22T02:15:03 < emeb> baby steps
2018-09-22T02:15:17 < kakimir> last step is complex delivery operations
2018-09-22T02:17:57 < kakimir> I wonder where my pin collection is
2018-09-22T02:18:34 < kakimir> there was some fancy ones
2018-09-22T02:18:52 < kakimir> real airline pilot wings etc.
2018-09-22T02:19:41 < kakimir> I wonder if I did something stupid like throw them away or sell them for 10euros
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2018-09-22T04:27:05 < dongs> zyp: all pics off jvnv.net load slow as balls lately
2018-09-22T04:27:18 < dongs> like it shows black screen for 2-5 seconds then pic shows up
2018-09-22T04:27:26 < dongs> maybe its new chrome being gay
2018-09-22T04:35:51 < dongs> englishman: beep
2018-09-22T04:36:04 < dongs> see cat chats
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2018-09-22T04:46:34 < dongs> on telegram
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2018-09-22T05:00:25 < jadew> kakimir, that video seems to be aimed at investors
2018-09-22T05:01:13 < jadew> the use of buzz words gave it away
2018-09-22T05:09:41 < dongs> just up
2018-09-22T05:16:34 < branjb> <+l0de> the l0de radio hour is live! http://www.youtube.com/l0de/live This week's episode: MIRC MARYTRS! call in live! 
2018-09-22T05:22:56 < jadew> man... ltspice simulations are slow
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2018-09-22T06:07:57 < dongs> crt, nice rap
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2018-09-22T06:32:38 < jadew> anyone in good terms with control theory?
2018-09-22T06:35:00 < jadew> how do you add the error to the input signal of a plant?
2018-09-22T06:35:17 < jadew> it's not possible, is it?
2018-09-22T06:36:35 < branjb> don't think so
2018-09-22T06:36:42 < branjb> just multiply/integrate/rate
2018-09-22T06:36:52 < branjb> well
2018-09-22T06:37:00 < branjb> if your P gain is 1 I guess it's just adding error
2018-09-22T06:37:30 < jadew> yeah, but if you add the error to the input signal and there's obviously delay in the plant, then it just sky rockets
2018-09-22T06:38:03 < branjb> depending on the system yeah
2018-09-22T06:38:38 < jadew> my problem is that my plant doesn't take an error input, so how do I scale that input, based on the error?
2018-09-22T06:38:50 < branjb> it doesn't have any feedback?
2018-09-22T06:39:11 < jadew> the plant itself, no
2018-09-22T06:39:18 < jadew> I have feedback from the result
2018-09-22T06:39:22 < branjb> right
2018-09-22T06:39:30 < branjb> is this in uC code or analog?
2018-09-22T06:39:34 < jadew> analog
2018-09-22T06:39:49 < branjb> so the input is a voltage range?
2018-09-22T06:39:52 < jadew> yes
2018-09-22T06:40:18 < branjb> you can just use op amps and resistor divider to add the error in
2018-09-22T06:40:39 < jadew> branjb, yeah, but the opamp gets instant feedback
2018-09-22T06:40:44 < jadew> and it keeps adding the error to its input
2018-09-22T06:40:54 < jadew> while the error feedback is delayed
2018-09-22T06:41:00 < branjb> gotcha
2018-09-22T06:41:04 < jadew> so the opamp becomes a comparator
2018-09-22T06:41:06 < branjb> don't add then, use caps to integrate
2018-09-22T06:41:34 < jadew> ah ha
2018-09-22T06:41:36 < branjb> you can make the RC really big so it doesn't saturate your input
2018-09-22T06:41:59 < jadew> well, it has to be rather quick too
2018-09-22T06:42:05 < branjb> ok so not that big
2018-09-22T06:42:14 < jadew> but yeah, I guess I could tune it
2018-09-22T06:42:31 < branjb> if you're doing that you mine as well add in differential feedback too
2018-09-22T06:42:43 < branjb> it will keep it from overshooting too fast
2018-09-22T06:43:04 < branjb> use pots instead of resistors so you can tune it
2018-09-22T06:43:05 < jadew> Cracki, still need a drawing? I think I got my answer tho - it needs an integrator
2018-09-22T06:43:12 < branjb> gl though analog control is black magic to me
2018-09-22T06:43:29 < Jak_o_Shadows> anybody put black magic probe onto the cheap st-link clones? I sorta want a JTAG programmer
2018-09-22T06:43:30 < jadew> yeah, makes sense now, thanks to both
2018-09-22T06:45:26 < branjb> depending what you are doing it might be easier to just put a uC with ADC for feedback and DAC/PWM for adding to the input
2018-09-22T06:45:45 < branjb> that way you can control gains via software
2018-09-22T06:46:10 < jadew> I know, but I wanted to get my feet wet
2018-09-22T06:46:17 < Jak_o_Shadows> I wouldn't do it analog unless the bandwidth was too high for my uC
2018-09-22T06:46:22 < branjb> gotcha
2018-09-22T06:46:49 < jadew> I let the integrator for later, thinking I can just plug it in afterwards, but yeah, that was stupid
2018-09-22T07:01:02 < jadew> I'm using ltspice but it sometimes starts taking lot to finish the simulation
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2018-09-22T07:20:57 < dongs> https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/131867603385? how garbage are these things to stick in front of adalm-pluto input?
2018-09-22T07:21:05 < dongs> or is that going to burn it with too much power
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2018-09-22T08:03:25 < englishman> probably fine if there are no other sources you are amplifying
2018-09-22T08:03:37 < englishman> like nearby wifi etc
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2018-09-22T08:04:17 < dongs> adalm frontend is pretty garbage
2018-09-22T08:04:22 < dongs> in terms of sensitivity
2018-09-22T08:04:29 < dongs> there's a LNA on-chip but no idea if lunix code enables it or not
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2018-09-22T09:24:20 < dongs> https://www.digikey.com/en/help/tariff-information haha
2018-09-22T09:24:23 < dongs> RIP digikey
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2018-09-22T09:43:00 < jadew> dongs, what's adalm pluto?
2018-09-22T09:43:14 < jadew> and I actually had one of those things until 2 days ago
2018-09-22T09:43:18 < jadew> when I blew it up
2018-09-22T09:43:32 < dongs> those things = RF amp?
2018-09-22T09:43:34 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-22T09:43:48 < dongs> http://www.analog.com/en/design-center/evaluation-hardware-and-software/evaluation-boards-kits/adalm-pluto.html $99 sdr that does up to 6ghz rx/tx
2018-09-22T09:44:04 < jadew> neat
2018-09-22T09:44:14 < jadew> it'll be fine
2018-09-22T09:44:15 < dongs> spec says 325mhz to 3.8ghz but their official wiki has a command to enable 60-6ghz
2018-09-22T09:44:46 < dongs> its $99 on mouser
2018-09-22T09:44:50 < dongs> without needing any proof of edu
2018-09-22T09:45:09 < jadew> that's really good
2018-09-22T09:45:26 < jadew> 12-bit ADC too I think the hackrf has 8?
2018-09-22T09:45:43 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-22T09:46:41 < jadew> you can use that amp, it will be fine, just make sure you don't overload it
2018-09-22T09:47:18 < dongs> like, chinese $3 USB RTL-SDR has better sensitivity to airport traffic than this thing
2018-09-22T09:47:21 < dongs> wiht same antenna
2018-09-22T09:47:27 < dongs> USB = can receive normal shit
2018-09-22T09:47:31 < dongs> pluto = silent
2018-09-22T09:48:09 < dongs> and in general everything in the same frequenc range (like 60mhz->1.2ghz) that I can compare between rtl and pluto the latter is waaay lower
2018-09-22T09:48:35 < dongs> can barely hear any FM radio withotu distortion
2018-09-22T09:48:41 < dongs> rtl picks it up loud and clear
2018-09-22T09:48:55 < jadew> had the same experience with hackrf
2018-09-22T09:49:05 < jadew> vs RTL-SDR
2018-09-22T09:49:08 < dongs> well hackrf is just garbage
2018-09-22T09:49:13 < dongs> no surprise ther
2018-09-22T09:50:31 < dongs> rtl thing? hold on.
2018-09-22T09:50:43 < jadew> just rtl-sdr should do it I think
2018-09-22T09:51:58 < dongs> https://www.banggood.com/cocks-p-1123670.html this is the trash I got, except mine din't have a remote and it was probably like 5 bucks
2018-09-22T09:53:10 < dongs> i even swapped the tuner to R820T2
2018-09-22T09:53:21 < dongs> it comes wiht R820T or someshit.
2018-09-22T09:53:24 < dongs> pin-compatible replacement
2018-09-22T09:53:34 < dongs> anyway, im sure if you dick around with that photo you can find the real cheap ones
2018-09-22T09:54:01 < dongs> wtf is rf biaser tee
2018-09-22T09:54:36 < dongs> to apply dc offset for powered antenna?
2018-09-22T09:55:00 < dongs> i guess that must be it
2018-09-22T09:55:15 < jadew> it's used for other stuff too, but yeah
2018-09-22T09:55:23 < dongs> im seeing less of those button things and more of the longer usb stick-style shits
2018-09-22T09:55:26 < dongs> for rtl
2018-09-22T09:55:51 < jadew> i have the small one, falls apart easily
2018-09-22T09:56:01 < dongs> rtl dongle?
2018-09-22T09:56:06 < jadew> yeah
2018-09-22T09:56:07 < dongs> well its literally just a piece of shit
2018-09-22T09:56:16 < dongs> the case is kept together by pcb or wahtever
2018-09-22T09:57:02 < dongs> https://github.com/Mictronics/pluto-gps-sim this works really nice
2018-09-22T09:57:08 < jadew> how low does that adalm-pluto thing go?
2018-09-22T09:57:26 < dongs> https://www.rtl-sdr.com/adalm-pluto-sdr-hack-tune-70-mhz-to-6-ghz-and-gqrx-install/ 70 to 6 looks like
2018-09-22T09:57:51 < dongs> or you can just leave it as-is and use that downconverter shit
2018-09-22T09:58:01 < dongs> or upconverteR? wahtever from airspy or wahatever
2018-09-22T09:58:10 < dongs> that goes 0-60Mhz and puts it up into higher band
2018-09-22T09:59:48 < jadew> hmm supports full duplex
2018-09-22T09:59:51 < jadew> that's interesting
2018-09-22T10:01:26 < jadew> I'm tempted to get one
2018-09-22T10:01:35 < dongs> ya just do it
2018-09-22T10:01:40 < dongs> its neat for fucking around
2018-09-22T10:01:51 < dongs> if you can solve weak input problem on it by an amp or whatever then its great
2018-09-22T10:02:41 < jadew> did you change the transciever?
2018-09-22T10:02:54 < dongs> the chip? no i just typed those lunix commands
2018-09-22T10:02:56 < dongs> to make it 6ghz
2018-09-22T10:03:07 < jadew> oh, cool
2018-09-22T10:03:16 < dongs> its bga, and the actual chip (either 3ghz or 6ghz version) is like $250 on digikey
2018-09-22T10:03:21 < dongs> so its not worth replacing :)
2018-09-22T10:03:28 < jadew> damn
2018-09-22T10:03:38 < dongs> as long as analog keeps giving these away, its all good
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2018-09-22T10:06:00 < jadew> I should probably sell my hackrf then
2018-09-22T10:06:46 < dongs> i hope you didnt get the genuine one
2018-09-22T10:06:49 < dongs> and the china knockoff
2018-09-22T10:07:02 < jadew> I did, I have it since before the china stuff came out
2018-09-22T10:07:05 < dongs> ah
2018-09-22T10:08:41 < Jak_o_Shadows> I've been meaning to get a SDR
2018-09-22T10:11:47 < jadew> dongs, I'd be careful with that amplifier tho
2018-09-22T10:12:27 < dongs> is it gonna kill my shit
2018-09-22T10:12:32 < jadew> it can
2018-09-22T10:12:53 < jadew> if it starts oscillating, it might
2018-09-22T10:13:47 < jadew> I'm sure it's max output power is higher than the max input power of the mixer inside that IC
2018-09-22T10:13:59 < jadew> let's see the datasheet
2018-09-22T10:14:26 < jadew> 2.5 dBm peak power
2018-09-22T10:14:32 < dongs> oh
2018-09-22T10:14:35 < dongs> and that thing is like 20dbm>?
2018-09-22T10:14:46 < dongs> but thats if input is 0
2018-09-22T10:14:48 < dongs> but it will never be
2018-09-22T10:14:53 < jadew> 20 dB gain, and possibly 23 dBm output max
2018-09-22T10:14:59 < dongs> input is gonna b more like -80
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2018-09-22T10:15:29 < jadew> if it starts oscillating, it can easily get to max power
2018-09-22T10:16:20 < Jak_o_Shadows> ringaround typey stuff?
2018-09-22T10:17:25 < jadew> I've tested mine and it was ok
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2018-09-22T10:42:18 < jadew> dongs, if you can wait, I can make something to help with that and add it to my next batch of tests
2018-09-22T10:42:31 < jadew> but I don't know how long you'll have to wait
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2018-09-22T11:16:22 < dongs> yeah, i dont really care. i have no immediate use for it anyway so... if you got something that you'll test later or wahtever thats fine
2018-09-22T11:24:57 < jadew> cool, it's not about testing it, but about getting the board - I already know it's going to work, so I'll just have to add the design to one of my test boards 
2018-09-22T11:26:43 < zyp> dongs, hmm, idk
2018-09-22T11:26:47 < zyp> works fine here
2018-09-22T11:27:06 < jadew> what works?
2018-09-22T11:27:22 < zyp> my file host
2018-09-22T11:27:27 < jadew> ah
2018-09-22T11:27:32 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/IX88h.jpg <- for shit like this
2018-09-22T11:27:38 < dongs> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/TWI5D.jpg like this thing
2018-09-22T11:27:40 < dongs> takes ages to load
2018-09-22T11:27:47 < dongs> mayb e its a 10meg jpg or something?
2018-09-22T11:27:52 < zyp> maybe routing to jp sucks
2018-09-22T11:27:59 < zyp> 3M or so I think
2018-09-22T11:28:06 < zyp> phone makes shitty big files
2018-09-22T11:28:13 < zyp> but I'm too lazy to do anything about it
2018-09-22T11:28:24 < jadew> loads instantly for me
2018-09-22T11:30:44 < Steffanx> Same ^
2018-09-22T11:31:37 < Sadale> wow. For once I thought that those tubes were made of wood
2018-09-22T11:32:14 < Steffanx> Lol?
2018-09-22T11:32:16 < jadew> lmfao
2018-09-22T11:32:27 < dongs> sadale continues bringing overall channel IQ down
2018-09-22T11:32:34 < dongs> singlehandedly
2018-09-22T11:32:43 < Sadale> dongs, I'm sorry :c
2018-09-22T11:33:03 < Sadale> Last night I saw those tubes I was like "hmm. How did you bend the wooden tube?"
2018-09-22T11:33:15 < jadew> you can boil them
2018-09-22T11:33:38 < Sadale> dongs, please. I'm a software guy. :P
2018-09-22T11:33:44 < Sadale> I don't do hardware
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2018-09-22T11:35:48 < Steffanx> Installation work is low iq work in general anyway :P
2018-09-22T11:36:56 < Steffanx> I mean for the practical educated.
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2018-09-22T11:37:37 < Sadale> Unless you do it professionally, it's probably fun to do :3
2018-09-22T11:39:34 < Steffanx> Perhaps
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2018-09-22T11:46:59 < jadew> must be fun for an hour or two
2018-09-22T11:47:09 < jadew> after that it's work
2018-09-22T11:47:16 < Sadale> I see :c
2018-09-22T11:47:30 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-22T11:55:58 < Steffanx> \o
2018-09-22T11:57:56 < Steffanx> Ys?
2018-09-22T11:58:11 < Steffanx> Purple ones?
2018-09-22T12:02:19 < Steffanx> The what
2018-09-22T12:04:36 < Steffanx> So they use gutter oil?
2018-09-22T12:09:01 < Steffanx> Did you go for the skyscraper?
2018-09-22T12:13:55 < Steffanx> Lol.
2018-09-22T12:14:16 < Steffanx> Drunk crts are baad
2018-09-22T12:17:55 < Steffanx> Nothing sir stvn. Nothing.
2018-09-22T12:18:06 < Steffanx> Same old ##stm32
2018-09-22T12:22:06 < Steffanx> There?
2018-09-22T12:22:22 < Steffanx> Still no rigol?
2018-09-22T12:22:49 < Steffanx> Whut?
2018-09-22T12:25:09 < Steffanx> Oh, dont tell em
2018-09-22T12:25:14 < Steffanx> Dont show screenshots
2018-09-22T12:33:08 < Steffanx> Was about to suggest to kill the jappy and take his tools :P
2018-09-22T12:33:21 < Steffanx> Because he sold his other one
2018-09-22T12:33:47 < dongs> racism
2018-09-22T12:34:07 < Steffanx> :)
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2018-09-22T12:48:20 < Steffanx> did you see it?
2018-09-22T12:51:16 < dongs> the what
2018-09-22T12:51:22 < dongs> oh that gay movie?
2018-09-22T12:51:56 < Steffanx> no clue if crt  is referring to that
2018-09-22T12:52:58 < Steffanx> you watched a movie?!
2018-09-22T12:53:06 < Steffanx> in the cinema
2018-09-22T12:53:17 < Steffanx> Did they drug you and drag you to it?
2018-09-22T12:53:32 < Steffanx> hm
2018-09-22T12:53:38 < Steffanx> Still surprised mate.
2018-09-22T12:54:04 < Steffanx> did you watch the other ones first?
2018-09-22T12:54:57 < Steffanx> And the alien va predator ones ofcourse
2018-09-22T12:55:44 < Steffanx> Arnie \o/
2018-09-22T12:56:17 < Steffanx> hell yea
2018-09-22T13:02:53 < Steffanx> what can we help you with
2018-09-22T13:04:53 < Steffanx> only one way to visit him
2018-09-22T13:24:13 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-22T13:24:35 < dongs> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/boss-accidentally-kills-worker-blasting-13287899 RIP Laurenceb 
2018-09-22T13:30:29 < Steffanx> whops..
2018-09-22T13:30:53 < jadew> was it any good?
2018-09-22T13:31:02 < jadew> I saw Alpha yesterday
2018-09-22T13:31:34 < jadew> it was either Alpha in 4D or peppermint in 3D
2018-09-22T13:31:56 < Steffanx> 4d.. 
2018-09-22T13:32:01 < jadew> first time I went into a 4D theather, didn't know that if the character on the screen breaks his back, they break your back too
2018-09-22T13:32:03 < Steffanx> anything > 2d sucks arse.
2018-09-22T13:32:22 < jadew> the chair was out of control
2018-09-22T13:33:00 < jadew> I wanted to see what it's like
2018-09-22T13:33:08 < jadew> I think I'll stop at 3D, I like those
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2018-09-22T13:57:24 < Sadale> kawaii desu! :3
2018-09-22T13:57:30 < Sadale> nya~
2018-09-22T14:05:10 < Steffanx> \o/
2018-09-22T14:44:24 < cjbaird> The magloop's tuner is about done (still to do mounting + finish faraday cage) .. Final rotation reduction down to 0.05deg/sec, or about 40 seconds to sweep through the good SWR region. 
2018-09-22T14:45:49 < cjbaird> The cage is seriously pro. Made of fibreglass PCB offcuts soldered into a box. No-one will laugh at me at Radio Club.
2018-09-22T14:56:17 < BrainDamage> the others will laugh when you exit the radio club
2018-09-22T15:00:22 < cjbaird> I'll remind them they have uBITX kits in plastic Sistema containers. (they do! looks like ass)
2018-09-22T15:04:12 < cjbaird> The group I'm with now did however make me a member after I gave a presentation on the 74LS-chip computer I made. (Two clubs in the area. #1 is mostly train drivers who should've stayed on 11 meters, #2 is mostly retired Radio and TV Engineers; I'm in the latter)
2018-09-22T15:07:58 < cjbaird> Until recently they used to have their meetings in the NBN TV Studios (building was sold and being demolished) ..Every meet started with the obligatry dumpster-dive through the engineering dept's bins. It was 60-70 year-olds doing this.. :D (Got good gear too-- kW linear amps..)
2018-09-22T15:18:29 < cjbaird> One meeting was someone finding a 15kW RF amp for the TV station's old VHF channel, and the guys spent the evening figuring out how to make parts of it useful for the 6M band, and ended up saving the 1kW preamp. The thing was worth $250,000 new..
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2018-09-22T15:49:04 < jadew> cjbaird, I thought anyone could join those clubs
2018-09-22T15:49:45 < jadew> didn't think you'd have to prove yourself
2018-09-22T15:50:13 < PeterM> theres no requirements/qualifications to join, but if they dont like you, you can fuck right off
2018-09-22T15:50:47 < BrainDamage> that applies everywhere
2018-09-22T15:52:28 < jadew> I think I'd like it in a radio club, I'm just afraid of the types of people I could meet there
2018-09-22T15:52:59 < cjbaird> Club #1 is of the 'bigger is better (..to pay the clubhouse costs)' type, and shovels in the trash. #2 have deliberately decided to Not Be Club #1.
2018-09-22T15:53:02 < jadew> if I'd join, it would be to meet RF gurus to learn from, but as far as I can tell, most HAM operators suck at electronics... or radio
2018-09-22T15:53:17 < dongs> but they're all fat
2018-09-22T15:53:46 < cjbaird> ..and dying off. (About 6 local SKs this year..)
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2018-09-22T15:53:57 < PeterM> or their weirdly frugal for all the wrong reasons
2018-09-22T15:54:40 < BrainDamage> most hams are consumers
2018-09-22T15:54:51 < jadew> yeah, that's a good word
2018-09-22T15:55:02 < BrainDamage> also operate in a frequency range that most don't give a shit about
2018-09-22T15:55:29 < cjbaird> or wrongly frugal for weird reasons ("Alibaba is SO AWESOME! I can afford it if 50% of the stuff is counterfeit..")
2018-09-22T15:55:55 < BrainDamage> if people want to talk across the world at 300bit/s, the internet solves that issue easily
2018-09-22T15:55:57 < cjbaird> 'appliance users' 
2018-09-22T15:56:03 < BrainDamage> even if you're in buttfuck nowhere
2018-09-22T15:56:30 < BrainDamage> so if you do it, it's because it's your personal fetish
2018-09-22T15:56:40 < PeterM> i mean, look at where we are, IRC.
2018-09-22T15:57:19 < BrainDamage> well, I'd ditch irc for discord if it were to let me use a non-js pile of shit
2018-09-22T15:58:06 < BrainDamage> the desktop client is literally a web browser running the same js pile of shit
2018-09-22T15:58:38 < jadew> it's an app
2018-09-22T15:59:33 < PeterM> did you know app is short for apple, the company that invented the app?
2018-09-22T15:59:43 < Thorn> https://www.powerelectronics.com/news/freethetech-finds-5784-inventions-suppressed-us-government-secrecy-orders
2018-09-22T15:59:43 < jadew> lol, it's not
2018-09-22T15:59:45 < PeterM> too obvious?
2018-09-22T16:00:02 < jadew> but you should start that rummor
2018-09-22T16:00:17 < jadew> *rumor
2018-09-22T16:00:19 < PeterM> https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/842/755/493.jpg
2018-09-22T16:00:38 < BrainDamage> the worst part are the nagscreens in the various sites "use our app", where the main difference is just that the js garbage runs with less sandboxing so they can poke their noses in the rest of the system
2018-09-22T16:01:19 < jadew> BrainDamage, yeah, they just want to be able to deliver ads better
2018-09-22T16:01:33 < PeterM> or mobile versions of websites that are worse than jsut using the desktop site on your phone
2018-09-22T16:01:36 < jadew> maybe get access to location, contacts and then send you notifications
2018-09-22T16:01:44 < Thorn> Patents can be restricted not only for being a national security threat, but also for disrupting economic stability. This means that any number of potentially ground-breaking inventions that challenge the status quo may be restricted and suppressed.
2018-09-22T16:02:12 < BrainDamage> they can restrict movement of people
2018-09-22T16:02:28 < BrainDamage> try visiting NK with a physics degree if you're an us citizen
2018-09-22T16:03:11 < cjbaird> Wonder what that fag who got that 'Crypto in 4 lines of Perl' tattoo is doing now..
2018-09-22T16:04:03 < dongs> maybe getting buttfucked somewheer
2018-09-22T16:04:23 < jadew> which guy?
2018-09-22T16:04:28 < jadew> what do I google?
2018-09-22T16:04:29 < dongs> any guy
2018-09-22T16:04:51 < cjbaird> One of the Slashdot attention whores back in the late 1990s..
2018-09-22T16:05:31 < dongs> http://www.cypherspace.org/rsa/tattoo2.jpg
2018-09-22T16:06:20 < PeterM> disgusting
2018-09-22T16:06:31 < dongs> http://www.cypherspace.org/rsa/tattoo3.jpg
2018-09-22T16:06:32 < dongs> lol
2018-09-22T16:06:38 < dongs> http://www.cypherspace.org/rsa/tattoo1.jpg
2018-09-22T16:08:18 < cjbaird> First tattoo guy is ded! obits.dignitymemorial.com/dignity-memorial/obituary.aspx?n=Jay-Dyson&lc=1014&pid=155149010&mid=4930372&locale=en-US
2018-09-22T16:10:08 < dongs> Surprise Funeral Care
2018-09-22T16:13:19 < Steffanx> First tattoo guy? Is that some meme i do t give a damn about?
2018-09-22T16:17:14 < dongs> probably tatoo1.jpg guy
2018-09-22T16:17:35 < cjbaird> Meme foods are out, meme tattoos are in. Everyone's getting "##stm32" tats
2018-09-22T16:18:53 < Steffanx> cjbaird first.
2018-09-22T16:20:18 < PeterM> http://dontclickthis.whatingods.name/tattoo.jpg an example  of a stm32 ##tattoo
2018-09-22T16:20:34 < dongs> soudns about right
2018-09-22T16:21:49 < Thorn> TIL about "transformer driver" ICs
2018-09-22T16:22:30 < PeterM> like those shitty maxim ones?
2018-09-22T16:22:39 < Steffanx> Ty PeterM.
2018-09-22T16:23:14 < PeterM> Steffanx i mean, the link in itself gives plenty of warning
2018-09-22T16:25:57 < Thorn> TI has some too
2018-09-22T16:28:20 < Steffanx> hah PeterM it could be worse
2018-09-22T16:30:42 < Thorn> what is saturation product
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2018-09-22T17:15:39 < tctw> back to microsoft edging
2018-09-22T17:15:41 < tctw> edging all day long
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2018-09-22T17:25:20 < dongs> oh for fucks sake
2018-09-22T17:25:31 < dongs> the PCB stackup in altidumb 19 moved to a separate fucking tab
2018-09-22T17:25:37 < dongs> and you cant float it / use it as dialog
2018-09-22T17:25:51 < dongs> someone needs to slap the fuck out of them
2018-09-22T17:25:57 < dongs> DIALOGS ARE NOT FUCKING BAD
2018-09-22T17:26:04 < dongs> PEOPLE HAVE BEEN USING THEM SINCE WIN 3.1
2018-09-22T17:27:19 < tctw> dongs <3
2018-09-22T17:27:43 < dongs> at least design rules are still a dialog
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2018-09-22T18:11:03 < catphish> hurray, my thingy can now retrieve a time from gps and write it to a card!
2018-09-22T18:11:32 < catphish> now just need to do all the boring things like verifying the write and power saving
2018-09-22T18:16:21 -!- Steffanx [~steffanx@unaffiliated/steffanx] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
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2018-09-22T18:24:51 < Laurenceb124> muh heritage
2018-09-22T18:25:21 < catphish> zyp: you around?
2018-09-22T18:26:29 < Laurenceb124> https://pics.me.me/psst-mi-amigo-you-need-ancestry-mutt-merchant-31734100.png
2018-09-22T18:26:40 < Laurenceb124> mfw
2018-09-22T18:27:54 -!- chipant_ [~chipant@27.34.20.15] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-22T18:29:36 < catphish> zyp: if you see this, please could you let me know if you're still happy to optimize my antenna, and if so, can you let me know which of these parts you want populated? https://i.imgur.com/eBrhFqh.png
2018-09-22T18:30:25 < dongs> i think the way he did it was jsut stacking caps on existing ones
2018-09-22T18:30:27 < dongs> to adjust stuff
2018-09-22T18:30:41 < catphish> dongs: that's correct, but has a VNA
2018-09-22T18:31:01 < catphish> i could probably do it with a scope and a signal generator
2018-09-22T18:33:15 < catphish> i'm a bit confused as to whether any of the components that aren't C15 will have any impact on the resonance
2018-09-22T18:33:49 < catphish> that's the only component i selected based on the antenna, the others are all copied from the reference design
2018-09-22T18:34:45 < catphish> dongs: yeah he ended up with a mighty stack of capacitors, there may be a better way, i dunno
2018-09-22T18:34:59 < catphish> but i don't really have the tools to do it properly
2018-09-22T18:36:26 < Sadale> shit. I may have got a wrong MOSFET :c
2018-09-22T18:39:45 < Laurenceb124> https://imgoat.com/uploads/8f15eda80c/150264.png
2018-09-22T18:39:47 < Laurenceb124> my sides
2018-09-22T18:40:01 < dongs> lol
2018-09-22T18:52:15 < Laurenceb124> >be american >loudmouth nutter blows off steam at me in obviously larpy manner >throws baseball bat which doesn't even hit me >coldly take him out with two headshots >get celebrated as a champion of self-defense by a load of autistic incels
2018-09-22T18:52:22 < Laurenceb124> kek the replies
2018-09-22T18:52:29 < dongs> > be banned
2018-09-22T18:52:31 < dongs> > from #stm32
2018-09-22T19:30:38 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/9pZwTNT.png um
2018-09-22T19:30:42 < dongs> is GPS that wide?
2018-09-22T19:39:03 < Laurenceb124> looks about right
2018-09-22T19:39:08 < Laurenceb124> what are you looking at?
2018-09-22T19:39:15 < dongs> pluto-gps-sim
2018-09-22T19:39:22 < dongs> it worked once 3 hours ago
2018-09-22T19:39:24 < dongs> and hasnt locked since
2018-09-22T19:39:51 < dongs> http://www.ni.com/cms/images/devzone/tut/dhall_GPS_figure23.jpg
2018-09-22T19:40:58 < dongs> ok its definitely too wide compared to NI pic
2018-09-22T19:41:01 < dongs> their span is 4mhz
2018-09-22T19:41:04 < dongs> and its in the center
2018-09-22T19:41:08 < dongs> my shit takes up nearly 4mhz by itself
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2018-09-22T22:32:36 < qyx> anyone used supercaps for stm32 rtc?
2018-09-22T22:32:43 < qyx> or any other caps
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2018-09-22T22:51:58 < catphish> i looked into it, but was concerned that the voltage curve of a capacitor makes is a bit useless for long term, but i see no reason it wouldn't work for short periods, pretty sure ST suggest it
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2018-09-22T23:24:38 < Steffann> tct is dead
2018-09-22T23:26:07 < Steffann> welcome crt
2018-09-22T23:26:46 < catphish> hiiiiiiiii
2018-09-22T23:29:13 < Steffann> i blame you aandrew. You made me look at 4k screens and i bought one. Now i need a second one, because 4k and 1080p next to each other does not work ( 23" 1080p one is uuuugly)
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2018-09-22T23:42:46 < invzim> goddamn PTH stuff
2018-09-22T23:42:50  * invzim solder overload
2018-09-22T23:42:59 < Steffann> hire a cheap student
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2018-09-22T23:43:24 < invzim> china soon for sure
2018-09-22T23:43:48 < invzim> it's nice to do a 'few' to weed out trouble
2018-09-22T23:46:09 < invzim> my willingness/motivation to pay for PTH assembly has increased a lot today :)
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--- Day changed Sun Sep 23 2018
2018-09-23T00:05:32 < Steffann> :)
2018-09-23T00:31:52 -!- Steffann is now known as Steffanx
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2018-09-23T01:00:55 < Laurenceb124> >be murican >get shot
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2018-09-23T01:09:46 < Laurenceb124> >be american >neighbour is  young father who's recently moved to the area and is stressed because of the move >puts trash outside and forgets to take it to the tip as he's late for church >ambush him as he's just about to go to the orphan home he volunteers at >deliver 5000 rounds coldly and professionally to his skull while you force his wife to watch  >rape his corpse >get celebrated by 4chan incel basement dwellers
2018-09-23T01:09:54 < Laurenceb124> wew the btfoing continues
2018-09-23T01:10:23 < catphish> how is pth soldering even automated?
2018-09-23T01:10:49 < catphish> robotic tip? reflow? something else?
2018-09-23T01:11:02 < Laurenceb124> carphish: look up wave soldering
2018-09-23T01:11:22 < Laurenceb124> 4chan on suicide watch
2018-09-23T01:11:41 < Laurenceb124> they memed irresponsibly
2018-09-23T01:13:36 < catphish> cool
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2018-09-23T01:28:12 < Laurenceb124> oh wow the countermemes have begun https://postimg.cc/5HVsNMZn
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2018-09-23T01:38:24 < Laurenceb124> full scale pro/anti miller meme war underway
2018-09-23T01:39:30 < Laurenceb124> kek
2018-09-23T01:41:58 < Laurenceb124> til he has a taffbong namesake who is just as insane https://postimg.cc/5HVsNMZn
2018-09-23T01:42:07 < Laurenceb124> oops https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/local-news/prisoner-set-fire-cell-after-14803882
2018-09-23T01:42:58 < Laurenceb124> crt is literally descended from criminal scumbags
2018-09-23T01:45:19 < Laurenceb124> keek
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2018-09-23T01:58:00 < Thorn> is PC40 the same as N87?
2018-09-23T01:58:49 < Thorn> all transformer cores on aliexpress seem to be PC40 for some reason
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2018-09-23T02:01:47 < Thorn> "near match" http://www.kolektor.com/resources/files/doc/Primerjalna_tabela-feritna_jedra.pdf
2018-09-23T02:01:57 < Thorn> also wat is 35G
2018-09-23T02:02:27 < Laurenceb124> zyp at work https://postimg.cc/8srR0zK9
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2018-09-23T02:09:24 < Laurenceb124> crt confirmed as newfag
2018-09-23T02:09:36 < Laurenceb124> crt: he used to be an electrician
2018-09-23T02:31:56 < catphish> grr, card detection range of this nfc still sucks
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2018-09-23T02:36:40 < Laurenceb124> If all Australians got genocided by the Chinese, would it really be that much of a loss?
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2018-09-23T04:06:02 < mawk> BrainDamage: this is what you meant ? http://tinyurl.com/ydg5o962
2018-09-23T04:26:18 < Laurenceb124> arrrggg I hate double glazed units
2018-09-23T04:26:35 < Laurenceb124> >trying to make my own in weird polygon shapes
2018-09-23T04:27:08 < Laurenceb124> >spacers seem to be MOQ 1km+ everywhere 
2018-09-23T04:27:32 < Laurenceb124> >try getting old/smashed units to salvage spacers
2018-09-23T04:27:53 < Laurenceb124> >spend 1hour hacking glue off, get 1m deglued O_o
2018-09-23T04:28:08 < Laurenceb124> this was a bad idea
2018-09-23T04:28:48 < Laurenceb124> next plan is burn it off with propane torch I guess
2018-09-23T04:31:22 < Laurenceb124> making my own double glazed units
2018-09-23T04:32:07 < Laurenceb124> adhesives and desiccants are easy to get and cost next to nothing, easier than I expected
2018-09-23T04:32:23 < Laurenceb124> the "simple" spacers are a pita
2018-09-23T04:33:11 < Laurenceb124> I have EN1279 to hand
2018-09-23T04:33:19 < Laurenceb124> >Edge deletion is necessary because the low-e coating on the glass surface affects adhesion with insulated glass sealants
2018-09-23T04:33:26  * Laurenceb124 on suicide watch
2018-09-23T04:33:50 < Laurenceb124> I'll just ignore that part
2018-09-23T04:35:44 < Laurenceb124> yes
2018-09-23T04:35:56 < Laurenceb124> you can sleep when you are dead
2018-09-23T04:36:06 < Laurenceb124> or in my case once 2m of spaces is deglued
2018-09-23T04:36:11 < Laurenceb124> *spacer
2018-09-23T04:36:34 < Laurenceb124> >implying I live in Londonistan
2018-09-23T04:36:50 < Laurenceb124> ooh nice WD-40 is having some effect
2018-09-23T04:37:48 < Laurenceb124> how about Derby
2018-09-23T04:38:13 < Laurenceb124> home of epin youtube channels like uk-copblock
2018-09-23T04:39:01 < Laurenceb124> ok found 5l of machine oil and metal container, tiem to leave all my spacers soaking overnight
2018-09-23T04:39:09 < Laurenceb124> looks like the glue will dissolve off
2018-09-23T04:39:13  * Laurenceb124 zzz
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2018-09-23T06:12:16 < jadew> ffs... had to read this a couple of times: "Since most major currency pairs are priced to 4 decimal places, the smallest change is that of the last decimal point which is equivalent to 1/100 of 1%, or one basis point."
2018-09-23T06:12:46 < jadew> why would you define it like that?
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2018-09-23T06:16:11 < jadew> anyone tried trading currency? any traps there?
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2018-09-23T07:30:01 < dongs> https://gfycat.com/CompleteVapidHaddock RIP englishman 
2018-09-23T07:40:24 < jadew> did he die?
2018-09-23T07:40:43 < dongs> lmao long time before the camera started rolling, yes
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2018-09-23T07:44:02 < dongs> thats teh direction buttcoin price is heading too
2018-09-23T07:44:11 < dongs> so youre not wrong
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2018-09-23T08:42:13 < jadew> can't find any info on why he fell
2018-09-23T08:42:44 < jadew> I thought they're all tied together
2018-09-23T08:43:16 < dongs> he tried installing gentoo
2018-09-23T08:43:23 < dongs> alone
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2018-09-23T09:23:32 < cjbaird> Black dude falling.swf
2018-09-23T09:26:33 < cjbaird> (for the benefit of crt who can't into Flash: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXsYZm0ypFg)
2018-09-23T09:58:42 < dongs> Apple users don't know
2018-09-23T09:58:55 < cjbaird> Savior of the Universe.
2018-09-23T10:48:42 < cjbaird> \o/ ... https://w3jdr.wordpress.com/2018/02/21/ubitx-now-running-on-arm-cortex-m4/
2018-09-23T10:51:05 < dongs> > arduino IDE
2018-09-23T10:51:07 < dongs> stopped reading there
2018-09-23T10:52:21 < Steffanx> Such innovation here today
2018-09-23T10:52:48 < dongs> Transmitter | Uses IRF510s  x 2 as PA and  2N3904 x 4 drivers in push-pull mode for low distortion transmission.
2018-09-23T10:52:54 < dongs> damn thats some high end rf power amp
2018-09-23T10:52:57 < cjbaird> Bugger, the Nucleo-32 boards are all pissweak.
2018-09-23T10:55:24 < dongs> http://www.phonestack.com/farhan/ubitx/ubitx_1st_conversion.png is that geda
2018-09-23T10:55:27 < dongs> err kikcad
2018-09-23T10:55:34 < Steffanx> Im sad to see you say 80MHz is pissweak cjbaird 
2018-09-23T10:55:56 < dongs> considering the fuckign thing replaces a retarduino at 16mhz with like 8k flash..
2018-09-23T10:56:11 < dongs> maybe he wants a 400MHz H7 to morse code with
2018-09-23T10:57:25 < dongs> http://www.hfsignals.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/IMG_20171123_005855-300x225.jpg
2018-09-23T10:57:28 < cjbaird> uBITX = kit QRP HF rig, can be pushed up to ~20 watts. About $100 US, $1500 cheaper than the Elecraft stuff.
2018-09-23T10:57:28 < dongs> typical hamfag shit
2018-09-23T10:58:08 < cjbaird> Made by /women/ in India, too. 
2018-09-23T10:59:13 < cjbaird> Mostly the 32kB Flash on the Nucleo-32s is the disappoint. Would've been nice to throw 'everything' in there (WPSR, FreeDV, etc.)
2018-09-23T10:59:20 < cjbaird> *WSPR
2018-09-23T11:00:09 < dongs> -discovery or nucleo boards exist
2018-09-23T11:00:28 < Steffanx> STM32L432KC
2018-09-23T11:00:28 < Steffanx> Is like 256k.
2018-09-23T11:02:49 < Steffanx> Good day crt
2018-09-23T11:04:47 < Steffanx> Hows foxconning?
2018-09-23T11:13:27 < cjbaird> Amateur Radio will never have to worry about the STEM Cancer pushing it way in and demanding it be done their way. It's like the Furry of Technology.
2018-09-23T11:20:41 < cjbaird> Makers? can't do much with it either. Adafruit and the rest of Dougherty's Cartel can't flog chinese cheapshit at those who buy whatever's shilled at them on Hackaday because most are too casual to get a ticket.
2018-09-23T11:20:59 < dongs> lol
2018-09-23T11:26:14 < Steffanx> PCB assembling crt, mate.
2018-09-23T11:27:56 < Steffanx> Bad memory? I told you before
2018-09-23T11:28:25 < Steffanx> "it is the world's largest contract electronics manufacturer"
2018-09-23T11:28:54 < BrainDamage> foxconn is where chinese kids assemble iphones thanks to their small hands
2018-09-23T11:29:07 < Steffanx> And commit suicide while doing it
2018-09-23T11:29:47 < cjbaird> Wonder how Foxconn's suicide rate is these days.
2018-09-23T11:29:49 < Steffanx> Ikr
2018-09-23T11:30:57 < Thorn> anyone used TPS6300x?
2018-09-23T11:32:43 < dongs> me
2018-09-23T11:33:00 < dongs> where x = 1
2018-09-23T11:34:36 < Thorn> lcsc has x=0 https://lcsc.com/product-detail/DC-DC-Converters_TI_TPS63000DRCR_TPS63000DRCR_C24966.html
2018-09-23T11:34:50 < dongs> ah teh adjustable version
2018-09-23T11:34:59 < dongs> well its fine but you need FB resistors around it
2018-09-23T11:35:03 < dongs> taking up space
2018-09-23T11:35:11 < dongs> 63001 is liek, chip + coil + 2 caps = done
2018-09-23T11:35:35 < Thorn> yeah the app ckt in datasheet is pretty small
2018-09-23T11:36:08 < Thorn> well they got this https://lcsc.com/product-detail/DC-DC-Converters_TI_TPS63031DSKR_TPS63031DSKR_C15516.html
2018-09-23T11:36:15 < Thorn> but more expensive
2018-09-23T11:36:26 < dongs> less common
2018-09-23T11:36:29 < dongs> even tho its less power heh
2018-09-23T11:36:33 < dongs> weird
2018-09-23T11:36:39 < Thorn> do I need a battery protection ic in addition to this
2018-09-23T11:36:42 < dongs> anyway just get 63000 and put fb
2018-09-23T11:37:01 < dongs> not if you put a high resistance divider @ EN
2018-09-23T11:37:43 < dongs> 0.1uA in EN=off mode
2018-09-23T11:37:45 < dongs> up2you
2018-09-23T11:38:12 < Thorn> ok
2018-09-23T11:38:18 < Thorn> but I do need a charge controller
2018-09-23T11:39:36 < Steffanx> Digikey and/or mouser dont ship to russia thorn?
2018-09-23T11:40:20 < Thorn> mouser works through http://pmelectronics.ru/
2018-09-23T11:40:35 < Thorn> they add ~20-25% markup + VAT
2018-09-23T11:41:09 < Thorn> digikey apparently ships to companies for a reasonable price but their standard shipping cost is $120 lol
2018-09-23T11:44:12 < Thorn> shipito.com etc. should work if you don't try to order anything restricted
2018-09-23T11:44:24 < Thorn> I haven't tried yet
2018-09-23T12:29:26 < Steffanx> not me
2018-09-23T12:29:35 < Steffanx> and welcome
2018-09-23T12:43:05 < Steffanx> Nah. You can do it superbia1 :)
2018-09-23T12:43:25 < Steffanx> ##stm32 cheerleaders will give great suppory
2018-09-23T12:43:28 < Steffanx> Even stvn
2018-09-23T12:44:48 < Steffanx> That cable website isnt really working with china, is it?
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2018-09-23T13:14:37 < Steffanx> Autism explosion crt?
2018-09-23T13:20:02 < Steffanx> Someone is watching aircrash investigation?
2018-09-23T13:23:38 < Steffanx> Did you have that meetinf with ivan yet?
2018-09-23T13:23:42 < Steffanx> Meeting
2018-09-23T13:24:09 < Steffanx> Crazy Ivan.
2018-09-23T13:25:01 < BrainDamage> crt is already busy in a love story with dave
2018-09-23T13:25:46 < Steffanx> You do, cant fool us mate
2018-09-23T13:26:23 < Steffanx> Jones.
2018-09-23T13:26:47 < Steffanx> Good morning.
2018-09-23T13:27:38 < Steffanx> Awh
2018-09-23T13:27:56 < Steffanx> You only do TheSignalPath now?
2018-09-23T13:28:03 < BrainDamage> I didn't watch a video since ever as well, but when the channel rants about it 24/7, it's hard to avoid it
2018-09-23T13:28:04 < Steffanx> Like a pro irc ee
2018-09-23T13:31:25 < BrainDamage> ##stm32 great technical channel
2018-09-23T13:32:42 < cjbaird> w2aew does videos at not-tard level. (ex-Tektronics engineer, goes over the physics of components a lot)
2018-09-23T13:38:04 < cjbaird> PCB design is certainly influenced by Transmission line effects. Gives you a clue about why, instead of just copying someone's say-so.
2018-09-23T13:38:45 < BrainDamage> amateur radio intentionally misspelled
2018-09-23T13:38:52 < cjbaird> I think it's w2aew with a vid about pcb signal quality.
2018-09-23T13:40:16 < cjbaird> There's a guy trying to build a RISC-V non-FPGA computer, and he wasted a lot of time rediscovering all that.
2018-09-23T13:42:21 < cjbaird> "Oh noes, I have to terminate the bus with the same intrinsic impedance as the circuit conductors, otherwise I get reflected power all over the place?!?" Duh.
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2018-09-23T13:47:35 < Sadale> the project looks cool.
2018-09-23T13:49:12 < Sadale> I still don't have much idea on what this project's about after watching the whole vid, tho
2018-09-23T13:50:47 < Sadale> I used to be a game developer too. A hobbyist one. :3
2018-09-23T13:50:51 < Sadale> Now no more. :c
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2018-09-23T14:10:25 < Steffanx> Welcome
2018-09-23T14:41:17 < jadew> wtf, did aliexpress make shipping expensive?
2018-09-23T14:43:35 < jadew> no, just shipping options
2018-09-23T14:43:50 < jadew> and for most it seems to get more expensive the more items you buy (absurdly expensive)
2018-09-23T14:44:27 < oz4ga> no more guvernement subsidiced shipping?
2018-09-23T14:44:45 < jadew> found one with free shipping
2018-09-23T14:45:03 < jadew> don't know what's going on, had the same issue with a package of 1000 pcs of a component
2018-09-23T14:45:18 < jadew> it all fitted into an envelope but the shipping was $120
2018-09-23T14:45:29 < jadew> the seller gave me a discount on that
2018-09-23T14:45:37 < jadew> I think their system is broken
2018-09-23T14:47:33 < oz4ga> pfft!
2018-09-23T14:51:51 < Steffanx> i blame the cheapskates buying everything on aliexpress, not paying taxes and stuff
2018-09-23T14:57:10 < Steffanx> not sure why that is relevant, but .. :P
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2018-09-23T14:58:19 < jadew> :) I'm about to buy a bunch of stuff that won't be taxated because of how cheap they'll be
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2018-09-23T15:16:44 < Thorn> jadew: what product is that, I can tell you what shipping costs I see
2018-09-23T15:17:08 < jadew> hold on, I'm repairing my mouse
2018-09-23T15:17:27 < jadew> I don't think I have the tabs open anymore tho
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2018-09-23T15:31:03 < jadew> Thorn, don't have them open anymore
2018-09-23T15:31:19 < Thorn> ok have a cat https://www.instagram.com/p/BoBZV4OlLnE/
2018-09-23T15:33:47 < jadew> replaced my middle mouse button with one of these: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/50pcs-lot-6x6x4-3MM-4PIN-G89-Tactile-Tact-Push-Button-Micro-Switch-Direct-Plug-in-Self/32669948621.html
2018-09-23T15:33:57 < jadew> requires a lot more force to push it
2018-09-23T15:34:17 < jadew> but it'll have to do until I get the good ones
2018-09-23T15:35:07 < Steffanx> get a new mouse ? :)
2018-09-23T15:35:39 < jadew> damn it, I logged in and it cleared my cart
2018-09-23T15:35:50 < jadew> Steffanx, not until I change all the buttons at least once
2018-09-23T15:37:46 < Steffanx> makes me wonder what kind of special mouse it is then
2018-09-23T15:37:58 -!- BrainDamage [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-23T15:37:58 < jadew> genius
2018-09-23T15:38:33 < jadew> I never liked shopping for a new one
2018-09-23T15:38:41 < jadew> I know this one
2018-09-23T15:39:14 < jadew> if the battery gets too low, I can smack it against the desk a few times and it keeps working
2018-09-23T15:39:22 < jadew> doesn't collect dust around the sensor
2018-09-23T15:40:13 < jadew> and all the toxic chemicals with which it was coated have already been replaced with my own dirt and dead skin
2018-09-23T15:40:33 < jadew> speaking of which, that button was not soldered with lead free solder
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2018-09-23T15:40:41 < jadew> and I bought this mouse about 2 years ago
2018-09-23T15:41:43 < jadew> I guess RoHS regulations are only meant to burden european businesses because they don't seem to be enforced for asian vendors
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2018-09-23T15:53:41 < marble_visions> hi all, is the "var nesting = 0; void entercritical() { nesting++; disable_interrupts; }; void exitcritical() { nesting--; if (nesting == 0) then enable_interrupts; }" the canonical way of doing interrupt/process context data sharing?
2018-09-23T15:53:48 < marble_visions> freertos does it like this
2018-09-23T15:54:00 < marble_visions> but i'm wondering if there are other ways
2018-09-23T15:54:58 < jadew> code wise?
2018-09-23T15:55:56 < marble_visions> jadew: code and concept.
2018-09-23T15:55:57 < dongs> marble_visions: there's strex/ldrex or someshit in arm that does atomic stuff
2018-09-23T15:56:25 < marble_visions> dongs: oh yeah, forgot to mention that i'm asking for m0/m0plus.. otherwise these instructions are really neat.
2018-09-23T15:56:47 < jadew> marble_visions, are you using C or C++?
2018-09-23T15:56:52 < marble_visions> C
2018-09-23T15:57:10 < marble_visions> what's c++ got?
2018-09-23T15:57:24 < jadew> mutexes, scoped locks
2018-09-23T15:57:52 < jadew> you can declare a scope lock in a block and it will get released at the end of the block
2018-09-23T15:58:11 < jadew> or when you exit the scope, no matter how
2018-09-23T15:58:15 < marble_visions> jadew: so they do the underlying interrupt enable/disable for me?
2018-09-23T15:58:21 < jadew> yes
2018-09-23T15:58:34 < marble_visions> that's interesting, thanks
2018-09-23T15:58:44 < jadew> you don't have to make sure that you leave the critical section on every branch your code might take
2018-09-23T15:58:46 < jadew> np
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2018-09-23T15:59:51 < jadew> as a side story, I wrote an implementation of scoped lock 10 years or more before it was part of C++
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2018-09-23T16:00:16 < jadew> posted it on codeproject and it got laught at :/
2018-09-23T16:00:24 < jadew> I removed the article
2018-09-23T16:00:36 < jadew> years later everyone is fucking using the same concept
2018-09-23T16:00:58 < marble_visions> jadew: ah. unfortunate
2018-09-23T16:01:18 < jadew> yeah, good lesson tho
2018-09-23T16:01:56 < marble_visions> well, every course out there has the mantra "protect data, not code" so indeed scoped locks don't align with this
2018-09-23T16:02:14 < marble_visions> don't know how they are used however
2018-09-23T16:02:49 < marble_visions> i need to have a look what they've done
2018-09-23T16:03:14 < marble_visions> what lesson did you learn?
2018-09-23T16:03:34 < jadew> keep my shit to myself
2018-09-23T16:04:24 < marble_visions> right
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2018-09-23T16:04:47 < marble_visions> i was also wondering if i can use peripherals in some way to do process/interrupt sync.. 
2018-09-23T16:04:59 < jadew> there's also this thing called a synchronized value, works in a similar way tho
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2018-09-23T16:06:01 < jadew> marble_visions, you can disable interrupts from an interrupt (that a peripheral would generate) if that's what you're asking
2018-09-23T16:07:52 < marble_visions> no, using something like a timer or the bitband region (stm32l/f0 dont have one i think) to set/clear values
2018-09-23T16:08:51 < marble_visions> doing sharing without disabling interrupts, that's what i'm wondering about
2018-09-23T16:09:02 < marble_visions> might not be doable, just exploring
2018-09-23T16:09:55 < marble_visions> but there isn't anything atomic apart from the cpsie 
2018-09-23T16:10:14 < marble_visions> for (m0/m0plus)
2018-09-23T16:10:17 < dongs> https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/ec/+/refs/heads/master/core/cortex-m0/atomic.h
2018-09-23T16:10:26 < dongs> there isnt so just use/steal that concept
2018-09-23T16:10:29 < dongs> (cpsid
2018-09-23T16:10:53 < marble_visions> dongs: was just looking at that
2018-09-23T16:11:14 < dongs> besides beign filthy gcc shit, i think its the best youre gonna do on m0
2018-09-23T16:12:35 < marble_visions> yep.. can't beat decades of collectively accumulated wisdom
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2018-09-23T16:18:58 < dongs> haha
2018-09-23T16:19:07 < dongs> ther's a STM32L031 on NVidia NVLink
2018-09-23T16:19:42 < marble_visions> nice, what's it used for?
2018-09-23T16:19:48 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/5r7m3ps.jpg fuck knows
2018-09-23T16:19:57 < dongs> its just sittin there chilling on nvlink pcb
2018-09-23T16:20:05 < dongs> i bet authentication so chinks cant clone shit
2018-09-23T16:24:55 < Thorn> why L
2018-09-23T16:25:02 < dongs> maybe it was cheap
2018-09-23T16:25:30 < Thorn> maybe because QFN?
2018-09-23T16:25:41 < dongs> there is plenty of F0 in qfn
2018-09-23T16:25:58 < marble_visions> lower consumption? maybe also it's easier to do in program updates with the VTOR
2018-09-23T16:26:35 < Thorn> if you need lower than F0 you're counting µA
2018-09-23T16:26:44 < Thorn> that thing is not battery powered is it
2018-09-23T16:27:01 < Thorn> what is the connector on the left called?
2018-09-23T16:27:04 < marble_visions> the erratas on the l03x are horrible
2018-09-23T16:27:11 < Thorn> my mac mini has several of them
2018-09-23T16:27:15 < dongs> left? you mean the J501?
2018-09-23T16:27:20 < Thorn> yeah
2018-09-23T16:27:47 < Thorn> I nearly pulled a pin out of one of them while disassembling it
2018-09-23T16:28:06 < Laurenceb124> >Philip Bunce, who is known to sometimes go to work in a wig and women's clothing, was named on the Financial Times & HERoes Champions of Women in Business list, an annual ranking of 100 "company leaders who support women in business."
2018-09-23T16:28:31 < Thorn> it's got 2 prongs and crimped onto the wire
2018-09-23T16:30:00 < Thorn> *and is
2018-09-23T16:30:39 < Thorn> the pcb side simply has short flat pins that go between the prongs
2018-09-23T17:17:50 < Laurenceb124> https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/racist-troll-who-sent-rape-tweet-addresses-ukip-members-8tdvlp6qj
2018-09-23T17:17:52 < Laurenceb124> keeek
2018-09-23T17:18:28 < dongs> Want to read more?
2018-09-23T17:18:29 < dongs> Register with a few details to continue reading this article
2018-09-23T17:18:34 < dongs> actually i've read enough
2018-09-23T17:18:38 < dongs> another shitty laurence/b/ link
2018-09-23T17:19:24 < Laurenceb124> >a YouTuber who has outraged even the Alt Right
2018-09-23T17:20:05 < Laurenceb124> so much lulz
2018-09-23T17:22:09 < Laurenceb124> >his vile views and language sicken even his followers.
2018-09-23T17:27:37 < mawk> "vile views"
2018-09-23T17:27:42 < mawk> that's objective journalism right here
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2018-09-23T17:28:31 < Thorn> dongs: which li-ion charging controllers are you using? lcsc has lots of 3-4 cent China ones that are less than trustworthy
2018-09-23T17:29:09 < dongs> well all the cheap ones are linear
2018-09-23T17:29:13 < dongs> they probably do work
2018-09-23T17:29:51 < kakimir> 1cell?
2018-09-23T17:30:00 < kakimir> 1S
2018-09-23T17:30:01 < Thorn> yes 1 cell
2018-09-23T17:30:11 < kakimir> how many amps?
2018-09-23T17:30:42 < Thorn> dunno probably <= 0.5A if linear
2018-09-23T17:31:13 < kakimir> what are exactly you main parameters?
2018-09-23T17:31:19 < dongs> the cheap ones do work
2018-09-23T17:31:46 < Thorn> ok thanks
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2018-09-23T17:34:07 < dongs> there's clones of LTC4054
2018-09-23T17:34:11 < dongs> is that the shit youre referring to ?
2018-09-23T17:34:14 < dongs> for 3C thing
2018-09-23T17:35:29 < kakimir> found nice chinese chip
2018-09-23T17:35:31 < kakimir> 2A
2018-09-23T17:35:37 < kakimir> 5V input
2018-09-23T17:35:46 < dongs> 2A charge rate is retarded for anything but huge batts.
2018-09-23T17:35:52 < kakimir> buck regulator
2018-09-23T17:36:10 < dongs> you don't wanna charge most cheap trash small size packs > 1C
2018-09-23T17:36:14 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-23T17:36:21 < dongs> whcih means unless you have a 2000mAh batt, you don't need 2A charger
2018-09-23T17:36:22 < kakimir> I won't use full current
2018-09-23T17:36:26 < kakimir> in any situation
2018-09-23T17:36:48 < kakimir> well I have 3450mAh batts dongs 
2018-09-23T17:37:00 < kakimir> and still won't charge them with 3.5A
2018-09-23T17:37:08 < kakimir> just 1.5
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2018-09-23T17:38:24 < kakimir> charger size is 18mm round pcb
2018-09-23T17:38:25 < kakimir> so
2018-09-23T17:38:56 < kakimir> there is nothing to dump heat from linear regulator to
2018-09-23T17:44:45 < kakimir> dongs: SLM6510
2018-09-23T17:45:02 < Thorn> lol up to 300 mA http://www.natlinear.com/uploadfiles/2014/XT/XT4052_E.pdf
2018-09-23T17:45:07 < dongs> haha SLM
2018-09-23T17:45:31 < dongs> Thorn: nice that one actually looks pretty solid
2018-09-23T17:45:39 < dongs> has a SOT89-ish extab for heatsinking
2018-09-23T17:46:09 < kakimir> dongs: what?
2018-09-23T17:46:18 < kakimir> should I use it?
2018-09-23T17:47:08 < kakimir> my chinabuddy said it's about 20cents a piece if they produce the device
2018-09-23T17:47:25 < dongs> looks ok but shrug
2018-09-23T17:50:00 < kakimir> let me run a production of 1000pcs and I'll tell you how it went
2018-09-23T17:52:51 < Thorn> actually I've got 5 of these, I guess this is what China cloned https://datasheet.lcsc.com/szlcsc/Microchip-Tech-MCP73831T-2ATI-OT_C14879.pdf
2018-09-23T17:52:51 < dongs> kikemir which dickstarted trusted you to make 1000 boards
2018-09-23T17:53:54 < dongs> no thermal cutoffon that one
2018-09-23T17:54:19 < dongs> i mean from cell ntc
2018-09-23T17:54:25 < dongs> when its catching on fire
2018-09-23T17:54:41 < dongs> oh, not on 405x clones either
2018-09-23T17:54:42 < dongs> oh well
2018-09-23T17:54:45 < dongs> move along
2018-09-23T17:54:48 < dongs> all those look good
2018-09-23T17:56:14 < Thorn> how would it work without an extra wire from the cell?
2018-09-23T17:56:30 < dongs> usually you have a resistor divider with a NTC on one end
2018-09-23T17:56:34 < dongs> that gets taped to teh battery
2018-09-23T17:56:45 < dongs> and then center tap goes to teh ic
2018-09-23T17:57:06 < Thorn> the XT4052 datasheet says it has thermal regulation but there is no pin for ntc
2018-09-23T17:57:14 < dongs> thermal regulation for package
2018-09-23T17:57:19 < dongs> same as the microchip thing
2018-09-23T17:57:33 < dongs> as in, it will reduce charge current when it overheats (the chip package)
2018-09-23T17:57:36 < Thorn> well that's normal for any linear reg since Widlar
2018-09-23T17:57:39 < dongs> yeah
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2018-09-23T17:59:47 < kakimir> dongs: my boss
2018-09-23T17:59:59 < kakimir> sure first sample of 50pcs maybe
2018-09-23T18:06:18 -!- ski7777 [~quassel@ip5b437013.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-23T18:19:43 < Thorn> is it the one accused of cheating using a lipstick radio?
2018-09-23T18:19:49 < Thorn> or something
2018-09-23T18:28:05 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1M_k8kxHUSQ_fc6bHZz__BgYWOdhsAbbN/view?usp=sharing today
2018-09-23T18:28:39 < kakimir> you can see - I'm fucked
2018-09-23T18:30:40 < kakimir> I retired at that point
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2018-09-23T19:04:39 < Steffanx> No more aclohol for kakimir 
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2018-09-23T19:09:17 < Thorn> chess musics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgc_LRjlbTU
2018-09-23T19:09:34 < catphish> kakimir: i suck at chess, i assume the pawns are the problem here
2018-09-23T19:13:06 < mawk> some aliexpress seller gave me 0/5 feedback
2018-09-23T19:13:08 < mawk> that bastard
2018-09-23T19:13:14 < catphish> aww
2018-09-23T19:13:14 < mawk> and I gave him 5/5
2018-09-23T19:13:27 < mawk> feedbacks can't be revised on ali, sadly
2018-09-23T19:14:00 < Steffanx> Hehe. Contact aliexpress
2018-09-23T19:14:13 < Steffanx> Why would a seller do 0/5?
2018-09-23T19:14:27 < mawk> I guess it's because I didn't send a confirmation fast enough
2018-09-23T19:14:31 < mawk> it's been like a week or two
2018-09-23T19:14:49 < Steffanx> Heh.
2018-09-23T19:15:13 < mawk> but it's stupid, if I have bad feedback I don't care much, but I could get pissed and leave him bad feedback as well
2018-09-23T19:15:20 < mawk> then he loses customers and stuff
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2018-09-23T19:27:39 < Steffanx> you cant see the review before you post yours right?
2018-09-23T19:40:12 < emeb> "a show with everything but yul brynner"
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2018-09-23T19:41:50 < jadew> I recently didn't leave feedback on something because I didn't know if the product was genuine (some components)
2018-09-23T19:42:23 < jadew> I bought from the same seller in the past and they were, but this time, it felt off and I opened it up to check the die and sure enough, it was different
2018-09-23T19:42:32 < jadew> but it performed the same, so...
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2018-09-23T19:44:11 < jadew> like... exactly the same S-parameters and the same non-linearities across the entire range, so maybe the manufacturer changed something?
2018-09-23T19:45:24 < dongs> you do some weird shit man
2018-09-23T19:45:34 < dongs> ok bedtime
2018-09-23T19:45:38 < jadew> heh
2018-09-23T19:45:39 < jadew> night
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2018-09-23T19:56:48 < catphish> nfc people - any thoughts why my write commands would be timing out (most of the time) while read commands work fine?
2018-09-23T19:58:23 < Thorn> Clifford algebras are cool
2018-09-23T20:02:20 < catphish> i think it's because the default timeout for an nfc command is 5ms, but the ntag takes 10ms to do a write, but i can't find a way to change the timeout in the reader :(
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2018-09-23T20:12:55 < veverak> Thorn: once you learn quaternions you never go back
2018-09-23T20:12:57 < veverak> :)
2018-09-23T20:13:55 < catphish> they're hard, i never did learn (
2018-09-23T20:16:37 < BrainDamage> math is hard, let's go shopping
2018-09-23T20:16:56 < Thorn> IBAT = (VPROG/RPROG) * 1000
2018-09-23T20:17:10 < Thorn> I wonder if it holds for all charger ICs
2018-09-23T20:17:35 < Thorn> not just https://datasheet.lcsc.com/szlcsc/NATLINEAR-LN2054Y42AMR_C141406.pdf
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2018-09-23T20:43:35 < catphish> there's surprisingly little written about writing nfc tags :( or compatibility of anything with anything else
2018-09-23T20:44:07 < catphish> i'd love to know if anyone had actually used st95hf with ntag21x
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2018-09-23T20:54:36 < catphish> seems like it does write, it just doesn't hang around long enough to acknowledge it
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2018-09-23T21:04:06 < monode> Hello and good evening
2018-09-23T21:05:31 < Steffanx> Hello welcome.
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2018-09-23T21:08:17 < catphish> pro desk lighters?
2018-09-23T21:08:55 -!- BrainDamage_ [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-23T21:08:57 < englishman> rgb mood lighting for taking HDR pics of spotlessly clean and empty desks of course
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2018-09-23T21:09:58 < catphish> ah, i'm in an electronics channel, i guess people do actually need to look at thins in their desk
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2018-09-23T21:11:48 < MrMobius> I have an r pi cluster set up to manage turning my desk lamp on and off
2018-09-23T21:11:55 < MrMobius> v pro
2018-09-23T21:12:21 < monode> so the cluster is for fallback?
2018-09-23T21:14:04 < MrMobius> ya 32 cores of redundancy
2018-09-23T21:14:19 < monode> I ordered some nucleos from farnell, got a lead time of two weeks at least. In the meantime found a very old stm32 vldiscovery board at a shop nearby. The thing is, the whole environment is very confusing. Is there some 'quick setup' available for window, where I can just see led blinks and mess around with hardware a bit?
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2018-09-23T21:15:23 < catphish> lol
2018-09-23T21:15:37 < catphish> yay, down to the last part of my project (stm32 power management)
2018-09-23T21:15:49 < monode> I find most stuff seriously overwhelming - configuring an arm-eabi-none toolchain around eclipse, just to realize it's outdated, system workbench and running examples, only to understand that openocd doesn't work to flash/debug with stlink... ugh
2018-09-23T21:16:16 < monode> I was expecting more issues than just using a makefile and some peripheral libs
2018-09-23T21:17:05 < monode> ugh, the things I told you is what I discovered at the end of various tutorials, for which they provided no solution
2018-09-23T21:17:45 < monode> is there a reference one can use for windows and stm32 vldiscovery? (i think it's a 32f100)
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2018-09-23T21:20:46 < monode> For example, through the system workbench tutorial, I'm getting this issue with openocd, although flashing works from the st-link utility: Info : STLINK v1 JTAG v13 API v2 SWIM v0 VID 0x0483 PID 0x3744 ; Info : using stlink api v2 ; Error: init mode failed (unable to connect to the target).
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2018-09-23T21:22:12 < catphish> i've still not found an IDE i like that isn't just a text editor, gcc and st-flash
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2018-09-23T21:22:30 < catphish> which isn't great because i'd quite like a proper GUI debugger
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2018-09-23T21:31:16 < qyx> catphish: now long is the range,
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2018-09-23T21:39:33 < catphish> qyx: 50mm
2018-09-23T21:39:36 < catphish> (ish)
2018-09-23T21:39:44 < catphish> more than enough for my needs
2018-09-23T21:40:53 < Steffanx> Why arent you dutch Laurenceb ?
2018-09-23T21:41:15 < Steffanx> There is this dutch "maker"space thats full with people like you
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2018-09-23T21:47:07 < Steffanx> Harlem
2018-09-23T21:47:10 < Steffanx> Or close to it
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2018-09-23T21:48:57 < Steffanx> +a ;)
2018-09-23T21:48:58 < Steffanx> Haarlem
2018-09-23T21:50:02 < Steffanx> Oh i think i meant the hague
2018-09-23T21:53:19 < Steffanx> Idk 
2018-09-23T21:53:32 < Steffanx> They do some cool stuff though
2018-09-23T21:55:24 < catphish> is there a way to get an estimate of power consumption in low power modes?
2018-09-23T21:55:31 < catphish> ie compare sleep mode vs stop mode
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2018-09-23T21:56:38 < Steffanx> Stm32cube can do calculatiin
2018-09-23T21:56:44 < Steffanx> Calculations
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2018-09-23T21:56:54 < Rickta59> is there any down side to using 32 byte max packet size for USB CDC_ACM?
2018-09-23T21:57:15 < MrMobius> catphish, what kind of battery are you working with? I have been thinking about low power stuff lately too
2018-09-23T21:57:26 < MrMobius> o/ Rickta59
2018-09-23T21:57:33 < Rickta59> hey
2018-09-23T21:58:58 < Steffanx> I dont think they really do that superbia1 
2018-09-23T21:59:14 < catphish> MrMobius: ls14250
2018-09-23T22:00:03 < Rickta59> https://github.com/satoshinm/pill_serial this project provides 3 virtual com ports but had issues if you use 64 bytes for max packet size but seems to work ok with 32
2018-09-23T22:00:32 < Rickta59> kind of a nice solution for something like a rpi where you get 3 ttl com ports for one usb connection
2018-09-23T22:01:01 < MrMobius> catphish, neato. how are you regulating it?
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2018-09-23T22:02:04 < catphish> MrMobius: i'm not, it's curve should fit within the parameters of all my hardware
2018-09-23T22:02:49 < catphish> MrMobius: check the discharge curve https://www.mouser.com/ds/2/101/LS%2014500_0408_revised_0908.58ecd0c2-6b62-44ca-8c7e-2392.pdf
2018-09-23T22:04:37 < MrMobius> catphish, that is absurd looking
2018-09-23T22:05:23 < catphish> indeed
2018-09-23T22:05:57 < catphish> i haven't tested it yet, in fact it won't be easy to test since in theory it should take my design 2 years to discharge it :)
2018-09-23T22:06:29 < MrMobius> hehe
2018-09-23T22:06:40 < MrMobius> I have been thinking about setting up something to test cr2032s
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2018-09-23T22:07:05 < MrMobius> I saw articles about how mAh varies with current draw but I would like to measure hot shitty the cheap chinese batteries are
2018-09-23T22:07:20 < MrMobius> I could probably use them if they can get 50% as much as duracells
2018-09-23T22:07:53 < catphish> those saft ls14500 cells are expensive :(
2018-09-23T22:07:57 < catphish> but probably worthwhile for me
2018-09-23T22:09:23 < MrMobius> ya looks a lot more expensive than AAs
2018-09-23T22:09:35 < catphish> yep
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2018-09-23T22:10:23 < catphish> reasonable price here: https://cellpacksolutions.co.uk/products/batteries/saft-ls14500-aa-lithium-battery/
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2018-09-23T22:12:17 < MrMobius> have you measured the voltage of a brand new one?
2018-09-23T22:12:43 < MrMobius> I would be scared of runing at 3.8v or something even for a short time
2018-09-23T22:13:41 < catphish> Open circuit voltage: 3.67 V
2018-09-23T22:13:54 < catphish> it exceeds the max run voltage of the STM32 (3.6v)
2018-09-23T22:14:47 < catphish> i'm not sure what to do about this, i'll probably also add a schokty diode for polarity protection, so not totally sure if this is a problem or not
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2018-09-23T22:15:46 < MrMobius> maybe it doesnt matter
2018-09-23T22:16:01 < MrMobius> is it a one off? you could discharge the battery slightly before installing it
2018-09-23T22:16:43 < catphish> i'm aiming for production quality, so no
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2018-09-23T22:17:54 < catphish> i'm hoping that because the current involved is so staggeringly low that it doesn't matter
2018-09-23T22:18:00 < catphish> but i'm not sure :(
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2018-09-23T22:30:28 < qyx> catphish: seems quite reasonable for 13.56MHz
2018-09-23T22:30:35 < qyx> I would not expect much more
2018-09-23T22:30:49 < catphish> qyx: well it's good enough for me anyway :)
2018-09-23T22:31:05 < catphish> i think i've got my antenna pretty well designed in my new build
2018-09-23T22:37:15 < catphish> this stm32 power management is a rabbit hole, so many questions
2018-09-23T22:50:51 < catphish> looks like i probably want "stop" mode
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2018-09-23T23:06:58 < Steffanx> Welcome the stvn crt.
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2018-09-23T23:13:07 < MrMobius> I got lost looking at batteries after catphish's link
2018-09-23T23:14:01 < catphish> MrMobius: come to any conclusions?
2018-09-23T23:14:02 < MrMobius> anyone know if a non rechargable 3.6v cr2032 exists?
2018-09-23T23:14:41 < MrMobius> I think I could use a rechargable 3.6 2032 instead of two 3v 2032s to save space but then its only 40mah vs 220mah :(
2018-09-23T23:14:51 < catphish> MrMobius: the letters at the start are the chemistry, so ls=3.6v
2018-09-23T23:15:13 < catphish> ls2032 seems not to exist
2018-09-23T23:15:36 < catphish> MrMobius: also, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_battery_sizes for a full list
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2018-09-23T23:16:54 < MrMobius> ya lir is the rechargeable one I was looking at
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2018-09-23T23:17:19 < catphish> you probably want li-ion
2018-09-23T23:17:29 < catphish> less charge though
2018-09-23T23:19:04 < catphish> cr2032 is pretty practical though at 3.0-3.4v
2018-09-23T23:19:33 < MrMobius> nah
2018-09-23T23:19:36 < catphish> i nearly used CR123A or CR2
2018-09-23T23:19:47 < MrMobius> the ones I have out out 3v flat new
2018-09-23T23:20:02 < catphish> interesting
2018-09-23T23:20:13 < catphish> but the ls14500 has way more energy
2018-09-23T23:21:24 < aandrew> PM is a deep dark rabbit hole
2018-09-23T23:21:38 < aandrew> it's very addicting trying to wring every last uW out of a design
2018-09-23T23:21:51 < catphish> MrMobius: a voltmeter likely draws enough current to read the rated voltage rather then the open circuit voltage
2018-09-23T23:22:20 < catphish> aandrew: i'm trying not to overdo it :)
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2018-09-23T23:22:43 < MrMobius> MrMobius, why does that matter? it will be that low or lower when im drawing current
2018-09-23T23:23:02 < MrMobius> discharge curve graphs show 2.8-2.9v under load
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2018-09-23T23:23:38 < MrMobius> @catphish,
2018-09-23T23:23:44 < catphish> i just want to get my design down to 100uA, the NFC reader needs 50uA, so that gives me 50uA for the STM32
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2018-09-23T23:56:14 < kakimir> average or idle?
--- Day changed Mon Sep 24 2018
2018-09-24T00:06:41 < kakimir> works tommorowe!
2018-09-24T00:11:35 < MrMobius> do you know if a z-stated input consumes any power? I know it must be negligible but I think sleep current will be 10uA and Im wondering if leaving the mcu I use to measure voltage connected to the battery while not measuring will add a few uA
2018-09-24T00:13:59 < kakimir> it depends if you have digital buffer powered
2018-09-24T00:14:06 < kakimir> that means digital input block
2018-09-24T00:14:10 < kakimir> per pin
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2018-09-24T00:23:42 < Steffanx> MrMobius: st has a nice AN about low power stuff somewhere.
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2018-09-24T00:30:28 < MrMobius> sorry, I meant the z-state on an input pin measuring the battery of powering a second sleeping mcu
2018-09-24T00:31:27 < MrMobius> assuming the measuring mcu is powered by something else and doesnt care about power consumption
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2018-09-24T00:40:52 < chipant> hello there ... I am getting "undefined reference error calling __disable_irq() " compiler : gcc in atolli-studio.  Not being able to get its cause because everything are  being included properly. The project is not in the workspace and those project created in workspace are fine calling those functions.
2018-09-24T00:41:11 < superbia2> bedtime
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2018-09-24T00:53:08 < catphish> kakimir: average
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2018-09-24T00:54:28 < kakimir> that 50µA is active power of NFC?
2018-09-24T00:54:39 < kakimir> does it generate some sort of interrupt or so?
2018-09-24T00:55:16 < kakimir> do you need to activate it and poll like once in a second?
2018-09-24T00:55:17 < catphish> no, that's the idle tag detection power, it generates an interrupt when a tag is near
2018-09-24T00:55:45 < kakimir> you have that interrupt to non maskable interrupt pin of stm32?
2018-09-24T00:55:59 < catphish> just an exti
2018-09-24T00:56:24 < kakimir> I think it might be the thing
2018-09-24T00:56:43 < catphish> the thing?
2018-09-24T00:57:05 < kakimir> I mean it will maybe wake it up from deep sleep?
2018-09-24T00:57:42 < catphish> it should be able to wake it from stop mode
2018-09-24T00:58:16 < kakimir> is stop mode like powerdown mode?
2018-09-24T00:58:43 < kakimir> stm32 terminology is so confusing :|
2018-09-24T01:00:07 < catphish> kakimir: https://imgur.com/a/YWp6inw
2018-09-24T01:00:13 < catphish> there are several low power modes
2018-09-24T01:00:49 < catphish> stop mode is the second-lowest power mode, it stops the core and peripherals but can be woken by any exti (basically any gpio)
2018-09-24T01:01:34 < catphish> there's an even lower power standby mode that can ony be woken by a couple of special wakeup pins
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2018-09-24T01:01:54 < kakimir> in LPC world you would need to condition all the critical signals externally and then shut down all the gpio blocks and digital buffers to gain maximal powersaving
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2018-09-24T01:02:26 < MrMobius> who was saying the other day that peripherals work basically the same across vendors?
2018-09-24T01:02:28 < kakimir> catphish: why you didn't use such pin?
2018-09-24T01:02:30 < Steffanx> Stm32 master race kakimir 
2018-09-24T01:02:33 < MrMobius> I think my skepticism was valid
2018-09-24T01:03:49 < kakimir> how does it happen in stm32 world?
2018-09-24T01:03:57 < catphish> kakimir: 1) because it's not necessary, stop mode retains the ram, seemed easier to go with that
2018-09-24T01:04:03 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-24T01:04:17 < Steffanx> kakimir, standby causes a reset, no ram retention et al. RAM retention is nice. Just wait for something to happen and continue.
2018-09-24T01:04:26 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-24T01:04:55 < catphish> yeah, i prefer ram retention, and power is low enough
2018-09-24T01:05:05 < catphish> 2) there is no 2
2018-09-24T01:07:08 < kakimir> you need 2 pins?
2018-09-24T01:08:13 < catphish> no
2018-09-24T01:08:27 < catphish> just one
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2018-09-24T01:09:41 < kakimir> how it goes in stm32 world with external conditioning of signals and turning GPIO and digital buffers off in order to save more power in sleep mode and little bit more in active mode?
2018-09-24T01:12:01 < kakimir> power saving is negligble?
2018-09-24T01:12:07 < kakimir> unlike in lpc chip
2018-09-24T01:26:00 < catphish> oh. the other reason to use the exti wakeup mechanism is that it supports falling edges, WKUP lines are rising edge only, this is relevent to my application
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2018-09-24T03:43:22 < catphish> i just got stuck in a quicksand of realising that using interrupts to save power kinda means changing my whole program to be interrupt driven
2018-09-24T03:53:04 < catphish> well some of my program is quite procedural
2018-09-24T03:53:53 < catphish> in my case, see if an nfc tag is present, read from it, write to it, read from it again
2018-09-24T03:57:07 < catphish> but maybe i can run all of this in an interrupt, and allow other interrupts to interrupt the interrupt routine, is this kosher?
2018-09-24T03:58:10 < catphish> i think i'll do that
2018-09-24T04:08:47 < englishman> that is precisely what interrupt preemption priority levels are for
2018-09-24T04:09:08 < catphish> yep, was just reading about them, seems like this should be fine
2018-09-24T04:09:19 < englishman> \o/
2018-09-24T04:11:25 < catphish> i started writing that, it got really messy, mostly because any interrupt will wake it
2018-09-24T04:11:47 < catphish> nope
2018-09-24T04:12:05 < catphish> just wake when a tag is detected, run all this, then go back to sleep
2018-09-24T04:12:30 < catphish> and there are other side tasks that may get run in the meantime in interrupts
2018-09-24T04:13:21 < catphish> but trying to pause the main loop got messy, running the main task in a low priority interrupt seems less so
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2018-09-24T06:12:09 < dongs> https://lulz.com/linux-devs-threaten-killswitch-coc-controversy-1252/ lol
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2018-09-24T06:22:33 < dongs> time to write a ##stm32 code of conduct
2018-09-24T06:27:32 < dongs> I guess what should and will happen is a white/yellow-male-only “fork” of Linux, which will build easily on the current kernel and additions, with a once-and-for-all code-of-no-conduct, including mandatory swearing as a reply to bull%$§@ code – this would be the free, stable, secure kernel.
2018-09-24T06:27:38 < dongs> And on the other side, Sage and AdaEhmke can do their trans/cis/gay/lesbian whatever (and, of course, it should be nonbinary!!) kernel with the clandestine help of M$ and other civil fronts for NSA, this would be the unfree, bluescreen, backdoor kernel.
2018-09-24T06:27:42 < dongs> ahahahahah
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2018-09-24T07:12:25 < ivanshmakov> Cracki: Examples? (and citations?) In some (I’d suspect many, if not most) countries, you can not lose, e. g., the right to be credited and named author of your work. However, you can sell your exclusive ‘material’ rights as you please.
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2018-09-24T07:17:55 < ivanshmakov> Cracki: Since when gnus have fingernails?
2018-09-24T07:20:02 < ivanshmakov> (Or toenails, FTM.)
2018-09-24T07:21:47 < dongs> GNU/Stallman
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2018-09-24T07:22:51 < dongs> why is it all opensores fags are alchoholics?
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2018-09-24T07:24:17 < ivanshmakov> Cracki: FSFe is a “sister” organization; AFAIK, they have no formal ties to FSF and are entirely independent from the latter.
2018-09-24T07:24:38 < ivanshmakov> Much like Wikimedia Charters.
2018-09-24T07:30:07 < ivanshmakov> Cracki: Google says a lot of things these days. But you have to admit I was quite precocious a child if I’ve had my patch accepted to GNU Emacs in 2008.
2018-09-24T07:31:56 < dongs> the real question is why the fuck were you using emacs enough to want to submit a patch
2018-09-24T07:32:03 < dongs> everyone knows VI is superior
2018-09-24T07:32:13 < ivanshmakov> Cracki: Both; since five years ago or so.
2018-09-24T07:32:46 < ivanshmakov> dongs: I use both Emacs and Vim; I haven’t use Vi proper, though.
2018-09-24T07:35:10 < ivanshmakov> dongs: Took a glance at the lulz.com page above; two points: yes, the contributors to Linux /do/ retain their copyright to the code and, for example, can release it under any other license they please.
2018-09-24T07:35:14 < ivanshmakov> And no, the general understanding, if not explicit wording, of GPLv2, makes it non-revokable.
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2018-09-24T07:35:54 < dongs> i dont even know what ass-expressions are
2018-09-24T07:36:04 < dongs> and I have never scripted anything in vim
2018-09-24T07:36:11 < dongs> a text editor just neesd to edit text
2018-09-24T07:36:18 < dongs> i dont carea bout scripting or any other shit
2018-09-24T07:36:35 < dongs> (((gay)))
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2018-09-24T07:37:05 < dongs> the only true way to define a function is C style func(arg, arg, arg)
2018-09-24T07:37:13 < dongs> anything else is straight up faggotry
2018-09-24T07:37:34 < dongs> sup pumper
2018-09-24T07:37:46 < dongs> me too
2018-09-24T07:37:59 < dongs> yea same
2018-09-24T07:38:04 < dongs> looking at this englishman layout
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2018-09-24T07:43:59 < dongs> chinapcb works fine as long as you don't need quality
2018-09-24T07:44:20 < dongs> OK for throwaway stuff
2018-09-24T07:45:59 < dongs> allpcb.com
2018-09-24T07:46:13 < dongs> 2L is like 24h turn
2018-09-24T07:46:21 < dongs> 4L is probly same or + 24h
2018-09-24T07:46:53 < dongs> dhl by default which is like 2-3 days
2018-09-24T07:48:03 < dongs> or that
2018-09-24T07:48:06 < dongs> yeah
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2018-09-24T08:10:27 < dongs> https://www.via-labs.com/product_show.php?id=82 @ zyp
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2018-09-24T08:14:44 < dongs> so this is how you make a USB2.0 hub connected to USB3.0 which doesn't degrade per-port speed
2018-09-24T08:15:31 < dongs> High Performance 32-bit Microprocessor
2018-09-24T08:15:32 < dongs> - Powerful RISC processor
2018-09-24T08:15:36 < dongs> I wonder if they put a risc-v in there
2018-09-24T08:15:38 < dongs> cuz opensores
2018-09-24T08:20:05 < dongs> no keil support either
2018-09-24T08:20:08 < dongs> so dead on arrival
2018-09-24T08:22:38 < dongs> my keil-loving pal "upgraded" to visualgdb :(
2018-09-24T08:22:58 < dongs> his latest cubeproj with feertos and other faggot shit took like 2 mins to build in keil
2018-09-24T08:23:04 < dongs> < seconds with gcc
2018-09-24T08:23:05 < dongs> RIP
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2018-09-24T09:04:52 < dongs> holy shit
2018-09-24T09:05:11 < dongs> i turned on windows GayBar with Winkey-G and clicked [x] YES THIS IS A GAME on altidumb window
2018-09-24T09:05:14 < dongs> and enabled game mode
2018-09-24T09:05:19 < dongs> and its fucking FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAST
2018-09-24T09:18:08 < zyp> dongs, haha
2018-09-24T09:18:26 < dongs> sup, haha re what
2018-09-24T09:18:31 < dongs> ive pasted few things
2018-09-24T09:18:33 < zyp> altium
2018-09-24T09:18:36 < dongs> ah right
2018-09-24T09:18:49 < zyp> idk, just logged on, still looking for interesting stuff in backlog
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2018-09-24T09:32:24 < dongs> he got raped by bogans
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2018-09-24T09:58:01 < Steffanx> The game mode made altium faster dongs?
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2018-09-24T10:03:29 < dongs> yes
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2018-09-24T10:30:17 < zyp> I like playing altium
2018-09-24T11:07:00 < day> one of the few games that is paid to play
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2018-09-24T12:06:55 < kakimir> what would happen to this channel if he wasn't there always overseeing
2018-09-24T12:07:36 < kakimir> hmm
2018-09-24T12:07:37 < kakimir> true
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2018-09-24T12:50:29 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/svytRpmh
2018-09-24T12:50:32 < Laurenceb124> >American
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2018-09-24T13:08:28 < Thorn> my j-link doesn't work with stm32f407
2018-09-24T13:08:36 < Thorn> tested on my device and a discovery
2018-09-24T13:08:54 < Thorn> works fine on other discovery boards (f0, f429, f401) 
2018-09-24T13:09:03 < Thorn> RAM code load failure
2018-09-24T13:09:06 < Thorn> wtf
2018-09-24T13:11:44 < Thorn> I also tried writing to ram and reading from it using w4 and mem32 commands (congrats to segger for consistency), I do mem32 0x20000000, 0xaa55aa55, and it ends up at 0x2000004
2018-09-24T13:13:54 < dongs> are you still using some ancient cloned jlink?
2018-09-24T13:17:51 < Thorn> 9.4 from aliexpress
2018-09-24T13:30:17 < Thorn> and st-link flashes those f407 targets fine
2018-09-24T13:30:35 < karlp> so... don't use jlink?
2018-09-24T13:30:54 < karlp> only advantage of jlink is comes before s in the alphabet, and two less letters?
2018-09-24T13:31:43 < Thorn> the advantage is ozone
2018-09-24T13:31:54 < Thorn> it doesn't work with st-link
2018-09-24T13:32:03 < karlp> ozone doesn't work with a gdbserver? it works with jlink directly?
2018-09-24T13:32:33 < Thorn> that is correct
2018-09-24T13:32:39 < karlp> how precious
2018-09-24T13:32:45 < karlp> ozone must be amaze
2018-09-24T13:33:08 < Thorn> it is
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2018-09-24T14:36:18 < kakimir> test points!
2018-09-24T14:36:26 < kakimir> a lot of test points
2018-09-24T14:36:36 < kakimir> my new SMA
2018-09-24T14:38:16 < BrainDamage> remember, it's only a kink unless you're unable to function sexually without it, then it becomes a fetish
2018-09-24T14:38:41 < kakimir> I have doubled testpoints
2018-09-24T14:38:47 < kakimir> different types
2018-09-24T14:39:07 < kakimir> it's getting there
2018-09-24T14:42:03 < kakimir> unless I need to use pads for hacks
2018-09-24T14:44:17 < kakimir> I could ofc use SMAs for testpoints
2018-09-24T14:44:23 < kakimir> but I'm at work
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2018-09-24T15:01:52 < dongs> Fucki, i wasted 4 minutes of my life to watch that shit
2018-09-24T15:01:56 < dongs> and they didnt even show machine playing it
2018-09-24T15:02:05 < dongs> The last link has been flagged by IRC NANNY as "Possibly Unsuitable". Please find your parent(s) first and have them check the content before opening. [this channel protected by IrCNaNNY by SafeSoft v1.0b]
2018-09-24T15:02:18 < dongs> link reported for being trash
2018-09-24T15:05:04 < englishman> local fab tried a panel of eco-friendly cyanide-free ENIG
2018-09-24T15:05:08 < englishman> looks like total garbage
2018-09-24T15:05:38 < dongs> you sure it wasnt OSP?
2018-09-24T15:05:43 < dongs> i never heard of enig being eco-friendly
2018-09-24T15:05:50 < englishman> some new process
2018-09-24T15:05:52 < englishman> looks burned
2018-09-24T15:06:40 < englishman> 99% of what i get is silver plated
2018-09-24T15:06:53 < englishman> way cheaper than ENIG, flat, and works exactly the same
2018-09-24T15:07:02 < dongs> how does it store
2018-09-24T15:07:07 < englishman> 6 months or so
2018-09-24T15:07:13 < dongs> I would get all my shit in OSP but its shelf life is garbage
2018-09-24T15:07:15 < englishman> but if it passes that you can just replate it
2018-09-24T15:08:47 < englishman> client had some 4 year old boards that were silver, totally tarnished from sitting out and had fingerprints on them etc, just ran them thru the plater again and in 5min they were fine
2018-09-24T15:09:34 < englishman> local place doesnt do ENIG cuz its like a $30k investment in the gold alone and everyone is happy with silver
2018-09-24T15:09:50 < dongs> cool
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2018-09-24T15:47:02 < kakimir> does rfid work thru aluminum?
2018-09-24T15:49:57 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-24T15:50:01 < kakimir> me smart
2018-09-24T15:50:10 < kakimir> they use aluminum foil to block those
2018-09-24T15:52:24 < kakimir> my job is challenge
2018-09-24T15:52:31 < kakimir> a challenge
2018-09-24T16:00:27 < karlp> heh, just got a pic of some partners at work. smoking in the office.
2018-09-24T16:00:29 < karlp> nice one
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2018-09-24T16:02:31 < kakimir> smoking?
2018-09-24T16:02:41 < kakimir> Asia?
2018-09-24T16:03:02 < kakimir> I need to start vaping in office
2018-09-24T16:03:51 < karlp> greece
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2018-09-24T16:56:44 < englishman> kaki engineering https://i.redd.it/03kwiovut4o11.gif
2018-09-24T16:57:20 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-24T16:57:27 < kakimir> that is my engineering dream
2018-09-24T16:57:37 < kakimir> make big sometimes lethal slides
2018-09-24T16:58:34 < kakimir> if device has usb pd
2018-09-24T16:58:41 < kakimir> can it also have usb bc?
2018-09-24T16:58:54 < zyp> yes
2018-09-24T16:59:35 < kakimir> device will be visible as CDP?
2018-09-24T16:59:43 < zyp> most of the usb power protocols are independent and either side can support several
2018-09-24T16:59:57 < kakimir> or DCP
2018-09-24T17:00:18 < kakimir> can device be DCP and have PD at same time
2018-09-24T17:00:27 < kakimir> I mean there is low impendance between data lins
2018-09-24T17:00:30 < kakimir> lines
2018-09-24T17:00:55 < zyp> yeah, PD signalling goes over vbus (legacy) or CC (type-c)
2018-09-24T17:01:08 < kakimir> over VBUS waas
2018-09-24T17:01:22 < kakimir> so device needs to have buffer or battery?
2018-09-24T17:01:39 < zyp> have you even read the spec?
2018-09-24T17:01:43 < kakimir> no way
2018-09-24T17:02:00 < kakimir> all I need to know is that same device can support BC
2018-09-24T17:02:09 < kakimir> my powered device will use BC
2018-09-24T17:02:16 < zyp> have you even read https://www.usb.org/usb-charger-pd?
2018-09-24T17:02:24 < zyp> "Power Delivery is designed to co-exist with standard USB Battery Charging implementations."
2018-09-24T17:03:50 < kakimir> what is ACA
2018-09-24T17:03:56 < kakimir> micro ACA etc.
2018-09-24T17:04:00 < kakimir> do I even need to know?
2018-09-24T17:06:38 < zyp> PD spec has a section titled "Interoperability with other USB Specifications"
2018-09-24T17:09:06 < zyp> "Initial operating conditions remain the USB Default Operation as defined in [USB 2.0], [USB 3.2], [USB Type-C 1.3] or [USBBC 1.2]."
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2018-09-24T17:09:48 < zyp> so a PD device always starts out with the power allowance negotiated by one of the simpler standards, including BC
2018-09-24T17:10:03 < kakimir> I already assumed that
2018-09-24T17:10:27 < kakimir> I don't think I'll lay my eyes on that PD beast of a document
2018-09-24T17:10:35 < kakimir> yet
2018-09-24T17:12:34 < kakimir> and I think it will go over my head when I try eventually
2018-09-24T17:13:27 < zyp> what, you don't read stuff like that for leisure? :p
2018-09-24T17:14:07 < kakimir> I cannot
2018-09-24T17:15:10 < zyp> I remember on a long flight once (probably to japan), I got tired of watching movies or whatever, and without internet the only other source of entertainment I had was a usb spec collection I happened to have in my download folder
2018-09-24T17:15:36 < zyp> so I read through the old PD spec, this was before usb-c
2018-09-24T17:15:47 < zyp> so it was specifying special A plugs/sockets and shit
2018-09-24T17:16:14 < zyp> and, like I said, vbus signalling
2018-09-24T17:16:17 < kakimir> have you since used it?
2018-09-24T17:16:25 < zyp> nah, but I like knowing stuff
2018-09-24T17:16:42 < kakimir> how does the signal modulate in VBUS?
2018-09-24T17:16:56 < kakimir> I don't need to know but I'm slightly interested
2018-09-24T17:17:03 < zyp> probably some overlaid freq
2018-09-24T17:17:26 < zyp> it's BFSK based, spec says
2018-09-24T17:17:37 < zyp> it's deprecated in PD 3.0
2018-09-24T17:20:07 < zyp> PD 2.0 spec says BFSK, 23.2 MHz carrier, +/- 500 kHz deviation
2018-09-24T17:31:29 < kakimir> interesting
2018-09-24T17:32:13 < zyp> not very, I don't think a lot of devices are using it
2018-09-24T17:33:04 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-24T17:33:06 < zyp> my impression is that most PD devices that exist are type-c, and they would mainly use BMC over CC line instead
2018-09-24T17:33:27 < zyp> for type-c, BMC is mandatory, BFSK is optional
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2018-09-24T18:10:50 < kakimir> do you have recommendation for integrated usb protection solution?
2018-09-24T18:11:05 < kakimir> VBUS, D-, D+, GND
2018-09-24T18:11:12 < kakimir> all in same package
2018-09-24T18:12:22 < kakimir> https://www.onsemi.com/pub/Collateral/STF202-22T1-D.PDF
2018-09-24T18:12:43 < kakimir> something like this
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2018-09-24T18:17:57 < kakimir> how do you get transients to dataline anyways?
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2018-09-24T18:34:52 < kakimir> or is it that you get transient to shield and then datalines are in different potentials
2018-09-24T18:35:00 < kakimir> related to shield
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2018-09-24T18:53:27 < kakimir> https://www.findchips.com/search/USBLC6-2SC6 have you used?
2018-09-24T18:54:01 < karlp> I was going to say, isn't there an ST part that's exactly for this?
2018-09-24T18:56:25 < kakimir> that exact part?
2018-09-24T18:56:51 < kakimir> is there one with lower breakdown voltage?
2018-09-24T18:57:58 < kakimir> I have things with 6.5Abs max. behind it
2018-09-24T18:58:48 < kakimir> well it's better than nothing
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2018-09-24T19:11:05 < jadew> https://i.imgur.com/wwlmRrL.gifv
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2018-09-24T19:45:49 < jadew> I just found out about that linux code of conduct shit lol
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2018-09-24T19:57:37 < Steffanx> Lol jadew. Two weeks later
2018-09-24T20:01:03 < emeb> asleep at the wheel
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2018-09-24T20:42:37 < kakimir> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/For-ASUS-UX305CA-Integrated-cpu-onboard-ux305ca-mainboard-rev2-0-freeshipping-100-tested/32805375144.html anyone know that stereo socket in the pictures?
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2018-09-24T20:46:24 < aandrew> kakimir: that looks like one of those TRRRS ones. offhand not sure of mfg but I've hunted for stuff like that before too and ended up at mfg websites that looked like their nephew designed it
2018-09-24T20:46:28 < aandrew> thought it was a joke 
2018-09-24T20:46:39 < kakimir> is might be
2018-09-24T20:46:50 < kakimir> and yes
2018-09-24T20:46:57 < kakimir> they draw them in napkins
2018-09-24T20:47:21 < kakimir> and get selected to design by super low price
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2018-09-24T20:49:11 < kakimir> what is purpose of TRRRS?
2018-09-24T20:49:57 < Thorn> kakimir: look through the photos here https://lcsc.com/products/Audio-Connectors_590.html
2018-09-24T20:55:48 < kakimir> nah
2018-09-24T20:55:50 < kakimir> not there
2018-09-24T20:56:23 < kakimir> I'll double check now
2018-09-24T20:56:48 < emeb> trying to replace a bad jack?
2018-09-24T21:02:50 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-24T21:08:08 -!- comptroller [~comptroll@47-213-222-253.paolcmtc01.res.dyn.suddenlink.net] has quit [Excess Flood]
2018-09-24T21:12:15 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@45.250.226.62] has quit [Quit: Streaker]
2018-09-24T21:12:17 < kakimir> I'll just
2018-09-24T21:12:32 < kakimir> quickly do stm32 based high quality headphone amplifier
2018-09-24T21:12:35 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@45.250.226.62] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-24T21:12:42 < kakimir> usb DAC
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2018-09-24T21:19:43 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/pDwTiMD slowly but surely
2018-09-24T21:20:03 < aandrew> (https://imgur.com/a/Em9qF57 is the progress album)
2018-09-24T21:20:57 -!- Streaker [~Streaker@45.250.226.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-24T21:22:51 < emeb> I once replaced a power jack on a chromebook
2018-09-24T21:23:05 < emeb> did an ebay search and found someone selling the exact item.
2018-09-24T21:23:21 < emeb> easy solder job
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2018-09-24T21:26:53 < catphish> morning
2018-09-24T21:27:12 < englishman> incorrect
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2018-09-24T21:30:46 < Steffanx> Hello Welcome catphish
2018-09-24T21:30:52 < Steffanx> How as the day
2018-09-24T21:30:56 < Steffanx> *was
2018-09-24T21:32:33 < catphish> mighty fine thanks :) yours?
2018-09-24T21:32:49 < Steffanx> i still blame you aandrew, for "making" me to get 2 new screens. Although im not like "why i didnt get them before" :P
2018-09-24T21:33:59 < englishman> how did you live before
2018-09-24T21:34:13 < Steffanx> i could live with 1920x1080
2018-09-24T21:34:28 < englishman> :o
2018-09-24T21:34:34 < catphish> i recently switched from 2 screens to thus guy: https://i.imgur.com/1WtQV4V.jpg
2018-09-24T21:34:41 < Steffanx> Then i got 4k and i couldve live no more with 1920x1080 :P
2018-09-24T21:34:54 < englishman> no wonder the € is worthless
2018-09-24T21:35:03 < catphish> i don't like 4k, i prefer normal DPI with more area
2018-09-24T21:35:16 < Steffanx> its awful when you can count the pixels
2018-09-24T21:35:17 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/sEUYAkv.png
2018-09-24T21:35:27 < catphish> lol
2018-09-24T21:35:34 < englishman> had thsi ~3 years now time to upgrade
2018-09-24T21:35:52 < Steffanx> all that for irc.
2018-09-24T21:35:59 < englishman> no #5 is for irc
2018-09-24T21:36:15 < catphish> my laptop is 4k, but i run it at 1080 because not all applications scale properly, X11 window managers really needs to add a feature to declare an app as highres or lowres
2018-09-24T21:36:24 < Steffanx> i no longer have space for the tiny ipad screens
2018-09-24T21:36:27 < englishman> found the problem
2018-09-24T21:36:39 < Steffanx> luuuuuniiiixxx
2018-09-24T21:36:46 < englishman> why would lunix need a window manager
2018-09-24T21:36:46 < catphish> and 4k is basically 1080 of desktop area, which isn't enough for me, that new monitor is more than 2 x 1080 screens side by side
2018-09-24T21:37:11 < Steffanx> windows (apps) have a hard time with > 100 dpi as well
2018-09-24T21:37:18 < Steffanx> *%
2018-09-24T21:37:21 < Steffanx> not dpi
2018-09-24T21:37:33 < englishman> usually shitty crossplatform or java ones
2018-09-24T21:38:10 < Steffanx> its best with a screen at 100% and one at like 150%. That doesnt work well.
2018-09-24T21:38:15 < catphish> most OSs can forcefully scale apps that don't scale themselves
2018-09-24T21:38:15 < aandrew> heh, these monitors are like 6-7 years old
2018-09-24T21:38:21 < aandrew> samsung syncmaster 2343
2018-09-24T21:38:26 < catphish> linux can't, which is shit
2018-09-24T21:38:27 < aandrew> nice resolution and not stupid size
2018-09-24T21:38:42 < aandrew> but I want to get a decent size 4k with these on the side rotated
2018-09-24T21:38:50 < catphish> my screen is stupid size, but i love it
2018-09-24T21:38:54 < Steffanx> 27" is decent size.
2018-09-24T21:38:56 < Steffanx> *is a
2018-09-24T21:39:31 < aandrew> catphish: that isn't stupid size, that is just about perfect I think for 4k
2018-09-24T21:39:56 < aandrew> catphish: which monitor is that
2018-09-24T21:40:08 < Steffanx> time to clean your keyboard btw, catphish
2018-09-24T21:40:09 < Steffanx> daaamn
2018-09-24T21:40:14 < catphish> it's 34" but it runs at 3440 x 1440
2018-09-24T21:40:32 < catphish> so rather than 4k, you get double the usable space at normal dpi
2018-09-24T21:40:45 < aandrew> wow that kb is pretty grody
2018-09-24T21:40:45 < catphish> actually way more than double
2018-09-24T21:41:27 < catphish> the screen is U3417W or maybe U3415W
2018-09-24T21:41:46 < catphish> the keyboard has been with me for 12 years
2018-09-24T21:41:55 < aandrew> catphish: yes you should clean it once in a while
2018-09-24T21:42:00 < aandrew> at least once every decade, heh
2018-09-24T21:42:08 < englishman> 27" is wayyyy too big
2018-09-24T21:42:09 < catphish> lol, it gets the lint emptied out from under it
2018-09-24T21:42:17 < Steffanx> Cant handle that englishman ?
2018-09-24T21:42:25 < englishman> im gonna get some more 24" 4k i think
2018-09-24T21:42:29 < englishman> and put them in a square
2018-09-24T21:42:31 < Steffanx> at 200%?
2018-09-24T21:42:33 < englishman> with the little ones underneath
2018-09-24T21:42:40 < englishman> let me check
2018-09-24T21:42:44 < englishman> 125%
2018-09-24T21:42:51 < catphish> i'm not sure what that coating on the wrist area is, i think it's actually the plastic, but i'm not sure, it could be skin, it scrapes off
2018-09-24T21:43:41 < catphish> maybe i'll clean it one day
2018-09-24T21:43:43 < aandrew> anyway time to pick up the kid
2018-09-24T21:43:46 < catphish> have fun
2018-09-24T21:43:47 < Steffanx> have fun
2018-09-24T21:43:49 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-24T21:43:55 < catphish> :)
2018-09-24T21:44:15 < aandrew> catphish: not sure I understand "34" but runs at 3440x1440 so rather than 4k you get double usable space at normal dpi"
2018-09-24T21:44:57 < Steffanx> i assumed he meant double of 1920xsomething, which is almost 3440
2018-09-24T21:45:03 < catphish> with a 4k monitor, things are normally display at 2x the size they would be on a 1080 monitor
2018-09-24T21:45:29 < Steffanx> oh
2018-09-24T21:45:38 < catphish> whereas on this monitor they're rendered at the same size (pixel wise) that they would be on a 1080 monitor
2018-09-24T21:46:06 < Steffanx> but that's entirely up to you catphish.... you dont have to do scaling.
2018-09-24T21:46:11 < catphish> i guess on a huge 4k monitor you don't have to do scaling
2018-09-24T21:46:16 < Steffanx> Just get some good eyes
2018-09-24T21:47:02 < catphish> in any case, assuming everything is scaled at what i would consider to be 100%, this monitor is the same as 2 x 1080 monitor side by side, plus some extra in the vertical direction
2018-09-24T21:47:33 < catphish> and it's almost exactly the same size as 2 normal 24" 1080 displays side by side
2018-09-24T21:47:55 < catphish> but yeah, not high dpi
2018-09-24T21:48:18 < catphish> high dpi looks lovely to me, but i don't get any benefit from it when working afaik
2018-09-24T21:48:48 < catphish> i prefer the extra space to open 5 terminals, a browser and a mail client
2018-09-24T21:48:53 < Steffanx> i love it. 
2018-09-24T21:49:03 < Steffanx> The sharpiness
2018-09-24T21:49:48 < aandrew> Yeah I want it for layout. Zoom out and still be able to read
2018-09-24T21:50:23 < Steffanx> Hah, youre fast. Getting the kid :P
2018-09-24T22:01:18 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-24T22:13:46 < mawk> my landlord is kicking me out
2018-09-24T22:13:54 < mawk> I've received a lawsuit assignation
2018-09-24T22:14:00 < mawk> I guess it's time to emigrate to the NL now
2018-09-24T22:15:05 < aandrew> Steffanx: irc from the car. The future is now 
2018-09-24T22:19:11 < englishman> how can open source solve this problem
2018-09-24T22:22:02 < Steffanx> Lol mawk 
2018-09-24T22:22:09 < Steffanx> Are you sure
2018-09-24T22:24:30 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-24T22:38:59 < Steffanx> Are you sure about dutchland
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2018-09-24T22:49:05 < zyp> mawk, what's up with being kicked out?
2018-09-24T22:49:39 < kakimir> unpayed rent?
2018-09-24T22:49:55 < kakimir> complaints about illegal activities?
2018-09-24T22:50:04 < BrainDamage> one screen for irc/fap, the other for work
2018-09-24T22:50:12 < BrainDamage> awww, I was scrolled up
2018-09-24T22:50:14 < BrainDamage> damn
2018-09-24T22:50:25 < BrainDamage> ignore my shitty comment
2018-09-24T22:50:44 < zyp> BrainDamage, I have one screen for irc, the other for work/fap
2018-09-24T22:51:15 < zyp> works out better since I don't work when I fap
2018-09-24T22:53:20 < mawk> no I pay my rent zyp , but I'm in a low-rent appartment without being on the official rent contract
2018-09-24T22:53:30 < mawk> the person on the contract has been dead for 10 years
2018-09-24T22:53:48 < mawk> here in Paris there are waiting times of 2 or 3 years for a low-rent appartment
2018-09-24T22:53:53 < mawk> so it's fair to get kicked out
2018-09-24T22:54:36 < zyp> oh
2018-09-24T22:54:37 < qyx> emigrate to nl then
2018-09-24T22:54:40 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-24T22:54:43 < mawk> I'm planning to
2018-09-24T22:55:06 < zyp> so you kinda inherited the rent contract except not formally?
2018-09-24T22:55:16 < mawk> yes
2018-09-24T22:55:30 < mawk> and that's illegal except if (1) you're poor enough and (2) you've lived 2 years with the person on the contract
2018-09-24T22:55:33 < mawk> and I don't fulfill (2)
2018-09-24T22:56:10 < BrainDamage> here if you abuse someone else's property long enough, it becomes yours
2018-09-24T22:56:12 < zyp> what does the owner benefit from kicking you out? being able to claim a higher rent from a new contract?
2018-09-24T22:56:14 < BrainDamage> but it's like 20 years
2018-09-24T22:56:28 < mawk> yes zyp I believe it's that
2018-09-24T22:56:46 < mawk> and also they're required by law to kick me out, but they can let things go slow, and they're not
2018-09-24T22:56:47 < zyp> couldn't they just offer you a new contract?
2018-09-24T22:57:05 < mawk> it wouldn't be fair regarding the 2 years waiting lists for people that want a low-rent appt
2018-09-24T22:57:07 < zyp> or are there laws requiring them to follow a waiting list?
2018-09-24T22:57:21 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-24T22:57:36 < BrainDamage> I bet it's some BS like inheritance tax they don't want to pay
2018-09-24T22:57:40 < zyp> when you say low-rent, is that some sort of public service thing?
2018-09-24T22:57:43 < mawk> yes
2018-09-24T22:57:50 < mawk> state-funded rents for poor people
2018-09-24T22:57:52 < zyp> right, that makes sense
2018-09-24T22:58:14 < zyp> what counts as poor over there?
2018-09-24T22:58:17 < mawk> it all started when some angry neighbor snitched on me at the appartement owner company
2018-09-24T22:58:22 < zyp> i.e. how do you qualify?
2018-09-24T22:58:27 < mawk> it's regarding your salary I guess
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2018-09-24T22:58:37 < mawk> your yearly resources
2018-09-24T22:58:48 < zyp> what's the limit?
2018-09-24T22:58:54 < mawk> also if you're a single mother you get faster access, etc
2018-09-24T22:59:24 -!- kow__ [~afed@135.0.26.107] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-24T22:59:52 < mawk> it's something like 23k€/year in Paris
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2018-09-24T23:00:00 < mawk> there are categories, it's higher if you have kids and stuff
2018-09-24T23:00:07 < zyp> yeah, of course
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2018-09-24T23:00:11 < BrainDamage> before or after taxes?
2018-09-24T23:00:20 < mawk> after taxes
2018-09-24T23:00:24 < BrainDamage> because after taxes, that's way less than the average salary here
2018-09-24T23:00:26 < zyp> uh
2018-09-24T23:00:33 < mawk> yeah
2018-09-24T23:00:42 < zyp> how does it even make sense to set limits after taxes?
2018-09-24T23:00:44 < mawk> other than Paris it's 20k€/year
2018-09-24T23:00:45 < mawk> hm
2018-09-24T23:00:53 < mawk> yeah it looks pretty high actually
2018-09-24T23:01:25 < mawk> but it makes sense
2018-09-24T23:01:40 < mawk> it's your available resources zyp , so I guess it's calculated after taxes
2018-09-24T23:01:43 < mawk> but I don't know exactly
2018-09-24T23:10:20 < zyp> yeah, makes sense
2018-09-24T23:10:24 -!- jon1012 [~jon1012@foresight/developer/jon1012] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-24T23:10:45 < zyp> in norway, poverty limit is defined as 60% of the median household income after tax
2018-09-24T23:11:41 < zyp> found some numbers that's a couple of years old, saying it's about 211k NOK, which is about 22k EUR
2018-09-24T23:18:23 < englishman> per region? or the whole country?
2018-09-24T23:18:56 < zyp> my numbers are national, I figure
2018-09-24T23:19:00 < englishman> cuz, 22keur in san fran is homeless eating from garbage can level, but 22keur in idaho is Chevy 3500HD Extended Cab high class livin
2018-09-24T23:20:26 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-24T23:21:06 < zyp> I figure the differences there are larger than here, but there's still pretty huge differences between e.g. Oslo or anywhere rural
2018-09-24T23:21:41 < englishman> how's the fibreoptic house
2018-09-24T23:23:00 < kakimir> how does Mega work?
2018-09-24T23:23:09 < kakimir> it seems to be downloading file to my computer
2018-09-24T23:23:19 < kakimir> and it's not in downloads
2018-09-24T23:23:55 < kakimir> so it's javascript downloader?
2018-09-24T23:24:14 < zyp> englishman, ran the rest of the conduit yesterday
2018-09-24T23:24:14 < BrainDamage> correct
2018-09-24T23:24:23 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/COAii.jpg
2018-09-24T23:24:23 < BrainDamage> the files are encrypted server side
2018-09-24T23:24:30 < BrainDamage> the download url contains the decryption key
2018-09-24T23:24:38 < BrainDamage> this way the host is not liable for the content
2018-09-24T23:24:38 < englishman> fibre conduit?
2018-09-24T23:24:49 < zyp> 20 conduits across 15 outlet boxes, plus one for power
2018-09-24T23:25:11 < zyp> nah, it's just normal conduit, but I don't see why I can't pull fiber through it
2018-09-24T23:25:27 < kakimir> sweet
2018-09-24T23:25:29 < englishman> idk, not seen that flexi conduit before
2018-09-24T23:25:33 < kakimir> it's downloading fast too
2018-09-24T23:25:47 < kakimir> BrainDamage: so - who holds the key?
2018-09-24T23:25:56 < zyp> ah, that's standard corrugated conduit, that's pretty much all that's used here
2018-09-24T23:26:11 < kakimir> my craptop is running like full steam
2018-09-24T23:26:13 < BrainDamage> kakimir: again, the url contains it
2018-09-24T23:26:21 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-24T23:26:22 < englishman> grey rigid pvc, or metal tubes, all approved stuff is all that's used here
2018-09-24T23:26:31 < zyp> electricians mostly use prepulled conduit, so they don't even have to pull the wires through it
2018-09-24T23:26:38 < kakimir> BrainDamage: that is neat
2018-09-24T23:26:54 < englishman> i guess prepulled conduit = teck cable?
2018-09-24T23:27:01 < BrainDamage> kakimir: half of the url is the key, the other half is the content hash
2018-09-24T23:27:13 < BrainDamage> so you have content localization and decryption
2018-09-24T23:27:25 < kakimir> and let me guess
2018-09-24T23:27:29 < BrainDamage> since decryption and encryption happens before it enters their site, they have no idea what they host
2018-09-24T23:27:32 < zyp> englishman, no, it's literally prepulled conduit, same shit
2018-09-24T23:27:33 < kakimir> key is produced client side?
2018-09-24T23:27:36 < BrainDamage> yes
2018-09-24T23:27:58 < kakimir> no kimdotcom news for a while
2018-09-24T23:28:03 < BrainDamage> all of that is a convoluted scheme to not make the host liable and have no idea what you put there
2018-09-24T23:28:13 < zyp> englishman, https://picture.elektroimportoren.no/pictures/1226265.jpg
2018-09-24T23:28:38 < englishman> funky
2018-09-24T23:28:50 < zyp> they have that stuff with network cables too: https://www.alcadon.no/Media/Cache/Images/5/4/WEB_Image%20Installasjons%20Kabel%20UTP%20Cat%206%20i%20K-r%C3%B8r%2016-433144761.Jpeg
2018-09-24T23:29:32 < zyp> but it's cheaper to pull it myself, and it varies how many cables I'd want to pull in each
2018-09-24T23:29:59 < zyp> I really don't need 40 cable runs :)
2018-09-24T23:30:04 < englishman> https://youtu.be/wVNOFoM-Uqw?t=2m22s
2018-09-24T23:30:08 < englishman> this is very satisfying
2018-09-24T23:30:33 < zyp> yeah, fiber is usually pulled in smooth conduit like that
2018-09-24T23:30:57 < zyp> I've got two of those coming up from the concrete floor next to the conduit for the main power cable
2018-09-24T23:31:00 < Thorn> today is not my day
2018-09-24T23:31:05 < zyp> thinner though
2018-09-24T23:31:06 < Thorn> lan8720a refuses to work
2018-09-24T23:31:18 < Thorn> ~2V on all pins
2018-09-24T23:32:25 < Thorn> with my soldering sk1llz the gnd pad may not be connected lol
2018-09-24T23:33:49 < emeb> Thorn: I had some fun w/ bad soldering when I used a LAN8720 w/ STM32
2018-09-24T23:34:08 < emeb> Something about that CSP that makes it fussy
2018-09-24T23:34:57 < emeb> suggesting - flow some flux around the edges and hit it with a heat gun
2018-09-24T23:36:07 < catphish> oh hey zyp, i wanted to bother you for a couple of things
2018-09-24T23:36:34 < englishman> time to go pick up a case of club-mate
2018-09-24T23:38:02 < Thorn> emeb: I discovered that you can probe the pads on lan8720a from the top (the metal tabs on the top are connected to pads)
2018-09-24T23:38:17 < Thorn> so I continuity tested it and it seems to be ok
2018-09-24T23:38:27 < catphish> zyp: thing 1) did you ever try the tag detection mode on the st95hf? i've been testing it a lot, and the range is approximately 0mm, it won't detect a tag unless it's physically touching the antenna
2018-09-24T23:38:28 < Thorn> the one thing I can't test is the gnd pad
2018-09-24T23:39:32 < catphish> zyp: and thing 2) are you still happy for me to send you a board to VNA, if so, what passives should i solder? https://i.imgur.com/eBrhFqh.png
2018-09-24T23:39:48 < Thorn> and there is definitely something wrong, I output 25 MHz from stm32 MCO to XTAL/CLKIN and there is a dc offset in the signal
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2018-09-24T23:40:08 < Thorn> I assume stm32 can't have dc offset on MCO
2018-09-24T23:40:15 < englishman> use heat, take off the chip, if there is no solder blob on the center pad then add some
2018-09-24T23:40:32 < englishman> and dont skimp on flux
2018-09-24T23:40:45 < kakimir> BrainDamage: how does browser buffer file locally?
2018-09-24T23:40:54 < Thorn> englishman: there will be, I tinned both the chip and the board before soldering lol
2018-09-24T23:40:56 < BrainDamage> localstorage
2018-09-24T23:41:07 < englishman> if the chip is flat then there will be contact there
2018-09-24T23:41:07 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-24T23:41:28 < kakimir> html5
2018-09-24T23:41:35 < Thorn> the chip is sitting flat on the pcb as far as I can tell
2018-09-24T23:44:05 < kakimir> movie recommds?
2018-09-24T23:44:37 < emeb> Thorn: you can test the ground pad by using diode test from any of the other pads to gnd
2018-09-24T23:45:00 < zyp> catphish, 1: no, I haven't, I can probably do that some time I find time
2018-09-24T23:45:01 < emeb> the diode test on an DMM will forward-bias the ESD diode in the I/O pads
2018-09-24T23:45:05 < zyp> and 2: yeah, sure
2018-09-24T23:45:16 < BrainDamage> kakimir: rocco and his sisters
2018-09-24T23:45:24 < englishman> Utoya Island
2018-09-24T23:45:33 < emeb> thorn: just put anode probe on gnd and cathode probe on io pin
2018-09-24T23:45:35 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxiB89t1RzQ
2018-09-24T23:46:29 < zyp> catphish, I figure all passives, except the ones that are NA, of course
2018-09-24T23:46:31 < Thorn> I'll try that thanks
2018-09-24T23:46:44 < zyp> if it needs to be tuned in the same way as mine, I'd stack small caps on C16
2018-09-24T23:47:10 < zyp> otherwise remove C15 and stack smaller caps there
2018-09-24T23:47:44 < catphish> zyp: yeah the sole purpose of C16 and C19 is to make it easier to combine / add caps
2018-09-24T23:48:22 < BrainDamage> catphish: a cheap way to tune it, would be to put your phone as nfc transmitter and measure the induced signal
2018-09-24T23:48:29 < BrainDamage> stack caps and see where the maximum is
2018-09-24T23:48:38 < BrainDamage> then you won't need a NA
2018-09-24T23:48:41 < catphish> that's not a bad idea
2018-09-24T23:49:16 < BrainDamage> coil antennas are reciprocal, so tx efficiency = rx efficiency
2018-09-24T23:49:49 < catphish> i'm a bit confused about what impact L1, L2, C11, C12, C13, C14 will have on antenna tuning (if any)
2018-09-24T23:50:08 < BrainDamage> I'd have to see the schematic to comment
2018-09-24T23:50:15 < catphish> BrainDamage: https://i.imgur.com/eBrhFqh.png
2018-09-24T23:50:43 < zyp> it's part of the impedance matching
2018-09-24T23:51:00 < BrainDamage> that's a pi filter
2018-09-24T23:51:12 < BrainDamage> it impedance matches and suppresses the common mode signal
2018-09-24T23:51:26 < catphish> i calculated the antenna resonance based only on C15
2018-09-24T23:51:50 < zyp> one thing is having the antenna resonating at the right freq, another is having it at the right impedance at that freq
2018-09-24T23:53:45 < Thorn> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/facebook-bans-election-candidate-called-13298741
2018-09-24T23:54:59 < BrainDamage> 40 billion revenue and rising, I'd call it the opposite of dead
2018-09-24T23:55:13 < catphish> looll
2018-09-24T23:56:12 < catphish> zyp: well i'll construct a couple, will need to buy a pile of passives, will put together a pile of 100/10/1 pf
2018-09-24T23:56:29 < catphish> thanks!
2018-09-24T23:56:44 < BrainDamage> catphish: might be worth to build / buy a decade box of caps
2018-09-24T23:58:53 < zyp> BrainDamage, for pf range? sounds like you'll have more capacitance in the circuitry :p
2018-09-24T23:59:14 < BrainDamage> oh, for pf range you just add 2 wires and twist as necessary
2018-09-24T23:59:24 < BrainDamage> and measure
--- Day changed Tue Sep 25 2018
2018-09-25T00:00:14 < zyp> englishman, couple more pics for you: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/3pn6J.jpg https://bin.jvnv.net/file/Fcwql.jpg
2018-09-25T00:00:24 < zyp> that's first floor ceiling, under the rack closet
2018-09-25T00:01:27 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-25T00:02:27 < BrainDamage> where do you keep the spooky skeletons?
2018-09-25T00:02:37 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFYoPAS9ZdQ kakitrance. Monumental.
2018-09-25T00:02:39 < zyp> idk, haven't decided
2018-09-25T00:03:54 < Steffanx> What is this all zyp? All for your home network?
2018-09-25T00:03:59 < zyp> yep
2018-09-25T00:04:03 < Steffanx> Or also power stuff
2018-09-25T00:04:11 < zyp> that's all network
2018-09-25T00:04:16 < zyp> electrician started running power today
2018-09-25T00:04:56 < zyp> the thing is, I had one chance to do this right, before the walls are closed up
2018-09-25T00:05:18 < zyp> conduit is cheap, so I figured I'd rather run too much than not enough
2018-09-25T00:06:13 < zyp> no plaster going in there, luckily
2018-09-25T00:06:39 < Steffanx> ....
2018-09-25T00:06:53 < Steffanx> Who is steffan
2018-09-25T00:06:55 < BrainDamage> what
2018-09-25T00:07:38 < Steffanx> No need to ask the question: hedde?
2018-09-25T00:07:48 < karlp> zyp: there should be no ~real functional difference for bMaxPacketSize0 being 16, 32 or 64 right? they're all allowed for usb-fs?
2018-09-25T00:08:09 < karlp> usb-ls _must_ be 8, fs can be 8,16,32,64 and hs _must_ be 64
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2018-09-25T00:09:15 < zyp> karlp, that sounds about right
2018-09-25T00:09:23 < zyp> I've never tried anything but 64 though
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2018-09-25T00:09:30 < kakimir> wait.. beaky was here?
2018-09-25T00:09:45 < Steffanx> He left?
2018-09-25T00:10:00 < Steffanx> I invited him kakimir. I missed him
2018-09-25T00:10:01 < karlp> yeah, 32 works, 16 stalls linux and sometimes fails enum, same on windows, and 8 totally borks: https://github.com/libopencm3/libopencm3/issues/968#issuecomment-423289732
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2018-09-25T00:11:32 < BrainDamage> Steffanx: how to drive TFT lcd?
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2018-09-25T00:12:30 < zyp> karlp, remind me a day I have time and I can try that with the analyzer to see what's actually going on on the bus
2018-09-25T00:15:24 < Steffanx> Just use an ethernet controlled smps, BrainDamage 
2018-09-25T00:16:50 < BrainDamage> how to do software smps?
2018-09-25T00:16:51 < karlp> zyp: yeah, I'm not real excited to go and add a pile of trace in things, it sounds like something that would be hard to diagnose.
2018-09-25T00:20:38 < Steffanx> Are you the new prince beaky, BrainDamage ?
2018-09-25T00:20:51 < BrainDamage> you said you missed beaky
2018-09-25T00:20:58 < BrainDamage> pretty easy to fill that shoe
2018-09-25T00:21:21 < Steffanx> Ikr. But he stopped beakimiring
2018-09-25T00:22:50 < kakimir> are you the real beaky?
2018-09-25T00:23:10 < Steffanx> Sont you miss miss leeloo, BrainDamage 
2018-09-25T00:23:17 < Steffanx> Can you replace her?
2018-09-25T00:24:01 < BrainDamage> I don't have gray hair and picking fights with the rest of the channel users on a daily basis sound exausting to me
2018-09-25T00:24:20 < Steffanx> Gray hair?
2018-09-25T00:25:31 < BrainDamage> the few pics she posted, she had gray hair
2018-09-25T00:25:46 < Steffanx> To behonest i dont really remember, but didnt you go towards no hair? !)
2018-09-25T00:25:59 < BrainDamage> wat
2018-09-25T00:26:43 < kakimir> it took 3months to reassure I wasn't you
2018-09-25T00:26:48 < Steffanx> Getting bald.
2018-09-25T00:27:21 < Steffanx> Its Prince beaky for you, kakimir 
2018-09-25T00:27:36 < kakimir> is he rich?
2018-09-25T00:28:35 < Steffanx> He doesnt work and drinks tea all day long
2018-09-25T00:28:47 < Steffanx> Claims to be a prince or something
2018-09-25T00:28:57 < kakimir> prince of what?
2018-09-25T00:29:15 < Steffanx> Sae
2018-09-25T00:30:02 < kakimir> what if he is?
2018-09-25T00:30:15 < Steffanx> *UAE.
2018-09-25T00:30:21 < Steffanx> Would be funny
2018-09-25T00:32:23 < kakimir> fet
2018-09-25T00:32:48 < kakimir> Cracki: give more parameters
2018-09-25T00:36:03 -!- talsit [foobar@gromit.mixdown.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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2018-09-25T00:36:30 < kakimir> don't you have like wall adapter for that?
2018-09-25T00:36:55 < kakimir> my uni-t eats batteries in 8hours or so
2018-09-25T00:37:18 < kakimir> it has cycloneII inside
2018-09-25T00:38:46 < kakimir> sweet
2018-09-25T00:38:50 < kakimir> and hey
2018-09-25T00:38:54 < kakimir> that was stupid
2018-09-25T00:39:06 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/35W-4A-OLED-USB-Electronic-Load-Capacity-Tester-Volt-Amp-Energy-Power-Temp-Time/181479677729 I have this for usb things but goes only to 4volts
2018-09-25T00:40:02 < kakimir> also bought one for work - I get good ballpark figures with that for small money
2018-09-25T00:40:48 < kakimir> a lot of connectors and seperate supply connector for logic
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2018-09-25T00:41:36 < kakimir> also a usb watt meter for pass thru for devices with D- and D+ connected thru
2018-09-25T00:42:49 < kakimir> just one day used it to see if my usb charger brick advertises all the modes it promises and yes.. even Ipad did 2.3A
2018-09-25T00:44:16 -!- c4017w__ [~c4017@209.52.68.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2018-09-25T00:44:39 < kakimir> I think it's way better deal than usb dongle that only does measurements in 5V range
2018-09-25T00:46:02 < kakimir> it has had 2 flaws in my use
2018-09-25T00:47:05 < kakimir> 1) heat sink is in different potential that usb shield right next to it - most likelly VBUS
2018-09-25T00:48:21 < kakimir> 2) has screw heads poking at bottom and fan vibration makes the device wander on hard desk surface - fixed with glued rubber feet to bottom plastic piece
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2018-09-25T00:50:06 < englishman> cool zyp 
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2018-09-25T00:50:46 < zyp> electrician and plumber and stuff came today and started putting in their stuff
2018-09-25T00:51:03 < zyp> I dropped by while people were working and they commented on my hardcore network setup :p
2018-09-25T00:52:01 < englishman> https://gitlab.com/femsf/toleranux
2018-09-25T00:52:31 < englishman> yeah cuz you really need 10gbe fiber to your spotify player
2018-09-25T00:52:54 < zyp> hehe
2018-09-25T00:53:46 < zyp> one of the electricians asked me «why so much cable, isn't everything wireless nowadays?»
2018-09-25T00:54:04 < BrainDamage> wireless needs cables
2018-09-25T00:54:16 < zyp> yeah, I mentioned that
2018-09-25T00:54:31 < zyp> two of my network points are for ceiling mount APs
2018-09-25T00:54:44 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/TWI5D.jpg
2018-09-25T00:54:54 < BrainDamage> ceiling mount AP watches you masturbate?
2018-09-25T00:54:57 < zyp> that was the first one I ran even
2018-09-25T00:55:31 < englishman> if you fuck up one of those holes they have to build you a new house
2018-09-25T00:56:04 < zyp> what holes?
2018-09-25T00:56:17 < englishman> thru the studs
2018-09-25T00:56:27 < zyp> fucked up plenty
2018-09-25T00:56:35 < englishman> tear it down, start over
2018-09-25T00:56:38 < zyp> hit nails and shit, that's pretty annoying
2018-09-25T00:57:10 < zyp> bought a new 18mm drill when I started on thursday, managed to ruin it before I finished
2018-09-25T00:57:37 < zyp> so the last ~50 holes I did with a 22mm drill instead
2018-09-25T00:58:24 < zyp> speaking of fucking up, I managed to puncture the plastic a couple of times when I ran conduit in the outer walls, that was pretty fucking annoying
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2018-09-25T00:59:23 < zyp> building code is nazi about houses being airtight nowadays, so they pressure test the whole thing
2018-09-25T00:59:59 < zyp> so I had to patch the holes I made behind a fucking stud
2018-09-25T01:00:06 < BrainDamage> to protect againstn nuclear attacks?
2018-09-25T01:00:38 < zyp> to protect against moisture going where it shouldn't
2018-09-25T01:02:01 < zyp> with thick insulation, there's big thermal differences between the inside and the outside of the wall, and the warmer side carries more moisture that would condensate if it's allowed to travel over to the cold side
2018-09-25T01:02:13 < zyp> and you don't want a lot of condensation in your walls
2018-09-25T01:02:30 < zyp> apparently it was much less of a problem in old poorly insulated houses
2018-09-25T01:09:25 < catphish> i'm getting distracted by wanting to build a pnp, they're so cool
2018-09-25T01:10:10 < kakimir> PNP what?
2018-09-25T01:10:16 < zyp> BJT
2018-09-25T01:10:21 < kakimir> build?
2018-09-25T01:10:26 < kakimir> how
2018-09-25T01:10:51 < catphish> kakimir: http://openpnp.org/hardware/
2018-09-25T01:15:03 < catphish> some of them are amazing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0t2hQxZ6_u4
2018-09-25T01:17:40 < kakimir> you can talk about realities of such devices with englishman
2018-09-25T01:17:51 < kakimir> that is cool
2018-09-25T01:18:01 < kakimir> 1) you need room
2018-09-25T01:18:33 < kakimir> 2) you need money
2018-09-25T01:18:56 < kakimir> 3) you need time
2018-09-25T01:19:33 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-25T01:19:36 < englishman> holy fuck i need to move
2018-09-25T01:19:40 < englishman> heaters have started for the winter
2018-09-25T01:19:42 < englishman> its 35C in here
2018-09-25T01:19:53 < catphish> that's a little warm
2018-09-25T01:19:54 < englishman> landlord's solution? get the adjacent unit to start their ac
2018-09-25T01:19:58 < kakimir> move?
2018-09-25T01:19:59 < englishman> it's 6:30pm
2018-09-25T01:20:08 < englishman> all these lazy french fucks are gone for the day
2018-09-25T01:20:13 < kakimir> thermostat?
2018-09-25T01:20:16 < kakimir> what is going on englishman?
2018-09-25T01:20:21 < catphish> i'm quite sure i can build a reasonable openpnp, my concern is more whether i'll ever use it
2018-09-25T01:20:23 < englishman> office is hot
2018-09-25T01:20:28 < englishman> sure
2018-09-25T01:20:37 < englishman> you can build a caffeine powered rocket to jupiter
2018-09-25T01:20:40 < kakimir> I thought you did business in your house
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2018-09-25T01:20:48 < englishman> no
2018-09-25T01:20:55 < englishman> ive had this office 2y
2018-09-25T01:20:59 < kakimir> okay
2018-09-25T01:21:00 < englishman> and a smaller one before that
2018-09-25T01:21:16 < englishman> but now its 100% time to fuck off
2018-09-25T01:21:43 < kakimir> high voltage coffee
2018-09-25T01:22:08 < kakimir> has canada still to invent thermostat for buildings?
2018-09-25T01:22:29 < englishman> this place has a dope hvac actually
2018-09-25T01:22:37 < englishman> but they refuse to connect my office properly
2018-09-25T01:22:44 < kakimir> oh
2018-09-25T01:22:49 < englishman> cuz its a sublet portion of a larger office
2018-09-25T01:23:04 < kakimir> room inside bigger office
2018-09-25T01:23:27 < kakimir> is your oven heating the place?
2018-09-25T01:23:32 < englishman> of course
2018-09-25T01:24:12 < kakimir> do you live in farm englishman?
2018-09-25T01:24:21 < kakimir> or do you have apparment in city or so?
2018-09-25T01:24:25 < englishman> yeah i am consdering build a cheap quonset hut
2018-09-25T01:24:33 < englishman> but an office in the city is very convenient
2018-09-25T01:25:12 < kakimir> https://www.steelmasterusa.com/news/7-things-consider-buying-steel-quonset-hut/
2018-09-25T01:25:16 < kakimir> first pic is nice
2018-09-25T01:26:33 < kakimir> you build quonset hut for your operations or house?
2018-09-25T01:27:26 < kakimir> or both?
2018-09-25T01:44:28 < kakimir> there is A/B versions of the optic ethernet converters where there is only one SC connector per box
2018-09-25T01:44:51 < kakimir> then there is boxes like mine with 2 SC connectors
2018-09-25T01:44:56 < kakimir> why?
--- Log closed Tue Sep 25 01:55:12 2018
--- Log opened Tue Sep 25 01:55:22 2018
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2018-09-25T04:00:37 < Laurenceb124> muh
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2018-09-25T04:08:31 < kakimir> muh sentence
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2018-09-25T04:12:35 < Laurenceb124> https://filebin.net/039neuysudeagngq/Bioenergy.tar.gz?t=4q4b756r
2018-09-25T04:12:37 < Laurenceb124> fail
2018-09-25T04:12:44 < Laurenceb124> wrong copypasta
2018-09-25T04:16:14 < Laurenceb124> >Williams and her husband, Reddit co-founder
2018-09-25T04:16:18 < Laurenceb124> wtf did I just read
2018-09-25T04:16:28 < Laurenceb124> the absolute state of reddit
2018-09-25T04:19:50 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/jC6yMx6s
2018-09-25T04:20:27 < dongs> looks jewish
2018-09-25T04:20:33 < dongs> also you should probly stop pasting shit
2018-09-25T04:24:14 < Laurenceb124> ikr, got my pastas mixed up
2018-09-25T04:25:44 < Laurenceb124> I need an automated shitposting gui
2018-09-25T04:33:30 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/hQ88xgst
2018-09-25T04:34:26 < Laurenceb124> its funny cuz she's probably getting raeped by the prison dykes right now
2018-09-25T04:40:39 < englishman> wifeishman sent me this
2018-09-25T04:40:40 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/d7ADWqA.png
2018-09-25T04:40:44 < englishman> thats bacon fat
2018-09-25T04:40:50 < englishman> the hole in the middle is from a very bad kitty
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2018-09-25T04:59:25 < englishman> does anyone here have any intel edison they can sell me
2018-09-25T05:01:48 < emeb_mac> I've got a barely used Galileo
2018-09-25T05:02:58 < dongs> does intel
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2018-09-25T05:20:15 < englishman> no last buy date was over a year ago
2018-09-25T05:20:23 < dongs> RIP
2018-09-25T05:31:55 < dongs> englishman: beep DSI
2018-09-25T05:32:00 < dongs> in cat chat
2018-09-25T05:33:07 -!- inca [~inca@162.154.131.90] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-25T05:33:54 < englishman> mee wow
2018-09-25T05:33:59 < dongs> ror
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2018-09-25T05:36:25 < dongs> not being able to dismiss fucking altidumb sidepanel "
2018-09-25T05:36:31 < dongs> dialogs" with ESC is fucking infuriating
2018-09-25T05:36:36 < dongs> yes, i cahgned view mode, now fucking git out of here
2018-09-25T05:36:40 < dongs> but no i need to find this tiny fucking X
2018-09-25T05:36:42 < dongs> to get it closed
2018-09-25T05:36:50 < dongs> does anyone at altidumb actually FUCKING USE this shit
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2018-09-25T06:34:20 < emeb_mac> diptrace 4-ever
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2018-09-25T07:11:13 < emeb_mac> muzeeks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsle1XldQvc
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2018-09-25T07:33:37 < englishman> closed sores music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7cTdCe1MSo
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2018-09-25T07:46:34 -!- Irssi: ##stm32: Total of 135 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 134 normal]
2018-09-25T07:47:54 < dongs> something is fucked with toggle elbow side in new altidumb
2018-09-25T07:47:55 < dongs> god damn
2018-09-25T07:48:00 < dongs> it just doesnt work
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2018-09-25T08:19:42 < kakimir> why so many problems
2018-09-25T08:20:06 < emeb_mac> crap software
2018-09-25T08:20:23 < dongs> "not opensores"
2018-09-25T08:20:37 < kakimir> kicad just works
2018-09-25T08:20:54 < dongs> yeah as long as your definition of "works" is "lunix on desktop" it certainlky does
2018-09-25T08:21:34 < emeb_mac> chinese bloatware
2018-09-25T08:22:15 < kakimir> maybe I'll go to work>
2018-09-25T08:22:35 < emeb_mac> it's good to get paid
2018-09-25T08:38:20 < englishman> 26 steel rods are missing from the FIU bridge collapse evidence collection
2018-09-25T08:38:22 < englishman> dun dun dun
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2018-09-25T08:43:28 < emeb_mac> someone needed some rebar for their patio?
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2018-09-25T09:30:32 < jadew> guy makes jet engine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYFYZ-g7fzA
2018-09-25T09:31:49 < dongs> motherfucker
2018-09-25T09:35:00 < jadew> first successful test: https://youtu.be/dYFYZ-g7fzA?t=836
2018-09-25T09:35:13 < jadew> (on a wooden bench)
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2018-09-25T09:44:44 < jadew> working properly here: https://youtu.be/dYFYZ-g7fzA?t=1288
2018-09-25T09:44:55 < dongs> The last link has been flagged by IRC NANNY as "Possibly Unsuitable". Please find your parent(s) first and have them check the content before opening. [this channel protected by IrCNaNNY by SafeSoft v1.0b]
2018-09-25T09:51:45 < Steffanx> If an IRC nanny was a thing, dongs wouldnt be on irc :P
2018-09-25T09:52:05 < kakimir> how old joke that ircnanny is?
2018-09-25T09:52:40 < kakimir> from age of great flamewars?
2018-09-25T09:53:49 < jadew> plane takes off: https://youtu.be/dYFYZ-g7fzA?t=3391
2018-09-25T09:54:14 < jadew> that's a kick ass project
2018-09-25T09:55:22 < c10ud> nice
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2018-09-25T10:15:01 < dongs> digitasl dongs
2018-09-25T10:16:40 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BoGkQbWHBxe/
2018-09-25T10:43:20 < jadew> https://youtu.be/PQngKXYZCKs?t=616
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2018-09-25T10:44:07 < jadew> also this: https://youtu.be/V8a2tOmpm7c?t=155
2018-09-25T10:45:17 < jadew> when I was in kindergarten I was asked for the first time what I want to be when I grow up
2018-09-25T10:45:24 < jadew> I said I want to be a tank
2018-09-25T10:45:49 -!- upgrdman [~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-25T10:46:12 < jadew> these guys actually succeeded
2018-09-25T10:49:28 < upgrdman> succeeded at what
2018-09-25T10:50:08 < jadew> <jadew> when I was in kindergarten I was asked for the first time what I want to be when I grow up <jadew> I said I want to be a tank
2018-09-25T10:50:22 < jadew> https://youtu.be/V8a2tOmpm7c?t=155 AND https://youtu.be/PQngKXYZCKs?t=616
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2018-09-25T10:50:38 < jadew> did you get disconnected?
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2018-09-25T10:50:58 < jadew> ok, then I guess you'll have to check the log
2018-09-25T10:51:12 < dongs> he's getting china'd
2018-09-25T10:51:53 < upgrdman_> yes very china'd
2018-09-25T10:51:54 < jadew> wasn't there a hack to get past that?
2018-09-25T10:51:58 -!- upgrdman_ is now known as upgrdman
2018-09-25T10:52:11 < jadew> maybe disabling the back off protocol or something along those lines?
2018-09-25T10:52:16 < upgrdman> jadew, vpn works fine, but packet loss is annoying as fuck
2018-09-25T10:52:28 < dongs> yea its just shitty internet
2018-09-25T10:52:51 < upgrdman> it's annoying too, because sometimes its great, other times its worse than dialup
2018-09-25T10:53:15 < upgrdman> like i can often Syncthing at >30Mbps, but sometimes even IRC won't be reliable
2018-09-25T10:53:31 < upgrdman> Haohmaru, the great firewall of china
2018-09-25T10:53:48 < dongs> syncthing sounds like something I would definitely ban if I was chinese
2018-09-25T10:54:07 < upgrdman> dongs, ya i syncthing while vpn'd
2018-09-25T10:54:28 < upgrdman> it works without vpn, but is surprisingly faster than routed through the vpn
2018-09-25T10:55:11 < upgrdman> but i often syncthing to get my youtube-dl rips, so i might as well be vpn'd anyway, so i can ssh into my server and youtube-dl stuff while browsing my subs
2018-09-25T10:55:44 < dongs> lol is jewtube that importnat
2018-09-25T10:55:55 < dongs> i dont think i ever felt the need to see jewtube while in china
2018-09-25T10:56:07 < upgrdman> no but if im bored and lazy, its nice
2018-09-25T10:56:33 < upgrdman> but ya, i usually just wander around town when china'd
2018-09-25T10:56:55 < upgrdman> plenty to do and see, and in the nicer areas, people to talk too (in english) too
2018-09-25T10:58:21 < upgrdman> crt, im 90% sure i've seen food stalls that use gutter oil
2018-09-25T10:58:27 < upgrdman> in the super poor areas
2018-09-25T10:59:05 < upgrdman> also not uncommon for it to smell like dumpster juice near sketchy food stalls, lol
2018-09-25T11:01:32 < upgrdman> bbl
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2018-09-25T11:34:04 < dongs> what the hell is 40.68mhz freq
2018-09-25T11:34:05 < dongs> for
2018-09-25T11:34:10 < dongs> some hamwank?
2018-09-25T11:37:05 < dongs> im being asked to find such osc
2018-09-25T11:37:23 < dongs> sounds like something RF related tho
2018-09-25T11:37:25 < dongs> from google
2018-09-25T11:37:39 < dongs> http://en.adtec-rf.com/product/rf-generator/4000w-4068
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2018-09-25T12:05:30 < zyp> seems like it's an ISM band
2018-09-25T12:05:36 < zyp> like 433 and 2.4G and shit
2018-09-25T12:07:30 < dongs> ya
2018-09-25T12:07:40 < zyp> yeah, 40.66 to 40.70
2018-09-25T12:07:53 < zyp> so it's 40kHz wide
2018-09-25T12:08:58 < zyp> when I think about it, I think I had a RC toy in that band when I were a kid
2018-09-25T12:09:04 < dongs> oh hm
2018-09-25T12:09:10 < dongs> you mean as oposed to 27mhz?
2018-09-25T12:09:21 < zyp> yes
2018-09-25T12:13:23 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/LPpz2.png <- here's the definition from the norwegian frequency plan
2018-09-25T12:13:49 < dongs> hah
2018-09-25T12:19:11 < zyp> norwegian laws refers to EN 300 220
2018-09-25T12:19:12 < zyp> https://www.etsi.org/deliver/etsi_en/300200_300299/30022002/03.01.01_30/en_30022002v030101v.pdf
2018-09-25T12:19:24 < zyp> annexes B and C lists a ton of shit
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2018-09-25T15:13:42 < dongs> hmmmmmm
2018-09-25T15:14:07 < dongs> pluto warms up and i think the signal drifts too much
2018-09-25T15:14:14 < dongs> GPS sim stops being useful
2018-09-25T15:14:23 < dongs> if i run it from cold, it locks almost immediately
2018-09-25T15:14:38 < dongs> after like 10 mins when its warm, it'll take like 20 mins if even
2018-09-25T15:15:36 < BrainDamage> there's 2 screws at the bottom, unscrew and slap a heatsink on the xtal?
2018-09-25T15:15:51 < BrainDamage> or you could correct for drift after it has warmed up
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2018-09-25T15:16:31 < BrainDamage> send a constant tone after it has warmed up and measure with your oscope the freq, and ppm compensate
2018-09-25T15:17:32 < dongs> hmm good idea
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2018-09-25T15:19:11 < dongs> its still locked, but i spsect if I restart it, there's gonna be offset that wont work
2018-09-25T15:19:22 < dongs> do you think i can send stuff at low frequency and > 1ghz offset will be similar?
2018-09-25T15:19:26 < dongs> or is it linearly worse
2018-09-25T15:19:31 < BrainDamage> if it's thermal dirft it's deterministic
2018-09-25T15:19:37 < BrainDamage> and it's a relative % of the freq
2018-09-25T15:19:50 < BrainDamage> so yes, you can test it at a low freq
2018-09-25T15:20:02 < BrainDamage> and restarting shouldn't affect it much
2018-09-25T15:20:24 < dongs> ah, i think it just went to shit
2018-09-25T15:20:31 < dongs> phone just lost lock despite all sats being green
2018-09-25T15:20:37 < dongs> like ~10 mins after power on
2018-09-25T15:21:28 < BrainDamage> I'll let mine warm up and will be able to tell you in a bit
2018-09-25T15:27:42 < dongs> hmm phone still locked
2018-09-25T15:27:49 < dongs> it relocked a bit later
2018-09-25T15:28:02 < dongs> night before i was fucking with it, it didnt work for ~hour+ after first 10-15mins
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2018-09-25T16:33:50 < dongs> https://mikrotik.com/download/share/CRS305_1G_4S_IN.pdf @ zyp
2018-09-25T16:36:38 < Steffann> Cool 
2018-09-25T16:36:54 < Steffann> $50?
2018-09-25T16:37:10 < dongs> just about
2018-09-25T16:37:13 < dongs> ~$100 or someshit
2018-09-25T16:37:21 < dongs> donno if its up on eurodk yet
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2018-09-25T17:04:44 < kakimir> what is the perfect hole size to hold scope probe upright?
2018-09-25T17:04:59 < kakimir> I have new autism
2018-09-25T17:05:18 < kakimir> I have caliber on my desk I don't need another one
2018-09-25T17:05:40 < kakimir> also scope probes laying around
2018-09-25T17:06:27 < kakimir> 1mm if you want it to go thru completelly
2018-09-25T17:06:41 < kakimir> is that how I want it?
2018-09-25T17:07:02 < kakimir> I can't wait to show you what new meme pcb I did
2018-09-25T17:07:24 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@193.173.113.122] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-25T17:09:20 < kakimir> I have 0.9mm
2018-09-25T17:09:25 < kakimir> wont change them
2018-09-25T17:09:34 < kakimir> I can raep them thru
2018-09-25T17:09:44 < kakimir> scope tip is 0.95mm
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2018-09-25T17:16:25 < marble_visions> hi all, does the adc in stm32l0 series do oversampling, it samples all enabled channels and does the math, or does the math for every enabled channel?
2018-09-25T17:17:12 < marble_visions> i can't seem to make out from the refman.. it makes sense for every channel to have it's own data but who knows
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2018-09-25T17:34:29 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/ESZ345n 
2018-09-25T17:34:30 < bitmask> that shine
2018-09-25T17:34:37 < englishman> iirc it should oversample as part of each channel's conversion no?
2018-09-25T17:34:57 < englishman> whats the simplest and cheapest way to switch 150A of 12VDC
2018-09-25T17:35:03 < englishman> bunch of SSR in series?
2018-09-25T17:35:11 < englishman> err parallel
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2018-09-25T17:44:16 < marble_visions> englishman: thanks
2018-09-25T17:44:19 < kakimir> are you planning to crank an engine?
2018-09-25T17:49:29 < englishman> no and yes
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2018-09-25T17:54:46 < BrainDamage> you can parallel SSR only if they have positive temperature coefficient
2018-09-25T17:55:05 < BrainDamage> unless you like christmas tree cascade failures
2018-09-25T17:58:12 < BrainDamage> you're reading too much
2018-09-25T17:58:20 < BrainDamage> i just meant as a light show
2018-09-25T17:58:58 < BrainDamage> the SSR will chain assplode if they have negative tempco though
2018-09-25T17:59:56 < BrainDamage> yes, and increased current means increased power dissipation, if the coefficient is negative it creates a feedback loop
2018-09-25T18:00:20 < BrainDamage> when you parallel, you end up with one suddendly supporting the majority of the current, like a breached dam
2018-09-25T18:00:49 < BrainDamage> P=RI^2 for a linear system
2018-09-25T18:01:14 < BrainDamage> and it's the compound of 2 factors
2018-09-25T18:01:22 < BrainDamage> R decrease, and I increase too 
2018-09-25T18:01:36 < BrainDamage> I increase because the current partition between the devices becomes unequal
2018-09-25T18:01:45 < BrainDamage> because the R lowered
2018-09-25T18:01:53 < BrainDamage> so you end up with factor^3
2018-09-25T18:02:29 < BrainDamage> once one fails, the other have to withstand more current, which in turn heats them up more
2018-09-25T18:02:43 < BrainDamage> you end up with exponentially decreasing decay time between failures
2018-09-25T18:02:57 < BrainDamage> pop           pop    pop poppopopop etc
2018-09-25T18:03:35 < BrainDamage> it's possible to design a stable system for positive tempco, eg adding degeneration resistors, careful overspec, ec
2018-09-25T18:03:43 < BrainDamage> err, for negative tempco
2018-09-25T18:03:54 < BrainDamage> ooor, just use a device with positive tempo and don't care
2018-09-25T18:06:48 < kakimir> snus
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2018-09-25T18:17:50 < englishman> BrainDamage: yeah like any fet
2018-09-25T18:18:16 < englishman> it is a fail-safe mode
2018-09-25T18:18:19 < englishman> if one fails, all fail
2018-09-25T18:18:22 < englishman> like communism
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2018-09-25T18:35:01 < kakimir> fetplosion
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2018-09-25T18:41:34 < kakimir> englishman: you need constant 120A?f
2018-09-25T18:41:38 < kakimir> for how long?
2018-09-25T18:41:42 < englishman> hours
2018-09-25T18:42:00 < kakimir> how about some smart switches
2018-09-25T18:42:06 < kakimir> a pile of them
2018-09-25T18:42:27 < kakimir> BTS50055-1tma
2018-09-25T18:42:33 < kakimir> paraller configuration
2018-09-25T18:42:50 < englishman> >infineon
2018-09-25T18:42:55 < englishman> is this going to cost $2k
2018-09-25T18:43:22 < kakimir> see the price
2018-09-25T18:43:37 < kakimir> I assume it's like one off solution you need to do?
2018-09-25T18:43:50 < englishman> not too bad i guess
2018-09-25T18:44:04 < englishman> idk could probably sell a few hundred
2018-09-25T18:44:09 < kakimir> what type the load is?
2018-09-25T18:44:29 < englishman> resistive
2018-09-25T18:44:38 < kakimir> no problem
2018-09-25T18:53:21 < karlp> how does one build a library projet and have either static _or_ shared, but not allow both.
2018-09-25T18:53:27 < karlp> why would you build a build system like that?
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2018-09-25T18:55:35 < zyp> karlp, what platform?
2018-09-25T18:56:45 < karlp> linux.
2018-09-25T18:56:55 < zyp> heh
2018-09-25T18:57:08 < karlp> https://github.com/google/re2
2018-09-25T18:57:36 < karlp> getting a bunch of new pacakges submitted to openwrt by a facebook staff member, using their work email.  all c++, and trying to push them otu as static libs, for all of them.
2018-09-25T18:58:59 < karlp> it sounds just like, "we dont' want to manage deps, so we're going to statically link everything and run them as magical containers, and fuck anyone else who doesn't have petabytes of storage for all this"
2018-09-25T18:59:31 < zyp> fun
2018-09-25T19:00:52 < emeb> sounds like a good time to just *plonk* the requests
2018-09-25T19:01:18 < karlp> no, just tell them to play more consistently with everytone else
2018-09-25T19:01:30 < emeb> ETRYAGAIN
2018-09-25T19:01:36 < karlp> I presume they're statically linking because it's marginally more performant, and that's more $ to them than the disk space.
2018-09-25T19:02:14 < emeb> right. not quite the trade-space that openwrt operates in though.
2018-09-25T19:02:37 < zyp> I flashed/tested the last panels I had left of my nfc readers today, 16 boards
2018-09-25T19:02:54 < zyp> had two test failures right after each other
2018-09-25T19:03:11 < zyp> only had one other in the whole batch of boards previously, so that was a weird coincidence
2018-09-25T19:03:20 < zyp> seemed like they had different issues too
2018-09-25T19:03:26 < karlp> yeah, we normally build both static and shared, and only install the shared.
2018-09-25T19:03:38 < karlp> this re2 project apparenrtlyt doesn't let you do that, you can only build static, or shared, not both.
2018-09-25T19:03:45 < karlp> which seems.... extremely narrow minded.
2018-09-25T19:03:57 < zyp> one board were hardfaulting in spi comms code (probably receiving garbage data), the other one were deadlocking waiting on a signal to get asserted
2018-09-25T19:04:09 < emeb> assy errors?
2018-09-25T19:04:29 < zyp> didn't spot any obvious solder bridges, nfc chip wasn't rotated
2018-09-25T19:04:46 < emeb> weird
2018-09-25T19:04:48 < zyp> so no obviosly visible problems
2018-09-25T19:07:07 < emeb> I've got an odd bug going - pushed out a firmware update to a product a few weeks ago and now getting sporadic reports of lockups in a certain operating mode that I can't duplicate on my hardware. Client has also tried on his boards. Overall we've got two customer reports of the lockup (out of roughly 300 units in the field) and haven't been able to get it to happen on any of the hardware we've got.
2018-09-25T19:07:32 < Ultrasauce> the cosmic rays are treating you poorly
2018-09-25T19:07:38 < emeb> Or something.
2018-09-25T19:07:52 < emeb> Having one of the failing units sent for analysis. 
2018-09-25T19:08:16 < sync> yeah zyp I had that happen before
2018-09-25T19:08:22 < sync> usually recooking the boards helps
2018-09-25T19:15:00 -!- talsit [foobar@gromit.mixdown.ca] has left ##stm32 []
2018-09-25T19:18:04 < emeb> "Value Line" H7 parts. 128kB flash but still has 1MB SRAM.
2018-09-25T19:27:07 < zyp> just curious it was two out of 16 that failed now, and previously I've had only one out of 84 or something
2018-09-25T19:27:12 < zyp> I think it was originally a 100-batch
2018-09-25T19:27:21 < zyp> but sure, numbers are not statistically significant
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2018-09-25T20:02:39 < dongs> holy shit 2am GTFO'ing
2018-09-25T20:04:19 < BrainDamage> foxconning?
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2018-09-25T21:14:52 < tomeaton17> hi
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2018-09-25T21:43:43 < catphish> that seems like a very silly way to install it :(
2018-09-25T21:44:14 < Ultrasauce> they did you a favour, keeping latency down
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2018-09-25T21:56:14 < tctw> #FeelingGood
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2018-09-25T22:01:04 < jpa-> emeb: i had that kind of thing when i was being hit by the F4 flash prefetch errata; it only occurred when branches jumped across cache lines in very specific order, about 1% of firmware builds had the problem for me and whenever the code moved in flash even by 1 word the bug would disappear
2018-09-25T22:02:18 < jpa-> dumping debug data from hardfault handler to whatever medium you have available is useful
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2018-09-25T22:34:56 < emeb> jpa-: Interesting
2018-09-25T22:35:02 < emeb> This is on an F7
2018-09-25T22:35:28 < emeb> jpa-: was there any workaround for that prefetch bug?
2018-09-25T22:38:18 < emeb> jpa-: I've got the unit on a debugger now. It's definitely stuck in the hardfault handler but I can't backtrace due to corrupt stack.
2018-09-25T22:40:46 < kakimir> superbia: I have seen this
2018-09-25T22:42:20 -!- oz4ga [~tim@hator.sunsite.lv] has quit [Quit: ZNC 1.7.1 - https://znc.in]
2018-09-25T22:48:41 < kakimir> I'm pretty confident I will end my chess carreer now
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2018-09-25T22:54:41 < tctw> how do people do jumpers (solder bridges) in altium (schematic symbol & used footprint)? what works well?
2018-09-25T22:55:09 < zyp> kakimir, aww, we're not gonna play more? :(
2018-09-25T22:55:56 < zyp> tctw, [> >] shaped pads, I guess
2018-09-25T22:56:13 < tctw> zyp, what kind of schematic symbol? got some screenshots?
2018-09-25T22:56:37 < kakimir> zyp: sorry
2018-09-25T22:56:53 < zyp> tctw, https://i.stack.imgur.com/iis71.jpg <- like this, I figure
2018-09-25T22:58:01 < kakimir> what is happening zyp?
2018-09-25T22:58:35 < tctw> zyp interesting
2018-09-25T22:58:45 < zyp> kakimir, not much, just relaxing on couch with wife
2018-09-25T22:58:55 < kakimir> nice
2018-09-25T22:59:04 < kakimir> does she ever see our irc pumps?
2018-09-25T22:59:30 < zyp> she's not very interested
2018-09-25T22:59:56 < kakimir> are you drinking wine in front of big fireplace?
2018-09-25T23:00:09 < zyp> nah
2018-09-25T23:00:21 < zyp> don't have much of either wine or fireplace here
2018-09-25T23:01:42 < jpa-> emeb: for the prefetch errata, only disabling flash prefetch helped
2018-09-25T23:01:59 < jpa-> (i knew about the errata, but for some reason thought it didn't affect me)
2018-09-25T23:03:54 < emeb> jpa-: yech - that doesn't help performance at all
2018-09-25T23:04:18 < emeb> looking @ the F7 errata it doesn't appear to have that particular bug.
2018-09-25T23:06:53  * PaulFertser can't find any flash prefetch errata for F4 either
2018-09-25T23:10:14 < Steffanx> enlighten us jpa-
2018-09-25T23:11:09 < Steffanx> Welcome superbia & crt
2018-09-25T23:11:12 < Steffanx> and tctw
2018-09-25T23:11:50 < Steffanx> fyi we speak dutch here, not Deutsch, superbia
2018-09-25T23:12:23 < Steffanx> the swissers still being nice to you?
2018-09-25T23:12:33 < MrMobius> you should learn Deutsch too
2018-09-25T23:12:37 < MrMobius> its Herr not her
2018-09-25T23:12:40 < MrMobius> :P
2018-09-25T23:13:31 < Steffanx> Australien 
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2018-09-25T23:52:00  * Steffanx hands crt a tissue
2018-09-25T23:55:07 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-25T23:57:33 < emeb>  /ᐠ｡ꞈ｡ᐟ\
2018-09-25T23:58:54 < Steffanx> :)
--- Day changed Wed Sep 26 2018
2018-09-26T00:00:21 < BrainDamage> ～((Φ◇Φ)‡ 
2018-09-26T00:01:13 < emeb> birb?
2018-09-26T00:02:20 < BrainDamage> herro
2018-09-26T00:06:25 < emeb> looks like I got me a Heisenbug here.
2018-09-26T00:06:47 < emeb> adding printfs to the section of code that's crashing makes it go away.
2018-09-26T00:10:06 < englishman> i love those bugs
2018-09-26T00:11:52 < emeb> they really are the best
2018-09-26T00:14:45 < Steffanx> Are you ok emeb ?
2018-09-26T00:15:02 < englishman> can you blame gcc yet
2018-09-26T00:15:34 < emeb> Steffanx: just peachy
2018-09-26T00:15:59 < emeb> englishman: while it's never too early to blame gcc, I suspect the real issue lies elsewhere.
2018-09-26T00:16:12 < englishman> well i'm going to blame gcc
2018-09-26T00:16:13 < emeb> since this bug only shows up on a small subset of hardware
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2018-09-26T00:31:35 < karlp> non x5r caps being supplied pushing some tolerances out?
2018-09-26T00:37:16 -!- Laurenceb124 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-26T00:37:24 < sync> emeb: maybe look at it with a jtrace?
2018-09-26T00:37:36 < Laurenceb124> muh babby shake
2018-09-26T00:37:48 < Laurenceb124> who would have imagined that babby shake is so boring
2018-09-26T00:38:44 < Laurenceb124> today I improved the speed of the database to 40% real time
2018-09-26T00:40:09 < Laurenceb124> shoking performance
2018-09-26T00:42:30 < Laurenceb124> nobody knows
2018-09-26T00:44:00 < Laurenceb124> its supposed to extract ukp4.5M grant money
2018-09-26T00:45:50 < Laurenceb124> Alba is the new Chris-Chan
2018-09-26T00:46:03 < Laurenceb124> after Ginnie got sent to prison
2018-09-26T00:46:41 < Laurenceb124> autists drew some ginnie fan art https://postimg.cc/hQ88xgst
2018-09-26T00:47:06 < emeb> sync: how would that help?
2018-09-26T00:48:01 < Laurenceb124> >when ur waifu is even more autistic than you are
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2018-09-26T00:49:11 < sync> you can trace out what it is doing even when it jumbles your stack emeb 
2018-09-26T00:49:24 < Laurenceb124> crt: https://www.albawhitewolf.com/
2018-09-26T00:49:56 < Laurenceb124> Alba-chan
2018-09-26T00:50:29 < Laurenceb124> even moar autistic than chris-chan
2018-09-26T00:56:18 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-26T00:59:13 < Steffanx> Even more than laurenceb?
2018-09-26T00:59:38 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/5HmmH1sN
2018-09-26T00:59:49 < Laurenceb124> hi William
2018-09-26T01:00:54 < emeb> sync: I see. I'd have to lay out $$ for the jtrace and debugger app, then port my application to their toolchain I suppose.
2018-09-26T01:00:59 < emeb> unlikely to happen.
2018-09-26T01:02:04 < Laurenceb124> mfw https://postimg.cc/GBp4QCcp
2018-09-26T01:14:13 < sync> I don't think you need to port anything
2018-09-26T01:14:22 < sync> just fire up ozone and the jtrace
2018-09-26T01:15:54 < Laurenceb124> ozone isnt flammable
2018-09-26T01:17:21 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/hzNRfH4v
2018-09-26T01:17:36 < BrainDamage> ozone is a strong oxidizer, you can fire it up by burning something with it
2018-09-26T01:18:35 < BrainDamage> like jtrace
2018-09-26T01:23:48 < Thorn> Ariane 5 launch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3rBUie9Rlw
2018-09-26T01:24:58 < Laurenceb124> in space news, someone realised how emdrive works
2018-09-26T01:25:38 < Laurenceb124> you need an anti-self-dual component to the electromagnetic field, but should attempt to define causality as independent of spatial geometry. Complex time is where interactions appearing act forward across the proper time of the observer, in actuality act directly across the complex time required by a covariant perspective
2018-09-26T01:29:21 < Thorn> T - 10 min
2018-09-26T01:29:42 < Laurenceb124> omg it just blew up
2018-09-26T01:30:25 < Laurenceb124> launch cancelled because influxdb crashed
2018-09-26T01:32:42 < Laurenceb124> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqeu1HhsY4o
2018-09-26T01:34:30 < sync> haha the translator just stopping because of confusedness
2018-09-26T01:41:27 < englishman> are there 100A anderson power pole connectors or equivalent
2018-09-26T01:53:50 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: aha, so the timecube guy designed emdrive. got it.
2018-09-26T01:54:06 < MrMobius> wait, you guys know timecube guy?
2018-09-26T01:54:10 < MrMobius> Dr. Ray?
2018-09-26T01:54:14 < aandrew> he was my roommate
2018-09-26T01:54:32 < MrMobius> aandrew, are you in your 80s?
2018-09-26T01:54:46 < aandrew> isn't it obvious? I'm always complaining about stupid kids
2018-09-26T01:55:00 < Laurenceb124> http://magaimg.net/img/68z2.jpg
2018-09-26T01:55:06 < Laurenceb124> I think he died
2018-09-26T01:55:08 < Laurenceb124>  F
2018-09-26T01:55:33 < MrMobius> timecube guy came to my university as a guest speaker and I got to go to his lecture
2018-09-26T01:55:39 < Laurenceb124> wew
2018-09-26T01:56:03 < Laurenceb124> I remember watching the video of that at school lunch time in IT room
2018-09-26T01:56:10 < Laurenceb124> you were prob on camera lol
2018-09-26T01:56:14 < MrMobius> heh
2018-09-26T01:56:24 < MrMobius> i didnt ask any questions
2018-09-26T01:56:35 < Laurenceb124> Mobius confirmed as oldfag
2018-09-26T01:56:57 < MrMobius> but when he said anyone who could disprove timecube could have this $100 bill, one guy got up and made some argument that it doesnt exist and went to the front of the room and took it
2018-09-26T01:57:15 < MrMobius> dunno if that was on the video you saw :P
2018-09-26T01:57:30 < MrMobius> indeed
2018-09-26T02:00:18 < Laurenceb124> we used to gather in school IT room and watch troll tier shit on projector like an irl 4chan
2018-09-26T02:00:54 < Laurenceb124> infowarz and timecube and shit
2018-09-26T02:01:05 < MrMobius> oh nice
2018-09-26T02:01:13 < MrMobius> good thing they didnt catch you watching infowars
2018-09-26T02:01:23 < MrMobius> you might have got away with timecube
2018-09-26T02:01:37 < MrMobius> lolol Laurenceb I appear in the first minute of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMZdNyRIATo
2018-09-26T02:01:42 < Laurenceb124> virginity defence club
2018-09-26T02:01:43 < Laurenceb124> wew
2018-09-26T02:03:01 < sync> englishman: yes
2018-09-26T02:03:06 < Laurenceb124> you made internet trolling history
2018-09-26T02:03:43 < sync> englishman: http://www.andersonpower.com/us/en/products/sb-sb-boots/sb-50.aspx
2018-09-26T02:04:03 < englishman> hmm i knew i had seen those before
2018-09-26T02:04:10 < MrMobius> I didnt even know that video existed
2018-09-26T02:04:17 < MrMobius> I see 0 females
2018-09-26T02:04:18 < sync> even the powerpoles can take 120A
2018-09-26T02:04:25 < MrMobius> seems representative
2018-09-26T02:04:31 < sync> http://www.andersonpower.com/us/en/products/powerpole/pp75.aspx
2018-09-26T02:04:43 < sync> I prefer the first kind
2018-09-26T02:05:25 < Laurenceb124> >grrrls dont get trolling culture
2018-09-26T02:05:27 < Laurenceb124> who knew
2018-09-26T02:05:45 < sync> they are for has quite affordably in china
2018-09-26T02:06:09 < englishman> torch soldered contacts
2018-09-26T02:06:17 < englishman> yeah i knew i had used those before
2018-09-26T02:06:26 < englishman> guess i should not be checking amazon
2018-09-26T02:06:52 < Laurenceb124> freaking amazon, I can see their shit from my house now
2018-09-26T02:07:07 < Laurenceb124> literally 2x2km warehouse about 8 stories high
2018-09-26T02:07:52 < sync> > torch soldered
2018-09-26T02:07:57 < sync> get a crimper
2018-09-26T02:08:02 < Laurenceb124> nuke amazon from orbit tbh
2018-09-26T02:08:17 < englishman> i have a crimper
2018-09-26T02:08:18 < sync> I got some shit from there last week Laurenceb124 so pfft
2018-09-26T02:08:25 < englishman> yeah amazon is gr8
2018-09-26T02:08:40 < englishman> dont have to go to a store and look people in the eye to buy socks
2018-09-26T02:08:44 < englishman> they just arrive
2018-09-26T02:08:47 < englishman> brilliant
2018-09-26T02:08:50 < englishman> world's richest man
2018-09-26T02:08:59 < BrainDamage> that existed before amazon
2018-09-26T02:09:02 < BrainDamage> it just did it better
2018-09-26T02:09:03  * Laurenceb124 has to look at their new EU main warehouse
2018-09-26T02:09:36 < Laurenceb124> I guess irl trolling me counts as a positive for some...
2018-09-26T02:09:47 < BrainDamage> s/some/many/
2018-09-26T02:10:20 < BrainDamage> be happy, when brexit comes they'll abandon the warehouse because of all the taxes
2018-09-26T02:10:36 < BrainDamage> so you'll end up with a window on a decaying monument to futility
2018-09-26T02:10:37 < Laurenceb124> yeah but we'll be stuck with the amerimutts
2018-09-26T02:10:48 < Laurenceb124> there are tons round my house all the time, wtf
2018-09-26T02:10:58 < MrMobius> heh, 1:35:22 for the $100 thing. my memory still works :P
2018-09-26T02:11:02 < Laurenceb124> looks like they are all from Star Citizen
2018-09-26T02:11:31 < Laurenceb124> they ran away to escape trump or something, more likely to escape angry backers
2018-09-26T02:11:36 < BrainDamage> maybe you should get checked for hallucinations
2018-09-26T02:12:01 < Laurenceb124> BrainDamage: they have a huge office block just off my street
2018-09-26T02:12:32 < Laurenceb124> and a motion capture stage or some bullshit
2018-09-26T02:14:01 < Laurenceb124> they spent their giganeetbux on running away from muricaland and hiring shitty office blocks in dumfuckistan, bongland
2018-09-26T02:16:44 < Laurenceb124> crt spotted: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJLtIaG0HmI
2018-09-26T02:20:57 < dongs> dongs
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2018-09-26T03:04:01 < dongs> https://www.ebay.com/itm/202406735035? found crt's shop
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2018-09-26T03:09:04 < dongs> wait i thought it was a 560A power supply but its some audio wank
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2018-09-26T03:27:23 < dongs> it doesnt color the sound
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2018-09-26T03:44:11 < Laurenceb124> racist sound
2018-09-26T03:44:19 < dongs> haha
2018-09-26T03:44:22 < Laurenceb124> >some audio wank
2018-09-26T03:44:31 < Laurenceb124> sounds like muh wambulance shit
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2018-09-26T04:54:20 < Thorn> muh lan8720a
2018-09-26T04:54:33 < Thorn> talks over SMI and generates 50 MHz clock
2018-09-26T04:57:30 < aandrew> hm
2018-09-26T04:58:19 < Thorn> MDIO pullup which I forgot doesn't seem to be required
2018-09-26T04:58:36 < aandrew> http://mixdown.ca/dump/foo.pcb - this is supposed to be an orcad pcb file but altium can't read it. can any of you? it's a 22mb file
2018-09-26T05:03:49 < Thorn> aandrew: file/open -> file type not recognized, file->import->no orcad importer in the menu, 18.1.9
2018-09-26T05:04:07 < Thorn> file->import wizard has orcad but the extension is supposed to be MAX
2018-09-26T05:05:14 < Thorn> renamed to foo.max, "design file not recognized"
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2018-09-26T05:08:07 < aandrew> yep that's exactly what I get as well
2018-09-26T05:08:48 < aandrew> they told me they work in orcad
2018-09-26T05:08:57 < branjb> well Cracki when two files love each other..
2018-09-26T05:08:58 < aandrew> I'll get them to send it again I guess
2018-09-26T05:09:02 < aandrew> branjb: lol
2018-09-26T05:11:14 < branjb> ever looked at the memory space of the ostream buffer?  that shit is so ineffecient lol
2018-09-26T05:11:40 < branjb> lol
2018-09-26T05:12:04 < branjb> boost prob converts bytes to strings to store them and then converts them back to bytes on the output
2018-09-26T05:14:15 < aandrew> sounds like old .doc formats
2018-09-26T05:14:18 < aandrew> just a memory dump basically
2018-09-26T05:16:01 < branjb> why would you ever use boost
2018-09-26T05:17:02 < branjb> boost doesn't even attempt to maintain backwards compatibility
2018-09-26T05:17:22 < branjb> new version comes out and they arbitrarily rearrange all header definitions to fuck you
2018-09-26T05:18:00 < branjb> oh boost::memcpy(pointer, size) is what the last version used?  now its boost::memcpy(size, pointer) KEK!
2018-09-26T05:18:10 < aandrew> renaming it an .alg is at least trying to import
2018-09-26T05:18:12 < branjb> ^ just an analogy but they do stupid shit like that
2018-09-26T05:18:16 < aandrew> I'm basically running it througha ll the fucking importers
2018-09-26T05:28:16 < aandrew> nope none of the importers worked
2018-09-26T05:28:43 < branjb> there's a 50/50 chance Avenatti is not even a real person
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2018-09-26T05:43:00 < englishman> aandrew: here comes the orscab expert right on time
2018-09-26T05:44:12 < aandrew> hm?
2018-09-26T05:44:36 < englishman> R2 "no time for irc" COM
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2018-09-26T06:30:23 < emeb> jpa-: tried your suggestion and disabled ART on the F7. That seems to have fixed my bug. Very strange since there's no erratum for this on the F7.
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2018-09-26T06:38:07 < emeb> No - it's the proprietary flash cache.
2018-09-26T06:38:21 < emeb> the graphics thingy is Chrom-ART
2018-09-26T06:58:13 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/lEUD4Ob that's a sexy power supply
2018-09-26T06:58:55 < dongs> cool
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2018-09-26T06:59:32 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/MdavnsD is the routing
2018-09-26T06:59:40 < aandrew> nice and neat, small loops, awesome
2018-09-26T06:59:49 < dongs> you and your viainpads
2018-09-26T06:59:56 < aandrew> I love laying out power supplies for some reason
2018-09-26T07:00:00 < aandrew> 'it becomes all geometric
2018-09-26T07:00:01 < aandrew> yes
2018-09-26T07:00:04 < aandrew> VIP > *
2018-09-26T07:00:20 < aandrew> show me a board with 0.2mm drills that are leaking solder
2018-09-26T07:00:38 < dongs> is that 2L
2018-09-26T07:00:42 < aandrew> 6
2018-09-26T07:00:50 < dongs> why are you cheating wiht pours
2018-09-26T07:00:56 < dongs> instead of proper split plane
2018-09-26T07:00:59 < aandrew> oh
2018-09-26T07:01:03 < aandrew> that's a dual power supply
2018-09-26T07:01:12 < dongs> man i see fucking vault components
2018-09-26T07:01:13 < aandrew> so the top half is 6V bottom is 3.3V
2018-09-26T07:01:30 < aandrew> and that particular regulator has three VIN pins
2018-09-26T07:01:41 < aandrew> you see the big blue (bottom layer) tall skinny rectangle
2018-09-26T07:01:46 < dongs> wtf is the thing in top right, is that DC jack
2018-09-26T07:01:49 < dongs> barrel jack wahtever
2018-09-26T07:01:51 < dongs> yeah i guess it is
2018-09-26T07:01:59 < aandrew> that connects two of them, and then middle of the right there's a pin with two vias on either end of it
2018-09-26T07:02:11 < dongs> you have leds running directly off DC jack? wtf
2018-09-26T07:02:19 < aandrew> I could bring over a thick trace on the bottom
2018-09-26T07:02:26 < aandrew> but fuck it, I got layers, so I put down that cyan blob
2018-09-26T07:02:36 < aandrew> those three LEDs are power good
2018-09-26T07:02:40 < dongs> and the gnd end of them is like powergood pins or someshit?
2018-09-26T07:02:46 < aandrew> top is VIN, middle and bottom are 6V PG and 3.3V PG
2018-09-26T07:02:51 < dongs> heh
2018-09-26T07:03:07 < aandrew> and yeah that is a barrel jack that will never be used in production
2018-09-26T07:03:17 < dongs> so how will it work
2018-09-26T07:03:34 < aandrew> you get .. 12.25 out
2018-09-26T07:03:40 < aandrew> from PoE
2018-09-26T07:03:58 < aandrew> there's a whole other board that is the PoE PD and magnetics 
2018-09-26T07:04:49 < aandrew> and yeah I have some vault components
2018-09-26T07:04:55 < aandrew> I'm kind of curious which ones you identified
2018-09-26T07:04:59 < aandrew> and hoiw
2018-09-26T07:05:00 < aandrew> er how
2018-09-26T07:05:37 < dongs> i can tell fail from a mile away
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2018-09-26T07:08:43 < englishman> nice sot23-6 with no pin1 mark
2018-09-26T07:09:05 < englishman> but sot23-5 do have pin1
2018-09-26T07:09:45 < englishman> untented vias
2018-09-26T07:10:13 < dongs> the sot23-6 are probly fets?
2018-09-26T07:10:15 < dongs> dual
2018-09-26T07:10:22 < dongs> they're usually symmetrical
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2018-09-26T07:10:31 < englishman> but 3d has pin1
2018-09-26T07:10:32 < dongs> there is pin1 mark on that anyway
2018-09-26T07:10:39 < dongs> the yellow shit
2018-09-26T07:10:45 < dongs> its in the center
2018-09-26T07:11:19 < aandrew> I have not done via tenting yet
2018-09-26T07:11:26 < englishman> wat
2018-09-26T07:11:35 < aandrew> that's one of hte last steps I do is make sure everything is tented except for where I explicitly want to probe
2018-09-26T07:11:39 < englishman> yellow shit in the center
2018-09-26T07:11:51 < aandrew> sot236 has pin1
2018-09-26T07:11:55 < aandrew> I see it lower left
2018-09-26T07:11:57 < dongs> the pin1 mark for 6pin
2018-09-26T07:13:07 < englishman> surely not the one on the 3d
2018-09-26T07:13:26 < englishman> oh there is a 2nd image
2018-09-26T07:13:28 < englishman> k
2018-09-26T07:13:48 < englishman> that barrel jack really needed pin1 marking too
2018-09-26T07:14:57 < aandrew> why?
2018-09-26T07:15:07 < aandrew> oh yeah you're being sarcastic. :-)
2018-09-26T07:15:12 < dongs> o yeah, i was looking at the 2D drawing
2018-09-26T07:15:30 < dongs> thats how you knew untented vias
2018-09-26T07:15:39 < dongs> there's a slight difference in 2D too but pic too lowrez to tell
2018-09-26T07:16:16 < englishman> vias need to be tented or tssop20 pin1 silk wont show up
2018-09-26T07:17:04 < aandrew> right
2018-09-26T07:17:14 < aandrew> little shit like that I generally don't worry about but adjust for prod
2018-09-26T07:17:51 < dongs> how the fuck does feedback work in that thing
2018-09-26T07:18:03 < dongs> or is it fixed output
2018-09-26T07:18:07 < dongs> without needing fb resistors
2018-09-26T07:18:11 < aandrew> oh there is a standard resistor divider on the bottom of hte board
2018-09-26T07:18:13 < aandrew> 2 of them actually
2018-09-26T07:18:22 < aandrew> one for 6V and one for 3.3
2018-09-26T07:18:40 < aandrew> you can't really see them because they're right under the top right and bottom right corners of the tssop
2018-09-26T07:18:55 < dongs> oh bottom wtf
2018-09-26T07:19:02 < dongs> your assembly house must hate you
2018-09-26T07:19:16 < dongs> yeah i see it now
2018-09-26T07:19:19 < aandrew> and there's that giant fucking sot23 which provides some boost by feeding 6v back to the boost1/2 pins
2018-09-26T07:19:28 < aandrew> why's that?
2018-09-26T07:19:33 < aandrew> it's all centroid 
2018-09-26T07:19:41 < aandrew> x/y/rotation nobody cares unless the spacing is bad
2018-09-26T07:19:53 < dongs> im talkin about double sided assembly for no rason
2018-09-26T07:19:56 < dongs> reason, too
2018-09-26T07:20:00 < aandrew> oh
2018-09-26T07:20:06 < aandrew> well first one is hand assembled 
2018-09-26T07:20:14 < aandrew> but really the only things on the bottom are passives
2018-09-26T07:20:15 < dongs> so you msut hate yourself
2018-09-26T07:20:26 < dongs> yeah, thats one thing I don't want on the bottom either
2018-09-26T07:20:29 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-26T07:20:59 < englishman> yeah that sux
2018-09-26T07:21:05 < englishman> make someone assemble it twice
2018-09-26T07:21:09 < englishman> for twice the price
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2018-09-26T07:59:50 < dongs> wahts the story with chrome apps
2018-09-26T07:59:53 < dongs> is taht shit all discontinued now
2018-09-26T08:04:27 < aandrew> what?
2018-09-26T08:04:34 < aandrew> did google can chrome?
2018-09-26T08:05:42 < dongs> chrome apps, long time ago
2018-09-26T08:05:47 -!- qyx [~qyx@gw2.krtko.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2018-09-26T08:06:10 < dongs> https://developers.chrome.com/apps/migration
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2018-09-26T08:23:24 < dongs> yes like access to usb, serial, HID, etc
2018-09-26T08:23:31 < dongs> and running in a proper window wiht its own chrome
2018-09-26T08:23:38 < dongs> instead of some fucking tba
2018-09-26T08:23:39 < dongs> tab
2018-09-26T08:23:51 < dongs> holy shit i fucking hate tabs so much
2018-09-26T08:23:58 < dongs> biggest waste of time since i dont know
2018-09-26T08:24:08 < dongs> i had to find an extension that made tabs permanently removed from chrome
2018-09-26T08:24:11 < dongs> it was like the best thing ever
2018-09-26T08:24:18 < dongs> i could finally fucking find what the fuck im browsing again
2018-09-26T08:24:31 < dongs> because now all chrome windows are in alt-tab list or in the explorer grouping list
2018-09-26T08:25:52 < dongs> i'll take 100 windows i can actually navigate to
2018-09-26T08:25:55 < dongs> and see their <title>
2018-09-26T08:26:26 < dongs> it has nothign to do with chrome
2018-09-26T08:26:36 < dongs> explorer does a fine job organizing windows
2018-09-26T08:26:48 < dongs> i don't need eahc fucking app to have theri own retarded way to organize windows
2018-09-26T08:27:02 < dongs> tabs is a faggot concept that does not work outside of MDI full-screen apps
2018-09-26T08:27:08 < dongs> where you can SEE all teh tabs at once as a single entity
2018-09-26T08:27:15 < dongs> multiple windows with multiple tabs = fucking gigantic fail
2018-09-26T08:27:38 < dongs> no wonder opensores faggots love thast shit
2018-09-26T08:27:46 < dongs> they get off on using hard to use retarded shit
2018-09-26T08:38:37 < jpa-> emeb_mac: i would be surprised if it had the same errata, considering it was successfully fixed in later F4 revisions also; are you sure your wait states etc. for the flash are configured correctly?
2018-09-26T08:39:17 < emeb_mac> jpa-: pretty sure that's right. I did review it carefully.
2018-09-26T08:40:00 < emeb_mac> jpa-: the strange thing about this is that the bug doesn't show up on all copies of the hardware. 
2018-09-26T08:42:22 < jpa-> have you compared revision markings on the chip?
2018-09-26T08:42:54 < jpa-> disabling ART will change timing in so many ways that even a pure software bug might be affected
2018-09-26T08:43:06 < dongs> Cube Bug
2018-09-26T08:44:05 < emeb_mac> jpa-: checking chip revisions is on the to-do list. trouble is that it takes a fair amount of time to disassemble the HW to the point where I can see them so it'll have to wait until tomorrow.
2018-09-26T08:45:04 < jpa-> you can check REV_ID in DBGMCU->IDCODE
2018-09-26T08:45:31 < emeb_mac> jpa-: and yeah - timing changes. Interestingly, I disabled the main data / instr caches and that didn't improve things
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2018-09-26T08:49:55 < jpa-> PaulFertser: for F4, the errata is called "ART Accelerator prefetch queue instruction is not supported" .. and yeah, the name is not obvious, which confused me also
2018-09-26T08:50:50 < jpa-> i always though there was some kind of "prefetch instruction" in the instruction set, but no - it means do not enable the prefetch in the flash config register on rev A devices
2018-09-26T08:52:19 < PaulFertser> Now that description in the errata is so vague, the implications are so not obvious...
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2018-09-26T09:19:23 < PaulFertser> Hey crt 
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2018-09-26T09:38:17 < aandrew> 67% routed
2018-09-26T09:39:28 < dongs> where is livestream
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2018-09-26T10:08:15 < aandrew> dongs: not gonna livestream already said that
2018-09-26T10:08:26 < dongs> pfft
2018-09-26T10:08:31 < dongs> where's the fun
2018-09-26T10:08:33 < aandrew> the last thing I need is a dozen of you screaming at me about how stupid I am for routing the way I'm routing at 3am
2018-09-26T10:08:39 < dongs> lol
2018-09-26T10:08:44 < dongs> but thats the point
2018-09-26T10:09:04 < aandrew> I make enough money that I don't need to set up a patreon so you can curse at me
2018-09-26T10:09:56 < zyp> haha
2018-09-26T10:10:08 < dongs> donate per curse
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2018-09-26T10:13:54 < aandrew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SxoI--xIdM you want to watch this dongs
2018-09-26T10:14:13 < aandrew> yes it's rossmann but he talks about dry vs clean assholes
2018-09-26T10:14:33 < aandrew> you only need the first 5min
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2018-09-26T10:20:25 < aandrew> night
2018-09-26T10:28:19 < Steffanx> Gutentag
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2018-09-26T10:48:44 < Thorn> do you normally length match RMII traces?
2018-09-26T10:49:39 < Thorn> I found some crazy shit (pic #3) https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/360139/ethernet-rmii-on-two-layer-pcb
2018-09-26T10:50:06 < Thorn> note that this LPC is easier to route than stm32
2018-09-26T10:50:14 < veverak> hmm
2018-09-26T10:50:42 < veverak> have you anybody ever tried to make 2s lipo circuit - something that let's the device use the battery, but also charges the battery from solar panels
2018-09-26T10:50:58 < veverak> or, you are aware of something done that is able to do this...
2018-09-26T10:51:57 < veverak> TBH I am scared as fuck to design something for lipo batteries :/
2018-09-26T10:55:52 < jpa-> if you want to keep things simple, just use 1S batteries with integrated protection circuit so you don't have to worry about balancing
2018-09-26T10:56:37 < jpa-> and you can just connect the device to battery as normal, and connect the charger in parallel; it won't get to 100% full while the device is in use, but usually close enough for hobby projects
2018-09-26T10:57:32 < veverak> well, I know about 1s chargers that do this
2018-09-26T10:57:36 < veverak> adafruit has something I believe
2018-09-26T10:58:06 < jpa-> there are nice easy to use charging chips for 1S, like mcp73831
2018-09-26T11:02:41 < dongs> MAKE:R chip
2018-09-26T11:02:52 < dongs> and LTC4054
2018-09-26T11:02:58 < dongs> and hundreds of chinaclones
2018-09-26T11:05:17 < veverak> ool
2018-09-26T11:05:20 < veverak> cool
2018-09-26T11:05:32 < dongs> < veverak> adafruit has something I believe
2018-09-26T11:05:41 < dongs> i bet he does, for 20x the cost of a real thing
2018-09-26T11:05:55 < veverak> adafruit has something => there is cheap clone on aliexpress
2018-09-26T11:06:12 < dongs> more like
2018-09-26T11:06:18 < dongs> aidsfruit has something from aliexpress
2018-09-26T11:06:19 < dongs> marked up 20x
2018-09-26T11:07:28 < veverak> hmm
2018-09-26T11:07:30 < veverak> they post eagle files
2018-09-26T11:07:38 < veverak> can DIY it than :)
2018-09-26T11:08:29 < veverak> it has TS61090
2018-09-26T11:08:45 < dongs> i dont think its a part#
2018-09-26T11:10:38 < veverak> damn it
2018-09-26T11:11:45 < veverak> ok, screw that, the MCP73871 looks cool too
2018-09-26T11:19:19 < dongs> we need a new CoC for this channel. How about using https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_Code_of_the_Builder_of_Communism as a base
2018-09-26T11:20:45 < dongs> let's open a gofundme
2018-09-26T11:20:52 < veverak> lol
2018-09-26T11:21:05 < veverak> reminds me of the pubertal notion I had last week
2018-09-26T11:21:15 < veverak> after reading that python joined the band wagon for removing slave/master
2018-09-26T11:21:27 < veverak> I was thinking of putting that terminlogy in every other code I have
2018-09-26T11:21:47 < dongs> just get straight to the point and call it whites/niggers
2018-09-26T11:21:50 < dongs> why beat around the bush
2018-09-26T11:21:58 < dongs> class Nigger { };
2018-09-26T11:22:00 < dongs> class White { }
2018-09-26T11:22:01 < dongs> done
2018-09-26T11:22:08 < veverak> lol
2018-09-26T11:22:43 < veverak> but every black should be slave ;)
2018-09-26T11:22:51 < dongs> ha ha, i was just typin that
2018-09-26T11:23:01 < veverak> Haohmaru: it's a joke
2018-09-26T11:23:04 < dongs> because irc
2018-09-26T11:23:06 < dongs> you retard
2018-09-26T11:23:22 < veverak> dongs: to slavery with you!
2018-09-26T11:23:35 < veverak> anyway, I have this "dark hummor" with my roommate
2018-09-26T11:24:36 < veverak> somehow it ended up, that we use it only at home, because you are kind of afraid that some people are dumb enough to report your for nacism ... 
2018-09-26T11:25:46 < veverak> yup
2018-09-26T11:27:30 < veverak> Haohmaru: I like dark humor and I _really like_ when it is shoutd back at me
2018-09-26T11:28:21 < veverak> what bothers me is that I am ginger and most of the people in my country are not aware of the "you have no soul" jokes :/
2018-09-26T11:36:23 < kakimir> Once I painted myself black
2018-09-26T11:36:44 < kakimir> it was black kaki prank
2018-09-26T11:37:46 < kakimir> no
2018-09-26T11:42:07 < kakimir> only ashamed of my rasist prank
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2018-09-26T12:32:28 < kakimir> crt?
2018-09-26T12:39:13 -!- catphish [~charlie@unaffiliated/catphish] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-26T12:40:08 < kakimir> suitable for work?
2018-09-26T12:43:55 < kakimir> nice
2018-09-26T12:44:10 < kakimir> altium looks good
2018-09-26T13:14:42 < Thorn> https://www.youtube.com/eventhorizonshow new channel
2018-09-26T13:55:31 < Thorn> >ID: 0x0007 0xc0f1 BCR: 0x3100 BSR: 0x782d autoneg_complete 1 link_up 1 hcdspeed: 6
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2018-09-26T14:04:37 < zyp> hmm?
2018-09-26T14:07:56 < Thorn> my lan8720a establishes link
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2018-09-26T14:22:11 < zyp> congrats
2018-09-26T14:26:37 < Thorn> current consumption goes up from 100 to 150 mA when link led goes on
2018-09-26T14:27:05 < zyp> haha
2018-09-26T14:27:15 < Thorn> if I disable MCO (clock to the phy) current is ~60mA
2018-09-26T14:27:33 < zyp> oh, MCO
2018-09-26T14:27:36 < zyp> does it work well?
2018-09-26T14:27:54 < Thorn> I haven't tested actual data tx/rx over RMII yet lol
2018-09-26T14:28:10 < Thorn> but it seems to work fine looking at the scope
2018-09-26T14:28:19 < Thorn> the phy receives 25 MHz and outputs 50
2018-09-26T14:29:17 < Thorn> I need to write code to configure the MAC and DMA
2018-09-26T14:29:33 < karlp> does lan8720a do green ethernet whatsit?
2018-09-26T14:29:43 < karlp> cable length detection power tuning?
2018-09-26T14:30:02 < Thorn> probably not, it's the simplest in the family
2018-09-26T14:30:41 < Thorn> HAL driver is written for lan8742a which is incompatible with 8720a (the latter has no register 16)
2018-09-26T14:32:38 < zyp> phy drivers are overrated, you can just strap up the phy to give you a link and then just run with it
2018-09-26T14:33:03 < zyp> once you have a link, all you need to do is shout RMII at it
2018-09-26T14:33:16 < karlp> yeah, there's a massive pile of openwrt and linux devicetrees that are just fixed links
2018-09-26T14:33:23 < Thorn> well if you do autoneg and then assume it will always negotiate 100base-tx full duples you don't even need straps (or SMI) lol
2018-09-26T14:33:43 < Thorn> *duplex
2018-09-26T14:33:46 < zyp> exactly
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2018-09-26T14:43:46 < dongs> https://www.seeedstudio.com/Air602-WiFi-Module-p-3139.htmlhttps://www.seeedstudio.com/Air602-WiFi-Module-p-3139.html wat is this trash?
2018-09-26T14:43:49 < dongs> my pal is saying this is M3
2018-09-26T14:44:17 < dongs> https://github.com/SeeedDocument/Outsourcing/raw/master/113990576/01.jpg
2018-09-26T14:45:03 < karlp> nice price
2018-09-26T14:50:00 < Thorn> nice datasheet http://www.winnermicro.com/en/html/1/156/158/497.html
2018-09-26T14:50:21 < dongs> http://www.winnermicro.com/en/upload/1/editor/1523340693301.pdf datasheet is this
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2018-09-26T14:55:01 < Thorn> lol a datasheet this long would make you think it's a linear reg or something
2018-09-26T15:09:50 < kakimir> recommend me a router
2018-09-26T15:09:58 < kakimir> 1Gbps ports
2018-09-26T15:10:05 < kakimir> no modem or wlan
2018-09-26T15:10:09 < kakimir> just a router
2018-09-26T15:10:50 < karlp> channel recs would probably be mikrodik or someting
2018-09-26T15:11:38 < zyp> ubnt edgerouter
2018-09-26T15:15:57 < catphish> kakimir: one of the edgerouter variants
2018-09-26T15:16:54 < catphish> kakimir: if your requirements are just for 1Gbps ports, then probably the ER-X
2018-09-26T15:17:39 < zyp> does the ER-X do NAT well?
2018-09-26T15:17:54 < catphish> yes
2018-09-26T15:17:55 < zyp> IIRC it was recommended to at least go with the ERL-3 for NAT
2018-09-26T15:22:28 < catphish> the ER-X has hardware acceleration for NAT, it can do 1Gbps NAT in hardware, or 400Mbps in software
2018-09-26T15:23:10 < zyp> hmm, okay
2018-09-26T15:23:10 < catphish> i personally use ERL but that's more historical
2018-09-26T15:23:30 < catphish> and has more mature support for other things like ipsec
2018-09-26T15:23:35 < zyp> yeah, I got mine before the ER-X existed
2018-09-26T15:23:42 < zyp> and later traded it for an ERPOE-5
2018-09-26T15:23:52 < catphish> i've used all of them
2018-09-26T15:24:09 < zyp> considering trading it for an ER-4 next year, mainly because it's rackmountable
2018-09-26T15:24:13 < catphish> even used ER-Pro in production for a while
2018-09-26T15:24:47 < zyp> did you see my home network?
2018-09-26T15:24:51 < catphish> nope
2018-09-26T15:25:10 < dongs> karlp: http://www.yamaha.com/products/en/network/routers/rtx810/
2018-09-26T15:25:16 < dongs> errr
2018-09-26T15:25:21 < dongs> kakimir: http://www.yamaha.com/products/en/network/routers/rtx810/
2018-09-26T15:25:26 < dongs> karlp: disregard
2018-09-26T15:25:46 < dongs> above can actually: route at 1gbps
2018-09-26T15:25:52 < dongs> good luck doing that with any lunix trash
2018-09-26T15:25:55 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/1B1mQ.jpg <- today it's just a pile of mess in my tv bench
2018-09-26T15:26:08 < catphish> lol
2018-09-26T15:26:33 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/COAii.jpg <- new house will get a dedicated network closet
2018-09-26T15:26:34 < catphish> zyp: my home network: https://imgur.com/a/2Fevv
2018-09-26T15:26:59 < catphish> zyp: that cabinet looks nice :)
2018-09-26T15:27:11 < catphish> i'd love proper structured cabling
2018-09-26T15:27:14 < zyp> https://www.atlasied.com/awr3w
2018-09-26T15:27:39 < catphish> i cant do much at the moment, live in a really old house
2018-09-26T15:27:49 < zyp> I wanted a proper rack, but traditional rack cabinets are too deep
2018-09-26T15:28:32 < catphish> i just make do with switch on my desk
2018-09-26T15:28:49 < zyp> works until you got stuff in several rooms
2018-09-26T15:28:59 < catphish> yeah i have to use wifi for everything
2018-09-26T15:29:05 < catphish> luckily the unifi works great
2018-09-26T15:29:12 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-26T15:29:22 < zyp> I added ceiling outlets for unifi APs
2018-09-26T15:29:34 < catphish> ideal
2018-09-26T15:29:34 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/TWI5D.jpg
2018-09-26T15:29:44 < catphish> i should build a house
2018-09-26T15:30:07 < dongs> dickstart, make millions, build house
2018-09-26T15:30:08 < dongs> don't deliver
2018-09-26T15:30:15 < catphish> but my current house has fibre into it so that's a win :)
2018-09-26T15:30:16 < zyp> good plan
2018-09-26T15:30:24 < zyp> hehe
2018-09-26T15:30:28 < catphish> i don't know what to dickstart
2018-09-26T15:30:39 < catphish> gonna start advertising IoT development services soon
2018-09-26T15:30:59 < dfgg> zyp: whoa,wooden profiles?
2018-09-26T15:31:00 < dongs> something something arduino whatever
2018-09-26T15:31:19 < dfgg> wooden house D:
2018-09-26T15:31:23 < zyp> catphish, also, I'm not used to see FTTH on fiber pairs
2018-09-26T15:31:31 < zyp> dfgg, yeah?
2018-09-26T15:31:40 < catphish> zyp: it's ethernet, not very common, but superior
2018-09-26T15:31:58 < zyp> dfgg, I live in norway, most houses are built from wood here
2018-09-26T15:32:34 < zyp> catphish, superior to GPON, sure
2018-09-26T15:32:37 < karlp> heh, I wonder hwo much fun a dual core CM4+CM4F would be to work with.
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2018-09-26T15:32:45 < dfgg> well
2018-09-26T15:33:24 < Laurenceb124> hello my fellow radical centrists
2018-09-26T15:33:28 < zyp> catphish, but I had 1gbase-bx10 where I lived last
2018-09-26T15:33:42 < zyp> i.e. bidi ethernet over one fiber
2018-09-26T15:33:50 < catphish> zyp: it's an 8-core fiber, so i guess in theory i could do 4 pairs, several 100Gbit waver per pair :)
2018-09-26T15:33:55 < catphish> *waves
2018-09-26T15:34:06 < zyp> sure, sure
2018-09-26T15:34:11 < catphish> but the fastest my ISP sell is 350/35 :(
2018-09-26T15:34:18 < zyp> heh
2018-09-26T15:34:31 < zyp> I currently have 500/500 over GPON
2018-09-26T15:34:33 < karlp> yeah, most fibre here seems to be bidir stuff, dual freq.
2018-09-26T15:34:50 < catphish> zyp: one serious complaint i have about my ISP is that they only do 10% upload speed
2018-09-26T15:35:03 < zyp> yeah, that's dumb
2018-09-26T15:35:18 < catphish> zyp: they claim consumers don't need more and anyone who needs more should buy a "leased line" ie 5x the price with an SLA
2018-09-26T15:35:58 < catphish> what i actually have from them is a grandfathered 100/50 connection from before they had that policy, which is plenty for my needs
2018-09-26T15:36:41 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/uT2Ih.JPG <- here's how stuff looked last place I lived
2018-09-26T15:36:44 < catphish> at some point i can convert that to 350/35, but i'm happy
2018-09-26T15:36:56 < zyp> that HET-3012 is a combined fiber termination box/media converter
2018-09-26T15:37:08 < catphish> neat
2018-09-26T15:37:15 < zyp> white thing is ISP router, I threw that out and plugged in the edgerouter instead
2018-09-26T15:37:16 < catphish> my setup is kinda DIY
2018-09-26T15:37:33 < catphish> i had to dig my own trench :)
2018-09-26T15:37:42 < zyp> I'm expecting to get same ISP in new house, they are apparently building out in that area now
2018-09-26T15:37:55 < catphish> 500/500 PON seems reasonable :)
2018-09-26T15:38:00 < catphish> assuming its not over contended
2018-09-26T15:38:09 < zyp> in new house, I'm tempted to just run the fiber directly into a bidi sfp that I plug into the ER-4
2018-09-26T15:38:27 < catphish> seems sane
2018-09-26T15:38:45 < catphish> i couldn't do that because of the delicate splicing arrangement
2018-09-26T15:38:55 < catphish> better to keep the media converter in the box with the fiber
2018-09-26T15:39:24 < zyp> just get a SC adapter, run another cord into the box and plug together
2018-09-26T15:39:37 < catphish> yeah that would work
2018-09-26T15:39:39 < zyp> that's what I expect to do
2018-09-26T15:39:44 < catphish> but meh, it works as it is :)
2018-09-26T15:39:55 < catphish> ethernet media converter does no harm
2018-09-26T15:40:01 < zyp> ISP would probably install that HET-3012 downstairs, and then I run my own fiber down there and just replug :p
2018-09-26T15:40:34 < zyp> main reason I would do that is because I'll have the edgerouter on UPS upstairs, no UPS downstairs where the fiber would come in
2018-09-26T15:41:04 < catphish> makes sense then
2018-09-26T15:42:05 < zyp> also considering getting one of these: https://mikrotik.com/product/crs328_24p_4s_rm
2018-09-26T15:42:40 < dongs> thats the new one wiht 4sfp eh
2018-09-26T15:42:45 < dongs> did you see the small 4sfp i linked
2018-09-26T15:42:55 < dongs> < dongs> https://mikrotik.com/download/share/CRS305_1G_4S_IN.pdf @ zyp
2018-09-26T15:43:14 < zyp> oh
2018-09-26T15:43:15 < zyp> neat
2018-09-26T15:43:18 < zyp> haven't seen that
2018-09-26T15:43:23 < catphish> wow, that's a nice little device
2018-09-26T15:43:30 < dongs> its hot off the press from my latvian friends
2018-09-26T15:43:35 < jadew> there was a discussion recently about the center pad on ICs and the stencil hole
2018-09-26T15:43:37 < dongs> should be arounf 150-ish
2018-09-26T15:43:41 < jadew> how big was it supposed to be?
2018-09-26T15:43:42 < dongs> $
2018-09-26T15:43:46 < catphish> jadew: that was me
2018-09-26T15:43:55 < dongs> jadew: however big datasheet says
2018-09-26T15:44:03 < dongs> otherwise, follow IPC standards
2018-09-26T15:44:08 < dongs> if all else fails, just negro it
2018-09-26T15:44:20 < catphish> what dongs says
2018-09-26T15:44:36 < catphish> if it's not going to get hot, less is probably better
2018-09-26T15:44:37 < jadew> yeah, it's a QFN32
2018-09-26T15:45:29 < zyp> dongs, haha, it's the same switch chip as the one I linked, just with the copper phys left out
2018-09-26T15:45:30 < catphish> jadew: i used kicad's QFN32, it has 9 segments, works nicely
2018-09-26T15:45:41 < catphish> except when the stencil maker inexplicably combines them
2018-09-26T15:45:51 < jadew> hmm, I used the footprint from an external library, I guess I should change it
2018-09-26T15:46:10 < catphish> jadew: this is what i was talking about last week: https://imgur.com/a/uIcvKDk
2018-09-26T15:46:32 < catphish> that's kicad's QFN32, and what i received from allpcb
2018-09-26T15:46:35 < jadew> catphish, that looks nice
2018-09-26T15:46:48 < jadew> catphish, heh, I guess you can add some tape to make it smaller
2018-09-26T15:47:11 < catphish> jadew: i emailed them, they said because the spacing was less than 0.4mm they merged them
2018-09-26T15:47:12 < jadew> Haohmaru, don't remember why I used an external one, I'm re-using an older design
2018-09-26T15:47:20 < jadew> interesting
2018-09-26T15:47:22 < catphish> jadew: but the next order i used the same part, and they did it correctly
2018-09-26T15:47:42  * catphish shrugs
2018-09-26T15:47:47 < dongs> zyp, yeah
2018-09-26T15:47:58 < zyp> anyway, super cute
2018-09-26T15:48:37 < catphish> jadew: nb, the combined pad was way too much solder, it left the IC floating
2018-09-26T15:48:51 < catphish> when i used the 9 pads, it worked perfectly
2018-09-26T15:49:22 < jadew> cool, then I'll use the kicad footprints and hope the manufacturer won't change it
2018-09-26T15:49:23 < Thorn> looks like muh MAC is receiving something
2018-09-26T15:50:26 < jadew> thanks for the answers
2018-09-26T15:53:51 < catphish> jadew: good luck
2018-09-26T15:54:21 < catphish> the first parts for my pick and place machine are here :)
2018-09-26T15:54:51 < jadew> you're making a p&p machine?
2018-09-26T15:54:59 < catphish> yes, i'm winging it with really cheap rails and 3d printed parts, may or may not work
2018-09-26T15:55:22 < catphish> if it doesn't work, i'll upgrade to better parts
2018-09-26T15:56:57 < catphish> i had a bit of a change of heart last night and decided GPS is too much of a power hog in cases where it can't get a lock, so i'm going to put that aside and experiment more with DCF77
2018-09-26T15:58:13 < catphish> i also wish the card detection on my ST95HF worked properly, hopefully i can get the antenna tuned at some point and that will be the answer
2018-09-26T15:59:16 < catphish> dongs: i tried to make an open source firmware for a mikrotik switch a while back, but qualcomm switch IC turned into a dead end :(
2018-09-26T16:00:48 < dongs> why? whats wron wiht closed sores oen?
2018-09-26T16:00:51 < dongs> since it just works
2018-09-26T16:01:26 < jadew> catphish, got any pictures with the progress for the p&p? I saw a couple like that and they seemed to do the job
2018-09-26T16:02:22 < catphish> jadew: literally only *just* started, got the first few parts today, so it's nothing but a pile of 2020 extrusions some linear bearings right now
2018-09-26T16:02:46 < catphish> dongs: the interface makes me vomit a little every time i use it
2018-09-26T16:03:24 < catphish> dongs: but actually, it was not for practical reasons at all, i just thought there *should* be a switch with open source software
2018-09-26T16:03:46 < catphish> it was purely for fun and the furtherment of humanity
2018-09-26T16:04:36 < catphish> like most of my projects
2018-09-26T16:05:05 < dongs> also known as autism
2018-09-26T16:05:19 < zyp> hahaha, I was waiting for that
2018-09-26T16:05:24 < dongs> ^_^
2018-09-26T16:05:50 < catphish> dongs: you sure know a lot about this spectrum ;)
2018-09-26T16:05:53 < dongs> i mean when i buy a $100 switch, opening the sores is really on teh bottom of todo list for me
2018-09-26T16:06:01 < dongs> i just want shit to work
2018-09-26T16:06:07 < dongs> i dont mind swos interface really
2018-09-26T16:06:11 < dongs> all I ever used it for was to name the ports
2018-09-26T16:06:19 < dongs> and occasionally for port mirroring when I wanna debug something
2018-09-26T16:06:21 < zyp> swos looks more reasonable than routeros
2018-09-26T16:06:31 < dongs> im not really sure what could be so terrible about it
2018-09-26T16:06:34 < catphish> i have NIH-autism
2018-09-26T16:06:44 < zyp> but my CRS210 doesn't have swos
2018-09-26T16:06:57 < catphish> it was a CRS125G i was hacking
2018-09-26T16:06:58 < zyp> and the vlan stuff in routeros seems terrible
2018-09-26T16:07:10 < catphish> routeros switch config is kind of a mess
2018-09-26T16:07:16 < catphish> maybe swos is better, not used it
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2018-09-26T16:29:01 < Thorn> I received a broadcast UDP datagram to port 7437
2018-09-26T16:36:41 < zyp> karlp, most multicore mcus seems to be meant to be treated as independent cores
2018-09-26T16:37:28 < zyp> but in theory you could build a system where you have one scheduler that schedules stuff across both cores
2018-09-26T16:38:33 < zyp> even M4/M4F should be easy enough to handle, you could just use runtime learning to learn which tasks are using the FPU
2018-09-26T16:38:55 < Thorn> zyp: I'm receiving good packets so I guess MCO clocking is working well
2018-09-26T16:38:59 < zyp> there is already provisions for doing that, to learn which tasks you need to save/restore FPU context for
2018-09-26T16:39:04 < Thorn> hopefully tx will work too
2018-09-26T16:39:05 < zyp> Thorn, cool
2018-09-26T16:46:26 < dongs> nice
2018-09-26T16:46:41 < dongs> MCO or TIm1?
2018-09-26T16:46:46 < dongs> how do you get 25mhz out of mco
2018-09-26T16:46:51 < dongs> you need to run shit at some multiple of that?
2018-09-26T16:46:56 < dongs> or was it 50mhz
2018-09-26T16:47:05 < zyp> probably direct HSE output
2018-09-26T16:47:11 < zyp> and 25MHz xtal
2018-09-26T16:47:15 < dongs> oh that works
2018-09-26T16:47:36 < karlp> zyp: I'm expecting to have a blob for one core anyway
2018-09-26T16:48:47 < zyp> yeah?
2018-09-26T16:49:08 < zyp> if you're only programming for one core, just treat the other like some peripheral
2018-09-26T16:49:12 < dongs> sekure
2018-09-26T16:49:25 < dongs> what dualcore stm32 is there
2018-09-26T16:49:38 < zyp> the new wireless shit?
2018-09-26T16:50:11 < dongs> it has proper docs now?
2018-09-26T16:50:13 < dongs> not like STM32W?
2018-09-26T16:50:34 < karlp> atmel shitz
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2018-09-26T16:58:28 < Thorn> dongs: LL_RCC_ConfigMCO(LL_RCC_MCO2SOURCE_HSE, LL_RCC_MCO2_DIV_1);
2018-09-26T16:58:49 < Thorn> 25 MHz HSE -> mco -> phy -> refclk -> mac
2018-09-26T17:13:23 < dongs> right
2018-09-26T17:13:32 < dongs> good shit
2018-09-26T17:13:34 < dongs> you've saved $0.20
2018-09-26T17:13:40 < dongs> we should file this under zypsnips
2018-09-26T17:14:09 < dongs> karlp: ^ last 2 Thorn lines, under "ethernet_phy_no_crystal.txt"
2018-09-26T17:14:20 < Steffanx> Time to show us your gitskillz 
2018-09-26T17:14:27 < dongs> fuck that noise
2018-09-26T17:14:30 < dongs> git is so damn annoying
2018-09-26T17:14:38 < Steffanx> Hah pumped :P
2018-09-26T17:16:12 < Thorn> section 3.7.4.2 REF_CLK Out Mode and fig. 3.9 in the datasheet
2018-09-26T17:17:12 < Thorn> which doesn't show the pulldown on LED2/nINTSEL which you need to enable this mode
2018-09-26T17:17:35 < dongs> is that for LANwhaetverPHY that you were talking about earlier>
2018-09-26T17:18:07 < Thorn> also sections 3.7.4 and 3.8.1.2
2018-09-26T17:18:14 < Thorn> lan8720a
2018-09-26T17:19:32 < Thorn> fig 3.11 in 3.8.1.2 shows the resistor
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2018-09-26T17:24:26 < Thorn> so my router sends mysterious broadcasts to udp port 7437 every 5 seconds. there're forum threads about it, people wrote to the mfr, sent them packet captures, etc. nobody knows wtf this is
2018-09-26T17:25:02 < zyp> which router?
2018-09-26T17:26:15 < Thorn> tp-link, multiple models probably
2018-09-26T17:28:02 < zyp> if you got root access on it, you can check the shit it's running
2018-09-26T17:28:27 < PaulFertser> Why would one run vendor firmware on tplink anyway? It's not like it has any features like mikrotik or ubnt, right?
2018-09-26T17:29:07 < zyp> Thorn, looks like it might be some sort of print shit
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2018-09-26T17:30:13 < zyp> ref. https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=49528735&postcount=15
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2018-09-26T17:34:41 < Thorn> this is the packet https://paste.jvnv.net/view/KXjkV
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2018-09-26T17:37:13 < Thorn> lol I did have server enabled. I though I disabled everything I didn't need. thanks
2018-09-26T17:37:41 < Thorn> anyway free test packets for my ethernet device
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2018-09-26T18:18:35 < karlp> added tot he phy section, under being cheap with an 8720a
2018-09-26T18:21:17 < karlp> bah, strace says, "restart_syscall(<... resuming interrupted call ...>"
2018-09-26T18:21:20 < karlp> and it's hung.
2018-09-26T18:21:23 < karlp> wtf is it waiting on.
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2018-09-26T18:26:35 < PaulFertser> karlp: sudo cat /proc/PID/wchan
2018-09-26T18:27:31 < karlp> oh neat, thanks.
2018-09-26T18:27:56 < karlp> I restarted the process and straced it from the beginning and it saw it was waiting on postgres for something.
2018-09-26T18:28:02 < karlp> restart and walk away again.
2018-09-26T18:28:05 < karlp> diagnosis is for chumps
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2018-09-26T20:32:05 < emeb> lol - crashy F7 bug goes away when I upgrade to latest GCC.
2018-09-26T20:33:35 < emeb> looks like englishman was right
2018-09-26T20:33:45 < jpa-> timing sensitive stuff is annoying to debug, any change you make can hide it
2018-09-26T20:34:08 < emeb> yeah
2018-09-26T20:34:24 < jpa-> so is it a hardfault? what is the hardfault cause?
2018-09-26T20:35:12 < emeb> jpa-: it was a hardfault but I couldn't narrow it down.
2018-09-26T20:35:12 < emeb> appeared to be crashing in a STemWin text rendering call
2018-09-26T20:35:39 < jpa-> well surely you can atleast get the CFSR fault reason?
2018-09-26T20:39:48 < PaulFertser> When I upgrade to latest GCC my project's .text goes to 110k from 94k.
2018-09-26T20:40:05 < emeb> jpa-: haven't tried reading the *FSRs
2018-09-26T20:40:17 < jpa-> .. isn't that like the first thing you should do
2018-09-26T20:40:50 < emeb> jpa-: perhaps so. Spent more time trying to figure out where it came from. :)
2018-09-26T20:44:53 < emeb> CFSR: 0x00010000
2018-09-26T20:44:53 < emeb> HFSR: 0x40000000
2018-09-26T20:45:47 < emeb> Undefined instr
2018-09-26T20:45:56 < jpa-> so undefined instruction.. which is either flash problems or your code jumps to weird places
2018-09-26T20:46:12 < emeb> yep
2018-09-26T20:46:20 < jpa-> do you get a backtrace, or  x /16xw $sp
2018-09-26T20:46:29 < emeb> no bactrace - corrupt stack
2018-09-26T20:47:16 < jpa-> you can try decoding it manually, look for entries starting with 08 and then do    info line 0x08....
2018-09-26T20:47:56 < jpa-> (you mentioned that it is in STemWin text rendering; interestinginly my F4 flash problems were always UNDEFINSTR in NuttX text rendering)
2018-09-26T20:48:17 < emeb> heh. damned graphics libs
2018-09-26T20:48:43 < jpa-> (I assumed the cause was heavy load on flash loading on both data & instruction bus, because it is jumping between character rendering and font decoding etc, and font is loaded as data from flash)
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2018-09-26T20:52:21 < emeb>  x /16xw $sp -> no entries w/ 0x08.....
2018-09-26T20:52:43 < jpa-> is the $sp value otherwise reasonable, i.e. within your stack area?
2018-09-26T20:57:02 < emeb> jpa-: yeah - $sp is near top of region that's allocated to stack in the .ld file.
2018-09-26T20:57:22 < emeb> (gdb) print $sp
2018-09-26T20:57:22 < emeb> $1 = (void *) 0x2000fd60
2018-09-26T21:00:29 < emeb> _estack = 0x20010000;    /* end of RAM */
2018-09-26T21:00:34 < jpa-> (i guess the entries might start with 00 if your code is linked there instead of the typical 08 addresses)
2018-09-26T21:01:23 < jpa-> usually the instruction causing hardfault would be at $sp+6*4
2018-09-26T21:03:24 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/Yz06xju so tiny
2018-09-26T21:05:25 < kakimir> nice
2018-09-26T21:05:49 < kakimir> those wires weight probably the same than the cell itself
2018-09-26T21:05:57 < aandrew> 301012, 30mAh
2018-09-26T21:06:09 < aandrew> heh yeah it's light
2018-09-26T21:06:19 < aandrew> no specific use case yet, just building up some stock
2018-09-26T21:06:38 < aandrew> but I suspect I can do something tiny and useful with an nrf51 or nrf52 and this
2018-09-26T21:06:39 < emeb> jpa-: hmm... that's deep inside my I2S DMA ISR code
2018-09-26T21:06:55 < aandrew> the usb micro connector would be the biggest item
2018-09-26T21:08:18 < kakimir> aandrew: hoe much internal resistance and maximum load current?
2018-09-26T21:09:08 < emeb> jpa-: I've got a bunch of high priority code linked into the F7 ITCM SRAM so I suppose it's possible something's stomping on that.
2018-09-26T21:09:29 < emeb> equivalent to flash problems, except code RAM problems.
2018-09-26T21:10:31 < emeb> better do a disassembly and compare the gdb x output for that location
2018-09-26T21:13:51 < emeb> jpa-: interesting - the disassembly for that location has the same value that I see in gdb
2018-09-26T21:14:01 < emeb> yet it came up as undef.
2018-09-26T21:18:32 < englishman> emeb: you know what they say. even a stopped HSI clock is right 36 million times a second.
2018-09-26T21:19:09 < emeb> englishman: hrhr
2018-09-26T21:19:45 < aandrew> kakimir: TBD, I have to test these and develop curves for them
2018-09-26T21:19:54 < aandrew> kakimir: I suspect they are really pathetic little batteries
2018-09-26T21:22:20 < kakimir> I think it will have enough power for stm32 and a led
2018-09-26T21:22:46 < kakimir> aandrew: do you have adjustable load?
2018-09-26T21:22:59 < kakimir> that plots to computer the voltage?
2018-09-26T21:23:16 < kakimir> or voltage meter that plots to computer?
2018-09-26T21:41:17 < aandrew> kakimir: I bought a re:load pro, it's actually not bad and I can hack it to do more ocmplicated things if needed
2018-09-26T21:42:56 < kakimir> how much?
2018-09-26T21:47:16 < aandrew> something like $100 a few years ago I think
2018-09-26T21:47:17 < aandrew> let me check
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2018-09-26T21:51:39 < aandrew> may 2014, UKP95
2018-09-26T21:51:59 < aandrew> it was a kickstarter. I received it July that same year
2018-09-26T21:52:21 < sync> wow it has been 4 years...
2018-09-26T21:52:38 < aandrew> you can buy them on tindie now
2018-09-26T21:52:43 < emeb> jpa-: I've run the crash several times and I see different addrs @ $sp+6*4 - sometimes I see locations in the exact region where I'd narrowed the bug to, other times I see it off in the ISR.
2018-09-26T21:52:52 < sync> aandrew: a friend of mine is making a quadcopter with those batteries
2018-09-26T21:52:55 < aandrew> Nick Johnson did a good job on it
2018-09-26T21:53:05 < aandrew> sync: with those tiny batteries? 30mAh on a quadcopter??
2018-09-26T21:53:29 < emeb> when it's in the identified bug region it's pointing not at the actual instr addr, but somewhere in the middle - like the PC didn't get properly incremented.
2018-09-26T21:53:32 < sync> yes aandrew
2018-09-26T21:54:00 < sync> sub 20mm per edge
2018-09-26T21:54:18 < zyp> emeb, what sort of crash are you having?
2018-09-26T21:54:39 < aandrew> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/x/32787085735.html is what I bought
2018-09-26T21:55:20 < emeb> zyp: I've got an F7 application running on production HW w/ hundreds of units in the field. A few weeks back I did a firmware update and I've seen two units that fail with a hardfault.
2018-09-26T21:55:45 < zyp> what kind of hardfault?
2018-09-26T21:56:08 < emeb> zyp: It's an unidentified instruction. Can't backtrace due to corrupt stack
2018-09-26T21:56:52 < emeb> When I look @ $sp+6*4 which is where the PC was at the time of the fault I sometimes see an addr in the area of code that I suspect, sometimes off in an ISR.
2018-09-26T21:57:21 < zyp> how deterministic is it?
2018-09-26T21:57:27 < emeb> very random.
2018-09-26T21:57:39 < aandrew> emeb: wow, have you talked to STM about it?
2018-09-26T21:57:51 < kakimir> 125dolhars aandrew 
2018-09-26T21:57:56 < kakimir> at the moment
2018-09-26T21:57:59 < zyp> and this has never happened with the previous firmware?
2018-09-26T21:58:05 < emeb> zyp: no
2018-09-26T21:58:16 < emeb> HW has been in the field for ~9mo
2018-09-26T21:58:36 < emeb> when I do minor tweaks to code in the suspect area then bug goes away.
2018-09-26T21:58:42 < emeb> changing compilers makes bug go away
2018-09-26T21:58:45 < zyp> have you changed anything like flash wait states or sysclk? that could give spurious corrupt reads
2018-09-26T21:59:01 < emeb> disabling flash ART makes it go away
2018-09-26T21:59:19 < emeb> I didn't touch flash settings from previous code
2018-09-26T21:59:31 < emeb> and AFAIK the flash waitstates are correct
2018-09-26T21:59:33 < zyp> have you checked that the number of wait states are appropriate for the sysclk you're running?
2018-09-26T21:59:43 < zyp> maybe it just happened to work before
2018-09-26T22:00:20 < emeb> zyp: waits are set to value suggested in TRM
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2018-09-26T22:01:03 < zyp> try increasing it by a step or two just to rule it out
2018-09-26T22:01:19 < emeb> worth a try
2018-09-26T22:01:26 < Thorn> walking a leopard https://www.instagram.com/p/BoLnlLmgTGW/
2018-09-26T22:01:28 < zyp> what have you concluded so far on the cache errata you were talking about earlier?
2018-09-26T22:01:33 < zyp> also, how long time to reproduce?
2018-09-26T22:02:23 < emeb> doubt it's the flash ART - suspect that just changed overall timing enough to mask it
2018-09-26T22:02:46 < emeb> reproduces within a few seconds of entering the suspect UI menu
2018-09-26T22:04:04 < emeb> zyp: increasing flash latency from 7 to 8 states doesn't fix.
2018-09-26T22:06:48 < emeb> PC according to $sp+6*4 = 0x0800aff6
2018-09-26T22:07:16 < emeb> code @ that location = 800aff4:	f00d f9b4 	bl	8018360 <tfp_sprintf.constprop.109>
2018-09-26T22:07:31 < emeb> so it's not even pointing at a legal instr location
2018-09-26T22:07:57 < emeb> but that is in the suspected region of code
2018-09-26T22:15:04 < zyp> sup?
2018-09-26T22:15:23 < Steffanx> sky.
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2018-09-26T22:23:38 < catphish> 1% progress :) https://imgur.com/a/sQeyRZi
2018-09-26T22:23:54 < Steffanx> what is it?
2018-09-26T22:24:46 < catphish> its a frame for a pick and place machine
2018-09-26T22:24:54 < Steffanx> aha
2018-09-26T22:25:09 < Steffanx> bought some kit or .. ?
2018-09-26T22:26:16 < catphish> well i bought some 2020 extrusions, and some bearing runners so far
2018-09-26T22:26:40 < PaulFertser> emeb: but what about the link register? It's supposed to be stored there on the stack too?
2018-09-26T22:27:18 < emeb> PaulFertser: tell me more about the LR - what can I learn from it?
2018-09-26T22:27:30  * emeb shows his n00b
2018-09-26T22:27:52 < catphish> ginished one looks like https://cdn.hackaday.io/images/6284601458365238459.JPG
2018-09-26T22:28:06 < Steffanx> you didnt even run the pro gdb script: armv7m-vectstate.gdb emeb ?
2018-09-26T22:28:10 < catphish> *finished
2018-09-26T22:28:40 < emeb> Steffanx: nope
2018-09-26T22:29:15 < Steffanx> https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/armv7m-vecstate-zippe.gdb the pro gdb tools.
2018-09-26T22:30:35 < PaulFertser> emeb: probably this is an ok description: https://www.freertos.org/Debugging-Hard-Faults-On-Cortex-M-Microcontrollers.html
2018-09-26T22:30:46 < PaulFertser> Not sure how applicable that is to M7
2018-09-26T22:31:12 < Steffanx> damn that thing is even slower than i expected, catphish
2018-09-26T22:31:16 < PaulFertser> But it tells $SP+5*4 should contain lr
2018-09-26T22:31:44 < catphish> Steffanx: what thing?
2018-09-26T22:31:53 < Steffanx> the pic and placer that image came from
2018-09-26T22:32:07 < catphish> ah
2018-09-26T22:32:07 < Steffanx> i mean the pic and placer in that image
2018-09-26T22:32:24 < catphish> now i need to work out how to mount my rails onto the frame
2018-09-26T22:32:49 < emeb> Steffanx: thx - that basically tells me the same thing I already knew
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2018-09-26T22:34:01 < emeb> but it's a nice macro - much quicker to get same info
2018-09-26T22:34:13 < Steffanx> yea, i forgot to tell you that :P
2018-09-26T22:34:14 < PaulFertser> emeb: I hoped "exact" undefined instruction would come from "bl", not just some branch.
2018-09-26T22:35:08 < emeb> https://pastebin.com/SNDPpknG
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2018-09-26T22:37:27 < sync> BrainDamage: I might actually cloner your idea of using an adsl line driver as output amp
2018-09-26T22:37:44 < zyp> very hifi
2018-09-26T22:38:11 < Steffanx> How a joke turns into reality :D
2018-09-26T22:38:26 < Ultrasauce> the widest of soundstages
2018-09-26T22:38:39 < catphish> and now it has feet, i feel very slightly accomplished, even though i didn't actually design anything yet https://i.imgur.com/nwXJ7Mc.jpg
2018-09-26T22:39:07 < Ultrasauce> your printer is gloopy as fuck
2018-09-26T22:39:10 < Steffanx> ^
2018-09-26T22:39:24 < Steffanx> i wouldnt have used the word gloopy, but .. what Ultrasauce  said.
2018-09-26T22:39:49 < Ultrasauce> but you will next time
2018-09-26T22:39:56 < Steffanx> Yes ty: D
2018-09-26T22:40:03 < sync> well Steffanx I looked into it
2018-09-26T22:40:19 < sync> and they actually don't suck dick too much
2018-09-26T22:42:51 < sync> but actually not for audio shit
2018-09-26T22:43:15 < catphish> Ultrasauce: that's just what the bottom of my prints look like when i print on a raft, i've never really looked that closely at it before
2018-09-26T22:43:33 < catphish> the other layers are fine
2018-09-26T22:43:48 < Ultrasauce> oh theres probably a layer gap then, that explains a lot
2018-09-26T22:43:55 < Ultrasauce> though the edges are still a bit messy
2018-09-26T22:44:59 < catphish> you're right, i have an old replicator, this is what it it produces at default 0.2mm settings :)
2018-09-26T22:45:44 < Steffanx> Just dont make it start such far away from the bad.
2018-09-26T22:47:21 < Steffanx> *bed
2018-09-26T22:47:21 < Steffanx> lol
2018-09-26T22:47:43 < catphish> that's just how it does rafts
2018-09-26T22:47:48  * catphish shrugs
2018-09-26T22:48:41 < Steffanx> oh, failed me. I missed that part somehow. The mention of "raft" :P
2018-09-26T22:48:47 < Steffanx> *-ed
2018-09-26T22:49:10 < zyp> I thought people didn't use rafts anymore nowadays :p
2018-09-26T22:54:56 < Ultrasauce> they're great on low precision printers with warped beds
2018-09-26T23:02:48 < emeb> zyp: backing off F7 sysclk from 216 MHz to 200 MHz makes problem go away.
2018-09-26T23:03:02 < emeb> so it's some kind of marginal timing issue in some chips
2018-09-26T23:04:08 < sync> heat/chill the things?
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2018-09-26T23:07:19 < emeb> yeah, cold usually makes things go fast
2018-09-26T23:08:15 < emeb> don't have cold spray though.
2018-09-26T23:12:45 < emeb> ah - spouse had some canned air. invert can to spray raw HFCs on the chip - ran for much longer b4 lockup. 
2018-09-26T23:15:44 < emeb> So, seems like ST is shipping F7 parts with marginal timing @ max supported clock rate.
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2018-09-26T23:37:57 < sync> yeah could be emeb
2018-09-26T23:38:05 < sync> which version did you get?
2018-09-26T23:39:13 < emeb> Rev Z
2018-09-26T23:40:31 < zyp> are you sure it's running at the speed you thing it is?
2018-09-26T23:40:46 < zyp> think*
2018-09-26T23:41:08 < emeb> Given the HSE xtal & the PLL settings yes.
2018-09-26T23:42:10 < zyp> could be something got mixed up somewhere and you've inadvertly overclocked it
2018-09-26T23:42:32 < emeb> Certainly possible. Worth looking at.
2018-09-26T23:46:15 < emeb> output IRQ rate is ~24kHz -> audio rate is 4x that so 96kHz which is what it ought to be.
2018-09-26T23:46:54 < emeb> but that's based on the SAI data rate which derives from the SAI PLL, not the system clock. All that tells me is that the HSE is running at the expected 8MHz rate.
2018-09-26T23:47:48 < emeb> but PLLM = 8 and PLLN = 432 and PLLP = 2 so sysclk should be 216MHz
2018-09-26T23:53:59 < sync> are you exceeding core temp somewhere?
2018-09-26T23:56:31 < emeb> Hard to say. The MCU is not exactly insulated - no fan or heatsink on it, but not in a hot environment.
2018-09-26T23:57:12 < Steffanx> Welcome.
2018-09-26T23:58:04 < sync> you could read the internal temp sensor
2018-09-26T23:58:08 < Thorn> emeb: is it consuming the expected amount of current, maybe there's some conflict on gpio leading to overcurrent
2018-09-26T23:59:31 < emeb> Thorn: interesting idea. 
--- Day changed Thu Sep 27 2018
2018-09-27T00:00:09 < Thorn> I've found my lab psu to be a useful debugging tool lol
2018-09-27T00:01:41 < emeb> Well, this is a fully assemble product with lots of other stuff on the board besides the F7. A bit harder to dembed the processor supply current.
2018-09-27T00:01:59 < catphish> Ultrasauce: yeah my bed sucks, and temperatures that stick to the base to not equate to temperatures that product good builds, to i use a raft now, i don't have high requirements
2018-09-27T00:02:01 < emeb> Runs off +12V thru a buck switcher and then LDOs
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2018-09-27T00:23:02 < zyp> the designer that did the schematic for the stuff I'm coding for at work insisted on putting 0Rs on the supplies in front of each complex IC so that they each could be tested separately
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2018-09-27T00:41:45 < sync> that is actually not too dum zyp
2018-09-27T00:46:36 < zyp> at least not for early revisions
2018-09-27T00:47:27 < englishman> makes for easy current test points too
2018-09-27T00:47:57 < zyp> yeah
2018-09-27T00:53:20 < englishman> crt heats his house with a bunch of 0R in series
2018-09-27T00:54:33 < PaulFertser> emeb: have you tried PLLM = 4 and PLLN = 216 "to reduce PLL jitter" as recommended by the F7 RM?
2018-09-27T00:54:44 < PaulFertser> "to limit PLL jitter"
2018-09-27T00:59:03 < emeb> PaulFertser: I'll give that a try
2018-09-27T00:59:40 < emeb> sync: I added measurements for on-chip VDD and temp sensor. Looks like VDD is in spec and temp is ~41C - not too bad.
2018-09-27T01:00:23 < sync> yeah
2018-09-27T01:00:35 < sync> then it might "just" be marginal silicon o0
2018-09-27T01:04:06 < emeb> PaulFertser: low jitter PLL settings seems to have solved it. Thanks.
2018-09-27T01:05:07 < PaulFertser> emeb: oh wow, nice
2018-09-27T01:06:02 < emeb> PaulFertser: PLL jitter is one of the things I was considering as a problem. Can cause min PW errors in logic timing.
2018-09-27T01:06:43 < emeb> Didn't realize that using a higher PLL ref freq was a solution though. Good thing you're reading the details.  
2018-09-27T01:06:48 < emeb> PaulFertser: where did you see that?
2018-09-27T01:06:58 < zyp> probably the register description
2018-09-27T01:07:09 < PaulFertser> Yep, exactly.
2018-09-27T01:07:19 < englishman> interesting
2018-09-27T01:07:20 < emeb> I was going from ST example code. Dopey me. :)
2018-09-27T01:08:22 < PaulFertser> I was just going to check you're not overclocking it after multiplication stage but spotted a note regarding recommended input freq.
2018-09-27T01:10:04 < emeb> Hmm... may have spoken too soon.
2018-09-27T01:10:27 < PaulFertser> Heh
2018-09-27T01:10:27 < emeb> removed some other code and retried and now it's locking up w/ the low jitter setting too. :P
2018-09-27T01:12:50 < emeb> lol - having the ADC code for VDD and temp loaded keeps it from crashing.
2018-09-27T01:13:07 < emeb> regardless of PLL setting
2018-09-27T01:13:27 < emeb> ADC code is completely unrelated, far away from area of interest.
2018-09-27T01:14:13 < emeb> this thing is soooo sensitive to code order.
2018-09-27T01:15:08 < zyp> but fairly deterministic on whether it fails or not for a given build?
2018-09-27T01:15:17 < emeb> Yes.
2018-09-27T01:16:16 < zyp> and it never fails with ART disabled?
2018-09-27T01:16:50 < emeb> right
2018-09-27T01:17:31 < emeb> and dropping sysclk from 216 to 200 MHz also never fails - with no changes except the constants loaded into the PLL regs.
2018-09-27T01:18:43 < zyp> crazy shit
2018-09-27T01:18:51 < emeb> true dat
2018-09-27T01:20:16 < emeb> we love living on the edge.
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2018-09-27T03:53:17 < Rickta59> was just trying out libusb_stm32 (lightweight usb lib) seems to perform fairly well and size is nice and small
2018-09-27T03:53:32 < Rickta59> https://github.com/dmitrystu/libusb_stm32
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2018-09-27T04:11:25 < Laurenceb124> >Kew Gardens researchers and an international team from 18 countries have discovered Aspergillus tubingensis can break down plastic in weeks rather than decades 
2018-09-27T04:11:30 < Laurenceb124> the autists have a use after all
2018-09-27T04:11:48 -!- srk [sorki@fedora/sorki] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-27T04:12:21 < Laurenceb124> > The fungi was found in a Pakistani trash dump
2018-09-27T04:12:24 < Laurenceb124> accurate
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2018-09-27T04:30:00 < dongs> After eight years, thousands of orders, and hundreds of thousands of boards, I've closed the doors of Hackvana.
2018-09-27T04:30:05 < dongs> oh look SJWVana is closed
2018-09-27T04:30:23 < dongs> I went to thier irc channel once, they had an actual chat CoC
2018-09-27T04:34:58 < emeb_mac> mmm... plastic mushrooms.
2018-09-27T04:35:09 < emeb_mac> soon to be found growing on yer iPhone.
2018-09-27T04:35:19 < dongs> wazzat?
2018-09-27T04:35:46 < emeb_mac> "Honey, I need the latest tech - the old stuff is infected w/ aspergillus tubingensis"
2018-09-27T04:46:19 < Laurenceb124> hackvana
2018-09-27T04:46:35 < Laurenceb124> tfw so pro I dont even know what that is
2018-09-27T04:50:43 < cjbaird> tarduino.com is gone too? boo.
2018-09-27T05:25:10 < aandrew> wow those are some shit boards
2018-09-27T05:25:19 < aandrew> I've got dozens of boards from him without any issue 
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2018-09-27T05:47:11 < englishman> lol hackvana
2018-09-27T05:47:23 < englishman> reselling Chinese PCBs doesn't pay??
2018-09-27T05:47:34 < aandrew> nah he was doing pretty good with it
2018-09-27T05:47:57 < aandrew> but moved on to a sw dev job, got a pretty nice gig from what I hear
2018-09-27T05:49:42 < aandrew> wow I thought altium was kind of old and crusty in the UI department
2018-09-27T05:49:46 < aandrew> PADS is right out of Win95
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2018-09-27T06:49:45 < dongs> lol
2018-09-27T06:50:10 < dongs> yes so is orcad, allegro,  cadstar, all that fucking cancer
2018-09-27T06:58:45 < aandrew> cadstar is straight up win311
2018-09-27T07:02:35 < dongs> what teh fuck does slice polygon pour do
2018-09-27T07:02:38 < dongs> it doesnt fucking work
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2018-09-27T09:20:03 < emeb_mac> R2COM lives
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2018-09-27T09:59:44 < Steffanx> "No homo" blaxter would say
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2018-09-27T10:33:27 < Thorn> Reply from 192.168.1.99: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64
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2018-09-27T11:47:12 < kakimir> is it better to have just copper or a hole for oscope probe ground "spring"
2018-09-27T11:47:49 < kakimir> which one works better?
2018-09-27T12:02:04 < dongs> on your 18mm batteroo?
2018-09-27T12:02:56 < kakimir> who?
2018-09-27T12:03:15 < dongs> do any of your trolls used MSP430 trash
2018-09-27T12:03:19 < dongs> i'd imagine baird did
2018-09-27T12:09:40 < dongs> donno these faggots
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2018-09-27T12:09:55 < dongs> im trying to avoid having to re-assemble 1k useless shit IoT boards because of thier fuckup
2018-09-27T12:10:52 < zyp> I bought a MSP430 demoboard once, if that counts
2018-09-27T12:11:04 < zyp> not sure I ever unwrapped it though
2018-09-27T12:12:30 < kakimir> I have msp430 stocked
2018-09-27T12:12:48 < kakimir> my guru uses them
2018-09-27T12:24:46 < kakimir> AVR ftw
2018-09-27T12:31:16 < kakimir> how did I end up using LPC?
2018-09-27T12:31:25 < kakimir> I cannot remember
2018-09-27T12:32:52 < kakimir> I came here after I had locked my vendor
2018-09-27T12:33:03 < kakimir> asking LPC questions
2018-09-27T12:33:56 < kakimir> around 2013-2014 was also when I started LPCing
2018-09-27T12:34:44 < kakimir> what?
2018-09-27T12:34:47 < kakimir> is hard
2018-09-27T12:35:20 < kakimir> it isn't
2018-09-27T12:35:58 < kakimir> I'm a living proof it is not
2018-09-27T12:38:28 < kakimir> you choose your hardness level yourself
2018-09-27T12:38:57 < kakimir> hello world is not that complicated
2018-09-27T12:40:25 < karlp> why would another cortex-m make c++ easier?
2018-09-27T12:40:42 < karlp> c++ just means you need to get your linker and compiler to do the right thing, 
2018-09-27T12:42:30 < karlp> do you have anything that didn't work? or are you just complaining that a perfectly formed build environment, tailored to how you like to work, didn't just magically appear in your home directory?
2018-09-27T12:44:02 < kakimir> Haohmaru: you need to think about what a dumdum I am
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2018-09-27T12:44:15 < kakimir> go to LPC
2018-09-27T12:44:22 < kakimir> m0
2018-09-27T12:44:58 < kakimir> lpc111x Haohmaru 
2018-09-27T12:45:13 < kakimir> it's like playing with 8bit
2018-09-27T12:45:14 < karlp> Haohmaru: good story, well told.
2018-09-27T12:45:32 < kakimir> McuXpresso
2018-09-27T12:46:07 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-27T12:46:16 < kakimir> why you have all these rules
2018-09-27T12:46:36 < kakimir> go C, go small, let the specific IDE do it's job
2018-09-27T12:47:28 < kakimir> why?
2018-09-27T12:48:04 < kakimir> well
2018-09-27T12:48:26 < kakimir> if you make a problem out of it
2018-09-27T12:49:04 < kakimir> there is mxuexpresso for linux too
2018-09-27T12:49:21 < kakimir> 64bit
2018-09-27T12:50:25 < kakimir> well
2018-09-27T12:50:27 < kakimir> that is C
2018-09-27T12:50:47 < kakimir> yes
2018-09-27T12:51:30 < kakimir> but if you can't do C++ - you have only one option
2018-09-27T12:52:40 < karlp> Rickta59: dmityr's usb code is turning up all over the place.
2018-09-27T12:52:49 < karlp> Rickta59: theyr'e insane, writing half the drivers in asm
2018-09-27T12:53:09 < karlp> Rickta59: I actually didn't find it every easy to work with, I was considering writing gadget0 tests against it, 
2018-09-27T12:53:18 < kakimir> Haohmaru: why to use atmel ide?
2018-09-27T12:53:37 < karlp> Rickta59: I was looking at one of their applications, with their own custom scheduler/rtos as well, all in define magic contiki style protothreads and stuff. 
2018-09-27T12:53:47 < kakimir> with 8bit you don't even get to debug your code
2018-09-27T12:54:01 < karlp> looked like a wonderful bit of work that ~no-one else would be able to work on the innards of.
2018-09-27T12:54:28 < kakimir> avr-gcc and avrdude
2018-09-27T12:54:34 < kakimir> and libc-avr
2018-09-27T12:56:16 < kakimir> that is why you use attinys only and if you need more you switch to cortex m0
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2018-09-27T12:57:12 < karlp> so, again, do you have anythign that went wrong using c++17 on stm32? or are you just going to moan all day?
2018-09-27T12:57:40 < karlp> and why the fuck do yo ucare about attiny vs atmega if you're writing c++ anyway? g++ targets them both
2018-09-27T12:58:41 < kakimir> what I mean if you want to use big AVR use arduino
2018-09-27T13:00:46 < kakimir> hey.. I don't still know how that shit goes
2018-09-27T13:01:53 < karlp> right, soyu're just moaning then.
2018-09-27T13:02:24 < karlp> well, if you ever actualllllly want help with that, feel free to ask specific questions.
2018-09-27T13:02:54 < kakimir> Haohmaru: that is why you start with IDE
2018-09-27T13:03:23 -!- DisruptiveNL [~Disruptiv@5ED42E60.cm-7-5a.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2018-09-27T13:03:26 < kakimir> let the wizard do the job and adjust stuff in graphical interface
2018-09-27T13:04:12 < karlp> well, you could get help here, but not if you're jsut going, "shti doesn't work, I'm just going to use avrs, tehy work"
2018-09-27T13:04:34 < dongs> https://i.4cdn.org/pol/1537649093870.png
2018-09-27T13:04:49 < kakimir> Haohmaru: what year we are living in? I have had 8GB of ram for >10years
2018-09-27T13:05:20 < sync> dongs: wat
2018-09-27T13:05:51 < karlp> dongs: slammerhammer user doesn't exist....
2018-09-27T13:06:21 < dongs> wat a surprise
2018-09-27T13:06:26 < dongs> deleted by SJWs
2018-09-27T13:06:36 < karlp> self deleted,
2018-09-27T13:06:41 < kakimir> let me see how much my mcuxpresso sips ram
2018-09-27T13:06:47 < karlp> slammerhammer was the obvious troll commenter, not the project
2018-09-27T13:08:19 < kakimir> under 250megs in development view
2018-09-27T13:10:11 < kakimir> it's a bit heavy though.. ecplise is a pile of java junk
2018-09-27T13:10:15 < sync> eh, who even cares about ram usage anymore when chrome eats like 40G regularily
2018-09-27T13:12:27 < kakimir> I don't understand chome mem jokes
2018-09-27T13:12:38 < kakimir> mine takes like 1-2.5GB
2018-09-27T13:13:22 < kakimir> besides wasn't firefox like the king of unnecessary mem usage just a few years back?
2018-09-27T13:14:02 < kakimir> I think their architecture might have got better since then
2018-09-27T13:14:43 < jpa-> how do you even know how much memory chrome takes?
2018-09-27T13:15:11 < dongs> I have 93 chrome windows open right now
2018-09-27T13:15:11 < jpa-> so many processes and they share some of the memory but not all
2018-09-27T13:15:16 < dongs> its taking up 6.1gb
2018-09-27T13:15:34 < dongs> jpa-: i donno i click taskmgr, and view chrome usage
2018-09-27T13:15:44 < dongs> 13.5% cpu (constant) and .1gb ram constantly going up
2018-09-27T13:15:49 < dongs> fucking garbage
2018-09-27T13:15:53 < BrainDamage> jpa-: all chrome processes are childs of the same base
2018-09-27T13:16:01 < BrainDamage> you can group and check for non-shared memory
2018-09-27T13:16:10 < dongs> don't
2018-09-27T13:16:12 < kakimir> I use chrome in isolated mode
2018-09-27T13:16:15 < dongs> its probably using more than it neesd to
2018-09-27T13:16:32 < kakimir> https://www.pcworld.com/article/3213031/computers/best-web-browsers.html?page=2
2018-09-27T13:17:10 < kakimir> last graph shows that chrome is killing it
2018-09-27T13:25:12 < chipant> Hello, I got a situation with freemodbus stack ported for STM32 as slave. While issuing read register command from master to slave (running with freemodbus stack) slave is returning value from actual reg address + 1. Upon debugging I could not understand that why usRegAddress++ is done in line 15. https://pastebin.com/C5R719RN
2018-09-27T13:26:23 < karlp> lurn to modbus.
2018-09-27T13:26:42 < chipant> it is adding up the register address value... upon removing this line everything is fine... Is it a bug ? Pretty strange to me. 
2018-09-27T13:26:43 < karlp> or, more politely, some tools and people use register numbers (starts at 1) and some use addresses (starts at 0
2018-09-27T13:27:39 < karlp> it's not a bug per se, 
2018-09-27T13:27:52 < karlp> but in my own handlers, I just do a -- because I prefer working with addresses rather than registers.
2018-09-27T13:28:22 < karlp> you'll see problems like this with register map tables and tooling the further into this world you go unfortuntely.
2018-09-27T13:29:10 < karlp> it's bsd code, you can just go and "fix" it,
2018-09-27T13:29:41 < karlp> but I felt it was saner to decrement in my own code to leave the freemodbus code more functionally identical to anyone elses forks.
2018-09-27T13:30:17 < chipant> karlp, I see, got the idea and thank you for the resolving idea :) 
2018-09-27T13:31:25 < chipant> but why is it incremented in there... since it always adds 1 to the address. 
2018-09-27T13:33:50 < karlp> did you read what I said?
2018-09-27T13:34:28 < karlp> it reads the _address_ from the wire. adds one to get a "register number" and passes that to your user callback.
2018-09-27T13:34:41 < PaulFertser> chipant: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modbus#Coil,_discrete_input,_input_register,_holding_register_numbers_and_addresses
2018-09-27T13:34:46 < karlp> if you want to work in regsiter numbers, you're done. if you prefer to work in addresses, do a -1 yourself.
2018-09-27T13:35:39 < PaulFertser> And yes, I'm doing exactly as karlp, usAddress--; in the beginning of each callback.
2018-09-27T13:35:45 < PaulFertser> Feels most sane.
2018-09-27T13:35:58 < karlp> fuck modicon numbering 3000x bullshit
2018-09-27T13:36:03 < karlp> fucking legacy crap.
2018-09-27T13:36:15 < karlp> refer to function codes handled, and addresses plz
2018-09-27T13:37:54 < PaulFertser> Yep
2018-09-27T13:38:55 < chipant> karlp, Yeah, sure, will do accordingly. Thank you.
2018-09-27T13:39:11 < chipant> PaulFertser, Thank you a lot :) 
2018-09-27T13:48:26 < zyp> https://www.tu.no/artikler/na-naermer-det-seg-oppskyting-av-den-forste-norske-romraketten/447269 <- live stream of norwegian rocket launch
2018-09-27T13:50:21 < zyp> this is some prototype thing, hybrid engine
2018-09-27T13:50:29 < zyp> i.e. mix of solid and liquid fuel
2018-09-27T13:51:06 < zyp> it's being touted in the media as the first norwegian-developed rocket, but I watched them launch a similar one 11 years ago, so idk :p
2018-09-27T13:51:35 < invzim> I'm sure there have been a couple of rockets from Kongsberg before :)
2018-09-27T13:51:51 < zyp> I can see my parents' house from this camera angle :)
2018-09-27T13:52:14 < zyp> it's one of the closest houses, always had a nice view of launches when I was a kid
2018-09-27T13:54:37 < karlp> PaulFertser: are you using a public git fork of freemodbus at all?
2018-09-27T13:55:26 < karlp> I don't _reallly_ want to put up one and maintain it, but it's a bit shitty that heaps of people have had to make the same minor patches over the years.
2018-09-27T13:55:41 < karlp> I'd be happy to be _part_ of one, but don't really want to own it.
2018-09-27T13:59:59 < Thorn> you received a udp packet. can you send your reply to the source mac addr without doing an arp request?
2018-09-27T14:01:41 < zyp> yeah? isn't that what's normally done?
2018-09-27T14:03:08 < Thorn> I can actually see hosts sending arp requests directly to my device (not broadcasts)
2018-09-27T14:03:19 < Thorn> "mac xxx, ip yyy, are you ip yyy?"
2018-09-27T14:03:44 < Thorn> what is that for
2018-09-27T14:04:27 < Thorn> (it happens after it sends something)
2018-09-27T14:04:53 < karlp> decades of backwards compatibility and interoperability fixes with millions of not very well programmed devices.
2018-09-27T14:05:36 < PaulFertser> karlp: last time I needed freemodbus I used https://github.com/ksarkies/ARM-Ports/ but I see now I added some tweaks to it.
2018-09-27T14:06:54 < Thorn> hm no, I just sent a udp packet after waiting for 10-15 min and the 1st thing mac os did was to send a direct arp request
2018-09-27T14:08:10 < karlp> yeah, that's not realy the sort of git repo for future maintennance I was hoping for :)
2018-09-27T14:09:00 < PaulFertser> karlp: apparently I needed this for proper RS-485 tx/rx switching: http://paste.debian.net/1044760/
2018-09-27T14:09:07 < PaulFertser> Alas
2018-09-27T14:09:44 < karlp> yeah, I wasn't really looking for the ports, just a "new" single upstream for the core itself,
2018-09-27T14:12:34 < PaulFertser> I'd like to see some nice portable modbus library targetted for embedded, both slave and master support etc. But meh.
2018-09-27T14:14:09 < karlp> what do you want that freemodbus doesn't do?
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2018-09-27T14:15:10 < PaulFertser> It lacks master, it lacks support for multiple uarts, it had some problems with slave id card command iirc.
2018-09-27T14:15:28 -!- Thorn [~Thorn@unaffiliated/thorn] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-27T14:17:39 < PaulFertser> Yeah, SLAVE_ID fix: http://paste.debian.net/1044763/
2018-09-27T14:19:42 < PaulFertser> Thorn__: I think it's the way to check arp cache validity, it doesn't need to be broadcasted.
2018-09-27T14:19:58 -!- Thorn__ is now known as Thorn
2018-09-27T14:20:31 < zyp> is modbus complicated enough to warrant a library?
2018-09-27T14:20:53 < karlp> it supports multiple uarts just fine? that's what the port number is for in all the callbacks?
2018-09-27T14:21:10 < karlp> yeah, the slaveid fix was one thing that was sad to have to have everybodyu fix themselves
2018-09-27T14:21:23 < karlp> zyp: yes?
2018-09-27T14:21:27 < karlp> why wouldn't it be?
2018-09-27T14:21:43 < karlp> there's lots of functions, lots of mechanics that can be wrapped up to make a nice api
2018-09-27T14:22:26 < zyp> fair, I just realized I've only implemented read_input_register() myself :p
2018-09-27T14:24:22 < zyp> https://paste.jvnv.net/view/blYUc <- I got some super complicated modbus code :p
2018-09-27T14:24:34 < PaulFertser> I "implemented" master read_holding_register myself too. It sucks.
2018-09-27T14:24:41 < Thorn> I wrote a slave library for what I though would be modbus but it ended up being a completely different protocol lol
2018-09-27T14:26:03 < PaulFertser> http://paste.debian.net/1044764/
2018-09-27T14:26:25 < karlp> zyp: you don't handle exception replies either.
2018-09-27T14:26:38 < zyp> true
2018-09-27T14:26:53 < karlp> and yhou've got fairly fixed ideas about how much to read,
2018-09-27T14:27:03 < karlp> which might work ok with usb, but aren't going to make you happy long term
2018-09-27T14:27:17 < zyp> in what sense?
2018-09-27T14:27:29 < karlp> you hope and pray that you get everything in a 64byte reply
2018-09-27T14:28:05 < karlp> which is a) shorter than allowed and b) no guarantee that all of it will be available on teh first recv() call.
2018-09-27T14:29:04 < karlp> PaulFertser: I've never needed/wanted modbus client on stm32 so far,
2018-09-27T14:29:13 < karlp> I just use libmodbus for that
2018-09-27T14:29:44 < PaulFertser> karlp: my code handles replies of different sizes and if it replies with an exception the CRC won't match :)
2018-09-27T14:31:38 < zyp> karlp, your point b is not true, my usb device only sends full modbus frames
2018-09-27T14:31:56 < zyp> as for point a, I haven't bothered adding support for larger frames than USB MPS yet
2018-09-27T14:32:25 < zyp> https://paste.jvnv.net/view/vyuXT <- point is, framing is handled in firmware
2018-09-27T14:33:30 < karlp> zyp: yes, your usb device, I just meant that as far as "general modbus is as easy as this"
2018-09-27T14:33:46 < zyp> :)
2018-09-27T14:34:40 < karlp> what's line 15 for?
2018-09-27T14:35:00 < karlp> oh, you're doing explicitly waiting for just the right length for that function
2018-09-27T14:35:27 < karlp> I think we've cleared up why people might like do have modbus as a library then :)
2018-09-27T14:35:33 < zyp> haha
2018-09-27T14:35:43 < zyp> :)
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2018-09-27T14:36:59 < zyp> still think that code took me less time to write than figuring out libmodbus would have, and it gets the job done :p
2018-09-27T14:37:27 < Thorn> HTV capture / docking https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0
2018-09-27T14:41:22 < karlp> I never knew about libscrc before 
2018-09-27T14:41:29 < karlp> so that's always good
2018-09-27T14:43:12 < zyp> the barrier for using third party libs in python is much lower than for in an embedded firmware :)
2018-09-27T14:45:16 < karlp> well, in python I just use pymodbus... :)
2018-09-27T14:46:17 < zyp> I probably could have, but I presume I would have had to write an ACM firmware instead then
2018-09-27T14:46:42 < karlp> yes.
2018-09-27T14:46:58 < zyp> not that that's all that hard
2018-09-27T14:46:59 < karlp> or eem/ecm/whatsit
2018-09-27T14:47:36 < zyp> the old ACM code I wrote years ago works, started using it for my "serial console over CAN" stuff that I made a couple of weeks ago
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2018-09-27T15:08:39 < dongs> crt needs to stop watching anniemay
2018-09-27T15:09:11 < dongs>  < Thorn> HTV capture / docking https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0
2018-09-27T15:09:13 < dongs> when?
2018-09-27T15:09:32 < Thorn> already finished
2018-09-27T15:09:42 < Thorn> you can probably still rewind
2018-09-27T15:09:46 < dongs> yes can
2018-09-27T15:09:48 < dongs> when was it?
2018-09-27T15:09:59 < dongs> like an hour ago>?
2018-09-27T15:10:10 < Thorn> 6:30am ET iirc
2018-09-27T15:10:15 < dongs> ok i see it in preview
2018-09-27T15:10:19 < dongs> HTV = is that eh jap thing?
2018-09-27T15:10:26 < dongs> that was delayed to launch
2018-09-27T15:10:32 < Thorn> yes
2018-09-27T15:10:50 < dongs> found
2018-09-27T15:13:00 < BrainDamage> that jap text? something about tentacles
2018-09-27T15:13:10 < BrainDamage> give tentacles or something like that
2018-09-27T15:14:20 < zyp> norwegian thing is launching now
2018-09-27T15:19:44 < dongs> im too busy innovating and it looked like retarded weeb google translate
2018-09-27T15:19:48 < dongs> and BrainDamage nailed it
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2018-09-27T15:25:37 < dongs> F4G24U-A1TD-R nice connector name
2018-09-27T15:32:28 < dongs> HASHTAG ASK NASA QUESTIONS
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2018-09-27T15:44:13 < Rickta59> i've done a lot with msp430 ... not so much with their radio stuff
2018-09-27T15:44:16 < Rickta59> @ dongs 
2018-09-27T15:44:34 < Rickta59> which chip / board are you looking at dongs ?
2018-09-27T15:44:42 < dongs> yes, teh radio shit
2018-09-27T15:44:43 < dongs> cc430
2018-09-27T15:44:53 < Rickta59> that is old crap why are you bothering with that?
2018-09-27T15:46:49 < Rickta59> what is your question about them dongs ?
2018-09-27T15:51:48 < dongs> just whether need 32k osc or not, but i trolled around e2e.ti and apparently there's internal shit that works just as well
2018-09-27T15:52:03 < dongs> i thought it used 32k in some low power modes
2018-09-27T15:52:05 < dongs> for actual cpu clock
2018-09-27T15:52:21 < Rickta59> you need to provide a xtal
2018-09-27T15:52:30 < dongs> there's 26Mhz for rf part.
2018-09-27T15:52:45 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-27T15:52:51 < Rickta59> that is done using the internal DCO
2018-09-27T15:53:39 < Rickta59> there is an internal ~40k clock .. 
2018-09-27T15:53:45 < Rickta59> but certainly not calibrated 
2018-09-27T15:53:46 < dongs> ah ok
2018-09-27T15:53:48 < Rickta59> or accurate
2018-09-27T15:53:49 < dongs> well, they're not using RTC so
2018-09-27T15:54:00 < Rickta59> you can measure 
2018-09-27T15:54:29 < dongs> not my problem, i just need to make sure I dont need to reassemble this shit later
2018-09-27T15:54:48 < Rickta59> you are playing with the wristwatch?
2018-09-27T15:54:55 < dongs> no, some customer trash
2018-09-27T15:56:56 < Rickta59> VLO is the internal low frequency osc
2018-09-27T15:57:35 < Rickta59> http://www.ti.com/lit/ug/slau259e/slau259e.pdf page 109 
2018-09-27T15:58:10 < Rickta59> hmm .. maybe it does have a 32k internal clock 
2018-09-27T15:58:15 < dongs> so when its in some deep sleep shit, none of the external crtystals are used right?
2018-09-27T15:58:17 < Rickta59> 110 ERFO
2018-09-27T15:58:38 < Rickta59> there are multiple sleep modes ...
2018-09-27T15:58:51 < Rickta59> the deepest one typically shutsdown everything
2018-09-27T15:59:21 < Rickta59> specific chips have different features as far as clocks and sleep
2018-09-27T15:59:26 < Rickta59> which chip?
2018-09-27T15:59:48 < dongs> nah doesnt matter. VLO is probably waht these people will be using
2018-09-27T15:59:54 < dongs> so 32k shit is gone, thanks.
2018-09-27T15:59:55 < Rickta59> so i take that back about the 32k clock
2018-09-27T16:00:17 < Rickta59> seems like for at least the cc430f5137 there is a REFO internal
2018-09-27T16:00:22 < Rickta59> +-3.5%
2018-09-27T16:00:25 < dongs> thats the shit they have
2018-09-27T16:00:44 < Rickta59> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/cc430f5137.pdf page 28
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2018-09-27T16:03:24 < Rickta59> LPM4 disables ACLK .. whereas LPM3 keeps it ticking
2018-09-27T16:03:41 < dongs> the customers are morons anyway
2018-09-27T16:03:49 < dongs> they were asking me about low power current measurement..
2018-09-27T16:03:54 < dongs> their ampmeter is Fluke 116...
2018-09-27T16:04:07 < dongs> he was like "it seems its got some internal resistance, we're not getting any useful readings in sleep mode"
2018-09-27T16:04:14 < zyp> haha
2018-09-27T16:04:20 < Rickta59> buy one of those newer launchpad boards and use energytrace to measure
2018-09-27T16:04:40 < Rickta59> one thing TI does well with software is that product
2018-09-27T16:04:47 < dongs> shit's already on PCB, they're past prototype stage long time ago
2018-09-27T16:05:02 < dongs> but now they're realizing its not as simple as sticking shit on board and having it work
2018-09-27T16:05:07 < Rickta59> do you have access to test and rst pins .. that is all you need
2018-09-27T16:05:25 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/dL0vcYZz
2018-09-27T16:05:27 < dongs> eyah those are on a header
2018-09-27T16:05:32 < dongs> you mean swdio/swclk or whatever
2018-09-27T16:05:42 < Rickta59> and can you power it from a pin
2018-09-27T16:05:53 < Laurenceb124> Beethoven looks like Elliot
2018-09-27T16:06:00 < Rickta59> if so you can use the launchpad board to externally power and monitor it
2018-09-27T16:06:02 < Rickta59> http://www.ti.com/tool/ENERGYTRACE
2018-09-27T16:06:55 < Rickta59> that tool will tell you what LPM levels you are in
2018-09-27T16:06:56 < dongs> that doesnt seem to support CC430
2018-09-27T16:06:59 < dongs> only MSP430
2018-09-27T16:07:13 < Rickta59> cc430 is an msp430
2018-09-27T16:07:15 < Rickta59> same thing
2018-09-27T16:07:20 < Rickta59> just has soc radio
2018-09-27T16:08:05 < Rickta59> it won't do the peripheral power tracing
2018-09-27T16:08:20 < Rickta59> but should be enough to monitor lpm state and power consumption
2018-09-27T16:08:36 < Laurenceb124> ppl still use msp430...
2018-09-27T16:08:45 < Rickta59> the fram stuff is kind of nice
2018-09-27T16:08:46 < Laurenceb124> is the soc radio any good? ism band?
2018-09-27T16:08:54 < Laurenceb124> oh its chipcon?
2018-09-27T16:09:00 < Rickta59> that is the old stuff
2018-09-27T16:09:15 < dongs> CC430 is I think MSP430 + CC1100 or wahever the fuck radio
2018-09-27T16:09:18 < Rickta59> new stuff is based on arm main cpu is m4 and soc is m0
2018-09-27T16:09:38 < Rickta59> cc13xx cc265x
2018-09-27T16:09:48 < Rickta59> wifi ... ism ... lots of options
2018-09-27T16:10:10 < Rickta59> but they want to force you to use their TI-RTOS stuff
2018-09-27T16:10:17 < Rickta59> on the new stuff
2018-09-27T16:10:23 < Rickta59> simplelink they call it
2018-09-27T16:10:56 < Rickta59> but the good thing .. the "professional" toolchain they used to sell is completely free and not limited now
2018-09-27T16:12:22 < Rickta59> dongs .. this shows you what you can get energytrace to do ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1GC78RDTs4
2018-09-27T16:13:40 < Rickta59> note that the peripheral power consumption stuff and function level stuff you see with the energytrace++ .. is only available on msp430fr5x msp430fr6x .. as needs a debug peripheral you don't find on older msp430 chips
2018-09-27T16:14:31 < Rickta59> for what you are describing I'm guessing it will monitor the sleeping current and detecting if lpm modes are being entered
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2018-09-27T17:39:12 < Thorn> what is the difference between an "audio adc" and a normal one? 24/192k non-audio adcs seem hard to come by and would cost many times more
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2018-09-27T17:42:19 < Laurenceb124> >President Donald Trump told reporters on Wednesday that China supposedly respects him for his "very, very large brain."
2018-09-27T17:42:23 < Laurenceb124> the memeworld
2018-09-27T17:42:43 < dongs> brain->penis
2018-09-27T17:42:44 < dongs> ftfy
2018-09-27T17:45:05 < emeb> Thorn: "audio adc" generally means a converter that has good frequency response, linearity, etc but doesn't have great gain accuracy.
2018-09-27T17:47:07 < emeb> They're inexpensive because they use sigma-delta architectures with simple analog sections and heavy oversampling & decimation. The latency and gain inaccuracy mean that they're not much good for applications like measurement and process control.
2018-09-27T17:48:22 < emeb> Also, they tend to have isochronous I2S-type data interfaces that need to run continuously, so if you need tight timing on when they sample it's hard to control them.
2018-09-27T17:48:42 < dongs> ah yes.
2018-09-27T17:48:48 < dongs> you can't just sample/read the shit
2018-09-27T17:49:00 < dongs> cuz i2s just spews junk
2018-09-27T17:49:04 < emeb> yep
2018-09-27T17:49:07 < dongs> probably best reason to not use one
2018-09-27T17:49:42 < emeb> if you want 24-bit sampling with tight timing and one-off it's going to be super expensive because the converter needs to get all that data in one shot.
2018-09-27T17:50:51 < dongs> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/nuvoton-technology-corporation-of-america/NAU7802SGI/NAU7802SGI-ND/2769782
2018-09-27T17:50:56 < dongs> nuvoton delivers
2018-09-27T17:51:34 < dongs> newboton
2018-09-27T17:53:44 < emeb> Interesting device
2018-09-27T17:54:04 < emeb> notice - it's still a sigma-delta converter and they don't give you tight control over timing. 
2018-09-27T17:54:34 < emeb> so it's likely still running continuously internal - it just gives you the most recent sample over I2C when you ask for it.
2018-09-27T17:54:35 < dongs> i just picked 24 bits and sorted by price down
2018-09-27T17:55:03 < emeb> ya
2018-09-27T17:55:23 < emeb> but it's got good accuracy & calibration. Not bad if you're sampling something slow.
2018-09-27T17:55:30 < dongs> chepst SAR is $13
2018-09-27T17:55:50 < dongs> theres like 12 pages of sigma-delta
2018-09-27T17:56:02 < dongs> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/analog-devices-inc/AD7766BRUZ-2/AD7766BRUZ-2-ND/1680410
2018-09-27T17:56:25 < emeb> Yep. 32ksps.
2018-09-27T17:56:26 < Thorn> so when you start an audio adc it basically outputs crap for the first ms or so?
2018-09-27T17:56:47 < dongs> maybe it outputs 0s until it powers on? i donno
2018-09-27T17:56:47 < jpa-> if it is one-off, you could use separate sample&hold and then slow sigma-delta
2018-09-27T17:57:05 < emeb> Yeah - until the internal filters settle down the data will not be accurate.
2018-09-27T17:57:23 < emeb> But that depends a lot on the filters
2018-09-27T17:58:50 < Thorn> and then you cann't know the latency of what it's outputting at any given moment (how long ago it was sampled)?
2018-09-27T17:59:08 < BrainDamage> if you know the filters, then you can characterize the latency
2018-09-27T17:59:12 < emeb> Well, you can probably get latency from the datasheet, or calibrate it out yourself.
2018-09-27T17:59:23 < BrainDamage> or measure it, yes
2018-09-27T17:59:48 < emeb> But a lot of I2S audio converters have different filters depending on the sample rates, clock ratios etc so you'd need to be careful.
2018-09-27T18:00:32 < jpa-> and the thing is, it wasn't sampled - everything it outputs is a sliding window (usually CIC) average over a period of time
2018-09-27T18:01:59 < emeb> generally not just CIC - usually there's a linear-phase FIR for the final output to give the nice sharp rolloff @ nyquist. But yeah - lots of filtering & decimation.
2018-09-27T18:02:14 < jpa-> true
2018-09-27T18:03:36 < emeb> The SDADCs in the STM32F373 are sigma-delta, pretty accurate and run @ 50ksps max. They have fairly gentle filtering internally (probably just CIC or equiv)
2018-09-27T18:04:14 < emeb> but just 16-bit
2018-09-27T18:05:18 < emeb> I've used them for some audio stuff actually and they work pretty well. The differential mode can be extremely sensitive and doesn't seem to be badly affected by on-chip noise as the ordinary ADCs are.
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2018-09-27T18:29:33 < Thorn> very interesting, thanks
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2018-09-27T19:19:00 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BoPABithNXp/
2018-09-27T19:19:30 < emeb> What is it with Russians and large wild cats?
2018-09-27T19:22:10 < englishman> what is it with americans and not having large wild cats
2018-09-27T19:22:49 < PaulFertser> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Cat_Rescue <- they got plenty
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2018-09-27T19:23:29 < englishman> >big cat rescue
2018-09-27T19:23:31 < englishman> >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geoffroy%27s_cat
2018-09-27T19:23:32 < englishman> pick one
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2018-09-27T19:25:17 < emeb> Just seems like there's a lot more vids & pix of ppl in .ru who have lynx/tigers/pumas/etc as housepets
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2018-09-27T19:43:00 < emeb> Has anyone ever seen an STM32 where the SWD port becomes unusable?
2018-09-27T19:43:41 < emeb> I've got a prototype that I've been using for sw dev and I can no longer program it thru SWD. Still works fine flashing code thru an SD card though.
2018-09-27T19:44:34 < emeb> Just assuming that I must have somehow damaged those I/O pins or something
2018-09-27T19:50:52 < zyp> ROP level 2 disables swd/jtag, if you have happened to turn that on
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2018-09-27T20:07:15 < Rickta59> did you try setting boot0 high emeb ?
2018-09-27T20:10:05 < emeb> zyp: I suppose that could have accidentally been turned on. I imagine that there's no going back from it since you can't use SWD to do a full erase once that's active.
2018-09-27T20:10:52 < emeb> Rickta59: no, haven't messed w/ BOOT0. I wouldn't think that would affect SWD though - doesn't that just cause the system to start in the bootloader?
2018-09-27T20:11:09 < Rickta59> it does
2018-09-27T20:11:24 < Rickta59> set it high and reset the board, you should be able to connect using swd after that
2018-09-27T20:11:39 < zyp> emeb, yeah, it's supposed to be irreversible
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2018-09-27T20:13:20 < Rickta59> or connect using the serial bootloader and reset
2018-09-27T20:13:39 < Adluc> hello guys, what prefix for symbol do you use for ESD protection diodes, e.g. D* or something more fancy?
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2018-09-27T20:24:33 < qyx> TVS* when I am creative enough
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2018-09-27T20:25:08 < emeb> heh - tried that again w/ a different ST-Link board and it works fine now.
2018-09-27T20:25:17 < emeb> perhaps that Nucleo was bad
2018-09-27T20:25:36 < sync> yeah, I had two or three die on me
2018-09-27T20:25:39 < sync> for no real reason
2018-09-27T20:25:47 < emeb> sync: very interesting.
2018-09-27T20:25:53 < emeb> good thing they're cheap.
2018-09-27T20:26:01 < Rickta59> i've got a bunch that have never failed
2018-09-27T20:27:21 < Rickta59> heh in spite of that I tend to use the st-link clone or bmp on a bluepill
2018-09-27T20:27:29 < emeb> well, I've been using that particular one almost exclusively for years. It's got some miles on it so I wouldn't be surprised if it's damaged.
2018-09-27T20:28:16 < emeb> I like BMP but last I checked it wasn't supporting the latest F7 & H7 processors so I don't tend to reach for it first.
2018-09-27T20:28:37 < sync> I usually flash my stlinks to the segger firmware
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--- Day changed Fri Sep 28 2018
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2018-09-28T00:13:59 < emeb> gentlemen of the evening?
2018-09-28T00:15:35 < antto> much men, such gentle
2018-09-28T00:15:51 < antto> very evening
2018-09-28T00:16:09 < Steffanx> hows the menskirt today antto ?
2018-09-28T00:16:26 < antto> que?
2018-09-28T00:16:38 < Steffanx> lol, you forgot about it?
2018-09-28T00:16:54  * antto pulls out the gun
2018-09-28T00:16:59 < Steffanx> Welcome superbia.
2018-09-28T00:17:07 < antto> Skoda superbia
2018-09-28T00:17:13 < antto> 4x4
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2018-09-28T00:28:28 < Steffanx> Indeed
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2018-09-28T00:48:11 < emeb> here you go crt -> https://wall.alphacoders.com/big.php?i=690227
2018-09-28T00:54:30 < antto> https://i.imgur.com/gzUol4M.jpg
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2018-09-28T00:58:12 < antto> predator
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2018-09-28T04:14:05 < dongs> sup pro irc EEs
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2018-09-28T04:30:18 < emeb_mac> just hangin'
2018-09-28T04:30:43 < emeb_mac> looking at cat pictures on the internet, as one does.
2018-09-28T04:32:05 < Thorn> "interesting parts" https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Electronic-Dice-KIT-LED-interesting-Parts-electronic-suite-electronic-practice-parts-production-suite-DIY-study/1959068_32723782118.html
2018-09-28T04:36:55 < emeb_mac> crt: nice cat. was he lost?
2018-09-28T04:38:09 < emeb_mac> shop cat.
2018-09-28T04:38:30 < emeb_mac> Powell's Technical Books in PDX used to have a shop cat
2018-09-28T04:39:27 < emeb_mac> https://www.powells.com/post/book-news/a-tribute-to-fup-store-cat
2018-09-28T04:47:14 < emeb_mac> We have a local chain of gardening stores that have cats at all locations
2018-09-28T04:47:39 < emeb_mac> Usually roaming the plants or lounging on bags of fertilizer.
2018-09-28T04:48:14 < emeb_mac> yes, but making it look easy.
2018-09-28T04:48:30 < emeb_mac> you don't see them stalking the pests at night.
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2018-09-28T04:57:05 < Laurenceb124> my sides https://mobile.twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/status/1044987140181032960?s=19
2018-09-28T05:00:54 < emeb_mac> Laurenceb124: umm... what's funny about that? (missing context here in the US)
2018-09-28T05:01:12 < Laurenceb124> BBC use some shitty freeware trial graphics editor
2018-09-28T05:01:37 < Laurenceb124> its been watermarked
2018-09-28T05:02:48 < Laurenceb124> its all bait for the trollz
2018-09-28T05:02:58 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/Yj06bnb3
2018-09-28T05:08:17 < Laurenceb124> muricans get towncougar meeting or something
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2018-09-28T05:39:34 < englishman> emeb_mac: I went to powells
2018-09-28T05:39:36 < englishman> cool store
2018-09-28T05:40:50 < englishman> is technical books different from the big powells
2018-09-28T05:42:24 < englishman> guess it was a separate division and building
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2018-09-28T05:55:45 < emeb_mac> englishman: Yeah, they shut down the separate store a few years ago and moved it all to the top floor of the main store.
2018-09-28T05:56:34 < englishman> well there was no kitty to guard it
2018-09-28T05:56:36 < englishman> now it's gone
2018-09-28T05:56:41 < emeb_mac> yeah
2018-09-28T06:02:13 < englishman> https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/27/tesla-falls-4percent-on-report-elon-musk-sued-by-sec.html
2018-09-28T06:02:29 < emeb_mac> poor musk. so misunderstood.
2018-09-28T06:03:15 < dongs> too much weed
2018-09-28T06:03:24 < emeb_mac> this
2018-09-28T06:03:43 < englishman> am considering taking ##stm32 private at 2 grand per ban. funding secured
2018-09-28T06:04:23  * emeb_mac prepares SEC lawsuit
2018-09-28T06:04:24 < dongs> needs t o be tweeted
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2018-09-28T06:23:43 < aandrew> wtf
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2018-09-28T06:24:26 < aandrew> I'm on an inner layer and altium is throwing a DRC about me crossing a keepout 
2018-09-28T06:30:36 < dongs> which keepout
2018-09-28T06:30:58 < aandrew> just says keepout
2018-09-28T06:36:22 < dongs> shift-V
2018-09-28T06:36:24 < dongs> over the violation
2018-09-28T06:36:28 < dongs> it should fucking say in details
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2018-09-28T06:48:09 < aandrew> nope
2018-09-28T06:48:32 < aandrew> "Clearance Constraint (Collision < 5mil) Between Pad on TopLayer and PolyRegion on KeepOutLayer"
2018-09-28T06:48:48 < aandrew> I clicked on the top layer there, but let's see what it says on the inner layer
2018-09-28T06:49:29 < aandrew> "Clearance Constraint (Collision < 5mil) Between PolyRegion on KeepOutLayer and Track on MidLayer1"
2018-09-28T06:56:17 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/FZyH2Cn rapidly running out of reasonable horizontal routing
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2018-09-28T07:15:33 < dongs> <= 1.5mm lowprofile 0.5mm pitch fpc to board connector < $0.06/ea, let's go
2018-09-28T07:16:03 < dongs> FH34SRJ looks ideal but its $1 @ 5k lol
2018-09-28T07:18:20 < dongs> i found something in china for $0.08 but im not sure how stable the supply is
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2018-09-28T07:22:52 < dongs> i mean, i probably will
2018-09-28T07:22:58 < dongs> but when do when next 5k
2018-09-28T07:23:02 < dongs> err what do
2018-09-28T07:26:44 < dongs> altidumb19 fucked with BOM list too
2018-09-28T07:26:48 < dongs> at least its still a dialog
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2018-09-28T08:22:09 < emeb_mac> wut?
2018-09-28T08:25:43 < emeb_mac> sink a pink
2018-09-28T08:38:22 < englishman> nice one
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2018-09-28T12:04:36 < zyp> welcome
2018-09-28T12:11:03 < Steffanx> Lol
2018-09-28T12:11:14 < dongs> waht is this pumping motion i see
2018-09-28T12:11:17 < Steffanx> Zyp is infected by crt-itus
2018-09-28T12:11:43 < zyp> sup?
2018-09-28T12:14:28 < Steffanx> Sky i think.
2018-09-28T12:14:47 < zyp> what are you doing outdoors?
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2018-09-28T12:22:42 < dongs> https://www.nikkei.com/article/DGXMZO35847060X20C18A9AC8Z00/ fuck, japs are getting dumber and dumber
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2018-09-28T12:24:16 < sync> ?
2018-09-28T12:24:42 < zyp> haha
2018-09-28T12:25:23 < zyp> to be fair, shit like that only got legalized in norway a few years ago
2018-09-28T12:27:25 < zyp> got legalized four years ago, with a 16 year age limit
2018-09-28T12:27:42 < zyp> and then age limit got removed this year, so now they're considered more or less equivalent to bicycles
2018-09-28T12:27:58 < dongs> more proof japan is backwards faggots
2018-09-28T12:28:13 < sync> same with germoney
2018-09-28T12:28:21 < sync> because shit like this is banned basically
2018-09-28T12:29:10 < zyp> before 2014, segways and everything were banned from public use, only legal to use in enclosed areas
2018-09-28T12:29:30 < sync> segways you can get a license plate for
2018-09-28T12:29:45 < zyp> don't think that's been a thing here
2018-09-28T12:30:11 < dongs> zyp, thats the situation in jp now
2018-09-28T12:31:10 < zyp> here it seems like they've started cracking down on illegal ebikes
2018-09-28T12:33:52 < zyp> some guy ran over somebody with an ebike last year, police confiscated it, tested it and concluded it was putting out enough power to get up to 108 kph
2018-09-28T12:33:58 < zyp> legal limit is 25
2018-09-28T12:34:56 < Steffanx> :)
2018-09-28T12:36:47 < cjbaird> An old mate does Vehicle Inspections for the gubbermint, and the police came to him with a bike with a lawn-mower motor. They needed to find out its speed, as the guy had faceplanted into a road when a rim crumpled due to excessive power.
2018-09-28T12:36:58 < BrainDamage> I had a classmate with a "50cc scooter" that overtook police uphill on a 40% slope
2018-09-28T12:37:10 < BrainDamage> they immediately confiscated it
2018-09-28T12:37:31 < kakimir> what pcb house you recommend if I need ENIG?
2018-09-28T12:37:41 < cjbaird> I wonder about the Mobility Scooters that're around with 14-17" wheels..
2018-09-28T12:37:46 < zyp> kakimir, any?
2018-09-28T12:38:09 < kakimir> I think I can't really get them cheaper
2018-09-28T12:38:11 < kakimir> maybe
2018-09-28T12:38:25 < kakimir> 21mm boards - 39dolhards
2018-09-28T12:38:55 < kakimir> maybe I just need to suck it
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2018-09-28T12:46:45 < sync> haha BrainDamage, I always have the same fear when I zip by the police in my 26 year old shitbox at 140mph
2018-09-28T12:48:54 < cjbaird> Wonder if it's still illegal to ride my (110cc) Postie bike over 60 km/h after dark..
2018-09-28T12:49:48 < sync> for a long time 125cc bikes here were limited to 75kmh
2018-09-28T12:49:54 < sync> unless you had a class A license
2018-09-28T12:52:41 < cjbaird> Snap. http://www7.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/nsw/consol_reg/rr2014104/s24.4.html?context=1;query=motor%20bike%20;mask_path=au/legis/nsw/consol_reg/rr2014104 ... <100cc 40 km/h, 100<200 50km/h ...
2018-09-28T12:53:12 < cjbaird> "This rule does not apply to any motor bike that is fitted with a headlight having an effective range of at least 50 metres. " ... hmm, not actually too sure about the Postie there..
2018-09-28T12:55:11 < sync> oh wot
2018-09-28T12:55:29 < Jak_o_Shadows> You ever say "bugger it, this chip is undocuemnted, let's see if there's an arduino library"?
2018-09-28T12:56:06 < sync> the reduction gearbox in that thing
2018-09-28T12:56:20 < sync> but I'd guess the headlight shines further than 50m
2018-09-28T12:58:13 < jpa-> Jak_o_Shadows: well, any code that shows up on google of course
2018-09-28T12:58:25 < jpa-> i can't see why arduino libs would be any different than random forum posts
2018-09-28T13:00:31 < Jak_o_Shadows> theoretically, you can just plug it into the arduino, to test that the chip works
2018-09-28T13:02:51 < sync> cjbaird: oh, it has a centrifugal clutch, nice
2018-09-28T13:02:56 < karlp> arduino is often a better search term than "c" though
2018-09-28T13:06:11 < BrainDamage> arduino implies low-end embedded
2018-09-28T13:06:22 < BrainDamage> for some people embedded is just a x86 computer in a box
2018-09-28T13:11:18 < Jak_o_Shadows> well, now I have the libary, and I can look at the i2c comms as well
2018-09-28T13:11:56 < tctw> hello welcome
2018-09-28T13:12:25 < jpa-> adios goodbye
2018-09-28T13:12:28 < cjbaird> sync: being able to control the bike one-handed is a thing for delivering mail. :)
2018-09-28T13:20:20 < Steffanx> Not so unfriendly jpa- 
2018-09-28T13:28:14 < jpa-> sorry
2018-09-28T13:28:18 < jpa-> i'll ignore myself next
2018-09-28T13:32:29 < tctw> I am devestated
2018-09-28T13:35:01 < dongs> did you install lunix
2018-09-28T13:36:45 < jpa-> devestated = not vestated; vestate: 1. present adverbial passive participle of vesti; vesti: To dress
2018-09-28T13:36:54 < jpa-> what a complex way to say you are naked, Tectu
2018-09-28T13:37:11 < Steffanx> Lol jpa- 
2018-09-28T13:37:21 < dongs> lewl
2018-09-28T13:38:16 < jpa-> https://www.bbc.com/pidgin/world-40997001    did you expect bbc news to read "To piss and poopoo for open field .."?
2018-09-28T13:39:26 < Steffanx> Laurenceb is that you?
2018-09-28T13:40:11 < jpa-> yes we share one account now
2018-09-28T13:41:25 < zyp> https://www.bbc.com/pidgin <- what is this even?
2018-09-28T13:41:35 < Steffanx> Blaxterware.
2018-09-28T13:41:40 < zyp> is it serious or supposed to be some kind of satire?
2018-09-28T13:46:31 < zyp> serious. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_News_Pidgin
2018-09-28T13:46:58 < dongs> As of 2017, about 75 million people in Nigeria, Cameroon, Ghana and Equatorial Guinea use the language.
2018-09-28T13:47:03 < dongs> so this is BBC for niggers?
2018-09-28T13:47:35 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fWESSV_7cc muzaks
2018-09-28T13:47:36 < Steffanx> Niggers already have a bbc
2018-09-28T13:47:43 < Steffanx> It is known
2018-09-28T13:49:03 < Steffanx> Even kakimir posts better music vids
2018-09-28T13:49:12 < dongs> thats subjective
2018-09-28T13:49:19 < cjbaird> Someone clueless thinks 'pidgin' has a set dictionary.
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2018-09-28T14:31:17 < catphish> haha
2018-09-28T14:32:50 < Steffanx> Is it picking yet, catphish
2018-09-28T14:33:43 < catphish> Steffanx: nope :) in fact it's on hold for at least 2 weeks because i ordered some new linear rails from china
2018-09-28T14:35:49 < catphish> i'm back to designing my nfc gizmo
2018-09-28T14:36:25 < catphish> https://i.imgur.com/tWc4WvG.png
2018-09-28T14:38:11 < catphish> GPS turned out to be impractical, but DCF77 seems like it'll work
2018-09-28T14:38:24 < catphish> plus it's much smaller :)
2018-09-28T14:41:23 < BrainDamage> where's the antenna?
2018-09-28T14:42:50 < catphish> it's a ferrite bar, it'll need to be mounted somewhere
2018-09-28T14:43:32 < catphish> just soldered wire to the board at the "ANT" pins
2018-09-28T14:45:01 < catphish> most likely down one side perpendicular to the battery
2018-09-28T14:45:43 < BrainDamage> I hope your DFC frontent filter is good at rejecting interference
2018-09-28T14:45:44 < cjbaird> Speaking of which, got the magloop working. Covers 16.5 to 33.0 MHz (stray capacitance from the motor box I expect pulled it down 2M). HF bands are Ded, but was able to hear IBP beacons in Japan, Hong Kong and Sri Lanka on 17 meters this arvo.
2018-09-28T14:45:53 < catphish> 60mm bar in fact, so that's pretty much the only option
2018-09-28T14:45:56 < BrainDamage> because the NFC tag's tx will be really really strong
2018-09-28T14:46:34 < BrainDamage> it's 2-3 orders of magnitude higher in frequency, so it can be filtered, but it'll also be 6-8 orders of magnitude more intense as far as signal goes
2018-09-28T14:46:37 < catphish> BrainDamage: that's a really good point, i haven't tested turning on both :(
2018-09-28T14:47:31 < catphish> super easy test at least
2018-09-28T14:47:43 < catphish> but worth doing before i commit to this concept
2018-09-28T14:48:14 < catphish> BrainDamage: if it can't handle it i'm blaming you :)
2018-09-28T14:49:14 < BrainDamage> you can partially shield it
2018-09-28T14:50:08 < BrainDamage> you can also alter the coil's geometry so that the field falls off faster
2018-09-28T14:51:14 < BrainDamage> you can also increase the order of the input resonant filter
2018-09-28T14:51:54 < catphish> it's possible the NFC burts will be too short to impact the AGCs
2018-09-28T14:52:34 < catphish> and i can lock the AGC when doing actual communication with NFC cards (as opposed to just the brief detection bursts)
2018-09-28T14:53:01 < catphish> they recommend locking the AGC for example when operating motors nearby
2018-09-28T14:53:43 < catphish> will do some tests later anyway
2018-09-28T14:55:06 < catphish> test setup: https://i.imgur.com/UzISyZi.jpg
2018-09-28T14:56:26 < catphish> it's my vague hope that my pnp might work by the time i'm ready to do a small run of these
2018-09-28T14:58:40 < Steffanx> Just hire englishman
2018-09-28T14:59:07 < tctw> catphish, I would not recommend putting PCBs on a mouse mat like that
2018-09-28T14:59:07 < Steffanx> Or dongs
2018-09-28T14:59:27 < Steffanx> Esd doesnt exist
2018-09-28T14:59:40 < Steffanx> Its a myth
2018-09-28T14:59:51 < karlp> right up until it does and you kill everthing
2018-09-28T15:00:15 < Steffanx> So you know about such case?
2018-09-28T15:00:31 < tctw> we've killed the SRAM on three of our 10 prototypes of a product we worked on for the past few months due to ESD
2018-09-28T15:00:43 < tctw> a customer of us killed a 20k USD FPGA due to ESD
2018-09-28T15:00:44 < Steffanx> How you know it was esd?
2018-09-28T15:00:45 < tctw> it's fucking real
2018-09-28T15:01:18 < BrainDamage> I've fried 2n7002 with esd
2018-09-28T15:01:20 < tctw> whenever an SRAM dies due to ESD all sequential read operations returns  0xESD  and all random ones just garbage
2018-09-28T15:01:34 < zyp> haha
2018-09-28T15:01:39 < Steffanx> Or did you use an esd gun
2018-09-28T15:02:04 < BrainDamage> I know because some worked, some didn't, and after i started manhandling some, they ceased to work as well
2018-09-28T15:02:14 < BrainDamage> after using proper precautions, all worked
2018-09-28T15:02:19 < Steffanx> 0xTCTI5FUNNY
2018-09-28T15:02:42 < tctw> exactly what BrainDamage described
2018-09-28T15:02:42 < BrainDamage> you can even turn on the gates if you wear a sweater, all you have to go is get close with a finger
2018-09-28T15:02:58 < Steffanx> This is no academic proof
2018-09-28T15:02:59 < tctw> I bet you like to get close with a finger to many things, BrainDamage 
2018-09-28T15:03:10 < tctw> stop templeos'ing, Steffanx 
2018-09-28T15:03:43 < Steffanx> Terry is dead. Forget about him tctw 
2018-09-28T15:03:46 < zyp> BrainDamage, I usually use a screwdriver to do that
2018-09-28T15:04:02 < zyp> just touch the metal part with my finger and touch it to the gate
2018-09-28T15:07:09 < BrainDamage> tctw: only after manhandling
2018-09-28T15:09:01 < tctw> Steffanx would surely like to be touched
2018-09-28T15:09:34 < catphish> tctw: i abuse asembled PCBs a lot, i test them on carpets, i test them in bed, i'm always careful with bare ICs, never had a problem, maybe it'll bite me one day
2018-09-28T15:09:53 < BrainDamage> it depends on the device and the environment humidity
2018-09-28T15:10:00 < tctw> yep
2018-09-28T15:10:05 < catphish> it's england, it's always wet :)
2018-09-28T15:10:07 < tctw> you certainly wouldn't do that with a 3k USD dev board
2018-09-28T15:10:13 < tctw> oh, you're a blaxter
2018-09-28T15:10:17 < tctw> interesting
2018-09-28T15:11:09 < tctw> in a certain way it does very much so, yes.
2018-09-28T15:11:54 < catphish> i've never heard that word before
2018-09-28T15:12:07 < BrainDamage> it's a last name
2018-09-28T15:12:09 < tctw> you should be greatful
2018-09-28T15:12:15 < catphish> it is a last name
2018-09-28T15:12:22 < tctw> grateful*
2018-09-28T15:12:23 < catphish> google shows nothing else relevant
2018-09-28T15:12:32  * tctw looks at Laurenceb
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2018-09-28T15:37:08 < karlp> heh, speaking about nuvoton love: https://direct.nuvoton.com/en/numaker-pfm-m2351
2018-09-28T15:37:17 < karlp> esp1488 module onboard and everything
2018-09-28T15:37:23 < dongs> newboton MAKE:R
2018-09-28T15:37:31 < dongs> wow thats an awful looking boart
2018-09-28T15:37:58 < dongs> huh, cortex M23?
2018-09-28T15:38:04 < dongs> securezone?
2018-09-28T15:39:31 < karlp> yeah
2018-09-28T15:39:35 < karlp> what's 22.1184 cryustal for?
2018-09-28T15:39:46 < karlp> nuvoton m4 parts have that as internal rc, 1%
2018-09-28T15:39:53 < karlp> gotta be for something particular surely
2018-09-28T15:40:21 < dongs> uart baudrates
2018-09-28T15:40:25 < karlp> NuLink. because jlink, stlink, rlink and ktlink are not good enough
2018-09-28T15:40:33 < dongs> tilink
2018-09-28T15:40:55 < karlp> dongs: like what? stm32 does fractional dividers why would you need a crazy specific osc in the modern world?
2018-09-28T15:41:18 < dongs> shrug
2018-09-28T15:41:25 < dongs> but 22.1184/115200/8 = 24 exctly
2018-09-28T15:41:49 < dongs> and i suspect every other standard baudrate
2018-09-28T15:42:44 < dongs> where do you see that crystal?
2018-09-28T15:44:03 < dongs> newbMaker has 12mhz /32khz normal shit
2018-09-28T15:44:22 < dongs> oh, internal
2018-09-28T15:44:54 < dongs> I guess 21.1184 +-1% is better than say 12Mhz +- 5%
2018-09-28T15:46:34 < dongs> huh it has 4bit trace too
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2018-09-28T15:52:09 < karlp> heh, doesnð't provide typ or max flase page erase or write times, only minimum times :)
2018-09-28T16:03:41 < Thorn> is there some simple scheduler that lets you say 'run this function in 10 ms'
2018-09-28T16:04:05 < jpa-> hardware timer + timer interrupts? :)
2018-09-28T16:04:24 < dongs> thorn, software timers running off systick or some TIMx
2018-09-28T16:04:58 < dongs> or yeah just hardware timer IRQ for a one-off thong
2018-09-28T16:05:00 < dongs> thing
2018-09-28T16:06:18 < englishman> dongs>	so this is BBC for niggers?
2018-09-28T16:06:18 < englishman> youd know this if you clicked on any laurenceb link to bbc in the last 2 years
2018-09-28T16:06:31 < dongs> heh
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2018-09-28T16:17:47 < Thorn> I looked at freertos software times and it's not really what I have in mind, I want a single queue where you can add any function at any time
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2018-09-28T16:23:42 < jpa-> yeah, i often want that also
2018-09-28T16:23:57 < jpa-> i have a custom system for that in my work project
2018-09-28T16:24:36 < jpa-> get_systime() => 64-bit microsecond timestamp, systime_schedule(time, callback, arg) => keeps a priority queue of the functions to run and uses a single timer interrupt to schedule them
2018-09-28T16:27:02 < dongs> me2, but I don't bother sorting the queue
2018-09-28T16:27:06 < dongs> cuz i dont have like 100 timers
2018-09-28T16:27:19 < dongs> so i just keep a list that gets set to -1 on completion
2018-09-28T16:27:20 < Thorn> yeah I'm thinking about a max-heap
2018-09-28T16:27:23 < dongs> and loop through it
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2018-09-28T16:33:46 < Thorn> muh ethernet https://i.imgur.com/AAOrfDq.jpg
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2018-09-28T16:44:59 < dongs> he waited months for those PCBs and parts
2018-09-28T16:45:04 < dongs> probly 2-3 months
2018-09-28T16:47:15 < Thorn> actually 2-3 weeks
2018-09-28T16:49:35 < dongs> is that F4
2018-09-28T16:49:38 < dongs> or F103
2018-09-28T16:49:51 < dongs> I see vcap
2018-09-28T16:49:53 < dongs> probly f4
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2018-09-28T17:44:40 < emeb> the amount of effort this dude went to in order to get a cheap chinese ARM part to work - http://smdprutser.nl/blog/the-arm-chip-that-wont-cost-an-arm-and-a-leg/
2018-09-28T17:46:06 < dongs> > eagle screenshots
2018-09-28T17:47:20 < emeb> very pro
2018-09-28T17:48:01 < emeb> I have no idea where you'd even buy those parts. (Not that I'm any expert on buying stuff from china)
2018-09-28T17:48:09 < dongs> im sure chinagirl has some
2018-09-28T17:48:09 < dongs> but
2018-09-28T17:48:15 < dongs> legit STm32 F0 stuff is like...
2018-09-28T17:48:20 < dongs> < 30c sometimes depending on model
2018-09-28T17:48:22 < dongs> so ...
2018-09-28T17:48:25 < emeb> yeah
2018-09-28T17:48:28 < emeb> why bother
2018-09-28T17:48:34 < dongs> it would have to be fucking amazingly cheap
2018-09-28T17:49:22 < emeb> At some point saving a few cents isn't worth the effort
2018-09-28T17:50:01 < dongs> nope
2018-09-28T17:50:07 < dongs> same with those STM32 clone chips
2018-09-28T17:50:11 < dongs> with serial flash or whatever
2018-09-28T17:50:29 < dongs> like yea byou can get them cheaper but can you get them cheaper in 10k+ qtys reliably?? probly not
2018-09-28T17:50:49 < emeb> will they still be around in a year?
2018-09-28T17:50:55 < dongs> also that
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2018-09-28T17:53:51 < emeb> Like ppl who designed those Rafael R820T2 tuner chips into their systems. Then Rafael decided to EOL the things and they had to do lifetime buys.
2018-09-28T17:53:58 < dongs> https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Synwit_SWM050I2P7-65_C111818.html
2018-09-28T17:54:19 < dongs> so 40c
2018-09-28T17:54:23 < dongs> i guess its OK if you only need 8 pins
2018-09-28T17:54:27 < dongs> but...
2018-09-28T17:54:34 < dongs> 32pin QFN STM32 is same price or cheaper
2018-09-28T17:54:40 < dongs> and takes up almost same sapce
2018-09-28T17:54:44 < dongs> like 4x4mm qfn or whatever
2018-09-28T17:54:45 < emeb> yep
2018-09-28T17:55:49 < dongs> does that mean the tray of R820T2 i have somewhere in my cold storage is worth gold now?
2018-09-28T17:55:51 < zyp> lifetime boys
2018-09-28T17:55:52 < dongs> lolz
2018-09-28T17:56:02 < emeb> dongs: probably
2018-09-28T17:56:32 < aandrew> wtf, why can't you edit keepouts
2018-09-28T17:56:40 < dongs> you can
2018-09-28T17:56:46 < dongs> but separate shit menu now
2018-09-28T17:56:48 < dongs> PKL etc
2018-09-28T17:57:08 < aandrew> nope
2018-09-28T17:57:14 < aandrew> so I break the component apart
2018-09-28T17:57:19 < aandrew> I can see the rectangle on the keepotu
2018-09-28T17:57:22 < aandrew> but I cannot select it
2018-09-28T17:57:25 < dongs> https://www.worksonmymachine.pro/
2018-09-28T17:57:31 < aandrew> I cant' edit select include, draw a box around it
2018-09-28T17:57:36 < aandrew> it's like the layer is locked
2018-09-28T17:57:42 < dongs> check your sidebar
2018-09-28T17:57:45 < dongs> for 'selected objects'
2018-09-28T17:57:50 < dongs> maybe y ou unchecked keepouts
2018-09-28T17:57:57 < aandrew> ah maybe that's some idiotic default
2018-09-28T17:58:03 < dongs> selection filter
2018-09-28T17:58:40 < aandrew> hm, no "Include all types"
2018-09-28T17:58:42 < dongs> i donno i can select stuff on keepout layer
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2018-09-28T18:06:27 < aandrew> I used OnLayer('Keep-Out Layer') and it selected it. inspector shows *not* locked
2018-09-28T18:06:58 < aandrew> what the fuck
2018-09-28T18:07:01 < aandrew> look at this
2018-09-28T18:07:36 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/ESyyhAj
2018-09-28T18:07:39 < aandrew> what the FUCK is the point of that keepout
2018-09-28T18:07:46 < aandrew> it's absolutely useless
2018-09-28T18:08:39 < dongs> lol, keepouts in components
2018-09-28T18:08:41 < aandrew> actually it's all my molex FFC connectors have that
2018-09-28T18:08:42 < dongs> do you even vault bro
2018-09-28T18:08:52 < aandrew> yeah these are valut components. wtf
2018-09-28T18:09:14 < dongs> tear up component and move that trash to mech3 or someshit
2018-09-28T18:09:17 < dongs> just for visual
2018-09-28T18:09:30 < aandrew> ahh
2018-09-28T18:09:32 < aandrew> you know what it was
2018-09-28T18:09:36 < aandrew> "lock primitives" 
2018-09-28T18:09:42 < dongs> yeah, thats on by default of course
2018-09-28T18:09:44 < dongs> but just fix the shit in your lib
2018-09-28T18:09:45 < aandrew> yes
2018-09-28T18:09:55  * aandrew hands in his pro card
2018-09-28T18:10:09 < dongs> also wtf @ pin names
2018-09-28T18:10:17 < dongs> MP1_MP2???
2018-09-28T18:10:21 < aandrew> still no fucking clue why they'd put that there
2018-09-28T18:10:25 < aandrew> mounting pad
2018-09-28T18:10:31 < dongs> yeah, but why the fuck is it different
2018-09-28T18:10:38 < dongs> you'd 99% of the time just tiei to gnd
2018-09-28T18:10:50 < dongs> for most shit I just do pin 0, tie to gnd + hide
2018-09-28T18:10:52 < dongs> so i dont even need to see it
2018-09-28T18:10:58 < dongs> and footprint automatically has it assigned
2018-09-28T18:11:09 < dongs> and any mounting pads/etc are just designator 0
2018-09-28T18:11:50 < aandrew> yeah
2018-09-28T18:12:01 < aandrew> I *hate* hidden pins, especially ones connected to a fixed net
2018-09-28T18:12:17 < aandrew> you can always break it up I guess
2018-09-28T18:12:36 < aandrew> I just hate the idea of not seeing what is connected and then failing due to some worng assumption
2018-09-28T18:12:51 < dongs> well the error here if that was the case would be super clear
2018-09-28T18:12:53 < dongs> no problem
2018-09-28T18:13:01 < dongs> like if you don't have 'GND' but DGND + other shit
2018-09-28T18:13:07 < dongs> it'll be right there in CC as error
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2018-09-28T18:13:10 < dongs> no big deal to fix
2018-09-28T18:14:46 < dongs> but yeah y ou gotta stop vaulting
2018-09-28T18:14:51 < dongs> or else your shit will be non-pro
2018-09-28T18:15:00 < dongs> copying out of vault for a personal lib is fine
2018-09-28T18:15:06 < dongs> but keeping using that shit is just meh
2018-09-28T18:15:29 < dongs> plus vault shit has soooo many unnecessary layers 
2018-09-28T18:15:30 < dongs> and properties
2018-09-28T18:15:34 < dongs> and paramters etc
2018-09-28T18:15:42 < dongs> makes for a super shit messy design
2018-09-28T18:16:47 < aandrew> yes
2018-09-28T18:16:53 < aandrew> we've been over that a few times. vault is awful
2018-09-28T18:16:55 < aandrew> it truly is
2018-09-28T18:17:09 < aandrew> I keep wanting to take two weeks and create a proper dblib with all my shit in it
2018-09-28T18:17:19 < dongs> vault is like the equivalent of sparkfun eagle library
2018-09-28T18:17:25 < dongs> random garbage made by MAKE:Rs
2018-09-28T18:17:38 < aandrew> heh actually sparkfun lib is more trustworthy
2018-09-28T18:17:41 < aandrew> just as useless though
2018-09-28T18:17:42 < dongs> you mgiht as well download footprints from SNAPEDA
2018-09-28T18:17:51 < dongs> this shit i routed few days ago
2018-09-28T18:17:53 < dongs> had a DDR2 socket
2018-09-28T18:17:56 < dongs> probably from snapeda
2018-09-28T18:18:07 < dongs> on the socket the pins are staggered rows
2018-09-28T18:18:14 < dongs> like bottom row 1/2 pitch ofset from top row
2018-09-28T18:18:17 < dongs> the retards had it parallel
2018-09-28T18:18:35 < aandrew> heh
2018-09-28T18:18:38 < dongs> it didnt even match 3d model, iw as like hold on wha the fuck
2018-09-28T18:18:46 < aandrew> yes there is always a risk when you don't do it yoruself
2018-09-28T18:18:58 < aandrew> in fact there's risk doing it yourself but I think you tend to be more careful because it's your ass on the line
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2018-09-28T18:20:30 < aandrew> esi,esu are probably two of my favourite shortcuts
2018-09-28T18:20:50 < aandrew> took a bit of training to undo my mentality of click to select
2018-09-28T18:20:56 < dongs> esl here
2018-09-28T18:21:00 < dongs> for grabbing buses
2018-09-28T18:21:05 < dongs> for PM
2018-09-28T18:21:28 < dongs> er, UM
2018-09-28T18:21:29 < aandrew> ah yes line
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2018-09-28T18:58:15 < karlp> hrm, as best I can tell, nuvoton "data flash" section is just "erase won't erase the pages above data flash address by defualt"
2018-09-28T18:58:26 < karlp> you don't get any finer grained access, or more write durability or anything
2018-09-28T18:58:39 < karlp> it's just a line in the sand to say, application, config.
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2018-09-28T19:02:54 < mawk> it's been 2 hours I've been trying to SPI talk to some device
2018-09-28T19:03:01 < mawk> I've tried with SPI device 1, 2, 3
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2018-09-28T19:03:11 < mawk> then after 2 hours I tried to get from "motorola" mode to "TI" mode
2018-09-28T19:03:14 < aandrew> yay 0.025mm grid for squeeking shit through
2018-09-28T19:03:14 < mawk> then the magic happened
2018-09-28T19:03:39 < aandrew> karlp: sounds like nordic nrf51's approach as well
2018-09-28T19:03:56 < aandrew> you get to set an address above which is blown away when you say erase
2018-09-28T19:04:08 < aandrew> then you have to do some dicking around with FICR to erase the entire chip
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2018-09-28T19:05:13 < karlp> I mean,sure, that's somewhat nice I guess.
2018-09-28T19:05:29 < karlp> I'd say calling it "configurable dataflash" is a bit shit, but whever.
2018-09-28T19:05:49 < karlp> marking write protect on page by page is what ti offers, 
2018-09-28T19:06:25 < karlp> I was thinking they meant more like kinetis flexnvm stuff, where you can trade x kb of flash to get x/y kb of  more durable flash, and they take care of the wear levelling for you.
2018-09-28T19:07:02 < aandrew> there we go. https://imgur.com/JlztsAo I think all the diff pairs are now through that minefield
2018-09-28T19:07:43 < aandrew> doesn't look like much but that was actually fairly difficult to do
2018-09-28T19:09:49 < dongs> dont you need ground spacing between each pair
2018-09-28T19:11:40 < karlp> are those, what, rj11 socket headers or something?
2018-09-28T19:12:29 < karlp> no, they're nto all the same. weird
2018-09-28T19:13:07 < dongs> the other shit is some SOP8 or so chip
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2018-09-28T19:13:10 < dongs> with caps around it
2018-09-28T19:13:16 < dongs> the DIP stuff is some kinda connector yeah
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2018-09-28T19:29:01 < aandrew> well, most of these are striplines (they're on an inner layer, with a ground "above" and pwr a fair away away ont eh other side
2018-09-28T19:29:08 < aandrew> the other inner layer is barely used where these lines are
2018-09-28T19:29:20 < aandrew> and with LVDS it's all very low voltage swing
2018-09-28T19:29:22 < aandrew> I should simulate
2018-09-28T19:29:32 < aandrew> but I've not had too much toruble with crosstalk in the past
2018-09-28T19:30:06 < aandrew> karlp: those two 1x6 headers are jsut a breakout so I can pop on another video amp or filtering 
2018-09-28T19:30:17 < aandrew> basically DNP unless I want to fuck with it
2018-09-28T19:31:22 < catphish> what's the lowest power mode in which i can do PWM input -> DMA?
2018-09-28T19:31:51 < catphish> i'm assuming "low power sleep"
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2018-09-28T19:49:32 < dongs> #prayfordonggala is trending
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2018-09-28T19:50:01 < dongs> oh, some place in shittyeastasia
2018-09-28T19:51:03 < dongs> https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/28/technology/facebook-hack-data-breach.html lmaooo
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2018-09-28T19:58:07 < aandrew> actually maybe I can space that out a bit yet
2018-09-28T19:58:26 < aandrew> the top layer traces I dont' care about, they're clock outputs from a clock gen and I can tweak that (ideally they're all in sync anyway)
2018-09-28T19:59:00 < aandrew> and then there's two diff pairs for each digitizer (CLKO and DATO) which are related and higher speed
2018-09-28T19:59:08 < aandrew> and then a trigger diff pair for each
2018-09-28T19:59:14 < aandrew> I think I'll be alright just spacing what I can
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2018-09-28T20:03:14 < dongs> thats it
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2018-09-28T20:14:09 < Steffanx> Welcome cry
2018-09-28T20:14:11 < Steffanx> Crt.
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2018-09-28T20:15:46 < emeb> kbd off-by-one
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2018-09-28T20:33:06 < qyx> my 60Ah LiFePO4 cells are plopping when moved, is it normal?
2018-09-28T20:33:32 < qyx> I somewhat assumed that the electrolyte is not liquidous
2018-09-28T20:33:50 < jpa-> electrolyte is liquid AFAIK, but they should be full
2018-09-28T20:33:57 < qyx> -ous
2018-09-28T20:34:57 < englishman> what does plopping mean
2018-09-28T20:35:01 < englishman> to you
2018-09-28T20:35:28 < qyx> "zblnk" :)
2018-09-28T20:35:38 < qyx> like if something falls into a water
2018-09-28T20:36:20 < englishman> splashing
2018-09-28T20:36:23 < englishman> can you make a video
2018-09-28T20:36:27 < englishman> i want to see a lipo plopping
2018-09-28T20:36:31 < englishman> are you dropping them into water?
2018-09-28T20:36:35 < qyx> no lipo, lifepo4
2018-09-28T20:39:12 < emeb> possibly gas accumulating inside the cells due to overcharging?
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2018-09-28T20:40:15 < jpa-> is it a soft-pouch or metal cover?
2018-09-28T20:40:34 < qyx> metal cover
2018-09-28T20:40:38 < ds2> bare cells?
2018-09-28T20:40:47 < qyx> yes, bare cells
2018-09-28T20:41:14 < qyx> they were not overcharged afaik
2018-09-28T20:41:30 < ds2> blah...PO4 nevermind...havent played with them much
2018-09-28T20:41:59 < qyx> 16 series cells though, matched without balancing
2018-09-28T20:42:09 < qyx> but they are still ~matched and are all the same
2018-09-28T20:42:18 < qyx> ie they make the same sound
2018-09-28T20:43:34 < emeb> Seems normal: "And regarding the presence of free electrolyte, my experience has been that while some electrolyte can be heard sloshing inside the new cell before the first full charge, after a couple charge cycles, all electrolyte is absorbed into the porous active electrode materials the same manner as an AGM Pb-acid battery."
2018-09-28T20:44:02 < qyx> idk, they seem to behave well so far
2018-09-28T20:44:12 < qyx> so "sloshing" is the right word
2018-09-28T20:44:46 < englishman> weird
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2018-09-28T20:48:54 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TO2-xDizjDE
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2018-09-28T20:50:16 < englishman> saved you 7min: no he doesnt open it
2018-09-28T20:54:37 < upgrdman> https://gfycat.com/NaiveShortEelelephant
2018-09-28T20:56:38 < Steffanx> ty englishman
2018-09-28T20:56:49 < Steffanx> now i can continue inventing
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2018-09-28T21:01:29 < kakimir> Fing cool watch
2018-09-28T21:04:20 < kakimir> 4000-5000usd
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2018-09-28T21:16:35 < englishman> did libraries change in altidumb 19
2018-09-28T21:16:40 < englishman> where is the available libraries panel
2018-09-28T21:17:30 < kakimir> they did kicad
2018-09-28T21:17:36 < kakimir> and removed it
2018-09-28T21:18:44 < kakimir> got today official certificate of helping kicad project
2018-09-28T21:19:54 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2018-09-28T21:20:11 < kakimir> pdf generated with my name and some dude has signed it
2018-09-28T21:20:40 < kakimir> I felt important
2018-09-28T21:20:41 < englishman> i cant even place parts wtf
2018-09-28T21:21:37 < kakimir> dongs will wake up in 5hours or so
2018-09-28T21:22:07 < Steffanx> time to finally read this altium for dummies book mr englishman
2018-09-28T21:23:22 < englishman> WAGO doesnt give footprint data for their parts in datasheet, but they provide footprint data for TARGET PCB DESIGN, DesignSpark, and EAGLE
2018-09-28T21:23:40 < englishman> fffffffffff
2018-09-28T21:24:11 < Thorn> VAGO
2018-09-28T21:25:30 < qyx> y u no eagle?
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2018-09-28T21:26:33 < englishman> Please sign in to EAGLE
2018-09-28T21:27:19 < Steffanx> You're even trying, lol
2018-09-28T21:28:56 < Blok> I am trying to use an stm32f103 with a usb boot loader e.g. dapboot. However I cannot get an application to work after programming through the boot loader. Even a blink example fails. Any beginner mistakes I could be doing?
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2018-09-28T22:00:20 < mawk> once every 100 reset my nRFsomething outputs shit values to my register read commands
2018-09-28T22:00:28 < mawk> how do I even begin to debug that
2018-09-28T22:00:35 < mawk> maybe the nRF itself is shit
2018-09-28T22:00:45 < mawk> I ordered some pcb breakout board from ali
2018-09-28T22:01:33 < qyx> china-induced nondeterminism?
2018-09-28T22:01:35 < kakimir> is your code confirmed to work Blok?
2018-09-28T22:04:10 < mawk> it's not for real code, just for a demo
2018-09-28T22:04:15 < mawk> so I hope it will work during the demo
2018-09-28T22:05:18 < kakimir> take confirmed code and start from there
2018-09-28T22:06:17 < mawk> you have a particular reason to use that bootloader thing Blok ? you can't get a stlink ?
2018-09-28T22:07:12 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-28T22:08:04 < kakimir> strong recommendation - get a debugger
2018-09-28T22:09:14 < qyx> Blok: is the app correctly linked?
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2018-09-28T22:16:38 < Blok> kakimir & qyx: yes and yes. I made a trivial mistake when configuring the boot loader. 
2018-09-28T22:16:54 < Blok> Works now
2018-09-28T22:16:54 < mawk> why do I need to pull up or down SCK when using SPI
2018-09-28T22:17:06 < mawk> isn't the core supposed to pull it high or low when it has to
2018-09-28T22:17:12 < mawk> in master mode
2018-09-28T22:17:32 < qyx> sck?
2018-09-28T22:17:37 < qyx> di you mean cs?
2018-09-28T22:17:43 < mawk> SCK
2018-09-28T22:17:44 < mawk> the clock
2018-09-28T22:17:57 < qyx> you are not supposed to do anything with the sck
2018-09-28T22:18:22 < mawk> "The idle state of SCK must correspond to the polarity selected in the SPI_CR1 register (bypulling up SCK if CPOL=1 or pulling down SCK if CPOL=0)."
2018-09-28T22:18:33 < kakimir> well
2018-09-28T22:18:34 < mawk> in the L1 doc
2018-09-28T22:19:12 < catphish> stm32 handles the pull up/down for you i believe
2018-09-28T22:19:39 < qyx> seems logical to me
2018-09-28T22:19:45 < catphish> oh, unless you have a multi master setup, then i guess its tri state and its probably a good idea to do it externally
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2018-09-28T22:21:00 < kakimir> interesting
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2018-09-28T22:54:01 < chipant> Sorry if I am getting something wrong in here, but I am bit not sure why these errors are being generates. https://imgur.com/a/WvTWTje
2018-09-28T22:54:38 < chipant> stm32f0xx_hal_rtc.h has been included as well. 
2018-09-28T22:54:51 < qyx> you forgot to include the library itself
2018-09-28T22:55:29 < chipant> qyx, sorry not getting you.
2018-09-28T22:55:43 < qyx> it is a linker error
2018-09-28T22:55:52 < qyx> you provided the required headers
2018-09-28T22:55:59 < qyx> to the compiler doesn't complain
2018-09-28T22:56:09 < qyx> but the linker couldn't find the actual code for the HAL functions
2018-09-28T22:56:49 < qyx> so either you are not compiling all the required *.c files
2018-09-28T22:57:12 < qyx> or they are provided as a library and you are not linking with the library
2018-09-28T22:57:23 < qyx> idk what environment/hal/compiler whatever you are using
2018-09-28T22:58:54 < chipant> well these HAL headers comes with the source (.c) and upon build all won't all .c will be compiled ? 
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2018-09-28T22:59:48 < qyx> I don't know, it depends on the ide/build system
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2018-09-28T23:06:10 < chipant> seems like I am in a trap :D 
2018-09-28T23:06:26 < Thorn> I don't think the linker gives you line #s in error messages
2018-09-28T23:06:46 < Thorn> chipant: did you #define HAL_RTC_MODULE_ENABLED in your hal_conf.h?
2018-09-28T23:07:15 < qyx> it does
2018-09-28T23:07:32 < qyx> I just checked
2018-09-28T23:07:47 < chipant> Thron, No I have not defined such. Let me define then.
2018-09-28T23:09:54 < chipant> Thorn, Yes... it solved the issue. Thank you so much :) 
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2018-09-28T23:13:53 < mawk> what's the best way to detect a floating line
2018-09-28T23:14:02 < mawk> quickly trying to pull up and down and detect that ?
2018-09-28T23:15:15 < Thorn> I've got a circuit courtesy dongs in my notes
2018-09-28T23:16:27 < Thorn> something like gpio output----|>|---/\/\----(unknown line)------ gpio input
2018-09-28T23:16:51 < Thorn> then you set output to 1, measure input, set output to 0, measure input
2018-09-28T23:17:11 < Thorn> you can determine 1/0/hi-z that way
2018-09-28T23:17:16 < mawk> if you know you're faster than the unknown line yeah
2018-09-28T23:17:46 < qyx> you could use internal pull-up/pull-down instead of the output+resistor combination
2018-09-28T23:17:51 < qyx> as mawk says
2018-09-28T23:20:51 < mawk> isn't there a best way that doesn't involve being faster than the blackbox ?
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2018-09-28T23:22:45 < PaulFertser> Why do you think you need to be faster? A floating line is no longer floating if you pull it up or down.
2018-09-28T23:23:14 < mawk> it could be floating for a small amount of time
2018-09-28T23:23:26 < mawk> and get pulled up or down by the blackbox in the meantime I'm measuring it
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2018-09-28T23:25:19 < PaulFertser> I guess you can gather more statistics then.
2018-09-28T23:25:58 < mawk> I can try to pull to high/2 and measure that right ?
2018-09-28T23:26:13 < mawk> and then it'll be pulled to high/2 only if it was floating
2018-09-28T23:26:18 < mawk> and then it's done in one measurement
2018-09-28T23:26:21 < mawk> but it doesn't matter after all
2018-09-28T23:26:42 < mawk> one measurement takes the same amount of time as two measurements, in orders of magnitude
2018-09-28T23:27:03 < mawk> if I wanted very accurate statistics I can't do anything but guarantee that I'm faster than the blackbox
2018-09-28T23:27:21 < mawk> so two measurements is good
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2018-09-28T23:39:15 < kakimir> is there a world of smart people somewhere?
2018-09-28T23:39:27 < qyx> here
2018-09-28T23:39:39 < kakimir> jeez
2018-09-28T23:40:03 < kakimir> how do you feel about letting me hang around here?
2018-09-28T23:41:52 < englishman> you're not the one to worry about
2018-09-28T23:42:05 < kakimir> now I'm scared
2018-09-28T23:42:39 < kakimir> I feel like my mind is in this failsafe mode
2018-09-28T23:43:13 < kakimir> limited functionality
2018-09-28T23:44:12 < kakimir> that there is more
2018-09-28T23:47:29 -!- upgrdman [~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
2018-09-28T23:47:52 < Steffanx> Stop the drugs kakimir 
2018-09-28T23:48:37 < Steffanx> Insomnia?
2018-09-28T23:48:47 < kakimir> I have slept well
2018-09-28T23:48:52 < kakimir> done no drugs
2018-09-28T23:49:04 < kakimir> but caffeine and nicotine
2018-09-28T23:49:14 < Steffanx> You smoke?
2018-09-28T23:49:39 < kakimir> I say like once a week like this:
2018-09-28T23:49:41 < kakimir> snus
2018-09-28T23:49:55 < Steffanx> Oh, why? Whats the point?
2018-09-28T23:51:02 < mawk> overdoing caffeine puts you in some overstimulated state where you can't think, kakimir 
2018-09-28T23:52:18 < kakimir> I know how to use and abuse caffeine
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2018-09-28T23:55:59 < mawk> then maybe you're depressed
2018-09-28T23:56:19 < mawk> try ADHD meds
2018-09-28T23:57:52 < Steffanx> Lol. 
2018-09-28T23:58:32 < kakimir> I need to put in context what I said just a moment ago as I tend to just flood sentences:
2018-09-28T23:58:40 < kakimir> 23:40 < kakimir> how do you feel about letting me hang around here?
2018-09-28T23:58:40 < kakimir> 23:41 < englishman> you're not the one to worry about
2018-09-28T23:58:40 < kakimir> 23:42 < kakimir> now I'm scared
2018-09-28T23:59:17 < Steffanx> How was your day kakimir 
2018-09-28T23:59:25 < kakimir> nice
2018-09-28T23:59:43 < Steffanx> Good. 
2018-09-28T23:59:43 < kakimir> really
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--- Day changed Sat Sep 29 2018
2018-09-29T00:09:02 < kakimir> and what I tried say after that is like "I'm excited"
2018-09-29T00:09:57 < kakimir> I see I need to break routines that dull me
2018-09-29T00:11:47 < mawk> you take vacations often ?
2018-09-29T00:12:47 < Steffanx> kakimir works 7 days/week
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2018-09-29T00:27:10 < englishman> GW CSSRM2.CM
2018-09-29T00:28:43 < englishman> i can buy a bulk feeder for this siplace
2018-09-29T00:28:55 < englishman> so i can feed in 10k 0201 via funnel
2018-09-29T00:29:02 < englishman> and it just picks them up
2018-09-29T00:29:04 < englishman> cra zee
2018-09-29T00:30:31 < englishman> https://youtu.be/EFP0RqktaR4?t=41s
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2018-09-29T00:34:56 < Steffanx> Is yours that fast englishman 
2018-09-29T00:35:02 < englishman> soon
2018-09-29T00:35:55 < qyx> will you assemble my axsems
2018-09-29T00:36:41 < englishman> yes, only assembly is guaranteed however
2018-09-29T00:36:43 < englishman> not function
2018-09-29T00:39:00 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-29T00:41:59 < Steffanx> ^ is what you need catphish ;)
2018-09-29T00:43:12 < catphish> wow
2018-09-29T00:44:05 < catphish> maybe i'll start with 1206 :)
2018-09-29T00:49:49 < catphish> more seriously, if i can get 0603 working, that will be good enough for my needs
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2018-09-29T00:57:13 < catphish> i dont even know what this conversation is about
2018-09-29T00:58:01 < BrainDamage> don't worry, neither does he while he spouts random stuff
2018-09-29T00:58:18 < BrainDamage> he has logic and everything, he just choses not to use it when IRC'ing
2018-09-29T00:58:32 < BrainDamage> just like faprenceb
2018-09-29T00:59:04 < BrainDamage> except faprenceb's much more obnoxious about it
2018-09-29T00:59:54 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-29T01:01:42 < Steffanx> Haha, BrainDamage knows the crt.
2018-09-29T01:02:38 < zyp> crt, when are you coming over to europe to hang out?
2018-09-29T01:03:14 < BrainDamage> in a year or two, you'll have less barriers to come to europe than faprenceb
2018-09-29T01:03:37 < englishman> they're going to build  a wall
2018-09-29T01:03:48 < BrainDamage> because europe will be pretty salty over england's shenanigans
2018-09-29T01:04:11 < BrainDamage> we always gave them a special snowflake status, exeption from shengen, etc
2018-09-29T01:04:29 < BrainDamage> and they still wanted to get their way
2018-09-29T01:04:48 < BrainDamage> now they have the chance, and they'll be treated like everyone else, they'll get what they wanted
2018-09-29T01:06:16 < catphish> so DCF77 seems largely immune to my NFC, but is massively sensitive to antenna orientation to the point of being useless for casual placement by an end user
2018-09-29T01:06:58 < BrainDamage> weird
2018-09-29T01:07:10 < BrainDamage> the propagation should be more sensitive to daylight conditions
2018-09-29T01:07:38 < catphish> that may be the case, i've only tested at 23:00-03:00
2018-09-29T01:08:25 < catphish> but of the 2 possible antenna orientations, only one works
2018-09-29T01:08:29 < catphish> *3 possible
2018-09-29T01:08:41 < BrainDamage> weeiiird
2018-09-29T01:09:06 < mawk> what happens in the other two conformations ?
2018-09-29T01:09:08 < BrainDamage> I've thrown my dcf-powered radio in all sort of wacky positions, and it does lock, just not consistently
2018-09-29T01:09:12 < mawk> what do you see on your scope ?
2018-09-29T01:09:25 < BrainDamage> and I can only get a skywave because of the giant rocky bullshit called the alps
2018-09-29T01:09:44 < mawk> which ones BrainDamage ?
2018-09-29T01:09:56 < emeb> damned Alps
2018-09-29T01:10:15 < BrainDamage> mawk: what?
2018-09-29T01:10:16 < emeb> all their japanese electromechanical stuffs
2018-09-29T01:10:38 < catphish> mawk: i don't have a way to scope this, only the output from a receiver IC, and the result is simply random junk instead of the desired pulses
2018-09-29T01:10:51 < Steffanx> How bad is it crt?
2018-09-29T01:10:55 < mawk> which alps, BrainDamage 
2018-09-29T01:10:59 < mawk> swiss or italians
2018-09-29T01:12:01 < BrainDamage> italian
2018-09-29T01:12:23 < BrainDamage> but I am within walking distance to switzerland
2018-09-29T01:12:32 < catphish> still not as expensive as UK petrol
2018-09-29T01:12:39 < Steffanx> Ooh 1.95 here, so stop whining :P
2018-09-29T01:12:51 < Steffanx> Usd
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2018-09-29T01:13:36 < Steffanx> Sadale: beats us all with 2.07 usd/litrel
2018-09-29T01:13:41 < emeb> USD 2.67/gal here. 'murica guzzles the gas
2018-09-29T01:14:03 < Steffanx> *2.17
2018-09-29T01:14:36 < emeb> g'day
2018-09-29T01:14:59  * emeb can't type Aussie accent
2018-09-29T01:15:10 < zyp> Steffanx, huh, that's as expensive as norway, I think
2018-09-29T01:15:11 < BrainDamage> oy mate
2018-09-29T01:15:20 < zyp> not that I'm following gas prices much nowadays
2018-09-29T01:15:33 < Steffanx> My source said its 2.07 there zyp
2018-09-29T01:15:34 < BrainDamage> lats go toh the macca layter
2018-09-29T01:15:36 < emeb> crt: what part of the great southern land?
2018-09-29T01:15:50 < zyp> Steffanx, sounds about right
2018-09-29T01:16:05 < zyp> been peaking above 17 NOK recently, apparently
2018-09-29T01:16:11 < catphish> BrainDamage: actually it's not as bad as i thought, it works reasonably well in most orientations as long as they're horizontal, 
2018-09-29T01:16:12 < emeb> crt: Nice - my sister lives Melbourne
2018-09-29T01:16:42 < catphish> it only fails if you point the ferrite directly at the transmitter, or orient is vertically
2018-09-29T01:17:20 < BrainDamage> catphish: pretty sure I've literally thrown my alarm clock after a bad morning awakening, and it still synced
2018-09-29T01:17:56 < zyp> crt, just buy an EV
2018-09-29T01:18:56 < emeb> crt: what is that person doing to the window?
2018-09-29T01:18:58 < zyp> I'm in .dk now, was charging on one of the fast chargers outside a shopping mall here earlier tonight
2018-09-29T01:18:58 < Steffanx> Ah there is my 7-11 friend crt \o/
2018-09-29T01:19:02 < catphish> BrainDamage: yeah i think my first test was particularly bad luck
2018-09-29T01:19:12 < zyp> when I got back out, there were another norwegian egolf waiting to charge
2018-09-29T01:19:27 < BrainDamage> catphish: I forgot again, what were your drift limits?
2018-09-29T01:20:30 < Steffanx> emeb i heard stvn sleeps there. In front of 7-11
2018-09-29T01:20:41 < catphish> BrainDamage: 1 second absolute
2018-09-29T01:20:56 < emeb> TIL .au has 7-11
2018-09-29T01:20:59 < BrainDamage> and your shitty xtal's allan deviation?
2018-09-29T01:21:07 < zyp> emeb, which country doesn't?
2018-09-29T01:21:13 < zyp> even norway got them
2018-09-29T01:21:17 < emeb> yikes
2018-09-29T01:21:26 < BrainDamage> italy doesn't
2018-09-29T01:21:29 < Steffanx> Dutchland has none
2018-09-29T01:21:30 < catphish> BrainDamage: i'm happy to use pretty much any crystal
2018-09-29T01:21:44 < emeb> "I started driving past convenience stores that *weren't* on the way home"
2018-09-29T01:21:56 < catphish> even if its a tcxo and costs all the money
2018-09-29T01:22:08 < BrainDamage> also italy doesn't have starbucks, at least for few months
2018-09-29T01:22:22 < BrainDamage> then shit's going to change, not necessarily for the better
2018-09-29T01:22:30 < catphish> the current xtal is 10ppm at 20C
2018-09-29T01:23:00 < BrainDamage> 10ppm means ~1s drift per day so resync every 12h
2018-09-29T01:23:09 < emeb> resist US cultural imperialism
2018-09-29T01:23:16 < BrainDamage> I would use a 1ppm xtal if you have DCF77
2018-09-29T01:23:21 < catphish> BrainDamage: sure, but i can only do that if the sync works
2018-09-29T01:23:33 < BrainDamage> propagation conditions won't guarantee you a sync every night
2018-09-29T01:23:53 < BrainDamage> so having a margin of 2-3 days will give you much more leeway
2018-09-29T01:24:07 < catphish> right now i get a sync any time if i point the antenna the right way
2018-09-29T01:24:20 < catphish> but no sync if its pointed at the transmitter
2018-09-29T01:24:22 < BrainDamage> you're in germoney, right?
2018-09-29T01:24:24 < BrainDamage> that's a ground wave
2018-09-29T01:24:31 < catphish> no, UK
2018-09-29T01:24:45 < emeb> no german sync for UK due to Brexit
2018-09-29T01:25:02 < BrainDamage> mmm, still flat terrain, however ground or sky depends on FSPL
2018-09-29T01:25:12 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-29T01:25:22 < BrainDamage> which I can't estimate while bullshitting on IRC
2018-09-29T01:25:34 < catphish> BrainDamage: so you think if i just run it 24/7 i will likely get a sync eventually
2018-09-29T01:25:40 < catphish> regardless of orientation
2018-09-29T01:25:50 < catphish> based on changing atmospheric conditions
2018-09-29T01:26:18 < BrainDamage> most clocks sync only in the nighttime because they have consistent propagating conditions
2018-09-29T01:26:34 < BrainDamage> not to mention, DCF transmits in localtime, which includes daylight savings
2018-09-29T01:26:40 < catphish> well it's nearly midnight here
2018-09-29T01:26:51 < BrainDamage> which sucks if you're syncing near midnight
2018-09-29T01:27:01 < BrainDamage> so most shit sync at 3AM where it's safe to
2018-09-29T01:28:48 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-cfb8d954.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2018-09-29T01:29:09  * emeb has a cheap-ass chinese RF sync clock that he got when working @ Intel years ago. Seems to sync at night.
2018-09-29T01:29:33 < emeb> I guess it uses WWVB which is going to shut down in the next few years
2018-09-29T01:30:04 < BrainDamage> huh? is it?
2018-09-29T01:30:15 < BrainDamage> I thought were only going to shut down the HF one
2018-09-29T01:30:27 < BrainDamage> altought I guess that's a good forewarning for future budget cuts
2018-09-29T01:30:28 < emeb> Orly?
2018-09-29T01:30:30 < catphish> seems mad to shut it down
2018-09-29T01:31:03 < catphish> maybe i should try the UK time transmitter instead
2018-09-29T01:31:03 < emeb> US Gov't does a lot of mad stuff
2018-09-29T01:31:31 < BrainDamage> yes, to my knowlede the VLF will remain on
2018-09-29T01:31:46 < BrainDamage> only the HF shit will be shut down
2018-09-29T01:32:03 < BrainDamage> however, if they shut down those, there's chance that they'll consider the VLF signal equally useless too
2018-09-29T01:32:47 < BrainDamage> pig radio operators use the HF signal to check for propatation conditions, but I guess that's no valid excuse to keep it in the budget
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2018-09-29T01:36:18 < emeb> so they're shutting off the 60kHz signal but leaving the 20kHz running?
2018-09-29T01:37:21 < BrainDamage> they are shutting down WWVH and WWV, not WWVB
2018-09-29T01:37:56 < BrainDamage> WWVL is obsolte since ~forever
2018-09-29T01:37:58 < emeb> not what I read
2018-09-29T01:38:00 < emeb> https://swling.com/blog/2018/08/nist-fy2019-budget-includes-request-to-shutdown-wwv-and-wwvh/
2018-09-29T01:38:09 < emeb> wwvb too
2018-09-29T01:38:18 < emeb> but yeah wwvl is long gone
2018-09-29T01:38:42 < BrainDamage> oh, I've probably read it before the "update"
2018-09-29T01:38:57 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-29T01:39:05 < BrainDamage> that does suck :/
2018-09-29T01:39:12 < emeb> yep
2018-09-29T01:39:25 < emeb> my nice Casio watch will no longer sync
2018-09-29T01:39:40 < emeb> Thanks Drumpf
2018-09-29T01:40:05 < BrainDamage> call me eurosocialist, but I consider a state's main goal to provide the best quality of life to its citizens
2018-09-29T01:40:33 < emeb> states main goal is to funnel tax monies into the pockets of big biz
2018-09-29T01:40:37 < BrainDamage> this means that institutionalized healthcare is mandatory, and having a couple of "not so necessary" extra services in the budget is perfectly justified
2018-09-29T01:41:32 < emeb> ideally, yes
2018-09-29T01:42:58 < emeb> but here in the US I pay a >35% marginal tax rate and still have to shell out $20k/yr for healthcare
2018-09-29T01:43:25 < emeb> but at least gasoline is cheap \o/
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2018-09-29T01:49:52 < catphish> wow, BBC radio 4 at 198khz it transmitted at 500kW and carries a time signal
2018-09-29T01:50:32 < catphish> there's tons of others https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_clock#List_of_radio_time_signal_stations
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2018-09-29T01:51:03 < catphish> france has a dedicated time signal at 1100kW :|
2018-09-29T01:51:27 < catphish> 2MW according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TDF_time_signal
2018-09-29T01:51:31 -!- c4017w__ [~c4017@209.52.68.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2018-09-29T01:53:10 < catphish> seems technically superior to DCF77
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2018-09-29T01:53:54 < BrainDamage> DCF is double-modulated
2018-09-29T01:53:57 < BrainDamage> AM and PM
2018-09-29T01:54:06 < BrainDamage> 99.9% of the receivers do AM only
2018-09-29T01:54:32 < BrainDamage> you can get the PM too and compensate for atmosphere aberrations, but there's little incentive to
2018-09-29T01:54:43 < BrainDamage> if you want an high quality receiver nowdays you just get GPS
2018-09-29T01:54:56 < BrainDamage> which grants you much better accuracy
2018-09-29T01:55:13 < catphish> i've been experimenting with GPS too
2018-09-29T01:55:21 < catphish> but it's very power hungry
2018-09-29T01:55:25 < BrainDamage> that's normal
2018-09-29T01:55:48 < BrainDamage> much higher chip rate and low SNR
2018-09-29T01:57:20 < emeb> how do they do GPS synced watches?
2018-09-29T01:57:30 < emeb> seems like that'd chew batteries up
2018-09-29T01:57:40 < BrainDamage> by syncing only rarely
2018-09-29T01:57:52 < emeb> and also unreliable inside structures
2018-09-29T01:58:31 < BrainDamage> if you sync frequency is less frequent than few hours, it doesn't matter if you sync every 6 h or 24 or 48, because your cache will be dirty no matter what and you'll need to do a full sync
2018-09-29T01:58:50 < catphish> i wasn't that impressed with gps, the problem is that you have to leave it on quite a while eating power with no guarentee of getting a sync
2018-09-29T01:58:56 < BrainDamage> so it boils down to the LO being stable enough that you can afford a very slow sync interval to have a low update frequency
2018-09-29T01:59:18 < catphish> this french TDF signal looks excellent
2018-09-29T01:59:29 < BrainDamage> well, if your LO drifts only by 1s every 2 weeks, you can afford 1 sync per week
2018-09-29T01:59:53 < catphish> 1 sync per week is ok only if it works
2018-09-29T02:00:09 < catphish> but how long do you wait, and what if after 1 minute, 10 minutes? you don't have a sync
2018-09-29T02:00:09 < catphish> :(
2018-09-29T02:00:19 < BrainDamage> 20 min worst case
2018-09-29T02:00:37 < BrainDamage> ephemeris is 2 min iirc and 10 for the extra shit I forgot
2018-09-29T02:00:51 < BrainDamage> so with 20 it's twice the sample so you're sure you'll get a lock
2018-09-29T02:01:18 < catphish> really it should only take 1 minute
2018-09-29T02:01:34 < BrainDamage> 1 min what? how? if you don't know where the sats are?
2018-09-29T02:01:35 < catphish> according to specs of my device
2018-09-29T02:02:01 < emeb> if you only want time is it OK to only lock one sat?
2018-09-29T02:02:05 < catphish> my understanding is that you do know how many sats there are, this information is mostly static
2018-09-29T02:02:09 < emeb> or is the timing error w/o location too large?
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2018-09-29T02:02:11 < BrainDamage> no because you won't know the delay
2018-09-29T02:02:18 < catphish> BrainDamage: the delay doesn't matter
2018-09-29T02:02:30 < catphish> it's in the millisecond range afaik
2018-09-29T02:02:43 < emeb> good enough for a watch
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2018-09-29T02:02:45 < Laurenceb124> muh loicense
2018-09-29T02:02:47 < catphish> but unfortunately i don't know of any gps receiver that will just report the first time it sees :(
2018-09-29T02:03:04 < emeb> make your own!
2018-09-29T02:03:04 < Laurenceb124> tfw my scaffolding loicense hasn't arrived
2018-09-29T02:03:21 < BrainDamage> hah, failrenceb iirc did a sw based gps receiver
2018-09-29T02:03:25 < emeb> Laurenceb124 knows how to RX GPS
2018-09-29T02:03:25 < Laurenceb124> and I dont have a loicense to apply for scaffolding loicense
2018-09-29T02:03:28 < BrainDamage> using a stm as multichannel correlator
2018-09-29T02:03:41 < Laurenceb124> BrainDamage: nope, it was in methlab
2018-09-29T02:03:48 < Laurenceb124> well actually it wasnt that bad
2018-09-29T02:04:02 < Laurenceb124> it was batch processing correlator on discovery
2018-09-29T02:04:07 < Laurenceb124> then rest in matlab
2018-09-29T02:04:27 < Laurenceb124> got ~3m error on first attempt, was very impressed
2018-09-29T02:04:42 < Laurenceb124> then I tried in realistic multipath and got ~50m error, not so good
2018-09-29T02:05:06 < BrainDamage> I've read that if you characterize your rx system for multipath you can get sub-m error
2018-09-29T02:05:06 < emeb> eh - still good enough for a watch
2018-09-29T02:05:07 < Laurenceb124> ragequit when it came to ionospheric corrections
2018-09-29T02:05:18 < Laurenceb124> the documentation was aweful
2018-09-29T02:05:33 < Laurenceb124> example asm for 16bit processor O_o
2018-09-29T02:05:34 < BrainDamage> eh ionospheric pretty much requires a separate info source or differential gps with enough spacing
2018-09-29T02:06:01 < Laurenceb124> nah just the broadcast ionospheric stuff
2018-09-29T02:06:08 < catphish> why does knowing the time have to be so hard? :(
2018-09-29T02:06:10 < Laurenceb124> you need that to reliably get <10m error
2018-09-29T02:06:26 < BrainDamage> I was talking for the sub-m receiver
2018-09-29T02:06:54 < Laurenceb124> problem is its poorly documented, I ended up with 80s documentaion off dtic that was a pita to follow
2018-09-29T02:07:59 < Laurenceb124> >be me >be replacing gas stove and chimney >spend ~£1k on parts >spend ~£1k on loicenses
2018-09-29T02:08:13 < Laurenceb124> britbong intensifies
2018-09-29T02:08:13 < BrainDamage> what
2018-09-29T02:08:36 < BrainDamage> here gas stove doesn't require chimeny, just a ventilation shaft in case of a leak
2018-09-29T02:08:42 < Laurenceb124> >scaffolding loicense >gas installation loicense >flue loicense >building inspection fee
2018-09-29T02:09:10 < BrainDamage> and a fucking gas range is 100-200 bucks most
2018-09-29T02:09:24 < Laurenceb124> now the person with a loicense to apply for scaffolding loicenses isnt replying to my texts
2018-09-29T02:09:29 < Laurenceb124> rage mode activated
2018-09-29T02:09:34 < emeb> Laurenceb124: you still trying to maintain that rental place for the overweight lesbians?
2018-09-29T02:10:06 < Laurenceb124> nah they left
2018-09-29T02:10:17 < Laurenceb124> I'm renovating it atm
2018-09-29T02:10:36 < emeb> big fun
2018-09-29T02:10:46 < Laurenceb124> they spilt wine on the floor
2018-09-29T02:10:58 < emeb> but did they have dogs peeing all over? 
2018-09-29T02:10:59 < Laurenceb124> and used the shower so much the plasterwork is disintegrating
2018-09-29T02:11:13 < emeb> or rebuild a car engine on the carpet?
2018-09-29T02:11:14 < Laurenceb124> nope, that the one thing they didnt do to screw it up
2018-09-29T02:11:30 < emeb> (all things that have happened to ppl who I know w/ rentals)
2018-09-29T02:12:03 < Laurenceb124> eek
2018-09-29T02:12:27 < Laurenceb124> I've paid 200 for to the guy to apply and there is nothing on the database...
2018-09-29T02:12:35 < Laurenceb124> he said he applied on Tuesday
2018-09-29T02:12:39 < catphish> i assume that building a 1 channel gps receiver is beyond the realm of sanity :)
2018-09-29T02:12:41 < Laurenceb124> now no replies to text
2018-09-29T02:12:48 < Laurenceb124> I got screwed
2018-09-29T02:12:56 < BrainDamage> catphish: you need a multichannel receiver
2018-09-29T02:13:03 < catphish> why?
2018-09-29T02:13:06 < emeb> catphish: w/ simple GNSS RX chip + FPGA you could do it.
2018-09-29T02:13:26 < Laurenceb124> crt: nobody knows... I've only ever text him 
2018-09-29T02:13:31 < BrainDamage> because you won't know what sat's the best SNR
2018-09-29T02:13:38 < catphish> i don't know much about gps signals, except that they're multiplexed on one frequency somehow
2018-09-29T02:13:42 < Laurenceb124> I was given the number by an italian american...
2018-09-29T02:13:44 < emeb> eh, just serial search all of them
2018-09-29T02:13:54 < emeb> easy. :P
2018-09-29T02:14:01 < Laurenceb124> what could possibly go wrong
2018-09-29T02:14:21 < Laurenceb124> just been lurking on faceberg
2018-09-29T02:14:26 < catphish> that was my thought too, try try each channel in the multiplex in turn until you find a signal?
2018-09-29T02:14:38 < catphish> again, i'm pretty oblivious to how it works
2018-09-29T02:14:52 < Laurenceb124> italian amerimutt guy ran away from New Jersey because he got raided for importing cocaine
2018-09-29T02:14:52 < emeb> catphish: yeah, that's all that multichl ones do. Just more at a time.
2018-09-29T02:14:55 < Laurenceb124> apparently...
2018-09-29T02:15:11 < Laurenceb124> maybe I've been texting cocaine guy the whole time
2018-09-29T02:15:23 < emeb> catphish: http://www.aholme.co.uk/GPS/Main.htm
2018-09-29T02:15:52 < catphish> that's pretty cool
2018-09-29T02:16:06 < Laurenceb124> well I know where he lives so I'm gunna go rage mode unless something turns up on highways agency database
2018-09-29T02:16:55 < Laurenceb124> hmm I should check with his insurance, I think I can get that info
2018-09-29T02:17:02 < Laurenceb124> he needs ukp10M public liability
2018-09-29T02:17:06 < catphish> i hate RF, i just want to know the time :)
2018-09-29T02:17:52 < Laurenceb124> so I can drop concrete blocks on ppl without being sued
2018-09-29T02:18:21 < Laurenceb124> catphish confirmed as ardutard
2018-09-29T02:18:27 < Laurenceb124> rf is fun and useful
2018-09-29T02:18:32 < catphish> Laurenceb124: don't worry about the insurance and licence, just get on with it, it'll be fine :)
2018-09-29T02:18:44 < Laurenceb124> catphish: some cowboys do that
2018-09-29T02:18:45 < catphish> Laurenceb124: it's madenning
2018-09-29T02:18:59 < Laurenceb124> I need to work on a A road
2018-09-29T02:19:10 < catphish> dress as cowboy, don't drop bricks on cars, you'll be fine
2018-09-29T02:19:11 < Laurenceb124> it could end badly if a jobsworth checks the database
2018-09-29T02:19:31 < emeb> hack the database
2018-09-29T02:19:35 < emeb> u haz mad skillz
2018-09-29T02:19:43 < catphish> for extra safety, close the road
2018-09-29T02:19:49 < catphish> that way nobody will see anyay :)
2018-09-29T02:20:46 < BrainDamage> RF is not fun
2018-09-29T02:21:03 < BrainDamage> maybe if you enjoy spiky dildos up your ass it's fun
2018-09-29T02:21:07 < Laurenceb124> I'm just weird like that
2018-09-29T02:21:08 < BrainDamage> it's useful
2018-09-29T02:21:23 < catphish> rf is 100% not fun
2018-09-29T02:21:30 < catphish> it just screws you over and over
2018-09-29T02:21:44 < BrainDamage> catphish: no offence but DCF is not RF :p
2018-09-29T02:21:57 < catphish> it literally is
2018-09-29T02:22:04 < englishman> sending the bogan-signal
2018-09-29T02:22:29 < Laurenceb124> crt is already here
2018-09-29T02:22:30 < BrainDamage> it literally isn't, the official definition by frequency excludes, and the distributed condition excludes it too
2018-09-29T02:22:35 < catphish> and it only works if you orient the antenna right, and it's a pain in my enourmous white ass
2018-09-29T02:22:40 < BrainDamage> unless your PCB has a size on the ~km range
2018-09-29T02:24:38 < emeb> RF is fun
2018-09-29T02:24:39 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.9.2 Aria http://www.kvirc.net/]
2018-09-29T02:24:41 < catphish> TIL i learned that there's "Tremendously high frequency"
2018-09-29T02:25:16 < BrainDamage> I too enjoy using substrates where the tangent delta is comparable to the propagation coefficient
2018-09-29T02:25:34 < BrainDamage> ohwait, I'm describing trying to do RF on a FR4 past 3GHz
2018-09-29T02:25:54 < emeb> meh - GHz
2018-09-29T02:26:18 < BrainDamage> gigaherz smhigahertz
2018-09-29T02:26:24 < emeb> this
2018-09-29T02:26:42 < emeb> Stick to HF/VHF/UHF/L-band
2018-09-29T02:26:48 < emeb> this is fine
2018-09-29T02:27:46 < Laurenceb124> muh emdrive
2018-09-29T02:27:49 < emeb> untz untz untz
2018-09-29T02:28:02 < Laurenceb124> the emdrive forum is actually useful for learning to do rf sims
2018-09-29T02:29:27 < BrainDamage> also a place to learn physics
2018-09-29T02:31:15 < emeb> they want to believe in magic
2018-09-29T02:31:32 < BrainDamage> because believing in magic fairy dust makes the world less bad
2018-09-29T02:31:38 < Laurenceb124> tbf the emdrive crew have finally built their "community emdrive" and disproved emdrive
2018-09-29T02:31:47 < Laurenceb124> they are less insane that flat earthers
2018-09-29T02:32:17 < BrainDamage> also if a conspiracy exists that suppresses information, then they less responsible for bad things happening to their lives
2018-09-29T02:32:30 < BrainDamage> flat earthers need to deny basic things like time zones
2018-09-29T02:33:21 < englishman> dongs: some of my LP129QE1 backlight died :(
2018-09-29T02:33:40 < Laurenceb124> now seashells can go back to being a cat lady and thetraveller can go back to being a cranky shed dwelling guy 
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2018-09-29T02:35:07 < Laurenceb124> to the rest of us they will always be known as "americans"
2018-09-29T02:35:27 < emeb> fuck yeah
2018-09-29T02:37:06  * emeb mounts flag on bumper of pickup truck
2018-09-29T02:37:25 < BrainDamage> *on mobility scooter
2018-09-29T02:37:31 < emeb> lol
2018-09-29T02:38:15 -!- chipant [~chipant@27.34.16.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
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2018-09-29T03:25:10 < Laurenceb124> https://postimg.cc/K3XTYrX3
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2018-09-29T03:26:16 < Laurenceb124> the memes
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2018-09-29T04:11:36 < dogukan> hi
2018-09-29T04:13:05 < dogukan> I have a stm32f303k8 nucleo board, but I have some problems related to PLL settings
2018-09-29T04:14:52 < dogukan> according to its manual, it supports up to 72Mhz, but it starts to act strange after 52Mhz
2018-09-29T04:15:35 < dogukan> I set HSI/2 (8Mhz / 2) as PLL source
2018-09-29T04:16:33 < dogukan> I also divide APB1 clock by 2
2018-09-29T04:24:49 < emeb_mac> define "act strange"
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2018-09-29T04:29:03 < emeb_mac> I've got a the same F303k8 nucleo and it works just fine running from HSI -> PLL
2018-09-29T04:29:39 < emeb_mac> note however that these parts can't get to 72MHz w/ HSI due to limits of the PLL dividers. 64 is the max.
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2018-09-29T04:32:54 < dogukan> what I mean is it starts to run the default interrupt handler
2018-09-29T04:33:38 < dogukan>     RCC->CFGR = (RCC_CFGR_PLLSRC_HSI_DIV2 | RCC_CFGR_PLLMUL13 | RCC_CFGR_PPRE1_DIV2);
2018-09-29T04:33:40 < dogukan>     RCC->CR |= RCC_CR_PLLON;
2018-09-29T04:33:41 < dogukan>     while ((RCC->CR & RCC_CR_PLLRDY_Msk) == 0);
2018-09-29T04:33:42 < dogukan>     RCC->CFGR |= RCC_CFGR_SW_PLL;
2018-09-29T04:33:50 < dogukan> this is my PLL setup code
2018-09-29T04:34:06 < dogukan> it works up to PLLMUL13
2018-09-29T04:34:21 < dogukan> but I can't use PLLMUL 14, 15 and 16
2018-09-29T04:37:27 < dogukan> is it something wrong with my configuration?
2018-09-29T04:37:57 < emeb_mac> nothing obviously wrong, but I don't usually do direct register access
2018-09-29T04:38:04 < emeb_mac> I usually use HAL lib routines
2018-09-29T04:38:12 < emeb_mac> or at least LL routines
2018-09-29T04:38:27 < emeb_mac> there may be other fine pts that need to be handled
2018-09-29T04:40:16 < emeb_mac> something like this: https://pastebin.com/AAvf322K
2018-09-29T04:42:24 < dogukan> alright thank you, I will take a look and try to find the problem
2018-09-29T04:43:45 < dogukan> btw is there an HSE clock on these boards?
2018-09-29T04:44:57 < emeb_mac> It's routed to an 8MHz MSO from the ST-Link, but there's a zero-ohm resistor in the path that's not installed
2018-09-29T04:45:09 < emeb_mac> so if you try to use the HSE then it fails.
2018-09-29T04:57:09 < cjbaird> Dsicovered that with some Nucleo-64 boards.. (although their fix is more than a resistor?)
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2018-09-29T05:22:18 < dogukan> I haven't been able to find the problem\
2018-09-29T05:23:11 < dogukan> When I check PSR register when it goes to interrupt handler, I see that its value is 0x1000003
2018-09-29T05:23:24 < dogukan> which indicates a hardfault
2018-09-29T05:29:56 < emeb_mac> backtrace?
2018-09-29T05:34:11 < emeb_mac> sometimes backtrace won't work in a hardfault - then zyps vecstate macro is better
2018-09-29T05:34:13 < emeb_mac> https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/armv7m-vecstate-zippe.gdb
2018-09-29T05:39:42 < dogukan> #0  Default_Handler () at os/startup.S:27
2018-09-29T05:39:44 < dogukan> #1  <signal handler called>
2018-09-29T05:39:45 < dogukan> #2  0x08000182 in main () at os/main.c:36
2018-09-29T05:40:12 < dogukan> main.c:36 is GPIOB->ODR |= 8;
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2018-09-29T06:36:12 < Sadale> <Steffanx> Sadale: beats us all with 2.07 usd/litrel
2018-09-29T06:36:18 < Sadale> Steffanx, as if I need to drive in Hong Kong :P
2018-09-29T06:43:34 < dongs> dong kong
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2018-09-29T07:35:24 < dongs> footwhat
2018-09-29T07:36:16 < dongs> how's your win10 dvd
2018-09-29T07:36:24 < dongs> figure out what ass to stick it in yet
2018-09-29T07:36:45 < dongs> https://www.microsoft.com/en-au/software-download/windows10
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2018-09-29T07:37:21 < dongs> alternatively you can just use roofus and copy install from that DVD to a USB stick
2018-09-29T07:37:32 < dongs> to save downloading 4gigs of shit
2018-09-29T07:37:56 < englishman> alternatively they could ship a usb key
2018-09-29T07:38:26 < dongs> oven
2018-09-29T07:42:22 < dongs> i'm just waiting for REDSTONE UPDATE
2018-09-29T07:42:29 < dongs> i heard it makes minecraft run over 9000 FPS
2018-09-29T07:42:48 < englishman> will it make altium run at 9000fps
2018-09-29T07:42:55 < dongs> only if you enable GAME BAR
2018-09-29T07:42:56 < englishman> cuz it crashes at 9000fps
2018-09-29T07:42:59 < dongs> (legit helps i think
2018-09-29T07:43:02 < englishman> i did win+g and nothing happened
2018-09-29T07:43:07 < englishman> i think gamebar doesnt work
2018-09-29T07:43:20 < dongs> yeah it was disabled on my shit probably cuz when i first isntalled windows and it came up
2018-09-29T07:43:28 < dongs> i probably checked 'fuck off and never appear aga' box
2018-09-29T07:43:34 < dongs> i had to edit some registry and reboot
2018-09-29T07:43:52 < englishman> on my laptop when i win+g the mouse cursor disappears so i cant click OK
2018-09-29T07:43:53 < dongs> https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/51180-enable-disable-windows-game-recording-broadcasting-windows-10-a.html
2018-09-29T07:44:35 < dongs> wait
2018-09-29T07:44:37 < dongs> no thats not it
2018-09-29T07:44:40 < dongs> why the fuck was that link blue
2018-09-29T07:46:02 < dongs> niggabyte 2080s come wiht plastic covers for nvlink and pcie slot
2018-09-29T07:46:06 < dongs> like a little sheath
2018-09-29T07:46:24 < dongs> gota have all these extras when youre charging $1500 for card
2018-09-29T07:46:30 < englishman> what comes next after lp129qe1
2018-09-29T07:48:50 < dongs> glossy white rage
2018-09-29T07:51:32 < englishman> actual superscreen
2018-09-29T07:51:47 < dongs> you mean TJKELLER DSPLY
2018-09-29T07:53:32 < englishman> aka changfun fantastic happy display co
2018-09-29T07:57:41 < dongs> Imagine the possibilities!
2018-09-29T07:57:41 < dongs> Connect this to your super powered desktop PC and play the most CPU intensive games wirelessly. Connect 2 of these to the same PC or mobile device and have the highest resolution VR headset. Connect your watch and get all the features you could have on a tablet or phone.
2018-09-29T07:57:45 < dongs> This promises to be revolutionary! I can't wait!
2018-09-29T07:57:48 < dongs> ahahahah
2018-09-29T07:58:01 < dongs> > vr headset ouf of pair 10" chink tablets
2018-09-29T07:59:05 < dongs> dickstarter.com
2018-09-29T07:59:44 < dongs> dickstarter.net is available
2018-09-29T08:02:14 < englishman> is this what youve been working on for months
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2018-09-29T11:16:59 < dongs> whats the trick to getting (and achieving) 95%+ efficiency in step-up
2018-09-29T11:17:02 < dongs> without much heat?
2018-09-29T11:17:12 < dongs> like 5V to 12V, around 6W@12V
2018-09-29T11:17:28 < dongs> last time I built something that did this, it was heating up like crazy
2018-09-29T11:17:57 < dongs> if its "95%" efficient, that means only 0.3W should be heat, right?
2018-09-29T11:23:51 < antto> charge pump? ;P~
2018-09-29T11:24:02 < antto> i've heard pumping is popular here
2018-09-29T11:24:33 < cjbaird> For the last few percent, matching power output to the load, a la MPPTs, I'd imagine. 
2018-09-29T11:31:39 < cjbaird> Going to something important in the morning, and tonight I'm eating a roast chicken that's been in the fridge for a week. Hmm.
2018-09-29T11:35:06 < veverak> dongs: small passive cooler?
2018-09-29T11:36:36 < dongs> no, i think the problem is either components or whatever, beause if part is as efficient as it claimed it should not be heating up
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2018-09-29T11:46:11 < cjbaird> Check the test load circuit in the datasheet for clues. In the RF world, the amplifier classes are only their rated efficiency into a matched and balanced load, and you blow your rig's finals (overheating, etc.) if not.
2018-09-29T11:46:37 < dongs> right, i was just reading maxim dataasheet along those lines
2018-09-29T11:48:42 < cjbaird> I recall a lot of the IBM XT-era cheap PSUs would HCF if they weren't given the running-computer's amount of load.
2018-09-29T11:49:07 < cjbaird> "Don't power these up unless connected to the motherboard" type of warnings.
2018-09-29T11:50:32 < dongs> yeah people still think thats teh case with modern atx stuff
2018-09-29T11:56:49 < Steffanx> Whats "HCF" cjbaird 
2018-09-29T11:57:09 < Steffanx> Things youngster is not from that era ;)
2018-09-29T11:58:45 < Steffanx> This*
2018-09-29T11:59:42 < antto> which youngster?
2018-09-29T12:11:09 < Steffanx> <
2018-09-29T12:11:36 < antto> oh
2018-09-29T12:16:11 < cjbaird> http://www.hacker-dictionary.com/terms/HCF
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2018-09-29T12:21:10 < Steffanx> Aha 
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2018-09-29T12:40:33 < Jak_o_Ombroj> hmmm. 
2018-09-29T12:59:54 < Steffanx> mmmh
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2018-09-29T13:53:35 < Steffanx> hi laurence, is that you?
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2018-09-29T13:54:39 < jpa-> we all have a small laurence within us
2018-09-29T13:55:10 < Steffanx> you even made a new small Laurence..
2018-09-29T13:55:51 < Steffanx> did junior did this first maker project yet, jpa- ?
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2018-09-29T14:04:25 < jpa-> Steffanx: does crap count?
2018-09-29T14:48:33 < dongs> well, makers do make crap
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2018-09-29T15:33:29 < jadew> what's the cheapest way of making many small PCBs
2018-09-29T15:33:35 < dongs> array them
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2018-09-29T15:33:45 < dongs> either wiht vcut or mousebites
2018-09-29T15:34:30 < jadew> hmm, mousebites might actually work best for this, I'll have to check with the PCB house if they allow it, right?
2018-09-29T15:34:40 < dongs> they shouldnt care, and y ou shouldnt even need to make them
2018-09-29T15:34:44 < dongs> just mspaint rough idea of how you want them
2018-09-29T15:34:49 < dongs> they'll ahve proper measurements/array stuff to do it
2018-09-29T15:35:09 < jadew> I'll look into it thanks
2018-09-29T15:36:25 < dongs> like tell them "5x5 array of this pcb, use mousebites to connect boards in the most appropriate way.
2018-09-29T15:38:05 < jadew> I'd like them plated but I guess plated holes don't get split nicely
2018-09-29T15:38:08 < Thorn> I've done 10x10 with v-cut
2018-09-29T15:38:36 < dongs> you have castellated shit on edges?
2018-09-29T15:38:59 < dongs> there will be a waste of material but they can still make it happen with route out + mousebites
2018-09-29T15:39:11 < jadew> dongs, no, but since you mentioned mousebits, it sounds like a good idea
2018-09-29T15:39:12 < dongs> like i said, just send single board gerber + instructions
2018-09-29T15:39:25 < dongs> they'll tell you the most appropriate way to do it
2018-09-29T15:39:44 < jadew> cool, I'll ask
2018-09-29T15:39:46 < jadew> thanks
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2018-09-29T16:32:12 < jpa-> i like v-grooves better, no sharp burrs on the edges
2018-09-29T16:33:12 < jpa-> in jlcpcb order form you can just set the number of boards you want in panel in X and Y direction and they'll v-groove them, easy to snap off
2018-09-29T16:34:15 < jpa-> got 60pcs of 40x30mm pcb for $2
2018-09-29T16:34:32 < dongs> jpa, v-cut works but it realyl depends what you want with final pcb
2018-09-29T16:34:38 < jpa-> yeah
2018-09-29T16:34:51 < jpa-> when would mousebites be better?
2018-09-29T16:36:41 < dongs> when you want clean board edges
2018-09-29T16:36:47 < dongs> for enclosure or similar
2018-09-29T16:36:59 < jpa-> hm yeah, they'll be bevelled with v-grooving
2018-09-29T16:37:02 < dongs> bites can be done so taht the breakpoint is right inside the board outline
2018-09-29T16:37:41 < qyx> wtf $2 for 10 pcbs?
2018-09-29T16:37:51 < qyx> and $20 for 15 pcbs
2018-09-29T16:38:45 < jpa-> qyx: heh, atleast they've fixed it for 5pcs; used to be that 10pcs is $2 and 5pcs is $10
2018-09-29T16:43:31 < qyx> it seems they are cheaper for higher quantities
2018-09-29T16:43:41 < qyx> like you can get 1000pcs for $200
2018-09-29T16:44:16 < qyx> in seeed you would pay ~$450
2018-09-29T16:47:06 < catphish> jadew: if you just want individual PCBs it's probably cheaper to let the fab house decide how to do it, but i could be wrong
2018-09-29T16:47:19 < catphish> i guess best to compare both options
2018-09-29T16:47:28 < catphish> but chinese places are so cheap it's kinda moot
2018-09-29T16:47:35 < dongs> individuall assembliny small pcbs like 1x1cm or etc is a real cunt tho
2018-09-29T16:47:39 < dongs> you gotta array them to be useful
2018-09-29T16:47:48 < dongs> which is probably why hes asking
2018-09-29T16:48:03 < dongs> the fab can also charge you extra for routing out 1000s of 1x1 pcbs 
2018-09-29T16:48:12 < dongs> and wouldn't charge if they were arrayed
2018-09-29T16:48:29 < catphish> makes sense
2018-09-29T16:49:13 < catphish> well i've officially given up trying to build a timecode receiver
2018-09-29T16:49:24 < dongs> dongcode
2018-09-29T16:49:27 < dongs> why, gps works?
2018-09-29T16:49:35 < catphish> but it doesn't
2018-09-29T16:49:44 < catphish> sometimes it works, sometimes it has no signal
2018-09-29T16:50:12 < catphish> the power consequent management is hideous :(
2018-09-29T16:50:24 < catphish> *consequent power management
2018-09-29T16:50:45 < catphish> like, how much power do i waste before deciding it's not worthwhile to wait for a lock
2018-09-29T16:51:05 < dongs> thats what you get with chinagps
2018-09-29T16:51:21 < catphish> if i could buy a programmable GPS receiver i'd just program is to output any and all time signals it receives, it's be quick and efficient
2018-09-29T16:51:29 < jadew> jlpcb is not really $2
2018-09-29T16:51:31 < catphish> but no idea how to find / achieve that
2018-09-29T16:51:50 < jadew> you pay $2 for the boards and 3-4 extra on shipping (on top of what it would normally cost)
2018-09-29T16:51:57 < catphish> i use allpcb, $10 basic price including 3 day shipping
2018-09-29T16:52:29 < jadew> and if you want to add another batch of 10 boards, the price gets adjusted, so you can't win
2018-09-29T16:52:30 < jpa-> catphish: you can always buy just gps frontend and go full-laurence and do gps in software ;)
2018-09-29T16:52:48 < catphish> where does one find a gps frontend?
2018-09-29T16:52:56 < dongs> dude
2018-09-29T16:52:58 < dongs> dont even bother
2018-09-29T16:53:08 < dongs> if tyou couldnt make a gps module work
2018-09-29T16:53:14 < dongs> youre not gonna get a standalone gps chip working
2018-09-29T16:53:15 < jadew> haha
2018-09-29T16:53:23 < dongs> there's a reason they're in modules normally
2018-09-29T16:53:28 < dongs> its not MAKE:R class stuff
2018-09-29T16:53:30 < catphish> you don't make a gps module work
2018-09-29T16:53:36 < catphish> it either works or it doesn't
2018-09-29T16:53:43 < dongs> yeah so how the fuck did you fail that basic part
2018-09-29T16:54:06 < catphish> i don't fail, the module fails on its own, there is nothing adjustable :)
2018-09-29T16:54:16 < dongs> ?? of course there is
2018-09-29T16:54:22 < jpa-> power management seems easy: if you don't have time, wait for a long time; after that if you want to update for precision, wait 2x the time it took the first time
2018-09-29T16:54:22 < dongs> it probably has tons of init strings you can send to it
2018-09-29T16:54:29 < dongs> to configure what NMEA sentences are being output and shti
2018-09-29T16:54:33 < catphish> nothing particularly useful
2018-09-29T16:54:36 < dongs> and/or switch to binary mode
2018-09-29T16:54:40 < dongs> which is also configurable
2018-09-29T16:54:41 < catphish> just enabling and disabling NMEA strings
2018-09-29T16:54:47 < dongs> yeah so, where's the problem?
2018-09-29T16:54:49 < jpa-> well if the particular module sucks, pick a better one :P
2018-09-29T16:54:53 < dongs> yeah
2018-09-29T16:55:14 < catphish> the problem is that it offers no way to know if it's going to get a lock or not, you just have to wait and hope
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2018-09-29T16:55:21 < catphish> and it's a huge waste of power
2018-09-29T16:55:41 < qyx> but thats not problem of the gps module
2018-09-29T16:55:42 < dongs> how often doyou need to get a lock?
2018-09-29T16:55:54 < jpa-> catphish: how would you do that with a gps frontend anyway?
2018-09-29T16:56:02 < jpa-> you don't know if you find a signal until you find a signal
2018-09-29T16:56:04 < catphish> once a day probably
2018-09-29T16:56:49 < qyx> I still have those SE4110L frontends
2018-09-29T16:56:51 < catphish> jpa-: it's a good question, and not one i know the answer to, the difference is that a gps module needs *lots* of signals to get a lock, i only need one
2018-09-29T16:57:19 < qyx> I somewhat hoped that Laurenceb124 makes a working code example
2018-09-29T16:57:41 < jadew> catphish, why just one?
2018-09-29T16:57:47 < jpa-> catphish: the GPS modules i've used, give initial time value even before they have the location
2018-09-29T16:58:03 < dongs> indeed
2018-09-29T16:58:32 < jadew> ah, you just want to know what the time is?
2018-09-29T16:58:35 < jpa-> and usually they have some messages that say "i can hear this satellite" when they get the C/A code lock.. but it's only max 30 seconds from the C/A lock to first time value, so it wouldn't save you much
2018-09-29T16:58:36 < catphish> jadew: i just need a single timestamp, nothing more, the module i'm using outputs a time, but with no indication of where that time came from, it might be gps, it might just be nonsense
2018-09-29T16:58:46 < dongs> wut
2018-09-29T16:58:48 < Laurenceb124> hi trolls
2018-09-29T16:58:55 < Laurenceb124> aha the SE4110L
2018-09-29T16:58:57 < dongs> catphish: if it outputs time, it has it from GPS
2018-09-29T16:58:57 < jadew> catphish, the time the module outputs should be the correct time
2018-09-29T16:59:05 < jadew> meaning compensated for location
2018-09-29T16:59:07 < Laurenceb124> nice but unavailable now :(
2018-09-29T16:59:14 < jpa-> catphish: is it nonsense, or is it just the default value of 2000 or something?
2018-09-29T16:59:16 < dongs> if you just cold started it, it wont output time until it actuall reeives enough bits to show time
2018-09-29T16:59:20 < qyx> Laurenceb124: and hows your code
2018-09-29T16:59:24 < Laurenceb124> I have some demo boards but I'm saving for myself
2018-09-29T16:59:30 < catphish> dongs: i know that not to be true, when it powers up its internal RTC starts at 23:59:55 and it counts up from there until it gets a signal from gps
2018-09-29T16:59:33 < Laurenceb124> qyx: dont have it to hand... sorry
2018-09-29T16:59:45 < qyx> :(
2018-09-29T16:59:47 < jadew> catphish, the thing about the time you get from a single satellite is that it won't be accurate
2018-09-29T16:59:47 < qyx> sad panda
2018-09-29T16:59:48 < Laurenceb124> qyx: it was based of ripped off Kai Borre matlab code
2018-09-29T17:00:00 < Laurenceb124> with thumb2 correlators running on discovery
2018-09-29T17:00:03 < catphish> jadew: sure it will, light doesn't travel that slowly :)
2018-09-29T17:00:09 < jpa-> catphish: yeah, the modules i've used do the same - but if the year is 2000, isn't it quite obvious it hasn't got a time fix yet?
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2018-09-29T17:00:24 < Laurenceb124> qyx: nibble based processing was fastest
2018-09-29T17:00:24 < jpa-> it probably also has a command you can use to set the RTC to whatever time you want
2018-09-29T17:00:35 < jadew> catphish, depends how accurate you need your synchronization to be I guess
2018-09-29T17:00:42 < catphish> jpa-: the problem is that they have a battery backed internal RTC, so when warm starting they will show an approximately correct time
2018-09-29T17:00:43 < Laurenceb124> autistic single bit processing ended up faster and arm cant do that sort of dsp
2018-09-29T17:00:50 < Laurenceb124> s/faster/slower
2018-09-29T17:01:06 < jpa-> catphish: ok, now you are making sense
2018-09-29T17:01:09 < catphish> i wonder if maybe the gps module i used just sucks and i need one that can be configured not to do these dumb things
2018-09-29T17:01:13 < jpa-> catphish: do you have a log of the NMEA output?
2018-09-29T17:01:31 < qyx> what module do y..
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2018-09-29T17:01:41 < jpa-> the ones i've used do that also, and it seems somewhat reasonable to output the timestamp from RTC; you can see the fix status from other messages
2018-09-29T17:01:54 < catphish> jpa-: probably, lemme check
2018-09-29T17:02:41 < zyp> catphish, been telling you you should just have gotten an ublox :p
2018-09-29T17:03:04 < zyp> UBX protocol signals validity of timestamp
2018-09-29T17:03:09 < catphish> jpa-: here, booting from cold: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/cJv8V6sVWM/ notice the time starts at 235942, then is coreected
2018-09-29T17:03:46 < catphish> the module is a quectel L80, i used it because it's cheap and has an integrated antenna
2018-09-29T17:04:08 < catphish> but it turns out its configurability and text protocol are pretty garbage, even though its ability to do its basic job is excellent
2018-09-29T17:05:40 < jpa-> um, you don't have GPZDA enabled? how do you get the date anyway
2018-09-29T17:05:43 < catphish> jpa-: that's a terribly confusing example, because the actual UTC time was 235938, and the default boot time of the device is 235942 :) but you see the clock jump from 000014.668 back to 235938.097 with no indication that it's now valid
2018-09-29T17:05:56 < dongs> hes probly looking at RMC
2018-09-29T17:06:15 < catphish> the date is in GPRMC
2018-09-29T17:06:18 < jpa-> ah
2018-09-29T17:06:34 < catphish> but this doesn't give any indication of time validity :(
2018-09-29T17:06:52 < dongs> so enable GPZDA sentence
2018-09-29T17:07:14  * catphish checks if supported
2018-09-29T17:07:27 < Laurenceb124> qyx: ok yeah I used one nibble per adc sample, so 4 complex samples per 32 bit word
2018-09-29T17:07:48 < Laurenceb124> then processing was "SIMD", 4 complex samples at a time
2018-09-29T17:08:04 < Laurenceb124> using a methlab script to write the asm
2018-09-29T17:08:07 < catphish> no,e no GPZDA
2018-09-29T17:08:10 < catphish> *nope
2018-09-29T17:08:11 < dongs> there is
2018-09-29T17:08:12 < dongs> nigger
2018-09-29T17:08:21 < Laurenceb124> about 16 channels in realtime on F4
2018-09-29T17:08:24 < dongs> its the bitmask
2018-09-29T17:08:26 < jpa-> catphish: what module is this?
2018-09-29T17:08:30 < dongs> PMTK314 or wahtever
2018-09-29T17:08:34 < dongs> quectel L80
2018-09-29T17:08:39 < dongs> where you enable/disable sentences
2018-09-29T17:09:00 < Laurenceb124> but the asm was yuuuge as it implemented each PRN as inline code
2018-09-29T17:09:31 < catphish> dongs: is not
2018-09-29T17:09:36 < dongs> ?
2018-09-29T17:09:43 < dongs> < catphish> the module is a quectel L80, i used
2018-09-29T17:09:44 < Laurenceb124> but the nibble based processing was fastest on M4 by a considerable margin over 8bit and single bit
2018-09-29T17:09:44 < jpa-> catphish: heh, indeed it seems not to indicate any validity of the timestamp
2018-09-29T17:09:59 < catphish> dongs: i mean there is not support for ZDA
2018-09-29T17:10:14 < catphish> maybe this module is just shit
2018-09-29T17:10:31 < dongs> catphish: ? send PMTK314 wtih 17th byte set to non-zero
2018-09-29T17:10:36 < dongs> and you'll see ZDA sentences
2018-09-29T17:11:15 < dongs> 3.21. Packet Type: 314 PMTK_API_SET_NMEA_OUTPUT 
2018-09-29T17:11:15 < catphish> dongs: oh ffs, you're right, it's right fucking there in the fucking manual
2018-09-29T17:11:17 < dongs> from datasheet
2018-09-29T17:11:26 < dongs> since its MTK, there's also binary mode
2018-09-29T17:11:31 < dongs> which might have a bit for timestamp vailidy
2018-09-29T17:11:36 < Laurenceb124> tl;dr a single channel just to extract time would be very doable
2018-09-29T17:11:40 < dongs> you should really be using binary mode anyway as its way easier to parse than NMEA cancer
2018-09-29T17:11:48 < catphish> dongs: i'm 99% sure this device doesn't support binary mode, i tried to find out how to enable that in the datasheet, got nothing
2018-09-29T17:12:02 < Laurenceb124> I never got as far as 50bps data extract, I abused the kia borre code to do that
2018-09-29T17:12:04 < catphish> but if it does and you can tell me how to enable it i'll be super happy
2018-09-29T17:12:10 < englishman> 3.32. Packet Type: 514 PMTK_DT_NMEA_OUTPUT
2018-09-29T17:12:10 < englishman> 17 ZDA ZDA interval - Time and Date
2018-09-29T17:12:23 < Laurenceb124> but the kai borre 50bps is mega lame and needs to be rewritten last time I checked
2018-09-29T17:12:52 < jpa-> catphish: if all else fails, I guess you can wait for GPGSV to to indicate visible satellites, and wait 31 seconds from that - because that is the longest it should take to get a time reading from a single satellite
2018-09-29T17:13:30 < dongs> ah apparently there's diffefent firmwares for MTK trash that do either nmea or binary
2018-09-29T17:13:49 < catphish> jpa-: honestly, in most cases i'll be looking to get a time within 10 seconds, so not quite ideal
2018-09-29T17:13:59 < Laurenceb124> I bet the DCF77 vertical e field is detectable
2018-09-29T17:14:04 < Laurenceb124> maybe not under trees :(
2018-09-29T17:14:37 < jpa-> catphish: sure, but if i were to do such a thing i'd budget atleast a few minutes per gps fix
2018-09-29T17:14:42 < catphish> i played with the dcf77 antenna in my house last night with the MAS receiver, with vertical position in my house i get absolutely nothing
2018-09-29T17:15:33 < catphish> so yeah, dcf77 is kinda out on the grounds that it can too easily be installed in a way that doesn't work, i've read this is true of budget commercial dcf77 clocks
2018-09-29T17:15:57 < Laurenceb124> you could use two orthogonal antennas...
2018-09-29T17:16:02 < catphish> so it's gps or nothing, and i was leaning towards nothing, but i'll 10hundred perent willing to try this new gps sentence
2018-09-29T17:16:41 < catphish> Laurenceb124: yeah i thought the same, though i'd potentially need 3, and those things are 60mm long, it would totally screw my mechanical design
2018-09-29T17:16:53 < sync> catphish: it is common to just mount the dcf77 antenna outside
2018-09-29T17:17:54 < catphish> i considered making it rotateable, but meh, it's all too much more complicated than the simple low cost design i want to create
2018-09-29T17:18:06 < zyp> catphish, maybe you'd want to consider other possibilities, like FM RDS or something
2018-09-29T17:18:23 < catphish> zyp: there are some other options, GSM is a good one
2018-09-29T17:18:34 < catphish> or RDS
2018-09-29T17:18:35 < dongs> ive always wanted to try RDS but stopped because it would be mega autistic
2018-09-29T17:18:36 < jpa-> catphish: so what is the time accuracy requirement?
2018-09-29T17:18:37 < englishman> or maybe making a product that works and worrying about timekeeping / battery longevity later
2018-09-29T17:18:41 < dongs> or the japanese traffic information shit that goes over FM
2018-09-29T17:18:44 < dongs> VICS or wahtever
2018-09-29T17:18:47 < catphish> jpa-: 1 second
2018-09-29T17:19:08 < zyp> norway doesn't even have FM broadcasts anymore
2018-09-29T17:19:08 < catphish> +/- 1 second would be ok :)
2018-09-29T17:19:16 < zyp> they all got scrapped in favor of DAB+
2018-09-29T17:19:22 < zyp> except some local stations here and there
2018-09-29T17:19:31 < catphish> broadcast fm is still hugely popular here
2018-09-29T17:19:36 < dongs> zyp, there's a local station opened at 88.8 FM
2018-09-29T17:19:40 < dongs> like last tyear
2018-09-29T17:19:46 < catphish> we still broadcast BBC radio 4 on like 200kHz too
2018-09-29T17:19:46 < dongs> japs(tm)
2018-09-29T17:20:03 < catphish> i learned during this that radio 4 has a time signal hidden in it too
2018-09-29T17:22:26 < catphish> dongs: well thanks for the pointer to the ZDA output
2018-09-29T17:22:33 < catphish> if that doesn't work, i'll just kill everyone
2018-09-29T17:23:46 < dongs> try it now and see
2018-09-29T17:24:10 < catphish> i see nothing in the message to indicate validity
2018-09-29T17:24:23 < catphish> so i can only hope the receiver doesn't transmit it when it doesn't have a gps time
2018-09-29T17:24:57 < catphish> Cracki: yes, maybe a couple of times a day
2018-09-29T17:25:00 < catphish> depending on my xtal
2018-09-29T17:25:19 < jpa-> it could be that they don't distinguish between position fix and time-only fix then
2018-09-29T17:25:39 < jpa-> maybe you could just reset the RTC and do a cold start every time :P
2018-09-29T17:26:08 < catphish> Cracki: no, what it dcf77?
2018-09-29T17:26:11 < jpa-> or offset the RTC by 1 minute or so that it becomes easy to see when it changes, but the estimated visible satellites remain the same
2018-09-29T17:26:13 < catphish> Cracki: i'm kidding
2018-09-29T17:26:38 < catphish> Cracki: i've tested dcf77, the requirement for antenna alignment is problematic for me
2018-09-29T17:27:51 < catphish> i tested some placements of the antenna, vertical position totally breaks it, putting it within 45 degrees either side of pointing the ferrite at the transmitter breaks it
2018-09-29T17:28:39 < catphish> Cracki: it is when a gps receiver does everything for you
2018-09-29T17:28:53 -!- Laurenceb124 [~laurence@host86-141-2-47.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
2018-09-29T17:29:01 < catphish> Cracki: no it doesn't
2018-09-29T17:29:32 < catphish> Cracki: exactly!
2018-09-29T17:29:38 < BrainDamage> almost every module does this
2018-09-29T17:29:44 < catphish> so maybe i need to try a better module, but cost is an issue
2018-09-29T17:29:53 < catphish> or maybe i can configure this one better
2018-09-29T17:30:30 < catphish> https://www.quectel.com/product/l80.htm
2018-09-29T17:30:38 < catphish> i need to make cider now
2018-09-29T17:30:54 < catphish> i have 15l of apple juice that's not going to brew itself :)
2018-09-29T17:31:05 < catphish> actually, if i just leave it, it probably will
2018-09-29T17:31:08 < dongs> kektel + mtk
2018-09-29T17:31:49 < catphish> if ublox can sell me a module with an integrated antenna for less than about 8 dollars i'll consider that too
2018-09-29T17:32:05 < catphish> yeah :(
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2018-09-29T17:32:46 < qyx> just google it and there is a ton of leaked hw/sw datasheets
2018-09-29T17:33:46 < catphish> i signed up for a login :)
2018-09-29T17:33:56 < catphish> SAM-M8Q costs 7.91 is you buy 250
2018-09-29T17:35:25 < catphish> well i'll get the ZDA fired up later anyway
2018-09-29T17:37:24 < catphish> that's an interesting idea
2018-09-29T17:39:42 < qyx> in standby it probably doesn't output 1PPS too
2018-09-29T17:39:55 < qyx> as there is o osc running
2018-09-29T17:39:59 < qyx> *no
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2018-09-29T18:12:16 < dogukan> hi
2018-09-29T18:15:55 < englishman> welcome
2018-09-29T18:16:46 < tctw> engage sexy times
2018-09-29T18:22:11 < dogukan> I asked this question yesterday too, sorry for repeating it but maybe I can get different ideas today. I have an stm32f303k8 nucleo board. Even though it supports clock speeds up to 72MHz, I wasn't able to clock it higher than 52MHz. When I go over 52MHz, it starts to act strange. For now I just blink the onboard led but if I clock it 56MHz, I can see that LEDs on/off invervals change. After acting unstable for couple of minutes, it starts to 
2018-09-29T18:22:13 < dogukan> execute hard fault interrupt, if I go over 56MHz it usually immediately executes the hard fault  interrupt
2018-09-29T18:22:38 < dongs> impossible
2018-09-29T18:22:43 < dongs> stop using cube
2018-09-29T18:23:07 < dogukan> cube? I use gcc + vim :D
2018-09-29T18:23:15 < dongs> oh, then DEFINITELY stop using that.
2018-09-29T18:23:26 < tctw> lol
2018-09-29T18:23:31 < dongs> anyway, 303 has intrc at 8mhz
2018-09-29T18:23:34 < tctw> I was like that too, dogukan, but dongs is right
2018-09-29T18:23:41 < dongs> which means highest you can clock it with out external xtal is 64mhz
2018-09-29T18:23:47 < tctw> well, unless your time & life means nothing to you. then continue gcc+vim
2018-09-29T18:23:47 < dogukan> yes
2018-09-29T18:23:52 < dongs> if you use HSE input (i think nucleo has 8mhz from stlink
2018-09-29T18:23:57 < dongs> then you can go to 72mhz normally
2018-09-29T18:24:29 < catphish> qyx: the TCXO must be running, how else would it keep time
2018-09-29T18:25:02 < dogukan> tctw: I'm just trying to learn more about mcus, it is just a hobby project
2018-09-29T18:25:43 < tctw> dogukan, yes, that's fine. I did exactly the same. Just don't become a religionfanboy that refuses to use different tools once you start doing some serious work.
2018-09-29T18:25:54 < tctw> otherwise you'll be stuck in frustration and won't make any serious progress
2018-09-29T18:25:58 < qyx> catphish: with a 32K xtal
2018-09-29T18:26:57 < catphish> qyx: oh that makes sense, for some reason i assumed it was the same xtal for both
2018-09-29T18:27:17 < catphish> apple problem solved: https://imgur.com/a/dX0V38o
2018-09-29T18:27:19 < qyx> it wont be even able to keep the multimegahurtz tcxo running on the tiny battery inside for longer than a few hours
2018-09-29T18:27:33 < catphish> yeah makes sense
2018-09-29T18:28:30 < dogukan> oh yeah I'm not a fanboy for anything, it is just for pure fun :) Anyway, this mcu has 8MHz HSI clock as dongs mentioned, I use HSI/2 as PLL source and multiply it by 13
2018-09-29T18:28:52 < dongs> right.
2018-09-29T18:28:56 < dongs> so it should work just fine
2018-09-29T18:29:02 < dogukan> yes 13 works fine
2018-09-29T18:29:03 < dongs> are you also adjusting flash latency
2018-09-29T18:29:05 < dongs> to match that mhz?
2018-09-29T18:29:22 < dongs> i dont have to worry abvout any of that shit cuz the .excel file that configures clocks does it all for me
2018-09-29T18:29:30 < dongs> but there's flash stuff that also needs to be set
2018-09-29T18:29:30 < dogukan> oh great, I don't know anything about that :D
2018-09-29T18:30:21 < dogukan> I was going to say I can not use multiplication factor 14 15 and 16 but first I think I will have to take a look at that flash stuff
2018-09-29T18:30:33 < emeb> weird - my code on F303 doesn't specifically do anything w/ flash waits
2018-09-29T18:30:34 < dongs> FLASH->ACR stuff
2018-09-29T18:30:43 < emeb> but then I use HAL for clock setup
2018-09-29T18:30:54 < dongs> yeah, hal does it in SystemInit
2018-09-29T18:30:56 < dongs> autogenerated shite
2018-09-29T18:31:29 < dongs> i've got several working projects with F302 which is basicalyl same shit, and i can definitely clock them all at 72mhz
2018-09-29T18:31:30 < emeb> hmm... not using cube autogen stuffs. 
2018-09-29T18:31:32 < dongs> (and higher)
2018-09-29T18:31:41 < emeb> ya - same here.
2018-09-29T18:31:43 < dongs> then? how do you set your clock
2018-09-29T18:31:50 < dongs> enable HSE, set PLL etc
2018-09-29T18:31:53 < dongs> manually?
2018-09-29T18:32:07 < emeb> just w/ tweaked clock code from HAL projects dir
2018-09-29T18:32:33 < dongs> Bits 2:0 LATENCY[2:0]: Latency
2018-09-29T18:32:33 < dongs> These bits represent the ratio of the HCLK period to the Flash access time.
2018-09-29T18:32:34 < dongs> 000: Zero wait state, if 0 < HCLK ≤ 24 MHz
2018-09-29T18:32:34 < dongs> 001: One wait state, if 24 MHz < HCLK ≤ 48 MHz
2018-09-29T18:32:34 < dongs> 010: Two wait sates, if 48 < HCLK ≤ 72 MHz
2018-09-29T18:32:50 < dongs> in FLASH->ACR
2018-09-29T18:32:52 < emeb> cool
2018-09-29T18:33:42 < emeb> need to look in HAL clock setup funcs to see if that's under the hood or what
2018-09-29T18:34:02 < dongs> if you copied SetSysClock or wahtever shit then it probably is
2018-09-29T18:34:11 < dongs> it sucks ST stopped maintaining all teh useful code gen shit and only has hal
2018-09-29T18:34:14 < emeb> yep - that's what I did
2018-09-29T18:34:17 < dongs> the excel clock generators are all ancient
2018-09-29T18:34:29 < dongs> i need to keep like excel 2003 installed just to use that trash
2018-09-29T18:34:38 < dongs> it doesnt woerk in anything newer
2018-09-29T18:34:50 < emeb> heh. a few stone knives & bearskins around just in case
2018-09-29T18:36:36 < emeb>   if (HAL_RCC_ClockConfig(&RCC_ClkInitStruct, FLASH_LATENCY_2)!= HAL_OK)
2018-09-29T18:36:45 < emeb> there it is - right in the example code.
2018-09-29T18:37:12 < emeb> dogukan: that's probably why you're bombing.
2018-09-29T18:37:57 < dogukan> yep, I am about to try the "two wait states"
2018-09-29T18:39:20 < dogukan> yes, now I can clock it to 64MHz
2018-09-29T18:39:33 < dogukan> thanks everyone! :)
2018-09-29T18:40:01 < dongs> opensource strikes again
2018-09-29T18:40:04 < emeb> copypasta narcosis strikes again
2018-09-29T18:44:19 < dongs> what was it set to, 0 probably?
2018-09-29T18:44:25 < dongs> so you weer already running out of spec beyond 24mhz
2018-09-29T18:44:38 < dongs> and it really crapped out when you went beyond 2x spec
2018-09-29T18:44:57 < emeb> overclocking FTW
2018-09-29T18:45:26 < dongs> yeah F1 runs totally fine at like 108/120mhz
2018-09-29T18:45:32 < dongs> even all peripherals
2018-09-29T18:45:44 < dongs> probly not usb or wahtever but who cares.
2018-09-29T18:45:48 < emeb> ya
2018-09-29T18:46:13 < emeb> I've accidentally had some F4 stuff running 1.5x faster than spec
2018-09-29T18:46:27 < dongs> by using 12mhz xtal isntead of 8 and not changing init stuff?
2018-09-29T18:46:39 < dongs> (or something to that effect
2018-09-29T18:46:57 < emeb> heh - been there done that
2018-09-29T18:47:05 < Steffanx> Did rob235 / bitmask die?
2018-09-29T18:47:10 < dongs> yes
2018-09-29T18:47:15 < dongs> death from HTML editing in VI
2018-09-29T18:48:31 < emeb> but what happens more often is using 8MHz xtal w/ example codes set up for 25MHz xtal
2018-09-29T18:48:38 < emeb> then wonder why everything is so slow
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2018-09-29T19:04:38 < invzim> do I just suck at timing this year, or is it increasingly more public holidays over there?
2018-09-29T19:04:49 < invzim> as in China
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2018-09-29T19:05:31 < emeb> it's always a holiday somewhere
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2018-09-29T19:33:23 < englishman> here you go invzim no excuses next time https://www.officeholidays.com/countries/china/2019.php
2018-09-29T19:33:32 < englishman> they do plan these things in advance you know
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2018-09-29T19:54:27 < emeb> error diffusion dither on a lo-res monochrome display doesn't look too impressive -> https://www.dropbox.com/s/p3l8no6ooweiw1g/0929180949.jpg?dl=0
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2018-09-29T20:01:09 < Steffanx> nice cat emeb  :P
2018-09-29T20:01:30 < emeb> Steffanx: the fact that you were able to tell that was a cat is a mark in its favor
2018-09-29T20:02:26 < Steffanx> Yeah, so that means it could've been worse
2018-09-29T20:03:11 < emeb> a crop from this pic -> http://ebrombaugh.studionebula.com/linux/fritz3.jpg
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2018-09-29T20:35:24 < jpa-> emeb: change the dither 100 times a second and it'll look better ;)
2018-09-29T20:37:53 < emeb> jpa-: heh. would need a different algorithm with variable seed or something. This is generic Floyd-Steinberg which is deterministic given a fixed input.
2018-09-29T20:38:33 < jpa-> well you can seed floyd-steinberg by e.g. the accumulator from the last pixel in the last run
2018-09-29T20:38:47 < jpa-> or if you have enough RAM, just keep error counts per pixel :P
2018-09-29T20:41:53 < emeb> jpa-: hmm... have to think about that a bit. This F-S doesn't really have a single accumulator - more like a line buffer since it's 2D. Might be able to carry that line buffer over from one render to the next tho.
2018-09-29T20:43:04 < jpa-> ah yeah, f-s was that
2018-09-29T20:43:37 < emeb> but getting some dynamics into the dithering with a continuous update would be kinda cool
2018-09-29T20:44:45 < emeb> these SSD13xx OLED drivers in SPI mode respond pretty quickly so that wouldn't be hard to update quickly.
2018-09-29T20:45:07 < invzim> guess I was only bitten a few times by chinese new year but somehow managed to not be affected by national day
2018-09-29T20:45:40 < invzim> I like those oled's a lot
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2018-09-29T20:46:33 < jpa-> emeb: for a silly dither, you could just do  bw = (x + rand()%256) / 256;
2018-09-29T20:46:37 < invzim> still need to find a 1x7/2x8 female header thingie that is assembly friendly
2018-09-29T20:46:52 < jpa-> it would be dynamic and average to correct, but the individual images won't be particularly great
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2018-09-29T21:33:23 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BoUBWoHApHp/
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2018-09-29T22:03:22 < emeb> jpa-: Added 4lsb dither to the quantization threshold. No carryover from one render to the next, just a bit of noise. https://www.dropbox.com/s/atzr0syam5e9pwd/0929181159.mp4?dl=0
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2018-09-29T22:04:44 < jpa-> heh
2018-09-29T22:05:31 < jpa-> emeb: so how's your crash bug doing?
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2018-09-29T22:07:25 < emeb> jpa-: Pretty much convinced myself that it's a marginal timing thing that's exacerbated by instruction order.
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2018-09-29T22:08:24 < jpa-> huh, that would be kinda scary if it is an unpublished errata
2018-09-29T22:08:36 < emeb> Yeah - we found <1% of HW that exhibits the problem. 
2018-09-29T22:09:09 < emeb> Esp since we're running no faster than the published max clockrate.
2018-09-29T22:10:31 < emeb> Backing off sysclk from 216MHz to 200MHz makes problem go away. Hitting MCU w/ cold spray delays the time to first crash.
2018-09-29T22:11:09 < jpa-> the cold spray is pretty interesting indeed
2018-09-29T22:11:31 < jpa-> just a double check, in addition to the wait states you verified the internal regulator voltage scale setting, right?
2018-09-29T22:12:50 < emeb> Well, I do have the recommended voltage scaling and overdrive bits set.
2018-09-29T22:12:56 < jpa-> yeah
2018-09-29T22:13:22 < emeb> https://pastebin.com/tx0bk56U
2018-09-29T22:13:27 < emeb> my clock setup
2018-09-29T22:14:07 < zyp> have you tried talking to ST?
2018-09-29T22:14:20 < emeb> zyp: no. Is that ever helpful?
2018-09-29T22:14:35  * emeb has had poor response from mfgs in the past
2018-09-29T22:15:24 < zyp> dunno, my impression is that the trick is just to find somebody interested in talking to you
2018-09-29T22:16:22 < emeb> Right. Luck of the draw.
2018-09-29T22:17:20 < emeb> what kind of resonators are you talking about - ceramic resonators?
2018-09-29T22:17:36 < emeb> I'm using an actual quartz crystal in this circuit.
2018-09-29T22:18:30 < jpa-> have you tried measuring clock phase noise, btw? if your scope can do it, it might be interesting to see if there is any difference between the working vs. failing units
2018-09-29T22:18:46 < zyp> emeb, you could try marcus.woxulv@st.com, that guy stopped by the channel here once
2018-09-29T22:19:05 < emeb> zyp: cool - I'll summarize the issue for him.
2018-09-29T22:19:47 < emeb> Cracki: yeah - PaulFertser suggested some alternate PLL settings for a higher reference freq to minimize phase noise. I've got that change cranked in but it didn't help.
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2018-09-29T22:31:00 < jpa-> emeb: here someone has a similar problem due to poorly soldered vcap: https://community.st.com/s/question/0D50X00009XkXyRSAV/stm32f7-clock-unable-to-reach-216-mhz
2018-09-29T22:33:43 < Thorn> all the most entertaining problems I've had so far have been caused by my soldering sk1llz
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2018-09-29T22:46:12 < emeb> jpa-: I'd actually considered if Vcap bypass might be a problem
2018-09-29T22:46:26 < emeb> I inspected the board and didn't see anything obvious.
2018-09-29T22:49:58 < emeb> But - worth noting is that I wasn't able to do a thorough inspection since the MCU is buried under several panels. I could only see it from the side.
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2018-09-29T23:09:55 < emeb> It took ~20min to disassemble the unit but I did take a close look at the VDD and Vcap bypassing - looks fine to me...
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2018-09-29T23:37:11 < zyp> check vcap with a scope?
2018-09-29T23:45:05 < emeb> Inaccessible when the unit is running w/o adding external harness which I don't have.
2018-09-29T23:45:21 < Thorn> reflow them
2018-09-29T23:45:52 < Thorn> solder joints don't have to look bad to be bad
2018-09-29T23:54:58 < Thorn> so I enter flux into the aliexpress search bar and one of the suggestions is flux capacitor
2018-09-29T23:55:08 < Thorn> did they clone it too
2018-09-29T23:56:35 < Steffanx> They stripped down DeLoreans
2018-09-29T23:56:50 < emeb> rofl
2018-09-29T23:58:50 < Rickta59> karlp: you mentioned something about a usb gadget .. do you have code that does that already?
2018-09-29T23:59:47 < Rickta59> * was in reference to libusb_stm32 mentioned the other day
--- Day changed Sun Sep 30 2018
2018-09-30T00:01:52 < englishman> i bought a box of sn63 bars, a huge solder pot, a bucket of flux and a paintbrush
2018-09-30T00:01:54 < englishman> ready2pth
2018-09-30T00:03:41 < BrainDamage> do you plan to have a gantry with a pot of boiling flux to pour like an iron smelter over a pcb?
2018-09-30T00:03:49 < BrainDamage> boiling tin sorry
2018-09-30T00:08:38 < Steffanx> Time for a wave solderer
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2018-09-30T01:31:25 < Laurenceb124> https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCNewsnight/status/1045792952474165248
2018-09-30T01:37:13 < Laurenceb124> >my neighbours are playing s club 7
2018-09-30T01:37:14 < Laurenceb124> the absolute state
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2018-09-30T01:53:22 < englishman> BrainDamage: me irl https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxYY7TfWQZo
2018-09-30T01:55:34 < englishman> https://nypost.com/2018/09/29/elon-musk-to-resign-as-board-chairman-of-tesla-pay-20-million-fine/
2018-09-30T02:09:19 < catphish> i'd like to use one of these for my 32khz lse: https://www.sitime.com/products/32-khz-tcxo/sit1568 - do i need a series capacitor between this and OSC32_IN?
2018-09-30T02:12:10 < catphish> looks like probably not
2018-09-30T02:15:10 < catphish> oh wow that thing is tiny
2018-09-30T02:15:31 < catphish> less than 0201 :(
2018-09-30T02:18:00 < englishman> not quite. but it is small
2018-09-30T02:19:15 < catphish> oh, 0201 isn't metric is it :)
2018-09-30T02:20:16 < catphish> oh, it's much bigger than i thought, i'm an idiot :)
2018-09-30T02:21:09 < karlp> why do you need a tcxo for this?
2018-09-30T02:21:11 < catphish> actually this is the one i'll want: https://www.sitime.com/products/32-khz-tcxo/sit1566 3v3 version
2018-09-30T02:21:24 < catphish> karlp: to keep decent time
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2018-09-30T02:23:02 < catphish> a regular xo is going to suck at any kind of temperature variation
2018-09-30T02:23:11 < BrainDamage> the better his timekeeping the less often he has to query the radio
2018-09-30T02:23:21 < BrainDamage> power tradeoff between the XO and the radio
2018-09-30T02:23:35 < catphish> indeed, and i'm seriously considering removing the radio at this point
2018-09-30T02:23:36 < karlp> yes, I just thought you were going to have to be online often enough anyway, 
2018-09-30T02:23:41 < catphish> gps *might* work
2018-09-30T02:23:53 < BrainDamage> gps is still a radio ...
2018-09-30T02:24:01 < catphish> yes it is
2018-09-30T02:24:27 < BrainDamage> why don't you just use lora to sync the time
2018-09-30T02:24:34 < catphish> i mean i might use gps, or i might scrap the radio and have users sync time manually with a cellphone
2018-09-30T02:24:49 < catphish> i've never looked at lora
2018-09-30T02:25:49 < catphish> any time i look at it all i see is corporate buzz speak
2018-09-30T02:26:02 < BrainDamage> not completely wrong
2018-09-30T02:26:10 < BrainDamage> it's low rate commercial radio
2018-09-30T02:26:27 < BrainDamage> due to low rate and spread spectrum you have huge SNR budget
2018-09-30T02:26:33 < catphish> that does sound cool for my application
2018-09-30T02:26:41 < BrainDamage> which means several km range even for a shit module
2018-09-30T02:26:51 < BrainDamage> people reliably get 50+km
2018-09-30T02:26:59 < englishman> lora is the solution to everything
2018-09-30T02:27:08 < BrainDamage> to make faprenceb shutup
2018-09-30T02:27:10 < catphish> i likely only need a couple of km
2018-09-30T02:27:36 < BrainDamage> you could use the nfc to enter the time on the devices
2018-09-30T02:28:09 < catphish> how much does this monstrosity cost?
2018-09-30T02:28:13 < karlp> Rickta59: was considering porting https://github.com/libopencm3/libopencm3/tree/master/tests/gadget-zero to dmitry's usb stack for shits and giggles in my copious free time.
2018-09-30T02:28:25 < BrainDamage> couple bucks for a module
2018-09-30T02:28:30 < karlp> (which is itself largely a port of linux's gadget zero implementation)
2018-09-30T02:29:01 < catphish> BrainDamage: got an example?
2018-09-30T02:29:15 < BrainDamage> really? can't google lora module?
2018-09-30T02:30:05 < catphish> seemingly not, but i shall continue to try
2018-09-30T02:30:59 < catphish> https://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/en/RN2483 i guess, at £10 each
2018-09-30T02:31:32 < englishman> or you can get that murata thing with stm32l072 inside for less
2018-09-30T02:32:10 < englishman> buy a bunch of B-L072Z-LRWAN1 and get innovating
2018-09-30T02:32:51 < branjb> englishman do they come on rpi shields
2018-09-30T02:33:01 < englishman> get the fuck out
2018-09-30T02:33:03 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/Y4Vbnft.jpg
2018-09-30T02:33:23 < catphish> well, as cool as that is, it's somewhat beyond the sane scope and budget of this device
2018-09-30T02:33:35 < branjb> that a dev board with lora chip and stm on the same board?
2018-09-30T02:33:46 < catphish> those are extremely sexy
2018-09-30T02:33:49 < englishman> lora chip and stm32l072 in the same module
2018-09-30T02:33:57 < catphish> i will endevour to find a use for one
2018-09-30T02:34:02 < branjb> that's cool
2018-09-30T02:34:07 < branjb> are they $15?
2018-09-30T02:34:29 < catphish> looks like it
2018-09-30T02:34:39 < englishman> maybe in singles at digikey
2018-09-30T02:35:09 < branjb> >$45
2018-09-30T02:35:10 < branjb> lol
2018-09-30T02:35:16 < englishman> for the devboard
2018-09-30T02:35:20 < branjb> oh
2018-09-30T02:35:31 < catphish> https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/Murata-Electronics/CMWX1ZZABZ-091?qs=sGAEpiMZZMve4%2fbfQkoj%252bIizbYdBjwt1AMXdlbl7GrQ%3d
2018-09-30T02:35:40 < branjb> i thought catphish meant they were $15 for the dev board
2018-09-30T02:35:53 < catphish> sadly not
2018-09-30T02:35:57 < branjb> the module itself is ~$15
2018-09-30T02:36:18 < englishman> just add antenna
2018-09-30T02:36:27 < branjb> i used the microchip lorawan module in a few products.. then they discontinued it
2018-09-30T02:36:36 < catphish> also 23mA receive power consumption
2018-09-30T02:36:37 < branjb> rn8952 or something
2018-09-30T02:36:40 < branjb> forget the chip #
2018-09-30T02:37:00 < catphish> not exactly practical for idling waiting for data
2018-09-30T02:37:16 < branjb> RN2903 
2018-09-30T02:37:18 < branjb> was close
2018-09-30T02:37:32 < englishman> i like this one cuz its not harder than programming a normal ass l072 and pulling in the nice german lorawan library
2018-09-30T02:38:52 < Laurenceb124> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ik53FPN0YYI
2018-09-30T02:41:08 < Laurenceb124> a nation of trollz
2018-09-30T02:42:56 < Laurenceb124> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h37KQu64RY4 tonight we watch uk classics
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2018-09-30T02:50:37 < catphish> as a british person, i still don't understand my blobby
2018-09-30T02:50:42 < catphish> *mr
2018-09-30T02:51:06 < catphish> also, i deleted the radio, now i can sleep well at night :) https://i.imgur.com/ld6zvOT.png
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2018-09-30T02:51:59 < catphish> v1 can have manual clock setting and be grateful
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2018-09-30T03:04:41 < karlp> englishman: you were looking for edisons right? https://www.sparkfun.com/products/14971
2018-09-30T03:05:30 < englishman> oohhh right
2018-09-30T03:05:35 < englishman> there were clones
2018-09-30T03:06:20 < emeb_mac> neutis
2018-09-30T03:06:21 < karlp> I mean, that's ntohing like an edison as I remember edison, but....
2018-09-30T03:06:28 < emeb_mac> neuter-is
2018-09-30T03:06:28 < karlp> just liked the way they worded it :)
2018-09-30T03:07:26 < emeb_mac> meh - not even x86 ISA
2018-09-30T03:09:36 < karlp> emeb_mac: yeah, exactly .)
2018-09-30T03:13:46 < emeb_mac> karlp: the form-factor is nice and all. well shielded, small and I'm sure that the quad-core ARM + GPU running Linux is fine.
2018-09-30T03:13:46 < emeb_mac> but the main attraction of edison stuff was for folks who were scared of *nix
2018-09-30T03:13:57 < emeb_mac> "Run Windows on a credit card!"
2018-09-30T03:50:31 < Laurenceb124> >be me
2018-09-30T03:50:43 < Laurenceb124> >speak to hospital staff about wambulance
2018-09-30T03:51:00 < Laurenceb124> "why does it need to be plugged into a laptop?! This is lame"
2018-09-30T03:51:04 < Laurenceb124> gui btfo
2018-09-30T03:53:26 < Laurenceb124> yes, like my stm32 prototype
2018-09-30T03:53:39 < Laurenceb124> with green "ok" and red "epic fail" leds
2018-09-30T03:55:10 < Laurenceb124> yeah that was the previous version
2018-09-30T03:55:37 < Laurenceb124> heh true
2018-09-30T03:56:04 < Laurenceb124> http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0954411916680235
2018-09-30T03:56:06 < Laurenceb124> seen there
2018-09-30T03:59:16 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: your device is mentioned in that doc?
2018-09-30T04:00:00 < Laurenceb124> yes
2018-09-30T04:00:10 < Laurenceb124> there is a photo
2018-09-30T04:10:47 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: very cool
2018-09-30T04:10:59 < aandrew> you're really gonna make me sci-hub that DOI to find the pic
2018-09-30T04:13:21 < emeb_mac> Blaxter
2018-09-30T04:13:28 < emeb_mac> blaxploitation
2018-09-30T04:18:05 < aandrew> nice univ of nottingham
2018-09-30T04:18:20 < aandrew> where do you get the bias estimate from for the bias comp? I know almost nothing about IMUs
2018-09-30T04:19:00 < aandrew> is "manikin" how you spell that in England?
2018-09-30T04:19:07 < aandrew> mannequin is how we do it here in Canadia
2018-09-30T04:20:03 < Laurenceb124> from the kalman filter?
2018-09-30T04:20:16 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: how does the kalman filter come up wtih the bias value? 
2018-09-30T04:20:20 < Laurenceb124> mannequin is what you have in a shop
2018-09-30T04:20:50 < Laurenceb124> aandrew: by following the discrepancy between observed and modelled sensor data
2018-09-30T04:21:06 < Laurenceb124> its a bit hard to understand and I'm not a textbook :P
2018-09-30T04:21:19 < emeb_mac> "educate yourself"
2018-09-30T04:21:24 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: no worries, just trying to quickly come up to speed
2018-09-30T04:21:29 < aandrew> Laurenceb124: very cool though, congrats
2018-09-30T04:21:31 < Laurenceb124> the trick in EKF/IMU is to design the state vector carefully
2018-09-30T04:21:36 < Laurenceb124> thanks
2018-09-30T04:22:04 < Laurenceb124> you can stick sensor bias into the state vector and remove the attitude from it
2018-09-30T04:22:50  * Laurenceb124 zzz
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2018-09-30T04:29:07 < dongs> sagepub
2018-09-30T04:29:15 < dongs> is that 4chan official scholarly works publisher
2018-09-30T04:29:52 < emeb_mac> nothing but the wisest of sages
2018-09-30T04:49:37 < dongs> fucking dell fails to power up for the second fucking time in 24 hours
2018-09-30T04:49:44 < dongs> when the fuck will someone make a monitor that isnt garbage
2018-09-30T04:50:15 < dongs> WTB 24" 4K 10bit color 400nits brightness, GB-r or proven wide gamut w/WLED, DP1.2+ input monitor
2018-09-30T04:50:26 < dongs> not dell up2414q becasuse garbage
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2018-09-30T05:45:05 < Sadale> such project, much risks :P
2018-09-30T05:45:15 < Sadale> It's fun to make one I guess :3
2018-09-30T05:54:47 < englishman> emeb_mac: the attraction of edison for this proj was small, removable lunix
2018-09-30T05:54:52 < englishman> size being important
2018-09-30T05:54:58 < englishman> its way smaller than rpi CM
2018-09-30T05:55:00 < englishman> and uses like 1W
2018-09-30T05:55:05 < englishman> mine is powered off a tiny ldo
2018-09-30T05:57:18 < dongs> that one is garbage too
2018-09-30T05:57:19 < dongs> thats wled
2018-09-30T05:57:20 < dongs> yes
2018-09-30T05:57:24 < dongs> and same DP problems
2018-09-30T05:57:31 < englishman> its pretty blue, but no dp problems
2018-09-30T05:57:40 < englishman> at least, worksonmymachine.pro
2018-09-30T05:57:41 < dongs> englishman: it doesnt even work off a NUC
2018-09-30T05:57:49 < englishman> i dont care about dumb faggot computers
2018-09-30T05:57:49 < dongs> i mean, it will fail to power up once a week or so
2018-09-30T05:57:50 < dongs> from standby
2018-09-30T05:58:03 < dongs> it does same shit off QUADRO card(s) too
2018-09-30T05:58:13 < englishman> works on the nvs510 i bought from u
2018-09-30T05:58:13 < dongs> its basically same fucking failboard as 2414 anyway
2018-09-30T05:58:30 < englishman> they have been on 24/7 for 3 years
2018-09-30T05:58:32 < dongs> crt: https://www.playtech.co.nz/computer-hardware/graphic-cards/asus-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-rog-strix-oc-11gb-video-card.html you need this first
2018-09-30T06:00:22 < englishman> i have a retropie. with some $10 amazon snes usb controllers
2018-09-30T06:00:24 < englishman> pretty fun
2018-09-30T06:01:21 < englishman> ha you think that grease is from chickens
2018-09-30T06:01:33 < dongs> crt, the ibuffalo shit?
2018-09-30T06:01:48 < dongs> newsflash: chinks copied them a while back. the legit japanese ones are out of production for years.
2018-09-30T06:02:07 < englishman> I too am extremely worried - I've just spent upwards of £50K developing products around edison. I frequently asked about long term availability and as recently as last month was told there were no plans to drop Edison.
2018-09-30T06:02:07 < englishman> We are just about to go to market with edison based products. I really can't say how upset I feel now.
2018-09-30T06:02:08 < englishman> SpiderKenny 20-Jun-2017
2018-09-30T06:02:23 < dongs> l o l
2018-09-30T06:02:51 < aandrew> edison looked like a terrible idea from the start
2018-09-30T06:03:17 < dongs> http://buffalo.jp/product/input/gamepad/bsgp810/
2018-09-30T06:03:33 < dongs> http://m.buffalo.jp/resource_pc/img/ic_close_01.png < sales finished
2018-09-30T06:04:21 < dongs> was edison the weird x86 thing
2018-09-30T06:04:25 < dongs> at like 300mhz
2018-09-30T06:04:34 < dongs> Curie or someshit? is that related?
2018-09-30T06:07:11 < englishman> karlp: interesting, they used the same footprint, but pinout is completely different
2018-09-30T06:07:46 < englishman> edison was 500mhz x86 yeah
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2018-09-30T06:10:21 < dongs> "The $40 million in penalties will be distributed to harmed investors under a court-approved process," the SEC said in a press release.
2018-09-30T06:11:30 < dongs> englishman: also https://www.variscite.com/variscite-products/
2018-09-30T06:11:39 < dongs> if you don't mind different form factors
2018-09-30T06:11:57 < englishman> well i do, if changing pcb why not just go to wrtik
2018-09-30T06:11:59 < englishman> artik
2018-09-30T06:12:15 < englishman> oh god damn not another imx6
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2018-09-30T06:13:12 < dongs> are you even using wireless on the edickson
2018-09-30T06:13:26 < englishman> not in usa, it didnt pass fcc
2018-09-30T06:13:33 < englishman> wifi shits all over
2018-09-30T06:13:55 < englishman> in jp and eu it's fine
2018-09-30T06:14:48 < dongs> could also fuck PCB modules and just go with this shit https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/octavo-systems-llc/OSD3358-512M-BAS/1676-1000-ND/6012564
2018-09-30T06:15:33 < englishman> neat
2018-09-30T06:15:52 < dongs> ram, pmic, passives, etc all inside the package
2018-09-30T06:15:58 < dongs> so you dont need to wory about routing ddr3 and shit
2018-09-30T06:16:08 < dongs> the ballz is just power and GPIO
2018-09-30T06:16:29 < englishman> the demo pic has ram outside
2018-09-30T06:16:38 < dongs> what demo pic
2018-09-30T06:16:42 < dongs> https://octavosystems.com/octavosystems.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/OSD335x-Detailed-Block.png
2018-09-30T06:16:47 < englishman> or maybe thats emmc
2018-09-30T06:16:52 < dongs> most likely
2018-09-30T06:17:13 < englishman> im sure its fully supported lunix as well as artik is right
2018-09-30T06:17:55 < englishman> 1.27mm pitch is generous
2018-09-30T06:17:55 < dongs> well, TI lunix yeah.http://www.ti.com/tools-software/processor-sw.html
2018-09-30T06:19:03 < dongs> they have a dickstarter going for a version wiht emmc inside the package too
2018-09-30T06:19:07 < dongs> https://octavosystems.com/octavo_products/osd335x-c-sip/
2018-09-30T06:19:29 < dongs> in same size package
2018-09-30T06:19:58 < englishman> This part number is impacted by tariff, however due to our inventory position we are able to delay passing through the tariff fee.
2018-09-30T06:20:05 < dongs> haha
2018-09-30T06:20:14 < dongs> wait
2018-09-30T06:20:22 < dongs> tariff doesnt affect digikey shipping outside usa tho
2018-09-30T06:20:26 < englishman> nope
2018-09-30T06:20:29 < dongs> once you login with your .ca account it should be fine
2018-09-30T06:20:33 < englishman> my biz is going to triple
2018-09-30T06:25:57 < aandrew> so
2018-09-30T06:26:07 < aandrew> I have these ip cameras, nothing fancy, 1080p h264
2018-09-30T06:26:32 < aandrew> trying to do motion detection with them is very much taxing this i7 (5 cameras is like 375% CPU on a 4 core
2018-09-30T06:26:54 < aandrew> so I'm reading about how to do this better, I don't really like the idea of NVRs because they all look like ass and are unconfigurable
2018-09-30T06:27:11 < englishman> just get a wyze cam for $20 from amazon.ca
2018-09-30T06:27:18 < aandrew> someone mentions "most cameras have a main stream and a lower quality substream - why not do motion detect on the substream and capture the main stream?"
2018-09-30T06:27:23 < aandrew> sonofabitch.jpg
2018-09-30T06:27:40 < aandrew> if this works this will be awesome. cpu use is like 25% in this setup
2018-09-30T06:27:55 < aandrew> englishman: wanna come over and wave in front of the cameras? I've had no motion to test in the last hour or so
2018-09-30T06:28:05 < englishman> on my way
2018-09-30T06:28:13 < aandrew> perfect
2018-09-30T06:28:29 < aandrew> I'm going ot send you the gerbers/centroids for this board when I'm closer to being done to get a quote for some assembly
2018-09-30T06:28:38 < englishman> sure
2018-09-30T06:31:02 < aandrew> 76%, man this is just crawling
2018-09-30T06:43:12 < aandrew> this routing
2018-09-30T06:57:40 < cjbaird> Rode through a swarm of bees, and the helmet visor was up. Kevlar jeans don't need washing, thankfully.
2018-09-30T06:59:09 < cjbaird> Lungs are remarkedly mee-free, too.
2018-09-30T06:59:13 < cjbaird> *bee-free
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2018-09-30T07:27:20 < upgrdman> https://i.redd.it/7dtihwnmm8p11.jpg
2018-09-30T07:29:24 < cjbaird> 14 hours into a ReactOS install on real hardware..
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2018-09-30T08:32:09 < emeb_mac> when it gets done you'll really appreciate it
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2018-09-30T09:04:54 < aandrew> cjbaird: lol
2018-09-30T09:04:58 < aandrew> er up
2018-09-30T09:05:00 < aandrew> fuck
2018-09-30T09:05:10 < aandrew> upgrdman isn't online so no tab complete for him
2018-09-30T09:05:13 < aandrew> the lol was for his pic
2018-09-30T09:05:58 < aandrew> cjbaird: wow why are you messing around with reactos cjbaird 
2018-09-30T09:06:21 < dongs> autism
2018-09-30T09:06:24 < dongs> cant be any othe reason
2018-09-30T09:07:22 < aandrew> fuck man been routing since I last blogged about it and I'm only 77.3%
2018-09-30T09:07:28 < aandrew> 1.3% ugh
2018-09-30T09:07:31 < aandrew> fail
2018-09-30T09:23:06 < cjbaird> aandrew: the only VK2 Advanced radio licence revision stuff I can find runs on Windows. Tried reactos and the software it in qemu, werked, slowly. Had this /wild/ thought that it'd be a lot faster on real hardware...
2018-09-30T09:24:15 < cjbaird> The install is actually 'finished', but now it's 'flushing the cache'.. at about 300 baud
2018-09-30T09:29:14 < englishman> i wonder what upgrdman will do all week
2018-09-30T09:32:38 < cjbaird> Spew. Local hams sent up a hab.. using that 'Raspberry Pi In the Sky' Appliance-User Bought-Online shit.
2018-09-30T09:35:15 < cjbaird> kekekek, looks like it (VK2LNA) ran out of power half-way.  (VK2"L"NA-- unattended beacons on a Standard licence??)
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2018-09-30T10:24:21 < jadew> crt, why the lol @ that thread?
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2018-09-30T10:35:59 < qyx> cjbaird: aren't they tracking on habhub?
2018-09-30T10:36:44 < qyx> also, does the callsign matter if they transmit in a ~free~ band?
2018-09-30T10:37:44 < qyx> cannot see any hab near .au :(
2018-09-30T10:48:38 < Steffanx> Odnetnin, crt.
2018-09-30T11:02:39 < Steffanx> Welcome superbia
2018-09-30T11:02:50 < Steffanx> Cant blame them for everything, crt..
2018-09-30T11:03:29 < cjbaird> qyx: switch to the 3-day record. They're using the 2m/145.175M APRS freq.
2018-09-30T11:04:52 < dongs> The following programs consumed the most virtual memory: Ozone.exe (38328) consumed 36564930560 bytes, javaw.exe (16512) consumed 7338242048 bytes, and javaw.exe (30456) consumed 7262859264 bytes.
2018-09-30T11:04:56 < dongs> fucking aids
2018-09-30T11:05:13 < Steffanx> ozone = java?
2018-09-30T11:05:23 < Steffanx> or should eclipse.exe also be in the list?
2018-09-30T11:05:23 < dongs> no, but java = bad
2018-09-30T11:05:26 < dongs> eclipse yeah
2018-09-30T11:05:31 < dongs> but its basically javaw.exe so
2018-09-30T11:06:21 < Steffanx> wherre is keil.exe?
2018-09-30T11:07:02 < dongs> not in the list cuz it doesnt use memory like a piece of shit
2018-09-30T11:09:07 < Steffanx> does ozone work with clonelink?
2018-09-30T11:09:26 < dongs> it should cuz clonelinks have RDI or wahtever license
2018-09-30T11:09:29 < dongs> which is what ozone needs
2018-09-30T11:11:53 < Steffanx> nah id pay the 500 euro if i really needed it :P
2018-09-30T11:12:07 < Steffanx> or edu it.
2018-09-30T11:12:48 < qyx> cjbaird: I see
2018-09-30T11:17:08 < cjbaird> re Standard/~Technician~ Licence in Australia: VKnabbb, a=[H L M N P V]. I thought up "Heavy Ladies Must Not Poledance Vigorously" to remember that for the test. :P
2018-09-30T11:19:54 < Steffanx> -_-
2018-09-30T11:21:21 < dongs> EDU has no RDI i thought
2018-09-30T11:21:24 < dongs> i dont remember tho
2018-09-30T11:21:26 < dongs> i gave away my last edu
2018-09-30T11:21:32 < dongs> now that i have pro toolz
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2018-09-30T13:00:15 < Thorn> special deal https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Multilayer-Ceramic-Capacitors-MLCC-SMD-SMT_SAMSUNG_CL10F104ZB8NNNC_100nF-104-80-20-50V_C1688.html
2018-09-30T13:00:44 < Thorn> only today 40% more
2018-09-30T13:04:09 < PaulFertser> I assume some people here have thingiverse accounts and so can answer this question: am I free to use any license for the uploaded things, or is there a hardcoded list, and if yes, what exactly that list consists of?
2018-09-30T13:04:53 < Sadale> What sort of hardcoded list?
2018-09-30T13:05:17 < markus-k> there is a list
2018-09-30T13:05:43 < markus-k> GPL, LGPL, BSD and all the CC variants
2018-09-30T13:05:49 < PaulFertser> dongs: btw, since you're using pro tools, can you probably give some step-by-step tutorial to emeb so that he could gather a useful execution trace of his failing units? That might provide additional clues into what exactly is happening there.
2018-09-30T13:06:21 < PaulFertser> markus-k: oh, what about public domain or wtfpl? Or custom bsd-like variants?
2018-09-30T13:06:57 < markus-k> PaulFertser: There is CC Public Domain Dedication, but no BSD variants
2018-09-30T13:07:04 < jpa-> it might, though i'd expect the trace to show just normal instruction flow until UNDEFINSTR comes out of nowhere
2018-09-30T13:07:48 < PaulFertser> It might or might not, who knows, and if emeb manages to get attention of an ST FAE the trace would be useful (even in the case it doesn't show anything interesting).
2018-09-30T13:08:06 < jpa-> yeah
2018-09-30T13:08:47 < jpa-> 216MHz trace might be difficult though if the pcb is not designed to have the 4-bit port available
2018-09-30T13:10:49 < PaulFertser> markus-k: thank you for the clarification!
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2018-09-30T13:40:36 < Thorn> lol turns out BME280 has a known self-heating problem
2018-09-30T13:42:40 < Adluc> Thorn: is it preventable? I was thinking about using it one board
2018-09-30T13:44:49 < Thorn> dunno maybe you can turn it off with a mosfet between measurements or something
2018-09-30T13:45:07 < Thorn> or a bjt
2018-09-30T13:45:08 < Adluc> -_-
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2018-09-30T14:07:03 < dongs> PaulFertser: erm sure, but you can't trace without jlinktrace
2018-09-30T14:08:08 < PaulFertser> dongs: oh, so jlink pro costs so much and yet can't capture trace? That's weird, FPGAs are cheap nowadays.
2018-09-30T14:09:05 < dongs> PaulFertser: thre's no fpga in pro, i think. i didnt bother taking it apart tho
2018-09-30T14:09:08 < dongs> trace has fpga
2018-09-30T14:09:30 < PaulFertser> So what pro features are you actually using?
2018-09-30T14:09:59 < dongs> im just assuming emeb only has jlink-edu
2018-09-30T14:10:01 < dongs> which cant trace
2018-09-30T14:10:09 < dongs> which is why i said
2018-09-30T14:10:41 < PaulFertser> Probably emeb has some high-speed LA then.
2018-09-30T14:10:43 < Steffanx> emeb has edu. better let segger sue him.
2018-09-30T14:13:26 < Sadale> That was a nice upgrade. I replaced the microcontroller of my game console project from a microcontroller with 16kB of flash to the one with 32kB of flash
2018-09-30T14:13:58 < Sadale> The bootloader-game rom split was 11k/5k. Now it's 12k/20k. It has much more space for the game itself. :)
2018-09-30T14:14:17 < mawk> you allocated 11k for the bootloader ?
2018-09-30T14:14:33 < mawk> why
2018-09-30T14:17:14 < Sadale> For the game library.
2018-09-30T14:17:22 < Sadale> library and driver and stuffs.
2018-09-30T14:17:39 < Sadale> It also help doing self-flashing so that it can load the games stored in the SD card.
2018-09-30T14:18:55 < Sadale> When you boot the game console, a game selection menu of the bootloader is shown. After choosing the game, the rom will be loaded from the SD card and flashed to the 20k of the flash space. Then it runs the game in the flash. The game also call the library API functions in the bootloader.
2018-09-30T14:19:21 < dongs> what, that sounds retarded
2018-09-30T14:19:32 < Sadale> huh? What's wrong with that?
2018-09-30T14:19:34 < Thorn> flash the flash from flash
2018-09-30T14:19:53 < zyp> flash wear is the main concern
2018-09-30T14:19:57 < Sadale> The microcontroller doesn't support executing code from SD card. What else could I do? :P
2018-09-30T14:20:15 < Sadale> It's like a few flashes a day. It wouldn't wear off that quickly.
2018-09-30T14:20:41 < Sadale> Assume that the flash can endures 10000 writes, and I do 10 flashes a day, that'd still last for 1000 days.
2018-09-30T14:20:42 < zyp> get one with enough ram instead
2018-09-30T14:21:24 < zyp> 20k of code would easily fit in ram on a bunch of chips
2018-09-30T14:21:38 < Sadale> Right.
2018-09-30T14:21:50 < Sadale> The chip I'm having is only having 4kB of RAM >_<
2018-09-30T14:22:24 < dongs> well you should solve that first
2018-09-30T14:22:35 < zyp> so you only need 24k of ram to have same functionality without rewriting flas all the time
2018-09-30T14:22:46 < zyp> plenty of lowent 
2018-09-30T14:22:56 < zyp> lowend parts fit that bill
2018-09-30T14:27:41 < Sadale> wow. Didn't know the flash of the chip I'm using only endures 1k cycles at minimum :o
2018-09-30T14:28:12 < Sadale> shit. I guess I should take your words.
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2018-09-30T14:30:36 < Steffanx> only 1k?
2018-09-30T14:30:48 < dongs> what garbage are youusing
2018-09-30T14:30:54 < Steffanx> is it avr?
2018-09-30T14:30:54 < Sadale> right. That's surprising.
2018-09-30T14:30:57 < Sadale> STM32.
2018-09-30T14:31:00 < Sadale> STM32F030.
2018-09-30T14:31:19 < Sadale> Anyway that's for 85°C.
2018-09-30T14:31:30 < dongs> can i kill you when i come to HK in november
2018-09-30T14:31:52 < Sadale> dongs, hey! That's mean :<
2018-09-30T14:32:28 < cjbaird> Too much bully in this channel.
2018-09-30T14:32:34 < Steffanx> lol cjbaird
2018-09-30T14:32:39 < dongs> i agree, not enough STM32
2018-09-30T14:32:40 < Steffanx> why so serioussss
2018-09-30T14:32:50 < Sadale> dongs, If we ever gonna meet I'm going to torture you by wearing cosplay costume and gifting you anime CDs and merchandise :<
2018-09-30T14:32:55 < dongs> gross.
2018-09-30T14:33:00 < dongs> thing is, i actually believe you
2018-09-30T14:33:05 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-30T14:33:28 < Steffanx> dont forget to give him some open sores.
2018-09-30T14:33:33 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-30T14:33:45 < dongs> like, i could tell steffie that I'll torture him wiht animoo costume and cds, but then I'd have to actually acquire such things
2018-09-30T14:34:17 < dongs> Sadale: im staying in sketchbnb somewehre in wanchai
2018-09-30T14:34:53 < Sadale> dongs, cool! :P
2018-09-30T14:34:56 < dongs> ~ cozy private room ~
2018-09-30T14:35:00 < dongs> for like $20/day
2018-09-30T14:35:04 < dongs> so im sure its aids
2018-09-30T14:36:03 < Sadale> I'm thinking if I go for the chip with higher RAM, it'll also have higher FLASH.
2018-09-30T14:36:10 < dongs> it will
2018-09-30T14:36:12 < Sadale> The FLASH would be wasted :/
2018-09-30T14:36:20 < dongs> it wouldn't be
2018-09-30T14:36:35 < Sadale> It would :P
2018-09-30T14:36:36 < dongs> you can use it for higher quality assets
2018-09-30T14:36:47 < dongs> that would be standard for all your "games"
2018-09-30T14:36:54 < dongs> and would still only need to be readonly.
2018-09-30T14:37:01 < dongs> or whatever the fuck it is you're autisming
2018-09-30T14:37:07 < Sadale> meh. Putting read only assets isn't a very attractive idea.
2018-09-30T14:37:20 < dongs> it reduces your actual "game" code to strictly code
2018-09-30T14:37:26 < dongs> for the loaders.
2018-09-30T14:37:41 < dongs> bbl
2018-09-30T14:38:23 < Sadale> I guess I may be doing my own experiment to figure out how long does the flash last in room temperature. :P
2018-09-30T14:38:34 < Sadale> I bet that it should be far higher than 1k cycles.
2018-09-30T14:39:03 < Sadale> 10000 cycles is acceptable to me. It isn't a heavy duty game console anyway. But 1000 cycles is a bit limiting.
2018-09-30T14:41:11 < Sadale> And if it's 1000 cycles, that means that some microcontrollers could be destroyed during the development process because it isn't uncommon to have it flashed for more than a thousand of times during the development process. :/
2018-09-30T14:41:17 < Steffanx> you want F4/F7 power for your games anyway
2018-09-30T14:41:26 < Sadale> oh. It's a low-end one.
2018-09-30T14:41:42 < Sadale> Monochrome 128x64 LCD. 1-bit 2 channels audio system.
2018-09-30T14:42:15 < Steffanx> SuperbiaMan
2018-09-30T14:42:57 < Sadale> There's a minimalist breakout game developed for the game console. :)
2018-09-30T14:43:13 < Sadale> The processing power of the chip is good enough for the game.
2018-09-30T14:44:11 < Sadale> I wonder why dongs hates me. >_<
2018-09-30T14:44:21 < Steffanx> he doenst hate you.
2018-09-30T14:44:33 < Steffanx> He just has no way to show you his love, so it comes out like this.
2018-09-30T14:44:35 < Sadale> It seems to me that he does. >_<
2018-09-30T14:44:37 < Sadale> lol
2018-09-30T14:45:23 < Thorn> he offers useful criticism
2018-09-30T14:45:29 < Sadale> Anyway thanks for pointing out the issue of the idea of self-flashing.
2018-09-30T14:45:51 < Steffanx> soon you will go F7 with colour screen.
2018-09-30T14:45:52 < Sadale> I brought up the game console in multiple other channels. None of them realized that self-flashing is a problem
2018-09-30T14:46:11 < cjbaird> Sounds very CHIP8
2018-09-30T14:47:06 < Sadale> Anyway I may be settling down with self-flashing for the first model of the game console. Mainly because it isn't a very serious project anyway. :p
2018-09-30T14:47:36 < Sadale> I don't know. Maybe loading the games to RAM will be for the next model.
2018-09-30T14:48:18 < Sadale> The knowledge of embedded programming for the users in this channel is far higher than any other channels I've joined in freenode. I appreciate that. And I'm glad that I joined here. :)
2018-09-30T14:49:22 < Sadale> dongs, BTW, would you be interested in a meetup if I'm not going to give you anime crap? :P
2018-09-30T14:50:27 < cjbaird> Sadale: This channel doesn't yet have a CoC. You have been warned.
2018-09-30T14:50:36 < Sadale> cjbaird, ?
2018-09-30T14:50:44 < Sadale> cjbaird, what did I do?
2018-09-30T14:50:59 < cjbaird> You're happier being ignorant. :)
2018-09-30T14:51:16 < BrainDamage> well, you mist still end up with a CoC forced on you regardless
2018-09-30T14:51:18 < Sadale> cjbaird, seriously what did I do?
2018-09-30T14:51:35 < BrainDamage> just that this is not a 'safe space'
2018-09-30T14:51:49 < BrainDamage> nothing that you did
2018-09-30T14:52:05 < Sadale> cjbaird, Here's the context. dongs hate anime stuffs. He'll be visiting my city. I jokingly told him that I'm going to torture him with anime and stuffs if we ever gonna meet. And he hates anime.
2018-09-30T14:52:22 < Sadale> cjbaird, so I wonder what am I warned about?
2018-09-30T14:53:24 < Sadale> oh. Or did you mean that this channel doesn't have a CoC so you're warning me that it's fine for other users to be rude to me?
2018-09-30T14:53:30  * Sadale is confused.
2018-09-30T14:55:04 < Thorn> BME280 replacement: SHT3{0,1}-DIS (t° and RH) + BMP280 for pressure only [y/n]
2018-09-30T15:13:09 < cjbaird> Meeting up with people known online gives me 1996 flashbacks. Not the good kind of flashbacks.. ("Oh you're a Furry? What's that?" :P)
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2018-09-30T15:19:46 < cjbaird> Behold the power of 128x64 .. https://twitter.com/Chris_J_Baird/status/732941106682298372
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2018-09-30T16:25:25 < Thorn> how do I RTD
2018-09-30T16:25:46 < Thorn> current source? bridge?
2018-09-30T16:27:26 < Thorn> do I need an expensive op amp?
2018-09-30T16:27:33 < Thorn> how many ADC bits?
2018-09-30T16:27:41 < jpa-> what accuracy are you aiming for?
2018-09-30T16:28:06 < jpa-> typically a current source + two ADC channels (or one differential channel) is enough
2018-09-30T16:28:42 < jpa-> (a capacitor on the ADC pins is a good idea to reduce noise)
2018-09-30T16:29:03 < Thorn> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/22003b.pdf ?
2018-09-30T16:30:35 < Thorn> 0.2...0.3°C accuracy would be nice
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2018-09-30T16:33:00 < jpa-> RTDs have about 0.5%/C response in room temp, so 0.1C would equal 0.05% of full scale, so a 18 bit ADC should give about 128 steps per 0.1C, which is plenty
2018-09-30T16:33:14 < jpa-> you'd probably get by even with 16 bits, or 12 bits + some oversampling
2018-09-30T16:34:10 < jpa-> though if you have a wide temperature range, the response will change so better have some margin
2018-09-30T16:34:11 < Thorn> that adc seems pretty cheap and easily available
2018-09-30T16:34:40 < jpa-> yeah, looks like a reasonable part
2018-09-30T16:37:59 < Thorn> how important is power noise/ripple? e.g. buck-boost vs. ldo
2018-09-30T16:40:22 < jpa-> that part looks to have 100dB power supply rejection, so not very important (to cause 0.1C error in output you'd need 3.3V*0.0005*10^(100/20) = 165V of noise on the power rail, except of course it will couple more in practice)
2018-09-30T16:40:53 < jpa-> the current source will be quite important to the accuracy
2018-09-30T16:41:10 < jpa-> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00001154B.pdf   this might work with MCP3421 also
2018-09-30T16:41:30 < jpa-> ah, except MCP3421 doesn't bring out the reference voltage
2018-09-30T17:04:01 < Thorn> one more adc http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ads1230.pdf
2018-09-30T17:10:21 < englishman> all my shipments got out of china before the shutdown \o/
2018-09-30T17:11:35 < Thorn> what fuel gauge IC do I use
2018-09-30T17:11:55 < Thorn> or do I measure I & U manually?
2018-09-30T17:12:18  * Laurenceb124 just measures the voltage and temperature
2018-09-30T17:12:40 < Laurenceb124> then filter for current draw fluctuations
2018-09-30T17:12:43 < mawk> which shutdown englishman 
2018-09-30T17:13:18 < Thorn> ok thanks much jpa- :3
2018-09-30T17:13:47 < Steffanx> golden week holiday something mawk
2018-09-30T17:13:48 < Steffanx> https://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/china/
2018-09-30T17:14:14 < Laurenceb124> >outsource all manufacturing the china
2018-09-30T17:14:20 < Laurenceb124> >what could possibly go wrong
2018-09-30T17:14:25 < mawk> I see
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2018-09-30T17:31:03 < englishman> lol, a chan i'm in is moving from freenode to another network due to incessant spam and an incompetent response by freenode opers
2018-09-30T17:31:06 < englishman> rip freenode
2018-09-30T17:32:21 < Thorn> let me guess, they're moving to snapchat
2018-09-30T17:33:03 < Sadale> Too bad.
2018-09-30T17:33:11 < Sadale> I hate those spammers. I wonder what's their motive.
2018-09-30T17:42:34 < Steffanx> incompentent. what should have been done about that spam englishman?
2018-09-30T17:43:20 < Steffanx> And the spam has been gone for quite a while now, right?
2018-09-30T17:43:57 < Steffanx> but yeah: Efnet4ever.
2018-09-30T17:46:46 < karlp> Steffanx: no, spam is still repeated on another channel I'm in.
2018-09-30T17:47:04 < Steffanx> aha ok, havent seen it for quite a while.
2018-09-30T17:47:46 < Steffanx> Still wonder what can be done about it, without affecting legit users.
2018-09-30T17:48:15 < karlp> it's only still a probleon a channel that doesn't want to +R because they want to allow anon sort of users
2018-09-30T17:48:46 < Steffanx> Must be incompentent ops then :P
2018-09-30T17:49:16 < Sadale> well, these days we have to use +R.
2018-09-30T17:49:20 < Sadale> It's too bad :(
2018-09-30T17:49:21 < Steffanx> ##stm32 isnt +R, but its not listed either so they were never able to find it.
2018-09-30T17:49:39 < karlp> Sadale: some people find +R an overly onerous obstacle to chat
2018-09-30T17:49:40  * karlp shrufgs
2018-09-30T17:49:45 < Steffanx> or ReadError / ReadError_ was kind enough to add it to the list with exceptions
2018-09-30T17:49:47 < Sadale> In an channel that I'm an op inside, we tried unlisting the channel. It didn't work
2018-09-30T17:50:01 < Sadale> It worked for a brief period of time. Then the spammer eventually reached the channel again.
2018-09-30T17:50:02 < Steffanx> probably because you were too late.
2018-09-30T17:50:08 < Sadale> karlp, agreed.
2018-09-30T17:50:26 < Sadale> karlp, freenode was awesome that anyone can chat in any channel without registering.
2018-09-30T17:50:27 < Steffanx> with +R we would loose dongs. Do we want that? 
2018-09-30T17:50:33 < Sadale> lol no
2018-09-30T17:50:46 < Sadale> We need dongs so that we can feed anime to him. :3
2018-09-30T17:50:53 < Steffanx> :D
2018-09-30T17:51:05 < englishman> if you use +R in this chan, everyone's favourite chatter could not be here.
2018-09-30T17:51:17 < englishman> because freenode idiots refuse to register his nick.
2018-09-30T17:51:35 < Sadale> Wouldn't it be easy to impersonate dongs because he isn't registered.
2018-09-30T17:51:45 < Sadale> In fact anyone could just register his nick for lulz.
2018-09-30T17:52:05 < Steffanx> i think he cant register it, because offensive or something.
2018-09-30T17:52:14 < Sadale> really?
2018-09-30T17:52:14 < Thorn> >Product Name : Thermocouple Probe; Type : PT100 Type
2018-09-30T17:52:15 < Steffanx> dont remember the details
2018-09-30T17:52:24 < Sadale> Isn't the registeration process automated?
2018-09-30T17:52:30 < Sadale> You just send a message to nickserv and that's it
2018-09-30T17:53:00 < Steffanx> but you are our most favourite chatter, englishman
2018-09-30T17:53:16 < Sadale> I wonder if englishman is from England.
2018-09-30T17:53:28 < Thorn> no
2018-09-30T17:53:34 < Sadale> But his nick suggests so.  :P
2018-09-30T17:53:42 < Thorn> England is bad. they killed all their lynx
2018-09-30T17:54:07 < englishman> ^
2018-09-30T17:54:20 < Sadale> And they had voted for brexit then blame Russian for manipulating the votes :P
2018-09-30T17:54:40 < Sadale> poor Russian :P
2018-09-30T17:54:40 < Steffanx> Russia is bad and i dont need a reason like that at all to say that Thorn  :P
2018-09-30T17:54:51 < englishman> Thorn: https://i.imgur.com/osfO8hB.gifv
2018-09-30T17:55:34 < Thorn> meow
2018-09-30T17:56:09 < Sadale> nya~
2018-09-30T17:56:14 < Steffanx> Our spoiled cat would say "F U" and walk away.
2018-09-30T17:57:19 < Thorn> Steffanx does that comment come with a Dutch passport
2018-09-30T17:57:23 < Thorn> or at least permanent residence
2018-09-30T17:57:53 < Thorn> englishman: https://www.instagram.com/p/BoWq6GMArui/
2018-09-30T17:58:11 < Sadale> wow.
2018-09-30T17:58:13 < englishman> howcome all your chatters are moving to holland
2018-09-30T17:58:17 < englishman> all you*
2018-09-30T17:58:46 < Steffanx> idk, i was kinda born with it Thorn
2018-09-30T17:59:13 < Steffanx> no clue if comments come wuth dutch passports.
2018-09-30T17:59:36 < Steffanx> (im not sure what you meant)
2018-09-30T17:59:56 < Steffanx> Stroopwafels, englishman .
2018-09-30T18:00:49 < mawk> and oil balls
2018-09-30T18:00:58 < Steffanx> lol, oil balls. 
2018-09-30T18:01:09 < Steffanx> That translation is terrible mawk
2018-09-30T18:01:11 < mawk> they call it "croustillons" in french
2018-09-30T18:01:21 < mawk> "crunchlings" or something in english I guess
2018-09-30T18:01:27 < mawk> lol
2018-09-30T18:01:29 < mawk> thank you
2018-09-30T18:01:31 < englishman> mawk i had fondue fromage 4 times this week
2018-09-30T18:01:33 < englishman> im going to die
2018-09-30T18:02:38 < mawk> I want some too
2018-09-30T18:02:41 < Steffanx> Was it with good dutch cheese?
2018-09-30T18:03:55 < mawk> isn't that antinomic ?
2018-09-30T18:04:08 < mawk> well I like dutch cheese but everytime I say it my friends make fun of me
2018-09-30T18:04:10 < emeb> mmm... gouda
2018-09-30T18:04:21 < mawk> they don't consider cooked-paste cheese really to be cheese
2018-09-30T18:05:11 < emeb> cocoa, stroopwafels, gouda...
2018-09-30T18:05:28 < emeb> what other tasty things have the netherlands given the world?
2018-09-30T18:05:40 < Steffanx> wind mills, tulips. wooden shoes.
2018-09-30T18:05:49 < emeb> not very tasty tho
2018-09-30T18:05:50 < Steffanx> oh tasty :p
2018-09-30T18:05:55 < Steffanx> lol missed that part
2018-09-30T18:06:15 < mawk> lots of tasty things I've seen in the stores emeb 
2018-09-30T18:06:20 < mawk> but not really fine gastronomy
2018-09-30T18:06:22 < Steffanx> hagelslag.
2018-09-30T18:06:26 < emeb> yes that!
2018-09-30T18:06:28 < BrainDamage> maybe he's a foot fetishist, therefore tasty shoes
2018-09-30T18:06:36 < mawk> influences from indonesian cuisine help
2018-09-30T18:07:41 < Steffanx> and dont forget our bitterballen and korketten emeb, but somehow we have a hard time exporting it.
2018-09-30T18:08:03 < emeb> Steffanx: TIL
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2018-09-30T19:14:48 < Steffanx> and dont forget the poffertjes emeb aka Dutch Mini Pancakes
2018-09-30T19:42:08 < englishman> i like dutch licorice
2018-09-30T19:44:58 < emeb> the salty stuff?
2018-09-30T19:46:34 < BrainDamage> if you want excessively salty, you just have to play a multiplayer game
2018-09-30T19:54:29 < englishman> yeah the salty stuff
2018-09-30T19:55:44 < Steffanx> We also have sweet licorice emeb 
2018-09-30T19:57:20 < emeb> Steffanx: all licorice is good.
2018-09-30T19:57:30  * emeb also likes absinthe
2018-09-30T19:59:00 < Steffanx> must be your european roots
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2018-09-30T19:59:45 < emeb> :)
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2018-09-30T20:53:37 < _abc_> st-link v2 clone talk: the Chinese clones, usb stick style; are they usually coming with fw suitable for general use with open source toolchains? Linux + makefile based burning?
2018-09-30T20:55:37 < emeb> If they are truly ST-Link V2 then they are supported by os tools.
2018-09-30T20:56:11 < emeb> I've got a couple cheapo usb-stick style ST-Link and they work w/ OpenOCD
2018-09-30T20:57:09 < emeb> Pretty sure that they're not fully V2 compatible though, (they don't have the extra serial port) and I haven't tried to upgrade the firmware to the latest.
2018-09-30T21:00:10 < karlp> that's v2.1
2018-09-30T21:00:30 < karlp> most common problem with cheap stlink clones is that some of them don't connect reset pin properly?
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2018-09-30T21:05:48 < PaulFertser> karlp: yes, the reset pin on some stlink clones is miswired but there exists a patched firmware. Also they can be probably reflashed to that jlink firmware .
2018-09-30T21:10:12 < catphish> karlp: how can that happen? thaty's such a fundamental feature :|
2018-09-30T21:10:27 < Steffanx> China...
2018-09-30T21:13:25 < PaulFertser> catphish: not really, if you have SWD access working you can always reset via SYSRESETREQ bit.
2018-09-30T21:14:24 < catphish> PaulFertser: sure, as long as you never break your SWD :)
2018-09-30T21:15:46 < emeb> yeah - if you try to re-use the SWD pins then reset is needed
2018-09-30T21:15:46 < PaulFertser> catphish: when you break it you pull the BOOT0 pin and connect as usual.
2018-09-30T21:16:02 < PaulFertser> Or use tweezers to short reset manually while connecting
2018-09-30T21:16:47 < emeb> I did a project on an F030 where I made that misteak
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2018-09-30T22:19:13 < Thorn> what do I do with these https://i.imgur.com/PR69wIh.jpg
2018-09-30T22:21:34 < jpa-> http://variwiki.com/index.php?title=VAR-SOM-AM43  install linux on it?
2018-09-30T22:23:10 < Steffanx> you meant windows right?
2018-09-30T22:23:36 < jpa-> why would someone want to hurt cute little windows like that?
2018-09-30T22:24:18 < Steffanx> punishment
2018-09-30T22:26:45 < Steffanx> Hows the self-emplyoing going jpa- ? Still better than expected?
2018-09-30T22:26:52 < Steffanx> Got yourself a ferrari yet?
2018-09-30T22:28:03 < jpa-> yeah; though better than expected = barely making ends meet with only me being employed and working like 2h/day
2018-09-30T22:28:59 < Thorn> has anyone used BQ27xxx
2018-09-30T22:29:00 < jpa-> no ferrari, but bought a second Bafang SWXK2
2018-09-30T22:29:33 < Steffanx> awh, sad to hear that jpa-
2018-09-30T22:29:41 < Thorn> also 0.5mm 9-ball bga wtf
2018-09-30T22:30:04 < jpa-> Steffanx: not sure there is that much to be sad about
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2018-09-30T22:32:03 < Steffanx> Yes, "Im sorry to hear that" was a bit less dramatic perhaps
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2018-09-30T22:33:17 < jpa-> i actually consider that part of the situation to be rather fortunate
2018-09-30T22:34:13 < jpa-> of course it would be great if i wasn't so depressed and could work more and/or she had a job too, but..
2018-09-30T22:35:57 < Steffanx> Hmm, what to say. Better get better.
2018-09-30T22:36:12 < jpa-> yep, hopefully time will fix things
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2018-09-30T22:39:43 < karlp> I imagine soem of the clones were clones of stlinkv1, which didn't have that pin broken out either?
2018-09-30T22:40:40 < englishman> anytime you want to feel that your life isnt so bad, you can come to ##stm32 and see the poor state the rest of the world lives in
2018-09-30T22:41:11 < jadew> jpa-, trying to start a business or just freelancing?
2018-09-30T22:41:20 < jpa-> just freelancing for now
2018-09-30T22:41:43 < jadew> yeah... I hate doing that
2018-09-30T22:42:00 < jpa-> why?
2018-09-30T22:42:31 < jadew> I don't know... I guess I'm tired
2018-09-30T22:43:03 < jadew> I can work for myself non-stop, but I find it very hard to work for other people
2018-09-30T22:43:31 < jadew> I do it, because I didn't manage to actually start making money from my own stuff, but I can't say that I enjoy it
2018-09-30T22:43:55 < jpa-> oh, quite the opposite for me; hard to keep up the motivation for own projects
2018-09-30T22:44:08 < karlp> I'm withjpa.
2018-09-30T22:44:54 < jadew> well, to an extent I'm suffering from that problem too, but I did put like a year in one of my current projects, before deciding to switch
2018-09-30T22:44:58 < jpa-> though i do hate the freelancing tasks from time to time, but that's why it's paid for
2018-09-30T22:45:06 < jadew> not sure if it was a motivation loss or panic (it was taking too long)
2018-09-30T22:47:08 < jadew> my biggest problem with freelancing is that I feel I'm not getting as much as I'm putting in
2018-09-30T22:47:18 < jadew> it's also a one time sale
2018-09-30T22:47:25 < jadew> you sell your hour for a fixed amount
2018-09-30T22:47:42 < jadew> which is much worse than investing in your own stuff
2018-09-30T22:47:57 < jadew> on the upside, you know exactly what you're getting, while your stuff could be worth 0
2018-09-30T22:48:54 < jpa-> yeah; fortunately the market rates are quite high atleast here, so even though it won't generate future income, it's still a good deal
2018-09-30T22:49:27 < jadew> how much are you charging?
2018-09-30T22:49:34 < jpa-> and in technology it is very hard to make stuff that really generates passive income; either you need to keep updating and improving it, or sell the design completely
2018-09-30T22:50:03 < jpa-> 70-80e/h typically
2018-09-30T22:50:16 < jadew> jpa-, that's great, I couldn't ask for that here
2018-09-30T22:50:45 < jadew> I'm only making 30/h
2018-09-30T22:50:54 < Steffanx> wut.
2018-09-30T22:51:09 < Steffanx> Thats after or before all taxes and crap?
2018-09-30T22:51:16 < jadew> before taxes
2018-09-30T22:51:32 < Steffanx> oof
2018-09-30T22:51:50 < jpa-> for me, before personal/company taxes but excluding VAT
2018-09-30T22:51:53 < Steffanx> or is that in php/webdev/whatever website related?
2018-09-30T22:52:05 < jpa-> i used to work for some engineering office who charged clients 70e/h and paid me only 20e/h
2018-09-30T22:52:12 < jadew> Steffanx, software related, yeah
2018-09-30T22:52:34 < Laurenceb124> clearly u need to look at babby shake
2018-09-30T22:52:34 < jadew> jpa-, hah
2018-09-30T22:52:47 < Laurenceb124> milk those funding schemes
2018-09-30T22:53:09 < jadew> I'd love some hardware projects, but I wouldn't know where to look for them
2018-09-30T22:53:29 < jpa-> but i guess time to sleep ->
2018-09-30T22:53:53 < jadew> I don't think a lot of people need things like that in here and if I was picking them off of freelance sites, I'd compete with indians
2018-09-30T22:56:06 < Laurenceb124> why work, when you can get megabux funding to do pointless shit by filling in random grant forms
2018-09-30T22:56:53 < jadew> Laurenceb124, I could actually access some funds for various stuff, but I want to actually build something
2018-09-30T22:57:00 < englishman> how much is babbyshake again
2018-09-30T22:57:05 < englishman> 4.5m ukp?
2018-09-30T22:57:38 < englishman> for bosch mems, usb audio and influxdb
2018-09-30T23:00:09 < Laurenceb124> jadew: no I just get shitty wage
2018-09-30T23:01:14 < Laurenceb124> englishman: yeah
2018-09-30T23:01:21 < Laurenceb124> we now have 17 employees O_o
2018-09-30T23:06:44 < Laurenceb124> last week someone managed to make something, a shocking development
2018-09-30T23:11:34 < Steffanx> does mr Laurenceb124  enjoy his job?
2018-09-30T23:11:46 < jadew> very good question :)
2018-09-30T23:11:51 < Laurenceb124> obvious question is obvious
2018-09-30T23:11:58 < Laurenceb124> I'm just there for the moneys
2018-09-30T23:12:06 < Steffanx> <Laurenceb124> jadew: no I just get shitty wage
2018-09-30T23:12:21 < Steffanx> shit money?
2018-09-30T23:12:28 < jadew> you know, if the regulars of this channel got together and started a business, we could make probably make a shit ton of money
2018-09-30T23:12:35 < Steffanx> no
2018-09-30T23:12:42 < jadew> you don't think so?
2018-09-30T23:12:43 < Laurenceb124> Steffanx: yeah but I dont have to do any work
2018-09-30T23:12:45 < Steffanx> we would circle jerk all they long
2018-09-30T23:13:00 < Laurenceb124> turn up at 1pm and Russian grrrl turns up drunk at 3pm
2018-09-30T23:13:05 < Laurenceb124> then leave at 4pm
2018-09-30T23:13:14 < Steffanx> i still dont believe this russian girl is real
2018-09-30T23:13:28 < Steffanx> we need facebook
2018-09-30T23:13:28 < Laurenceb124> female brogrammer?! ikr
2018-09-30T23:13:54 < jadew> probably is real, but has a beard and looks more manly than laurence
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2018-09-30T23:15:02 < Steffanx> 0615 you mean crt
2018-09-30T23:15:41 < Laurenceb124> 0603
2018-09-30T23:15:49 < englishman> sounds like the ideal job for Laurenceb
2018-09-30T23:16:06 < englishman> low pay for low responsibility
2018-09-30T23:16:13 < Laurenceb124> shitpost on irc the jerb
2018-09-30T23:16:46 < Laurenceb124> waiting for russian to write some methlab codez...
2018-09-30T23:16:57 < Steffanx> i still dont believe this russian girl is real
2018-09-30T23:16:59 < Laurenceb124> the eternal wait
2018-09-30T23:17:28 < Steffanx> Where is ReadError. Did he crawl out of his hiding yet?
2018-09-30T23:18:08 < Steffanx> Or dis he join rob235
2018-09-30T23:18:10 < Steffanx> Did
2018-09-30T23:18:15 < Steffanx> L
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2018-09-30T23:25:18 < Laurenceb124> >because female programmer amirite?
2018-09-30T23:25:22 < Laurenceb124> >implying she can do anything other than drink vodka and be a bitch
2018-09-30T23:32:33 < Thorn> https://youtu.be/9ps7H0Jb4ZM?t=18m48s
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2018-09-30T23:37:12 < Laurenceb124> Reddit: a place where every poster tries really hard to present themselves as being edgy and unflinching, but shits themselves the moment anything which actually contradicts the status quo is posted. It's like if vice made forum posters.
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2018-09-30T23:57:58 < emeb> grrreeetings erthleeengs
2018-09-30T23:58:00 < con3> just quickly want to ask, is there any reason to have an external clock on these mcu's? Anything that the internal clock can't run/do?
2018-09-30T23:58:07  * con3 is a noob
2018-09-30T23:58:26 < emeb> if you want accuracy you need external osc / xtal
2018-09-30T23:58:35 < emeb> internal osc is only good to 5% or so
2018-09-30T23:58:46 < con3> accuracy? assuming for like adc's?
2018-09-30T23:58:51 < emeb> no
2018-09-30T23:59:04 < emeb> to match timing of other systems
2018-09-30T23:59:16 < emeb> or to keep stable freq
2018-09-30T23:59:37 < emeb> eg I use these things for music, so if I want to stay in tune then an xtal is needed.
2018-09-30T23:59:48 < con3> ah ok, I understand :)
--- Log closed Mon Oct 01 00:00:06 2018