--- Log opened Fri Feb 01 00:00:33 2019
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2019-02-01T01:02:12 < zyp> dongs, looks like mikrotik made another 10G switch, sized between the kawaii four port one and the older 16-port one
2019-02-01T01:02:16 < zyp> https://mikrotik.com/product/crs309_1g_8s_in
2019-02-01T01:34:38 < Simon--> how much power does it draw?
2019-02-01T01:35:15 < Simon--> it says "max", but.. hm...
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2019-02-01T04:57:32 < machinehum> hi
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2019-02-01T05:09:50 < englishman> hi machiney
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2019-02-01T05:26:40 < machinehum> !!
2019-02-01T05:27:35 < machinehum> Going to the openocd channel to get hated on!
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2019-02-01T05:35:08 < dongs> zyp: cool
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2019-02-01T06:10:36 < dongs> damn
2019-02-01T06:10:50 < dongs> there's no such thing as FT2232H breakout WITH that weird spi-eque flash eh
2019-02-01T06:11:26 < dongs> ooo
2019-02-01T06:11:27 < dongs> there's one
2019-02-01T06:11:32 < dongs> https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Particle/PROGSHIELD?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuqBwn8WqcFUm5mmg9GeJArH4peQWcpZg3hTYcjbHQjcA%3d%3d
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2019-02-01T06:13:27 < dongs> ok that looks like the least aidsy thing thats ins tock
2019-02-01T06:13:47 < dongs> https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Seeed-Studio/103990006?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuqBwn8WqcFUsGY9cgyOYqFHNznpsAFVhf6qN1T8VW9tg%3d%3d mm theres this thing from AIDS studio
2019-02-01T06:14:08 < dongs> oh but its EAR
2019-02-01T06:14:10 < dongs> yea no
2019-02-01T06:19:21 < dongs> hm what else to get from mouserrrr for free shipping
2019-02-01T06:27:54 < Thorn> wtf, why is FT2232H export restricted
2019-02-01T06:28:11 < dongs> i dont know, the particle one is same and isnt
2019-02-01T06:28:59 < dongs> maybe its EAR cuz it orig's from china for the shitsutdio one
2019-02-01T06:36:00 < machinehum> WHAT
2019-02-01T06:36:04 < machinehum> what*
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2019-02-01T07:09:39 < aandrew> fuck yes
2019-02-01T07:09:50 < dongs> sup dongs
2019-02-01T07:09:51 < aandrew> I have the FTDI chip I put on this board working with the intel fpga tools
2019-02-01T07:09:58 < dongs> > intel
2019-02-01T07:10:00 < dongs> fuck altera
2019-02-01T07:10:07 < aandrew> I can use signaltap and all that shit with nothing but the shit I have on board
2019-02-01T07:10:10 < dongs> xilinx ISE that only runs in winxp 4 lyfe
2019-02-01T07:10:21 < aandrew> I am not using their jtag adapter, I'm using my own that is onboard
2019-02-01T07:10:27 < dongs> nice
2019-02-01T07:10:29 < dongs> which ftdi?
2019-02-01T07:10:30 < aandrew> with the whole jtag chain in there too (fpga, two clock gens and the PHY)
2019-02-01T07:10:33 < aandrew> FT2232H
2019-02-01T07:10:36 < dongs> i just ordered a boar with that
2019-02-01T07:10:41 < dongs> board
2019-02-01T07:10:43 < dongs> breakout
2019-02-01T07:10:47 < aandrew> it's even working at 480mbps although it's being passed through a ULPI PHY in bypass mode
2019-02-01T07:11:01 < dongs> i fucking have one on this lattice pcie card but it has no pins to be usable as external debugger
2019-02-01T07:11:09 < dongs> so i had to pay 30bux for a breakout
2019-02-01T07:11:11 < aandrew> yep
2019-02-01T07:11:59 < aandrew> brb gotta blog this shit so I don't forget how I did it
2019-02-01T07:18:13 < dongs> yip, solved what i needed to buy
2019-02-01T07:18:21 < dongs> lul, fucking tinyFPGA  trash uses the slowest grade chip
2019-02-01T07:19:42 < aandrew> most times that is more than enough
2019-02-01T07:19:47 < aandrew> I almost always use the slowest speed grade devices
2019-02-01T07:20:16 < dongs> yes but for testing i'll use the highest grade one and the price difference covered jump to free shipping
2019-02-01T07:20:21 < aandrew> of course
2019-02-01T07:20:36 < aandrew> hell even the PCIe device I did used -8 speed grade
2019-02-01T07:20:38 < aandrew> (slowest)
2019-02-01T07:20:46 < aandrew> it did need the I temp range though
2019-02-01T07:20:50 < dongs> higher number is faster in lattice
2019-02-01T07:20:56 < aandrew> opposite in altera
2019-02-01T07:21:04 < dongs> forget what it is in xilinx
2019-02-01T07:21:11 < aandrew> I *think* it's the same as altera
2019-02-01T07:21:24 < aandrew> of course just to be different they probably use letters KWOP
2019-02-01T07:26:17 < dongs> 2019年2月19日(火) 
2019-02-01T07:26:17 < dongs> 14:00 - 15:00
2019-02-01T07:26:17 < dongs> (JST)
2019-02-01T07:26:17 < dongs> 担当者
2019-02-01T07:26:17 < dongs> 児島 史郎
2019-02-01T07:26:19 < dongs> フィールドアプリケーションエンジニア
2019-02-01T07:26:22 < dongs> free altidumb s eminar
2019-02-01T07:26:27 < dongs> i get to watch jap try to click for an hour
2019-02-01T07:28:43 < jadew> man... that chinese festival is long
2019-02-01T07:28:55 < jadew> who the hell parties for 10 days straight?
2019-02-01T07:30:19 < dongs> oh hey
2019-02-01T07:30:24 < dongs> mouser updated product description
2019-02-01T07:30:29 < dongs> for the ddr socket i complained about
2019-02-01T07:30:31 < dongs> 571-1473150-4
2019-02-01T07:30:43 < dongs> it didn't have indication it was reverse in description, only in parametrics below
2019-02-01T07:30:51 < dongs> they added 'REV' like others in that category have
2019-02-01T07:31:20 < jadew> but you already bought it?
2019-02-01T07:31:26 < dongs> no
2019-02-01T07:31:30 < dongs> i was looking for datasheets
2019-02-01T07:31:35 < dongs> or rather
2019-02-01T07:31:42 < dongs> looking for who makes reverse socket then finding chinaclones
2019-02-01T07:31:55 < dongs> so i filtered all ddr shits and went down the list through the big brands
2019-02-01T07:33:13 < dongs> Service Excellence Team
2019-02-01T07:33:13 < dongs> Mouser Electronics Inc.
2019-02-01T07:33:21 < dongs> these guys really do excellent service , then!
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2019-02-01T07:39:30 < dongs> is circuitmaker still exists
2019-02-01T07:39:39 < upgrdman> jadew, the festival isnt so much about partying. it's about familt.
2019-02-01T07:39:39 < jadew> probably
2019-02-01T07:39:42 < upgrdman> err family
2019-02-01T07:39:44 < dongs> i start it up from time to time and they havent updated it in years
2019-02-01T07:39:58 < aandrew> https://mixdown.ca/redmine/projects/mixdown/wiki/QuartusFTDI
2019-02-01T07:40:38 < upgrdman> jadew, most chinese people are from the "country" and work in the "big city" ... the big national holidays are a time for families to reunite.
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2019-02-01T07:40:54 < jadew> upgrdman, makes sense
2019-02-01T07:41:04 < aandrew> still want an ethernetblaster
2019-02-01T07:41:05 < aandrew> but this is good
2019-02-01T07:41:08 < jadew> trains must be india-full
2019-02-01T07:41:22 < upgrdman> jadew, all public transit is full
2019-02-01T07:41:29 < dongs> .so lol
2019-02-01T07:41:31 < dongs> what is this lunix shit
2019-02-01T07:42:00 < upgrdman> and many small shops have already closed down for the holiday
2019-02-01T07:42:09 < aandrew> don't worry my point and click friend, there's win64 there as well and it's twice as fucky to get working
2019-02-01T07:42:35 < jadew> upgrdman, you're in China now?
2019-02-01T07:42:54 < upgrdman> dongs, serious q: whats the point of those webinars? like why not just make it a jewtube video and be done with it? or a live jewtube video if needed
2019-02-01T07:42:57 < upgrdman> jadew, yes
2019-02-01T07:43:12 < aandrew> I fucking hate webinars
2019-02-01T07:43:17 < dongs> upgrdman: yea no idea. ive seen a few they'er boring as shit
2019-02-01T07:43:21 < dongs> and the guy usually has no idea???
2019-02-01T07:43:22 < upgrdman> k
2019-02-01T07:43:29 < dongs> like i saw altium dude poking literally everything with a mouse
2019-02-01T07:43:32 < dongs> instead of using keyboard shit
2019-02-01T07:43:34 < aandrew> and I also fucking hate youtube vids when a page of text would be so much fucking better including the ability to copy and paste what the fuck they've typed
2019-02-01T07:43:34 < dongs> it was terrible
2019-02-01T07:44:04 < jadew> I think webinars are done to grab your contact info
2019-02-01T07:44:11 < dongs> for sure
2019-02-01T07:44:16 < aandrew> well it's like the old fashioned seminars
2019-02-01T07:44:18 < jadew> it's basically "let's see who's interested in this thing"
2019-02-01T07:44:18 < dongs> altium dudees called me after
2019-02-01T07:44:23 < aandrew> but no donuts and no free hardware
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2019-02-01T08:02:47 < tjq> handjobs
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2019-02-01T08:04:38 < aandrew> hm, never got one of those at a seminar
2019-02-01T08:13:05 < tjq> Well you may in time
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2019-02-01T08:16:37 < jadew> is anyone using the new acrobat reader?
2019-02-01T08:16:41 < jadew> that DC thing?
2019-02-01T08:17:04 < jadew> looks so bloated and shit
2019-02-01T08:17:26 < jadew> I hid the menu and now I can't access it
2019-02-01T08:17:51 < jadew> and it has those huge tabs at the top
2019-02-01T08:17:52 < jadew> WTF?
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2019-02-01T08:56:41 < tjq> Good isn’t it....
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2019-02-01T09:15:31 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/Fa9zkpE.png how the fuck do i set this in new altidumb
2019-02-01T09:15:40 < dongs> ever since they fucked with sidebars of shit its all been fucked
2019-02-01T09:16:22 < dongs> oh nvm its just a rectangle i drew in symbol
2019-02-01T09:19:47 < Thorn> Altium Disaster
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2019-02-01T09:35:01 < kakimir> for 3mm led what would ideal hole size to 1.6mm fr4?
2019-02-01T09:38:48 < tjq> Lol
2019-02-01T09:39:02 < kakimir> does glue stick better to exposed board surface
2019-02-01T09:39:11 < kakimir> no silkscreen or copper
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2019-02-01T09:39:48 < tjq> The fucking CHINESE did it again
2019-02-01T09:40:02 < tjq> Idk
2019-02-01T09:40:05 < tjq> Something
2019-02-01T09:40:12 < kakimir> okay
2019-02-01T09:41:07 < tjq> Are you Japanese Haohmaru
2019-02-01T09:41:49 < tjq> Do you download?
2019-02-01T09:42:45 < tjq> ANIME
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2019-02-01T09:50:26 < jadew> I think tentacle sex is still anime
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2019-02-01T09:52:45 < kakimir> #tentacles32
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2019-02-01T10:15:47 < Steffanx> Innovation in ##stm32 has vanished ages ago
2019-02-01T10:15:57 < rajkosto> i innovated your mom last night
2019-02-01T10:16:06 < zyp> jadew, christmas/newyears here isn't really all that different
2019-02-01T10:16:41 < jadew> zyp, yeah, but they're making my stuff
2019-02-01T10:16:50 < jadew> they should sync holidays
2019-02-01T10:16:52 < zyp> I mean, I had 11 days in a row off
2019-02-01T10:17:41 < jadew> Haohmaru, he pays attention
2019-02-01T10:18:38 < rajkosto> do air packets work the same way during chinese nye ?
2019-02-01T10:20:27 < Steffanx> Oh, you didnt know this yet Haohmaru. Next time ill add [spoileralert]
2019-02-01T10:21:41 < jadew> kidding aside, I think there's a lot going on here
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2019-02-01T10:47:33 < Steffanx> Is it a better day with tentacles, Haohmaru?
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2019-02-01T11:42:43 < tjq> http://en.hengfu.com
2019-02-01T11:42:47 < tjq> HENG
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2019-02-01T12:55:16 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyTgTMvVYAE7xV2.jpg:orig
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2019-02-01T13:51:28 < Cracki> I know
2019-02-01T13:51:35 < Cracki> that's why I don't pay any :3
2019-02-01T13:51:49 < Cracki> nah it's legal
2019-02-01T13:51:57 < Cracki> they're the criminals
2019-02-01T13:52:36 < Cracki> a bunch of selfrighteous germans back in 2015 wanted to vouch for "refugees" monetarily. now they're asked to pay up 50k each.
2019-02-01T13:52:59 < Cracki> they pussied out. now tax payers get to pay their debt.
2019-02-01T13:53:36 < Cracki> there's really no reason to let these monsters breathe another breath.
2019-02-01T13:54:14 < Cracki> let's call it "post-birth abortion"
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2019-02-01T13:55:03 < Cracki> also: giving condoms to 7 year olds https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DySroc6WoAAKhB9.jpg:orig
2019-02-01T13:56:09 < Cracki> actually makes sense... that would end the blood line of whatever parents fail to raise their kids right
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2019-02-01T13:58:12 < Cracki> difficult question. depending on factors, either shotgun wedding or shotgun abortion.
2019-02-01T13:58:26 < Cracki> (and shotgun sterilization)
2019-02-01T13:59:07 < Cracki> no. people have been having children as soon as they're able for millennia
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2019-02-01T13:59:32 < Cracki> shutgun weddings are a tradition
2019-02-01T13:59:59 < Cracki> it ensures that the pregnant "lady" has someone to provide for her
2019-02-01T14:00:45 < Cracki> back when socialism hadn't destroyed the institution of family, this was how they ensured their survival
2019-02-01T14:00:57 < Cracki> now tax payers pay for your sins
2019-02-01T14:01:23 < Cracki> die shot: https://zeptobars.com/en/read/atmel-tiny4-attiny4-microcontroller
2019-02-01T14:02:32 < specing> socialism is one big family
2019-02-01T14:02:36 < Cracki> also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barn_(unit)
2019-02-01T14:02:40 < Cracki> while we're talking about shotguns
2019-02-01T14:02:55 < Cracki> socialism is a HUNDRED MILLION KILLED
2019-02-01T14:03:25 < Cracki> lying together in a big stinking mass grave doesn't make you family
2019-02-01T14:03:55 < Cracki> not sure what scheme they use for colorizing their die shots
2019-02-01T14:04:26 < Cracki> you have a bunch of layers, metal and whatnot
2019-02-01T14:04:34 < Cracki> those form transistors and such
2019-02-01T14:05:06 < specing> Cracki: thats a lot of shotguns
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2019-02-01T15:00:38 < Cracki> https://twitter.com/fightc1ub/status/1091193605828554752
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2019-02-01T16:30:34 < mawk> the judiciary police just called me
2019-02-01T16:30:46 < mawk> I'm famous
2019-02-01T16:30:48 < mawk> https://pix.watch/
2019-02-01T16:30:54 < mawk> they sent a requisition about my image hosting service
2019-02-01T16:31:00 < mawk> they want all info I have on some paedo guy
2019-02-01T16:32:24 < BrainDamage> I guess they are finally onto faprenceb
2019-02-01T16:32:44 < mawk> lol
2019-02-01T16:33:29 < BrainDamage> I assume they have some criterias that aren't just content that you can use to screen your logs?
2019-02-01T16:33:37 < BrainDamage> browser agent, or whatever?
2019-02-01T16:33:50 < BrainDamage> since your site says that it encrypts on client side
2019-02-01T16:34:27 < mawk> the images are encrypted yes
2019-02-01T16:35:12 < BrainDamage> browser headers are often detailed enough to uniquely identify a client
2019-02-01T16:35:30 < mawk> I have some statistics about my users, and some logs but not the image url
2019-02-01T16:35:56 < mawk> so you can't exploit the logs without a somewhat precise timestamp of the upload time
2019-02-01T16:36:04 < mawk> without that the logs are useless, they don't contain the image url
2019-02-01T16:36:22 < mawk> so I hope the police sent me a precise time
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2019-02-01T17:23:28 < Cracki> uh?
2019-02-01T17:23:45 < Cracki> client side encryption would imply to me that you only see requests to opaque blobs
2019-02-01T17:23:55 < Cracki> and they need to point out to you the exact blob they want logs on
2019-02-01T17:24:12 < Cracki> if you keep logs that long, which you shouldn't
2019-02-01T17:26:38 < BrainDamage> they can just request the accesses in a time range and investigate each one of those, if few enough
2019-02-01T17:27:29 < BrainDamage> and eg correlate with other service usages / accesses
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2019-02-01T17:47:30 < zyp> Cracki, unless there's laws requiring you to retain logs
2019-02-01T17:47:41 < Cracki> certainly
2019-02-01T17:48:22 < Cracki> I can't trust anyone who would hand out logs that are older than the mandated retention period
2019-02-01T17:48:44 < zyp> why?
2019-02-01T17:49:01 < zyp> it's retention that's mandatory, not deletion
2019-02-01T17:49:15 < Cracki> now you're confusing words and meanings
2019-02-01T17:49:33 < jadew> most servers hold on to their logs until the hdd is full
2019-02-01T17:49:37 < Cracki> same
2019-02-01T17:49:42 < jadew> then the admin gets in and delets stuff
2019-02-01T17:49:54 < Cracki> but if anyone asked, they wouldn't get anything they aren't legally entitled to
2019-02-01T17:50:04 < jadew> so if the cops ask for logs on someone and you have those logs... why not give them what they need?
2019-02-01T17:50:27 < Cracki> because healthy distrust of the state?
2019-02-01T17:50:54 < jadew> that's a fair point I guess
2019-02-01T17:51:19 < jadew> but it's like living with a partner you don't trust
2019-02-01T17:51:22 < Cracki> destruction of privacy is a slippery slope. they wave the banner of "but the children!", install wide-ranging censorship infrastructure, and then abuse their privileges
2019-02-01T17:51:36 < jadew> generally speaking, you have to assume that the police has your best interest at heart
2019-02-01T17:51:40 < Cracki> muricans have the second amendment because of this
2019-02-01T17:51:43 < Cracki> lol
2019-02-01T17:51:45 < Cracki> hahahahah
2019-02-01T17:52:01 < Cracki> you must be living in a high trust society, so that excludes all western countries
2019-02-01T17:52:12 < zyp> haha
2019-02-01T17:52:14 < specing> isn't second amendment the guns thing?
2019-02-01T17:52:29 < zyp> I actually went to the police station today
2019-02-01T17:52:31 < specing> is that why the american police are so trigger happy and carry rifles?
2019-02-01T17:52:36 < zyp> that was a fairly pleasant experience
2019-02-01T17:53:03 < Cracki> look at france. their police aren't all that pleasant. in fact they want to maim and kill you
2019-02-01T17:53:20 < Cracki> countless people have lost eyesight because they keep aiming their "flash balls" for the head
2019-02-01T17:53:22 < zyp> sucks to be french
2019-02-01T17:53:31 < Cracki> they should bring out the guillotines
2019-02-01T17:53:48 < jadew> well, in situation like that it's different
2019-02-01T17:54:10 < zyp> I've generally only had pleasant experiences with norwegian police
2019-02-01T17:54:11 < jadew> you have the class sustained from taxes vs the tax payers
2019-02-01T17:54:26 < zyp> even when they fined me 3800 NOK for speeding last year, it wasn't unpleasant, just annoying :p
2019-02-01T17:54:50 < jadew> yeah, same here
2019-02-01T17:54:55 < Cracki> they're pleasant because they have no reason to harass you
2019-02-01T17:55:11 < Cracki> always remember their bosses are politicians
2019-02-01T17:55:24 < Cracki> and politicians only do politics for their electorate, not the whole country
2019-02-01T17:55:25 < jadew> Cracki, there you go
2019-02-01T17:55:34 < jadew> as long as you can keep the politicians in line, the police is on your side
2019-02-01T17:55:44 < jadew> that's why it exists
2019-02-01T17:56:00 < Cracki> there is no way to keep the politicians in line if they can use police to keep YOU in line
2019-02-01T17:56:29 < jadew> again, I think there's a distinction there, between conflict situations and regular police work
2019-02-01T17:56:37 < Cracki> and every little bit of freedom you lose to the state, it will use and abuse
2019-02-01T17:56:58 < jadew> but yeah, usually when a segment turns against the government, the police is with the government
2019-02-01T17:57:03 < Cracki> back when london got to isntalling cameras everywhere, people got upset
2019-02-01T17:57:05 < Cracki> remember that?
2019-02-01T17:57:08 < Cracki> now they're all cattle.
2019-02-01T17:57:49 < jadew> I don't know why people got upset over that
2019-02-01T17:57:58 < jadew> I'd pay for that level of surveilance
2019-02-01T17:57:58 < Cracki> ok then
2019-02-01T17:58:09 < Cracki> read 1984 please
2019-02-01T17:58:23 < Cracki> if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy, please refrain from voting ever again
2019-02-01T17:58:39 < jadew> don't forget I come from an ex-communist country, I'm well aware of what totalitarian regimes can do
2019-02-01T17:58:52 < jadew> but it all comes down to who is running the country
2019-02-01T17:59:18 < Cracki> I do appreciate the surveillance cameras in my city center, where all the scum pools... but only there
2019-02-01T18:00:26 < Cracki> and no, my country's rulers are either puppets or evil
2019-02-01T18:00:51 < Cracki> we're getting boiled slowly
2019-02-01T18:01:11 < jadew> Cracki, that's probably a bit true everywhere
2019-02-01T18:01:20 < jadew> the key is to let them know that if they step out of line they die
2019-02-01T18:01:33 < Cracki> if you let them know that, YOU go to jail
2019-02-01T18:01:34 < jadew> worked for us
2019-02-01T18:02:35 < Cracki> I'm dissatisfied that it has to come to that, and I'm dissatisfied by the enormous length of the leash most people grant their rulers
2019-02-01T18:02:37 < jadew> yeah, that's the case here too, but we have a president killing in our recent history, so we don't have to say it
2019-02-01T18:02:46 < aandrew> jadew: heh
2019-02-01T18:02:53 < aandrew> I think my wife said she was 14 when that went down
2019-02-01T18:02:59 < Cracki> I'm amazed that more political assassinations aren't happening these days
2019-02-01T18:03:28 < aandrew> there's easier access to bread and circuses these days
2019-02-01T18:03:38 < Cracki> either the police are good at that job, or the population is sufficiently pacified
2019-02-01T18:04:04 < jadew> Cracki, that sort of shit only happens in extreme situations
2019-02-01T18:04:26 < jadew> you don't go killing people for doing a poor job
2019-02-01T18:04:39 < Cracki> I'm really puzzled why the hungry mob in venezuela hasn't barbecued maduro yet
2019-02-01T18:04:52 < jadew> they didn't get their hands on him yet
2019-02-01T18:05:00 < jadew> but I'm sure they will
2019-02-01T18:05:04 < Cracki> "doing a poor job" is a huge understatement
2019-02-01T18:05:20 < Cracki> destroying a nation has historically ALWAYS been grounds for execution
2019-02-01T18:05:46 < Cracki> as it should be. nothing less deters from the act.
2019-02-01T18:06:37 < jadew> I don't know, if it wasn't intentional, I don't think execusion is a correct punishment
2019-02-01T18:06:51 < Cracki> "not intentional"
2019-02-01T18:06:55 < Cracki> he's a dictator
2019-02-01T18:06:57 < jadew> but maybe if it was, people would think twice about getting into power
2019-02-01T18:07:19 < Cracki> there's no risk to "being in power"
2019-02-01T18:07:26 < Cracki> you don't decide alone, you have a whole nation to ask
2019-02-01T18:07:39 < Cracki> and if you fuck up, you resign
2019-02-01T18:07:57 < Cracki> that's the honorable thing to do, and has been what politicians did up until a decade or two ago
2019-02-01T18:08:27 < Cracki> (at least in the version of my country they claim it was)
2019-02-01T18:09:13 < jadew> I have a much healthier view on politics these days
2019-02-01T18:09:17 < Cracki> nowadays, the *opposition* party is getting assassination attempts
2019-02-01T18:09:31 < jadew> much like what it was when I was a kid: I didn't care much about it
2019-02-01T18:09:32 < Cracki> I might have too, would I live in your country
2019-02-01T18:09:52 < Cracki> but this place is getting fucked and we get blamed for our tyrants
2019-02-01T18:11:36 < Cracki> I mean... what the fuck kinda propaganda does this regime run that causes assassination attempts on *opposition* politicians?!
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2019-02-01T18:17:32 < kakimir> tyranny
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2019-02-01T18:34:40 < mawk> I can't know which blob it is Cracki 
2019-02-01T18:34:48 < mawk> the blobs are indexed by the URL, which I don't log
2019-02-01T18:34:54 < Cracki> exactly, but they know which
2019-02-01T18:34:56 < mawk> yes
2019-02-01T18:35:03 < mawk> they found the image on a forum I guess
2019-02-01T18:35:20 < Cracki> so they can ask you for who requested that blob, and who uploaded it, right?
2019-02-01T18:35:20 < mawk> but even if they give me just the url I can't find the log
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2019-02-01T18:35:26 < Cracki> hm why not?
2019-02-01T18:35:27 < mawk> I need other info, like precise time or UA or whatever
2019-02-01T18:35:32 < mawk> because I don't log the url
2019-02-01T18:35:37 < Cracki> for who uploaded it, eh?
2019-02-01T18:35:38 < mawk> so I can't correlate the url to a precise upload
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2019-02-01T18:35:55 < Cracki> good, in general. bad for the cp cae.
2019-02-01T18:35:58 < Cracki> case
2019-02-01T18:36:03 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-01T18:36:36 < mawk> I had two previous requisitions before that, one for drugs and the other for CP
2019-02-01T18:36:46 < mawk> so I shut down the URL that the cp guys know, but it wasn't enough
2019-02-01T18:37:03 < Cracki> so... what traffic do you get? if they came to you with the span of a whole day, how many upload(er)s would they have to wade through?
2019-02-01T18:38:10 < Cracki> I thinkyou mentioned it was linked in a forum... so they could just say "give an hour before the time of the post"
2019-02-01T18:38:44 < mawk> yes
2019-02-01T18:38:56 < mawk> I didn't check stats for a long time, but I have 90 GiB of images now
2019-02-01T18:40:21 < Cracki> apropos lewd stuff... snow dalek! https://twitter.com/oeufelia/status/1091317901565591553
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2019-02-01T19:18:12 < jpa-> (gdb) x /xs 0   0x0: "\177ELF\001\001\001"     and here i'm wondering why this doesn't run
2019-02-01T19:18:38 < jpa-> for some reason openocd didn't quite realize it was .elf.. though i think the 'program' command should support elf files
2019-02-01T19:19:33 < PaulFertser> Yes, program supports ELFs
2019-02-01T19:20:01 < PaulFertser> "flash write_image" is what handles it under the hood
2019-02-01T19:20:15 < PaulFertser> Probably you added "offset" parameter and so openocd decided it's a binary?
2019-02-01T19:21:43 < jpa-> -c "program $< verify reset exit"
2019-02-01T19:22:44 < aandrew> hm does anyone have an stm32f7xx openocd script for flash etc? 
2019-02-01T19:22:56 < aandrew> I seem to be running some goofy hybrid one from god knows when (back when I was on stm32f207)
2019-02-01T19:22:57 < zyp> jpa-, sure $< expands to only one argument?
2019-02-01T19:25:53 < jpa-> http://paste.dy.fi/AZ1  yeah, seems to expand only to one arg
2019-02-01T19:26:16 < jpa-> maybe i have something else messed up
2019-02-01T19:29:28 < aandrew> there we go, found one
2019-02-01T19:38:22 < aandrew> wow way to go microchip
2019-02-01T19:38:35 < aandrew> took you over two full weeks to assign a case to someone internally
2019-02-01T19:38:50 < PaulFertser> jpa-: it just reads first 4 bytes, compares to "\177ELF" , if matches treats as ELF, I can't see how it can go wrong.
2019-02-01T19:38:58 < aandrew> someone on IRC noticed something with a similar chip they used and suggested I try the same thing with this one and it worked
2019-02-01T19:44:10 < PaulFertser> Probably you have an elf inside an elf :)
2019-02-01T19:44:23 < aandrew> elfception
2019-02-01T19:44:44 < englishman> anyone going to embeddedworld
2019-02-01T19:46:05 < jpa-> PaulFertser: yeah, i'm starting to suspect the same
2019-02-01T19:46:30 < jpa-> the main .elf is 1.7MB so wouldn't fit anyway
2019-02-01T19:46:44 < jpa-> (i mean, if it was interpreted as .bin and debug info included)
2019-02-01T19:50:24 < zyp> jpa-, haha, how?
2019-02-01T19:51:06 < jpa-> no idea, and objdump -D doesn't show it
2019-02-01T19:52:09 < jpa-> hmm no
2019-02-01T19:52:17 < jpa-> if i load the same .elf from gdb it works ok
2019-02-01T19:52:37 < jpa-> but if i load with openocd -c, it writes 'ELF' to the start of the flash
2019-02-01T19:55:51 < jpa-> http://paste.dy.fi/Ah3   maybe it's because this image is a bit strange, it has ".text_bootloader" section at start but it is empty
2019-02-01T19:57:49 < jpa-> http://paste.dy.fi/8tz/plain   it seems to write in one go from 0x0 to end of image, and perhaps it has some garbage in the start in memory when there is no data for it in .elf
2019-02-01T19:58:08 < jpa-> i'll just include the bootloader in the .elf, i was going to anyway
2019-02-01T20:01:25 < karlp> 0
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2019-02-01T20:30:20 < jpa-> yeah, seems to work now that there is no gap there
2019-02-01T20:30:34 < PaulFertser> Bad buggy openocd...
2019-02-01T20:37:07 < mawk> you're flashing a elf to flash jpa- ?
2019-02-01T20:37:23 < jpa-> yes, in so many ways..
2019-02-01T20:37:30 < mawk> but you can't
2019-02-01T20:37:35 < mawk> you need a flatfile
2019-02-01T20:37:35 < mawk> no ?
2019-02-01T20:38:03 < jpa-> openocd converts automatically, except when it doesn't
2019-02-01T20:38:09 < mawk> lol
2019-02-01T20:39:43 < PaulFertser> Not really converts, rather reads list of sections from program header and writes them to the addresses specified.
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2019-02-01T23:15:06 < Laurenceb_123> sup
2019-02-01T23:17:52 < Steffanx> Sky
2019-02-01T23:29:34 < kakimir> suppa duppa
2019-02-01T23:30:01 < antto> i i can't stand da rain
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2019-02-01T23:43:51 < Steffanx> i like the rain, as long as im not outside :)
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2019-02-02T01:22:25 < Laurenceb_123> https://imgoat.com/uploads/8a2fc6ed39/191934.png
2019-02-02T02:00:04 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.hyperloopdesign.net/
2019-02-02T02:06:07 < mawk> hypersupramegaloop
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2019-02-02T03:04:47 < tjq> the jolly queer
2019-02-02T03:05:34 < englishman> if it's in a vacuum why does it have to be aerodynamic
2019-02-02T03:05:38 < englishman> asking the real questions here
2019-02-02T03:06:23 < specing> its not a perfect vacuum
2019-02-02T03:07:08 < englishman> are you saying hyperloop isnt perfect
2019-02-02T03:07:15 < englishman> /ban
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2019-02-02T03:24:02 < Laurenceb_123> englishman: cuz its not a perfect vacuum
2019-02-02T03:24:03 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-47096767
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2019-02-02T03:38:59 < tjq> Laurenceb_123
2019-02-02T03:39:05 < tjq> Where is crt
2019-02-02T03:39:19 < tjq> You spotted him
2019-02-02T03:39:22 < Laurenceb_123> u r not crt?
2019-02-02T03:39:39 < tjq> You posted crt spotted
2019-02-02T03:39:41 < Laurenceb_123> kek I know dat acronym
2019-02-02T03:40:02 < tjq> Indeed
2019-02-02T03:40:06 < Laurenceb_123> oh - garage arts
2019-02-02T03:40:17 < tjq> Whut is that
2019-02-02T03:40:24 < Laurenceb_123> guy who livestreams arguments with his asian wife
2019-02-02T03:40:33 < tjq> LOL
2019-02-02T03:46:32 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmV_yvhOWRQ
2019-02-02T03:47:42 < Laurenceb_123> >Sell everything, convert money to gold, dig hole in forest and hide it. Buy her ticket to communist china
2019-02-02T03:47:45 < Laurenceb_123> kekking
2019-02-02T03:48:51 < tjq> lol
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2019-02-02T06:27:06 < jadew> is anyone making any money out of freelance sites or are they a dead end?
2019-02-02T06:27:28 < jadew> I see most projects have peanuts for budget
2019-02-02T06:27:41 < jadew> and the ones with bigger budgets have all of india over them
2019-02-02T06:27:58 < jadew> I need some more income
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2019-02-02T06:41:51 < Cracki> my boss trolls the mikrocontroller.net board for people with the right kind of problem
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2019-02-02T06:42:42 < Cracki> that and he maintains a web shop where he sells his modules (and resale parts that fit the app area)
2019-02-02T06:43:00 < jadew> that's not a bad idea
2019-02-02T06:43:26 < Cracki> anything "international" is bound to be useless for anyone not living in the poorest possible country
2019-02-02T06:43:34 < jadew> I got a bit bummed because of the chinese festival, another delay in one of my projects
2019-02-02T06:43:40 < jadew> it feels like it's never going to end
2019-02-02T06:44:27 < jadew> Cracki, well, EU jobs should be ok, no?
2019-02-02T06:44:34 < jadew> shipping is cheap
2019-02-02T06:45:31 < Cracki> uh. meaning? anyway, I found freecancer and other such sites cater to cheapskates and scammers
2019-02-02T06:45:51 < Cracki> as a customer, to get any useful work out of it, you have to be insanely precise in the contract
2019-02-02T06:45:59 < jadew> yeah, I've been browsing freelancer and upwork and I couldn't find anything with a decent budget
2019-02-02T06:46:13 < jadew> even the big projects are severely underbudgeted
2019-02-02T06:46:40 < Cracki> and as a "seller" you compete with dozens of people who are barely competent and they know how to hustle
2019-02-02T06:47:30 < Cracki> it's like web development. swamped with barely competent arts majors who "learned programming" HTML
2019-02-02T06:47:45 < Cracki> (and bolshevik journos, these days)
2019-02-02T06:48:23 < Cracki> most tasks are so low-skill, transaction costs are higher than actual work put in
2019-02-02T06:49:45 < Cracki> I've accepted some money for random tasks thrown in my general direction... but that was on IRC
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2019-02-02T06:50:37 < PeterM> jsut bid what you think you should, even if it is way over their budget, you might get the job, people get sick of indians bidding on things, fucking up and wasting time and money
2019-02-02T06:51:14 < jadew> PeterM, problem is the jobs are listed with shitty budgets too
2019-02-02T06:51:21 < jadew> as if they're looking for indians
2019-02-02T06:51:34 < Cracki> fuck their budget, dose of cold hard reality
2019-02-02T06:51:42 < PeterM> thats fine, still bid way over their budget
2019-02-02T06:51:44 < Cracki> and list all the holes in their spec ;)
2019-02-02T06:51:56 < jadew> I'll give it a try
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2019-02-02T06:52:44 < Cracki> bid on people who at least look like they would have the money. anything sounding like hobby or "I could have bought that cheaper at amazon!" are a waste of time
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2019-02-02T07:09:48 < Thorn> WWI was a British conspiracy against Germany https://www.corbettreport.com/wwi/
2019-02-02T07:09:57 < englishman> ,kkkkkk.;/'
2019-02-02T07:10:06 < englishman> bad lildongs
2019-02-02T07:10:18 < englishman> chasing the mousepointer
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2019-02-02T07:29:22 < Cracki> all you need to know about ww1 is "Balfour Declaration"
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2019-02-02T08:17:40 < dongs> man, icestick board is really garbage
2019-02-02T08:17:49 < dongs> like, theres nothing useful you can do with it
2019-02-02T08:17:54 < dongs> it has 5 leds
2019-02-02T08:17:55 < dongs> and IR rx/tx
2019-02-02T08:17:58 < dongs> and nothing else
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2019-02-02T08:50:34 < emeb_mac> it's pretty limited
2019-02-02T08:51:24 < ds2> is that the cheap one?
2019-02-02T08:51:34 < dongs> donno it was free for me
2019-02-02T08:51:37 < dongs> i think its around 30-35$
2019-02-02T08:51:43 < emeb_mac> it's not super cheap
2019-02-02T08:51:58 < dongs> i guess if ihad some useful pmod boards..
2019-02-02T08:52:01 < emeb_mac> just a demo board tho - enough to do some simple crap
2019-02-02T08:52:12 < emeb_mac> and yeah - one pmod connector
2019-02-02T08:52:15 < dongs> and they didnt even connected full 8bit paralle fifo bus to FTDI
2019-02-02T08:52:17 < ds2> think the pmod connector there has just barely enough IO for stuff
2019-02-02T08:52:30 < dongs> so you cant use it for any highspeed data stuff either
2019-02-02T08:52:33 < ds2> been meaning to do something with that
2019-02-02T08:52:38 < dongs> just has uart and some random gpio going to it
2019-02-02T08:52:49 < emeb_mac> YEP
2019-02-02T08:52:59 < ds2> wonder if it is big enough to put in a strip down riscv core ;)
2019-02-02T08:53:01 < emeb_mac> just basic demo stuff 
2019-02-02T08:53:10 < emeb_mac> the chip on it is an 8K
2019-02-02T08:53:22 < dongs> 8K? mine says 1K
2019-02-02T08:53:22 < emeb_mac> so you could put a softcore MCU in it
2019-02-02T08:53:32 < emeb_mac> dongs: oh  -
2019-02-02T08:53:38 < ds2> even a cortex-m1?
2019-02-02T08:53:39 < emeb_mac> maybe I'm wrong then
2019-02-02T08:53:54 < dongs> mine says ICE40HX1K
2019-02-02T08:54:01 < emeb_mac> a 1k part is too small for doing much
2019-02-02T08:54:23 < dongs> fucking completely useless then
2019-02-02T08:54:32 < ds2> it is bigger then a 22V10 :D
2019-02-02T08:54:47 < emeb_mac> yep - good enough to demo simple crap, but not enough to really stretch
2019-02-02T08:55:08 < emeb_mac> I was able to build some SDR stuffs into an LP4k
2019-02-02T08:55:17 < emeb_mac> and a UP5k
2019-02-02T08:55:29 < emeb_mac> but wouldn't want to bother with smaller stuffs
2019-02-02T08:55:57 < dongs> anyway this board seems to have no purpose
2019-02-02T08:55:59 < ds2> isn't the smaller stuff good for minor glue logic and levelshifting?
2019-02-02T08:56:05 < emeb_mac> sure
2019-02-02T08:56:09 < emeb_mac> that's about all tho
2019-02-02T08:56:15 < dongs> ds2, yeah, but t his is a 2x2cm 144pin qfp
2019-02-02T08:56:17 < dongs> giant as shit
2019-02-02T08:56:23 < emeb_mac> lots of io
2019-02-02T08:56:27 < emeb_mac> good for routing
2019-02-02T08:56:30 < ds2> dongs: doh
2019-02-02T08:56:31 < dongs> most of the IO on icedick isnt evne used!
2019-02-02T08:56:35 < emeb_mac> not much logic
2019-02-02T08:57:15 < ds2> can it run as fast as the old 74F family?
2019-02-02T08:57:25 < dongs> it says 1600mhz or someshit
2019-02-02T08:57:26 < emeb_mac> faster
2019-02-02T08:57:39 < ds2> but that's inside, right?
2019-02-02T08:57:47 < ds2> isn't it much slower on the IOs
2019-02-02T08:57:50 < emeb_mac> when you do any kind of complex stuff it can run 50-100MHz
2019-02-02T08:57:53 < dongs> Maximum Operating Frequency: 1066 MHz
2019-02-02T08:58:06 < emeb_mac> hah
2019-02-02T08:58:20 < emeb_mac> if you're building a simple ring oscillator maybe
2019-02-02T08:58:33 < emeb_mac> but if you're doing any clocked logic it'll be slower
2019-02-02T08:59:40 < ds2> a giant SPI controlled GPIO expander 
2019-02-02T08:59:46 < emeb_mac> sure
2019-02-02T08:59:50 < Cracki> with a 10-pin header
2019-02-02T09:00:12 < ds2> use the other pins as a RF generator ;)
2019-02-02T09:00:18 < emeb_mac> the UP5k parts have some good DSP and memory
2019-02-02T09:00:18 < Cracki> I was surprised myself that they put such a big fucker on the board, and then almost no breakout
2019-02-02T09:01:19 < ds2> i wonder if it was cheaper to assemble the giant QFP then to deal with the micro big package
2019-02-02T09:01:34 < ds2> assemble as in put on a PCB
2019-02-02T09:02:54 < Cracki> looks like the pins on the long-facing sides go nowhere
2019-02-02T09:03:00 < Cracki> so... at least that can be tapped
2019-02-02T09:03:59 < emeb_mac> heh - if you like bodging wires on by hand
2019-02-02T09:04:24 < Cracki> I don't...
2019-02-02T09:04:47 < Cracki> and the silk screen seems contradictory. the broken out pins have numbers that indicate they come from the long-facing sides...
2019-02-02T09:04:51 < ds2> it isn't that hard once you get used to it
2019-02-02T09:05:25 < Cracki> the fuckers
2019-02-02T09:05:53 < Cracki> I originally bought the thing because everyone and their dog played with it (and that icestorm/yosys/whatever stuff)
2019-02-02T09:06:07 < Cracki> should have gone for one of the proper breakouts
2019-02-02T09:06:41 < emeb_mac> been farting around with yosys/nextpnr recently - getting better
2019-02-02T09:07:34 < emeb_mac> still can't match strict timing that iCEcube can do tho
2019-02-02T09:09:34 < dongs> lols
2019-02-02T09:09:54 < Cracki> the older I get, the more I learn to resist hype... but it's a process
2019-02-02T09:09:58 < dongs> hey emeb_mac why do i get some gnd_GND warning not co nnected shit
2019-02-02T09:10:02 < dongs> in stuff i didnt even write
2019-02-02T09:10:08 < dongs> in icedongs
2019-02-02T09:10:43 < emeb_mac> dongs: beats me - icecube is some weird crap
2019-02-02T09:10:50 < dongs> 	1166052	WARNING - logical net 'GND_net' has no load.
2019-02-02T09:11:00 < dongs> its weird
2019-02-02T09:11:07 < emeb_mac> ya
2019-02-02T09:11:20 < emeb_mac> synthesis tools don't always make sense
2019-02-02T09:11:33 < emeb_mac> if it's just a warning then I wouldn't worry too much
2019-02-02T09:11:46 < dongs> yeah shit works i was just curious why
2019-02-02T09:11:53 < dongs> thre's people bitching about it as far back as like 2002 haha
2019-02-02T09:12:25 < emeb_mac> it's old & dusty
2019-02-02T09:13:00 < dongs> hmm its somethign to do wiht TSALL pin
2019-02-02T09:14:38 < dongs> https://github.com/abraithwaite/STM32/blob/master/src/verilog/eece444_vga_videocard/Top_prim.v
2019-02-02T09:14:42 < dongs> is t his autogenerated shit
2019-02-02T09:14:44 < dongs> or did someone actually wrie this
2019-02-02T09:14:57 < dongs> Verilog netlist produced by program LSE :  version Diamond (64-bit) 2.1.0.103
2019-02-02T09:14:58 < dongs> ah
2019-02-02T09:15:00 < dongs> autogen
2019-02-02T09:15:51 < dongs>  TSALL TSALL_INST (.TSALL(GND_net));
2019-02-02T09:15:55 < emeb_mac> gah
2019-02-02T09:15:57 < dongs> so its caused by latticeshit automatically adding this
2019-02-02T09:15:59 < emeb_mac> ugly coe
2019-02-02T09:16:01 < emeb_mac> code
2019-02-02T09:16:08 < dongs> whatever the fuck that is
2019-02-02T09:16:48 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/3d4Wjkn.png
2019-02-02T09:19:08 < dongs> im just too autistic, i need a green checkmark
2019-02-02T09:19:11 < dongs> instead of irrelevant warning
2019-02-02T09:20:19 < emeb_mac> lol
2019-02-02T09:21:05 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-02T09:21:08 < jpa-> you got only one warning?
2019-02-02T09:21:09 < dongs> so VLO is Logic Low generator
2019-02-02T09:21:11 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-02T09:21:18 < dongs> and it s connected to that TSALL shit
2019-02-02T09:21:22 < dongs> which is also active low
2019-02-02T09:21:23 < jpa-> it's normal for fpga synthesis tools to throw up hundreds of warnings
2019-02-02T09:21:25 < dongs> why the fuck is it bitching
2019-02-02T09:21:34 < dongs> jpa, sure
2019-02-02T09:21:35 < jpa-> that make no sense
2019-02-02T09:21:38 < dongs> but i don't wanna see them
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2019-02-02T10:42:22 < Ultrasauce> >icestick is useless
2019-02-02T10:42:29 < Ultrasauce> thats where you're wrong kiddo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFqWjZudOho
2019-02-02T10:43:10 < dongs> ..
2019-02-02T10:43:12 < dongs> the hell
2019-02-02T10:47:26 < dongs> meh
2019-02-02T10:47:29 < dongs> still useless tho
2019-02-02T10:53:23 < BrainDamage> 16 bucks digital strain gauge
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2019-02-02T11:30:43 < Cracki> ze fuk
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2019-02-02T12:30:44 < dongs> o crap, i can use versa board as programmer
2019-02-02T12:30:51 < dongs> i had to disconnect some jumpers tho
2019-02-02T12:35:52 < dongs> wait waht the nigger fuck
2019-02-02T12:36:01 < con3> :|
2019-02-02T12:36:03 < dongs> this tinyaids shit
2019-02-02T12:36:13 < dongs> actually had some fucking bootloader inside
2019-02-02T12:36:19 < dongs> for the dumb PIC programmer
2019-02-02T12:36:27 < dongs> and now i flashed it with raw jed file and its all aidsed up
2019-02-02T12:36:29 < dongs> what fucking garbage
2019-02-02T12:36:34 < dongs> fucking opensores faggots god damn
2019-02-02T12:37:26 < veverak> ``lol
2019-02-02T12:38:40 < dongs> k recovered it
2019-02-02T12:38:41 < dongs> total aids
2019-02-02T12:39:04 < jpa-> you must be glad that aids is not transmitted by usb connection
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2019-02-02T13:21:06 < Steffanx> That depends on the kind of fetish you have, jpa- 
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2019-02-02T16:46:56 < englishman> hello innovators
2019-02-02T16:47:06 < englishman> did you know that esp32 + arduino ide is better than stm32 in every way
2019-02-02T16:47:55 < englishman> tarduino libs are better documented, more consistent and easier to use than HAL
2019-02-02T16:48:45 < mawk> stop trolling englishman or I'll ban you from this channel
2019-02-02T16:50:27 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o mawk] by ChanServ
2019-02-02T16:54:15 <@mawk> lol
2019-02-02T16:57:26 < kakimir> hello englishman 
2019-02-02T16:57:43 < kakimir> is it cold out there?
2019-02-02T16:57:54 < englishman> hello finnish and french innovators
2019-02-02T16:58:19 < englishman> no it warmed up to -12℃
2019-02-02T16:58:30 < englishman> pretty nice
2019-02-02T16:58:32 < kakimir> !wz EFOU
2019-02-02T16:58:33 < englishbot> [EFOU, Finland] Clear. Temp is -16°C but feels like -25°C. East wind: 17 kph. Humidity: 92%.
2019-02-02T16:58:47 < kakimir> it's warm now
2019-02-02T17:04:03 < kakimir> did canada suffer from the coldwave at all?
2019-02-02T17:04:47 < kakimir> if infrastructure and people are prepaired for cold it doesn't really matter if it gets to -40C
2019-02-02T17:06:35 < Steffanx> Welcome home kakimir 
2019-02-02T17:08:03 < englishman> yeah in winnipeg and other shitholes it was -40 or whatever
2019-02-02T17:08:07 < englishman> like every year
2019-02-02T17:11:36 < Steffanx> Brrr
2019-02-02T17:11:47 < sync> some lad I know in .fi has different cars for different temps
2019-02-02T17:12:03 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-02T17:12:12 < kakimir> that one that starts in -30 is winter car
2019-02-02T17:12:21 < sync> from the mazda that will not start at -10 to the lada that will always start
2019-02-02T17:12:30 < sync> so clapped out bores that it just does not care
2019-02-02T17:12:59 < kakimir> lada carburetor mixture is probably adjusted for -20C average
2019-02-02T17:13:24 < sync> probably
2019-02-02T17:13:39 < sync> if it fails to crank over you just hook it to the welding supply
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2019-02-02T17:20:04 < kakimir> if it's too cold you probably can make fire under the engine and then crank it
2019-02-02T17:21:28 < specing> speaking of esp
2019-02-02T17:21:34 < specing> is there a stm32 with built-in radio?
2019-02-02T17:21:54 < specing> I'd love to make an internet of shits and giggles
2019-02-02T17:22:29 < jpa-> radio for what?
2019-02-02T17:22:42 < jpa-> there is stm32wb but that is kinda non-existent
2019-02-02T17:22:51 < Cracki> that's their portfolio: https://www.st.com/en/wireless-transceivers-mcus-and-modules.html
2019-02-02T17:23:16 < specing> wifi
2019-02-02T17:23:47 < Cracki> stm32wb apparently is general 2.4 ghz...
2019-02-02T17:23:57 < jpa-> "general"
2019-02-02T17:24:06 < Cracki> so might need some more software-side stuff than fixed function 802.11
2019-02-02T17:24:12 < Cracki> https://www.st.com/en/microcontrollers/stm32wb-series.html?querycriteria=productId=SS1961
2019-02-02T17:24:27 < Cracki> "multi protocol"
2019-02-02T17:24:43 < Steffanx> and like jpa- said: "but that is kinda non-existent"
2019-02-02T17:24:57 < Cracki> the "matrix" (row vector) checks many boxes but I didn't notice 802.11
2019-02-02T17:25:10 < specing> guess I'm stuck to laying wires
2019-02-02T17:25:22 < jpa-> multi protocol yeah, but i'm not so sure it would even be capable of 802.11
2019-02-02T17:25:41 < jpa-> specing: are you stuck to stm32?
2019-02-02T17:25:54 < jpa-> there are many wifi socs with cortex-m cpus
2019-02-02T17:25:58 < Cracki> perhaps grab some nordic stuff
2019-02-02T17:26:03 < Steffanx> Whoa, is Cracki the first one that got removed from the ignore list jpa-? :D
2019-02-02T17:26:06 < Cracki> I think they have cortex m with wifi
2019-02-02T17:26:08 < specing> jpa-: no, but I cannot target xtensa that esp is based on
2019-02-02T17:26:41 < jpa-> Steffanx: i cleared the whole ignore list in the beginning of year, h* was the first one that got back on it, c* might follow :P
2019-02-02T17:27:52 < Steffanx> idk who h* is, but yay. :D
2019-02-02T17:28:03 -!- Irssi: ##stm32: Total of 133 nicks [2 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 131 normal]
2019-02-02T17:28:09 < jpa-> Haohmaru
2019-02-02T17:28:17 < jpa-> looks like he's not here now
2019-02-02T17:29:10 < Steffanx> no, h* is his work nick. During nights he's a*.
2019-02-02T17:30:03 < jpa-> i never knew!
2019-02-02T17:31:14 < Steffanx> Anyway, he's weird, but not that bad imho. :P
2019-02-02T17:31:38 < englishman> yeah harmless
2019-02-02T17:31:51 < englishman> and occasional stm32 content
2019-02-02T17:31:54 < Cracki> so... no wifi, but .15.4 and custom stuff. nordic isn't novel, so easy to get
2019-02-02T17:32:01 < jpa-> sure, harmless, just too much useless lines
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2019-02-02T17:32:05 < BrainDamage> I assume I'm a permanent member of the ignore list
2019-02-02T17:32:26 < jpa-> BrainDamage: of course you are, you have brain damage anyway
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2019-02-02T17:33:13 < marble_visions> Cracki: right, so the stm32 security paper describes that if you do a crc32 of your firmware at boot, and they get a hold of that crc32, they reconstruct the firmware 
2019-02-02T17:33:33 < Steffanx> [insert BrainDamage's standard response this to the brain damage comment]
2019-02-02T17:33:33 < Cracki> not just the final crc32. they watch it evolving.
2019-02-02T17:33:44 < Cracki> they're almost singlestepping through the computation that way
2019-02-02T17:33:54 < marble_visions> indeed, they need it after each iteration in order to derive the values for each byte of flash
2019-02-02T17:34:46 < Cracki> or they would have to solve for several bytes
2019-02-02T17:35:18 < Cracki> perhaps crc32 has some crypto properties that make this simpler than brute force
2019-02-02T17:36:09 < Cracki> or... if you're in luck... you get to clock the whole thing externally and can control single cycles
2019-02-02T17:36:31 < marble_visions> oh nice
2019-02-02T17:36:50 < Cracki> maybe they can even use SWD to single-step the core... that shouldn't lock the flash because you aren't touching it.
2019-02-02T17:37:04 < Cracki> paper didn't say and I'm not enough into SWD to know
2019-02-02T17:37:32 < Steffanx> They released the code for all this. Or is this a different paper?
2019-02-02T17:37:47 < marble_visions> Steffanx: https://www.aisec.fraunhofer.de/content/dam/aisec/ResearchExcellence/woot17-paper-obermaier.pdf
2019-02-02T17:38:29 < jpa-> if you can observe CRC32 value after every word, it is trivial to get out the input data
2019-02-02T17:39:25 < jpa-> though flash protection without disabling SWD is just a slowdown anyway, there are plenty of tricks one can do if you can mess with ram contents freely
2019-02-02T17:39:50 < Steffanx> Yes, that's the one is was thinking about, marble_visions
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2019-02-02T17:41:19 < jadew> that's an interesting paper
2019-02-02T17:43:32 < Cracki> aye. I would like to see them dig some more, or investigate some other adjacent product lines
2019-02-02T17:45:59 < Steffanx> Yeah. I wonder if they continued working on this subject. Since it's like 1.5-2 years old, this one.
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2019-02-02T17:49:42 < marble_visions> i'm playing with an L031 nucleo at the moment, the onboard stm32f103 for stlink is flashed with the jlink emulator and i cant read ram contents..
2019-02-02T17:49:51 < marble_visions> from ozone
2019-02-02T17:50:14 < marble_visions> maybe they've fixed reading sram
2019-02-02T17:56:41 < Cracki> it's not really an emulator. their own devices contain some cortex m that just runs their firmware. this jlink OB stuff is firmware ported to whatever controller and board/hookup they decide to target.
2019-02-02T17:57:27 < marble_visions> right
2019-02-02T17:58:09 < Cracki> (of course the high end stuff has more than just some cortex m... catching trace data at their supported speeds... probably not a cortex m for that)
2019-02-02T17:58:29 < Cracki> so... you have trouble reading sram?
2019-02-02T17:58:46 < marble_visions> yes
2019-02-02T17:58:55 < marble_visions> with rdp 1 set
2019-02-02T18:00:51 < Cracki> maybe a difference between F0 and L0
2019-02-02T18:01:06 < Cracki> maybe not... debugging is cortex-m domain
2019-02-02T18:03:08 < Cracki> can you read sram with readout protection disabled?
2019-02-02T18:04:18 < marble_visions> yes
2019-02-02T18:04:25 < zyp> enabled, you mean?
2019-02-02T18:04:27 < marble_visions> i can debug all i want with rdp 0
2019-02-02T18:05:24 < zyp> IIRC there were some parts that had a «firewall», to protect ram against readout
2019-02-02T18:05:33 < zyp> might be you have one of those
2019-02-02T18:05:53 < marble_visions> maybe it's a sdcard readonly-lock type thing where it's not actually unavailable but the jlink respects the rdp 2 and doesn;t show contents
2019-02-02T18:06:04 < marble_visions> not, haven't configured firewall
2019-02-02T18:06:08 < Cracki> so... the conclusion would be that your L0's readout protection actually also protects sram?
2019-02-02T18:06:39 < marble_visions> it seems so, as long as it's not just jlink software respecting the rdp level
2019-02-02T18:06:42 < Cracki> rdp 2 is a totally different beast, no?
2019-02-02T18:06:51 < Cracki> hmm... got an stlink around?
2019-02-02T18:07:02 < zyp> rdp 2 kills the entire debugger interface
2019-02-02T18:07:05 < marble_visions> sorry i meant it's respecting rdp 1, not rdp 2*
2019-02-02T18:07:14 < Cracki> you can reflash your debugger with stlink. that jlink OB stuff will help you with that.
2019-02-02T18:07:26 < marble_visions> will do
2019-02-02T18:07:30 < marble_visions> tomorrow maybe 
2019-02-02T18:07:45 < Cracki> while you're at it, get yourself a standalone stlink off aliexpress. I think they're 1-2 bucks
2019-02-02T18:08:06 < marble_visions> we've got one or two somewhere around here
2019-02-02T18:08:22 < Cracki> I think I saw an stlink-compatible open source firmware for various china-clone boards too
2019-02-02T18:08:34 < Cracki> in case you have a bluepill/blackpill
2019-02-02T18:09:02 < Cracki> I also saw a cmsis-dap compliant firmware project
2019-02-02T18:09:13 < zyp> and there's always blackmagic probe
2019-02-02T18:09:58 < Cracki> right! that supports a bunch of boards too
2019-02-02T18:14:21 < marble_visions> zyp: nice, didn't know about that one
2019-02-02T18:14:52 < zyp> it's been my preferred choice for a long time
2019-02-02T18:15:28 < zyp> no hassle with any pc side software, just connect gdb directly to its usb serial port
2019-02-02T18:22:35 < marble_visions> attaching a debugger to rdp 1 makes the mcu no longer function before flashing it again
2019-02-02T18:22:51 < marble_visions> maybe it triggers a rdp 1 -> rdp 0 which erases the flash?
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2019-02-02T18:24:33 < zyp> no
2019-02-02T18:25:35 < zyp> attaching a debugger in rdp 1 kills the flash interface, and it stays that way until powercycled
2019-02-02T18:25:55 < zyp> (because otherwise you could load a program in sram that would dump the flash, then detach the debugger and have it run)
2019-02-02T18:26:17 < marble_visions> i powercycle and it still does not respond
2019-02-02T18:26:31 < marble_visions> three, four times
2019-02-02T18:26:37 < zyp> hmm, okay
2019-02-02T18:26:43 < zyp> then you might have fucked up something
2019-02-02T18:26:56 < marble_visions> it spills some bytes over uart, that's how i know it's not working
2019-02-02T18:27:01 < kakimir> goal of the weekend: xmc1100 hello world
2019-02-02T18:27:09 < zyp> I've dicked around with rdp 1 devices before without permanently bricking them
2019-02-02T18:27:35 < Steffanx> kakimir: Goal of the evening you mean? 
2019-02-02T18:27:37 < Steffanx> next hour?
2019-02-02T18:27:42 < zyp> hehe
2019-02-02T18:27:50 < marble_visions> haha
2019-02-02T18:27:55 < zyp> I picked up a spare TRÅDFRI remote today
2019-02-02T18:27:58 < marble_visions> i just went full rdp 2
2019-02-02T18:28:03 < zyp> planning to crack it open and mess around with the firmware
2019-02-02T18:28:08 < marble_visions> so rip mcu
2019-02-02T18:28:36 < Steffanx> cool zyp. Messing around with the firmware = write new stuff for it or reverse engineering?
2019-02-02T18:28:46 < zyp> sort of a mix
2019-02-02T18:28:49 < zyp> I guess
2019-02-02T18:29:00 < kakimir> Steffanx: I'm middle of netflix marathon now
2019-02-02T18:29:06 < Steffanx> What series?
2019-02-02T18:29:11 < kakimir> Sex Eduncation
2019-02-02T18:29:14 < Steffanx> haha
2019-02-02T18:29:18 < Steffanx> fool
2019-02-02T18:29:21 < kakimir> *Education
2019-02-02T18:29:22 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-02T18:29:28 < zyp> I figure I wanna start out by dumping eeprom (or wherever it is it stores stuff)
2019-02-02T18:29:49 < zyp> then connect it to the mesh, and dump again
2019-02-02T18:30:00 < zyp> to figure out where it stores the network key (and what the key is)
2019-02-02T18:31:50 < zyp> my goal is to eventually make my own device that can talk to the TRÅDFRI stuff
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2019-02-02T18:32:21 < zyp> but before I get there I need to learn zigbee first, and I figure the best way to do that is to play around with a working system
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2019-02-02T18:52:10 < Cracki> marble_visions, rdp 2 shouldn't be a "RIP". iirc you can still erase the whole chip
2019-02-02T18:52:27 < Cracki> but I can be mistaken
2019-02-02T18:53:22 < marble_visions> Cracki: rdp 1 does that, rdp 2 freezes everything
2019-02-02T18:53:29 < Cracki> so I am... rdp levels figure shows no way out of rdp2...
2019-02-02T18:54:05 < marble_visions> yes
2019-02-02T18:54:22 < marble_visions> but that was intended on my part so all is good
2019-02-02T18:58:46 < zyp> if you decap the chip and shine some light on it, you might be able to downgrade it to rdp 1 again :)
2019-02-02T18:58:53 < marble_visions> :D
2019-02-02T18:59:16 < marble_visions> nah, now i can go back to something more beefy like the stm32l073 nucleo and ada :)
2019-02-02T18:59:28 < zyp> haha, l0, beefy :D
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2019-02-02T19:00:40 < marble_visions> compared to l011, it's like i've landed on the virgin lands of the americas with 192k flash and 20k ram
2019-02-02T19:03:03 < marble_visions> i think st will do great good if the introduce a zero level hal.. no structs, no functions, all init is done in main() with hardcoded 32bit ints that get plugged in the proper registers
2019-02-02T19:03:34 < marble_visions> since ll drivers' init take away 1/4 of flash on l011
2019-02-02T19:14:04 < kakimir> anyone played with xmc1100?
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2019-02-02T19:18:40 < Cracki> marble_visions, look at their LL offering
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2019-02-02T19:37:31 < marble_visions> it's ll i'm talking about
2019-02-02T19:37:34 < marble_visions> Cracki: 
2019-02-02T19:37:52 < Cracki> so... you want LL, or you want something even lower than LL?
2019-02-02T19:38:03 < marble_visions> something lower
2019-02-02T19:38:09 < marble_visions> like, zero level
2019-02-02T19:38:34 < marble_visions> just do GPIOA->REG_BLAH = 0x01234567
2019-02-02T19:38:40 < Cracki> huh. I haven't touched LL much. perhaps some current "port" of stdperiph?
2019-02-02T19:39:01 < marble_visions> don't know
2019-02-02T19:39:04 < marble_visions> will check it out
2019-02-02T19:39:12 < Cracki> just to state the obvious... ST has "hal" and "ll"
2019-02-02T19:39:19 < Cracki> (these days)
2019-02-02T19:39:24 < marble_visions> indeed
2019-02-02T19:39:31 < Cracki> stdperiph is something old they don't support anymore
2019-02-02T19:39:55 < marble_visions> yes
2019-02-02T19:40:04 < marble_visions> i've used stdperiph for a while
2019-02-02T19:40:32 < marble_visions> ll is great, all other things considered
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2019-02-02T20:24:54 < Thorn> cats https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rkyPYXiriQ
2019-02-02T20:25:22 < emeb> There's no reason they couldn't make an option in cubemx that pre-computes most registers and generates direct load code.
2019-02-02T20:25:57 < emeb> of course maintaining code like that is... fun.
2019-02-02T20:31:52 < Cracki> hmmm I think that wouldn't be too difficult even as a source processing step
2019-02-02T20:32:02 < emeb> true
2019-02-02T20:32:15 < Cracki> resolve all the macros/defines/..., collect memory updates
2019-02-02T20:32:36 < Cracki> but! sequence of updates sometimes matters
2019-02-02T20:32:54 < emeb> yeah - can't mess with order
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2019-02-02T20:34:07 < Cracki> love those lynxes
2019-02-02T20:35:20 < emeb> they're quite playful
2019-02-02T20:35:55 < emeb> bet it's a lot of work taking care of them, lots of meat to keep those big cats fed.
2019-02-02T20:37:49 < emeb> vicious cat drags prey to secluded spot to tear it apart -> http://cephalopodgal.tumblr.com/post/132990273360/krisstraub-uglyfun-this-encounter-seems-very
2019-02-02T20:38:51 < kakimir> have you ever wrotten code for programming some mcu via serial?
2019-02-02T20:40:54 < emeb> what do you mean? like over the serial bootloader?
2019-02-02T20:41:05 < qyx> Thorn: are those bobcats yours?
2019-02-02T20:42:07 < Thorn> everything on youtube is mine
2019-02-02T20:42:08 < Thorn> including all the test equipment in the Dave Jones lab
2019-02-02T20:42:16 < Cracki> that would be nice
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2019-02-02T20:48:10 < Cracki> stm32cube... I click one innocent button and now it's downloading ALL THE datasheets for everything that ever was
2019-02-02T20:48:28 < Cracki> I don't remember it being that crazy... must be new in 5.x
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2019-02-02T20:51:31 < emeb> 5.x is awful
2019-02-02T20:51:45 < emeb> the GUI is completely different and sucks
2019-02-02T20:53:28 < Steffanx> Custom UI elements is great. You dont get it, emeb 
2019-02-02T20:54:14 < emeb> You kids get off my lawn
2019-02-02T20:55:07 < Cracki> you have been expropriated without compensation. this is state lawn now.
2019-02-02T20:56:43 < emeb> fscking eminent domain
2019-02-02T20:59:16 < Cracki> nah I think that has provisions for proper compensation... at least while your people are the majority
2019-02-02T21:00:55 < emeb> depends
2019-02-02T21:01:00 < emeb> "proper"
2019-02-02T21:01:17 < emeb> "I have altered the deal. Pray I do not alter it again."
2019-02-02T21:07:32 < Thorn> https://www.instagram.com/p/BsBRb-HgPxQ/
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2019-02-02T21:10:58 < scrts> anyone heard of https://www.nacsemi.com/?
2019-02-02T21:11:09 < jpa-> hm, these EFM32 peripherals have some nice ideas; e.g. ADC has hardware support for oversampling
2019-02-02T21:12:59 < englishman> nice cat link emeb
2019-02-02T21:13:01 < englishman> thanks
2019-02-02T21:16:03  * scrts feels lazy
2019-02-02T21:16:15 < scrts> gents, anyone have KSZ9031RNX footprint for altium?
2019-02-02T21:20:33 < qyx> jpa-: L4 too, I did try recentyl
2019-02-02T21:21:21 < Steffanx> doesnt the l0+ or something have it as well?
2019-02-02T21:23:48 < qyx> maybe yes maybe no
2019-02-02T21:23:55 < Steffanx> I hope jpa- does not use that crappy IDE
2019-02-02T21:23:57 < Steffanx> for it
2019-02-02T21:24:19 < jpa-> you mean simplicity? nope :)
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2019-02-02T21:26:14 < Steffanx> Yes simplicity studio.
2019-02-02T21:27:59 < jpa-> i made my own makefile, the actual sdk is somewhat ok
2019-02-02T21:28:07 < jpa-> not as bad as cube, that is
2019-02-02T21:28:27 < jpa-> but crappy license that forbids redistribution
2019-02-02T21:28:28 < qyx> a reference is important when doing comparisons
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2019-02-02T22:52:41 < tjq> the laurence
2019-02-02T22:53:47 < kakimir> laurencer
2019-02-02T23:04:42 < Steffanx> Welcome kakimir. Hows the day
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2019-02-02T23:18:17 < tjq> hi sir
2019-02-02T23:19:30 < kakimir> Steffanx: boring
2019-02-02T23:19:45 < Steffanx> Netflix and beer?
2019-02-02T23:19:48 < tjq> is he on?
2019-02-02T23:20:12 < Steffanx> "he"
2019-02-02T23:20:29 < specing> laurence of miserabia
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2019-02-02T23:23:15 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/ZpbNw.jpg
2019-02-02T23:23:20 < zyp> my switch is getting crowded
2019-02-02T23:24:13 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2019-02-02T23:24:18 < tjq> welcome
2019-02-02T23:24:40 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-02T23:26:31 < Steffanx> zyp, finally a reason to get a new one right?
2019-02-02T23:26:40 < zyp> eventually
2019-02-02T23:26:53 < zyp> not at the top of the list :p
2019-02-02T23:27:39 < englishman> zyp, when your network cabinet fills up, do you need to get a new house?
2019-02-02T23:28:15 < zyp> nah, I get more racks
2019-02-02T23:28:45 < zyp> I already got one in the outdoor storage than I'm gonna put up on the wall there
2019-02-02T23:29:06 < zyp> one of my pals were getting rid of it and said I could just take it, so I did
2019-02-02T23:29:56 < zyp> and I'm planning a wheeled one for the server under the stairs
2019-02-02T23:34:47 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-02T23:35:46 < aandrew> zyp: I bought 2x 2970g and a 3560poe for like $150 on ebay
2019-02-02T23:35:55 < aandrew> I have more ports than I have forseeable use for
2019-02-02T23:36:02 < aandrew> and 48 of them are POE
2019-02-02T23:38:09 < zyp> don't we all? :p
2019-02-02T23:38:24 < englishman> https://youtu.be/j-ZWHGSvY9Y?t=2796
2019-02-02T23:38:26 < englishman> lold irl
2019-02-02T23:39:12 < zyp> haha
2019-02-02T23:39:50 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-02T23:40:07 < zyp> I actually don't have any poe switches yet, just the router in the pic
2019-02-02T23:40:28 < zyp> but I have a bunch of other shit
2019-02-02T23:40:42 < zyp> including way too many SFP ports
2019-02-02T23:41:59 < aandrew> zyp: yeah both of them have 4xSFP
2019-02-02T23:42:25 < aandrew> not sure what's so funny about that link
2019-02-02T23:42:32 < zyp> oh, I'm talking about shit like 24xSFP
2019-02-02T23:42:57 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/nmouc.JPG <- this switch cluster has 24+12 and eight XFPs
2019-02-02T23:43:04 < aandrew> heh no I don't have that many
2019-02-02T23:43:21 < zyp> and I've got another smaller switch that also has 24xSFP (of which 8 are combo with copper)
2019-02-02T23:43:22 < aandrew> the idea was to run 2x1G fiber to the garage
2019-02-02T23:43:51 < englishman> aandrew: sony used repeating 0xAA as their aes key
2019-02-02T23:43:57 < aandrew> so 2G between garage and basement, and then 1G between 2970g and 3560
2019-02-02T23:44:02 < aandrew> englishman: ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
2019-02-02T23:44:06 < aandrew> now that IS funny
2019-02-02T23:44:09 < englishman> muchly
2019-02-02T23:44:10 < tjq> englishman: l0de
2019-02-02T23:44:24 < zyp> aandrew, link aggregation is not all that useful
2019-02-02T23:44:30 < aandrew> zyp: probably not
2019-02-02T23:44:39 < aandrew> I was putting the fiber in for future
2019-02-02T23:44:58 < aandrew> I also have some 40gb infinibong for experimenting with esxi<-->linux nas
2019-02-02T23:45:07 < zyp> switches typically hash the headers so packets belonging to the same connection always take the same path of an aggregated link
2019-02-02T23:45:28 < zyp> hehe
2019-02-02T23:45:33 < aandrew> zyp: my brohter's a CCIE or CCNE or whatever toplevel cico is I can never eremember
2019-02-02T23:45:38 < aandrew> I'll ask him to config it, heh
2019-02-02T23:46:01 < zyp> I don't have any 40g yet, but I've been running 10gbe for some years now
2019-02-02T23:49:08 < englishman> are you all moved in then
2019-02-02T23:50:59 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-02T23:51:08 < zyp> returned the keys for the apartment the other day
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2019-02-02T23:58:02 < aandrew> hm PCLK2=108MHz, ADCCLK is PCLK2/4
2019-02-02T23:58:46 < aandrew> so 108/4 is 27MHz, 15 cycles to do a 12b conversion is 1.8Msps
--- Day changed Sun Feb 03 2019
2019-02-03T00:02:16 < englishman> cool, congrats
2019-02-03T00:03:31 < zyp> place is still a mess, got too much stuff everywhere and not enough stuff to organize it yet :p
2019-02-03T00:03:52 < zyp> but it's improving gradually
2019-02-03T00:12:26 < tjq> any capacitors
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2019-02-03T00:16:22 < tjq> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bias_against_left-handed_people
2019-02-03T00:16:24 < tjq> let
2019-02-03T00:16:29 < tjq> let's start a war
2019-02-03T00:29:19 < bitmask> oh boy, getting a tax refund even though I didnt work, time to get my car in order and myself presentable so I can get a jobby job
2019-02-03T00:31:20 < Steffanx> lol
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2019-02-03T00:48:09 < tjq> quarter wavelength niggers
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2019-02-03T01:24:22 < Laurenceb_123> https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=45824.840
2019-02-03T01:24:26 < Laurenceb_123> >thread 11
2019-02-03T01:26:16 < Laurenceb_123> https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=46557.0
2019-02-03T01:26:20 < Laurenceb_123> the absolute state
2019-02-03T01:27:40 < Laurenceb_123> https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/660/cpsprodpb/7BCA/production/_99609613_8e5e3cfe-4bfe-407a-85d8-4f9526cb0670.jpg
2019-02-03T01:27:48 < Laurenceb_123> ^should say emdrive not nhs
2019-02-03T01:52:14 < aandrew> lol
2019-02-03T01:53:29 < Laurenceb_123> meanwhile in usa: Mexico will pay for the emdrive
2019-02-03T02:04:27 < Laurenceb_123> 999 what is ur emergency? https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192304.jpg
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2019-02-03T02:37:10 < Laurenceb_123> https://poleaboo.wordpress.com/university-correspondence/
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2019-02-03T06:46:41 < dongs> fucksticks who only fucking put retarded eagle files on shithub
2019-02-03T06:46:44 < dongs> and not evne pdf of schematic
2019-02-03T06:48:26 < dongs> i guess eagle is now called AUTODESK EAGLE PREMIUM 
2019-02-03T06:52:36 < Thorn> found a math channel with no views. everyone subscribe now https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBxkPz_ZPG84LpEKVa8Hq8g/videos
2019-02-03T06:53:56 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2019-02-03T06:54:14 < dongs> downlaoded eagle portable
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2019-02-03T06:54:16 < dongs> doesnt start.
2019-02-03T06:54:16 < dongs> great
2019-02-03T06:54:28 < dongs> time to fire up vm
2019-02-03T06:54:42 < Thorn> <dongs>	time to fire up vim
2019-02-03T06:54:53 < dongs> ya you wish it was taht
2019-02-03T06:55:46 < dongs> wow it runs in vm
2019-02-03T06:55:47 < dongs> what the shit
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2019-02-03T07:07:10 < dongs> nice, so this particleshit FT2232 breakout has all the pins on headers that I can use for a sync fifo mode
2019-02-03T07:07:44 < dongs> anyone still using AUTODESK EAGLE?
2019-02-03T07:09:28 < aandrew> nope
2019-02-03T07:10:05 < dongs> looks like they missed the maker boat 
2019-02-03T07:10:17 < dongs> all new IoT MAKE:Rs are using kikecad
2019-02-03T07:10:52 < dongs> thankfuck its still free
2019-02-03T07:11:06 < dongs> Kholat is now registered to your account on Steam.
2019-02-03T07:11:07 < dongs> To access your new content, simply launch this product from your Library on Steam.
2019-02-03T07:11:27 < dongs> https://store.steampowered.com/app/343710/Kholat/ free useless steam shit if anyone's collecting
2019-02-03T07:24:37 < scrts> sup dongs?
2019-02-03T07:26:54 < dongs> not much
2019-02-03T07:26:54 < dongs> blogging
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2019-02-03T07:36:14 < dongs> looks like the particle programmer i got from mouser will have enough pins to implement sync fifo
2019-02-03T07:36:17 < dongs> on FT232H
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2019-02-03T07:37:15 < englishman> autodesk killed my best friend
2019-02-03T07:37:23 < dongs> how
2019-02-03T07:37:35 < dongs> did he become a lunix user
2019-02-03T07:37:37 < englishman> cut the brake line on his motorcycle
2019-02-03T07:38:01 < englishman> no he was a windows bro
2019-02-03T07:38:13 < dongs> how was autodesk incolved
2019-02-03T07:38:18 < englishman> got a job at autodesk
2019-02-03T07:38:20 < englishman> 6 months later
2019-02-03T07:38:21 < englishman> dead
2019-02-03T07:38:24 < dongs> oh. 
2019-02-03T07:38:42 < englishman> eagle kills
2019-02-03T07:40:08 < englishman> An error was encountered while processing your request:
2019-02-03T07:40:08 < englishman> The link you followed does not appear to be a valid URL.
2019-02-03T07:40:13 < englishman> typical steam experience
2019-02-03T07:40:20 < dongs> yeah i donno why
2019-02-03T07:40:22 < dongs> i had to login
2019-02-03T07:40:27 < dongs> then go back and click add
2019-02-03T07:40:33 < dongs> it did same shit for me with fail url
2019-02-03T07:41:06 < englishman> fat gabe is fat
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2019-02-03T08:59:37 < dongs> allegro pcb is orcad shit right?
2019-02-03T09:00:50 < dongs> https://www.orcad.com/resources/library/orcad-172-2016-release-overview
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2019-02-03T10:05:55 < dongs> https://www.snapeda.com/questions/question/may-i-work-for-your-snapeda/
2019-02-03T10:06:33 < dongs> also fuck digijew linking to snapeda shit
2019-02-03T10:07:14 < dongs> where tehfuck can i get 3d model for the generic ethernet transformer thingy
2019-02-03T10:07:24 < dongs> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/pulse-electronics-network/H1102NLT/553-1532-1-ND/4162622
2019-02-03T10:07:27 < dongs> like this shit
2019-02-03T10:07:36 < dongs> i suppose i can just let altidumb make it
2019-02-03T10:07:40 < dongs> using a super tall sop 
2019-02-03T10:11:38 < dongs> hmm shitty
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2019-02-03T10:24:45 < dongs> cadence sigrity more like nigrity
2019-02-03T10:25:20 < dongs> https://www.cadence.com/content/cadence-www/global/en_US/home/tools/ic-package-design-and-analysis/si-pi-analysis-integrated-solution/allegro-sigrity-si.html
2019-02-03T10:25:23 < dongs> man so much garbage
2019-02-03T10:25:31 < dongs> each fucking orcad tool is a new entry in start menu
2019-02-03T10:25:36 < dongs> wait, no im lying
2019-02-03T10:25:39 < dongs> 10 entries in start menu
2019-02-03T10:25:41 < dongs> for each tool
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2019-02-03T11:59:01 < jpa-> dongs: you should just start everything from command line, no need to look in start menu
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2019-02-03T12:49:35 < Steffanx> Like this win10 start menu is useful. Its fucking awful. 
2019-02-03T12:50:17 < Steffanx> WinXP start menu, especially the application menu was best.
2019-02-03T13:24:10 < dongs> jpa-: i usually do
2019-02-03T13:24:15 < dongs> Steffanx: what the fuck are you talking about
2019-02-03T13:24:27 < dongs> win+type someshit = way better than navigating retarded XP hierarchical menu
2019-02-03T13:24:44 < Steffanx> Yes, that part is goos. But the list is useless
2019-02-03T13:24:52 < Steffanx> Good*
2019-02-03T13:25:10 < dongs> i never used the list
2019-02-03T13:25:21 < Steffanx> And sometimes apps have stupid names and the. The search is useless.
2019-02-03T13:25:29 < Steffanx> In that case
2019-02-03T13:25:51 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyV4hdsWsAErfmQ.jpg:orig
2019-02-03T13:27:11 < dongs> hmmm
2019-02-03T13:27:16 < dongs> looks like china fucked up this fpc assembly
2019-02-03T13:27:20 < dongs> and its not my fault
2019-02-03T13:27:40 < dongs> i used 3mil spacing/5mil traces
2019-02-03T13:27:52 < dongs> and 0.15/0.35 vias
2019-02-03T13:27:58 < dongs> some cables are just shorted together
2019-02-03T13:28:03 < dongs> others dont wrok
2019-02-03T13:28:17 < dongs> so either short somewhere or bad connection
2019-02-03T13:29:01 < Cracki> 3 mil spacing... for what price
2019-02-03T13:29:15 < dongs> i donno it was like few bucks
2019-02-03T13:29:19 < dongs> fpc is cheap as hell
2019-02-03T13:29:20 < dongs> for some reason
2019-02-03T13:29:30 < dongs> it included mounting a 0.4mm pitch socket on there too
2019-02-03T13:29:32 < Cracki> maybe they thought 30 mil
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2019-02-03T13:30:49 < dongs> donno they LOOK allright
2019-02-03T13:30:56 < dongs> maybe the .4mm footprint is shitty
2019-02-03T13:31:01 < dongs> i see some of them dont look straight
2019-02-03T13:31:28 < Cracki> uh.. error in footprint??
2019-02-03T13:32:01 < dongs> well, i used same one on PCB and it worked
2019-02-03T13:32:08 < dongs> but maybe it needs different rules for fpc
2019-02-03T13:33:18 < Cracki> or they just fucked it up
2019-02-03T13:33:26 < Cracki> who knows how they image that stuff
2019-02-03T13:40:47 < dongs> hmmm
2019-02-03T13:40:59 < dongs> PCB library footprint in altidumb has like no documentation fields
2019-02-03T13:41:03 < dongs> what the hell
2019-02-03T13:41:08 < dongs> only deesciprtion and name
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2019-02-03T13:41:16 < dongs> but schematic lets you add million useless fucking things
2019-02-03T13:42:22 < specing> dongs: use Kicad
2019-02-03T13:43:05 < dongs> yea ok
2019-02-03T13:43:29  * antto gives specing an umbrella
2019-02-03T13:45:31  * specing opens said umbrella and points it at dongs
2019-02-03T13:46:39 < antto> now you're protected from his allergic reaction
2019-02-03T13:47:05 < specing> thanks
2019-02-03T13:47:16 < antto> ur welcome
2019-02-03T14:05:26 < Steffanx> When you troll you dont get to use a protective umbrella..
2019-02-03T14:05:55 < specing> I wasn't trolling Steffanx 
2019-02-03T14:06:11 < specing> Kicad is much better
2019-02-03T14:07:18 < dongs> yea thats why so many pro places use kikecad
2019-02-03T14:07:41 < Steffanx> did you ever use altium specing
2019-02-03T14:07:52 < specing> Steffanx: no
2019-02-03T14:10:07 < antto> tbh, i don't wanna teach dongs how to kicad, so maybe it's better if he keeps altidumbing
2019-02-03T14:13:11 < antto> dongs did you write some user feedback to the altidumb authors?
2019-02-03T14:13:24 < antto> maybe they'll listen and fix it in the next version ;P~
2019-02-03T14:13:27 < dongs> are y ou referring to that screenshot
2019-02-03T14:13:48 < antto> i haven't seen a screenshot, i meant.. in general
2019-02-03T14:14:32 < antto> but.. akchually.. it's none of my biddness
2019-02-03T14:14:39 < Cracki> I hear constant complaints about altium. how come they can afford to be so bad?
2019-02-03T14:15:23 < veverak> Cracki: complaining of people does not mean something is bad
2019-02-03T14:15:31 < veverak> some people just like to complain :)
2019-02-03T14:15:32 < Cracki> it correlates
2019-02-03T14:15:55 < veverak> it can, but I would not expect it everytime
2019-02-03T14:16:05 < Cracki> I see your dismissal, but no argument
2019-02-03T14:16:42 < Cracki> if you're content with it, you aren't who I'm asking.
2019-02-03T14:21:01 < Steffanx> Complaints = bad? It could also mean it could be better. 
2019-02-03T14:21:10 < Steffanx> Lacks some features someone "needs"
2019-02-03T14:24:39 < antto> maybe after some years, autodesk is gonna buy it and fix it ;P~
2019-02-03T14:24:45  * antto runs
2019-02-03T14:25:26 < Steffanx> And then others will complain because ... "insert reason"
2019-02-03T14:27:07 < Steffanx> You'd almost think people like to complain
2019-02-03T14:29:58 < Cracki> I find it more likely that they'll overhaul eagle to get on par with the ease of interaction of their other products
2019-02-03T14:57:11 < antto> pimp my EDA with xzibbit
2019-02-03T14:57:35 < dongs> well cracki
2019-02-03T14:57:41 < dongs> i just downloaded eagle 9.9 or wahtever teh fuck
2019-02-03T14:57:49 < dongs> and it was jsut as retarded as eagle 5.x that i last tried to use
2019-02-03T14:57:54 < dongs> so i wouldnt hold my breath there
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2019-02-03T14:59:49 < Cracki> I thought so. they did some things but it's still eagle.
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2019-02-03T15:17:20 < dongs> welp, i deniggered the footprint a bit
2019-02-03T15:17:29 < dongs> time to try it again after china reopens
2019-02-03T15:18:13 < antto> you bleached the footprint?
2019-02-03T15:19:26 < Cracki> bleach it like hillary
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2019-02-03T17:21:50 < Laurenceb_123> https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192499.jpg
2019-02-03T17:21:54 < Laurenceb_123> orbital sides
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2019-02-03T17:23:15 <@mawk> lol
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2019-02-03T17:33:13 < Laurenceb_123> https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192502.png
2019-02-03T17:33:23 < Cracki> looks like german cigarette packs
2019-02-03T17:39:21 < Laurenceb_123> sargon of shortlad
2019-02-03T17:41:28 < Steffanx> Haha, they planted some new plants on the other side of the road. Kids came and pulled it all out. :D
2019-02-03T17:41:59 < Steffanx> Was it you Laurenceb_123?
2019-02-03T17:42:38 < Laurenceb_123> probably
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2019-02-03T18:31:05 < Cracki> eagle 9 wants autodesk login. cancer!
2019-02-03T18:35:49 < qyx> all free eagles from autodesk
2019-02-03T18:36:07 < qyx> 7.7 or so was the last which works without it
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2019-02-03T18:39:01 < Laurenceb_123> eagle is cancer
2019-02-03T18:39:20 < Laurenceb_123> tiem to use gnu shit
2019-02-03T18:39:21 < Laurenceb_123> https://ust.chatango.com/um/b/l/blackbird9/img/l_2016.jpg
2019-02-03T18:47:40 < Cracki> never gonna use kicad
2019-02-03T18:48:36 < Cracki> I have eagle 7.7 installed since I looked into what the last forever-free version was... trying 9.x right now... I do appreciate these panels they added
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2019-02-03T20:00:52 < Laurenceb_123> the globalists!!!!
2019-02-03T20:11:55 < Cracki> one might say... termites
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2019-02-03T20:20:03 < bitmask> https://youtu.be/wxL4ElboiuA
2019-02-03T20:20:03 < bitmask> fun watch
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2019-02-03T20:23:47 < Cracki> nice
2019-02-03T20:52:51 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-6662543/Martina-Big-identifies-black-reveals-plans-permanently-Africa.html
2019-02-03T20:53:23 < Laurenceb_123> the memes
2019-02-03T20:54:41 < bitmask> are vacuum tube amplifiers better in some ways or do people just like em because they look cool and have a sense of nostalgia 
2019-02-03T20:57:14 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.flickr.com/photos/mrnickyp/159936289 memetic
2019-02-03T20:58:35 < Cracki> bitmask, people talk about "warmth" too, so I guess their nonlinearity is valued
2019-02-03T20:58:47 < bitmask> ahh
2019-02-03T20:59:37 < Cracki> or... their *superior* linearity. what do I know :P https://www.effectrode.com/knowledge-base/vacuum-tubes-and-transistors-compared/
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2019-02-03T21:02:51 < Ultrasauce> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjK5d0_Yd8Y
2019-02-03T21:06:01 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
2019-02-03T21:07:50 < Thorn> what linearity, they don't even have feedback most of the time afaik
2019-02-03T21:14:05 < englishman> that's terrible Steffanx
2019-02-03T21:14:27 < englishman> the penalty for vandalism should be death
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2019-02-03T21:28:04 < Steffanx> Its a kid playzone. I knew this was going to happen, englishman 
2019-02-03T21:32:34 < qyx> are they playing gardeners or what
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2019-02-03T21:33:51 < karlp> how the fuck is one meant to save a project in kicad as a new project to make a variation of it?
2019-02-03T21:56:59 < Steffanx> They are playing vandalism, qyx
2019-02-03T21:59:45 < Laurenceb_123> Overconfident Woman CHALLENGES Jordan Peterson's Intelligence
2019-02-03T22:11:32 < Cracki> he's a trotskyist; she wins.
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2019-02-03T22:13:25 < bitmask> hmm these liitokala batteries seem to have pretty good reviews
2019-02-03T22:17:52 < qyx> liitokala?
2019-02-03T22:18:22 < qyx> sounds northish
2019-02-03T22:20:01 < qyx> *nordish maybe
2019-02-03T22:24:38 < scrts> pulling 0.3A from LM117 LDO Vin=3.3V / Vout=1.25V with SOT223 packaging is really bad idea?
2019-02-03T22:25:23 < scrts> oops, LM317
2019-02-03T22:25:45 < specing> bitmask: they are good repacks of some others
2019-02-03T22:26:02 < specing> they have rated capacity but not rated current
2019-02-03T22:27:02 < bitmask> yea that would be good for me, I dont need high current
2019-02-03T22:27:25 < bitmask> and they are real cheap
2019-02-03T22:28:19 < bitmask> meh, on the other hand do I want to risk putting cheap cells on my body
2019-02-03T22:29:06 < qyx> where are you buying them?
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2019-02-03T22:38:34 < jadew> karlp, you copy the current one
2019-02-03T22:38:42 < jadew> and name project_old
2019-02-03T22:38:44 < jadew> then you save
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2019-02-03T23:13:10 < Laurenceb_123> ##stm32 irl https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192653.jpg
2019-02-03T23:16:05 < Steffanx> Except for being on the street and the yankeeflag.. i cant deny that Laurenceb_123 :P
2019-02-03T23:16:46 < scrts> meanwhile in russia
2019-02-03T23:16:47 < scrts> https://9gag.com/gag/az92v8N
2019-02-03T23:18:17 < Laurenceb_123> >9gag
2019-02-03T23:18:25 < Laurenceb_123> Russian grrl has a 9gag tshirt
2019-02-03T23:19:37 < Steffanx> did you date her yet Laurenceb_123?
2019-02-03T23:19:38 < kakimir> you still share your basement with commrade?
2019-02-03T23:21:39 < Laurenceb_123> yes
2019-02-03T23:23:30 < Laurenceb_123> Steffanx: she claims to have a boyfriend, but I stole her phone and its full of cat photos
2019-02-03T23:23:37 < Laurenceb_123> no boyfriend visible
2019-02-03T23:24:38 < Laurenceb_123> she has over 9000 cats
2019-02-03T23:26:28 < kakimir> how strong the cat pee is?
2019-02-03T23:27:24 < Laurenceb_123> I think she wants some britbong chad guy to be her boyfriend, but he doesnt seem keen, prob cuz of her autism level
2019-02-03T23:27:39 < Laurenceb_123> kakimir: dunno I've never been to her house
2019-02-03T23:28:04 < kakimir> she moved out of your basement?
2019-02-03T23:28:38 < Laurenceb_123> thats where she works
2019-02-03T23:28:47 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-03T23:28:55 < kakimir> keeps office there?
2019-02-03T23:29:28 < Laurenceb_123>  "my" basement == the basement office where we work
2019-02-03T23:29:32 < Laurenceb_123>  > being this new
2019-02-03T23:29:46 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-03T23:30:10  * antto playz: Basement Jaxx - Red Alert
2019-02-03T23:30:58 < kakimir> basements are the best
2019-02-03T23:31:00 < Laurenceb_123> its very lulzy when she texts chad guy and he turns up looking grumpy, and doesnt want to talk to her, offers to drive her to the shops
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2019-02-03T23:32:14 < Laurenceb_123> havent seen him for a week, he probably blocked her number lol
2019-02-03T23:35:35 < qyx> you have a chance now
2019-02-03T23:36:39 < antto> get some russian flesh, tigerrr
2019-02-03T23:39:54 < Laurenceb_123> I found some lulzy whatsapp messages to her sister - she wants a britbong chad to get her pregnant for anchor baby
2019-02-03T23:40:19 < Laurenceb_123> moar liek autist babby
2019-02-03T23:40:39 < antto> well, it sounds like a plan
2019-02-03T23:40:46 < kakimir> anchor babby?
2019-02-03T23:41:15 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-03T23:41:16 < Laurenceb_123> how do you like my blog? https://poleaboo.wordpress.com/about/
2019-02-03T23:42:26 < kakimir> paki laurencer
2019-02-03T23:42:37 < Laurenceb_123> ikr
2019-02-03T23:43:21 < BrainDamage> imagine if laurenceb was being able to channel even just 1/3 of the effort he puts in digging up shit web link into actual positive efforts
2019-02-03T23:44:07 < kakimir> are you seriously paki laurencer?
2019-02-03T23:44:38 < BrainDamage> kakimir: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S7KujrsUB1w#t=4884
2019-02-03T23:44:42 < Steffanx> kakimir is  that a serious question?
2019-02-03T23:45:04 < Steffanx> Aaah, balloon tie, there it is.
2019-02-03T23:45:24 < Laurenceb_123> only 1/8th Syrian
2019-02-03T23:46:16 < Laurenceb_123> that site makes me sad tbh, I thought it was a truly epic troll, but then realised it was a real person being unironic
2019-02-03T23:46:46 < Steffanx> When will your next presentation/talk Laurenceb_123?
2019-02-03T23:47:02 < Laurenceb_123> when I do useful stuff
2019-02-03T23:47:06 < Steffanx> You should work on your question answer skills. Like repeat the question so the question gets recorded as well.
2019-02-03T23:47:17 < Laurenceb_123> so never if I keep associating with Russian grrl
2019-02-03T23:47:21 < Laurenceb_123> ok
2019-02-03T23:47:29 < Steffanx> yw
2019-02-03T23:49:03 < qyx> does she distract you?
2019-02-03T23:49:34 < Steffanx> We've never seen the girl yet, so .. does she even exist outside the basement?
2019-02-03T23:50:01 < Laurenceb_123> qyx: no my jerb is shit and I have to work with autistic tards like her
2019-02-03T23:50:32 < qyx> says an autist
2019-02-03T23:51:32 < qyx> but right, 9000 cat pictures is too much
2019-02-03T23:51:36 < qyx> many even
2019-02-03T23:52:28 < Laurenceb_123> she has dressed her cat in a tie like Julian Assange
--- Day changed Mon Feb 04 2019
2019-02-04T00:00:28 < Steffanx> You should join stm32 telegram Laurenceb_123. To enjoy the cats. :p
2019-02-04T00:16:54 < Laurenceb_123> kek wtf https://mobile.twitter.com/GID_UKIRE/status/1092097991744335875
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2019-02-04T00:35:02 < tjq> Laurenceb / Laurenceb_123  are you in it
2019-02-04T00:35:25 < Laurenceb_123> no I'm not that autistic
2019-02-04T00:35:29 < tjq> cool
2019-02-04T00:37:18 < tjq> can you assist it
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2019-02-04T05:14:24 < dongs> nice, the FTDI jtagger thingy works wiht lattice diamond
2019-02-04T05:14:32 < dongs> didnt even need to change any FTDI device IDs
2019-02-04T05:14:36 < dongs> lookin at you, aandrew and quartus lol
2019-02-04T05:14:44 < dongs> they just straight up use FTDI jtag mode without any special hax
2019-02-04T05:23:19 < aandrew> dongs: yeah lattice doesn't try to fuck you that way 
2019-02-04T05:23:29 < scrts> are you using ice40 fpga?
2019-02-04T05:23:39 < scrts> the software is terrible there..
2019-02-04T05:23:50 < scrts> if you want to use hard i2c core - you need one package
2019-02-04T05:23:58 < scrts> if you want reveal - you have to use another
2019-02-04T05:24:00 < aandrew> altera had their own shiz using some CPLD and a micro, then changed to cypress and a CPLD, then Arrow used FTDI and that's what broke it open
2019-02-04T05:24:05 < scrts> and project files are not compatible inbetween
2019-02-04T05:24:07 < aandrew> ice40 software is awful
2019-02-04T05:24:16 < aandrew> and no, you don't use the I2C or SPI hard IP on ICE40, it's just shit
2019-02-04T05:24:30 < aandrew> I wrote my own little SPI core
2019-02-04T05:24:36 < scrts> I needed I2C
2019-02-04T05:24:42 < aandrew> you poor bastard
2019-02-04T05:24:50 < scrts> but didn't work it till the end... project died
2019-02-04T05:24:52 < aandrew> actually i2c wasn't that bad but still
2019-02-04T05:31:02 < aandrew> wtf is this bullshit
2019-02-04T05:31:13 < aandrew> nrf52 has the ability to do back-to-back receive
2019-02-04T05:31:30 < aandrew> but I can't fucking receive when the packets are < 60us apart?
2019-02-04T05:31:31 < aandrew> ghey
2019-02-04T05:36:14 < dongs> aandrew: but lattice still sells a $160 programming cable
2019-02-04T05:36:17 < dongs> no idea why
2019-02-04T05:36:32 < aandrew> dongs: because they can
2019-02-04T05:36:44 < aandrew> how many business will say "just get the cable" without even thinking?
2019-02-04T05:36:49 < dongs> ya sure
2019-02-04T05:36:49 < aandrew> it's free money
2019-02-04T05:37:58 < tjq> the conglomerate nigger
2019-02-04T05:38:30 < tjq> i need one of those so8 sockets
2019-02-04T05:38:39 < Laurenceb_123> https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192749.jpg
2019-02-04T05:38:39 < dongs> i can send you a picture of one
2019-02-04T05:39:05 < tjq> thankyou
2019-02-04T05:39:24 < tjq> laurence you have to pick a different img host man
2019-02-04T05:39:31 < dongs> yeah no shit
2019-02-04T05:39:33 < tjq> nobody will click those links otherwise
2019-02-04T05:39:48 < dongs> dont worry, nobody will click his links even if he uses somethign else
2019-02-04T05:42:00 < tjq> shhhhh
2019-02-04T05:53:36 < dongs> scrts: and no not ice40
2019-02-04T05:53:38 < dongs> machxo2
2019-02-04T05:53:47 < dongs> i have icestick but it looks useless for any actual exploring
2019-02-04T05:53:57 < scrts> tell me you're doing MIPI shit?
2019-02-04T05:54:04 < dongs> nah thats aandrew 
2019-02-04T05:54:29 < scrts> last time I did something on FPGA was cyclone v
2019-02-04T05:54:34 < scrts> and it wasn't bad
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2019-02-04T05:57:47 < tjq> Laurenceb_123: THE ISLE OF DOGS
2019-02-04T05:59:37 < tjq> how about here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gropecunt_Lane
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2019-02-04T06:06:26 < MrMobius> you guys going to KiCon this year?
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2019-02-04T06:27:43 < dongs> is that a kikecad convention
2019-02-04T06:29:58 < tjq> KiCon is a KiCad user focused conference.
2019-02-04T06:29:58 < tjq> Held for the first time ever, April 26th and 27th 2019 in Chicago IL.
2019-02-04T06:31:39 < jadew> if it was closer I would have gone just to make everyone there think about colored nets so they can bug the developers into implementing them
2019-02-04T06:40:56 < dongs> kicad schematic output is gross looking too
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2019-02-04T06:41:17 < tjq> m
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2019-02-04T09:35:42 < kakimir> tell me about courtyards of components?
2019-02-04T09:35:52 < kakimir> I always ignore them
2019-02-04T09:35:53 < kakimir> always
2019-02-04T09:35:58 < dongs> i disable them
2019-02-04T09:36:01 < dongs> fucking useless shit
2019-02-04T09:36:04 < dongs> waste of a layer
2019-02-04T09:36:22 < kakimir> is there some pick n pase related shit in courtyard stuff=
2019-02-04T09:36:35 < kakimir> pick of the dick
2019-02-04T09:36:40 < kakimir> *pic
2019-02-04T09:37:13 < kakimir> oh I failed
2019-02-04T09:40:02 < kakimir> so we have come in conclusion that courtyards are totally arbitrary
2019-02-04T09:40:35 < kakimir> with no relation to manufacturing capatibilities
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2019-02-04T09:42:37 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-04T09:42:45 < kakimir> but those are totally arbitrary still
2019-02-04T09:43:45 < kakimir> it may involve some standard how different pads and stuctures of different heights need different margin around them
2019-02-04T09:45:52 < kakimir> what standard?
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2019-02-04T09:54:24 < kakimir> what are they doing with that layer
2019-02-04T09:54:31 < kakimir> they know where components go
2019-02-04T09:54:40 < kakimir> with .pos file
2019-02-04T09:54:51 < kakimir> or whatever file[3~
2019-02-04T09:55:07 < kakimir> just say to them "make it happen"
2019-02-04T09:59:09 < kakimir> these designs do not happen if I follow rules
2019-02-04T09:59:28 < kakimir> nether does your mobile phone pcb
2019-02-04T09:59:36 < kakimir> have you seen that shit
2019-02-04T10:00:05 < kakimir> have you seen how packed it is
2019-02-04T10:02:57 < kakimir> mobile phones are so 2010
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2019-02-04T10:07:06 < Cracki> people have been discussing this since the beginning of time https://www.edaboard.com/showthread.php?237450-What-is-the-point-of-component-courtyards
2019-02-04T10:09:02 < Cracki> reworkability was one of the most critical aspects I've seen mentioned
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2019-02-04T11:01:11 < Cracki> wat "A Siemens business"
2019-02-04T11:05:07 < Cracki> so they have had that Xpedition thing since 2014... https://www.edn.com/electronics-blogs/across-the-board/4429584/Mentor-impresses-with-PCB-layout-software
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2019-02-04T11:14:45 < Cracki> hmmmm 3d placement, nice https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkMvagEZ4cg&list=PLgJ_BwPsneuVAJEbVaO8mG8ZGEm3dyIAp&index=9
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2019-02-04T11:15:29 < karlp> Cracki: did you miss siemens buying mentor?
2019-02-04T11:16:31 < karlp> jadew: I couldn't find any way to rename a project in the gui, had to copy the directory, rename files. fuckign stupid.
2019-02-04T11:20:57 < karlp> courtyards are fucking useless, except kicad library maintainers insist on them in a certain form. 
2019-02-04T11:20:59 < karlp> fucking pain 
2019-02-04T11:21:04 < dongs> haha
2019-02-04T11:21:36 < karlp> and the courtyard isn't meant to be the footprint but "some aribtraty size bigger" 
2019-02-04T11:21:58 < karlp> and there's no tool to say, "take this rectangle, expand x mm" like in gimp/photoshop
2019-02-04T11:22:25 < karlp> http://kicad-pcb.org/libraries/klc/F5.3/
2019-02-04T11:22:55 < karlp> with their fucking "illustrative diagrams" with no legends
2019-02-04T11:23:34 < dongs> wow such autism
2019-02-04T11:23:52 < karlp> and nicely arbitrary, qfn gets 0.25mm, but bga gets 1mm. hooray for ducking sanity
2019-02-04T11:24:14 < dongs> karlp: the mental.com article Cracki linked explained why different spacing for BGAs
2019-02-04T11:24:15 < karlp> and you're NOT ALLOWED to submit footprints that don't have a square for pin "one".
2019-02-04T11:24:30 < dongs> but yeah whatever, fuck courtyards
2019-02-04T11:24:52 < karlp> qfn and lga stuff don't count?
2019-02-04T11:25:18 < dongs> no, its for like rework and shit
2019-02-04T11:25:23 < dongs> and depends on ball pitch/bga size
2019-02-04T11:25:27 < dongs> to get the rework tools into the space
2019-02-04T11:25:37 < dongs> but if you aint gonna rework teh shit, who gives a fuck
2019-02-04T11:25:43 < karlp> kicad doesn't even follow that pages recommendations being based on ball sizes
2019-02-04T11:25:48 < dongs> laugh
2019-02-04T11:25:49 < karlp> so no, they're just being arbitrary and dumb
2019-02-04T11:27:37 < Cracki> hahahaha dat progression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadence_Design_Systems#Mentor_Graphics
2019-02-04T11:28:42 < dongs> wtf
2019-02-04T11:28:46 < karlp> I like how they're all, "why don't you put sillk outside?" "oh, that's an faq, here's the answer:  'it's important not to'"
2019-02-04T11:28:49 < karlp> good fucking answer
2019-02-04T11:31:48 < karlp> it's the best we've got, but it doesn't make it great.
2019-02-04T11:35:40 < Cracki> >dunking on mud huts to own the libs
2019-02-04T11:36:08 < karlp> mine too
2019-02-04T11:36:15 < karlp> Haohmaru: it could be a lot less suck though
2019-02-04T11:36:24 < karlp> it's got great _parts_
2019-02-04T11:37:13 < karlp> obviously not making much then.
2019-02-04T11:37:39 < karlp> those rules I linked don't matter anyway if you don't want to contribute your symbols/footprints
2019-02-04T11:38:19 < karlp> or why you have to have a different _symbol_ based on whether the G/D/S are on pins 1 2 3 or 3 2 1 or 1 3 2 on fets et al.
2019-02-04T11:41:24 < karlp> it's the pcb side I have the most issues with, and the connection between the two.
2019-02-04T11:41:35 < karlp> I think that's a horrific use of the word atomic too.
2019-02-04T11:41:52 < karlp> but yes, there does seem to be community disagreement on how to proceed with some of these
2019-02-04T11:42:10 < karlp> there's "generic" symbols for _some_ things
2019-02-04T11:42:35 < karlp> but when I tried to make ageneric symbol for something else, that was already re-used in multiple symboles, it was, "no, symbols must have parts associated, and footprints!" 
2019-02-04T11:43:26 < karlp> this hsould really be done in the part assigning pins to a footprint though, not having different symbols for each arrangement
2019-02-04T11:46:14 < karlp> yeah, like i said, it's the best we've got, it just doesn't amke it great.
2019-02-04T11:46:23 < Cracki> btw, this problem is strongly related to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database_normalization
2019-02-04T11:46:45 < karlp> somewhat, sure.
2019-02-04T11:46:49 < Cracki> modeling can be arbitrarily simple, ro complex
2019-02-04T11:47:53 < Cracki> tons of tradeoffs. tons of ways to make one decision stretch.
2019-02-04T11:52:36 < Cracki> that's why some people manage to make their gerbers with inkscape...
2019-02-04T11:53:11 < Cracki> also for VLSI
2019-02-04T11:53:19 < Cracki> or at least IC design
2019-02-04T11:53:28 < Cracki> it's just layers of metal, right? :>
2019-02-04T11:53:38 < Cracki> and yes, i saw a video of someone doing that
2019-02-04T11:54:39 < Cracki> my sides http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/SpecElectronicsCAD
2019-02-04T11:55:20 < Cracki> "poking ram locations is basically an operating system"
2019-02-04T11:55:36 < Cracki> (my paraphrasing)
2019-02-04T11:56:18 < Cracki> this is the Blub paradox (or Dunning Kruger)
2019-02-04T11:56:48 < Cracki> they have an "algorithm" for that? doesn't that just take a path, close it, and then triangulate it sufficiently?
2019-02-04T11:57:30 < Cracki> or one could make a rasterizer that can deal with whatever complex model of path you want
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2019-02-04T11:58:03 < Cracki> (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
2019-02-04T11:58:37 < Cracki> someone needs to be shot for that
2019-02-04T11:59:24 < Cracki> I remember... some Wesley Crusher type a few years ago, in a "3d printing" (mesh algorithms and data structures) lab, decided to compute the offset of a contour by rasterizing it
2019-02-04T12:00:05 < Cracki> because fuck nice things, we'll just run this kernel on the gpu
2019-02-04T12:00:47 < Cracki> I mean... sure... with sufficient resolution it's irrelevant, and it implicitly deals with tricky edge cases such as arbitrary intersections
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2019-02-04T12:01:50 < Cracki> nothing would have prevented him from using proper data structures and algorithms to compute an exact solution
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2019-02-04T12:50:52 < tjq> \\\\\\\\\\\\\\
2019-02-04T12:51:56 < tjq> hii
2019-02-04T12:52:59 < Cracki> heyyy
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2019-02-04T12:53:20 < Cracki> do u rp
2019-02-04T12:54:33 < rajkosto> > i slowly begin to unzip your lizard
2019-02-04T12:55:05 < Cracki> OwO
2019-02-04T12:57:03 < Cracki> made a keychain-format sticker scraper from a tin can lid. too many bolshevik propaganda sticking to public property around here
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2019-02-04T13:00:30 < karlp> you're lolrencing again cracki
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2019-02-04T13:03:33 < Thorn> https://www.packtpub.com/application-development/hands-embedded-programming-c17
2019-02-04T13:03:39 < Thorn> note the author
2019-02-04T13:07:11 < day> what about her?
2019-02-04T13:07:30 < tjq> so we have a new laurence
2019-02-04T13:13:48 < jpa-> so, is it a good book?
2019-02-04T13:54:21 < jadew> karlp, yeah, I know... I'm familiar with the issue
2019-02-04T13:54:50 < jadew> regarding courtyards, you can disable the checks in the DRC, if that's what's bothering you
2019-02-04T13:56:10 < jadew> heh
2019-02-04T13:58:54 < jadew> my boards have finally arrived
2019-02-04T13:59:16 < jadew> first problem: I forgot to add a programming header on a QFN part :/
2019-02-04T13:59:45 < jadew> yeah...
2019-02-04T13:59:56 < karlp> that's pretty amateur hour jade, unlike you
2019-02-04T14:00:00 < rajkosto> how long did boards take
2019-02-04T14:00:25 < jadew> karlp, it was there, but I removed it in the schematic so I could reorder some stuff from the previous version and forgot about it
2019-02-04T14:00:37 < jadew> rajkosto, to be made or to get here?
2019-02-04T14:00:51 < rajkosto> why not both
2019-02-04T14:01:04 < jadew> 4 days to be made, a couple more to get here and then two weeks for the post office to deliver them to me
2019-02-04T14:01:40 < jadew> Haohmaru, it was a big overhaul
2019-02-04T14:01:57 < jadew> and I didn't think I'd forget about that
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2019-02-04T14:03:28 < kakimir> what do you think about placing electronic device being potted in vacuum to excite air to come out?
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2019-02-04T14:04:00 < jadew> kakimir, what do you mean?
2019-02-04T14:04:14 < kakimir> if there is complex structure
2019-02-04T14:04:21 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-04T14:04:28 < kakimir> potential airtraps
2019-02-04T14:04:59 < jadew> if you're using a vacuum pump, then that air would have to be sealed
2019-02-04T14:05:07 < jadew> so... why worry about it?
2019-02-04T14:05:26 < jadew> also, what could possibly happen if it got out?
2019-02-04T14:05:53 < jadew> and which aspect do you want us to think about?
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2019-02-04T14:07:49 < BrainDamage> vacuum potting is pretty standard procedure
2019-02-04T14:09:14 < jadew> don't think so
2019-02-04T14:10:26 < kakimir> BrainDamage: what will happen to my tssop?
2019-02-04T14:10:42 < kakimir> vacuum will suck air under it out
2019-02-04T14:10:50 < kakimir> then pottings go under tssop
2019-02-04T14:11:55 < BrainDamage> what are you especting it'll happen next? magical explosion?
2019-02-04T14:12:22 < kakimir> expexting destruction
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2019-02-04T14:14:18 < BrainDamage> if the potting material coefficient of expansion is chosen carefully, nothing will happen if it gets trapped underneath
2019-02-04T14:15:09 < rajkosto> potting material isnt that thin to go under tssop
2019-02-04T14:15:48 < BrainDamage> it'll form a meniscus on the side
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2019-02-04T14:41:08 < englishman> idk about potting but when I had conformal coating done they applied the shit so precisely with a 5axis shit there is no need for vac
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2019-02-04T14:57:07 < karlp> that sounds pretty different process :)
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2019-02-04T15:17:24 < rajkosto> my pcbs are 50 miles away from me
2019-02-04T15:17:33 < rajkosto> now if customs decides to inspect them that will be 12 more days, otherwise 1
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2019-02-04T15:18:26 < dongs> sucks to be in a thirdworld country
2019-02-04T15:24:52 < rajkosto> they might inspect cuz it has components in it too, value 49.9$
2019-02-04T15:25:01 < rajkosto> if it was just 10$ pcbs they wouldnt
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2019-02-04T15:31:29 < tjq> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2483343/Asda-Nazi-Shameless-father-parades-aisles-SS-uniform-pushing-baby-trolley.html
2019-02-04T15:40:11 < Laurenceb> muh family
2019-02-04T15:40:43 < Laurenceb> >Sieg aisle
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2019-02-04T15:47:13 < Laurenceb> bongs on suicide watch https://www.theregister.co.uk/2019/02/04/mindgeek_ageid_security_privacy_assessment/
2019-02-04T15:52:47 < day> lol that is hilarious
2019-02-04T15:53:30 < day> maybe brexit stops that cancer from infesting the rest of europe 
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2019-02-04T15:55:21 < Laurenceb> https://files.catbox.moe/4qlgr1.jpg
2019-02-04T16:00:20 < Laurenceb> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DykFMMAW0AE5jsg.jpg:large
2019-02-04T16:01:13 < Cracki> uhhhh
2019-02-04T16:01:31 < Laurenceb> >not a plague of frogs
2019-02-04T16:01:37 < Cracki> do they export waste that's edible?
2019-02-04T16:02:04 < Laurenceb> very little
2019-02-04T16:02:35 < jadew> that poor guy
2019-02-04T16:02:35 < Cracki> I know electronics junk is exported to india and such, they love floppy drives
2019-02-04T16:02:59 < jadew> the moment he heard about brexit he probably thought: "Oh no! The rats!"
2019-02-04T16:04:08 < jadew> Cracki, I've seen that documentary as well
2019-02-04T16:04:10 < Cracki> just eat your rats. it's the socialist thing to do. they did it in 1984 too!
2019-02-04T16:05:05 < Cracki> all this doomsday BS... as if a brexit would prevent anyone from trading their trash to india...
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2019-02-04T16:08:16 < Cracki> I think someone even linked that trash documentary here
2019-02-04T16:09:01 < jadew> might have been me
2019-02-04T16:09:46 < jadew> did you see the one with the toilets?
2019-02-04T16:10:18 < Laurenceb> faces of autism https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192812.jpg
2019-02-04T16:10:54 < jadew> what's that Laurenceb, some sort of school?
2019-02-04T16:11:10 < Cracki> Toilet Paper UK, the "neocon" export from the US
2019-02-04T16:11:23 < Laurenceb> https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/media/2019/02/turning-point-uks-launch-memes-going-brilliantly-bad-you-expected
2019-02-04T16:11:25 < Laurenceb> keeek
2019-02-04T16:11:26 < Cracki> totally puppets to murica's greatest ally
2019-02-04T16:11:44 < Laurenceb> >white supremacist
2019-02-04T16:11:44 < Cracki> playing identity politics (just look at their diversity!) while claiming to reject it
2019-02-04T16:12:30 < Cracki> I would vote for Corbyn if TPUK is the best right-wing party that island can muster
2019-02-04T16:13:01 < rajkosto> KORBENNN DALLLASSSS ??
2019-02-04T16:13:38 < Laurenceb> that aa drill tweet
2019-02-04T16:13:44 < Laurenceb> >this is an insult
2019-02-04T16:14:02 < Laurenceb> >ur a loser if you dont eat ass
2019-02-04T16:14:11 < Laurenceb> wtf reality are we in now
2019-02-04T16:15:01 < Cracki> reaction to roosh's rejection of ass because it's ghey?
2019-02-04T16:15:06 < Laurenceb> kek
2019-02-04T16:15:33 < Cracki> btw, he chose that name only because too many retards can't speell "rouge" properly
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2019-02-04T16:27:40 < rajkosto> rogue the bat
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2019-02-04T16:52:52 < Laurenceb> wtf I love Corbyn now https://imgoat.com/uploads/d686fd640b/192823.jpg
2019-02-04T16:56:31 < Cracki> he's tough medicine
2019-02-04T16:56:40 < Cracki> or bitter, or whatever
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2019-02-04T17:01:24 < karlp> plz stahp
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2019-02-04T20:37:47 < Steffann> haha karlp made it stop :)
2019-02-04T21:04:01 < Cracki> quiet evening... you know what that means... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyabgM3W0AE7K0q.jpg:orig
2019-02-04T21:05:22 < kakimir> bullish
2019-02-04T21:05:36 < kakimir> are you bullish or bearish
2019-02-04T21:07:44 < Cracki> only people I allow into my bed will find that out
2019-02-04T21:09:39 < kakimir> so
2019-02-04T21:10:48 < Steffann> so you should ask Laurenceb
2019-02-04T21:11:48 < kakimir> laurencer is right at nerve of economy
2019-02-04T21:12:02 < Cracki> economy is in the basement!
2019-02-04T21:15:25 <@mawk> I'll write an article about 6LoWPAN/IEEE 802.15.4
2019-02-04T21:15:28 <@mawk> in english I think
2019-02-04T21:15:40 <@mawk> to sanitize this jungle for the future
2019-02-04T21:16:08 <@mawk> no wonder nobody uses 6LoWPAN, the current state of the art is in such a bad shape
2019-02-04T21:17:20 < qyx> I'll thank you then
2019-02-04T21:17:42 < qyx> don't forget to include 802.15.4g or how is it called
2019-02-04T21:17:51 < qyx> for other bands
2019-02-04T21:18:17 <@mawk> yeah there's a ton of amendments for other bands
2019-02-04T21:18:24 <@mawk> but that is about the PHY layer, there's not much to write
2019-02-04T21:18:31 <@mawk> other than just get the proper transceiver and antenna
2019-02-04T21:18:47 <@mawk> this isn't the hard part, the MAC and upper layer is the tricky point with linux and other stuff
2019-02-04T21:19:56 <@mawk> http://sci-hub.tw/10.1109/SmartGridComm.2012.6486030
2019-02-04T21:19:58 <@mawk> smart metering utilities
2019-02-04T21:20:13 <@mawk> SUNs
2019-02-04T21:20:19 <@mawk> lol
2019-02-04T21:20:27 <@mawk> they do that on purpose with their acronyms I bet
2019-02-04T21:20:30 <@mawk> SUNs, NANs
2019-02-04T21:20:34 <@mawk> HANs
2019-02-04T21:21:23 <@mawk> it's like in France they love funny acronyms
2019-02-04T21:21:36 <@mawk> PHAROS, THEOREM, SPHINX
2019-02-04T21:21:42 <@mawk> they find the acronym first, then its meaning
2019-02-04T21:21:50 <@mawk> the military do that
2019-02-04T21:22:05 <@mawk> OSIRIS
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2019-02-04T21:23:09 < mawk> :(
2019-02-04T21:23:18 < mawk> I stepped down from my pedestal
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2019-02-04T21:55:40 < Steffann> lol mawk i forgot about it :P
2019-02-04T21:56:07 < mawk> I hoped you wouldn't remember
2019-02-04T21:56:38 < Steffann> but then i noticed the @ in front of your nick
2019-02-04T21:58:18 < Steffann> So the son of the neighbour still let you live for now?
2019-02-04T21:58:30 < mawk> yeah I didn't encounter him again
2019-02-04T21:58:38 < mawk> but he comes now and then visit his father
2019-02-04T21:58:50 < mawk> and he comes in the appartment above and drill holes in the ground
2019-02-04T21:59:30 < Steffann> lolwut
2019-02-04T22:00:04 < mawk> with a shit drill
2019-02-04T22:00:32 < mawk> he drilled for 3 seconds, then he felt like a little boy and he got out the appartment without making the slightest noise and avoiding other neighbors
2019-02-04T22:00:43 < mawk> but I saw him through the peephole
2019-02-04T22:19:20 < Steffann> :)
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2019-02-04T22:24:01 < ohsix> bloop
2019-02-04T22:24:28 < ohsix> TheSeven: the ali script goes nuts if you type something in that ali offers to correct, refresh loop
2019-02-04T22:25:18 < ohsix> this dealie https://i.imgur.com/3wZ5xzh.png
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2019-02-04T22:33:29 < Steffann> Welcome catphish. Still no progress on the pick and placer?
2019-02-04T22:34:36 -!- Steffanx [~steffanx@unaffiliated/steffanx] has quit [Quit: Meh]
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2019-02-04T22:35:05 < catphish> Steffann: afraid not, rather, i got to the point where it works, but then suffered from a realization that it wasn't worth the effort to actually set up a board and feeders to test it properly
2019-02-04T22:35:43 < catphish> i was hoping for something useful, and i just don't think it will be, so i gave up
2019-02-04T22:36:17 < Steffanx> awh
2019-02-04T22:37:22 < zyp> haha
2019-02-04T22:37:53 < zyp> so how far did you get? p&p head but no feeders?
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2019-02-04T22:52:00 < Steffanx> So what  chinese manufacturer is hot these days? I see people here complain about jlcpcb a lot (because shipping is muuuch et all)
2019-02-04T22:52:12 < Steffanx> *pcb manufacturer
2019-02-04T22:55:51 < emeryth> jlcpcb or allpcb
2019-02-04T22:58:26 < karlp> I have bene happy with elecrow fwiw.
2019-02-04T22:58:39 < karlp> but i'm considering using aisler.net for some work stuff, for a balance between speed and price
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2019-02-04T23:00:46 < qyx> I can't see any prices
2019-02-04T23:00:51 < qyx> do I have to register first
2019-02-04T23:01:52  * qyx uploading random project
2019-02-04T23:02:08 < Steffanx> hah was doing the same
2019-02-04T23:02:10 < qyx> This is lookin' pretty amazing!
2019-02-04T23:02:16 < Steffanx> Ups, something went completely wrong! Do you mind sending us your files to felix@aisler.net? That'd be great :)
2019-02-04T23:02:16 < karlp> no idea, I've never actually used them yettt, but it's been well reported by some other people.
2019-02-04T23:02:32 < karlp> and it's not _that_ much more expensive and if it ships neatly and quickly 
2019-02-04T23:02:32 < tjq> philes
2019-02-04T23:02:35  * karlp shrugs
2019-02-04T23:02:36 < karlp> will try.
2019-02-04T23:02:48 < karlp> elecrow or other china for "fast" quickly became expensive again.
2019-02-04T23:03:09 < qyx> Steffanx: https://aisler.net/p/QEPJDRJK
2019-02-04T23:03:10 < Steffanx> 50 euros for 4layer isnt that bad imho
2019-02-04T23:03:13 < qyx> idk if it works
2019-02-04T23:03:19 < Steffanx> Yes works
2019-02-04T23:03:41 < karlp> but yeah, pricing isn't really as transparent as I think thhey should have it
2019-02-04T23:03:43 < qyx> 27€ for 3 boards is not THAT much
2019-02-04T23:03:53 < qyx> if they ship from .de and for free
2019-02-04T23:04:44 < karlp> yeah, that's what I was thinking.
2019-02-04T23:04:48 < Steffanx> They really dont like my project.
2019-02-04T23:05:10 < qyx> we also have some local flat-rate prototyping service
2019-02-04T23:05:19 < qyx> it was like 30€ for 10x10
2019-02-04T23:06:11 < karlp> only downside is green only.
2019-02-04T23:06:21 < karlp> I like using red for protos so I don't mix them up, 
2019-02-04T23:06:30 < karlp> but not really a real downside ...
2019-02-04T23:07:25 < qyx> I like their gerber viewer
2019-02-04T23:08:34 < Steffanx> heh https://support.jlcpcb.com/article/73-jlcpcb-spring-festival-holiday-schedule
2019-02-04T23:10:23 < kakimir> dhl starts deliverys 12th
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2019-02-05T00:48:46 < englishman> any pros want some copypaste work
2019-02-05T00:49:07 < englishman> client supplies bom, schematics and photos of a PCB, you recreate in real pcb soft
2019-02-05T00:49:14 < mawk> lol
2019-02-05T00:49:16 < englishman> 4 designs pretty simple
2019-02-05T00:50:53 < Thorn> 50% of the work is going to be creating a component library
2019-02-05T00:51:49 < Thorn> which is where mistakes are going to happen
2019-02-05T00:51:49 < englishman> pretty much
2019-02-05T00:52:04 < englishman> thats why i said pros only
2019-02-05T00:52:15 < Thorn> because of new untested components & footprints
2019-02-05T00:58:41 < mawk> pros don't make mistakes
2019-02-05T00:59:02 < englishman> they do but they know how to detect and fix them
2019-02-05T00:59:17 < englishman> without anyone finding out
2019-02-05T01:00:31 < zyp> how well do you pay?
2019-02-05T01:01:32 < englishman> this is a legit company so you could probably charge a few k for pro work
2019-02-05T01:02:42 < englishman> example https://i.imgur.com/c1oZOP0.png
2019-02-05T01:02:59 < englishman> a few photos like this, and a 16 page document of schematics and copper layers
2019-02-05T01:03:07 < zyp> wait, really?
2019-02-05T01:03:55 < englishman> yeah? i get work like this all the time
2019-02-05T01:04:09 < karlp> speaking of edge connectors, anything better than pcie x1 for < 20ish contacts?
2019-02-05T01:04:39 < englishman> i used those once it was great. super cheap and over9000 vendors
2019-02-05T01:04:42 < zyp> better how?
2019-02-05T01:04:47 < aandrew> holy fuck those are nasty boards
2019-02-05T01:05:15 < karlp> zyp: lower profile, cheaper? 
2019-02-05T01:05:22 < karlp> but yeah, pcie 1x is looking pretty awesome
2019-02-05T01:05:30 < zyp> how about minipcie or m2 or whatever?
2019-02-05T01:05:41 < zyp> or do you want the 90deg angle?
2019-02-05T01:05:47 < karlp> I want 90deg yeah
2019-02-05T01:06:12 < karlp> I mean, there's just straight pins/headers for 90degrees too,
2019-02-05T01:06:26 < karlp> but honestly seems worse than just an edge and a socket
2019-02-05T01:06:49 < zyp> I'm guessing you won't find anything that'll beat it unless you wanna pay more
2019-02-05T01:07:12 < zyp> unless you do a pair of connectors
2019-02-05T01:07:28 < zyp> some combination of side and top entry
2019-02-05T01:07:32 < karlp> yeah, I've found samtec and amphenol and so on have explicit edge connectors, for N positions, but they're all way more, for no real entry
2019-02-05T01:07:45 < karlp> two connectors doesn't really seem to buy anything other than cost though.
2019-02-05T01:08:14 < zyp> maybe make the board really thin so you can stuff it into a FFC connector :)
2019-02-05T01:08:19 < karlp> hahah
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2019-02-05T01:09:16 < zyp> englishman, so anyway, those are all single layer pth boards?
2019-02-05T01:09:24 < englishman> appears so
2019-02-05T01:09:34 < zyp> and they want the layout itself cloned?
2019-02-05T01:09:56 < karlp> presumably just the edge connectors and perhaps the positions of the trimpots
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2019-02-05T01:10:45 < zyp> yeah, I mean the sane way would be to make some 2L boards with smt parts with the same circuit
2019-02-05T01:10:47 < englishman> yeah i think he just needs gerbers
2019-02-05T01:10:54 < englishman> something the pcbfab can actually make
2019-02-05T01:11:24 < englishman> though im sure this is from 1981 or something so maybe a swift look at component availability would be nice
2019-02-05T01:11:48 < zyp> looks like mostly passives
2019-02-05T01:12:24 < englishman> it is, and some leds. the ics are opamps
2019-02-05T01:13:06 < englishman> AUTO PITCH/ROLL FOR WATSON GYRO INCLINOMETER SENSORS
2019-02-05T01:13:11 < Thorn> is this a prototype of an analog guidance computer for some kind of missile
2019-02-05T01:13:24 < zyp> then it should be straight forward to make a smt relayout, faster than cloning that layout
2019-02-05T01:14:04 < englishman> hand-drawn schematics are dated 1985
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2019-02-05T01:14:37 < karlp> heh, never even occured to me they wanted the layout cloned.
2019-02-05T01:14:40 < englishman> computer drawn ones are dated 1989
2019-02-05T01:15:08 < zyp> karlp, you haven't worked enough with customers :)
2019-02-05T01:16:15 < zyp> englishman, is there a timeline on this? how fast do they need to be done?
2019-02-05T01:16:26 < karlp> zyp: obviously :)
2019-02-05T01:16:32 < englishman> i was asked to look at this like 2 weeks ago i think they just want it done this century
2019-02-05T01:18:27 < zyp> I've got a long list of shit I wanna buy for the house so I wouldn't mind the extra income, and I could probably find some time to get it done this week
2019-02-05T01:18:54 < zyp> next week I might be away
2019-02-05T01:19:14 < zyp> got a business trip coming up, but it keeps getting pushed back because shit's not ready
2019-02-05T01:21:06 < englishman> what's the best snowblower
2019-02-05T01:21:12 < zyp> but recreating the layout would be kinda ridiculous, imagine having to make a bunch of resistor footprints with varying leg lengths
2019-02-05T01:21:15 < englishman> honda is certainly the most expensive
2019-02-05T01:21:25 < zyp> dunno, I've been wondering about it myself
2019-02-05T01:21:30 < englishman> im sure a functional clone would be fine
2019-02-05T01:21:37 < englishman> i think i will get one with tracks
2019-02-05T01:21:58 < englishman> husqvarna looks like total crap, i played with one in a store, all plastic
2019-02-05T01:22:03 < englishman> thin metal
2019-02-05T01:22:15 < zyp> I only got a small driveway, so I thought about getting a little electric one
2019-02-05T01:22:25 < zyp> but last friday I concluded I won't
2019-02-05T01:22:27 < englishman> those looked awful
2019-02-05T01:22:32 < englishman> the impeller is plastic
2019-02-05T01:22:39 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-05T01:23:18 < zyp> last friday I got home from work and found the plow had left a bunch of snow right in front of my driveway, in addition to a lot of wet heavy snow in the driveway itself
2019-02-05T01:23:56 < englishman> https://www.ariens.com/en-us/snow-products/snow-blowers/compact/compact-track-24
2019-02-05T01:24:03 < englishman> something like this, small, but tracked and tall
2019-02-05T01:24:25 < zyp> I don't think a little single stage one is gonna cope with that, and I concluded it's pointless to buy something that's not usable in those situations when I want a snowblower the most :p
2019-02-05T01:25:14 < zyp> ariens seems to have a decent reputation here
2019-02-05T01:25:40 < englishman> cool
2019-02-05T01:25:54 < englishman> there are a lot of ancient 60-70s ones around which is a good sign
2019-02-05T01:26:01 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-05T01:26:18 < zyp> hmm, it's gonna keep raining here all week
2019-02-05T01:26:26 < zyp> hope that takes care of most of the snow
2019-02-05T01:29:30 < sync> now retrofit one with some bldcs and servos on the controls and have it rip through the driveway remotely englishman
2019-02-05T01:29:46 < englishman> yes 100%
2019-02-05T01:30:27 < englishman> though the hydraulic drive ones should be easier
2019-02-05T01:30:34 < zyp> I've thought about picking up some old snowblower with a broken engine and replacing it with a three phase AC induction motor
2019-02-05T01:30:52 < englishman> plug it into the CCS port for power?
2019-02-05T01:31:19 < zyp> nah, I figured I'll put up a three phase outlet eventually :)
2019-02-05T01:33:37 < zyp> englishman, so anyway, I can do those pcb layouts as long as I can do them in a sane manner
2019-02-05T01:34:16 < englishman> pm me your email address and i'll forward the documents to you for an estimate?
2019-02-05T01:34:39 < zyp> zyp@jvnv.net
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2019-02-05T01:35:22 < bitmask> booo, I thought I was coding something wrong but it turns out I just used up too much memory on the nano :(
2019-02-05T01:36:05 < zyp> I'm heading to bed now, so I'll take a look tomorrow
2019-02-05T01:37:36 < englishman> nite
2019-02-05T01:39:47 < zyp> I see the pics, but no bom/schematic
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2019-02-05T01:41:07 < englishman> sent
2019-02-05T01:46:27 < zyp> now I've got schematics also, but I can't really see anything resembling a bom
2019-02-05T01:51:08 < zyp> anyway, I'll try to make some more sense of it tomorrow
2019-02-05T01:51:44 < englishman> yeah no bom
2019-02-05T01:52:06 < ds2> zyp: you can get 3Ph drops w/o a lot of trouble?
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2019-02-05T02:39:29 < jadew> any chinese company making a good & cheap direct heat station (100W+)?
2019-02-05T02:39:59 < jadew> cheap = ~200 USD
2019-02-05T02:40:43 < jadew> I need something that can heat better than my 100W soldering gun
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2019-02-05T03:42:52 < fenugrec> englishman, ariens are expensive as fu but are way better built than MTD stuff like the one I have
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2019-02-05T03:56:24 < bitmask> ugh, 2kb sram is useless
2019-02-05T04:13:49 < mawk> plenty of space in 2KiB
2019-02-05T04:14:03 < mawk> you're a spoiled kid bitmask 
2019-02-05T04:14:13 < bitmask> hah, just depends what youre doing
2019-02-05T04:14:17 < bitmask> I ran out
2019-02-05T04:14:27 < bitmask> gotta organize this better
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2019-02-05T04:19:05 < mawk> I was joking
2019-02-05T04:19:11 < mawk> what's your application ?
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2019-02-05T04:19:22 < bitmask> 2kb can be plenty for a lot of stuff though
2019-02-05T04:19:51 < bitmask> heated hoodie, I think its my UI/menu system thats the issue
2019-02-05T04:20:09 < mawk> ah
2019-02-05T04:20:16 < mawk> your UI items are taking all the place ?
2019-02-05T04:20:19 < bitmask> I got it to work now but I still have to add some stuff
2019-02-05T04:21:56 < bitmask> well my globals take 46%, so I'm guessing its my screen refresh method that is taking a lot of local variables.  Each menu item has a few pointers for the linked list and the text is stored in flash
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2019-02-05T05:18:59 < englishman> fenugrec: I saw a used one for sale, guy bought it new in 1972. I'm down for that kind of investment right now
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2019-02-05T07:27:52 < dongs> if particle.io 's goal is to sell me shit
2019-02-05T07:27:56 < dongs> they'fve fucking failued
2019-02-05T07:28:01 < dongs> ive been on their site for last 5 mins
2019-02-05T07:28:04 < dongs> trying to figure out what the fuck they do
2019-02-05T07:28:16 < dongs> and i see nothing that makes me want to click 'buy now'
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2019-02-05T07:46:28 < jadew> https://www.particle.io/pricing
2019-02-05T07:46:36 < jadew> dongs ^
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2019-02-05T09:50:59 < zyp> ds2, what do you mean by drop? the cable into the house?
2019-02-05T09:51:26 < zyp> every house here has three phase
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2019-02-05T10:07:28 < zyp> yeah?
2019-02-05T10:08:18 < zyp> got 3P+N coming in and being distributed across 12 single phase circuits: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/vUXFc.jpg
2019-02-05T10:08:56 < zyp> so i.e. I've got four circuits on each phase
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2019-02-05T10:16:41 < dongs> anyway whatever.
2019-02-05T10:16:48 < dongs> the only thing I got from particle was that FTDI thing
2019-02-05T10:16:50 < dongs> and it works
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2019-02-05T10:35:57 < tjq> flop
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2019-02-05T12:40:29 < kakimir> XMC 2GO is sweet
2019-02-05T12:44:12 < kakimir> but no worries to get serial comms working
2019-02-05T12:44:38 < kakimir> usic section of the reference manual is 233 pages
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2019-02-05T12:56:05 < Laurenceb_123> https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/liam-neeson-rape-black-man-attack-cosh-cold-pursuit-sexual-assault-interview-a8760866.html
2019-02-05T12:56:18 < Laurenceb_123> do a Neeson loser
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2019-02-05T13:07:21 < karlp> heh, HLW8012 in this wifi wall switch claims 0.5% accuracy in metering and shit
2019-02-05T13:07:27 < karlp> only outputs are via frequency outputs.
2019-02-05T13:07:33 < karlp> thing has an internal clock....
2019-02-05T13:07:59 < karlp> typical, 3.579, but ranges from 3.04 to 4.12 MHz
2019-02-05T13:08:02 < karlp> good luck!
2019-02-05T13:09:40 < jpa-> :)
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2019-02-05T13:12:49 < zyp> haha
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2019-02-05T13:15:41 < kakimir> jlink lite
2019-02-05T13:15:49 < kakimir> do it usually only support certain baudrate?
2019-02-05T13:15:55 < kakimir> in uart comms
2019-02-05T13:16:12 -!- Cracki [~cracki@unaffiliated/crackwitz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2019-02-05T13:16:15 < kakimir> I mean it was shipped with program with 115kbaud
2019-02-05T13:16:26 < kakimir> example program has 57600baud
2019-02-05T13:16:34 < kakimir> too complicated to change
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2019-02-05T13:16:55 < kakimir> anyways nothing is tranfered
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2019-02-05T13:52:35 < kakimir> problem found when I located "initial_codez.zip" from internets
2019-02-05T13:52:46 < kakimir> analog channels have digital buffer disabled by default
2019-02-05T13:53:04 < kakimir> and those pins were in that "block"
2019-02-05T13:53:32 < dongs> kikemir , wat?
2019-02-05T13:53:37 < dongs> why would jlink have a uart
2019-02-05T13:53:38 < dongs> for wat
2019-02-05T13:55:26 < kakimir> also usic timing parameters etc. were off but
2019-02-05T13:55:34 < kakimir> jlink lite
2019-02-05T13:55:57 < kakimir> thing that is used integrated to development boards
2019-02-05T13:56:01 < kakimir> idk. but it works greawt
2019-02-05T13:57:25 < kakimir> I don't genuinelly know these parameters
2019-02-05T13:57:34 < kakimir> sampling points and timings
2019-02-05T13:57:38 < kakimir> dozen of them
2019-02-05T13:57:53 < kakimir> luckily this example code will do for development purposes
2019-02-05T14:04:59 < kakimir> iot is shit
2019-02-05T14:05:55 < kakimir> nope
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2019-02-05T14:20:13 < kakimir> meeh
2019-02-05T14:20:32 < kakimir> why doesn't dave use inc src structure for my files
2019-02-05T14:20:50 < kakimir> how I'm supposed to throw them in there
2019-02-05T14:20:59 < kakimir> just all in one pile rite?
2019-02-05T14:41:30 < Laurenceb> https://imgoat.com/uploads/597e50502f/193082.png
2019-02-05T14:46:37 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o englishman] by ChanServ
2019-02-05T14:46:39 -!- mode/##stm32 [+b *!*@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk] by englishman
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2019-02-05T14:47:15 < dongs> that shit isnt even funny
2019-02-05T14:53:43 < c10ud> just like altium support forum
2019-02-05T14:54:26 <@englishman> i do like how you can like bugs
2019-02-05T14:55:08 <@englishman> ima just give this critical error a nice big thumbs up
2019-02-05T14:57:03 <@englishman> https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1092270756715737088
2019-02-05T14:57:04 <@englishman> cool
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2019-02-05T15:46:44 < dongs> what the fuck
2019-02-05T15:46:53 < dongs> lattice has a *different* toolchain for ice40 shit?
2019-02-05T15:47:00 < dongs> fucking why
2019-02-05T15:49:46 < dongs> so iceCUBE is only for ice40
2019-02-05T15:52:38 < dongs> why is anything named *Cube so retarded
2019-02-05T15:52:48 < dongs> timecube, icecube, cubemx
2019-02-05T16:04:37 < day> but was it a good day?
2019-02-05T16:04:59 < dongs> the important question is does it spark joy
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2019-02-05T16:07:51 < day> I dont know, but today seems kinda odd.
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2019-02-05T16:18:50 < jpa-> dongs: icecube is separate because they used to be made by siliconblue before lattice bought them
2019-02-05T16:19:10 < dongs> yeah i gathered that after some googling
2019-02-05T16:19:11 < dongs> hmm.
2019-02-05T16:22:20 < qyx> anyone ordered maker stuff from the pi hut?
2019-02-05T16:22:33 < dongs> ive heard about them
2019-02-05T16:23:53 < qyx> mhm ordered something on friday and no more emails so far
2019-02-05T16:23:58 < qyx> except the first one confirming my order
2019-02-05T16:24:44 < jpa-> isn't china closed?
2019-02-05T16:25:07 < qyx> I though they are based in the UK
2019-02-05T16:25:12 < qyx> UK is not closed yet
2019-02-05T16:25:12 < jpa-> ah, ok
2019-02-05T16:25:33 < jpa-> LaurenceB is not here, maybe they've brexited early
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2019-02-05T16:33:21 < day> the difference between china an uk is that china reopens :^)
2019-02-05T16:36:39 < dongs> lorf
2019-02-05T16:42:12 < dongs> for driving ~16mhz signals over coat hangers do i want more or less slew rate, and higher or lower drive current?
2019-02-05T16:43:09 < kakimir> porting
2019-02-05T16:46:18 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTYD_kN7rPg musics?
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2019-02-05T16:52:38 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFkSUOm8u3Y more?
2019-02-05T16:53:50 < dongs> https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/yajiuma/1168227.html
2019-02-05T16:58:32 < qyx> you want to have your coat hangers twisted
2019-02-05T16:59:46 < dongs> i tried, that wasnt veryt helpful
2019-02-05T16:59:53 < dongs> i shall try to twist more
2019-02-05T17:02:03 < kakimir> uart has 64byte buffer
2019-02-05T17:02:28 < kakimir> just dump da dump
2019-02-05T17:02:37 < kakimir> this is future
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2019-02-05T17:10:39 < kakimir> how would you store PC when watchdog reset occurs?
2019-02-05T17:11:19 < kakimir> or
2019-02-05T17:11:20 < qyx> on stm32 there is an interrupt
2019-02-05T17:11:25 < qyx> occurring before the reset
2019-02-05T17:11:27 < kakimir> watchdog alert
2019-02-05T17:11:30 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-05T17:11:37 < qyx> you can store it here
2019-02-05T17:11:40 < kakimir> now I know what it's for
2019-02-05T17:12:36 < dongs> so you can log where your shit crashed?
2019-02-05T17:12:58 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-05T17:13:38 < kakimir> actually my shit doesn't crash
2019-02-05T17:14:15 < kakimir> current revision has been on field for hmm
2019-02-05T17:14:27 < kakimir> half an year
2019-02-05T17:14:48 < kakimir> I even forgot wdt with reset disabled
2019-02-05T17:15:53 < dongs> https://cdn.piek.international/wp-content/uploads/2017-SMT-soldering.jpg
2019-02-05T17:15:58 < dongs> this doesnt look very complex at all
2019-02-05T17:16:02 < dongs> i've hand soldered more weird shit
2019-02-05T17:16:08 < dongs> i could probly ace that shit without effort
2019-02-05T17:16:38 < kakimir> it would be also useful to replace while(1) loops in fault handlers
2019-02-05T17:16:53 < kakimir> at least I know it has not faulted once
2019-02-05T17:17:05 < kakimir> because it would be unresponsive
2019-02-05T17:17:13 < kakimir> lucky mistakes
2019-02-05T17:21:22 < kakimir> try QFN
2019-02-05T17:21:40 < kakimir> and get a real iron
2019-02-05T17:22:45 < bitmask> gimme more ram!
2019-02-05T17:26:42 < kakimir> it's hard to get information about status of buffer
2019-02-05T17:26:48 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/WqqIToH yay
2019-02-05T17:26:51 < kakimir> I can have event or interrupt
2019-02-05T17:26:57 < kakimir> but I cannot see way to poll it
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2019-02-05T17:51:39 < kakimir> I have set of functions to manipulate gpio
2019-02-05T17:51:55 < kakimir> for certain pin all the functions have same prefix
2019-02-05T17:52:08 < kakimir> ie. P2_1
2019-02-05T17:53:30 < kakimir> can I use macro mechanisms somehow to..
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2019-02-05T17:56:36 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-05T17:56:53 < kakimir> I have had poor success with stringify
2019-02-05T17:57:03 < kakimir> I will just write macros for all needed functions
2019-02-05T17:57:16 < kakimir> it's only like 15pins
2019-02-05T17:58:36 < qyx> Your order has shipped!
2019-02-05T18:01:06 < kakimir> what order?
2019-02-05T18:01:23 < kakimir> and are they fooling u
2019-02-05T18:01:37 < kakimir> "shipped" meaning it sits waiting for transport
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2019-02-05T18:02:31 < kakimir> fuu
2019-02-05T18:02:40 < kakimir> API has file GPIO.h
2019-02-05T18:02:49 < kakimir> my project has file gpio.h
2019-02-05T18:05:04 < kakimir> oh wait
2019-02-05T18:05:21 < kakimir> lib doesn't have GPIO.h.. it's in the hello world project
2019-02-05T18:05:52 < karlp> qyx: there's no interrupt for iwdg, only for wwdg
2019-02-05T18:06:06 < qyx> maybe
2019-02-05T18:06:39 < kakimir> xmc_gpio.h
2019-02-05T18:06:43 < kakimir> now we are talking
2019-02-05T18:07:29 < karlp> aandrew: did the assmebly house put those "green" wires on for you?
2019-02-05T18:09:11 < karlp> dongs: function was only for 320 points out of 634 if I read it right.
2019-02-05T18:09:24 < karlp> inspections and cleaning and safety procedures make up the rest
2019-02-05T18:09:30 < karlp> but yeah, shitty video.
2019-02-05T18:10:49 < dongs> oh there was a video
2019-02-05T18:10:55 < dongs> but its just a slideshow?
2019-02-05T18:11:09 < dongs> ah video later on
2019-02-05T18:11:12 < dongs> yeah it s that board
2019-02-05T18:11:18 < dongs> i donno man, that shit looks pretty basic
2019-02-05T18:11:32 < dongs> they even have dual tip irons..
2019-02-05T18:11:36 < dongs> for like 0603 or wahtever teh fuck parts
2019-02-05T18:11:57 < karlp> yeah, I mean, the winner got a perfect score, zero deductions
2019-02-05T18:12:16 < karlp> it's a bit of a wank anyway, a competition that only a few people knew about, who were already going to some conference
2019-02-05T18:12:32  * karlp soldered some 0402 today, "worked"
2019-02-05T18:12:50 < qyx> I am still considering moving from 0603 to 0402
2019-02-05T18:12:52 < karlp> even with my vomit loads of paste
2019-02-05T18:12:59 < qyx> but I have a plenty of 0603s available
2019-02-05T18:13:19 < karlp> board was laid out for 0603, but found some 0402s in the boxes, and wasn't going to use them for anythign else so plced them instead.
2019-02-05T18:13:49 < dongs> ya 0402 fit ok into 0603 footprint, just higher chances of tombstone/floating off
2019-02-05T18:14:05 < karlp> yeah, it's a oneoff, wasn't concerned
2019-02-05T18:14:19 < karlp> that competition is pro too, total score: 634. Grand total (600 possible)
2019-02-05T18:14:22 <@englishman> lol IPC CHAMPION
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2019-02-05T18:15:01 <@englishman> do they drug test
2019-02-05T18:29:45 < kakimir> we should participate
2019-02-05T18:37:30 < aandrew> karlp: those are my boards
2019-02-05T18:37:33 < aandrew> I hand assembled those
2019-02-05T18:38:00 < aandrew> also ultrasonic cleaner works amazeballs. I usually don't wash boards but had to put stickers on those little mosfet modules
2019-02-05T18:40:01 < kakimir> pcb soldering drinking game
2019-02-05T18:41:33 < kakimir> ultrasonic acetone cleaning does miracles in 60C
2019-02-05T18:44:47 < aandrew> I bet
2019-02-05T18:44:57 < aandrew> I'm using official electronic cleaner at 10% strength (could go 5% I think)
2019-02-05T18:45:20 < aandrew> it was $80 for a 4L jug which should last me a good long time considering I don't wash much
2019-02-05T18:50:46 < kakimir> does it smell like alcohol?
2019-02-05T18:50:52 < kakimir> alcohols
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2019-02-05T19:16:16 < karlp> new laptop keeps thermal throttling while building big projets
2019-02-05T19:18:13 < Steffanx> Whops
2019-02-05T19:18:59 <@englishman> the apple design principles
2019-02-05T19:19:10 <@englishman> put in top end hardware and assume noone will use it
2019-02-05T19:19:25 < kakimir> >laptop
2019-02-05T19:19:30 < kakimir> >big projects
2019-02-05T19:22:12 < karlp> well, old laptop was not as portable, but worked just fine for building shit
2019-02-05T19:22:16 < karlp> new one is perhaps a little slim
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2019-02-05T20:04:53 < con3> I'm seeing something very weird, my DMA is shifting its memory pointer to the second buffer, but the NDTR shows that the first buffer isn't fully filled :/
2019-02-05T20:06:41 < bitmask> gotta adjust some spacing and what menu items/names I actually want but the system is working great! https://youtu.be/oj37YSloDgU
2019-02-05T20:07:18 < bitmask> hah does the preview actually say MeHigh?
2019-02-05T20:09:32 < bitmask> Really happy with it
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2019-02-05T20:31:10 < kakimir> xmc1100 has holistic approach for interfacing peripherals
2019-02-05T20:31:51 < Cracki> feng shui crossbar
2019-02-05T20:32:42 < antto> feng shui dice thrower
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2019-02-05T20:41:33 < kakimir> https://jaycarlson.net/pf/infineon-xmc1100/
2019-02-05T20:50:02 < kakimir> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/infineon-technologies/KITXMCLINKSEGGERV1TOBO1/KITXMCLINKSEGGERV1TOBO1-ND/5970448 isolated jlink
2019-02-05T20:50:11 < kakimir> xmc-link
2019-02-05T20:51:54 < kakimir> I wonder how full-blown jlink that is
2019-02-05T20:52:12 < kakimir> is it crimped somehow to only support xmc series chips or so
2019-02-05T20:58:30 < Cracki> >logarithmic-brightness LED control
2019-02-05T20:58:39 < Cracki> I see they understand their craft
2019-02-05T20:59:01 < Cracki> on a CM0! >XMC1300 adds math coprocessor
2019-02-05T20:59:25 < Cracki> cordic unit in particular
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2019-02-05T21:07:27 < kakimir> let m0 crunch
2019-02-05T21:07:48 < kakimir> there is plenty of power for many kinds of applications
2019-02-05T21:08:04 < kakimir> Cracki: have you played with infineon?
2019-02-05T21:08:38 < Cracki> no but I've looked at them (cursorily) several times and keep mentioning them to my boss, who does all the electronics design
2019-02-05T21:08:46 < kakimir> I wonder if XMC1300 is XMC1100 direct replacement
2019-02-05T21:09:00 < kakimir> like in LPC realm LPC13xx is direct slap-on
2019-02-05T21:09:08 < kakimir> for LPC11xx
2019-02-05T21:09:29 < Cracki> pin compatible you mean? maybe they have an app note answering that :P
2019-02-05T21:09:47 < Cracki> wouldn't surprise me if they paid attention to pin compat
2019-02-05T21:09:56 < Cracki> (infineon are germans)
2019-02-05T21:14:36 < kakimir> pinouts and pins look identical
2019-02-05T21:14:37 < Cracki> if you want a little more, there's XMC4xxx
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2019-02-05T21:14:59 < kakimir> Cracki: you do the codings?
2019-02-05T21:15:06 < Cracki> I do the codings
2019-02-05T21:15:27 < kakimir> do you have energy after works to code your own?
2019-02-05T21:15:52 < Cracki> yes :3 he doesn't get/pay for many hours a week
2019-02-05T21:16:44 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-05T21:17:03 < Steffanx> Did you know silabs isnt that bad either kakimir? And cheapish. Why you went for xmc mr kakimir?
2019-02-05T21:17:09 < kakimir> 5v
2019-02-05T21:17:19 < kakimir> codebase is for m0
2019-02-05T21:17:19 < Steffanx> awh
2019-02-05T21:17:23 < kakimir> 12bit adc
2019-02-05T21:17:34 < qyx> his 5V dictates things
2019-02-05T21:17:59 < kakimir> it's just an another voltage
2019-02-05T21:18:01 < qyx> I wonder if you get m0 when you glue 4 AVRs in parallel
2019-02-05T21:18:41 < Steffanx> fuck AVR.
2019-02-05T21:19:16 < Steffanx> Was lucky enough to work with one today. Had to get a spi slave working, was wondering why i couldnt make it work. 
2019-02-05T21:19:42 < kakimir> so
2019-02-05T21:19:45 < kakimir> it didn't have master?
2019-02-05T21:19:56 < kakimir> only slave spi?
2019-02-05T21:20:09 < Steffanx> Read errata. > "peripherals pin override may not work when using bladie blablabla."
2019-02-05T21:20:10 < Steffanx> fuck that.
2019-02-05T21:20:49 < qyx> yes, fuck them
2019-02-05T21:20:51 < Steffanx> i really like it when they use the word "may" in such errata. Especially when the workaround is "None". 
2019-02-05T21:20:57 < Steffanx> Be fucking specifici about what does not work.
2019-02-05T21:21:03 < Steffanx> And what does work.
2019-02-05T21:21:33 < Steffanx> xmega much. I get the feeling the abandonded it.
2019-02-05T21:21:39 < kakimir> I should read xmc1100 errata now
2019-02-05T21:21:47 < Steffanx> You should always read the errata before using something.
2019-02-05T21:21:51 < Steffanx> always.
2019-02-05T21:21:52 < kakimir> as I have made the boards and about to send gerbers in
2019-02-05T21:22:26 < Steffanx> or you will run into shit like me.
2019-02-05T21:22:35 < Steffanx> *like i did
2019-02-05T21:22:54 < qyx> I did once
2019-02-05T21:22:59 < qyx> for enc28j60
2019-02-05T21:23:06 < Steffanx> haha also microshit.
2019-02-05T21:23:18 < qyx> I threw it away instantly
2019-02-05T21:23:42 < Steffanx> isnt it still used by the arduino gang? with the same bugs.
2019-02-05T21:23:49 < qyx> it is
2019-02-05T21:24:00 < qyx> haha, some time ago
2019-02-05T21:24:07 < qyx> I was reading some report on blitzorting.org
2019-02-05T21:24:23 < qyx> and their VLF lighting measurement thing
2019-02-05T21:24:40 < Steffanx> for some reason i didnt want to use the enc28j60 and went for some wiznet thing. Wasnt too bad actually, with the tcp/ip stack in hw.
2019-02-05T21:24:57 < qyx> there were a schematic of the thing with a F4 together with enc28j60
2019-02-05T21:25:02 < Steffanx> :D
2019-02-05T21:25:05 < qyx> *was
2019-02-05T21:25:15 < Cracki> F4 includes an ethernet mac, doesn't it
2019-02-05T21:25:24 < qyx> I was curious why did they do that
2019-02-05T21:25:39 < Cracki> because they didn't think
2019-02-05T21:25:40 < zyp> Cracki, yeah, except the smallest variants
2019-02-05T21:25:40 < qyx> but couldn't find the answer
2019-02-05T21:26:14 < Cracki> maybe they had some code for an ip stack that hardcoded for 28j60
2019-02-05T21:26:41 < qyx> actually that was one of the reasons I started doing the same thing and offering a board design for them
2019-02-05T21:26:53 < Cracki> or... arduino. arduino can target cortex m, and there's surely some enc28j60 library that might even be shit
2019-02-05T21:27:08 < qyx> because even the board was eagled up with top/bottom routing perpendicular to each other
2019-02-05T21:27:14 < qyx> and with square (!) vias
2019-02-05T21:27:21 < Cracki> how
2019-02-05T21:27:24 < Cracki> wwww
2019-02-05T21:27:39 < Cracki> set circle ncorners=4?
2019-02-05T21:28:01 < qyx> http://en.blitzortung.org/Menu_Images/Controller_PCB_18.jpg
2019-02-05T21:28:09 < kakimir> https://www.infineon.com/dgdl/Infineon-xmc1100_AB-ES-v01_04-EN.pdf?fileId=5546d4624a0bf290014a0f5813ba6a1b
2019-02-05T21:28:10 < qyx> uh now they are round
2019-02-05T21:28:24 < Cracki> *enhance enhance* I see pixels. the vias might be round or not
2019-02-05T21:28:32 < kakimir> anyone read this errata with me?
2019-02-05T21:28:34 < qyx> theres still the enc28j60 thing
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2019-02-05T21:29:09 < kakimir> btw.
2019-02-05T21:29:14 < kakimir> if you buy a chip
2019-02-05T21:29:38 < kakimir> is there any chance you get silicon revision from year 2016?
2019-02-05T21:30:08 < zyp> duh, depends where you buy it from
2019-02-05T21:30:18 < kakimir> mouser, digikey
2019-02-05T21:30:32 < zyp> also what chip
2019-02-05T21:30:51 < kakimir> in this case xmc1100
2019-02-05T21:30:57 < zyp> three years doesn't sound neither unreasonably new or unreasonably old to me
2019-02-05T21:30:59 < Cracki> I think they source directly, so it hasn't been sitting in some warehouse for over 3 years
2019-02-05T21:31:12 < kakimir> but I always wonder how long it usually takes for new silicon revision to totally flush old stocks
2019-02-05T21:31:33 < Cracki> same
2019-02-05T21:31:47 < zyp> Cracki, sure it can have been, if you buy some unpopular shit that doesn't get restocked often
2019-02-05T21:31:51 < Cracki> impossible to tell? depends on distribution path at the very least
2019-02-05T21:31:57 < Cracki> yeh
2019-02-05T21:32:25 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-05T21:32:30 < kakimir> some old errata can look like "ewww!" and new errata can look like "hmm!"
2019-02-05T21:32:31 < Cracki> if you're out of luck, you buy from some street vendor who closes his shop right after you leave
2019-02-05T21:33:01 < zyp> idk when stm32f427 rev 3 was made, but it was pretty fucking hard to get my hands on during summer 2015
2019-02-05T21:33:13 < zyp> asked several vendors, most only had rev 1
2019-02-05T21:33:56 < Cracki> would be nice if digikey/... listed the revision they sell
2019-02-05T21:34:24 < zyp> digikey fucked up and sent me rev 1 parts even though they promised rev 3 :p
2019-02-05T21:34:38 < Cracki> ... then nobody would buy the old stuff... then they'd have to list the oldest rev in stock and only sell newer ones upon request
2019-02-05T21:34:49 < Cracki> that sucks
2019-02-05T21:35:09 < zyp> according to the f427 errata sheet, information about rev 3 was added in may 2014
2019-02-05T21:35:31 < kakimir> when did rev3 become widelly available?
2019-02-05T21:35:39 < kakimir> thru the common channels
2019-02-05T21:35:41 < Cracki> I'm beginning to understand my boss's preference for "old" chips. they're old enough to have all the silicon bugs chased out
2019-02-05T21:36:31 < zyp> dunno, dongs managed to find somebody with it in stock after that digikey fuckup
2019-02-05T21:37:40 < zyp> Cracki, my problem was that I had a board originally designed for f407
2019-02-05T21:37:44 < kakimir> Cracki: mature.
2019-02-05T21:38:15 < Cracki> "mature" is an euphemism used by age fetishists
2019-02-05T21:38:39 < kakimir> indeed
2019-02-05T21:38:47 < zyp> then people found out they wanted more flash than 1MB and we decided to swap to f427 with 2MB flash instead, since we had a bunch of bare pcbs still that we didn't want to throw away and respin to add serial flash
2019-02-05T21:38:57 < Cracki> anyway, new shit is hard to source so he get another point for that
2019-02-05T21:39:27 < Cracki> so you upgraded 407 to 427, and suddenly bugs everywhere?
2019-02-05T21:39:35 < zyp> and pre rev-3 f427 has an errata that would corrupt reads from the second half of that f427 flash
2019-02-05T21:39:40 < Cracki> awesome
2019-02-05T21:40:10 < zyp> it's the most ridiculous shit
2019-02-05T21:40:16 < zyp> «When PA12 is used as GPIO or alternate function in input or output mode, the data read
2019-02-05T21:40:19 < zyp> from Flash memory can be corrupted.»
2019-02-05T21:40:24 < Cracki> wat
2019-02-05T21:40:35 < Cracki> spooky action at a distance?
2019-02-05T21:40:37 < kakimir> sweet!
2019-02-05T21:40:42 < zyp> workarounds: don't use PA12 or don't use flash bank 2
2019-02-05T21:40:48 < Cracki> kek
2019-02-05T21:41:02 < zyp> our design used PA12 and the whole point of swapping to f427 was to get the second flash bank :p
2019-02-05T21:41:05 < Cracki> so... did you need pa12 for anything?
2019-02-05T21:41:08 < Cracki> hah
2019-02-05T21:41:09 < zyp> yeah, USB
2019-02-05T21:41:20 < Cracki> pcb surgery to remap to different pin?
2019-02-05T21:41:24 < Cracki> yay bodge wires
2019-02-05T21:42:07 < zyp> nah, at that point I'd rather add a flash to the footprint and make them pay for another pcb run
2019-02-05T21:42:20 < Cracki> indeed
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2019-02-05T21:43:35 < Cracki> how did you notice the corrupt reads to the second half?
2019-02-05T21:43:43 < zyp> also digikey refunded me the money I paid and told me to keep the rev 1 parts
2019-02-05T21:43:44 < Cracki> in system or by combing errata sheet?
2019-02-05T21:43:49 < Cracki> nice
2019-02-05T21:43:55 < zyp> which I think dongs ended up using for some other shit :p
2019-02-05T21:44:12 < zyp> just found it in the errata sheet, never assembled a board with rev 1
2019-02-05T21:44:13 < Cracki> sounds like he did assembly for that?
2019-02-05T21:44:16 < zyp> yes
2019-02-05T21:44:27 < zyp> I had digikey ship them directly there
2019-02-05T21:44:35 < Cracki> convenient
2019-02-05T21:45:09 < zyp> no point in having them shipped to norway, pay 25% VAT on import and then send them abroad again
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2019-02-05T23:16:09 < kakimir> NVM Write access to trigger NVM erase operation must
2019-02-05T23:16:10 < kakimir> NOT be executed from NVM
2019-02-05T23:18:38 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-05T23:18:50 < kakimir> now I understand
2019-02-05T23:19:01 < kakimir> rom api is used
2019-02-05T23:23:57 < ds2> zyp: lucky!
2019-02-05T23:24:08 < ds2> 3PH here is a lot of trouble
2019-02-05T23:25:45 < kakimir> how to control leaf inverter http://productions.8dromeda.net/c55-leaf-inverter-protocol.html
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2019-02-05T23:28:25 < kakimir> also some snow drifting
2019-02-05T23:32:13 < Steffanx> Could he find a more ugly car?
2019-02-05T23:32:17 < kakimir> no
2019-02-05T23:33:01 < kakimir> absolute ugli has been reached
2019-02-05T23:33:15 < kakimir> but it's very functional
2019-02-05T23:41:19 < kakimir> spacious
2019-02-05T23:41:22 < kakimir> doors
2019-02-05T23:41:26 < kakimir> big seats
2019-02-05T23:41:30 < kakimir> easy structure
2019-02-05T23:41:46 < kakimir> lot of room under the car to utilize for modifications
2019-02-05T23:44:45 < kakimir> chassis and struts look like from small truck or heavy duty work cars
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--- Day changed Wed Feb 06 2019
2019-02-06T00:00:14 < karlp> ds2: where are you again?
2019-02-06T00:00:32 < karlp> traditionally homes were one phase here, but anything newbuild is always three phase.
2019-02-06T00:01:39 -!- sterna [~Adium@c-7de0e253.016-35-62726f1.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
2019-02-06T00:03:11 < ds2> karlp: California, USA
2019-02-06T00:03:33 < karlp> right, I knew _getting_ three phase is a problem, but what are newbuilds getting thhere?
2019-02-06T00:06:52 -!- tprrt [~tprrt@ram31-1-82-234-79-177.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
2019-02-06T00:07:36 < ds2> 1PH @ 200A
2019-02-06T00:08:25 < karlp> gross
2019-02-06T00:12:47 < kakimir> legacy of anaconda copper
2019-02-06T00:12:56 < kakimir> 110V and single phase
2019-02-06T00:13:44 < kakimir> plot to pump copper price
2019-02-06T00:16:11 < kakimir> wiring was copper, handshakes were golden
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2019-02-06T00:24:36 < boostedcabbage> what generally provides librt for the arm toolchain?
2019-02-06T00:24:37 < karlp> bah kicad website down all dow
2019-02-06T00:24:59 < karlp> boostedcabbage: probaly nothhing for baremetal.
2019-02-06T00:25:14 < boostedcabbage> trying to build ardupilot
2019-02-06T00:28:36 < kakimir> karlp: what you need the site for?
2019-02-06T00:38:03 -!- Jybz [~jibz@ip-37-201-5-63.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2019-02-06T00:47:09 < karlp> trying to follow the KLC for some new footprints
2019-02-06T00:47:13 < karlp> google cache was enough 
2019-02-06T00:47:50 < kakimir> why?
2019-02-06T00:50:46 < kakimir> new footprints?
2019-02-06T00:52:40 < kakimir> empty library or?
2019-02-06T00:53:28 < karlp> new symbols, new footprints, all the shit people need to do
2019-02-06T00:53:49 < karlp> I'm _generally_ trying to make anything that I have to make as feasible as possible to upstream, tedious as that often is.
2019-02-06T01:06:09 < kakimir> my stomach is making a loud noise
2019-02-06T01:06:19 < kakimir> it's bubblin
2019-02-06T01:06:44 < kakimir> when I breathe
2019-02-06T01:11:39 < kakimir> I need music
2019-02-06T01:18:48 < mawk> ingest nutrients
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2019-02-06T01:30:00 < karlp> blah mornsun step links are all busted
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2019-02-06T01:37:18 < aandrew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=734&v=2pAy5DvuidA that's pretty nifty
2019-02-06T01:37:43 < aandrew> go from -74dBm to -98dBm of noise with a couple extra I/O and some passives
2019-02-06T01:43:52 < karlp> is there a summar? or do I have to watch 47minutes?Ð
2019-02-06T01:44:57 < aandrew> yeah 
2019-02-06T01:45:05 < aandrew> https://m.eet.com/media/1134628/15421-93004di.pdf is what it's based off of
2019-02-06T01:45:14 < aandrew> simplified circuit is like 3m in
2019-02-06T01:45:47 < aandrew> in a nutshell: create PWM/PDM output and an inverted duplicate
2019-02-06T01:46:06 < aandrew> feed the inverted duplicate through a HIGH PASS filter and add that to the normal output
2019-02-06T01:46:14 < aandrew> you're basically subtracting the noise off
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2019-02-06T01:48:15 < karlp> this is like the reverse of adding noise to an adc to help with oversampling?
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2019-02-06T01:48:55 < karlp> this is for making better quality dac output with pwm/pdm stuff right?
2019-02-06T01:49:45 < aandrew> karlp: this isn't about dithering 
2019-02-06T01:50:04 < aandrew> it's about removing PWM/PDM noise without slowing shit down like crazy with a heavier filter
2019-02-06T02:02:47 < Laurenceb_123> which waifu? https://imgoat.com/uploads/597e50502f/193190.png
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2019-02-06T02:06:46 < kakimir> ladies
2019-02-06T02:07:38 < Laurenceb_123> ikr
2019-02-06T02:07:45 < Laurenceb_123> those legs
2019-02-06T02:09:18 < kakimir> something fishy about it
2019-02-06T02:13:03 < kakimir> image created to shape public opinion
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2019-02-06T05:32:36 < jadew> I wonder if what I have has a name
2019-02-06T05:33:39 < jadew> spent ~one hour or more (maybe... I lost track of time?), because I wanted to add a comment before I commited some changes
2019-02-06T05:34:38 < jadew> comment that I might not need - I had to do some math to figure out some possible values in order to add them as examples
2019-02-06T05:35:41 < jadew> before this I had an internal struggle on wether to proceed and do the math or just commit and forget about it
2019-02-06T05:39:51 < dongs> that autism bro
2019-02-06T05:39:56 < jadew> lol
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2019-02-06T09:10:47 < dongs> https://securityaffairs.co/wordpress/80685/hacking/ubiquiti-vulnerable-devices.html lol
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2019-02-06T09:16:26 < dongs> lunixfags
2019-02-06T09:16:28 < dongs> more like
2019-02-06T09:17:14 < qyx> hjalp sos
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2019-02-06T09:27:29 < Thorn> musics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wm8vcFn0bgY
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2019-02-06T09:28:46 < Thorn> http://fuckingifcaseletsyntax.com/ >modern programming languages
2019-02-06T09:30:33 < dongs> lol swift
2019-02-06T09:30:38 < dongs> faggot shit made for no purpose just like python
2019-02-06T09:30:40 < dongs> fuck off and die
2019-02-06T09:31:10 < dongs> some apple-only language
2019-02-06T09:31:18 < dongs> best way to desolder Apple A10X?
2019-02-06T09:31:22 < dongs> to turn it into keychain
2019-02-06T09:31:29 < dongs> looks like there's epoxy underfill and shit.
2019-02-06T09:33:50 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/q1w81CD.jpg
2019-02-06T09:34:13 < dongs> that PMIC under it is funny
2019-02-06T09:34:23 < dongs> its just surrounded by caps and coils
2019-02-06T09:34:32 < dongs> literally nothing else
2019-02-06T09:36:29 < dongs> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_A10X
2019-02-06T09:36:32 < sync> oh those feedthrough caps are interesting
2019-02-06T09:36:46 < dongs> the ones with 4 pins?
2019-02-06T09:39:31 < sync> yes
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2019-02-06T09:45:42 < dongs> whats so good about them
2019-02-06T09:45:45 < dongs> https://www.murata.com/~/media/webrenewal/products/emc/emifil/knowhow/20to22.ashx
2019-02-06T09:45:48 < dongs> this shit?
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2019-02-06T09:57:50 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-06T09:58:09 < kakimir> that is why there is three terminals
2019-02-06T09:59:45 < kakimir> that apple stuff has that all over the shop
2019-02-06T10:02:56 < kakimir> probs you get away with smaller area for caps
2019-02-06T10:03:06 < kakimir> using those
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2019-02-06T10:16:55 < dongs> oh hah
2019-02-06T10:17:05 < dongs> these days 'reballing' doesnt even bother weith actual balls
2019-02-06T10:17:14 < dongs> they just put a stencil on it and cover with paste
2019-02-06T10:17:26 < dongs> https://youtu.be/QsgjeVqqhlY?t=431
2019-02-06T10:19:07 < dongs> oh wait what
2019-02-06T10:19:09 < dongs> they heat them up
2019-02-06T10:19:19 < dongs> to turn into balls
2019-02-06T10:19:19 < dongs> omg
2019-02-06T10:19:20 < dongs> amazing
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2019-02-06T10:37:56 < kakimir> you are starting your own iphone repair business dongs?
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2019-02-06T12:38:11 < kakimir> puzzle of shadow registers and triggers
2019-02-06T12:40:02 < kakimir> there is even mechanisms to update timercounter values
2019-02-06T12:42:55 < kakimir> what is floating prescaler
2019-02-06T12:43:06 < kakimir> and fixed prescaler
2019-02-06T12:47:23 < kakimir> check out "XMC CCU4"
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2019-02-06T13:19:20 <@englishman> https://i1.wp.com/securityaffairs.co/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Digging-The-Deep-Web.png?w=412&ssl=1
2019-02-06T13:19:23 <@englishman> typical hacker attire
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2019-02-06T14:53:51 < Ecco> Hi everyone
2019-02-06T14:53:58 < Ecco> Which crystal brand would you recommend?
2019-02-06T14:55:53 < karlp> the cheapest ones.
2019-02-06T14:55:54 < dongs> the cheapest one
2019-02-06T14:55:57 < dongs> doh
2019-02-06T14:56:02 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-06T14:56:02  * karlp hi5s dongs
2019-02-06T14:56:18 < karlp> pick size, pick speed, pick stability ifyou care, order by price, by
2019-02-06T14:56:21 < Ecco> Yeah, I'm looking for a "serious" datasheet to pick the land pattern from
2019-02-06T14:56:29 < karlp> you're overthinking it again.
2019-02-06T14:56:34 < Ecco> probably
2019-02-06T14:56:40 < Ecco> Well, I want an HC49 SMD
2019-02-06T14:56:41 < karlp> abracon/epson are both cheap and readily available
2019-02-06T14:56:46 < karlp> fuck you and your hc49 bullshit
2019-02-06T14:56:51 < Ecco> why?
2019-02-06T14:56:54 < Ecco> :-D
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2019-02-06T14:58:12 < karlp> same reasons as last time.
2019-02-06T14:58:34 < Ecco> well, yeah, but they're cheaper
2019-02-06T14:58:46 < karlp> I'm not remotely convinced that you're making a meaningful bottom line improvement by using a hc49 crystal instead of a 3225 or similar.
2019-02-06T14:58:55 < karlp> but go on, keep telling yourself that.
2019-02-06T14:59:13 < dongs> HC49 DIP is cheaper
2019-02-06T14:59:14 < Ecco> well, I really don't want to offend you in any way
2019-02-06T14:59:16 < dongs> HC49 smd is NOT cheaper.
2019-02-06T14:59:32 < karlp> you're not offending me, I just think you're making poor choices :)
2019-02-06T14:59:39 < Ecco> Currently we pay 3225 ~17c, and HC49SMD ~5c
2019-02-06T14:59:52 < karlp> and how many units are you making?
2019-02-06T14:59:55 < Ecco> a bunch
2019-02-06T14:59:59 < karlp> right.
2019-02-06T15:00:05 < dongs> 10
2019-02-06T15:00:09 < karlp> well, go on then, you know what you're doing. what do you need from us?
2019-02-06T15:03:01 < Ecco> let's say at least 10k
2019-02-06T15:03:21 < Ecco> but anyway, you can make a very good design and manufacture a few
2019-02-06T15:03:21 < dongs> anyoen know a decent opensores network / http lib that isnt cancer and works on windows?
2019-02-06T15:03:25 < dongs> i.e. not curl and shit
2019-02-06T15:03:27 < Ecco> or make a bunch and have a bad design
2019-02-06T15:03:30 < dongs> something less bloated
2019-02-06T15:03:46 < dongs> preferably a file or two that I add to project without wanking around
2019-02-06T15:04:00 < Ecco> dongs: what's wrong with curl?
2019-02-06T15:04:44 < dongs> < dongs> preferably a file or two that I add to project without wanking around
2019-02-06T15:04:48 < dongs> it fails this requirement
2019-02-06T15:04:51 < dongs> < dongs> something less bloated
2019-02-06T15:04:52 < dongs> and this one
2019-02-06T15:05:22 < Ecco> well, the problem with network is that you never really know who you'll be talking to, so I'd believe you're better be on the safe side
2019-02-06T15:06:03 < Ecco> Maybe there's a windows-only API though?
2019-02-06T15:06:12 < dongs> winhttp, i am already using it.
2019-02-06T15:06:15 < Ecco> seems like there's winhttp.h
2019-02-06T15:06:23 < Ecco> see, probably can't get any easier :)
2019-02-06T15:06:25 < karlp> openwrt guysbuilt https://git.openwrt.org/?p=project/uclient.git;a=summary to be a tiny alternative to libcurl/busybox wget
2019-02-06T15:06:26 < dongs> i dont want to use it tho
2019-02-06T15:06:34 < karlp> but you're probably gonna hate it.
2019-02-06T15:06:41 < dongs> does it build on windows?
2019-02-06T15:06:50 < karlp> hah
2019-02-06T15:06:58 < dongs> i mean, thats like #1 requirement lol
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2019-02-06T15:45:47 < dongs> https://rakuten.today/blog/rakutens-upcoming-end-to-end-cloud-native-mobile-network.html can someone understand waht teh fuck is this guy on about
2019-02-06T15:46:42 < dongs> A fully virtualized network allows a shift away from a model in which the hardware and software are tightly coupled to enable Network Functions Virtualization (NFV) technology to keep up with constantly changing market conditions. NFV uses the principles of cloud computing to create service delivery platforms with greater agility and customization.
2019-02-06T15:46:47 < dongs> especially this garbage
2019-02-06T15:46:59 < dongs> its like buzzword on buzzword
2019-02-06T15:48:35 < dongs> no doubt there
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2019-02-06T15:49:59 < dongs> autism-infused networking
2019-02-06T15:53:37 < Cracki> they just want to part rich fuckers from their money
2019-02-06T15:58:32 < englishbot> [Varna, Bulgaria] Overcast. Temp is 4.5°C. East wind: 1.4 kph. Humidity: 81%.
2019-02-06T16:14:32 < kakimir> infineon dave has "cube"
2019-02-06T16:16:22 < kakimir> it's touching me
2019-02-06T16:21:39 < kakimir> fucking yes
2019-02-06T16:21:51 < kakimir> my code was almost right
2019-02-06T16:22:11 < kakimir> should I look what was the problem or just enjoy?
2019-02-06T16:22:19 < kakimir> added like 2 lines of code
2019-02-06T16:23:19 < kakimir> I assume it was that idle flag
2019-02-06T16:23:26 < kakimir> that needed to be cleared
2019-02-06T16:26:57 < kakimir> 	/* clear IDLE mode for the slice*/
2019-02-06T16:26:59 < kakimir> 	XMC_CCU4_EnableClock(CCU40, (uint8_t)0);
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2019-02-06T16:29:37 < kakimir> I got pretty far without dave app or "cube"
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2019-02-06T16:52:06 < Cracki> wanna laugh at muricans? they're too snobby to step out of the car anywhere but at that fucking curb https://twitter.com/urbanthoughts11/status/1051568823739052032
2019-02-06T16:52:35 < Cracki> (ok ok I'm assuming it's muricans, but have no indication)
2019-02-06T16:54:05 < Cracki> aaand it's muricans https://usa.streetsblog.org/2016/12/16/watch-the-insanity-of-american-school-drop-off/
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2019-02-06T16:57:07 < bitmask> who was telling me to worry about Beryllium oxide if I were to disassemble a microwave? stop passing on your myths :P
2019-02-06T16:57:47 < qyx> beryllium oxide sounds like a fun to play with
2019-02-06T16:58:04 < bitmask> they havent used it in microwaves in a while from what I read
2019-02-06T16:58:10 < bitmask> to be RoHS compliant
2019-02-06T16:58:46 < BrainDamage> RoHS is 'only' 20 years old
2019-02-06T16:58:52 < BrainDamage> there's microwave ovens older than that
2019-02-06T16:59:22 < bitmask> yes but its still a much much smaller risk than was presented
2019-02-06T16:59:48 < bitmask> I thought it was in every mw from that convo
2019-02-06T17:07:28 < zyp> Cracki, haha, that looks pretty ridiculous
2019-02-06T17:11:15 < kakimir> last snus
2019-02-06T17:24:39 < jadew> bitmask, I told you about that and it's not a myth
2019-02-06T17:24:54 < jadew> bitmask, just be careful
2019-02-06T17:24:56 < bitmask> hah I know its not a myth but its not as common as you made it seem
2019-02-06T17:25:06 < jadew> you don't know what gets imported from china with the CE mark on it
2019-02-06T17:25:20 < bitmask> BeO is white so it should be fairly easy to tell what insulator they use by color
2019-02-06T17:25:36 < jadew> RoHS is only reliable if everyone follows the rules, which is not the case
2019-02-06T17:25:36 < bitmask> but yes I agree I should be very careful no matter what
2019-02-06T17:26:15 < jadew> bitmask, I don't know about the color, I heard they might be pink
2019-02-06T17:26:29 < jadew> not sure how good of an indicator that is tho
2019-02-06T17:29:47 < karlp> it also doesn't matter unless you grind it up...
2019-02-06T17:29:51 < qyx> yes
2019-02-06T17:29:53 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-06T17:29:58 < qyx> as long as it is rigid, no worries
2019-02-06T17:30:17 < jadew> although... someone else might have done that before you (at the factory for example)
2019-02-06T17:30:28 < jadew> so there could be some dust already waiting for you
2019-02-06T17:33:04 < bitmask> I heard pink was fine
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2019-02-06T17:41:53 < bitmask> I think pink is something with alumina
2019-02-06T17:42:04 < bitmask> all this is based on a youtube video I watched :)
2019-02-06T17:44:06 < kakimir> there is 4x16bit timers
2019-02-06T17:44:12 < kakimir> that can be chained
2019-02-06T17:44:24 < kakimir> next challenge - get it chained
2019-02-06T17:46:01 < kakimir> I hope there is buffered mem address to read the combined value from
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2019-02-06T17:55:32 < jadew> bitmask, yeah, I don't know where I've heard the pink thing, maybe the pink one was ok - I don't know
2019-02-06T17:56:09 < bitmask> ehh better safe than sorry
2019-02-06T17:56:45 < bitmask> how do you safely discharge a big capacitor?
2019-02-06T17:57:06 < bitmask> wear thick gloves and connect a dummy load?
2019-02-06T17:59:40 < jadew> that reminds me of a story about a TV repair man
2019-02-06T17:59:49 < BrainDamage> I just wire a power resistor
2019-02-06T18:00:03 < jadew> he opened the TV at the customer's house and started discharging the cap like a pro, with a screw driver
2019-02-06T18:00:19 < BrainDamage> just have the decency to calculate the peak power so it doesn't burn
2019-02-06T18:00:22 < jadew> he did it once, twice, 3 times: "Damn... this cap is recovering fast"
2019-02-06T18:00:28 < jadew> turned out it was still plugged in
2019-02-06T18:01:38 < jadew> not his only achievement of this sort
2019-02-06T18:11:39 < bitmask> someone send me a meter of 25mm^2 wire
2019-02-06T18:27:35 < kakimir> copper or alu?
2019-02-06T18:29:10 < kakimir> fine strand or coarse strand?
2019-02-06T18:29:19 < kakimir> or EF?
2019-02-06T18:31:52 < bitmask> copper coarse
2019-02-06T18:31:55 < bitmask> whats ef?
2019-02-06T18:33:00 < PaulFertser> Sadale: hey :) Do you think it's possible to find a datasheet for this Cortex-M based controller with integrated radio? PAN163CX (likely there's XN297L transceiver integrated) https://world.taobao.com/item/568533071945.htm?spm=a21wu.11804641.1.1 . Or probably dongs' chinagirl can get that?
2019-02-06T18:34:31 < kakimir> bitmask: extrafine
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2019-02-06T18:34:46 < bitmask> oh
2019-02-06T18:36:00 < kakimir> 1.5GB zip inside a zip
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2019-02-06T18:38:40 < kakimir> lack of processing power becomes apparent
2019-02-06T18:38:54 < Sadale> PaulFertser, let me check
2019-02-06T18:40:27 < Sadale> PaulFertser, bad luck. Ask me again later. It's Chinese new year holiday. Those staffs don't work.
2019-02-06T18:40:46 < Sadale> PaulFertser, I found nothing on google. So I have to ask their customer support.
2019-02-06T18:41:02 < PaulFertser> Sadale: thank you for trying!
2019-02-06T18:41:39 < PaulFertser> Sadale: I thought there might be something on "Chinese google", I've checked the regular one already, that's the most detailed info I could find.
2019-02-06T18:41:46 < Sadale> PaulFertser, baidu.
2019-02-06T18:41:55 < Sadale> Anyway if Google couldn't catch it, I doubt that baidu would catch it.
2019-02-06T18:42:10 < bitmask> will these go boom?
2019-02-06T18:42:10 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/2018-6pcs-LiitoKala-NEW-original-NCR18650B-3-7V-3400mAh-18650-rechargeable-lithium-battery-for-battery-DIY/217753_32855302955.html
2019-02-06T18:42:19 < Sadale> PaulFertser, The whole point of getting me to help is that, when there's a piece of Chinese text, they may well you where to get more info about the chip.
2019-02-06T18:42:35 < Sadale> PaulFertser, yes, there's a piece of Chinese text on the site. But it said nothing about datasheet.
2019-02-06T18:42:58 < kakimir> liitokala :o
2019-02-06T18:43:02 < PaulFertser> Sadale: I thought you might know "places" :)
2019-02-06T18:43:03 < kakimir> it's a finnish word
2019-02-06T18:43:20 < kakimir> liito = glide, fly
2019-02-06T18:43:22 < kakimir> kala = fish
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2019-02-06T18:44:03 < bitmask> but they are not flying fish, they are batteries
2019-02-06T18:44:05 < bitmask> :)
2019-02-06T18:46:09 < kakimir> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exocoetus_volitans this is liitokala in finnish
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2019-02-06T18:50:09 < kakimir> I wonder if there is random name generators for such products
2019-02-06T18:53:48 < qyx> I knew it sounds nordish
2019-02-06T18:55:05 < bitmask> they seem to be very popular but I know they sell fakes so I'm not sure how safe the batteries are
2019-02-06T18:55:13 < bitmask> they are probably fine if you dont push em
2019-02-06T18:55:40 < kakimir> wha are you doing?
2019-02-06T18:56:15 < bitmask> heated hoodie, its the fact that I'm wearing them that worries me but the current draw isn't that high
2019-02-06T18:56:34 < bitmask> I mean by the time they arrive its gonna be spring so I prob wont even get em this year
2019-02-06T18:56:46 < bitmask> this winter was so mild
2019-02-06T18:56:51 < kakimir> indeed
2019-02-06T18:57:52 < bitmask> yea fuck it, I'm not ordering them, I'll keep it in mind for next year but hopefully I have a job by then and can afford nice batteries :)
2019-02-06T18:58:23 < kakimir> what you should invest in instead of hacky hoodie
2019-02-06T18:58:33 < kakimir> is layers
2019-02-06T18:58:53 < bitmask> thats not fun, I like active heating, it felt great the couple times I used it :)
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2019-02-06T19:02:22 < mawk> I can't give my logs to the cops about the pædo guy
2019-02-06T19:02:37 < mawk> that's illegal
2019-02-06T19:02:45 < mawk> the cop keep trying to call me on my phone
2019-02-06T19:02:54 < mawk> I need to give him a good answer
2019-02-06T19:02:56 < kakimir> active heating but you don't have really money to do it properly.. set your priorities straight bitmask 
2019-02-06T19:03:05 < bitmask> psh
2019-02-06T19:03:14 < bitmask> I'm staying in my fantasy world
2019-02-06T19:03:22 < bitmask> until the day I burn up :P
2019-02-06T19:03:41 < kakimir> fantacy worlds just eventually wear thin
2019-02-06T19:04:01 < kakimir> mawk: what kind of paedo hosting do you provide?
2019-02-06T19:06:10 < Cracki> what's illegal? giving them the logs, or not giving them the logs?
2019-02-06T19:07:24 < kakimir> or them trying to force the logs from you?
2019-02-06T19:07:47 < kakimir> I mean it's not illegal to ask at least
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2019-02-06T19:17:58 < mawk> not giving them the logs Cracki 
2019-02-06T19:18:04 < mawk> is illegal
2019-02-06T19:18:16 < mawk> I'd give them if I had logs, but I have none
2019-02-06T19:18:20 < mawk> and that's illegal too, not keeping logs
2019-02-06T19:18:21 < Cracki> kek
2019-02-06T19:18:26 < Cracki> make up some
2019-02-06T19:18:30 < mawk> kakimir: https://pix.watch/
2019-02-06T19:18:32 < mawk> I have an image host
2019-02-06T19:18:34 < mawk> I thought of doing that Cracki 
2019-02-06T19:18:41 < Cracki> but that's illegal too :>
2019-02-06T19:18:50 < mawk> like saying "their addresses are all 127.0.0.1, ie they used tor, bye bye"
2019-02-06T19:18:52 < Cracki> so... perhaps get a lawyer to figure out what's less trouble
2019-02-06T19:18:57 < mawk> but yeah that sounds pretty illegal
2019-02-06T19:19:04 < mawk> I asked my mom, which is a lawyer
2019-02-06T19:19:15 < mawk> but she was just horrified by me getting into legal affairs
2019-02-06T19:19:17 < Cracki> lawyer specialized to the area perhaps
2019-02-06T19:19:19 < mawk> so she didn't answer anything useful
2019-02-06T19:19:22 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-06T19:19:26 < Cracki> they never do, they want money first
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2019-02-06T19:19:42 < Cracki> I think they're even required to have a contract with you before they can counsel at all
2019-02-06T19:19:52 < mawk> but it's fine I'll apologize, and tell them they can make further requests without going through a state attorney
2019-02-06T19:20:32 < Cracki> maybe a face to face chat with whoever conducts that investigation?
2019-02-06T19:20:37 < mawk> and tell them I had legal requisitions before and it went fine
2019-02-06T19:20:41 < mawk> and it's just a mistake if I don't have logs
2019-02-06T19:20:45 < Cracki> lobbing letters back and forth isn't all that conducive
2019-02-06T19:20:51 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-06T19:20:59 < mawk> he calls me but he has a private number so I can't call back
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2019-02-06T19:35:52 <@englishman> Ecco: SiTime MEMS Oscillators of course
2019-02-06T19:39:27 <@englishman> For context, even though Nest was not breached, customers may be vulnerable because their email addresses and passwords are freely available on the internet.
2019-02-06T19:39:28 <@englishman> wtf
2019-02-06T19:39:33 <@englishman> that is not a good explanation at all
2019-02-06T19:39:36 <@englishman> what are you doing Nest
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2019-02-06T20:02:16 < mawk> lol
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2019-02-06T20:06:13 < aandrew> 8kw generator acquired and assembled and started
2019-02-06T20:06:16 < aandrew> now I have to wire up an outlet for the water pump and bend the electrical code to the breaking point for the furnace
2019-02-06T20:06:19 < aandrew> the longterm plan is to install a proper transfer switch at the sub box in the garage and backfeed back to the main panel for the entire house
2019-02-06T20:06:22 < aandrew> but that's not happenning today
2019-02-06T20:15:43 < Steffanx> What? Have power outages much?
2019-02-06T20:22:56 < aandrew> well we're in the middle of an ice storm (15-25mm expected) and I've wanted to have backup handy for a while. this was just the perfect opportunity to do it
2019-02-06T20:23:16 < aandrew> got the generator for 20% off and it's a goodstuff briggs 
2019-02-06T20:23:27 < aandrew> it's oversized for my expected load so the surging and sagging should be minimized
2019-02-06T20:23:58 < aandrew> I was inspired ot install a sub panel in the garage though. in theory I can backfeed the entire house through it
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2019-02-06T20:46:43 < Cracki> vision test: https://i.imgur.com/FGdZpS8.jpg
2019-02-06T20:48:33 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-06T20:48:46 < antto> <fail.jpg>
2019-02-06T20:49:58 < kakimir> I failed the test
2019-02-06T20:51:44 < Cracki> left wolf, count legs
2019-02-06T20:52:11 < Cracki> I guess if you see it, you must be a furry
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2019-02-06T21:22:20 < kakimir> should I replace my M660 casette with M771 bicycle guise?
2019-02-06T21:22:55 < aandrew> haha nice Cracki 
2019-02-06T21:23:49 < kakimir> if you ever build a bicycle remember this: 7 speed casette costs under 10eur
2019-02-06T21:24:00 < kakimir> 10speed casette is 40eur
2019-02-06T21:24:11 < aandrew> weird wy
2019-02-06T21:24:13 < aandrew> why
2019-02-06T21:24:23 <@englishman> aandrew: cool
2019-02-06T21:24:59 <@englishman> I'd get a genny but it'd really just be to keep the fishies warm, our furnace is way too big for a genny
2019-02-06T21:25:26 <@englishman> and we haven't had an outage in years. there's like 3cm of ice on all the lines right now
2019-02-06T21:25:28 < aandrew> I'm pretty sure 8kw would run everything in the house except for the clothes dryer
2019-02-06T21:25:39 < aandrew> I'm still pissed we let the salesman talk us out of nat gas for that, my last one was gas and I loved it
2019-02-06T21:25:59 <@englishman> I installed that iotawatt last night, on low setting furnace is 13kw
2019-02-06T21:26:19 <@englishman> hot tub 6kw
2019-02-06T21:26:44 <@englishman> do you have wood backup
2019-02-06T21:27:30 < kakimir> englishman: psst.. *waste oil burner*
2019-02-06T21:27:45 <@englishman> waste garbage burner
2019-02-06T21:28:09 <@englishman> all the cardboard and packing from ARROW could keep several families warm for a winter
2019-02-06T21:28:31 < kakimir> and plastic
2019-02-06T21:43:15 < aandrew> englishman: yeah we're oscillating between warm enough to melt and cold enough to layer the ice on thick
2019-02-06T21:43:19 < aandrew> roads are fun
2019-02-06T21:43:34 < aandrew> englishman: 13kW? you have resistive heating??
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2019-02-06T21:43:48 < aandrew> <@englishman> all the cardboard and packing from ARROW could keep several families warm for a winter
2019-02-06T21:43:51 < aandrew> lololol
2019-02-06T21:44:13 <@englishman> ya, 23kw on hi
2019-02-06T21:44:13 < aandrew> the amount of that quasi-shredded paper digikey likes to pack shit in piles up fast
2019-02-06T21:44:23 < aandrew> ah yeah see i wanted everythig gas here
2019-02-06T21:44:37 < aandrew> stove, furnace, hot water. should have got dryer too. fucking salescritter
2019-02-06T22:02:11 < bitmask> they have neon "led"s?
2019-02-06T22:02:22 < bitmask> I wonder what they look like in person
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--- Day changed Thu Feb 07 2019
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2019-02-07T00:24:34 < Cracki> so... control theory for mechanisms with backlash, lost cause? did a quick search, didn't find any magic. I'm considering a "segway" pendulum (with IMU), but the motor (encoder on rotor) has a box of "loose" gears before driving the wheels
2019-02-07T00:26:53 < Cracki> can't load the gears or shaft obviously, and it's not a continuous motion problem either. friction might be an option to make backlash more "deterministic". measuring backlash and straight up adding it upon reversal of direction, sure...
2019-02-07T00:35:55 < BrainDamage> the canon version is to model backlash as a 2nd order elastic component 
2019-02-07T00:36:53 < BrainDamage> if in turn you try compensate with a pid, you're fucked because the only solution is a shorter bandwith
2019-02-07T00:37:15 < BrainDamage> but if instead you can use arbitrary transfer functions, you can compensate the douple pole
2019-02-07T00:37:49 < BrainDamage> however, depending on the cancellation level, you can end up with an in-band zero pair, which will give you non-minimal phase and overelongation
2019-02-07T00:38:20 < zyp> I wish I learned more signal theory in uni :)
2019-02-07T00:39:42 < Cracki> thanks. I know enough to know that I should know what poles and zeros are and how to move them, but us poor computer scientists get the "light" version of that course where the fun stuff isn't discussed
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2019-02-07T00:40:35 < Cracki> and yes I can have arbitrary transfer functions. it's for playing with it, and maybe I can get some fellow students interested in it
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2019-02-07T00:43:01 < Cracki> our EE people do this too, but when they presented this, their "reference" demo was jittering thanks to gears, and they were lazy in their control
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2019-02-07T00:43:49 < Cracki> (it lacked one more integration... residual position error on tilted table)
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2019-02-07T00:54:25 < sync> you can also just ignore how your motor jitters
2019-02-07T00:55:58 < Cracki> that's for plebes
2019-02-07T00:57:04 < sync> works tho
2019-02-07T00:57:11 < Cracki> eh... it's just cheap parts. they all use hall sensors and permanent magnets with 11 PPR on rotor
2019-02-07T00:57:21 < sync> and if your platform is stable, why not
2019-02-07T00:57:45 < Cracki> boss gave me some scrap part out of an old printer, 100 PPR optical encoder on rotor, no gear box, enough torque for making it move
2019-02-07T00:58:00 < Cracki> stable? it's an inverted pendulum, it's supposed to be unstable
2019-02-07T00:58:56 < sync> sure, but if it stays upright why not
2019-02-07T00:58:58 < Cracki> anyway, I'm sure I could avoid all that by picking the right motor and mounting a high-PPR optical encoder on the rotor but that's not teaching me :P
2019-02-07T00:59:24 < sync> why not, that is the way to go
2019-02-07T00:59:53 < Cracki> well, I found some code discs on aliex, but they were either shit or relatively expensive
2019-02-07T01:01:36 < Cracki> and I'm not about to bother thinking about how to mount the encoder part onto the motor or even the frame
2019-02-07T01:01:58 < Cracki> (hot glue and/or tape, sure...)
2019-02-07T01:02:13 < sync> just machine some holder and mount it
2019-02-07T01:02:31 < sync> and get some high res heidenhain rod or whatever
2019-02-07T01:02:40 < jadew> sync, you got a mill?
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2019-02-07T01:04:39 < Cracki> funny picture in description: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/-/32617291589.html
2019-02-07T01:05:05 < sync> jadew: several, yes
2019-02-07T01:05:26 < jadew> sync, I meant milling machine
2019-02-07T01:05:42 < jadew> you have more than one?
2019-02-07T01:05:58 < karlp> haven't you reaad the zypsnips jade?
2019-02-07T01:06:18 < jadew> karlp, I did, but now I feel I should remember something and I don't
2019-02-07T01:06:19 < karlp> https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/budgets#L12
2019-02-07T01:06:36 < sync> jadew: yes
2019-02-07T01:06:53 < jadew> karlp, ah, I remember that one :)
2019-02-07T01:07:01 < jadew> sync, any of them cheap? :P
2019-02-07T01:07:07 < sync> all of them were cheap
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2019-02-07T01:07:17 < Cracki> if I had a mill, I'd do a lot of things "properly"...
2019-02-07T01:07:26 < jadew> I'm wondering if I can run one in my apartment
2019-02-07T01:07:44 < jadew> (noise wise)
2019-02-07T01:08:04 < Cracki> the spindle is the loudest part and that's less than a vacuum cleaner
2019-02-07T01:08:12 < sync> maybe, you can build an enclosure the make it quieter
2019-02-07T01:08:59 < jadew> so you think the noise level is manageable? I've never heard one in reality
2019-02-07T01:09:16 < jadew> except really big ones that just purr like a cat when they cut through steel
2019-02-07T01:11:22 < Cracki> lots of people get those "simple" portal constructions, seem to be good enough for aluminium
2019-02-07T01:11:45 < jadew> Cracki, if that's the case, then I guess an enclosure would make it basically quiet
2019-02-07T01:12:18 < jadew> Cracki, what portal constructions?
2019-02-07T01:13:44 < bitmask> why is that self balancing chassis so expensive?
2019-02-07T01:14:06 < jadew> cuz live in the present
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2019-02-07T01:14:46 < Cracki> to get an idea, check out "stepcraft"
2019-02-07T01:15:10 < jadew> ah, right
2019-02-07T01:15:13 < Cracki> bitmask, each motor + wheel individually is already 10 bucks (each)
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2019-02-07T01:15:50 < bitmask> oh I thought those were cheaper
2019-02-07T01:15:55 < jadew> Cracki, I've seen similar CNC's running, but they seem slow and noisy
2019-02-07T01:15:59 < karlp> stepcraft doesn't help me understand what "portal" construction is?
2019-02-07T01:16:06 < Cracki> I just ordered a pair of beefier motors and wheels. I can cut whatever frame I need at a local faplab
2019-02-07T01:16:28 < jadew> karlp, probably the fact that the spindle is mounted on the X axis
2019-02-07T01:16:44 < Cracki> jadew, aye they take their sweet time. they're only as noisy as the spindle (the fast thing with the edgy tip)
2019-02-07T01:16:44 < jadew> as opposed to a classic vertical milling machine, where the spindle is fixed
2019-02-07T01:17:04 < karlp> and the table moves?
2019-02-07T01:17:10 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-07T01:17:15 < Cracki> something's gotta move and for those... it's the spindle because people mount big flat workpieces in those
2019-02-07T01:17:35 < Cracki> those handoperated mills, sure, you can upgrade them to use motors
2019-02-07T01:18:07 < jadew> yeah, I'd want one of those because they can also be used for drilling
2019-02-07T01:18:08 < Cracki> bitmask, they price things per weight ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2019-02-07T01:18:27 < jadew> I don't think one of these CNCs has the necessary sturdyness for slow drilling
2019-02-07T01:18:31 < Cracki> good idea. I'd want a decent drill press too
2019-02-07T01:18:33 < bitmask> I ordered a small geared motor for $3.80 a couple months ago, still waiting on it :P
2019-02-07T01:18:56 < jadew> karlp, you have a 3040 IIRC?
2019-02-07T01:18:59 < Cracki> bitmask, oh these of course include the hall encoder and stuff
2019-02-07T01:19:03 < Cracki> not just a simple motor
2019-02-07T01:19:05 < karlp> jadew: I have nothhing at all.
2019-02-07T01:19:24 < jadew> hmm... weren't you the one showing off some aluminium parts a couple of years back?
2019-02-07T01:19:47 < karlp> not me.
2019-02-07T01:21:08 < jadew> was hoping to get an opition regarding drilling with one of those CNC's, but that's my gut feeling on it, it's probably not sturdy enough
2019-02-07T01:21:15 < jadew> you can mill the hole, but not drill it
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2019-02-07T01:21:30 < Cracki> what material?
2019-02-07T01:21:44 < Cracki> I'm sure it's good enough for aluminium, even drilling it
2019-02-07T01:21:45 < jadew> I could do with just aluminium
2019-02-07T01:21:54 < jadew> hmm
2019-02-07T01:22:01 < Cracki> how do you imagine it failing? the frame bending?
2019-02-07T01:22:03 < sync> just helix in holes
2019-02-07T01:22:05 < jadew> for a CNC like that it's eavy easy to make an enclosure
2019-02-07T01:22:13 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-07_00-21-13_i2Jpq7SfN.png which one to use
2019-02-07T01:22:15 < jadew> Cracki, yeah
2019-02-07T01:22:48 < Cracki> nah, even those portal style ones, if they're made from aluminium themselves, they won't budge
2019-02-07T01:22:50 < jadew> first when it's pushing against the part and then when the drill bit is pulling towards the part
2019-02-07T01:23:29 < Cracki> they might be a little springier than solid steel though :P
2019-02-07T01:23:43 < jadew> for sure :)
2019-02-07T01:23:45 < Cracki> rajkosto, which one do you like more
2019-02-07T01:24:04 < rajkosto> i need to put 4 buttons somewhere too
2019-02-07T01:24:14 < rajkosto> if the square one had a touchscreen i would use that
2019-02-07T01:24:21 < Cracki> lots of people build their own, starting from a dozen alu profiles side to side. that will not move.
2019-02-07T01:24:57 < Cracki> what might move is all the joints and bearings
2019-02-07T01:25:56 < Cracki> I've been watching yt videos (titans of cnc, haas, ...). their cnc mills weigh a ton at least, and they're constructed just like those handoperated mills, really solid
2019-02-07T01:26:02 < jadew> right, it needs good bearings too from what I understand
2019-02-07T01:26:21 < jadew> they're special in the sense that they support a lot of radial force
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2019-02-07T01:26:30 < Cracki> and in the right places. those portal constructions, also for 3d printers, have their weaknesses.
2019-02-07T01:26:55 < jadew> yeah, I've been watching a lot of milling videos too
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2019-02-07T01:27:36 < jadew> I'm tempted to rent another place for work (my current one is on the 3rd floor) and just buy one of those giant mills
2019-02-07T01:27:52 < jadew> they cost used as much as a mini mill
2019-02-07T01:28:22 < jadew> then I would be able to mill locomotive parts
2019-02-07T01:28:48 < BrainDamage> the annoying shit about mills is that small ones perform worse than bigger ones, despite costing similar
2019-02-07T01:28:49 < Cracki> personally I'd ask around what metal shop would let me use their stuff (after instruction). might be even cheaper, and comes with more knowhow
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2019-02-07T01:29:31 < jadew> BrainDamage, yeah
2019-02-07T01:29:35 < BrainDamage> so the only solution is to have space first, then buy large one
2019-02-07T01:30:05 < BrainDamage> and if you buy a small one, you'll be unhappy no matter what
2019-02-07T01:30:57 < jadew> Cracki, don't know any such shop - the ones I visited were very strict regarding who gets to use what
2019-02-07T01:31:09 < Cracki> bummer
2019-02-07T01:31:11 < jadew> the lathe guy did only lathe things, the mill guy only mill things
2019-02-07T01:31:50 < Cracki> random maker spaces maybe. someone always has some money to burn and buys random scrap metal off the internet.
2019-02-07T01:32:09 < jadew> BrainDamage, that's what I think too, but damn... big ones are BIG
2019-02-07T01:33:01 < Cracki> some local dudes decided to buy a quarter ton of scrap metal that used to be a robotic arm. I think they got the power electronics box with it, but no docs at all. afaik it hasn't moved usefully in the two years they've had it
2019-02-07T01:33:27 < jadew> heh
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2019-02-07T01:56:42  * karlp loves opensource: feedlist: JSON.parse(JSON.stringify(feedlist))
2019-02-07T01:57:24 < jadew> karlp, that's not a mistake
2019-02-07T01:57:48 < jadew> it could be, but it most likely isn't
2019-02-07T01:57:55 < karlp> what on earth for?
2019-02-07T01:57:57 < jadew> its purpose is to clone feedlist
2019-02-07T01:58:09 < jadew> basically... easy deep clone
2019-02-07T01:58:37 < jadew> it's very costly tho
2019-02-07T01:58:48 < qyx> dumb too
2019-02-07T01:58:53 < karlp> if you need to deep clone your objects, you're already doing things wrong likely.
2019-02-07T01:58:59 < karlp> ok, chekc this out instead then: https://github.com/boblemaire/IoTaWatt/blob/master/SD/graph.js#L601
2019-02-07T02:00:12 < jadew> yeah, it has the smell
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2019-02-07T03:18:40 < mawk> you think opensource does that often karlp ?
2019-02-07T03:19:12 < karlp> depends on the project, don't get defensive about it.
2019-02-07T03:19:38 < karlp> a lot of projects dig themselves a big hole that they manage by "volunteering"
2019-02-07T03:24:10 < mawk> yeah I phrased it wrong, I meant you find
2019-02-07T03:25:26 < karlp> no, it's really varied.
2019-02-07T03:25:35 < karlp> but "web" projects are special
2019-02-07T03:26:01 < karlp> sometimes beautiful nice looking projects are funtional because somone just sacrificed a MOUNTAIN of time on it.
2019-02-07T03:26:34 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-07T03:27:06 < mawk> well even with my comrades that have a high level of education I wouldn't trust them continuing my projects and keep the same spirit and code quality, so even less with total strangers
2019-02-07T03:27:31 < karlp> not sure it's actually strangers
2019-02-07T03:27:35 < mawk> especially with the less technically advanced projects, that statistically attract the people that have the least skills required to contribute
2019-02-07T03:27:44 < karlp> lots of "big" open source projects are really just a couple of people
2019-02-07T03:28:10 < mawk> I see
2019-02-07T03:35:53 <@englishman> do you have a day off tomorrow karlp
2019-02-07T03:39:31 <@englishman> replacing this dumb toshiba part
2019-02-07T03:39:32 <@englishman> Start of commercial production
2019-02-07T03:39:32 <@englishman> 1982-12
2019-02-07T03:43:41 <@englishman> console hackers hacking shitberreypi https://gist.github.com/marcan/6dde73a9a0c917cd4fc9784a0a73efe3
2019-02-07T03:45:20 < mawk> nice
2019-02-07T03:49:11 < fenugrec> englishman, what part
2019-02-07T03:50:11 < karlp> englishman: hah
2019-02-07T03:50:13 < karlp> I wish
2019-02-07T03:50:17 < karlp> no, writing grant shit
2019-02-07T03:50:24 < karlp> just going to be short of sleep
2019-02-07T03:50:30 <@englishman> fenugrec: some bjt
2019-02-07T03:51:02 < fenugrec> meh just toss a 3904/3906
2019-02-07T03:51:21 <@englishman> yeah since i am clear that i am not liable for shit
2019-02-07T03:52:19 < fenugrec> tried a 3906 in the vertical power amp of my tek2215 scope once, instead of a BFRsomething GHz part... worked surprisingly well
2019-02-07T03:53:34 < aandrew> that's becasue the vertical power amp isn't doing anything more than a single-digit MHz or so anyway
2019-02-07T03:54:42 <@englishman> today @ newjob used a keysight b2901a
2019-02-07T03:54:48 < aandrew> newjob?
2019-02-07T03:54:49 <@englishman> p nice jobbo
2019-02-07T03:56:15 < dongs> lul FemtoAmp
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2019-02-07T03:58:49 < fenugrec> aandrew, well, I trust Tek to be more competent than me at speccing transistors, so that BFR probably was there for a reason
2019-02-07T03:58:56 < dongs> no
2019-02-07T03:59:06 < dongs> it was tehre because they didn't want two different transistors on a BOM
2019-02-07T03:59:10 < dongs> and they already used it somewehre else
2019-02-07T04:00:07 <@englishman> it was there because they wanted to justify the price
2019-02-07T04:00:15 < dongs> or that
2019-02-07T04:06:31 < fenugrec> dunno, 6 BJTs in the final stage, 4 different parts, doesn't smell like BOM cheating
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2019-02-07T09:03:03 < tjq> is this on?
2019-02-07T09:04:34 < rajkosto> xbox off
2019-02-07T09:05:03 < tjq> clean the unit
2019-02-07T09:14:21 < Steffanx> jadew: jpa- is the one with the cnc
2019-02-07T09:14:29 < mawk> I sent a mail to the cop
2019-02-07T09:14:34 < mawk> to say I don't have the logs
2019-02-07T09:14:49 < mawk> but that I don't like pædos so I'll be happy to collaborate further without the hassle of a court order
2019-02-07T09:15:00 < mawk> maybe that'll content him and I won't get charged with absence of logging$
2019-02-07T09:15:37 < Steffanx> You need a lawyer
2019-02-07T09:16:09 < mawk> I'm sure it'll be fine
2019-02-07T09:16:21 < mawk> I'll get some legal advice if he doesn't look happy in his answer
2019-02-07T09:17:02 < mawk> the court order starts like this: https://pix.watch/m-emKb/WMRaz6.png
2019-02-07T09:17:08 < mawk> cool graphics
2019-02-07T09:17:55 < tjq> wut is happening here
2019-02-07T09:18:06 < jpa-> jadew: on 3020, drilling works ok up to ~3mm or so; the spindle is designed for high-rpm, so bigger holes are better milled/routed
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2019-02-07T09:36:57 < Thorn> >Binary operator '/' cannot be applied to operands of type 'Double' and 'Float'
2019-02-07T09:37:33 < mawk> yeah, those are totally different types
2019-02-07T09:37:40 < mawk> for instance one start with the letter D and the other with the letter F
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2019-02-07T10:11:42 < tjq> where is dr blaxter?
2019-02-07T10:12:22 < dongs> banned
2019-02-07T10:12:29 < tjq> from freenode?
2019-02-07T10:12:34 < dongs> from this channel, i think
2019-02-07T10:12:38 < tjq> ah
2019-02-07T10:12:38 < dongs> -!- 5 - ##stm32: ban *!*@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk [by englishman, 156345 secs ago]
2019-02-07T10:12:44 < tjq> lol
2019-02-07T10:12:53 < dongs> 1.8 days ago
2019-02-07T10:12:54 < dongs> sounds about right
2019-02-07T10:12:57 < dongs> i think i saw when it got banned
2019-02-07T10:13:03 < dongs> after he posted another unfunny as shit imgoat link
2019-02-07T10:13:26 < tjq> that has to be the worst website 
2019-02-07T10:13:35 < dongs> no thats not the one y oure thinking of
2019-02-07T10:13:41 < tjq> ah
2019-02-07T10:13:42 < dongs> the one that shows tiny image and then like 100 ads around it
2019-02-07T10:13:49 < tjq> yeah that abortion
2019-02-07T10:13:51 < dongs> that was something else, at least imgoat is just the fucking image
2019-02-07T10:15:19 < tjq> hmm
2019-02-07T10:15:26 < tjq> yeah some stupid brexit stuff again
2019-02-07T10:19:12 < zyp> haha
2019-02-07T10:20:55 < qyx> do you have any favorite din rail pcb box?
2019-02-07T10:21:24 < qyx> something to accomodate many terminals and a single pcb
2019-02-07T10:21:51 < qyx> and I hate this thing https://www.dinrailenclosure.com/site/img/products/DINRailEnclosures/DINRAILENCLOSURE_Support_M72_2.png
2019-02-07T10:22:03 < zyp> I don't know about favorite, but I've used this: https://bernic.net/enclosure-catalogue/category/m36-din-rail-building-blocks-method
2019-02-07T10:22:33 < dongs> dingdong rail
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2019-02-07T10:31:52 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov0FAPhRK0c musics
2019-02-07T10:34:07 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, is fine
2019-02-07T10:34:36 < rajkosto> 28AWG copper wire can carry way more than 500mA without heating up
2019-02-07T10:38:53 < rajkosto> "header pin" implies something like that
2019-02-07T10:39:43 < rajkosto> voltage drop is dependent on conductor length anyway
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2019-02-07T10:41:18 < rajkosto> them bois thicc
2019-02-07T10:42:44 < rajkosto> power wire in usb cables ( which can be quite long ) is smaller diameter than 28AWG i think
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2019-02-07T10:56:17 < zyp> rajkosto, nah, they are even thicker in decent cables
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2019-02-07T12:15:36 < Ecco> Hi :)
2019-02-07T12:15:54 < Ecco> When converting an elf file to a bin one, how does objcopy know which sections to take?
2019-02-07T12:16:24 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-07T12:17:05 < PaulFertser> Ecco: by default it just takes sections marked as loadable.
2019-02-07T12:17:16 < karlp> Ecco: you can also tell it explicitly
2019-02-07T12:17:34 < Ecco> Spot on, thanks guys
2019-02-07T12:17:43 < jpa-> (objdump -h foo.elf will show the flags)
2019-02-07T12:18:24 < Ecco> what format would you guys use to distribute a firmware that span a non-contiguous flash area? (e.g. internal + external flash)
2019-02-07T12:18:37 < Ecco> If it's all in one chunk, you can just objcopy -O binary
2019-02-07T12:19:49 < Ecco> I'm considerin using a dfuse file
2019-02-07T12:19:55 < Ecco> (since it'll most likely by over dfu)
2019-02-07T12:20:05 < jpa-> sounds reasonable
2019-02-07T12:20:10 < jpa-> stripped elf is not a bad choice either
2019-02-07T12:20:37 < Ecco> yeah, that's true
2019-02-07T12:20:56 < Ecco> actually Haohmaru was spot on: the best answers depends on how it's going to be used eventually
2019-02-07T12:20:56 < jpa-> (not the kind you'll get when googling for 'stripping elf')
2019-02-07T12:21:06 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-07T12:22:14 < Ecco> yeah, would make sense
2019-02-07T12:23:06 < PaulFertser> For me google in private tab gives "How to strip executables thoroughly - Stack Overflow" as the first result for "stripping elf".
2019-02-07T12:24:28 < Ecco> PaulFertser: I get some weird Hentai
2019-02-07T12:24:39 < Ecco> too many tentacles
2019-02-07T12:24:53 < jpa-> google knows everybody's fetish
2019-02-07T12:34:59 < karlp> the way unsafe google used to be?
2019-02-07T12:39:41 < Ecco> Same question for openocd: how does it know what part of an elf file to flash when used with gdb?
2019-02-07T12:40:22 < Ecco> also, would it be a bad idea to have no "text" section in an elf file, but rather two "internal_text" and "external_text"?
2019-02-07T12:43:27 < karlp> same way that objdump does dummy
2019-02-07T12:48:53 < jpa-> Ecco: i usually name things .text.bootloader etc, just because some tools use hardcoded .text* to find code (usually only some scripts, smarter tools use section flags)
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2019-02-07T12:54:22 < PaulFertser> Ecco: openocd uses only segments of PT_LOAD type.
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2019-02-07T14:10:03 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-07_12-40-24_APcTiW0iH.jpg wait this one doesnt have CS pin like the other one
2019-02-07T14:10:28 < rajkosto> the chip doesnt care about it and they permanently tied it to 0 or something
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2019-02-07T14:11:20 < karlp> that picture also has pins labelled for i2c...
2019-02-07T14:11:28 < rajkosto> yes we talked about this before, its not i2c
2019-02-07T14:11:40 < rajkosto> SCL is SPI CLK and SDA is SPI MOSI
2019-02-07T14:11:51 < karlp> so how the fuck are we supposed to know what pin sis CS
2019-02-07T14:11:56 < karlp> buy garbage, get garbage dude
2019-02-07T14:11:58 < rajkosto> the CS pin 
2019-02-07T14:12:19 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-07_00-21-13_i2Jpq7SfN.png
2019-02-07T14:12:27 < karlp> you'ðve got mislablled parts and are asking us what pin is CS? the labels are already demonstrably wrong, how would we know?
2019-02-07T14:12:52 < karlp> ask your seller for docs
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2019-02-07T14:14:06 < rajkosto> its "4-Wire SPI Interface" of ST7789 vs "5-Wire SPI Interface" that has CS as well
2019-02-07T14:15:03 < rajkosto> except these SPI LCD/OLED driver chips also require RES and DC
2019-02-07T14:15:22 < rajkosto> so they count it as RES, DC, CLK, MOSI and optional CS
2019-02-07T14:16:06 < rajkosto> https://www.adafruit.com/product/3787
2019-02-07T14:16:44 < rajkosto> the other one is https://www.adafruit.com/product/3533 but i have CS on that one
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2019-02-07T14:16:50 < dongs> aidsfruit
2019-02-07T14:17:04 < rajkosto> well mine is chyna not aids
2019-02-07T14:17:14 < rajkosto> same display much more expensive pcb
2019-02-07T14:17:19 < rajkosto> from adafruit
2019-02-07T14:17:54 < rajkosto> anyway after i pick a display ill just make my own pcb for the flex to solder onto
2019-02-07T14:17:57 < rajkosto> with the buttons on it
2019-02-07T14:18:30 < rajkosto> its fine its the only thing on the bus
2019-02-07T14:18:33 < rajkosto> saves me a pin
2019-02-07T14:18:41 < rajkosto> i think they just tied CS to gnd on the flex
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2019-02-07T14:40:52 <@englishman> where do you think aidsfruit gets their shit
2019-02-07T14:42:22 < rajkosto> they just take chyna design pcbs and add some more silkscreen or features and write some shitty arduino examples for it
2019-02-07T14:42:26 < rajkosto> and charge 10x 
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2019-02-07T15:47:36 < dongs> okay
2019-02-07T15:47:42 < dongs> this dragging of shit together with part
2019-02-07T15:47:44 < dongs> is getting a bit annoying
2019-02-07T15:47:45 < dongs> in altifuck19
2019-02-07T15:47:48 < dongs> wehre do i turn that shit off
2019-02-07T15:50:48 < karlp> it's pro, you should do it they way they want you to.
2019-02-07T15:51:46 < Steffanx> ^
2019-02-07T16:09:36 -!- BrainDamage [~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2019-02-07T16:21:09 < dongs> oh GOOD FUCKING JOB
2019-02-07T16:21:14 < dongs> THIS SELECTION INCLUDES LOCKED ITEMS. CONTINUE?
2019-02-07T16:21:23 < dongs> YES I KNOW, BUT PLEASE KEEP THEM LOCKED YOU FUCKING RETARDS
2019-02-07T16:22:15 < sync> sounds like kicad
2019-02-07T16:23:23 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-07T16:23:33 < dongs> whats the point of ESD protection for ac-biased inputs
2019-02-07T16:23:45 < dongs> like input -> ESD -> cap -> adc/whatever
2019-02-07T16:23:49 < dongs> why do i even need ESD there
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2019-02-07T16:30:04 < day> tbf. i had my moments with locked tracks in kicad too~
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2019-02-07T16:44:17 < zyp> dongs, ESD protection, obviously
2019-02-07T16:44:29 < jadew> dongs, because an ESD spike can go through the cap just fine
2019-02-07T16:44:58 < jadew> not necessarily
2019-02-07T16:45:10 < jadew> the cap will probably be the last to go
2019-02-07T16:46:08 < jadew> I hurt my back today... while cutting my hair
2019-02-07T16:46:36 < jadew> yeah...
2019-02-07T16:46:54 < jadew> it was so bad, my wife had to leave work so she could help me move
2019-02-07T16:46:54 < dongs> which hair
2019-02-07T16:47:13 < jadew> head hair, that's why I was bending over the toilet
2019-02-07T16:47:31 < zyp> wtf
2019-02-07T16:47:33 < dongs> are you so brokebitch that you cut your own hair
2019-02-07T16:47:41 < dongs> isnt a cheap barber in .ro like $5
2019-02-07T16:47:46 < jadew> I'm germophobe
2019-02-07T16:47:54 < jadew> so I cut my own hair
2019-02-07T16:48:01 < dongs> ya cutting it on top of the toilet sounds all super clean and shit
2019-02-07T16:48:10 < day> thought the same xD
2019-02-07T16:48:24 < day> but his toilet is probably pristine :p
2019-02-07T16:48:31 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-07T16:48:39 < zyp> hmm, now I miss the place I used to get a haircut in .jp
2019-02-07T16:49:00 < dongs> zyp, wehn is your next jp voyage
2019-02-07T16:49:08 < day> im paying 13eur D:
2019-02-07T16:49:10 < zyp> dunno, maybe june
2019-02-07T16:49:13 < day> for a machine cut!
2019-02-07T16:49:36 < jadew> I don't know how much it costs here, been doing this for the last 15 years or more
2019-02-07T16:49:53 < dongs> ffs
2019-02-07T16:50:01 < dongs> well i guess at least youre married
2019-02-07T16:50:04 < dongs> and probably dont leave the house
2019-02-07T16:50:14 < zyp> I think I pay close to 40EUR for a haircut here in .no
2019-02-07T16:50:23 < jadew> dongs, your guess is correct
2019-02-07T16:50:40 < jadew> I cut my hair twice per year
2019-02-07T16:50:41 < dongs> 2500 yen here gives me a cut, shampoo/wash/dry, head massage, shoulder massage
2019-02-07T16:50:48 < zyp> I mean, I could get a cheaper one if I went to some cheap place
2019-02-07T16:51:02 < zyp> yeah, sounds about right
2019-02-07T16:51:14 < jadew> dongs, jeez...
2019-02-07T16:51:14 < zyp> I used to pay 1000 yen for a cut
2019-02-07T16:51:29 < dongs> yeah 1000 is just cut and get out
2019-02-07T16:51:35 < dongs> but i get my ~personal barber~
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2019-02-07T16:51:53 < zyp> the sign on my place says «barbar»
2019-02-07T16:51:59 < dongs> haha
2019-02-07T16:52:12 < jadew> so he knows how to handle a blade
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2019-02-07T16:52:59  * PaulFertser just doesn't cut but iirc my wife said the price was about 10 bucks for her.
2019-02-07T16:53:12 < jadew> PaulFertser, how long is your hair?
2019-02-07T16:53:15 < zyp> https://goo.gl/maps/BeAjkfuGXt32
2019-02-07T16:53:20 < dongs> you're one of those opensores developers that doesn't cut thier hair like ever right
2019-02-07T16:54:18 < dongs> zyp, what the fuck is self-shampoo
2019-02-07T16:54:26 < dongs> is that wehre they give you some shampoo and tell you to go fuck yourself?
2019-02-07T16:54:32 < zyp> idk, I've never tried it
2019-02-07T16:54:44 < PaulFertser> jadew: most are about the waist I guess
2019-02-07T16:54:58 < jadew> PaulFertser, beard too?
2019-02-07T16:55:36 < dongs> god damn
2019-02-07T16:55:39 < PaulFertser> jadew: I rarely shave but it doesn't grow too fast or big anyway.
2019-02-07T16:55:45 < dongs> PaulFertser looks like hans reiser
2019-02-07T16:55:46 < PaulFertser> Yeah, I'm a monster.
2019-02-07T16:55:52 < zyp> haha
2019-02-07T16:55:57 < jadew> PaulFertser, is this you? https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/06/06/article-2155159-13789E99000005DC-57_233x442.jpg
2019-02-07T16:55:59 < dongs> wait, no, PaulFertser IS hans reiser
2019-02-07T16:56:05 < dongs> hiding from the police
2019-02-07T16:56:28 < PaulFertser> jadew: lol
2019-02-07T16:56:55 < jadew> PaulFertser, I remember hearing that if it grows to a certain length it stops growing
2019-02-07T16:57:03 < jadew> something about the hair tip splitting
2019-02-07T16:57:05 < jadew> is that true?
2019-02-07T16:57:51 < zyp> it doesn't stop growing, but at some point you hit an equilibrium between growing and falling off
2019-02-07T16:58:08 < karlp> ~40€for a haircut here too.
2019-02-07T16:58:21 < PaulFertser> jadew: I do not have a microscope to investigate it, some hairs do split at the tip but I'm not sure that's the main factor, I'd rather guess it's the maximum height that limits the hair growth in most humans.
2019-02-07T16:58:38 < karlp> I could go to a barber for maybe 25-30 or so.
2019-02-07T16:58:57 < PaulFertser> s/height/weight/
2019-02-07T16:59:06 < karlp> but fuck that, I dont' go often, so I'l have some girl shampoo and give me head a rub in the hot water for a bit more and enjoy it
2019-02-07T16:59:09 < zyp> I guess if I went to some really cheap immigrant shop I could get a haircut as cheap as 15 EUR
2019-02-07T16:59:53 < dongs> i get shit cut every 3 months or so or else it becomes too fucking annoying to wash/too heavy
2019-02-07T17:02:01 < jadew> I can't do anything special with the hair, so I just trim it to 2cm and let it grow for 6 months or so
2019-02-07T17:02:31 < jadew> that's about when it becomes annoying to wash
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2019-02-07T17:09:23 < day> 40eur for a haircut
2019-02-07T17:09:28 < day> are you kidding me?
2019-02-07T17:09:32 < dongs> zyp is balling
2019-02-07T17:09:52 < day> do they give you a blowjob while cutting your hair?
2019-02-07T17:09:59 < dongs> from a dude
2019-02-07T17:10:55 < karlp> day: it's not crazy expensive relatively, just that all the numbers are high here.
2019-02-07T17:11:27 < karlp> it's omething like ~double minimum wage maybe?
2019-02-07T17:11:30 < day> karlp: well it  certainly depends on what you get done. but if they charge 40EUR for a 5min machine cut i would call it ridiculous no matter where you live
2019-02-07T17:11:54 < karlp> like I said, Icould get a barber cut cheaper, but I pay for a "haircut" instead.
2019-02-07T17:12:13 < day> yeah ok. thats a different story then
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2019-02-07T17:12:35 < karlp> but there's not really a culture of "just run in and get a machine trim and out in 5 minutes" that I've seen in other countries
2019-02-07T17:12:46 < karlp> it's go in, sit, chat, waste time
2019-02-07T17:13:09 < karlp> even when I went to a "cheap" mens barber, it still took too long and cost too much, so I decided to have nicer haircuts instead :)
2019-02-07T17:13:50 < day> well if one has the hair for it why not
2019-02-07T17:14:05 < zyp> we have this new «Cutters» chain which are opening small branches in shopping malls and airports and shit, supposed to be quick 15min haircuts
2019-02-07T17:14:09 < zyp> they charge 30EUR
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2019-02-07T17:14:18 < zyp> haven't tried it yet
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2019-02-07T17:19:07 < qyx> uh mens haircut is 5-10e here
2019-02-07T17:19:10 < dongs> blah
2019-02-07T17:19:35 < dongs> trying to autism my way around routing a 2 bit level shifter with dualnfet and 4 resistors
2019-02-07T17:19:40 < dongs> any way i try to arrange the parts it looks gay
2019-02-07T17:20:01 < karlp> some survey out today was that a "standard food basket" was 60% more expensive here than in helsinki, which was cheapest nordic.
2019-02-07T17:20:15 < karlp> we were 40% more than oslo too. (cheapest nordic capital)
2019-02-07T17:20:19 < qyx> just use a dedicated level shifter in bga9 or such
2019-02-07T17:20:27 < dongs> lol nigger im trying to save $
2019-02-07T17:20:29 < karlp> greenpak!
2019-02-07T17:20:31 < dongs> and reuse parts alreadyi n bom
2019-02-07T17:20:37 < dongs> is greenpaki even 5V-tolerant
2019-02-07T17:20:54 < dongs> this is your standard garbage I2C 5V>3V shifter
2019-02-07T17:21:03 < qyx> you went full kakimir'd
2019-02-07T17:21:15 < karlp> seems to be 1.8V-5V for ~most of them, yes
2019-02-07T17:22:10 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/cCXPKvo.png i guess i just deal wiht this swastika-looking thing
2019-02-07T17:22:12 < karlp> "benefits over discrete design": "Design Security – Makes reverse engineering substantially more difficult by disabling the read-back of NVM configuration, obscuring design details."
2019-02-07T17:22:26 < qyx> mhm just arrived at new house, 5.8°C here
2019-02-07T17:22:33 < qyx> turned on LPG furnace
2019-02-07T17:22:44 < karlp> but dongs, "A typical GreenPAK implementation removes from ten to thirty components per instance."
2019-02-07T17:22:47 < dongs> design security by obscurity?
2019-02-07T17:22:57 < dongs> that has always gone well
2019-02-07T17:23:22  * karlp laughs
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2019-02-07T17:50:31 < Ecco> I'm looking at readelf's output. How can I tell a section is marked as LOAD?
2019-02-07T17:52:00 < karlp> what did jpa tell you earlier?
2019-02-07T17:53:38 < Ecco> Yeah, with objdump -h you get the right infos
2019-02-07T17:53:42 < Ecco> but I can't find them in readelf
2019-02-07T17:55:27 < karlp> "it hurts when I poke myself in the eye" ?
2019-02-07T17:55:31 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-07T17:58:45 < PaulFertser> Ecco: Program Headers in readelf output.
2019-02-07T17:59:46 < Ecco> oh great, thanks :)
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2019-02-07T18:27:03 < karlp> why would it matter?
2019-02-07T18:33:54 < kakimir> in what situation it's not good?
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2019-02-07T18:38:33 < jadew> isn't it obvious?
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2019-02-07T18:47:07 < kakimir> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury-arc_valve
2019-02-07T18:47:18 < kakimir> a diode
2019-02-07T18:47:34 < kakimir> sorry.. rectifier?
2019-02-07T18:59:58 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2019-02-07T19:04:43 < Steffanx> Recitifier*
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2019-02-07T19:38:15 <@englishman> holy fuck the msp430 programmer is $$$
2019-02-07T19:38:21 <@englishman> why does anyone buy that crap
2019-02-07T19:38:51 < zyp> because asshole clients wants msp430?
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2019-02-07T19:39:57 < karlp> goodfet maybe?
2019-02-07T19:40:09 < karlp> can't you get one of the launchpads and use that to program with?
2019-02-07T19:42:02 <@englishman> goodfet is still 3x stlink wtf
2019-02-07T19:43:18 < karlp> it's a deadend alley dude. you know that
2019-02-07T19:43:32 < karlp> it was a step up from 8bit when 32bit was arm7tdmi and mips and a train wreck
2019-02-07T19:43:37 < karlp> but now with cortex-m it's a deadend
2019-02-07T19:45:29 < antto> karlp, kakimir, i don't know.. i was critiqued when i showed one of my projects..
2019-02-07T19:45:45 < srk> cortex-m might be a deadend too with risc-v
2019-02-07T19:46:16 < antto> https://i.imgur.com/uhN6ItY.jpg
2019-02-07T19:47:01 < Steffanx> who was the hater this time?
2019-02-07T19:47:56 < Steffanx> my ocd doenst like c8-10 antto
2019-02-07T19:48:01 <@englishman> yeah I am replacing all msp430 with stm32
2019-02-07T19:48:05 < antto> Steffanx you think there was a group of folks who didn't hate it?
2019-02-07T19:48:15 <@englishman> but still have to make some supporting crap for existing msp430
2019-02-07T19:48:29 <@englishman> lol riscv
2019-02-07T19:48:31 <@englishman> ok
2019-02-07T19:49:15 <@englishman> oh man so close
2019-02-07T19:49:19 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o englishman] by ChanServ
2019-02-07T19:49:21 < englishman> why pth leds
2019-02-07T19:49:31 < englishman> pth xtal
2019-02-07T19:49:47 < englishman> which tarduino is that
2019-02-07T19:50:23 < englishman> is that length matching or just squiggles
2019-02-07T19:50:30 < Steffanx> looks like antto wants leds sticking out of the case.. and not use light pipes.
2019-02-07T19:50:33 < englishman> and what on tarduino needs length matching
2019-02-07T19:50:51 < Steffanx> the length matching is just to troll you.
2019-02-07T19:50:53 < englishman> there are smt leds that do that
2019-02-07T19:51:04 < antto> there we go x_x
2019-02-07T19:51:13 < Steffanx> you asked for it antto
2019-02-07T19:51:28 < englishman> dialight 5912001013F
2019-02-07T19:51:36 < antto> technically i only asked about the crystal
2019-02-07T19:51:51 < Steffanx> 2.50 yay
2019-02-07T19:51:54 < Steffanx> damn englishman
2019-02-07T19:52:40 < antto> englishman it's not crapduino, it's xmega
2019-02-07T19:52:56 < Steffanx> even worse.
2019-02-07T19:53:03 < antto> shadap!
2019-02-07T19:53:04 < englishman> tardumel from tardochip
2019-02-07T19:53:23 < Steffanx> msp430 it englishman
2019-02-07T19:53:27 < antto> https://i.imgur.com/nKP8rIG.jpg
2019-02-07T19:53:32 < englishman> awful.
2019-02-07T19:53:48 < englishman> msp430 not the PCB, the PCB is fine.
2019-02-07T19:53:59 < Steffanx> At least there is some ST mr savov.
2019-02-07T19:54:07 < jpa-> pcb has atmega peeking out from under all the flux
2019-02-07T19:54:16 < englishman> you even listened to ##stm32 pros and put the nice usb
2019-02-07T19:54:24 < antto> it's xmega but teh important X is covered in flux
2019-02-07T19:54:27 < englishman> I had to replace a non thruhole usb yesterday
2019-02-07T19:55:03 < Steffanx> suddenly through hole is good?
2019-02-07T19:55:23 < englishman> the paste in hole mounted ones yes
2019-02-07T19:55:42 < antto> englishman it was easy to solder by hand (thanks to flux and wick) but hard to verify.. had to photograph it with teh camera to inspect wut i've done
2019-02-07T19:55:45 < antto> https://i.imgur.com/mMGUBpN.jpg
2019-02-07T19:56:00 < englishman> nice
2019-02-07T19:56:16 < englishman> next time you order from digikey get one of those $5 10x loupes
2019-02-07T19:56:19 < englishman> with light
2019-02-07T19:56:27 < antto> i don't digikey
2019-02-07T19:56:29 < zyp> sup? https://bin.jvnv.net/file/LU8mZ.JPG
2019-02-07T19:56:41 < englishman> China, then
2019-02-07T19:56:45 < Steffanx> isnt that a mr d fail, zyp?
2019-02-07T19:56:45 < antto> bought my parts from dedmuser
2019-02-07T19:56:49 < englishman> nice1
2019-02-07T19:57:13 < antto> zyp aww, it's like it's about to fart
2019-02-07T19:57:32 < Steffanx> you lift your legs when you are about to fart?
2019-02-07T19:57:45 < Steffanx> or butt
2019-02-07T19:57:46 < antto> nah, when you're sitting
2019-02-07T19:58:00 < Steffanx> ty
2019-02-07T19:58:01 < antto> you lift one butt cheek
2019-02-07T19:58:23 < antto> ..to direct teh cloud
2019-02-07T19:58:24 < Steffanx> dont tell the queen
2019-02-07T19:59:04 < antto> when you see someone doing it - now you know why
2019-02-07T19:59:32 < antto> otherwise if u sit on it, it may amplify teh sound
2019-02-07T20:02:16 < antto> so anyway.. it seems like i'm close to finishing with teh ethernet module schematic at teh job, and i've also routed some of it (passives around the KSZ8081, around the arm cr0t3x..)
2019-02-07T20:02:49 < antto> i switched to 0402 size for most things, and 3225 SMD crystals
2019-02-07T20:03:29 < antto> but according to teh feng-shui, the crystal on the arm cortex is gonna end up near the edge of the PCB
2019-02-07T20:04:03 < antto> can't move it to other pinz coz the alternative place is already taken by the MAC periph
2019-02-07T20:04:39 < antto> :/
2019-02-07T20:05:02 < antto> i'm also trying to put all SMD components on the top side
2019-02-07T20:05:41 < antto> haven't routed the most important signals yet (MAC<->PHY)
2019-02-07T20:05:42 < zyp> what's wrong with that?
2019-02-07T20:06:17 < antto> i don't know, i remember someone in here vomited when he saw my white board with the HC49 crystal near the edge
2019-02-07T20:06:31 < zyp> well, duh, it had a HC49
2019-02-07T20:06:57 < antto> so besides that, it's not an issue?
2019-02-07T20:07:34 < zyp> not as far as I know
2019-02-07T20:07:40 < antto> i am surrounding teh crystal with ground and have a few vias around it for bett0r connection to the GND layer..
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2019-02-07T20:36:22 < kakimir> why there is music by artist but not music by producer
2019-02-07T20:37:01 < antto> a kakiquestion
2019-02-07T20:39:11 < kakimir> I noticed that a lot of my musics taste are actually by producer based not by artist
2019-02-07T20:44:11 < Steffanx> dok
2019-02-07T20:48:16 < mawk> the cop called me twice while I was sleeping
2019-02-07T20:48:19 < mawk> that doesn't sound good lol
2019-02-07T20:48:29 < mawk> but I can't call him back, he has a private number
2019-02-07T20:49:50 < mawk> he'll send a SWAT team smash down my door
2019-02-07T20:49:51 < kakimir> you mean no caller id
2019-02-07T20:49:54 < mawk> yes
2019-02-07T20:50:03 < mawk> but he doesn't have my address for now, I'm safe
2019-02-07T20:50:18 < antto> nah, they won't smash yer door
2019-02-07T20:50:34 < antto> they gon open up yer roof and descend from teh sky
2019-02-07T20:50:55 < mawk> lol
2019-02-07T20:51:13 < antto> right in ur bed
2019-02-07T20:51:19 < mawk> I hope he doesn't believe I'm protecting the pædos
2019-02-07T20:51:27 < kakimir> why don't you give the logs?
2019-02-07T20:51:31 < mawk> because I don't have them
2019-02-07T20:51:41 < antto> synthesize some logs together
2019-02-07T20:51:44 < mawk> I forgot to enable logging some months ago when my hosting provider crashed my server
2019-02-07T20:51:51 < kakimir> you microwaved your servers?
2019-02-07T20:51:52 < mawk> he wants logs about precise URLs
2019-02-07T20:52:16 < mawk> the motherboard fried, according to the provider
2019-02-07T20:52:41 < Steffanx> i'd move to dutchland while you still can :P
2019-02-07T20:52:47 < mawk> lol
2019-02-07T20:52:55 < kakimir> so if you don't have logs - what they want?
2019-02-07T20:53:08 < zyp> better delete your own cp before they come and grab your computer
2019-02-07T20:53:11 < mawk> lol
2019-02-07T20:53:14 < mawk> they still want the logs
2019-02-07T20:53:17 < mawk> I'm required by laws to have them
2019-02-07T20:53:37 < kakimir> okay
2019-02-07T20:53:47 < kakimir> have you studied implications for not having logs?
2019-02-07T20:54:01 < kakimir> in this type of case?
2019-02-07T20:54:02 < mawk> maybe 5 years of jail and around 50k€ fine
2019-02-07T20:54:07 < mawk> is the theoretical maximum
2019-02-07T20:54:10 < mawk> but they never give it
2019-02-07T20:54:14 < kakimir> and remember - article 13
2019-02-07T20:54:42 < Steffanx> dont forget to remove ##stm32 logs as well
2019-02-07T20:55:58 < mawk> https://korben.info/a-propos-de-duree-de-conservation-logs-de-connexion.html
2019-02-07T20:56:09 < mawk> this article says the european law is okay with 14 days conservation of lgos
2019-02-07T20:56:12 < mawk> which is what I did
2019-02-07T20:56:21 < mawk> and that is in contradiction with the french law that mandates 1 year
2019-02-07T20:56:27 < mawk> maybe if I get political and stuff I will avoid sanction
2019-02-07T20:56:59 < Steffanx> i'd start a crowd fund
2019-02-07T21:00:09 < mawk> I checked the law, it's 1 year prison and 75k€ fine
2019-02-07T21:00:21 < mawk> the law is so unreadable
2019-02-07T21:00:28 < mawk> the politicians do that on purpose to keep their jobs
2019-02-07T21:01:16 < kakimir> when was the content uploaded to your site?
2019-02-07T21:01:45 < mawk> child porn I guess
2019-02-07T21:01:57 < mawk> if it was drugs that'd be the customs police that would contact me
2019-02-07T21:02:12 < mawk> I didn't click on the links in the judiciary requisition, for obvious reasons
2019-02-07T21:03:11 < mawk> the law says that the requsition is said known to me only if it contains my full name, address, date of birth, job
2019-02-07T21:03:17 < mawk> it didn't contain any of that, just my name
2019-02-07T21:03:22 < mawk> maybe I can oppose the requsition that way
2019-02-07T21:03:27 < mawk> a competent lawyer could help
2019-02-07T21:03:34 < mawk> but I'm sure the cop is nice and all and won't press charges
2019-02-07T21:03:43 < mawk> I can help him further with more CP cases
2019-02-07T21:08:00 < mawk> at least I can't be charged with hosting CP
2019-02-07T21:08:10 < mawk> because I didn't know
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2019-02-07T21:11:49 < kakimir> I wonder how people creating neural network based content analysers teach neural networks for detecting CP
2019-02-07T21:13:27 < mawk> you mix a nudity detector with a children detector
2019-02-07T21:13:43 < mawk> UNIX philosophy applied to ML
2019-02-07T21:14:58 < kakimir> have you concidered setting up some content filters mawk?
2019-02-07T21:15:08 < kakimir> is it possible nowdays?
2019-02-07T21:15:16 < mawk> I'm not required by law to do it
2019-02-07T21:15:18 < kakimir> for small players
2019-02-07T21:15:34 < mawk> I'm just required to keep logs and delete litigious content upon request
2019-02-07T21:15:48 < mawk> but I guess if you like ML you could use a content filter yeah
2019-02-07T21:16:33 < kakimir> is there solutions that you could get for free or for reasonable pricing?
2019-02-07T21:20:13 < mawk> well I can surely cook up my own using open source tools
2019-02-07T21:20:20 < mawk> but I have no incentive to do so
2019-02-07T21:20:25 < mawk> now that I have proper logging I respect the law
2019-02-07T21:20:32 < mawk> I can delete upon request, respond to requsitions
2019-02-07T21:20:50 < mawk> but that also means the pædos keep enjoying their filthy stuff using my servers so I don't know
2019-02-07T21:20:54 < mawk> I guess I can take a look
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2019-02-07T21:37:05 < mawk> I have too much deadlines
2019-02-07T21:37:15 < mawk> if I wasn't totally lazy I'd burn out
2019-02-07T21:37:21 < Steffanx> Poor mawk
2019-02-07T21:37:30 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-07T21:37:45 < mawk> so my technique of prioritization is "do the most interesting, skip the rest"
2019-02-07T21:38:21 < mawk> that means I'm several months late on a C parser, I just have a few hours left for a KVM client, a few days left for the 6LoWPAN stack, a few hours for a chrome extension
2019-02-07T21:38:40 < mawk> so I don't get paid also
2019-02-07T21:39:26 < mawk> I should ask for higher rates and do less stuff
2019-02-07T21:39:34 < mawk> but people don't trust students right out of the school
2019-02-07T21:39:42 < mawk> they think I don't have skills and I'll have to be trained so paid less
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2019-02-07T21:50:03 < Cracki> they don't think at all. they just aim low and see if you bite
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2019-02-07T21:50:34 < Cracki> most recent offer I got for consulting and implementing on computer vision was 50/hour. that's practically an insult.
2019-02-07T21:51:30 < qyx> I don't consider 50e/h low even for germany
2019-02-07T21:51:48 < qyx> thats 8k€ in consultations monthly
2019-02-07T21:52:22 < Cracki> your calc is wrong
2019-02-07T21:52:36 < qyx> in what sense
2019-02-07T21:52:39 < Cracki> consulting will never amount to full 40 hours a week 
2019-02-07T21:52:58 < qyx> yeah, but you also don't consult only one contract
2019-02-07T21:53:14 < Cracki> you're charging all the time you are NOT on the clock, but educating yourself, R&D, tools, ..
2019-02-07T21:53:27 < zyp> shitposting on irc
2019-02-07T21:53:30 < zyp> most important part
2019-02-07T21:53:45 < Cracki> 50/hour is a good salary but NOT an acceptable freelance rate
2019-02-07T21:54:06 < zyp> idk, I've done contract work at 50/hour
2019-02-07T21:54:22 < Cracki> my boss doesn't even sell me to the customer for less than 60/h and that's with the understanding that I'm a "lowly student programmer monkey"
2019-02-07T21:54:52 < qyx> it doesn't matter what your boss sells you for
2019-02-07T21:55:22 < qyx> it is not what you will write on the invoice
2019-02-07T21:55:30 < Cracki> for a high skill task that's not just code monkeying, 50/h is an insult
2019-02-07T21:56:04 < qyx> you'll have very hard life
2019-02-07T21:56:25 < Cracki> the one who made that offer now gets to learn the skills for that task himself
2019-02-07T21:57:46 < Cracki> there is simply no way I'm dealing with the headache of a *stingy* customer who has no idea how hard the task is. I've done that once and it backfired.
2019-02-07T21:58:06 < Cracki> they want it? they can pay for it, or diy
2019-02-07T21:59:26 < Cracki> price dumping is a stab in the back of your fellow freelancers. customers learn to expect cheap rates, but they never learn that for their expectations they will only get poor results
2019-02-07T22:00:06 < zyp> something something supply and demand
2019-02-07T22:00:32 < Cracki> that theory of economy assumes a rational agent
2019-02-07T22:01:30 < Cracki> it entirely lacks notions of trust and deception, fitness signaling, ...
2019-02-07T22:03:02 < kakimir> can you make it big in engineering?
2019-02-07T22:03:06 < kakimir> inspire me
2019-02-07T22:03:42 < qyx> less irc
2019-02-07T22:05:33 < kakimir> I said inspire
2019-02-07T22:06:07 < qyx> sorry I am not being helpful
2019-02-07T22:06:57 < kakimir> I irc less when I'm more inspired about the innovations
2019-02-07T22:07:08 < kakimir> it doesn't go another way
2019-02-07T22:07:37 < kakimir> Ircing less doesn't make me more inspired
2019-02-07T22:23:10 < aandrew> lol freecancer
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2019-02-07T23:03:12 < jpa-> Cracki: i've started weighting the job contents more and more; interesting task at 60e/h makes more sense than boring stuff at 80e/h; and 60e/h is always better than 0e/h
2019-02-07T23:04:26 < jpa-> and besides, nowadays the people who want cheapest and crappiest freelancers have enough supply from low-income countries - it's not like one more makes much of a difference
2019-02-07T23:16:05 < zyp> jpa-, but even offering the interesting task at 60 is an insult!
2019-02-07T23:24:32 < kakimir> how much of that 60 is net income?
2019-02-07T23:24:52 < zyp> net how?
2019-02-07T23:25:02 < mawk> in France you substract a 28% tax 
2019-02-07T23:25:12 < mawk> it's not even tax, it's social cotisation
2019-02-07T23:25:18 < mawk> I'm exempted from tax since I don't make enough money
2019-02-07T23:25:35 < mawk> I received my social cotisation paper some time ago, they're asking me for around 300€
2019-02-07T23:25:39 < mawk> while my bank account is at -1200€
2019-02-07T23:25:43 < mawk> so I declared 0€ income
2019-02-07T23:25:50 < mawk> I hope they won't look around too much
2019-02-07T23:26:14 < zyp> tax rates generally depends on a bunch of factors
2019-02-07T23:26:28 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-07T23:26:41 < mawk> it's split into levels, each level is gradually more taxed
2019-02-07T23:26:50 < mawk> here at least, but that system must be common
2019-02-07T23:27:01 < zyp> yes
2019-02-07T23:27:08 < mawk> the last level is around 50%, they deleted the 70% level because the high court ruled that is was confiscatory
2019-02-07T23:27:14 < mawk> maybe it was 80%
2019-02-07T23:27:18 < mawk> that Hollande president hated the rich
2019-02-07T23:31:37 < kakimir> there is taxes and other fees too
2019-02-07T23:33:14 < zyp> hmm, in my current tax bracket, the marginal tax rate on profit from contract work and similar is 37.6%
2019-02-07T23:34:24 < zyp> if I actually started to do more contract work (without my day job salary going down), I'd go up another bracket and pay 46.6%
2019-02-07T23:34:42 < Cracki> when I see obvious headaches, 50/h isn't forth the suffering
2019-02-07T23:36:31 < Cracki> I'm not gonna be essentially the project manager for 50/h, nope. I've seen enough of htat.
2019-02-07T23:38:23 < Cracki> that offer would have included telling the guy what hw to buy and how to set it up so it yields decent sensor data, over the internet... I'm sure you guys just didn't grasp the scope
2019-02-07T23:39:01 < zyp> well, naturally, you didn't elaborate on it
2019-02-07T23:39:33 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2019-02-07T23:39:52 < Cracki> application would have been industrial, supposedly, and I gave him names of some companies that would sell him EXACTLY what he wanted
2019-02-07T23:40:06 < Cracki> but he thought he could reinvent the wheel cheaper than they would sell it
2019-02-07T23:40:45 < Cracki> sure, customers aren't supposed to know all this, they only have a need they want fulfilled.
2019-02-07T23:41:34 < Cracki> but if I explain all that and the scope of it still doesn't register, yeah maybe not
2019-02-07T23:43:12 < Cracki> maybe next time I'm being too vague, I get a little trust? :P
2019-02-07T23:45:19 < mawk> if I had 50€/h I'd be happy lol
2019-02-07T23:46:35 < mawk> my last thing is at 30€/h
2019-02-07T23:46:37 < mawk> before taxes
2019-02-07T23:47:34 < mawk> if I didn't cheat the taxes I'd get 23.30€/h after deduction
2019-02-07T23:48:44 < qyx> you cheat logging, taxes.. what else
2019-02-07T23:49:35 < Steffanx> Life.
2019-02-07T23:49:40 < Steffanx> Death*
2019-02-07T23:49:44 < Steffanx> I mean,. Lol.
2019-02-07T23:51:11 < qyx> you are laughing but here in eastern EU, a common programmer's monthly income is around 2-3k€
2019-02-07T23:51:22 < mawk> lol qyx 
2019-02-07T23:51:28 < mawk> I didn't cheat logging, it wasn't on purpose
2019-02-07T23:51:39 < qyx> and 25-30€/h is common for simple contract work
2019-02-07T23:51:59 < mawk> if I wasn't at -1200€ on my bank account I'd have paid the taxes I think
2019-02-07T23:52:26 < qyx> https://www.platy.sk/platy/informacne-technologie/c-programator
2019-02-07T23:52:29 < qyx> see for example
2019-02-07T23:52:44 < mawk> in France too
2019-02-07T23:52:46 < mawk> same numbers
2019-02-07T23:52:51 < mawk> for simple programming work
2019-02-07T23:54:31 < Cracki> income needs to be interpreted relative to cost of living
2019-02-07T23:54:50 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-07T23:54:56 < Cracki> so... how many loaves of bread is that? or how many iphones? :>
2019-02-07T23:55:00 < mawk> in Paris the cost of living is very high
2019-02-07T23:55:11 < qyx> so lets compare, monthly rent of a 3room flat here is ~650€
2019-02-07T23:55:31 < Cracki> how much is that in sq meters?
2019-02-07T23:55:47 < qyx> about 70-80
2019-02-07T23:55:54 < Cracki> my place is 60 sqm for ~570/month
2019-02-07T23:56:02 < mawk> a coffee is 2-3€, a baguette is 1€, a 30m² flat is 1000€/month
2019-02-07T23:56:06 < Cracki> old house tho, so cheaper
2019-02-07T23:56:19 < mawk> and typically the landlords ask for a salary that's triple the rent, so you need to make 3000€/month to get a 30m² flat
2019-02-07T23:56:23 < Cracki> wat 1000 for 30 sqm? usury!
2019-02-07T23:56:26 < mawk> lol
2019-02-07T23:56:28 < mawk> that's paris
2019-02-07T23:56:34 < Cracki> shoot the landlords
2019-02-07T23:57:09 < qyx> mawk: bread about 1.2€, 1L of milk ~0.80€, baguette depends, 1-3€
2019-02-07T23:57:36 < qyx> I mean, cost of living is very high here
2019-02-07T23:57:40 < mawk> yeah, sounds about the same prices
2019-02-07T23:57:41 < qyx> and salaries low
2019-02-07T23:57:50 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-07T23:58:06 < mawk> Cracki: https://www.seloger.com/prix-de-l-immo/location/ile-de-france/paris.htm
2019-02-07T23:58:09 < qyx> but this is in the capital, if you go more east, rental is about ~half
2019-02-07T23:58:22 < Cracki> too many people in the job market? why are they paying you so little compared to cost of living?
2019-02-07T23:58:23 < qyx> other things like food are comparable
2019-02-07T23:58:32 < Cracki> ah, good
2019-02-07T23:59:25 < Cracki> my area isn't the cheapest (eastern country is cheapest) but compared to big cities it's still affordable
2019-02-07T23:59:50 < qyx> not many, we are short of IT people and despite that fact, many companies don't want to pay more
--- Day changed Fri Feb 08 2019
2019-02-08T00:00:16 < Cracki> their loss
2019-02-08T00:00:30 < Cracki> apparently they don't need the skill?
2019-02-08T00:00:47 < qyx> idk
2019-02-08T00:01:10 < qyx> people are shy to ask rather
2019-02-08T00:01:22 < Cracki> brains drain, dumb workers flow in
2019-02-08T00:01:55 < Cracki> I'm working to shake that shyness myself
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2019-02-08T00:11:59 < karlp> where's qyx again?
2019-02-08T00:12:35 < qyx> .sk
2019-02-08T00:13:19 < antto> riding a skateduino board
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2019-02-08T00:26:32 < tjq> Full take care
2019-02-08T00:26:52 < tjq> :$
2019-02-08T00:26:56 < tjq> :)
2019-02-08T00:30:17 < Cracki> >security [...] UNWILLING to work https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dy0ZIFDWwAE9XKf.jpg
2019-02-08T00:36:47 < dongs> lunix.tv is expiring in < 2 months what should I do
2019-02-08T00:39:55 < zyp> looks pretty dead
2019-02-08T00:40:07 < zyp> just like tv on linux
2019-02-08T00:40:14 < dongs> lul
2019-02-08T00:40:21 < dongs> well tv on lunix was never alive
2019-02-08T00:50:38 < karlp> hhere dongs, better tahn heatshrink. https://www.eenewsembedded.com/news/bringing-compression-smallest-embedded-computer-systems?news_id=114570
2019-02-08T00:51:30 < dongs> ya?
2019-02-08T00:51:36 < dongs> uhh
2019-02-08T00:51:39 < dongs> thats payware lol
2019-02-08T00:51:49 < zyp> only 3k EUR
2019-02-08T00:51:50 < karlp> closed sorce is best thought?
2019-02-08T00:51:58 < dongs> what fucking faggotry
2019-02-08T00:52:01 < dongs> no, segger can fuck themselves
2019-02-08T00:52:17 < dongs> i opened a ticket that their shit needs a usb replug after the probe cable is connected backwards into jtag socket
2019-02-08T00:52:25 < dongs> they closed it as "it works here"
2019-02-08T00:52:28 < dongs> when it obviosuly doesnt
2019-02-08T00:52:36 < dongs> oh and suggested i use keyed sockets
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2019-02-08T00:52:45 < zyp> well, duh :p
2019-02-08T00:53:24 < dongs> what a terrible product name
2019-02-08T00:53:30 < dongs> apparently SMASH V2 is some fucking sneakers
2019-02-08T00:53:44 < dongs> https://us.puma.com/en/us/pd/puma-smash-v2-sneakers/364989.html
2019-02-08T00:53:47 < dongs> 1st google hit
2019-02-08T00:54:00 < karlp> no, that's just the _algoriddim_
2019-02-08T00:54:03 < karlp> it's really called "emCompress-ToGo "
2019-02-08T00:54:29 < zyp> https://www.segger.com/purchase/pricing/empack/ <- nice price on this shit also
2019-02-08T00:54:42 < dongs> haha
2019-02-08T00:55:19 < karlp> plus 20% for germs
2019-02-08T00:56:01 < zyp> I'm pretty sure anybody buying that shit would be VAT registered
2019-02-08T00:56:05 < englishman> good evening dongers and dongees
2019-02-08T00:56:24 < dongs> karlp is putting emModBus out of business with his opensores shit
2019-02-08T00:56:26 < englishman> another esp32 opensores project arrived in the mail today
2019-02-08T00:56:34 < karlp> dongs: not me, I'm just using freemodbus.
2019-02-08T00:56:38 < englishman> with a hologram.io sim card inside
2019-02-08T00:56:43 < dongs> ah i thought you were contributing to ti
2019-02-08T00:56:47 < dongs> it
2019-02-08T00:56:54 < karlp> got afew patches, but I don't want to maintain it
2019-02-08T00:57:06 < karlp> upstream froze and just left it as is, only offers commercial now.
2019-02-08T00:57:17 < karlp> and there's no group/(person who decided to take over 
2019-02-08T00:57:33 < karlp> so there's like NNN forks all over githhub with varrious patches
2019-02-08T00:57:33 < englishman> zyp why are you contracting for 50/hr it is minimum 100/hour for pros just starting off
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2019-02-08T00:57:50 < dongs> https://blog.segger.com/smash-an-efficient-compression-algorithm-for-microcontrollers/
2019-02-08T00:59:22 < qyx> so it is basically the same as heatshrink
2019-02-08T00:59:27 < dongs> yeah pretty much
2019-02-08T01:00:31 < qyx> when does china reopens
2019-02-08T01:00:36 < dongs> 13th
2019-02-08T01:00:43 < qyx> mhm
2019-02-08T01:00:47 < dongs> but i think some people will be back on 11th
2019-02-08T01:00:58 < dongs> chinapcb opened wednesday
2019-02-08T01:01:04 < dongs> but stencil shop doesnt open until 13
2019-02-08T01:11:24 < englishman> opensores esp32 project is setup and selfupdating firmwarez ota
2019-02-08T01:14:35 < dongs> esp1488
2019-02-08T01:14:41 < dongs> does that shit have a proper debugger yet
2019-02-08T01:14:45 < dongs> or is it still arduino.exe
2019-02-08T01:16:47 < veverak> what
2019-02-08T01:16:53 < veverak> everything has proper debugger these days
2019-02-08T01:16:56 < veverak> use printf()
2019-02-08T01:16:58 < veverak> </troll>
2019-02-08T01:20:00 < englishman> no its printf ONLY
2019-02-08T01:20:23 < englishman> but with all this writeonce and or copypaste code there really is no need for debugging
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2019-02-08T01:26:27 < Cracki> https://hackaday.com/2015/12/12/squash-your-esp-8266-bugs-with-esp-gdbstub/
2019-02-08T01:26:54 < Cracki> (dec 2015, so even if nothing happened since then, at least that level has been achieved)
2019-02-08T01:27:38 < englishman> theres so much flash on the esp32 it can store a bunch of images and fallback nicely if there is a problem
2019-02-08T01:33:07 < dongs> gdbstub is fucking useless
2019-02-08T01:33:12 < dongs> that just runs in userspace
2019-02-08T01:33:20 < dongs> so when your shit crashes, its just as good as arduino debugging
2019-02-08T01:35:05 < zyp> the rtos a guy at my old company wrote had a gdb stub thing that let you debug other threads
2019-02-08T01:35:45 < dongs> i wrote a gdbstub for BREW and leeched ROM of my flipphone back in like 2005
2019-02-08T01:35:52 < dongs> via mobile data
2019-02-08T01:36:56 < karlp> yeah, ardu esp dudes reallyt figured out making OTA pretty much work
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2019-02-08T02:52:20 < Laurenceb_123> the demiurge
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2019-02-08T05:53:05 < rajkosto> anyone tried http://embeddedlightning.com/ugui/ ?
2019-02-08T06:06:05 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-08_05-05-59_CvtU097gC.png A L  L
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2019-02-08T07:29:35 < R2COM> yo
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2019-02-08T07:39:09 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-08T07:39:12 < dongs> my trash failed EMC
2019-02-08T07:39:17 < dongs> highest peaks at 186mhz
2019-02-08T07:39:21 < dongs> what teh shit is that a multiple of
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2019-02-08T07:47:22 < Simon--> arduino frequency
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2019-02-08T07:57:32 < dongs> hmm the only thing thats switching is at 400kHz, 409 to be exaft
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2019-02-08T08:17:38 < ds2> SPI bus garbage?
2019-02-08T08:20:56 < ds2> do you have a spec an plot form the EMC run?
2019-02-08T08:21:20 < tjq> Peddle my balls
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2019-02-08T08:44:33 < rajkosto> as for my missing CS pin, this fixes it https://github.com/Bodmer/TFT_eSPI/issues/163
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2019-02-08T10:38:59 < rajkosto> at 2x5 might as well break out all of jtag
2019-02-08T10:39:04 < rajkosto> swd can be done wiht 4 pins
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2019-02-08T10:56:16 < rajkosto> im counting gnd
2019-02-08T10:56:18 < rajkosto> vdd isnt necessary
2019-02-08T10:56:41 < rajkosto> GND, SWDCLK, SWDIO, SWDO
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2019-02-08T10:57:38 < rajkosto> if both devices are powered by 3.3v you dont need to expose it
2019-02-08T10:58:14 < qyx> idk, I am using gnd, swdio, swclk only
2019-02-08T10:58:22 < qyx> with a dump stlink2 from nucleo boards
2019-02-08T10:58:25 < rajkosto> yes SWDO is for trace output only
2019-02-08T10:58:30 < qyx> works for anything from 1V8 to 3V3
2019-02-08T10:59:16 < qyx> *dumb
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2019-02-08T11:00:32 < rajkosto> you invent whatever you need
2019-02-08T11:02:01 < rajkosto> it does if you use the correct idc cables
2019-02-08T11:02:04 < rajkosto> with the notch
2019-02-08T11:03:27 < qyx> yes, you have to remove one pin
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2019-02-08T11:16:41 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_qwUS8Uqjg how about musics?
2019-02-08T11:19:50 < dongs> old as fuck
2019-02-08T11:22:01 < dongs> nice kikecad bro
2019-02-08T11:24:56 < qyx> your rj45 holes are not holing correctly
2019-02-08T11:25:20 < qyx> also if you put the cortex debug connector close to the screw, you won't be able to connect anything to it
2019-02-08T11:25:38 < qyx> because the IDC is wider
2019-02-08T11:26:10 < dongs> how many hours did that take to render on POV-GAY
2019-02-08T11:26:31 < qyx> HAHA
2019-02-08T11:27:09 < dongs> production flashing using swd is retarded
2019-02-08T11:27:23 < dongs> setup vcc/rx/tx/boot/gnd and flahs using uart bootloader
2019-02-08T11:27:39 < dongs> doesn't have to be a header, could be pads for pogo pins etc.
2019-02-08T11:27:42 < qyx> it depends what is production
2019-02-08T11:27:47 < dongs> no , uart bootloader is free
2019-02-08T11:27:58 < dongs> qyx, i'd say anything > 10 units
2019-02-08T11:28:18 < dongs> ?
2019-02-08T11:28:23 < dongs> oh lul
2019-02-08T11:28:28 < dongs> well, i think atmel has some SAM-BA tarsh
2019-02-08T11:29:48 < karlp> good assumings
2019-02-08T11:30:05 < karlp> you think _all_ sam shit is production flashed via swd/jtag?
2019-02-08T11:30:41 < qyx> I like how optimistically you routed the MII/RMII
2019-02-08T11:30:51 < qyx> oh maybe on SAM it is more sane
2019-02-08T11:30:59 < karlp> "kinda faked" ?
2019-02-08T11:31:02 < qyx> because on STM32 it is spread across the entire chip
2019-02-08T11:32:28 < karlp> still keeping the xplained headers
2019-02-08T11:32:32 < karlp> what are you even doing here?
2019-02-08T11:32:50 < karlp> can I haz my own xplained board?
2019-02-08T11:36:03 < karlp> is your board going to be useful to enough people, that are all assembling themselves that this is a useful thing to have done?
2019-02-08T11:39:47 < rajkosto> i do the multi footprint thing often too
2019-02-08T11:39:55 < rajkosto> so i can use whatever i have on hand instead of waiting for parts to arrive
2019-02-08T11:41:26 < karlp> 8081 is the new parts right?
2019-02-08T11:42:56 < karlp> 8091 adds wakeon lan and green tech
2019-02-08T11:43:09 < karlp> driver would work same, just no extra features
2019-02-08T11:43:33 < karlp> reducing power when it detects a shorter cable
2019-02-08T11:43:40 < karlp> instead of blasting everything assuming 100m links
2019-02-08T11:43:55 < karlp> power savings canbe quite substantial
2019-02-08T11:44:09 < karlp> especially when you're in a switch :)
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2019-02-08T12:18:21 < rajkosto> does it say you can ?
2019-02-08T12:18:29 < rajkosto> for some you can even swap the wires inside of a pair
2019-02-08T12:50:22 < Steffanx> It is
2019-02-08T12:52:17 < qyx> yes you can swap rx/tx
2019-02-08T12:52:25 < qyx> you can swap rx+/rx- on some too as rajkosto says
2019-02-08T12:53:23 < qyx> and you don't need to match lengths unless they are like tens of cm different
2019-02-08T12:53:55 < qyx> just route it from the back then
2019-02-08T12:54:06 < qyx> I don't see any problem
2019-02-08T12:54:56 < qyx> http://andybrown.me.uk/wp-content/images//ksz8051mk2/cad_top.png
2019-02-08T12:54:58 < qyx> like this
2019-02-08T12:55:59 < rajkosto> non 45-degree traces reeee
2019-02-08T12:56:35 < qyx> theres no cortex, it doesn't matter
2019-02-08T12:58:10 < qyx> wth should I mspaint it to you?
2019-02-08T12:58:44 < rajkosto> is it 100mbit or gigabit
2019-02-08T12:59:35 < rajkosto> then auto mdix would handle the rx/tx pairs swapped
2019-02-08T12:59:48 < rajkosto> but polarity must still be correct unless datasheet says otherwise
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2019-02-08T13:07:46 < rajkosto> my autism would still force me to wire it "correctly" 
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2019-02-08T13:17:16 < qyx> stm32f373 RM is only 915 pages long
2019-02-08T13:17:25 < rajkosto> yooo can i on the fly switch SPI from 8bit to 16bit mode
2019-02-08T13:17:27 < qyx> I liked those much
2019-02-08T13:17:37 < rajkosto> before a transaction
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2019-02-08T13:23:40 < jpa-> rajkosto: you have to disable SPE bit before that, and then re-enable
2019-02-08T13:23:50 < jpa-> otherwise you'll get 11 bit transfer instead
2019-02-08T13:24:26 < rajkosto> just wanna use the full girth of DR
2019-02-08T13:25:31 < rajkosto> is spi disable/reenable slow ?
2019-02-08T13:27:31 < karlp> just use dma instead?
2019-02-08T13:27:37 < karlp> what are you trying to save?
2019-02-08T13:29:18 < rajkosto> blame dongs
2019-02-08T13:33:38 < jpa-> SPE is just one bit
2019-02-08T13:33:48 < jpa-> it doesn't take any longer than any register write to APB bus
2019-02-08T13:41:48 < karlp> hello eurovision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVbShUW6QBM
2019-02-08T13:44:01 < Steffanx> Fuck this freak show vison karlp :P
2019-02-08T13:44:46 < karlp> certainly more fun than the generic trash of the other contestants.
2019-02-08T13:45:10 < dongs> rajkosto: absolutely
2019-02-08T13:45:20 < dongs> depends on chip, some you have to disable/reenable.
2019-02-08T13:45:40 < dongs> im doing that for SPI-connected LCD thing in my code
2019-02-08T13:45:52 < rajkosto> me 2
2019-02-08T13:46:15 < dongs> 8bit for commands then switch to 16bit, and depending on amount of data to send, i either jsut clock it out or if DMA setup time +etc is wroth it, go that route.
2019-02-08T13:46:44 < rajkosto> exactly
2019-02-08T13:47:10 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-08_12-47-06_GE3MVSJ94.png
2019-02-08T13:47:27 < dongs> dongtastic lcdv
2019-02-08T13:48:01 < karlp> what'swith the twists in those pins?!
2019-02-08T13:48:36 < englishman> I'd say production flashing with swd is fine, st-link Util even has an automatic mode
2019-02-08T13:48:51 < englishman> and stdink is $20
2019-02-08T13:50:22 < PaulFertser> karlp: that clip might be visually intriguing but I fail to hear anything noteworthy in the audio part of it, sorry. 
2019-02-08T13:50:57 < rajkosto> he's clipping the mic
2019-02-08T13:51:04 < rajkosto> or just cranking up volume
2019-02-08T13:51:09 < rajkosto> bad form
2019-02-08T13:51:14 < karlp> that's ok, I've always enjoyed their music too.
2019-02-08T13:57:29 < PaulFertser> I'd watch eurovision if it had something like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FLZXEN4H1E
2019-02-08T13:58:15 < englishman> I'd watch Eurovision if it had https://youtu.be/SYnVYJDxu2Q
2019-02-08T13:59:46 < karlp> PaulFertser: nice one, thanks.
2019-02-08T14:00:11 < karlp> well, I'm not real confident that Hatari will get out of the competition here, the "eurovision people" are just ignoring it and pretendign it doesn't exist.
2019-02-08T14:00:53 < Thorn> I'd watch Eurovision if it had  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wm8vcFn0bgY and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnsUkE8i0tU
2019-02-08T14:00:57 < PaulFertser> karlp: I'm really glad you liked it. Somehow they're one of the "less known" bands despite being quite unique.
2019-02-08T14:02:03 < qyx> englishman: we used swd/jtag in production too, even some of our customers in large factories
2019-02-08T14:02:19 < qyx> although with some weird renesas jtag adapters
2019-02-08T14:11:11 < PaulFertser> englishman: I'd guess that one had fair chances to get into the eurovision contest back then.
2019-02-08T14:12:59 < PaulFertser> Thorn: you know Grateful Dead were giving out LSD during their performances? Would be kinda cool too see that going on EV indeed.
2019-02-08T14:16:41 < PaulFertser> And for those unfamiliar with that story you might be interested in bizzare design of their sound equipment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_of_Sound_(Grateful_Dead)
2019-02-08T14:16:45 < Thorn> if your music is good you don't need that shit
2019-02-08T14:17:59 < PaulFertser> Probably
2019-02-08T14:19:09 < PaulFertser> I remember there was a regular bulletin called "Infected Mushroom" with nice articles on developing malware in the 90s, distributed via BBSes and Fidonet.
2019-02-08T14:25:25 < rajkosto> dongs, i want a OLED with full RGB instead of this IPS tho, but they are 2x the price
2019-02-08T14:25:40 < dongs> good thing you only need one, so price is not an issue
2019-02-08T14:26:42 < rajkosto> still feels silly to pay 9$ for a tiny display
2019-02-08T14:31:29 < rajkosto> and they need a boost circuit to provide 12V
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2019-02-08T15:30:36 < Ecco> Hi :)
2019-02-08T15:30:46 < Ecco> I'm having weird issue with USB not enumerating on certain MCUs
2019-02-08T15:30:59 < Ecco> same code, same board. Works great on F767, doesnt on F730
2019-02-08T15:31:07 < Ecco> I think it has to do with vbus sensing
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2019-02-08T15:50:02 < zyp> yeah, I think there are differences in dwc_otg version between some of the F7 parts
2019-02-08T15:51:04 < Ecco> what's dwc?
2019-02-08T15:51:28 < zyp> synopsys designware
2019-02-08T15:51:33 < Ecco> oh
2019-02-08T15:51:37 < Ecco> ok :)
2019-02-08T15:51:49 < zyp> dwc_otg is the name of the usb core used in the otg-capable stm32s
2019-02-08T15:51:51 < Ecco> so wait, you mean ST doesn't do its own IP?
2019-02-08T15:51:55 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-08T15:52:20 < zyp> not all of it, no
2019-02-08T15:52:32 < qyx> anyone used F373 except emeb?
2019-02-08T15:52:34 < zyp> both the usb otg and the ethernet cores are synopsys
2019-02-08T15:52:42 < Ecco> ok!
2019-02-08T15:53:12 < zyp> qyx, I've got some of emeb's old f373 breakout boards somewhere
2019-02-08T15:53:15 < qyx> datasheet says 21 SDADC channels max
2019-02-08T15:53:28 < zyp> never did anything with the SDADC though
2019-02-08T15:54:08 < qyx> but somehow I found 23
2019-02-08T15:54:16 < qyx> so probably I am missing something
2019-02-08T15:54:21 < zyp> baker's dozen
2019-02-08T15:55:05 < zyp> what do you mean by found? documentation being inconsistent?
2019-02-08T15:55:06 < qyx> maybe some combinations are not usable
2019-02-08T15:55:36 < qyx> it is consistent, it says 21 everywhere
2019-02-08T15:56:03 < qyx> but when I start counting pins marked as SDADCx AINx, I count 23
2019-02-08T15:57:44 < zyp> ok, I'm gonna look
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2019-02-08T15:59:30 < qyx> theres a catch probably, because there are AIN-P and AIN-M pins
2019-02-08T15:59:55 < zyp> yeah, it says 21 single ended or 11 differential
2019-02-08T16:00:08 < qyx> RM says if you configure in single-ended mode, AIN9 is not usabled
2019-02-08T16:00:18 < qyx> because it is connected internally to VMID or whatever
2019-02-08T16:00:32 < zyp> and then later it says SDADC3 has 10, while 1 and 2 have five each and five shared
2019-02-08T16:00:33 < qyx> but theres not even a AIN9 pad
2019-02-08T16:01:26 < qyx> so it would be 25 in this case
2019-02-08T16:01:50 < qyx> so the question is which are usable as single-ended
2019-02-08T16:04:21 < zyp> ah, RM says 5 differential or 9 single ended per peripheral
2019-02-08T16:05:06 < qyx> yeah
2019-02-08T16:05:24 < zyp> "All three SDADCs can share up to 23 input pins which may be configured in any combination of single-ended (up to 21) or differential inputs (up to 11)."
2019-02-08T16:05:49 < zyp> I don't get this :)
2019-02-08T16:05:54 < qyx> so I have to find the 2 which cannot be configured as single-ended
2019-02-08T16:06:02 < qyx> for some reason
2019-02-08T16:07:39 < zyp> hmm, I suspect the explanation might be fairly simple, hang on
2019-02-08T16:08:11 < karlp> it is just overlapping pins from the separate sdadcs?
2019-02-08T16:08:49 < zyp> okay, I expect it's PB10 and PD15 that are not usable as single ended inputs
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2019-02-08T16:12:18 < zyp> yup, that would be it
2019-02-08T16:12:31 < qyx> why?
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2019-02-08T16:13:41 < zyp> because for singleended channels you'd only use SDADCx_AINyP
2019-02-08T16:14:06 < qyx> fuk
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2019-02-08T16:14:14 < zyp> "When in single-ended mode, the negative input is set to VREFSD- pin internally, leaving the corresponding pin for the negative input (SDADCx_AIN[n]M) free to be used for other purposes."
2019-02-08T16:14:31 < zyp> and PB10/PD15 only have M-signals
2019-02-08T16:14:38 < zyp> so there's 21 pins in total with P-signals
2019-02-08T16:14:59 < qyx> yeah, those are the only two without P alternatives
2019-02-08T16:15:11 < qyx> \o/
2019-02-08T16:17:41 < karlp> did ST use Positive and Minus? instead of Positive and Negative?
2019-02-08T16:17:43 < karlp> weirdos.
2019-02-08T16:17:50 < zyp> plus and minus?
2019-02-08T16:17:56 < karlp> ok, that works too :)
2019-02-08T16:18:01 < karlp> don't mind me then :)
2019-02-08T16:18:12 < zyp> USB_DP and USB_DM is also a thing
2019-02-08T16:18:24 < karlp> yeah, somehow that was always plus and minus though.
2019-02-08T16:20:03 < qyx> zyp: thanks
2019-02-08T16:20:13 < zyp> np
2019-02-08T16:20:13 < qyx> rubber duck debugging
2019-02-08T16:20:25 < zyp> seems like they've overcomplicated everything
2019-02-08T16:20:26 < qyx> actually not in this case though
2019-02-08T16:22:20 < zyp> apparently the peripherals themselves have 9 positive and 9 negative inputs, so they can each do 9 single ended or differential inputs, and any further limitations are just a matter of which pins are available at the same time
2019-02-08T17:34:59 < jpa-> hmph.. i have this interrupt that needs to run at 1kHz.. it takes 1067us
2019-02-08T17:35:10 < karlp> oops
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2019-02-08T17:50:28 < qyx> H7 to the rescue
2019-02-08T18:13:55 < jpa-> first time i've really wanted CCM ram, and this has none
2019-02-08T18:14:35 < jpa-> i guess i should modify my samplerates a bit so that instead of these silly 5 byte blocks i atleast get 4 byte blocks and can load then aligned as a word
2019-02-08T18:20:00 < jpa-> converting to/from pulse density modulation is surprisingly slow in software
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2019-02-08T18:42:46 < zyp> if the cpu load of the rest of the system isn't too large, optimizing the ISR a bit to run faster should be possible
2019-02-08T18:43:30 < zyp> you just need a 10% efficiency win or something like that
2019-02-08T18:46:42 < jpa-> yeah, but I'd really like it to use more like 10% of cpu time than 90%
2019-02-08T18:48:55 < jpa-> but i think i'll get it there with just slightly worse filtering
2019-02-08T18:51:02 < zyp> 10x efficiency wins aren't all that impossible either, unless you originally did it in a clever way
2019-02-08T18:52:58 < zyp> at least I hope that is the case for some of the work code my coworker is producing
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2019-02-08T19:12:05 < englishman> these Mitsubishi tfts are dope
2019-02-08T19:12:20 < englishman> also til pioneer makes tfts for noritake
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2019-02-08T19:43:36 < qyx> jpa-: are you donging PDM to PCM conversion?
2019-02-08T19:57:17 < jpa-> qyx: yeah, mems mic PDM to PCM and then back to PDM for speaker
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2019-02-08T20:04:27 < qyx> O_o
2019-02-08T20:04:37 < qyx> how are you doing speaker PDM?
2019-02-08T20:04:52 < qyx> with a simple driver/transistor?
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2019-02-08T20:08:09 < jpa-> qyx: basically like class D amplifier
2019-02-08T20:09:21 < qyx> very wow
2019-02-08T20:13:40 < jpa-> i don't know how it sounds yet :P
2019-02-08T20:16:46 < qyx> do you use some ready-made part to drive the speaker? or discretes
2019-02-08T20:16:59 < qyx> did you abuse a mosfet driver?
2019-02-08T20:17:07  * qyx would
2019-02-08T20:17:33 < zyp> I thought we were all about adsl line drivers
2019-02-08T20:21:40 < Cracki> ^
2019-02-08T20:23:42 < jpa-> qyx: currently it is two gpio pins to resistor to headphone speaker :P
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2019-02-08T22:07:22 < jpa-> note to self: -fdata-sections makes functions that access a lot of global variables very slow, as they need to keep track addresses separately instead of indexing (as the sections could be relocated independently)
2019-02-08T22:08:00 < jpa-> there is rarely any data to -gc-sections anyway, so no point using that; -ffunction-sections is fine though
2019-02-08T22:09:28 < Steffanx> hm
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2019-02-08T22:56:55 < antto> fun safe maths
2019-02-08T22:57:29 < antto> fun signed char
2019-02-08T22:57:44 < antto> it's always fun with gcc!
2019-02-08T22:58:19 < Cracki> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpJIhxE1iQk
2019-02-08T23:02:07 < Cracki> steel legos, that'd be something
2019-02-08T23:09:57 < antto> noice
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2019-02-08T23:20:53 < rajkosto> dongs, figured out you dont even need to switch from 16bit spi mode after initial init for the tft displays
2019-02-08T23:21:18 < rajkosto> the 0x00 command is NOP so having a 0x00 prefix on commands is no big deal if they take 16bit parameters (the windowing ones do)
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2019-02-08T23:45:42 < englishman> hax
2019-02-08T23:50:43 < mawk> haxor
2019-02-08T23:51:25 < englishman> mawk for real why are you hosting a pedo image site that isnt on the deepdark
2019-02-08T23:51:53 < mawk> lol
2019-02-08T23:51:57 < mawk> it's not a pedo image site
2019-02-08T23:52:06 < mawk> it's a very legit image site I did for myself and a few friends
2019-02-08T23:52:11 < mawk> and pedos are using it without my consent
2019-02-08T23:52:19 < mawk> I already took down the URL twice to get rid of them
2019-02-08T23:52:23 < mawk> but they keep coming back
2019-02-08T23:52:24 < BrainDamage> few friends that just happen to be the whole internet
2019-02-08T23:52:26 < mawk> they find the new URL
2019-02-08T23:52:27 < englishman> ReadError once purchased very.legit.website
2019-02-08T23:52:30 < mawk> lol
2019-02-08T23:52:40 < Steffanx> Where is ReadError_ 
2019-02-08T23:52:46 < BrainDamage> if you want to make it just friends make it be access controlled
2019-02-08T23:52:50 < englishman> didnt you watch the efnet news stefs
2019-02-08T23:52:56 < BrainDamage> even just a username or pw would suffice
2019-02-08T23:53:02 < malinus> >someone builds a street >drug dealers dealing on said street >WHY DID U BUILD A STREET FOR DRUG DEALERS YOU IDIOT, POLICE, ARREST THIS MAN!
2019-02-08T23:53:05 < mawk> well I mean internet friends BrainDamage 
2019-02-08T23:53:07 < mawk> and their friends and so on
2019-02-08T23:53:15 < BrainDamage> see
2019-02-08T23:53:15 < Steffanx> englishbot the one from ages ago?
2019-02-08T23:53:16 < mawk> but I don't want it referenced on google for instance
2019-02-08T23:53:21 < Steffanx> englishbot*
2019-02-08T23:53:29 < BrainDamage> all it takes is a single shared link
2019-02-08T23:53:31 < englishman> yes
2019-02-08T23:53:35 < englishman> he hasnt been back since
2019-02-08T23:53:49 < Steffanx> Yes i noticed. Irc cares about him!
2019-02-08T23:53:52 < BrainDamage> btw, faprenceb upgraded to pm spambot
2019-02-08T23:54:03 < englishman> yeah i /ignored him
2019-02-08T23:54:10 < Steffanx> Same here
2019-02-08T23:56:12 < mawk> he doesn't pm me
2019-02-08T23:56:14 < mawk> I'm jealous
2019-02-08T23:56:22 < karlp> me either, but I'm not jealous at all :)
2019-02-08T23:57:17 < mawk> also englishman I did not break any law by hosting a site that happen to inevitably has pedo content
2019-02-08T23:57:22 < qyx> mawk: I assume a single robots.txt will do then
2019-02-08T23:57:22 < mawk> I just have to respond to takedown notice
2019-02-08T23:57:36 < mawk> as a non-commercial site owner I do not have to screen the content
2019-02-08T23:57:46 < mawk> and I can't, it's the principle of that site
2019-02-08T23:57:49 < mawk> images are encrypted
2019-02-08T23:57:56 < mawk> yeah qyx I thought I had one
2019-02-08T23:58:02 < mawk> but it's not the case
2019-02-08T23:58:14 < englishman> pedo.club PREMIUM $18.27
2019-02-08T23:58:34 < englishman> pedo.fm $78.88
2019-02-08T23:58:43 < mawk> but it's not only the pedo contents that attracts the cop
2019-02-08T23:58:51 < mawk> once I had a judiciary requsition for drug contents
2019-02-08T23:59:01 < englishman> pedo.lol $25.88
2019-02-08T23:59:09 < mawk> some guy showed his weed plants with a sign that said "6€/g contact me at superdealer@hotmail.fr"
2019-02-08T23:59:10 < qyx> stop being a charity then
2019-02-08T23:59:24 < mawk> well I usually just respond to the requsition and everything goes fine qyx 
2019-02-08T23:59:29 < mawk> it's just that this time I forgot to enable the logs
2019-02-08T23:59:55 < mawk> this is the only legal issue
2019-02-08T23:59:58 < qyx> your bank account will be -30000 soon instead of -1200
--- Day changed Sat Feb 09 2019
2019-02-09T00:00:28 < englishman> "innocent man sent to jail for nothing" - a headline you will never see
2019-02-09T00:00:42 < mawk> lol
2019-02-09T00:00:50 < mawk> the law is fuzzy anyway
2019-02-09T00:01:09 < mawk> so no-one has been convicted with it recently 
2019-02-09T00:01:34 < mawk> european rule says that 15 days of log retention is fine, french law wants 1 year
2019-02-09T00:01:42 < mawk> and european rules have precedence over national law
2019-02-09T00:04:07 < mawk> also I got some donations on the bitcoin address on the site
2019-02-09T00:04:15 < mawk> around 500€ total since the site is running
2019-02-09T00:04:58 < qyx> 23:01 < mawk> and european rules have precedence over national law
2019-02-09T00:05:05 < qyx> are you sure?
2019-02-09T00:05:11 < mawk> yes
2019-02-09T00:05:18 < qyx> because I am not
2019-02-09T00:06:10 < mawk> https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A61964CJ0006
2019-02-09T00:06:31 < mawk> also in Lisbonne treaty
2019-02-09T00:06:40 < mawk> declaration #17 of the final act of the treaty
2019-02-09T00:08:59 < mawk> see number 3 of the summary of the eur-lex link
2019-02-09T00:09:03 < mawk> they call it the precedence principle
2019-02-09T00:10:29 < mawk> EU devs make ugly URLs
2019-02-09T00:12:57 < mawk> in short: "The law stemming from the treaty, an independent source of law, could not because of its special and original nature, be overridden by domestic legal provisions, however framed, without being deprived of its character as community law and without the legal basis of the community itself being called into question."
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2019-02-09T01:02:33 < PaulFertser> Hm, the obscure Panchip PAN163CX MCU+RF is apparently a Nuvoton Mini58 clone. Probably illegal :)
2019-02-09T01:05:40 < englishman> is that panchip an ic made specifically for cheap as fuck chinese quadcopters?
2019-02-09T01:07:04 < PaulFertser> englishman: I've only got this link so far https://world.taobao.com/item/568533071945.htm?spm=a21wu.11804641.1.1 . But I searched for similar pinmux arrangements and it matches Mini58 perfectly.
2019-02-09T01:07:45 < PaulFertser> I say it's probably illegal because they're apparently too shy to admit it's cortex-m0 or related to nuvoton anyhow in those taobao pictures (apparently taken from the datasheet).
2019-02-09T01:08:44 < englishman> whichi mini58? this one http://www.nuvoton.com/resource-files/DS_Mini58DE_Series_EN_Rev1.03.pdf doesnt look the same?
2019-02-09T01:09:44 < PaulFertser> englishman: pinmux (what features are shared by each pin), not pin numbers.
2019-02-09T01:11:16 < englishman> ooh
2019-02-09T01:11:21 < englishman> it's not far off
2019-02-09T01:12:48 < englishman> how did you catch that lol
2019-02-09T01:15:39 < PaulFertser> I just searched for something like "P1.4 PWM0_4 UART1_RXD" but I can't reproduce that :)
2019-02-09T01:16:55 < PaulFertser> Yes, I guess I was lucky to type "P1.3 PWM0_CH1" instead, that works.
2019-02-09T01:20:23 < PaulFertser> I figured they must be using some ready-made MCU but the packaging would obviously be different since they add an RF module inside. And in the hindsight it's obvious they'd be using a Chinese MCU for that.
2019-02-09T01:24:09 < englishman> reboot lunix -> sound card no longer detected
2019-02-09T01:24:12 < englishman> why do i fucking bother
2019-02-09T01:24:24 < englishman> pretty interesting
2019-02-09T01:25:27 < qyx> how would you do a lithium coin cell backup for your stm32?
2019-02-09T01:25:56 < qyx> obvious solution is with two schottky diodes from 3V3 and from Vbat (3V0)
2019-02-09T01:26:56 < qyx> or the other way around, I am trying to find a 1:2 power mux controlled by a single input
2019-02-09T01:27:15 < qyx> I am pretty sure simething like this should exist
2019-02-09T01:29:59 < qyx> DG4157E looks promising
2019-02-09T01:33:43 < qyx> meh I'll just use a schottky, there will be like ~1mA current max
2019-02-09T01:36:57 < zyp> backup for vdd?
2019-02-09T01:37:01 < zyp> or vbat?
2019-02-09T01:40:00 < qyx> for vdd
2019-02-09T01:40:14 < qyx> I have to log some data after the power supply disconnects
2019-02-09T01:40:24 < zyp> I see
2019-02-09T01:40:30 < zyp> how are you detecting disconnection?
2019-02-09T01:40:32 < qyx> and keep the RTC running
2019-02-09T01:40:47 < qyx> mhm there is a buck converter with power good
2019-02-09T01:41:05 < qyx> although I am not sure it is an ideal solution
2019-02-09T01:41:14 < zyp> sounds reasonable enough
2019-02-09T01:41:32 < qyx> with schottky I don't need it though
2019-02-09T01:41:35 < zyp> which part?
2019-02-09T01:41:44 < zyp> I mean, which stm32?
2019-02-09T01:41:52 < qyx> L4 in QFN32
2019-02-09T01:41:59 < qyx> stm32l432k
2019-02-09T01:42:03 < zyp> ah, okay
2019-02-09T01:43:09 < zyp> BAT54C could work
2019-02-09T01:43:26 < qyx> basically there will be only an accel+mic running for a few seconds saving into the flash
2019-02-09T01:43:33 < qyx> and then only a RF beacon
2019-02-09T01:43:38 < qyx> until the battery dies
2019-02-09T01:44:41 < qyx> mhm could work
2019-02-09T01:45:32 < englishman> what is that thermal tape stuff called that chink places put between fets and a heatsink
2019-02-09T01:45:34 < englishman> kind of rubbery
2019-02-09T01:46:19 < zyp> if the buck converter isn't leaking much in reverse, you could just put a single diode to prevent charging the battery
2019-02-09T01:46:31 < qyx> the buck has an active discharge :>
2019-02-09T01:46:44 < qyx> I am considering replacing it with something more reasonable
2019-02-09T01:48:20 < qyx> https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Heat-Sink-Silicone-Rubber-Thermal-Insulation_60669565181.html
2019-02-09T01:48:23 < qyx> this thing?
2019-02-09T01:48:52 < zyp> no, probably the thinner sheets
2019-02-09T01:49:13 < zyp> or maybe I'm just picturing that
2019-02-09T01:50:12 < zyp> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100PCS-TO-220-Transistor-Plastic-Washer-Insulation-Washer-TO-220-Pads-Silicone/32847237706.html <- I was thinking this shit
2019-02-09T01:51:24 < qyx> ah those
2019-02-09T02:00:07 < aandrew> hm, apparently all this sbus/ibus RC shit uses a knockoff nrf24 which means I can probably talk to it all with an nrf51 or 52
2019-02-09T02:00:13 < aandrew> dongs should have a lot of experience/info on this
2019-02-09T02:03:59 < rajkosto> qyx, is it thermal conductive or thermal insulating ??? confusing as hecc title
2019-02-09T02:11:06 < Cracki> electrically insulating certainly
2019-02-09T02:11:33 < Cracki> should conduct heat, check "Scope"
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2019-02-09T02:35:37 < rajkosto> its obvious they are thermal pads
2019-02-09T02:35:47 < rajkosto> but the practice of just putting every possible keyword in the title is silly
2019-02-09T02:56:19 < englishman> aandrew: which stuff specifically
2019-02-09T02:58:27 < aandrew> englishman: just screwing with cheap r/c shits
2019-02-09T02:58:53 < aandrew> looks like flysky is afhds 2a 
2019-02-09T02:58:55 < englishman> cuz there's a billion different chinq shits
2019-02-09T02:58:58 < aandrew> yeah
2019-02-09T02:59:22 < aandrew> a7105 is the chinese transciever which is a clone nrf24l01 (ther are others too but this seems the most popular)
2019-02-09T02:59:24 < englishman> and abunch of stm32ers have already reversed a bunch of ota protocols
2019-02-09T03:00:14 < aandrew> yeah that's what I'm seeing
2019-02-09T03:00:26 < aandrew> lots of relevant shit on github and of course the deviation people too
2019-02-09T03:01:07 < aandrew> e.g. https://github.com/goebish/deviation/blob/protocol_afhds2a/src/protocol/flysky_afhds2a_a7105.c 
2019-02-09T03:04:35 < englishman> yeah goebish is in another innovation channel
2019-02-09T03:08:11 < aandrew> heh "innovation channel"
2019-02-09T03:08:23 < aandrew> ah yes XN297 is the other nrf24l01 clone I was familiar with
2019-02-09T03:11:32 < jadew> anyone got any cool tools that are surprisingly useful?
2019-02-09T03:15:40 < aandrew> I really like my pcbite board holders
2019-02-09T03:15:52 < aandrew> I used to just use magnets on my metal table to hold shit down but htese work really nicely
2019-02-09T03:16:46 < jadew> you mentioned them before
2019-02-09T03:17:11 < aandrew> yep
2019-02-09T03:17:21 < aandrew> have't bought new gadgets lately
2019-02-09T03:17:51 < jadew> me neither
2019-02-09T03:18:10 < jadew> I'll keep them in mind
2019-02-09T03:18:25 < jadew> although, it seems like the kind of thing I'd enjoy making once I get a lathe
2019-02-09T03:19:14 < aandrew> yep this looks like enough info for me
2019-02-09T03:19:55 < jadew> mt birthday is coming and my wife wants to get me some tools
2019-02-09T03:19:56 < aandrew> I can buy a bunch of cheap flysky receivers, buy two cheap handheld transmitters and then build a stm32+nrf24l01 module or just use a nrf51 or 52 dongle for a tx
2019-02-09T03:20:37 < jadew> aadamson, what are you making?
2019-02-09T03:20:43 < jadew> aandrew
2019-02-09T03:21:38 < aandrew> jadew: just playing
2019-02-09T03:21:45 < aandrew> need some cheap r/c shits for the boys
2019-02-09T03:21:53 < jadew> ah, nice
2019-02-09T03:21:54 < aandrew> but don't want them to be handheld controleld only
2019-02-09T03:22:47 < dongs> sup dongs
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2019-02-09T04:31:02 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-09_03-30-43_27XeemAAe.png the vertical stripes pattern ive had on it all night burned in
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2019-02-09T04:37:27 < dongs> good job
2019-02-09T04:38:42 < rajkosto> its IPS so it will go away, but turn whole display off, not just backlight, is something to remember
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2019-02-09T04:38:53 < tjq> is l0de alright,
2019-02-09T04:38:55 < tjq> do you know
2019-02-09T04:39:23 < jadew> didn't know LCDs can burn in
2019-02-09T04:39:36 < rajkosto> they burned in since 2005
2019-02-09T04:39:48 < jadew> heard about plasma TVs doing that
2019-02-09T04:39:50 < rajkosto> its a temporary ghost image of something youve displayed on it for a long tiem tho
2019-02-09T04:39:55 < jadew> (aside from CRTs of course)
2019-02-09T04:39:57 < rajkosto> plasma/OLED burn in is permanent
2019-02-09T04:40:04 < tjq> i've beem watching ANIME
2019-02-09T04:40:18 < jadew> rajkosto, well, is it OLED?
2019-02-09T04:40:21 < jadew> because that would make sense
2019-02-09T04:40:23 < rajkosto> its IPS
2019-02-09T04:40:32 < jadew> IPS is not OLED as far as I know
2019-02-09T04:40:37 < jadew> IPS is just a LCD
2019-02-09T04:40:39 < rajkosto> yes.
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2019-02-09T04:40:56 < rajkosto> they have temporary white ghost burn in on high contrast edges of an image that is displayed for a long time
2019-02-09T04:41:09 < dongs> are you sure that shit is even IPS? all chinq lcds are like TN/TFT type shits
2019-02-09T04:41:11 < rajkosto> typical culprits are taskbar icons, the Firefox/Chrome UI static elements, etc
2019-02-09T04:41:17 < dongs> do you get nearly 180" viewing angle?
2019-02-09T04:41:20 < rajkosto> yes.
2019-02-09T04:41:22 < dongs> really
2019-02-09T04:41:26 < rajkosto> ive seen china tiny TN and its AWFUL
2019-02-09T04:41:30 < rajkosto> this is fine
2019-02-09T04:41:33 < dongs> nice
2019-02-09T04:41:36 < dongs> ive never seen non-TN shit
2019-02-09T04:41:38 < dongs> and yeah it is awful
2019-02-09T04:42:01 < rajkosto> TN is worthless on small displays
2019-02-09T04:44:00 < rajkosto> jadew, https://josh.st/blog/wp-content/2005/09/burninRGB.jpg LCD burn in looks like this
2019-02-09T04:44:48 < dongs> thats not lcd burn in
2019-02-09T04:44:50 < rajkosto> one brand of display used on the nintendo switch has really terrible burn in like that
2019-02-09T04:44:53 < dongs> thats a garbage lunix desktop
2019-02-09T04:46:02 < jadew> rajkosto, I'm skeptical about this because I've never experienced it myself
2019-02-09T04:46:23 < rajkosto> ive experienced it on some cheapish displays, especially in the areas where the backlight is (hot?)
2019-02-09T04:46:39 < rajkosto> can clear up in a few hours to lasting for days
2019-02-09T04:46:47 < rajkosto> but it all fades away eventually
2019-02-09T04:47:15 < rajkosto> https://nintendosoup.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/nintendo-switch-online-burnin-sept182018.jpg
2019-02-09T04:47:18 < jadew> I guess if the structure of the material changes due to heat, while it's display a certain thing, you could get that effect
2019-02-09T04:47:39 < jadew> but then it's not really burn in, is it?
2019-02-09T04:48:01 < rajkosto> its ghost image at high contrast edges of something stuck on the screen for a long time
2019-02-09T04:48:09 < rajkosto> call it whatever
2019-02-09T04:48:22 < jadew> yeah, it's good to know it can happen
2019-02-09T04:48:55 < jadew> https://i.imgur.com/eVubO.png
2019-02-09T04:49:21 < dongs> this looks liek a l0de ad
2019-02-09T04:49:35 < rajkosto> is he sure that isnt a plasma
2019-02-09T04:49:42 < jadew> it's plasma
2019-02-09T04:50:03 < jadew> (I remember the story)
2019-02-09T04:51:03 < rajkosto> https://i.stack.imgur.com/KAsLp.jpg
2019-02-09T04:52:00 < dongs> is that itrash
2019-02-09T04:52:09 < rajkosto> yeah but itrash doesnt use oled until the X
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2019-02-09T04:52:44 < jadew> takes years of chinese refining techniques to get working technology that's known not to have this issue, to have this issue
2019-02-09T04:52:56 < rajkosto> i had it in 2005
2019-02-09T04:53:01 < rajkosto> on the first LCD i bought
2019-02-09T04:53:27 < rajkosto> kept returning it because "LCD shouldnt have this issue" and they gave me another and had the same thing
2019-02-09T04:53:32 < rajkosto> some panels just do that more than others
2019-02-09T04:54:48 < tjq> the old denial 
2019-02-09T04:55:03 < tjq> how many did the dogs give you in the end?
2019-02-09T04:55:30 < rajkosto> and the panels that did that on the switch were made in japan
2019-02-09T04:55:48 < tjq> even better
2019-02-09T04:56:14 < tjq> can't remember who was the last Japanese tv
2019-02-09T04:56:20 < tjq> maybe sharp idk
2019-02-09T04:56:41 < rajkosto> but all the best stuff is made in japan
2019-02-09T04:56:42 < jadew> aren't they all made at the same factory in China and they put whatever sticker on them?
2019-02-09T04:57:01 < rajkosto> you mean AU optoelectronics vs Chi Mei optoelectronics ?
2019-02-09T04:57:14 < rajkosto> LG/Samsung makes a lot of panels too
2019-02-09T04:57:22 < tjq> i like the Japanese capacitor
2019-02-09T05:09:39 < englishman> dongs there are plenty of chinq ips now
2019-02-09T05:09:54 < englishman> and some nice TN technologies that dont suck ass
2019-02-09T05:10:13 < englishman> but if it has rgb interface = trash typically
2019-02-09T05:11:13 < englishman> that little shit is probably not ips
2019-02-09T05:11:30 < dongs> rajdongs claims it is
2019-02-09T05:11:35 < englishman> certainly not with rajhobo's budget
2019-02-09T05:11:39 < dongs> haha
2019-02-09T05:11:57 < englishman> did you know
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2019-02-09T05:12:01 < englishman> i am considering a panel from NORITAKE
2019-02-09T05:12:07 < englishman> it is actually pretty cool
2019-02-09T05:12:07 < dongs> haha
2019-02-09T05:12:16 < aandrew> that does look like a l0de ad
2019-02-09T05:12:19 < englishman> and literally the only mfg to guarantee 10+ year product lifetime
2019-02-09T05:12:35 < englishman> panels themselves are made by PIONEER
2019-02-09T05:13:15 < englishman> LRH LIVE! http://youtube.com/l0de/live CALL IN NOW @ 877-293-1933 
2019-02-09T05:14:48 < tjq> lol
2019-02-09T05:17:58 < rajkosto> englishman, china TN small displays are so bad that they look DIFFERENT in the different eyes
2019-02-09T05:18:22 < rajkosto> its definitely not that
2019-02-09T05:18:26 < rajkosto> it was this https://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-IPS-1-3-inch-3-3V-12PIN-SPI-HD-Full-Color-TFT-Display-Screen-ST7789/32859772356.html
2019-02-09T05:18:53 < englishman> cool i was about to ask for a link
2019-02-09T05:18:55 < rajkosto> says it itself, viewing angle: ANY
2019-02-09T05:19:04 < rajkosto> they wouldnt lie
2019-02-09T05:20:57 < englishman> that looks not bad actually
2019-02-09T05:21:14 < rajkosto> image is super fake
2019-02-09T05:21:29 < rajkosto> real image here https://www.adafruit.com/product/3787
2019-02-09T05:22:25 < rajkosto> pcb is weird since they force tied CS to gnd so you have to give it a hardware reset, and also use spi mode 3
2019-02-09T05:24:13 < rajkosto> i also tried out this one https://www.aliexpress.com/item/IPS-0-96-inch-7P-SPI-HD-65K-Full-Color-LCD-Module-ST7735-Drive-IC-80/32859445140.html image is similar (https://www.adafruit.com/product/3533)
2019-02-09T05:24:33 < dongs> god damn i fucking hate alinigpress keeping cookies of country
2019-02-09T05:24:36 < dongs> i clicked some es.aliexpress link
2019-02-09T05:24:39 < dongs> and now everything is in spic
2019-02-09T05:24:46 < rajkosto> click top right "Return to global site"
2019-02-09T05:25:01 < dongs> yes i know
2019-02-09T05:29:05 < tjq> recaptcha
2019-02-09T05:29:27 < tjq> can someone photoshop one - select all the squares containing niggers
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2019-02-09T05:33:19 < tjq> it must die
2019-02-09T05:34:24 < rajkosto> you dont get those if you just let google collect all your browsing habits
2019-02-09T05:34:26 < rajkosto> then you can jnust click
2019-02-09T05:40:27 < dongs> select evey square containing a BLACK MAN
2019-02-09T05:43:13 < rajkosto> https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*Gb84CXRIZEE4wXMFy_ilvQ.png
2019-02-09T05:43:23 < rajkosto> http://i.imgur.com/z8dGV.jpg
2019-02-09T05:43:36 < rajkosto> it would be impossible for the machine to verify you selected good
2019-02-09T05:45:49 < englishman> that is why you have to teach it
2019-02-09T05:47:37 < jadew> mabye that's exactly what they did
2019-02-09T05:48:32 < jadew> programmer thinking he's being funny
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2019-02-09T06:11:59 < rajkosto> can stm32 do SPI rx and tx on same MOSI pin ?
2019-02-09T06:13:34 < englishman> dongs: http://www.mateksys.com/?portfolio=f722-mini
2019-02-09T06:14:14 < jadew> rajkosto, how would that work?
2019-02-09T06:14:21 < rajkosto> you would switch it
2019-02-09T06:14:28 < rajkosto> from unidirectional tx to unidirectional rx
2019-02-09T06:14:29 < jadew> then it wouldn't be SPI
2019-02-09T06:14:40 < rajkosto> its how this display works
2019-02-09T06:15:05 < jadew> doesn't sound like SPI to me
2019-02-09T06:15:24 < jadew> MOSI and MISO happen at the same time with SPI
2019-02-09T06:15:29 < rajkosto> optional CS, separate D/C# pin required
2019-02-09T06:15:33 < rajkosto> its some abomination
2019-02-09T06:15:42 < rajkosto> but it works in normal spi modes
2019-02-09T06:15:52 < rajkosto> theres a separate mosi/miso mode but the pcb doesnt expose it
2019-02-09T06:19:45 < rajkosto> it looks like it is supported and a bunch of devices do that
2019-02-09T06:19:51 < rajkosto> "I'm trying to read 4 byte from a SPI-compatible slave (MAX31855) in 1-wire bidirectonal SPI half-duplex."
2019-02-09T06:21:26 < rajkosto> what else are these for https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-09_05-21-22_4KHgHVig8.png
2019-02-09T06:21:57 < jadew> rajkosto, that guys could be confused too
2019-02-09T06:22:08 < jadew> the IC he mentions seems to only have an output
2019-02-09T06:22:39 < rajkosto> yeah the easiest way to interface with that would be to clock out zeroes on the unconnected mosi pin
2019-02-09T06:22:54 < jadew> you don't have to even configure it
2019-02-09T06:23:08 < jadew> so it doesn't matter what you put in the buffer
2019-02-09T06:24:01 < rajkosto> im sure you can do bidir by just shorting mosi and miso together and then disabling OE on mosi when wanting to "read"
2019-02-09T06:24:20 < rajkosto> but i want it on mosi only, which isnt possible ?
2019-02-09T06:25:05 < jadew> you could technically mux them and send one byte, receive one byte and it would still technically be SPI
2019-02-09T06:25:38 < jadew> if you want to only use one pin and nothing else, then it's a function on weather the MCU you want can map the pin to both functions MOSI & MISO
2019-02-09T06:28:42 < rajkosto> the burn in stripes are almost gone, how long did that take, 3 hours ?
2019-02-09T06:33:06 < jadew> now try with gay porn like that guy in the ad, see if takes more or less
2019-02-09T06:34:53 < rajkosto> guy's stupid obviously you fix that by taking a pic of the screen, inverting the colors, then displaying that for another 2 weeks
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2019-02-09T07:50:06 < dongs> aandrew: halp me with this fifo shit
2019-02-09T08:02:51 < rajkosto> wait, the size you read/write from the SPI->DR matters ?
2019-02-09T08:03:57 < dongs> yep
2019-02-09T08:04:01 < dongs> depends on device tho
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2019-02-09T08:08:58 < rajkosto> what about 0x0800 in CR1 telling it to be 16b mode
2019-02-09T08:09:12 < dongs> which chip is this
2019-02-09T08:09:16 < dongs> there's 2 d ifferent SPI cores
2019-02-09T08:09:24 < rajkosto> stm32f103 you know this
2019-02-09T08:09:28 < dongs> oh right.
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2019-02-09T08:10:59 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/AS5Is822.html this works
2019-02-09T08:15:08 < rajkosto> so on that core the load/store size doesnt matter ?
2019-02-09T08:16:18 < dongs> nope
2019-02-09T08:17:49 < dongs> you just do a 16bit read and cast to 8bit shit if you done need the ton
2019-02-09T08:17:51 < dongs> top
2019-02-09T08:18:16 < rajkosto> on the f7 it matters
2019-02-09T08:20:35 < dongs> ya the way stdlib does the read there is weird
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2019-02-09T08:20:44 < dongs>   spixbase = (uint32_t)SPIx; 
2019-02-09T08:20:44 < dongs>   spixbase += 0x0C;
2019-02-09T08:20:44 < dongs>   
2019-02-09T08:20:44 < dongs>   return *(__IO uint8_t *) spixbase;
2019-02-09T08:20:46 < dongs> this sorta shit
2019-02-09T08:21:11 < dongs> and 16 read is just return SPIx->DR
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2019-02-09T08:30:17 < rajkosto> you dont have to do it that weird
2019-02-09T08:30:28 < rajkosto> return *(__IO uint8_t *)SPI1->DR; works
2019-02-09T08:30:38 < rajkosto> if you want to force a 8bit load
2019-02-09T08:30:56 < rajkosto> missed a &
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2019-02-09T09:14:42 < dongs> that didnt work for me
2019-02-09T09:14:47 < dongs> cuz the struct makes compiler do a 16bit read
2019-02-09T09:14:51 < dongs> i forgot why
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2019-02-09T09:26:16 < rajkosto> now how do i dma this
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2019-02-09T09:52:24 < rajkosto> dma machine broke, help
2019-02-09T09:58:15 < Steffanx> Time to sleep rajkosto 
2019-02-09T10:00:29 < tjq> put that on mate
2019-02-09T10:05:34 < rajkosto> how does dma engine know it should only transfer bytes when TXE 
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2019-02-09T12:31:46 < dongs> ^ blogger
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2019-02-09T12:34:04 < Thorn> rajkosto: that's what dma requests are for
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2019-02-09T12:37:46 < karlp> jadew: read the halfduplex section in the spi ref man?
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2019-02-09T12:40:59 < qyx> jadew: I am using SPI in half-duplex multimaster too
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2019-02-09T12:46:38 < qyx> I am curious if you can use 100mbit ethernet over a single pair too
2019-02-09T12:46:51 < qyx> probably it won't handle collisions correctly
2019-02-09T12:48:59 < qyx> actually it is called 100base-T1
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2019-02-09T13:12:08 < rajkosto> what the FUCK kind of moonspeak is this https://github.com/jeelabs/embello/blob/master/explore/1608-forth/flib/stm32f1/dac.fs
2019-02-09T13:12:27 < dongs> forth lol
2019-02-09T13:12:28 < dongs> fucking aids
2019-02-09T13:13:29 < rajkosto> i thought the dude's code tags on his blogs werent working
2019-02-09T13:13:35 < rajkosto> so i went to github link
2019-02-09T13:13:50 < rajkosto> that was a mistake
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2019-02-09T13:19:54 < Steffanx> You have to expand your borders rajkosto. Get to know whats out in the world.
2019-02-09T13:20:14 < rajkosto> ```[: BUSY ios! 12 bit EXTI-PR ! slavetask wake ;] irq-exti10 !```
2019-02-09T13:20:19 < rajkosto> actual code wat
2019-02-09T13:23:05 < Thorn> a well commented forth implementation was the best thing I read last year (not that I'd actually use forth lol)
2019-02-09T13:23:19 < Thorn> definitely not a cat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8gTryEwQ1o
2019-02-09T13:24:41 < rajkosto> https://files.sshnuke.net/blind%20girl%20plays%20with%20her%20cat.webm
2019-02-09T13:33:46 < karlp> jcw from jeelabs is prolifici, but does some reallllly weird stuff sometimes
2019-02-09T13:36:00 < rajkosto> so what do i need to reset to get a dma transfer going again, same params as last time just change the size
2019-02-09T13:37:48 < rajkosto> just set CNDTR to 0 ? then DMA_CCR1_EN again ?
2019-02-09T13:38:59 < dongs> re-set start address
2019-02-09T13:39:02 < dongs> cuz that changes as DMA runs
2019-02-09T13:39:10 < dongs> re-set cndtr
2019-02-09T13:39:15 < dongs> enable stream.
2019-02-09T13:39:18 < dongs> or channel/hatever
2019-02-09T13:39:38 < rajkosto> dont need to re-enable it in SPI ?
2019-02-09T13:39:56 < dongs> acutally no, cmar doesnt change. 
2019-02-09T13:40:09 < dongs> you need to deal with setting cmar if your dma length is > 65k
2019-02-09T13:40:19 < dongs> cuz thats the max transfer length
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2019-02-09T13:41:46 < rajkosto> what happens on the bus if SPI controller's CR2 has the dma request bit set but the DMA channel is disabled
2019-02-09T13:42:09 < rajkosto> should i bother clearing that bit ?
2019-02-09T13:42:25 < Thorn> rajkosto: you have to reset all flags for your dma channel
2019-02-09T13:42:32 < Thorn> for example EN is not cleared when CNDTR goes to 0
2019-02-09T13:46:32 < jadew> karlp, qyx, half-duplex is different tho and I said that would be possible
2019-02-09T13:47:02 < jadew> what I said it's not SPI was doing both TX and RX on the same line on the same transfer
2019-02-09T13:47:14 < jadew> with RX and then TX being possible if you mux the lines
2019-02-09T13:49:42 < rajkosto> yes i obviously want TX cmd then dummy clock to switch direction, then RX
2019-02-09T13:49:52 < rajkosto> but whatever, its optional
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2019-02-09T13:54:01 < rajkosto> some code examples lead me to believe all i gotta do is reset CNDTR and then EN dma again
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2019-02-09T14:24:09 < rajkosto> https://pastebin.com/1nwPHG2t dunno if this is optimal but seems to work
2019-02-09T14:24:50 < dongs> "extern "C"?
2019-02-09T14:24:53 < dongs> the fuck is that shit
2019-02-09T14:24:56 < rajkosto> its in a .cpp file
2019-02-09T14:25:00 < rajkosto> you need that on vectors
2019-02-09T14:25:37 < Steffanx> you cpp?
2019-02-09T14:25:39 < rajkosto> dunno if the enabling/disabling of the CR2 bit in the spi peripheral is required
2019-02-09T14:25:47 < rajkosto> yes i cpp for inline and templates
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2019-02-09T14:48:23 < antto> ++rajkosto;
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2019-02-09T14:59:12 < dongs> does zyp's bootloader work on F042?
2019-02-09T14:59:22 < dongs> or any of those crystal-less shits
2019-02-09T15:05:10 < dongs> bedtime
2019-02-09T15:06:49 < Steffanx> Idk what zyps bootlaoder is. And goodbye
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2019-02-09T15:29:06 < antto> gudbai?
2019-02-09T15:29:12 < antto> u mean gudnoit
2019-02-09T15:38:26 < Steffanx> Hi antto, hows the day
2019-02-09T15:38:28 < Steffanx> ?
2019-02-09T15:39:11 -!- zoobab [zoobab@vic.ffii.org] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-09T15:41:00 < antto> rectangular with rounded corners
2019-02-09T15:41:53 < zoobab> have you seen the CS32 clones?
2019-02-09T15:42:07 < zoobab> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-STM32F103C8T6-ARM-STM32-Minimum-System-Development-Board-Module-Forarduino/32525208361.html
2019-02-09T15:57:38 < Cracki> is that a clone of the GD32 clone?
2019-02-09T15:59:18 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2019-02-09T16:00:10 < Cracki> wow these things do have a data sheet! http://www.ckscup.com/upload/CS32F103%E6%89%8B%E5%86%8C.pdf
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2019-02-09T16:18:28 < zoobab> in chinese only it seems
2019-02-09T16:26:47 < emeryth> is it binary compatible?
2019-02-09T16:29:12 < zoobab> no idea
2019-02-09T16:29:25 < zoobab> I have ordered one to try it out
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2019-02-09T16:37:20 < Ik90> Hi guys need help was working on sx1276 Lora module cubed with stm32lo . was using i-cube-lrwan library but not able to communicate
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2019-02-09T17:14:16 < zoobab> trying arduino-cli with stm32
2019-02-09T17:14:19 < zoobab> $ arduino-cli compile --fqbn stm32duino:STM32F1:genericSTM32F103C Arduino/blink3
2019-02-09T17:14:19 < zoobab> Sketch uses 13252 bytes (20%) of program storage space. Maximum is 65536 bytes.
2019-02-09T17:14:19 < zoobab> Global variables use 2824 bytes (13%) of dynamic memory, leaving 17656 bytes for local variables. Maximum is 20480 bytes.
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2019-02-09T17:29:36 < Laurenceb_123> funtimes
2019-02-09T17:29:48  * Laurenceb_123 just busted his ukp60 rivnut tool
2019-02-09T17:29:59 < Laurenceb_123> wtf do I use to put in stainless stell rivnuts??
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2019-02-09T17:42:55 < Laurenceb_123> tfw https://imgoat.com/uploads/84b6fbb107/195022.jpg
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2019-02-09T17:50:35 < englishman> Ik90: 
2019-02-09T17:50:41 < englishman> he left already wtf
2019-02-09T17:51:04 -!- mode/##stm32 [+o englishman] by ChanServ
2019-02-09T17:51:06 -!- mode/##stm32 [+b *!*@81.141.246.111] by englishman
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2019-02-09T17:59:13 < con3> I take it we shouldn't click on that link...
2019-02-09T17:59:54 < BrainDamage> never click on laurenceb's links as a general rule
2019-02-09T18:00:49 < con3> I'll remember that, usually on here when I'm in office.
2019-02-09T18:05:15 < Steffanx> its shit but not really nsfw con3..
2019-02-09T18:05:21 < Steffanx> like it usually is
2019-02-09T18:05:28 <@englishman> yeah I didn't even click
2019-02-09T18:06:03 < con3> ah ok, thought he shares NSFW images/memes. Don't want to be labelled that guy in the office
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2019-02-09T18:32:33 < jadew> con3, you'll be labled something tho
2019-02-09T18:32:51 < con3> jadew: ?
2019-02-09T18:33:20 < jadew> I don't know what that something is... but it is something
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2019-02-09T18:34:25 < jadew> in other news, I'm missing a screwdriver I only use for one thing and that I keep with all the other screwdrivers
2019-02-09T18:34:33 < jadew> and nobody else in the house could possibly need it
2019-02-09T18:35:11 < jadew> quite annoying, I looked in the same place like 5 times... almost as if my brain can't believe it's not there
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2019-02-09T18:46:20 < Steffanx> awh
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2019-02-09T18:54:14 < kakimir> my server is under pretty hard attack
2019-02-09T18:54:55 < kakimir> it looks different this time
2019-02-09T18:55:06 < kakimir> I see western country ips
2019-02-09T18:55:10 < kakimir> not chinese
2019-02-09T18:55:41 < jadew> those are servers on which that attack has worked
2019-02-09T18:56:01 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-09T18:56:22 < kakimir> raspi has 5% processor load just for fail2ban
2019-02-09T18:56:47 < kakimir> I grepped logs of this day
2019-02-09T18:57:01 < BrainDamage> don't use fail2ban
2019-02-09T18:57:06 < kakimir> why
2019-02-09T18:57:23 < BrainDamage> it's shit, and it's not better than using rate limiting using the kernel firewall
2019-02-09T18:57:37 < BrainDamage> just rate limit connections and use key auth
2019-02-09T18:57:37 < kakimir> I'm a noob
2019-02-09T18:57:59 < kakimir> I'm A NOOB!
2019-02-09T18:58:02 < mawk> but for other protocols it's nice
2019-02-09T18:58:06 < mawk> imap, smtp
2019-02-09T18:58:13 < mawk> everywhere there's password auth
2019-02-09T18:58:14 < mawk> no ?
2019-02-09T18:58:19 < jpa-> BrainDamage: wouldn't that limit both allowed and unallowed connections?
2019-02-09T18:58:38 < BrainDamage> jpa-: it tracks per ip
2019-02-09T18:58:49 < jpa-> i mean, both valid authentication and invalid
2019-02-09T18:59:24 < BrainDamage> sure, but when do you ever connect say, more than 3 times every 30s in ssh?
2019-02-09T18:59:31 < mawk> I'm sure you can get around this with a small hack jpa- 
2019-02-09T18:59:35 < jpa-> it's not that rare to run scp tens of times in an hour
2019-02-09T18:59:41 < mawk> add yourself to the exempted ipset on successful ssh authentication
2019-02-09T18:59:45 < jpa-> but yeah, depends on limits etc.
2019-02-09T19:00:14 < BrainDamage> use sftp or rsync instead of scp, it performs way better
2019-02-09T19:00:26 < BrainDamage> for one, it doesn't close the ssh link
2019-02-09T19:00:35 < mawk> or ssh with a master socket anyway
2019-02-09T19:00:36 < jpa-> yep; works fine if you're the only one using the server
2019-02-09T19:00:36 < mawk> for any purpose
2019-02-09T19:00:41 < jpa-> much harder to control other people
2019-02-09T19:00:46 < mawk> sftp is through ssh
2019-02-09T19:01:10 < BrainDamage> even just 1 connection per second would be ok
2019-02-09T19:01:18 < BrainDamage> just enforce key auth, and you're set
2019-02-09T19:01:27 < BrainDamage> 'unpossible' to bruteforce
2019-02-09T19:03:09 < kakimir> I don't know how to key
2019-02-09T19:03:22 < kakimir> besides I like to connect to my server from where ever
2019-02-09T19:03:32 < mawk> you can use a key or 2FA
2019-02-09T19:03:34 < mawk> for instance
2019-02-09T19:03:40 < mawk> and just don't use passwords
2019-02-09T19:06:01 < BrainDamage> oh and if you want to reduce login attemps, put ssh on a non standard port
2019-02-09T19:06:10 < BrainDamage> most scripts are too dumb to scan you for services
2019-02-09T19:07:40 < kakimir> my ssh is non standard port
2019-02-09T19:07:59 < kakimir> I should look what username they are trying
2019-02-09T19:08:11 < BrainDamage> https://www.rackaid.com/blog/how-to-block-ssh-brute-force-attacks/  this is to rate limit connection attemps per port
2019-02-09T19:08:28 < mawk> look in /var/log/auth.log kakimir 
2019-02-09T19:08:51 < BrainDamage> adjust the window as necessary
2019-02-09T19:11:26 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JXV7FJ1Sn8jDwHo_6lwNJdbi6W3ZaNtM/view?usp=sharing 
2019-02-09T19:13:55 < Steffanx> time for a beer kakimir
2019-02-09T19:14:42 < mawk> beer impedes your reasoning
2019-02-09T19:14:44 < mawk> you need coffee
2019-02-09T19:16:34 < kakimir> Steffanx: it's so hard to get good beer
2019-02-09T19:17:52 < kakimir> after that I got stuck 2 times in courtyard
2019-02-09T19:18:07 < kakimir> we used tractor to recover it
2019-02-09T19:18:19 < kakimir> because I was piped
2019-02-09T19:19:21 < kakimir> maybe piped is not the right word
2019-02-09T19:19:55 < kakimir> I was breathing my lungs out and shaking from lack of energy
2019-02-09T19:20:06 < kakimir> then I went to sauna
2019-02-09T19:20:15 < kakimir> sauna was really good at this time
2019-02-09T19:32:47 < Steffanx> You need more stroop waffles
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2019-02-09T19:36:57 < karlp> I found fail2ban the easiest to setup hoenstly, even if there were / are better solutions
2019-02-09T19:39:11 < bitmask> whachu use to control 5-12v brushless motor
2019-02-09T19:40:35 < Steffanx> tarduino io pin?
2019-02-09T19:41:57 < bitmask> gonna need more than that
2019-02-09T19:44:51 < Steffanx> https://imgur.com/a/x4xLDJ6 ty altium
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2019-02-09T20:03:13 < Steffanx> what are the requirements bitmask?
2019-02-09T20:03:37 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5V-12V-DC-Brushless-Driver-Board-Controller-For-Hard-Drive-Motor-3-4-Wire-New/32832483944.html
2019-02-09T20:03:39 < bitmask> I'm just gonna get that guy
2019-02-09T20:05:46 < Steffanx> whokay
2019-02-09T20:16:39 < bitmask> hah wtf
2019-02-09T20:16:59 < bitmask> they wont show what one of the ICs is, on peoples feedback it shows a pic with the IC sanded down
2019-02-09T20:19:26 < BrainDamage> why the hell is aliexpress trying to use drm to play 'multimedia content'
2019-02-09T20:21:17 < zyp> so they can serve you more ads
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2019-02-09T20:53:52 < Cracki> bitmask, L298? or some allegro perhaps? TI drv8835?
2019-02-09T20:54:16 < Cracki> you need a full bridge and maybe some extra diodes, tons of options
2019-02-09T20:54:32 < Cracki> uhh *brushless*, sorry, misread
2019-02-09T20:54:38 < bitmask> between something like that and a regular 10A ESC
2019-02-09T20:54:48 < bitmask> drv11873 is what those boards use
2019-02-09T20:56:44 < Cracki> hmmm... triple half bridge? :> or something that does FOC on its own?
2019-02-09T20:58:17 < Cracki> there's this https://github.com/NiklasFauth/ottercontrol
2019-02-09T20:58:55 < Cracki> maybe look for hw compatible with STMBL
2019-02-09T20:59:16 < bitmask> 11873 should be fine
2019-02-09T20:59:27 < bitmask> not sure why you recommended something so beefy..
2019-02-09T21:00:29 < Cracki> wasn't sure how beefy that stuff I had in mind actually is
2019-02-09T21:06:03 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5V-12V-DC-Brushless-Driver-Board-Controller-For-Hard-Drive-Motor-3-4-Wire-New-G205M/32848471079.html
2019-02-09T21:06:06 < srk> bitmask: there's also trinamic 
2019-02-09T21:06:15 < bitmask> that one is twice the price but they aren't hiding the mcu at least
2019-02-09T21:06:42 < bitmask> ehh I dont need a lot of control for this, just looking for cheap, I'll be measuring rpm with a hall sensor
2019-02-09T21:07:43 < bitmask> I assume trinamic has all feature filled stuffs
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2019-02-09T21:15:01 < bitmask> hmm, fluid bearings only like one direction? I'll have to remember that
2019-02-09T21:15:24 < bitmask> counterclockwise is probably the direction id want anyway
2019-02-09T21:26:06 < BrainDamage> https://twitter.com/Vasconium/status/1094226511475945473
2019-02-09T21:39:14 < bitmask> how do motor ratings work? :P says its rated for 12V 0.75A, does that mean max? or no load? will a 1.2A controller be enough?
2019-02-09T21:41:26 < bitmask> maybe I should build my own and learn
2019-02-09T21:41:49 < bitmask> oh fuck it, it has built in overcurrent sensor, I'm good :P
2019-02-09T21:43:43 < bitmask> blah, is trapezoidal louder than sinusoidal?
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2019-02-09T22:41:59 < srk> bitmask: ratings are typically maximum 
2019-02-09T22:42:05 < bitmask> ok
2019-02-09T22:42:24 < srk> you can go with higher current provided you have enough cooling
2019-02-09T22:42:48 < srk> don't go over voltage as that one is limited by windings
2019-02-09T22:43:10 < srk> "maybe I should build my own and learn"
2019-02-09T22:43:20  * srk like two years ago
2019-02-09T22:46:34 < bitmask> :)
2019-02-09T22:47:11 < bitmask> I'm trying to figure out the difference between drv8313 and drv11873
2019-02-09T22:52:38 < qyx> anyone usng fatfs, how much flash does it occupy?
2019-02-09T22:52:44 < srk> first one has 3x 1/2 bridges so one way only?
2019-02-09T22:52:46 < qyx> or google first
2019-02-09T22:58:30 < qyx> ok, around 12K
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2019-02-09T23:29:35 <@englishman> Steffanx: i am going to post that bug to altium with no other explanation at all
2019-02-09T23:29:38 <@englishman> fuck those assholes
2019-02-09T23:31:23 < zyp> haha
2019-02-09T23:33:05 < machinehum> englishman: I do that all the time.
2019-02-09T23:33:24 < machinehum> Post aggro comments on their stupid forum
2019-02-09T23:34:37 < Steffanx> Dont forget to tell them it's version 18.1.8 from a certian russian source, englishman
2019-02-09T23:34:54 < rajkosto> > 2019
2019-02-09T23:34:57 < rajkosto> > not running 19 yet
2019-02-09T23:35:18 <@englishman> 19.0.12 is out btw
2019-02-09T23:35:27 < zyp> I'm still running 15
2019-02-09T23:35:38 < rajkosto> also what source do you need other than altium
2019-02-09T23:35:38 < zyp> latest I have a license for
2019-02-09T23:35:47 < qyx> I was wathing some kicad tutorial videos today :X
2019-02-09T23:35:57 < Steffanx> Russia has 19.x.x but .. i couldnt get a proper download.
2019-02-09T23:36:13 < rajkosto> you dont know how to download altium installer and cache from altium themselves ?
2019-02-09T23:36:30 < Steffanx> i dont know what keys/license/whatever work :P
2019-02-09T23:36:36 < rajkosto> theyre generic
2019-02-09T23:36:40 < Steffanx> oh really?
2019-02-09T23:36:49 < Steffanx> i could try, but meh.
2019-02-09T23:37:05 < Steffanx> is that how you do it, or did you give them your money, rajkosto?
2019-02-09T23:37:13 < rajkosto> im not fuckin dave jones
2019-02-09T23:37:27 < rajkosto> you can just request infinite trials from them too
2019-02-09T23:37:28 < Steffanx> That could go either way. Did you pay them?
2019-02-09T23:37:38 < rajkosto> i dont have 3 million dollhairs
2019-02-09T23:37:45 < Steffanx> are you antto?
2019-02-09T23:42:15 < machinehum> Steffanx: lol
2019-02-09T23:43:04 < machinehum> qyx: Kicad is great
2019-02-09T23:43:15 < machinehum> v5 fixed the two biggest issues for me
2019-02-09T23:43:18 < machinehum> Step and vias
2019-02-09T23:43:33 < machinehum> Their parts lib is massive
2019-02-09T23:46:10 < rue_shop1> and completely unlinked
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2019-02-09T23:47:07 < machinehum> hmm?
2019-02-09T23:48:25 < qyx> machinehum: idk every time I tried it I was lost
2019-02-09T23:48:53 < qyx> but as I want to be a cern pro, I have to learn it
2019-02-09T23:49:03 < Steffanx> Cern pro?!
2019-02-09T23:50:18 < machinehum> qyx: If you're using Linux make sure to purge kicad4 and it's libs before installing 5
2019-02-09T23:50:25 < machinehum> That breaks things if you don't
2019-02-09T23:50:27 < qyx> it is made in cern, isn't it?
2019-02-09T23:50:33 < machinehum> otherwise it should all just work
2019-02-09T23:50:36 < qyx> I have to update my debians first
2019-02-09T23:50:43 < machinehum> Backports dude
2019-02-09T23:50:54 < qyx> I found no 5.x.x for jessie
2019-02-09T23:50:59 < machinehum> Yeah
2019-02-09T23:51:08 < machinehum> Oh no 5 backports?
2019-02-09T23:51:13 < qyx> seems so
2019-02-09T23:51:59 < machinehum> Oh...gotta go to stretch I guess
2019-02-09T23:53:46 < bitmask> alright so I might as well use this 30A ESC I have.  hard drive motors are so nice and quiet.  Its only drawing 0.5A at 12V though, thought it was gonna be 0.75.  I hope its gonna be powerful enough
--- Day changed Sun Feb 10 2019
2019-02-10T00:07:38 < antto> Steffanx wut?
2019-02-10T00:10:33 < rajkosto> k, on 19.0.12 did they fix the components tab not working at all
2019-02-10T00:13:34 < rajkosto> the manufacturer part search* https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-09_23-13-30_Am7xe8mJy.png nop
2019-02-10T00:13:36 < antto> qyx beware, most video tutorials are about kicad4
2019-02-10T00:13:40 < antto> don't bother
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2019-02-10T00:29:39 <@englishman> rajkosto: altium doesnt give out offline installers anymore
2019-02-10T00:29:40 <@englishman> all webshit
2019-02-10T00:29:47 <@englishman> you have to *ask* for the offline installer
2019-02-10T00:29:54 < rajkosto> you can get it somehow
2019-02-10T00:29:59 <@englishman> off russian sites sure
2019-02-10T00:30:01 < rajkosto> theres a script for it
2019-02-10T00:30:05 <@englishman> oh yeah?
2019-02-10T00:30:13 < rajkosto> it fully populates the cache yes
2019-02-10T00:30:30 <@englishman> fenugrec: ariens obtained
2019-02-10T00:30:34 <@englishman> tracked model
2019-02-10T00:30:38 <@englishman> can climb stairs to do the patio
2019-02-10T00:30:59 < fenugrec> englishman, good man
2019-02-10T00:31:14 < fenugrec> has that gearbox steery thing on the chute ?
2019-02-10T00:31:40 < Steffanx> Better share in a pm. The script that is, rajkosto :)
2019-02-10T00:32:39 <@englishman> yeah has "remote control deflector" which means you can turn and elevate the shit from the control panel
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2019-02-10T00:38:54 < Datz> Hello. I just reinstalled windows10, and installed a few arduino "boards" for stm32, but I am having a problem uploading to my board with my stlink https://hastebin.com/ehigesayar.makefile
2019-02-10T00:38:58 < Datz> any ideas?
2019-02-10T00:45:52 <@englishman> did it work before the reinstall?
2019-02-10T00:45:56 < Datz> yes
2019-02-10T00:46:18 <@englishman> stlink appears in device manager? drivers installed?
2019-02-10T00:46:22 < Datz> yes
2019-02-10T00:46:58 <@englishman> can you talk to the chip with st-link utility (the one provided by ST)?
2019-02-10T00:47:09 < Datz> noticed it says it's using "Using the open source texane-stlink instead of the proprietary STM stlink exe"
2019-02-10T00:47:21 < Datz> not sure if the problem is there
2019-02-10T00:47:28 <@englishman> ouch
2019-02-10T00:47:58 < Datz> let me try that utility 
2019-02-10T00:48:01 <@englishman> idont think thats a big problem? its not one of those opensores things that makes you flash and ruin your stlink i think
2019-02-10T00:48:30 < Datz> yikes
2019-02-10T00:49:16 < Datz> it's this ST-LINK/V2?
2019-02-10T00:49:20 < Datz> https://www.st.com/en/development-tools/stsw-link004.html
2019-02-10T00:49:30 < PaulFertser> Datz: fyi rem means it's commented out, that's from the DOS BAT file syntax
2019-02-10T00:49:42 < Datz> humm, I see
2019-02-10T00:50:01 < PaulFertser> For the reference, stlink drivers by ST are WinUSB based, so OpenOCD and other tools can use it without any additional hassle.
2019-02-10T00:50:30 < Datz> I see
2019-02-10T00:50:34 < PaulFertser> Newer stlink firmware finally allows DAP-level access btw, so it can erase Kinetis etc etc. 
2019-02-10T00:52:33 < Datz> yeah, I can connect with the utility
2019-02-10T00:52:46 < Datz> it installed some drivers, let me check the arduino IDE again
2019-02-10T00:53:32 < bitmask> I love each and every one of you
2019-02-10T00:53:48 < Datz> lay off the drugs, bitmask 
2019-02-10T00:53:57 < bitmask> ;)
2019-02-10T00:54:13 < Datz> humm, things may be working now!
2019-02-10T00:55:57 < Datz> yes, things are working now.
2019-02-10T00:56:16 < Datz> must not have had all of the required drivers.
2019-02-10T00:56:26 < Datz> Didn't know this room existed, how nice..
2019-02-10T00:59:12 <@englishman> welcome
2019-02-10T01:04:04 < bitmask> 450 mOhm Rds(On) is kinda high, no?
2019-02-10T01:04:33 < bitmask> maybe it doesnt matter
2019-02-10T01:04:33 < Ultrasauce> space heater with a gate
2019-02-10T01:07:06 < bitmask> so at 1.5A (max spec) its producing 1W of heat? or am I missing something
2019-02-10T01:09:02 < rajkosto> even the cheapy chinese mosfets i have are 100mOhm
2019-02-10T01:09:21 < machinehum> 420m sucks
2019-02-10T01:10:07 < bitmask> oh this is for total driver, so two mosfets? its the TI DRV11873
2019-02-10T01:10:21 < bitmask> maybe theres more than just the mosfets
2019-02-10T01:12:25 < machinehum> bldc is usually 6 fets
2019-02-10T01:12:32 < machinehum> So that's 2x rdson
2019-02-10T01:12:44 < machinehum> plus H whatever the fuck that is
2019-02-10T01:13:19 < rajkosto> ```The SPI peripheral of the STM32F4 is configureable for a single wire bidirectional half duplex transfer. In this mode the MOSI pin is used as a master or the MISO as a slave, no need to short the pins together on the STM32 side as only one is used.```
2019-02-10T01:17:21 < bitmask> I just went with this garbage: https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-5V-15V-3-Phase-DC-Brushless-Motor-Driver-Board-Speed-Controller-CW-CCW-Swtich/263868060297
2019-02-10T01:17:38 < bitmask> (which has the drv11873 and a 555 to control the pwm input)
2019-02-10T01:17:55 < bitmask> should be fine, if not i'll just use an esc for my hexacopter :/
2019-02-10T01:19:48 < bitmask> I need to order some stuff from ALI, my cart has been full for a while
2019-02-10T01:20:41 < machinehum> lol
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2019-02-10T01:23:31 < Steffanx> can it get full?
2019-02-10T01:23:41 < bitmask> 100 items max
2019-02-10T01:24:42 < Steffanx> hm
2019-02-10T01:36:25 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzcvRDWgRIE encore
2019-02-10T01:38:37 < Steffanx> kakimir: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xat1GVnl8-k
2019-02-10T01:38:56 < kakimir> oh yes
2019-02-10T01:39:06 < kakimir> but
2019-02-10T01:39:10 < kakimir> un tis is better
2019-02-10T01:40:01 < kakimir> *uhn tiss uhn tiss uhn tiss
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2019-02-10T01:41:59 < mawk> Steffanx: one PVV activist made a conversion to islam
2019-02-10T01:42:00 < mawk> lol
2019-02-10T01:42:20 < Steffanx> yeah.
2019-02-10T01:42:26 < Steffanx> actually hes not the first one
2019-02-10T01:42:50 < mawk> we had one in France too, one guy from the FN saw a shitty brainwashing documentary on islam and became religious all of a sudden
2019-02-10T01:43:09 < kakimir> where is our imam
2019-02-10T01:43:24 < mawk> then spammed the mailing list of the party with shitting "scientific miracles in the qur'an !" videos
2019-02-10T01:43:27 < mawk> and got expelled
2019-02-10T01:43:29 < Steffanx> dont give a damn about pvv anyway.
2019-02-10T01:43:38 -!- Dave_Elec [~Dave@197.156.126.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
2019-02-10T01:43:57 < mawk> the pvv leader got google bombed at some point, he was curing his nose on the front image when you typed his name
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2019-02-10T02:00:35 < tjq> http://niggermania.net/forum/showthread.php?138019-Five-%93Youths%94-charged-with-murder-in-Nashville
2019-02-10T02:01:44 < mawk> that's not a very politically correct website tjq 
2019-02-10T02:05:17 < tjq> has less ads than the news site
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2019-02-10T02:05:27 < rajkosto> what a domain name
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2019-02-10T02:08:11 < rajkosto> why dont none of the chyna displays expose the controller's vsync/TE line for solderin
2019-02-10T02:10:37 < tjq> rajkosto: one day i'll have a domain name worthy to compare
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2019-02-10T03:28:16 < dongs> d o n g s
2019-02-10T03:29:34 < dongs> nice url you got there crt
2019-02-10T03:31:17 < dongs> https://www.banggood.com/cocks-p-1111802.html
2019-02-10T03:31:22 < dongs> retweeting from stonertronics
2019-02-10T03:31:49 <@englishman> did you actually get one
2019-02-10T03:32:06 <@englishman> every China microscope I've tried has ended up in the trash
2019-02-10T03:32:19 <@englishman> $200 is way too much to try out a new one
2019-02-10T03:32:24 < dongs> <timecop> jero32: how bad is that
2019-02-10T03:32:24 < dongs> <jero32> ?
2019-02-10T03:32:24 < dongs> <timecop> teh scope
2019-02-10T03:32:24 < dongs> <jero32> its pretty decent
2019-02-10T03:32:24 < dongs> <jero32> I can solder on it
2019-02-10T03:32:24 <@englishman> plus not binocular
2019-02-10T03:32:26 < dongs> <timecop> it seems quite expensive for chinashit
2019-02-10T03:32:55 <@englishman> you can get a good Korean microscope for not much more
2019-02-10T03:34:15 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMQnyHmA-EQ
2019-02-10T03:34:23 < dongs> fucking paki review
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2019-02-10T04:14:55 < dongs> https://interferencetechnology.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Figure-4-clock-trace.jpg this looks like autorouted STM32F4 SDRAM
2019-02-10T04:16:35 < rajkosto> but why
2019-02-10T04:16:37 < rajkosto> why are you running
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2019-02-10T04:19:04 < dongs> routing is defintiely gay in A19
2019-02-10T04:19:15 < dongs> it adds unnecessary bends in shit that can't be fixed
2019-02-10T04:19:19 < dongs> where A18 didnt do this
2019-02-10T04:19:21 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-10T04:19:30 < rajkosto> have to delete the little dots hiding in the bends
2019-02-10T04:19:33 < rajkosto> and re-do
2019-02-10T04:19:44 < rajkosto> are you sure youre in the same mode
2019-02-10T04:20:14 -!- jadew [~razvan@unaffiliated/jadew] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
2019-02-10T04:20:38 < dongs> https://imgur.com/a/v4t7P7y
2019-02-10T04:21:01 < dongs> pressing space only gives those 2 options
2019-02-10T04:21:11 < dongs> for some reason it wants to stick to the edges of that shit no matter waht
2019-02-10T04:21:16 < rajkosto> yes it kept misaligning on pads for me too
2019-02-10T04:24:11 < dongs> found it
2019-02-10T04:24:13 < dongs> routing gloss effort
2019-02-10T04:24:17 < dongs> in pcb graphical editing
2019-02-10T04:24:18 < dongs> set to off
2019-02-10T04:24:41 < dongs> back to perfect now.
2019-02-10T04:24:55 < dongs> err, interactive routing
2019-02-10T04:27:03 < rajkosto> its in the tab settings while routing
2019-02-10T04:28:20 < dongs> yeah sorry, fuck that sidebar garbage
2019-02-10T04:28:25 < dongs> i'd rather permanently turn it off.
2019-02-10T04:29:44 < rajkosto> it used to be a modal dialog
2019-02-10T04:29:46 < rajkosto> sidebar is better ?
2019-02-10T04:29:54 < rajkosto> you know what the best mistake is
2019-02-10T04:29:59 < rajkosto> when the NetLabel doesnt exactly snap to the Wire
2019-02-10T04:30:06 < rajkosto> so the wire endsf up being not assigned to the net
2019-02-10T04:30:23 < dongs> that cant happen unless your library is absolute dogshit and not on 100mil grid
2019-02-10T04:30:40 < rajkosto> happened
2019-02-10T04:30:44 < dongs> nope
2019-02-10T04:30:46 < rajkosto> moving the netlabel up and then down fixed
2019-02-10T04:32:22 < dongs> it hapepned because your library is garbage, yes
2019-02-10T04:32:32 < dongs> it happened in a clean library/schematic on 100grid? nope
2019-02-10T05:00:54 < dongs> fatal error C1091: compiler limit: string exceeds 65535 bytes in length
2019-02-10T05:00:56 < dongs> what the fuck
2019-02-10T05:01:04 < dongs> are we on C64 or something
2019-02-10T05:01:54 < MrMobius> the limit is a lot less than that on C64 dongs
2019-02-10T05:05:32 < dongs> what hte fuck that error has been around for almsot 20 eyars
2019-02-10T05:05:46 < dongs> how the fuck could it possibly matter in 2019
2019-02-10T05:10:09 < tjq> everytime i see another one of those autistic reaction face title screens (linus tech tips) on youtube want to hit the cunt in the face with an old shovel
2019-02-10T05:10:50 < dongs> yeah lunix nigger tips should die
2019-02-10T05:11:21 < dongs> some dumb chink i know keeps linking his shit to me
2019-02-10T05:11:23 < rajkosto> can i use 2 timer channel as input and one as output
2019-02-10T05:11:24 < dongs> i refuse to click it
2019-02-10T05:11:32 < tjq> yeah, just needed to get that off my chest
2019-02-10T05:11:38 < dongs> yes as long as youre ok with it being on same timebase
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2019-02-10T05:18:52 < jadew> I think one of my instruments is tripping the circuit breaker, with a boom
2019-02-10T05:18:58 < jadew> but I'm not sure which one
2019-02-10T05:19:19 < jadew> thing is... after it happens, it works again
2019-02-10T05:20:34 < jadew> not really sure what to make of this
2019-02-10T05:22:10 < dongs> jews
2019-02-10T05:22:19 < jadew> I thought I heard the boom from the SA, but it could also be the sound it makes when you kill the power + the sound my speakers make when they lose power
2019-02-10T05:23:04 < jadew> I guess I'll keep it on for a while and see what happens
2019-02-10T05:23:42 < jadew> oh, and after it happened, I killed the power to all the instruments and tried to switch the breaker on, but it would immediately trip
2019-02-10T05:23:58 < jadew> so... maybe it's something else, or maybe it was some thermal protection?
2019-02-10T05:35:47 < rajkosto> dongs, doesnt output anything
2019-02-10T05:36:34 < rajkosto> since its on USB_DM do i have to disable USB so timer can take over the pin ? because just setting that pin as gpio works
2019-02-10T06:03:54 < rajkosto> OH
2019-02-10T06:03:59 < rajkosto> its preferring USART1_CTS
2019-02-10T06:04:02 < rajkosto> to TIM1_CH4
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2019-02-10T06:32:09 < rajkosto> that cant be right, something else is fucky
2019-02-10T06:34:37 < rajkosto> timer's counting fine im getting updatre interrupts, i did the TIM_OC4Init with the proper struct, why it fucky
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2019-02-10T06:36:43 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-10T06:36:52 < rajkosto> additional bit needs to be set to enable channels for TIM1
2019-02-10T06:40:24 < rajkosto> didnt do shit
2019-02-10T06:43:56 < rajkosto> if i change the "Idle mode" of CC4 to Set its at permanent 1 instead of 0
2019-02-10T06:52:16 < rajkosto> needed explicit
2019-02-10T06:52:16 < rajkosto> TIM_BDTRInitStructure.TIM_AutomaticOutput = TIM_AutomaticOutput_Enable;
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2019-02-10T07:12:54 < bitmask> herro
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2019-02-10T07:31:05 < dongs> F1 gpio is garbage
2019-02-10T07:34:12 < rajkosto> nah it was the intricacies of the complicated TIM gettin me down
2019-02-10T07:36:45 < rajkosto> i thought it be like the other simpler ones, but it dont
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2019-02-10T11:39:10 < rajkosto> dongs, how do you deal with tear line 
2019-02-10T11:47:59 < dongs> a wat
2019-02-10T11:49:34 < rajkosto> these displays dont have any sort of VSYNC in or TE out pin exposed
2019-02-10T11:49:48 < dongs> o
2019-02-10T11:49:55 < rajkosto> so rate at which cpu uploads and the framerate of display are completely independent
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2019-02-10T11:56:38 < rajkosto> even worse for me cuz i have to use display rotation, so the tear line is horizontal
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2019-02-10T12:12:50 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-10_11-12-44_mAUFs22Yg.png burned in again
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2019-02-10T13:05:52 < kakimir> how
2019-02-10T13:05:54 < kakimir> what
2019-02-10T13:33:22 -!- tjq [uid339161@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hqgnnjtrhsjzgjpb] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-10T13:37:35 < Steffanx> Its e-ink
2019-02-10T13:38:33 < rajkosto> its not, hate the tearing tho https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-10_12-38-26_Cswdurd3o.png
2019-02-10T13:41:27 < jpa-> does it maybe have a register where you can ask the scanline?
2019-02-10T13:41:33 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-10T13:41:47 < rajkosto> problem: if you read anything, you must toggle CS high for it to accept another command
2019-02-10T13:41:50 < rajkosto> CS is not exposed
2019-02-10T13:42:18 < jpa-> uh, did you buy your breakout board from some arduino engineer or what?
2019-02-10T13:42:25 < rajkosto> c h y n a
2019-02-10T13:43:20 < rajkosto> it might be on the flex cable tho, can hand solder to that
2019-02-10T13:43:39 < rajkosto> but i'd rather get the TE interrupt line instead
2019-02-10T13:43:51 < Steffanx> Buy a proper one
2019-02-10T13:44:47 < rajkosto> it seems all the ST7789 pcbs come with no CS pin
2019-02-10T13:44:48 < Steffanx> Or "hack" it ofcourse
2019-02-10T13:45:21 < tjq> funds are safu
2019-02-10T13:45:24 < tjq> ... ... 
2019-02-10T13:45:26 < tjq> hack it.
2019-02-10T13:46:34 < rajkosto> CS is on the flex but not the TE line :(
2019-02-10T13:46:36 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-10_12-46-24_9joBiUcVS.png
2019-02-10T13:48:38 < rajkosto> who told me stm32 cant read bits on the MOSI pin tho ? seems exactly what the BIDIR bit is for
2019-02-10T13:49:56 < Steffanx> must have been tjq
2019-02-10T13:50:04 < jpa-> misleading information on ##stm32? never!
2019-02-10T13:50:24 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1-54-inch-TFT-LCD-screen-LH154Q01-TD01-NANO-6-not-touch-panel-240-RGB-240/1669089957.html this one has CS (probably because of the SPI flash on there too) but dat price
2019-02-10T13:52:08 < tjq> hmm
2019-02-10T13:52:47 < jpa-> https://www.adafruit.com/product/3787  use professional stuff
2019-02-10T13:52:57 < rajkosto> NEVER.
2019-02-10T13:53:20 < Steffanx> find the same board on alie.
2019-02-10T13:53:30 < rajkosto> you cant
2019-02-10T13:53:36 < rajkosto> its the same display, adafruit always makes their own boards tho
2019-02-10T13:53:51 < Steffanx> make your own board. you'll need it anyway one day
2019-02-10T13:54:08 < rajkosto> i will
2019-02-10T13:54:12 < rajkosto> but dunno if it will have oled or this
2019-02-10T13:54:22 < rajkosto> im just messing around
2019-02-10T14:05:34 < tjq> m
2019-02-10T14:31:55 < rajkosto> bah they tied CS to GND via a via thats under the flex so i have to unsolder the whole flex
2019-02-10T14:58:09 < Steffanx> awh
2019-02-10T15:06:25 < karlp> man UL testing is tedious
2019-02-10T15:06:37 < karlp> "manual doesn't state operating altitude"
2019-02-10T15:07:53 < rajkosto> what if someone tries it in a plane and doesnt work and manual doesnt say that
2019-02-10T15:25:02 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-10_14-24-57_xEcNSJSWd.png problem solved
2019-02-10T15:36:14 -!- rajkosto [~Rajko@cable-178-149-127-67.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
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2019-02-10T16:26:44 < zoobab> https://www.cnx-software.com/2019/02/10/cs32-mcu-stm32-clone-bluepill-board/
2019-02-10T16:28:36 < Steffanx> tbh i dont really see a point in using a clone.
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2019-02-10T17:53:24 < R0b0t1> c/lose
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2019-02-10T18:54:00 < qyx> any kicad pros, ho do I populate the list of libraries in "manage symbol libraries"?
2019-02-10T18:54:05 < qyx> I cannot find any reasonable answer
2019-02-10T19:00:46 < srk> qyx: it's empty for you?
2019-02-10T19:01:21 < srk> qyx: it respects KICAD_SYMBOL_DIR, for me it points to git repo of kicad-symbols
2019-02-10T19:05:54 < qyx> meh I skipped the "copy user sym-lib-table" dialog
2019-02-10T19:06:11 < qyx> I deleted .config/kicad/sym-lib-table and run it again
2019-02-10T19:06:42 < qyx> but of course the file select dialog has a *.* filter
2019-02-10T19:06:53 < qyx> and there is no dot in the sym-lib-table file name
2019-02-10T19:07:19 < qyx> it took me a while to understand whats going on
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2019-02-10T19:15:33 < srk> library management is not quite there yet, would be nice to have something like package manager for libs 
2019-02-10T19:16:11 < srk> so you can publish theirs easily and also list requirements in some text file
2019-02-10T19:27:30 < qyx> I like the git concept
2019-02-10T19:28:27 < srk> yeah, it's fine 
2019-02-10T19:29:25 < srk> a bit of a problem is creating your project in earlier version and trying to open it with like 5.x
2019-02-10T19:30:09 < srk> would be better if you can just pull correct kicad + lib version instead of fixing incompatibilities
2019-02-10T19:35:51 < srk> btw there's #kicad as well
2019-02-10T19:42:55 < Steffanx> Lies
2019-02-10T19:43:58 -!- Jybz [~jibz@ufr-132-230-194-144.eduroam-nat.uni-freiburg.de] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2019-02-10T19:45:08 < kakimir> I need vacuum chamber
2019-02-10T19:45:17 < kakimir> I just don't want to pay the price
2019-02-10T19:45:51 < kakimir> sealing is the problem in DIY
2019-02-10T19:46:01 < kakimir> any recommeds?
2019-02-10T19:46:37 < Steffanx> Pass
2019-02-10T19:47:02 < kakimir> no pass
2019-02-10T19:50:47 < Steffanx> Hi kakimir, hows the day
2019-02-10T19:51:23 < Cracki> tupperware + some vacuum pump?
2019-02-10T19:51:36 < Steffanx> I think kakimir needs it huuge
2019-02-10T19:51:44 < kakimir> I think gallon at least
2019-02-10T19:51:53 < Steffanx> Whats a gallon?
2019-02-10T19:52:00 < kakimir> idk
2019-02-10T19:52:09 < kakimir> no idea
2019-02-10T19:52:19 < kakimir> x.xxxxx litres
2019-02-10T19:52:44 < Cracki> metal bucket and lid then
2019-02-10T19:52:55 < Steffanx> but whats the volume?
2019-02-10T19:53:06 <@englishman> get some leftover hyperloop equipment?
2019-02-10T19:53:16 < Steffanx> and the w-h-l
2019-02-10T19:53:33 <@englishman> what's a gallon
2019-02-10T19:53:37 <@englishman> a type of ship?
2019-02-10T19:53:48 < qyx> some non-SI pseudo unit
2019-02-10T19:53:49 < Steffanx> its like a retarder.
2019-02-10T19:53:57 <@englishman> hello qyx
2019-02-10T19:54:00 <@englishman> how is your weekend
2019-02-10T19:54:04 < qyx> like a ship
2019-02-10T19:54:09 < qyx> kicading much
2019-02-10T19:54:27 < qyx> I decided this weekend is a good time to start
2019-02-10T19:54:46 <@englishman> sorry to hear thay
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2019-02-10T19:54:49 <@englishman> that
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2019-02-10T19:55:04 < qyx> I spent 10 minutes tweaking the color scheme
2019-02-10T19:55:10 < qyx> to not feel like surrounded by a rainbow
2019-02-10T19:55:32 <@englishman> nicely done. first thing to do with opensores is waste time fixing shit right
2019-02-10T19:55:32 < Steffanx> and whats it now then?
2019-02-10T19:55:41 < qyx> now it is mostly gray
2019-02-10T19:55:46 < Steffanx> Dont you like lbhgdbyuys-flag style?
2019-02-10T19:55:49 < qyx> with blue values and refs
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2019-02-10T19:56:39 < srk> altium pros pls
2019-02-10T19:57:19 < qyx> so far it goes well
2019-02-10T19:57:22 < qyx> mostly
2019-02-10T19:57:51 < qyx> all parts in the library
2019-02-10T19:58:01 < qyx> I don't like the style though
2019-02-10T19:58:10 < qyx> STM32 have VDD on top and VSS on the bottom
2019-02-10T19:58:38 <@englishman> well why did you draw it like that
2019-02-10T19:59:02 < srk> it comes with the library, we don't waste time drawing common components
2019-02-10T19:59:03 < qyx> I did not do such things
2019-02-10T19:59:19 < srk> you can easily edit it
2019-02-10T19:59:25 < qyx> yes I did
2019-02-10T19:59:27 <@englishman> why would you use another man's libraries
2019-02-10T19:59:29 < qyx> with a single click
2019-02-10T19:59:47 < qyx> because it is opensores
2019-02-10T19:59:49 < srk> why would you waste time when you can use quality opensource libs?
2019-02-10T19:59:53 < srk> xD
2019-02-10T20:00:27 <@englishman> does kikecad make drawing footprints difficult and obtuse? sounds like opensores
2019-02-10T20:00:45 < srk> almost .. flash(rx): ORIGIN = 134217728, LENGTH =Just 65536  sram(rwx): ORIGIN = 536870912, LENGTH =Just 20480
2019-02-10T20:00:53 < Steffanx> Does kikad supprot my 3dconnexion?
2019-02-10T20:00:55 < Steffanx> support.
2019-02-10T20:01:18 < qyx> sure, in 2d mode
2019-02-10T20:01:32 < srk> you do 3d in eda?
2019-02-10T20:01:42 < Steffanx> its even useful in 2d
2019-02-10T20:02:06 < srk> was looking at these the other day
2019-02-10T20:02:22 <@englishman> 3d is helpful for placement sometimes
2019-02-10T20:02:24 < srk> but I mostly draw in 2D even when doing 3D stuff, only assembly is in 3D
2019-02-10T20:02:31 < Steffanx> Yes, what englishman says.
2019-02-10T20:02:35 <@englishman> and of course on the design side
2019-02-10T20:02:49 <@englishman> you can see cable exits etc
2019-02-10T20:06:01 < antto> i'm kicading since a few years now and it's gud
2019-02-10T20:06:37 < Steffanx> enough.
2019-02-10T20:07:07 < srk> it's getting even better with each release :)
2019-02-10T20:07:07 < antto> no.
2019-02-10T20:07:17 < antto> Steffanx CLICK CLACK
2019-02-10T20:07:23 < Steffanx> uh?
2019-02-10T20:08:06 < antto> kitkad EDA much
2019-02-10T20:08:35 < Steffanx> its like anything. Good enough :P
2019-02-10T20:09:22 < Steffanx> like your days.
2019-02-10T20:09:37 < antto> teh kicad channel iz only getting bigg0r
2019-02-10T20:11:23 < Steffanx> ok
2019-02-10T20:11:26 < srk> linker_script.lds:68: warning: memory region `ccsram' not declared
2019-02-10T20:11:54 < srk> wondering what's gonna happen if I try to load this on f103
2019-02-10T20:12:05 < srk> is it even possible to write "portable" linker scripts?
2019-02-10T20:12:12 < antto> a breakthrough in innovation
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2019-02-10T20:43:08 < jpa-> srk: among cortex-m*, you mostly have to adjust memory size & memory start address, everything else can remain the same
2019-02-10T20:45:32 < srk> that would be cool
2019-02-10T20:46:45 < jpa-> https://github.com/libopencm3/libopencm3/blob/master/ld/linker.ld.S
2019-02-10T20:48:01 < srk> yeah, was looking at that a moment ago
2019-02-10T20:48:24 < srk> think I need to add these #if defined(_CCM) ..
2019-02-10T20:49:02 < jpa-> well, only if you want to use ccm ram for global/static variables
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2019-02-10T20:53:12 < srk> cool, it segfaults now in init_relocate () at stm32_freertos_init.c:18 
2019-02-10T20:53:14 < srk> getting closer :D
2019-02-10T20:54:38 < srk> yeah, looks like it tries to relocate stuff to ccsram due to '> ccsram AT > flash'
2019-02-10T21:06:56 <@englishman> https://media.ccc.de/v/35c3-9671-self-encrypting_deception
2019-02-10T21:06:58 <@englishman> this was fun
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2019-02-10T21:38:21 < Steffanx> Did you enjoy his dutch accent (and no waffles :( )
2019-02-10T21:42:35 < zoobab> Bluepill firmware from scratch:
2019-02-10T21:42:38 < zoobab> https://ftp.belnet.be/mirror/FOSDEM/2019/K.4.401/microcontroller_firmware_from_scratch.mp4
2019-02-10T21:44:02 < Steffanx> zhe fosdem
2019-02-10T21:51:07 < srk> zoobab: that's what I'm doing atm :)
2019-02-10T21:51:26 < srk> along with the rest of stm32 family
2019-02-10T21:52:19 < zoobab> playing with arduino-cli-stm32
2019-02-10T21:53:21 < srk> arduwhat?
2019-02-10T21:54:38 <@englishman> i did enjoy his accent and polite mannerisms steffy
2019-02-10T21:55:00 <@englishman> and you can see he is not skinny due to waffel intake
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2019-02-10T21:56:29 < tjq> where is dr.b
2019-02-10T21:58:28 < Steffanx> Dr. Banned.
2019-02-10T22:00:28 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-10T22:00:33 < kakimir> our Imam
2019-02-10T22:07:53 < srk> wow, it wurkz
2019-02-10T22:07:54 < srk> kind of
2019-02-10T22:07:56 < srk> yes!
2019-02-10T22:10:09 < Steffanx> Great lunix work though englishman. Kernel panic during a presentation :D
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2019-02-10T22:10:37 <@englishman> yes though it's annoying the camera goes to him doing nothing instead of capturing his screen
2019-02-10T22:13:39 < aandrew> who's that
2019-02-10T22:13:47 < aandrew> oh that bluepill link?
2019-02-10T22:13:50 < Steffanx> nein
2019-02-10T22:13:56 < Steffanx> <@englishman> https://media.ccc.de/v/35c3-9671-self-encrypting_deception
2019-02-10T22:13:56 < Steffanx> <@englishman> this was fun
2019-02-10T22:14:39 < aandrew> oh
2019-02-10T22:14:41 < aandrew> let me watch that one
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2019-02-10T22:44:33 < Steffanx> Its nice indeed. And lol @ jtagging into it
2019-02-10T22:54:41 < srk> jpa-: how does it work with libopencm3 and these #if defined(_CCM) sections? you need to annotate your code to put it there?
2019-02-10T22:56:07 < srk> yeah, like this uint16_t levels[4] __attribute__((section(".ccmram")));
2019-02-10T22:56:35 < srk> speed up your code for free
2019-02-10T22:59:41 < srk> libopencm3 passes this to ld as -D_CCM if its part of ld/devices.data via some awk magic
2019-02-10T23:00:29 < srk> clock config time
2019-02-10T23:22:46 < Steffanx> its 22:22 srk
2019-02-10T23:23:45 < srk> cool
2019-02-10T23:24:11 < srk> 4:20 is better for clocks tho
2019-02-10T23:24:16 < srk> time slows down
2019-02-10T23:26:07 < srk> <RefParameter Comment="System clock" DefaultValue="8000000" Display="value/1000000" Max="72000000" Name="SYSCLKFreq_VALUE" Type="double" Unit="MHz" Visible="false"/>
2019-02-10T23:26:09 < srk> totally unit MHz
2019-02-10T23:31:54 < Steffanx> Haha
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2019-02-10T23:36:51 < Steffanx> srk: srk
2019-02-10T23:37:25 < srk> :(
2019-02-10T23:39:06 < srk> https://blog.salkinium.com/modm-devices/
2019-02-10T23:39:09 < srk> not bad
2019-02-10T23:41:39 < qyx> srk: maybe the value SYSCLKFreq_VALUE is in the base unit
2019-02-10T23:42:06 < qyx> and when displaying it, name it "System clock", compute "value/1000000" and append "MHz"
2019-02-10T23:42:12 < srk> yeah, exactly
2019-02-10T23:47:09 < Cracki> what does this modm do and why should anyone bother using it?
2019-02-10T23:47:58 < Cracki> I'm browsing some samples and haven't seen anything that strikes me as a novel contribution to the world
2019-02-10T23:50:37 < Cracki> I'm certain that stuff is useful to their team (their robotics club) but that's all
--- Day changed Mon Feb 11 2019
2019-02-11T00:01:10 < Cracki> okok I see the example in the blog post, makes sense
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2019-02-11T01:03:07 < qyx> how the hell is the L4 internal opamp biased
2019-02-11T01:03:33 < qyx> may I assume output VREF = VDDA/2 and just AC couple the input?
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2019-02-11T01:12:19 < Cracki> any particular L4?
2019-02-11T01:12:38 < qyx> L432
2019-02-11T01:13:02 < Cracki> RM0394 then
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2019-02-11T01:14:51 < Cracki> figure 122 shows me both inputs
2019-02-11T01:16:19 < qyx> so
2019-02-11T01:16:27 < qyx> whats the internal "PE" sign
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2019-02-11T01:17:16 < qyx> I see the figure more illustrational than literal
2019-02-11T01:17:44 < Cracki> "PE"?
2019-02-11T01:18:46 < qyx> http://www.ni.com/cms/images/devzone/tut/GroundingTermsandSignals.gif
2019-02-11T01:19:10 < Cracki> ah, didn't make the connection
2019-02-11T01:19:11 < qyx> PE is protective earth
2019-02-11T01:20:21 < Cracki> doing adc or something else with that opamp?
2019-02-11T01:20:34 < qyx> yes directly to the ADC
2019-02-11T01:20:46 < qyx> I may as well use an external opamp and save another 2 pins
2019-02-11T01:25:59 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/OVU11ni just a few USB ports...
2019-02-11T01:27:54 < qyx> industrial grade flashing station?
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2019-02-11T01:43:06 < aandrew> no
2019-02-11T01:43:25 < aandrew> those are all nRF51822 dongles (so j-link+nrf51822) and two nRF52840 dongles (no jlink on them)
2019-02-11T01:43:53 < Cracki> purpose being radio testbed?
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2019-02-11T02:58:56 < karlp> I'm guess that's his TDM test shits.
2019-02-11T03:03:52 < karlp> siemens, living in the future, "All computers or servers must have a CD-Rom drive and it is recommended that a UPS (power supply) and at least 17” or greater monitor be used."
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2019-02-11T03:45:35 < aandrew> Cracki: yes testbed to make sure I can load all 10 timeslots down and run without issues
2019-02-11T03:47:25 < Cracki> I assume they are ok with such short distances and the accordingly low attenuation?
2019-02-11T03:50:20 < aandrew> the required range is only a few meters
2019-02-11T03:50:30 < aandrew> this is just a test setup
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2019-02-11T04:20:43 < jadew> are the chinese not back from vacation?
2019-02-11T04:21:02 < rajkosto> not the 12th yet
2019-02-11T04:21:05 < rajkosto> some wait until 14th
2019-02-11T04:21:18 < jadew> jeez...
2019-02-11T04:39:43 < rue_shop1> anyone ported the arduino talkie library to stm32?
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2019-02-11T05:20:29 < rajkosto> jadew, ali seller just shipped my order that has been waiting all lunar new year so
2019-02-11T05:20:31 < rajkosto> some are back
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2019-02-11T08:40:15 < dongs> https://s.adroll.com/a/TLH/ESD/TLHESD5DOVEVZHWVFBPAOW.png
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2019-02-11T08:52:23 < jpa-> it feels weird how layout work is considered "monkey stuff".. seems like that's the way to get monkey quality layouts
2019-02-11T08:52:39 < dongs> rite?
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2019-02-11T09:30:42 < dongs> fucking altinigger
2019-02-11T09:30:48 < dongs> routing is definitely fucking fucked in 19
2019-02-11T09:30:58 < dongs> it keeps adding bullshit necks and bends everyfuckingwehre
2019-02-11T09:31:10 < dongs> that I have to later straighten out by rerouting
2019-02-11T09:31:11 < dongs> piece of shit
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2019-02-11T09:36:12 < zyp> jpa-, IMO doing the layout is the most fun part
2019-02-11T09:36:36 < zyp> it's like solving a puzzle
2019-02-11T09:36:54 < qyx> it is fun if you have enough time for it
2019-02-11T09:37:59 < dongs> why is python so fucking gay
2019-02-11T09:38:03 < dongs> what a horrible language
2019-02-11T09:38:20 < zyp> haha
2019-02-11T09:38:21 < dongs> w = bytearray([ord(p)^ord(q) for p,q in zip(z,y)])
2019-02-11T09:38:25 < dongs> liek, get the FUCK OUT
2019-02-11T09:38:48 < zyp> eww, python2
2019-02-11T09:38:57 < dongs> sorry i dont even know the diference
2019-02-11T09:39:03 < dongs> im sure they're all equally gay
2019-02-11T09:39:38 < zyp> also wtf, it doesn't make sense to use a list comprehension for that
2019-02-11T09:39:53 < dongs> you lost me at 'comprehension'
2019-02-11T09:40:01 < zyp> the [] part
2019-02-11T09:40:13 < zyp> you can drop the [] and it'd work equally well, just faster
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2019-02-11T09:41:14 < dongs> i mean from what I understand this is literally just a for (i..length) array[i] = anotherarray[i] ^ array[i]
2019-02-11T09:41:24 < dongs> but why write such faggoting way
2019-02-11T09:42:12 < dongs> search and replace python with a GARBAGE BIN
2019-02-11T09:42:22 < zyp> yeah, w[i] = z[i] ^ y[i]
2019-02-11T09:42:39 < dongs> so why write it in such obtuse retard way
2019-02-11T09:42:56 < dongs> does gaython not have array indexes
2019-02-11T09:45:11 < dongs> i think this is due to the fact that python "programmers' have never written an actual program and don't want to spend time thinking how to implement something
2019-02-11T09:45:18 < dongs> so they just bruteforce it with bullshit syntax
2019-02-11T09:45:22 < dongs> that gets teh job done
2019-02-11T09:45:29 < zyp> haha
2019-02-11T09:45:57 < dongs> it results in write-only garbage code like above
2019-02-11T09:46:05 < squirrel1> wat
2019-02-11T09:46:10 < squirrel1> that's simplex syntax
2019-02-11T09:46:19 < squirrel1> *simple
2019-02-11T09:46:21  * squirrel1 can't write
2019-02-11T09:46:29 < dongs> i bet you write python, too
2019-02-11T09:47:01 < squirrel1> used to, but simple list comprehensions are nice
2019-02-11T09:47:23 < dongs> no, this is 100% incomprehensible because it doesn't show what teh fuck the code actualyl does
2019-02-11T09:47:41 < squirrel1> (when you stop being old fag)
2019-02-11T09:47:42 < dongs> when someone looks at w[i] = z[i] ^ y[i] its immediately obvious what the shit does
2019-02-11T09:48:13 < squirrel1> dongs: so, just because you are not faimiliar with it, it sucks?
2019-02-11T09:48:15 < zyp> https://paste.jvnv.net/view/m5Ezy
2019-02-11T09:48:16 < squirrel1> the way the go
2019-02-11T09:48:22 < dongs> "familiar"????
2019-02-11T09:48:47 < zyp> there you have equivalent shit
2019-02-11T09:48:48 < dongs> oh, so t here isnt normal array indexing in gaython.
2019-02-11T09:48:50 < squirrel1> come on, this is obvious when you are aware of the feature and tried to read a first tutorial about it
2019-02-11T09:49:11 < dongs> zyp, i'd probly do w = [0] * 16; and would just w[i] = blah instead.
2019-02-11T09:49:23 < zyp> yeah, that'd also work
2019-02-11T09:49:40 < dongs> because then there's no confusion and faggotry
2019-02-11T09:49:42 < squirrel1> so, [ord(p)^ord(q) for p,q in zip(z,y)] is a problem, but [0]*16 evidently not
2019-02-11T09:49:53 < zyp> haha
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2019-02-11T09:50:08 < dongs> [0] * 16 is equivalent of w[16] = { 0, };
2019-02-11T09:50:12 < dongs> it shows exactly waht happens.
2019-02-11T09:50:21 < squirrel1> [ord(p)^ord(q) for p,q in zip(z,y)] also show exactly what happens
2019-02-11T09:50:25 < dongs> no it doesnt
2019-02-11T09:50:29 < squirrel1> just different syntax
2019-02-11T09:50:31 < squirrel1> but meh
2019-02-11T09:50:46 < dongs> you have to loop up what the fuck ord does, waht the fuck zip does, adn what teh fuck is a for loop that is a faggot nigger shit way of using it there
2019-02-11T09:51:12 < zyp> you'd still need ord() either way if you were dicking around with python2
2019-02-11T09:51:14 < dongs> er 1st loop = look
2019-02-11T09:51:28 < dongs> zyp, how could it possibly matter
2019-02-11T09:51:35 < dongs> does python not have array indexes (back to original question)
2019-02-11T09:51:36 < dongs> lol
2019-02-11T09:51:54 < squirrel1> because you evidently do not know the language, same argument could be used wtih beginner looking at: void(foo*)(int,int)
2019-02-11T09:52:06 < squirrel1> what the fuck it does? why anybody uses it when I have to google shit because of that?
2019-02-11T09:52:12 < dongs> i don't need to know the language to read somethign that was properly written
2019-02-11T09:52:27 < squirrel1> but hey
2019-02-11T09:52:33 < dongs> but then you have this write-only garbage like python, that even if you KNOW it you can't see what the fuck is does
2019-02-11T09:53:26 < squirrel1> some people just prefer to blaim the language...
2019-02-11T09:53:39 < dongs> i would much rather if python didn't exist, sure
2019-02-11T09:53:49 < dongs> it serves no purpose as far as I'm concerned
2019-02-11T09:53:54 < dongs> haev never seen anything quality written in it
2019-02-11T09:54:02 < dongs> just retarded quick hacks made by people who shouldn't be coding anythign
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2019-02-11T09:58:39 < zyp> joke languages are joke languages
2019-02-11T09:59:21 < dongs> no
2019-02-11T10:01:35 < zyp> anything that's turing complete "works"
2019-02-11T10:02:08 < zyp> and x86 interrupt gates
2019-02-11T10:02:40 < zyp> ref. https://github.com/jbangert/trapcc
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2019-02-11T10:05:32 < dongs> sample.c 7megs
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2019-02-11T10:32:42 < dongs> its in wahtever it says
2019-02-11T10:52:57 < zyp> is this a linear regulator?
2019-02-11T10:53:12 < zyp> if so, yes
2019-02-11T10:54:15 < zyp> there's a max current rating, and then there's a max voltage rating, but it won't be able to supply max current at max voltage drop, since that would exceed the max power rating
2019-02-11T10:54:33 < zyp> so you have to operate within all three of those limits
2019-02-11T10:55:07 < dongs> TypeError: argument must be read-only bytes-like object, not bytearray
2019-02-11T10:55:13 < dongs> what happens wehn you start with a garbage language
2019-02-11T10:55:15 < dongs> and add shit on later
2019-02-11T10:55:21 < dongs> beacuse "oh shit"
2019-02-11T11:13:23 < zyp> dongs, just replace bytearray() with bytes()
2019-02-11T11:13:45 < dongs> no, it was more inolved than that but that wasnt my point
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2019-02-11T11:17:18 < zyp> Haohmaru, isn't it more sensible to just use a bit more beefy LDO?
2019-02-11T11:17:25 < zyp> rather than a small LDO in series with a diode?
2019-02-11T11:22:49 < zyp> just put it downstream of the regulator, the LDO itself would probably work well enough as a diode
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2019-02-11T11:25:01 < zyp> yeah, that's common
2019-02-11T11:25:48 < zyp> not necessarily
2019-02-11T11:27:33 < zyp> haha
2019-02-11T11:28:01 < zyp> what are you doing that'll draw 500 mA?
2019-02-11T11:28:39 < dongs> aka autisming
2019-02-11T11:28:53 < tjq> lol
2019-02-11T11:29:14 < zyp> well, duh, if you're calculating with worst case numbers, of course you get a worst case result
2019-02-11T11:29:48 < zyp> the datasheet for your mcu will have typical numbers for it
2019-02-11T11:31:16 < tjq> the adafruit approach
2019-02-11T11:31:35 < tjq> how would they do it....
2019-02-11T11:33:56 < zyp> stm32f407 has 240mA as absolute maximum rating on supply lines, so you can be pretty safe the MCU won't draw more than that :p
2019-02-11T11:34:13 < zyp> https://www.st.com/resource/en/datasheet/stm32f405rg.pdf <- ref. page 79
2019-02-11T11:35:05 < zyp> also page 85 has the table you're referring to
2019-02-11T11:35:36 < zyp> it says with _everything_ enabled at 25C you're at 87mA
2019-02-11T11:35:49 < zyp> you probably won't have everything enabled
2019-02-11T11:35:56 < tjq> traitor
2019-02-11T11:36:00 < dongs> fun fact
2019-02-11T11:36:11 < dongs> the retarduinoused sam3e thing
2019-02-11T11:36:17 < dongs> draws like 200mA just idling
2019-02-11T11:36:21 < dongs> it actualyl heats up
2019-02-11T11:36:28 < dongs> and you can see it on thermal camera
2019-02-11T11:38:21 < kakimir> legacy
2019-02-11T11:38:33 < kakimir> guise
2019-02-11T11:38:38 < kakimir> I need advice
2019-02-11T11:39:43 < kakimir> how to protect voltage rail when operating voltage and maximum voltage are close to each other?
2019-02-11T11:39:53 < dongs> sounds about right
2019-02-11T11:40:24 < karlp> zyp: huh, nice dropping the list comprehension
2019-02-11T11:40:34 < kakimir> I wonder if my chip has overvoltage event.. just returning from sleep would do the trick
2019-02-11T11:40:40 < karlp> I'm not used to have teh for return an iterator, but of course it will.
2019-02-11T11:40:59 < zyp> karlp, list comprehensions vs generator expressions
2019-02-11T11:41:05 < karlp> I love list comprehensions personally, and I had to even try it out to test that it was unnecessary
2019-02-11T11:41:23 < zyp> you only want to use list comprehensions if you actually need it to be a list
2019-02-11T11:41:35 < zyp> i.e. if you want to do multiple lookups into it
2019-02-11T11:42:00 < zyp> generator expressions works the same, but only calculates the expression as they are consumed
2019-02-11T11:42:16 < zyp> so you've got less memory requirement
2019-02-11T11:42:32 < zyp> and you can use them on infinite iterators
2019-02-11T11:42:39 < jpa-> but generator expressions don't work before python 2.4!
2019-02-11T11:42:50 < zyp> something like that
2019-02-11T11:43:10 < dongs> i prefer a language that doesn't result in different shit depending on its version
2019-02-11T11:43:16 < dongs> so I'll stick with C tqvm
2019-02-11T11:43:27 < dongs> all this newfag versioned shit can fuck right off
2019-02-11T11:43:37 < kakimir> C is like a wine
2019-02-11T11:43:45 < kakimir> it just keeps getting better
2019-02-11T11:45:42  * kakimir spits in his coffee
2019-02-11T11:46:11  * kakimir then drinks it
2019-02-11T11:46:38 < karlp> yeah, I just don't always see the generator expresson (iterator in lua) as self evident.  like, blah = something_that_iterators() ? that might be concrete, or it might still be the iterator? who knows! 
2019-02-11T11:48:29 < zyp> dongs, you mean like C89 vs C99 vs C11?
2019-02-11T11:48:43 < dongs> those are not changes that make shit break
2019-02-11T11:48:56 < zyp> neither is generator expressions
2019-02-11T11:48:57 < karlp> sure they are, can't do for (int i = ... in c89
2019-02-11T11:49:21 < dongs> thats good, because thats lazy faggot practice anyway
2019-02-11T11:49:23 < zyp> adding features doesn't break older code
2019-02-11T11:49:32 < dongs> and waht zyp said
2019-02-11T11:49:33 < karlp> man verical wants me to install a browser side bar
2019-02-11T11:49:37 < karlp> what is this, the fucking 90s?
2019-02-11T11:49:43 < dongs> they do? haha
2019-02-11T11:49:43 < zyp> wat
2019-02-11T11:49:43 < dongs> wtf
2019-02-11T11:49:50 < zyp> is side bars still a thing?
2019-02-11T11:49:59 < dongs> browser toolbro
2019-02-11T11:50:04 < dongs> maybe a chrome extension these days
2019-02-11T11:50:18 < karlp> https://imgur.com/a/Ahcydm8
2019-02-11T11:50:28 < karlp> it's an "extension" of some sort yeah
2019-02-11T11:51:04 < zyp> hahaha
2019-02-11T11:51:06 < zyp> wtf
2019-02-11T11:51:16 < karlp> https://www.verical.com/extensions?utm_source=eloqua&utm_medium=email&utm_term=extensions&utm_content=verical_sidekick_12percent_off&utm_campaign=verical_row_en_sidekick-12percent-off-promo_feb2019
2019-02-11T11:51:22 < karlp> the amount of tracking that would hahve to do is insane.
2019-02-11T11:51:27 < zyp> 2019 more like 1999
2019-02-11T11:52:37 < tjq> i want some silicon pieces
2019-02-11T11:52:52 < emeryth> go to a beach
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2019-02-11T12:07:07 < qyx> are you using sot23-5 vreg for 5V->3V3 at 200mA?
2019-02-11T12:08:40 < qyx> I am looking at a random TPS706 LDO
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2019-02-11T12:09:01 < qyx> it lists junction-to-ambient at 212°C per 1W
2019-02-11T12:09:49 < qyx> your part dissipates 0.2A*1.7V, so about 0.35W
2019-02-11T12:10:54 < qyx> idk if cooking the part at 100°C when ambient is 25°C is okay
2019-02-11T12:11:49 < qyx> any linear vreg have to dissipate the remainder of the energy as a heat
2019-02-11T12:12:11 < qyx> if you put 200mA through your vreg regulating from 5V to 3V3
2019-02-11T12:12:27 < qyx> it dissipates 200mA * (5V - 3.3V) watts
2019-02-11T12:13:39 < qyx> see thermal resistance in absolute maximum ratings in your DS
2019-02-11T12:13:46 < qyx> θ JA (SOT23-5) ...............................................191°C/W
2019-02-11T12:13:56 < qyx> they even elaborate it
2019-02-11T12:14:19 < qyx> see Note 1 on page 2
2019-02-11T12:15:02 < qyx> junction temp max is 125°C
2019-02-11T12:15:33 < qyx> Tj_max is 125
2019-02-11T12:15:43 < qyx> you should put what your DS says
2019-02-11T12:16:36 < qyx> TA is let's say 25°C, but I would consider at least 45°C because 25 is ideal
2019-02-11T12:16:56 < qyx> so the allowable diff Tj_max to T_A is 125-45 = 80
2019-02-11T12:17:21 < qyx> Pd_max is Tdiff / θ JA
2019-02-11T12:17:47 < qyx> so 80 / 191 = ~0.41W
2019-02-11T12:18:02 < qyx> so your 0.35W is marginal
2019-02-11T12:18:11 < qyx> of course you want operating conditions, not abs max
2019-02-11T12:18:25 < qyx> absolute maximum doesn't mean the part is working nominally
2019-02-11T12:18:33 < qyx> it means the part is not destroyed yet
2019-02-11T12:18:58 < qyx> yes, all power values are usually in watts
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2019-02-11T12:19:46 < qyx> yeah, thats within the limit
2019-02-11T12:20:00 < qyx> but I would not be happy with it
2019-02-11T12:20:18 < qyx> for the same price you may get a DFN6 part for example
2019-02-11T12:21:03 < qyx> or to fuk it up a little bit more
2019-02-11T12:21:18 < PaulFertser> dongs, why are you multirotor friends are providing many nice features for micro-quads with custom firmware http://sirdomsen.diskstation.me/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=start but their code makes me sick?
2019-02-11T12:21:57 < qyx> my random TPS706 lists SOT23-5 at 212°C/W but only 73°C/W for DFN6
2019-02-11T12:22:32 < qyx> so either use a proper package or minimize your consumption or use a SMPS vreg
2019-02-11T12:24:40 < qyx> you can still use a d2pak just for the lulz
2019-02-11T12:28:45 < qyx> a good smps would dissipate less than 50mW in this case
2019-02-11T12:28:57 < qyx> which is 0.3W difference
2019-02-11T12:29:44 < qyx> in 10000hours it dissipates 3kWh less which is about 0.50€
2019-02-11T12:29:47 < qyx> and pays itself!
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2019-02-11T13:03:04 < jpa-> PaulFertser: it doesn't look that bad
2019-02-11T13:09:35 < PaulFertser> jpa-: I thought that before I actually took a look at the code. Basically, there're several "forks" of about the same code slightly tailored for particular boards, horribly formatted, without any clean git history, and even inside one fork there's plenty of unexplainable duplication, e.g. in https://github.com/silver13/H8mini_blue_board/ all Silverware/src/rx_* files have same static
2019-02-11T13:09:41 < PaulFertser> decode_packet function; drv_xn297.c is an almost verbatim copy of drv_xn297_3wire.c; etc etc, just wtf... 
2019-02-11T13:12:38 < PaulFertser> It looks like those people just do not have a clue about programming, and yet their project is highly successful, several vendors started making boards specifically for their firmware.
2019-02-11T13:13:06 < kakimir> ideal situation
2019-02-11T13:16:35 <@englishman> sounds like the RC world hasnt changed a bit
2019-02-11T13:16:53 < kakimir> I just created 32bit timer
2019-02-11T13:17:18 < PaulFertser> " Your firmware and the community surrounding it has CHANGED MY LIFE and is changing the entire world of flying whoops!!!!! Not a day goes by that I don't think of how grateful I am for that. "
2019-02-11T13:18:29 <@englishman> that kind of softwre can make flying those little $20 copters a lot more fun. they are not that complex in the end, so if it works, who cares if the code is shit
2019-02-11T13:19:05 < kakimir> flying craplets
2019-02-11T13:19:14 < kakimir> but the cheapest ones are the most fun
2019-02-11T13:19:45 < kakimir> totally dodgy and when it goes into shits you can have that $20 laughter
2019-02-11T13:19:56 < PaulFertser> englishman: I flashed my nephew's quad ($10 one) with suitable fork but then it's apparently lacking "headfree/headless" mode and also the LEDs are not turning on when expected, so naturally one has to dig the code now to fix it.
2019-02-11T13:19:57 <@englishman> it is, those little copters can be flown indoors and are super crash resistant
2019-02-11T13:20:40 <@englishman> since they are mostly fpv guys i'm surprised headfree is in there at all
2019-02-11T13:20:44 < PaulFertser> Also, the yaw rate is somehow many times slower than it should be.
2019-02-11T13:21:18 < PaulFertser> The "main" fork has it so I guess I can follow their steps and just copy-paste it...
2019-02-11T13:21:58 <@englishman> ha
2019-02-11T13:22:08 -!- mode/##stm32 [-o englishman] by ChanServ
2019-02-11T13:23:07 < kakimir> when you make one crappy public code you can see your code flying in millions of $20 craplets
2019-02-11T13:23:14 < PaulFertser> I thought about introducing my nephew to tiny whoop FPV but afaict any proper FPV goggles would require considerably more money than the quad itself + AIO camera costs.
2019-02-11T13:23:37 < englishman> true
2019-02-11T13:23:44 < englishman> but they also last a lot longer
2019-02-11T13:24:05 < PaulFertser> If he continues with the hobby that'd make sense.
2019-02-11T13:24:27 < englishman> if you find some older led Zeiss Cinemizer glasses you can save a lot
2019-02-11T13:24:34 < englishman> and they are by far the best imo
2019-02-11T13:24:42 < kakimir> you need to start with something
2019-02-11T13:24:47 < PaulFertser> Another option would be USB receiver and OTG phone in a google cardboard but it's probably not worth the hassle. 
2019-02-11T13:24:56 < englishman> you can also fly with a little screen if you are just flying indoors
2019-02-11T13:25:14 < englishman> don't need goggles necessairly
2019-02-11T13:25:32 < PaulFertser> Indoors and tiny flats do not mix well :)
2019-02-11T13:25:39 < englishman> i disagree
2019-02-11T13:25:49 < englishman> tiny copter + tiny flat = proportionally correct
2019-02-11T13:26:11 < PaulFertser> I do not fly anything so I guess I just do not have a real clue.
2019-02-11T13:26:32 < kakimir> I need to see 32bit timer to overflow.. with prescaller 1 it takes 9minutes
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2019-02-11T13:27:45 < PaulFertser> I guess I could use a tiny quad with invert capability and acro firmware as a poorman's heli trainer for indoors though. 
2019-02-11T13:27:47 < karlp> Haohmaru: tps703 is tops for dissipation. 
2019-02-11T13:28:02 < karlp> though remember that using a package with better dissipation still means the heat has to go somewhere....
2019-02-11T13:28:22 < englishman> here, this is a MUCH bigger copter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQSJb4nvO9Q
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2019-02-11T13:28:41 < kakimir> first goals: get the heat spread to wider area
2019-02-11T13:28:57 < kakimir> second goals: get the heat transferet out of that area
2019-02-11T13:29:09 < kakimir> *transfered
2019-02-11T13:29:37 < PaulFertser> I guess if there was a nice club nearby I'd just buy a 450-size heli and would practice regularly, but alas.
2019-02-11T13:30:21 < englishman> the price of those has come down astoundingly
2019-02-11T13:30:31 < tjq> chinese new year is a 2 week opium binge
2019-02-11T13:30:33 < englishman> and thanks to flybarless technology you can actually fly them
2019-02-11T13:30:45 < englishman> without tweaking shit all the time
2019-02-11T13:31:04 < PaulFertser> My cat used to hunt the tiny heli but somehow stopped liking that.
2019-02-11T13:31:11 < PaulFertser> s/heli/multi-copter/
2019-02-11T13:31:11 < srk> get a mobula 7 
2019-02-11T13:32:09 < srk> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxmMaDBxkf8
2019-02-11T13:32:11 < tjq> yeah cats do that for no reason
2019-02-11T13:33:12 < englishman> wow brushless
2019-02-11T13:33:35 < srk> best thing since tinywhoops
2019-02-11T13:33:53 < srk> this is F3 based, there's also eachine trashcan which run F4
2019-02-11T13:34:20 < srk> 2S, 16000kV, thing is a rocket :D
2019-02-11T13:34:45 < englishman> higher number makes you fly faster right
2019-02-11T13:34:47 < englishman> f3/f4
2019-02-11T13:35:01 < srk> nope :)
2019-02-11T13:35:14 < englishman> yeah i read it on rcgroups
2019-02-11T13:35:26 < srk> yeah, ppl buying F10
2019-02-11T13:35:37 < srk> which is like F7 + F3 with proprietary filters
2019-02-11T13:35:39 < srk> retards
2019-02-11T13:35:57 < englishman> the most important part of flying
2019-02-11T13:35:58 < englishman> the filtesr
2019-02-11T13:36:29 < srk> f4 is a bit more future proof due to stuff landing in betaflight
2019-02-11T13:36:40 < englishman> eachine trashcan is $10 cheaper, is it just as good?
2019-02-11T13:36:43 < srk> they are adding more dynamic filtering in 4.x
2019-02-11T13:37:11 < englishman> yeah im sure clifton will continue to add dumb bloat and require H7 soon
2019-02-11T13:37:31 < dongs> lol @ needing space or speed of F3/F4 to fly gyro
2019-02-11T13:37:36 < dongs> "
2019-02-11T13:37:39 < dongs> "needing"
2019-02-11T13:37:52 < englishman> srsly
2019-02-11T13:38:02 < srk> you can still run on f1 cc3d board
2019-02-11T13:38:14 < englishman> brainfpv came out with his new graphical osd
2019-02-11T13:38:18 < englishman> tha thas "only" f4
2019-02-11T13:38:27 < englishman> and ppl were asking how is that possible?????
2019-02-11T13:38:30 < dongs> you mean the shit from years ago?
2019-02-11T13:38:36 < englishman> no he made a new one
2019-02-11T13:38:39 < dongs> oh okay
2019-02-11T13:38:39 < englishman> without the fpga afaik
2019-02-11T13:38:43 < rajkosto> isnt f4 basically required to drive a 480p display at decent framerates
2019-02-11T13:38:44 < dongs> there was never fpga
2019-02-11T13:38:50 < englishman> cpld wahtever
2019-02-11T13:38:53 < dongs> or that
2019-02-11T13:39:08 < dongs> unless i missed something. his thing from years ago was just graphical thing
2019-02-11T13:39:15 < englishman> yeah
2019-02-11T13:39:20 < rajkosto> the gyro on those so smuth
2019-02-11T13:39:24 < englishman> i stopped selling mine
2019-02-11T13:40:42 < englishman> srk the eachine is cheaper and better why recommend the other one?
2019-02-11T13:41:04 < srk> why do you think it's better?
2019-02-11T13:41:10 < englishman> and it has leds, the second most important part of flying behind filters
2019-02-11T13:41:17 < englishman> you havent told me anything otherwise
2019-02-11T13:41:32 < PaulFertser> dongs: what's the real reason for people writing that "silverware" firmware instead of adding support to baseflight if they're targetting 32k flash f03x controllers and tiny quads like cx10?
2019-02-11T13:41:41 < srk> m7 flies great out of box, trashcan not so much
2019-02-11T13:41:50 < srk> which is why the former is still more popular
2019-02-11T13:42:03 < srk> but there's like new machine every 2 weeks in this category
2019-02-11T13:42:14 < dongs> PaulFertser: baseflight has bene dead for years, people writing other trash are java/retard coders, they just write garbage and throw it at a wall and hope it sticks
2019-02-11T13:42:41 < englishman> yeah i am well aware of product turnover
2019-02-11T13:42:46 < englishman> for rc trash
2019-02-11T13:42:55 < PaulFertser> dongs: ok, thanks for confirming. Yet they are reasonably successful with their retarded codes...
2019-02-11T13:43:10 < dongs> PaulFertser: i mean, you can fly a shitcopter with rageberrypi and be succesful...
2019-02-11T13:43:27 < dongs> it doesnt eaxctly take huge amounts of talent
2019-02-11T13:43:42 < srk> englishman: and gonna build something like this next 0:00 / 1:01
2019-02-11T13:43:45 < srk> fuck
2019-02-11T13:43:49 < srk> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-ou2495g7g
2019-02-11T13:44:25 < dongs> always asme shit
2019-02-11T13:44:29 < dongs> shitty boring gyro only flight
2019-02-11T13:44:31 < dongs> yawn
2019-02-11T13:44:36 < srk> wut
2019-02-11T13:44:43 < dongs> branded by some retard who has nothing better to do
2019-02-11T13:44:53 < srk> what's not boring? full auto? 
2019-02-11T13:45:07 < dongs> srk, its been same fucking shit for years, literally zero change from 'quad fpv' vids 10 years ago
2019-02-11T13:45:11 < dongs> where's the improvement
2019-02-11T13:45:29 < srk> everywhere :)
2019-02-11T13:45:34 < dongs> i see none
2019-02-11T13:45:55 < srk> for example in 65g machines that fly like 5" 
2019-02-11T13:46:04 < srk> all in one electronics 
2019-02-11T13:46:11 < srk> 6S capable machines
2019-02-11T13:46:17 < PaulFertser> srk: probably car drivers are not too happy driving in that area :)
2019-02-11T13:46:19 < srk> and so on :)
2019-02-11T13:47:33 < srk> yeah, I have real understanding for these poor suckers that have to driver in the city
2019-02-11T13:47:55 < srk> one of the reasons I want to move out of one :)
2019-02-11T13:48:20 < srk> lazy ass tards who need to drive everywhere 
2019-02-11T13:51:58 < englishman> i dont remember 6s copters ever not being available
2019-02-11T13:52:46 < englishman> available of course meaning shit you made from towel bars and screws and airplane motors
2019-02-11T13:52:50 < srk> 5"/6" racers
2019-02-11T13:53:09 < englishman> using flashed esc firmware you found from some canadian in ##stm32
2019-02-11T13:53:21 < englishman> cuz when it went into low voltage cutoff you fell out of the sky
2019-02-11T13:53:24 < dongs> does anyone evne solder shit anymore
2019-02-11T13:53:29 < dongs> or do they just buy some chink shit
2019-02-11T13:53:38 < srk> I do
2019-02-11T13:53:42 < srk> I make my own frames as well
2019-02-11T13:53:46 < dongs> lol k
2019-02-11T13:53:47 < srk> and electronics sometimes
2019-02-11T13:53:59 < englishman> well look at that chink shit linked earlier $95 with batteries why would anyone spend $50 on a soldering iron
2019-02-11T13:53:59 < srk> https://wiki.base48.cz/File:Anqc.jpeg
2019-02-11T13:54:17 < dongs> ah, 3 blade newb-props
2019-02-11T13:54:42 < srk> more grip, less efficient :)
2019-02-11T13:54:44 < dongs> i guess some 'racer' recomended them 5 years ago and they're still the rage
2019-02-11T13:55:10 < englishman> i bet it cant do this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZrw4N4xQZw
2019-02-11T13:55:20 < srk> it really depends on what you wanna do with your quad, right
2019-02-11T13:55:43 < dongs> lewl
2019-02-11T13:57:31 < srk> https://scontent-frx5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51385343_2303358213019533_370116165327912960_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-frx5-1.xx&oh=7e9428553afe984c369065c865db8598&oe=5CF8B795
2019-02-11T13:58:35 < PaulFertser> dongs: here's something innovative: jet-powered aircraft less than 115kg (so doesn't require a PPL): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cotErJ6wsxw
2019-02-11T13:59:03 < dongs> ultralight?
2019-02-11T13:59:39 < dongs> i think he meant TLV703
2019-02-11T13:59:39 < PaulFertser> dongs: yes, using jet engine for RC models :)
2019-02-11T13:59:53 < dongs> poh switching
2019-02-11T14:00:26 < englishman> that lil jet is adorable
2019-02-11T14:00:52 < dongs> TLV703
2019-02-11T14:01:33 < qyx> small switching, see TPS62825
2019-02-11T14:01:40 < qyx> a nice 1.5x1.5mm one
2019-02-11T14:01:49 < dongs> ya that thing is cool
2019-02-11T14:01:53 < qyx> approved
2019-02-11T14:01:57 < dongs> as long as you don't need > 5V Vin
2019-02-11T14:02:01 < qyx> I also tested it with a gprs modem
2019-02-11T14:02:13 < qyx> it handles all the peaks with 2x47uF ceramic caps
2019-02-11T14:02:37 < qyx> so no need for bulky 1000uF caps
2019-02-11T14:04:07 < PaulFertser> englishman: the engines are retractable so after their fuel is over (about 10 minutes) it's still a nice glider.
2019-02-11T14:04:49 < rajkosto> dongs, yooo, the official function for switching from 8bit to 16bit mode SPI doesnt even disable/reenable SPI_EN bit
2019-02-11T14:05:14 < dongs> yea y ou gotta do that
2019-02-11T14:05:18 < dongs> the docs say it
2019-02-11T14:05:22 < rajkosto> what about BIDIROE
2019-02-11T14:05:22 < dongs> the function just switches
2019-02-11T14:05:32 < rajkosto> thats also in CR1
2019-02-11T14:05:33 < dongs> dont know, i didnt need to fuck wtih that as far as i can remember
2019-02-11T14:05:37 < dongs> thats the shit for 3-wire spi
2019-02-11T14:05:41 < rajkosto> yes im doin it
2019-02-11T14:05:45 < dongs> yea no idea there
2019-02-11T14:05:50 < dongs> i tried and it looked aids
2019-02-11T14:05:52 < dongs> so i gave up
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2019-02-11T14:16:05 < rajkosto> i know that you need to disable/reenable for RXONLY mode
2019-02-11T14:16:11 < rajkosto> after the enable it immediately starts clocking forever
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2019-02-11T14:26:50 < karlp> Haohmaru: tps709 sorry...
2019-02-11T14:27:39 < karlp> in WSON
2019-02-11T14:28:06 < karlp> but yeah, if you can do switching, do it.
2019-02-11T14:31:40 < karlp> sy8088 then.
2019-02-11T14:31:43 < karlp> zypsnips approved
2019-02-11T14:32:45 < qyx> also LM3671MF-3.3
2019-02-11T14:32:59 < qyx> very low pin count, 22uA Iq, sot23-5 hand solderable
2019-02-11T14:33:13 < qyx> but it doesn't like big caps on the output
2019-02-11T14:33:35 < karlp> "regs-stepdown.txt" in zypsnips too.
2019-02-11T14:34:01 < qyx> low pin count = low external part count
2019-02-11T14:34:07 < qyx> moderate BrainDamage here
2019-02-11T14:43:05 < rajkosto> im just getting 0 or 4 from SPI1->DR read after bidiroe cleared
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2019-02-11T14:51:19 < karlp> but it's a switcher
2019-02-11T14:51:30 < karlp> you're not going to be droppign the same amount in the body....
2019-02-11T14:51:43 < dongs> sy8088 is great
2019-02-11T14:51:54 < dongs> its different layout from all the other switchers tho
2019-02-11T14:51:57 < dongs> but its cheap as shit
2019-02-11T14:57:01 < dongs> 1280/1281 are usable
2019-02-11T15:00:04 < qyx> yes, you have to look up the efficiency at a specified Vin, Vout and Iout
2019-02-11T15:00:07 < qyx> there are graphs
2019-02-11T15:00:36 < qyx> then you calculate how much power is your load and compute how much power does the switcher need to deliver it
2019-02-11T15:00:43 < qyx> the difference is the dissipated power
2019-02-11T15:01:15 < qyx> and the rest is the same
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2019-02-11T15:10:28 < basker> hello, i'm looking this board and i would like some recommendations about to know if it is a good board to use with the ad7606 and connect it to my pc using ethernet 
2019-02-11T15:10:30 < basker> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Industrial-Control-STM32F407VET6-Development-Board-RS485-Dual-CAN-Ethernet-Networking-STM32/32871711843.html?spm=a2g0s.8937460.0.0.3a0d2e0eNr1m1z
2019-02-11T15:12:31 < basker> reading the comments, i saw that this board does not has doccumentation
2019-02-11T15:17:33 < qyx> no
2019-02-11T15:17:52 < qyx> did you see %Eff graph?
2019-02-11T15:18:07 < qyx> lets say your switcher is 95% efficient at the specified Vin/Vout/Iout
2019-02-11T15:18:17 < qyx> then if you require 200mA at 3V3
2019-02-11T15:18:32 < qyx> Iin = 0.2A/0.95
2019-02-11T15:18:55 < qyx> well no
2019-02-11T15:19:04 < qyx> that applies to P, not to I
2019-02-11T15:19:17 < qyx> I am writing bullshit
2019-02-11T15:19:31 < qyx> Pin = 0.2A * 3.3V = 660mW
2019-02-11T15:19:41 < qyx> *Pout = 0.2A * 3.3V = 660mW
2019-02-11T15:19:55 < qyx> Pin = Pout / 0.95 = 695mW
2019-02-11T15:20:06 < qyx> Ptotal_loss should be 35mW in this case
2019-02-11T15:20:45 < qyx> 80% eff at those values is junk and not a switcher
2019-02-11T15:20:58 < qyx> which one?
2019-02-11T15:21:10 < qyx> AOZ1280CI?
2019-02-11T15:22:33 < qyx> DS says about 83% for Vin=5V and 0.2A
2019-02-11T15:22:51 < qyx> also thats because you selected 26Vin switcher for your 5V
2019-02-11T15:22:56 < qyx> also not synchronous
2019-02-11T15:23:33 < dongs> go for SY8088
2019-02-11T15:23:34 < qyx> voltage drop of the schottky makes considerable losses at low Vout
2019-02-11T15:23:39 < dongs> for a simple sync switcher
2019-02-11T15:23:57 < dongs> or NCP1521 if you insist on having 'murican parts
2019-02-11T15:24:02 < dongs> or LM3610
2019-02-11T15:24:11 < qyx> yeah that ncp one is ~ok
2019-02-11T15:24:21 < dongs> NCP one is pretty old and getting harder to get
2019-02-11T15:24:24 < dongs> im switching all my designs to SY
2019-02-11T15:24:34 < qyx> *was ok
2019-02-11T15:24:50 < dongs> sry LM3670
2019-02-11T15:24:58 < qyx> yeah approved
2019-02-11T15:25:01 < dongs> thats also old but works fine
2019-02-11T15:25:01 < qyx> 3671 too
2019-02-11T15:25:43 < dongs> its a chinesium part
2019-02-11T15:26:00 < dongs> but
2019-02-11T15:26:06 < dongs> its 0.05$ in 2k reels
2019-02-11T15:26:07 < dongs> :)
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2019-02-11T15:27:41 < dongs> the coils i use for that thing cost more than the switcher :(
2019-02-11T15:27:47 < dongs> they're 0.06 @ 2k
2019-02-11T15:27:57 < dongs> i could probly switch to some 0805 bead coil
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2019-02-11T15:33:20 < dongs> if your input is 5v, yes
2019-02-11T15:33:31 < dongs> and one that doesnt neeed a diode
2019-02-11T15:36:48 < rajkosto> well bidirOE is supposedly working as the other device can put stuff onto the line
2019-02-11T15:36:58 < rajkosto> but its clocking out 32bits instead of 16 after bidirOE is disabled wot
2019-02-11T15:39:43 < qyx> who was the guy with readelf/objdump
2019-02-11T15:40:08 < karlp> qyx: ecco iirc
2019-02-11T15:40:44 < qyx> I think this is very similar
2019-02-11T15:41:01 < karlp> what is?
2019-02-11T15:41:45 < qyx> Haohmaru asks for a solution, he is given multiple from different people and then it picks something unrelated again
2019-02-11T15:41:55 < dongs> fucking nigger
2019-02-11T15:43:25 < qyx> at least the NCP1529 should be usable
2019-02-11T15:43:28 < rajkosto> oh so receive works correctly, but only at prescaler 8
2019-02-11T15:43:32 < rajkosto> at 2 and 4 it gives me garbo
2019-02-11T15:43:58 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-11_14-43-56_opLL8qJMt.png
2019-02-11T15:44:13 < dongs> is that saleae noise
2019-02-11T15:44:49 < qyx> whats your SPI SCK freq at prescaler=2?
2019-02-11T15:45:25 < qyx> I would say it is much above what the LCD is able to accept if you clock the STM32 on the nominal max freq
2019-02-11T15:45:44 < rajkosto> 36
2019-02-11T15:46:00 < rajkosto> 4 is 18 and 8 is 9
2019-02-11T15:46:10 < rajkosto> the LCD is totally fine with receiving the data from the mcu
2019-02-11T15:46:23 < rajkosto> its not saleae noise its "the shittiest chinese clip on probes" noise
2019-02-11T15:46:59 < qyx> you should not be surprised then
2019-02-11T15:47:05 < rajkosto> anyway it seems that after i BIDIROE again, it re-sends what it had in the biffer
2019-02-11T15:47:09 < rajkosto> the TX buffer
2019-02-11T15:47:19 < rajkosto> so 32 clock cycles vs 16
2019-02-11T15:47:20 < qyx> theres also a clock/data phase shift on SPI
2019-02-11T15:47:46 < qyx> which may make things worse on higher SCK freq
2019-02-11T15:48:07 < rajkosto> it should always receive at opposite edge it sends at, no ?
2019-02-11T15:48:11 < rajkosto> only mode 0 and 3 work
2019-02-11T15:48:14 < rajkosto> same results on either
2019-02-11T15:49:34 < qyx> yes but your wires are not ideal, they are not zero length and the drivers on both ends do not have instant rise/fall time
2019-02-11T15:50:06 < rajkosto> lol pretty sure i had 100MHz over pure garbage longest possible wires before
2019-02-11T15:50:24 < rajkosto> maybe i need to mess with CPHA when switching between receive and send mode
2019-02-11T15:51:35 < qyx> then run your SPI LCD breakout multimegaherts fast and be surprised
2019-02-11T15:52:18 < rajkosto> it might not be SPI compliant and sends on the same edge it receives
2019-02-11T15:52:57 < qyx> whats the LCD btw?
2019-02-11T15:53:06 < dongs> that chinese trash he linked several times
2019-02-11T15:53:10 < rajkosto> ST7789
2019-02-11T15:53:12 < dongs> with CS that was perm tied down
2019-02-11T15:53:14 < rajkosto> is the datasheet you need
2019-02-11T15:53:18 < rajkosto> dongs, NO LONGER TIED DOWN
2019-02-11T15:53:25 < rajkosto> can now move my body freeerrryy
2019-02-11T15:54:16 < rajkosto> needs to not be tied down for receiving to work
2019-02-11T15:54:38 < rajkosto> as cs high is how it resets back
2019-02-11T15:55:14 < dongs> why are you reading shit back from the lcd
2019-02-11T15:55:19 < rajkosto> SCANLINE NUMBER
2019-02-11T15:55:21 < dongs> isnt that usually slow and shitty
2019-02-11T15:55:29 < dongs> for your tearing trash?
2019-02-11T15:55:32 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-11T15:55:35 < dongs> goodluck
2019-02-11T15:56:18 < qyx> dod you even read the datasheet you listed?
2019-02-11T15:56:23 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-11T15:56:38 < qyx> and did you see 150ns clock cycle during read (SPI)?
2019-02-11T15:56:52 < rajkosto> where this
2019-02-11T15:56:57 < dongs> luls
2019-02-11T15:57:02 < qyx> fuk you are raging about everything
2019-02-11T15:57:06 < qyx> all day long
2019-02-11T15:57:27 < qyx> thats the first thing you should read in the SPI interface characteristics
2019-02-11T15:57:56 < rajkosto> i just search for the command hex
2019-02-11T15:57:56 < qyx> before you start awesoming your clock at a speed of light rate
2019-02-11T15:58:35 < dongs>  < dongs> isnt that usually slow and shitty
2019-02-11T15:58:38 < dongs> ^
2019-02-11T15:58:39 < dongs> truth
2019-02-11T15:58:52 < rajkosto> im not doing anything wrong then, it just sucks
2019-02-11T15:59:07 < qyx> you are
2019-02-11T15:59:24 < qyx> if they say 150ns SCK period, you have to have such period
2019-02-11T15:59:30 < qyx> and not 1/36MHz
2019-02-11T15:59:47 < rajkosto> i didnt think read and write clocks would be different
2019-02-11T15:59:55 < dongs> they generally are
2019-02-11T15:59:55 < qyx> they are not that different
2019-02-11T15:59:59 < dongs> sensors too
2019-02-11T15:59:59 < qyx> read is 66ns
2019-02-11T16:00:10 < rajkosto> its fine ill just slow it down while trolling for scanlines
2019-02-11T16:00:12 < dongs> register write speed is liek 1mhz, register read speed could be up to 10mhz
2019-02-11T16:00:17 < qyx> which is not 36MHz neither
2019-02-11T16:00:37 < dongs> qyx, wat
2019-02-11T16:00:40 < dongs> thats just period
2019-02-11T16:00:51 < dongs> err
2019-02-11T16:00:52 < dongs> duty
2019-02-11T16:00:54 < qyx> yeah the minimum SCK period
2019-02-11T16:00:59 < dongs> saying that it should be close to 50/50 or wahtever
2019-02-11T16:01:14 < qyx> T SCYCW and T SCYCR
2019-02-11T16:01:21 < qyx> they call it Serial clock cycle (Write)
2019-02-11T16:01:29 < dongs> rite
2019-02-11T16:02:04 < rajkosto> write is 62.5MHz read is 6.66MHz
2019-02-11T16:02:07 < rajkosto> quite a discrepancy
2019-02-11T16:02:15 < qyx> 62MHz?
2019-02-11T16:02:35 < rajkosto> limits for the ST7789 from the datasheet
2019-02-11T16:03:10 < qyx> where did you get that number?
2019-02-11T16:03:34 < rajkosto> convert 16ns and 150ns to MHz ?
2019-02-11T16:03:59 < qyx> 16ns?
2019-02-11T16:04:16 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-11_15-04-14_56obiNHq5.png
2019-02-11T16:04:48 < dongs> sounds about right
2019-02-11T16:05:53 < qyx> I seewhich revision do you have?
2019-02-11T16:06:01 < rajkosto> https://www.rhydolabz.com/documents/33/ST7789.pdf
2019-02-11T16:06:50 < qyx> mhm your is ST7789VW, I did read ST7789V
2019-02-11T16:06:51 < rajkosto> also when was i raging
2019-02-11T16:07:20 < qyx> because I have 66ns for writing and 150ns for reading
2019-02-11T16:08:56 < qyx> in either case, read is slow
2019-02-11T16:10:26 < dongs> yeah 60mhz does sound a bit extreme for a garbage chinq lcd
2019-02-11T16:10:38 < dongs> maybe thats the speceial export to murica version
2019-02-11T16:10:44 < dongs> chinks get the garbage one
2019-02-11T16:10:53 < dongs> i wouldnt bother doing it > 66ns heh
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2019-02-11T16:11:58 < dongs> ragedkosto
2019-02-11T16:14:26 < kakimir> kosto = revenge
2019-02-11T16:16:16 < kakimir> funlandish
2019-02-11T16:17:52 < qyx> here too
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2019-02-11T16:22:52 < Ecco> hi :)
2019-02-11T16:23:04 < Ecco> Altium gives me an "unrouted net error" with… nothing!
2019-02-11T16:23:19 < Ecco> It tells me a ground pad shall be connected to "something" that's outside of the board
2019-02-11T16:23:28 < Ecco> How can I fix this shit? :-D
2019-02-11T16:23:43 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/QuNDRgN.png so fucking sick of this shit in 19
2019-02-11T16:23:53 < dongs> the routing is so fucking retarded holy shit
2019-02-11T16:24:16 < dongs> it does all the dumb fucking worst decisions
2019-02-11T16:24:35 < rajkosto> so turning off gloss didnt help ?
2019-02-11T16:25:05 < dongs> gloss fixed other obnoxious trash
2019-02-11T16:25:22 < rajkosto> are you SURE youre in the same mode (hugnpush etc) as your previous altium versions
2019-02-11T16:25:28 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-11T16:28:18 < qyx> they use half-bridge output stage instead of the schottky to the ground
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2019-02-11T16:29:24 < Rajko> freenode server why you do
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2019-02-11T16:31:48 < qyx> so they are more efficient when the resistive&switching losses are smaller than a diode forward losses
2019-02-11T16:32:07 < qyx> which is the case for very small output voltages
2019-02-11T16:34:53 < dongs> god fucking damn
2019-02-11T16:34:59 < dongs> why do apps have this fucking TILE WINDOWS shit
2019-02-11T16:35:07 < dongs> WHO ACTUALLY EVER USES THAT
2019-02-11T16:36:04 < dongs> ......................................
2019-02-11T16:36:08 < dongs> holy shit fucking altium
2019-02-11T16:36:16 < dongs> Window -> Close All
2019-02-11T16:36:20 < dongs> doesnt just close ALL OPEN WINDOWS
2019-02-11T16:36:25 < dongs> it fucking closes all open PROJECTS as well
2019-02-11T16:36:29 < dongs> what the ACTUAL FUCK
2019-02-11T16:39:20 < kakimir> altidum
2019-02-11T16:39:27 < kakimir> try kicad
2019-02-11T16:39:43 < kakimir> no tile bullshit
2019-02-11T16:39:51 < kakimir> just one responsive window at the time
2019-02-11T16:51:02 < kakimir> systick as wakeup source
2019-02-11T16:51:43 < kakimir> first set reload value, then enable timer, go to sleep, systick int and then disable systick?
2019-02-11T16:57:00 < kakimir> can it be so simple
2019-02-11T16:59:06 < Ecco> Seriously though, how do I get rid of that bug?
2019-02-11T16:59:11 < Ecco> I can't run DRC anymore :(
2019-02-11T16:59:29 < karlp> rigid flex is looking realllly appealing
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2019-02-11T17:03:24 < karlp> how important are hard gold for pcb edge connectors?
2019-02-11T17:06:01 < karlp> seems you need hard gold plating for "repeated connections" but I wonder how many that means
2019-02-11T17:10:21 < karlp> yeah, but like 5, or like 500
2019-02-11T17:13:45  * qyx is interested too
2019-02-11T17:14:49 < qyx> karlp: doing DIN bus connectors?
2019-02-11T17:15:31 < karlp> hrm?
2019-02-11T17:15:50 < karlp> internal connectors for submoudles, but yeha, all goes on a din rail sure.
2019-02-11T17:16:03 < karlp> http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2015-February/004289.html seems useful
2019-02-11T17:16:07 < karlp> enig ok for ~5
2019-02-11T17:16:29 < qyx> https://whitebream.nl/images/projects/offgrid-dinrail-t-bus.jpg
2019-02-11T17:16:37 < qyx> I did this once
2019-02-11T17:18:26 < srk> qyx: do you have any writeup bout that offgrid project?
2019-02-11T17:18:45 < srk> found
2019-02-11T17:19:37 < zyp> karlp, if it's an internal connector that's only ever gonna be plugged in once, ENIG is probably perfectly fine
2019-02-11T17:20:58 < qyx> srk: it is not my page
2019-02-11T17:21:11 < karlp> zyp: yeah, that's what I'd... think, but not sure whether that's legit or not.
2019-02-11T17:21:18 < srk> The OGS control® bus is a proprietary communications layer on top of standard 1Mbps 11-bit CAN. We have extended the standard CAN functionality with node identification, firmware update, file transfer, bus conflict detection and watchdog features. This bus is used to communicate with up to 127 option modules.
2019-02-11T17:21:23 < srk> just use canopen lulz
2019-02-11T17:21:28 < karlp> still curious about rigidflex.  build it once, test it all in a single flat piece.
2019-02-11T17:21:44 < karlp> but plugs and probably easier for reallllly doing it.
2019-02-11T17:21:49  * karlp should not get distracted
2019-02-11T17:22:11 < zyp> rigidflex would be fun
2019-02-11T17:22:25 < karlp> qyx: yeah, see a few products putting comms/power down the channel.
2019-02-11T17:24:24 < karlp> canadaistan people, who the hell is myro? http://www.myropcb.com/online-quote/fpc-quote/
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2019-02-11T17:27:56 < karlp> rigidflex makes it harder to shop out pieces to people without the full picture
2019-02-11T17:27:58 < kakimir> I don't see any interrupt handlers anywhere
2019-02-11T17:28:06 < kakimir> those extern blah
2019-02-11T17:28:15 < kakimir> where those usually reside?
2019-02-11T17:32:50 < dongs> polygon manager got its own idiotic sidebar
2019-02-11T17:32:51 < dongs> fucking RIP
2019-02-11T17:37:02 < kakimir> newlib
2019-02-11T17:37:07 < kakimir> howe does this work
2019-02-11T17:37:31 < kakimir> where is my start file for lib that has interrupt vectors and shiet
2019-02-11T17:37:47 < kakimir> in code red there is cr_startup something
2019-02-11T17:39:52 < PaulFertser> kakimir: newlib has its own cortex-m startup, and it's kinda usable iirc but for some reason neither libopencm3 nor ST are using it.
2019-02-11T17:40:09 < kakimir> how do I create handlers?
2019-02-11T17:43:01 < kakimir> in code red you just redefine the function
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2019-02-11T17:43:38 < dongs> opensores reinventing the wheel
2019-02-11T17:43:42 < dongs> what a shocking development
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2019-02-11T17:44:33 < kakimir> I cannot see vector table, I cannot see function prototypes or defines for any handlers
2019-02-11T17:45:45 < kakimir> literally everyone here uses newlib
2019-02-11T17:45:55 < PaulFertser> kakimir: what exactly are you tragetting, libopencm3?
2019-02-11T17:46:14 < PaulFertser> kakimir: or are you doing something really plain, without any support libraries and CMSIS even?
2019-02-11T17:46:21 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-11T17:46:26 < kakimir> I have CMSIS
2019-02-11T17:46:35 < kakimir> and xmc api
2019-02-11T17:46:39 < kakimir> really low level
2019-02-11T17:46:43 < kakimir> and newlib is there
2019-02-11T17:47:28 < kakimir> luckily my code has only one interrupt
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2019-02-11T17:50:51 < karlp> PaulFertser: linke to newlib startup? it's possibly just tht it wasn't available/documented "back in the day" ?
2019-02-11T17:57:57 < karlp> if you mean this, I'm not sure why I'd want to work with it: https://github.com/bminor/newlib/blob/master/newlib/libc/sys/arm/crt0.S
2019-02-11T17:58:45 < dongs>  /*  Workspace for Angel calls.  */
2019-02-11T17:58:45 < dongs> wat
2019-02-11T18:06:06 < kakimir> I had startup directory in my projectspace but I was blind
2019-02-11T18:07:55 < kakimir> it was just the directory structure that fooled me
2019-02-11T18:08:12 < kakimir> I was expecting to find it in newlib directory
2019-02-11T18:08:15 < PaulFertser> kakimir: karlp: so I figure newlib by default is using elf-redboot linker script, and that doesn't have any interrupt table for obvious reasons.
2019-02-11T18:09:03 < kakimir> I have startup_XMC1100.S
2019-02-11T18:09:33 < PaulFertser> kakimir: the ld script is what's important.
2019-02-11T18:10:56 < kakimir> okay
2019-02-11T18:11:07 < kakimir> I let the IDE magic do it for me
2019-02-11T18:19:30 < karlp> PaulFertser: so.... you still have to do your own things anwyay?
2019-02-11T18:21:35 < kakimir> why is value 0 loaded to sys tick val?
2019-02-11T18:21:51 < kakimir> not the reload value?
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2019-02-11T18:32:38 < PaulFertser> karlp: obviously, and libopencm3 does it nicely afaict.
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2019-02-11T19:18:19 < aandrew> dongs: https://i.imgur.com/KNsfvvP.jpg
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2019-02-11T19:22:27 < englishman> karlp: rigidflex is super great and not as expensive as you think when it comes to total savings
2019-02-11T19:22:37 < mawk> rigidflex
2019-02-11T19:22:37 < mawk> lol
2019-02-11T19:22:46 < englishman> what's so funny
2019-02-11T19:22:52 < mawk> hotcold
2019-02-11T19:23:09 < englishman> like a peltier
2019-02-11T19:24:07 < mawk> rigidflex makes me think of flexiscurity, the name of an employement reform to make employees more flexible (i.e. more easy to fire)
2019-02-11T19:24:15 < mawk> and they called it like that to make think it adds employement security
2019-02-11T19:24:29 < mawk> flexisecurity
2019-02-11T19:25:57 < mawk> https://rigid-flex.com/
2019-02-11T19:26:11 < mawk> they should fire the web designer
2019-02-11T19:27:34 < kakimir> oh wow
2019-02-11T19:27:40 < kakimir> I did deep sleeps
2019-02-11T19:27:52 < Steffanx> congratz
2019-02-11T19:28:03 < kakimir> new chip and at first try it works just how it should
2019-02-11T19:28:27 < kakimir> totally effortless compared to lpc11xx
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2019-02-11T19:29:00 < kakimir> no fiddle with clocks, no fiddle with timer output to pin and match registers
2019-02-11T19:30:37 < kakimir> imagine that you need to set up timer to output compare match to GPIO that causes start logic to generate interrupt
2019-02-11T19:31:01 < kakimir> and before and after you need to switch clock sources by hand
2019-02-11T19:31:24 < Steffanx> but in the end you have no clue whats going on
2019-02-11T19:32:25 < kakimir> I'm a bit worried if my 32bit timer is running from standby clock when this thing is sleeping
2019-02-11T19:32:37 < kakimir> and how to correctly halt it
2019-02-11T19:33:05 < kakimir> there is just a ton of run bits and clock gatings
2019-02-11T19:35:21 < mawk> my kvm "works"
2019-02-11T19:35:41 < mawk> it's the first time I'm happy to see a kernel panic: https://asciinema.org/a/96Evs181wElVs68L2PsUBcyJ3
2019-02-11T19:35:58 < kakimir> I think it's the case - 32bit timer is still running
2019-02-11T19:36:09 < kakimir> from main clock that is changed to 32khz
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2019-02-11T19:40:24 < kakimir> let's read the papyrus
2019-02-11T19:44:03 < kakimir> If I knew I would just disable gating of clock to timer
2019-02-11T19:44:17 < kakimir> but idk. if it has any bad effects
2019-02-11T19:48:43 < kakimir> yes definitelly error in timer value is in function of sleep time
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2019-02-11T19:59:26 < kakimir> I just stop the slices and prescaller
2019-02-11T19:59:29 < kakimir> should be okey
2019-02-11T20:04:38 < antto> OM NOM.. big wafer
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2019-02-11T21:09:15 < Steffanx> stroop waffle you mean antto?
2019-02-11T21:10:39 < kakimir> vohveli
2019-02-11T21:11:31 -!- hexo_ is now known as plytkejsie
2019-02-11T21:21:05 < jpa-> siirappivohveli with sma strösseli
2019-02-11T21:23:32 < kakimir> SMA jelly
2019-02-11T21:23:37 < kakimir> my favourite flavour
2019-02-11T21:25:38 < kakimir> bicycle guise - what rating of oil put in my fork?
2019-02-11T21:25:59 < jpa-> why are you putting oil in your fork?
2019-02-11T21:28:55 < kakimir> oh this manual says
2019-02-11T21:29:02 < kakimir> 5w and 15w
2019-02-11T21:29:13 < jpa-> 5 watt oil
2019-02-11T21:30:32 < kakimir> and 15w
2019-02-11T21:56:21 < kakimir> https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2019/02/11/8453622221592250.mp4 magic?
2019-02-11T21:56:32 < kakimir> it's like watching a magic trick
2019-02-11T21:57:40 < Steffanx> and he finds a new customer in kakimir
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2019-02-11T21:59:08 < Steffanx> Are you easily fooled kakimir?
2019-02-11T22:00:01 < kakimir> guess
2019-02-11T22:01:25 < sYCH3L> https://paste2.org/HnIyMYfF can somebody help me with this, i dont quite understand why MDK-arm is acting up with this inline asm
2019-02-11T22:02:35 < Steffanx> Dongs we have a keil user ^
2019-02-11T22:02:53 < sYCH3L> :D :D 
2019-02-11T22:03:32 < sYCH3L> Steffanx: why do you not like keil?
2019-02-11T22:03:54 < zyp> that looks like gcc inline assembly syntax with constraints and stuff
2019-02-11T22:03:56 < Steffanx> i think it doesnt like your gcc syntax sYCH3L. Where did you get that inline assemly stuff?
2019-02-11T22:04:04 < zyp> I don't think that's gonna work with keil at all
2019-02-11T22:04:15 < zyp> hmm, unless the new clang based armcc will eat it
2019-02-11T22:04:33 < jpa-> is that "464" supposed to be there?
2019-02-11T22:04:54 < sYCH3L> thats the line number where the error occured
2019-02-11T22:04:54 < zyp> also, fuck doing a busywait in assembly
2019-02-11T22:05:03 < zyp> just write it in C
2019-02-11T22:05:18 < Steffanx> but also on line 8 sYCH3L?
2019-02-11T22:05:26 < zyp> volatile int dicks = 1000000; while(dicks--); done
2019-02-11T22:05:43 < sYCH3L> Steffanx: well yes. 
2019-02-11T22:05:51 < Steffanx> you added it?
2019-02-11T22:05:54 < sYCH3L> zyp: i need a microsecond delay on stm32f0
2019-02-11T22:05:57 < zyp> if you actually need accurate timing, use a timer
2019-02-11T22:06:05 < Steffanx> or count cycles.
2019-02-11T22:06:14 < zyp> a cycle counter is a timer :p
2019-02-11T22:06:18 < Steffanx> Naaah
2019-02-11T22:06:30 < zyp> or alternatively a timer is a cycle counter
2019-02-11T22:06:42 < Steffanx> Thats more accurate i think
2019-02-11T22:06:57 < zyp> same same
2019-02-11T22:18:45 < PaulFertser> kakimir: fork oil viscosity is not the same as engine oil viscosity, it's a different unit. Usually 5Wt but it's winter so you probably want even thinner.
2019-02-11T22:19:13 < zyp> fork oil?
2019-02-11T22:19:20 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-11T22:19:44 < kakimir> but yeah
2019-02-11T22:19:48 < kakimir> winter is once a year
2019-02-11T22:20:29 < PaulFertser> zyp: yes, it's the same with any dampers, they use special oil.
2019-02-11T22:20:56 < jpa-> so this is for fork springs/dampers, not the rotation bearings?
2019-02-11T22:20:57 < sYCH3L> Assembly is more accurate than timer :D
2019-02-11T22:21:00 < jpa-> explains a lot
2019-02-11T22:21:21 < PaulFertser> kakimir: the recommended oil probably depends on your rebound adjustment limits.
2019-02-11T22:22:08 < PaulFertser> jpa-: springs is another topic, oil is for hydraulic dampers only I think. At least that's what I thought kakimir was talking about.
2019-02-11T22:22:21 < jpa-> ok
2019-02-11T22:22:51 < PaulFertser> I would guess most regular bicycle forks are using "air springs" these days.
2019-02-11T22:23:48 < zyp> sYCH3L, no, it's not
2019-02-11T22:24:05 < zyp> sYCH3L, instruction timing is nondeterministic
2019-02-11T22:25:24 < jpa-> and that's already before you start having interrupts or dma
2019-02-11T22:25:34 < zyp> yes
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2019-02-11T22:29:06 < karlp> keil user, they know better though...
2019-02-11T22:30:37 < sYCH3L> karlp: .. :D 
2019-02-11T22:35:57 < catphish> morning
2019-02-11T22:43:20 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2019-02-11T22:44:06 < zoobab> @karlp btw found some libusb code for the ch341a gpios ...
2019-02-11T22:49:58 < sYCH3L> okay fuck keil, can somebody suggest something better other than eclipse
2019-02-11T22:50:20 < sYCH3L> i was thinking qtcreator and baremetal
2019-02-11T22:52:00 < Ultrasauce> a text editor
2019-02-11T23:02:48 < zyp> I prefer vim
2019-02-11T23:02:55 < Steffanx> emacs ate
2019-02-11T23:02:56 < Steffanx> mate
2019-02-11T23:03:05 < zyp> vscode with a vim plugin is also okay
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2019-02-11T23:24:41 < antto> Steffanx no, just dark chocolate wafer
2019-02-11T23:25:10 < antto> hyper wafer
2019-02-11T23:25:28 < antto> muchos grande wafer
2019-02-11T23:30:09 < Steffanx> waffle mate
2019-02-11T23:30:21 < antto> it says wafer on it
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2019-02-11T23:31:16 < Steffanx> its fake.
2019-02-11T23:33:47 < antto> http://www.prestige96.bg/uploads/products/images/photo_big_en_26.jpg
2019-02-11T23:33:50 < antto> iz real
2019-02-11T23:34:43 < antto> 55 grams
2019-02-11T23:34:59 < Steffanx> ah the bulgarian ware
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2019-02-11T23:55:22 < qyx> https://i.imgur.com/4gdt2uE.png
2019-02-11T23:55:27 < qyx> my first kicad board
2019-02-11T23:55:37 < qyx> it went surprisingly well so far
2019-02-11T23:56:10 < zyp> nice refdes on the silk
2019-02-11T23:56:35 < zyp> what sort of connector is X1?
2019-02-11T23:56:46 < qyx> harting harflex
2019-02-11T23:58:26 < qyx> actually I am thinking about replacing them before it is too late
2019-02-11T23:58:46 < qyx> I have ~tens of such boards in testing, different kinds
2019-02-11T23:59:00 < qyx> and I fear that there will be no alternative one day
2019-02-11T23:59:26 < qyx> also they are quite expensive, around 2.50€
2019-02-11T23:59:56 < Ultrasauce> i see an error
--- Day changed Tue Feb 12 2019
2019-02-12T00:00:02 < Ultrasauce> there are still some pads left uncovered by silkscreen
2019-02-12T00:00:04 < kakimir> qyx: kicad?
2019-02-12T00:01:33 < qyx> y
2019-02-12T00:01:57 < kakimir> how did you end up trying it?
2019-02-12T00:02:09 < kakimir> curiosity?
2019-02-12T00:02:37 < zyp> need to check why everybody is hating it so much :p
2019-02-12T00:03:00 < kakimir> everybody as in the loudest ones*
2019-02-12T00:05:52 < kakimir> I think kicad has become more a norm.. it is okay to try or use it without any explanation
2019-02-12T00:06:39 < aandrew> qyx: what's x1?
2019-02-12T00:06:49 < qyx> 22:56 < qyx> harting harflex
2019-02-12T00:06:50 < aandrew> oh haha zyp already asked
2019-02-12T00:07:12 < kakimir> recover that flying mlcc
2019-02-12T00:07:27 < qyx> it waits for a PDM mic
2019-02-12T00:07:34 < qyx> no footprint for it yet
2019-02-12T00:07:50 < aandrew> I've used those before
2019-02-12T00:07:52 < aandrew> not bad connectors
2019-02-12T00:07:56 < kakimir> mems mic?
2019-02-12T00:08:05 < qyx> yeah but china does not have them
2019-02-12T00:08:12 < qyx> erni makes compatible ones though
2019-02-12T00:08:29 < qyx> but both are so industrial, much $$$
2019-02-12T00:08:31 < kakimir> I saw a desk in shenghen market of local mems company
2019-02-12T00:08:50 < kakimir> just shitloads of different types of mems stuff
2019-02-12T00:08:59 < qyx> I meant connectors
2019-02-12T00:08:59 < kakimir> oscillators, mics everything
2019-02-12T00:09:07 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-12T00:16:22 < antto> qyx when you're at the point of fixing the refdes - select F.SilkS layer, and press H
2019-02-12T00:18:36 < qyx> it dims other layers?
2019-02-12T00:18:55 < qyx> good, ty
2019-02-12T00:19:53 < antto> high-contrast mode - the current layer is accentuated visually, and you can only select stuff on that layer (gud, since you wanna move teh textz)
2019-02-12T00:20:47 < antto> then you do the same for the other layers (now there's the flip-board feature which makes it easy for the back side)
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2019-02-12T00:55:10 < kakimir> b ctrl-b h v routine
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2019-02-12T01:33:25 < dongs> aandrew: lol
2019-02-12T01:35:43 < englishman> dongs: new gaydeon card doesnt support UEFI
2019-02-12T01:36:21 < englishman> no secure boot by installing AMD HARDWARE
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2019-02-12T01:48:44 < kakimir> movie recommds: Mute
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2019-02-12T02:02:35 < dongs> englishman: what, no way
2019-02-12T02:02:42 < englishman> ya
2019-02-12T02:04:44 < dongs> https://www.techpowerup.com/252476/amd-radeon-vii-has-no-uefi-support haha
2019-02-12T02:05:13 < englishman> gj
2019-02-12T02:10:44 < Cracki> howww
2019-02-12T02:11:03 < Cracki> do they test their stuff at all during development?
2019-02-12T02:11:11 < dongs> no, they all run lunix
2019-02-12T02:11:16 < dongs> and lunix requires disabling secure boot to operate
2019-02-12T02:11:21 < dongs> because its insecure garbage
2019-02-12T02:11:25 < Cracki> oh well
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2019-02-12T02:14:11 < qyx> do I understand correctly that if USB is the only source of power for the device, I can safely omit vbus detection?
2019-02-12T02:16:10 < dongs> for sure, what else would you need it for
2019-02-12T02:16:18 < dongs> what is vbus detection? the extra pin on F4/whatever?
2019-02-12T02:16:24 < dongs> thats for OTG or someshit anyway
2019-02-12T02:16:39 < qyx> idk I am USB noob
2019-02-12T02:17:00 < qyx> yes the vbus pin
2019-02-12T02:17:09 < dongs> ya pretty sure thats for otg
2019-02-12T02:17:16 < dongs> when you decide if voltage is coming in or out
2019-02-12T02:17:44 < zyp> no
2019-02-12T02:18:05 < dongs> wel, zyp would know for sure :)
2019-02-12T02:19:02 < zyp> I'm not sure what the exact purpose of vbus detection is, I think it's sort of a mix between power saving and avoiding powering unconnected data lines
2019-02-12T02:19:02 < rajkosto> vbus detection is so that if you are self powered
2019-02-12T02:19:12 < zyp> but in either case you don't need it
2019-02-12T02:19:18 < qyx> on L432 there is no such thing
2019-02-12T02:19:18 < rajkosto> you can sleep the usb core or the entire chip
2019-02-12T02:19:20 < rajkosto> if its not plugged in
2019-02-12T02:19:28 < qyx> but there is a USB_NOE pin instead
2019-02-12T02:19:29 < qyx> wtf
2019-02-12T02:20:30 < qyx> The
2019-02-12T02:20:30 < qyx> output enable control signal of the analog transceiver (active low) is provided externally
2019-02-12T02:20:33 < qyx> on USB_NOE. It can be used to drive some activity LED or to provide information about
2019-02-12T02:20:41 < qyx> .. ok
2019-02-12T02:21:34 < zyp> L432 is device only, not OTG?
2019-02-12T02:21:57 < qyx> so in a self-powered scenario, how the peripheral know it was connected to the host to start enumeration?
2019-02-12T02:22:14 < qyx> Universal serial bus full-speed device interface (USB)
2019-02-12T02:22:29 < zyp> the device only core doesn't have any concept of vbus sensing, only parts with dwc_otg does
2019-02-12T02:22:58 < zyp> but that's not inherently because of OTG, it's just that dwc_otg has a ton of extra features in general
2019-02-12T02:23:11 < zyp> qyx, also, it doesn't
2019-02-12T02:23:55 < qyx> I'll just wire DP/DM then
2019-02-12T02:24:11 < zyp> enumeration starts when host detects the DP pullup and issues a reset
2019-02-12T02:24:35 < zyp> device would see SOF tokens starting to arrive when the bus goes live, and then a bus reset from the host
2019-02-12T02:25:47 < qyx> it has an internal pullup, so it should be enough
2019-02-12T02:25:54 < zyp> yup
2019-02-12T02:26:00 < qyx> k, thx
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2019-02-12T09:58:15 < kakimir> it's the standard
2019-02-12T10:03:34 < kakimir> go ahead
2019-02-12T10:03:47 < kakimir> but.. what is there to autism about stupid regulators?
2019-02-12T10:04:43 < kakimir> and?
2019-02-12T10:06:02 < kakimir> what input voltage?
2019-02-12T10:06:05 < kakimir> what amperes?
2019-02-12T10:06:39 < kakimir> tell me
2019-02-12T10:07:06 < kakimir> what input voltage
2019-02-12T10:07:37 < kakimir> how much current?
2019-02-12T10:10:50 < kakimir> get a small switcher?
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2019-02-12T10:11:57 < dongs> christ just slap a fucking LM1117 in SOT223
2019-02-12T10:11:58 < dongs> done
2019-02-12T10:12:04 < dongs> why are you wasting time
2019-02-12T10:12:09 < kakimir> autisming
2019-02-12T10:13:21 < kakimir> maybe you could try someting like TLV702 in WSON package
2019-02-12T10:13:23 < kakimir> but
2019-02-12T10:13:32 < dongs> 706
2019-02-12T10:13:39 < kakimir> or that
2019-02-12T10:13:44 < dongs> we already went through all those recomendatyions yesterday
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2019-02-12T10:13:55 < dongs> hes just literally wasting everyones time right now
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2019-02-12T10:14:28 < kakimir> wson has pretty nice W/C
2019-02-12T10:14:39 < kakimir> but it won't help if board it packed
2019-02-12T10:17:28 < kakimir> big wson - that 1.5mm pack doesn't have a chance
2019-02-12T10:18:17 < kakimir> tps706 junction to board thermal resistance: 42.6C/W
2019-02-12T10:20:16 < kakimir> what were the size parameters?
2019-02-12T10:20:28 < kakimir> texas has 3x3 SON packages too
2019-02-12T10:22:39 < kakimir> https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tps732.pdf 
2019-02-12T10:23:12 < kakimir> for some reason this SON has higher junction to board than smaller wson in tps706 to say
2019-02-12T10:23:49 < kakimir> I don't undestand.. it's bigger and has exposed pad
2019-02-12T10:29:10 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-12T10:29:25 < kakimir> capacitor-free optionally
2019-02-12T10:42:53 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-12T10:42:55 < kakimir> in output
2019-02-12T10:43:28 < kakimir> how come board area is so restrained?
2019-02-12T10:43:35 < kakimir> Haohmaru: 
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2019-02-12T11:05:28 < kakimir> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/cakeism
2019-02-12T11:22:00 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEj6pNGRcYU musics
2019-02-12T11:23:59 < kakimir> oh wow
2019-02-12T11:24:04 < kakimir> dongs is psytrancer
2019-02-12T11:37:33 < karlp> zoobab: there's been code to manually do things with ch341 for ages, for all sorts of things, the problem was that none of it was ever getting into the kernel drivers
2019-02-12T11:37:53 < karlp> I've got ~zero interest in using libusb to toggle gpios on a ch341 anyway.
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2019-02-12T11:45:50 < qyx> mhm kicad marks power input pins as not driven when they are connected to the source through a ferrite bead
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2019-02-12T12:09:38 < Thorn> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ng0zQO6Xrmk
2019-02-12T12:16:28 < jpa-> qyx: yeah, time for power flags
2019-02-12T12:16:47 < jpa-> i don't like that feature much, it's kind of useful but not useful enough to be worth the trouble
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2019-02-12T12:23:36 < kakimir> Haohmaru: usually you cannot change the functinality
2019-02-12T12:23:53 < kakimir> when you set EN to passive state it discharges the output
2019-02-12T12:25:40 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-12T12:25:48 < kakimir> external load resistor
2019-02-12T12:25:51 < kakimir> I see
2019-02-12T12:26:30 < kakimir> nope
2019-02-12T12:26:45 < kakimir> see diagram 8.2
2019-02-12T12:26:48 < kakimir> no chance
2019-02-12T12:26:58 < kakimir> it sips those electrons with 100ohm load
2019-02-12T12:27:45 < kakimir> The LP5912 output employs an internal 100-Ω (typical) pulldown resistance to discharge the output when the EN
2019-02-12T12:27:48 < kakimir> pin is low. Note that if the LP5912 EN pin is low (the device is OFF) and the OUT pin is held high by a secondary
2019-02-12T12:27:51 < kakimir> supply, current flows from the secondary supply through the automatic discharge pulldown resistor to ground.
2019-02-12T12:28:43 < kakimir> no problem
2019-02-12T12:28:48 < kakimir> just keep en pin high
2019-02-12T12:29:08 < kakimir> off threshold is 0.3V
2019-02-12T12:29:16 < kakimir> you mcu has browned out long before that
2019-02-12T12:29:54 < kakimir> just figure it out
2019-02-12T12:30:43 < kakimir> how about diodes instead of resistors
2019-02-12T12:31:59 < kakimir> "sot23 dual diode"
2019-02-12T12:32:16 < kakimir> oh via regulator
2019-02-12T12:33:08 < kakimir> The LP5912 input is protected against reverse current when output voltage is higher than the input.
2019-02-12T12:33:39 < kakimir> but
2019-02-12T12:33:50 < kakimir> it turns off the regulator and activates pulldown
2019-02-12T12:33:58 < kakimir> 8.3.3
2019-02-12T12:39:32 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-12T12:39:45 < kakimir> you want reverse protection
2019-02-12T12:39:51 < kakimir> but not that pulldown thing
2019-02-12T12:40:18 < kakimir> some MCUs do not like slow transients in low voltages
2019-02-12T12:40:22 < kakimir> or all of them
2019-02-12T12:40:51 < kakimir> at least it needs to go up within certain rate when it's started
2019-02-12T12:42:01 < kakimir> idk. but I have seen the specs and some errata mentions of chips not reseting right even outside the rising VDD spec
2019-02-12T12:44:52 < jpa-> STM32 RTC sometimes resets if VDD falls too slowly
2019-02-12T12:45:14 < kakimir> within operating voltage range?
2019-02-12T12:45:38 < jpa-> outside it, i'd assume; but i haven't fully characterized it, as it is pretty random
2019-02-12T12:46:02 < kakimir> xmc1100 has all kind of fancy monitors for voltages and oscillators
2019-02-12T12:46:21 < kakimir> I didn't know monitoring oscillators is a thing
2019-02-12T12:46:30 < jpa-> IIRC STM32 datasheet allows slow fall times, but it didn't work for me
2019-02-12T12:46:38 < kakimir> how slow?
2019-02-12T12:47:47 < jpa-> "infinite" says STM32F407 datasheet, but 470µF cap with no load was too slow
2019-02-12T12:48:27 < jpa-> it fell quite fast until STM32 went into low voltage reset, then it kept floating there and that was probably what annoyed the RTC
2019-02-12T12:50:29 < kakimir> when did RTC reset?
2019-02-12T12:50:35 < kakimir> at what phase?
2019-02-12T12:53:04 < jpa-> i don't know
2019-02-12T12:53:37 < jpa-> it was just that randomly when you shut the device down and later turned back on, RTC time was lost. And adding 1kohm pull-down on the 3.3V line fixed it
2019-02-12T12:54:15 < kakimir> rtc supply?
2019-02-12T12:55:47 < jpa-> http://xob.kapsi.fi/~jpa/stm32/2013-02.log  details here around 2013-02-04
2019-02-12T12:55:58 < jpa-> apparently i tracked it down further by monitoring when rtc oscillator stops
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2019-02-12T13:04:38 < kakimir> why wouldn't it?
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2019-02-12T13:08:12 < kakimir> will it?
2019-02-12T13:08:21 < kakimir> some do not
2019-02-12T13:08:30 < kakimir> and can go pretty low
2019-02-12T13:08:39 < qyx> the regulator just won't regulate if it doesn't have UVLO
2019-02-12T13:09:08 < kakimir> undervoltage lockout
2019-02-12T13:13:21 < kakimir> shut down in that case means at least that discharge resistor is active
2019-02-12T13:13:52 < kakimir> what are the limits?
2019-02-12T13:13:55 < kakimir> for UVLO?
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2019-02-12T13:14:22 < kakimir> https://documentation.help/ wat is this?
2019-02-12T13:14:42 < kakimir> it has pretty nice XMC tutorials
2019-02-12T13:14:59 < kakimir> og you changed the regulator
2019-02-12T13:15:04 < kakimir> what is the current option?
2019-02-12T13:18:00 < kakimir> i'd say 200mA constant thru that is no go
2019-02-12T13:19:31 < kakimir> for constant?
2019-02-12T13:20:19 < kakimir> you should find under 100C/W
2019-02-12T13:20:48 < kakimir> god knows how bad the thermal transfer is from chip surroundings to ambient
2019-02-12T13:21:51 < kakimir> well me neather
2019-02-12T13:22:11 < kakimir> I just know that LOWER C/W is desirable
2019-02-12T13:22:16 < kakimir> not higher
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2019-02-12T13:23:30 < kakimir> those figures rely on some standards that describe board shape/size, airflow, setup and whatnot
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2019-02-12T13:25:35 < kakimir> just go under 100
2019-02-12T13:25:57 < kakimir> at least for junction to board
2019-02-12T13:26:48 < kakimir> WSON 2x2 packages I have seen go to around 50
2019-02-12T13:27:13 < kakimir> texas
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2019-02-12T13:34:29 < rajkosto> why sperging out so much about basic regulators
2019-02-12T13:36:51 < dongs> lul why would BGA be thermally better
2019-02-12T13:36:53 < dongs> ur dum
2019-02-12T13:39:11 < qyx> finding a unicorn probably
2019-02-12T13:39:40 < BrainDamage> if anything, bga should be worse because the surface in contact with the pcb is considerably smaller
2019-02-12T13:40:23 < BrainDamage> if you need something with high thermal dissipation, find a chip with a thermal pad
2019-02-12T13:40:46 < rajkosto> use QFN with the middle being a thermal pad
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2019-02-12T13:59:57 < kakimir> wow this XMC has even control for external ADC mux
2019-02-12T14:00:04 < kakimir> ADC peripheral controls it
2019-02-12T14:01:37 < kakimir> first I thought EMUX pin function was for muxing more adc channels
2019-02-12T14:01:46 < kakimir> in input output pins
2019-02-12T14:11:06 < qyx> because it is WSON without thermal pad
2019-02-12T14:11:30 < kakimir> in BGA there is also minimal amount of material appart from the silicon
2019-02-12T14:11:51 < qyx> in bga it looks like http://www.sigcon.com/images/straight/bgafig-2.gif
2019-02-12T14:12:52 < qyx> in wson/dfn/qfn etc it is like https://m.eet.com/media/1101809/SS1233_QFN.gif
2019-02-12T14:12:58 < qyx> except that yours have no thermal pad
2019-02-12T14:13:42 < qyx> so there is only a plastic between the chip itself and the pcb
2019-02-12T14:14:39 < qyx> also you have chosen a RF LDO, much $$$
2019-02-12T14:15:54 < rajkosto> why do you need such specificity
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2019-02-12T14:24:46 < kakimir> autisming excercise
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2019-02-12T14:24:57 < kakimir> it's good
2019-02-12T14:25:16 < kakimir> it's not every day you can slap LD1117 to it
2019-02-12T14:27:51 < zyp> haha
2019-02-12T14:28:18 < zyp> I don't give much of a shit about regulators either, they just need to provide the correct voltages
2019-02-12T14:28:52 < zyp> why?
2019-02-12T14:29:10 < kakimir> smol pcb
2019-02-12T14:31:14 < kakimir> pics
2019-02-12T14:31:18 < kakimir> when?
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2019-02-12T15:17:21 < englishman> you can get smaller than 1x1mm ldos but I'm assuming that size will not be the design constraint
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2019-02-12T16:06:22 < Getty> Hey, kinda stupid question, but...... is there some kind of way to find out if the STM32 is "underpowered" or different, that i can find out that his last "outage" was related to power? I don't think there is, but i wanted to ask before I miss out something ;)
2019-02-12T16:08:40 < zyp> which stm32?
2019-02-12T16:08:59 < jpa-> Getty: you can enable brown out reset and check the reset reason bits in PWR block
2019-02-12T16:09:27 < zyp> provided the stm32 has that block
2019-02-12T16:09:48 < jpa-> but enabling brown out reset will make it reset earlier than it normally would; if you wait until power down reset, you'll know only that the power was cut, not whether it was just low or totally off
2019-02-12T16:10:47 < jpa-> you can also monitor Vdd while it is running using ADC
2019-02-12T16:21:00 < Ecco> Hi :)
2019-02-12T16:21:10 < Ecco> Are you guys using LTO?
2019-02-12T16:21:19 < Ecco> I'm running into a rather stupid issue
2019-02-12T16:22:30 < Ecco> when using LTO with a linker script, it looks like I cannot do things such as "myfile.o(.text)" since LTO would have discarded the fact that a given symbol might come from a file named myfile.o
2019-02-12T16:22:34 < Getty> its an STM32F107
2019-02-12T16:22:45 < Getty> does it have this block?
2019-02-12T16:25:40 < karlp> look in the RM.
2019-02-12T16:25:47 < karlp> theres a register with reset reasons.
2019-02-12T16:27:23 < Getty> uh hu!!! "Embedded reset and power control block characteristics", that stuff, right?
2019-02-12T16:27:29 < Getty> that looks very interesting
2019-02-12T16:28:15 < zyp> Ecco, I believe I read something about LTO using gold instead of ld, and gold having less linker script support
2019-02-12T16:28:42 < Ecco> hmmm
2019-02-12T16:29:02 < zyp> Ecco, have you tried setting section attributes on the symbols instead?
2019-02-12T16:29:02 < Ecco> yeah, I've read that too, but that was about exotic linker script commands
2019-02-12T16:29:21 < Ecco> well, that would work (I'm using explicit section attributes in other places)
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2019-02-12T16:29:30 < Ecco> but that's quite a pain to maintain
2019-02-12T16:29:57 < Ecco> using a "foo/*(.text)" pattern, I can (in theory) automagically put all code from the folder "foo" at a given place
2019-02-12T16:30:11 < zyp> what is this for? partitioning tasks so you can isolate them with MPU?
2019-02-12T16:30:23 < Ecco> splitting code between internal and external flash
2019-02-12T16:30:29 < zyp> ah, flash
2019-02-12T16:30:33 < Ecco> yep
2019-02-12T16:31:05 < Ecco> so yeah, your option would work, definitely
2019-02-12T16:31:07 < jpa-> i've used that like    bootloader.o(.text)   to partition code also, it's quite handy
2019-02-12T16:31:09 < Ecco> but it's a pain to maintain
2019-02-12T16:31:15 < Ecco> indeed jpa- 
2019-02-12T16:31:16 < jpa-> but i can see why it wouldn't work with LTO
2019-02-12T16:31:20 < Ecco> but I can't get it to work with LTO
2019-02-12T16:31:38 < Ecco> well, there's a good set of slides from the LLVM gyys that explain the issue
2019-02-12T16:31:44 < zyp> have you measured whether LTO wins you enough to be worthwhile?
2019-02-12T16:31:47 < Ecco> https://llvm.org/devmtg/2017-10/slides/LTOLinkerScriptsEdlerVonKoch.pdf
2019-02-12T16:31:59 < Ecco> zyp: yeah, it's quite efficient
2019-02-12T16:32:33 < Ecco> jpa-: I'm not sure gcc's LTO is done the same way
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2019-02-12T16:33:12 < jpa-> LTO often brings my binaries from 100+kB down to 0kB, it is very effective
2019-02-12T16:33:25 < Ecco> :-D
2019-02-12T16:33:25 < zyp> :D
2019-02-12T16:33:41 < Ecco> To give some numbers, I think it brought us from 800K to ~500
2019-02-12T16:33:45 < Ecco> 500K
2019-02-12T16:33:48 < Ecco> so yeah, kinda cool
2019-02-12T16:33:54 < Ecco> Maybe the initial code sucked though
2019-02-12T16:34:00 < zyp> jpa-, well, the point of optimization is to throw out useless code :)
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2019-02-12T16:34:59 < jpa-> Ecco: could you perhaps separately compile the external flash binary, and internal flash binary, and then after LTO has run on each then link them together?
2019-02-12T16:35:18 < Ecco> hmmm
2019-02-12T16:35:30 < Ecco> that's an interesting suggestion
2019-02-12T16:36:16 < Ecco> seems complicated though
2019-02-12T16:36:23 < Ecco> but yeah, I guess that could work
2019-02-12T16:36:28 < zyp> what settings were the 800k binary built with? if it includes a bunch of dead code, -ffunction-sections and -Wl,--gc-sections would help a lot
2019-02-12T16:36:36 < Ecco> already had those
2019-02-12T16:36:43 < Ecco> it was really just the LTO gains
2019-02-12T16:37:04 < zyp> so it's full of thin functions that can just be folded as is?
2019-02-12T16:37:11 < jpa-> are you using cube? :P
2019-02-12T16:37:16 < Ecco> nope :-D
2019-02-12T16:37:58 < zyp> close to 40% code size win from LTO over otherwise fairly well optimized code sounds strange
2019-02-12T16:38:04 < jpa-> i've tried LTO a few times, but i've found it is too effective in finding undefined behaviour, and tends to complicate debugging too much
2019-02-12T16:38:24 < Ecco> yeah, it definitely adds overhead
2019-02-12T16:38:49 < jpa-> 40% sounds like it might be ripping out something you'll later notice you actually need, like interrupt handlers that are not correctly marked accessible
2019-02-12T16:38:53 < zyp> jpa-, probably mostly memory checks
2019-02-12T16:39:25 < Ecco> Well, LTO is not magic anyway, so the initial code most likely wasn't well optimized
2019-02-12T16:39:26 < zyp> without LTO, compiler needs to assume globals may have changed every time it calls a different translation unit
2019-02-12T16:39:53 < zyp> with LTO, it can see they haven't, and then you run into issues when it's actually modified by ISRs or DMA
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2019-02-12T16:47:55 < Getty> jpa-: what i found now is that power supply supervisor where i can get an interrupt if a power supply threshold is reached. Do you mean this, or something else that is even more interesting?
2019-02-12T16:51:22 < jpa-> Getty: which stm32?
2019-02-12T16:51:30 < Getty> STM32F107
2019-02-12T16:52:10 < Getty> do you need the more precise number? i must check that
2019-02-12T16:52:37 < jpa-> nah, that's enough
2019-02-12T16:52:54 < zyp> shouldn't be any peripheral differences between f107 variants
2019-02-12T16:53:01 < jpa-> yes, for STM32F107 that would be the "PVD level detection" in PWR block
2019-02-12T16:53:58 < jpa-> but if it goes below power down reset voltage, you might miss that interrupt
2019-02-12T16:54:22 < Getty> yeah, so we got something more to know that this case happened?
2019-02-12T16:54:25 < zyp> is there a reset reason register?
2019-02-12T16:54:26 < Getty> afterwards is fine enough
2019-02-12T16:54:37 < zyp> I looked in F407 RM for it earlier, didn't find
2019-02-12T16:55:13 < jpa-> just a bit that indicates wakeup from standby (which causes a reset)
2019-02-12T16:55:54 < jpa-> Getty: you could perhaps do something like have a ram location you write 0xGE771 to and then after reset check if it is still there - if it is, you probably weren't powered down for very long
2019-02-12T16:56:05 < jpa-> but that of course would be true also for NRST pin reset
2019-02-12T16:56:39 < Getty> i dont do pin reset, if you mean with it what i think it means ;)
2019-02-12T16:56:52 < jpa-> yes :
2019-02-12T16:56:59 < jpa-> pressing a button :P
2019-02-12T16:57:07 < jpa-> zyp: ah, reset flags are in RCC->CSR
2019-02-12T16:57:17 < zyp> ah
2019-02-12T16:58:13 < zyp> yeah, description doesn't mention the word "reason" which I searched for :p
2019-02-12T16:58:25 < jpa-> but STM32F107 doesn't have brown out detector, which would be the normal solution for this
2019-02-12T16:59:42 < Getty> given that our cases are all so borderline works/works not i hope that the interrupt then is enough
2019-02-12T16:59:54 < zyp> still useful to distinguish between a power reset or a software/watchdog reset
2019-02-12T17:00:44 < jpa-> Getty: what is the "normal" reset case?
2019-02-12T17:01:10 < Getty> everything i do is restarting the app, the only alternative is power cycle
2019-02-12T17:01:52 < Getty> the "reset" button is just a normal button that triggers the software to go back to square zero
2019-02-12T17:02:17 < Getty> and my watchdog is done by software that just checks with the RTC interrupt that the software is flowing
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2019-02-12T17:11:43 < bitmask> hi hi
2019-02-12T17:16:32 < jpa-> only high bits today?
2019-02-12T17:17:10 < bitmask> 0xFF all the way baby
2019-02-12T17:18:09 < bitmask> I hope this electromagnet is strong enough to levitate some neodymiums
2019-02-12T17:19:34 < jpa-> qyx: re: the pdm mic/speaker stuff; kind of works, but noisy; dunno why really, but seems like i shall go for a more traditional solution
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2019-02-12T17:35:25 < kakimir> can you tell me about eclipse peripheral viewer
2019-02-12T17:35:30 < kakimir> register viewer
2019-02-12T17:35:31 < kakimir> whatever
2019-02-12T17:35:37 < kakimir> there is colors
2019-02-12T17:35:41 < kakimir> light blue
2019-02-12T17:35:45 < kakimir> green
2019-02-12T17:35:48 < kakimir> yellow
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2019-02-12T18:57:02 < qyx> jpa-: the output is noisy? it is used by sony so it must be good(tm)
2019-02-12T18:57:29 < qyx> did you low-pass filtere id?
2019-02-12T18:57:31 < qyx> *it
2019-02-12T19:11:15 < Thorn> kaboom https://arxiv.org/pdf/1812.00016.pdf
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2019-02-12T19:18:01 < jpa-> qyx: sound is noisy; no, not low-pass filtering because i want it to work in class D
2019-02-12T19:18:43 < jpa-> it's taking too much irq time so not so interested to pursue it further
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2019-02-12T19:28:37 < kakimir> couldn't get ADC to convert
2019-02-12T19:29:08 < kakimir> where is #xmc32
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2019-02-12T19:34:58 < jadew> is the country of origin label mandatory in the EU?
2019-02-12T19:35:26 < karlp> mandattory for what?
2019-02-12T19:35:33 < jadew> for electronic products
2019-02-12T19:35:33 < karlp> there's a couple of norms that say so, yes.
2019-02-12T19:35:45 < karlp> there's no "electronic products" standard dude.
2019-02-12T19:35:53 < karlp> you know how many seas of bullshit there are.
2019-02-12T19:35:53 < jadew> so... for all products?
2019-02-12T19:36:17 < jadew> it kinda ruins my back panel
2019-02-12T19:37:07 < karlp> iec 61010 for instance only says manufacturer, and model, 
2019-02-12T19:37:38 < karlp> but there's _other_ ones that overlap with it and have their own requirements
2019-02-12T19:37:49 < karlp> we recently had to redo labels to include country of manufacture
2019-02-12T19:39:04 < jadew> I wonder if there are any instances where any of the required labels were of use to anyone
2019-02-12T19:39:48 < karlp> sure,
2019-02-12T19:39:53 < karlp> makes lots of money for testing labs
2019-02-12T19:40:14 < karlp> we got dinged yesterday for having "12V" with out either the letters dc or a dc logo....
2019-02-12T19:40:49 < karlp> once you read the standards you start to recognise shit in the manuals that is only there because the standards require it.
2019-02-12T19:41:02 < jadew> really?
2019-02-12T19:41:05 < karlp> sure.
2019-02-12T19:41:25 < karlp> but hey, makes it all consistent, so it can be fuzzed out by the brain ignoring the repetitive stuff
2019-02-12T19:41:32 < jadew> I have a DC IN label, so I guess I'm covered
2019-02-12T19:41:35 < jadew> who checked for that tho?
2019-02-12T19:41:46 < karlp> teh testing lab.
2019-02-12T19:41:53 < karlp> because that's who makes money off this..
2019-02-12T19:42:01 < jadew> heh
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2019-02-12T19:55:44 < chipant> hello friends... I got an issue in regarding to modbus implementation. The slave stack is implemented in STM32 and it works fine communicating with modbus master as PC using USB-UART adapter but it does not works perfectly with real RS485 to USB adapter.
2019-02-12T19:56:15 < chipant> modbus data interchange works fine just for few seconds after STM32 boots upand goes to timeout error later on.
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2019-02-12T20:31:34 < karlp> did you fuck up your rs485 transceiver driver enable management?
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2019-02-12T20:59:49 < chipant> you mean enabling it in poertserial file ?
2019-02-12T21:00:27 < chipant> karlp, I think yes ... seems so
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2019-02-12T22:03:48 < kakimir> guise
2019-02-12T22:04:06 < kakimir> is anyone using such graph viewer
2019-02-12T22:04:50 < kakimir> that shows current market stock values?
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2019-02-12T23:07:59 < Steffanx> Dear altidongs pros. How i do this in altidongs: I have this current sense resistor. One end is connected to GND, but i want two seperated traces to the resistor. The trace on the gnd side happens to be have a via. How do i not let this via connect to a GND plane that happens to there as well?
2019-02-12T23:08:43 < Steffanx> https://imgur.com/a/oIpYnso like that. I do not want the via that happens to be in the SN trace connect to the ground plane.
2019-02-12T23:10:15 < Steffanx> or do i have to make a rule for that.
2019-02-12T23:11:47 < jpa-> shouldn't your current sense resistor symbol have four pins to start with? :P
2019-02-12T23:12:08 < jpa-> and your amplifier have differential input
2019-02-12T23:12:12 < antto> busted!
2019-02-12T23:12:33 < Steffanx> perhaps jpa-
2019-02-12T23:13:08 < jpa-> kicad pros do it like this  https://jpa.kapsi.fi/stuff/pix/shunt.png
2019-02-12T23:13:22 < Steffanx> lol
2019-02-12T23:13:51 < Steffanx> i guess i'll just go that way jpa-
2019-02-12T23:14:03 < Steffanx> sounds like the easiest solution
2019-02-12T23:14:17 < Steffanx> i thought of this but .. for some reason i didnt want that.
2019-02-12T23:14:32 < Steffanx> But when pro jpa- says it i have no choice but accept it.
2019-02-12T23:15:13 < antto> shall i give you the kicad download page URL or will you dig it out yourself?
2019-02-12T23:15:15 < antto> ;P~
2019-02-12T23:15:34 < Steffanx> did your shunt actually have 4 pads or did you overlay them/ connect them to the same pin or .. what jpa-?
2019-02-12T23:15:48 < Steffanx> altium is so pro it can do that as well, antto
2019-02-12T23:16:26 < antto> but does it have a built-in raytracer? ;P~
2019-02-12T23:17:09 < jpa-> Steffanx: i have 4 pads in the layout symbol; i originally had shunts that also had 4 pads but it was wrong resistance, so now i have just normal 2010 resistor that is soldered to four pads
2019-02-12T23:17:23 < Steffanx> hm
2019-02-12T23:17:46 < jpa-> https://www.analog.com/en/analog-dialogue/articles/optimize-high-current-sensing-accuracy.html
2019-02-12T23:18:04 < antto> 2010 resistor sounds kinda old, like, 9 years old
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2019-02-12T23:18:47 < Steffanx> yeah better go 2512
2019-02-12T23:18:47 < antto> hapi burthdei resistor!
2019-02-12T23:18:52 < englishman> yes Steffanx that is the pro way
2019-02-12T23:19:08 < englishman> also net ties
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2019-02-12T23:19:23 < englishman> wait 4 pads wut
2019-02-12T23:19:32 < englishman> net ties would be more pro imo
2019-02-12T23:19:49 < englishman> the footpeint doesn't change because your connections to it change
2019-02-12T23:20:16 < jpa-> englishman: but having the pads separate makes it more accurate
2019-02-12T23:20:39 < jpa-> (solder has resistance too)
2019-02-12T23:22:05 < englishman> how so? the resistor and its solder joints is the device to be sampled
2019-02-12T23:22:33 < englishman> with your setup you are adding resistance to the sense lines
2019-02-12T23:22:46 < englishman> however small
2019-02-12T23:24:50 < Steffanx> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/2253366.pdf what bourns told me to do. ..
2019-02-12T23:40:26 < karlp> heh, openscada ftp download server appears to be hosted on someones private home computer in ukraine.
2019-02-12T23:40:51 < karlp> absolute nutters
2019-02-12T23:41:48 < Steffanx> Wasnt there something similar with some lunix kernel maling list website?
2019-02-12T23:42:11 < Steffanx> Except that it was in dutchland(??)
2019-02-12T23:42:46 < karlp> oh, oscada.org is all ukrainian anyway, so it's likely as legit as it gets, just weird still :)
2019-02-12T23:44:28 < Steffanx> Hah the website even has a good old visitor counter
2019-02-12T23:46:44 < aandrew> hah. FMC write test works a lot better if you enable FMC write operations
2019-02-12T23:46:54 < zyp> how come?
2019-02-12T23:47:08 < aandrew> dunno. probably cubemx bullshit
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--- Day changed Wed Feb 13 2019
2019-02-13T00:21:09 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/top/2996273
2019-02-13T00:21:15 < karlp> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EN0Tnw5zy6w&index=2&list=PLC37A87364712F83B
2019-02-13T00:21:38 < karlp> kakimir: that 's awesome! whjere is it?
2019-02-13T00:36:01 -!- veegee [~veegee@ipagstaticip-3d3f7614-22f3-5b69-be13-7ab4b2c585d9.sdsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: veegee]
2019-02-13T00:51:47 < antto> random catz https://i.imgur.com/C0qtuw8.mp4
2019-02-13T00:55:23 < jadew> I don't understand why netflix removed the quality selection menu... bugs the shit out of me
2019-02-13T00:55:28 -!- kow_ [~afed@135.0.26.171] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2019-02-13T00:55:44 < jadew> now movies play at 480p :/
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2019-02-13T00:58:27 < kakimir> karlp: idk.
2019-02-13T00:58:29 < kakimir> I like it
2019-02-13T00:59:30 < kakimir> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist_architecture
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2019-02-13T01:45:29 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/top/2993477
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2019-02-13T01:47:03 < jadew> ffs...
2019-02-13T01:47:46 < jadew> I contacted netflix about the piss poor quality and the only solution they could come up with was to turn it on and off
2019-02-13T01:48:16 < jadew> but only after I follow the steps on some page, which involved checking some shit that I already checked while talking with live support
2019-02-13T01:48:58 < jadew> I said my PC works fine and I'd rather spend that time looking for a different streaming service that works
2019-02-13T01:49:04 < jadew> fucking assholes
2019-02-13T01:49:17 < jadew> what was the point in removing that menu?
2019-02-13T01:49:23 < jadew> spite?
2019-02-13T01:49:58 < Cracki> yes, they want you to torrent that shit
2019-02-13T01:50:20 < jadew> *to turn my PC on and off
2019-02-13T01:50:29 < Cracki> then you get fhd/4k and it will sit on your disk until the end of time
2019-02-13T01:50:38 < Cracki> that's standard level 1 support
2019-02-13T01:51:02 < Cracki> "I could strangle you to unconsciousness if you'd like"
2019-02-13T01:51:45 < Cracki> doesn't take that much really, "just" obstruct blood vessels for a few seconds
2019-02-13T01:52:30 < jadew> I think I'll try amazon prime
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2019-02-13T01:58:44 < jadew> got amazon prime
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2019-02-13T02:08:43 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/top/2992764
2019-02-13T02:13:25 -!- veegee [~veegee@ipagstaticip-3d3f7614-22f3-5b69-be13-7ab4b2c585d9.sdsl.bell.ca] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-13T02:23:07 < Cracki> are you learning to decipher the german tags on that site?
2019-02-13T02:25:42 < Cracki> https://pr0gramm.com/top/2998172
2019-02-13T02:28:44 < Cracki> https://pr0gramm.com/top/Schmuserlugser/2767262
2019-02-13T02:41:29 < Cracki> https://pr0gramm.com/top/Nicht-Nuss-November/2826340
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2019-02-13T04:27:19 < jadew> https://imgur.com/gallery/W98lKvU
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2019-02-13T06:11:16 < rajkosto> all my stm32f103c8t6 are 64KB the internet lied to me
2019-02-13T06:15:19 < aandrew> weird.
2019-02-13T06:15:24 < aandrew> interesting that the STM32 doesn't always burst
2019-02-13T06:15:27 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/pMhqeY8
2019-02-13T06:15:30 < aandrew> in fact it seems to only burst 4 halfwords on 0xc addresses
2019-02-13T06:16:11 < aandrew> writing to 0x50 bursts for two halfwords
2019-02-13T06:16:48 < aandrew> 0x52, 0x53, 0x54, 0x55 - all single writes (no burst)
2019-02-13T06:16:56 < aandrew> 0x56 bursts for two halfwords again
2019-02-13T06:17:18 < aandrew> 0x58, 0x59, 0x5a, 0x5b -- single writes again
2019-02-13T06:17:23 < aandrew> 0x5c a burst of four halfwords
2019-02-13T06:17:29 < aandrew> completely repeatable
2019-02-13T06:22:56 < bitmask> finally built a magnetic levitator that ive been planning for a while.  just gotta add some connectors, cut out the board to fit in the case and hope I didnt fuck it up
2019-02-13T06:24:21 < aandrew> closed loop PWM to regulate the magnetic field?
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2019-02-13T06:38:10 < bitmask> havent looked at his code, but I know it uses PID
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2019-02-13T06:56:50 < rajkosto> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eHpoPZvI3U NUTT x
2019-02-13T06:59:20 < aandrew> heh got it now
2019-02-13T06:59:59 < aandrew> if I write 32-bit data the write fifo will coalesce them into bursts and I end up with 8 byte bursts on the FMC
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2019-02-13T07:11:22 < mawk> I have a bidirectionnal shell
2019-02-13T07:11:28 < mawk> welcome to linux !
2019-02-13T07:11:28 < mawk> / # 
2019-02-13T07:11:31 < mawk> isn't it beautiful
2019-02-13T07:11:37 < mawk> it's with my emulated CPU
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2019-02-13T07:23:07 < rajkosto> whatcha emulatin
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2019-02-13T07:24:59 < mawk> I'm more hypervising than emulating
2019-02-13T07:25:03 < mawk> x86, using KVM
2019-02-13T07:25:20 < rajkosto> on a stm32 ?
2019-02-13T07:25:37 < mawk> no, not yet
2019-02-13T07:25:42 < mawk> but I'll try KVM for ARM next ues
2019-02-13T07:25:43 < mawk> yes
2019-02-13T07:26:17 < rajkosto> but you cant even run linux normally on a stm32 (uclinux doesnt count)
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2019-02-13T09:01:25 < Steffanx> Welcome at work Haohmaru 
2019-02-13T09:02:20 < Steffanx> Sure
2019-02-13T09:04:43 < Steffanx> Such party pooper.
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2019-02-13T09:19:02 < tjq> Meow
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2019-02-13T09:41:59 < qyx> wheres superbia with his F7 based SMPS
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2019-02-13T09:56:31 < qyx> I wonder if it is feasible to do PWM spread spectrum with a DMA copying a ring bufer to the timer CCR register
2019-02-13T09:56:44 < qyx> with precomputed values in the buffer
2019-02-13T09:59:14 < jpa-> i've thought the same, can't see why not
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2019-02-13T10:19:32 < Thorn> why do people hate triacs for switching line loads, even small ones (< 1A)
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2019-02-13T10:19:39 < Thorn> are they really so inefficient?
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2019-02-13T10:27:25 < kakimir> triacs
2019-02-13T10:27:39 < kakimir> not so inefficient
2019-02-13T10:27:46 < kakimir> you lose something like 0.7V
2019-02-13T10:29:21 < kakimir> people that do not undestand triacs hate them
2019-02-13T10:31:09 < kakimir> triacs ofc. lower the PF especially if used for adjusting application
2019-02-13T10:31:32 < kakimir> or is it distortion power factor
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2019-02-13T10:37:11 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-13T10:37:17 < kakimir> you said smol
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2019-02-13T10:38:44 < rajkosto> big bungus tqfp128
2019-02-13T10:38:52 < kakimir> huge
2019-02-13T10:39:22 < kakimir> stm32 detected
2019-02-13T10:39:40 < kakimir> :o
2019-02-13T10:39:46 < rajkosto> traitor
2019-02-13T10:40:13 < kakimir> that's sweet
2019-02-13T10:40:28 < Thorn> why still no stm32g0 @ lcsc
2019-02-13T10:40:38 < rajkosto> whats the g0 for
2019-02-13T10:41:21 < Thorn> somewhat upgraded f0
2019-02-13T10:42:16 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyTAhtNbiKs this is me avoiding stm32 when I change vendor between projects
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2019-02-13T10:57:31 < rajkosto> i think its a standard pinout
2019-02-13T10:57:36 < rajkosto> for the smol qfn ones
2019-02-13T10:57:43 < rajkosto> i have a richtek one thats the same footprint and pinout i think
2019-02-13T10:58:31 < rajkosto> nvm mine is a smps
2019-02-13T10:59:01 < rajkosto> RT8071A 
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2019-02-13T12:00:29 < tjq> has the doctor done himself in?
2019-02-13T12:27:04 < rajkosto> lol why did some lads in here move to Telegram
2019-02-13T12:27:20 < rajkosto> any messaging platform which as the first registration step has GIVE US YOUR PHONE NUMBER can fuck right off
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2019-02-13T12:30:18 < jpa-> as compared to the ones that are GIVE US YOUR IP ADDRESS?
2019-02-13T12:30:28 < rajkosto> thats fine
2019-02-13T12:30:37 < rajkosto> they get that anyway once i connect to them
2019-02-13T12:30:57 < rajkosto> both Signal and Telegram say they are focused on privacy and encryption yet they DEMAND phone number first
2019-02-13T12:31:26 < zyp> I hate all the online stores that are like GIVE US YOUR POSTAL ADDRESS when I try ordering something
2019-02-13T12:31:34 < rajkosto> ??? they need that.
2019-02-13T12:31:41 < rajkosto> a messaging platform does not need my phone number. ever.
2019-02-13T12:31:53 < rajkosto> Signal wants me to install it on a phone first so it can collect the phone number and likely all my contacts first
2019-02-13T12:32:14 < jpa-> except when it uses the phone number as the unique user id
2019-02-13T12:32:26 < rajkosto> why would it do that ?
2019-02-13T12:32:29 < jpa-> they're trying to be whatsapp competitors
2019-02-13T12:32:48 < rajkosto> why not let you register with email only
2019-02-13T12:32:54 < rajkosto> what if im on a tablet with no GSM module
2019-02-13T12:33:29 < jpa-> it's their sources, it is a proprietary service anyway
2019-02-13T12:33:43 < rajkosto> its a real shame Tox doesnt have more traction
2019-02-13T12:34:07 < zyp> rajkosto, a messaging service doesn't need your email either
2019-02-13T12:34:22 < rajkosto> that's right
2019-02-13T12:34:25 < rajkosto> Tox doesnt.
2019-02-13T12:34:35 < zyp> I don't really see the fundamental difference between using your phone number as a login and using your email as a login
2019-02-13T12:34:46 < rajkosto> you can make anonymous emails
2019-02-13T12:34:58 < rajkosto> while you can go around and buy prepaid numbers without any registration in some places
2019-02-13T12:35:02 < rajkosto> most people use one tied to their name
2019-02-13T12:35:16 < zyp> most people use their primary email too
2019-02-13T12:35:36 < rajkosto> unless they use their ISP's mailbox
2019-02-13T12:35:40 < rajkosto> its not tied to a contract they signed.
2019-02-13T12:35:46 < qyx> I get rajkosto's point
2019-02-13T12:36:08 < zyp> I get the point too, I just don't think it's a very good one
2019-02-13T12:37:01 < qyx> if you are striving for privacy and are able to make OTR messaging without logs and such things
2019-02-13T12:37:11 < qyx> it is natural that at this level you also want the anonymity
2019-02-13T12:37:19 < qyx> which a non-anonymous identifier is not able to gove you
2019-02-13T12:37:34 < zyp> the way I see it, it's pretty obvious why a messaging service would use phone numbers as login; it makes the transition from sms easy
2019-02-13T12:37:42 < rajkosto> yes, the privacy stuff in both Signal and Telegram is for marketing only
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2019-02-13T13:13:04 < tjq> field programmable disaster 
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2019-02-13T13:27:40 < BrainDamage> you can want confidentiality without anonimity
2019-02-13T13:27:48 < BrainDamage> for example, business discussions, etc
2019-02-13T13:28:18 < tjq> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAc241Bzx9k
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2019-02-13T13:41:34 < englishman> Job is closed due to a SNOW DAY
2019-02-13T13:41:58 < rajkosto> its high noon tho
2019-02-13T13:50:49 < kakimir> critical part has gone to NRND status
2019-02-13T13:50:52 < kakimir> interesting
2019-02-13T13:54:00 < englishman> nice1
2019-02-13T13:54:32 < englishman> this week i found literally the only lcd panel manufacturer to offer 10+ year product lifecycle guarantee
2019-02-13T13:54:58 < englishman> chinese are 2-3 years with 6 month eol
2019-02-13T13:58:19 < kakimir> where?
2019-02-13T14:00:39 < kakimir> oh wow
2019-02-13T14:00:53 < kakimir> replacing product is not found from resellers
2019-02-13T14:02:48 < englishman> a traditional name, but one you wouldnt expect
2019-02-13T14:02:50 < englishman> noritake
2019-02-13T14:02:57 < qyx> englishman: check deutschlanders
2019-02-13T14:03:13 < qyx> display elektronik for example
2019-02-13T14:03:26 < qyx> they still manufacture displays I was playing with on the school
2019-02-13T14:03:32 < qyx> or that other one
2019-02-13T14:03:42 < qyx> electronic assembly
2019-02-13T14:04:29 < englishman> it says they are a value added supplier? however i will check it out
2019-02-13T14:04:44 < englishman> there are a lot of guys that sell display solutions, but still dont manufacture the lcd itself
2019-02-13T14:05:18 < englishman> distec is another german that does that
2019-02-13T14:05:41 < qyx> EADIP128J for example
2019-02-13T14:06:20 < qyx> idk if they guarentee that
2019-02-13T14:07:01 < englishman> oh thats a little smaller than i was looking for heh... 10.1" wxga
2019-02-13T14:07:12 < qyx> O_o
2019-02-13T14:07:24 < englishman> https://www.display-elektronik.de/filter/DEM1024600B_TMH-PW-N.pdf
2019-02-13T14:07:31 < englishman> that looks like a lot of other datasheets
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2019-02-13T14:08:00 < englishman> but i am casting a wide net so i will check them out just the same thanks
2019-02-13T14:08:32 < englishman> mitsubishi and NLC (formerly NEC) panels are also 7 year lifecycles
2019-02-13T14:08:45 < englishman> err NLT
2019-02-13T14:09:15 < karlp> tjq: glasslinger is rad.
2019-02-13T14:09:19 < karlp> super niche
2019-02-13T14:09:30 < englishman> but noritake comes from their vfd background with 20+ year lifecycles and has to work with that i guess
2019-02-13T14:10:00 < englishman> i cant believe work is closed due to a SNOW DAY
2019-02-13T14:10:06 < englishman> it's a great place to work
2019-02-13T14:10:13 < englishman> and they are looking for more pro IRC EEs
2019-02-13T14:10:20 < englishman> i can play with cats all day guilt-free
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2019-02-13T14:12:32 < kakimir> have you ever invested in obsoleted part?
2019-02-13T14:12:42 < kakimir> buying stocks of the part
2019-02-13T14:13:05 < englishman> yes
2019-02-13T14:13:09 < englishman> EDISON
2019-02-13T14:13:14 < kakimir> oh boy
2019-02-13T14:13:22 < kakimir> englishboy
2019-02-13T14:17:55 < qyx> haha
2019-02-13T14:22:05 < kakimir> do you still have piles of that stuff?
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2019-02-13T14:25:37 < zyp> englishman, haha, snow day
2019-02-13T14:26:15 < englishman> kakimir: no
2019-02-13T14:26:20 < englishman> zyp: ikr!
2019-02-13T14:33:28 < kakimir> was there some special type of fet that is the most suitable for linear operating area?
2019-02-13T14:33:55 < kakimir> I remember those fets had some property that made them more suitable than others
2019-02-13T14:43:18 < jpa-> i think most manufacturers just call them "linear FETs"
2019-02-13T14:56:46 < karlp> don't they call them bjts? :)
2019-02-13T14:56:51 < zyp> haha
2019-02-13T15:04:53 -!- hexo is now known as olovnatejsie
2019-02-13T15:06:43 < karlp> best jazzedup transistor
2019-02-13T15:12:10 < Steffanx> Good luck figuring out SERCOM id/pin/pads crap, Haohmaru 
2019-02-13T15:12:44 < Steffanx> Or doesnt your sam do sercom?
2019-02-13T15:14:51 < Steffanx> Isnt it awesome?
2019-02-13T15:15:00 < Steffanx> You can always go atmel start :P
2019-02-13T15:36:09 < Ecco> Hi :)
2019-02-13T15:36:33 < Ecco> Stupid question: when using internal and external flash to run code
2019-02-13T15:36:47 < Ecco> is it worth it to put "often used" functions in the internal flash?
2019-02-13T15:37:19 < Ecco> I thought so, but apparently the compiler will need to emit trampoline function calls because ARM jumps can only be 4MB long
2019-02-13T15:37:55 < Ecco> yeah, assuming internal flash is faster
2019-02-13T15:38:08 < Ecco> also, it has its own bus
2019-02-13T15:51:44 < jpa-> Ecco: if you give the functions __attribute__((long_call)) in the header file, it should emit long call directly instead of trampoline
2019-02-13T15:53:21 < jpa-> but i wouldn't bother, if i had something that needed to be really fast I'd just load it in ram (ccm ram if it exists) in runtime
2019-02-13T15:53:36 < jpa-> and leave everything else in one flash area
2019-02-13T15:58:54 < Ecco> jpa-: yeah, that could work too
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2019-02-13T16:13:53 < kakimir> BJTs have cutoff current
2019-02-13T16:17:07 < karlp> jpa-: well, ecco was going to have two flash areas anyway, because of their jumbotron project needed external flash just to start wiht
2019-02-13T16:26:48 < zyp> gotta love windows
2019-02-13T16:27:12 < zyp> added some more source files to my stuff, now the build is breaking with "The command line is too long."
2019-02-13T16:29:36 < zyp> apparently I'm passing 122 object files to the linker
2019-02-13T16:34:32 < zyp> problem seems to mainly be the simulink generated stuff, each object file there are stored like seven folders deep
2019-02-13T16:34:53 < zyp> those make up a bit over half the number of files
2019-02-13T16:36:32 < zyp> the build tree looks like build/<variant>/<module>/
2019-02-13T16:36:52 < zyp> I should probably pack a lib file per module
2019-02-13T16:36:59 < zyp> but eh, some other time
2019-02-13T16:37:30 < zyp> seems like it's possible to get around this by changing the way processes are spawned
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2019-02-13T16:37:52 < zyp> scons
2019-02-13T16:38:31 < zyp> gonna try some of this: https://bitbucket.org/scons/scons/wiki/LongCmdLinesOnWin32
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2019-02-13T16:38:42 < bitmask> what up boys
2019-02-13T16:43:34 < bitmask> gonna? psh I already did
2019-02-13T16:51:51 < bitmask> I wanna make my own board with integrated mcu, Ive only made two boards before (for the same project) and they just have holes for pinheaders for a premade mcu board
2019-02-13T16:53:39 < bitmask> like holes to solder a arduino nano board in there
2019-02-13T16:54:01 < bitmask> ive never soldered an actual mcu chip
2019-02-13T16:54:08 < bitmask> right
2019-02-13T16:54:11 < Steffanx> What kind of drugs did you use Haohmaru?
2019-02-13T16:54:56 < bitmask> yea, unfortunately the only mcu's I have are atmega328P
2019-02-13T16:55:14 < bitmask> I should order some F0 or F1 s
2019-02-13T16:55:31 < karlp> don't order f1s
2019-02-13T16:55:37 < bitmask> ok, why?
2019-02-13T16:56:18 < Steffanx> Old
2019-02-13T16:56:22 < bitmask> o
2019-02-13T16:56:24 < bitmask> ok
2019-02-13T16:56:48 < bitmask> I'll get some F030 for easy soldering and F072 c8t6, or should I go with the cb
2019-02-13T16:56:58 < emeryth> but F1 has the most software to clone
2019-02-13T16:56:58 < zyp> fuck
2019-02-13T16:57:14 < bitmask> psh, I dont clone no software
2019-02-13T16:57:41 < zyp> the createprocess trick seems like it should work, but it doesn't use the updated search path where I've added the toolchain dir
2019-02-13T17:06:33 < bitmask> hmm, I gotta figure out how to cut this perfboard into a circle
2019-02-13T17:21:17 < karlp> now you've ot a hole in the middle too
2019-02-13T17:32:20 < BrainDamage> bitmask: https://ptpb.pw/dLAb.png
2019-02-13T17:32:48 < BrainDamage> a dremel in a vice would also work as a saw
2019-02-13T17:33:09 < BrainDamage> just watch your fingers as you spin it
2019-02-13T17:39:01 < BrainDamage> yes
2019-02-13T17:43:10 < bitmask> I just used an acrylic cutter knife, basically a box cutter
2019-02-13T17:43:19 < bitmask> worked out pretty well, now I just gotta file down the ends
2019-02-13T17:43:43 < karlp> I was using an angle grinder held down with my feet as a saw the other night.
2019-02-13T17:43:56 < karlp> super osha compliant
2019-02-13T17:44:06 < bitmask> just gotta go over the slice like 10 times and snap it
2019-02-13T17:44:44 < karlp> was just cutting some ~3mm threaded rods down to right length, wasn't driving home for a hacksaw or a vice
2019-02-13T17:45:04 < karlp> but yeah, super safety mega plus
2019-02-13T17:45:04 < BrainDamage> I have this shitty vice
2019-02-13T17:45:05 < BrainDamage> http://static.axminster.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/920x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/9/5/953690_xl.jpg
2019-02-13T17:45:20 < BrainDamage> it's pretty shit, but it's actually super useful to hold random things
2019-02-13T17:45:30 < karlp> squishy jaws would be really nice for some things
2019-02-13T17:45:48 < BrainDamage> the jaws are normal carbon steel, there's a plastic cover in the pic
2019-02-13T17:45:49 < karlp> I've only got a big chunky steel one, and sometimes it marks surfaces way too much on soft things 
2019-02-13T17:45:55 < BrainDamage> which is also sold with
2019-02-13T17:47:01 < BrainDamage> ( you can put back / remove the cover )
2019-02-13T17:48:14 < karlp> heh, regardless of pincount or anything, the cheapest card edge connectors _by far_ are all pcie, 1x and 2x
2019-02-13T17:48:56 < karlp> you'd have to have a pretty good reason to not use them.
2019-02-13T17:59:09 < bitmask> this project says it doeesn't matter which way you connect a coil (for use as an electromagnet) how can that be? wouldn't the magnetic field switch direction?
2019-02-13T17:59:46 < bitmask> ohhh maybe it doesnt matter because its levitating a magnet so you just have to turn the levitating magnet over
2019-02-13T18:00:44 < englishman> yes
2019-02-13T18:00:55 < englishman> and dont forget the availability
2019-02-13T18:01:02 < bitmask> hate asking dumb questions only to realize the answer
2019-02-13T18:01:15 < englishman> millions of chinacloners will be pumping them out for all eternity
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2019-02-13T18:33:24 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/top/2991608
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2019-02-13T18:45:11 < Steffanx> Is kakimir the new /b/axter?
2019-02-13T18:46:06 < kakimir> blaxter would not link such funny content
2019-02-13T18:47:12 < kakimir> watched it 4 times
2019-02-13T18:47:24 < kakimir> laughed every time
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2019-02-13T19:09:56 < qyx> karlp: m.2 too
2019-02-13T19:10:14 < qyx> but they are insert-at-angle
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2019-02-13T19:23:01 < qyx> I also found SFP connectors interesting once, although they are not made vertical
2019-02-13T19:24:29 < aandrew> got stm32 fmc bursting figured out
2019-02-13T19:24:45 < kakimir> get panavise
2019-02-13T19:25:01 < aandrew> looks like it'll burst up to 8 bytes, and that maximum only if the write fifo is enabled and you write 32-bit values on dword address boundaries
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2019-02-13T19:52:02 < mawk> https://asciinema.org/a/ti3OqbcurQRYzKkDzPzWmOg2o
2019-02-13T19:52:04 < mawk> isn't it beautiful
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2019-02-13T19:58:37 < karlp> qyx: yeah, m2 is actually not nearly as available as pcie, but was another option.  the mess of keying and the much higher pitch makes it a lot less attractive, and alos, it'
2019-02-13T19:58:43 < karlp> s all flat mounted stuff too
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2019-02-13T20:28:27 < Steffanx>  whats so special about this kvm mr mawk?
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2019-02-13T20:59:48 < kakimir> wow. my bank account balance
2019-02-13T21:00:15 < jpa-> one million dollars
2019-02-13T21:01:12 < kakimir> went under 1000
2019-02-13T21:01:29 < jpa-> time for a pikavippi
2019-02-13T21:01:30 < kakimir> me ded
2019-02-13T21:01:40 < kakimir> time for all the pikavippis
2019-02-13T21:02:53 < Steffanx> ill donate some stroopwaffels kakimir
2019-02-13T21:02:56 < jpa-> is your workplace no longer paying you?
2019-02-13T21:03:32 < Steffanx> whats wrong with a balance under 1k?
2019-02-13T21:04:09 < Steffanx> when is pay day?
2019-02-13T21:04:11 < kakimir> somebody here said that under 1k is bad
2019-02-13T21:04:11 < mawk> it's that I made it Steffanx
2019-02-13T21:04:16 < kakimir> like.. tommorow
2019-02-13T21:04:30 < Steffanx> ooh.
2019-02-13T21:05:00 -!- chipant_ [~chipant@27.34.104.207] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2019-02-13T21:05:00 < mawk> kvm makes the cpu and IRQ chip, and I make the rest
2019-02-13T21:05:22 < mawk> which is BIOS, smbios, pci, mp, whatever tables and functions linux wants
2019-02-13T21:05:38 < mawk> also bootloader, and finally every peripheral linux may need, I did serial port here
2019-02-13T21:06:29 < mawk> I can also hack together a VGA peripheral but serial port is enough for a shell
2019-02-13T21:06:51 < zyp> kakimir, 1k EUR? I try to keep mine under 1k EUR most of the time
2019-02-13T21:07:01 < jpa-> why?
2019-02-13T21:07:11 < kakimir> to invest
2019-02-13T21:07:44 < jpa-> well yeah, but 1keur sounds a bit little to have for random expenses
2019-02-13T21:07:54 < Steffanx> savings account i assume?
2019-02-13T21:08:10 < zyp> jpa-, how so?
2019-02-13T21:08:31 < Steffanx> *you put it in a savings account i assume
2019-02-13T21:08:50 < Steffanx>  i do, hence my "normal" account is never above 1k.
2019-02-13T21:09:07 < Steffanx> for > 1 day
2019-02-13T21:09:32 < jpa-> well yeah, i don't bother because savings account doesn't pay practically any interest either
2019-02-13T21:09:48 < Steffanx> what is practically not interest ?
2019-02-13T21:09:56 < Steffanx> *no
2019-02-13T21:10:02 < zyp> yeah, salary comes in on my main account, and then I've got a separate account that I pay bills from, so I move over enough to cover this month's bills
2019-02-13T21:10:12 < jpa-> what i can i put in stocks, but i have like 10k in bank account; but i guess my income varies more than most people's
2019-02-13T21:10:17 < jpa-> Steffanx: 0.25%
2019-02-13T21:10:24 < jpa-> per year
2019-02-13T21:10:35 < Steffanx> oh about the same here then.
2019-02-13T21:11:41 < zyp> putting away for savings is not for the interest but to distinguish money I can spend from money I shouldn't spend
2019-02-13T21:12:10 < zyp> last year the latter was money I had budgeted putting towards the house
2019-02-13T21:12:24 < zyp> at the moment savings is 0 :p
2019-02-13T21:13:23 < zyp> as for interest, I get 0.10% on my normal account
2019-02-13T21:14:19 < zyp> my savings account currently would give me 1.10% if I keep a balance over 100k NOK there, otherwise the same 0.10%
2019-02-13T21:15:19 < zyp> on the other hand, at the moment, paying off my car loan would be more beneficial than any sort of savings accounts
2019-02-13T21:15:55 < zyp> so when I'm done buying stuff for the house, I figure that's where I'll put my spare money towards until it's paid off
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2019-02-13T21:21:38 < con3> so south africa's power is fucked
2019-02-13T21:22:55 < kakimir> ?
2019-02-13T21:23:29 < con3> got hectic load shedding, had no power for about 3 and a half hours today. Main electricity provider(eskom) is fucked in debt
2019-02-13T21:23:44 < con3> programming in the dark
2019-02-13T21:24:23 < kakimir> why it's fucked in debt?
2019-02-13T21:25:24 < con3> eh their idiots, i think the biggest issue was that for the past like 30 years they didnt do any maintenance on their plants, two broke, now there isn't enough capacity for the country, they built two more but can't seem to get them going
2019-02-13T21:25:41 < con3> and corruption
2019-02-13T21:26:00 < con3> eksom will ask a friend to install a solar panel for 3 million
2019-02-13T21:26:20 < kakimir> are you planning to leave or stay?
2019-02-13T21:26:32 < kakimir> I mean it's not the only problem
2019-02-13T21:26:37 < kakimir> electricity
2019-02-13T21:26:46 < con3> their are so many problems, but this is just annoying
2019-02-13T21:26:59 < con3> Want to leave, but need to finish my studies
2019-02-13T21:27:09 < kakimir> where you want to go?
2019-02-13T21:27:50 < con3> Need to head to Namibia for a bit (much better than this place) and then hoping to head to europe or the states one day
2019-02-13T21:28:45 < con3> just sucks cause man I love this place, but trying to be optimistic is useless nowadays
2019-02-13T21:30:34 < con3> If land reform happens this country is fuckt
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2019-02-13T21:31:46 < con3> oh well
2019-02-13T21:32:12 < kakimir> it certainly is
2019-02-13T21:33:17 < kakimir> when do you finish the school?
2019-02-13T21:34:02 < con3> End of the year
2019-02-13T21:34:17  * con3 hopes
2019-02-13T21:41:15 < Steffanx> Does con3 speak afrikaans?
2019-02-13T21:42:05 < con3> Steffanx: I can
2019-02-13T21:42:35 < Steffanx> The weird dutch language.
2019-02-13T21:42:56 < con3> dutch is the weird afrikaans language !
2019-02-13T21:43:02 < Steffanx> you wish
2019-02-13T21:43:34  * con3 thinks Steffanx is biased..
2019-02-13T21:44:03 < Steffanx> Did we at least bring stroopwafels to SA?
2019-02-13T21:44:36 < con3> what is that? Can I braai that?
2019-02-13T21:46:17 < Steffanx> No you can eet it.
2019-02-13T21:46:30 < Steffanx> Best dutch cookie.
2019-02-13T21:46:41 < con3> I've never had that, just googled it
2019-02-13T21:46:50 < con3> waffel covered in syrup?
2019-02-13T21:47:07 < Steffanx> na. Cookie - syrupish stuff - cookie
2019-02-13T21:48:22 < con3> hmm.. will see if you can find them somewhere in cape town
2019-02-13T21:48:50 < con3> ah looks like woolworths has them!
2019-02-13T21:48:56 < con3> will report back
2019-02-13T21:49:01 < Steffanx> hah
2019-02-13T21:49:52 < con3> Steffanx: know what a koeksister is?
2019-02-13T21:50:47 < Steffanx> nope
2019-02-13T21:51:02 < Steffanx> but i see it must be great since you even have a monument of it
2019-02-13T21:51:47 < con3> oh god thats in orania
2019-02-13T21:52:11 < con3> bunch of white people decided to make a segregated town -> orania
2019-02-13T21:54:36 < Cracki> must be an utopia
2019-02-13T21:55:26 < englishman> i have some sauce mix "rob's special braai"
2019-02-13T21:55:52 < con3> Cracki: I don't know much about it, it isn;t really talked about. very controversial
2019-02-13T21:56:28 < Cracki> I'd be hush hush about my utopia too if I had one
2019-02-13T21:56:38 < Cracki> no tire necklaces, no "kiss the boer" songs
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2019-02-13T21:57:46 < Cracki> I'm constantly amazed at then-now pictures of places... south africa has seen better days and everyone knows when it went sideways
2019-02-13T21:58:08 < con3> Cracki: its become a scary place tbh
2019-02-13T21:58:39 < Cracki> walls around properties looking like supermax prisons
2019-02-13T21:58:45 < con3> I mean it's a really nice place, there's just some scary shit
2019-02-13T21:59:00 < con3> by scary i mean dear god scary
2019-02-13T21:59:20 < qyx> you mean ghosts or what
2019-02-13T21:59:36 < Steffanx> famous leggless  runners killing their gf.
2019-02-13T21:59:42 < Steffanx> leg
2019-02-13T21:59:47 < con3> crime
2019-02-13T21:59:56 < Cracki> let's go back to the good old days
2019-02-13T22:00:19 < Steffanx> pre-dutch invasion i assume?
2019-02-13T22:00:28 < con3> eh but let me not hog the chat
2019-02-13T22:00:38 < Steffanx> nah
2019-02-13T22:00:50 < Cracki> do bacon fences work on the local wildlife?
2019-02-13T22:02:24 < con3> bacon fences...? I'm seeing a very literal image of that
2019-02-13T22:04:05 < Cracki> :3
2019-02-13T22:04:14 < Steffanx> Good braat.
2019-02-13T22:04:17 < Steffanx> *braai
2019-02-13T22:05:18  * con3 makes coffee
2019-02-13T22:20:14 < qyx> is the F334 the only STM32 with HRTIM?
2019-02-13T22:20:44 < qyx> it looks like they are not much used
2019-02-13T22:22:47 < Cracki> they have a separate cookbook for hrtim, and only the f334 is mentioned
2019-02-13T22:22:53 < Cracki> (it's from 2014 tho so who knows)
2019-02-13T22:23:44 < Cracki> heh it contains switching regulators
2019-02-13T22:24:34 < Cracki> oh, H7 seems to have hrtims too
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2019-02-13T22:29:44 < kakimir> what is between boomers and millenials?
2019-02-13T22:30:25 < Cracki> trick question?
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2019-02-13T22:36:33 < qyx> wait what, current mode SMPS control can be implemented with a common timer
2019-02-13T22:36:59 < qyx> using PWM mode and OCxREF_CLR
2019-02-13T22:37:07 < qyx> with the internal comparator
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2019-02-13T22:40:27 < qyx> no need for F334 then
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2019-02-13T23:03:51 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/LQ5FuIp.png
2019-02-13T23:13:23 < Cracki> ugh don't remind me of 3d printing... made a tiny part, supposed 17 minutes to print, but the local faplab needed an hour to heat the printer, another few hours for the support material to be dissolved, and then it had major printing defects
2019-02-13T23:13:46 < Cracki> bunch of wankers with expensive toys
2019-02-13T23:14:49 < Steffanx> Should post more pics bitmask :P
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--- Day changed Thu Feb 14 2019
2019-02-14T00:16:26 < catphish> kakimir: animosity
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2019-02-14T01:03:31 < kakimir> catphish: yes
2019-02-14T01:03:47 < kakimir> but I meant generation
2019-02-14T01:12:43 < catphish> kakimir: those labels are dumb and meaningless, pretend they don't exist :)
2019-02-14T01:28:41 < Thorn> which SBC do I use for an outdoor kiosk (hd display, wi-fi, camera, gpio, ethernet)?
2019-02-14T01:31:09 < catphish> i'm a big fan of allwinner based devices http://linux-sunxi.org/Table_of_Allwinner_based_boards
2019-02-14T01:31:20 < catphish> no idea about camera though
2019-02-14T01:31:51 < Ultrasauce> biggest variable there is probably video
2019-02-14T01:32:03 < Ultrasauce> fancy graphics? video encoding?
2019-02-14T01:32:36 < catphish> i assume it needs to display pics from its own camera only?
2019-02-14T01:33:01 < Thorn> pics/videos cached from server 
2019-02-14T01:33:14 < Thorn> probably full motion HD
2019-02-14T01:33:35 < Ultrasauce> hardware video decoding on allwhiner was a bit fucky last i tried
2019-02-14T01:33:39 < catphish> the allwinner boards have hardware h464 because they're designed for tv streaming boxes
2019-02-14T01:33:53 < catphish> the letdown would be the camera support i'd say
2019-02-14T01:34:47 < Thorn> isn't allwinner basically crap tier because of the lack of documentation?
2019-02-14T01:35:27 < catphish> Thorn: all chinese SoCs are
2019-02-14T01:35:38 < catphish> but assuming you use linux, it doesn't really matter
2019-02-14T01:35:46 < rajkosto> the video decoding is hit or miss on ALL the cheap set-top-box (ironically) SOC
2019-02-14T01:35:56 < rajkosto> catphish, drivers SUCK for linux for most of them
2019-02-14T01:36:01 < rajkosto> only android is barely usable (not always)
2019-02-14T01:36:09 < catphish> rajkosto: android is linux...
2019-02-14T01:36:13 < rajkosto> ha haaaaa
2019-02-14T01:36:23 < rajkosto> cool story bro
2019-02-14T01:36:49 < catphish> the SoC makers supply drivers, but how well they work for a particular use case is very much a matter for trial and error :)
2019-02-14T01:37:08 < rajkosto> they supply a very hacked up forked kernel usable only with the shittiest android distro they supply
2019-02-14T01:37:39 < Ultrasauce> i guess mainline support has come a long way since i messed with the a10 but eh
2019-02-14T01:37:55 < catphish> rajkosto: that's definitely true in part, but for several reasons, that's generally good enough
2019-02-14T01:37:58 < rajkosto> the video driver for android will never work on mainline linux
2019-02-14T01:38:06 < rajkosto> so you dont get anything you would want for your OUTDOOR KIOSK
2019-02-14T01:38:11 < catphish> and actually allwinner despite the price are pretty ok with drivers
2019-02-14T01:38:23 < rajkosto> you get simple sw framebuffer with no vsync
2019-02-14T01:38:26 < rajkosto> enjoy it
2019-02-14T01:39:00 < catphish> i have no experience using the video decoding though
2019-02-14T01:39:29 < catphish> http://linux-sunxi.org/Cedrus
2019-02-14T01:39:51 < catphish> that's the state of open source on the sunxi
2019-02-14T01:40:16 < catphish> but you're largely correct, this is not using the sucky officially provide "for-android" frivers
2019-02-14T01:40:19 < catphish> *drivers
2019-02-14T01:40:32 < rajkosto> yeah most people have H3, H5 and A64 dont they
2019-02-14T01:40:34 < rajkosto> cuz orangepi
2019-02-14T01:40:47 < catphish> yeah, i use the H3
2019-02-14T01:41:01 < rajkosto> aarch64 H5 is way better
2019-02-14T01:41:08 < catphish> and honestly, its documentation is ok, not good, but workable
2019-02-14T01:42:07 < rajkosto> RockChip set top boxes only support android and there the video decoder barely works in apps like kodi etc (various random color errors and such on a bunch of content)
2019-02-14T01:42:31 < rajkosto> life is pain, i hate
2019-02-14T01:42:46 < catphish> rockchip have some reasonably documented devices, but overall they seemed less good about open source than allwinner
2019-02-14T01:43:04 < catphish> i found allwinner to be the best of a terrible bunch
2019-02-14T01:43:12 < rajkosto> what about MediaTek
2019-02-14T01:43:22 < rajkosto> i assume fully NDA'd
2019-02-14T01:43:23 < rajkosto> nonsense
2019-02-14T01:43:31 < Ultrasauce> personally im using the tegra x1 for stuff but i imagine the price is a sticking point here
2019-02-14T01:43:41 < catphish> but still very mcuh worthwhile because of the crazy price ($15 gets you a quad core 1.2GHz PC with 1GB of RAM and 1080p)
2019-02-14T01:43:55 < catphish> i know nothing about mediatek
2019-02-14T01:44:13 < rajkosto> the quad core doesnt mean much with A53 cores, they are tiny and weak in-order execution only
2019-02-14T01:44:18 < catphish> only found anything useful from allwinner and rockchip, with allwinner being the best
2019-02-14T01:44:31 < rajkosto> its why they went for octa-core already
2019-02-14T01:44:38 < catphish> umm, it means 4x as many operations as one core
2019-02-14T01:45:10 < rajkosto> P C
2019-02-14T01:45:33 < catphish> H3 is Cortex-A7, i don't know where they're lacking, but they seem competent to me
2019-02-14T01:46:01 < rajkosto> even the most expensive 1000$ current phones dont have the performance of a core 2 quad from 10 years ago
2019-02-14T01:46:23 < catphish> i mean, it can execute 4 x 1.2 million instructions per second under the right conditions :)
2019-02-14T01:46:43 < catphish> though i don't fully know what those conditions are, i don't know the cost of forks etc
2019-02-14T01:46:57 < catphish> though i found arm could do a lot of things in one cycle
2019-02-14T01:47:09 < catphish> including conditional execution
2019-02-14T01:47:45 < catphish> i'm far from an expert on cpu performance :)
2019-02-14T01:48:36 < catphish> but i'm convinced that for the money, the H3 is an exraordinarily capable device, not least because of the vast array of peripherals and high clock speed
2019-02-14T01:48:49 < rajkosto> raspberry has way more configurable GPIO
2019-02-14T01:49:19 < catphish> really?
2019-02-14T01:49:36 < rajkosto> yeah a ton of alt functions on each pin, and the PWM stuff has some advanced features
2019-02-14T01:49:58 < rajkosto> (and runs at way higher clocks than sunxi)
2019-02-14T01:50:47 < rajkosto> https://github.com/ChristopheJacquet/PiFmRds
2019-02-14T01:51:12 < catphish> not really, they both have quad core A53s at 1.4ish GHz
2019-02-14T01:51:19 < rajkosto> i mean for the pwm
2019-02-14T01:51:22 < catphish> oh
2019-02-14T01:51:29 < catphish> that i dont know much about
2019-02-14T01:51:33 < rajkosto> check that project, not possible at all with sunxi gpio
2019-02-14T01:51:44 < catphish> it wouldnt surprise me if the broadcom was a better chip though
2019-02-14T01:51:52 < catphish> just a shame about the docs
2019-02-14T01:52:16 < rajkosto> its not better core wise, but it has a lot of features broadcom initially locked away until their hand was forced as raspberry became popular
2019-02-14T01:52:22 < catphish> H3 has 2 PWM channels at 24MHz
2019-02-14T01:52:57 < catphish> plenty of MHz, shame there's only 2 channels
2019-02-14T01:53:14 < con3> weird... Vgs is 0 but the fet seems to be on
2019-02-14T01:53:58 < Ultrasauce> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vTgns7SAqMnbgr59tvSmbmhU-rS4vhI0tRejXYY39RZm0KJDOqgwx9bNY-zHgQBTNh6np7YUV-L4Hp3/pubhtml
2019-02-14T01:54:41 < catphish> i am quite a sunxi fanboy though, had good experience programming them, and the hobby community are super helpful
2019-02-14T01:54:52 < rajkosto> sunxi backdoor bootloader is quite neat yes
2019-02-14T01:55:04 < catphish> but they may well be technically inferior (not surprising for the money)
2019-02-14T01:55:39 < catphish> oh yeah i love the bootloader, i can play with code without any programming at all
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2019-02-14T02:06:26 < bitmask> man this levitator sucks :P
2019-02-14T02:06:31 < bitmask> I cant get it to stabilize
2019-02-14T02:07:03 < jadew> control loop not tuned
2019-02-14T02:07:16 < bitmask> nope, cant find the right pid constants
2019-02-14T02:07:30 < Thorn> con3: *zap*
2019-02-14T02:08:01 < jadew> bitmask, that's what I ment hehe
2019-02-14T02:08:12 < con3> Thorn: ?
2019-02-14T02:08:22 < Thorn> ESD damage
2019-02-14T02:08:24 < jadew> meant
2019-02-14T02:09:56 < bitmask> too many variables too, I can add weight to the magnet by adding non magnetic material, add magnetic material, set P, I, D, set point, max magnet strength, and I'm sure im forgetting something
2019-02-14T02:11:18 < bitmask> I mean I guess if I just choose a magnet and set the max strength to 100% then I can find a P with I=D=0 where it just oscillates, at least in an ideal world
2019-02-14T02:13:05 < con3> this is weird, applying a voltage to source and its resistance drops to about 600k ohm. it has a drop of 0.7V over Vds and VGS = 0V
2019-02-14T02:13:26 < con3> hope its esd and not a circuit thing
2019-02-14T02:16:57 < jadew> bitmask, yep, sounds reasonable
2019-02-14T02:18:07 < Ultrasauce> is it backwards con3
2019-02-14T02:24:43 < con3> Ultrasauce: Nope, weirder part is that when I apply the gate voltage, VDS drops close to 0. So it switches on, but it's semi on without the gate voltage when something is applied to the source
2019-02-14T02:29:12 < Ultrasauce> measure gate-drain resistance?
2019-02-14T02:30:47 < con3> it's this mosfet : https://www.diodes.com/assets/Datasheets/ZXMN10A07F.pdf
2019-02-14T02:30:59 < con3> Ultrasauce: will in a bit
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2019-02-14T02:47:01 < ds2> con3: have you accounted for the parasitic diode?
2019-02-14T02:47:23 < con3> ds2: the parasitic diode?
2019-02-14T02:48:18 < con3> wait
2019-02-14T02:52:51 < con3> forgot about this, but it says that the zero gate voltage drain current is 1 uA, I'm seeing a bit more current passing than that
2019-02-14T02:53:59 < con3> going to search for a spare quick and swap it out
2019-02-14T03:00:39 < ds2> yes mosfets have a diode in them btwn D/S
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2019-02-14T04:51:31 < rajkosto> ah im an idiot
2019-02-14T04:51:45 < rajkosto> the reason im getting 32clocks by reading DR one time is because it frees it up for another transfer
2019-02-14T04:51:51 < rajkosto> which carries out immediately
2019-02-14T04:52:05 < rajkosto> by disabling SPI before reading it out it stops it
2019-02-14T04:54:09 < rajkosto> DR is a different register depending if youre reading it or writing it too
2019-02-14T04:54:28 < rajkosto> swapping modes doesnt invalidate its contents
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2019-02-14T05:26:50 < R2COM> hi
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2019-02-14T06:00:36 < rajkosto> "However there seems to be a bug / feature in the F103 and F4 (and possibly other STM32 processors), where the hardware SPI Software Select pin, known as NSS basically doesn't do anything."
2019-02-14T06:00:37 < rajkosto> why this
2019-02-14T06:07:27 < jadew> R2COM, hi
2019-02-14T06:07:34 < jadew> you haven't been around much
2019-02-14T06:07:40 < jadew> too busy gaming?
2019-02-14T06:15:00 < bitmask> hmm, I'm attempting to 'bind' a book by gluing the edges of a stacked sheet of card stock with wood glue, I wonder if it will hold together well enough
2019-02-14T06:15:59 < rajkosto> when in BIDIR = 1, BIDIROE = 0 mode of SPI, it always seems to yeet one transaction more than i want it to (32bit if datasize is 16, 16bit if datasize is 8, 24bit if datasize is 8 and i wait for RXNE twice, etc)
2019-02-14T06:16:08 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-14_05-13-54_NDdm1pHxa.png
2019-02-14T06:16:35 < rajkosto> i software toggle CS and it applies before its stopped clocking data out
2019-02-14T06:26:17 < R2COM> jadew no just other stuff
2019-02-14T06:26:20 < R2COM> but yeah i game too
2019-02-14T06:26:21 < R2COM> whats up
2019-02-14T06:28:25 < jadew> not much
2019-02-14T06:28:34 < R2COM> what were you making these weeks
2019-02-14T06:28:58 < jadew> don't know, been working on a bunch of stuff
2019-02-14T06:29:01 < jadew> I think I'm gonna start freelancing again
2019-02-14T06:29:25 < jadew> hardware seems to take way too long to develop
2019-02-14T06:29:30 < jadew> either that, or I'm doing something wrong
2019-02-14T06:29:44 < R2COM> indeed
2019-02-14T06:29:53 < R2COM> it takes long to develop[
2019-02-14T06:29:57 < R2COM> what did you try to develop
2019-02-14T06:30:55 < jadew> I don't want to talk about it yet, I thought it was ready, but I had a final surprise that threw me back at least a month
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2019-02-14T06:31:41 < aandrew> hm
2019-02-14T06:32:09 < aandrew> I think I may have fried this stm32f756
2019-02-14T06:32:26 < jadew> high 5!
2019-02-14T06:32:33 < aandrew> RST has a 10k pullup to 3.3v but is at 0.8V, and SWDIO is being pulled down fairly hard
2019-02-14T06:32:34 < jadew> I fried a MCU yesterday too
2019-02-14T06:32:43 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-14T06:33:25 < jadew> in my case, I know what happened
2019-02-14T06:34:12 < jadew> because I forgot to add the programming header, I connected to the pins with enameled wire
2019-02-14T06:34:23 < aandrew> yeah I am not sure what happened
2019-02-14T06:34:27 < jadew> as I was changing the position of the board, one of them touched the 12V rail
2019-02-14T06:34:33 < aandrew> I think I have another here
2019-02-14T06:34:41 < aandrew> but dn't want to replace it if not necessary
2019-02-14T06:35:20 < jadew> I didn't want to replace it either, so I just ordered a new board, with a proper header
2019-02-14T06:35:33 < jadew> it was painful to solder those wire (QFN package)
2019-02-14T06:35:38 < jadew> *wires
2019-02-14T06:37:12 < branjb> should have used tag connect
2019-02-14T06:37:38 < jadew> I made my own thing... I just forgot to add it after I changed MCUs from revision to revision
2019-02-14T06:40:59 < rajkosto> a stray 12V wire killed 3 things on my desk like 3 weeks ago
2019-02-14T06:42:51 < R2COM> what kind of freelancing you doing
2019-02-14T06:43:42 < jadew> R2COM, not sure, everything I guess
2019-02-14T06:43:55 < jadew> branjb: http://5.12.15.1/stuff/20181002_161330.jpg
2019-02-14T06:44:34 < rajkosto> ok found the trick
2019-02-14T06:44:39 < rajkosto> disable SPI before reading out the 2nd byte
2019-02-14T06:44:48 < rajkosto> last byte you wanna read
2019-02-14T06:44:49 < branjb> that's quite a special programmer
2019-02-14T06:45:03 < rajkosto> waouw
2019-02-14T06:45:07 < jadew> works great
2019-02-14T06:45:08 < R2COM> jack of all trades
2019-02-14T06:45:11 < R2COM> and master of none
2019-02-14T06:45:17 < R2COM> i thought you are a software gui pro?
2019-02-14T06:45:36 < jadew> R2COM, I used to be a software pro, not GUI in particular
2019-02-14T06:45:44 < R2COM> what you mean used to
2019-02-14T06:45:51 < jadew> I quit ~ two years ago
2019-02-14T06:45:54 < R2COM> why
2019-02-14T06:46:00 < jadew> got borred
2019-02-14T06:46:08 < R2COM> so what you doing now
2019-02-14T06:46:19 < jadew> designing hardware and spending money
2019-02-14T06:46:26 < branjb> and burning MCUs
2019-02-14T06:46:29 < jadew> and that
2019-02-14T06:46:36 < R2COM> how does that pay bills
2019-02-14T06:46:42 < jadew> it doesn't
2019-02-14T06:47:00 < jadew> at least not yet, which is why I have to start doing freelancing
2019-02-14T06:47:22 < jadew> I figured I could do both sw and hw, hence "everything" because that's all there is the world
2019-02-14T06:47:41 < R2COM> what about particle astrophysics
2019-02-14T06:47:59 < jadew> if I don't do it, it doesn't exist
2019-02-14T06:48:38 < branjb> the only people who want someone to do a freelance hw and sw project also want to pay them $500 for 100+ hours of time
2019-02-14T06:48:56 < jadew> branjb, yeah, that seems to be the case
2019-02-14T06:49:18 < branjb> sad world we live in
2019-02-14T06:49:31 < jadew> I've been scounting a little and it seems they really don't care about the quality
2019-02-14T06:49:48 < branjb> that's the same in the professional world too though
2019-02-14T06:49:54 < jadew> which is why I see a lot of projects on fixing previous work (presumably done by $5/h pros)
2019-02-14T06:49:58 < R2COM> depends on project and company
2019-02-14T06:50:13 < branjb> lol
2019-02-14T06:50:39 < R2COM> noone who is serious about product will hire sw+hw "do it all" guy
2019-02-14T06:50:44 < aandrew> man I do not want to replace this BGA
2019-02-14T06:50:53 < aandrew> branjb: fuck right off with tag connect haha
2019-02-14T06:50:54 < branjb> somehow the program that i got put on at work is reusing some legacy project from a decade ago that we are now finding out they fudged and skipped a ton of integration and testing
2019-02-14T06:51:22 < branjb> so i spend my day fixing code worse than a pajeet could write
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2019-02-14T06:51:52 < jadew> R2COM, yeah, thought that could be an issue... so I'm not sure how to go about that
2019-02-14T06:52:03 < R2COM> i guess do what you do best
2019-02-14T06:52:07 < aandrew> R2COM> noone who is serious about product will hire sw+hw "do it all" guy
2019-02-14T06:52:11 < R2COM> if its sw then it is the way to go
2019-02-14T06:52:12 < aandrew> speak for yourslef, I am that guy
2019-02-14T06:52:12 < jadew> on one hand, I'm not that happy about doing sw for other people, on the other hand, I'm really good at it
2019-02-14T06:52:28 < R2COM> no you are not
2019-02-14T06:53:03 < branjb> i had to add a single SCPI command to some power supply code we have and had to go through 4 or 5 layers of wrappers and setters/getters 
2019-02-14T06:53:05 < jadew> thing is, I want to do hw (I think I'm decent on this front too)
2019-02-14T06:53:35 < R2COM> hw != MCU+shit
2019-02-14T06:53:54 < R2COM> hw is vague statement and varies
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2019-02-14T06:55:03 < aandrew> R2COM: I'm not?
2019-02-14T06:55:09 < R2COM> nah
2019-02-14T06:55:27 < aandrew> could have fooled me
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2019-02-14T06:57:04 < jadew> I kinda wonder what the indians are producing in terms of hardware
2019-02-14T06:57:25 < jadew> R2COM, what does it mean to you? to me it just means hardware design - of the various kinds
2019-02-14T06:58:14 < R2COM> a loty of everyday usage hw made in asia
2019-02-14T06:58:31 < R2COM> or cheap "unbranded" shit from ali
2019-02-14T06:58:38 < branjb> mfg in china or designed in china?
2019-02-14T06:58:44 < R2COM> designed too
2019-02-14T06:59:14 < R2COM> come on man they launched drone on dark side of the moon they know how to design basic shit which you do in your home
2019-02-14T06:59:17 < branjb> yeah rip america's EE industry
2019-02-14T06:59:29 < R2COM> why would it rip?
2019-02-14T06:59:43 < branjb> because if it's not defense related its outsourced
2019-02-14T06:59:50 < R2COM> you are not intelligent, sorry
2019-02-14T06:59:55 < R2COM> no
2019-02-14T06:59:55 < branjb> k
2019-02-14T07:00:21 < R2COM> expensive medical, mining, industrial measurement/machinery equipment etc made in usa
2019-02-14T07:00:22 < jadew> R2COM, sorry, but the chinese crap from aliexpress or ebay is usually crap
2019-02-14T07:01:11 < jadew> now, I'm sure they have lots of good engineers, but what I'm wondering about is what those guys that charge $5/hr are producing
2019-02-14T07:01:31 < R2COM> pretty sure they get paid more than that
2019-02-14T07:02:11 < R2COM> its 2019, china changed a lot
2019-02-14T07:02:32 < branjb> vietnam the new china
2019-02-14T07:03:50 < bitmask> nice, vday present finished just in time
2019-02-14T07:05:17 < jadew> R2COM, so in your opinion I shouldn't advertise myself as both sw and hw guy?
2019-02-14T07:05:37 < R2COM> not if you dont want to be tagged as $5/hr guy
2019-02-14T07:05:43 < jadew> hah
2019-02-14T07:07:24 < R2COM> jadew how much would you charge for doing some GUI soft
2019-02-14T07:07:39 < jadew> depends
2019-02-14T07:07:52 < jadew> $50-$80 /hr
2019-02-14T07:08:05 < jadew> I'm not keen on doing that yet tho
2019-02-14T07:08:10 < jadew> I'd rather do hw
2019-02-14T07:08:28 < jadew> or both, that would make it bearable
2019-02-14T07:08:46 < R2COM> $8k to finish some 100hr development worth sw project
2019-02-14T07:08:54 < R2COM> (if it can be done within 100hr..)
2019-02-14T07:09:29 < jadew> you have that project?
2019-02-14T07:09:36 < R2COM> not yet
2019-02-14T07:10:02 < R2COM> but if it takes 2x of that to finish, someone might just negotiate a flat rate "per project"
2019-02-14T07:10:22 < jadew> eh, you never know how long it takes
2019-02-14T07:11:19 < jadew> if you say it's a 100h project, it means it has some complexity in it, which means there's room for things to go wrong
2019-02-14T07:12:49 < aandrew> I can never estimate projects like that and as a general rule I don't do fixed bids
2019-02-14T07:13:08 < aandrew> nobody ever wants to sign a spec and nobody ever gives enough detail
2019-02-14T07:14:16 < jadew> I haven't done freelance jobs in a very long while, but that's the case for full-time jobs too
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2019-02-14T07:14:28 < R2COM> full time job is different
2019-02-14T07:14:37 < R2COM> and doubt you can get $80/hr that easily there lol
2019-02-14T07:15:50 < aandrew> not as an employee no
2019-02-14T07:15:58 < R2COM> i just wanna build a spaceship and travel on another planets, mine gold, bring them on earth and sell
2019-02-14T07:16:07 < branjb> play EVE
2019-02-14T07:16:11 < jadew> haha
2019-02-14T07:16:22 < aandrew> I bill myself out at $125/hr, going to $150 now. fuck being an employee and putting up with that bS
2019-02-14T07:16:43 < jadew> branjb, I think in EVE you'd be mining tritanium
2019-02-14T07:17:03 < jadew> aandrew, neat
2019-02-14T07:17:04 < branjb> aandrew does it have to be engineering work?
2019-02-14T07:17:18 < jadew> wish I had customers that paid like that
2019-02-14T07:17:33 < aandrew> branjb: I couldn't possibly bill out at that rate for non-engineering stuff. I'm a one trick pony
2019-02-14T07:18:36 < R2COM> employee = tolerate stupid retards every day
2019-02-14T07:18:57 < R2COM> and deal with stupid people surrounding you
2019-02-14T07:19:07 < R2COM> and plus that ethical shit
2019-02-14T07:19:15 < aandrew> it's not even that
2019-02-14T07:19:16 < R2COM> i cant use words: faggot etc
2019-02-14T07:19:29 < bitmask> I don't mind being an employee but I don't know where I  can get a job.  Every place either requires 3-5 years experience or entry level with experience in A through Z
2019-02-14T07:19:40 < aandrew> it's business policies, HR shit, fighitng for vacation time or scheduling
2019-02-14T07:20:07 < R2COM> i never have problems with business policy, HR loves me, and i take vacation any time i want
2019-02-14T07:20:29 < jadew> I had it easy in that regard, I could get vacation anytime, but I wasn't happy with the pay anymore and I felt I'm not advancing
2019-02-14T07:21:05 < jadew> it's not better now, but it could get better, which is why I quit
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2019-02-14T07:23:29 < R2COM> if you switch from one company to another you can make 10-20% jumps in salary
2019-02-14T07:23:51 < R2COM> if you stay with one company for many years you advnace very slow
2019-02-14T07:23:54 < jadew> still... it sucks
2019-02-14T07:23:58 < jadew> someone tells you what to work on
2019-02-14T07:24:06 < jadew> as opposed to you having a choice
2019-02-14T07:24:21 < aandrew> you're kidding yourself if you think you can work on what you like when working for yourself
2019-02-14T07:24:27 < aandrew> you have a wider variety of course
2019-02-14T07:24:30 < aandrew> but still you answer to someone
2019-02-14T07:24:39 < R2COM> it depends on wha ttype of "work for yourse;lf
2019-02-14T07:24:46 < R2COM> if you developing own product then yes
2019-02-14T07:24:48 < R2COM> you do what you want
2019-02-14T07:24:56 < R2COM> if you are contractor, you will have to deal with BS too
2019-02-14T07:24:57 < jadew> aandrew, yeah, but you get to choose who you answer to, and also what R2COM said
2019-02-14T07:25:35 < R2COM> you take project, it starts, then stupid requests follow and you have to deal with it
2019-02-14T07:25:40 < R2COM> you dont have 100% of freedom
2019-02-14T07:25:51 < R2COM> only freedom is personal product development
2019-02-14T07:26:01 < jadew> you have no idea what I had to deal with as a SA
2019-02-14T07:27:03 < jadew> ever changing requirements and awkward ways of expressing them
2019-02-14T07:27:12 < aandrew> SA?
2019-02-14T07:27:17 < jadew> software architect
2019-02-14T07:27:27 < R2COM> sex addict
2019-02-14T07:29:19 < aandrew> fuck. I only brought one MCU in
2019-02-14T07:29:26 < aandrew> Arrow will have them to me monday
2019-02-14T07:29:32 < aandrew> but I'll have ten fully populated boards tomorrow
2019-02-14T07:29:34 < aandrew> balls
2019-02-14T07:29:37 < aandrew> I can't work on this anymore tonight
2019-02-14T07:31:32 < jadew> R2COM, you kinda pissed on my parade, but you basically said the same thing I was worrying about
2019-02-14T07:32:00 < jadew> I'll have to present myself differently
2019-02-14T07:32:07 < R2COM> yep
2019-02-14T07:32:20 < aandrew> jadew: any contractor has your same issues
2019-02-14T07:32:28 < aandrew> nobody likes to work from specs
2019-02-14T07:34:06 < jadew> aandrew, I know, it's not that big of a deal for me
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2019-02-14T07:35:17 < jadew> I've learned to deal with that a long time ago
2019-02-14T07:37:55 < jadew> for fixed-price contract work, I'd just let them know that if they have extensive changes, I'll charge them extra
2019-02-14T07:38:11 < aandrew> hm this chip still is functioning, but the SWD seems fucked
2019-02-14T07:38:14 < jadew> I'm sure they'll see it as fair
2019-02-14T07:38:27 < aandrew> jadew: sure but then you get into what is considered "extensive"
2019-02-14T07:38:36 < aandrew> creeping featurism is a bitch
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2019-02-14T07:38:48 < jadew> that would be for me to decide
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2019-02-14T08:16:21 < dongs> what did you break now macdrew
2019-02-14T08:18:21 < aandrew> dunno
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2019-02-14T08:18:32 < aandrew> I"ve been fucking around with jtag/swd and I think I damaged the pad
2019-02-14T08:18:38 < aandrew> chip seems to function fine
2019-02-14T08:18:41 < aandrew> just can't see it on SWD
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2019-02-14T08:26:29 < dongs> https://youtu.be/jvb9b8GMDTg?t=578 found chinagirl box packing dude
2019-02-14T08:30:55 < tjq> the autism scale is emitting smoke
2019-02-14T08:31:01 < dongs> totally
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2019-02-14T08:56:27 < aandrew> hm
2019-02-14T08:56:35 < aandrew> I put a 1k pullup on swdio and it came back to life
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2019-02-14T10:16:45 < jadew> jeez... I got quoted by China 60% more than I got quoted in here for a machined part...
2019-02-14T10:17:13 < Steffanx> Awh
2019-02-14T10:17:24 < jadew> well, it wasn't exactly 60%, but that would have been the cost for me after taxes
2019-02-14T10:17:38 < jadew> so... about 50%?
2019-02-14T10:17:48 < Steffanx> Romania is the new china?
2019-02-14T10:18:07 < Steffanx> When will you start foxconning jadew?
2019-02-14T10:18:32 < jadew> I think they're prices are not as low as they used to be - maybe?
2019-02-14T10:18:32 < kakimir> is jadew a machinist?
2019-02-14T10:18:42 < jadew> *their
2019-02-14T10:18:57 < jadew> kakimir, not yet, but I plan to become
2019-02-14T10:19:12 < jadew> at these prices, it's going to be cheaper to machine the parts myself
2019-02-14T10:19:18 < Steffanx> For now
2019-02-14T10:20:16 < kakimir> china realized the middleman role in business
2019-02-14T10:21:05 < kakimir> somebody wants something - find somebody that does the job for you - profit
2019-02-14T10:22:14 < jadew> yeah... but I don't think it's going to work that well
2019-02-14T10:22:23 < kakimir> for who?
2019-02-14T10:22:26 < jadew> for them
2019-02-14T10:22:43 < jadew> I would have used their services to save money
2019-02-14T10:22:58 < jadew> there's no other reason for me to do that
2019-02-14T10:23:26 < jadew> so if they're more expensive than the local shop (even before applying taxes & shipping), then it's a no-go
2019-02-14T10:24:41 < jadew> the only things that are still cheap, seem to be items that are garbage to begin with
2019-02-14T10:25:43 < jadew> did I not tell you about that time when I got quoted a couple of bucks for a nut?
2019-02-14T10:39:33 -!- tjq [uid339161@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nsodskqttfxsyvtw] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
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2019-02-14T11:02:32 < Steffanx> Hah mawk soon your image hosting is dooomed. With this new uploading filter. Gotta love the EU.
2019-02-14T11:02:48 < Ecco> Yay
2019-02-14T11:02:49 < Ecco> (gdb) file epsilon.elf 
2019-02-14T11:02:49 < Ecco> A program is being debugged already.
2019-02-14T11:02:49 < Ecco> Are you sure you want to change the file? (y or n) y
2019-02-14T11:02:49 < Ecco> Reading symbols from epsilon.elf...
2019-02-14T11:02:52 < Ecco> zsh: segmentation fault  arm-none-eabi-gdb
2019-02-14T11:03:09 < Ecco> never had that occur before
2019-02-14T11:04:18 < jadew> Steffanx, what uploading filter?
2019-02-14T11:04:50 < Steffanx> Oh the EU wants some upload filter. No more copyrighted stuff on youtube et all
2019-02-14T11:05:47 < jadew> Haohmaru, good ones do that
2019-02-14T11:06:12 < jadew> Steffanx, neat, more legislation nobody asked for
2019-02-14T11:18:01 < rajkosto> 10 days ago i said i would either have my pcbs the next day if no customs or 12 days after if customs, guess which one happened
2019-02-14T11:18:37 < jadew> they stole your boards
2019-02-14T11:19:01 < rajkosto> no, i get an update every day on tracking when the customs office opens that they didnt process it the previous day lol
2019-02-14T11:19:12 < rajkosto> 8 such entries already
2019-02-14T11:20:04 < jadew> are you from Romania?
2019-02-14T11:20:11 < rajkosto> close
2019-02-14T11:20:26 < rajkosto> anyway, previous package from UK was 3 days shipping, 12 days customs, so thats what im expecting
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2019-02-14T11:20:57 < jadew> so Slovakia
2019-02-14T11:21:01 < rajkosto> i should have not used lcsc for parts
2019-02-14T11:21:13 < rajkosto> the pcb alone would have been light/cheap enough to just be skipped by customs
2019-02-14T11:21:48 < rajkosto> and then i could have ordered like 100 different small envelopes from china/singapore that would have arrived sooner than this (the ones that i ordered from ali cuz lcsc didnt have, i got already)
2019-02-14T11:24:10 < rajkosto> this is why i have BOXES of chinese padded envelopes with 1 type of component each
2019-02-14T11:24:19 < jadew> I meant Serbia
2019-02-14T11:24:25  * jadew should go to sleep
2019-02-14T11:24:32 < rajkosto> what do you get if you /whois my nick
2019-02-14T11:24:39 < jadew> I don't know
2019-02-14T11:24:53 < jadew> .rs
2019-02-14T11:24:56 < jadew> what's that?
2019-02-14T11:25:00 < rajkosto> its that
2019-02-14T11:25:10 < jadew> Serbia?
2019-02-14T11:25:11 < rajkosto> you get the full host or masked ? i obviously cant tell myself
2019-02-14T11:25:19 < jadew> it's the full one
2019-02-14T11:25:27 < jadew> you have to enable masking for it to be masked
2019-02-14T11:25:35 < jadew> (you have to ask the gods of freenode)
2019-02-14T11:26:10 < rajkosto> dont hecc me pls kthx
2019-02-14T11:26:21 < jadew> too late
2019-02-14T11:26:30 < rajkosto> oh no all my barely working stm32 and fpga codes
2019-02-14T11:26:31 < jadew> I'm already filming you masturbate
2019-02-14T11:26:54 < jadew> send bitcoins to cdb180d7-62de-4661-a2de-d66162ded661
2019-02-14T11:27:02 < rajkosto> cool guid
2019-02-14T11:27:18 < jadew> :P
2019-02-14T11:32:41 < jadew> yet, you found his IP address!
2019-02-14T11:34:21  * jadew is browsing \\cable-178-149-127-67.dynamic.sbb.rs\
2019-02-14T11:38:51 < jadew> I'm off to bed, nigth
2019-02-14T11:38:57 < jadew> night
2019-02-14T11:55:17 < Steffanx> Good morning Haohmaru. 
2019-02-14T12:01:49 < qyx> morning guys
2019-02-14T12:08:15 < qyx> so I draw that LED SMPS during the night
2019-02-14T12:08:55 < qyx> I'll see how does the current mode control work with the internal comparator and DAC and timers
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2019-02-14T12:32:13 < rajkosto> oh no
2019-02-14T12:33:30 < rajkosto> why not use proper led current mode controller
2019-02-14T12:33:33 < rajkosto> i had to give in and do that
2019-02-14T12:33:53 < tjq> its good
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2019-02-14T12:51:21 < kakimir> alternatives for ACS724?
2019-02-14T12:51:41 < kakimir> 10AU and 05AB are not basically available
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2019-02-14T13:12:21 < jpa-> would you put micro-usb or usb C as the charging connector in a new device?
2019-02-14T13:13:15 < rajkosto> micro-usb is easier, there's more chargers for it
2019-02-14T13:13:30 < kakimir> depends on device
2019-02-14T13:13:30 < rajkosto> usb-c gives you optional superspeed, more than 5V/2A
2019-02-14T13:13:43 < rajkosto> but requires a frontend chip or something to mess with the CC line
2019-02-14T13:13:51 < jpa-> yeah, no need for high current
2019-02-14T13:14:17 < rajkosto> and the connectors are waaay more expensive and usually are mid-mount
2019-02-14T13:17:05 < qyx> no, because in 2019 I don't have a single usb-c charger
2019-02-14T13:17:11 < qyx> and most of the people neither
2019-02-14T13:17:30 < jpa-> yeah, that's probably true
2019-02-14T13:17:31 < qyx> so if there is no required added value, I would go micro-B
2019-02-14T13:17:48 < jpa-> will take a few more years before usb-c is more common
2019-02-14T13:19:11 < qyx> I is a big surprise for me that the world has settled on a common household charger connector
2019-02-14T13:19:15 < qyx> which is a big improvement
2019-02-14T13:19:21 < qyx> *it
2019-02-14T13:20:52 < rajkosto> EU MANDATED microusb
2019-02-14T13:21:10 < rajkosto> did they do anything about usb-c ? like say usb-c is acceptable ? or do companies have to include a usb-c to microusb adapter
2019-02-14T13:21:44 < karlp> ah, so rajkosti is a piboi it seems
2019-02-14T13:22:10 < rajkosto> a wot
2019-02-14T13:22:59 < englishman> haha @ branjb raging about low freelance pay
2019-02-14T13:23:09 < englishman> he was in here last week pie-eyed about how much cash he was going to make
2019-02-14T13:23:13 < qyx> yeah and thats the case when regulation is good
2019-02-14T13:24:10 < englishman> usbC is definitely more versatile and durable
2019-02-14T13:28:28 < emeryth> rajkosto: the EU did not mandate it, the companies complied volountarily
2019-02-14T13:29:16 < karlp> eu only said, "use a fucking common phone charger, we don't mind what it is"
2019-02-14T13:29:35 < karlp> jpa-: I'd still go micro-b for now.
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2019-02-14T13:46:25 < zyp> jpa-, what sort of device is it?
2019-02-14T13:54:30 < zyp> that usually means your cable is shit
2019-02-14T13:54:48 < zyp> micro-b is designed so it's the plugs that wear, not the sockets
2019-02-14T13:55:04 < rajkosto> cables go to shit at about the same rate for usb-c and microb
2019-02-14T13:55:09 < rajkosto> depends on cable quality
2019-02-14T13:55:13 < zyp> this was the main improvement from mini-b, where you had to replace the device after connector wear
2019-02-14T13:55:52 < rajkosto> get a toothpick
2019-02-14T13:55:53 < rajkosto> clean it out
2019-02-14T13:56:05 < qyx> or don't smoke
2019-02-14T13:56:07 < qyx> solved
2019-02-14T13:56:38 < rajkosto> MY JUUUL PODS
2019-02-14T13:57:36 < kakimir> JUUL
2019-02-14T14:08:18 < dongs> allright
2019-02-14T14:08:43 < dongs> so i suspect my parallel>usb bridge chip is maybe losing packets so time to make a test thing in cpld to generate some sequential data to see if im losing some
2019-02-14T14:08:50 < dongs> prepare for more dumb questions from me!
2019-02-14T14:09:26 < karlp> "nylon" ?
2019-02-14T14:10:00 < Thorn> is ENIG a completely chemical process? no electroplating involved?
2019-02-14T14:10:19 < dongs> i think this dude means 'latex'
2019-02-14T14:10:29 < Ultrasauce> i believe the E holds the answer thorn
2019-02-14T14:11:00 < dongs> i can't spell nigger without ENIG
2019-02-14T14:11:02 < Thorn> does it refer to the nickel process only or to both nickel and gold?
2019-02-14T14:14:53 < karlp> wht's your hypothesis?
2019-02-14T14:15:46 < jpa-> so, uh, stupid question: does one use solder paste with bga packages? if no, how does the chip stay in place during reflow?
2019-02-14T14:16:38 < dongs> jpa-: yes, of course.
2019-02-14T14:16:47 < dongs> i assemble bga stuff.
2019-02-14T14:16:50 < dongs> they have balls.
2019-02-14T14:16:51 < dongs> and paste.
2019-02-14T14:16:56 < jpa-> ok, makes sense
2019-02-14T14:16:57 < dongs> it gets put on the board, it reflows.
2019-02-14T14:17:01 < dongs> same as any other part
2019-02-14T14:17:09 < dongs> the balls sit on paste
2019-02-14T14:17:15 < dongs> if its aligned OK at start, its not going anywhere.
2019-02-14T14:17:25 < dongs> and the surface tension etc shit will center it just like any other part.
2019-02-14T14:17:53 < rajkosto> jpa-, if you arent pick and placing
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2019-02-14T14:17:56 < rajkosto> you can do it without solder paste
2019-02-14T14:17:58 < rajkosto> just flux
2019-02-14T14:18:05 < rajkosto> then place the balls onto the pads as well as you can
2019-02-14T14:18:08 < dongs> lmao please dont
2019-02-14T14:18:21 < dongs> rajkosto: jpa can afford some solder paste and as tencil
2019-02-14T14:18:22 < jpa-> dongs: any guess for a good stencil hole size for 0.25mm balls?
2019-02-14T14:18:23 < dongs> a stencil
2019-02-14T14:18:27 < rajkosto> dongs, its not the stencil
2019-02-14T14:18:31 < dongs> jpa-: what pitch?
2019-02-14T14:18:35 < jpa-> 0.5mm
2019-02-14T14:18:36 < rajkosto> its that you can smear the paste around during alignment if doing it by hand
2019-02-14T14:18:48 < dongs> i have some .5mm pitch stuff lemme see
2019-02-14T14:18:58 < rajkosto> so its better without if hand aligning
2019-02-14T14:19:01 < jpa-> rajkosto: yeah, i've seen people do it with just flux, but seems more like one-off stuff
2019-02-14T14:19:12 < rajkosto> thats why you do ENIG
2019-02-14T14:19:21 < rajkosto> all perfectly level
2019-02-14T14:19:23 < dongs> is that a STM?
2019-02-14T14:19:26 < rajkosto> so you can get by with just flux
2019-02-14T14:19:30 < dongs> i have some STM part with that pitch
2019-02-14T14:19:34 < dongs> and 0.25mm batlls
2019-02-14T14:19:44 < rajkosto> i wouldnt do 0.5mm pitch by hand at all
2019-02-14T14:19:46 < jpa-> dongs: that'll be a good enough guess, though this is some dialogic part
2019-02-14T14:20:06 < dongs> and paste openings are just same size as balls, 0.25mm
2019-02-14T14:20:11 < jpa-> (err, dialog)
2019-02-14T14:20:12 < dongs> it has worked previouisly without issues
2019-02-14T14:20:23 < jpa-> dongs: ok, that's good to know
2019-02-14T14:20:34 < jpa-> what about pad sizes, 0.25mm also?
2019-02-14T14:20:43 < Ultrasauce> Thorn: i think it might vary, i'm seeing conflicting sources
2019-02-14T14:21:15 < dongs> jpa, yes
2019-02-14T14:21:36 < Thorn> if it's electric how do they connect the galvanic psu to every pad?
2019-02-14T14:21:47 < jpa-> dongs: thanks!
2019-02-14T14:21:48 < dongs> STM actualyl recommends 0.27mm pads
2019-02-14T14:21:55 < dongs> but i went with 0.25 and works fine
2019-02-14T14:22:02 < dongs> i think i needed more space for routing or someshit
2019-02-14T14:22:22 < jpa-> Thorn: wikipedia says E is for Electroless
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2019-02-14T14:22:41 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/LSnGwMl.png
2019-02-14T14:23:27 < Thorn> jpa-: <Thorn>	does it refer to the nickel process only or to both nickel and gold?
2019-02-14T14:23:52 < jpa-> Thorn: "electroless nickel" "immersion gold", so first electroless solution for nickel, and then immersion for gold
2019-02-14T14:24:11 < Thorn> what does immersion mean exactly
2019-02-14T14:24:16 < jpa-> https://www.corrosionpedia.com/definition/660/immersion-plating
2019-02-14T14:24:37 < jpa-> basically gold ions will deposit by itself on nickel
2019-02-14T14:25:15 < Thorn> if both processes are the same (put into a solution to plate with nickel, put into another solution for gold) why are they named differently
2019-02-14T14:25:24 < Thorn> is it because the chemistry is different?
2019-02-14T14:27:13 < jpa-> yeah, IIRC gold deposit on less-noble metals quite easily
2019-02-14T14:27:26 < jpa-> while nickel requires something special to go on copper
2019-02-14T14:28:15 < jpa-> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroless_plating  so in electroless plating there is some catalyst that provides the energy for the deposition reaction
2019-02-14T14:32:21 < kakimir> recommend a plating for copper/brass parts that is both corrosion resistant and solderable
2019-02-14T14:32:39 < Thorn> ok thanks
2019-02-14T14:32:40 < kakimir> so that no partial plating needs to be done
2019-02-14T14:33:11 < kakimir> what are contact terminals usually plated with?
2019-02-14T14:33:12 < kakimir> tin?
2019-02-14T14:33:42 < jpa-> gold, nickel, tin; corrosion resistance varies
2019-02-14T14:34:06 < jpa-> even copper/brass itself is corrosion resistant, it just won't remain conductive in the oxidized parts
2019-02-14T14:34:13 < jpa-> but if it is already soldered it might not matter
2019-02-14T14:34:27 < jpa-> oh, and zinc of course also
2019-02-14T14:34:59 < kakimir> there needs to be part that is soldered to pcb
2019-02-14T14:35:07 < kakimir> and part that is exposed to elements
2019-02-14T14:38:02 < kakimir> partial plating would do it
2019-02-14T14:38:17 < kakimir> nickel is applied in electroplating?
2019-02-14T14:43:40 < englishman> Thorn: afaik it is entirely chemical yes
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2019-02-14T14:44:23 < englishman> the nickel process is catalyzed with palladium
2019-02-14T14:44:51 < englishman> i am going to the pcb place tonight and they just installed an enig line i can ask
2019-02-14T14:45:21 < englishman> there was also something cool about the copper diffusing through the nickel, or similar
2019-02-14T14:46:18 < englishman> anyway it has to be electroless because you will never be able to have continuity to all the traces after etching
2019-02-14T14:46:43 < englishman> unless you design that in, as in finger gold
2019-02-14T14:52:18 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-14T14:52:21 < kakimir> ofc
2019-02-14T14:53:07 < englishman> yes kaks there is a few mils of nickel on the copper then the gold
2019-02-14T14:59:24 < kakimir> yesbox
2019-02-14T15:05:35 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaXSCHE8SDI rainy day musics
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2019-02-14T16:19:24 < kakimir> I need refresh my memory about arrays
2019-02-14T16:19:57 < kakimir> so I have struct type
2019-02-14T16:20:09 < kakimir> that includes const char *
2019-02-14T16:20:31 < kakimir> I usually avoid such thing
2019-02-14T16:20:32 < Cracki> <º))))><
2019-02-14T16:20:43 < Cracki> it's all good man
2019-02-14T16:21:05 < kakimir> so when I create const instance of this new structtype
2019-02-14T16:22:21 < kakimir> I get values to it with macro that produces {1,2,3,"blah"}
2019-02-14T16:22:32 < kakimir> does it then allocate mem for that "blah"
2019-02-14T16:23:02 < Cracki> sure
2019-02-14T16:23:16 < Cracki> constness doesn't change the need for things to be somewhere
2019-02-14T16:23:42 < Cracki> in particular, in C, evena "const int" uses ram because you can take a pointer to it
2019-02-14T16:24:07 < Cracki> the compiler might optimize that away if it's smart and you don't actually access it like that
2019-02-14T16:25:43 < Cracki> in particular, I think the "blah" gets put somewhere anyway, and the struct field gets the address to that
2019-02-14T16:27:45 < qyx> what, you get a warning "discarding conts" if you try to cast const to non-const
2019-02-14T16:28:55 < qyx> when particularly does the compiler place const variables to the ram?
2019-02-14T16:31:58 < Cracki> yes, always, because you can take pointers to const values (unless you don't and it's smart enough to optimize that away)
2019-02-14T16:33:55 < kakimir> now I understand
2019-02-14T16:34:28 < kakimir> expression "string" generates string data to address space and returns pointer
2019-02-14T16:35:00 < kakimir> how did I define that not only the pointer is const but the data in array is also const?
2019-02-14T16:35:33 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-14T16:35:42 < kakimir> how
2019-02-14T16:37:10 < kakimir> but as I create const instance of the structtype it is reduntant and I need only const char *
2019-02-14T16:43:29 < kakimir> more I know the less I know
2019-02-14T16:43:35 < kakimir> you nasty boy
2019-02-14T16:44:04 < kakimir> actually void pointers would be pretty for strings
2019-02-14T16:44:25 < kakimir> usually I use uin8_t
2019-02-14T16:44:35 < kakimir> for strings
2019-02-14T16:46:15 < kakimir> the type is not important I think
2019-02-14T16:46:33 < kakimir> but there is some flags that define something about strings
2019-02-14T16:46:58 < kakimir> if strings are int8_t or uint8_t or something
2019-02-14T16:47:15 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/lDVGKv91.html does this look right if I wanna pick the bits
2019-02-14T16:47:32 < kakimir> char is just another name for uint8_t
2019-02-14T16:47:56 < kakimir> does that flag in project properties change that?
2019-02-14T16:48:39 < kakimir> idk.
2019-02-14T16:48:43 < kakimir> idc.
2019-02-14T16:49:12 < kakimir> everything works
2019-02-14T16:49:34 < kakimir> when things work - there no issue - do nothing about it
2019-02-14T16:50:36 < kakimir> when there is issue - you learn then what you need to fix stuff
2019-02-14T16:54:42 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-14T16:54:45 < dongs> i added stuff
2019-02-14T16:54:55 < dongs> and the clock constraints are getting worse and worse
2019-02-14T16:54:58 < dongs> da fuqs going on
2019-02-14T16:55:43 < dongs> is 'case' statement expensive?
2019-02-14T16:55:43 < dongs> yes
2019-02-14T16:56:01 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/ZHEnAg20.html this is my current filth
2019-02-14T17:03:12 < dongs> hmmm
2019-02-14T17:03:20 < dongs> hardware is outputting 191 bytes between sync
2019-02-14T17:03:21 < dongs> instead of 188
2019-02-14T17:03:23 < dongs> da fuq
2019-02-14T17:03:26 < dongs> how did i screw that one up
2019-02-14T17:08:00 < kakimir> dongs isn't godlike after all
2019-02-14T17:08:22 < kakimir> I have only heard him rage about mistakes others make
2019-02-14T17:09:13 < kakimir> what is this language
2019-02-14T17:10:58 < dongs> yes fact
2019-02-14T17:11:09 < kakimir> it looks garbegeish
2019-02-14T17:12:55 < kakimir> but seriously
2019-02-14T17:12:58 < kakimir> what is it
2019-02-14T17:13:03 < dongs> verilog lol
2019-02-14T17:14:57 < Thorn> musics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0iJgUzs8IU
2019-02-14T17:15:18 < jadew> dongs, is that thing supposed to run every 8th clock?
2019-02-14T17:16:22 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-14T17:16:27 < dongs> i'm dividing clock first
2019-02-14T17:16:32 < jadew> and what's the problem?
2019-02-14T17:16:33 < dongs> i wonder if I should do taht separately in another module 
2019-02-14T17:16:44 < jadew> yeah, that would be a good idea
2019-02-14T17:16:56 < jadew> just write a clock divider
2019-02-14T17:17:05 < jadew> and instantiate it as you need it
2019-02-14T17:17:09 < dongs> FUCK
2019-02-14T17:17:10 < dongs> the problem is
2019-02-14T17:17:20 < dongs> if (ts_counter >  has no fucking effect
2019-02-14T17:17:27 < dongs> it just randomly decides when to cahnge it
2019-02-14T17:17:35 < dongs> right now it resets every 0x100 bytes
2019-02-14T17:17:41 < dongs> i reduced 188/189 to 120
2019-02-14T17:17:45 < dongs> and it STILL resets every 0x100 bytes
2019-02-14T17:17:46 < dongs> ???
2019-02-14T17:19:36 < jadew> well, I can see the problem
2019-02-14T17:19:49 < jadew> I'm surprised the synthesizer didn't complain about it
2019-02-14T17:19:51 < dongs> you do?
2019-02-14T17:20:21 < jadew> I think I do
2019-02-14T17:20:24 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/TAGmLQ85.html
2019-02-14T17:20:27 < dongs> ive cleaned it up as such for now
2019-02-14T17:20:36 < dongs> the > xx makes no diff tho
2019-02-14T17:20:56 < jadew> you're assigning ts_counter from two places when the condition is met
2019-02-14T17:21:29 < jadew> if (ts_counter > 120) // do shit; <= 0; else ts_counter <= ts_counter + 1;
2019-02-14T17:21:31 < dongs> so i should put ++ into else ?
2019-02-14T17:21:32 < dongs> ok
2019-02-14T17:21:43 < jadew> you should increment in the else block
2019-02-14T17:21:53 < jadew> so you're either setting it to 0 or you're incrementing it
2019-02-14T17:21:56 < jadew> not both
2019-02-14T17:22:16 < dongs> lets roll this and see
2019-02-14T17:22:28 < jadew> although, not sure if that would generate the glitch you speak of, since it's a thing that would happen when you reach the condition and you say you're not reaching it
2019-02-14T17:23:11 < dongs> now its 190
2019-02-14T17:23:22 < jadew> with the condition being for what?
2019-02-14T17:23:31 < dongs> if (ts_counter > 188) begin
2019-02-14T17:23:42 < dongs> rebuilding with 186..
2019-02-14T17:23:42 < jadew> ok, it sounds right I guess
2019-02-14T17:23:57 < dongs> but i gues it wont change
2019-02-14T17:23:59 < dongs> which is the problem
2019-02-14T17:24:13 < dongs> hmm should I do the IFs on every clk_in
2019-02-14T17:24:17 < dongs> instead of every 7th clock?
2019-02-14T17:24:24 < dongs> i.e. on the faster clock
2019-02-14T17:24:33 < jadew> no, it shouldn't matter
2019-02-14T17:24:44 < dongs> -xBB now..
2019-02-14T17:24:52 < jadew> so that was the issue
2019-02-14T17:25:05 < dongs> no, its still broken
2019-02-14T17:25:08 < jadew> oh
2019-02-14T17:25:12 < dongs> i mean, im randomly changing if > value
2019-02-14T17:25:17 < dongs> until it will hit acvtually 188 over wire
2019-02-14T17:25:35 < dongs> wait so 187, i need to increment
2019-02-14T17:25:56 < jadew> if you're in the ballpark, it means that was the issue
2019-02-14T17:26:11 < jadew> and the reason you're not hitting the exact number is because of the logic of the thing
2019-02-14T17:26:18 < jadew> which should be easy to debug
2019-02-14T17:26:28 < dongs> now its BD
2019-02-14T17:26:28 < dongs> FUCK
2019-02-14T17:26:41 < jadew> you incremented by 1?
2019-02-14T17:26:49 < dongs> if (ts_counter > 187) begin
2019-02-14T17:27:05 < dongs> 186 was BB i think
2019-02-14T17:27:10 < dongs> i need fucking BC
2019-02-14T17:27:25 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-14T17:27:56 < dongs> hey its bc today
2019-02-14T17:28:20 < jadew> cool, so what did you set it to?
2019-02-14T17:28:26 < dongs> 186
2019-02-14T17:28:28 < jadew> 186?
2019-02-14T17:28:30 < dongs> but i had it there before
2019-02-14T17:28:35 < dongs> and it was BB
2019-02-14T17:28:38 < dongs> < dongs> rebuilding with 186..
2019-02-14T17:28:44 < dongs> < dongs> -xBB now..
2019-02-14T17:28:53 < jadew> maybe you had a typo?
2019-02-14T17:28:58 < jadew> let's see if it makes sense
2019-02-14T17:28:58 < dongs> no definitely not
2019-02-14T17:29:31 < fenugrec> you know that placin "ts_counter <= ts_counter + 1" before the "if (ts > 188)" is the same as placing it after, right...
2019-02-14T17:29:32 < jadew> when the reg > x, it becomes 0 and it ouputs something
2019-02-14T17:29:55 < dongs> fenugrec: no of course not
2019-02-14T17:29:56 < jadew> so you're outputting x + 2
2019-02-14T17:30:16 < jadew> because you have 1, from the clock with the condition
2019-02-14T17:30:20 < jadew> and 1 from the 0 position
2019-02-14T17:30:33 < jadew> so if you need 188, you'll have to set the condition for 188 - 2
2019-02-14T17:30:40 < jadew> so 186
2019-02-14T17:30:47 < jadew> which means it's working fine now
2019-02-14T17:30:54 < dongs> izzit
2019-02-14T17:31:20 < dongs> i recompiled and now its BF
2019-02-14T17:31:28 < jadew> hah
2019-02-14T17:31:49 < jadew> can you show the code?
2019-02-14T17:31:54 < jadew> the one you have right now
2019-02-14T17:31:56 < jadew> with BF
2019-02-14T17:32:23 < dongs> well i got rid of 32 bit sequence and made it only 4 bit and removed those 4 case: things that filled it
2019-02-14T17:32:28 < jadew> also, are you sure you're counting correctly?
2019-02-14T17:32:31 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-14T17:32:34 < dongs> i actually ran it in sim and it was fine
2019-02-14T17:32:36 < jadew> (with the scope or whatever?)
2019-02-14T17:32:41 < dongs> i wonder if this is because im failing clock constraint
2019-02-14T17:32:45 < dongs> like shit is too slow for this
2019-02-14T17:33:11 < jadew> if the clock is jittery, sure
2019-02-14T17:33:14 < jadew> that could happen
2019-02-14T17:33:15 < dongs> my clock is ~125, synth is telling me its good up to about 90 with 32bit and 119 with 4bit
2019-02-14T17:33:55 < jadew> how are you verifying the number of output bytes?
2019-02-14T17:34:05 < dongs> create_clock -period 5.000000 -name     |             |             |
2019-02-14T17:34:06 < dongs> clk0 [get_nets clk_in_c]                |  200.000 MHz|   94.331 MHz
2019-02-14T17:34:07 < jadew> do you also verify their content?
2019-02-14T17:34:10 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-14T17:34:13 < dongs> i can see the hex dump
2019-02-14T17:34:15 < dongs> content looks OK
2019-02-14T17:35:14 < jadew> I don't see anything else wrong with the code, so maybe look for something else at this point?
2019-02-14T17:36:15 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/e23PEi87.html
2019-02-14T17:37:48 < dongs> the outputs are like... 47 00 01 0X FF 32 24 16 08 FF FF FF .... until next sync
2019-02-14T17:37:50 < dongs> whic his correct
2019-02-14T17:37:56 < dongs> X = 15bit counter
2019-02-14T17:38:07 < dongs> and 32/24 = teh entire 32bit t hing
2019-02-14T17:38:17 < dongs> but FFs run t oo long
2019-02-14T17:41:26 < dongs> what the fucking hell
2019-02-14T17:41:41 < dongs> < jadew> because you have 1, from the clock with the condition
2019-02-14T17:41:44 < dongs> what the shit does this mean?
2019-02-14T17:42:18 < jadew> dongs, when in the clock when you set ts_counter to 0, you're also executing the case for ts_counter = x + 1
2019-02-14T17:42:35 < jadew> so you're executing it for x + 1
2019-02-14T17:42:36 < dongs> really?
2019-02-14T17:42:38 < dongs> what
2019-02-14T17:42:39 < dongs> why
2019-02-14T17:42:41 < jadew> and you're executing it for x = 0 too
2019-02-14T17:42:43 < dongs> its in else () part ?
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2019-02-14T17:42:49 < jadew> no
2019-02-14T17:43:04 < jadew> but the case () fires at the same time with the assignment
2019-02-14T17:43:12 < jadew> so it evaluates before the assignment is complete
2019-02-14T17:43:39 < jadew> you can put it in the else part
2019-02-14T17:43:52 < jadew> and then it won't fire when the condition is met too
2019-02-14T17:44:01 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/TP4vL953.html
2019-02-14T17:44:02 < jadew> and you'll only have x + 1
2019-02-14T17:44:03 < dongs> this is current shit
2019-02-14T17:44:26 < jadew> yeah, if you put it in the else block, then it should just be x + 1
2019-02-14T17:44:39 < dongs> put which part into else block?
2019-02-14T17:44:43 < jadew> the case
2019-02-14T17:44:49 < dongs> oh
2019-02-14T17:44:51 < dongs> OH!
2019-02-14T17:44:55 < dongs> fucking bullshit parallel crap
2019-02-14T17:45:16 < jadew> but then you'll have 8 skipped cycles
2019-02-14T17:45:35 < jadew> if you don't want to skip them, then you have to live with the -2 thing
2019-02-14T17:45:44 < dongs> waht skipped ccles
2019-02-14T17:45:46 < dongs> what will this skip
2019-02-14T17:46:02 < jadew> if you put it in the else step, then when the condition is met, it will become 0
2019-02-14T17:46:22 < jadew> then it will wait 8 cycles (divided by 8, so 1 byte) and then it will run again, with ts_counter = 0
2019-02-14T17:46:23 < dongs> and then case = 0 will run
2019-02-14T17:46:26 < jadew> yes
2019-02-14T17:46:39 < dongs> i want case 0 to run when its zero
2019-02-14T17:46:45 < dongs> not really sure how the fuck that works
2019-02-14T17:46:49 < dongs> why this shit just cant be sequential like C
2019-02-14T17:49:00 < emeb> haha
2019-02-14T17:49:37 < emeb> the fact that it isn't sequential but parallel is why it's awesome.
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2019-02-14T17:52:24 < dongs> fuck if i touch the board wrong way it all goes to shit
2019-02-14T17:53:07 < jadew> when you said the clock is slow, you meant the edges are slow?
2019-02-14T17:53:25 < dongs> what dyou mean
2019-02-14T17:53:25 < jadew> weren't you the one saying you don't know what a sig gen is useful for?
2019-02-14T17:54:03 < jadew> dongs, if the clock is jittery / edges are rising/falling too slow, you might get weird behaviour
2019-02-14T17:54:57 < jadew> if merely touching the board changes the number of output bytes, then you should try to feed it a known good clock
2019-02-14T17:55:36 < jadew> is it siglent these days that has the best bang per buck?
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2019-02-14T18:07:23 < jadew> is there any direct heat soldering station I can get for under $200?
2019-02-14T18:07:38 < jadew> and has > 60 W
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2019-02-14T18:28:34 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/H5D2HcZ.png is this posedge or negedge for capture
2019-02-14T18:28:38 < dongs> i think i asked before
2019-02-14T18:28:41 < dongs> i cant tell worth a fuck
2019-02-14T18:29:38 < jadew> maybe if they were overlapped it would be easier to tell
2019-02-14T18:30:04 < jadew> looks like neg edge
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2019-02-14T18:51:12 < dongs> allright
2019-02-14T18:51:13 < dongs> well
2019-02-14T18:51:13 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-14T18:51:25 < dongs> i fucked around with teh code and 186 seems to work reliably
2019-02-14T18:51:33 < dongs> at speeds from 30 to 100mbit
2019-02-14T18:51:48 < dongs> and data looks ok
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2019-02-14T19:23:00 < invzim_> power matters!
2019-02-14T19:23:03 < invzim_> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WB97GxOe1wbZeeoGyQjUR7ROuixDKnXP/view
2019-02-14T19:23:07 < invzim_> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1zW3BLaavn714punAu7UR2ESfnjXMKzXB/view
2019-02-14T19:23:47 < invzim_> new bench atx psu
2019-02-14T19:23:51 < bitmask> woot, vday present was a big hit
2019-02-14T19:24:15 -!- invzim_ is now known as invzim
2019-02-14T19:25:14 < bitmask> invzim what psu, and what did you do with it? Ive been wanting to make a bench psu
2019-02-14T19:25:39 < invzim> Cooler Master MasterWatt 650
2019-02-14T19:25:53 < invzim> it's not a 'lab' psu
2019-02-14T19:26:05 < invzim> just for use when I need a litle oomphf
2019-02-14T19:26:30 < bitmask> yea thats all I need
2019-02-14T19:27:29 < invzim> this one is not gamer-expensive, and nice that the hdd/pci-e cables are not hard-wired
2019-02-14T19:27:53 < invzim> oh, and fanless unless you really crank it
2019-02-14T19:31:40 -!- \\server\share is now known as Apple][
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2019-02-14T19:39:52 < jadew> invzim, that's great
2019-02-14T19:39:55 < jadew> mine sucks
2019-02-14T19:40:18 < jadew> and radiates a lot if I use poor quality cables 
2019-02-14T19:40:29 < jadew> (unshielded USB cables for example)
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2019-02-14T19:49:11 < jadew> mine is Cooler Master GX Bronze, 650W
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2019-02-14T20:07:54 < kakimir> is oscope FFT any good for anything?
2019-02-14T20:08:01 < kakimir> I mean
2019-02-14T20:08:35 < kakimir> is it just slower than spectrum analyzer?
2019-02-14T20:08:53 < kakimir> and limited range
2019-02-14T20:09:04 < jadew> doesn't have to be slower
2019-02-14T20:09:15 < jadew> and it can be good
2019-02-14T20:09:27 < kakimir> why to buy a spectrum analyzer?
2019-02-14T20:09:43 < jadew> because while FFT can be good, it usually isn't
2019-02-14T20:10:56 < kakimir> so
2019-02-14T20:11:04 < kakimir> how is it done in spectrum analyzer?
2019-02-14T20:11:15 < kakimir> a lot of analog magic?
2019-02-14T20:11:26 < kakimir> oh they use mixer maybe
2019-02-14T20:11:31 < jadew> depends on how deep you look
2019-02-14T20:11:45 < jadew> the theory is simple, the realization of the components is RF magic
2019-02-14T20:12:10 < jadew> but basically the SA is a sweeping radio, with a narrow bandwidth
2019-02-14T20:12:48 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-14T20:13:20 < jadew> so it measures each frequency independently, as opposed to extracting the frequency content from the time domain data
2019-02-14T20:14:35 < jadew> both techniques have their merits, which is why there's a whole class of FFT based spectrum analyzers
2019-02-14T20:15:14 < jadew> have to go to dinner
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2019-02-14T20:15:15 < jadew> ttyl
2019-02-14T20:15:16 < ds2> there are even hybrids
2019-02-14T20:15:34 < ds2> turns a chunk, FFT, adjust to next chunk, FFT, etc
2019-02-14T20:16:03 < jadew> yeah, even my 20 year old SA has FFT
2019-02-14T20:16:25 < jadew> it's using it to resolve down to 1 Hz
2019-02-14T20:16:44 < jadew> for >= 100, it has physical filters and for less than that it's using FFT
2019-02-14T20:17:02 < jadew> anyway, dinner time
2019-02-14T20:18:32 < ds2> that works around filter settling time issues... narrower BW, longer settling time. longer settling time => longer sweep times
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2019-02-14T20:41:41 < bitmask> hmmm, I may have gone a bit overboard ordering 600 smd rgb leds
2019-02-14T20:43:54 < jadew> ds2, on mine, FFT takes a bit longer, but I think that's because of the old age of the instrument
2019-02-14T20:52:07 < ds2> that's a compute limitation. there is a physical limitation of how long it takes a filter of a given bw to settle down
2019-02-14T20:52:22 < ds2> you can't tune faster then that and still get useful results
2019-02-14T20:53:09 < ds2> for digital stuff, it is the time to get data out the other end... and bw is roughly ~ to num of taps and taps is ~ delay
2019-02-14T20:53:45 < Cracki> bitmask, gonna place and solder them all by hand?
2019-02-14T20:54:07 < jadew> he's going to attach leads to them first, because he meant to buy through hole
2019-02-14T20:54:13 < Cracki> kek
2019-02-14T20:54:14 < bitmask> I don't have plans for all of them.  I want to make a pov globe eventually and got 100 of 6 different sizes to see what will work best
2019-02-14T20:54:24 < Cracki> I bought some smd/breakout rgb leds a while ago
2019-02-14T20:54:44 < bitmask> why would you get smd led on a breakout board?
2019-02-14T20:54:56 < Cracki> we glued them to sorting cabinets for small parts, and had to hook them up of course. that was a shitload of soldering
2019-02-14T20:55:04 < Cracki> because china sells them like that
2019-02-14T20:55:19 < Cracki> also you can just solder to them AND glue them to whatever, no thought needed
2019-02-14T20:55:37 < bitmask> yea I guess in that case, gluing them is easier if they are on a little board
2019-02-14T20:55:38 < Cracki> ah a pov thingy, nice
2019-02-14T20:55:56 < jadew> point of view?
2019-02-14T20:56:01 < Cracki> actually for the sorting thingy we glued the wires to the plastic frame, and the LEDs "floated"
2019-02-14T20:56:03 < bitmask> persistence of vision
2019-02-14T20:56:04 < Cracki> persistence of vision
2019-02-14T20:56:11 < jadew> ah, so not porn
2019-02-14T20:56:13 < Cracki> how "pov ray" got its name too
2019-02-14T20:56:54 < bitmask> https://youtu.be/g7_VKGsEKeA
2019-02-14T20:56:58 < bitmask> thats a large example
2019-02-14T20:57:17 < Cracki> yay dickstarter muzak
2019-02-14T20:57:35 < Cracki> use all 600, have MOAR resolution
2019-02-14T20:58:04 < jadew> ah, didn't know that's what they're called
2019-02-14T20:58:17 < bitmask> https://youtu.be/iosG9f9x9-4
2019-02-14T20:58:29 < bitmask> I like that video, I love the earth view
2019-02-14T20:59:49 < jadew> that one is cool, it has two layers, eh?
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2019-02-14T21:00:03 < bitmask> yea
2019-02-14T21:01:35 < bitmask> I bought a hard drive motor for it but I don't think I'll be able to make a big enough display with it.  It is just so nice and quiet though :P
2019-02-14T21:02:40 < bitmask> maybe I'll try 3d printing something the shape/weight of the pcb+components and see how fast it will spin
2019-02-14T21:06:21 < bitmask> anyone use any software (besides excel) for keeping track of components you have on hand? looking at partsbox.io but wondering if theres anything better
2019-02-14T21:09:34 < jadew> when did these guys launch? I wanted to make a similar thing
2019-02-14T21:09:47 < jadew> in fact, exactly the same, it looks like they ticked all my boxes
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2019-02-14T21:11:28 < superbia> evening
2019-02-14T21:14:20 < superbia> where's Steffanx 
2019-02-14T21:14:42 < superbia> that beta cuck is never around when i join
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2019-02-14T21:24:45 < Steffanx> poor superbia
2019-02-14T21:26:29 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-14T21:26:36 < kakimir> I forget it always
2019-02-14T21:26:47 < kakimir> that superbia has some beef
2019-02-14T21:28:51 < Steffanx> Welcome kakimir. hows the day
2019-02-14T21:29:00 < kakimir> ok
2019-02-14T21:33:15 < Steffanx> ok then
2019-02-14T21:34:46 < aandrew> Finally got my assembled panels
2019-02-14T21:36:09 < aandrew> The assembler did not mask off the boards I didn’t want assembled which sucks
2019-02-14T21:36:34 < aandrew> They also didn’t dnp some of the parts I said to dnp
2019-02-14T21:37:14 < Steffanx> Hehe. Assembling is hars
2019-02-14T21:37:26 < Steffanx> D
2019-02-14T21:37:35 < kakimir> did some shopping
2019-02-14T21:37:58 < kakimir> new laptop battery and usb - uart converters
2019-02-14T21:38:17 < Steffanx> The laptop you complained about being awfully slow?
2019-02-14T21:38:34 < kakimir> yes.. it was a software issue
2019-02-14T21:39:07 < kakimir> and I rather use this than pay 1k
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2019-02-14T22:07:36 < tjq> you know what you look like to me with your good bag and your cheap shoes?
2019-02-14T22:09:40 < Ultrasauce> a well scrubbed hustlin rube with a little taste
2019-02-14T22:09:58 < kakimir> tjq: who are you talking to?
2019-02-14T22:12:25 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/18ZTgxtUCCMnWC7Bpsz4jGRb9t7rkGJcC/view?usp=sharing
2019-02-14T22:15:18 < kakimir> the beard is now a part of me
2019-02-14T22:23:27 < tjq> lol
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2019-02-14T22:59:17 < Cracki> bitmask, halp be my rubberducky, I need to adapt a 0.5 module 8mm diameter gear to gates tooth 2mm (1st attempt https://gist.github.com/crackwitz/877366236e9a85caf6479e887a27fd2f), and all I have is some dumb bastards with a 3d printer who tell me to come back in three days, so no rapid iterations. first iteration didn't fit, so I guess I'll need some springy construction. thoughts?
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2019-02-14T23:30:55 < tjq> I’ve been thinking about the dr
2019-02-14T23:30:57 < Steffanx> The Altium joys => "stream read error". Can no longer add foot prints. 
2019-02-14T23:31:21 < Steffanx> it secretly adds a empty foot print when i press the "Add footprint" button. How awesome.
2019-02-14T23:31:33 < tjq> Better PuLL another copy steffan
2019-02-14T23:31:48 < Steffanx> i wish i had a backup of this.
2019-02-14T23:32:03 < Steffanx> its one SchLib that is broken
2019-02-14T23:32:21 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=066WAeG5muE
2019-02-14T23:32:28 < kakimir> non-music
2019-02-14T23:32:31 < tjq> Ty kakimir
2019-02-14T23:32:40 < tjq> But I’m too scared
2019-02-14T23:32:44 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-14T23:32:49 < Steffanx> there you got your Dr. /b/-ware, tjq
2019-02-14T23:33:01 < Steffanx> kakimir is going for the new dr. status
2019-02-14T23:33:26 < tjq> Steffanx: who did what now
2019-02-14T23:33:38 < rajkosto> Steffanx, doesnt it keep a history of file versions every time you save
2019-02-14T23:33:50 < Steffanx> ah it does lol
2019-02-14T23:33:51 < Steffanx> ty
2019-02-14T23:33:58 < kakimir> tjq: when did you change your nick?
2019-02-14T23:34:16 < Steffanx> i never look in this history folder, rajkosto
2019-02-14T23:34:28 < tjq> kakimir: English please
2019-02-14T23:34:42 < Steffanx> when did you change your nick, tjq?
2019-02-14T23:34:55 < kakimir> your nickname
2019-02-14T23:34:59 < tjq> Only when the trouble starts
2019-02-14T23:35:06 < Steffanx> i miss crt.
2019-02-14T23:35:13 < tjq> He died
2019-02-14T23:35:19 < tjq> Steffan got him
2019-02-14T23:35:33 < tjq> Oh wait no
2019-02-14T23:35:47 < tjq> He killed himself because ppl didn’t like him
2019-02-14T23:36:22 < tjq> His suicide note said steffan molested him
2019-02-14T23:36:46 < kakimir> :o
2019-02-14T23:36:57 < tjq> Pretty deep stuff hey
2019-02-14T23:37:42 < englishman> kakimir: i took a video of the enig line
2019-02-14T23:38:06 < englishman> Thorn: 
2019-02-14T23:38:14 < englishman> there are wires going into the nickel and gold tanks
2019-02-14T23:38:21 < englishman> the chief wasnt there so il ask tomorrow maybe
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2019-02-14T23:54:34 < boB_K7IQ> kakimir  LOVED that video link !
2019-02-14T23:57:50 < kakimir> :o
2019-02-14T23:58:07 < bitmask> haha these damn pc817 fakes.  there is an arrow that signals what plant it was manufactured at and it can point NE, SE or SW,  and mine points NW
--- Day changed Fri Feb 15 2019
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2019-02-15T00:17:39 < kakimir> wow
2019-02-15T00:18:00 < kakimir> I found a micro that does just what I needed
2019-02-15T00:19:49 < kakimir> built in USB BC 1.2 detection
2019-02-15T00:24:44 < kakimir> I just accidentally stumbled upon it
2019-02-15T00:26:14 < Steffanx> Accidentally?
2019-02-15T00:28:45 < kakimir> nope
2019-02-15T00:29:18 < kakimir> just series of events that leaded me to the chip
2019-02-15T00:30:02 < kakimir> you have been talking about silabser
2019-02-15T00:30:15 < kakimir> did some parametric searching
2019-02-15T00:31:18 < kakimir> I was not looking chip for this particular project
2019-02-15T00:39:03 < bitmask> can someone tell me if this loads for you? https://partsbox.io/rjfeddeler/parts/  I want to know if user lists are public
2019-02-15T00:39:14 < rajkosto> log in pls
2019-02-15T00:39:17 < bitmask> ok
2019-02-15T00:39:18 < bitmask> thx
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2019-02-15T01:01:29 < Steffanx> Welcome and sleep well superbia 
2019-02-15T01:02:56 < superbia> o ty, i was seeking for you earlier
2019-02-15T01:03:09 < superbia> no more help needed, fixed it myself
2019-02-15T01:03:29 < Steffanx> :P
2019-02-15T01:04:58 < superbia> good to see you
2019-02-15T01:04:59 < Steffanx> Kb done?
2019-02-15T01:05:07 < superbia> i was busy since holidays
2019-02-15T01:05:17 < superbia> kb is on hold, no time to finish
2019-02-15T01:06:42 < superbia> any projects you doing ?
2019-02-15T01:08:56 < superbia> here ziping shit, plan to wipe top, or even buy larger ssd perhaps (although unlikeley)
2019-02-15T01:09:38 < superbia> need space
2019-02-15T01:10:20 < friendofafriend> xz -T 0 is my best buddy.
2019-02-15T01:11:37 < superbia> apacking here
2019-02-15T01:24:35 < kakimir> silabsers here?
2019-02-15T01:26:21 < superbia> mechanical watches have silicone hairsprings
2019-02-15T01:26:52 < superbia> /s/hair/main
2019-02-15T01:28:47 < kakimir> should I go crazy and buy jlink
2019-02-15T01:28:50 < kakimir> real jlink
2019-02-15T01:29:07 < kakimir> it apparently supports silabsers 8bit thingies
2019-02-15T01:30:27 < superbia> fuck, i completely fell out of ee news
2019-02-15T01:30:37 < kakimir> nah let's leave that for next time
2019-02-15T01:30:44 < kakimir> development board has integrated thingie
2019-02-15T01:31:15 < superbia> it should be illegal to do hardware stuff in the future kakimir 
2019-02-15T01:31:50 < superbia> when i think how bad engineers make and write stuff for cars... yuck and they do it in c
2019-02-15T01:32:10 < kakimir> I don't think so
2019-02-15T01:32:23 < kakimir> most of the crap by any meter would be in other languages
2019-02-15T01:32:59 < superbia> there's nothing wrong in using safe language on a microcontroller... is the future man
2019-02-15T01:33:12 < superbia> also, lack of special hardware tools to flash them, i hope is all gone
2019-02-15T01:33:36 < kakimir> what are you rambling
2019-02-15T01:33:38 < superbia> bedtime for me, i talk rubbish, didn't sleep well for 2 weeks
2019-02-15T01:33:49 < kakimir> sleep tight
2019-02-15T01:33:50 < kakimir> you need it
2019-02-15T01:34:01 < superbia> keep Steffanx safe for me
2019-02-15T01:34:15 < superbia> kakimir: 
2019-02-15T01:34:58 < kakimir> *steffanx stored in safe*
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2019-02-15T01:37:45 < mawk> I'm applying for the city of rotterdam Steffanx 
2019-02-15T01:37:49 < mawk> to do embedded stuff
2019-02-15T01:43:40 < kakimir> shit has been ordered
2019-02-15T01:47:39 < kakimir> I wonder what superbia meant with "safe" languages
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2019-02-15T02:05:14 < englishman> https://twitter.com/eevblog/status/1088727364362588160
2019-02-15T02:05:47 < karlp> thatð's..... unexpected.
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2019-02-15T03:08:57 < boB_K7IQ> But those SMT caps are stacked ceramics with out leads so it's really OK
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2019-02-15T03:58:47 < dongs> http://www.seventransistorlabs.com/Articles/xkcd.html fucking autism
2019-02-15T04:00:08 < englishman> dongs: why are.there wires going into the nickel and gold tanks on the enig line
2019-02-15T04:00:31 < dongs> i dono
2019-02-15T04:00:41 < dongs> i dont make my own PCBs like Thorn or rajkosto 
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2019-02-15T04:01:25 < rajkosto> dongs, in .SchDoc, as dog intended
2019-02-15T04:01:45 < Thorn> last time I etched a pcb was 10 years ago
2019-02-15T04:02:01 < rajkosto> mine was 3 years ago
2019-02-15T04:02:10 < Thorn> englishman: interesting, are there any large PSUs nearby?
2019-02-15T04:02:20 < englishman> no
2019-02-15T04:02:36 < englishman> could be temp sensors I guess
2019-02-15T04:02:37 < dongs> maybe its a thermocouple?
2019-02-15T04:02:39 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-15T04:02:40 < Thorn> maybe it's temperature/pH sensors
2019-02-15T04:02:45 < englishman> are you on telegram
2019-02-15T04:02:57 < Thorn> yes I am
2019-02-15T04:03:02 < englishman> if you say no I won't believe you
2019-02-15T04:03:03 < englishman> ok
2019-02-15T04:03:08 < dongs> haha
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2019-02-15T04:47:07 < jadew> sup?
2019-02-15T04:50:53 < rajkosto> this https://streamable.com/wsibk
2019-02-15T04:51:34 < jadew> are you sure that's burn in and not poor driving?
2019-02-15T04:51:58 < jadew> do you still get the flag after you show the santa guy?
2019-02-15T04:52:33 < rajkosto> yep
2019-02-15T04:52:50 < rajkosto> just disconnected its pin header and reconnected (so i can see the backlight), flag is still there and vivid in darkness
2019-02-15T05:21:57 < rajkosto> also was it you who told me that "theres no such thing as bidirectional spi over MOSI only"
2019-02-15T05:31:59 < jadew> rajkosto, yeah, but not as definitive as that
2019-02-15T05:32:17 < jadew> what I meant is that you can't do it in one transfer
2019-02-15T05:32:23 < rajkosto> cuz its working just fine and fully supported by stm32
2019-02-15T05:32:35 < jadew> and how is the data transmitted?
2019-02-15T05:32:39 < rajkosto> theres just no examples about it you gotta twiddle the registers just right
2019-02-15T05:33:09 < rajkosto> you send command byte, switch BIDIROE=0, read response bytes over same line, disable SPI and put CS high
2019-02-15T05:33:23 < rajkosto> have to disable SPI or it would just read as long as the DR register is empty
2019-02-15T05:33:58 < rajkosto> BIDIRE=1 is always on (since the initial spi init)
2019-02-15T05:34:55 < jadew> so BIDIRE controls the muxing on the pin
2019-02-15T05:35:17 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-15_04-35-14_M0o4MUjnX.png
2019-02-15T05:35:21 < jadew> when = 1, it's MOSI, when = 0, it's MISO
2019-02-15T05:35:35 < rajkosto> thats BIDIROE
2019-02-15T05:35:38 < rajkosto> 0x4000
2019-02-15T05:35:44 < jadew> right
2019-02-15T05:36:25 < rajkosto> but just like RXONLY, as soon as you set BIDIROE to 0, it will clock transactions as long as DR is empty
2019-02-15T05:36:30 < rajkosto> until you set SPE to 0
2019-02-15T05:36:49 < rajkosto> so its tricky to get the exact amount of clocks you want on the line before the stop
2019-02-15T05:36:59 < rajkosto> you need to stop it before reading out the last DR you want
2019-02-15T05:37:43 < rajkosto> https://pastebin.com/6K73z0wj
2019-02-15T05:38:06 < jadew> is there no overlap in driving of the line?
2019-02-15T05:38:11 < jadew> (by master and slave)
2019-02-15T05:38:17 < rajkosto> nop
2019-02-15T05:38:26 < rajkosto> setting CS high they both release it
2019-02-15T05:38:35 < jadew> ah, so you set CS high
2019-02-15T05:38:45 < rajkosto> yes that gets the device out of send mode
2019-02-15T05:39:12 < jadew> how do you let it know that you want to read or write?
2019-02-15T05:39:24 < rajkosto> the device just goes into send mode after specific command bytes
2019-02-15T05:39:44 < jadew> so you send that stuff, CS high, CS low, read data
2019-02-15T05:39:46 < jadew> correct?
2019-02-15T05:39:54 < rajkosto> nop
2019-02-15T05:41:42 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-15_04-41-40_QNN0HotD5.png
2019-02-15T05:41:56 < jadew> what's DC?
2019-02-15T05:42:03 < rajkosto> DATA/COMMAND#
2019-02-15T05:42:11 < jadew> ah...
2019-02-15T05:42:27 < rajkosto> that and CS are just gpio, unrelated to stm32 spi core tho
2019-02-15T05:42:42 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-15T05:47:32 < rajkosto> slave stops driving MOSI a little after CS is deasserted
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2019-02-15T06:52:54 < rajkosto> hoo hoo maybe i can overclock the stm32f103 to get closer to 66MHz max SPI output speed
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2019-02-15T09:29:34 < tjq> you know what you look like to me with your good bag and your cheap shoes?
2019-02-15T09:29:59 < tjq> How are you Takamisawa
2019-02-15T09:30:33 < tjq> Anime
2019-02-15T09:31:02 < tjq> And Hannibal
2019-02-15T09:33:16 < PaulFertser> I had weird noise when switching the input language. Was puzzled until I realised it turns on two additional LEDs on my keyboard and that made PSU hum.
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2019-02-15T09:40:44 < PaulFertser> No, those were normal LEDs with normal current. Just slight variations made old transformer/inductor emit high-pitch noise.
2019-02-15T09:41:35 < PaulFertser> Yes, that. Just loosy PSU, it's normal.
2019-02-15T09:48:49 < tjq> And then what
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2019-02-15T11:50:36 < rajkosto> jadew, double the burn https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-15_10-50-07_0WCasECjf.png
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2019-02-15T11:58:14 < jadew> hah
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2019-02-15T12:29:01 < englishman> dongs: nvidia revenue down 45% in gaming market. buttcoin ruins everything
2019-02-15T12:38:37 < Steffanx> What is buttcoin?
2019-02-15T12:39:25 < englishman> or maybe its because the latest $1000 cards are just as good as the 3 year old $1000 cards idk
2019-02-15T12:39:37 < englishman> but puddles look better
2019-02-15T12:51:03 < Steffanx> Id go AMD gfx
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2019-02-15T12:54:24 < rajkosto> > not using nvidia for OpenGL
2019-02-15T12:55:42 < rajkosto> > using linucks on the desktop
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2019-02-15T13:23:41 < dongs>  Haohmaru> older nvidia cards on linux haz dumb issues with power management
2019-02-15T13:23:42 < dongs> no
2019-02-15T13:23:47 < dongs> the problem is lunix has no usable power management
2019-02-15T13:23:58 < dongs> or usable API for proper accelrated graphics
2019-02-15T13:24:20 < dongs> nvidia had to rewrite and include basically 95% of Xserver functionality into their kernel driver
2019-02-15T13:24:24 < dongs> because lunix is shit
2019-02-15T13:24:45 < PaulFertser> Do you mean D3D by proper API? Does Altium use D3D btw?
2019-02-15T13:24:56 < dongs> it does actually
2019-02-15T13:25:02 < dongs> its hte only PCB cad that uses proper 3D API
2019-02-15T13:25:08 < dongs> instead of drawing shit wiht GDI like ocrad & co
2019-02-15T13:25:31 < dongs> altium uses DirectDraw, Direct2D, direct3D for schematic/layout/3d pcb rendering
2019-02-15T13:25:34 < PaulFertser> And xserver functionality is unrelated to acceleration, it was never meant for accelerated graphics.
2019-02-15T13:25:43 < dongs> my point exactly
2019-02-15T13:25:53 < PaulFertser> Why doesn't it use D3D for everything if it's _the_ API?
2019-02-15T13:25:57 < dongs> so to haev any hope of accelerating anything, they had to write large portions of the shit
2019-02-15T13:26:00 < dongs> ?
2019-02-15T13:26:11 < dongs> because there's diffefrent APIs for text/2d rendering and 3D
2019-02-15T13:26:39 < PaulFertser> You're stuck in the past, modern cards do not have any text/2d api at all.
2019-02-15T13:31:49 < BrainDamage> modern lunix apis don't use/need X at all for acceleration
2019-02-15T13:32:02 < jpa-> it's not like the card itself has D3D api either; modern cards have drivers that translate direct2d and direct3d and whatever into commands the card uses
2019-02-15T13:33:29 < jpa-> but kicad also uses opengl, which is portable and open so 100x better than altium!
2019-02-15T13:37:09 < qyx_> you donged him
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2019-02-15T13:39:17 < qyx> fellow kicaders, my gerbers don't match drills
2019-02-15T13:39:21 < qyx> hows that possible
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2019-02-15T13:40:29 < jpa-> you selected different offset or scale or something in the drill export dialog
2019-02-15T13:41:09 < jpa-> it's important to have a feature that lets you generate unmatched drill file
2019-02-15T13:41:43 < englishman> or your Gerber parser sucks
2019-02-15T13:41:53 < qyx> no, gerbviewer shows it okay
2019-02-15T13:42:02 < qyx> seedstudio doesn't
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2019-02-15T13:42:26 < qyx> like they say
2019-02-15T13:42:37 < englishman> oh yeah kikecad has like 500 different origins
2019-02-15T13:42:38 < qyx> http://support.seeedstudio.com/knowledgebase/articles/1824574-how-to-generate-gerber-and-drill-files-from-kicad
2019-02-15T13:42:50 < englishman> all in their own menu
2019-02-15T13:42:57 < jadew> if the gerber viewer shows them ok, ignore the shitstudio preview
2019-02-15T13:43:11 < qyx> https://www.seeedstudio.com/gerber-view.html?sn=b29a10b3311611e999d9026a86b9cae7
2019-02-15T13:43:12 < englishman> does it work in oshpark
2019-02-15T13:43:27 < qyx> you have to zoom it out to see the baord
2019-02-15T13:44:03 < jadew> CTRL+C
2019-02-15T13:44:06 < jadew> now it's mine
2019-02-15T13:44:11 < PaulFertser> Also, D3D was developed my high-performance gaming demands, not for correctness, so it's not professional to use D3D for CAD, dongs, OpenGL is the industry-approved API.
2019-02-15T13:45:09 < jpa-> qyx: what does your drill file header look like?
2019-02-15T13:45:24 < qyx> mhm inches
2019-02-15T13:45:28 < jadew> again, he said it works fine in kicad's gerber viewer
2019-02-15T13:45:28 < qyx> threy have mm selected
2019-02-15T13:45:46 < qyx> lets check the old gerbv
2019-02-15T13:45:58 < jadew> that means that it's likely a bug in the web based thing
2019-02-15T13:46:40 < qyx> old gerbv diesplays it correctly too
2019-02-15T13:46:42 < jpa-> jadew: yeah, very probable; but it's easy enough to generate files that show up correctly in the web viewer also
2019-02-15T13:46:59 < jadew> jpa-, that's true as well, I never had issues
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2019-02-15T13:47:06 < jadew> and I just use the default settings for the drill files
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2019-02-15T13:47:31 < jadew> what happens if I click destroy gerber?
2019-02-15T13:50:30 < qyx>     Couldn't find bottom soldermask layer.
2019-02-15T13:50:43 < qyx> ok, it shows ok in another two online viewers
2019-02-15T13:51:25 < qyx> jpa-: M48
2019-02-15T13:51:25 < qyx> ;DRILL file {KiCad (5.0.2)} date Fri 15 Feb 2019 12:32:32 PM CET
2019-02-15T13:51:27 < qyx> ;FORMAT={3:3/ absolute / metric / suppress leading zeros}
2019-02-15T13:53:10 < jpa-> i've always used "decimal format" instead of "suppress leading zeros"
2019-02-15T13:53:20 < qyx> they say not to use auxiliary axis
2019-02-15T13:53:27 < qyx> Haohmaru: ^
2019-02-15T13:53:35 < jpa-> auxiliary axis is ok if you use it also for gerbers
2019-02-15T13:54:00 < jpa-> but it shouldn't matter which you use, as long as it is the same for both
2019-02-15T13:54:33 < zyp> haha
2019-02-15T13:57:42 < englishman> do i need anything else from digikey/mouser
2019-02-15T13:57:53 < zyp> always
2019-02-15T13:58:04 < englishman> probably my last order for a while
2019-02-15T13:59:55 < qyx> who did suggest decimal format, this solved it together with auxiliary axis
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2019-02-15T14:33:34 < qyx> your order has been confirmed \o/
2019-02-15T14:34:19 < rajkosto> your gerbers are in mm units ?
2019-02-15T14:35:05 < qyx> yes as they suggest
2019-02-15T14:35:18 < rajkosto> every pcb house wanted inches for gerbers wtf
2019-02-15T14:35:28 < qyx> idk fuk inches
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2019-02-15T14:39:43 < rajkosto> if i ever used mm gerbers their size estimate would be all wrong
2019-02-15T14:39:43 < rajkosto> so
2019-02-15T14:39:56 < rajkosto> and his drill is in inches so i think its just a weird UI label saying its mm
2019-02-15T14:40:23 < qyx> where
2019-02-15T14:41:32 < qyx> yes the label says mm
2019-02-15T14:42:19 < rajkosto> why the hecc is "Do not tent vias" a GLOBAL option ?
2019-02-15T14:43:01 < rajkosto> you dont have proper realtime preview of all the layers ? should be able to draw random shapes in the soldermask and silkscreen layers for maximum flexibility
2019-02-15T14:43:07 < qyx> M72 tells it is in inches
2019-02-15T14:43:14 < rajkosto> and have per-via tenting control
2019-02-15T14:44:15 < englishman> they will just convert it to inches anyway
2019-02-15T14:44:23 < englishman> as all their drills will use one system
2019-02-15T14:44:39 < englishman> and bump them up to next largest size
2019-02-15T14:45:01 < qyx> but M72 was from eagle, kicad uses METRIC if you select mm
2019-02-15T14:45:10 < qyx> yes, it is METRICin the drill file
2019-02-15T14:47:02 < qyx> and gerbers are in mm too because MOMM
2019-02-15T14:47:10 < qyx> so no, it is not just a wrong label
2019-02-15T14:47:12 < qyx> they are in mm
2019-02-15T14:47:16 < dongs> that kikecad dialog looks awful
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2019-02-15T14:48:44 < englishman> what is with all those fucking axes
2019-02-15T14:50:08 < rajkosto> SABOTAGE
2019-02-15T14:50:11 < rajkosto> kikekad AINT EVEN INSTALLED.
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2019-02-15T14:51:13 < BrainDamage> I bet if we check the commit log he'll be listed in the main authors under a pseudonym
2019-02-15T14:51:31 < rajkosto> altium pretty much doesnt even let you place stuff on the "negative" coordinates
2019-02-15T14:52:04 < englishman> if you check the lunix kernel he's listed as "linus torvalds"
2019-02-15T14:52:39 < englishman> you know it's a fake name, noone would name their kid "linus"
2019-02-15T14:52:54 < rajkosto> that the guy who runs the clickbait youtube channel ?
2019-02-15T14:53:53 < zyp> one of my friends named his son linus
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2019-02-15T14:55:54 < jadew> sounds like a hillbilly name
2019-02-15T14:57:43 < jadew> we are
2019-02-15T14:58:01 < jadew> but names are easier to pronounce
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2019-02-15T14:59:08 < qyx> like karrppallattallpalla
2019-02-15T14:59:40 < jadew> and speaking of linus tech tips... that guy is fucking annoying
2019-02-15T14:59:57 < jadew> I don't like his face
2019-02-15T15:00:22 < jadew> and his fake enthusiasm
2019-02-15T15:00:38 < jadew> over shit I don't give a crap about - so why is he being suggested to me?
2019-02-15T15:00:47 < qyx> like dave
2019-02-15T15:00:52 < qyx> the same applies
2019-02-15T15:00:57 < qyx> voice, face, enthusiasm
2019-02-15T15:01:33 < jadew> someone send him a cat fish
2019-02-15T15:01:52 < jadew> I'm sure he'll get the joke
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2019-02-15T15:33:54 < rajkosto> dave's videos are just rambling
2019-02-15T15:33:56 < rajkosto> i hate it
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2019-02-15T15:43:39 < kakimir> in nowdays standards he is just medium class rambler
2019-02-15T15:44:23 < kakimir> standard nowdays is to make 20min to answer one simple clickbait question
2019-02-15T15:45:09 < BrainDamage> I always hated how ... sparse his videos are
2019-02-15T15:45:36 < BrainDamage> granted, I hate videos as teaching tool generally, but some are worse than others
2019-02-15T15:57:52 < kakimir> why hate?
2019-02-15T15:57:57 < kakimir> why watch?
2019-02-15T15:58:07 < englishman> too much hate in the world
2019-02-15T15:58:17 < kakimir> and too much watching
2019-02-15T15:58:46 < Steffanx> Are you getting soft englishman ?
2019-02-15T15:59:04 < englishman> wat
2019-02-15T15:59:15 < Steffanx> "too much hate"
2019-02-15T15:59:24 < englishman> didn't you see the kitten
2019-02-15T15:59:40 < Steffanx> The farmy?
2019-02-15T15:59:47 < BrainDamage> kakimir: a person teaching live you can interact with, a video you cannot
2019-02-15T16:00:08 < BrainDamage> skimming makes you lose details, and it's just awkward
2019-02-15T16:00:17 < BrainDamage> text you can skim much easier
2019-02-15T16:00:31 < BrainDamage> also, text you read it at your own pace, video you don't
2019-02-15T16:00:43 < BrainDamage> also, most of the videos are not well-thought before
2019-02-15T16:01:01 < BrainDamage> it's just someone taping themselves during a virtual conversation
2019-02-15T16:01:33 < BrainDamage> a text instead let people review what they've said, make corrections, etc, altough ofc they require more effort
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2019-02-15T16:05:53 < kakimir> personalized teaching comes with a price BrainDamage 
2019-02-15T16:06:23 < kakimir> besides daves videos are not exactly rocket science to start with
2019-02-15T16:07:13 < BrainDamage> I am not saying personalized teaching
2019-02-15T16:07:59 < c10ud> medmgr-sitep
2019-02-15T16:07:59 < BrainDamage> any teacher will give you 5 min extra after the lesson or if they aren't assholes, allow a question during the topic
2019-02-15T16:08:07 < BrainDamage> at my univ it was actively encouraged
2019-02-15T16:09:13 < rajkosto> if i enable -flto in my release build collect2.exe: fatal error: CreateProcess: No such file or directory
2019-02-15T16:09:14 < rajkosto> wtf
2019-02-15T16:10:47 < rajkosto> spaces in paths, great for MCU GCC ARM to install to appdata then
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2019-02-15T16:11:52 < Steffanx> Lol why is spaces in paths still an issue?
2019-02-15T16:11:58 < rajkosto> because linucks
2019-02-15T16:12:01 < rajkosto> makefiles
2019-02-15T16:12:04 < Steffanx> Yeah
2019-02-15T16:12:17 < mawk> lier
2019-02-15T16:12:20 < mawk> we all saw the ".exe"
2019-02-15T16:12:26 < Steffanx> Not that commandline windows makes it unsuck
2019-02-15T16:12:27 < rajkosto> yeah but the linucks legacy remains.
2019-02-15T16:12:40 < mawk> sprinkle some ""
2019-02-15T16:12:41 < rajkosto> makefiles use spaces as a list separator
2019-02-15T16:12:45 < rajkosto> so everything gets ruined
2019-02-15T16:13:11 < rajkosto> its not like bash where you can get by with some judicious ""
2019-02-15T16:14:15 < rajkosto> recommended GCC ARM MCU eclipse is some xPack bullshit that installs to appdata anyway, f dat
2019-02-15T16:14:40 < Steffanx> Use keil
2019-02-15T16:14:53 < rajkosto> and go back
2019-02-15T16:14:54 < rajkosto> to 1998
2019-02-15T16:15:08 < Steffanx> Gcc arm mcu eclipse
2019-02-15T16:15:09 < Steffanx> , what mcu are you targetting?
2019-02-15T16:15:52 < rajkosto> the eclipse shit integrates with openocd the best for me
2019-02-15T16:15:53 < rajkosto> i like it
2019-02-15T16:15:59 < Steffanx> Whats wrong with the !False Studio?
2019-02-15T16:16:03 < rajkosto> even though eclipse is THE WORST IDE EVER
2019-02-15T16:16:10 < rajkosto> its almost as bad as gedit is for being a notepad
2019-02-15T16:17:25 < Steffanx> Except "for its shit" i never heard a proper argument why eclipse sucks
2019-02-15T16:17:45 < rajkosto> slow, annoying, java mess with hotkeys that no other program ever uses
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2019-02-15T16:18:20 < BrainDamage> last time I've tried, it did text parsing in the same thread as the ui
2019-02-15T16:18:35 < BrainDamage> so start typing and it'd freeze midway doing completion bullshit
2019-02-15T16:18:51 < rajkosto> anyway, moved all the tools to no spaces
2019-02-15T16:18:53 < rajkosto> -flto now works
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2019-02-15T16:21:08 < Steffanx> Was that in 1999 BrainDamage ?
2019-02-15T16:21:24 < BrainDamage> 3-4 years ago
2019-02-15T16:21:24 < rajkosto> i dont think it does that anymore
2019-02-15T16:21:32 < rajkosto> however compilation output/messages WILL still become modal 
2019-02-15T16:21:36 < rajkosto> and interrupt you
2019-02-15T16:22:00 < rajkosto> even faux-IDEs like visual studio code are better than eclipse for actual programming
2019-02-15T16:22:11 < Steffanx> Modal? Wut?
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2019-02-15T16:27:00 < Steffanx> Did you know that is like 1 click and its gone. Forever rajkosto?
2019-02-15T16:28:18 < mawk> I don't know what charm you find to eclipse and horrible things like it
2019-02-15T16:28:35 < mawk> it's because you're all prejudiced against linux and makefiles
2019-02-15T16:29:10 < Steffanx> Such argument :P
2019-02-15T16:29:44 < mawk> :(
2019-02-15T16:31:01 < Steffanx> Anyway.. rotterdamn :P
2019-02-15T16:32:30 < mawk> this rotterdamn Steffanx ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Kl0N7fvX18
2019-02-15T16:32:43 < mawk> I listened to this when I was a young drughead
2019-02-15T16:33:28 < Steffanx> Lol paul elstak
2019-02-15T16:33:50 < kakimir> mawk: did you do meth?
2019-02-15T16:34:02 < Steffanx> Hardcore will never die, mawk.
2019-02-15T16:34:05 < mawk> not quite meth because it's expensive but something like it
2019-02-15T16:34:08 < mawk> of course Steffanx 
2019-02-15T16:35:07 < mawk> I did everything kakimir 
2019-02-15T16:35:10 < Steffanx> Better visit some rave party while youre in dutchland
2019-02-15T16:35:11 < Steffanx> .
2019-02-15T16:35:13 < mawk> I made a list once, it was like 60 chems
2019-02-15T16:35:36 < mawk> some hunters have deer heads above their chimneys, and me I have a list of 60 drugs I did
2019-02-15T16:36:08 < BrainDamage> what was the one that fucked you up the most in a bad way?
2019-02-15T16:36:32 < mawk> I was pretty lucky throughout, but I had one or two bad encounters, I think the worst was MDPV
2019-02-15T16:36:43 < mawk> this drug has been found in animal trials to be around 60× more addictive than meth
2019-02-15T16:36:54 < mawk> like, the rats would push the pedal up to 3000 times for a single dose of the drug
2019-02-15T16:37:03 < mawk> and they would die of inanition because they were busy pushing the pedal
2019-02-15T16:37:41 < mawk> the drug is tricky
2019-02-15T16:37:56 < mawk> after 8 days with no sleep I was deeply convinced that insects would eat me alive if I didn't carry on taking the drug
2019-02-15T16:38:09 < mawk> but luckily the doctor knocked me out with a neuroleptic
2019-02-15T16:38:20 < mawk> because benzodiazepines injections would do nothing, just add a little color to my vision
2019-02-15T16:38:27 < kakimir> not sure if trolling
2019-02-15T16:38:30 < mawk> lol
2019-02-15T16:38:32 < mawk> I'm not trolling
2019-02-15T16:38:36 < mawk> look for "cocaine bugs" or something
2019-02-15T16:38:38 < mawk> it's the same mechanism
2019-02-15T16:38:43 < mawk> sleep deprivation + stimulants = psychosis
2019-02-15T16:38:50 < mawk> or look for mdpv reports on bluelight.ru
2019-02-15T16:39:59 < mawk> but luckily I had no damage or anything, not even to the heart
2019-02-15T16:40:04 < mawk> apart from tachycardia
2019-02-15T16:40:19 < kakimir> yes, no
2019-02-15T16:40:24 < mawk> :(
2019-02-15T16:40:42 < BrainDamage> tachicardia was likely a consequence of the benzos
2019-02-15T16:40:47 < kakimir> a hell of a story mawk.. you really went all the way
2019-02-15T16:40:53 < mawk> I mean for several months BrainDamage 
2019-02-15T16:41:04 < mawk> so that was pretty short-lasting damage BrainDamage; the most annoying was that I got arm paralysis from being knocked out by a shady opiate chemical and sleeping on my arm and destroying the nerves
2019-02-15T16:41:09 < mawk> and it was my writing hand
2019-02-15T16:41:14 < mawk> it took over a year to recover
2019-02-15T16:41:27 < mawk> now I'm pretty clean, I just have daily methadone doses to prevent some withdrawals
2019-02-15T16:41:33 < mawk> but I'm slowly lowering the dose
2019-02-15T16:41:42 < mawk> now I just take caffeine and nicotine, like normal people do
2019-02-15T16:42:04 < mawk> it's not hard to do that kakimir , you just have to take the first dose
2019-02-15T16:42:12 < mawk> your brain will do the rest
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2019-02-15T16:42:49 < mawk> lol
2019-02-15T16:43:02 < kakimir> ##drugs32
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2019-02-15T16:43:33 < mawk> ah it changed url
2019-02-15T16:43:33 < mawk> http://www.bluelight.org/
2019-02-15T16:43:39 < mawk> it's not .ru anymore see
2019-02-15T16:43:42 < mawk> you can click on it
2019-02-15T16:44:20 < mawk> lol the site has a black theme in rememberance of an overdosed admin
2019-02-15T16:44:49 < kakimir> he went for the ultimate trip
2019-02-15T16:45:35 < mawk> it was pain meds, he wasn't conscious
2019-02-15T16:45:39 < mawk> he wasted his ultimate trip
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2019-02-15T16:54:01 < kakimir> or started it
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2019-02-15T16:56:46 < mawk> let's write linux drivers
2019-02-15T16:56:50 < mawk> that'll be good for my resumé
2019-02-15T16:57:15 < mawk> also why do you say résumé it doesn't even mean curriculum vitæ, just "sum-up"
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2019-02-15T16:57:29 < mawk> I'm just re-writing an existing one
2019-02-15T16:57:40 < mawk> for the mrf24j40 2.4GHz transceiver
2019-02-15T16:57:48 < mawk> because it has a race condition somewhere I hope to find
2019-02-15T16:57:55 < mawk> that messes up fragmentation
2019-02-15T16:59:01 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-15T16:59:32 < zyp> wiresharking shit that produces like 5k packets a second is a bit annoying, capture memory grows quickly
2019-02-15T17:00:07 < mawk> you don't flush to disk fast enough ?
2019-02-15T17:00:09 < Cracki> capture filter?
2019-02-15T17:00:30 < zyp> Haohmaru, workstuff
2019-02-15T17:01:15 < zyp> currently playing around with running ip alongside industrial comms on my industrial ethernet bus
2019-02-15T17:02:13 < zyp> https://paste.jvnv.net/view/7CHHx <- made a shitty ARP responder
2019-02-15T17:03:46 < zyp> shit works, now I just need to make some shit to deal with ip and udp headers (including checksum) and then I can use udp instead of raw ethernet for stuff
2019-02-15T17:04:13 < zyp> raw ethernet is simple but a bit annoying to work with on windows
2019-02-15T17:04:20 < mawk> ah you're on windows
2019-02-15T17:04:22 < mawk> I was about to suggest tap
2019-02-15T17:04:31 < mawk> but even on windows you have third-party tap drivers no ?
2019-02-15T17:04:57 < zyp> tap is not relevant
2019-02-15T17:05:37 < mawk> it would fill the ip and udp headers
2019-02-15T17:05:44 < zyp> remember that tap creates a virtual network card towards the OS network stack
2019-02-15T17:05:49 < mawk> yes
2019-02-15T17:06:07 < zyp> that's no use to me
2019-02-15T17:06:09 < mawk> ah
2019-02-15T17:06:24 < zyp> what I've been doing is sending and receiving raw ethernet frames on a physical network card
2019-02-15T17:06:28 < zyp> i.e. raw sockets
2019-02-15T17:06:46 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-15T17:06:59 < zyp> on windows I can do that through winpcap, but the API is limited and fragile
2019-02-15T17:07:19 < zyp> I have a bootloader utility that talks to a bootloader over raw ethernet like that
2019-02-15T17:08:48 < zyp> winpcap has the same problem with other traffic, when the other comms are running, the bootloader packets gets lost
2019-02-15T17:09:02 < zyp> with udp, the OS would take care of all the filtering for me
2019-02-15T17:26:49 < rajkosto> 128MHz stm32f103 why
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2019-02-15T17:29:29 < rajkosto> as easy as just changing the multiplier from 9 to 16 and the constants
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2019-02-15T19:17:24 < englishman> holy shit msp430 is total utter junk
2019-02-15T19:18:40 < englishman> an optional hardware integer multiplier are you fucking kidding
2019-02-15T19:19:46 < Steffanx> :)
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2019-02-15T19:59:24 < MrMobius> msp430 is cool
2019-02-15T19:59:28 < MrMobius> dont blaspheme
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2019-02-15T20:06:55 < englishman> Disable interrupts before using the hardware multiplier.
2019-02-15T20:07:04 < zyp> haha
2019-02-15T20:08:55 < Cracki> who still uses that stuff?
2019-02-15T20:09:09 < Cracki> smells like pic
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2019-02-15T20:16:20 < Rickta59> i think mickey ears are still using msp430g2553
2019-02-15T20:17:04 < MrMobius> englishman, why do you care if it uses the hardware multiplier or something else if you are writing C code? they marketed as low power not high performance
2019-02-15T20:17:23 < MrMobius> *theyre
2019-02-15T20:18:07 < Steffanx> their
2019-02-15T20:19:00 < Rickta59> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIIjR5prez0 ir + msp430g2553
2019-02-15T20:19:20 < englishman> and they are neither
2019-02-15T20:19:25 < englishman> nor cheap
2019-02-15T20:19:31 < englishman> nor small
2019-02-15T20:19:46 < Rickta59> they have one thing you can
2019-02-15T20:19:58 < Rickta59> t get in any other chip .. fram instead of flash
2019-02-15T20:20:10 < Steffanx> but its not an tarduino....
2019-02-15T20:20:12 < Rickta59> and all the new chips have a hw multiplier
2019-02-15T20:20:42 < Rickta59> they have the best flexibility when it comes to source a clock to a peripheral
2019-02-15T20:20:52 < Rickta59> i wish the stm32 had its spi peripheral
2019-02-15T20:20:52 < Steffanx> you are the engineer now englishman, you can say fuck you. dont use it.
2019-02-15T20:21:44 < Rickta59> the clock system on some of them lets you infinity adjust the cpu clock from 10k to 16MHz
2019-02-15T20:21:48 < englishman> disable interrupts before using the multiplier. still lolling.
2019-02-15T20:22:11 < englishman> yes Steffy. del ./legacy/*
2019-02-15T20:23:17 < Rickta59> compared to the gyrations required to make an stm32 drive an ws2811 it is super simple with an msp430
2019-02-15T20:23:24 < Steffanx> yeah thats cool Rickta59
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2019-02-15T20:24:04 < Rickta59> but you are right they are too expensive and suck for a lot of things
2019-02-15T20:24:41 < Steffanx> does it keil?
2019-02-15T20:24:56 < Rickta59> i'm sure yes
2019-02-15T20:24:58 < Rickta59> do i no
2019-02-15T20:25:10 < Rickta59> i think TI internally uses IAR for some stuff
2019-02-15T20:25:45 < Rickta59> even though they have 2 different compilers .. a internal TI one and redhat developed gcc
2019-02-15T20:26:01 < Rickta59> internally developed but now free
2019-02-15T20:26:43 < Rickta59> redhat did it but TI paid for it .. now some other firm is handling on going dev
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2019-02-15T20:27:47 < Steffanx> i bet it does code composer studio
2019-02-15T20:27:54 < Steffanx> the best version of eclipse ever.
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2019-02-15T20:28:16 < Rickta59> it used to suck .. now they don't add much special sauce and it works great
2019-02-15T20:28:50 < Rickta59> used to cost when it sucked now it is completely free and unrestricted
2019-02-15T20:36:40 < Steffanx> except that it was easy to work around that :P
2019-02-15T20:36:46 < Rickta59> seems it doesn't keil although it used to be supported .. they do support the msp432 stuff ( arm cortex-m4 with msp430 peripherals )
2019-02-15T20:37:07 < Steffanx> 90 dails trial was mac address based. all you needed was a new fake virtualbox host adapter :P
2019-02-15T20:37:31 < Rickta59> yeah that is a pain .. it was easier to pick up the license for $20 they offered every once and a while
2019-02-15T20:39:53 < Rickta59> or maybe it was never supported ...
2019-02-15T20:40:26 < Steffanx> that probably.
2019-02-15T20:40:54 < Rickta59> why are you looking at the msp430 englishman ?
2019-02-15T20:41:08 < Steffanx> hes working on something that already has it in it
2019-02-15T20:41:12 < englishman> legacy hardware
2019-02-15T20:41:18 < Steffanx> the poor lad.
2019-02-15T20:41:27 < Steffanx> will you be ok?
2019-02-15T20:41:46 < Steffanx> You can always go back to assemblying.
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2019-02-15T21:45:02 < kakimir> sexycode
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2019-02-15T22:14:04 < kakimir> bus is empty
2019-02-15T22:14:27 < kakimir> 2hours to go and others left
2019-02-15T22:14:40 < kakimir> this is VIP
2019-02-15T22:23:28 < Steffanx> who wants to go to the middle of nowhere anyway?
2019-02-15T22:24:06 < jadew> thought you're talking about a data bus
2019-02-15T22:24:47 < Steffanx> lol
2019-02-15T22:24:58 < Steffanx> assuming kakimir goes to parent's house?
2019-02-15T22:29:41 < kakimir> I mean
2019-02-15T22:29:56 < kakimir> who wants to go anywhere in funlandia
2019-02-15T22:30:52 < kakimir> it's not like - "it's super exciting to get from nowhere A to nowhere B"
2019-02-15T22:32:13 < jpa-> uh, why not? there's trees and fields and everything along the way
2019-02-15T22:32:29 < kakimir> I mean who wants to go to city
2019-02-15T22:32:32 < jpa-> sometimes you can even see writing on the hay bales
2019-02-15T22:33:49 < kakimir> when there is cozy forrests to live and stroll in
2019-02-15T22:35:32 < Steffanx> Hows the snow in kakiland?
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2019-02-15T22:48:40 < kakimir> snow is hard
2019-02-15T22:48:47 < Steffanx> is it still there?
2019-02-15T22:48:50 < kakimir> and dirty
2019-02-15T22:48:53 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-15T22:48:57 < kakimir> definitelly
2019-02-15T22:49:08 < Steffanx> but you have a good snow mobile.
2019-02-15T22:52:24 < kakimir> in many sense it's the worst
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2019-02-15T23:11:52 < englishman> Steffanx: yes i'll be fine. this one project has both msp430 and stm32f3. they were approaching free pro compiler size limit. i came in and added f to every floating point literal and saved 4k
2019-02-15T23:12:11 < englishman> and yes, it still works
2019-02-15T23:12:25 < Steffanx> haha
2019-02-15T23:12:27 < Steffanx> :)
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2019-02-16T01:02:18 < rajkosto> https://medium.com/@RiotChat/the-big-1-0-68fa7c6050be
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2019-02-16T01:26:27 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mIEB4e2LHc
2019-02-16T01:31:13 < englishman> that looks easier to replace than a piston engine mainbearing i guess
2019-02-16T01:31:22 < catphish> what's the go-to hardware for IoT devices these days? ESP32, anything else out there that's cheap and awesome?
2019-02-16T01:31:32 < englishman> what did he do, weld to the driveshaft while it was in the engine?
2019-02-16T01:31:38 < englishman> esp32 man
2019-02-16T01:31:44 < englishman> you open tardiino.exe
2019-02-16T01:31:46 < englishman> double click
2019-02-16T01:31:46 < englishman> it
2019-02-16T01:31:49 < englishman> then copypaste the codes in
2019-02-16T01:31:51 < englishman> click YES
2019-02-16T01:31:54 < englishman> and it works
2019-02-16T01:32:16 < englishman> embedded software development 2019
2019-02-16T01:32:29 < englishman> buy your development environment on amazon
2019-02-16T01:32:31 < catphish> but is there anything else worthwhile? i assume there's competition
2019-02-16T01:32:34 < englishman> product finished in 24 hours
2019-02-16T01:34:02 < catphish> there's been some talk around my office of building an IoT framework so people can build their internet of shit devices without being immediately mocked for being insecure or unreliable
2019-02-16T01:34:18 < englishman> i dont understand any of those words
2019-02-16T01:34:26 < englishman> except IoT
2019-02-16T01:34:29 < englishman> so sounds good
2019-02-16T01:34:38 < bitmask> https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/bomb-threat-home-depot-turned-man-warning-others-badly-needed-use-restroom-212452328.html
2019-02-16T01:34:54 < catphish> so, i thought i'd look into what kinda hardware was available these days
2019-02-16T01:37:08 < englishman> i think rather than having competition, people make opensores stuff for the chips that are available
2019-02-16T01:37:12 < englishman> so theres all this stuff around esp32
2019-02-16T01:37:24 < englishman> and not a lot around the other simiar crap from ti and silabs etc
2019-02-16T01:39:47 < catphish> my thought was that we could make a firmware and a server side app that people could use for their new toasters or whatever and not have to design their own network protocols
2019-02-16T01:49:46 < zyp> catphish, that sounds like https://xkcd.com/927/
2019-02-16T01:50:35 < catphish> zyp: of course, but understand that each one of those 15 standards equates to a profitable company pushing it :)
2019-02-16T01:51:04 < zyp> haha
2019-02-16T01:51:40 < zyp> sounds to me like you just wanna reinvent AWS IoT
2019-02-16T01:52:12 < zyp> ref. https://aws.amazon.com/iot/
2019-02-16T01:52:26 < catphish> zyp: yes, i saw AWS have something similar, i didn't read the details but i suspect it would be very similar
2019-02-16T01:52:49 < catphish> but not so similar that people can move their devices to AWS down the line
2019-02-16T01:52:57 < mawk> I had a class on aws iot
2019-02-16T01:53:32 < catphish> essentially it would provide the device<->server protocol, and the server<->enduser APIs
2019-02-16T01:53:52 < catphish> so a developer could just make some hardware and an iphone app
2019-02-16T01:54:11 < mawk> so you'll implement something alongside rest/coap/mqtt ?
2019-02-16T01:54:13 < catphish> we're a little late to the party probably, but figured it might be worthwhile
2019-02-16T01:54:27 < zyp> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/apn/connect-microcontroller-based-devices-to-the-cloud-with-amazon-freertos-and-espressif-esp32/ <- they've got esp32 covered as well
2019-02-16T01:54:29 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIDi07qQNZk where is blaxter I have musics
2019-02-16T01:54:41 < catphish> i've actually never heard of coap :)
2019-02-16T01:54:42 < mawk> b&
2019-02-16T01:54:58 < mawk> constrained application protocol or something
2019-02-16T01:55:16 < catphish> but yeah, something like rest/message queue, with a server being the middleman and dealing with authentication of all ends
2019-02-16T01:55:28 < zyp> to me coap seems like an efficiency optimized http
2019-02-16T01:55:49 < zyp> I mean, memory footprint optimized
2019-02-16T01:55:54 < catphish> but also handling scripting both pushed to run locally on the MCU and on the server
2019-02-16T01:56:12 < mawk> you mean firmware updates ?
2019-02-16T01:56:14 < mawk> or real scripts
2019-02-16T01:56:34 < mawk> you're targeting relatively huge devices then
2019-02-16T01:56:55 < mawk> might as well use ssl or something to get security for free
2019-02-16T01:57:00 < zyp> starting with a solution and looking for a problem doesn't strike me as the best business plan
2019-02-16T01:58:40 < zyp> sounds mostly like «we want to play with electronics, so we came up with an excuse to convince the boss/shareholders/whoever»
2019-02-16T01:59:10 < mawk> that builds up competence for the employees
2019-02-16T01:59:17 < mawk> but the shareholders will be disappointed that's sure
2019-02-16T02:02:42 < zyp> old company I worked for had a client project with some stuff running on some embedded linux boxes which they weren't happy about the reliability of
2019-02-16T02:03:18 < catphish> mawk: the devices don't need to be huge, and SSL isn't necessary, but on a sufficiently capable device might come for free :)
2019-02-16T02:03:31 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-16T02:03:41 < mawk> I mean huge enough to run an interpreter
2019-02-16T02:03:49 < mawk> so unless something is custom-built I guess it will run linux
2019-02-16T02:04:01 < zyp> and then they spent a bunch of time and money developing a new hardware platform that were supposed to be able to do all sorts of stuff, not targetted for that project specifically, but intended for that to be the first customer use
2019-02-16T02:04:15 < mawk> that seems ambitious zyp 
2019-02-16T02:04:20 < mawk> developing a hardware platform
2019-02-16T02:04:34 < zyp> I think I joined the company around the time the hardware design was finalized
2019-02-16T02:04:38 < zyp> well
2019-02-16T02:05:06 < catphish> mawk: well that depends on the complexity of the scripts of course
2019-02-16T02:05:22 < zyp> it was a board with an avr32 mcu and a ton of various stuff that were nice to haves
2019-02-16T02:05:29 < zyp> e.g. an fram chip
2019-02-16T02:05:35 < zyp> and a ton of power options
2019-02-16T02:05:35 < catphish> such a script may be a simple binary set of rules
2019-02-16T02:05:47 < zyp> and extension board connectors and stuff
2019-02-16T02:06:04 < zyp> with a couple different IO extension boards as well
2019-02-16T02:06:19 < mawk> ah like a custom interpreter catphish 
2019-02-16T02:06:34 < catphish> mawk: right :)
2019-02-16T02:06:58 < catphish> like a VM with just a handful of instructions
2019-02-16T02:08:18 < mawk> you like writing parsers ?
2019-02-16T02:08:25 < mawk> like with bison/flex
2019-02-16T02:08:50 < catphish> i seriously doubt it would be ascii, and no
2019-02-16T02:09:04 < aandrew> oh
2019-02-16T02:09:13 < aandrew> figured out my problem with the fucking stm32 not showing up on swd 
2019-02-16T02:09:22 < zyp> for this customer project, I ended up designing an extension board that just exposed some signal buses on a pair of ribbon cables and then the customer designed their own board that those ribbon cables would connect to
2019-02-16T02:09:34 < aandrew> I left PA0 floating which, when you're an idiot like me and disable the internal regulator, PA0 becomes a 1.2V domain reset signal
2019-02-16T02:09:36 < catphish> aandrew: you accidentally initialized the port to a different function?
2019-02-16T02:09:43 < aandrew> nope
2019-02-16T02:10:03 < catphish> ah
2019-02-16T02:11:02 < zyp> they also started on a couple projects for other customers on the same platform, but none of them actually ended up getting funded, and eventually most of the staff got laid off, including me
2019-02-16T02:12:08 < zyp> and due to some ownership structure bullshit, the people owning the rights to the hardware platform was not the same people that had a contract with the one original customer
2019-02-16T02:12:35 < catphish> my NFC device seems to have worked nicely, it's been running off its battery for the last few months, the card detection and RTC are still stable :)
2019-02-16T02:13:06 < zyp> and the platform owners apparently wanted to recoup cost on the unsold stock they had
2019-02-16T02:13:28 < zyp> so they jacked up the price to 400 EUR/ea or so
2019-02-16T02:16:12 < zyp> I was involved in a discussion about that, so I mentioned that «I can probably design and manufacture you a replacement at a tenth of that price»
2019-02-16T02:16:27 < zyp> and ended up getting contracted to do so
2019-02-16T02:16:32 < mawk> lol
2019-02-16T02:16:38 < mawk> you didn't get a lawsuit ?
2019-02-16T02:16:48 < zyp> why?
2019-02-16T02:17:12 < mawk> they could think you kept internal documents
2019-02-16T02:17:17 < mawk> and re-designed from that
2019-02-16T02:17:26 < catphish> why would it matter
2019-02-16T02:17:36 < catphish> if its for them anyway
2019-02-16T02:17:43 < mawk> ah
2019-02-16T02:17:48 < mawk> I thought it was for the customers
2019-02-16T02:17:50 < zyp> nah, I didn't reuse any of the old hardware layout
2019-02-16T02:18:04 < zyp> I mean, cloning the avr32 design probably would have been bad
2019-02-16T02:18:08 < zyp> but I didn't
2019-02-16T02:18:30 < zyp> I made a new stm32f4 based thing that just hooked up to the buses on the customer board
2019-02-16T02:18:40 < mawk> it's the same nfc thing you were designing some months ago catphish ? nice
2019-02-16T02:18:56 < zyp> and then the software guy ported the software from avr32 to stm32
2019-02-16T02:19:00 < catphish> mawk: yeah, about 5 months ago i finished it
2019-02-16T02:19:30 < catphish> mawk: never got around to manufacturing a batch, but the protype i left running to see how it would perform, and the answer is perfectly so far
2019-02-16T02:19:41 < mawk> time flies
2019-02-16T02:19:46 < mawk> nice
2019-02-16T02:20:12 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/rL7QV.png <- here's the board I designed, plugged into the customer board
2019-02-16T02:20:52 < zyp> original avr32 board was probably five times as large and had a ton more parts, because it was designed as a general platform, whereas my board was targetted to this project
2019-02-16T02:21:02 < catphish> this board: https://i.imgur.com/OqNwJJe.png
2019-02-16T02:21:07 < mawk> the buttons are funny
2019-02-16T02:21:09 < mawk> they look vintage
2019-02-16T02:21:34 < catphish> zyp: neat
2019-02-16T02:21:36 < mawk> you designed the antenna yourself catphish ?
2019-02-16T02:21:43 < mawk> or you used some software that does the maths
2019-02-16T02:22:51 < zyp> there's two ways to design an nfc antenna
2019-02-16T02:22:57 < catphish> mawk: well, i designed it pretty much by guesswork, i also used the software to calculate the matching capacitors required, which turned out to be useful, but wildly inaccurate, trial and error produced the final matching results, the design of the antenna didn't really matter much
2019-02-16T02:23:46 < catphish> the antenna is just 4 loops of copper, that mappen to match the size and shape of the rest of the board, no more logic to its design than that
2019-02-16T02:23:48 < zyp> 1: calculate the inductance of it
2019-02-16T02:24:14 < zyp> 2: draw something at random, measure it and adjust matching caps until it resonates at the right freq
2019-02-16T02:24:46 < zyp> the math is a bit daunting, so I went with number 2 myself :)
2019-02-16T02:24:50 < catphish> i kinda did both
2019-02-16T02:25:27 < catphish> ST have a calculator tool that gives a good idea of the inductance, but its far from accurate in real life, so some experimentation helped with fine tuning
2019-02-16T02:25:56 < jadew> the reason it's off is probably because of stray capacitance
2019-02-16T02:26:04 < catphish> yes i'm sure
2019-02-16T02:26:08 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/6cVmy.gif <- before matching, yellow mark is target frequency, goal is to have it in the center of the plot
2019-02-16T02:26:50 < zyp> instead of overthinking it, I just moved around caps and checked which direction the yellow mark moved
2019-02-16T02:27:03 < catphish> i did my trial and error less scientifically, but using my actual final circuit and a real NFC card to test
2019-02-16T02:27:06 < zyp> and kept stacking caps until it moved as far as I wanted
2019-02-16T02:27:24 < jadew> zyp, should be in the center of the plot, if the driver was 50 Ohm
2019-02-16T02:27:34 < zyp> jadew, exactly
2019-02-16T02:28:17 < zyp> I forgot to screenshot it after tuning
2019-02-16T02:28:27 < zyp> but I have one of a random 2.4G antenna for comparison: https://bin.jvnv.net/file/fxfyo.gif
2019-02-16T02:28:45 < catphish> sadly i never quite got to grips with soldering QFN
2019-02-16T02:28:56 < catphish> but maybe i'll get china to do a run of these boards one day
2019-02-16T02:29:07 < zyp> I got dongs to solder mine
2019-02-16T02:29:34 < catphish> i thought it was englishman
2019-02-16T02:30:01 < zyp> not me, I've never outsourced anything to englishman
2019-02-16T02:30:16 < catphish> guess i got confused :)
2019-02-16T02:30:41 < zyp> doesn't matter, point is the same
2019-02-16T02:31:14 < catphish> better than china?
2019-02-16T02:31:59 < zyp> I was thinking more along the lines of «it's worthwhile to outsource assembly work to people with proper equipment when you don't have it yourself»
2019-02-16T02:32:20 < jadew> what qty did you make?
2019-02-16T02:32:52 < zyp> two proto runs with 12 boards each IIRC, and then a production run with I believe 200 boards
2019-02-16T02:33:18 < catphish> i mean did you find it better to outsource it to someone known rather than a cheap chinese board house for some reason in particular?
2019-02-16T02:33:20 < jadew> jeez.. that's a lot
2019-02-16T02:33:37 < zyp> found out I fucked up and missed a signal on first proto, but I could still use it to tune the antenna
2019-02-16T02:34:04 < zyp> and then I did a second proto to double check antenna tuning was sane and confirm everything worked before doing a bigger run
2019-02-16T02:34:12 < zyp> wouldn't want to retune 200 boards by hand
2019-02-16T02:34:30 < catphish> they were nice boards, i destroyed 2 of them
2019-02-16T02:34:49 < zyp> those were leftovers of the second protos :p
2019-02-16T02:35:27 < catphish> shame that, should have been more patient and got a proper jig
2019-02-16T02:35:58 < jadew> zyp, those were boards you had a contract for?
2019-02-16T02:36:05 < jadew> or did you make them in advance (your investment)
2019-02-16T02:36:07 < jadew> ?
2019-02-16T02:36:17 < zyp> well
2019-02-16T02:36:48 < zyp> guy I know wanted half of them, other half I sold myself
2019-02-16T02:37:00 < jadew> I see
2019-02-16T02:37:06 < jadew> that's neat
2019-02-16T02:37:09 < zyp> so kinda mixed
2019-02-16T02:38:13 < zyp> investment is not that big, just a couple thousand dollars or something
2019-02-16T02:38:52 < jadew> I've been having some thoughts lately about what I'm doing wrong and I wonder if not going for big production volume might be one of those things
2019-02-16T02:39:09 < jadew> problem is I don't know how big is the market for my product
2019-02-16T02:39:54 < jadew> did you have that information in advance?
2019-02-16T02:40:04 < jadew> you knew that you'd be able to sell 100 pcs in X amount of time?
2019-02-16T02:41:28 < zyp> I'm soon gonna make another batch of the HID adapter boards I've been selling, so I started accepting orders for it earlier this week, people have put in like $900 worth of orders so far
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2019-02-16T02:41:43 < jadew> neat
2019-02-16T02:42:58 < zyp> or rather, most of them are orders that were put in after I sold out the previous batch in november, I just haven't invoiced those orders until now
2019-02-16T02:44:24 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-16T02:45:35 < zyp> got another $650 worth of unpaid orders too, but I expect some of them won't get paid
2019-02-16T02:45:54 < jadew> why don't you charge them when they place the order?
2019-02-16T02:45:55 < zyp> there's always some people ordering and then never end up paying
2019-02-16T02:46:06 < zyp> well
2019-02-16T02:46:38 < zyp> partly because I've been too lazy to integrate a payment api thing in my store thing
2019-02-16T02:46:54 < branjb> anyone know much about the limesdr project?
2019-02-16T02:46:56 < zyp> and partly because that lets me review orders before I ask for money
2019-02-16T02:46:57 < jadew> ah, I got that cover on mine
2019-02-16T02:47:32 < jadew> branjb, I know of it, but you probably know more than I do
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2019-02-16T02:48:08 < jadew> zyp, you can always refund if something is wrong
2019-02-16T02:50:42 < zyp> true
2019-02-16T02:50:59 < zyp> but still, more coding work
2019-02-16T02:51:07 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-16T02:52:33 < zyp> my webstore is pretty simple, I mainly made it to automate the printing of shipping labels :p
2019-02-16T02:52:48 < jadew> I have yet to do that
2019-02-16T02:52:51 < jadew> I write them by hand
2019-02-16T02:53:03 < jadew> you use sticky paper?
2019-02-16T02:53:26 < zyp> before I made this, I took orders through some google forms bullshit that just dumped them into a spreadsheet
2019-02-16T02:54:02 < zyp> and then I copied addrs into a latex document that generated labels that I printed on my label printer
2019-02-16T02:54:16 < zyp> and then I had another pdf with a prefilled CN22 form that I printed on another label
2019-02-16T02:55:08 < jadew> is that thing mandatory?
2019-02-16T02:55:13 < jadew> how does it help?
2019-02-16T02:55:21 < zyp> plus another label for sender name/addr, a priority mail sticker and a postage mark (or before that I used good old stamps)
2019-02-16T02:55:57 < zyp> you need a CN22 for any items you send internationally, otherwise don't expect stuff to go through customs
2019-02-16T02:56:18 < jadew> didn't know that
2019-02-16T02:56:32 < jadew> luckily, I only sent within the EU
2019-02-16T02:57:09 < zyp> I think the breaking point was when I also started selling the nfc readers, because all of a sudden I had more variants, just having a single prefilled CN22 wouldn't do anymore
2019-02-16T02:57:46 < zyp> and also, five different things to stick on each package was tedious
2019-02-16T02:58:24 < jadew> so now you have a single thing?
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2019-02-16T02:58:32 < zyp> so I swapped my label printer for a larger one and designed a html template that would contain all the information on a single label
2019-02-16T02:58:34 < jadew> one label with the customs declaration?
2019-02-16T02:58:36 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-16T02:58:52 < zyp> the shit I print now is like 100x150mm
2019-02-16T02:58:52 < jadew> that's neat, which label printer do you recommend?
2019-02-16T02:59:04 < zyp> the old one did 62mm wide at most
2019-02-16T02:59:16 < zyp> brother ql-something
2019-02-16T02:59:26 < zyp> both the old one and the new one
2019-02-16T02:59:27 < jadew> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Brother-QL570-Professional-Label-Printer/333070377504?epid=113488151&hash=item4d8c8aa220:g:id8AAOSw~-ZcYwiO:rk:7:pf:0
2019-02-16T02:59:32 < jadew> like that?
2019-02-16T02:59:50 < zyp> yeah, ql-1060n is what I've got now
2019-02-16T02:59:57 < zyp> old one was a ql-700
2019-02-16T02:59:58 < jadew> thanks
2019-02-16T03:01:17 < zyp> this shit pops up as a regular printer in the OS, so I just made the html template with print css to make everything look right, so I can just hit print directly in the browser
2019-02-16T03:01:34 < zyp> no dicking around with anything else between the online store and the printer
2019-02-16T03:01:42 < jadew> makes sense
2019-02-16T03:02:20 < zyp> and then I made an order database hooked to the label template and a simple form for customers to put in orders :p
2019-02-16T03:03:46 < rajkosto> what you lads tghink of the STM32F373CxT6
2019-02-16T03:03:49 < zyp> last year I added an order status page, but I haven't deployed it yet, I was planning to add automated order confirmation and shipping confirmation emails but I got sidetracked before I managed to finish that
2019-02-16T03:04:05 < zyp> I wanted to have that in place before adding payment integration
2019-02-16T03:04:35 < zyp> rajkosto, you're gonna use the SDADC?
2019-02-16T03:04:50 < rajkosto> no i just want the DOZENS of timers
2019-02-16T03:05:07 < zyp> does F373 have more timers than other stm32 variants?
2019-02-16T03:05:14 < rajkosto> it has 12
2019-02-16T03:05:38 < zyp> is that a lot?
2019-02-16T03:05:49 < rajkosto> its more than 4
2019-02-16T03:06:13 < zyp> hmm, looks like 14 to me, but sure
2019-02-16T03:07:17 < zyp> F303 «only» has 9
2019-02-16T03:10:19 < zyp> hmm, looks like 27 channels or so
2019-02-16T03:10:57 < zyp> I think F407 has fewer timers, but about as many channels because it has more four-channel timers
2019-02-16T03:11:04 < zyp> F373 seems to lack both TIM1 and TIM8
2019-02-16T03:13:14 < zyp> ah
2019-02-16T03:13:15 < zyp> Basic timers (TIM6, TIM7, TIM18)
2019-02-16T03:13:15 < zyp> These timers are mainly used for DAC trigger generation.
2019-02-16T03:13:37 < zyp> that explains why F373 got so many
2019-02-16T03:14:24 < zyp> nice if it's the timers itself you want, not all that useful if it's PWM channels you want
2019-02-16T03:19:43 < rajkosto> yeah i need to master->slave chain like 6 of them
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2019-02-16T05:47:52 < englishman> ive never outsourced anything to an englishman eithe
2019-02-16T05:47:54 < englishman> r
2019-02-16T06:02:26 < branjb> anyone ever done pulseaudio over an ssh/x11 session?
2019-02-16T06:03:07 < englishman> branjb have you quit your job to become a super well paid person
2019-02-16T06:03:17 < branjb> nope
2019-02-16T06:03:32 < englishman> damn
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2019-02-16T06:12:55 < mawk> something like this yes branjb 
2019-02-16T06:13:08 < mawk> I've done pulseaudio over a "remote" machine
2019-02-16T06:13:11 < mawk> e.g. a container
2019-02-16T06:13:15 < mawk> it's not related to X11 tho
2019-02-16T06:13:20 < branjb> i'm trying to get audio from a remote gqrx to play on my local desktop
2019-02-16T06:13:25 < branjb> so far wasted 2 hours with this shit
2019-02-16T06:13:30 < branjb> yeah it's related to pulseaudio
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2019-02-16T06:14:30 < mawk> it's quite akin to X11, you have to tell the local system to use a different pulseaudio that the localhost one
2019-02-16T06:17:44 < mawk> it changes some env vars then everything launched in the current terminal/session/whatever will run using the distant PA
2019-02-16T06:18:00 < mawk> so you have two parts to take care of, this one and running an open PA server
2019-02-16T06:18:21 < branjb> so I need pulseaudio running on my local PC?
2019-02-16T06:19:08 < mawk> I guess yeah
2019-02-16T06:19:12 < mawk> you need the PA client
2019-02-16T06:19:20 < branjb> interesting
2019-02-16T06:24:20 < dongs> what the fuck
2019-02-16T06:24:24 < dongs> why is my keil foldedr like 8gb
2019-02-16T06:24:35 < mawk> GUI software is heavy
2019-02-16T06:24:48 < mawk> you better join the emacs crowd before your hard drive breaks up with you
2019-02-16T06:25:47 < dongs> no
2019-02-16T06:25:52 < dongs> keil installer is 500megs
2019-02-16T06:25:55 < dongs> it doesnt unpack to 8gigs
2019-02-16T06:26:12 < mawk> maybe a combination of downloaded BSPs and cache
2019-02-16T06:26:22 < englishman> doesnt ISE/vivado unpack 25gb from 1gb
2019-02-16T06:27:20 < dongs> ya thats it, fucking PACK folder is 4gb
2019-02-16T06:27:25 < dongs> god damn junk
2019-02-16T06:27:27 < dongs> i dont even use it
2019-02-16T06:27:46 < dongs> i think its time to find a keil replacement, since i usually only use ozone for debugging too cuz keil got too fucking slow
2019-02-16T06:28:12 < dongs> mabbe ill just pay for visualgdb or so
2019-02-16T06:28:21 < dongs> at least i can use proper vstudio ide for code
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2019-02-16T06:29:24 < englishman> iar to the rescue
2019-02-16T06:29:38 < dongs> lul no
2019-02-16T06:29:42 < dongs> IAR gets what, 1 update in 10 years?
2019-02-16T06:29:50 < englishman> the arm one is pretty up to date
2019-02-16T06:29:57 < englishman> the msp430 one is still not w10 compatible
2019-02-16T06:30:00 < dongs> laugh
2019-02-16T06:30:10 < englishman> i literally have to run it in win8 compatibility mode as recommended by iar
2019-02-16T06:31:11 < dongs> gah
2019-02-16T06:31:13 < dongs> deleting old packs
2019-02-16T06:31:17 < dongs> so fucking slow
2019-02-16T06:31:30 < dongs> delete.. wait like 30 secs
2019-02-16T06:31:31 < dongs> delete next
2019-02-16T06:31:42 < englishman> what other ides use the arm compiler
2019-02-16T06:31:46 < dongs> none
2019-02-16T06:31:54 < dongs> the new arm shit is clang anyway
2019-02-16T06:32:00 < dongs> but with arm mods?? 
2019-02-16T06:32:05 < englishman> oh yeah the iar libs are awful too
2019-02-16T06:32:18 < englishman> sprintf is like 6k
2019-02-16T06:32:23 < dongs> heh
2019-02-16T06:32:28 < dongs> ah right thats why i still use keil
2019-02-16T06:32:35 < dongs> cuz microlib > jewlib or any other opensauce alternative
2019-02-16T06:32:41 < englishman> yeah
2019-02-16T06:33:43 < dongs> oh tehre
2019-02-16T06:33:46 < dongs> i can right click and remove + delete pack
2019-02-16T06:33:51 < dongs> saves one set of 30 seconds waits
2019-02-16T06:44:38 < dongs> there, reduced shit by liek 2gb
2019-02-16T06:44:40 < dongs> still huge but better
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2019-02-16T07:19:53 < rajkosto> 128MHz overclocked stm32f103 still works good
2019-02-16T07:22:05 < englishman> add a M to your product model number, void the warranty and charge double
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2019-02-16T07:27:17 < rajkosto> just wnated to try out the absolute max spi clock the display could take, 64MHz
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2019-02-16T11:46:34 < marble_visions> englishman: if you tolerate cmake, you can use clion from jetbrains
2019-02-16T11:47:29 < marble_visions> cmake can be made to use gcc-arm-none-eabi, so it might be possible to hook it up to armcc
2019-02-16T11:59:36 < dongs> remind me why crapmake exists again?
2019-02-16T11:59:39 < dongs> what was wrong wiht gnu/make?
2019-02-16T11:59:40 < dongs> oh, right
2019-02-16T11:59:47 < dongs> they just needed Yet Another Fucking Build System
2019-02-16T11:59:53 < dongs> because 'sores
2019-02-16T12:00:25 < dongs> im sorry but until opensores fags get their shit together and stop reinventing the fucking wheel 10x over, nobody is gonna take their shit seriously
2019-02-16T12:00:43 < rajkosto> cmake is awful at handling array variables too
2019-02-16T12:01:01 < dongs> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_build_automation_software#Make-incompatible
2019-02-16T12:01:02 < rajkosto> they are always space separated strings in all these crappy build systems
2019-02-16T12:01:04 < dongs> you gotta be shitting me
2019-02-16T12:01:16 < rajkosto> i hate cmake really bad because what it does is generate makefiles/project files for other compilers REALLY TERRIBLY
2019-02-16T12:01:16 < dongs> look at how much effort wasted
2019-02-16T12:01:18 < dongs> in that list
2019-02-16T12:03:26 < Steffann> Look at the effort wasted raging about it.. again
2019-02-16T12:03:35 < dongs> well, yeah :)
2019-02-16T12:03:40 < Steffann> Oh no, it doesnt take you any effort :P
2019-02-16T12:03:46 < veverak> lol
2019-02-16T12:03:50 < rajkosto> raging feels good
2019-02-16T12:04:00 < PaulFertser> dongs: haha, funny you mention it because cmake actually requires some other make to build, it just generates the makefiles.
2019-02-16T12:04:00 < rajkosto> using cmake definitely doesnt
2019-02-16T12:05:53  * veverak wanted to ask something but forgot what, damn it
2019-02-16T12:06:15 < Steffann> Awh
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2019-02-16T12:19:18 < malinus> dongs: opensores fags? But their compilers are the only relevant ones...
2019-02-16T12:25:22 < rajkosto> dongs is a weirdo who uses Keil for more than the minimum
2019-02-16T12:25:28 < rajkosto> i had to use it for some 8051 once
2019-02-16T12:25:31 < rajkosto> sdcc was still better
2019-02-16T12:26:54 < Steffann> Eclipse
2019-02-16T12:27:08 < malinus> hahahaha Keil
2019-02-16T12:27:49 < malinus> next you tell me he uses IAR
2019-02-16T12:27:52 < oz4ga> short version: dongs is a weirdo. we all know that
2019-02-16T12:28:05 < Steffann> Arent we all?
2019-02-16T12:28:22 < malinus> IAR: insufficient at realtime
2019-02-16T12:28:22 < oz4ga> oh yeah. some more than the rest ;)
2019-02-16T12:43:38 < marble_visions> that's why i said tolerate because dongs is cranky
2019-02-16T12:46:49 < marble_visions> and we all know that the best tools are what dongs uses ;)
2019-02-16T12:51:01 < Steffann> Hows your day marble_visions?
2019-02-16T12:51:19 < marble_visions> good so far
2019-02-16T12:51:46 < marble_visions> can't wait to go skiing tomorrow
2019-02-16T12:54:30 < Steffann> What mountains will you be in?
2019-02-16T12:56:13 < marble_visions> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitosha local one, will go to a bigger resort next month
2019-02-16T12:57:35 < marble_visions> but since i'm very new to this it doesn't matter, i just want to go down some green and blue slopes
2019-02-16T13:03:05 < Steffann> :)
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2019-02-16T13:14:05 < malinus> As someone ocassionally having to work on chip-specific compilers (freescale dsp), it's always amazing when working with open source tools instead.
2019-02-16T13:15:36 < marble_visions> of course
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2019-02-16T15:15:53 < englishman> going to buy keil for a second time
2019-02-16T15:16:02 < englishman> it's just that pro
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2019-02-16T15:33:57 < englishman> https://github.com/RIOT-OS/RIOT
2019-02-16T15:34:38 < englishman> all the buzzwords
2019-02-16T15:35:05 < Steffanx> you dont have to use it, close page, forget about it
2019-02-16T15:36:01 < englishman> why? with all those features why wouldnt i try it?
2019-02-16T15:36:13 < englishman> you're so negative steffy
2019-02-16T15:36:27 < Steffanx> i read some negativity in your words
2019-02-16T15:37:03 < englishman> theres a lot of stuff in there
2019-02-16T15:38:37 < Steffanx> ok cool, let us know if it worked
2019-02-16T15:47:25 < dongs> it has like zero support for any stm32 peripherals
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2019-02-16T16:17:29 < englishman> who cares about stm32
2019-02-16T16:17:35 < englishman> it doesn't even have wifi
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2019-02-16T16:35:35 < srk> lol
2019-02-16T16:39:48 < marble_visions> englishman: wow mdk pro perpetual lic is 9k EUR @ farnell
2019-02-16T16:40:17 < marble_visions> ~4k EUR for the 1year lic one
2019-02-16T16:42:01 < marble_visions> makes more sense to get the "forever yours" one
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2019-02-16T16:43:08 < englishman> that sucks. my price is 1/3 of that
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2019-02-16T16:49:56 < fenugrec> damn, and I thought IDA was expensive
2019-02-16T16:53:59 < Sadale> I think some STM32 microcontroller has WiFi.
2019-02-16T16:55:04 < marble_visions> one can always add an rpi3 as a peripheral to gain wifi :D
2019-02-16T16:55:19 < Sadale> never mind. I was mistaken
2019-02-16T16:55:48 < Sadale> Some of the STM32's support wireless interface. But it doesn't say WiFi.
2019-02-16T16:56:48 < Sadale> Anyway ESP8266 is pretty much the go-to chip for WiFi. It's supercheap :3
2019-02-16T16:58:38 < malinus> < dongs> it has like zero support for any stm32 peripherals
2019-02-16T16:58:42 < malinus> Sound like mbed?
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2019-02-16T17:11:09 < mawk> riotos
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2019-02-16T17:17:30 < marble_visions> Sadale: esp32 might cost less if you're doing a cortex-m-based mcu + esp8266 for wifi?
2019-02-16T17:18:08 < Sadale> marble_visions, right. In fact, even ESP8266 alone could be used as a programmable microcontroller.
2019-02-16T17:18:22 < Sadale> Then you could get rid of the ARM mcu. :)
2019-02-16T17:18:37 < marble_visions> nice
2019-02-16T17:18:40 < Sadale> Anyway those people who I worked with in the previous company I worked for doesn't like ESP32 nor ESP8266.
2019-02-16T17:18:52 < Sadale> They claim that it could be unreliable. xD
2019-02-16T17:19:06 < marble_visions> they might have a point. what were their considerations?
2019-02-16T17:19:35 < Sadale> Their consideration was that "there's no way that it's so cheap. It sounds too good to be true" and something similar xD
2019-02-16T17:21:29 < Sadale> I couldn't tell if their reason is having any reasonable ground, tho.
2019-02-16T17:21:57 < Steffanx> So did you find yourself a new job in the meantime Sadale?
2019-02-16T17:22:16 < Sadale> Steffanx, lol I resigned from that company long ago and I experimented with freelancing.
2019-02-16T17:22:21 < Sadale> And I failed. I'll look for another day job real soon
2019-02-16T17:22:24 < Steffanx> :P
2019-02-16T17:22:36 < Sadale> There isn't enough embedded programming freelancing jobs in the market at all. 
2019-02-16T17:22:43 < Sadale> And those freelancing websites are just lame
2019-02-16T17:23:00 < Rickta59> what you don't want to work for $1/hr?
2019-02-16T17:23:10 < Steffanx> i think there is enough, but you need the right contacts
2019-02-16T17:25:24 < marble_visions> yeah most people here are hardware/embedded programming hybrids, maybe they can freelance since they can more or less produce a device
2019-02-16T17:26:01 < marble_visions> (most people that i've seend chatting)
2019-02-16T17:38:47 < jadew> I still have to get the hang of it
2019-02-16T17:38:55 < jadew> (freelancing)
2019-02-16T17:39:22 < jadew> my problem is that the customers don't pay enough
2019-02-16T17:39:39 < jadew> otherwise, there are plenty of jobs
2019-02-16T17:39:51 < jadew> but who wants to work for < $20/hr?
2019-02-16T17:40:45 < Steffanx> you dont ask enough :P
2019-02-16T17:42:28 < jadew> don't know... there's also the fact that I don't know if I should waste my time on other people's projects
2019-02-16T17:44:27 < jadew> I mean.. if I'm going to take time from working on my own stuff, in order to work on someone else's borring junk, they better pay well
2019-02-16T17:44:46 < jadew> *boring
2019-02-16T17:51:00 < bitmask> nice, just found $40
2019-02-16T17:51:00 < bitmask> what should I buy? :)
2019-02-16T17:51:31 < jadew> cock ring
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2019-02-16T17:52:27 < bitmask> I have enough of those
2019-02-16T17:52:33 < jadew> then perhaps a tool?
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2019-02-16T17:52:44 < jadew> some nice pliers
2019-02-16T17:52:48 < jadew> a caliper
2019-02-16T17:53:13 < bitmask> maybe put it towards a decent desktop psu
2019-02-16T17:53:23 < jadew> for your PC?
2019-02-16T17:53:25 < bitmask> actually I dont have room for that yet
2019-02-16T17:53:39 < bitmask> no, for projects just variable voltage/current
2019-02-16T17:53:40 < jadew> or lab psu?
2019-02-16T17:53:43 < bitmask> lab
2019-02-16T17:54:01 < jadew> you already have something that's not sufficient?
2019-02-16T17:54:11 < bitmask> I have uhh buck converters? :P
2019-02-16T17:54:23 < jadew> heh
2019-02-16T17:54:37 < jadew> you can probably get something used on ebay
2019-02-16T17:54:43 < bitmask> true
2019-02-16T17:55:29 < bitmask> brb
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2019-02-16T17:56:10 < bitmask> I do want to buy a label maker, esd bags and a euro hook punch and organize my stuffs nicely
2019-02-16T17:56:20 < jadew> if new, the Korad/tenma ones are a popular choice
2019-02-16T17:56:36 < bitmask> yea I just saw that on a facebook group, thats what sparked my reinterest
2019-02-16T17:56:43 < jadew> the rotary encoder is shit tho, so you'll probably have to change it at some point, but they're ok otherwise
2019-02-16T17:56:48 < bitmask> but I like the display of another that eevblog talked about
2019-02-16T17:57:02 < jadew> which one?
2019-02-16T17:57:17 < bitmask> rd tech, let me get a link
2019-02-16T17:57:19 < jadew> I looked into label makers last night (and today)
2019-02-16T17:57:25 < bitmask> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cw2AjcczHg4
2019-02-16T17:57:32 < jadew> you can probably get the brother ql-700 for that money
2019-02-16T17:57:37 < jadew> it's on sale on amazon
2019-02-16T17:57:44 < bitmask> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LV8QI9M/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza?th=1\
2019-02-16T17:57:50 < bitmask> thats the one I was looking at because it has multi line
2019-02-16T17:58:05 < jadew> ah, you need smaller labels
2019-02-16T17:58:05 < Rickta59> get one of those new risc-v boards from seeedstudio
2019-02-16T17:58:32 < jadew> bitmask, I don't like that one
2019-02-16T17:58:38 < bitmask> ohhhh the ql-700 is much nicer
2019-02-16T17:58:51 < bitmask> whys that?
2019-02-16T17:59:05 < BrainDamage> why getting something that's not computer controlled?
2019-02-16T17:59:05 < jadew> don't know, feels hacky
2019-02-16T18:00:04 < bitmask> yea I guess
2019-02-16T18:00:05 < jadew> it has that... chinesium smell (cheap, built beyond a small budget, probably with lots of cut corners)
2019-02-16T18:00:10 < jadew> and generally unreliable
2019-02-16T18:00:18 < bitmask> BrainDamage what the label maker?
2019-02-16T18:00:24 < bitmask> because its cheap
2019-02-16T18:00:47 < bitmask> its 1/3rd the price of these nice ones
2019-02-16T18:01:56 < jadew> bitmask, if I remember correctly, that PSU you linked also caught fire
2019-02-16T18:01:57 < bitmask> and I just need a few lines with support for those nifty barcodes
2019-02-16T18:02:07 < bitmask> hah umm ok
2019-02-16T18:02:18 < bitmask> I guess i'll look at the other one then
2019-02-16T18:02:40 < bitmask> I gotta take a shower, brb
2019-02-16T18:02:47 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2rvAoO-MIA
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2019-02-16T18:27:14 < bitmask> thanks! glad I mentioned it here first
2019-02-16T18:28:08 < bitmask> I gotta start using diodes,  I think connecting 5v on these cheap bucks  output destroys them
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2019-02-16T18:43:44 < bitmask> nice, tweezers came, now I can stop using my gf's eyebrow tweezers :P
2019-02-16T18:44:35 < bitmask> of course they are bent
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2019-02-16T18:54:45 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/N5umirO
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2019-02-16T19:24:32 < Cracki> bitmask, I think they're supposed to be
2019-02-16T19:24:48 < Cracki> at least, the shape isn't unusual. I just hope they're bent in the right direction :P
2019-02-16T19:24:54 < bitmask> why do you all assume I'm an idiot
2019-02-16T19:25:11 < Cracki> because you used your gf's tweezers? :>
2019-02-16T19:25:12 < bitmask> look at the pic, def not the right direction, plus I know what I bought :P
2019-02-16T19:25:26 < bitmask> so? its better than nothing
2019-02-16T19:26:21 < Cracki> what now, bend them straight or use for seppuku?
2019-02-16T19:27:53 < bitmask> I bent em straight, I think they are ok,  I was just worried it would weaken em too much because the tips are so thin
2019-02-16T19:30:29 < Cracki> if that's the 1-buck-kind from china, I won't even suggest regrinding the tip
2019-02-16T19:33:05 < bitmask> close
2019-02-16T19:33:07 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DIYFIX-Electronics-Industrial-Tweezers-Anti-static-Curved-Straight-Tip-Precision-Stainless-Forceps-Phone-Repair-Hand-Tools/32867268552.html?spm=a2g0s.12269583.0.0.5f995ca0RqVIHd
2019-02-16T19:34:20 < bitmask> I like em though
2019-02-16T19:34:33 < bitmask> I just used some needle nose pliers to bend em back
2019-02-16T19:39:30 < BrainDamage> wow, they even drill the bodies so they can get away with less metal
2019-02-16T19:39:56 < rajkosto> why not VETUS ones
2019-02-16T19:40:22 < zyp> as long as the tips match up, just leave the curve
2019-02-16T19:40:52 < bitmask> I like the drilled holes
2019-02-16T19:41:03 < bitmask> makes it comfortable to hold, thats actually the reason I got these
2019-02-16T19:43:51 < bitmask> who would you guys be if you didnt keep bitching though :/
2019-02-16T19:44:17 < zyp> if you ask, expect people to reply :p
2019-02-16T19:44:54 < bitmask> I expect it, doesnt mean its not ridiculous 
2019-02-16T19:46:39 < Steffanx> i see no bitching really.
2019-02-16T19:47:20 < bitmask> why the holes and why not xxx
2019-02-16T19:47:24 < bitmask> standard responses
2019-02-16T19:47:37 < Steffanx> that's not bitching.
2019-02-16T19:47:47 < bitmask> if you say so
2019-02-16T19:47:57 < rajkosto> i see a ton of people using the VETUS ones
2019-02-16T19:48:02 < bitmask> well ok yes you are right, its not bitching
2019-02-16T19:48:06 < rajkosto> they are better for me than just the straight up metal ones
2019-02-16T19:48:38 < bitmask> its just second guessing and people with superiority complexes telling you what you should be doing ;)
2019-02-16T19:49:12 < bitmask> I thought vetus was the regular metal ones like these?
2019-02-16T19:49:17 < bitmask> just without the holes
2019-02-16T19:51:00 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Vetus-6-Pcs-lot-TS10-TS-11-TS-12-TS-13-TS-14-TS-15-High/32946626308.html
2019-02-16T19:52:28 < Steffanx> bitmask better not post shit you're getting if you do no want people to comment on it.
2019-02-16T19:52:50 < bitmask> just like people can comment on what I post, I can comment on what people are commenting
2019-02-16T19:53:01 < bitmask> is that not fair?
2019-02-16T19:53:52 < Steffanx> *bitching :P
2019-02-16T19:53:57 < rajkosto> lol my vetus are black except the tip
2019-02-16T19:54:08 < bitmask> yea they also come in pink :P
2019-02-16T19:54:14 < Steffanx> sexy
2019-02-16T19:55:19 < bitmask> https://www.ebay.com/itm/SALES-4-X-6-4mil-100um-ESD-Anti-Static-Silver-Foil-Zip-Lock-Bag-X-200/112530770893?_trkparms=aid%3D333200%26algo%3DCOMP.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20190129125700%26meid%3Db7919b5ffe9645f8b9fdca3d57f3ac66%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D113628451850%26itm%3D112530770893&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982
2019-02-16T19:55:23 < bitmask> these bags are sexy
2019-02-16T20:06:52 < Steffanx> no one dares to comment bitmask :P
2019-02-16T20:07:15 < bitmask> haha thats ok
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2019-02-16T20:13:02 < Cracki> get some for the gf
2019-02-16T20:34:21 < bitmask> noooo the velcro came off in the washer/drier
2019-02-16T20:34:35 < bitmask> guess I gotta get the sew on kind
2019-02-16T20:48:59 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@2a02:8070:a19d:2500:b5db:4c75:ea37:4e21] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-16T21:01:26 < jadew> bitmask, why anti-static bags?
2019-02-16T21:01:42 < jadew> if it's for organizing your shit, what kind of ESD sensitive things do you have that are loose?
2019-02-16T21:01:51 < jadew> and why are they loose to begin with
2019-02-16T21:03:18 < bitmask> well I have ICs and stuff, I was gonna look for real small bags for that, they arent necessarily loose but in the reel or whatever its called, some are loose or in esd foam
2019-02-16T21:03:33 < bitmask> just thought hanging shit on pegs would be a good way to go about it
2019-02-16T21:04:41 < bitmask> or even in a box thats easy to flip through like a filing cabinet
2019-02-16T21:05:59 < jadew> I recently organized my 0 to 1k resistors in a box, came out OK, but it was a tight fit
2019-02-16T21:06:07 < jadew> (two rows)
2019-02-16T21:06:18 < jadew> single row would be ideal
2019-02-16T21:06:35 < jpa-> i've begun to put my components in folders by just punching holes in the bags they were shipped in
2019-02-16T21:06:42 < rajkosto> the thing about that is when you get a value thats in between 2 values youve already put in the box
2019-02-16T21:06:50 < bitmask> yea, nice boxes that are short/thin but deep and stack em or something
2019-02-16T21:07:21 < jadew> rajkosto, so you put it between them
2019-02-16T21:07:27 < rajkosto> but how
2019-02-16T21:07:34 < jadew> let me take a photo to see what I mean
2019-02-16T21:07:37 < bitmask> my original idea was to get the esd bags and put em all on hooks but that might be a bitch to get to the ones in the back
2019-02-16T21:08:05 < bitmask> these bigger ones were mainly for storing cables and what not, so they dont need to be esd but those bags I linked are so nice :P
2019-02-16T21:10:02 < bitmask> jadew can that $100 label maker do thin labels as well? because those postage sized ones might be too big for what I'm looking for
2019-02-16T21:10:25 < jadew> I believe so, yes
2019-02-16T21:10:30 < bitmask> figured, just wanted to check
2019-02-16T21:10:32 < jadew> you just use a smaller roll
2019-02-16T21:10:50 < jadew> I want to get one that does 100mm max, but they're a bit expensive
2019-02-16T21:15:22 < bitmask> I think I'm gonna 3d print something for resistors and caps, things with lots of values are a pain in the ass
2019-02-16T21:16:09 < bitmask> I bought 3 packs of these 300 or so resistor assortments and they are just in the bag they came in, I guess its not really that bad looking through to find the value
2019-02-16T21:16:21 < bitmask> but I'm also trying to get more into smd
2019-02-16T21:16:59 < bitmask> I have a book of 0805s but they are 5% and I want 1 :P
2019-02-16T21:17:09 < rajkosto> https://1436477554.rsc.cdn77.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/SMT-SMD-Components-Storage-Module-box-50-pcs.jpg
2019-02-16T21:17:21 < jadew> I have those
2019-02-16T21:17:29 < jadew> I use them for a different purpose tho
2019-02-16T21:18:06 < bitmask> https://www.amazon.com/Resistor-Capacitor-Organizer-Storage-Compartments-x/dp/B008GDSGTK
2019-02-16T21:18:08 < bitmask> I want that :P
2019-02-16T21:18:23 < rajkosto> yeah those are better
2019-02-16T21:19:42 < jadew> I don't
2019-02-16T21:19:52 < jadew> that means that they're all loose
2019-02-16T21:20:06 < rajkosto> but i like the cheap boxes because you can dissasebmle and reassemble them
2019-02-16T21:20:08 < rajkosto> any order you want
2019-02-16T21:22:19 < rajkosto> however they do seem to leak 0402s
2019-02-16T21:22:23 < rajkosto> so no bueno
2019-02-16T21:22:49 < jadew> this is how I keep mine: http://5.12.15.1/stuff/resistor_storage.jpg
2019-02-16T21:23:06 < bitmask> wow
2019-02-16T21:23:08 < bitmask> nice
2019-02-16T21:23:11 < bitmask> those rolls?
2019-02-16T21:23:32 < jadew> segments
2019-02-16T21:23:34 < jadew> of 100-200 pcs
2019-02-16T21:23:42 < bitmask> ahh ok
2019-02-16T21:23:44 < jadew> they're mainly for experimenting
2019-02-16T21:23:59 < jadew> and as long as you keep them ordered, locating a particular value is really easy
2019-02-16T21:24:26 < jadew> I have 0 to 100 on one side
2019-02-16T21:24:29 < jadew> 100 to 1k on the other
2019-02-16T21:27:23 < jadew> this has the advantage that you will also know what PN you used
2019-02-16T21:27:40 < jadew> but that's not important for everyone
2019-02-16T21:27:44 < invzim> I changed how I organize stuff recently to diff between low and high qty
2019-02-16T21:28:07 < jadew> invzim, how did you do it?
2019-02-16T21:28:12 < invzim> high qty I leave the way it was delivered, unless it's totally retarded
2019-02-16T21:28:27 < invzim> low qty I put in smallish ESD bags
2019-02-16T21:29:06 < invzim> I also have a few of the one rajkosto pasted
2019-02-16T21:29:27 < rajkosto> what if you put 100pcs rolls inside the 2x2cm boxes
2019-02-16T21:29:32 < bitmask> hmm, all I have is low quantity at the moment.  been buying things either in qty of 10-20 or some in 100
2019-02-16T21:29:42 < invzim> 100pcs smallish component is low qty :)
2019-02-16T21:30:01 < rajkosto> this would prevent them falling out
2019-02-16T21:30:14 < rajkosto> i think ill do it that way
2019-02-16T21:30:23 < jadew> rajkosto, those little boxes are too small for storing the strip IMO
2019-02-16T21:30:29 < jadew> it's better to use a catalog
2019-02-16T21:30:32 < rajkosto> 0402 100pcs strip is smol
2019-02-16T21:30:42 < jadew> yeah, but you bend it too much
2019-02-16T21:31:01 < jadew> it might get annoying when you try to use it
2019-02-16T21:31:10 < invzim> Let me snap a few pics
2019-02-16T21:31:17 < bitmask> I want some like 5x7cm esd bags for that stuff
2019-02-16T21:31:38 < jadew> the boxes you linked, I use to drop used parts in (the ones I experiment with and are left over)
2019-02-16T21:31:58 < jadew> so I just collect them all in one of those boxes and then I throw the box in the box with the rest of the components for that particular project
2019-02-16T21:32:51 < jadew> comes in handy if I get back to trying new values or combinations
2019-02-16T21:33:09 < invzim> https://drive.google.com/open?id=1zPOWJCXNisMzTAr298wAf4Y33pCfpoEM
2019-02-16T21:33:24 < invzim> that would be the low qty
2019-02-16T21:33:33 < jadew> that looks nice!
2019-02-16T21:33:35 < rajkosto> i have them like that i hate it
2019-02-16T21:33:38 < jadew> I like the separator boxes
2019-02-16T21:33:43 < invzim> https://drive.google.com/open?id=1364oewMxafWh4AMFfzFpNyzTgFSzT5am
2019-02-16T21:33:46 < invzim> high qty
2019-02-16T21:33:51 < jadew> rajkosto, why?
2019-02-16T21:34:01 < invzim> https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ny9mNRksUNwDmK02iQiT6KkoUi-VQhGj
2019-02-16T21:34:02 < rajkosto> have to open the antistatic, remove strip, put it back
2019-02-16T21:34:19 < invzim> and the small boxes I use as 'transit' or 'used all the time'
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2019-02-16T21:34:40 < jadew> invzim, those are very well organized
2019-02-16T21:34:45 < jadew> where did you get that last box from?
2019-02-16T21:35:10 < invzim> those are great
2019-02-16T21:35:14 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-Arrival-SMD-SMT-IC-Electronic-Component-Portable-7-days-Mini-Storage-Box-21-Cells/32967408262.html lol literally a pill box
2019-02-16T21:36:02 < jadew> I use something like that for stuff I use all the time
2019-02-16T21:36:51 < invzim> jadew: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Raaco-Handy-ASSORTER-55-Best%C3%BCck-Assorted/dp/B001GQL91G
2019-02-16T21:36:59 < invzim> you can find them cheaper
2019-02-16T21:37:03 < jadew> awesome, thank you
2019-02-16T21:37:04 < invzim> but they are stackable and sturdy
2019-02-16T21:37:23 < invzim> orinial brand is raaco and they're called handy box
2019-02-16T21:37:43 < jadew> thanks, they do look handy
2019-02-16T21:38:35 < invzim> https://uk.farnell.com/raaco/136242/handybox-with-4-service-cases/dp/2069918
2019-02-16T21:39:04 < invzim> I get them cloned or licensed from here, https://www.clasohlson.com/no/Oppbevaringsboks/Pr311432000
2019-02-16T21:39:34 < jadew> what's that in money?
2019-02-16T21:39:48 < invzim> 81 usd
2019-02-16T21:39:56 < jadew> not a huge difference
2019-02-16T21:39:57 < invzim> or 63 gbp
2019-02-16T21:40:15 < jadew> ah, vs 111 it is
2019-02-16T21:40:53 < jadew> I'll see if I can find them locally, I've been looking for a solution for storing the bigger parts (switches, buttons, knobs)
2019-02-16T21:42:39 < invzim> where are you located?
2019-02-16T21:43:45 < jadew> Romania
2019-02-16T21:47:00 < invzim> EU so you can shop around unless us here in soviet norway
2019-02-16T21:47:10 < invzim> unlike
2019-02-16T21:47:35 < jadew> what's making it difficult for you?
2019-02-16T21:48:32 < invzim> anything from outsie Norway is 25% salestax, which I guess is fair enough, but you get processing fees, clearance fees etc etc that makes it very expensive 
2019-02-16T21:49:07 < zyp> invzim, not necessarily
2019-02-16T21:49:17 < zyp> what's the context here, I haven't been following
2019-02-16T21:49:19 < invzim> no, if you're a company it's much easier :)
2019-02-16T21:49:31 < zyp> doesn't have to be a company, but sure
2019-02-16T21:50:12 < zyp> I'm just thinking there's shipping methods that include customs processing, which means there's no additional fees, just the VAT itself
2019-02-16T21:51:53 < jadew> I didn't know Norway was not part of the EU
2019-02-16T21:52:05 < invzim> may be getting better, these days I do it all via my company which makes it a lot easier
2019-02-16T21:52:10 < zyp> hehe
2019-02-16T21:52:14 < zyp> VAT registered?
2019-02-16T21:52:17 < invzim> yup
2019-02-16T21:52:22 < jadew> well, if you pay VAT, doesn't that mean you can buy them for less?
2019-02-16T21:52:30 < invzim> the shipping hassle was one of the main motivators for setting that stuffup :)
2019-02-16T21:52:43 < zyp> I'm not VAT registered
2019-02-16T21:52:43 < jadew> if you buy from a VAT paying company, the company wouldn't ask you for VAT
2019-02-16T21:52:50 < invzim> last month I got VAT money BACK from the government which was a nice change
2019-02-16T21:52:56 < zyp> hehe
2019-02-16T21:53:35 < zyp> I guess I could declare more income to get above the limit for VAT registration
2019-02-16T21:53:46 < zyp> but then I'd have to pay tax on that income, so eeh :p
2019-02-16T21:54:53 < invzim> ENK?
2019-02-16T21:54:59 < zyp> yes
2019-02-16T21:55:38 < zyp> I'm not bothering declaring hobby income, just actual contract work
2019-02-16T21:57:34 < invzim> for now I just keep everthing within the company, just a hobby thing anyway so no real need to put it in my 'pocket'
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2019-02-16T22:01:52 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-16T22:02:14 < zyp> got zigbee sniffing working, got the traffic between my ikea lights all piping into wireshark now
2019-02-16T22:02:37 < zyp> next step is figuring out how to get the encryption key so I can look at what they're transferring :p
2019-02-16T22:10:50 < rajkosto> with any well designed protocol passive sniffing shouldnt get you those
2019-02-16T22:11:05 < Steffanx> what are you using as sniffer zyp?
2019-02-16T22:13:36 < jpa-> rajkosto: well, there has to be some mechanism to pair the devices
2019-02-16T22:13:51 < rajkosto> so unless you MITM that, no keys for you
2019-02-16T22:14:42 < zyp> Steffanx, https://openlabs.co/store/Raspberry-Pi-802.15.4-radio
2019-02-16T22:23:27 < Steffanx> Didnt you once say you can just jtag into the bulb and/or gateway zyp?
2019-02-16T22:23:47 < zyp> yes, I have a cracked open remote here just waiting for me to solder on some swd leads
2019-02-16T22:24:06 < Steffanx> binaries are available on the web as well i see.
2019-02-16T22:26:55 < qyx> jpa-: yes but even on TOFU protocols you have to do MITM if they are at least using a kind of DH
2019-02-16T22:28:18 < zyp> from what I've read, I'm not sure DH is involved, seems like the exchange is just using some predefined secret key that I'm not supposed to know
2019-02-16T22:29:08 < jpa-> yeah, based on some googling seems many zigbee devices just transmit random key XOR hard-coded master key
2019-02-16T22:29:15 < zyp> this is ZLL
2019-02-16T22:29:32 < zyp> so just google «zll master key» :p
2019-02-16T22:29:38 < zyp> https://itsecx.fhstp.ac.at/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/20151103_ITSECX_ZigBee_GBU_v13_novids.pdf
2019-02-16T22:30:19 < zyp> that said, I tried doing a couple of handshakes here, and I can't really pick out the key exchange in wireshark, so idk
2019-02-16T22:30:53 < Steffanx> but how can the tradfri stuff talk to hue stuff? They shared the key?
2019-02-16T22:30:59 < zyp> on the other hand, I think gateway updated the firmware on the old bulb I paired, after pairing it I suddenly had another 18k packets in my trace :p
2019-02-16T22:31:06 < zyp> they are both based on ZLL
2019-02-16T22:31:56 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-16T22:32:13 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/et6Bi.png <- pretty sure that must have been an automatic firmware upgrade :p
2019-02-16T22:32:14 < Steffanx> But why do you need the key then? Going for "bare"  802.15.4 and do it all yourself?
2019-02-16T22:32:56 < jpa-> is ZLL a standard based on sharing a secret key all across an industry?
2019-02-16T22:32:59 < zyp> well, first of all because it's no fun looking at a wireshark trace full of encrypted payload
2019-02-16T22:33:03 < zyp> yes :D
2019-02-16T22:33:25 < Steffanx> hmm didnt know that
2019-02-16T22:33:49 < zyp> so here's my plan:
2019-02-16T22:33:52 < qyx> lol
2019-02-16T22:34:08 < zyp> step 1: get a decrypted trace so I can figure out how everything works together
2019-02-16T22:34:31 < zyp> step 2: hook up swd to the remote I cracked open and hack around with it
2019-02-16T22:34:56 < zyp> step 3: figure out how to make my own code participate in the zigbee network and talk to the other devices
2019-02-16T22:35:10 < zyp> step 4: make my own light switches
2019-02-16T22:35:30 < qyx> step 5 profit
2019-02-16T22:35:41 < zyp> also that
2019-02-16T22:36:17 < zyp> I mean, if I can make a simple module that works along the ikea stuff, I figure other people might be interested too
2019-02-16T22:51:54 < Steffanx> How you push your data into wireshark btw? Made some fancy usb tool?
2019-02-16T22:52:29 < Steffanx> or is it all on the pri
2019-02-16T22:52:30 < Steffanx> rpi
2019-02-16T22:53:13 < Steffanx> or using remote capture (didnt know wireshark could do that )
2019-02-16T22:54:04 < zyp> just netcat
2019-02-16T22:54:24 < zyp> tshark piped into netcat on one end, netcat piped into wireshark on the other
2019-02-16T22:54:49 < zyp> tshark -i monitor0 -w - -F pcap | nc 10.188.0.101 19848
2019-02-16T22:54:50 < zyp> nc -l 19848 | wireshark -k -i -
2019-02-16T23:00:55 -!- jadew [~razvan@unaffiliated/jadew] has quit [Quit: exit]
2019-02-16T23:04:21 < catphish> i always just do that with ssh
2019-02-16T23:05:27 < Steffanx> Damn, whops. jlcpcb is too fast putting stuff into producted. 10 minutes after ordering i noticed i didnt add the proper paste data for the stencil, but it was already too late to cancel. 
2019-02-16T23:05:34 < catphish> ssh remotehost tcpdump -U -s0 -w - 'not port 22' | wireshark -k -i -
2019-02-16T23:06:22 < Steffanx> what if its not tcp?
2019-02-16T23:06:28 < catphish> Steffanx: after checking repeatedly, i tend to only notice errors on my boards seconds after i submit them
2019-02-16T23:06:44 < catphish> Steffanx: tcpdump is misnamed, it's actually just an ethernet capture tool
2019-02-16T23:07:36 < Steffanx> in this case i forgot to add the paste gerbers completely. guess theyll just use the solder mask stuff.
2019-02-16T23:09:01 < catphish> Steffanx: last time i *did* upload a paste gerber to allpcb they used the solder mask gerber for the stencil anyway :(
2019-02-16T23:09:17 < catphish> the next time i made sure to place it as 2 separate items and they did it right
2019-02-16T23:09:28 < Steffanx> Yes, that's what ill do next time
2019-02-16T23:09:38 < catphish> means you cant mess it up too :)
2019-02-16T23:09:44 < Steffanx> yes you can, but .. :P
2019-02-16T23:09:46 < catphish> and they can't mess it up, and everyone wins
2019-02-16T23:10:40 < rajkosto> Steffanx, 10 MINUTES ?
2019-02-16T23:10:45 < rajkosto> took a day to queue up for me
2019-02-16T23:11:01 < rajkosto> took a few hours to pass "Audit" too
2019-02-16T23:11:19 < Steffanx> yes. 10 minutes
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2019-02-16T23:47:09 < zyp> «cstartup-iar.c»
2019-02-16T23:47:10 < zyp> heh
2019-02-16T23:52:27 < malinus> ew
2019-02-16T23:53:25 < zyp> hmm, there's two copies of the zll master key in the firmware binary
2019-02-16T23:55:11 < zyp> one is in what looks like .rodata, and the other looks like it might be in a config storage area
2019-02-16T23:59:09 < zyp> definitely a config storage area, after I reset the remote and redumped the flash, that entire page is erased
--- Day changed Sun Feb 17 2019
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2019-02-17T00:08:17 < superbia> found a more efficient way to backup, simply order new 500gig ssd
2019-02-17T00:09:29 < superbia> they are under 100 franks
2019-02-17T00:12:33 < zyp> looks like the config storage system of this thing is tag based, similar to the one I made for workstuff
2019-02-17T00:16:54 < superbia> bedtime boys
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2019-02-17T00:32:40 < zyp> nice, found the key
2019-02-17T00:43:34 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/bhtev.png
2019-02-17T00:43:44 < Steffanx> Wasnt that just a binary search for something you already know?
2019-02-17T00:43:58 < zyp> not the master key, the network key
2019-02-17T00:44:05 < Steffanx> Ah. 
2019-02-17T00:44:20 < Steffanx> Oh wireshark already has the decoder et all?
2019-02-17T00:44:23 < zyp> every zigbee network creates their own random network key, the master key is just used to encrypt the network key during pairing
2019-02-17T00:44:26 < zyp> yes
2019-02-17T00:46:14 < zyp> wireshark dissectors handles decryption and everything, you just need to feed it a list of keys and it'll figure out which works
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2019-02-17T00:56:49 < mawk> do they encrypt at the PHY level zyp ?
2019-02-17T00:56:54 < mawk> or it's at the application level
2019-02-17T00:56:55 < zyp> no
2019-02-17T00:58:46 < zyp> 802.15.4 and zigbee network layer are unencrypted
2019-02-17T00:58:50 < mawk> I see
2019-02-17T00:59:09 < zyp> and then there's a zigbee security layer on top of the network layer
2019-02-17T00:59:54 < zyp> that again contains the encrypted payload for the application layer
2019-02-17T01:00:03 < mawk> for 6LoWPAN I've seen recommandations for encrypting at the 802.15.4, then use SSL
2019-02-17T01:00:13 < mawk> and they even mention encrypting at the ipv6 level with ipsec but they say it's not practical
2019-02-17T01:00:18 < mawk> it was on wikipedia actually
2019-02-17T01:00:32 < mawk> ah, so kinda same thing
2019-02-17T01:00:36 < mawk> what's the reason for this double encryption ?
2019-02-17T01:01:58 < mawk> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3574732/
2019-02-17T01:01:59 < mawk> lol
2019-02-17T01:02:14 < mawk> an article about 6LoWPAN on the medical publication registry
2019-02-17T01:17:59 < kakimir> unicorn technology
2019-02-17T01:22:08 < Cracki> do they have something on that 5g tin foil hat stuff too?
2019-02-17T01:22:56 < Cracki> kek dat abstract "Low power [OVER wpan]"
2019-02-17T01:23:05 < Cracki> tesla would be proud
2019-02-17T01:33:09 < kakimir> let's pump
2019-02-17T01:34:04 < kakimir> where is my boi dr. B
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2019-02-17T01:46:35 < bitmask> grrr
2019-02-17T01:47:33 < bitmask> I was gonna get the brother p-touch pt-d400 because its only $35 but it doesn't do qr codes.  now I'm leaning towards the pt-d600 which is $77,  more than double the price to get qr codes
2019-02-17T01:50:26 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/t0kNLE8
2019-02-17T01:50:27 < aandrew> that's the most difficult mod on this board
2019-02-17T01:50:34 < aandrew> englishman: OES did kind of a shit job
2019-02-17T01:50:34 < kakimir> no man
2019-02-17T01:51:58 < kakimir> bitmask: ptp700
2019-02-17T01:52:05 < kakimir> you should get it pretty cheap
2019-02-17T01:52:17 < kakimir> and PC laber writer just totally rules
2019-02-17T01:53:53 < bitmask> its the same price and both are pc connected
2019-02-17T01:54:49 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/2tliDnO are the panels, assembled
2019-02-17T01:55:28 < aandrew> bitmask: I have an ancient 2430PC, I love it
2019-02-17T01:56:59 < bitmask> I guess I should just bite the bullet and spend the money, the D600 also takes up to 24mm (versus 18 on the cheap one), and pc connection makes a big difference since its also the only way to do QR codes
2019-02-17T01:57:12 < aandrew> yeah I like the PC connection
2019-02-17T01:57:34 < aandrew> although for osx software it's only avaiable on the japanese brother site and in some dark and dank corner of it at that
2019-02-17T01:57:49 < kakimir> SMA detected
2019-02-17T01:58:02 < aandrew> nope
2019-02-17T01:58:03 < aandrew> MCX
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2019-02-17T03:00:43 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-17T03:00:56 < zyp> EFR32 doesn't document the radio interface
2019-02-17T03:01:06 < zyp> «The Radio Transceiver interface is accessible through software drivers provided by Silicon Labs.»
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2019-02-17T03:20:19 < mawk> lol
2019-02-17T03:25:46 < jadew> by software drivers they mean what? closed source stuff or some source code you can get from them?
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2019-02-17T04:07:08 < aandrew> well after struggling with teh first few panels, the rest are coming up really nicely
2019-02-17T04:07:22 < jadew> what panels?
2019-02-17T04:07:31 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/2tliDnO
2019-02-17T04:07:53 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/t0kNLE8 is the nastiest mod I had to do (2x per digitizer board, the largest board in the panel)
2019-02-17T04:07:58 < jadew> they look neat
2019-02-17T04:08:38 < jadew> yeah, that looks painful
2019-02-17T04:10:24 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/UHh9e61 is what a digitizer looks like after the mods
2019-02-17T04:11:45 < jadew> looks very nice, are these the first runs?
2019-02-17T04:12:06 < aandrew> there's like $600 of parts one each one of those digitizers
2019-02-17T04:12:09 < aandrew> yes
2019-02-17T04:12:13 < aandrew> hence the mods
2019-02-17T04:12:31 < aandrew> I fucked up a few things. nothing that will kill these prototypes (yet) but still embarassing enough
2019-02-17T04:13:08 < jadew> why did you get multiple boards made if it was the first run? is that common?
2019-02-17T04:13:36 < aandrew> JTAG chain is fucked (that's what most of those flywire mods fix), the barrel jack I swapped pin and switch so you can't use it at all (dead short), the clock chip fix that I linked, and then the hermaphroditic connector on the bottom I pinswapped left-to-right so it won't work
2019-02-17T04:13:40 < jadew> you had confidence in the design?
2019-02-17T04:13:48 < aandrew> it mates fine but I used the pinout for the wrong "end" of it
2019-02-17T04:14:09 < aandrew> thankfully samtec has interposer connector microcoax cables that I can use to fix that
2019-02-17T04:14:23 < aandrew> well they want to get developing
2019-02-17T04:14:30 < jadew> ah, I see
2019-02-17T04:14:34 < aandrew> so we did the normal checks but clearly not diligently enogh
2019-02-17T04:14:39 < jadew> so they needed multiple boards for that
2019-02-17T04:14:57 < aandrew> *hopefully* there's no shorts under the BGAs, I found one on the STM32 of one of them
2019-02-17T04:15:07 < aandrew> and HOPEFULLY design-wise I didn't overlook anything
2019-02-17T04:15:13 < aandrew> theoretically it should work
2019-02-17T04:15:21 < aandrew> yeah there will be multiple units in the labs
2019-02-17T04:15:37 < aandrew> optics guys will get a few, application guys will get one, electronics guys will get a few etc etc
2019-02-17T04:15:45 < aandrew> and then you get a few more too because you know they're gonna get fried
2019-02-17T04:18:18 < aandrew> in that section that's repeated 5 times you see two rows of 6 pins -- those 5 areas are the digitizers; the 2 6 pin headers are for an optional signal conditioning board in case we need to play with any filtering or pre-processing before the digitizer gets it
2019-02-17T04:18:42 < aandrew> without anything plugged in it's just got a preamp (digitizer driver) and then some light filtering
2019-02-17T04:19:32 < jadew> you didn't do any testing prior to sending the prototypes out for production?
2019-02-17T04:19:38 < jadew> no sub-boards and stuff like that?
2019-02-17T04:19:57 < aandrew> no
2019-02-17T04:20:15 < aandrew> there's too much that has to work together to try to cobble it together with a dev kit
2019-02-17T04:20:42 < aandrew> I guess we could have done a tiny digitizer front end to HSMC or something like that
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2019-02-17T04:39:02 < englishman> aandrew: boards look ok
2019-02-17T04:39:11 < englishman> what's crappy?
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2019-02-17T05:04:43 < tjq> https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/422b4424-6963-483f-8602-54225998b8a7
2019-02-17T05:09:05 < jadew> what's that from?
2019-02-17T05:09:32 < jadew> ah, it says in the title
2019-02-17T05:09:35 < jadew> I thought it might be that
2019-02-17T05:09:42 < jadew> maybe it's time to see it again
2019-02-17T05:11:27 < jadew> neither amazon prime, nor netflix has it
2019-02-17T05:16:53 < jadew> ah ha! netflix works in HD from the app
2019-02-17T05:17:02 < jadew> finally...
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2019-02-17T05:53:18 < englishman> also aandrew werent those due to be assembled like 3 months ago
2019-02-17T05:56:13 < rajkosto> dongs, dont @ me bro
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2019-02-17T06:08:07 < englishman> you dont have @
2019-02-17T06:08:11 < englishman> i dont see the issue
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2019-02-17T07:07:12 < bitmask> grrrrbls
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2019-02-17T07:54:39 < mawk> I'm trying to download the Thread specifications
2019-02-17T07:54:40 < mawk> lol
2019-02-17T07:54:55 < mawk> they take your name and address, then send you a watermarked and encrypted pdf by mail
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2019-02-17T08:27:36 < tjq> sniff it
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2019-02-17T09:31:04 < dongs> rajkosto: loldongs
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2019-02-17T10:23:01 < tjq> hello chief let's talk why not
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2019-02-17T12:21:52 < rajkosto> littlevgl is fantastic
2019-02-17T12:22:07 < rajkosto> the double buffered mode is exactly what i wanted (rendering one strip while another is transferring over dma)
2019-02-17T12:24:19 < Steffanx> Never heard of it. Is it newish?
2019-02-17T12:25:51 < Steffanx> Never call something like this little, it never stays little :P
2019-02-17T12:30:59 < rajkosto> its not that new
2019-02-17T12:31:17 < rajkosto> its a full featured properly skinned UI library
2019-02-17T12:31:34 < rajkosto> specifically for MCU
2019-02-17T12:33:57 < rajkosto> but yeah unlike the other garbage like uGUI it doesnt do flickery drawing only
2019-02-17T12:41:44 < tjq> ugfx
2019-02-17T12:41:52 < rajkosto> adafruit gfx is the same as uGUI
2019-02-17T12:42:02 < rajkosto> immediate writing of all rendering ops as they happen
2019-02-17T12:42:07 < Steffanx> Youre doing it wrong
2019-02-17T12:44:25 < rajkosto> how come
2019-02-17T12:44:40 < rajkosto> if you just wanna benchmark box and line drawing, adafruit GFX and uGUI are fine
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2019-02-17T13:44:16 < dongs> uGuuFx
2019-02-17T13:44:33 < dongs> yeah littlevgl is neat
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2019-02-17T13:56:59 < Steffanx> Hmm touchgfx is free too now for stm32.. it looked pretty cool
2019-02-17T13:57:17 < dongs> what is that? is that the shit ST offers?
2019-02-17T13:57:25 < dongs> i thought ST thing was segger UI thing
2019-02-17T13:58:31 < Steffanx> Its something ST bought a while ago
2019-02-17T13:58:39 < veverak> fuck me
2019-02-17T13:58:40 < Steffanx> It was non-free
2019-02-17T13:58:47 < Steffanx> And its c++ :P
2019-02-17T13:58:50 < dongs> --++--++--++--++--++--++--++--++--++--++--++--++
2019-02-17T13:58:51 < dongs> gross
2019-02-17T13:58:53 < dongs> well never mind taht
2019-02-17T13:59:02 < veverak> evidently I can't write simple callback
2019-02-17T13:59:11 < Steffanx> The code examples looked pretty clean
2019-02-17T13:59:31 < dongs> STM32Cube includes STM32CubeMX. The graphic software configuration tool supports the generation of C initialization code to run TouchGFX on your supported STM32 microcontroller.
2019-02-17T13:59:34 < dongs> cubeonly
2019-02-17T14:00:35 < veverak> anyway, I have PBUFFER[x][y][z] array, and do something like: uint8_t ** pbuffer = PBUFFER[PBUFFER_I];   if (pbuffer[0][i] == PACKET_END) { ...} HardFault always points at the line with "pbuffer[0][i] == PACKET_END"
2019-02-17T14:01:16 < veverak> but, the pbuffer pointer points at the start of defined array, so it does not access memory where it should not
2019-02-17T14:03:37 < veverak> waaaait
2019-02-17T14:03:38 < veverak> fuck me
2019-02-17T14:03:58  * veverak is dumb has hell, goes away in shame, he can see his mistakes and will praty to the cthulhu tday
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2019-02-17T15:51:39 < rajkosto> dongs, what the FUCK is the interface for making a keypad input driver for littlevgl tho
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2019-02-17T16:05:43 < rajkosto> https://jaycarlson.net/microcontrollers/ ???
2019-02-17T16:05:53 < zyp> jadew, from what I understand it's just distributed as a precompiled library and headers
2019-02-17T16:06:53 < kakimir> jaeckel: who is that dude?
2019-02-17T16:07:09 < kakimir> jaeckel: nevermind wrong nick
2019-02-17T16:07:47 < kakimir> rajkosto: who is jay carlson?
2019-02-17T16:10:09 < Steffanx> https://jaycarlson.net/about/
2019-02-17T16:13:55 < kakimir> I'm writing a script
2019-02-17T16:14:02 < kakimir> to
2019-02-17T16:14:06 < kakimir> produce G-code
2019-02-17T16:16:42 < Steffanx> what scripting language?
2019-02-17T16:16:48 < Steffanx> kakiscript?
2019-02-17T16:16:56 < kakimir> js
2019-02-17T16:17:05 < antto> javamir
2019-02-17T16:17:11 < Steffanx> :P
2019-02-17T16:17:26 < kakimir> it is really great if this works
2019-02-17T16:17:32 < kakimir> it's for qcam
2019-02-17T16:17:37 < kakimir> qcadcam
2019-02-17T16:28:05 < Steffanx> can i replace my tradfri gateway yet, zyp? :P
2019-02-17T16:29:10 < zyp> haha
2019-02-17T16:29:43 < mawk> tråååådfri
2019-02-17T16:32:33 < zyp> the EFR32 radio seems annoying to work with, so now I'm wondering if it's possible to get my hands on stm32wb instead
2019-02-17T16:39:04 < mawk> st will give me one in some time
2019-02-17T16:39:11 < mawk> I signed up for a "workshop" in some french city
2019-02-17T16:39:30 < zyp> farnell says they have 28 in stock and doesn't seem negative to shipping it to norway
2019-02-17T16:41:47 < zyp> but apparently the reference manual for the chip is not published
2019-02-17T16:41:52 < zyp> maybe NDA or something
2019-02-17T16:42:35 < zyp> I should probably email ST and ask
2019-02-17T16:43:42 < Steffanx> time for a stm32 meetup in one of the following places: https://www.st.com/content/st_com/en/about/events/events.html/stm32wb-hands-on-workshop-2018.html :P
2019-02-17T16:43:59 < Steffanx> Rennes = mawk i assume?
2019-02-17T16:44:09 < Steffanx> or Toulouse
2019-02-17T16:44:28 < zyp> aww, all the nearby ones have been already
2019-02-17T16:45:15 < Steffanx> hm the STM32WB55CG  is even "active" now. how fancy
2019-02-17T16:49:33 < englishman> maek is in paris
2019-02-17T16:49:37 < englishman> everyone in france is in paris
2019-02-17T16:49:54 < Steffanx> i know, but ST isnt.
2019-02-17T16:50:07 < englishman> stm32 meeting in jo-bourg
2019-02-17T16:50:34 < Steffanx> id prefer Cape Town i think
2019-02-17T16:57:01 < mawk> I don't remember which one I picked Steffanx 
2019-02-17T16:57:29 < mawk> Toulouse I think
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2019-02-17T17:19:05 < aandrew> englishman: there's some garbage. there was definitely no AOI done, they did not mask off the boards I didn't want stuffed so I have fucking solder everywhere on them
2019-02-17T17:19:11 < aandrew> englishman: nothing bad
2019-02-17T17:19:45 < englishman> thats pretty typical, idk if you can put anything on a pcb to mask off paste like that
2019-02-17T17:19:55 < aandrew> englishman: yes, they were supposed to be in my grubby little hands before Jan 1
2019-02-17T17:19:57 < englishman> any thickness in there would fuck up other parts of the pcb i think
2019-02-17T17:20:01 < englishman> lol
2019-02-17T17:20:43 < aandrew> englishman: well before they got the stencils made I told them that I did not want the other boards showing up. just the 5 sensor boards and the long digitizer board
2019-02-17T17:20:50 < aandrew> that would have prevented the problem. 
2019-02-17T17:21:08 < englishman> weird
2019-02-17T17:21:30 < aandrew> so they ignored that request, I had a DNP list that they half ignored and DNP'd additional components that I didn't ask to be DNP'd
2019-02-17T17:23:05 < englishman> lol ok
2019-02-17T17:23:07 < englishman> that sucks
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2019-02-17T18:23:23 < rajkosto> the lvgl KEYPAD type input device sucks as it has separate PREV, NEXT, LEFT, RIGHT, UP, DOWN requirements, the ENCODER sorts this all out but only has one button available
2019-02-17T18:24:20 < Steffanx> its sores, you can make it work
2019-02-17T18:24:25 < rajkosto> code sucks
2019-02-17T18:24:28 < rajkosto> dont understand it
2019-02-17T18:24:32 < Steffanx> haha
2019-02-17T18:24:43 < rajkosto> i also dont like forking git submodules
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2019-02-17T18:25:14 < Steffanx> bye
2019-02-17T18:37:20 < zyp> haha
2019-02-17T18:37:58 < Steffanx> Autism kicked in?
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2019-02-17T19:21:48 < Steffanx> Wb raj
2019-02-17T19:21:52 < Steffanx> rajkosto.
2019-02-17T19:22:05 < rajkosto> why
2019-02-17T19:22:15 < rajkosto> https://streamable.com/xax9p gooey
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2019-02-17T19:23:59 < superbia> evening pros
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2019-02-17T19:32:40 < rajkosto> need to photoshop a gooey i would like first i suppose
2019-02-17T19:34:04 < Cracki> wat
2019-02-17T19:34:41 < rajkosto> CONCEPT
2019-02-17T19:34:55 < Steffanx> Use pen and paper :)
2019-02-17T19:37:55 < Cracki> a gui for what? selecting from three options?
2019-02-17T19:38:03 < rajkosto> dpi is strange cuz if i use the actual dpi of the display all the widgets end up being huge
2019-02-17T19:38:13 < rajkosto> Cracki, that was just sample code
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2019-02-17T19:38:23 < rajkosto> to see if display/input driver worked
2019-02-17T19:38:26 < Cracki> so perhaps the widgets are supposed to be huge
2019-02-17T19:38:44 < Cracki> widgets specified in millimeters or something?
2019-02-17T19:50:30 < jpa-> it could be the widgets are scaled for what you would typically use on a PC screen, which is huge compared to embedded stuff
2019-02-17T19:51:14 < rajkosto> it does attempt to do some scaling based on LV_DPI value, which real world is 262, but default is 96
2019-02-17T19:51:33 < rajkosto> with that DPI i'd only be able to have like two button or widgets on screen though
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2019-02-17T19:51:53 < jpa-> and how large is the screen? 1 inch?
2019-02-17T19:52:05 < rajkosto> 1.3, 240x240
2019-02-17T19:52:13 < jpa-> sounds about right
2019-02-17T19:56:37 < rajkosto> i can fit like 6 of the displays into a 240x240px square on desktop monitor
2019-02-17T20:01:38 < qyx> my 240px are 63mm long
2019-02-17T20:02:14 < qyx> wich is exactly 96dpi O_o
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2019-02-17T20:04:42 < rajkosto> same
2019-02-17T20:05:01 < invzim> usb descriptor randomness, what's the diff between physical and logical collection?
2019-02-17T20:05:28 < rajkosto> while the display is 24mm
2019-02-17T20:10:57 < zyp> invzim, I assume you mean HID?
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2019-02-17T20:15:01 < zyp> invzim, HID spec section 6.2.2.6 explains it
2019-02-17T20:15:15 < zyp> «A physical collection is used for a set of data items that represent data points collected at one geometric point.»
2019-02-17T20:15:37 < zyp> «A logical collection is used when a set of data items form a composite data structure. An example of this is the association between a data buffer and a byte count of the data. The collection establishes the link between the count and the buffer.»
2019-02-17T20:19:30 < invzim> clear as ink :)
2019-02-17T20:19:46 < zyp> is that sarcasm? :p
2019-02-17T20:23:00 < invzim> dumped a few of my usb controllers, and they have wildly different hid descriptors
2019-02-17T20:23:19 < rajkosto> more than oen way to skin a cat
2019-02-17T20:23:37 < zyp> well, yeah, HID is crazy
2019-02-17T20:23:52 < rajkosto> hid report layout was made to be flexible enough that you can pretty much describe any random collection of bits in the input report
2019-02-17T20:24:08 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-17T20:25:11 < zyp> my arcin firmware normally declares itself to be a gamepad, but I once made a firmware that presented inputs as a keyboard instead, for compatibility with a game that expected some specific keyboard inputs
2019-02-17T20:25:16 < rajkosto> use an interactive hid descriptor designer that highlights the bits you are referencing ?
2019-02-17T20:25:24 < zyp> didn't have to change the report at all, just the report descriptor
2019-02-17T20:26:09 < zyp> https://cgit.jvnv.net/arcin/commit/?id=7a08559
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2019-02-17T21:43:22 < Steffanx>  usage('z' - 'a' + 4).. the zyp style programming :P
2019-02-17T21:43:45 < Steffanx> First semi-descriptive, then magic values.
2019-02-17T21:44:22 < jpa-> it's very clear! z is.. probably the 'z' key? 'a' is.. some offset? and 4 is.. because it needs that to work.
2019-02-17T21:44:47 < Steffanx> yes, i didnt copy it all. I was mainly referring to what followed.
2019-02-17T21:44:51 < Steffanx> the other usages.
2019-02-17T21:44:53 < jpa-> yep
2019-02-17T21:44:57 < Steffanx> sorry for not making that clear
2019-02-17T21:45:07 < jpa-> no i understood and was making fun with you
2019-02-17T21:45:14 < Steffanx> damn you.
2019-02-17T21:45:19 < jpa-> sorry for not making that clear!
2019-02-17T21:45:25 < Steffanx> Need a waffle?
2019-02-17T21:45:38 < jpa-> will you deliver it wearing wood shoes?
2019-02-17T21:45:56 < Steffanx> I can deliver it in wooden shoes.
2019-02-17T21:48:52 < Steffanx> Can i do something else for you today jpa-?
2019-02-17T21:49:08 < jpa-> you could motivate me to go to sleep early
2019-02-17T21:49:27 < Steffanx> Why? You can sleep till noon right?
2019-02-17T21:49:46 < bitmask> damn you Steffanx where were you to stop me from spending $100 on a label maker last night :P
2019-02-17T21:50:00 < Steffanx> Im not allowed to bitch.
2019-02-17T21:50:09 < jpa-> Steffanx: no, 2-year-olds don't sleep until noon
2019-02-17T21:50:10 < Steffanx> Or does the little jpa- has to go to kindergarten?
2019-02-17T21:50:41 < jpa-> nah, he stays home still
2019-02-17T21:54:29 < Steffanx> ah
2019-02-17T21:55:06 < jpa-> though tomorrow morning wife takes care of him, and i'm supposed to do something called "work"
2019-02-17T21:55:33 < Steffanx> So what is a good time to go sleep? 22.00?
2019-02-17T21:55:48 < jpa-> probably yeah
2019-02-17T21:55:56 < Steffanx> Ok, have a good sleep then :)
2019-02-17T21:56:11 < jpa-> i'll just surf the web for a while, i'll go real soon..
2019-02-17T21:56:23 < Steffanx> dont end up on youtube, that wont work.
2019-02-17T21:56:37 < mawk> 'z'-'a'
2019-02-17T21:56:44 < mawk> hipster way of counting the number of letters in the alphabet
2019-02-17T21:56:52 < jpa-> and being wrong by one
2019-02-17T21:56:56 < mawk> yeah
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2019-02-17T22:21:11 < Steffanx> hm
2019-02-17T22:21:20 < Steffanx> Is jpa- still there?
2019-02-17T22:21:27 < jpa-> yes :/
2019-02-17T22:21:37 < jpa-> but i'm going to sleep right now
2019-02-17T22:21:41 < Steffanx> :P
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2019-02-17T23:55:55 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/CSBuyJu.png
2019-02-17T23:55:56 < bitmask> aliexpress
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--- Day changed Mon Feb 18 2019
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2019-02-18T00:17:50 < Cracki> uhhh wat is that on the bottom left
2019-02-18T00:18:02 < Cracki> roastie-be-gone cream?
2019-02-18T00:18:40 < Cracki> >Sumifun
2019-02-18T00:19:00 < bitmask> hmm what size esd bags should I buy
2019-02-18T00:19:15 < Cracki> depends on what goes in them?
2019-02-18T00:19:56 < Cracki> my boss uses 115x155 mm bags for his smaller pcbs
2019-02-18T00:20:15 < Cracki> 180 total length
2019-02-18T00:20:23 < bitmask> small components, mostly in that reel tape stuff, what do you call that
2019-02-18T00:20:34 < bitmask> I'm thinking either 80x120 or 6.5x120
2019-02-18T00:20:49 < Steffanx> No sexy lingerie for bitmask ?
2019-02-18T00:21:00 < bitmask> I'm saving that for you
2019-02-18T00:22:20 < bitmask> are all esd bags the same? they must be hard to photograph because they all look different. different shades of grey/blue
2019-02-18T00:22:30 < Cracki> well... the largest you'll have is whatever's big enough to hold a whole reel, because that's what the reels might come in... at least my boss's box from digikey is full of reels in ziplocs
2019-02-18T00:22:45 < Cracki> #notall...
2019-02-18T00:23:08 < bitmask> I don't get full reels, If I ever do i'll start different storage for that
2019-02-18T00:23:11 < Cracki> my boss's bags are pinkish and quite translucent. there are smoky ones, silvery ones, ...
2019-02-18T00:23:21 < bitmask> yea I wanted to skip the pink ones
2019-02-18T00:23:28 < Cracki> going for a hanging "file" storage?
2019-02-18T00:23:39 < Cracki> use something you can look into easily
2019-02-18T00:23:42 < bitmask> was thinking of hanging them but I may just keep em in boxes 
2019-02-18T00:23:47 < Cracki> they're all antistatic, when they say they are
2019-02-18T00:23:57 < bitmask> but you get something like this:
2019-02-18T00:23:58 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100Pcs-Antistatic-Storage-Package-Bag-Zip-Lock-Resealable-Pouch-For-Storage-Bags-Components/32857671967.html
2019-02-18T00:24:01 < Cracki> it's gonna be boxes, i can see that
2019-02-18T00:24:01 < bitmask> looks very silvery
2019-02-18T00:24:16 < Cracki> still translucent enough
2019-02-18T00:24:36 < bitmask> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/50Pcs-Lot-Antistatic-Aluminum-Storage-Bag-Ziplock-Bags-Resealable-Anti-Static-Pouch-for-Electronic-Accessories-Package/32898930278.html
2019-02-18T00:24:42 < bitmask> then those looks dark bluish
2019-02-18T00:24:54 < bitmask> I'm just wondering if they are the same thats all
2019-02-18T00:24:59 < Cracki> some chinese modules I've ordered come in opaque-backed bags (welded shut)
2019-02-18T00:25:09 < bitmask> could just be the angle or whatever since they have a metallic coating it must be hard to take a consistent shot
2019-02-18T00:25:27 < Cracki> I'm sure they won't be the same. different hue, different opacity, ...
2019-02-18T00:25:34 < Cracki> different thickness!
2019-02-18T00:25:47 < bitmask> yea
2019-02-18T00:26:16 < Cracki> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ get some variety? they're just a few bucks a set
2019-02-18T00:26:46 < bitmask> I really like these but I can't find em in ziploc: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400pcs-lot-Aluminium-Foil-Clear-Front-Mylar-Bag-Phone-Battery-Packaging-Bag-Open-Top-Anti-Static/32827386928.html
2019-02-18T00:26:52 < Cracki> in the end, you might decide based on how easily the ziploc can be opened, or something like that
2019-02-18T00:27:20 < Cracki> you won't find those as ziploc because they're too narrow to be popular with ziploc
2019-02-18T00:27:36 < Cracki> besides they look like they have an opaque back
2019-02-18T00:28:10 < bitmask> yea they do, I like it
2019-02-18T00:28:30 < Cracki> weirdo
2019-02-18T00:28:41 < bitmask> why, you only look through one way?
2019-02-18T00:29:04 < Cracki> open back is the way https://i.pinimg.com/originals/66/0b/76/660b76629cb5050cad5bd5e208ff0fe2.jpg
2019-02-18T00:29:32 < Cracki> imagine having a handful of bags in front of you. you can only see into the first one...
2019-02-18T00:29:35 < bitmask> and I'm the weirdo :P
2019-02-18T00:29:44 < Cracki> not into women? me neither ;)
2019-02-18T00:29:46 < kakimir> concrete speaker project
2019-02-18T00:29:51 < kakimir> I'm excitement
2019-02-18T00:29:53 < Cracki> if they were all translucent to some degree, you could see into many at once
2019-02-18T00:29:58 < Cracki> concrete, eh?
2019-02-18T00:30:27 < kakimir> instead of glueing all that wood
2019-02-18T00:30:45 < kakimir> you first do the wooden box
2019-02-18T00:30:52 < kakimir> then you pour concrete in
2019-02-18T00:30:53 < Cracki> and you think a concrete box will sound better?
2019-02-18T00:31:02 < kakimir> and then you break the wooden box
2019-02-18T00:31:09 < Cracki> and then you have a solid block
2019-02-18T00:31:14 < Cracki> not sure how that's gonna speak
2019-02-18T00:31:20 < kakimir> make molds for internals too yes
2019-02-18T00:31:29 < Cracki> that won't resonate at all
2019-02-18T00:31:33 < kakimir> it wont
2019-02-18T00:31:39 < Cracki> or only at high frequencies
2019-02-18T00:31:45 < kakimir> it does pretty much nothing
2019-02-18T00:32:05 < Cracki> fascinating
2019-02-18T00:32:40 < Cracki> I think there's concrete-infused cloth you could (ab)use for that. they use it for shake-and-bake concrete tents and lining irrigation ditches
2019-02-18T00:32:56 < kakimir> no
2019-02-18T00:33:02 < kakimir> I want pour concrete
2019-02-18T00:33:16 < Cracki> you wanna play with mud :3
2019-02-18T00:34:07 < kakimir> http://www.homecrux.com/25-concrete-speakers-that-promise-best-acoustics-and-longevity/78665/
2019-02-18T00:34:27 < kakimir> it's not totally unfamiliar for me to play with dirt
2019-02-18T00:34:41 < Cracki> I see that
2019-02-18T00:35:08 < kakimir> what is the correct term in english for pour concrete?
2019-02-18T00:37:20 < Cracki> just that?
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2019-02-18T00:42:17 < kakimir> mud
2019-02-18T00:42:31 < kakimir> in finnish "kura"
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2019-02-18T00:52:18 < bitmask> alright I think I'm going for these, they are thicker than most (4 mil instead of 3) and have the euro hook hole https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-X-5-4mil-100um-ESD-Anti-Static-Zip-Lock-Bag-X-100/122740859020
2019-02-18T00:52:27 < bitmask> you guys can rest easy now
2019-02-18T00:55:41 < BrainDamage> do you want that I make up some bullshit to criticise them so that you feel at ease?
2019-02-18T00:56:28 < bitmask> please
2019-02-18T00:56:48 < bitmask> and then I will bitch about you being an asshole
2019-02-18T00:56:54 < bitmask> and all will be normal again
2019-02-18T00:57:21 < bitmask> I'll try to stop being so touchy, I dont know why I take it personally since everyone does it to everyone
2019-02-18T00:58:03 < BrainDamage> to be fair, this channel tends to be more caustic than the average
2019-02-18T00:58:44 < BrainDamage> howrever, don't confuse criticism to a pattern with personal cricism, some users here criticize the person, other just the tecnique/idea
2019-02-18T00:59:14 < Cracki> what he said
2019-02-18T00:59:33 < bitmask> yea
2019-02-18T01:03:56 < bitmask> one question about esd bags, does transparency correspond to how effective is it? the ones I'm looking at are 70% and some others are like 40%
2019-02-18T01:04:00 < englishman> whoever you are talking to seems very negative
2019-02-18T01:04:10 < englishman> why not use /ignore and improve the quality of your chat experience?
2019-02-18T01:04:27 < bitmask> who me?
2019-02-18T01:04:53 < englishman> those concrete speakers look fantastic
2019-02-18T01:05:47 < Steffanx> Btw bitmask you want really to skip the pink ones. Those are not meant for want you want
2019-02-18T01:06:02 < Steffanx> Pink ones are only to be used in esd protected areas.
2019-02-18T01:06:19 < bitmask> yea I wasn't even considering them
2019-02-18T01:08:55 < bitmask> I read that only the ones with actual foil linings protect against shock from the outside by creating like a faraday cage, so the pink and silvery ones just are good for static buildup which is probably all I want anyway
2019-02-18T01:10:11 < bitmask> I mean I could probably get away without using any esd protection like I have been, so anything is a step up
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2019-02-18T01:34:04 < zyp> Steffanx, oh, heh, I didn't realize that
2019-02-18T01:34:51 < zyp> I picked up a pack of pink bags because they were conveniently available last time I ran out of foil bags
2019-02-18T01:35:19 < bitmask> you use foil bags? what kind? got pics? :)
2019-02-18T01:36:14 < zyp> yeah, for the stuff I make and sell
2019-02-18T01:37:51 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/M93ml.jpg <- here's an old pic, IIRC that's from the first batch I had made
2019-02-18T01:40:19 < zyp> by the way, is ESD really a major issue nowadays?
2019-02-18T01:41:05 < zyp> I don't usually worry about it and I haven't experienced any issues
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2019-02-18T01:41:34 < zyp> my impression is that modern parts have pretty decent ESD protection built in
2019-02-18T01:42:25 < bitmask> oh ok, just standard esd aluminized pet
2019-02-18T01:42:36 < zyp> yeah?
2019-02-18T01:42:37 < bitmask> some have a full foil lining
2019-02-18T01:42:46 < zyp> heh
2019-02-18T01:42:47 < bitmask> thats what I thought you meant
2019-02-18T01:42:56 < zyp> no, sorry :)
2019-02-18T01:43:05 < bitmask> no problem
2019-02-18T01:43:10 < zyp> so why are you worrying about ESD bags anyway?
2019-02-18T01:43:20 < zyp> what are you gonna put in them?
2019-02-18T01:43:45 < bitmask> I overthink things :) I just ordered a label maker and want to start a storage system and want to use all the same bags so I just get picky
2019-02-18T01:44:00 < bitmask> just for ICs and stuff
2019-02-18T01:44:46 < bitmask> so esd isn't really that important but if I'm gonna be buying new stuff I might as well get some protection out of it
2019-02-18T01:44:53 < zyp> sounds like a lot of unnecessary work, considering most ICs already come in labelled ESD bags when you buy them :p
2019-02-18T01:45:15 < englishman> unless you buy them from china, when they come wrapped in saran wrap and thrown in a box
2019-02-18T01:45:17 < bitmask> not from aliexpress hah
2019-02-18T01:45:37 < zyp> also, do you really keep a large stock of ICs?
2019-02-18T01:45:50 < bitmask> they come in the tape and reel or whatever its called and then in a standard plastic bag
2019-02-18T01:46:48 < bitmask> I'm trying to build a collection, not a large quantity but just common stuff, I'll probably have diodes and other stuff as well.
2019-02-18T01:47:26 < zyp> IME stocking parts is not really worthwhile, I just order what I need for a project at the same time I order the PCBs, the parts will arrive before the PCBs anyway
2019-02-18T01:48:53 < bitmask> yea I know, I feel like I want to experiment with some stuff though so while i'm learning I just kinda want to have stuff around. probably not worth it in the end but its fun ordering stuffs ;)
2019-02-18T01:49:13 < zyp> only stock I've got are a couple of boxes with leftovers from various projects, and some reels for stuff that's actually common enough I'd use them in most projects
2019-02-18T01:49:19 < zyp> e.g. 100nF caps and some resistors
2019-02-18T01:50:40 < zyp> also, most of what I've got are just passives, and they are so small it'd be better to keep them in those boxes with spring loaded lids rather than bags
2019-02-18T01:52:07 < bitmask> they arent in tapes? thats what most of the stuff I'm ordering seems to come in so thats why bags seemed like a good choice
2019-02-18T01:52:18 < zyp> https://www.google.com/search?q=smd+component+box&tbm=isch <- I mean this sort of shit
2019-02-18T01:52:33 < bitmask> yea thats what I was thinking of when you said it :)
2019-02-18T01:53:05 < zyp> if I actually bothered organizing a collection of stocked parts, I'd get those
2019-02-18T01:54:26 < zyp> which label printer did you get?
2019-02-18T01:55:22 < bitmask> uhh
2019-02-18T01:55:28 < bitmask> pt-d600
2019-02-18T01:55:43 < zyp> sounds like brother
2019-02-18T01:55:46 < bitmask> cheaper than the one that was only computer connected so its kinda big
2019-02-18T01:55:47 < bitmask> yup
2019-02-18T01:55:56 < bitmask> has full keyboard but whatever
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2019-02-18T02:59:14 < aandrew> https://i.imgur.com/fTbZp8N.jpg
2019-02-18T02:59:29 < aandrew> Attn laurenceb
2019-02-18T03:07:32 < Cracki> haaah
2019-02-18T03:28:31 < englishman> haha
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2019-02-18T03:36:09 < jadew> that's great
2019-02-18T03:36:15 < jadew> took me a second to get it
2019-02-18T03:37:47 < jadew> zyp, I don't know what you were talking about when you highlighted me
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2019-02-18T04:53:53 < bitmask> how do you find weird sized boxes :P
2019-02-18T05:03:59 < Cracki> cardboard? plastic? sheet metal?
2019-02-18T05:04:49 < Cracki> notoriously hard for text search and as soon as you get parametric search, it can't understand orientations...
2019-02-18T05:05:05 < Cracki> custom commission maybe?
2019-02-18T05:11:57 < bitmask> cardboard, I think sports card storage is my best bet, just found something 
2019-02-18T05:14:15 < bitmask> https://www.bcwsupplies.com/graded-card-shoe-box
2019-02-18T05:14:19 < bitmask> not ideal but not terrible
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2019-02-18T05:16:48 < bitmask> problem is most storage has the long size as the width and not the height
2019-02-18T05:17:20 < jadew> is this for components?
2019-02-18T05:19:18 < bitmask> yea, I'm stepping away from cardboard now
2019-02-18T05:19:35 < bitmask> I was trying to save money but I only need one or two so I dont mind getting something nice
2019-02-18T05:19:45 < jadew> I hate cardboard
2019-02-18T05:19:50 < bitmask> the bags I'm getting are 3x5"
2019-02-18T05:20:04 < jadew> I'm alergic to dust and it seems to collect dust in a way in which it can never be removed
2019-02-18T05:20:16 < bitmask> true
2019-02-18T05:21:41 < jadew> also, $5/pcs is way too much for that box
2019-02-18T05:21:41 < bitmask> https://www.tops-products.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/3x5BLA_1.jpg
2019-02-18T05:21:49 < bitmask> something like that wouldnt be bad though
2019-02-18T05:22:05 < jadew> yeah, that looks like it has a nice surface
2019-02-18T05:22:09 < jadew> nicer
2019-02-18T05:22:30 < jadew> it's very tall tho
2019-02-18T05:23:04 < jadew> how big is it?
2019-02-18T05:23:39 < bitmask> not sure, doesnt matter cause its not the size I need
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2019-02-18T06:30:18 < mawk> I wrote an article about transparent proxying on linux
2019-02-18T06:30:21 < mawk> https://medium.com/@ntfd/transparent-proxying-through-tor-6c2cd5df024a
2019-02-18T06:30:28 < mawk> is my english good enough
2019-02-18T06:30:37 < mawk> e.g. do I sound like an indian or not
2019-02-18T06:32:14 < dongs> jebus
2019-02-18T06:32:21 < dongs> systemdick now spawns cucktainers too/
2019-02-18T06:32:25 < dongs> what the fuck does it NOT do these days
2019-02-18T06:34:53 < jadew> mawk, you missed a "Sir, "
2019-02-18T06:35:16  * karlp looks to see what stm32 in +10 is like.
2019-02-18T06:37:17 < mawk> lol jadew 
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2019-02-18T08:40:16 < zyp> Steffanx, 'z' - 'a' gives the letter offset, the letter keycodes starts at 4, so 'z' - 'a' + 4 gives the keycode for 'z'
2019-02-18T08:41:42 < zyp> jpa-, it's not off by one when you're talking offsets, 'a' - 'a' gives 0 which the obvious offset for the first letter
2019-02-18T08:42:20 < zyp> jadew, you were asking about the library, if it were closed source
2019-02-18T08:42:31 < zyp> the efr32 radio driver
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2019-02-18T08:57:05 < PaulFertser> mawk: "The object of this article" sounds odd, you meant objective I guess?
2019-02-18T08:58:47 < PaulFertser> mawk: and the first part would benefit from a link to some sensible article detailing common pitfalls with tor (i.e. how to use it properly and typical gotchas)
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2019-02-18T09:08:02 < PaulFertser> mawk: I'd say the article has some language oddities but the overall impression is that it's quite readable.
2019-02-18T09:10:23 < jpa-> same impression
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2019-02-18T09:19:18 < tjq> put this on
2019-02-18T09:20:37 < tjq> Haohmaru: what are you saying?
2019-02-18T09:24:28 < PaulFertser> dongs: it also apparently integrates an NTP client now but I can't figure out when it writes to hw RTC (if it does that at all), whether it takes adjtime in account etc.
2019-02-18T09:28:12 < PaulFertser> dongs: so it's apparently lacking documentation, that's for sure.
2019-02-18T09:29:11 < PaulFertser> dongs: btw, I wrote a couple of "unit" files for custom services recently and it seemed saner than shell init scripts.
2019-02-18T09:31:28 < PaulFertser> What I kinda expected but couldn't do was to use some adhoc way (e.g. grep the stdout) to signal systemd that the service was actually fully ready.    
2019-02-18T09:32:32 < dongs> 2019 and klunix still has no standard way to tell that a process has been started
2019-02-18T09:32:35 < dongs> fucking hell
2019-02-18T09:35:21 < tjq> https://stallman.org/patreon.html
2019-02-18T09:36:08 < dongs> im surprised hes not angry that they take a 20% cut
2019-02-18T09:36:11 < dongs> for services offered
2019-02-18T09:36:59 < dongs> can you imagine if stallman made a gaytreon
2019-02-18T09:37:03 < dongs> he'd never have eto work again
2019-02-18T09:37:08 < dongs> all the lunix dweebs would pay for himn
2019-02-18T09:37:29 < tjq> yeah i was thinking the same, activated the google, and my link is the result
2019-02-18T09:42:09 < PaulFertser> dongs: what's the standard way on other systems?
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2019-02-18T09:44:37 < dongs> i dont fucking know, windows obviously has a mechanism with services and shit
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2019-02-18T09:50:16 < PaulFertser> dongs: so does systemd, you can add a systemd-specific call to a daemon to signal systemd it's started. 
2019-02-18T09:51:19 < PaulFertser> So it certainly exists for systemd but I'm not so sure about windows, you're not giving any API function name so I can't check.
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2019-02-18T09:51:56 < PaulFertser> SetServiceStatus ?
2019-02-18T09:53:21 < PaulFertser> Yeah, looks like that. systemd has API for that.
2019-02-18T09:54:00 < PaulFertser> But it's not like you can easily use that from a shell script.
2019-02-18T09:55:18 < PaulFertser> Windows API is so fucking complex, so over-engineered... dwWaitHint
2019-02-18T09:55:20 < PaulFertser> The estimated time required for a pending start, stop, pause, or continue operation, in milliseconds. Before the specified amount of time has elapsed, the service should make its next call to the SetServiceStatus function with either an incremented dwCheckPoint value or a change in dwCurrentState.
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2019-02-18T09:55:45 < dongs> sounds very well thought oout to me actually
2019-02-18T09:56:01 < dongs> this gives system ability to track service state like a watchdog-like
2019-02-18T09:56:13 < dongs> if you failed to start and didn't check in wtih next status update, the system will know
2019-02-18T09:56:41 < dongs> lets compare that to some lunix shit making a .pid file in /var/fuckoff and you having no way to know if that .pid file is fresh or belongs to cufrrent process or to one that crashed a month ago
2019-02-18T09:56:52 < PaulFertser> How the hell are you supposed to "estimate" anything in ms on a multi-user non-RTOS system?
2019-02-18T09:57:11 < dongs> the argument is a DWORD, 4 billion ms is a lot of seconds
2019-02-18T09:57:24 < PaulFertser> dongs: no, systemd actually knows about all the services it started, fully reliably, without any pid files.
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2019-02-18T10:09:58 < dongs> .
2019-02-18T10:10:20 < dongs> is this your first time seeing an adjustable LDO
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2019-02-18T10:23:17 < dongs> what doyouthink assembly houses job is
2019-02-18T10:23:23 < dongs> to place components in a specified place
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2019-02-18T10:25:41 < rajkosto> littlevgl group/keypad functionality is big succ ill have to fork it
2019-02-18T10:26:08 < rajkosto> the _ESC key is not used for anything outside of dropdownbox
2019-02-18T10:40:32 < ds2> are moods linear at all?
2019-02-18T11:11:40 < Ecco> Hi :)
2019-02-18T11:12:04 < Ecco> Is there a way to prevent Altium from adding PCB-only parts (such as solder bridges) to the BoM
2019-02-18T11:20:13 < rajkosto> set the type to Standard (No BOM)
2019-02-18T11:21:08 < Ecco> thanks rajkosto 
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2019-02-18T12:06:30 < jadew> anyone here switched to D?
2019-02-18T12:06:54 < jadew> it seems superior to C++
2019-02-18T12:07:27 < emeryth> bruh I'm already at E
2019-02-18T12:07:33 < jadew> yeah, at least it seems to be scratching an itch I'm having right now
2019-02-18T12:07:38 < jadew> emeryth, heh
2019-02-18T12:08:07 < rajkosto> eeeeee
2019-02-18T12:08:08 < jadew> and it seems Andrei Alexandrescu is behind it too, so it must be good
2019-02-18T12:08:20 < rajkosto> there isnt enough compiler, library support for D
2019-02-18T12:08:30 < jadew> Haohmaru, Romanian
2019-02-18T12:08:37 < jadew> never heard of him?
2019-02-18T12:08:39 < jadew> C++ god
2019-02-18T12:09:05 < jadew> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Alexandrescu
2019-02-18T12:09:09 < jadew> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_C%2B%2B_Design
2019-02-18T12:09:28 < jadew> that book used to be the book you read last, after you learned C++
2019-02-18T12:10:27 < jadew> heh, actually he explores what you can do with templates
2019-02-18T12:10:32 < jadew> it's a bit outdated tho
2019-02-18T12:10:44 < jadew> he joined D several years after he published that
2019-02-18T12:10:46 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-18T12:10:59 < jadew> no, C++11 made it outdated
2019-02-18T12:11:07 < jadew> and 14 and 17 and now 20
2019-02-18T12:12:40 < rajkosto> youre so uninformed lol
2019-02-18T12:12:49 < rajkosto> he's on the committee and does a lot of C++ talks
2019-02-18T12:13:04 < rajkosto> with every new standard rev he tries to do even more crazy stuff with templates
2019-02-18T12:13:12 < jadew> yup
2019-02-18T12:13:32 < jadew> he's a c++ legend
2019-02-18T12:40:30 < jadew> "industry average bugs per 1000 lines of code at 15-50 and Microsoft released code at 0.5 per 1000, and 0(!) defects in 500,000 lines of code for NASA"
2019-02-18T12:41:25 < jadew> and apparently that 15-50 bugs/k is independent of language
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2019-02-18T12:46:18 < rajkosto> lol, to make that metric more favorable
2019-02-18T12:46:21 < rajkosto> just write more verbose code
2019-02-18T12:46:55 < jadew> that would be impossible in my case, I'm already writing verbose code
2019-02-18T12:47:12 < rajkosto> switch to java
2019-02-18T12:47:18 < jadew> hah
2019-02-18T12:53:13 < jadew> had to look it up
2019-02-18T12:53:24 < jadew> I'm using Allman style, it's the best there is
2019-02-18T12:53:59 < rajkosto> you would love golang then
2019-02-18T12:54:05 < jadew> the other stuff on that wiki page, other than K&R, is just garbage
2019-02-18T12:54:10 < rajkosto> because they F O R C E opening brace on same line
2019-02-18T12:54:17 < rajkosto> just cuz
2019-02-18T12:54:29 < jadew> really? it's part of the syntax?
2019-02-18T12:54:36 < rajkosto> its not
2019-02-18T12:54:40 < rajkosto> but its a compiler error not to.
2019-02-18T12:54:46 < jadew> heh
2019-02-18T12:54:50 < rajkosto> it used to be flexible but then they made it mandatory
2019-02-18T12:55:32 < rajkosto> golang is a really weird language by people nostalgic for C but not really needing any of the C stuff
2019-02-18T12:55:50 < rajkosto> could have been so much better if not for a few misguided design decisions
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2019-02-18T15:29:32 < aandrew> what's the status of qemu for stm32 (full mcu not just cpu and a timer)
2019-02-18T15:30:35 < aandrew> opening brace should be on the same line for everything but functions
2019-02-18T15:31:33 < aandrew> I guess I"m more like a bsd knf kind of guy
2019-02-18T15:31:41 < aandrew> never tried quantifying what I do
2019-02-18T15:31:50 < aandrew> but it's pretty damn close to the linux kernel
2019-02-18T15:32:12 < aandrew> yep kernel style with 8 character TABS
2019-02-18T15:32:17 < aandrew> fuck anyone who does it different
2019-02-18T15:34:15 < aandrew> I have the law on my side good sir
2019-02-18T15:35:57 < aandrew> I do mandatory braces too and my "case" keyword is in line with the switch, with the actual code for the case being indented
2019-02-18T15:36:48 < aandrew> wont' bother me, I use sans-serif. :-)
2019-02-18T15:36:55 < aandrew> (weak morning joke)
2019-02-18T15:43:36 < englishman> i had them change the coding style guide at work to double spaces, tabs not allowed
2019-02-18T15:43:52 < englishman> all variables declared at beginning of scope and k&r style braces
2019-02-18T15:43:58 < englishman> my way or the highway
2019-02-18T15:45:24 < aandrew> eww
2019-02-18T15:46:00 < aandrew> I agree with variables declared at beginning of scope, and K&R is similar enough to linux kernel that I wouldn't complain too loudly
2019-02-18T15:46:13 < aandrew> but your indentation is evil and you will fry for that
2019-02-18T15:46:35 < englishman> if it was completely my way it'd be ansi c only
2019-02-18T15:46:38 < aandrew> in fact I'm not even sure I want that dicknplace anymore, I feel kind of dirty just talking to you now that I know about your indentation preference. :-)
2019-02-18T15:46:56 < aandrew> Haohmaru: I'm a big big fan of variables declared up top
2019-02-18T15:47:12 < aandrew> Haohmaru: organization
2019-02-18T15:47:15 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:16 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:16 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:17 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:17 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:20 < aandrew> variable decl
2019-02-18T15:47:23 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:25 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:26 < englishman> lunix nerds love their whitespace
2019-02-18T15:47:28 < aandrew> code
2019-02-18T15:47:30 < aandrew> it's easy to miss
2019-02-18T15:47:34 < englishman> adds to the uselesness
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2019-02-18T15:47:44 < aandrew> englishman: I like BIG INDENTS and I can not like
2019-02-18T15:47:47 < aandrew> you other coders can't deny
2019-02-18T15:48:11 < aandrew> that when a little bitty code block comes up on the screen with a big wide tab you get SPRUNG
2019-02-18T15:48:36 < aandrew> I maintain that you want nice big indents because it serves two purposes
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2019-02-18T15:48:49 < aandrew> 1. it makes it very fucking clear that context changed
2019-02-18T15:49:05 < aandrew> 2. if your code starts wandering off the far right of hte screen it's a clear indication you need to break that function up
2019-02-18T15:49:49 < aandrew> Haohmaru: yep
2019-02-18T15:49:52 < aandrew> it is C actually
2019-02-18T15:50:12 < aandrew> and if you can't fit the function on to the screen in a reasonable manner it's an indication you need to rethink things
2019-02-18T15:50:17 < aandrew> sometimes you cannot 
2019-02-18T15:50:20 < aandrew> but it's not very often
2019-02-18T15:50:41 < aandrew> I long long ago gave up writing "smart" or "cute" code and try to write as clean and clear as possible
2019-02-18T15:51:43 < Ultrasauce> 80 columns should be enough for anyone
2019-02-18T15:51:49 < aandrew> there's nothing wrong with void pointers
2019-02-18T15:52:09 < aandrew> there are very good reasons to use them sparingly
2019-02-18T15:52:24 < aandrew> and it's a lot better than CubeMX's predilection for TYPEDEF ALL THE FUCKING THINGS
2019-02-18T15:55:27 < Ultrasauce> 80x30 characters is a lot more than 80x30 pixels
2019-02-18T15:55:35 < Ultrasauce> but all the good parts are in that resolution anyway i guess
2019-02-18T15:55:46 < Ultrasauce> gotta squint to enjoy
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2019-02-18T16:34:03 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-18T16:34:52 < zyp> I asked ST about stm32wb RM, got a prerelease copy of it
2019-02-18T16:35:00 < zyp> apparently super sekrit
2019-02-18T16:35:52 < zyp> the radio one
2019-02-18T16:36:23 < zyp> no, bluetooth or 802.15.4
2019-02-18T16:38:32 < zyp> I was wondering if they were gonna document the radio interface, seems like they won't
2019-02-18T16:38:46 < zyp> radio chapter is only two pages, no register description
2019-02-18T16:39:00 < zyp> so I guess they'll just ship a blob for cpu2
2019-02-18T16:39:32 < zyp> yeah, radio stack got it's own cpu
2019-02-18T16:39:41 < zyp> I was just hoping I could write my own radio stack
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2019-02-18T16:42:20 < zyp> oh well, still better than having to link a radio blob into the main firmware
2019-02-18T16:42:56 < zyp> haha
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2019-02-18T16:49:43 < zyp> main cpu is an M4, radio cpu is a M0+
2019-02-18T17:05:07 < c10ud> do you guys have some reference select() implementation I could take a look at?=
2019-02-18T17:05:19 < c10ud> not stm32 related but still...so much pros here
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2019-02-18T17:17:14 < zyp> hmm, looked a bit more through the RM, all the stuff about how to configure where CPU2 should run from is documented, so it's totally possible to run your own code on both CPU1 and CPU2
2019-02-18T17:17:39 < zyp> just the radio registers that's missing
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2019-02-18T17:41:32 < englishman> >super secret RM
2019-02-18T17:41:37 < englishman> >gives it out to the first rando emailing
2019-02-18T17:42:43 < englishman> would it even have radio registers? the other stuff they make that has a stanalone processor either links binaries or gives library code only
2019-02-18T17:43:13 < englishman> they might keep all that stuff scret
2019-02-18T17:43:26 < englishman> or like nrf, have a super simple radio and do all the rest in proprietary blobs
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2019-02-18T19:16:02 < kakimir> guise
2019-02-18T19:16:19 < kakimir> can someone help me with software issue
2019-02-18T19:16:46 < kakimir> I need software to be run in win environment that has english locale
2019-02-18T19:17:25 < kakimir> to see if it causes some fuckery and if output is correct I can use the output
2019-02-18T19:20:42 < englishman> sounds like a job for vmware
2019-02-18T19:22:06 < PaulFertser> windows runs on kvm too
2019-02-18T19:22:21 < kakimir> imma in bus
2019-02-18T19:22:24 < PaulFertser> But isn't it easy to switch locale temporarily on windows?
2019-02-18T19:22:47 < englishman> last time i did that it failed updating windoes features
2019-02-18T19:23:04 < kakimir> if windows works
2019-02-18T19:23:07 < kakimir> do not touch it
2019-02-18T19:23:09 < englishman> https://www.google.com/search?q=the+referenced+assembly+cannot+be+found
2019-02-18T19:23:42 < Steffanx> Just change the locale. Its 3 clicks
2019-02-18T19:24:02 < kakimir> does it change decimal characters etc.
2019-02-18T19:24:04 < kakimir> for programs
2019-02-18T19:24:10 < kakimir> not just the language
2019-02-18T19:24:12 < Steffanx> Yea
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2019-02-18T19:24:32 < englishman> french still pops in places on my work computer despite deleting that shit from like 4 places
2019-02-18T19:24:36 < Steffanx> Especially .net is awesome when it comes to that
2019-02-18T19:25:01 < Steffanx> Where string to double stuff depends on the locale 
2019-02-18T19:25:05 < Steffanx> <3
2019-02-18T19:25:12 < englishman> the perkele menu
2019-02-18T19:25:32 < MrMobius> englishman, it is an omen
2019-02-18T19:25:32 < Ultrasauce> tfw your parser breaks in a different locale
2019-02-18T19:25:42 < MrMobius> you offended the msp430 god
2019-02-18T19:25:51 < kakimir> perkele
2019-02-18T19:26:10 < Steffanx> Haha isnt it nice Ultrasauce 
2019-02-18T19:26:23 < Steffanx> So many people run into that issue
2019-02-18T19:26:29 < Steffanx> Ei ei ei, kakimir 
2019-02-18T19:26:52 < englishman> apollo guidance computer had interrupt-safe hardware multiplier
2019-02-18T19:26:55 < englishman> msp430 does not
2019-02-18T19:27:04 < englishman> msp430 is not space age tech
2019-02-18T19:28:21 < Steffanx> Poor englishman has to work with ir
2019-02-18T19:28:24 < Steffanx> It
2019-02-18T19:28:42 < Steffanx> Imagine working with xmega like me
2019-02-18T19:29:39 < MrMobius> englishman, is it as fast as an msp430 doing software multiply?
2019-02-18T19:30:45 < zyp> heh, ipv4 header checksums are interesting
2019-02-18T19:31:40 < zyp> it operates on 16-bit input and gives 16-bit input, but the algorithm gives a correct whether it's run in big or little endian
2019-02-18T19:31:49 < zyp> correct result*
2019-02-18T19:32:44 < zyp> it's a one's complement sum, which means that low byte carries into high byte and high byte also carries into low byte
2019-02-18T19:33:02 < zyp> so it doesn't matter whether you swap high and low, as long as input and output are consistent
2019-02-18T19:46:00 < kakimir> I was right
2019-02-18T19:46:15 < kakimir> I did vm it
2019-02-18T19:46:19 < kakimir> I got correct results
2019-02-18T19:48:25 < zyp> Steffanx, all locales have fucking retarded number formatting rules
2019-02-18T19:48:53 < zyp> , as decimal point is stupid
2019-02-18T19:49:01 < zyp> , as thousands separator is also stupid
2019-02-18T19:55:27 < Cracki> csv suddenly using semicolon is just one thing internationalism fucked up
2019-02-18T19:58:34 < Cracki> ipv4 header checksum, wasn't that just xor?
2019-02-18T19:58:55 < Cracki> can't remember, but I remember it was something trivial once you get over their opaque wording
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2019-02-18T20:06:35 < zyp> not xor, it's an actual sum
2019-02-18T20:07:35 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1e7MrhcudhUYM7bFXLjUAZfYUERu4okAO/view?usp=sharing
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2019-02-18T20:55:19 < bitmask> shitty label maker :P
2019-02-18T20:55:32 < bitmask> it jammed on my first print
2019-02-18T20:56:14 < kakimir> did you get the one I said you should
2019-02-18T20:56:37 < bitmask> I didnt want that one
2019-02-18T20:57:31 < bitmask> its basically teh same thing but with a full keyboard instead of computer connection only but it has better resolution, you suggested the pt-p700 right?
2019-02-18T20:59:12 < kakimir> and it works too
2019-02-18T20:59:27 < kakimir> there is bluetooth version also
2019-02-18T20:59:54 < bitmask> it just jammed, its not a big deal, it was the tape, not the machine
2019-02-18T21:00:09 < bitmask> I opened the tape up and fixed it
2019-02-18T21:00:42 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-18T21:02:49 < kakimir> tz tape has a slot where surface film and base tape should meet
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2019-02-18T21:05:14 < kakimir> only time i had jams was whem surface film escaped that slot
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2019-02-18T21:50:55 < mawk> I have my trial tomorrow
2019-02-18T21:55:44 < aandrew> what'd you allegedly do?
2019-02-18T21:59:40 < kakimir> CP
2019-02-18T21:59:56 < kakimir> now that is quick mawk
2019-02-18T22:00:06 < kakimir> trial I mean
2019-02-18T22:00:40 < kakimir> I thought trials take like months of prepairing
2019-02-18T22:01:45 < mawk> lol
2019-02-18T22:01:48 < mawk> no it's not a CP trial
2019-02-18T22:01:52 < mawk> and I won't get a CP trial ever
2019-02-18T22:02:08 < mawk> I'm not responsible for the content posted on my website, I don't have to screen it unless I am a profit company
2019-02-18T22:02:19 < mawk> no it's a trial for me living in a subsidized appartement
2019-02-18T22:03:17 < Steffanx> lol
2019-02-18T22:05:11 < zyp> ah, I think I remember you mentioning that before
2019-02-18T22:05:23 < zyp> sounded like some load of bullshit
2019-02-18T22:05:49 < kakimir> subsidized appartement?
2019-02-18T22:06:03 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-18T22:06:12 < mawk> low-rent appartement
2019-02-18T22:06:16 < mawk> some neighbor told on me
2019-02-18T22:08:13 < kakimir> so what is the problem
2019-02-18T22:08:31 < mawk> the problem is I needed to live 1 year with the grandma that owned the appartement if I wanted to stay in it
2019-02-18T22:08:40 < mawk> and I didn't, so the rent contract has been nulled
2019-02-18T22:08:45 < mawk> and I need to go
2019-02-18T22:08:49 < catphish> anyone know anything about toslink?
2019-02-18T22:08:55 < mawk> but I pay my rent and everything, they're just being vicious
2019-02-18T22:09:04 < catphish> like mainly how hard it is to implement a transceiver for it
2019-02-18T22:10:22 < catphish> they're claiming you owe a ton of excess rent?
2019-02-18T22:10:50 < catphish> sounds shit :(
2019-02-18T22:11:24 < catphish> you should probably stop with the CP too :)
2019-02-18T22:11:34 < zyp> catphish, isn't that just optical spdif?
2019-02-18T22:12:07 < mawk> no they're claiming nothing about the rent catphish 
2019-02-18T22:12:11 < mawk> also yeah I don't like CP lol
2019-02-18T22:12:17 < mawk> I'm fully cooperating with the cops on that
2019-02-18T22:12:23 < mawk> and I took down 2 urls the pedos were using
2019-02-18T22:12:29 < mawk> maybe I'll just took down everything
2019-02-18T22:12:48 < mawk> but I have around a terabyte of pictures I'm constantly serving, people count on that I guess
2019-02-18T22:13:03 < catphish> mawk: so what's it about? they accusing you of criminal fraud? if so, seems overboard
2019-02-18T22:13:18 < mawk> they just want me to leave
2019-02-18T22:13:23 < mawk> for the housing trial
2019-02-18T22:13:29 < mawk> and they want a bit of €€€ at the same time
2019-02-18T22:13:29 < catphish> zyp: toslink is optical spdif, yes, with that said, i'm lying, what i actually want to implement isn't spdif at all, its ADAT, a different audio protocol that uses the toslink hardware
2019-02-18T22:13:37 < mawk> it's a civil lawsuit, nothing criminal
2019-02-18T22:13:44 < Steffanx> mawk will you have serious issues with this new upload filter the EU wants?
2019-02-18T22:13:51 < catphish> mawk: oh, well that's not too bad i guess
2019-02-18T22:13:58 < catphish> though being evicted sucks too :(
2019-02-18T22:14:04 < aandrew> damn mawk that sucks
2019-02-18T22:14:07 < aandrew> hope it works out
2019-02-18T22:14:12 < mawk> I didn't check on that Steffanx , I know there are 3 conditions for avoiding the filter, I think being non-profit is enough
2019-02-18T22:14:29 < mawk> yeah I just hope to get a delay large enough, then I'll come to the netherlands
2019-02-18T22:14:32 < mawk> I just have to finish my studies
2019-02-18T22:14:55 < Steffanx> go gogogo :P
2019-02-18T22:15:26 < mawk> lol
2019-02-18T22:17:56 < catphish> mawk: what do you host?
2019-02-18T22:18:02 < mawk> an image hosting website
2019-02-18T22:18:06 < mawk> https://pix.watch/
2019-02-18T22:19:16 < catphish> eww french
2019-02-18T22:19:48 < mawk> :(
2019-02-18T22:19:52 < mawk> there are nice pictograms
2019-02-18T22:20:21 < catphish> :)
2019-02-18T22:22:42 < Steffanx> lol your website breaks my firefox mawk
2019-02-18T22:23:15 < Steffanx> when i click on "upload image" the tool tip shows up somewhere on a totally different spot on my screen
2019-02-18T22:23:52 < mawk> yeah on chrome too
2019-02-18T22:23:59 < mawk> and it's a standard browser feature, not even a shitty js tool
2019-02-18T22:24:22 < catphish> i guess i should get an optical receiver connected up to an MCU/FPGA and just play with it and see what i can receive
2019-02-18T22:24:31 < Steffanx> nah i chrome it says inside the window mawk
2019-02-18T22:24:38 < Steffanx> here. in firefox it shows up on my 2nd screen :D
2019-02-18T22:24:41 < mawk> yeah but still not in the correct place
2019-02-18T22:24:43 < mawk> I put required="true" on the <input>
2019-02-18T22:24:43 < Steffanx> i dont even have a window there.
2019-02-18T22:24:49 < mawk> so it shows up that tooltip
2019-02-18T22:25:42 < catphish> lol i see the same
2019-02-18T22:25:46 < mawk> don't you need a transceiver catphish ?
2019-02-18T22:26:06 < catphish> mawk: well the transmitter and receiver will be separate, it's not bidi
2019-02-18T22:26:13 < catphish> but yeah both in one module would be nice
2019-02-18T22:26:52 < mawk> I wonder if you can do DMA with stuff external to the MCU chip
2019-02-18T22:27:10 < mawk> you certainly can, x86 does it for the PCI devices
2019-02-18T22:27:16 < mawk> but I wonder how it's done with a arm mcu
2019-02-18T22:28:32 < catphish> i don't know how much electronics i need between the optics and the mcu, i don't know if i need an mcu or an fpga, don't know where to begin with this at all :)
2019-02-18T22:28:53 < mawk> you're transmitting sound right
2019-02-18T22:29:02 < mawk> it's not an incredibly high bitrate
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2019-02-18T22:30:18 < catphish> yeah, the specific protocol is called adat lightpipe, the data rate is 12.288Mbps
2019-02-18T22:30:50 < catphish> so it's not exactly trivial
2019-02-18T22:31:46 < catphish> "This datastream is NRZI encoded for a 6.144Mbps symbol rate"
2019-02-18T22:31:56 < mawk> ah, right
2019-02-18T22:32:05 < catphish> some kind of DDR magic
2019-02-18T22:32:07 < mawk> what is used with that ? quad SPI ?
2019-02-18T22:32:34 < mawk> if you take a mcu with like 20× the symbol rate it sounds like working
2019-02-18T22:32:46 < catphish> it uses the same hardware as toslink, and transmits 8 x 24-bit 48ksps audio streams
2019-02-18T22:33:31 < catphish> i guess it'll need a fpga
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2019-02-18T22:35:20 < mawk> you have 400 MHz stm32 cores
2019-02-18T22:35:23 < mawk> I'm sure it could be fine
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2019-02-18T22:37:54 < zyp> catphish, did you check whether you can make SAI talk ADAT?
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2019-02-18T22:41:37 < catphish> zyp: i actually have no idea what that is :(
2019-02-18T22:42:36 < zyp> the «serial audio interface» in some stm32 variants
2019-02-18T22:43:01 < zyp> I haven't used it myself, but my understanding is that it's flexible and can be set up for multiple standards, including spdif
2019-02-18T22:43:20 < zyp> ADAT might still be too complex though
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2019-02-18T22:44:52 < catphish> it's weird, i get the impression that it intentionally uses some weird encoding to make it compatible with cheap transceiver hardware, but at the same time makes it much more complicated
2019-02-18T22:45:50 < catphish> so i guess one starts with a spdif toslink PHY and work from there
2019-02-18T22:46:08 < catphish> "Because the data rate of 12.288Mbps is too fast for the popular TOTX173 fiber tramsit module, data is NRZI encoded by sending a '1' as a change in signal level, a '0' being sent as no change in the signal."
2019-02-18T22:46:43 < catphish> i don't really understand how that doubles the bitrate
2019-02-18T22:48:16 < qyx> wiki manchester encoding
2019-02-18T22:49:04 < zyp> NRZI != manchester
2019-02-18T22:49:20 < qyx> hop
2019-02-18T22:49:32 < zyp> but yeah, NRZI has half the bandwith of manchester for the same bitrate
2019-02-18T22:49:51 < zyp> although so does normal NRZ
2019-02-18T22:52:35 < zyp> ah, it's a comparison to spdif
2019-02-18T22:52:56 < zyp> spdif is biphase mark, which is almost equivalent to manchester
2019-02-18T22:53:03 < zyp> and NRZI is then half of that
2019-02-18T22:53:37 < catphish> so manchester transmits one bit per clock, NRZI transmits 2, just looking at diagrams
2019-02-18T22:54:15 < zyp> depends what you mean by clock, the whole point of manchester is that the clock is embedded
2019-02-18T22:54:41 < catphish> yeah that's true
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2019-02-18T22:56:05 < catphish> i'm trying to work out how one recovers the clock from NRZI
2019-02-18T22:56:13 < zyp> in manchester encoding, each bit is transferred as 10 or 01 so that there's always a transition in the middle of the bit, so you can always recover the clock even in a series of zeroes
2019-02-18T22:56:16 < catphish> it's not quite as obvious as manchester
2019-02-18T22:56:29 < zyp> not any different from NRZ
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2019-02-18T22:57:00 < zyp> self-clocked NRZ*-based protocols generally use bit stuffing
2019-02-18T22:57:11 < zyp> e.g. CAN and USB
2019-02-18T22:57:14 < catphish> the only clue is "For ensuring enough signal transitions are made, a '1' bit is sent after every 4 databits for correct decoding of the ADAT stream"
2019-02-18T22:57:33 < zyp> there you've got it
2019-02-18T22:58:20 < zyp> in USB, if there's five consecutive identical bits, another bit of the opposing polarity is added
2019-02-18T22:58:46 < zyp> CAN does the same, although I don't remember if the number was five
2019-02-18T22:58:57 < catphish> oh, here we go, there's a syncronization period in the stream https://ackspace.nl/w/images/7/70/Adat_protocol.gif
2019-02-18T22:59:37 < fenugrec> catphish, what are you making that uses adat
2019-02-18T22:59:41 < zyp> that's not for clock recover
2019-02-18T22:59:44 < zyp> recovery
2019-02-18T23:00:02 < catphish> zyp: no, i'm struggling to see why it would be useful actually
2019-02-18T23:00:16 < zyp> the syncronization period would be to detect the frame boundaries
2019-02-18T23:00:16 < catphish> then again, i can't really see how one recovers the clock at all
2019-02-18T23:00:31 < zyp> catphish, that's what the 1s are for
2019-02-18T23:00:52 < catphish> zyp: but those ones aren't adjacent, so i don't quite see how they're useful
2019-02-18T23:01:10 < catphish> since there could be any number of zeros (non-transitions) between them
2019-02-18T23:01:16 < fenugrec> aren't those 1's to keep the average from saturating at 0 or 1
2019-02-18T23:01:25 < catphish> fenugrec: yes i think they are
2019-02-18T23:01:27 < fenugrec> i.e AC bias, etc
2019-02-18T23:01:53 < zyp> fenugrec, no, it's to ensure frequent transitions, catphish just quoted that earlier
2019-02-18T23:02:05 < catphish> fenugrec: and quite simply, i wondered if i could make an ADAT <-> PC interface, because they're expensive
2019-02-18T23:02:30 < catphish> zyp: isn't the reason for frequent transitions usually to avoid excessve dc bias though?
2019-02-18T23:02:38 < zyp> no
2019-02-18T23:02:50 < zyp> I mean, consider how UART works
2019-02-18T23:03:04 < catphish> i'm not sure how they help with clock syncronization though
2019-02-18T23:03:28 < catphish> maybe it's simply not self clocking, and one needs a local clock
2019-02-18T23:03:39 < catphish> then just sync to one of those edges
2019-02-18T23:03:44 < catphish> in fact it's obviously
2019-02-18T23:03:45 < zyp> you always need a local clock to work with a self clocking signal
2019-02-18T23:03:47 < catphish> *obviously not
2019-02-18T23:03:50 < zyp> :p
2019-02-18T23:04:20 < catphish> yeah, i guess i need to run my own clock, and i can just use the transitions to keep it in sync
2019-02-18T23:04:28 < zyp> consider how uart works, there's a start bit and a stop bit, start is always 0 and stop is always 1, and there's 9 data bits in between
2019-02-18T23:04:33 < zyp> 8*
2019-02-18T23:04:54 < zyp> so even if the data bits are 0x00 or 0xff, you never have more than 9 consecutive identical bits in a row
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2019-02-18T23:05:21 < catphish> yeah, uart has absolutely no inbuilt clock, for some reason i was thinking this did have such a thing
2019-02-18T23:06:04 < bonzibuddy> hey all - if im spinnig up a custom stm32f401 board.  im having trouble determining if i am required to use the 20 pin JTAG for initial firmware load, or if i can get away with a smaller SWD header
2019-02-18T23:06:07 < catphish> anyway, think it makes sense now
2019-02-18T23:06:11 < bonzibuddy> -if*
2019-02-18T23:06:16 < zyp> catphish, but uart still works without a clock
2019-02-18T23:06:41 < zyp> because you detect the edges of the start bit, and just time it from there
2019-02-18T23:06:46 < catphish> zyp: well it's async, so each end needs its own clock, but yeah
2019-02-18T23:07:06 < catphish> i was somehow hoping this wasn't like that :)
2019-02-18T23:07:13 < catphish> so i jut need something that can run a clo
2019-02-18T23:07:15 < zyp> then you'd need a clock signal :p
2019-02-18T23:07:33 < catphish> *run a 6.144MHz clock
2019-02-18T23:08:00 < catphish> or more likely a 12.288MHz clock
2019-02-18T23:08:14 < catphish> i'm starting to get a feel for why these are expensive
2019-02-18T23:08:47 < fenugrec> PLL
2019-02-18T23:08:57 < jadew> can someone please type my nickname?
2019-02-18T23:09:04 < Steffanx> jadew
2019-02-18T23:09:06 < fenugrec> my nickname
2019-02-18T23:09:09 < BrainDamage> jaden smith
2019-02-18T23:09:13 < jadew> thanks!
2019-02-18T23:09:19 < jadew> doesn't seem to flash :/
2019-02-18T23:09:27 < Steffanx> Awh
2019-02-18T23:09:56 < mawk> which client jadew ?
2019-02-18T23:10:15 < mawk> weechat
2019-02-18T23:10:17 < jadew> mawk, weechat through putty
2019-02-18T23:10:27 < mawk> how do you flash ? \a ?
2019-02-18T23:10:34 < jadew> the window flashes once, but the taskbar icon doesn't
2019-02-18T23:10:44 < mawk> the putty icon ?
2019-02-18T23:10:46 < jadew> \b maybe?
2019-02-18T23:10:50 < jadew> I don't know
2019-02-18T23:10:56 < jadew> oh, it's \a
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2019-02-18T23:10:58 < mawk> it's \a
2019-02-18T23:11:00 < mawk> \b is backspace
2019-02-18T23:11:10 < mawk> but that's on unix, maybe it's different for windows
2019-02-18T23:11:26 < jadew> well, it's running on linux, so it should work
2019-02-18T23:11:28 < mawk> also if you have a recent enough win10 they redesigned the Console, you have new codes and maybe a better ding one
2019-02-18T23:12:56 < catphish> jadew: flash now!
2019-02-18T23:13:06 < jadew> :)
2019-02-18T23:13:57 < jadew> the problem with the windows console is that it doesn't let mouse events through
2019-02-18T23:14:16 < jadew> it looks good otherwise
2019-02-18T23:14:25 < jadew> not sure if it does links either
2019-02-18T23:14:58 < mawk> isn't putty the win console ?
2019-02-18T23:15:08 < mawk> I use mintty otherwise on windows, with cygwin
2019-02-18T23:15:09 < mawk> no putty
2019-02-18T23:15:11 < jadew> putty is a SSH client
2019-02-18T23:15:14 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-18T23:15:22 < mawk> but I thought it used the cmd.exe window for display
2019-02-18T23:15:30 < jadew> no, has its own thing
2019-02-18T23:15:41 < mawk> I see
2019-02-18T23:17:17 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2019-02-18T23:19:52 < qyx> fellow kicad pros
2019-02-18T23:19:55 < qyx> https://i.imgur.com/korMWhe.png
2019-02-18T23:20:15 < qyx> why the hell is the mosfet SW node disconnected from the filled zone
2019-02-18T23:21:14 < jadew> qyx, it doesn't have a net
2019-02-18T23:21:35 < jadew> or at the very least, it's not GND
2019-02-18T23:21:50 < qyx> it does, it is written there
2019-02-18T23:23:29 < catphish> qyx: have you tried turning it off and on again?
2019-02-18T23:23:49 < catphish> qyx: that's clearly nonsense :( the ratsnest says as much
2019-02-18T23:24:37 < catphish> qyx: check the pad properties, connecting to fills is optional, and you have no thermal relief, so i'd suggest the pad settings are non default
2019-02-18T23:25:28 < catphish> you seems to have differing pad-fill settings
2019-02-18T23:25:42 < catphish> so maybe you accidentally selected no-connect instead of no-thermal-relief
2019-02-18T23:26:05 < catphish> your GND has thermal relief, other pads do not
2019-02-18T23:26:23 < bonzibuddy> good idea
2019-02-18T23:26:28 < qyx> fukit
2019-02-18T23:26:34 < catphish> qyx: ?
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2019-02-18T23:26:44 < qyx> catphish: yes indeed, pad connection = none
2019-02-18T23:26:50 < catphish> qyx: :)
2019-02-18T23:26:51 < qyx> thx
2019-02-18T23:27:00 < qyx> it was fromt he kicad lirbary
2019-02-18T23:27:10 < catphish> well thats dumb :)
2019-02-18T23:27:30 < bonzibuddy> whats up with the vias on that component gnd pad?  are they buried?
2019-02-18T23:28:18 < catphish> looks like they're just vias on the pad, i avoid it but it's perfectly legal
2019-02-18T23:28:30 < qyx> I avoid it too usually
2019-02-18T23:28:54 < bonzibuddy> ive never tried it, in fact ive never seen it until now
2019-02-18T23:29:00 < bonzibuddy> just curious
2019-02-18T23:29:22 < qyx> mhm I can turn off thermals on a per-pad basis
2019-02-18T23:29:26 < qyx> cool
2019-02-18T23:36:55 < catphish> qyx: yep :)
2019-02-18T23:57:17 < catphish> zyp: this is what i want the ADAT interface for by the way: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-X-BEHRINGER-PRO-8-DIGITAL-A-D-D-A-Converter-8x-mic-pre-Model-ADA8000/223236859655
2019-02-18T23:57:39 < catphish> those things are awesome, but PC interfaces are crazy expensive
2019-02-18T23:57:49 < catphish> will probably just buy one eventually though
2019-02-18T23:59:24 < fenugrec> catphish, what do they use inside commercial stuff, an ASIC ?
--- Day changed Tue Feb 19 2019
2019-02-19T00:00:39 < catphish> here's an old PCI card i found, looks like it uses a spartan https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rme-Hdsp-9652-Pci-Sound-Card-Daughter-Board-breakout-cables/153380922568
2019-02-19T00:01:03 < catphish> those cards usually sell for around $200
2019-02-19T00:02:15 < catphish> i also found this: https://ackspace.nl/wiki/ADAT_project
2019-02-19T00:02:51 < catphish> so it seems like with a fibre module and an fpga, it can be done
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2019-02-19T00:24:59 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msXtgTVMcuA encore
2019-02-19T00:25:17 < kakimir> so cool machine
2019-02-19T00:26:39 < kakimir> somebody linked this 4years ago or so
2019-02-19T00:31:53 < Cracki> >_> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DztXYPwWsAIK7oi.jpg:orig
2019-02-19T00:37:52 < R2COM> sup\
2019-02-19T00:39:10 < Cracki> muricans manufacture a hate crime hoax to push through their lynching law
2019-02-19T00:40:04 < R2COM> https://i.imgur.com/hXuY2a5.jpg
2019-02-19T00:40:14 < R2COM> so proud of my weekend project of custom cabinet
2019-02-19T00:44:49 < R2COM> has anyone by any chance used graphics library called LVGL?
2019-02-19T00:46:30 < kakimir> R2COM: where were you?
2019-02-19T00:48:54 < R2COM> busy with work shit
2019-02-19T00:49:31 < kakimir> tell me about it
2019-02-19T00:49:41 < R2COM> sorry cant break NDA
2019-02-19T00:50:12 < Steffanx> dongs and rajkosto i think, R2COM
2019-02-19T00:50:15 < Steffanx> used it
2019-02-19T00:50:27 < Steffanx> the last one actuallly mentioned using it a few days ago
2019-02-19T00:50:42 < R2COM> this interface seems to be the most advanced
2019-02-19T00:50:43 < Steffanx> assuming you mean littlevgl
2019-02-19T00:50:44 < R2COM> yet free
2019-02-19T00:50:46 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-19T00:50:51 < R2COM> yes
2019-02-19T00:51:08 < Steffanx> but mr rajsomethinguto doesnt seem to be around
2019-02-19T00:52:04 < R2COM> new releases are coming one after another
2019-02-19T00:55:33 < kakimir> so do you have now some time off or so R2COM?
2019-02-19T00:55:41 < R2COM> kinda
2019-02-19T00:58:39 < kakimir> project is complete?
2019-02-19T00:58:44 < kakimir> or almost complete?
2019-02-19T00:58:57 < R2COM> just ongoing stuff but more free personal time
2019-02-19T00:59:04 < R2COM> work less for job related things during my time off
2019-02-19T00:59:18 -!- con3 [~kvirc@ml.sun.ac.za] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-19T00:59:31 < R2COM> also took extra work a while ago at work, doing some analog blocks for another business unit
2019-02-19T01:02:31 < R2COM> some recent stuff looks neat, i might even try patenting it
2019-02-19T01:03:23 < englishman> bonzibuddy: swd is fine
2019-02-19T01:04:25 < englishman> I think maybe 1 person has used JTAG on stm32 in here, and it was a decade ago
2019-02-19T01:07:13 < bitmask> what do you need on a label? part number, package, short description, qr code to datasheet
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2019-02-19T01:08:54 < aandrew> I will be using jtag with stm32
2019-02-19T01:09:01 < aandrew> but I will have a fallback to swd
2019-02-19T01:09:21 < aandrew> the issue is that I already have a full jtag chain (two clock gens, an FPGA and a PHY) and it's a pain in the dick switching between them
2019-02-19T01:09:57 < aandrew> so I'm fully breaking out SWD with jumpers so I can run the stm32 independently, but also have the ability to use the existing jtag chain to develop it as well (for people who just take my project and flash the entire board)
2019-02-19T01:10:03 < englishman> yeah that's pretty much the only advantage
2019-02-19T01:14:30 < fenugrec> bitmask, date
2019-02-19T01:15:18 < bitmask> good idea
2019-02-19T01:16:27 < kakimir> is there multi target swd?
2019-02-19T01:17:00 < kakimir> and
2019-02-19T01:17:14 < kakimir> what is your fav connector for high power speakers?
2019-02-19T01:17:26 < kakimir> I mean 200w rms etc.
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2019-02-19T01:20:18 < englishman> banana
2019-02-19T01:20:27 < englishman> or spring terminals
2019-02-19T01:21:22 < kakimir> how about neutric twist
2019-02-19T01:21:31 < kakimir> neutrik*
2019-02-19T01:22:44 < englishman> what is that and why are spring terminals better?
2019-02-19T01:24:04 < aandrew> I don't thnk you can do multi-target SWD
2019-02-19T01:27:15 < banana> man fuk englishman
2019-02-19T01:28:47 < bitmask> haha
2019-02-19T01:29:54 < banana> hi englishman
2019-02-19T01:30:05 < banana> ;-;
2019-02-19T01:30:15  * banana disappears back to the banana republic
2019-02-19T01:36:58 < kakimir> what is happening in here
2019-02-19T01:37:54 < bitmask> englishman woke the dead and got scared and ran away
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2019-02-19T04:04:59 < R2COM> emeb_mac whats up
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2019-02-19T04:15:37 < fenugrec> never seen git used to draw discrete opamp schematics https://i.imgur.com/cqONnWB.jpg
2019-02-19T04:16:46 < PeterM> the fuck
2019-02-19T04:21:04 < fenugrec> git merge --cascode-follower
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2019-02-19T04:25:44 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Not a lot - how about you?
2019-02-19T04:26:01 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Still in AZ?
2019-02-19T04:31:33 < R2COM> emeb_mac yes, ilike AZ
2019-02-19T04:31:56 < R2COM> just innovating
2019-02-19T04:33:26 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Glad you're liking it here. I do too.
2019-02-19T04:34:39 < emeb_mac> R2COM: $DAYJOB has been on hold for a while - no contracts lately so I've been just farting around with lots of personal projects
2019-02-19T04:34:39 < R2COM> what projects you busy with
2019-02-19T04:34:53 < R2COM> ah
2019-02-19T04:35:00 < R2COM> why is dayjob on hold
2019-02-19T04:35:33 < emeb_mac> Did some Xilinx Zynq stuff. Did some audio/synth stuff. Lately doing some Lattice FPGA projects.
2019-02-19T04:36:01 < emeb_mac> And some STM32 fiddling here & there.
2019-02-19T04:36:03 < R2COM> so you are contractor?
2019-02-19T04:36:36 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Yeah - mostly work w/ a small group of clients who know me.
2019-02-19T04:36:44 < scrts> good evening
2019-02-19T04:37:55 < R2COM> emeb_mac  why dont you work for Raytheon or Honeywell, so that your circuits can blow shit up overseas
2019-02-19T04:38:43 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Hah! I used to work for Motorola GEG in Scottsdale - they got bought up by General Dynamics.
2019-02-19T04:39:03 < R2COM> is general dynamics have design centers in AZ?
2019-02-19T04:39:38 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Yeah - they've got a huge plant down @ Hayden & McDowell in S. Scottdale.
2019-02-19T04:39:50 < emeb_mac> I've done a lot of work for them over the years
2019-02-19T04:39:51 < R2COM> so theres EE jobs too yea?
2019-02-19T04:39:58 < emeb_mac> R2COM: Oh yeah
2019-02-19T04:40:00 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-19T04:40:27 < emeb_mac> Lots of radio stuff, secure comms, even some "blow shit up" stuff
2019-02-19T04:40:52 < R2COM> nice!
2019-02-19T04:40:59 < emeb_mac> Not as much as 30yrs ago, but still a lot.
2019-02-19T04:41:18 < R2COM> it will grow, that shit gets serious spin now
2019-02-19T04:41:46 < emeb_mac> Yep - it shrinks/grows depending on who's running the gov't
2019-02-19T04:42:07 < R2COM> usa abandoned missile treaty now, so it will just grow
2019-02-19T04:42:51 < emeb_mac> heh.
2019-02-19T04:43:40 < R2COM> emeb_mac do you use gui with stm32?
2019-02-19T04:43:58 < emeb_mac> R2COM: I've used STemWin stuff.
2019-02-19T04:44:42 < emeb_mac> tried some of their GUI things but most of my application don't need all the windows/buttons/etc
2019-02-19T04:44:49 < R2COM> i just imported and successfully compiled this lvgl stuff... now ill have to somehow do some "hello world" on my mipi dsi disco board
2019-02-19T04:45:11 < R2COM> https://littlevgl.com/
2019-02-19T04:45:54 < emeb_mac> that looks nice.
2019-02-19T04:46:03 < emeb_mac> I tried using uGFX a while back
2019-02-19T04:46:05 < R2COM> yeah which is reason i wanna start playing with it
2019-02-19T04:46:18 < R2COM> but this stuff is free and yet advanced (at least looks like its advanced)
2019-02-19T04:46:30 < R2COM> hmm it might be even better than some non free stuff dunno
2019-02-19T04:47:10 < emeb_mac> Yeah
2019-02-19T04:47:50 < aandrew> dongs: help me with this fucking idiotic keil bullshit
2019-02-19T04:47:51 < emeb_mac> I used uGFX on Zynq but it's really a PITA to integrate into the Xilinx SDK IDE
2019-02-19T04:48:12 < aandrew> the pack installer shows all kinds of packs installed including the device I'm using (nordic nrf51822_xxAA)
2019-02-19T04:48:21 < aandrew> but if I click on the manage run time environment it shows nothing
2019-02-19T04:48:23 < emeb_mac> huge code base that requires lots of fiddling to make the IDE compile it
2019-02-19T04:48:38 < dongs> aandrew: you need to make a pack project, uvprojx
2019-02-19T04:48:41 < dongs> not 'legacy device project'
2019-02-19T04:48:44 < dongs> the samples might be legacy
2019-02-19T04:48:53 < R2COM> dongs have you used lvgl lib for gui?
2019-02-19T04:48:59 < rajkosto> R2COM, littlevgl ftw
2019-02-19T04:49:04 < dongs> R2COM: ive looked at it, i think rajkosto is using it.
2019-02-19T04:49:17 < R2COM> guy who made it has examples
2019-02-19T04:49:19 < rajkosto> even though i had to rewrite its KEYPAD input handling and add a parent to all groups
2019-02-19T04:49:25 < R2COM> but dont see example of the direct stm32 driver
2019-02-19T04:49:28 < R2COM> for f7 foir example
2019-02-19T04:49:35 < rajkosto> why does it need to have a driver ?
2019-02-19T04:49:35 < dongs> you mean using ldtc or whatever>?
2019-02-19T04:49:49 < dongs> just port one of the SPI screen ones or whatever
2019-02-19T04:49:50 < dongs> it cant be that hard
2019-02-19T04:49:52 < rajkosto> you should know how to configure stm32 to do what you want it to do when the buffer needs flushing
2019-02-19T04:49:57 < R2COM> by "driver" i mean the code responsible for talking to graphics unit
2019-02-19T04:50:02 < R2COM> ltdc
2019-02-19T04:50:03 < R2COM> exactly
2019-02-19T04:50:04 < R2COM> soirry
2019-02-19T04:50:10 < rajkosto> for me it was just trigger DMA, in DMA TC i call flush_complete
2019-02-19T04:50:30 < R2COM> i mean, i wanna utilize this lib through ltdc
2019-02-19T04:50:39 < rajkosto> if you can fit entire framebuffer into ram (you can on stm32f4 with 256KB sram) its even easier
2019-02-19T04:50:51 < rajkosto> all you have to do is tell it how to set the framebuffer pointer
2019-02-19T04:51:44 < aandrew> dongs: this is a legacy project, how do I convert it over?
2019-02-19T04:51:59 < aandrew> it says "I'll save it in uvision5 format" but I don't know that that's enough
2019-02-19T04:52:33 < dongs> aandrew: project->migrate to version 5 yeah
2019-02-19T04:52:38 < dongs> and it lets y ou pick a pack or whatever
2019-02-19T04:53:12 < R2COM> rajkosto so you did it through spi?
2019-02-19T04:53:32 < rajkosto> yes 
2019-02-19T04:53:47 < rajkosto> on stm32f4 i would do it over 8080 or RGB interface which they expose
2019-02-19T04:54:14 < aandrew> yeah I was thinking it was not seeing it
2019-02-19T04:54:17 < aandrew> maybe it'll work now
2019-02-19T04:54:21 < R2COM> im trying to see if there is a driver for that lvgl utilising ltdc and dma2d
2019-02-19T04:54:23 < aandrew> although now it's just bitching about not finding headers
2019-02-19T04:54:49 < rajkosto> R2COM, im sure you can write a 10 line function
2019-02-19T04:54:55 < aandrew> gah it's still got nothing for manage real time environment
2019-02-19T04:55:04 < aandrew> how the fuck is this any easier or better than a makefile
2019-02-19T04:55:27 < R2COM> umm yeah but its a bit more involved
2019-02-19T04:56:29 < aandrew> ah. quit and go back in and it looks like it's there now
2019-02-19T04:58:55 < R2COM> is that Keil shit still $5k stuff?
2019-02-19T04:59:14 < aandrew> don't know I've pirated it
2019-02-19T04:59:23 < aandrew> let me assure you it's worth every penny I paid
2019-02-19T04:59:23 < R2COM> i thought pirating is 1998
2019-02-19T05:00:02 < rajkosto> dongs, https://youtu.be/XGErL12TfTQ?t=477i made this with littlevgl as well
2019-02-19T05:00:09 < rajkosto> https://youtu.be/XGErL12TfTQ?t=477 i*
2019-02-19T05:00:33 < aandrew> rajkosto: what is, what's on the switch?
2019-02-19T05:03:38 < dongs> rajkosto: what is, that file browser?
2019-02-19T05:03:51 < rajkosto> CUSTOM
2019-02-19T05:04:03 < rajkosto> all littlevgl widgets ofc
2019-02-19T05:05:37 < dongs> wheres your current vgl stm32 stuff
2019-02-19T05:08:29 < rajkosto> nowhere
2019-02-19T05:08:45 < rajkosto> just started doing it like 2 days ago
2019-02-19T05:09:03 < rajkosto> i didnt need to bother with keypad navigation on the switch, its a bit lacking in stock lvgl
2019-02-19T05:10:58 < aandrew> I think I got somewhere
2019-02-19T05:11:15 < aandrew> now I've got some .sct file error L6235E: More than one section matches selector - cannot all be FIRST/LAST
2019-02-19T05:12:44 < rajkosto> but this works for spi dma on stm32 with littlevgl: https://pastebin.com/3SLamMnk
2019-02-19T05:14:01 -!- kow__ [~afed@135.0.26.55] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
2019-02-19T05:14:34 < aandrew> Program Size: Code=49508 RO-data=4024 RW-data=644 ZI-data=6284  
2019-02-19T05:14:38 < aandrew> ".\_build_wsm_tdma\mcu_device.axf" - 0 Error(s), 0 Warning(s).
2019-02-19T05:14:45 < aandrew> I wonder if that's actually built or not
2019-02-19T05:18:31 < dongs> yes obviously
2019-02-19T05:19:26 < aandrew> this pointy clicky embedded dev makes me puke
2019-02-19T05:19:33 < aandrew> may as well be building C# apps
2019-02-19T05:20:00 < R2COM> why?
2019-02-19T05:20:13 < R2COM> what you mean pointy clicky dev?
2019-02-19T05:20:14 < dongs> aandrew doesn't like shit that works
2019-02-19T05:20:18 < dongs> has to be complicated
2019-02-19T05:20:22 < dongs> with makefails and shit.
2019-02-19T05:20:26 < aandrew> there's nothing complicated about cubemx and makefiles
2019-02-19T05:20:27 < R2COM> is he prefering DOS maybe too?
2019-02-19T05:20:33 < aandrew> nah
2019-02-19T05:20:34 < aandrew> unix is good
2019-02-19T05:20:48 < rajkosto> > using CubeMX for anything other than pin planner
2019-02-19T05:20:54 < R2COM> how the fuck you can see snapshot of all debug registers and variables at same time with that console development shit concept?
2019-02-19T05:21:02 < R2COM> enlighten me...
2019-02-19T05:21:09 < dongs> < rajkosto> > using CubeMX for anything other than pin planner
2019-02-19T05:21:09 < aandrew> cubemx's pin planner might be useful with some changes
2019-02-19T05:21:10 < dongs> haha this
2019-02-19T05:21:23 < aandrew> R2COM: ozone is a decent debugger
2019-02-19T05:21:36 < aandrew> it's my preferred one infact, but I am competent in gdb as well
2019-02-19T05:21:55 < aandrew> oh the cubemx gui is ok for clocking too
2019-02-19T05:22:06 < aandrew> but after that you just get the dir structure and write your own shit
2019-02-19T05:22:11 < aandrew> don't use it's idiotic codegen
2019-02-19T05:22:16 < aandrew> that's no different than the keil idiocy
2019-02-19T05:22:32 < rajkosto> i dont use its dir structure or generated projects either
2019-02-19T05:22:34 < R2COM> i think couple big examples for dev board with stm32 workbench enough
2019-02-19T05:22:44 < R2COM> i can craft any custom board out of it and tune all stuff necessarily
2019-02-19T05:22:49 < R2COM> appropriately*
2019-02-19T05:23:48 < R2COM> but of course all stuff would be better in Keil
2019-02-19T05:23:54 < aandrew> I need to get into some gui dev for stm32
2019-02-19T05:27:39 < rajkosto> using your IDE's project templates is a way smaller mess than using cube generated stuff
2019-02-19T05:27:51 < dongs> keil doesht have any templates.
2019-02-19T05:27:59 < dongs> it just collects your .c/h files and compiles them.
2019-02-19T05:28:09 < aandrew> what is RTE?
2019-02-19T05:28:14 < aandrew> some dir with shit in it
2019-02-19T05:28:19 < dongs> i always build keil shit wiht 'disable external includes' and my projects are self-contained with all the needed include/cmsis/etc shit
2019-02-19T05:28:23 < rajkosto> has project and device settings tho
2019-02-19T05:28:28 < rajkosto> its also keil, and belongs in 1998-2001
2019-02-19T05:28:48 < rajkosto> VisualGDB is pimp
2019-02-19T05:29:20 < rajkosto> GCC MCU ARM eclipse is eclipse but works well enough
2019-02-19T05:30:01 < aandrew> eclipse is awful
2019-02-19T05:31:26 < R2COM> is visualgdb used now?
2019-02-19T05:31:49 < R2COM> would someone use it now at all, since stm32 workbench already gives good reasonable debugger
2019-02-19T05:32:02 < dongs> stm32 cuckbench is jsut eclipse isnt it?
2019-02-19T05:32:05 < rajkosto> stm32 workbench is just stm32 proprietary customized eclipse
2019-02-19T05:32:09 < dongs> i mean, i'd rather us ozone than anything eclipse-pased
2019-02-19T05:32:10 < aandrew> who uses that hsit
2019-02-19T05:32:12 < rajkosto> id rather use gcc mcu arm eclipse
2019-02-19T05:32:27 < R2COM> i use it now
2019-02-19T05:32:28 < aandrew> every vendor has "proprietary customized eclipse"
2019-02-19T05:32:29 < aandrew> that's why it's shit
2019-02-19T05:32:45 < R2COM> i mean, i open it, create any stm32 project for any chip or devboard.. and it compiles and all ready
2019-02-19T05:32:46 < rajkosto> https://gnu-mcu-eclipse.github.io/
2019-02-19T05:32:48 < R2COM> what else one need?
2019-02-19T05:32:48 < rajkosto> comic sans !
2019-02-19T05:33:15 < aandrew> ozone works really nicely
2019-02-19T05:33:24 < aandrew> I'd like to give bmp another chance
2019-02-19T05:33:31 < scrts> dongs: do you use Repeat() in Altium?
2019-02-19T05:33:38 < aandrew> just because I don't like being stuck with jlink but honestly nothing works better IMO
2019-02-19T05:34:12 < dongs> scrts, i used it like once, it was buggy/weird but got the job done
2019-02-19T05:34:23 < dongs> but it was a simple thing, i had a button (btn+r+c for debounce) that I needed to copy 8x
2019-02-19T05:34:58 < scrts> I am trying to understand
2019-02-19T05:35:17 < scrts> e.g. I have a bus: DATA0, so the first bit of that bus is DATA01?
2019-02-19T05:36:03 < scrts> the reason it happened is that I have ETH_RXD0, ETH_RXD1... so after repeat, not sure if ETH_RXD01 is the 1st entry
2019-02-19T05:36:18 < R2COM> wtf is Repeat() ? does Altium need programming language to master to do pcbs ? lol
2019-02-19T05:36:29 < rajkosto> no, thats eagle
2019-02-19T05:36:42 < rajkosto> but there's scripting and scripts for all the big pcb packages
2019-02-19T05:36:57 < rajkosto> repeat boring stuff and automation
2019-02-19T05:37:58 < scrts> R2COM: basically you design schematic sheet once and repeat for multiple channels
2019-02-19T05:38:14 < scrts> instead of copying multiple sheets...
2019-02-19T05:38:32 < scrts> plus when you finish layout - ou can copy layout 1:1
2019-02-19T05:38:49 < dongs> scrts: you don't really need repeat() for that you can just use device sheets
2019-02-19T05:38:55 < dongs> i'd say thats probly better + rooms
2019-02-19T05:38:59 < dongs> how many are you really copying there?
2019-02-19T05:39:05 < scrts> repeat does rooms
2019-02-19T05:39:06 < aandrew> scrts: altium REPEAT is VERY dumb
2019-02-19T05:39:18 < aandrew> it took me a while to get it right
2019-02-19T05:39:26 < R2COM> hah
2019-02-19T05:39:41 < scrts> dongs: so you add same sheet symbol twice?
2019-02-19T05:39:46 < dongs> yep
2019-02-19T05:39:49 < dongs> and just connect the ports
2019-02-19T05:39:58 < dongs> you can call it something else of course, like LAN1 LAN2 etc
2019-02-19T05:40:30 < dongs> i think repeat would severaly break if you have diff lanes and shit in your repeat block
2019-02-19T05:40:37 < dongs> i wouldn't use it for anything otehr than simple button shit
2019-02-19T05:41:07 < scrts> hmm, ok, lets see
2019-02-19T05:41:23 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-19T05:47:51 < scrts> quick question: how does it work with the net names then?
2019-02-19T05:48:00 < scrts> it will auto-generate net names?
2019-02-19T05:48:23 < dongs> the device sheets?
2019-02-19T05:48:58 < dongs> they;'ll be appended with room name
2019-02-19T05:49:02 < dongs> (or can be configured)
2019-02-19T05:49:12 < dongs> default is add _roomname tho.
2019-02-19T05:49:18 < dongs> like IC1_LAN1, IC1_LAN2
2019-02-19T05:49:20 < dongs> and so on.
2019-02-19T05:49:32 < dongs> net names same,
2019-02-19T05:49:38 < dongs> VDDIO_LAN1 blah
2019-02-19T05:50:19 < aandrew> https://imgur.com/a/VfZAOIH
2019-02-19T05:50:22 < aandrew> works fine with diff pairs
2019-02-19T05:50:34 < dongs> lol allright
2019-02-19T05:51:13 < scrts> https://imgur.com/a/uLaXrZd
2019-02-19T05:51:31 < aandrew> reload that url for what I had to do to connect the diff pairs up so they could be used properly  though
2019-02-19T05:51:35 < englishman> so dongs
2019-02-19T05:51:40 < scrts> so U5C and U5D pins 39 & 57 will have which names?
2019-02-19T05:51:42 < R2COM> i have allergy on that altium schematics
2019-02-19T05:51:42 < englishman> had this iar project at 32k
2019-02-19T05:51:55 < englishman> ported to keil and v5 compiler, used microlib, 25k
2019-02-19T05:52:02 < englishman> with v6 compiler, 21k
2019-02-19T05:52:08 < dongs> scrts: you didn't name nets so
2019-02-19T05:52:12 < englishman> -O0 all builds
2019-02-19T05:52:33 < dongs> englishman: nice, lol IAR
2019-02-19T05:53:01 < englishman> its mostly reduction in library code
2019-02-19T05:53:08 < dongs> yeah no surprise
2019-02-19T05:53:09 < englishman> app code didnt shrink very much
2019-02-19T05:53:11 < dongs> microlib is decent
2019-02-19T05:53:13 < englishman> yea
2019-02-19T05:53:23 < dongs> like, float-using printf() uses less space htan newlib printf with integer only
2019-02-19T05:53:28 < dongs> now thats innovation
2019-02-19T05:53:35 < rajkosto> i want this innovation
2019-02-19T05:53:36 < englishman> sprintf is not that much smaller but sscanf is
2019-02-19T05:53:37 < scrts> dongs: well its named in the sheet: https://imgur.com/a/LPQ1sFZ
2019-02-19T05:53:43 < R2COM> dongs do you have plus, essential or professional Keil package?
2019-02-19T05:53:57 < dongs> R2COM: pro, cuz i'm pro
2019-02-19T05:53:58 < scrts> so not sure how to name
2019-02-19T05:54:04 < dongs> scrts: sync to layout and see
2019-02-19T05:54:11 < scrts> no footprints yet...
2019-02-19T05:54:18 < scrts> wouldn't ask then
2019-02-19T05:54:19 < scrts> :)
2019-02-19T05:54:26 < dongs> then worry when time comes
2019-02-19T05:54:32 < aandrew> reload https://imgur.com/a/VfZAOIH to see how I managed to get from a REPEAT(..) sheet with diff pairs to the FGPA
2019-02-19T05:54:46 < dongs> yeawh aandrew that looks fucking terrible
2019-02-19T05:54:47 < R2COM> dongs when you buy pro, is it perpetual forever? or if there is major version upgrade you need to buy full price again?
2019-02-19T05:54:58 < dongs> R2COM: its one year for udpates/support
2019-02-19T05:55:02 < englishman> repeat is very useful
2019-02-19T05:55:33 < aandrew> what's a year of keil pro cost anyway
2019-02-19T05:55:35 < englishman> why are you answering that retard's questions? he will just complain no matter what you say and never actually buy the shit
2019-02-19T05:55:52 < englishman> it was like 4.5k i think aandrew i got a quote this week
2019-02-19T05:55:53 < englishman> for pro
2019-02-19T05:56:07 < aandrew> englishman: that's not actually bad
2019-02-19T05:56:15 < aandrew> altium is like 3-5k too IIRC
2019-02-19T05:56:19 < englishman> yeah it was reasonable, the 1 year support kind of sucks
2019-02-19T05:56:25 < englishman> $800/year thereafter
2019-02-19T05:56:54 < englishman> 1 year is barely long enough for a project
2019-02-19T05:57:13 < aandrew> how often do you actually need something from them though
2019-02-19T05:57:14 < karlp> kicad+netbeans
2019-02-19T05:57:18 < R2COM> englishman why so much hostility, what did i do wrong to you?
2019-02-19T05:57:23 < karlp> 0 + 0/year 
2019-02-19T05:57:24 < dongs> im actually thinking of not renewing keil after 5.27 or whatver is out next month
2019-02-19T05:57:57 < dongs> am gonna miss the non-retarded linker stuff but like.... the GUI has gotten worse and worse over the years
2019-02-19T05:58:06 < dongs> debugger is barely usable
2019-02-19T05:58:11 < rajkosto> dont buy keil unless you have an obscure 8051 variant mcu that is only supported by keil, or lib files that are specifically for keil and closed source
2019-02-19T05:58:20 < englishman> what the shit are you talking about
2019-02-19T05:58:21 < dongs> 99% of the time if I need to do soemthing more complex than run and inspect one gvariable, ill be doing it in ozone
2019-02-19T05:58:53 < englishman> does ozone work with st-dink? i guess if you flash it with jlink?
2019-02-19T05:59:02 < aandrew> englishman: exactly
2019-02-19T05:59:06 < englishman> cool
2019-02-19T05:59:10 < aandrew> I flash all my stlinks with jlink
2019-02-19T05:59:25 < aandrew> but like I said I want to buy a few bmps and test, get back to roots so to speak
2019-02-19T05:59:28 < englishman> is there a j-link program equivalent to st-link utility
2019-02-19T05:59:34 < englishman> that is easy to use
2019-02-19T05:59:34 < dongs> to do what?
2019-02-19T05:59:39 < dongs> firmware update?
2019-02-19T05:59:40 < aandrew> not sure what that utiliy does
2019-02-19T05:59:45 < aandrew> there's JLinkExe
2019-02-19T05:59:51 < englishman> flashing, downloading, option bits
2019-02-19T05:59:51 < aandrew> you can inspect/flash/erase etc
2019-02-19T06:00:06 < englishman> without 500 pages of "setup"
2019-02-19T06:00:17 < englishman> and scrolling menus to find the mcu i'm using
2019-02-19T06:00:18 < englishman> ?
2019-02-19T06:00:32 < aandrew> none of my shit involves guis or scrolling
2019-02-19T06:00:44 < englishman> that's not good
2019-02-19T06:00:50 < aandrew> I mean to erase or set option bits you'll probably write a half dozen line "script" that writes to the regs to do it
2019-02-19T06:00:50 < englishman> why is there no gui
2019-02-19T06:01:04 < aandrew> englishman: you can use JFlash which is a gui for flashing and I think option its
2019-02-19T06:01:07 < aandrew> bits
2019-02-19T06:03:21 < scrts> aandrew: uff that's kind of ugly
2019-02-19T06:03:27 < aandrew> scrts: yep
2019-02-19T06:03:31 < scrts> but at least it works
2019-02-19T06:03:33 < aandrew> scrts: like I said, altium's repeat is retarded
2019-02-19T06:03:47 < aandrew> it ONLY appends to the net name/sheet name, and because of that it fucks up diff pairs
2019-02-19T06:03:54 < aandrew> hence that interconnect page
2019-02-19T06:04:00 < aandrew> took me a bloody long time to figure that out
2019-02-19T06:04:03 < aandrew> just trying rando shit
2019-02-19T06:04:36 < karlp> anything worht looking at in the scroll back?
2019-02-19T06:04:37 < aandrew> and the "altium sucks" on the first image is because altium couldn't figure out how to link those two harnesses as one
2019-02-19T06:04:47 < aandrew> karlp: no, not a single cat pic or brexit meme
2019-02-19T06:05:04 < karlp> wat?!
2019-02-19T06:05:06 < karlp> boo hiss
2019-02-19T06:05:32 < aandrew> in fact I thnk my brexit meme pic was the last one
2019-02-19T06:05:35 < aandrew> that's kind of depressing
2019-02-19T06:05:45 < karlp> or relaxing and pleasing :)
2019-02-19T06:07:18 < aandrew> so
2019-02-19T06:07:28 < aandrew> I'm watching all the  batman movies
2019-02-19T06:07:32 < aandrew> er "modern" batman movies
2019-02-19T06:07:57 < aandrew> batman begins sucked. dark knight is the only good one so far, dark knight returns is dumb
2019-02-19T06:09:46 < karlp> taking kidshhhhhhhhnh
2019-02-19T06:09:49 < karlp> `kkkkkkkkkkkkhhhhhhhhh
2019-02-19T06:10:04 < dongs> you know the worst one?
2019-02-19T06:10:06 < dongs> lego batman
2019-02-19T06:10:11 < dongs> fucking cringe shit right there
2019-02-19T06:11:03 < R2COM> dongs if you dont update that soft after 5.27 what would be tradeoff?
2019-02-19T06:11:22 < dongs> i would switch to something else anyway
2019-02-19T06:11:25 < R2COM> afterall its all working and no new Mx is out which your current version doesnt support, rite?
2019-02-19T06:11:28 < dongs> right now i just use keil to compile and as a text editor
2019-02-19T06:11:31 < aandrew> what would you switch to
2019-02-19T06:11:32 < dongs> it kinda sucks at both
2019-02-19T06:11:36 < R2COM> switch??
2019-02-19T06:11:43 < R2COM> to what??
2019-02-19T06:11:50 < R2COM> i thought you loved keil?
2019-02-19T06:11:56 < dongs> maybe visualgdb and/or makefiles
2019-02-19T06:12:04 < R2COM> you trolling rite
2019-02-19T06:12:06 < R2COM> lol
2019-02-19T06:12:15 < dongs> they're not making improvements that are worth  the contract maintenance price
2019-02-19T06:12:19 < dongs> they just keep making it slower
2019-02-19T06:12:26 < R2COM> what is contract maintenance price?
2019-02-19T06:12:28 < dongs> i don't use and don't plan to use packs or RTX stuff
2019-02-19T06:12:38 < dongs> i don't use cube or the shitty projects it autogens
2019-02-19T06:13:18 < dongs> R2COM: it was mentioned earlier.
2019-02-19T06:14:02 < R2COM> ozone + what for compiler?
2019-02-19T06:14:28 < dongs> gcc or clang
2019-02-19T06:14:31 < englishman> it was pretty frustrating porting that iar shit to keil
2019-02-19T06:14:39 < rajkosto> just use anything eclipse based + openocd works fine
2019-02-19T06:14:39 < englishman> it wanted to link with timecube SO BAD
2019-02-19T06:14:47 < R2COM> but isnt gcc making bigger excutables than Keil, dongs ?
2019-02-19T06:14:55 < englishman> took like 10mins to figure out how to make it a "standalone" project
2019-02-19T06:15:01 < englishman> until then it just wouldnt compile
2019-02-19T06:15:40 < englishman> also you cant use the free m0 license and free 32k limit license at the same time
2019-02-19T06:15:44 < englishman> you have to edit TEXTFILES
2019-02-19T06:15:46 < englishman> basically lunix
2019-02-19T06:15:57 < rajkosto> timecube you say ? http://timecube.2enp.com/
2019-02-19T06:16:58 < dongs> englishman: wait you swtiched from free 32k iar to free 32k keil cuz IAR ran out of space? haha
2019-02-19T06:19:16 < bitmask> I think I'm expecting too much from this kind of labeler: https://i.imgur.com/ZuMKpBe.jpg
2019-02-19T06:20:01 < bitmask> might have to drop the package icon but the rest will do
2019-02-19T06:20:06 < aandrew> englishman> it was pretty frustrating porting that iar shit to keil
2019-02-19T06:20:07 < aandrew> I bet
2019-02-19T06:20:39 < englishman> dongs: yes
2019-02-19T06:20:45 < englishman> aandrew: idk it was like 30min total
2019-02-19T06:21:01 < aandrew> bitmask: that is pretty low res
2019-02-19T06:21:11 < englishman> including changing all the proprietary iar intrinsics
2019-02-19T06:21:31 < bitmask> I knew it would be, just wanted to see what was possible
2019-02-19T06:23:06 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-CDSENET-E32-TTL-1W-7500m-1W-SX1278-SX1276-LoRa-433MHz-long-range-rf-transceiver/32791508935.html are they afraid of showing the actual product pics ? why 3d models
2019-02-19T06:26:31 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
2019-02-19T06:26:31 < R2COM> dongs so you ok trading code size for better GUI and stuff with your ide?
2019-02-19T06:26:47 -!- [7] [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-19T06:26:47 < R2COM> or gcc became much better and difference is not much
2019-02-19T06:27:14 < rajkosto> gcc -Os --function-sections --data-sections is fine
2019-02-19T06:27:22 < aandrew> yep
2019-02-19T06:27:35 < R2COM> so you say just -Ox it and get smaller code?
2019-02-19T06:27:44 < aandrew> yep
2019-02-19T06:27:47 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-19T06:28:18 < dongs> newlib is still garbage
2019-02-19T06:28:23 < aandrew> screw with SIMD/FP options
2019-02-19T06:28:32 < aandrew> but most times the defaults are good
2019-02-19T06:28:46 < aandrew> there are bunch of vfp options
2019-02-19T06:28:47 < rajkosto> the -- should be --f forget it each time but yes
2019-02-19T06:28:57 < rajkosto> or simply dont use floats ever and compile printf without float support
2019-02-19T06:29:14 < R2COM> so, one option is to get that VisualGDB + ozone ?
2019-02-19T06:29:19 < rajkosto> (pointless if mcu has hard-float)
2019-02-19T06:29:28 < rajkosto> VisualGDB has OpenOCD integration you dont need separate debugging stuff
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2019-02-19T06:29:50 < dongs> yeah but lol openocd
2019-02-19T06:29:51 < karlp> (netbeans...)
2019-02-19T06:29:51 < dongs> no fucking thanks
2019-02-19T06:29:53 < R2COM> does ozone offer more in terms of debugging than visualGDB/openocd ?
2019-02-19T06:30:01 < dongs> yeah ozone is great for debug
2019-02-19T06:30:05 < R2COM> k
2019-02-19T06:30:09 < rajkosto> its by segger and dongs probably has a LEGIT segger cuz he's pro that way
2019-02-19T06:30:14 < karlp> but yeah, you're having the same conversation with aretoo again, it will never fucking change a thing in their world.
2019-02-19T06:30:22 < dongs> rajkosto: i do, i have the legit ULTRA segger
2019-02-19T06:30:31 < dongs> its pretty amaze
2019-02-19T06:30:35 < aandrew> I've got 5 legit seggers and a shitload that are legit but stuck to eval boards
2019-02-19T06:30:50 < rajkosto> ive had no problesm with OpenOCD and VisualGDB or OpenOCD with gcc mcu arm eclipse
2019-02-19T06:31:16 < aandrew> a plus, two or three base and a couple of hte jlink lites they don't make anymore
2019-02-19T06:31:40 < aandrew> openocd/stlink/ftdi always fuck up when I've finally isolated a bug and want to poke around
2019-02-19T06:31:48 < aandrew> they desync or otherwise fail and it's rage inducing
2019-02-19T06:31:56 < aandrew> I'm inclined to belive it's the hardware and not openocd though
2019-02-19T06:32:06 < rajkosto> never had that and i use it with a ft2232h over JTAG not swd
2019-02-19T06:32:10 < rajkosto> maybe swd is problematic 
2019-02-19T06:32:29 < karlp> stlinks give me wayyyy less issue sthan they yused to.
2019-02-19T06:32:39 < karlp> it's almost like 30 something fw revisions have made fixes or something :)
2019-02-19T06:32:54 < aandrew> heh I haven't used a stlink in probably 6y
2019-02-19T06:32:58 < R2COM> stm32 workbench with stlink sometimes gets stuck and hangs when i do repeated runs, so you restart process and its ok... i guess its kinda clunky, but workable maybe
2019-02-19T06:33:40 < dongs> i see no purpose for workbench really.
2019-02-19T06:33:41 < dongs> its just eclipse.
2019-02-19T06:33:47 < dongs> and therefore aids.
2019-02-19T06:33:48 < rajkosto> so is atollic truestodio
2019-02-19T06:33:51 < aandrew> ^^ exactly
2019-02-19T06:33:52 < rajkosto> is that what they renamed to workbench
2019-02-19T06:34:00 < rajkosto> cuz st made truestudio free for stm32 before that
2019-02-19T06:34:03 < aandrew> anywwwway bedtime for this pro
2019-02-19T06:34:04 < R2COM> it is eclipse yes...
2019-02-19T06:34:05 < aandrew> later
2019-02-19T06:34:17 < rajkosto> R2COM, just use gcc mcu arm eclipse then
2019-02-19T06:34:22 < dongs> リマインダー: Webセミナー「Altium Designer 19 新機能 Webセミナー」は、本日、2019年2月19日(火) 14:00 - 15:00 (JST) 開催です。
2019-02-19T06:34:27 < dongs> yall wanna see new features in altidumb19
2019-02-19T06:34:34 < dongs> join free web seminar in 30 mins
2019-02-19T06:34:35 < rajkosto> in japonese ?
2019-02-19T06:34:37 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-19T06:34:44 < rajkosto> how understand moon speak
2019-02-19T06:34:46 < dongs> im sure it will be hilarious watching the jap poke around shit
2019-02-19T06:34:48 < dongs> you wont need to
2019-02-19T06:34:56 < dongs> https://zoom.us/j/286802373
2019-02-19T06:35:07 < dongs> warning: need proprietary software to join meeting
2019-02-19T06:35:16 < rajkosto> RICHARD STALLMAN IS NOT PLEASED
2019-02-19T06:35:50 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_05-35-44_cVK1pKoSt.png this is the same shit that fuckin malware websites do
2019-02-19T06:36:13 < R2COM> lol
2019-02-19T06:36:31 < karlp> luvverly new china dev fpgas https://www.seeedstudio.com/Sipeed-TANG-PriMER-FPGA-Development-Board-p-2881.html?utm_source=mailchimp&utm_medium=edm&utm_campaign=bazaar_0214
2019-02-19T06:37:45 < rajkosto> dongs, what kind of spyware did this just install
2019-02-19T06:37:57 < karlp> rajkosto: no, stm32 workbench is what they paid some useless italians to do, repackaging eclipse badly.
2019-02-19T06:38:11 < rajkosto> what did they do with atollic which worked fine but again was just eclipse
2019-02-19T06:38:13 < dongs> rajkosto: ZOOM MEETINGS CLIENT
2019-02-19T06:38:22 < karlp> it was so badly done that they eventually boguth atollic so they could give away their not quite as sucky, but still fairly suckful eclipse repackaign
2019-02-19T06:38:30 < dongs> rajkosto: stm32studio was separatre from atoolic shit, just some abandoned STM thing that they did fof ree
2019-02-19T06:38:39 < dongs> now that atollic is free I suspect its just unmaintained shit
2019-02-19T06:38:50 < rajkosto> why the hell is R2COM mentioning it then
2019-02-19T06:38:53 < karlp> well, they "bought" atollic, but yeah, let's see what happens.
2019-02-19T06:38:55 < karlp> fuck aretoo
2019-02-19T06:39:05 < karlp> who cares wat that nutter thinks
2019-02-19T06:39:06 < dongs> rajkosto: donno hes autisming over useless shit as usual
2019-02-19T06:39:07 < R2COM> fuck off im not mentioning it im just exploring
2019-02-19T06:39:18 < R2COM> im seeing the opinions
2019-02-19T06:39:30 < dongs> opinion = its ecelipse and you shouldnt be using it
2019-02-19T06:39:31 < karlp> just like the last five times you had this conversation
2019-02-19T06:39:37 < R2COM> im not saying its good, i know it probably sucks and not that pro
2019-02-19T06:39:42 < dongs> if you WANT to use eclipse,m just use raw fucking eclipse + gnu-arm-gcc + openocd
2019-02-19T06:39:47 < dongs> all these bullshit vendor forks add zero value
2019-02-19T06:39:50 < rajkosto> use the one i linked
2019-02-19T06:39:54 < rajkosto> its the easiest one
2019-02-19T06:39:56 < karlp> go back to orcad or something
2019-02-19T06:40:21 < R2COM> rajkosto visualgdb?
2019-02-19T06:40:27 < rajkosto> if you wanna pay
2019-02-19T06:40:35 < R2COM> pay? but thjat one is cheap
2019-02-19T06:40:45 < dongs> its liek $99? seems reasonable
2019-02-19T06:40:48 < rajkosto> <rajkosto> https://gnu-mcu-eclipse.github.io/ if free eclipse is what you are ok with
2019-02-19T06:41:03 < rajkosto> no need to get locked into atollic/stm32/other vendors eclipse
2019-02-19T06:41:13 < R2COM> right.. no i wont use eclipse
2019-02-19T06:41:19 < rajkosto> why not
2019-02-19T06:41:31 < R2COM> dunno? more people here say its shit
2019-02-19T06:41:44 < rajkosto> cuz you can use vs with visualgdb
2019-02-19T06:42:03 < rajkosto> but its not that bad compared to keil/iar
2019-02-19T06:42:26 < dongs> Lol riscv
2019-02-19T06:42:29 < dongs> is anyone seriously using that
2019-02-19T06:42:36 < rajkosto> stick it in a fpga
2019-02-19T06:42:36 < rajkosto> why not
2019-02-19T06:42:58 < rajkosto> also dont bother with xPack, instead just get all the tools and place them in a dir without spaces
2019-02-19T06:43:04 < rajkosto> then point gcc arm mcu eclipse to them
2019-02-19T06:43:08 < rajkosto> in Tools->Preferences
2019-02-19T06:43:21 < R2COM> dongs $99 is minimal version, the full (custom) is $189 
2019-02-19T06:43:56 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_05-43-44_IK3IwU3Tl.png https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_05-43-49_NQFEV5IOO.png https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_05-43-54_UylD5NXDN.png
2019-02-19T06:44:08 < rajkosto> or https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_05-44-05_QlGwxuAhu.png for j-link
2019-02-19T06:44:42 < rajkosto> karlp, is this TANG something like PENG ?
2019-02-19T06:44:43 < dongs> nice.
2019-02-19T06:44:57 < dongs> out of hte box work wiht segger sounds liek a win
2019-02-19T06:44:59 < dongs> i might give it a try
2019-02-19T06:45:01 < dongs> still eclipse tho
2019-02-19T06:45:07 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-19T06:45:15 < rajkosto> but replace the keyboard shortcuts with normal human ones and its not so bad
2019-02-19T06:45:49 < R2COM> um... if i install VisualGDB does it have those autocomplete shit and all that stuff?
2019-02-19T06:46:00 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-19T06:46:06 < R2COM> also, what about selecting any stm32Fx target device etc?
2019-02-19T06:46:09 < R2COM> that too?
2019-02-19T06:46:10 < rajkosto> the eclipse has autocomplete too
2019-02-19T06:46:16 < rajkosto> and ctrl click and it works
2019-02-19T06:46:19 < rajkosto> most of the time
2019-02-19T06:46:27 < karlp> rajkosto: depends, what's peng?
2019-02-19T06:46:36 < dongs> R2, visualgdb is literally just visual studio 2017 + mcu extensions
2019-02-19T06:46:42 < dongs> so it has all the same features of vstudio
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2019-02-19T06:46:45 < R2COM> yeah i see it now
2019-02-19T06:46:46 < rajkosto> karlp, there's always peng
2019-02-19T06:49:13 < R2COM> dongs so VisualGDB + ozone, sounds alright?
2019-02-19T06:49:42 < R2COM> (visualgdb just for build then + interface)
2019-02-19T06:49:56 < rajkosto> you dont need to use ozone at all
2019-02-19T06:50:04 < rajkosto> its just dongs using it cuz his IDE is keil which sucks
2019-02-19T06:50:44 -!- fc5dc9d4 [~quassel@p5B081633.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
2019-02-19T06:51:03 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-19T06:51:05 < R2COM> ok
2019-02-19T06:51:08 < R2COM> will try
2019-02-19T06:51:19 < rajkosto> just start with gcc mcu arm eclipse and see how it works
2019-02-19T06:51:45 < R2COM> i already have stm32 eclipse... dont wanna go to another (vanilla) eclipse
2019-02-19T06:51:52 < rajkosto> its better
2019-02-19T06:54:18 < rajkosto> karlp, 
2019-02-19T06:54:18 < rajkosto> SDRAM: Built-in 32bit bit width 64MBit its in the fpga ?
2019-02-19T06:59:09 < rajkosto> dongs, japonese has started
2019-02-19T07:00:37 < rajkosto> SOREDEWA DESUNE
2019-02-19T07:00:38 < dongs> yes
2019-02-19T07:01:54 < dongs> god damn he sucks at talking
2019-02-19T07:02:03 < rajkosto> why listening to moonspeak
2019-02-19T07:02:04 < dongs> 80% noise to 20% content
2019-02-19T07:03:50 < rajkosto> why did you link this when most people wouldnt be able to understand it
2019-02-19T07:04:12 < dongs> i just wanna see him blindly poke into altium UI
2019-02-19T07:04:18 < dongs> now its just boring shit powerpoint
2019-02-19T07:04:26 < dongs> ive been to a few of their web and real meetings
2019-02-19T07:04:27 < dongs> they're so boring
2019-02-19T07:04:31 < dongs> they have like no idae 
2019-02-19T07:04:33 < dongs> how to altium
2019-02-19T07:04:40 < dongs> and these are supposed to be people who sell it
2019-02-19T07:04:54 < rajkosto> just watch fedevel on youtube poke around it
2019-02-19T07:05:14 < dongs> he actually knows what hes doing tho
2019-02-19T07:05:20 < rajkosto> reibrary fairu
2019-02-19T07:06:15 < dongs> ahah
2019-02-19T07:06:17 < dongs> he fucked something up
2019-02-19T07:06:56 < dongs> fuck
2019-02-19T07:07:00 < dongs> gross gray color
2019-02-19T07:07:07 < rajkosto> thats the default
2019-02-19T07:07:08 < rajkosto> i use it
2019-02-19T07:07:16 < dongs> 5 clicks to permanently get rid of it
2019-02-19T07:07:21 < dongs> absolutely unusable gray on gray shite
2019-02-19T07:07:34 < rajkosto> low contrast == easier on the eyes obviously
2019-02-19T07:07:41 < dongs> are you retarded
2019-02-19T07:07:46 < dongs> how is gray on gray easier to see
2019-02-19T07:07:50 < dongs> than black on white
2019-02-19T07:07:55 < rajkosto> dont want to be blasted by white 
2019-02-19T07:08:13 < dongs> haha, using mouse w/menus
2019-02-19T07:08:19 < rajkosto> great his UI is in japanese so i dont even know what he's clicking
2019-02-19T07:08:26 < rajkosto> he has to, otherwise you wouldnt know what he's pressing
2019-02-19T07:08:31 < dongs> the keys are under ( )
2019-02-19T07:08:33 < dongs> same hotkeys
2019-02-19T07:08:46 < dongs> haha, in stackup mode there's File/Edit/View/Tools
2019-02-19T07:09:07 < dongs> looks like impedance shit didnt get translated
2019-02-19T07:09:11 -!- fenugrec [~fenugrec@thsnmb0123w-ds01-215-201.dynamic.bellmts.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
2019-02-19T07:09:17 < rajkosto> i left, this is pointless
2019-02-19T07:10:07 < dongs> i can understand, and its still pointless
2019-02-19T07:11:51 < dongs> 5 minutes to explain that there's a function to calculate trace width based on stackup and entered impedance number
2019-02-19T07:13:13 < dongs> what the hell
2019-02-19T07:13:25 < dongs> 'i wanna explain the previous shit EVEN MROE SIMPLER'
2019-02-19T07:13:28 < dongs> shit was already simple as fuck
2019-02-19T07:17:29 < dongs> hahah 
2019-02-19T07:17:37 < dongs> hes using the stupid fucking menu that i disable
2019-02-19T07:17:39 < rajkosto> the impedance calculator was there since like 13
2019-02-19T07:17:55 < dongs> hmm what key is that
2019-02-19T07:17:59 < dongs> oh, ctrl+l ehj
2019-02-19T07:18:42 < dongs> hmm thats ok i guess
2019-02-19T07:18:45 < dongs> i never used that
2019-02-19T07:21:39 < R2COM> hah
2019-02-19T07:25:28 < dongs> haha hes totally failing it
2019-02-19T07:26:07 < dongs> haha
2019-02-19T07:27:07 < rajkosto> strange flex
2019-02-19T07:27:45 < dongs> aahah
2019-02-19T07:27:48 < dongs> it doesnt take diff width
2019-02-19T07:31:00 < dongs> ohh, thats kinda nice
2019-02-19T07:31:02 -!- boB_K7IQ [boB_K7IQ@c-73-193-6-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
2019-02-19T07:31:24 < rajkosto> tonight in #stm32, dongs talks to a wall
2019-02-19T07:31:42 < dongs> hey that IS nice
2019-02-19T07:31:45 < dongs> follow the guide mode
2019-02-19T07:31:48 < dongs> for routing
2019-02-19T07:32:30 < dongs> ctrl+shift+f while routing
2019-02-19T07:32:31 < dongs> pt
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2019-02-19T07:32:42 < dongs> if your outline is round or weird shape, really helps
2019-02-19T07:36:46 -!- [7] [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
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2019-02-19T07:38:31 < dongs> oh my, you can individually mark vias/pads for thermal relief
2019-02-19T07:43:07 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/GzQfPgq.jpg
2019-02-19T07:43:09 < bitmask> now thats a label
2019-02-19T07:50:04 < rajkosto> dongs, i thought you knew this since you had 19
2019-02-19T07:50:17 < rajkosto> shows up pretty clearly every time you click a via
2019-02-19T07:51:55 -!- bitmask [~bitmask@pool-100-35-68-83.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Gone to sleep...]
2019-02-19T07:52:00 < dongs> rajkosto: individual thermals?
2019-02-19T07:52:05 < dongs> well, i just default all vias to dirrect
2019-02-19T07:52:08 < dongs> in DR
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2019-02-19T08:54:40 < tjq> Steffanx: is laurence alright, do you know?
2019-02-19T08:55:40 < rajkosto> he was never alright
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2019-02-19T10:04:03 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-19_09-02-24_P82t97iXN.png
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2019-02-19T10:46:24 < jadew> sup?
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2019-02-19T11:10:38 < Steffanx> Hes dead tjq 
2019-02-19T11:31:31 < dongs> dongs
2019-02-19T11:36:08 < rajkosto> like a pokemon, he can only say his own name
2019-02-19T11:37:30 < tjq> voltage
2019-02-19T11:38:17 < jadew> wth are pokemons?
2019-02-19T11:38:20 < jadew> what do they do?
2019-02-19T11:38:32 < rajkosto> i dunno its some kids thing
2019-02-19T11:38:44 < tjq> pokemons give children autism
2019-02-19T11:38:47 < tjq> that's what they do
2019-02-19T11:39:56 < tjq> basically japan's revenge for the hiroshima bomb
2019-02-19T11:40:55 < tjq> and by injured they really meant touched up
2019-02-19T11:41:14 < jadew> they made a lot of fuss about that app, I remember too
2019-02-19T11:41:24 < jadew> it was all a publicity ploy I bet
2019-02-19T11:41:53 < jadew> because nobody I know gives a shit about pokemon
2019-02-19T11:41:58 < jadew> or knows what that is
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2019-02-19T11:42:10 < tjq> nobody gives a shit about pokemon
2019-02-19T11:43:04 < jadew> my only contact with that was once in highschool, when I heard some 5th graders scream "pokemoon!" while running
2019-02-19T11:43:33 < jadew> I remember I looked at my friend and said something along the lines of "wtf is that?"
2019-02-19T11:43:48 < jadew> I guess it's one of those things... I'll never know what it is
2019-02-19T11:44:04 < jadew> 20 years later and I'm still wondering
2019-02-19T11:45:33 < jadew> I must have been 17 yo when that happened
2019-02-19T11:45:38 < jadew> I'm 34 now
2019-02-19T11:46:04 < jadew> so.. 17 years ago
2019-02-19T11:46:42 < jadew> damn... time flies
2019-02-19T11:47:27 < jadew> that's also about the time when I met my wife
2019-02-19T11:47:51 < jadew> (and many other chicks)
2019-02-19T11:47:53 < jadew> great times
2019-02-19T11:48:18 < tjq> do you remember the penis chick?
2019-02-19T11:48:56 < jadew> actually, I got hit on by two gay dudes in a parc once
2019-02-19T11:49:55 < jadew> they were looking for a 3rd person
2019-02-19T11:50:10 < jadew> lol
2019-02-19T11:50:18 < jadew> your story sounds more interesting
2019-02-19T11:50:25 < jadew> what do you mean by close encounter?
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2019-02-19T11:52:59 < jadew> and what happened?
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2019-02-19T11:53:24 < jadew> ah... that's nothing
2019-02-19T11:53:49 < jadew> when I was called to enroll into the army, I had to travel to another city by train
2019-02-19T11:54:09 < jadew> and had a connection in some city, where I had to wait for several hours (at night)
2019-02-19T11:54:28 < jadew> it was winter, the train station stinked, so I went on a walk
2019-02-19T11:54:55 < jadew> after a while I find myself with some older dude next to me
2019-02-19T11:54:57 < jadew> shorter too
2019-02-19T11:55:12 < jadew> starting a conversation with me...
2019-02-19T11:55:28 < jadew> (if you can't tell, by this point it was already weird - it must have been 2 am)
2019-02-19T11:55:52 < jadew> anyway, he asks me what I'm doing, where I'm going etc
2019-02-19T11:56:30 < jadew> makes some jokes about all the recruits being naked in front of the nurses and somehow mentions everyone's dicks
2019-02-19T11:56:48 < jadew> anyway, I head back towards the station, trying to lose this guy
2019-02-19T11:57:59 < jadew> and when we get close to station he says "wanna go there with me?" pointing towards the entrance of a building
2019-02-19T11:58:18 < jadew> I said no, but now I wish I asked "why?"
2019-02-19T11:58:30 < jadew> because I'm curious what he was thinking about
2019-02-19T11:58:43 < Ecco> well he most likely wanted to trade you some Pokemon cards
2019-02-19T11:58:48 < jadew> haha
2019-02-19T12:02:44 < jadew> I guess they have to be like that, considering only 5-6% of the population is gay
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2019-02-19T12:32:11 < Sadale> wow. Is it that high?
2019-02-19T12:32:34 < jadew> the percentage?
2019-02-19T12:32:39 < Cracki> "cruising". that's what you do when no gay club lets you in.
2019-02-19T12:32:52 < Cracki> or when the clubs are too prudish
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2019-02-19T12:38:47 < Cracki> also, gays only do that as long as it's safe. in germany they stopped that because the recent "enrichment" would beat them to a bloody pulp
2019-02-19T12:40:17 < Steffanx> Haohmaru / jadew: its 1 pokemon, 2 pokemon. Not 2 pokemons
2019-02-19T12:40:26 < PaulFertser> Is it really _that_ dangerous on German streets nowadays? You can just seriously beat someone and get away with it?
2019-02-19T12:40:41 < jadew> Steffanx, thanks
2019-02-19T12:40:43 < Steffanx> Yw
2019-02-19T12:40:51 < Steffanx> Lolno, hater.
2019-02-19T12:41:06 < Steffanx> I just happen to know this
2019-02-19T12:42:33 < Steffanx> Hows your day Haohmaru 
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2019-02-19T13:11:41 < Steffanx> Can you evun nurmal inglish Haohmaru ?
2019-02-19T13:13:06 < Steffanx> What the hell is dolan
2019-02-19T13:13:57 < Steffanx> I guess i missed that
2019-02-19T13:14:12 < englishman> you didnt miss anything
2019-02-19T13:14:49 < jadew> speaking of guys with a nickname that starts with H... is that paki guy still visiting this channel?
2019-02-19T13:15:00 < Steffanx> Who?
2019-02-19T13:15:05 < tjq> you mean kakimir ?
2019-02-19T13:15:05 < jadew> Hamilton I think?
2019-02-19T13:15:12 < Steffanx> He was irania ln
2019-02-19T13:15:15 < Steffanx> Iranian
2019-02-19T13:15:22 < jadew> right
2019-02-19T13:16:35 < rajkosto> yay my JST PH cables have arrived from CN faster than the pcbs i need to use them for simply because pcbs got delayed by customs 13 days now
2019-02-19T13:17:15 < tjq> Haohmaru: are you replacing blxtr?
2019-02-19T13:17:40 < jadew> lol, that's some crazy shit
2019-02-19T13:18:16 < Steffanx> Time for your waaam video tjq
2019-02-19T13:18:31 < tjq> you post it
2019-02-19T13:18:52 < jadew> here's some feel good music & video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL5A4H8QJH8
2019-02-19T13:19:00 < jadew> the edit is great
2019-02-19T13:19:28 < tjq> kkmr
2019-02-19T13:20:50 < tjq> kakinigger would match too
2019-02-19T13:21:51 < jadew> adaptability
2019-02-19T13:24:29 < kakimir> what hair
2019-02-19T13:24:52 < Steffanx> Kakihair
2019-02-19T13:26:44 < karlp> PaulFertser: you should know better than to believe cracki's absolutism
2019-02-19T13:26:49 < mawk> I didn't get to plead at my trial
2019-02-19T13:27:04 < mawk> the court president was pissed at other lawyers taking too long
2019-02-19T13:27:11 < mawk> so she didn't want to hear my lawyer
2019-02-19T13:27:18 < mawk> the deliberate is set to may
2019-02-19T13:28:18 < PaulFertser> karlp: well, my last time in Germany I didn't notice any street violence but it was ~10y ago so I thought something might have changed by now.
2019-02-19T13:29:37 < Steffanx> Aaawh mawk 
2019-02-19T13:29:42 < BrainDamage> trial about?
2019-02-19T13:29:42 < Steffanx> Judge judy
2019-02-19T13:30:34 < Steffanx> He doesnt want to leave his house
2019-02-19T13:31:56 < mawk> I just want a delay and no fine
2019-02-19T13:32:07 < mawk> since I pay my rent in due time
2019-02-19T13:33:06 < mawk> funny thing, the maniac neighbor that told the owner company I had no rent contract stopped paying her rent
2019-02-19T13:34:25 < mawk> and she gave the keys to the one neighbor that hit me
2019-02-19T13:34:46 < mawk> and he comes in the appartment and drill holes in the ground to piss me off
2019-02-19T13:34:54 < mawk> France is great you see
2019-02-19T13:36:28 < jadew> we know, there's a reason french people are so well regarded all over the world
2019-02-19T13:37:55 < jadew> the germs have the most flattering stereotype
2019-02-19T13:38:14 < jadew> hard working and they make high quality stuff
2019-02-19T13:38:20 < jadew> germans
2019-02-19T13:39:11 < mawk> but no humor
2019-02-19T13:39:51 < jadew> ja
2019-02-19T13:41:39 < jadew> I don't get it tho, what exactly did you do?
2019-02-19T13:41:46 < jadew> and how come your landlord didn't know what's up with you?
2019-02-19T13:43:20 < jadew> in here the landlord gets a fine if you don't have a contract
2019-02-19T13:52:23 < Cracki> somebody said germans
2019-02-19T13:52:50 < Cracki> germans drink beer from a Maßkrug and have a Dackel dog
2019-02-19T13:53:46 < Cracki> it's true, most germans lack any kind of normal humor. forget about delivering jokes in english, just woosh.
2019-02-19T13:56:36 < Cracki> PaulFertser, get away with it? definitely! we aren't an orwellian surveillance state like london, but some districts are straight up ghettos. nobody didn't see nothing.
2019-02-19T13:57:20 < Cracki> you have to watch when and where you hold hands with a dude, or the enrichment approaches you for a little chat, if you know what I mean
2019-02-19T13:57:32 < mawk> jadew I inherited the appartement from a deceased grandma, but because I didn't live with her during her last year I don't inherit the contract
2019-02-19T13:57:44 < mawk> since it's a subsidized appartement the law is strict
2019-02-19T13:57:55 < jadew> mawk, I see
2019-02-19T13:58:06 < jadew> and why did the neighbours care?
2019-02-19T13:58:14 < mawk> because she wanted to harm me
2019-02-19T13:58:40 < mawk> because I asked her to stop making high heels sounds at 3 am
2019-02-19T13:58:43 < PaulFertser> Cracki: so do they beat to death?
2019-02-19T13:58:47 < mawk> or something like this
2019-02-19T13:59:02 < Cracki> nah, that'd be real trouble. they just make you suffer. death wouldn't be suffering.
2019-02-19T13:59:08 < jadew> mawk, sounds like a classy gal
2019-02-19T13:59:15 < Cracki> everything's just peachy as long as there are no bodies.
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2019-02-19T14:00:19 < Cracki> murder would be *work*. violence is meant to terrorize. it's a power play. killing people kills the "things" you wield your power over.
2019-02-19T14:00:19 < PaulFertser> Cracki: but if they do beat, then you can initiate a criminal investigation and if you remember the face the police is supposed to find the offender etc.
2019-02-19T14:00:32 < Cracki> haha, such investigations find nothing, regularly.
2019-02-19T14:00:41 < Cracki> single digit percentage of cases are solved.
2019-02-19T14:01:02 < Cracki> you'll become a file in a cabinet.
2019-02-19T14:01:29 < PaulFertser> I can't read german so I have no idea how to find statistics in support of your claim.
2019-02-19T14:01:57 < Cracki> "PKS" https://www.bka.de/DE/AktuelleInformationen/StatistikenLagebilder/PolizeilicheKriminalstatistik/pks_node.html
2019-02-19T14:02:47 < Cracki> also remember lots of incidents are simply not reported. when I showed up at the police station to report my little "encounter", either I was the first, or they wouldn't admit to anything.
2019-02-19T14:03:06 < Cracki> Wasserwerfernen!
2019-02-19T14:03:19 < jadew> Cracki, what encounter did you have?
2019-02-19T14:03:49 < jadew> you got assaulted?
2019-02-19T14:03:55 < Cracki> walking with my then-bf, passing a hookah bar with appropriate wildlife lingering in front of it.
2019-02-19T14:04:02 < PaulFertser> Cracki: if you had some health harm you went to a hospital and then any serious incident is supposed to automatically lead to an investigation as harming people is an offense against the state (in other words, criminal offense).
2019-02-19T14:04:46 < Cracki> one of them was looking for trouble, bumped into me, then went like "watch where you're going, do you want trouble"
2019-02-19T14:04:52 < Cracki> run of the mill bullying
2019-02-19T14:05:35 < Cracki> funny enough, his compatriots didn't feel like having to deal with his shit
2019-02-19T14:05:51 < Cracki> also I suspect there was a surveillance camera at that intersection...
2019-02-19T14:06:50 < Cracki> I must have a guardian angel or something, never actually got beaten up, never broke a bone, no surgery for anything
2019-02-19T14:07:49 < Cracki> shit like this is what tells people they aren't safe. it's not a feeling. it's literally tangible.
2019-02-19T14:08:42 < Cracki> he only let me go when I made enough noise to attract eyes
2019-02-19T14:08:51 < Cracki> I know demons exist :P
2019-02-19T14:09:04 < Cracki> hookah bar
2019-02-19T14:09:11 < Cracki> yus
2019-02-19T14:09:13 < PaulFertser> Are you feeling safe riding in traffic?
2019-02-19T14:09:42 < Cracki> in public transportation? all our busses have cameras.
2019-02-19T14:09:47 < Cracki> so... kinda.
2019-02-19T14:09:48 < PaulFertser> No, pushbike or motorbike.
2019-02-19T14:09:59 < Cracki> we aren't NL
2019-02-19T14:10:28 < Cracki> germoney has some decent bicycle lanes separate from car lanes, but often enough you share the road
2019-02-19T14:10:32 < PaulFertser> I mean riding on two wheels with cars around you.
2019-02-19T14:10:50 < Cracki> they're mandated to keep a minimum distance so that's good...
2019-02-19T14:11:23 < Cracki> I used to bike a lot more back home, where the terrain was flat and we had dedicated bicycle/pedestrian paths beside rivers and stuff
2019-02-19T14:11:35 < Cracki> here, inclinations everywhere
2019-02-19T14:12:21 < Cracki> they try to push electric bicycles. the meager supply is overkill compared to the nonexistent demand
2019-02-19T14:14:16 < Cracki> diversity = race war. simple equation. most innocuous example: bavaria and its at least three different tribes of aborigines. it's all in good spirit, but on the edge of being mean.
2019-02-19T14:16:32 < Cracki> identity politics is the only politics in a multicultural country. individualism cannot exist outside of a homogeneous society.
2019-02-19T14:17:02 < Cracki> anyway, so... french landlords are assholes I hear?
2019-02-19T14:18:05 < mawk> it's a state-funded subsidized rental owner
2019-02-19T14:18:07 < mawk> not a normal landlor
2019-02-19T14:18:09 < mawk> d
2019-02-19T14:18:21 < mawk> they're required by law to kick me out
2019-02-19T14:18:27 < mawk> but they're not required to be that zealous
2019-02-19T14:18:43 < mawk> also they have other options like increase my rent instead of kicking meout
2019-02-19T14:19:06 < Cracki> so the grandma didn't own the place, just rented it... and now you own the stuff in it, but have no rent contract?
2019-02-19T14:19:23 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-19T14:19:39 < Cracki> stuff to storage, done?
2019-02-19T14:19:53 < mawk> yeah but then I'll need to find a new place
2019-02-19T14:20:02 < Cracki> ah you live in it
2019-02-19T14:20:05 < mawk> it's extremely cheap right now
2019-02-19T14:20:07 < mawk> yes
2019-02-19T14:20:09 < Cracki> hehehe
2019-02-19T14:20:29 < mawk> 250€/month for around 30m², when the market price for that area would be 900€
2019-02-19T14:20:39 < mawk> that's why I want a generous delay lol
2019-02-19T14:21:17 < Cracki> wow
2019-02-19T14:21:50 < Cracki> maybe they have no idea they can raise your rent. would you talk to them about that, to get them off your back?
2019-02-19T14:21:50 < mawk> anywhere in the world it's cheaper I'm sure
2019-02-19T14:21:56 < mawk> paris 30€/m²
2019-02-19T14:21:58 < jadew> Haohmaru, where's this ghetto?
2019-02-19T14:22:10 < Cracki> owo
2019-02-19T14:22:14 < mawk> I already tried Cracki , they responded by sending a court assignation
2019-02-19T14:22:15 < jadew> ah, right
2019-02-19T14:22:18 < Cracki> kek
2019-02-19T14:22:22 < jadew> I like .bg
2019-02-19T14:22:33 < mawk> bg means fit guy
2019-02-19T14:22:38 < mawk> abbreviation of beau gosse
2019-02-19T14:22:42 < mawk> :(
2019-02-19T14:23:07 < Cracki> Gosse is german for gutter
2019-02-19T14:23:36 < jadew> mawk, did you go to their office?
2019-02-19T14:23:51 < mawk> no jadew 
2019-02-19T14:23:58 < mawk> it's french bureaucracy, you can't do that
2019-02-19T14:24:02 < Cracki> isn't this technically squatting?
2019-02-19T14:24:11 < mawk> no, squatting implies you broke in
2019-02-19T14:24:11 < jadew> if you confront a real person, you are more likely to get a favourable answer than if you do it by e-mail/phone
2019-02-19T14:24:21 < mawk> I didn't broke it, I got the keys from a regular renter
2019-02-19T14:24:25 < mawk> broke in*
2019-02-19T14:25:14 < Cracki> an acquaintance of mine "confronted a real person" once... by lifting the clerk's office table. dude got his wish, but also security escorting him from the premises.
2019-02-19T14:26:42 < jadew> heh, not like that
2019-02-19T14:27:07 < jadew> just... making the other guy uncomfortable enough, that he might be willing to do stuff to remove you from his office
2019-02-19T14:27:25 < jadew> like... looking into your issue
2019-02-19T14:27:48 < jadew> gypsy technique
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2019-02-19T14:28:06 < mawk> lol
2019-02-19T14:28:38 < jadew> you figure out that's what's happening after you get scammed a couple of times
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2019-02-19T14:48:37 < kakimir> I think I need to freelance
2019-02-19T14:48:45 < kakimir> someone should ADC for me
2019-02-19T14:49:04  * BrainDamage sigma deltas kakimir
2019-02-19T14:49:45 < kakimir> ADC wont convert
2019-02-19T14:50:09 < Steffanx> Yes it will
2019-02-19T14:50:29 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-19T14:50:29 < englishman> mawk
2019-02-19T14:50:34 < englishman> i have to deal with a supplier in paris
2019-02-19T14:50:36 < englishman> fucking awful
2019-02-19T14:50:36 < englishman> also
2019-02-19T14:50:38 < mawk> lol
2019-02-19T14:50:42 < kakimir> it is capable
2019-02-19T14:50:44 < kakimir> to convert
2019-02-19T14:50:44 < mawk> I can translate some mails for you if you want
2019-02-19T14:50:50 < mawk> if he doesn't speak engrish
2019-02-19T14:50:55 < Steffanx> Je ne parle pas français?
2019-02-19T14:51:02 < kakimir> but I cannot give it a right spell for it
2019-02-19T14:51:03 < mawk> yes you do Steffanx 
2019-02-19T14:51:15 < mawk> you even included the ç
2019-02-19T14:51:19 < englishman> there is a stagière
2019-02-19T14:51:20 < englishman> from paris
2019-02-19T14:51:22 < Steffanx> Je voudrais une kilo de pomme the terre? :d
2019-02-19T14:51:26 < BrainDamage> most french it's not like they can't speak english, they don't want to speak english
2019-02-19T14:51:26 < englishman> he fell asleep at his desk on the first day
2019-02-19T14:51:46 < BrainDamage> you speak to them in english, and they answer in french
2019-02-19T14:51:48 < mawk> almost Steffanx !
2019-02-19T14:51:52 < mawk> un kilo
2019-02-19T14:51:55 < mawk> you speak good french
2019-02-19T14:51:57 < englishman> mawk why do you assume only the french speak french? don't you remember colonizing half of africa?
2019-02-19T14:52:05 < mawk> lol
2019-02-19T14:52:16 < BrainDamage> there's also a stain in canada
2019-02-19T14:52:34 < Steffanx> Lol no, i only remember this crap from high school mawk
2019-02-19T14:52:55 < Steffanx> The useless stuff. Who need pommes de terre in france?
2019-02-19T14:53:06 < englishman> potatoes are an AMERICAN invention
2019-02-19T14:53:18 < BrainDamage> french fries are belgian
2019-02-19T14:53:22 < englishman> typical french cultural appropriation
2019-02-19T14:53:30 < mawk> :(
2019-02-19T14:53:41 < mawk> we eat a lot of potatoes Steffanx 
2019-02-19T14:54:36 < mawk> you bring it to your country
2019-02-19T14:54:41 < mawk> because it didn't exist before
2019-02-19T14:54:46 < BrainDamage> several vegetables are actually result of careful selection and breeding
2019-02-19T14:54:52 < BrainDamage> originally carrots were purple
2019-02-19T14:54:56 < mawk> yeah and that too
2019-02-19T14:55:03 < mawk> lol
2019-02-19T14:55:27 < aandrew> englishman: what's a stagiere
2019-02-19T14:55:29 < BrainDamage> Haohmaru: it is, you combine two things to make a third different thing
2019-02-19T14:55:41 < mawk> a female intern aandrew 
2019-02-19T14:55:45 < englishman> aandrew: student work experience?
2019-02-19T14:55:46 < englishman> i guess
2019-02-19T14:55:48 < mawk> typically young
2019-02-19T14:55:55 < mawk> and makes coffee on demand
2019-02-19T14:56:00 < aandrew> and the whole ask in english, answer in french I find is a quebec thing
2019-02-19T14:56:11 < englishman> well why the shit did you ask in english in the first place
2019-02-19T14:56:15 < mawk> some painters patented colors Haohmaru 
2019-02-19T14:56:16 < aandrew> most French people I know who aren't Canadian are pretty normal
2019-02-19T14:56:22 < aandrew> englishman: ah ok
2019-02-19T14:57:17 < aandrew> day 2 in detroit
2019-02-19T14:57:33 < mawk> yes Haohmaru 
2019-02-19T14:57:35 < aandrew> I have to say that I really like this area (plymouth)
2019-02-19T14:57:37 < mawk> copyright law are tricky
2019-02-19T14:57:44 < aandrew> oh man fuck copyright
2019-02-19T14:57:52 < aandrew> my son's in a recently released movie
2019-02-19T14:58:12 < aandrew> some assclown cam'd it and put it on youtube, saying he (the guy posting it on yt) is my son
2019-02-19T14:58:24 < mawk> lol
2019-02-19T14:58:26 < aandrew> so I file a complaint with yt and they want me to provide "proof of copyright"
2019-02-19T14:58:39 < dongs> wut
2019-02-19T14:58:44 < mawk> you provided his ID ?
2019-02-19T14:58:47 < aandrew> I'm like hello, it's a film in theatres in north america and a cam s on yt at this link
2019-02-19T14:58:52 < aandrew> this isn't rocket fucking science
2019-02-19T14:59:07 < aandrew> mawk: no, I asked them what proof they want, he's 6 and I'm his father
2019-02-19T14:59:17 < mawk> right
2019-02-19T14:59:21 < dongs> why did you make him cam a movie
2019-02-19T14:59:23 < dongs> you monster
2019-02-19T14:59:25 < aandrew> lol
2019-02-19T14:59:29 < mawk> someone just called me "bro": 
2019-02-19T14:59:29 < mawk> [13:58:15] <hardik_> yes bro
2019-02-19T14:59:34 < aandrew> he's not old enough to watch the movie
2019-02-19T14:59:49 < mawk> it has adult talk parts ?
2019-02-19T14:59:56 < mawk> or violent
2019-02-19T14:59:58 < aandrew> no, they took out his speaking parts
2019-02-19T15:00:04 < aandrew> it's horror/thriller
2019-02-19T15:00:17 < aandrew> still gets paid as a principal though so I don't care
2019-02-19T15:00:32 < mawk> he'll be disappointed
2019-02-19T15:00:36 < aandrew> nah
2019-02-19T15:00:43 < mawk> did they say why they did it ?
2019-02-19T15:00:46 < aandrew> he isn't so interested in the outcome. he just loves to act
2019-02-19T15:00:51 < mawk> I see
2019-02-19T15:00:55 < aandrew> mawk: it's typical, they film a dozen scenes then use 3
2019-02-19T15:01:10 < aandrew> he's in another movie out next month too
2019-02-19T15:01:40 < Steffanx> Time to move to the Wood
2019-02-19T15:01:53 < aandrew> the last 6mos or so have been really slow for him though, wonder if it'll pick up again or not
2019-02-19T15:01:56 < dongs> i finally got in the loop of why my panels have been going to australia for the last few months
2019-02-19T15:01:57 < aandrew> move to the wood?
2019-02-19T15:02:02 < dongs> they're going on the set of new kingdong film
2019-02-19T15:02:10 < dongs> so thre's that
2019-02-19T15:02:12 < aandrew> dongs: nice
2019-02-19T15:02:19 < aandrew> led shits or something more interesting?
2019-02-19T15:02:30 < aandrew> also, keil is *fast*
2019-02-19T15:02:30 < Steffanx> The HollyWood
2019-02-19T15:02:35 < dongs> mips/dp screens, yeah, just same old trash
2019-02-19T15:02:40 < aandrew> credit where due. builds the whole project in 3 seconds
2019-02-19T15:02:40 < dongs> err mipi
2019-02-19T15:02:44 < aandrew> similar gcc is like 15s
2019-02-19T15:03:46 < aandrew> well maybe not... I'm building in keil on a ryzen system where I'm on a 7yo i7 laptop for gcc
2019-02-19T15:03:51 < aandrew> should compare the two more equally
2019-02-19T15:03:53 < aandrew> but keil is fast
2019-02-19T15:04:09 < aandrew> maybe it's not rebuilding libraries though (the "packs")
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2019-02-19T15:39:09 < rajkosto> you can make -j8 or something to make all the gcc run in parallel and then only the linker is the bottleneck
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2019-02-19T16:04:42 < Steffanx> Haohmaru: Do people say you're weird, often?
2019-02-19T16:11:23 < zyp> I fucking hate fuzzy types
2019-02-19T16:11:39 < kakimir> what
2019-02-19T16:11:46 < qyx> rabbit_t count;
2019-02-19T16:12:05 < kakimir> uint8_t
2019-02-19T16:12:35 < qyx> if (count ~= MANY) ..
2019-02-19T16:12:53 < jpa-> count.pet();
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2019-02-19T16:21:56 < bitmask> how can I send data from my android phone to my macbook? can you use bluetooth for serial?
2019-02-19T16:22:08 < bitmask> data != files
2019-02-19T16:22:34 < Steffanx> Yes, but afaik your iphone cant so it out of the box
2019-02-19T16:22:36 < rajkosto> theres something called PIM protocol
2019-02-19T16:22:41 < rajkosto> and there is UART over Bt
2019-02-19T16:22:42 < Steffanx> Do*
2019-02-19T16:22:45 < rajkosto> but both endpoints must support it
2019-02-19T16:22:49 < bitmask> iphone?
2019-02-19T16:22:50 < rajkosto> and i dont think either exposes that by default
2019-02-19T16:23:01 < rajkosto> woujld need CUSTOM app or driver
2019-02-19T16:24:04 < Steffanx> Use audio bitmask 
2019-02-19T16:24:21 < bitmask> audio?
2019-02-19T16:24:38 < Steffanx> Beep beep bop bop beep
2019-02-19T16:24:58 < bitmask> how does that work
2019-02-19T16:25:10 < bitmask> headphone jack listening?
2019-02-19T16:25:30 < Steffanx> Microphone-speaker :)
2019-02-19T16:25:51 < rajkosto> actually a bunch of iphone peripherals use the headphone jack because apps can play/record over it easily
2019-02-19T16:26:02 < rajkosto> if the badnwdith is enough, why not
2019-02-19T16:26:19 < bitmask> ehh I dont want to have my mic on all the time
2019-02-19T16:26:22 < Steffanx> Hehe
2019-02-19T16:26:47 < bitmask> I'm thinking a web app is gonna be best
2019-02-19T16:35:30 < qyx> bitmask: you can use serial over bt, there is even a connectbot fork supporting that
2019-02-19T16:35:42 < qyx> but idk if it works, I have not tried it myself
2019-02-19T16:35:42 < bitmask> nice
2019-02-19T16:35:53 < bitmask> i'll check it out thanks
2019-02-19T16:36:15 < aandrew> hm
2019-02-19T16:36:22 < aandrew> openocd keeps telling me the stm32 is write protected
2019-02-19T16:36:31 < aandrew> it unlocks, tells me to power cycle and when I do it says it's locked again
2019-02-19T16:36:56 < qyx> bitmask: iirc this is the app https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=nz.co.cloudstore.serialbot&hl=en
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2019-02-19T16:45:45 < aandrew> hm, I can't read option bits 
2019-02-19T16:49:49 < kakimir> babbys first bit shift registers
2019-02-19T16:50:06 < kakimir> hello worlds is pretty blinky
2019-02-19T16:59:45 < zyp> by fuzzy types, I mean the way this code generator shit turns one-element vectors into scalars
2019-02-19T17:00:49 < zyp> I've got some code that can be built for a varying number of elements, 1 being a valid number
2019-02-19T17:01:15 < fenugrec> hah. the S12X mcus have "fuzzy" opcodes. basically weighted avg and 1D LUT
2019-02-19T17:01:42 < zyp> now I have to special case shit to work with that, since the code generator doesn't just output a one element array
2019-02-19T17:01:58 < zyp> fucking bullshit
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2019-02-19T17:24:02 < Steffanx> bitmask: iphone right?
2019-02-19T17:24:08 < bitmask> android
2019-02-19T17:24:23 < Steffanx> Oh i thought you said iphone somewhere
2019-02-19T17:24:28 < bitmask> nope
2019-02-19T17:56:12 < Steffanx> Lol i read iphone
2019-02-19T17:56:25 < Steffanx> Macbook > iphone
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2019-02-19T18:03:53 < Steffanx> Hows your day Haohmaru?
2019-02-19T18:05:33 < PaulFertser> Aren't you afraid of systemd enough?
2019-02-19T18:09:50 < Steffanx> You didnt answer my question. Not the 1st time nor the 2nd :P
2019-02-19T18:11:02 < Steffanx> Time to go home mr maru
2019-02-19T18:13:20 < Steffanx> Not very productive. But at least Dell is going to fix the laptop
2019-02-19T18:13:45 < Steffanx> The wam is broken
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2019-02-19T20:24:22 < aandrew> what the fuck is going on. can't unprotect the flash,c an't erase the chip, it's showing up just fine in SWD both on openocd and jlink
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2019-02-19T20:50:12 < aandrew> holy fuckballs that was a chore. JLinkSTM32 and telling it to unlock an STM32f4xx instead of f5xx/f7xx worked
2019-02-19T20:50:24 < aandrew> still no bootloader action though, wonder what I'm doing wrong there
2019-02-19T20:50:40 < aandrew> USART1 has a pullup on STM32's TXD, but it's not responding
2019-02-19T20:52:58 < aandrew> db 0x1ff0edbe 1
2019-02-19T20:52:59 < aandrew> 0x1ff0edbe: 90
2019-02-19T20:53:11 < aandrew> that is saying USART bootloader v3.1 is present
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2019-02-19T21:08:27 < aandrew> nope it's locked again
2019-02-19T21:08:28 < aandrew> wtf
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2019-02-19T22:19:56 < Cracki> TIL: always annotate drawings. for a timing belt I forgot to copy the center line. now my gear is too large. gotta print again. I hope the bastards take smallish print jobs more than once a week
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2019-02-19T23:28:41 < jadew> Cracki, where are you printing them?
2019-02-19T23:29:37 < Cracki> one of the cs institutes (the apple[tm] chair) has two rooms full of their maker shit. they open up once a week to the public.
2019-02-19T23:29:51 < Cracki> if you aren't one of them, your shit gets printed on an ancient stratasys
2019-02-19T23:30:08 < Cracki> quality is acceptable, and it appears to be ABS
2019-02-19T23:30:51 < jadew> ah, so you need very high quality prints
2019-02-19T23:31:02 < Cracki> iteration time is shit tho. my 17 minute part took 1-2 hours for the thing to heat up (wtf!), another few hours to print (they pool print jobs), and another few hours in chemical bath to dissolve support material
2019-02-19T23:31:07 < Cracki> I don't actually
2019-02-19T23:31:29 < Cracki> I just need tight iteration times to correct whatever the machine does imperfectly
2019-02-19T23:31:46 < jadew> why don't you print them yourself then?
2019-02-19T23:32:00 < Cracki> got no printer :P
2019-02-19T23:32:05 < jadew> ah :)
2019-02-19T23:32:27 < Cracki> and I'm not about to spend even just 150 bucks on something that's not worth it
2019-02-19T23:32:49 < Cracki> just a metric gear to gates tooth timing belt adapter...
2019-02-19T23:33:24 < Cracki> oh btw, ST has packaged an F0 with triple half bridges and sells it for BLDC applications
2019-02-19T23:34:47 < Cracki> general question about hall sensors... I know servos use them for a binary quadrature signal which gives position, but using it for speed measurement is iffy
2019-02-19T23:35:56 < Cracki> my understanding of a hall sensor tells me that the analog signal amplitude should(?) increase proportional to speed
2019-02-19T23:37:31 < Cracki> did I go wrong anywhere? I suspect these cheap chinese things will only give me digital quadrature signal, no raw analog signal
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2019-02-19T23:43:55 < Cracki> ah, "magnetic pickups" work that way, hall sensors apparently not? https://www.hydraulicspneumatics.com/200/TechZone/SystemInstrumen/Article/False/87208/TechZone-SystemInstrumen
2019-02-19T23:44:03 < superbia> good evening Steffanx 
2019-02-19T23:53:13 < Steffanx> Hello superbia 
2019-02-19T23:53:25 < Steffanx> Hows the suite
2019-02-19T23:53:40 < Steffanx> And the shoes
2019-02-19T23:54:33 < superbia> i was sweating like a pig
2019-02-19T23:54:48 < superbia> a collumn on my keyboard was like working and not working
2019-02-19T23:55:12 < superbia> so i figured i must have burned an io when soldering, but then i realised if i did, entire group of ports would have been fried
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2019-02-19T23:55:49 < superbia> so now for no reason the collumn is working, and i am extremely pissed because i know it will fail again, and i wont be able to consistently debug and fix the problem with it
2019-02-19T23:56:30 < Steffanx> Sucks. Nicest issues to debug :P
2019-02-19T23:57:07 < superbia> i think it's a joint so hardware issue
2019-02-19T23:57:11 < superbia> i can
2019-02-19T23:57:18 < superbia> replicate it anymore
2019-02-19T23:57:21 < superbia> can't
--- Day changed Wed Feb 20 2019
2019-02-20T00:01:58 < jadew> my keyboard has a broken trace
2019-02-20T00:02:07 < jadew> on boards this big, that's also an option
2019-02-20T00:02:19 < jadew> I got angry once...
2019-02-20T00:03:06 < superbia> the issue is that it's working for past hour
2019-02-20T00:03:44 < superbia> and before that it was working and not working from minute to minute.... then i did some random resoldering on diodes... and for now is working.... will see in the late run...
2019-02-20T00:03:56 < superbia> if it happens again, i will have no idea how to fix it
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2019-02-20T00:04:38 < jadew> in that time you could earn enough money to get a new keyboard
2019-02-20T00:05:10 < superbia> you can't buy such board
2019-02-20T00:05:17 < superbia> you must makeit your self
2019-02-20T00:07:57 < aandrew> hm
2019-02-20T00:08:16 < aandrew> the hex file wants to put shit in 0x08000000 but I can't hit that memory
2019-02-20T00:09:02 < aandrew> flash on ITCM is at 0x00200000 and flash on AXIM is at 0x08000000
2019-02-20T00:09:42 < aandrew> why the fuck would this loader want to put shit on axim
2019-02-20T00:10:12 < superbia> config shit
2019-02-20T00:11:08 < aandrew> hm, I think this might be right
2019-02-20T00:11:14 < aandrew> axim is code and data, itcm is code only
2019-02-20T00:12:39 < zyp> as in execute only, no reads?
2019-02-20T00:12:49 < zyp> sounds useless
2019-02-20T00:13:18 < zyp> (useless because it'd fault as soon as it hit a pc-relative constant pool)
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2019-02-20T00:21:25 < aandrew> as soon as it tries to execute the first instruction it hits the hardfault handler, then the first instruction there faults as well
2019-02-20T00:21:28 < aandrew> wtf
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2019-02-20T00:37:35 < zyp> haha
2019-02-20T00:37:47 < zyp> sounds like it doesn't allow execute after all :p
2019-02-20T00:38:23 < zyp> what does SCB_CFSR say? IACCVIOL?
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2019-02-20T00:56:27 < catphish> is there an stm32 dev board with usb connected to the MCU?
2019-02-20T00:56:39 < catphish> i assume some of the super cheap ones use DFU?
2019-02-20T00:57:08 < catphish> ie for developing an application with USB
2019-02-20T00:57:57 < malinus> catphish: all the discovery boards
2019-02-20T00:58:02 < malinus> iirc
2019-02-20T00:58:27 < catphish> malinus: thanks, i only have a nucleo board, which seems to have the usb connected purely to a programmer
2019-02-20T01:23:05 < Cracki> do chinese boards count as devboards?
2019-02-20T01:23:38 < Cracki> I have an F4 board. the usb port is connected and I can use DFU
2019-02-20T01:23:39 < zyp> malinus, not all, but most
2019-02-20T01:23:55 < zyp> also some nucleos also do, I believe
2019-02-20T01:23:55 < Cracki> it has no stlink on it, just swd/jtag header
2019-02-20T01:24:12 < srk> bluepill? :)
2019-02-20T01:24:16 < catphish> either would work for me i guess
2019-02-20T01:24:22 < Cracki> nah, squarish F4
2019-02-20T01:24:50 < Cracki> there was something strange about bluepills/blackpills and usb
2019-02-20T01:25:14 < srk> I was running dfu on bluepill with opencm3 iirc
2019-02-20T01:25:15 < Cracki> their rom BL is often accessed via a separate usb uart
2019-02-20T01:25:17 < catphish> well now i'm confused, seemingly nobody sells a 44.1 or 48 ksps DAC
2019-02-20T01:25:28 < catphish> (i'm interested in audio)
2019-02-20T01:25:36 < Cracki> 96/192 khz then
2019-02-20T01:25:41 < srk> Cracki: like builtin bootloader?
2019-02-20T01:25:47 < zyp> Cracki, f1 doesn't have usb in the builtin bootloader
2019-02-20T01:25:48 < Cracki> they might have lower sample rates or downsampling
2019-02-20T01:25:54 < Cracki> exactly that's what it was
2019-02-20T01:26:00 < catphish> Cracki: nope, those aren't listed either :|
2019-02-20T01:26:03 < srk> eh eh :)
2019-02-20T01:26:28 < zyp> catphish, you're probably looking at the wrong product group
2019-02-20T01:26:39 < Cracki> i remember the datasheet vaguely. would have been nice if they did usb dfu... but no, which is why they always come with a flash BL for arduino compat
2019-02-20T01:26:46 < catphish> zyp: maybe audio dacs are separate for some reason
2019-02-20T01:27:00 < Cracki> does it have i2s output?
2019-02-20T01:27:12 < zyp> catphish, they are often called codecs
2019-02-20T01:27:49 < catphish> https://www.mouser.co.uk/Search/Refine?N=19408172
2019-02-20T01:27:58 < catphish> vs https://www.mouser.co.uk/Search/Refine?N=7283677
2019-02-20T01:28:05 < Cracki> when you talk about usb dfu, I assume you meant rom BL because flash BLs can do pretty much anything, including implementing DFU
2019-02-20T01:28:07 < zyp> catphish, https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/interface-codecs/716
2019-02-20T01:28:56 < catphish> zyp: after contemplating ADAT yesterday i thought it might be more interesting to make my own analog audio interface instead :)
2019-02-20T01:29:34 < zyp> maybe grab a stm32f4discovery, it comes with a codec
2019-02-20T01:29:50 < zyp> only output though, so maybe not so interesting
2019-02-20T01:29:58 < catphish> The STM32F4DISCOVERY kit leverages the capabilities of the STM32F407 high performance microcontrollers, to allow users to easily develop applications featuring audio.
2019-02-20T01:30:00 < catphish> cool :)
2019-02-20T01:30:07 < srk> lol, there's even SPDIFRX
2019-02-20T01:30:16 < srk> but I want SPDIFTX /o\
2019-02-20T01:30:23 < srk> from USB
2019-02-20T01:30:38 < Cracki> til: it stands for sony/philips ...
2019-02-20T01:30:45 < catphish> i can probably comfortably build my own anyway
2019-02-20T01:31:01 < catphish> with adc and dac
2019-02-20T01:31:17 < srk> I was running some firmware from internetz on f4disco 
2019-02-20T01:31:43 < srk> my internal notebook jack broke and turned into mono
2019-02-20T01:31:52 < aandrew> hm
2019-02-20T01:32:02 < zyp> IIRC my waveshare kit came with a codec board that does both in and out
2019-02-20T01:32:03 < aandrew> I've managed to get my BOOT_ADR0/ADR1 stuck at 0xffff both
2019-02-20T01:32:05 < srk> worked but it produced weird noises from time to time, like once in 90 minutes xD
2019-02-20T01:32:26 < aandrew> writing the correct value to FLASH_OPTCR1 does nothing, it looks like it works but reset and it's back to x0ffffffff
2019-02-20T01:32:49 < zyp> aandrew, what are you doing anyway?
2019-02-20T01:32:58 < zyp> hacking on a busted part?
2019-02-20T01:33:02 < srk> zyp: spdif?
2019-02-20T01:33:11 < zyp> srk, no, I2S
2019-02-20T01:33:32 < zyp> spdif support didn't come before newer stm32s, my kit is f407
2019-02-20T01:33:59 < zyp> the SAI peripheral in the newer parts will do spdif
2019-02-20T01:34:14 < srk> ES9023 SPDIF DAC 
2019-02-20T01:34:22 < srk> sounds good, i2s -> spdif 
2019-02-20T01:34:27 < srk> SAI, hmm
2019-02-20T01:34:58 < zyp> I think maybe f42x got it
2019-02-20T01:35:03 < zyp> or was it f46x
2019-02-20T01:35:46 < srk> or f7s 
2019-02-20T01:36:04 < aandrew> zyp: no, I have a bunch of these boards and I'm not sure if they're marginally soldered or not but one of them is like perma-protected, I unlocked it ONCE but can't get it back now, and this one I can write to but the fucking boot addr is fucked
2019-02-20T01:37:03 < catphish> basically i figured i'd hook up something like http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/pcm5310.pdf to an stm32 do handle usb and see how i get on
2019-02-20T01:37:16 < aandrew> the option bits are fine (not read protected or anything) but I can't change the boot address anymore
2019-02-20T01:39:39 < srk> I've bought this thing recently https://www.amazon.com/Fiio-TAISHAN-D03K-Digital-Analog-Converter/dp/B017JF6EOO 
2019-02-20T01:40:03 < srk> and it solved all my noise issues
2019-02-20T01:40:40 < srk> if I can feed it from SAI that would be awsum
2019-02-20T01:41:07 < aandrew> Writing 08192A3B -> 40023C08
2019-02-20T01:41:07 < aandrew> Writing 4C5D6E7F -> 40023C08 # write OPTKEY1/2
2019-02-20T01:41:07 < aandrew> 40023C14 = C0FFAAFC FFFFFFFF # OPTCR shows it's unlocked (bit 0=0, OPTCR1 is all 1s which is what I want to change)
2019-02-20T01:41:10 < aandrew> Writing 00400080 -> 40023C18 # write new OPTCR1
2019-02-20T01:41:12 < aandrew> 40023C18 = 00400080          # read it back, it's correct
2019-02-20T01:41:15 < aandrew> Sleep(500)                   # wait
2019-02-20T01:41:17 < aandrew> Writing C0FFAAFE -> 40023C14 # write new OPTCR and set 'OPTSTRT'
2019-02-20T01:41:20 < aandrew> Sleep(500)                   #
2019-02-20T01:41:22 < aandrew> 40023C14 = C0FFAAFC FFFFFFFF # read back, OPTSTRT autocleared but OPTCR1 is back to all-1s
2019-02-20T01:41:25 < aandrew> 40023C0C = 00000000          # FLASH_STAT shows no errors
2019-02-20T01:41:28 < aandrew> everything looks fucking correct
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2019-02-20T01:48:16 < catphish> i'm a bit confused about these product categories, ADC vs DAC vs CODEC
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2019-02-20T01:54:31 < catphish> dedicated audio ADC/DAC seems like the right way to go
2019-02-20T01:57:09 < catphish> "The PCM186x audio frontend supports single-ended input levels from small-mV microphone inputs to 2.1-VRMS line inputs, without external resistor dividers"
2019-02-20T01:57:11 < catphish> win
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2019-02-20T02:40:48 < Cracki> switchable fixed pregain?
2019-02-20T02:41:41 < Cracki> or just that much dynamic range? the analog mixers (audio tech) I'm familiar with give mic inputs some fixed preamp on top of the gain fader
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2019-02-20T02:48:54 < catphish> well what i want is a gain controllable pre-amp into an ADC then into USB
2019-02-20T02:49:35 < catphish> but if the IC has programmable gain built in, then i guess i don't really need a separate amp, if it's software gain, then i definitely do want a searate physical amp
2019-02-20T02:51:21 < catphish> prgrammable gain amplifier, –12 dB to +32 dB
2019-02-20T02:51:34 < catphish> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/pcm1864.pdf
2019-02-20T02:51:47 < catphish> seems like all bases are covered by this IC
2019-02-20T03:00:25 < srk> all your bass
2019-02-20T03:00:51 < srk> PGAs are cool
2019-02-20T03:01:58 < srk> according to page 27 it's both analog and digital one
2019-02-20T03:03:05 < englishman> +32dB noise
2019-02-20T03:05:37 < catphish> just looking at page 31 now that has full details of the gain tontrol
2019-02-20T03:06:33 < catphish> questionable whether i want that, or a much simpler device, with an analog frontend
2019-02-20T03:06:53 < catphish> i suspect the latter, since all the equipment i've seen has dedicated hardware preamps
2019-02-20T03:07:17 < catphish> but then i am going for low budget :)
2019-02-20T03:07:50 < englishman> how much crappier is it than the LT part it was cloned from
2019-02-20T03:08:16 < Cracki> 32 dB is a factor of 40 in amplitude. doesn't sound much
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2019-02-20T03:28:04 < mawk> a factor of 40 ? how do you compute that Cracki ?
2019-02-20T03:28:13 < Cracki> 10**(32/20)
2019-02-20T03:28:16 < Cracki> that's how dB works
2019-02-20T03:28:23 < mawk> isn't it 10 ?
2019-02-20T03:28:24 < Cracki> dB is a measure of power, P = U * I
2019-02-20T03:28:30 < Cracki> amplitude is voltage
2019-02-20T03:28:38 < Cracki> double voltage, four times power
2019-02-20T03:28:51 < mawk> ah
2019-02-20T03:28:52 < mawk> right
2019-02-20T03:28:54 < Cracki> or... consider 16 bit pcm audio. 15 bits are ~90 dB
2019-02-20T03:29:37 < Cracki> some people always calculate with 2 or 20, even when it's already a power quantity...
2019-02-20T03:30:04 < Cracki> e.g. PWM for light, where emitted light is linearly proportional to duty cycle, no square anywhere
2019-02-20T03:34:16 < catphish> sleep time now :)
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2019-02-20T03:41:24  * Cracki googles sleeping catfish
2019-02-20T03:43:51 < mawk> I'm doing a chrome extension
2019-02-20T03:43:53 < mawk> I hate js
2019-02-20T03:44:30 < Cracki> use tampermonkey maybe?
2019-02-20T03:44:45 < Cracki> a little more immediate, less ceremony
2019-02-20T03:45:57 < Cracki> js isn't that bad. lacks some syntax you might be used to from other langs, but all the features are there and apart from the grave errors in judgment that is the implicit type conversion, it's quite well behaved
2019-02-20T03:46:25 < mawk> yeah thanks to years of dedicated efforts to overcome the terrible specification
2019-02-20T03:46:42 < mawk> I have to use push notification with a background worker
2019-02-20T03:46:56 < mawk> the notifications are sent to a python server that receives webhooks from a SIP provider
2019-02-20T03:47:13 < mawk> everytime there's a phone call the extension is supposed to open a billing program tab
2019-02-20T03:47:23 < mawk> it's for a call center I'm doing this
2019-02-20T03:48:10 < mawk> I could've done a script or a native program but the billing program has a lame API so I need to be in the browser to open the right thing
2019-02-20T03:49:34 < mawk> I could've received the hooks from a chrome *application* directly but they're deprecating chrome apps for whatever reason
2019-02-20T03:49:52 < mawk> and the useful APIs like TCP/UDP sockets aren't replaced with extension APIs
2019-02-20T03:50:00 < mawk> chrome like to deprecate things without warning, it's worse than apple
2019-02-20T03:50:17 < Cracki> wow that's a lot of moving parts
2019-02-20T03:50:18 < BrainDamage> chrome plans to drop the api that most adblockers use
2019-02-20T03:50:27 < mawk> they canceled that decision BrainDamage 
2019-02-20T03:50:30 < mawk> but yeah I had this example in mind
2019-02-20T03:50:46 < mawk> they wanted to deprecate the extension API that allows you to modify a page
2019-02-20T03:50:56 < mawk> and instead force you to use a declarative API that can't really scan the page
2019-02-20T03:51:07 < mawk> just list filters and actions, and you don't know what filter gets applied
2019-02-20T03:51:27 < mawk> that would instantly prevent any malware extension from functionning, but also incidentally adblocker extension
2019-02-20T03:51:28 < Cracki> sounds very communist, this "force people to use $ideology"
2019-02-20T03:52:03 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-20T03:52:06 < Cracki> "it's for your own good! we know better!"
2019-02-20T03:52:15 < srk> there are privacy reasons for that
2019-02-20T03:52:17 < Cracki> no surprise, just look at who runs the place
2019-02-20T03:52:28 < Cracki> privacy reasons, google, I am pissing myself
2019-02-20T03:52:33 < srk> as the adblocker can track you just as well
2019-02-20T03:52:34 < srk> :)
2019-02-20T03:52:38 < srk> haha yeah
2019-02-20T03:52:54 < srk> I only use chromium for betaflight configurator xD
2019-02-20T03:53:05 < srk> there's even ungoogled-chromium or something like that
2019-02-20T03:53:19 < srk> https://github.com/Eloston/ungoogled-chromium
2019-02-20T03:53:47 < Cracki> that surely violates some law of thermodynamics
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2019-02-20T04:18:31 < bitmask> how did I get sucked into this project?
2019-02-20T04:18:46 < bitmask> doing my first android and os x app
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2019-02-20T04:41:45 < aandrew> ok
2019-02-20T04:41:56 < aandrew> so I'm more certain that these fucky stm32s are mfg issues
2019-02-20T04:42:05 < aandrew> although I'm struggling to understand what exactly could cause that
2019-02-20T04:43:42 < aandrew> ten boards: 4 work fine, three are "protected" although JLinkSTM32 can't unlock them and looking at FLASH_OPTCR/OPTCR1 show there is *no* protection, 1 WAS working but now boot_adr0/1 are both 0xffff and can't be changed, and two I"ve not tested yet
2019-02-20T04:44:32 < scrts> u sure everything OK with power supplies and clock?
2019-02-20T04:45:56 < aandrew> yes
2019-02-20T04:46:08 < aandrew> 12MHz clock is shared with FT2232 and that's working fine
2019-02-20T04:46:12 < aandrew> but will re-verify the clock
2019-02-20T04:46:15 < aandrew> supplies are actually really nice
2019-02-20T04:46:27 < scrts> I rmember I had issues with FT232
2019-02-20T04:46:28 < aandrew> 60mV noise on 3.3V, 30mV on 1.2V (pk-pk)
2019-02-20T04:46:38 < scrts> it did not generate clock when not pluged to USB
2019-02-20T04:47:13 < aandrew> no, the FT2232 is fine, I am able to access all devices on JTAG chain, and on some devices I can hit the ROM bootloader over serial as well
2019-02-20T04:47:36 < scrts> and it also fails if there's no firmware?
2019-02-20T04:47:39 < scrts> empty piece
2019-02-20T04:50:01 < aandrew> they are empty. I can't flash them
2019-02-20T04:50:11 < aandrew> erase fails, unprotect fails. I can't read flash or rom
2019-02-20T04:51:01 < aandrew> if I halt CPU and set PC=rom entry, it just double-faults
2019-02-20T04:55:56 < scrts> ok, then that's odd
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2019-02-20T05:10:28 < karlp> aandrew: I seem to recall some people having odd issues with factory blank parts and some of the erase ops.
2019-02-20T05:10:44 < dongs> aandrew: isd your boot1 floating Ol
2019-02-20T05:10:49 < karlp> stlink windows util worked and from then on every other tool was ok, iirc, no other resolution or cause was found
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2019-02-20T05:15:06 < karlp> I still find it funny with microchip owning microsemi now.
2019-02-20T05:17:42 < dongs> really?
2019-02-20T05:17:48 < dongs> didnt microsemi buy actel
2019-02-20T05:17:52 < dongs> so microchip makes FPGAs now?
2019-02-20T05:18:04 < dongs> or did they shitcan that department
2019-02-20T05:19:55 < karlp> nope, getting emails abotu microchip's new released of libero, and all their polarfire stuff, which is all microsemi
2019-02-20T05:20:15 < dongs> yeah i remember libero
2019-02-20T05:20:20 < dongs> man what fucking cancer
2019-02-20T05:20:27 < dongs> a bunmch of shareware FPGA tools
2019-02-20T05:20:33 < dongs> tied together by tcl scripts
2019-02-20T05:20:40 < dongs> workflow was aids
2019-02-20T05:20:44 < karlp> isn't all fpga stuff tied together with tcl?
2019-02-20T05:20:46 < dongs> alt-tab from one thing to another
2019-02-20T05:21:00 < dongs> PE edition this LE edition that
2019-02-20T05:21:00 < karlp> I know my mentor friend is doing all their big stuff in gross cascades of tcl 
2019-02-20T05:21:10 < dongs> all limited to garbage
2019-02-20T05:24:05 < englishman> 12 PROJECTS THAT HELPS YOU BECOMING SELF-DRIVING CAR ENGINEER (PYTHON and C++ CODE AVALIABLE)
2019-02-20T05:25:48 < PeterM> PROJECT ONE: HOW TO SET OFF A BOMB WIHT A MOBILE PHONE
2019-02-20T05:28:08 < PeterM> PROJECT 2: ADD RGB LEDS TO YOUR CARS INTERIOR
2019-02-20T05:28:10 < karlp> heh, vector ops on cortex-m https://www.eenewsembedded.com/news/arm-introducing-helium-technology?news_id=114867
2019-02-20T05:28:32 < aandrew> dongs: no boot1
2019-02-20T05:28:40 < aandrew> just boot0 and it's definitely not floating
2019-02-20T05:28:46 < dongs> hmm
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2019-02-20T05:47:24 < dongs> what teh nigger
2019-02-20T05:47:37 < dongs> just tried to make some BOM lists in A19 and its no longer grouping parts by value
2019-02-20T05:47:43 < dongs> it just lists them all like its XY data
2019-02-20T05:47:44 < dongs> what the fuck
2019-02-20T05:49:21 < dongs> WTF
2019-02-20T05:51:24 < dongs> HALP
2019-02-20T05:52:49 < scrts> lists all like non same?
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2019-02-20T05:57:16 < aandrew> dongs: you have to group it
2019-02-20T05:57:22 < aandrew> you had to do that in 17 as wlel
2019-02-20T06:00:08 < ColdKeyboard> What outdoor positioning system has accuarcy of ~1m? Is GPS/GNSS good enough or would you need to make your own network of beacons?
2019-02-20T06:03:06 < scrts> global stuff is good, but you need good atenna
2019-02-20T06:03:07 < fenugrec> ColdKeyboard, at 1m you're on the limit of what DGPS can do. I'd look at RTK with 
2019-02-20T06:03:33 < fenugrec> a public RTCM broadcaster, if available, or your own base station
2019-02-20T06:08:09 < fenugrec> beware though, the RTK rabbithole is a deep one
2019-02-20T06:10:43 < ColdKeyboard> fenugrec: How accurate is DGPS assuming there is nothing obscuring the view? Also what's RTK? :)
2019-02-20T06:18:24 < fenugrec> ColdKeyboard, you have a lot of googling before you! DGPS/WAAS will get you in the 1-3m ballpark assuming good sat coverage (not just clear view of sky)
2019-02-20T06:20:00 < fenugrec> RTK with a dualfrequency rx, good antennas, base + rover, will get you in the 10-50mm range
2019-02-20T06:20:12 < fenugrec> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real-time_kinematic
2019-02-20T06:20:45 < ColdKeyboard> fenugrec: I know, this is not my area of expertise but I'm trying to learn more
2019-02-20T06:24:39 < fenugrec> I'm hoping prices go down for dual-freq RTK, an entry-level receiver is still 3-6k$ (was >> 10k$ not long ago)
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2019-02-20T06:27:35 < ColdKeyboard> fenugrec: I'm curous to what they use in outdoor asset tracking, like on docks, shipping ports, outdoor warehouses and etc for tracking? Would GPS/GNSS be sufficient for 1-2m accuracy or do they use something else?
2019-02-20T06:28:35 < fenugrec> If you're within 2m of a 300000kg container and can't find it...
2019-02-20T06:28:36 < ColdKeyboard> I imagine if you are tracking a car, truck or something else that is 2/3/5m in size and is mostly stationary... you don't neet cm/mm precision
2019-02-20T06:28:41 < fenugrec> *30000
2019-02-20T06:28:49 < rajkosto> they use LORA the hip tech
2019-02-20T06:29:17 < fenugrec> for a moment I was thinking of LORAN-C, haha
2019-02-20T06:29:28 < ColdKeyboard> rajkosto: LoRa for tracking? Whaaa?
2019-02-20T06:33:25 < karlp> I think raj was just making the sort of hipster comment about lora
2019-02-20T06:33:29 < karlp> lora will make your teeth white
2019-02-20T06:33:38 < karlp> lora will babysit your kids
2019-02-20T06:34:23 < ColdKeyboard> lmao
2019-02-20T06:34:44 < ColdKeyboard> Yeah, I noticed that in a lot of whitepapers... 
2019-02-20T06:36:11 < ColdKeyboard> But since fenugrec mentioend 30 ton container... what do they use for tracking those? GPS/GNSS or something based on ground beacons?
2019-02-20T06:36:28 < rajkosto> they use it for cattle tracking so why not container tracking
2019-02-20T06:38:03 < karlp> where are cattle individually gps tagged?
2019-02-20T06:38:31 < karlp> I thought they were normally rfid on gates sutff, so know what pens/trucks/paddocks they'r ein, but not any ned for more than that
2019-02-20T06:41:00 < ColdKeyboard> Is there a way to "correct" GPS position by adding fixed location beacons but without using RTCM broadacsters... those seem very expensive
2019-02-20T06:42:22 < ColdKeyboard> If you have a fixed location beacon and you calculate that the position lat/long is off by x/y, can you broadcast that correction to nearby units via LoRa/WiFi/BLE or whatever? Sounds simple so that's why I'm sketical :)
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2019-02-20T06:43:34 < fenugrec> that's basically what DGPS does
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2019-02-20T06:50:49 < ColdKeyboard> But does the information have to be transmitted at the same time when you are recieving satelite date or can you do post-processing to correct the location data?
2019-02-20T06:52:19 < ColdKeyboard> To continue with our 30ton container example; if I recieve that container is reporting lat/long value, and I have a fixed ground station that is reporting lat1/long1 values that are off by x/y of their actual value, can you just add/remove that offset to the container data?
2019-02-20T06:52:45 < ColdKeyboard> How acurate would that be, seems simple but I'm afraid of what I don't know, might introduce even greater inaccuracy that way :)
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2019-02-20T06:56:51 < fenugrec> you can't win
2019-02-20T07:00:02 < fenugrec> you're not going to get better than 1-3m unless your gps measures signal phase, and that implies solving the "integer ambiguity", either with RTK or complicated post-processing
2019-02-20T07:01:04 < karlp> depending on how many of these you need, just call up trimble and open your wallet?
2019-02-20T07:01:25 < fenugrec> ColdKeyboard, what exactly are you trying to accomplish
2019-02-20T07:02:25 < karlp> come now, how is that relevant? :)
2019-02-20T07:02:39 < fenugrec> I'm not a gnss pro, not even close, but believe me when I say <3m is tough, regardless of what your phone gps reports as "estimated accuracy"
2019-02-20T07:02:48 < fenugrec> true
2019-02-20T07:04:53 < ColdKeyboard> I'm trying to figure out how would you develop a solution where you track things on the ground with 1-3m accuarcy without requiring equipment that is more expensive than the thing you are tracking :D
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2019-02-20T07:05:37 < karlp> the expensive parts aren't normally the mounted parts.
2019-02-20T07:05:50 < fenugrec> well there you go - slap on a ublox / whatever module, do a proper antenna, average the position and move on
2019-02-20T07:06:06 < ColdKeyboard> karlp: What do you mean?
2019-02-20T07:06:08 < fenugrec> and expect 3-10m
2019-02-20T07:06:47 < fenugrec> (post-processing is tough shit : http://www.anderswallin.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/rtklib_settings_2014-02-20.png )
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2019-02-20T07:13:59 < ColdKeyboard> fenugrec: Which RTK transmitter and reciever manufacturers are there?
2019-02-20T07:14:40 < ColdKeyboard> Curious to what price ranges can you expect on the reciever side, assuming you pay those 5-10K$ for transmitter/basestation
2019-02-20T07:15:36 < fenugrec> I don't think you really want an RTK setup, but https://gssc.esa.int/navipedia/index.php/RTK_Systems#RTK_Receiver_Manufacturers
2019-02-20T07:16:07 < fenugrec> you use the same kind of receiver as a rover and a base station, same price, usually permanent base stations have a better antenna than the rover
2019-02-20T07:16:55 < fenugrec> depending where you live, some countries have a network of free, public RINEX broadcasters so you could just use a rover with an internet connection
2019-02-20T07:19:01 < ColdKeyboard> Awesome, thanks fenugrec! Off to educate myself a bit more on this topic :)
2019-02-20T07:23:32 < fenugrec> np
2019-02-20T07:23:49 < karlp> huh, new sheeva plugs
2019-02-20T07:24:09 < rajkosto> marvellous
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2019-02-20T07:53:26 < R2COM> yo
2019-02-20T07:53:27 < dongs> aandrew: group what
2019-02-20T07:53:35 < dongs> i have NEVER had a bom that wasnt grouped
2019-02-20T07:53:38 < dongs> i just press RI
2019-02-20T07:53:40 < dongs> everywehre
2019-02-20T07:53:41 < dongs> and it works
2019-02-20T07:53:43 < dongs> wehre is the fucking option?
2019-02-20T07:54:15 < dongs> hmm in fact
2019-02-20T07:54:18 < dongs> its just THIS pcb that isnt like taht
2019-02-20T08:01:30 < dongs> no man they fucked something
2019-02-20T08:01:33 < dongs> left side gvoruped shit is gone
2019-02-20T08:01:34 < dongs> WTF
2019-02-20T08:08:51 < rajkosto> since hte last time i used it littlevgl has only received MORE typos
2019-02-20T08:10:06 < dongs> motherFUCKER
2019-02-20T08:10:14 < dongs> so in A19 BOM *is* flat by default
2019-02-20T08:10:18 < dongs> i made that project in 19
2019-02-20T08:10:24 < dongs> all the others ones are imports from older
2019-02-20T08:10:36 < dongs> you have to make some fucking ActiveBOM trash in a new project
2019-02-20T08:10:37 < dongs> to set grouping
2019-02-20T08:12:04 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-20T08:12:09 < dongs> as soon as I made a retarded .bomdoc
2019-02-20T08:12:13 < dongs> now RI is also grouped
2019-02-20T08:12:17 < dongs> garbage
2019-02-20T08:13:29 < rajkosto> https://media.giphy.com/media/G8ebH5TOE3pde/giphy.gif
2019-02-20T08:14:09 < dongs> why are all A19 doc screenshots gray on grasy
2019-02-20T08:14:15 < dongs> in the website docs
2019-02-20T08:15:20 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/E0FxMn7.png how can anyone find this readable?
2019-02-20T08:15:28 < dongs> youve got a white page with text on it
2019-02-20T08:15:34 < dongs> and then these gray pieces of poop
2019-02-20T08:15:35 < rajkosto> because autodesk did it
2019-02-20T08:15:37 < rajkosto> therefore it must be so
2019-02-20T08:15:53 < rajkosto> its normal that screenshots are always of the default theme/settings
2019-02-20T08:15:56 < rajkosto> or people would get confus
2019-02-20T08:16:05 < rajkosto> the solution is therefore to make the website low contrast as well
2019-02-20T08:16:16 < dongs> > low contrast
2019-02-20T08:16:29 < rajkosto> yes since our shitty 50$ LCD monitors cant do contrast anyway
2019-02-20T08:17:01 < dongs> thats yours./
2019-02-20T08:17:07 < dongs> mine does it jsut fine tqvm
2019-02-20T08:17:17 < R2COM> whats happening dongs
2019-02-20T08:17:35 < rajkosto> we need some shit to happen to display technology, LCD makers arent INNOVATING at all just using the same tech for 15 years now
2019-02-20T08:17:39 < rajkosto> cuz its still the cheapest
2019-02-20T08:17:56 < rajkosto> get some tarduinos to innovate
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2019-02-20T08:24:28 < R2COM> you want lcd with perfect black and high resolution?
2019-02-20T08:25:02 < rajkosto> i want it all
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2019-02-20T08:27:32 < rajkosto> R2COM, a manufacturer is now stacking 2 VA panels to get pretty good contrast, too bad VA sucks for response time
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2019-02-20T08:36:21 < dongs> judew, whats the sma format for the shit you sent me
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2019-02-20T08:37:26 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/t6gor4s.png this is the trash i have, is that sma female?
2019-02-20T08:38:52 < rajkosto> take the caps off
2019-02-20T08:39:56 < R2COM> most likely it is
2019-02-20T08:39:58 < rajkosto> you can have SMA Male, Female and RP-SMA Male, Female in that footprint
2019-02-20T08:40:31 < R2COM> is that fucken oshpark board or wat
2019-02-20T08:44:55 < jadew> dongs, it's SMA female to SMA male
2019-02-20T08:45:02 < jadew> female on the input, male on the output
2019-02-20T08:45:41 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/WvyTcIS.png
2019-02-20T08:45:51 < dongs> this is on both ends
2019-02-20T08:45:53 < dongs> of RF amp
2019-02-20T08:46:50 < rajkosto> thats SMA female
2019-02-20T08:46:59 < jadew> yeah, that's because it's stupid
2019-02-20T08:47:10 < jadew> you'll need a male to male adapter
2019-02-20T08:48:04 < rajkosto> wait does it have threads on the outside or inside
2019-02-20T08:48:08 < rajkosto> if it has threads on the inside its RP-SMA male
2019-02-20T08:49:17 < dongs> threadas re outside
2019-02-20T08:49:23 < jadew> rajkosto, RP-SMA male has the thread on the outside
2019-02-20T08:49:33 < jadew> anyway, that shit in the image is regular SMA female
2019-02-20T08:49:45 < jadew> so you'll need a male to male
2019-02-20T08:49:46 < rajkosto> jadew, i have an image here saying the opposite lol
2019-02-20T08:49:56 < rajkosto> this shit is stupid
2019-02-20T08:49:57 < jadew> rajkosto, show me
2019-02-20T08:50:18 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/K1R3J1O.png
2019-02-20T08:50:19 < dongs> side view
2019-02-20T08:50:23 < rajkosto> http://image.helipal.com/le-0178-big-1.jpg
2019-02-20T08:51:02 < rajkosto> https://avacomtech.com/pub/media/catalog/product/cache/image/1000x1320/e9c3970ab036de70892d86c6d221abfe/c/o/combined_1_1.jpg
2019-02-20T08:51:13 < rajkosto> cool contrarian images
2019-02-20T08:51:17 < jadew> dongs, yup, order something like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DSHA-New-Hot-5-pcs-Gold-Tone-SMA-Male-to-SMA-Male-Plug-RF-Coaxial-Adapter/32699746180.html
2019-02-20T08:51:21 < jadew> NOT RP-SMA
2019-02-20T08:51:29 < jadew> if it says RP-SMA on the page, don't buy it
2019-02-20T08:51:34 < rajkosto> anyway RP-SMA should only be used on routers and shit
2019-02-20T08:51:54 < jadew> rajkosto, yeah, that picture is wrong
2019-02-20T08:52:05 < jadew> the image at the bottom is obviously a female
2019-02-20T08:52:27 < jadew> the polarity is reversed
2019-02-20T08:52:44 < jadew> although, I guess if you call it reverse polarity
2019-02-20T08:52:48 < jadew> then female is male
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2019-02-20T08:52:50 < jadew> and male is female
2019-02-20T08:53:12 < dongs> yours is pass through right? male one end and female on another?
2019-02-20T08:53:17 < jadew> so it kinda makes sense to call it male and say it's RP
2019-02-20T08:53:21 < jadew> (so it's female)
2019-02-20T08:53:28 < jadew> dongs, yeah
2019-02-20T08:53:28 < rajkosto> you always have to go by images for these things
2019-02-20T08:53:29 < dongs> pluto is male for RF input
2019-02-20T08:53:32 < jadew> female on the input, male on the output
2019-02-20T08:53:40 < jadew> dongs, what?
2019-02-20T08:53:42 < dongs> ok, so ill need that adapter for your shit -> pluto
2019-02-20T08:53:51 < jadew> I don't believe that
2019-02-20T08:53:53 < dongs> and no adapter RF -> your shit
2019-02-20T08:54:02 < dongs> err wait
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2019-02-20T08:54:10 < jadew> I just looked it up
2019-02-20T08:54:13 < dongs> < rajkosto> thats SMA female
2019-02-20T08:54:15 < jadew> pluto is female
2019-02-20T08:54:16 < dongs> yeah its female
2019-02-20T08:54:16 < dongs> ok
2019-02-20T08:54:26 < dongs> anyway, i still need one of those at least right?
2019-02-20T08:54:33 < jadew> yeah
2019-02-20T08:54:34 < dongs> (china pic link
2019-02-20T08:54:34 < dongs> ok
2019-02-20T08:54:36 < dongs> sending to chinagirl
2019-02-20T08:54:36 < jadew> a male-to-male
2019-02-20T08:56:14 < tjq> Lol
2019-02-20T08:56:26 < tjq> The 2 males they butt together
2019-02-20T08:57:06 < tjq> 👉🏻👈
2019-02-20T08:57:23 < rajkosto> asss 2 assss
2019-02-20T08:57:51 < tjq> Cool man
2019-02-20T08:58:25 < tjq> I was just thinking of anime and irc
2019-02-20T08:58:36 < Steffanx> Pumpers..
2019-02-20T08:58:51 < tjq> Ty
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2019-02-20T09:06:19 < jadew> have to go, ttyl
2019-02-20T09:11:24 < tjq> Australia
2019-02-20T09:11:31 < tjq> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/w8gIkbWc/cousins_meth.PNG
2019-02-20T09:11:53 < R2COM> crt is that you?
2019-02-20T09:13:06 < tjq> Yeah muscles
2019-02-20T09:13:19 < R2COM> i can recognize you on the fly, see?
2019-02-20T09:13:30 < tjq> Most can
2019-02-20T09:14:09 < tjq> If I was going to go under the radar I’d have to start contributing
2019-02-20T09:14:26 < R2COM> to what
2019-02-20T09:14:48 < tjq> I’ve been testing a terrible design that is doomed to fail no matter what is done to it
2019-02-20T09:15:27 < tjq> Now they have to choose profit or a good reputation lol
2019-02-20T09:15:56 < R2COM> design of what
2019-02-20T09:16:13 < tjq> A switching power supply for a product
2019-02-20T09:16:22 < qyx> for a missile guidance computer
2019-02-20T09:16:30 < tjq> Ty I wish
2019-02-20T09:16:41 < tjq> I’d make it launch without command
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2019-02-20T09:18:05 < R2COM> IC ?
2019-02-20T09:18:22 < tjq> IC
2019-02-20T09:18:30 < tjq> Uc3844b
2019-02-20T09:19:11 < R2COM> but thats made by ST
2019-02-20T09:19:13 < tjq> At the very least I’d move to an active clamp
2019-02-20T09:19:30  * tjq dumps head in a bucket
2019-02-20T09:19:35 < R2COM> i thought you testing IC made by whatever your company is
2019-02-20T09:19:47 < tjq> N
2019-02-20T09:19:50 < R2COM> k
2019-02-20T09:19:55 < tjq> Just a simple power supply
2019-02-20T09:21:07 < R2COM> well its easy rite, just follow guidelines of the IC datasheet and make PCB 
2019-02-20T09:24:14 < tjq> Well
2019-02-20T09:24:20 < tjq> Tell China that
2019-02-20T09:24:44 < tjq> Should have to me to design it
2019-02-20T09:24:52 < tjq> told
2019-02-20T09:24:56 < R2COM> china > australia
2019-02-20T09:25:13 < tjq> Indeed
2019-02-20T09:25:19 < tjq> They have the bomb
2019-02-20T09:25:24 < tjq> The power plants
2019-02-20T09:25:28 < tjq> Asian pussy
2019-02-20T09:25:34 < R2COM> yummy
2019-02-20T09:25:52 < tjq> And they kill drug dealers
2019-02-20T09:26:12 < R2COM> drug dealers = sanitizers of humanity
2019-02-20T09:26:13 < tjq> Sounds like the right direction
2019-02-20T09:27:23 < tjq> If heroin was more pure we’d be much better off
2019-02-20T09:27:31 < tjq> At least the fuckers died
2019-02-20T09:27:43 < tjq> Now they’re begging for money
2019-02-20T09:27:45 < tjq> :/
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2019-02-20T09:33:47 < tjq>  If you are Gay, or a nigger, or both, you may want to apply for membership.
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2019-02-20T09:39:28 < R2COM> lol
2019-02-20T09:40:07 < R2COM> oh shit im so tired
2019-02-20T09:40:37 < dongs> too much pumping?
2019-02-20T09:41:00 < R2COM> i should remove habit of bringing work laptop home
2019-02-20T09:42:19 < R2COM> dongs should i buy i9 9900 or watever it is
2019-02-20T09:42:28 < R2COM> 5ghz 8 core or some shit
2019-02-20T09:42:57 < dongs> no
2019-02-20T09:43:27 < tjq> You’d be pumping hard on that, as dong said don’t waste your money
2019-02-20T09:45:09 < tjq> Rather than appeasing
2019-02-20T09:46:31 < tjq> Some fuckhole - it’s great at benchmarks
2019-02-20T09:47:36 < tjq> IRC performance is the only relevant yardstick
2019-02-20T09:48:48 < R2COM> or 135 open pornhub tabs
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2019-02-20T10:02:24 < Steffanx> I have the i7-9700, same shit without the hyperthreading. Its ok
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2019-02-20T10:07:07 < qyx> I have i3-2120T, it is ok too if it is relevant
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2019-02-20T10:10:16 < bitmask> I need to upgrade my design skillz
2019-02-20T10:10:17 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/B9fEsst.png
2019-02-20T10:11:17 < dongs> you also need to upgrade your desktop
2019-02-20T10:11:20 < dongs> to win10 1809
2019-02-20T10:11:34 < qyx> your image is not available, why
2019-02-20T10:11:56 < dongs> he probly noticed the cp channels that were listed on the irc client screenshot
2019-02-20T10:12:01 < dongs> and went back to crop them
2019-02-20T10:12:27 < bitmask> shh
2019-02-20T10:12:28 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/0xptRgV.jpg
2019-02-20T10:12:34 < dongs> lmao
2019-02-20T10:12:36 < dongs> called it
2019-02-20T10:12:45 < bitmask> ;)
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2019-02-20T10:17:00 < Steffanx> Ty qyx 
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2019-02-20T10:50:38 < rajkosto> > using a mac
2019-02-20T10:50:40 < rajkosto> > pro engineer
2019-02-20T10:50:41 < rajkosto> pic kone
2019-02-20T10:51:10 < dongs> worse if actual mac
2019-02-20T10:51:57 < rajkosto> worse if hackintosh as it means you actually WANTED to run their shitty OS and spent effort setting up the drivers/acpi tables and are ok if it breaks next point release
2019-02-20T10:55:09 < dongs> lol
2019-02-20T10:55:12 < dongs> i dont even know whats involved
2019-02-20T10:55:46 < rajkosto> i do and only people who change linux distros every 2 weeks seem to do it because they dont have anything actually productive to do
2019-02-20T10:56:24 < rajkosto> your reward is a shitty OS that has more nags/limitations than Vista did and runs none of the productivity software you want and has the UI of iOS
2019-02-20T10:57:04 < dongs> isn't 'ui of ios' the point why people use mac shit
2019-02-20T10:57:12 < dongs> cuz y ou only need one-two clicks to start scrolling instagram
2019-02-20T10:57:19 < dongs> on your $3000 macbook pro
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2019-02-20T11:52:04 < c10ud> mh...interesting..this f746 fails so much boots when the frequency is set to 216mhz
2019-02-20T11:52:18 < c10ud> I have a f767 and works perfectly
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2019-02-20T11:56:33 < c10ud> probably Ccap are fucked
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2019-02-20T12:13:41 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-20T12:13:47 < dongs> what serial is 2.048mhz 
2019-02-20T12:13:57 < dongs> could this be something like SWO or someshit
2019-02-20T12:14:40 < rajkosto> swdio is 4MHz by default ?
2019-02-20T12:15:05 < dongs> i am not sure
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2019-02-20T12:15:43 < dongs> this seems to be PPM-like? stuff
2019-02-20T12:16:08 -!- kow_ [~afed@135.0.26.55] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
2019-02-20T12:16:09 < dongs> 326ns short pulse width mixed with 650ns
2019-02-20T12:16:25 < dongs> not manchester or self-clocking either because there's long sequences of either short or wide pulse
2019-02-20T12:17:02 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/4Q2RkDq.png
2019-02-20T12:18:25 < dongs> hm wawit thats 1.538mhz
2019-02-20T12:18:30 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: it can be anything you set with prescalers, there's no default.
2019-02-20T12:18:56 < rajkosto> default with stock j-link settings
2019-02-20T12:20:18 < qyx> dongs: pdm uses such weird frequencies
2019-02-20T12:20:25 < qyx> like 48000*64
2019-02-20T12:20:26 < dongs> audio?
2019-02-20T12:20:27 < dongs> hmmm
2019-02-20T12:20:37 < dongs> does that look like pdm tho?
2019-02-20T12:20:41 < dongs> (the waveform
2019-02-20T12:20:49 < qyx> idk, it is just a bunch of pulses on a single wire
2019-02-20T12:21:01 < qyx> it may look like anything
2019-02-20T12:21:01 < dongs> yes basicaklly
2019-02-20T12:21:36 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-20T12:22:39 < qyx> although there should be a clock line too
2019-02-20T12:23:50 < dongs> no
2019-02-20T12:23:52 < dongs> there isnt one
2019-02-20T12:24:00 < rajkosto> can only be manchester then ?
2019-02-20T12:24:04 < dongs> which is why i thought it would be something like manchester/self-clocking shit
2019-02-20T12:24:11 < dongs> raj, but I thought that was supposed to be dispersed
2019-02-20T12:24:16 < dongs> there's long sequences of both long and short pulses
2019-02-20T12:24:16 < rajkosto> the "long" bits being the 1s
2019-02-20T12:24:20 < rajkosto> and short being 0s
2019-02-20T12:24:32 < qyx> but there are short, long and even longer
2019-02-20T12:24:41 < dongs> no,. thjers only 2 types
2019-02-20T12:24:49 < qyx> oh
2019-02-20T12:25:07 < qyx> yes, at most 3 bit long
2019-02-20T12:25:46 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/DL9vxLF.png
2019-02-20T12:26:21 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/iRU1ZUF.png
2019-02-20T12:26:25 < dongs> i see stuff longer than 3 bits
2019-02-20T12:26:43 < dongs> also there's no sync frame of any kind
2019-02-20T12:26:47 < dongs> or lead-in or whatever the fuck
2019-02-20T12:28:06 < dongs> hmm
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2019-02-20T12:28:30 < dongs> i think there';s a start frame of some kind
2019-02-20T12:28:49 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/BmB48sa.png
2019-02-20T12:29:03 < dongs> and there is a 3rd 'very long' thing at start
2019-02-20T12:30:09 < qyx> what kind of device is it
2019-02-20T12:30:20 < dongs> 1us for the start period
2019-02-20T12:30:25 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-20T12:31:11 < dongs> 975 actually
2019-02-20T12:31:16 < dongs> so its all a multiple of 650/2
2019-02-20T12:31:29 < dongs> 325 = short, 650 = medium, 975 = long
2019-02-20T12:31:48 < dongs> qyx, assdroid device
2019-02-20T12:35:13 < dongs> hm m all these numbers are multiples of 1.024mhz or wahtever
2019-02-20T12:35:16 < dongs> this gotta be something weird
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2019-02-20T12:40:21 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, what r u working on
2019-02-20T12:42:28 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/nSUqf0M.png there's definitely framing of some kind
2019-02-20T12:44:05 < dongs> yes
2019-02-20T12:45:00 < dongs> you mean teh next frame?
2019-02-20T12:45:01 < dongs> no its same
2019-02-20T12:45:05 < dongs> same width.
2019-02-20T12:45:16 < dongs> interesting that the variable bits part is *always* same
2019-02-20T12:46:01 < dongs> length tha is
2019-02-20T12:49:41 < dongs> its on a socket
2019-02-20T12:49:45 < dongs> with nothing pluged into it.
2019-02-20T12:49:49 < dongs> which is why im figuring it out.
2019-02-20T12:50:17 < dongs> .
2019-02-20T12:50:37 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/MKmI6Ee.png
2019-02-20T12:50:59 < dongs> that bits thing cant be manchester either, to omany repetitions
2019-02-20T12:51:25 < dongs> but its always fixed width!
2019-02-20T12:51:34 < dongs> so the actual spread of 1/0 in it must be 50/50
2019-02-20T12:51:37 < dongs> so WTF
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2019-02-20T12:59:42 < rajkosto> hmm VisualGDB has supprot for "boosted" JTAG frequency after firmware is loaded but i cant use it if i specify my own board file with OpenOCD
2019-02-20T13:02:42 < rajkosto> nvm it doesnt work as soon as you select stm32f103
2019-02-20T13:16:39 < englishman> ColdKeyboard: theres a company i did work for that does asset tracking via drones (with rtk), downward facing cameras, and AI
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2019-02-20T13:52:12 < rajkosto> dongs, does thermal relief connect to GND even do anything ?
2019-02-20T13:52:32 < rajkosto> they seem to solder at the same rate for me (way slower than non-plane pins)
2019-02-20T13:52:54 < rajkosto> kinda wish that altium would automatically rotate the thermal relief to connect to the existing trace that's there
2019-02-20T13:55:29 < rajkosto> thats not
2019-02-20T13:55:29 < rajkosto> wot
2019-02-20T13:55:41 < rajkosto> it dont be like that
2019-02-20T14:05:06 < zyp> dongs, what'cha looking at?
2019-02-20T14:05:26 < zyp> looks like manchester plus some sort of frame boundary
2019-02-20T14:07:40 < zyp> I mean, it looks like BMC to me, which is a variant of differential manchester
2019-02-20T14:09:06 < rajkosto> doesnt samd have an interesting "any protocol" customizable gpio engine, something like GPIF2 but for serial instead of parallel
2019-02-20T14:09:39 < rajkosto> pwm looks way different
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2019-02-20T14:11:03 < rajkosto> mid range ones
2019-02-20T14:11:05 < dongs> zyp, im not sure also
2019-02-20T14:11:10 < dongs> i mean thats what i wanna find out
2019-02-20T14:11:57 < dongs> yeah i thoguht it could be someshit like WS2812 thing but yea no
2019-02-20T14:12:06 < dongs> there's obviously frames and some bits of stuff
2019-02-20T14:12:16 < dongs> packetized with maybe 1-2 bytes per packet
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2019-02-20T14:15:55 < dongs> zyp, would't bmc have equal number of changes even during repeated bit sequences
2019-02-20T14:16:02 < zyp> no
2019-02-20T14:16:19 < zyp> repeated 0 would be long transitions, repeated 1 would be short transitions
2019-02-20T14:16:48 < zyp> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Biphase_Mark_Code.svg/2000px-Biphase_Mark_Code.svg.png
2019-02-20T14:17:01 < dongs> i saw that
2019-02-20T14:17:23 < dongs> but yh
2019-02-20T14:17:29 < dongs> that looks different?
2019-02-20T14:17:37 < dongs> there's not 50/50 duty stuff there
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2019-02-20T14:45:18 < rajkosto> dongs, could it possibly be RMT ?
2019-02-20T14:55:16 < aandrew> dongs: did you figure out your protocol
2019-02-20T15:14:47 < englishman> dongs: visualgdb looks pretty pro
2019-02-20T15:14:54 < englishman> even supports Keil compiler
2019-02-20T15:15:05 < englishman> but do you have to use shitty opensores libs?
2019-02-20T15:15:26 < rajkosto> i swapped to Light theme in VS just to please dongs
2019-02-20T15:15:43 < rajkosto> (and because with VAX off, which VisualGDB turns off , the dark theme text no longer pops)
2019-02-20T15:16:29 < aandrew> I'll have to check this visualgdb out
2019-02-20T15:16:35 < rajkosto> its poppin
2019-02-20T15:17:01 < rajkosto> you can use your own gcc and make install but you have to use the embedded openocd or whatever j-link package
2019-02-20T15:18:08 < jadew> I have visualgdb, it's ok
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2019-02-20T15:19:12 < jadew> it's no atmel studio, but it has what you need
2019-02-20T15:21:20 < rajkosto> its my favourite since i usually use vs anyway
2019-02-20T15:21:28 < rajkosto> would be even more favourite if it could work at same time as VAX
2019-02-20T15:21:57 < jadew> IIRC that was an issue with VAX
2019-02-20T15:22:10 < jadew> I don't have a VAX license anymore tho
2019-02-20T15:22:23 < rajkosto> nah its cuz if you want to use VisualGDB's syntax highlighting, squigglies and include file paths, you have to not use VAX's
2019-02-20T15:22:33 < rajkosto> and i really like VAX's syntax highlightig and refactoring
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2019-02-20T15:22:56 < jadew> VS 2017 does refactoring just fine
2019-02-20T15:23:15 < jadew> don't remember if VS2015 was able to do it (I can still use VAX with that one)
2019-02-20T15:23:40 < rajkosto> visualGDB asks you if you want to use VAX's stuff or it's stuff 
2019-02-20T15:23:47 < jadew> ah, right
2019-02-20T15:23:49 < jadew> I remember that
2019-02-20T15:24:03 < rajkosto> have to use it's stuff or all the gcc-specific extensions create squigglies and break everything same as include file handling
2019-02-20T15:24:38 < englishman> lol it just fucking crashes
2019-02-20T15:24:47 < englishman> Jesus Christ utter trash
2019-02-20T15:24:55 < jadew> what crashes?
2019-02-20T15:25:20 < rajkosto> visualgdb works beautifully here and compiles(using msbuild but same toolchain) much faster than eclipse with make
2019-02-20T15:26:58 < rajkosto> also starts a COM port session in release mode immediately (semihosting in Debug) so i dont have to use external terminal
2019-02-20T15:29:25 < englishman> vs2017
2019-02-20T15:29:37 < rajkosto> yes latest vs2017
2019-02-20T15:29:37 < englishman> crashes out immediately with vgdb installed
2019-02-20T15:29:51 < rajkosto> noice
2019-02-20T15:32:24 < aandrew> oh it's visual studio 
2019-02-20T15:32:54 < aandrew> if it doesn't interfere with my makefiles and doesn't try to be "smart" it might be ok
2019-02-20T15:32:55 < englishman> support ticket opened
2019-02-20T15:33:00 < englishman> not looking good guys
2019-02-20T15:33:02 < aandrew> I can't remember how it works now
2019-02-20T15:33:06 < rajkosto> its extremely smart unless you use a makefile project i suppose
2019-02-20T15:33:09 < englishman> lol makefiels
2019-02-20T15:33:11 < rajkosto> manages everything for you
2019-02-20T15:33:15 < englishman> fuck off
2019-02-20T15:33:18 < aandrew> rajkosto: ew
2019-02-20T15:33:19 < aandrew> fuck that shit
2019-02-20T15:33:22 < rajkosto> makefiles, ew
2019-02-20T15:33:22 < englishman> makefails*
2019-02-20T15:33:26 < aandrew> how is it any better than eclipse then
2019-02-20T15:33:28 < rajkosto> msbuild is the beest build system, i love .props files
2019-02-20T15:33:41 < rajkosto> 1. its not eclipse
2019-02-20T15:33:49 < aandrew> bullshit hidden "features" for figuring shit out that you need a PhD in visualgdbology to know about or suss out
2019-02-20T15:34:08 < rajkosto> you can use all the visualgdb features with a makefile project chill
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2019-02-20T15:37:22 < rajkosto> the default visualgdb project for stm32 also lets you use a common stm32 bsp (so no copying of all the cmsis/drivers to your local folder) while still copying stm32xxxx_system.c so you can mess with the clocks
2019-02-20T15:47:46 < englishman> how can a makefail person complain about hidden features
2019-02-20T15:47:59 < englishman> literally everything about makefails is hidden
2019-02-20T15:49:01 < englishman> yeah Raj I am stoked to use vs for embedded too bad their software CRASHES VS IMMEDIATELY WHAT THE FUCK
2019-02-20T15:49:14 < rajkosto> lol
2019-02-20T15:49:15 < rajkosto> 5.4 ?
2019-02-20T15:49:33 < rajkosto> i even have tons of other add-ins in vs like qt and android and vax and it all worked fine
2019-02-20T15:50:15 < rajkosto> report the issue with the crashdump or something
2019-02-20T15:50:58 < englishman> 5.4 what
2019-02-20T15:51:07 < rajkosto> VisualGDB
2019-02-20T15:51:11 < englishman> no idea
2019-02-20T15:51:15 < englishman> download today
2019-02-20T15:51:26 < englishman> why would I give a shit about version
2019-02-20T15:51:34 < rajkosto> cuz they rewrote half of it in 5.4
2019-02-20T15:51:40 < englishman> put it back
2019-02-20T15:51:43 < englishman> put it back
2019-02-20T15:51:46 < rajkosto> download 5.3r2
2019-02-20T15:51:50 < rajkosto> see if that works
2019-02-20T15:52:00 < englishman> sounds like effort
2019-02-20T15:52:07 < rajkosto> effort is continuing to eclipse
2019-02-20T15:52:11 < englishman> or keil
2019-02-20T15:52:15 < englishman> ?
2019-02-20T15:52:22 < rajkosto> keil is like using msvc++6.0
2019-02-20T15:52:24 < englishman> why the shit would I want to fix my tools
2019-02-20T15:52:27 < rajkosto> like almost identical
2019-02-20T15:52:32 < englishman> tools are supposed to do work not make work
2019-02-20T15:53:05 < rajkosto> what if you ARE the tool
2019-02-20T15:53:19 < englishman> luckily I'm not in the embedded ide business
2019-02-20T15:59:34 < aandrew> rajkosto> the default visualgdb project for stm32 also lets you use a common stm32 bsp (so no copying of all the cmsis/drivers to your local folder) while still copying stm32xxxx_system.c so you can mess with the clocks
2019-02-20T15:59:39 < aandrew> that's a nice feature
2019-02-20T16:00:03 < rajkosto> or it references nothing and you provide everything including ldscripts
2019-02-20T16:00:37 < rajkosto> but yeah its "managed", the VisualGDB settings are in their own little dialog not in normal Project properties, and they are stored in XML files next to vcxproj
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2019-02-20T16:52:30 < kakimir> can I initialize values of array per index?
2019-02-20T16:52:39 < kakimir> not just listing in order
2019-02-20T16:53:35 < rajkosto> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/40688666/initialize-sparse-constant-array-in-c
2019-02-20T16:53:38 < kakimir> gcc designated inits
2019-02-20T16:53:40 < kakimir> wow
2019-02-20T16:53:45 < kakimir> my life changed
2019-02-20T16:53:55 < rajkosto> C99 also lests you do that to struct members
2019-02-20T16:54:05 < kakimir> my proprocessor code life
2019-02-20T16:54:06 < kakimir> *
2019-02-20T16:54:08 < rajkosto> struct whatever var = {.member = whatever};
2019-02-20T16:55:02 < kakimir> well no shit
2019-02-20T17:03:02 < Steffanx> Yw kakimir 
2019-02-20T17:05:55 < kakimir> ?
2019-02-20T17:06:03 < kakimir> thx?
2019-02-20T17:06:36 < kakimir> oh rajkosto linked the thing
2019-02-20T17:07:15 < kakimir> thanks rajkosto 
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2019-02-20T17:48:34 < kakimir> intentional overflow
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2019-02-20T17:52:19 < kakimir> I want to use something else instead of {} constructor for array
2019-02-20T17:54:15 < rajkosto> you can use string constants
2019-02-20T17:55:40 < kakimir> can I do something like const array[SIZE] = (type)(value)?
2019-02-20T17:56:22 < rajkosto> sure
2019-02-20T17:56:32 < rajkosto> array[SIZE] = { (type)(value) }
2019-02-20T17:56:38 < rajkosto> but all elements you dont specify are 0
2019-02-20T17:57:05 < kakimir> I mean my array size is 2
2019-02-20T17:57:23 < rajkosto> just use a repeat macro
2019-02-20T17:57:35 < rajkosto> if the array was of a considerable size tho, it would be better to leave it empty and just initialize with code though
2019-02-20T17:57:39 < rajkosto> wastes less flash space
2019-02-20T17:57:59 < kakimir> hmm I go with uint16_t
2019-02-20T17:58:12 < kakimir> my macro generates 16bits
2019-02-20T17:58:12 < rajkosto> i mean if you have a 1024 element array
2019-02-20T17:58:20 < rajkosto> and you want it all to be the value 1337
2019-02-20T17:58:41 < rajkosto> repeating the value 1337 1024 times will waste a lot more flash than just a for loop setting each element to 1337 and leaving it uninitialized
2019-02-20T17:58:46 < kakimir> yes.. but rarelly it's the case
2019-02-20T17:59:09 < rajkosto> you dont need the cast either, but you will get a narrowing conversion warning by the compiler if you dont use it
2019-02-20T17:59:23 < rajkosto> just typing out the value twice is probably better than using a repeat macro
2019-02-20T17:59:33 < rajkosto> for readability
2019-02-20T17:59:52 < rajkosto> with C++ you have a lot more options, by using constexpr initialization functions
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2019-02-20T18:03:48 < rajkosto> can programmatically generate whatever the hell you want at compile time that gets stuck into .data
2019-02-20T18:13:42 < Cracki> hmmm how far can that go? can that generate lookup tables of "nontrivial" math functions that are just faster to lookup+interpolate than to compute?
2019-02-20T18:16:37 < rajkosto> any function you call in a constexpr function must also be constexpr
2019-02-20T18:17:07 < Cracki> sure but how does that translate to filling an array?
2019-02-20T18:17:21 < Cracki> are loops ok or does this work with some template recursion fuckery?
2019-02-20T18:17:29 < rajkosto> loops of constexpr size are ok
2019-02-20T18:17:43 < Cracki> (the function I'd compute has a closed form but it involves floating point math)
2019-02-20T18:17:56 < rajkosto> dunno if sinf is constexpr or if floats are constexpr at all
2019-02-20T18:18:14 < rajkosto> some obvious stuff like pointer casts are not constexpr for whatever reason
2019-02-20T18:18:33 < Cracki> errno fucks it up https://stackoverflow.com/questions/17347935/constexpr-math-functions
2019-02-20T18:18:56 < Cracki> ah, c++14 might have fixed that
2019-02-20T18:19:31 < Cracki> this would allow me to get rid of the python script that generates the table
2019-02-20T18:19:35 < rajkosto> in C++11 theres no complicated constexpr at all
2019-02-20T18:19:48 < rajkosto> in C++14 its of medium complexity but lots of template MPL stuff is still required
2019-02-20T18:19:59 < rajkosto> C++17 should be just like writing a normal function
2019-02-20T18:20:25 < Cracki> good, I think gcc 8.2/8.3 will do that
2019-02-20T18:20:58 < Cracki> 7 even
2019-02-20T18:23:18 < Cracki> uh... does constexpr imply that it has to be all expressions, no statements/loops?
2019-02-20T18:23:31 < Cracki> nvm, reading a blog post from 2011...
2019-02-20T18:23:33 < rajkosto> in C++11
2019-02-20T18:24:04 < rajkosto> range based for and iterators are not constexpr
2019-02-20T18:24:10 < rajkosto> a int loop is
2019-02-20T18:24:10 < Cracki> damnit, so much written about it for c++11, which is not what I care about
2019-02-20T18:24:17 < Cracki> int loop is ok
2019-02-20T18:25:30 < rajkosto> a constexpr function is not guaranteed to be evaluated at compile time unless the variable youre storing the result into is also constexpr 
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2019-02-20T18:29:27 < Cracki> nice https://stackoverflow.com/a/37413361/2602877
2019-02-20T18:30:17 < Cracki> hm... what would happen if you overrun the array range... exploiting the compiler?
2019-02-20T18:30:32 < rajkosto> compile error
2019-02-20T18:30:43 < Cracki> so... they are smart enough these days
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2019-02-20T18:32:13 < rajkosto> https://godbolt.org/z/Nmbl9G
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2019-02-20T18:33:28 < rajkosto> try it there
2019-02-20T18:33:30 < Cracki> <3
2019-02-20T18:36:01 < Cracki> my table is the derivative of a square root, which is 1 / (2 sqrt(x)) so lookup is way cheaper. iirc even the fpu takes a dozen or so cycles for one of division or sqrt
2019-02-20T18:36:49 < Cracki> that table started as the time between steps for a stepper motor acceleration profile, which, in the limit, is the derivative of a sqrt
2019-02-20T18:40:08 < Cracki> nice it works, even complained about the degenerate 1/0 case
2019-02-20T18:42:26 < Cracki> can that site also execute the binary?
2019-02-20T18:42:58 < rajkosto> nop
2019-02-20T18:43:01 < rajkosto> other sites for that
2019-02-20T18:43:55 < rajkosto> you can see all your generated stuff at the start of the assembly
2019-02-20T18:43:59 < rajkosto> all them .words
2019-02-20T18:44:20 < Cracki> I still wish c++ had the c syntax of {.field = value, ...} for struct initialization
2019-02-20T18:44:23 < rajkosto> some compilers are dumb and emit a huge constructor with all the words in code form instead (thanks msvc in debug mode)
2019-02-20T18:44:28 < Cracki> or anything equivalent
2019-02-20T18:44:28 < rajkosto> that's C99
2019-02-20T18:44:32 < Cracki> I know
2019-02-20T18:45:08 < rajkosto> and its because C++ has constructors
2019-02-20T18:45:14 < Cracki> yeees
2019-02-20T18:45:26 < rajkosto> you can write anonymous constexpr lambda functions for your constructors btw ;)
2019-02-20T18:45:36 < Cracki> let me understand that first
2019-02-20T18:45:43 < Cracki> hmhm yes...
2019-02-20T18:46:12 < rajkosto> constexpr SomeStruct initializeMe = [](){ code to return initialized value };
2019-02-20T18:46:21 < rajkosto> woops missing (); at end
2019-02-20T18:46:34 < Cracki> i mostly use struct literals for optional init
2019-02-20T18:46:40 < Cracki> but c++ has optional args iirc
2019-02-20T18:46:57 < Cracki> would still be nice not to have to write a ctor for that
2019-02-20T18:46:59 < rajkosto> has defaults
2019-02-20T18:47:04 < Cracki> yes, defaults
2019-02-20T18:47:43 < Cracki> for c99 I can just have {...} with the values I care about and the rest are its type's default, without any code to be explicit about it
2019-02-20T18:47:53 < rajkosto> you can have that with constructors as well
2019-02-20T18:48:00 < rajkosto> since c++11 you have default values for all the members
2019-02-20T18:48:01 < Cracki> illuminate me pls
2019-02-20T18:48:13 < Cracki> I still have to write the ctor, no?
2019-02-20T18:48:23 < rajkosto> it only needs to write the values you need to change
2019-02-20T18:48:33 < Cracki> with Foo(int a, int b, ...) : a(a), b(b), ...?
2019-02-20T18:48:39 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-20T18:48:46 < Cracki> that's boilerplate
2019-02-20T18:48:50 < rajkosto> youre boilerplate
2019-02-20T18:49:08 < rajkosto> c++ has encapsulation and does not like just exposing all the members like C's designator initializers do
2019-02-20T18:49:20 < Cracki> not very communist
2019-02-20T18:49:28 < rajkosto> C++20 will have limited designator initialziers
2019-02-20T18:49:46 < Cracki> I just noticed the "C++20" label here... https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/aggregate_initialization
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2019-02-20T18:50:53 < Cracki> does c++ have named arguments yet?
2019-02-20T18:51:40 < Cracki> this appears to dispatch by type, instead of coercing... https://www.programiz.com/cpp-programming/default-argument
2019-02-20T18:51:56 < rajkosto> default arguments are just syntactic sugar
2019-02-20T18:52:07 < rajkosto> its why they can only appear in the declaration of a function too
2019-02-20T18:52:12 < Cracki> oh no, that site is just shit
2019-02-20T18:53:11 < rajkosto> well the pattern for having named parameters is to just make a struct
2019-02-20T18:53:21 < rajkosto> and default initialize them all
2019-02-20T18:53:28 < rajkosto> then pass that as the single argument
2019-02-20T18:53:44 < Cracki> but in c++ you can't initialize specific fields of a struct from a literal!
2019-02-20T18:53:49 < Cracki> not much of a workaround
2019-02-20T18:53:55 < kakimir> c++20? :o
2019-02-20T18:54:05 < rajkosto> you can with either member functions that reutnr a this reference
2019-02-20T18:54:08 < Cracki> I'm impatient. it's the current year!
2019-02-20T18:54:17 < rajkosto> or just write lambda functions
2019-02-20T18:54:22 < Cracki> foo().setA().setB()...?
2019-02-20T18:54:25 < rajkosto> yeah that
2019-02-20T18:54:27 < Cracki> how do lambdas solve that?
2019-02-20T18:54:55 < Cracki> that'd look like []() { Foo foo; foo.b = 123; return foo; }
2019-02-20T18:55:00 < rajkosto> or ConstructorCall([]() { StructWithDefaults val; val.A = 5; val.B = 4; return val }());
2019-02-20T18:55:15 < Cracki> and that's way more than (struct Foo){ .b = 123 }
2019-02-20T18:55:24 < rajkosto> wait for c++20 then
2019-02-20T18:55:35 < rajkosto> you can also do it with named tuples
2019-02-20T18:55:37 < Cracki> grml
2019-02-20T18:55:41 < Cracki> whats that
2019-02-20T18:55:52 < Cracki> googling...
2019-02-20T18:56:45 < rajkosto> https://github.com/duckie/named_types
2019-02-20T18:56:56 < rajkosto> this makes your c++ code more like javascript/python nonsense tho
2019-02-20T18:57:06 < Cracki> hmmmm
2019-02-20T18:57:11 < rajkosto> where you check your argument for the presence of a named value and if its there, apply it
2019-02-20T18:57:16 < Cracki> code smells french there
2019-02-20T18:59:47 < Cracki> ok fuck that I'll just have to give that convenience up and define ctors for the cases I need
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2019-02-20T19:02:52 < Cracki> hehehe this looks naughty https://www.fluentcpp.com/2018/12/14/named-arguments-cpp/
2019-02-20T19:04:08 < invzim> utter fail  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGB7Yrbeo_Y
2019-02-20T19:04:58 < invzim> it's actually a little interesting how/why stupidity propagates
2019-02-20T19:05:17 < Cracki> those tweezers look pozzed
2019-02-20T19:05:36 < Cracki> omg is that a booger on the tip?!
2019-02-20T19:05:39 < invzim> how can you try to teach soldering without using flux..
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2019-02-20T19:06:45 < Cracki> kek
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2019-02-20T19:09:12 < rajkosto> invzim, he has flux in his solder
2019-02-20T19:10:26 < Cracki> i use to little copper wick, I just recently discovered that it was fluxed
2019-02-20T19:10:43 < rajkosto> all the copper wicks that WORK are fluxed.
2019-02-20T19:10:55 < rajkosto> the ones that arent work terribly (the chinese garbage)
2019-02-20T19:11:02 < rajkosto> i dont see whats wrong with that video
2019-02-20T19:11:05 < Cracki> never noticed before... guess I never had unfluxed wick
2019-02-20T19:11:16 < rajkosto> he also solders a way finer pitch afterwards
2019-02-20T19:11:46 < Cracki> working with extra flux, if not the first lesson, needs to be mentioned
2019-02-20T19:11:54 < rajkosto> never found good flux
2019-02-20T19:11:57 < rajkosto> thats also cheap
2019-02-20T19:12:00 < rajkosto> so i just add mroe solder
2019-02-20T19:12:02 < rajkosto> that adds more flux
2019-02-20T19:12:07 < Cracki> he basically demonstrated drag soldering
2019-02-20T19:12:09 < rajkosto> and then remove extra solder with blob
2019-02-20T19:12:17 < Cracki> I'm 5 minutes in, he hasn't said "well tip" yet
2019-02-20T19:12:43 < rajkosto> its not an advanced tutorial
2019-02-20T19:13:00 < rajkosto> just "tack down the 2 corner pins and then blob up the rest"
2019-02-20T19:13:26 < Cracki> has mentioned optical magnification?
2019-02-20T19:13:38 < rajkosto> for SOIC...
2019-02-20T19:13:53 < Cracki> someone said he's gonna solder smaller stuff?
2019-02-20T19:14:02 < rajkosto> he doesnt use any pro stuff...
2019-02-20T19:14:05 < rajkosto> he's a MAKER
2019-02-20T19:14:09 < Cracki> oh right
2019-02-20T19:14:12 < rajkosto> uses EAGLE and BREADBOARDS and THROUGH HOLE
2019-02-20T19:14:24 < Cracki> sherlock holmes style magnifying glass is definitely not make:r :P
2019-02-20T19:14:38 < Cracki> through hole for wire terminals? sounds good to me
2019-02-20T19:14:45 < Cracki> or is that pin strips...
2019-02-20T19:15:24 < Cracki> ah! at 9:40 he says "some liquid flux would come in handy"
2019-02-20T19:15:54 < rajkosto> his eagle maker boards dont even have vias tented
2019-02-20T19:15:58 < Cracki> he wouldn't have to touch the chip while removing tweezers if the tweezers weren't grimy and sticky
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2019-02-20T19:17:10 < Cracki> oh right I need to find my brass "sponge"...
2019-02-20T19:17:33 < invzim> in other news, snip snip - got a new tool today :) https://www.digikey.no/products/en?keywords=10828S-ND
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2019-02-20T19:22:25 < bitmask> javafx vs swing, what should I learn?
2019-02-20T19:24:59 < Cracki> good q, I'm facing the same decision
2019-02-20T19:25:51 < Cracki> I'm leaning towards javafx. more modern paradigms
2019-02-20T19:26:42 < bitmask> k
2019-02-20T19:29:56 < Cracki> green field: probably javafx, existing programs: probably swing? :P
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2019-02-20T19:32:39 < Cracki> probably same discussion as WinForms vs WPF. winforms is solid but getting no love anymore, wpf seems to make you decide too many things you might not even care about
2019-02-20T19:37:43 < Cracki> for the kind of stuff I need (show a picture, interact with it), anything is good
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2019-02-20T19:48:30 < Cracki> here's some propaganda for javafx: https://www.dummies.com/programming/java/10-differences-between-javafx-and-swing/
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2019-02-20T20:10:53 < zyp> bitmask, they are probably both shit
2019-02-20T20:11:07 < bitmask> great attitude ;)
2019-02-20T20:11:17 < zyp> no, I'm serious
2019-02-20T20:11:31 < bitmask> yea possibly but its whats out there
2019-02-20T20:11:53 < zyp> I haven't looked at javafx, but I encountered swing when I had programming 101 in uni
2019-02-20T20:12:09 < zyp> it's shit, so I ended up going with Qt instead
2019-02-20T20:12:16 < Cracki> please don't use programming 101 in uni to judge
2019-02-20T20:12:28 < zyp> swing is shit no matter what the occasion
2019-02-20T20:12:31 < Cracki> imho qt is shit, because their docs are shit
2019-02-20T20:12:45 < zyp> haha, what
2019-02-20T20:13:01 < mawk> they're autogenerated docs like 38450948309 other projects
2019-02-20T20:13:07 < mawk> but apart from that they're not so bad
2019-02-20T20:13:15 < Cracki> they don't answer the right questions
2019-02-20T20:13:22 < Cracki> it's like a cookbook
2019-02-20T20:13:33 < zyp> Qt has pretty consistently decent documentation
2019-02-20T20:13:36 < Cracki> and api docs
2019-02-20T20:13:49 < Cracki> I have gone through their shit a thousand times.
2019-02-20T20:14:12 < Cracki> haven't found a guide to all their bs
2019-02-20T20:14:28 < zyp> haha
2019-02-20T20:14:45 < Cracki> I regularly get frustrated by their seeming preference for WALLS OF FUCKING TEXT instead of a simple explanatory graphic
2019-02-20T20:14:53 < Cracki> so yes it's shit
2019-02-20T20:15:31 < zyp> so what's better?
2019-02-20T20:15:37 < Cracki> it's a fucking cookbook. what I expect is explanations of the basic building blocks, the rationales, etc
2019-02-20T20:15:49 < Cracki> wrong question my pal
2019-02-20T20:16:06 < Cracki> criticism is meant to suggest improvement, not replacement
2019-02-20T20:16:49 < Cracki> did your programming 101 touch javafx?
2019-02-20T20:17:31 < zyp> no
2019-02-20T20:17:48 < zyp> are swing and swt different things?
2019-02-20T20:17:55 < zyp> IIRC it touched both of those
2019-02-20T20:18:02 < zyp> I largely avoided them and went with qt
2019-02-20T20:18:14 < Cracki> yes, swing != swt
2019-02-20T20:18:18 < Cracki> swt is even older than swing
2019-02-20T20:18:35 < Cracki> and lots of people (on reddit etc) seem to mix up spring (some server framework) and swing (gui)
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2019-02-20T20:56:37 < zyp> ah, I've encountered that too
2019-02-20T21:13:49 < kakimir> how did laurencer get banned this time?
2019-02-20T21:14:39 < zyp> guy I know wrote some web service built on spring, I committed some code to it a few years ago
2019-02-20T21:15:01 < zyp> didn't seem all that awful in itself, just very enterprise and I hate enterprise
2019-02-20T21:15:19 < banana> i love enterprise
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2019-02-20T21:22:41 < Cracki> >enterprise
2019-02-20T21:22:51 < Cracki> you should look up worf/wesley slashfic sometime
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2019-02-20T22:56:47 < Steffann> Found tjq on the web https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe8ZmE2Dj3s&feature=youtu.be
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2019-02-20T23:18:13 < englishman> zyp, so, do you want that clonejob
2019-02-20T23:18:17 < englishman> guy is bugging me about it
2019-02-20T23:22:48 < zyp> ah, that
2019-02-20T23:23:19 < zyp> how was it, does the layout need to be a close replica, or just functionally?
2019-02-20T23:24:53 < englishman> functional
2019-02-20T23:29:32 < zyp> how's the timeline looking? I'm away this week, like I think I mentioned I would be
2019-02-20T23:29:38 < antto> aka there's room for innovation
2019-02-20T23:30:16 < zyp> worked from 0800 to 2130 today
2019-02-20T23:30:26 < englishman> oh no worries
2019-02-20T23:30:31 < englishman> the guy has already waited some months
2019-02-20T23:30:44 < englishman> also sorry for not following the movements of important chatters
2019-02-20T23:30:59 < antto> shame on u
2019-02-20T23:31:00 < englishman> i will try to stay up to date on important chatter trips
2019-02-20T23:31:22 < zyp> h<hh<h<haha
2019-02-20T23:31:31 < zyp> also, internet sucks here
2019-02-20T23:33:12 < zyp> anyway, I hope I'll get home some time this weekend, so I hope I can find some time to look at it next week
2019-02-20T23:36:12 < englishman> cool
2019-02-20T23:36:13 < englishman> thanks
2019-02-20T23:38:47 < zyp> https://bin.jvnv.net/file/HLYHV.jpg <- working on this stuff this week
2019-02-20T23:39:28 < englishman> for some reason i was expecting mechanized japanese dolls
2019-02-20T23:39:38 < englishman> i could still be right
2019-02-20T23:39:38 < zyp> haha
2019-02-20T23:39:56 < aandrew> well that does look an awful lot like japanese tentacle porn with a bit of an industrial twist
2019-02-20T23:40:10 < zyp> could probably build a gundam out of these, they have pretty fucking crazy torque
2019-02-20T23:40:11 < aandrew> that is a lot of hydraulics. wtf are you doing
2019-02-20T23:40:31 < zyp> aandrew, firmware :D
2019-02-20T23:40:35 < aandrew> hahaha
2019-02-20T23:40:46 < kakimir> zyp: hmm hydraulic motors to operate what?
2019-02-20T23:40:53 < zyp> winches and shit
2019-02-20T23:41:09 < kakimir> winches for what?
2019-02-20T23:41:50 < englishman> winching
2019-02-20T23:42:07 < kakimir> winching what?
2019-02-20T23:42:24 < kakimir> hey
2019-02-20T23:42:28 < kakimir> is that in a boat?
2019-02-20T23:43:27 < qyx> wtf is that octopus
2019-02-20T23:43:39 < kakimir> hydraulic apparatus
2019-02-20T23:44:37 < aandrew> it's clear he either can't or doesn't want to specify
2019-02-20T23:44:39 < aandrew> looks cool anyway
2019-02-20T23:44:39 < kakimir> hydraulic motors with incredibly complex tubing
2019-02-20T23:45:09 < qyx> I can see some metric connectors
2019-02-20T23:46:00 < qyx> is it that board you posted in the past
2019-02-20T23:46:06 < qyx> with M12 ethernets
2019-02-20T23:46:22 < qyx> under the cylindrical shaped part
2019-02-20T23:46:32 < kakimir> every cylinder has dual solenoids
2019-02-20T23:46:59 < kakimir> are those some kind of hydraulic servo type motors?
2019-02-20T23:47:29 < kakimir> or maybe "digital hydraulics" to harvest back movements every
2019-02-20T23:47:32 < kakimir> energy
2019-02-20T23:48:38 < kakimir> or maybe it has speed control where things are connected paraller or series depending on torque/speed compromise required
2019-02-20T23:49:44 < kakimir> but anyway those look like drive motors of excavator or machine like forrest tractor
2019-02-20T23:51:20 < kakimir> zyp: please
2019-02-20T23:51:26 < kakimir> any hints?
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--- Day changed Thu Feb 21 2019
2019-02-21T00:00:17 < kakimir> 3 pressure transducers in front
2019-02-21T00:01:00 < kakimir> that cable routing is a bit meeh
2019-02-21T00:01:09 < zyp> sorry, I left to go shower
2019-02-21T00:01:24 < zyp> qyx, yeah, that's correct
2019-02-21T00:02:26 < zyp> kakimir, yeah, this is digital hydraulics
2019-02-21T00:02:59 < zyp> each cylinder has digitally controlled valves to high- and low-pressure feeds
2019-02-21T00:03:00 < kakimir> I thought it was done only for linear motions
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2019-02-21T00:05:29 < antto> rajkosto, flux iz cheap if u brew your own
2019-02-21T00:05:41 < rajkosto> i dont want that
2019-02-21T00:05:49 < rajkosto> i want the amtech tacky gel flux
2019-02-21T00:05:51 < rajkosto> that works miracles
2019-02-21T00:06:08 < englishman> raj, i got visualgdb to work
2019-02-21T00:06:09 < rajkosto> but no way to get that easily, would have to pay lots of money to american resellers
2019-02-21T00:06:12 < englishman> it needed some package
2019-02-21T00:06:18 < kakimir> rajkosto: multifix 450-01
2019-02-21T00:06:20 < antto> my lemon flux is surprisingly effective during soldering
2019-02-21T00:06:21 < englishman> their support was dumb as fuck and didnt help at all
2019-02-21T00:06:42 < kakimir> 450-01 is a gel worth to try
2019-02-21T00:07:20 < zyp> kakimir, and no, it's not in a boat, it's in the workshop of the partner company who makes the motors
2019-02-21T00:07:31 < kakimir> that is a test bench?
2019-02-21T00:07:40 < zyp> yes
2019-02-21T00:10:34 < zyp> we've ran tests before with just one of these paired to a traditional one with a mechanical distributor valve
2019-02-21T00:11:04 < zyp> (the latter operating as a pump to create a load)
2019-02-21T00:11:13 < englishman> a pumper pro
2019-02-21T00:11:31 < zyp> this is a new test bench where we can run various combinations of up to four motors
2019-02-21T00:12:19 < kakimir> very interesting
2019-02-21T00:13:49 < zyp> traditional one was a bit big for the flange, so they could only fit three bolts to hold it
2019-02-21T00:14:01 < zyp> when we started applying torque, it started wiggling around :p
2019-02-21T00:14:42 < zyp> apparently somebody is gonna just weld the flange tomorrow morning so we don't have to worry about shearing the bolts :p
2019-02-21T00:18:43 < kakimir> three bolts hmm..
2019-02-21T00:18:48 < kakimir> nope.
2019-02-21T00:24:09 < zyp> :p
2019-02-21T00:25:50 < zyp> overpressure valve on the hydraulic pump were stuck earlier today
2019-02-21T00:27:09 < zyp> shit was pushing around 50 bar no matter how much we set it to pump and nothing seemed to happen when we tried adjusting it
2019-02-21T00:28:20 < kakimir> stuck open?
2019-02-21T00:28:50 < zyp> well, yeah, since it's overpressure it releases pressure when it goes above the set value
2019-02-21T00:29:37 < zyp> we were wondering if there were any leaks elsewhere in the system since we couldn't really get the pressure over 50 bar
2019-02-21T00:30:33 < kakimir> was it faulty or just misadjusted?
2019-02-21T00:30:43 < zyp> until it apparently suddenly came loose when nobody was touching it
2019-02-21T00:30:56 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-21T00:31:48 < zyp> other guy had been trying to adjust it and were walking away from it when all of a sudden the pressure rose rapidly until it hit the automatic emergency stop :p
2019-02-21T00:32:01 < aandrew> zyp> until it apparently suddenly came loose when nobody was touching it
2019-02-21T00:32:07 < aandrew> that would cause underpressure for sure. heh
2019-02-21T00:32:18 < zyp> loose as in unstuck
2019-02-21T00:32:31 < aandrew> oh
2019-02-21T00:32:32 < zyp> presumably it came loose and shut
2019-02-21T00:32:41 < aandrew> I thought hydraulic oil spraying everywhere through a loose connection
2019-02-21T00:33:00 < zyp> sorry if I worded that badly
2019-02-21T00:33:44 < zyp> we've had some oil sprays too from bad seals
2019-02-21T00:34:07 < zyp> but that was earlier at lower pressure
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2019-02-21T00:40:46 < kakimir> funds are safu
2019-02-21T00:43:33 < Steffann> Is that you steven?
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2019-02-21T01:24:00 < englishman> god damn altidumb 19 is so fucking slow
2019-02-21T01:25:07 < rajkosto> why does every altium force itself onto my .c file association
2019-02-21T01:25:18 < rajkosto> and then when it opens it does NOTHING other than making a Debug.log in the .c file location
2019-02-21T01:28:19 < kakimir> did they reinvent file naming?
2019-02-21T01:36:19 < Cracki> didn't they extend altium towards fpga programming? maybe they also support HLS from c source now? :>
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2019-02-21T01:48:57 < rajkosto> i hate it
2019-02-21T01:51:43 < Cracki> hate is good
2019-02-21T01:51:58 < Cracki> *sith talking points*
2019-02-21T02:27:46 < catphish> stm32 seems not to support high speed usb without an external phy, lame :(
2019-02-21T02:32:21 < jadew> sup?
2019-02-21T02:33:13 < rajkosto> catphish, supreme lame
2019-02-21T02:33:23 < rajkosto> just stick a 1$ FX2 on there for high speed usb
2019-02-21T02:34:55 < catphish> all i really need is a usb<->i2s bridge, there's probably a better choice then stm32 anyway, like https://www.ftdichip.com/Products/ICs/FT90x.html
2019-02-21T02:35:28 < catphish> just still looking at ways to drive audio into usb
2019-02-21T02:36:10 < rajkosto> for i2s i use CP2114
2019-02-21T02:36:14 < rajkosto> tho thats not high speed either is it
2019-02-21T02:36:25 < rajkosto> you might want one of those xaudio whatever they are called, multi core audio processing chips with high speed usb
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2019-02-21T02:39:23 < rajkosto> XMOS
2019-02-21T02:39:46 < catphish> so, lowest spec would be 8 x 48000 x 24 bps of i2c = 9.2Mbps
2019-02-21T02:39:50 < catphish> *i2s
2019-02-21T02:40:05 < rajkosto> you want 8 channel 24bit ?
2019-02-21T02:40:11 < rajkosto> get dat xmos
2019-02-21T02:40:14 < catphish> too high for FS USB really
2019-02-21T02:40:29 < rajkosto> there's also some cmedia chips you can use
2019-02-21T02:41:21 < catphish> i'm still getting my head around how i2s actually works, but seems you can parallel up ADCs and run lots into one stream
2019-02-21T02:42:20 < rajkosto> its a weird fuckin SPI with additional R/L pin
2019-02-21T02:43:13 < catphish> essentially what i want is to have 8 ADCs, latch them all simultaneously, then have each one stream its 24 bits in turn
2019-02-21T02:43:30 < catphish> then convert the resulting stream to usb
2019-02-21T02:43:46 < rajkosto> how will you do that
2019-02-21T02:43:55 < rajkosto> like when its not its turn
2019-02-21T02:44:32 < catphish> i don't know how they know when to transmit, but i'm told they can be run in parallel somehow
2019-02-21T02:44:50 < rajkosto> i dont think thats how i2s works at all
2019-02-21T02:44:56 < rajkosto> if you want more than 2 channels you just run multiple i2s buses
2019-02-21T02:45:15 < rajkosto> since R/L is literally one pin with 2 possible states == 2 channels
2019-02-21T02:46:02 < catphish> yeah that puzzled me too
2019-02-21T02:47:45 < catphish> with that said, 4 channel i2s ADCs exist
2019-02-21T02:50:01 < rajkosto> yes but its multiple i2s buses at the same time
2019-02-21T02:50:10 < rajkosto> not one running at 4x the frequency and somehow 3-bit R/L signals
2019-02-21T02:50:15 < catphish> yeah, i just came to that conclusion
2019-02-21T02:50:45 < catphish> well that's irritating
2019-02-21T02:50:47 < rajkosto> the one you might be thinking of 
2019-02-21T02:50:48 < rajkosto> is SPDIF
2019-02-21T02:51:02 < rajkosto> which is clock and data in one line up to 8 channels or so
2019-02-21T02:54:59 < catphish> well that sucks :)
2019-02-21T02:55:21 < catphish> new plan then i guess
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2019-02-21T02:58:25 < catphish> looks like the TI ADCs have a "TDM" mode that can handle up to 10 x 24-bit channels
2019-02-21T03:00:14 < catphish> https://i.imgur.com/QvJvEnj.png
2019-02-21T03:01:20 < rajkosto> full wiring pls
2019-02-21T03:02:19 < catphish> this is from TI's datasheet http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/pcm1864-q1.pdf page 73
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2019-02-21T03:13:55 < catphish> multiple i2s seems popular, but would need to find a usb chip with enough connectivity
2019-02-21T03:14:05 < catphish> thanks for the pointers anyway
2019-02-21T03:16:13 < catphish> that tdm might be ideal too if i can get it into a usb ic somehow :)
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2019-02-21T04:34:24 < englishman> https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1334343#
2019-02-21T04:34:26 < englishman> neat
2019-02-21T04:36:25 < englishman> will the world make a return to magnetic media
2019-02-21T04:44:20 < aandrew> that's pretty wild
2019-02-21T04:44:33 < aandrew> solid state magnetic media
2019-02-21T04:47:01 < banana> >.>
2019-02-21T04:47:09 < banana> bananning englishman
2019-02-21T04:47:41 < englishman> your nick sucks fyi
2019-02-21T04:47:47 < banana> no u
2019-02-21T04:52:24 < englishman> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fcDdobgIr0
2019-02-21T05:02:13 < banana> thats kinda cool
2019-02-21T05:08:40 < aandrew> no
2019-02-21T05:08:46 < aandrew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ao6stS2toU is kind of cool
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2019-02-21T05:29:59 < dongs> god damn
2019-02-21T05:30:05 < dongs> this dumb brazilian company wants me to send shit by DHL
2019-02-21T05:30:11 < dongs> when its like $280 for 500gram box
2019-02-21T05:30:17 < dongs> and they're buying shit thats costs half of that
2019-02-21T05:30:19 < dongs> fuckign retards
2019-02-21T05:30:44 < scrts> $280 includes gram of colombian coke?
2019-02-21T05:30:49 < dongs> i fucking hope so
2019-02-21T05:30:56 < dongs> DHL rates out of here are straight up retarded
2019-02-21T05:32:00 < scrts> what are u shipping from there?
2019-02-21T05:32:17 < tjq> duhhhhhl
2019-02-21T05:32:27 < dongs> some pcbs
2019-02-21T05:32:49 < R2COM> they have money so just do what they ask
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2019-02-21T05:35:25 < tjq> yeah mate
2019-02-21T05:35:55 < tjq> 8 layer stm32f103 development board
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2019-02-21T05:36:51 < R2COM> what about 8 loayers
2019-02-21T05:37:28 < jadew> any ideas if you can handle WEEE yourself?
2019-02-21T05:37:34 < jadew> the WEEE you produce
2019-02-21T05:37:46 < R2COM> wtf is weee 
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2019-02-21T05:37:51 < tjq> ya wtf is that
2019-02-21T05:37:56 < jadew> WEEE is electronic waste
2019-02-21T05:38:04 < tjq> oh
2019-02-21T05:38:07 < jadew> which according to the EU, is anything that's electronic
2019-02-21T05:38:27 < tjq> that's why niggers desolder components and resell
2019-02-21T05:38:35 < jadew> and it's the responsibility of the producer to get rid of other companies WEEEs, through some stupid lottery based mechanism
2019-02-21T05:38:39 < R2COM> fuck EU its a shithole place
2019-02-21T05:38:42 < jadew> so if I produce 1 kg of electronics per year
2019-02-21T05:39:05 < jadew> I may "win" a couple of tons of electronics waste, that I have to dispose of, on my own money
2019-02-21T05:39:40 < jadew> the solution is to join an association that deals with that, but you have to pay them
2019-02-21T05:40:09 < R2COM> why dont you ignore that shit
2019-02-21T05:40:29 < jadew> and nobody was ok with letting me in, considering I don't produce enough WEEE (you pay them by the kg - so if you don't pay them enough, it's not a good deal for them)
2019-02-21T05:40:38 < jadew> R2COM, because fines
2019-02-21T05:41:08 < R2COM> so if you are not into weee you cant produce electronics?
2019-02-21T05:41:52 < jadew> yes, if you don't register as a WEEE producer, you can't produce electronics (unless they're kits or meant to be installed in other products, that are covered by the WEEE already)
2019-02-21T05:41:53 -!- upgrdman_ is now known as upgrdman
2019-02-21T05:43:14 < jadew> the fine is ~ 6k USD
2019-02-21T05:43:18 < R2COM> but what if you order from china the assembly of PCBs, then they ship to you and you pack and sell ...now you kinda "resell" shit rather than manufacture and produce
2019-02-21T05:43:23 < upgrdman> that moment when youre porting arm code to a pic24, and realize that one fucking line of code now takes over 500us to execute, because a constant was "ULL" when it could have been "UL" which drops time below 100us
2019-02-21T05:43:44 < jadew> R2COM, resellers have to do that too
2019-02-21T05:43:44 < upgrdman> fucking 16bit MCUs in 2019. why. fml.
2019-02-21T05:44:08 < jadew> the importer of WEEE has to be registered to and report everything that they bring in and put on the market
2019-02-21T05:44:09 < R2COM> upgrdman cuz price of silicon maybe? costs less?
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2019-02-21T05:44:41 < R2COM> jadew that sounds like some fucked up environmental shitlaw, you need president like Trump to remove that shit and let companies do business normally without PITA
2019-02-21T05:44:59 < upgrdman> ya, we're saving a few pennies in BoM cost, and wasting thousands on EE costs
2019-02-21T05:45:48 < R2COM> not pennies, companies who produce that shit save a lot maybe
2019-02-21T05:45:56 < R2COM> its all about supply and demand
2019-02-21T05:46:21 < R2COM> there are TONS of "legacy" product buying companies, who will buy obsolete shit for next 10 years
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2019-02-21T05:50:52 < tjq> https://youtu.be/rq7qm3T3cPE?t=77
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2019-02-21T05:58:55 < tjq> why did steffanx break
2019-02-21T06:09:16 < dongs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJtWEhl5smA muzak for today
2019-02-21T06:13:04 < R2COM> installing visual gdb now, and already shows some error with installing arm package online
2019-02-21T06:13:15 < R2COM> isnt fucking gargabe supposed to work out of the box
2019-02-21T06:17:07 < srk> installing arm package online. what does it even mean
2019-02-21T06:17:38 < R2COM> when you install that visualGDB on top of MS VC, and then start visualGDB project, it needs to download all arm related shit internally
2019-02-21T06:17:46 < srk> aww
2019-02-21T06:17:53 < R2COM> and shit gives me some "XML error"
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2019-02-21T06:26:46 < srk> pro tools
2019-02-21T06:27:00 < jadew> maybe the quality has lowered
2019-02-21T06:34:47 < R2COM> seems i can download package manually and show location
2019-02-21T06:36:00 < dongs> so it failed cuz your internet is shit?
2019-02-21T06:36:18 < R2COM> no cuz that MS VC cant download shit on its own
2019-02-21T06:36:28 < R2COM> from VisualGDB
2019-02-21T06:36:39 < R2COM> they fucked up their shit somehow
2019-02-21T06:37:01 < dongs> r2bro how many kills you got in apex legnends
2019-02-21T06:37:14 < R2COM> i havent installed it yet
2019-02-21T06:41:11 < jadew> is that a game on steam?
2019-02-21T06:41:13 < jadew> I can't find it
2019-02-21T06:41:17 < jadew> ah, VR shit?
2019-02-21T06:42:16 < dongs> sadly not on steam
2019-02-21T06:42:19 < dongs> EA's retarded steamclone
2019-02-21T06:43:13 < R2COM> its not on steam unfortunately
2019-02-21T06:43:16 < R2COM> but its free
2019-02-21T06:43:27 < R2COM> anything non steam = gay
2019-02-21T06:43:45 < jadew> ah, the one I found was some VR game, this is a regular shooter?
2019-02-21T06:43:50 < dongs> yeah
2019-02-21T06:44:00 < R2COM> this is a battleroyale shooter
2019-02-21T06:44:11 < tjq> cats and dogs on the run
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2019-02-21T06:48:53 < R2COM> wtf i did download and manually install that stm32 devices and restarted tool but it cant find them to create project
2019-02-21T06:49:32 < R2COM> what a fucking garbage how they are planning to charge $200 for something whats not fucking working
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2019-02-21T06:54:24 < karlp> silly weechatchose the same colours for rajkosto and catfishy and they have the same length nicks.
2019-02-21T06:54:45 < jadew> you can have different colors?
2019-02-21T06:54:54 < jadew> you're all gray for me
2019-02-21T06:58:20 < R2COM> im using original mirc
2019-02-21T06:58:56 -!- scrts [~quassel@unaffiliated/scrts] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-21T06:59:02 < dongs> > still using mirc in 2019
2019-02-21T06:59:15 < jadew> R2COM, I gave up on it 2 days ago because of a notification from freenode that the version I'm using has a vulnerability
2019-02-21T06:59:32 < jadew> so I figured I'd switch to weechat, which is the only other client I like
2019-02-21T06:59:59 < R2COM> yeah whats wrong with mirc?
2019-02-21T07:00:11 < jadew> I'm not fond of the colors tho, but I'll get to them at some point
2019-02-21T07:00:16 < R2COM> you have to download later version
2019-02-21T07:00:32 < jadew> R2COM, not sure, a "known vulnerability" which allowed attackers to run arbitrary code on your PC
2019-02-21T07:00:47 < jadew> so... a rather serious security issue
2019-02-21T07:00:57 < R2COM> i dont think its doable
2019-02-21T07:01:06 < R2COM> its simple client
2019-02-21T07:01:13 < R2COM> they cant run shit on it
2019-02-21T07:01:14 < jadew> yeah, something related to binvar or something like that
2019-02-21T07:01:20 < R2COM> nah
2019-02-21T07:01:22 < R2COM> all bullshit
2019-02-21T07:02:10 < R2COM> this visualgdb drives me nuts
2019-02-21T07:02:24 < R2COM> so you download 214MB of device/bsp toolchain shit
2019-02-21T07:02:33 < R2COM> then start visualgdb, point to it, it installs it
2019-02-21T07:02:46 < R2COM> and after that when you create new project you must see device selection and shit
2019-02-21T07:02:48 < R2COM> and it doesnt show it
2019-02-21T07:02:55 < R2COM> although it says package installed
2019-02-21T07:04:27 < jadew> brb
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2019-02-21T07:11:47 < R2COM> what a fucking faggots who designed this shit soft
2019-02-21T07:11:59 < R2COM> they cant integrate their garbage into MSVC properly
2019-02-21T07:12:00 < karlp> someone who kept a picture of you over their cube to wank over each night
2019-02-21T07:12:31 < R2COM> i remember long ago when i did some work with Atmel devices, in fact Atmel had its own IDE completely based on MS VC, and you could start project there in fucking 5 seconds, and debug and all
2019-02-21T07:18:07 < R2COM> dongs fuck this shit
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2019-02-21T07:50:12 < R2COM> ok started the project
2019-02-21T07:56:32 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-21T07:56:39 < R2COM> http://visualgdb.com/documentation/debugmethods
2019-02-21T07:57:06 < R2COM> so... for arm devices it supports segger, openocd... or....texane st-link??
2019-02-21T07:57:15 < R2COM> what about the ST factory ST-Link... ?
2019-02-21T07:57:37 < R2COM> i used texane st-link eons ago...but thats a different shit right
2019-02-21T07:57:47 < R2COM> whataver on disco board is just regular st-link
2019-02-21T07:57:52 < R2COM> or actually st-link/v2
2019-02-21T07:58:04 < R2COM> seems that visual gdb does not support factory st-link?
2019-02-21T08:00:11 < R2COM> hmm
2019-02-21T08:05:44 < R2COM> nevermind ill just select openOCD and see what happens
2019-02-21T08:08:39 < R2COM> ok it builds
2019-02-21T08:08:49 < R2COM> and i can flash and download the code and start debugger
2019-02-21T08:08:56 < R2COM> okkk
2019-02-21T08:09:01 < R2COM> seems to be working
2019-02-21T08:09:07 < R2COM> although this shit made me rage for a while
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2019-02-21T08:32:28 < jadew> I need a press of some kind - think an arbor press is the way to go?
2019-02-21T08:33:09 < R2COM> press for what?
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2019-02-21T08:33:46 < jadew> to press fit stuff
2019-02-21T08:34:04 < Rajko> englishman, lol the VisualGDB package manager online XML file was corrupted or something yesterday
2019-02-21T08:34:08 < Rajko> why you gotta break things
2019-02-21T08:41:22 < R2COM> Rajko why are you talking about visualgdb?
2019-02-21T08:41:34 < Rajko> because its big pimpin
2019-02-21T08:41:49 < R2COM> did you see me writing about it now?
2019-02-21T08:41:55 < Rajko> n
2019-02-21T08:41:57 < Rajko> did you break it ?
2019-02-21T08:42:13 < R2COM> i wanted to try it today and failed to get shit installed from within app
2019-02-21T08:42:26 < R2COM> so i had to manually install it after downloading packages
2019-02-21T08:42:29 < Rajko> got XML error at line 1467 ?
2019-02-21T08:42:33 < R2COM> yes
2019-02-21T08:42:35 < Rajko> cuz that was all day yesterday
2019-02-21T08:42:36 < Rajko> solved now
2019-02-21T08:42:46 < R2COM> solved now by whom?
2019-02-21T08:42:52 < Rajko> (them)
2019-02-21T08:43:46 < R2COM> now i see its working
2019-02-21T08:44:08 < R2COM> another shit thing is, when you install that device package, it auytomatically installs in the user directory in appdata
2019-02-21T08:44:16 < Rajko> the bsp yes
2019-02-21T08:44:18 < R2COM> without asking for alternative location
2019-02-21T08:44:20 < Rajko> you can relocate it in VisualGDB
2019-02-21T08:44:23 < R2COM> yes, but
2019-02-21T08:44:25 < Rajko> VisualGDB package manager
2019-02-21T08:44:33 < R2COM> if you do it, it hangs in the process of relocation...
2019-02-21T08:44:37 < Rajko> didnt here
2019-02-21T08:44:40 < Rajko> did it super fast
2019-02-21T08:44:53 < R2COM> maybe it was related to that 1496 problem
2019-02-21T08:45:47 < R2COM> the thing is, when its relocating it copies files
2019-02-21T08:45:54 < R2COM> but the progress window is not moving
2019-02-21T08:46:23 < R2COM> says "cleaning target folder..."
2019-02-21T08:46:28 < R2COM> "moving BSP files"
2019-02-21T08:48:32 < R2COM> maybe i should give it more time
2019-02-21T08:49:08 < R2COM> Rajko did you use openocd with it?
2019-02-21T08:49:14 < Rajko> yep
2019-02-21T08:49:18 < R2COM> with st-link/v2 ?
2019-02-21T08:49:21 < Rajko> you have to use its own openocd, wont take an arbitrary folder
2019-02-21T08:49:35 < Rajko> which is kinda lame
2019-02-21T08:49:38 < Rajko> i had to copy my scripts into it
2019-02-21T08:50:01 < Rajko> but you can just write anything into the advanced openocd options so it can work the same way it did in eclipse
2019-02-21T08:50:03 < R2COM> i never used openocd, so i just downloaded its debug packjage
2019-02-21T08:50:12 < R2COM> and selected and it worked flashing my disco eval board
2019-02-21T08:50:24 < Rajko> yes just click the test button
2019-02-21T08:50:31 < R2COM> yes it worked, debug works now
2019-02-21T08:51:00 < R2COM> (that relocation shit goes really slow.... no progress bar, i wonder if this shit is broken or it really takes long time..)
2019-02-21T08:51:09 < Rajko> it just moves the folder contents
2019-02-21T08:51:18 < Rajko> took .5fs on my nvme ssd
2019-02-21T08:51:46 < R2COM> im moving from ssd to hdd
2019-02-21T08:54:37 < R2COM> Rajko if buying it, i guess "custom" version is the one which makes sense right?
2019-02-21T08:54:49 < R2COM> it has couple features one might need, which embedded version doesnt have
2019-02-21T08:54:53 < R2COM> like timer
2019-02-21T08:55:21 < Rajko> > keeping source/object files on hdd
2019-02-21T08:55:22 < Rajko> why
2019-02-21T08:55:32 < Rajko> maybe its broken if the source/destination drives are different
2019-02-21T08:55:53 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_07-55-45_GqcLOGQQr.png oh i see how this woudl take a while to move to hdd
2019-02-21T08:56:26 < R2COM> umm
2019-02-21T08:57:15 < R2COM> lets see
2019-02-21T08:57:37 < Rajko> anyway, the eclipse based ones would install the cmsis packages somewhere in appdaat too and you wouldtn be able to move it
2019-02-21T09:02:26 < R2COM> lets see how quickly it relocates to same ssd in different folder
2019-02-21T09:03:19 < R2COM> wow
2019-02-21T09:03:22 < R2COM> immediately lol
2019-02-21T09:04:05 < R2COM> heh... the openOCD package cant be relocated!
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2019-02-21T09:04:20 < R2COM> that stays in appdata.... wtf
2019-02-21T09:05:41 < R2COM> is it the case for you?
2019-02-21T09:05:53 < Rajko> yes
2019-02-21T09:06:21 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_08-06-14_G57NXN3Jx.png why care
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2019-02-21T09:08:10 < R2COM> ok
2019-02-21T09:09:05 < R2COM> alright, it works
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2019-02-21T09:17:45 < dongs> fucking vmware garbage
2019-02-21T09:17:53 < Rajko> vmware >>>> virtualbox
2019-02-21T09:18:06 < dongs> in V15 they changed USB device connect from "connect to FOREGROUND VIRTUAL MACHINE"
2019-02-21T09:18:20 < dongs> to fucking "CONNECT TO A RUNNING VM EVEN IF FUCKING VMWARE WINDOW IS MINIMIZED
2019-02-21T09:18:30 < dongs> motherfucker so to get proper working usb ih ave to always switch to home tab
2019-02-21T09:18:36 < dongs> instead of just alt-tabbing away from an open vmware window
2019-02-21T09:18:38 < dongs> fucking garbage
2019-02-21T09:18:45 < R2COM> haha
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2019-02-21T09:24:43 < Rajko> also if you dont use their own ARM toolchain in VisualGDB you lose semihosting support and your binaries end up being way larger than they should
2019-02-21T09:24:48 < Rajko> whatever reason
2019-02-21T09:25:07 < R2COM> wait
2019-02-21T09:25:13 < R2COM> i downloaded arm from gnuarm
2019-02-21T09:25:19 < Rajko> yeah dont
2019-02-21T09:25:20 < Rajko> remov
2019-02-21T09:25:24 < Rajko> use their SysGCC
2019-02-21T09:25:36 < R2COM> but their instructions tell to get arm eabi?
2019-02-21T09:25:38 < R2COM> how come?
2019-02-21T09:25:47 < Rajko> what instructions
2019-02-21T09:25:53 < Rajko> when you make a project it has you pick a toolchain
2019-02-21T09:25:59 < Rajko> "ARM" Package from them is default
2019-02-21T09:26:53 < R2COM> https://i.imgur.com/1mbwK3z.jpg
2019-02-21T09:27:18 < Rajko> yeah you added it yourself via "Import a 3d party toolchain"
2019-02-21T09:27:23 < Rajko> instead just go online and download ARM
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2019-02-21T09:28:12 < R2COM> ARM mbed ?
2019-02-21T09:28:16 < Rajko> no.
2019-02-21T09:28:36 < R2COM> ARM toolchain ?
2019-02-21T09:28:50 < Rajko> take a screenshot so i know what youre doing wrong
2019-02-21T09:29:20 < R2COM> https://i.imgur.com/00NSoXy.jpg
2019-02-21T09:29:31 < Rajko> yes
2019-02-21T09:29:37 < dongs> the bottom one i guess
2019-02-21T09:29:39 < Rajko> go to toolchains
2019-02-21T09:29:44 < Rajko> not "All"
2019-02-21T09:29:57 < dongs> also why the fuck is that shit retardo gray colorscheme lmao
2019-02-21T09:30:03 < Rajko> its default "Dark" visual studio
2019-02-21T09:30:05 < Rajko> since 2012
2019-02-21T09:30:10 < Rajko> dongs, get with the low contrast times
2019-02-21T09:30:26 < dongs> i have never used any app in gray on gray mode, and i dont plan to
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2019-02-21T09:31:04 < R2COM> i like grayt
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2019-02-21T09:31:54 < R2COM> im tired of white
2019-02-21T09:32:02 < R2COM> yellow or white on gray is best
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2019-02-21T09:32:35 < Rajko> R2COM, this is visual assist x syntax coloring on dark https://i.gyazo.com/7696ac43d195add7faa0bfd7af0a6dc8.png
2019-02-21T09:32:37 < qyx> yellow on white
2019-02-21T09:32:45 < Rajko> shame i cant use it with VisualGDB
2019-02-21T09:33:34 < dongs> fucking gross
2019-02-21T09:34:02 < R2COM> i like it
2019-02-21T09:34:13 < R2COM> Rajko i also installed VsVim extension
2019-02-21T09:34:19 < R2COM> so i can edit like vim
2019-02-21T09:34:25 < R2COM> and do vertical splits and shit
2019-02-21T09:34:32 < Rajko> are you just following all the hipster trends
2019-02-21T09:35:26 < R2COM> yes
2019-02-21T09:38:44 < R2COM> im looking at same program which was built with 3rd party arm debugger
2019-02-21T09:38:50 < R2COM> its just couple kB difference
2019-02-21T09:38:54 < R2COM> ah
2019-02-21T09:38:57 < R2COM> but both were Debug
2019-02-21T09:39:04 < R2COM> so i guess for Debug you dont notice difference
2019-02-21T09:39:07 < R2COM> it might be release
2019-02-21T09:39:40 < Rajko> you need to go into the VIsualGDB project settings and change the toolchain
2019-02-21T09:39:53 < Rajko> first tab
2019-02-21T09:39:58 < R2COM> but i did for new project during new proiject creation
2019-02-21T09:40:22 < R2COM> i created new project, and this time selected the SysG whatever
2019-02-21T09:40:25 < R2COM> and compiled with it
2019-02-21T09:40:29 < R2COM> also in Debug mode
2019-02-21T09:40:35 < Rajko> enable semihosting support
2019-02-21T09:40:40 < R2COM> where is that?
2019-02-21T09:40:44 < R2COM> and what is that?
2019-02-21T09:40:49 < Rajko> oh dear
2019-02-21T09:42:23 < dongs> is semihosting the brokebitch way of debugging
2019-02-21T09:43:18 < R2COM> https://visualgdb.com/tutorials/arm/semihosting/
2019-02-21T09:43:43 < Rajko> its the first tab of VisualGDB project settings...
2019-02-21T09:43:47 < Rajko> semihosting support combo box
2019-02-21T09:44:17 < dongs> does it not actually support realtime readout of stuff via swd/swo?
2019-02-21T09:44:20 < R2COM> first tab is Embedded Project
2019-02-21T09:44:36 < Rajko> dongs, of course it does
2019-02-21T09:44:45 < dongs> then why this brokebitch shit
2019-02-21T09:44:52 < Rajko> printf
2019-02-21T09:45:13 < R2COM> hmm if i can see all variables and regs i dont know if i need printf much..
2019-02-21T09:45:14 < dongs> ????
2019-02-21T09:45:21 < dongs> Rajko: yes i printf from my keil projects all the time
2019-02-21T09:45:24 < dongs> direct to swo
2019-02-21T09:45:31 < dongs> err, to swd rather
2019-02-21T09:45:34 < dongs> ITM_sendchar stuff
2019-02-21T09:45:39 < dongs> swo is for trace in separate box
2019-02-21T09:45:55 < Rajko> semihosting uses ITM
2019-02-21T09:46:09 < dongs> no it doesnt
2019-02-21T09:46:13 < dongs> semihosting is that int AB shit
2019-02-21T09:46:22 < dongs> that i never got to work realiably for anything
2019-02-21T09:46:25 < Rajko> ?
2019-02-21T09:46:29 < Rajko> "int AB shit"
2019-02-21T09:47:10 < R2COM> Rajko for me that semihosting combo box is not active, why?
2019-02-21T09:47:13 < dongs> https://visualgdb.com/tutorials/arm/semihosting/ https://visualgdb.com/w/wp-content/uploads/tutorials/arm/semihosting/09-bkpt.png
2019-02-21T09:47:18 < dongs> 'bkpt 0xab'
2019-02-21T09:47:27 < Rajko> R2COM, click Change
2019-02-21T09:47:31 < Rajko> jesus you need handholding
2019-02-21T09:47:48 < dongs> dongholding
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2019-02-21T09:49:09 < R2COM> ok
2019-02-21T09:49:10 < R2COM> tested
2019-02-21T09:49:12 < R2COM> printf works
2019-02-21T09:49:26 < R2COM> no
2019-02-21T09:49:37 < R2COM> its just this interface fucking non intuitive for first time user
2019-02-21T09:49:56 < Rajko> "Everything is grayed out until i click Change"
2019-02-21T09:49:59 < Rajko> WHY IS IT GRAYED OUT
2019-02-21T09:50:25 < R2COM> why the fuck there needs to be "CHANGE" button in the first place
2019-02-21T09:50:29 < R2COM> just let me change settings
2019-02-21T09:50:30 < R2COM> lol
2019-02-21T09:50:34 < Rajko> because it regenerates stuff after you chagne
2019-02-21T09:50:36 < R2COM> settings are on a form
2019-02-21T09:50:57 < R2COM> thats ok, let people change, and upon hitting "apply" pop up message saying it needs to regenerate
2019-02-21T09:50:57 < Rajko> dongs, oh this ITM requires a j-link or something
2019-02-21T09:51:00 < R2COM> its more natural
2019-02-21T09:51:39 < dongs> Rajko: no idea, but bkpt ab stuff is aids that never wroks
2019-02-21T09:51:41 < R2COM> soo everything is working now
2019-02-21T09:51:43 < dongs> all i need to do in keil to printf is
2019-02-21T09:51:57 < Rajko> R2COM, now go into the third tab and check "Fast semihosting"
2019-02-21T09:52:01 < dongs> make a int fputc(char c) that does ITM_PutChar(c); return c;
2019-02-21T09:52:04 < dongs> and i get printf into keil console
2019-02-21T09:52:09 < dongs> no other nigger shit needed
2019-02-21T09:53:08 < Rajko> 2nd tab, "Embedded frameworks"
2019-02-21T09:54:15 < R2COM> why i have shitloads of duplicated "fast semihosting..." rows?
2019-02-21T09:54:22 < Rajko> click first one
2019-02-21T09:54:41 < R2COM> downloads package
2019-02-21T09:54:51 < R2COM> okk?
2019-02-21T09:55:12 < R2COM> "redirect printf() to fast semihosting" check
2019-02-21T09:55:17 < R2COM> 4096 buffer
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2019-02-21T09:56:36 < R2COM> now my build fucking fails
2019-02-21T09:58:19 < R2COM> q:\gnu\newlib-nano\gcc-arm-none-eabi-6-2017-q2-update\src\newlib\libgloss\arm\syscalls.c(776): error : multiple definition of `_isatty'
2019-02-21T09:58:29 < R2COM> EmbeddedEFPs/Profiler/FastSemihosting.cpp:230: first defined here
2019-02-21T10:00:27 < R2COM> which settings you have for this shit?
2019-02-21T10:01:04 < Rajko> if you are using the GNU ARM toolchain, please disable regular semihosting on the first page of VisualGDB Project Properties
2019-02-21T10:02:17 < R2COM> ok all works
2019-02-21T10:02:41 < R2COM> seems cool actually!
2019-02-21T10:02:50 < R2COM> much less clunky than in stm32 workbench!
2019-02-21T10:03:06 < R2COM> in that ide, clicking Debug, you had to wait 15 seconds before its tarts debugging etc
2019-02-21T10:03:15 < R2COM> and hands often in the middle, so one needs to restart
2019-02-21T10:03:32 < R2COM> here it seems to be much faster
2019-02-21T10:04:08 < Rajko> power of visual studio
2019-02-21T10:04:22 < R2COM> VS is superior IDE that is without question
2019-02-21T10:06:31 < R2COM> the included Cube examples here compile and run nicely too
2019-02-21T10:06:37 < kakimir> is there some defined macro I should look for in order to detect endianess?
2019-02-21T10:10:14 < Rajko> its always little
2019-02-21T10:12:48 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-21T10:13:23 < R2COM> okk time to sleep
2019-02-21T10:13:44 < R2COM> hvala vam Rajko
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2019-02-21T11:03:32 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_10-03-20_d5Hal2vKd.png i hate this warning so much especially since unsigned int and unsigned long on the platform are equivalent
2019-02-21T11:11:45 < dongs> wot
2019-02-21T11:17:44 < Rajko> if you use %u in printf and the argument is a uint32_t
2019-02-21T11:18:18 < Rajko> uint32_t ends up being an unsinged long somewhere in stdint.h while %u is for unsigned int, and even tho they are both unsigned 32bit integers on the platform you get that warning
2019-02-21T11:20:04 < Rajko> on a mcu
2019-02-21T11:20:05 < Rajko> lad
2019-02-21T11:20:11 < Rajko> im trying to save flash space not waste it
2019-02-21T11:20:20 < Rajko> also std::cout shouldnt be used in modern c++
2019-02-21T11:20:26 < Rajko> you would use some fancy fast format library instead
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2019-02-21T11:32:10 < kakimir> what is cheap?
2019-02-21T11:32:21 < kakimir> you know everything is expensive at small quantities
2019-02-21T11:46:40 < kakimir> you bet big motherboard manuf doesn't pay shit for such part
2019-02-21T11:47:02 < marble_visions> dongs: re: cmake, i don't know how much non-embedded, non-trivial software development you do, but cmake really works. although i do feel your pain as cmake doesn't cater to embedded paradigms much
2019-02-21T11:47:33 < Rajko> passive RJ45 with external transformer is what EVERY vendor uses cuz cost
2019-02-21T11:47:40 < marble_visions> i've tried substituting it with something else, but haven't found anything that suits my use case better
2019-02-21T11:47:51 < Rajko> marble_visions, literally anything
2019-02-21T11:48:42 < Rajko> scons, ninja, meson, whatever
2019-02-21T11:48:48 < Rajko> anything's better than cmake and its awful legacy
2019-02-21T11:49:37 < marble_visions> awful legacy of what?
2019-02-21T11:49:53 < Rajko> the whatever "language" they invented for making cmakerules
2019-02-21T11:50:21 < Rajko> also that its generated output is AWFUL and in every case non-idiomatic for the build system its generating for
2019-02-21T11:50:44 < marble_visions> Rajko: do you mean cmake prior 3.x?
2019-02-21T11:50:48 < Rajko> no.
2019-02-21T11:51:00 < Rajko> i'd rather be using plain makefiles 
2019-02-21T11:51:49 < Rajko> oh and all those "Modern" FindXXXX.cmakerules are awful and only work on the developer's machine
2019-02-21T11:53:49 < marble_visions> i don't think plain make syntax is better than the cmake "language"
2019-02-21T11:54:06 < Rajko> but the cmake "language" isnt worth using it over makefiles.
2019-02-21T11:54:12 < Rajko> as they have mostly the same disadvantages
2019-02-21T11:54:38 < Rajko> + cmake is way harder to configure
2019-02-21T11:54:54 < marble_visions> what do you mean configure?
2019-02-21T11:55:04 < Rajko> with makefiles if it uses some external library
2019-02-21T11:55:07 < Rajko> all you gotta do is set some env vars
2019-02-21T11:55:10 < Rajko> and boom ding
2019-02-21T11:55:33 < Rajko> while cmake tries to be smart and manages a bunch of hidden variables behidn your back so you dont knwo whats what anymore
2019-02-21T11:56:18 < marble_visions> are your deps coming from the system or some third party place?
2019-02-21T11:56:22 < Rajko> you use what you like, but its really sad CMake is what seems to be the most common
2019-02-21T11:58:16 < marble_visions> does scons generate idiomatic build system files?
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2019-02-21T11:58:36 < Rajko> its not a generator.
2019-02-21T11:59:01 < Rajko> i vasttly prefer runners than generators
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2019-02-21T11:59:18 < Rajko> as they have some idea what the actual build process will be instead of just shitting out text files
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2019-02-21T12:00:12 < Rajko> (text files that are completely useless by humans and are just there to run the build process anyway)
2019-02-21T12:00:40 < marble_visions> true dat, i have a hard time following cmake generated makefiles
2019-02-21T12:01:06 < Rajko> the visual studio ones are especially awful since you are supposed to use them with an IDE
2019-02-21T12:01:33 < Rajko> and its just filled with garbage and absoltue paths
2019-02-21T12:01:48 < marble_visions> i thought the ide ones would be less important as they're just a means of configuring your ide and not for human consumption
2019-02-21T12:01:49 < Rajko> overriding defaults with absolute path expanded defaults
2019-02-21T12:02:00 < Rajko> the IDE ones you actually interact with
2019-02-21T12:02:08 < Rajko> makefiles you just run
2019-02-21T12:02:24 < Rajko> you can SEE what it SHAT out and its completely contrary how you would actually set it up manually
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2019-02-21T12:02:54 < Rajko> you want to fix something so the IDE works better ? tough shit, they get regenerated every run
2019-02-21T12:03:02 < marble_visions> indeed
2019-02-21T12:03:59 < Rajko> life is pain, i hate
2019-02-21T12:06:47 < kakimir> what tool makes you sad today?
2019-02-21T12:06:56 < marble_visions> cmake, obviously
2019-02-21T12:07:01 < Rajko> marble_visions, you did this
2019-02-21T12:07:07 < Rajko> i was happily going around not thinking of cmake
2019-02-21T12:07:13 < Rajko> you had to bring me down
2019-02-21T12:07:21 < marble_visions> brb will file a bugreport that cmake makes people sad
2019-02-21T12:07:27 < kakimir> I don't know but cmake looks "fun"
2019-02-21T12:08:02 < marble_visions> it's not fun but it WorksForMe(TM)
2019-02-21T12:09:15 < Rajko> yeah it works for a bunch of projects on linux generally
2019-02-21T12:09:38 < Rajko> but if whatever that author's conception of where a library should be is diferent than your machine youre pretty much fucked boyo
2019-02-21T12:09:58 < kakimir> I never got it going with cmake
2019-02-21T12:10:10 < marble_visions> > oh and all those "Modern" FindXXXX.cmakerules are awful and only work on the developer's machine 
2019-02-21T12:10:13 < marble_visions> lies and slander
2019-02-21T12:10:16 < marble_visions> :d
2019-02-21T12:10:51 < Rajko> you know it to be true
2019-02-21T12:11:28 < marble_visions> also you shouldn't be writing those by yourself
2019-02-21T12:11:30 < marble_visions> iirc
2019-02-21T12:11:40 < marble_visions> i mean, you should push for support upstream
2019-02-21T12:11:47 < kakimir> what are you doing with cmake exactly?
2019-02-21T12:11:48 < Rajko> yeah so whoever pushd it up stream
2019-02-21T12:11:54 < Rajko> it never works for anyone with a different setup than theirs
2019-02-21T12:12:00 < kakimir> did you try to avoid it in all costs?
2019-02-21T12:12:03 < Rajko> and cuz its up stream its that much harder to modify
2019-02-21T12:12:29 < marble_visions> kakimir: i started this from a previous discussion with dongs about cmake
2019-02-21T12:12:30 < Rajko> it gives me brain damage
2019-02-21T12:13:20 < kakimir> what is the project?
2019-02-21T12:13:21 < BrainDamage> certainly so
2019-02-21T12:13:28 < kakimir> the platform etc.
2019-02-21T12:15:17 < kakimir> babbys first production tester
2019-02-21T12:15:33 < marble_visions> ?
2019-02-21T12:17:08 < kakimir> I made a production tester
2019-02-21T12:17:26 < marble_visions> good job
2019-02-21T12:17:59 < Rajko> what does it test in production
2019-02-21T12:20:34 < kakimir> short circuits, bod, watchdog, voltage dividers, currents of CC regulator
2019-02-21T12:22:29 < kakimir> temperature sensor
2019-02-21T12:23:00 < kakimir> output capacitors potentially
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2019-02-21T12:42:48 < tjq> ?
2019-02-21T12:43:31 < tjq> is that anime Haohmaru 
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2019-02-21T12:45:28 < englishman> dongs: 32k project in IAR is 38k with gcc+newlib-nano
2019-02-21T12:45:42 < englishman> 25k with arm clang v6+microlib
2019-02-21T12:46:37 < englishman> -o0
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2019-02-21T12:49:32 < Rajko> how do you use microlib without Keil
2019-02-21T12:49:34 < Rajko> also how use clang
2019-02-21T12:51:09 < englishman> https://www.st.com/content/st_com/en/about/media-center/press-item.html/p4140.html
2019-02-21T12:51:30 < englishman> pretty sure its a keil exclusive
2019-02-21T12:51:41 < Rajko> proven STM32Cube ecosystem
2019-02-21T12:51:42 < Rajko> oh no
2019-02-21T12:52:53 < englishman> 650MHz stm32
2019-02-21T12:53:07 < Rajko> if ur gonna use linux
2019-02-21T12:56:36 < jadew> any ideas on how to measure radius of a corner precisely?
2019-02-21T12:57:06 < jadew> I know it's about 2mm, but I can't tell if it's below or above 2mm, or 2mm exactly
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2019-02-21T12:57:17 < jadew> it's definitely more than 1, but it could be 1.5
2019-02-21T12:59:12 < Lux> englishman: pretty much the same as imx7
2019-02-21T12:59:23 < englishman> the lower end ones yeah
2019-02-21T12:59:31 < englishman> lvds output is pretty important
2019-02-21T13:00:53 < Lux> yeah people want touchscreens
2019-02-21T13:03:05 < Lux> but their platform seems outdated allready, nothing better than imx7 which has been out for 2 years
2019-02-21T13:03:15 < englishman> i.mx8?
2019-02-21T13:03:18 < Lux> and i bet lunix support isn't good either
2019-02-21T13:03:32 < englishman> i dont care, not my department :)
2019-02-21T13:04:11 < Rajko> hgaving to use OpenSTLinux or whatever doesnt seem good
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2019-02-21T13:10:20 < Rajko> can you use a bluepill to mimick a j-link or st-link with SWDO ?
2019-02-21T13:10:29 < Steffann> tjq
2019-02-21T13:10:34 < Rajko> i can do without SWDO
2019-02-21T13:11:28 < englishman> you mean swo?
2019-02-21T13:11:36 < Rajko> yes
2019-02-21T13:11:40 < tjq> hi Steffann 
2019-02-21T13:11:44 < Rajko> you can hook it up to a usb UART if it supports 2mbaud but its just not the same
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2019-02-21T13:12:06 < englishman> i dont see why not
2019-02-21T13:12:12 < englishman> but at the same time
2019-02-21T13:12:13 < englishman> why
2019-02-21T13:12:20 < Rajko> want a full featured j-link
2019-02-21T13:12:29 < Rajko> cuz ITM is useful yes
2019-02-21T13:12:33 < englishman> just flash your st-link then
2019-02-21T13:12:38 < Rajko> dont have st-link
2019-02-21T13:12:45 < englishman> then solve the problem
2019-02-21T13:12:52 < englishman> rather than looking for a solution to a different problem
2019-02-21T13:13:30 < Rajko> there's a j-link firmware for the NUCLEO-F103RB
2019-02-21T13:14:11 < englishman> arent those v2.1 exactly the same hardware?
2019-02-21T13:14:15 < englishman> dono
2019-02-21T13:14:26 < englishman> but you should be able to flash taht to jlink no?
2019-02-21T13:30:14 < Rajko> i would have to figure out schematics on how to make my own st-link module that they put on the nucleos then flash that
2019-02-21T13:30:33 < Rajko> but they do all seem to use stm32f103rbt6
2019-02-21T13:31:56 < Steffann> My jlink clone <3
2019-02-21T13:31:58 < marble_visions> Rajko: i think you can literally break out the debug part of a nucleo board
2019-02-21T13:32:07 < Rajko> yes
2019-02-21T13:32:09 < Rajko> i dont have any
2019-02-21T13:32:21 < Rajko> so i would have to make that debug part
2019-02-21T13:32:46 < marble_visions> if your time is less expensive than a ~20$ board, sure
2019-02-21T13:33:08 < Rajko> its just a few resistors 
2019-02-21T13:33:25 < Rajko> and its not about money its about not being able to get them fast
2019-02-21T13:36:04 < sync> the question would be why you don't have any nucleo
2019-02-21T13:37:09 < Rajko> dont need em
2019-02-21T13:37:12 < Rajko> 2 big
2019-02-21T13:37:59 < sync> you always need some throwaway dev platform to prototype shit
2019-02-21T13:42:26 < karlp> Haohmaru: hanrun is your friend.
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2019-02-21T13:45:54 < karlp> why does rajko seem to think they don't get swo with stlink?
2019-02-21T13:46:46 < Rajko> cuz im an idiot
2019-02-21T13:46:55 < karlp> ok, fair enough then.
2019-02-21T13:47:15 < karlp> Haohmaru: there's a zyðpsnips for cheap magjacks.
2019-02-21T13:47:18 < karlp> we have covered this before.
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2019-02-21T13:47:53 < karlp> ethernet-phys-jacks.txt
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2019-02-21T13:51:17 < karlp> about fucking time mp1 got announced propely.
2019-02-21T13:51:25 < karlp> dts files were committed what, 6 months ago now?
2019-02-21T13:52:33 < karlp> isn't ddr3 already getting more epensive? or was that ddr2?
2019-02-21T13:54:28 < marble_visions> Rajko: big fan of this form factor : https://www.st.com/en/evaluation-tools/nucleo-l031k6.html
2019-02-21T13:55:46 < karlp> nucleo32 has a name
2019-02-21T13:55:56 < karlp> also, useless for getting a stlink for debugging your own projects though
2019-02-21T13:55:57 < sync> karlp: last time I looked it was only ddr2 but I guess it is about time for ddr3
2019-02-21T13:55:58 < Rajko> his name is robert paulson
2019-02-21T13:56:05 < sync> but still
2019-02-21T13:56:21 < karlp> sync: thought I saw hardkernel or someone had canned a project because of costs with ddr3, and redid it ddr4
2019-02-21T13:56:45 < sync> maybe, but eh
2019-02-21T13:57:05 < karlp> stm32mp1 doesn't really look all that appealing.
2019-02-21T13:57:44 < karlp> why it wasn't developed more openly, when they claim to have all full upstream linux, odd choices.
2019-02-21T13:58:26 < sync> yeah, it seems relatively useless overall
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2019-02-21T13:59:34 < sync> ah yeah, they stopped making the odroid n1
2019-02-21T13:59:44 < sync> as the 4G verson needed a single chip 4G ram
2019-02-21T13:59:55 < sync> and samsung doesn't make that one anymore
2019-02-21T14:05:10 < dongs> MP1 looks gay
2019-02-21T14:05:15 < dongs> useless bga packages
2019-02-21T14:06:11 < englishman> wut
2019-02-21T14:06:15 < englishman> why
2019-02-21T14:06:22 < englishman> all the imx are
2019-02-21T14:06:33 < englishman> like every arm a7
2019-02-21T14:06:51 < dongs> yes but imx packages are routable
2019-02-21T14:06:58 < dongs> STM insists on this retarded fucking 0.5mm pitch trash
2019-02-21T14:07:09 < dongs> also there's a QFP144 or so i.mx23
2019-02-21T14:07:18 < dongs> also some QFP allwinners and shit.
2019-02-21T14:07:51 < englishman> routing DDR from qfp sounds fun
2019-02-21T14:10:06 < kakimir> DDR4 sounds good
2019-02-21T14:10:20 < kakimir> sounds like kicad jubb
2019-02-21T14:11:52 < kakimir> tell me why my LM35 outputs 370mV in 23C room
2019-02-21T14:12:48 < englishman> forgot to plug in car last night, Nissan plug notification didn't get sent
2019-02-21T14:13:02 < englishman> /wtc nissan
2019-02-21T14:13:36 < englishman> that hyundai kona is looking good rn
2019-02-21T14:17:02 < kakimir> it should have minimal self heating
2019-02-21T14:17:25 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-21T14:17:29 < kakimir> did re measurement
2019-02-21T14:17:35 < kakimir> 243mV
2019-02-21T14:18:15 < kakimir> and
2019-02-21T14:18:17 < kakimir> my room is 24C
2019-02-21T14:19:32 < jadew> that is the best temperature
2019-02-21T14:19:53 < jadew> it's the best for outside and inside
2019-02-21T14:20:58 < kakimir> I have done optimizations
2019-02-21T14:21:13 < kakimir> for the room temp
2019-02-21T14:22:22 < Steffann> < 20C is best room temp
2019-02-21T14:22:29 < Steffann> > 18
2019-02-21T14:22:43 < jadew> eh, I'd say 22-23 really
2019-02-21T14:22:55 < jadew> anything below that and it's not great being naked
2019-02-21T14:23:19 < jadew> above it and you get too hot when you make any effort
2019-02-21T14:23:39 < kakimir> for physical work 18-20
2019-02-21T14:23:57 < kakimir> for physical work with pants on 15C
2019-02-21T14:26:44 < sync> are you not missing a -?
2019-02-21T14:26:49 < sync> as a finnisher
2019-02-21T14:27:55 < kakimir> -15C is a bit too cold to be perfect temperature for any activity
2019-02-21T14:28:03 < kakimir> -10C maybe
2019-02-21T14:28:30 < jadew> what could that be perfect for?
2019-02-21T14:28:47 < kakimir> hard outdoor sports
2019-02-21T14:28:48 < jadew> minimum -7 for outdoor activities
2019-02-21T14:29:17 < jadew> but I rate temperatures on the ability to stay naked
2019-02-21T14:29:18 < kakimir> I changed yesterday to my summer jacket - it's only -10C
2019-02-21T14:29:56 < jadew> how many months of night do you have left?
2019-02-21T14:30:01 < sync> jogging in -10°C is nice
2019-02-21T14:33:02 < englishman> -10C is nice weather
2019-02-21T14:33:11 < englishman> 24C indoors no way
2019-02-21T14:33:19 < englishman> sweltering
2019-02-21T14:33:23 < sync> yeah
2019-02-21T14:33:25 < englishman> absurd
2019-02-21T14:33:28 < sync> 21-22
2019-02-21T14:33:44 < sync> I mean, yeah if I'd be sitting around naked 24 is ok
2019-02-21T14:33:46 < jadew> I wonder how much I have in here right now
2019-02-21T14:33:48 < sync> but once you move
2019-02-21T14:33:50 < jadew> because this is the perfect temperature
2019-02-21T14:33:51 < sync> D:
2019-02-21T14:34:19 < jadew> I used to stay naked a lot
2019-02-21T14:34:32 < jadew> like... for years I've stayed naked in the house
2019-02-21T14:34:37 < jadew> all the time
2019-02-21T14:34:37 < marble_visions> karlp: i mentioned nucleo32 since Rajko thought nucleo64 was too big
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2019-02-21T15:09:10 < aandrew> depends on the environment
2019-02-21T15:09:26 < aandrew> if I've got a sweater and slippers on then 20-21 is fine
2019-02-21T15:09:34 < aandrew> if my fingers are cold I don't care what I'm wearing I can't fucking work
2019-02-21T15:09:52 < aandrew> 24 is getting pretty warm though unless there's a breeze
2019-02-21T15:10:13 < aandrew> if the air is humid things change too, I need it warmer when it's humid becuase the air sucks the heat out of you
2019-02-21T15:15:22 < jadew> I was never aware of air humidity
2019-02-21T15:15:31 < jadew> I think in here it's mostly dry
2019-02-21T15:16:32 < aandrew> I try to keep the humidity around 35-40%
2019-02-21T15:16:36 < aandrew> too much lower and static becomes an issue
2019-02-21T15:26:06 < kakimir> #define ADC0                  (*(ADC_t *) 0x0600) /* Analog to Digital Converter */
2019-02-21T15:26:36 < kakimir> what does this structure mean exactly
2019-02-21T15:26:48 < Rajko> its the register layout of an ADC
2019-02-21T15:26:54 < kakimir> (*(type *) address)
2019-02-21T15:27:02 < Rajko> and ADC0 is an instance of that placed at 0x0600
2019-02-21T15:27:08 < Rajko> the * is there just so you dont have to use ->
2019-02-21T15:27:09 < Rajko> which is weird
2019-02-21T15:27:24 < Rajko> i would have preferred using ->
2019-02-21T15:27:28 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-21T15:27:36 < kakimir> that's why -> didn't work
2019-02-21T15:27:48 < Rajko> ptr->member is the same as (*ptr).member
2019-02-21T15:28:02 < kakimir> so
2019-02-21T15:28:13 < Rajko> the cast binds first to the address
2019-02-21T15:28:23 < Rajko> then the dereference operator * binds to the pointer resulting from the cast
2019-02-21T15:28:45 < kakimir> I have not done advanced pointer stuff since kaalib
2019-02-21T15:28:59 < Rajko> basic dereference is advanced now ?
2019-02-21T15:29:29 < kakimir> let me think about it a while
2019-02-21T15:30:00 < Rajko> why does Atmel Studio look exactly like visual studio
2019-02-21T15:30:10 < kakimir> it is visual studio
2019-02-21T15:30:18 < Rajko> but with a weird layout ?
2019-02-21T15:30:49 < Rajko> i dont think it can be visual studio while renaming the title bar
2019-02-21T15:30:51 < kakimir> different flavoud
2019-02-21T15:31:05 < Rajko> so they specifically made their own thing that looks exactly like visual studio
2019-02-21T15:31:12 < Rajko> nvm, it can have VAssistX
2019-02-21T15:31:13 < jadew> Rajko, no
2019-02-21T15:31:14 < Rajko> wtf
2019-02-21T15:31:20 < jadew> they licensed VS
2019-02-21T15:31:48 < jadew> and they built their own environment around the base IDE
2019-02-21T15:32:10 < jadew> and yeah, they licensed VAX too
2019-02-21T15:32:23 < jadew> Atmel rocked
2019-02-21T15:32:27 < jadew> too bad microshit bought them
2019-02-21T15:32:37 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_14-32-33_cVc8BSGkE.png why would you do this
2019-02-21T15:32:56 < jadew> do what?
2019-02-21T15:33:01 < Rajko> measuring supply voltage ?
2019-02-21T15:33:03 < jadew> the voltage divider?
2019-02-21T15:33:10 < jadew> most likely, yeah
2019-02-21T15:35:18 < Rajko> do you save anything by having paramaters be a smaller type than int
2019-02-21T15:36:05 < jadew> depends on the architecture
2019-02-21T15:37:00 < Rajko> thumb2, M3, the usual
2019-02-21T15:37:11 < Rajko> all the registers are 32bit so it shouldnt matter waht size you use for parameters
2019-02-21T15:37:18 < Rajko> unless they end up on the stack somehow ?
2019-02-21T15:37:19 < jadew> on 32bit architectures, I doubt it
2019-02-21T15:37:39 < Rajko> so variable argument functions ?
2019-02-21T15:41:31 < kakimir> Rajko: got the pointer thing now
2019-02-21T15:42:44 < kakimir> as it's rereferenced there seems to be no other way to pass it to function as parameter than denote it first?
2019-02-21T15:42:50 < kakimir> *dereferenced
2019-02-21T15:43:15 < Rajko> what does the function expect ?
2019-02-21T15:43:21 < Rajko> and are you in C or C++
2019-02-21T15:43:24 < kakimir> C
2019-02-21T15:43:32 < Rajko> then undo the dereference
2019-02-21T15:43:39 < Rajko> pass &ADC0 and it ends up being an ADC_t*
2019-02-21T15:43:45 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-21T15:43:56 < kakimir> I see why this is a bit nasty
2019-02-21T15:44:07 < Rajko> if you were in C++ you could have ADC_t& as the function argument
2019-02-21T15:44:14 < Rajko> and then no & would be required at each call site
2019-02-21T15:44:21 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-21T15:44:23 < Rajko> however, theres really no reason for the * to be in the #define
2019-02-21T15:44:34 < Rajko> it confuses everyone
2019-02-21T15:44:41 < Rajko> and -> is there EXACTLY so you dont have to do that kind of shit
2019-02-21T15:44:51 < kakimir> this is avr
2019-02-21T15:44:59 < jadew> are electrolitic capacitors leaky when reversed polarized?
2019-02-21T15:45:18 < kakimir> nah boi
2019-02-21T15:45:32 < kakimir> negative
2019-02-21T15:45:44 < Rajko> jadew, they explode
2019-02-21T15:46:24 < jadew> Rajko, I know
2019-02-21T15:46:34 < jadew> but are they leaky before they explode?
2019-02-21T15:47:01 < jadew> I want to use them at 0 potential cuz I don't have the correct size ceramic
2019-02-21T15:47:17 < jadew> and I don't feel like paralleling 40 of the ones I do have
2019-02-21T15:48:11 < aandrew> what the fuck value of cap do you need that you might have to put 40 in parallel??
2019-02-21T15:48:25 < jadew> 40 uF
2019-02-21T15:48:33 < jadew> and the biggest ceramic I have is 1
2019-02-21T15:48:40 < aandrew> 40 10uF in series is wrong?
2019-02-21T15:48:41 < jadew> (through hole project)
2019-02-21T15:48:48 < aandrew> oh you want to do it in ceramic only
2019-02-21T15:48:50 < jadew> I could use some SMDs... but meh
2019-02-21T15:48:59 < jadew> that would be ideal
2019-02-21T15:49:03 < aandrew> er no it is parallel
2019-02-21T15:49:04 < aandrew> I'm on crack
2019-02-21T15:49:13 < aandrew> too much blood in my caffeine stream
2019-02-21T15:49:14 < jadew> I'm just hacking together a phantom power for my microphone
2019-02-21T15:49:56 < jadew> the aliexpress assholes only sent me the microphone (from amazon.co.uk) and the phantom power was apparently sent at the same time, but it's 2 weeks late
2019-02-21T15:58:34 < jadew> so maybe I already received it?
2019-02-21T16:00:23 < Rajko> how would that happen if you are immaterial
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2019-02-21T16:28:55 < jadew> phantom power worked great
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2019-02-21T16:57:40 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEpIIlJBiKM musics
2019-02-21T17:03:15 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4uA3t9AOUw
2019-02-21T17:04:08 < jadew> works better for me without the video (possibly because when I first saw the music video it was very different than what I had in my head)
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2019-02-21T17:10:15 < Rajko> what do you have in your head for https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BG-w-tFb5ic
2019-02-21T17:12:10 < aandrew> nice. RBC wants me to have a high limit CC for the business
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2019-02-21T17:24:44 < jadew> Rajko, that was interesting
2019-02-21T17:25:56 < Rajko> the jagulars
2019-02-21T17:28:01 < jadew> lol, I see there are more songs about the panasonic blu-ray
2019-02-21T17:28:21 < Rajko> loads https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjRV0G6qWgw&feature=youtu.be&t=32s
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2019-02-21T18:23:19 < Rajko> smuth corners
2019-02-21T18:24:26 < Rajko> why is this an infinite loop https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_17-24-21_8jRwb6RQu.png
2019-02-21T18:25:27 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_17-25-23_ZcE4BCkJa.png
2019-02-21T18:32:50 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_17-32-40_TMAtGZIGv.png all good
2019-02-21T18:37:53 < marble_visions> Rajko: what did you flash it on?
2019-02-21T18:38:30 < Rajko> blank stm32f103r8t6
2019-02-21T18:38:46 < marble_visions> nice
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2019-02-21T19:04:03 < mawk> you bricked it Rajko 
2019-02-21T19:04:22 < Rajko> no its good
2019-02-21T19:07:08 < aandrew> Rajko: yep. upgrade to j-link is best
2019-02-21T19:07:26 < aandrew> Rajko: ooh, you made your own jlink by first making an st-link? that's smart
2019-02-21T19:08:46 < malinus> daily reminder j-link only costs 10$ 
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2019-02-21T19:08:47 < malinus> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/JINSHENGDA-High-Speed-J-Link-JLink-V8-USB-ARM-JTAG-Emulator-Debugger-J-Link-V8-Emulator/32846502604.html
2019-02-21T19:09:17 < aandrew> I want to get me a jlink with trace capability
2019-02-21T19:09:27 < aandrew> don't truly need it
2019-02-21T19:09:28 < Steffann> V8.. cant even upgrade it with official fw
2019-02-21T19:09:44 < Rajko> ive had to makesome
2019-02-21T19:09:48 < Rajko> hardware modifications
2019-02-21T19:09:49 < kakimir> malinus: doesn't work with latest jlink software
2019-02-21T19:10:02 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_18-09-57_c4kdPJVgY.png
2019-02-21T19:10:03 < Steffann> I got a V9 (i think). It works with the official stuff
2019-02-21T19:10:03 < aandrew> Rajko: make some hw mods to what
2019-02-21T19:10:03 < kakimir> openocd does it
2019-02-21T19:10:13 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_18-10-08_BH6OOUIhB.png
2019-02-21T19:10:24 < Steffann> "some"
2019-02-21T19:10:54 < aandrew> Rajko: it looks like it might be neat to just drop an f103 on a board and have embedded jlink
2019-02-21T19:11:16 < aandrew> I don't think the jlink firmware that goes on stlinks can do jtag though, swd only 
2019-02-21T19:11:25 < Rajko> MB1136.pdf has the schematic of st-link on the f103 nucleo
2019-02-21T19:11:29 < Rajko> just make a pcb of that
2019-02-21T19:11:37 < Rajko> then you can flash with st-link firmware, then you can upgrade that to j-link
2019-02-21T19:11:56 < Rajko> yes i already have a jtag pod but jtag is slower on f103
2019-02-21T19:12:00 < Rajko> and no ITM
2019-02-21T19:12:04 < aandrew> Rajko: yes MB1137 also has schematic for the stlink, but again, I don't think you can do JTAG with it
2019-02-21T19:12:08 < aandrew> SWD only
2019-02-21T19:13:11 < Rajko> thats what i want
2019-02-21T19:14:19 < Rajko> has uart too
2019-02-21T19:20:31 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_18-20-27_tfD34YygV.png
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2019-02-21T19:22:43 < Rajko> can program, is all good
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2019-02-21T19:50:15 < englishman> aandrew: tell them to eat dick
2019-02-21T19:50:25 < englishman> I get 4% cashback now
2019-02-21T19:50:34 < englishman> RBC doesn't have any good cards
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2019-02-21T19:51:49 < englishman> nice Rajko
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2019-02-21T19:55:14 < Rajko> hmm how do i use the uart is that a st-link only thing
2019-02-21T19:55:31 < Rajko> onboard stlink has a uart conn to the other chip on the nucleo board
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2019-02-21T19:56:01 < arc_phasor> hi, i'm wondering how many PWM outputs I can get from a typical STM32L0x
2019-02-21T19:57:00 < arc_phasor> could I have one PWM setup with frequency and duty, and output it to say 10 GPIO's?
2019-02-21T19:57:11 < Rajko> unfortunately no
2019-02-21T19:57:49 < Rajko> why would you want the same signal on 10 gpios tho
2019-02-21T19:58:03 < arc_phasor> driving 10 solenoid valves
2019-02-21T19:58:19 < jpa-> you can do things with DMA to GPIO, but you won't get as good precision as with direct PWM outputs from timer
2019-02-21T19:58:36 < arc_phasor> but when a solenoid turns on I want 100% duty cycle for 50ms, then for the PWM to take over
2019-02-21T19:58:41 < Rajko> arc_phasor, but i mean you can take 1 signal and just... route it to 10 places
2019-02-21T19:59:00 < aandrew> I have a business amex I get marriot rewards for, I use those a lot
2019-02-21T19:59:03 < arc_phasor> i still need separate control over each solenoid valve, to tell it when to turn on and off
2019-02-21T19:59:23 < Rajko> anyway you get 4 pwm channels per timer (except on complex timers where you can get 6 with a trick)
2019-02-21T19:59:26 < arc_phasor> so like "solenoid 5 turn on at 100% duty cycle for 50ms, then go into shared PWM state"
2019-02-21T19:59:59 < Rajko> so you can get 12 channels with just 3 timers
2019-02-21T20:00:03 < jpa-> you could have a resistor from the common PWM output to each pin, and then put the IO pin either high/low or input mode, and in input mode the resistor will take over
2019-02-21T20:00:15 < jpa-> but yeah, for 10 channels just use a few timers
2019-02-21T20:00:31 < arc_phasor> jpa-: oh man i think that would work
2019-02-21T20:01:07 < arc_phasor> it's really confusing trying to relate how many PWM channels i have vs the Timer amount
2019-02-21T20:01:26 < Rajko> each normal timer has 4 channels
2019-02-21T20:01:33 < aandrew> $0.03/L for fuel and 1 point/$, wife uses the points a lot with her stuff
2019-02-21T20:01:35 < Rajko> meaning 4 duty cycles, all with same frequency
2019-02-21T20:01:45 < Rajko> if you want different frequency need to use different timers
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2019-02-21T20:02:44 < arc_phasor> jpa-: so run a resistor in series from the common PWM output to each GPIO output?
2019-02-21T20:02:49 < aandrew> I have a USD business visa too which saves me quite a lot on exchange
2019-02-21T20:02:51 < arc_phasor> How big would that resistor be?
2019-02-21T20:03:05 < aandrew> (since there is no exchange, contact pays in USD and I have a USD acct)
2019-02-21T20:03:16 < Rajko> no you would run 10 resistors
2019-02-21T20:03:17 < aandrew> cashback is usually best though
2019-02-21T20:03:22 < Rajko> 100ohm-1k ?
2019-02-21T20:04:07 < arc_phasor> that's such a great idea, i never knew the benefits of tri-state GPIO until now
2019-02-21T20:04:09 < englishman> Rajko: yeah the virtual uart is stlink 2.1 
2019-02-21T20:04:30 < Rajko> how do i get 2.1
2019-02-21T20:04:55 < englishman> use a nucleo
2019-02-21T20:04:59 < Rajko> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-21_19-04-54_xrGLiXLOw.png its on here
2019-02-21T20:05:46 < Rajko> board ident is different on 2.1 or something ?
2019-02-21T20:07:03 < englishman> ?
2019-02-21T20:07:12 < englishman> stlink firmware is different
2019-02-21T20:07:14 < Rajko> how does it know if its st-link 2.0 or 2.1
2019-02-21T20:07:22 < Rajko> st-link firmware is all the same
2019-02-21T20:07:33 < englishman> not between 2.0 and 2.1 it isn't
2019-02-21T20:07:42 < englishman> that's why the version changes
2019-02-21T20:07:53 < englishman> afaik
2019-02-21T20:08:18 < englishman> openocd doesn't even make them compatible
2019-02-21T20:08:30 < englishman> so if you choose 2.0 it wont talk to a nucleo
2019-02-21T20:08:36 < englishman> or whatever I never tried
2019-02-21T20:10:49 < PaulFertser> englishman: now it does, for more than half a year.
2019-02-21T20:11:21 < PaulFertser> Actually, much more than half a year, Thu Jan 26 23:41:40 2017
2019-02-21T20:12:46 < PaulFertser> There's also stlink v3 now available, and new stlink firmware to upgrade old hw versions.
2019-02-21T20:14:59 < mawk> why is there no openocd release since a long time ?
2019-02-21T20:15:10 < mawk> there are changes in master, but since it's not released the debian package is old
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2019-02-21T20:16:44 < englishman> ah cool
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2019-02-21T20:17:11 < englishman> I saw v3, new hardware too
2019-02-21T20:19:23 < kakimir> mawk: you simply dont use distro packages
2019-02-21T20:19:25 < PaulFertser> mawk: the first thing to do would be to go through all the commits since last release and write NEWS file with short clear summary for each of them. 
2019-02-21T20:19:57 < arc_phasor> has anyone used the secure boot and secure firmware uploader before?
2019-02-21T20:20:11 < mawk> you'll go to hell with that attitude kakimir 
2019-02-21T20:20:18 < arc_phasor> i need to make sure i can do rock solid updates on-board from another MCU
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2019-02-21T20:56:24 < kakimir> mawk: I'll risk it
2019-02-21T20:59:02 < antto> kakigambler
2019-02-21T20:59:10 < jpa-> arc_phasor: secure boot seems focused in preventing tampering, if you just need reliability that is a whole different thing
2019-02-21T21:07:48 < Rajko> does secure boot let you distribute encrypted firmware updates into the wild that the chinese cant use to clone your product ?
2019-02-21T21:11:52 < Steffann> Hows antrolls day today?
2019-02-21T21:12:15 < arc_phasor> the host MCU is running linux, so I just need to make sure that if I send half an image and something happens, the stm can revert back to the working image
2019-02-21T21:12:22 -!- Steffann is now known as Steffanx
2019-02-21T21:13:02 < Rajko> you dont need to have secure boot for that
2019-02-21T21:14:06 < arc_phasor> i just noticed secure boot talks about "dual-bank" updating, which i assumed was the only way
2019-02-21T21:14:26 < arc_phasor> Rajko: how would I do it?
2019-02-21T21:14:41 < Rajko> you dont even need to do the dual bank thing if you are clever
2019-02-21T21:14:57 < arc_phasor> please share the knowledge
2019-02-21T21:15:01 < Rajko> how do computer bios do it ? they have a failsafe at the start of flash that can operate independently, and then they flash that part last
2019-02-21T21:16:05 < Rajko> but dual bank is easier if you have it in the chip
2019-02-21T21:16:34 < arc_phasor> i'm leaning towards the STM32L073RZ
2019-02-21T21:16:55 < mawk> I don't think computer bioses do it in a particularly secure fashion Rajko 
2019-02-21T21:17:08 < Rajko> didnt have to be secure
2019-02-21T21:17:09 < mawk> you always have warnings about how a power cut will brick the motherboard
2019-02-21T21:17:12 < Rajko> just recover on bad flash
2019-02-21T21:17:14 < mawk> yean I mean reliable
2019-02-21T21:17:17 < Rajko> nah the boot block worked pretty well
2019-02-21T21:17:24 < Rajko> the warning is there so you dont stop it
2019-02-21T21:20:24 < Rajko> routers do the same thing, they never touch the first 64KB of flash in which there is a TFTP recovery routine if the main image has bad crc
2019-02-21T21:25:49 < Rajko> (arduino bootlaoders what what)
2019-02-21T21:33:47 < jpa-> arc_phasor: i'd just tie the BOOT0 pin to the host cpu, and upgrade using the ROM bootloader
2019-02-21T21:34:00 < jpa-> that way atleast you can always rerun the upgrade and no way to accidentally overwrite the bootloader
2019-02-21T21:34:23 < jpa-> and no need to develop anything
2019-02-21T21:36:24 < Rajko> only needs 2 GPIO on linux host (BOOT0 control and STM32 NRST control), and UART of linux connected to UARTA of STM32
2019-02-21T21:36:34 < Rajko> then just run stm32flash on linux, noice
2019-02-21T21:44:33 < kakimir> but have you ran linux in stm32
2019-02-21T21:44:56 < Rajko> you cant
2019-02-21T21:45:06 < Rajko> unless its uclinux on a beefy stm32 
2019-02-21T21:45:13 < Rajko> not really linux or a good idea
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2019-02-21T21:50:09 < invzim> Rajko: enter OpenSTLinux
2019-02-21T21:50:23 < Rajko> does the STL stand for Standard Template Library
2019-02-21T21:50:38 < Rajko> and that doesnt ocunt, it runs on the Cortex-A part of the new dual core part
2019-02-21T21:50:42 < Rajko> not on the MCU part
2019-02-21T21:51:24 < invzim> in an stm32 package :)
2019-02-21T21:51:29 < Rajko> so wont it basically be exactly like wiring a Linux SoC to a normal stm32 ?
2019-02-21T21:51:44 < invzim> would like to make a board for it, but have no projects at hand or idea that require it
2019-02-21T21:51:45 < jpa-> Rajko: uclinux is just a config option in main linux nowadays
2019-02-21T21:52:05 < invzim> and embedded linux is about as much fun as poking needles in your eyes
2019-02-21T21:52:37 < Rajko> you have to run uclinux if your cpu doesnt have a MMU
2019-02-21T21:54:23 < jpa-> which is just linux, configured for a mmuless cpu
2019-02-21T21:55:10 < jpa-> unless you love fork(), the difference is not really that big
2019-02-21T21:55:35 < Rajko> everything's in the same process space like in a RTOS so might as well use a RTOS
2019-02-21T21:55:50 < jpa-> eh
2019-02-21T21:56:21 < jpa-> i assume that if you were to run linux, it would be to use some software that runs easily on linux and is difficult to port elsewhere
2019-02-21T21:56:41 < jpa-> and it does support STM32 MPU, so not really in the same space
2019-02-21T21:56:45 < Rajko> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2019-02-21T21:57:53 < jpa-> but i agree that for most purposes one would use stm32 for, linux would be way too bloat; and for most purposes one would run linux for, stm32 is too weak
2019-02-21T21:58:11 < jpa-> i just don't agree that having or not having MMU has much to do with it
2019-02-21T22:01:21 < Rajko> tomrorow i finally get my stm32 boards, took longer for someone to calculate 20% of the value on the box than to travel half the world
2019-02-21T22:01:33 < Rajko> what if i messed up the oscillator connection somehow, oh no
2019-02-21T22:03:02 < catphish> lol
2019-02-21T22:07:51 < Rajko> if you put 1kohm in series with a gpio it should be ok to juist have the other end hooked up to 3.3v or gnd with the stm32 still driving the gpio, yeah ?
2019-02-21T22:08:39 < jpa-> sure
2019-02-21T22:08:50 < Rajko> what about 100ohm
2019-02-21T22:08:53 < Rajko> then its bad
2019-02-21T22:09:33 < Rajko> its higher than the gpio drive current then
2019-02-21T22:10:15 < aandrew> Rajko: look at the maximum output current specs for the pin (and the port)
2019-02-21T22:10:25 < Rajko> its 4ma per pin
2019-02-21T22:10:28 < aandrew> it all depends on Voh/Vol and Ioh/Iol
2019-02-21T22:10:36 < aandrew> well that's pretty easy to calculate
2019-02-21T22:11:17 < aandrew> if it's 4mA you're overdriving the port by a factor of ten
2019-02-21T22:11:28 < Rajko> yes so 1k good
2019-02-21T22:12:57 < Cracki> 3.3 V / 4 mA = 825 Ohm, to give you an idea
2019-02-21T22:15:42 < Cracki> also consider that source and sink current limits can be unequal
2019-02-21T22:16:13 < Rajko> i can still get a few mhz out with 1K in series right
2019-02-21T22:16:42 < Cracki> that doesn't depend on the resistor
2019-02-21T22:16:45 < Rajko> rise times should be fine for 1-2MHz
2019-02-21T22:17:29 < Cracki> got a capacitor anywhere? then you can worry. if it's only a resistor, then meh
2019-02-21T22:17:39 < Rajko> they still slow down the rise times
2019-02-21T22:18:02 < Cracki> yeees, because wires and the other side have capacity
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2019-02-21T22:18:33 < Cracki> why the resistor anyway, show a schematic maybe
2019-02-21T22:19:10 < Rajko> its so that some other device can drive the signal with priority over the stm32 if i want it to
2019-02-21T22:19:21 < arc_phasor> dang i disconnected during lunch
2019-02-21T22:19:56 < Cracki> so it's a kind of "bus" then
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2019-02-21T22:20:14 < mawk> jpa-: why didn't they make fork act like the original fork in absence of mmu ?
2019-02-21T22:20:18 < mawk> eg don't use CoW
2019-02-21T22:20:25 < mawk> it'd ease porting of programs
2019-02-21T22:20:35 < Cracki> if you're curious, check out frequency limit calculations of other busses such as i2c, 1wire, CAN, ...
2019-02-21T22:20:42 < Cracki> 485 and whatnot
2019-02-21T22:21:15 < Rajko> i2c is different as its open drain and the only rise current comes from the resistor
2019-02-21T22:21:29 < Rajko> but still 400KHz is possible with 4.7K-10K, and 1MHz with 2.2k, usually
2019-02-21T22:21:53 < Cracki> see, the orders of magnitude sound like you're in the green
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2019-02-21T22:22:44 < arc_phasor> the linux is running on a bananapi, whole different chip. I was thinking of connecting it with the stm32 via UART
2019-02-21T22:23:09 < Rajko> if you want the SoC to control power/reset of stm32 then do what i suggested
2019-02-21T22:23:12 < arc_phasor> the problem is, the stm32 controls power to it, so if the stm32 is botched, the m2m wont boot and be able to reflash the stm32
2019-02-21T22:23:20 < Rajko> thats bad
2019-02-21T22:25:03 < Rajko> and yet, your usb is on the linux ?
2019-02-21T22:25:10 < arc_phasor> Rajko: no usb
2019-02-21T22:25:32 < arc_phasor> the bananapi runs linux and the app (display)
2019-02-21T22:26:17 < arc_phasor> the stm32 is connected directly to battery, and so i'd like it to run at all times, and control power to the bananapi when the user hits the power button
2019-02-21T22:26:34 < Rajko> there are power management chips that do exactly that
2019-02-21T22:26:35 < arc_phasor> so in a way its like a PMIC
2019-02-21T22:26:49 < Rajko> does it do much else ?
2019-02-21T22:26:54 < arc_phasor> i need a bunch of custom stuff though so i decided to use a mcu, like showing charging lights and what not
2019-02-21T22:27:09 < Rajko> whats with the solenoids
2019-02-21T22:27:11 < arc_phasor> "breathing lights"when power is plugged into battery charging IC
2019-02-21T22:27:49 < arc_phasor> solenoids will be driven directly by stm32, i don't trust linux to control them. so instead it will send commands via UART to stm32
2019-02-21T22:27:57 < arc_phasor> and the stm32 will handle the solenoid driver directly
2019-02-21T22:29:10 -!- Jybz [~jibz@2a02:8071:9289:5900:4a51:b7ff:fe84:99e6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
2019-02-21T22:29:19 < arc_phasor> so i really need to make sure that firmware doesn't get botched :/
2019-02-21T22:29:44 < Rajko> waste half your flash on dual bank then i dunno
2019-02-21T22:30:05 < arc_phasor> that's what im thinking
2019-02-21T22:31:23 < arc_phasor> i don't really need all the encryption and tamper proof stuff though since the system is pretty closed. but i do need it to handle power being cut, and linux just being linux
2019-02-21T22:32:45 < Rajko> i would just use a proper pmic
2019-02-21T22:33:07 < Rajko> they make some pretty complicated ones that have config memory that lets you program i2c commands to send to other devices on various power transitions etc
2019-02-21T22:33:47 < arc_phasor> Rajko: bananapi has it's own pmic. I'm using a battery charging IC and a fuel gauge IC from TI. Still need a proper pmic?
2019-02-21T22:34:22 < arc_phasor> i already need the stm32 for the low level solenoid driving, i figured throw in the power button detection and control over a couple buck boosts
2019-02-21T22:34:48 < Rajko> whats wrong with bananapis
2019-02-21T22:35:07 < Rajko> you can have stm32 do the funky anims but if its firmware is broken you just dont get funky anims
2019-02-21T22:35:16 < srk> you can issue poweroff or just sync and then cut power after T
2019-02-21T22:35:51 < arc_phasor> the idea is to make firmware 100% reliable.
2019-02-21T22:35:56 < arc_phasor> firmware upgrading
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2019-02-21T22:36:15 < arc_phasor> then i don't have to worry about any of that
2019-02-21T22:36:25 < Rajko> sure you do, issue a buggy firmware
2019-02-21T22:36:29 < Rajko> and its all over, cant turn on the system anymore
2019-02-21T22:36:34 < arc_phasor> right, that would suck
2019-02-21T22:36:42 < srk> add some bypass :)
2019-02-21T22:36:44 < Rajko> while if you use the bananapi pmic as normal for the power, you still could
2019-02-21T22:36:51 < Rajko> just no funky anims
2019-02-21T22:36:57 < arc_phasor> they don't expose the pmic across the gpio header
2019-02-21T22:37:06 < arc_phasor> so i have no control over it, AND i need the device as a whole to be ULP
2019-02-21T22:37:33 < arc_phasor> and if i supply power to teh bananapi, i instantly get a 50mA baseline current
2019-02-21T22:39:21 < Rajko> get a greenpak tiny fpga and OTP it with a rock solid gateware just for the power button/standby ;)
2019-02-21T22:39:36 < arc_phasor> i was thinking about adding some bypass to the power button, like holding it down forces the bananapi to boot up
2019-02-21T22:39:48 < tjq> https://youtu.be/ZlQx_kGAuNs?t=60
2019-02-21T22:43:13 < Rajko> arc_phasor, who would be in charge of detecting the bypass
2019-02-21T22:46:27 < arc_phasor> Rajko: hmm, maybe it would charge an RC filter up to flip the soft latch on, then the bananapi would have to make sure to hold it high once it powers
2019-02-21T22:47:22 < arc_phasor> so like, in the rare case that firmware is botched on the PMIC, the user can hold power button down to force the bananapi to boot
2019-02-21T22:47:55 < arc_phasor> than the bananapi would detect that it can't communicate with the stm32, and could re-flash it
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2019-02-21T22:48:10 < arc_phasor> lol, is it something i said?
2019-02-21T22:51:07 < Cracki> maybe tripped over the power cord
2019-02-21T22:52:51 < arc_phasor> hopefully he wasn't updating his bios
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2019-02-21T22:59:47 < Cracki> if you update your walking-powered shoes and you stop walking, will you ever be able to take another step?
2019-02-21T23:01:13 < arc_phasor> only if you hold your crotch
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2019-02-21T23:11:26 < arc_phasor> what is the recommended IDE to work with stm32?
2019-02-21T23:11:31 < arc_phasor> i can't find info on that
2019-02-21T23:13:04 < Cracki> uh, you have a bunch of choices
2019-02-21T23:13:36 < Cracki> also for compilers. there's arm-gcc, there are a bunch of proprietary compilers, ...
2019-02-21T23:14:01 < Cracki> iirc ST has bundled some stuff and called it an IDE and they give you that for free
2019-02-21T23:14:06 < Cracki> don't ask me what it's called
2019-02-21T23:14:15 < arc_phasor> ahh option overload!
2019-02-21T23:14:16 < Cracki> it's sure to interact well with stm32 tho :>
2019-02-21T23:15:57 < Cracki> debugger hw choices are st-link (on all the disco boards and nucleos, also standalone), segger jlink, "CMSIS DAP"
2019-02-21T23:16:15 < Cracki> oh also the "blackmagic probe"
2019-02-21T23:16:36 < Cracki> so... maybe grab a disco board or nucleo and the ST-provided IDE and start with that
2019-02-21T23:16:59 < arc_phasor> Atollic Truestudio 
2019-02-21T23:17:06 < arc_phasor> k thanks
2019-02-21T23:18:13 < Cracki> I have no idea if this will be the best option for you, but it's the option where you can bitch at ST for anything they might have messed up
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2019-02-21T23:18:53 < arc_phasor> i do like to bitch thats for sure
2019-02-21T23:19:28 < Cracki> the errata sheets will be a delight then
2019-02-21T23:20:41 < Cracki> nb: singular is erratum, similar to bacteria/bacterium :P
2019-02-21T23:24:55 < Cracki> pfft! https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dz82Q4LXQAELGlb.jpg:orig
2019-02-21T23:31:24 < arc_phasor> very topical
2019-02-21T23:31:45 < Cracki> want something even more topical? look up "stalag fiction"
2019-02-21T23:32:15 < arc_phasor> lol wth
2019-02-21T23:32:20 < arc_phasor> i'm at work dude
2019-02-21T23:32:43 < Cracki> yw
2019-02-21T23:33:27 -!- c10ud^ [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2019-02-21T23:34:01 < Cracki> this is fascinating! I'll have to sample that smut
2019-02-21T23:34:27 < Cracki> deep insights into the psyche
2019-02-21T23:37:53 < aandrew> what the fuck
2019-02-21T23:38:00 < aandrew> this STM32 which was working great suddenly went to shit
2019-02-21T23:38:03 < aandrew> same error as the others
2019-02-21T23:38:10 < aandrew> board hasn't been flexed or even moved
2019-02-21T23:38:23 < Cracki> something's torturing them somehow
2019-02-21T23:38:41 < Cracki> are they staying dead or is it a heisenbug kinda thing?
2019-02-21T23:40:32 < Cracki> today I gave a battery-powered kitchen scale a wall PSU. that fucks it up because it uses capacitive touch... and the wall wart has no ground... I'll have to see if I can lessen the effect by getting the right prong onto the neutral phase
2019-02-21T23:41:26 < Cracki> what are you even doing there? how complex a board? not those fancy digitizers?
2019-02-21T23:47:01 < Thorn> Hayabusa2 Touchdown live https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMwAdquDYM 
2019-02-21T23:53:08 < Cracki> this is unlike any anime I've ever seen
2019-02-21T23:53:44 < malinus> kakimir: can't you just use older jlink software with the chinese jlink copies then? It's not like they make revolutionary addition. I would have to make sure the version works with external flash and sram though.
2019-02-21T23:56:17 < Cracki> my chinese jlink v8 clone runs some old leaked firmware. you can upgrade it if you patch it a little
2019-02-21T23:56:31 < Cracki> 2009 or 2013 or something was in the binary iirc
2019-02-21T23:58:18 < malinus> wow that's ancient
2019-02-21T23:58:56 < Cracki> just a beachhead
2019-02-21T23:59:11 < Cracki> stm32f1 isn't bleeding edge either
2019-02-21T23:59:35 < malinus> well I'm not interested in ancient m3
--- Day changed Fri Feb 22 2019
2019-02-22T00:00:27 < Cracki> v8 firmware (c) 2009 segger
2019-02-22T00:00:34 < malinus> I'm usually only doing m7, sometimes m4. Or the cortex-a processors
2019-02-22T00:00:48 < malinus> gotta go fast
2019-02-22T00:00:59 < Cracki> oh right, that jlink v8 used an atsam
2019-02-22T00:01:02 < Cracki> my bad
2019-02-22T00:01:13 < malinus> thank god for neon ("helium") finally comming to m7
2019-02-22T00:01:39 < malinus> that's pretty existing
2019-02-22T00:02:19 < malinus> well I think it will work across most of the cortex-m, not just the 7, but anyway. Pretty neat
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2019-02-22T00:15:45 < englishman> I have a mystery dhl package waiting for me
2019-02-22T00:15:50 < englishman> what could it be
2019-02-22T00:16:24 < Steffanx> Waffles
2019-02-22T00:16:39 < englishman> it is from usa
2019-02-22T00:17:13 < Steffanx> Gun it is then
2019-02-22T00:18:08 < Steffanx> Or did r2com send you antrax?
2019-02-22T00:20:22 < arc_phasor> wait, so there's no way to utilize the unused LCD segment pins to drive separate PWM's?
2019-02-22T00:20:34 < arc_phasor> /s/drive/output
2019-02-22T00:34:41 < antto> https://i.imgur.com/usir4Kt.mp4
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2019-02-22T00:39:45 < englishman> it's some workshit I ordered that they never sent me tracking for
2019-02-22T00:40:03 < englishman> also private citizens cant export guns from usa
2019-02-22T00:40:16 < englishman> nor import from
2019-02-22T00:40:23 -!- MrMobius [~default@c-73-134-82-217.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
2019-02-22T00:40:23 -!- [1]MrMobius is now known as MrMobius
2019-02-22T00:41:49 < englishman> so you just go to the store to get guns instead
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2019-02-22T00:51:19 < catphish> i looked into ADC/DAC options a little more, the common option seems to be multiple I2S channels, though i'm not totally sure what can translate between 4+4 i2s lines and usb
2019-02-22T00:52:25 < zyp> why not AC97?
2019-02-22T00:53:23 < catphish> beats me, weirdly i've not come across any examples of it
2019-02-22T00:53:25 < catphish> i'll look
2019-02-22T00:57:18 < catphish> looks like Azalia has largely replaced it
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2019-02-22T01:04:28 < catphish> zyp: does ac97 allow several DACs to share the same data line?
2019-02-22T01:05:46 < zyp> dunno
2019-02-22T01:06:47 < catphish> can't find a great deal of info about it
2019-02-22T01:07:30 < catphish> "The link carries a bidirectional serial data stream at a fixed bitrate (12.288 Mbit/s) between the controller and one or more codecs. "
2019-02-22T01:07:31 < catphish> so yes :)
2019-02-22T01:14:02 < catphish> zyp: thanks, it seems like ac97 *just* meets my requirements, but doesn't seem any easier to hook up to usb
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2019-02-22T01:16:14 < zyp> why not? doesn't the stm32 SAI talk AC97?
2019-02-22T01:17:18 < zyp> sure does
2019-02-22T01:17:20 < zyp> «The SAI interface (serial audio interface) offers a wide set of audio protocols due to its flexibility and wide range of configurations. Many stereo or mono audio applications may be targeted. I2S standards, LSB or MSB-justified, PCM/DSP, TDM, and AC’97 protocols may be addressed for example.»
2019-02-22T01:17:29 < catphish> actually yes it does, that's interesting
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2019-02-22T01:20:05 < zyp> seems like it can also be configured for dual i2s, if you wanna run four channels of that
2019-02-22T01:20:27 < catphish> some stm32s have 4 lanes of SAI
2019-02-22T01:21:02 < catphish> so that's a maximum of 8 audio channels
2019-02-22T01:23:27 < zyp> AC97 seems to have 9 channels of output
2019-02-22T01:23:53 < zyp> apparently there's 12 slots in a frame, of which three are used for metadata, leaving 9 for audio data
2019-02-22T01:24:32 < catphish> indeed, so would only need 2 lanes for 8 in + 8 out
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2019-02-22T01:52:42 < catphish> zyp: i think i will play with I2S TDM first, looks like SAI supports that too
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2019-02-22T02:02:10 < englishman> zyp: https://i.imgur.com/cpYz0pr.jpg
2019-02-22T02:04:54 < catphish> lol poor
2019-02-22T02:05:31 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-22T02:05:44 < aandrew> I get great joy in parking my TDI VW in parking spaces for e-vehicles
2019-02-22T02:05:50 < englishman> why
2019-02-22T02:05:55 < englishman> thats so passive aggressive
2019-02-22T02:06:05 < aandrew> one spot in particualr has like 6 parking spaces total and they took two for e-vehicle charging
2019-02-22T02:06:08 < englishman> i think less of you
2019-02-22T02:06:09 < aandrew> fuck 'em, I'm a paying customer too
2019-02-22T02:06:28 < aandrew> if there's other parking I use it but if those two are the only two left I'm taking one
2019-02-22T02:08:07 < arc_phasor> hell yea
2019-02-22T02:08:23 < arc_phasor> only reserved parking should be for handicapped
2019-02-22T02:08:26 < arc_phasor> fuck everyone else.
2019-02-22T02:08:31 < aandrew> yep
2019-02-22T02:08:35 < englishman> nice attitude there
2019-02-22T02:08:53 < aandrew> I do avoid the pink parking as well only because I've been there with two carseats in the winter and it sucks
2019-02-22T02:08:56 < arc_phasor> i might need a snickers
2019-02-22T02:12:45 < Cracki> "pink parking"?
2019-02-22T02:12:48 < Cracki> sounds sexist
2019-02-22T02:13:21 < Cracki> are those the parking spaces with extra maneuvering room and padded bumpers?
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2019-02-22T02:19:36 < jadew> morning
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2019-02-22T02:38:56 < aandrew> there we go. got that little ssd1306 display running
2019-02-22T02:39:02 < aandrew> now I have some debug output
2019-02-22T02:39:18 < englishman> printf debugging
2019-02-22T02:39:21 < englishman> sounds like you are using opensores
2019-02-22T02:39:32 < englishman> on an 80x60 pixel screen too
2019-02-22T02:39:34 < englishman> high tech!
2019-02-22T02:39:48 < aandrew> actually no, will be graphing current draw. I have SWO if I want printf debugging
2019-02-22T02:39:58 < aandrew> 128x64 too. :-)
2019-02-22T02:40:05 < aandrew> don't hate, appreciate.
2019-02-22T02:41:32 < aandrew> time to pack up and go to the hotel
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2019-02-22T02:56:50 < jadew> another opensource success story: http://libregraphicsworld.org/blog/entry/librecad-vs-qcad
2019-02-22T02:58:48 < jadew> what do you guys use for 2D cad?
2019-02-22T02:58:56 < englishman> mspaint
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2019-02-22T02:59:22 < jadew> that's what I've been using, but if I draw more than a couple of lines, it's getting hard to manage them
2019-02-22T02:59:54 < jadew> I'm actually using inkscape, but it's lacking some basic CAD features
2019-02-22T03:00:30 < jadew> if it had constraints and a nice tool for dimension marking, it would be great
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2019-02-22T03:01:17 < fenugrec> inkscape lacking cad features... minor understatement there
2019-02-22T03:01:52 < jadew> it's not a CAD program, so you can't fault it for that
2019-02-22T03:02:06 < jadew> but it could be used as one if it had some basic CAD functionality
2019-02-22T03:03:00 < jadew> I'm gonna test QCAD now
2019-02-22T03:03:14 < jadew> at 33 EUR for the pro version, it might be worth it
2019-02-22T03:04:03 < jadew> I don't know what other alternatives are there
2019-02-22T03:04:37 < jadew> I don't think AutoCAD can even be bought anymore (looks like it's on a monthly basis) - not that I would have bought it, I don't have money for that
2019-02-22T03:06:07 < fenugrec> autocad still blows, I believe
2019-02-22T03:08:12 < jadew> installed QCAD, can't find how to show the sheet I'm drawing on
2019-02-22T03:08:21 < jadew> seems I have an infinite space at my disposal
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2019-02-22T03:16:11 < jadew> I'm back to inkscape
2019-02-22T03:21:08 < catphish> so it turns out there is an stm32 with HS USB PHY :)
2019-02-22T03:21:26 < catphish> stm32f7x3
2019-02-22T03:26:19 < aandrew> orly
2019-02-22T03:26:35 < aandrew> I have a 756 on a baord but put a HS ULPI PHY on it
2019-02-22T03:26:42 < aandrew> havent' brought that part up yet
2019-02-22T03:27:16 < catphish> i'm hunting for anything that can bridge 8+8 channels of i2s with usb
2019-02-22T03:27:28 < aandrew> sure
2019-02-22T03:27:39 < aandrew> ft2232 can't do that for you?
2019-02-22T03:29:21 < catphish> isnt that a uart chip?
2019-02-22T03:29:43 < aandrew> no, it'll do high speed parallel too
2019-02-22T03:30:02 < aandrew> it's good for 480mbps but not sure what it can actually achieve in that mode
2019-02-22T03:31:04 < aandrew> sync fifo mode is probably what you want if you're using it
2019-02-22T03:31:53 < aandrew> 16ns clock what's that, 60MHz?
2019-02-22T03:32:30 < aandrew> so 480Mbps
2019-02-22T03:32:38 < catphish> wow
2019-02-22T03:33:16 < aandrew> check the price of it+mcu vs something like f7x3
2019-02-22T03:33:58 < catphish> do i even need the mcu
2019-02-22T03:34:20 < aandrew> depends on what your'e connecting it to
2019-02-22T03:34:31 < catphish> although i'm not totally understanding, it only has 2 channels
2019-02-22T03:34:41 < aandrew> you could use one FTDI channel for spi/i2c/whatever and the other for high speed
2019-02-22T03:34:56 < aandrew> yes
2019-02-22T03:35:01 < aandrew> you get 2 channels
2019-02-22T03:35:21 < aandrew> make one serial/i2c/spi/jtag/bitbang and the ohter your fifo interface
2019-02-22T03:36:29 < catphish> is this "CPU-style FIFO Interface Mode"?
2019-02-22T03:36:45 < aandrew> it can act like a motorola / intel CPU bus
2019-02-22T03:37:12 < catphish> that's not something i'm very familiar with
2019-02-22T03:37:51 < aandrew> perhaps let's start by defining what you know
2019-02-22T03:38:01 < aandrew> you've got 8+8 i2s
2019-02-22T03:38:08 < aandrew> how do you get data in/out of that
2019-02-22T03:38:26 < aandrew> ie what is this 8+8 i2s interface
2019-02-22T03:38:57 < catphish> i'll start over
2019-02-22T03:39:12 < catphish> i want to run 8 ADCs and 8 DACs
2019-02-22T03:39:57 < catphish> the obvious choice of interface is 8 x i2s, since each i2s carries 2 channels
2019-02-22T03:40:40 < aandrew> so 8 codecs then, not much other than that outputs native i2s I don't think
2019-02-22T03:40:56 < aandrew> or 4 codecs because they're often stereo
2019-02-22T03:41:17 < Cracki> spacex is doing something https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS0E35aYJcU
2019-02-22T03:41:45 < catphish> aandrew: i believe i2s always carries 2 channels
2019-02-22T03:42:38 < catphish> so assuming everything is separate, that's 4 stereo lines in and 4 stereo lines out
2019-02-22T03:45:00 < catphish> worst case scenario, each line would be running at 192khz x 64 bit, so 12.288 MHz
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2019-02-22T03:52:17 < ds2> jadew: have you looked at TurboCAD?
2019-02-22T03:52:31 < jadew> ds2, I have not
2019-02-22T03:52:35 < jadew> I'll check it out, thanks
2019-02-22T03:53:00 < ds2> for some reason, they seem to do deals with magazines where you can get a free copy
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2019-02-22T03:54:07 < jadew> looks like they have a 2D version for $50
2019-02-22T03:54:09 < jadew> that's acceptable
2019-02-22T03:54:28 < catphish> aandrew: any idea where i find the timings of the 8-channel bit-bang mode of the ft2232? because it seems a lot like that chip *could* handle the 4 raw i2s channels
2019-02-22T03:54:43 < jadew> ds2, I'll get a trial, thanks
2019-02-22T03:54:49 < aandrew> 8 channel?
2019-02-22T03:55:13 < ds2> jadew: what are you going to use it for?
2019-02-22T03:55:18 < aandrew> the datasheet is pretty good I'd start there
2019-02-22T03:55:37 < catphish> aandrew: in bitbang mode it provides 8 parallel lines i believe
2019-02-22T03:55:45 < jadew> ds2, I can't export my frontpanel from fusion, so I have to re-do it in a 2D cad program
2019-02-22T03:56:04 < ds2> jadew: oh you got sucked into the Fusion trap? Do you know about alibre?
2019-02-22T03:56:29 < jadew> I do not
2019-02-22T03:56:45 < ds2> alibre is a low(er?) cost Solidworks clone
2019-02-22T03:56:54 < catphish> "The  FT2232H  channel  A  or  channel  B  can  be  configured  as  a  synchronous  or  asynchronous  bit-bang interface. Bit-bang mode is a special FTDI FT2232H device mode that changes the 8 IO lines on either (or both) channels into an 8 bit bi-directional data bus. There are two types of bit-bang modes: synchronous and asynchronous. "
2019-02-22T03:57:00 < jadew> oh, neat
2019-02-22T03:57:12 < jadew> I'll have to check it out, it sounds promising
2019-02-22T03:57:14 < ds2> I use that for 3D modeling...turbocad is good for cleaning up 2D stuff to send to a cutter
2019-02-22T03:57:15 < jadew> you're using that?
2019-02-22T03:57:42 < ds2> yes... I been using them since 2011... things sucked after they got acquired but they got spun off again (the original developers bought back the rights)
2019-02-22T03:58:52 < ds2> technically I have 2 licenses for it but only 1 is really usable...and everything I am talking about is an indefinite license none of that autodesk crap
2019-02-22T03:59:23 < jadew> neat, how much does it cost? it can't be cheap
2019-02-22T03:59:40 < jadew> I didn't find a price yet
2019-02-22T04:00:10 < ds2> well... one of my license was $99 but that got effectively lost after the mergers/splits; the other license was like $300ish but I am also paying maintence.
2019-02-22T04:00:29 < ds2> they were talking about bringing back a low cost version (<$200) but donno where they are with that
2019-02-22T04:00:58 < jadew> I see
2019-02-22T04:01:21 < jadew> the reseller in my country says it costs between 915 and 1600 EUR
2019-02-22T04:01:36 < ds2> I am using this customer stuff
2019-02-22T04:01:47 < ds2> whoa... that's more then a year's maintence
2019-02-22T04:02:41 < ds2> I see a base version for $199
2019-02-22T04:02:56 < ds2> does this appear for you: https://www.alibre.com/product/alibre-atom3d/
2019-02-22T04:03:19 < catphish> sleep now :)
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2019-02-22T04:03:23 < englishman> catphish: do you run tho
2019-02-22T04:03:24 < englishman> fuck
2019-02-22T04:03:26 < englishman> shit timing
2019-02-22T04:03:40 < jadew> ds2, it does
2019-02-22T04:03:43 < jadew> how did you get there?
2019-02-22T04:04:03 < jadew> when I clicked the red buy button I got an empty page with a link to all the distributors
2019-02-22T04:04:53 < ds2> front page, buy now and it brings me to a page with 3 levels...label is Buy Alibre Products Online
2019-02-22T04:05:19 < jadew> what does node locked license mean?
2019-02-22T04:05:21 < ds2> all I see..there are javascript trickery.... 
2019-02-22T04:05:45 < ds2> it is tied to the machine.... I think you can uninstall and reinstall on another machine
2019-02-22T04:05:54 < jadew> yeah, it looks like I might be able to buy it
2019-02-22T04:06:08 < jadew> I see
2019-02-22T04:06:19 < ds2> if you disable javascript, there is somethijng about "Alibre does not sell direct to your location. "
2019-02-22T04:06:47 < ds2> not trying to help them sell it... I just been using it
2019-02-22T04:07:03 < fenugrec> ds2, turbocad ! didn't even know that still existed, I remember using a version that came on 3-4 1.44Mb disks
2019-02-22T04:07:12 < jadew> yeah, if I try to buy it from their page, Romania is not in the dropdown of countries
2019-02-22T04:08:12 < ds2> fenugrec: heh.. same here til I saw it on the newstand... figure a license for the price of a magazine isn't too bad
2019-02-22T04:08:14 < jadew> probably because they have to meet some EU regulations, so you have to buy through a distributor
2019-02-22T04:08:39 < jadew> ds2, nice
2019-02-22T04:09:33 < aandrew> oh catphish left
2019-02-22T04:09:43 < aandrew> I don't think i2s will work reliably with a bulk transfer bitbang interface
2019-02-22T04:10:03 < aandrew> with a fifo mode maybe but you'll have an intermediary FGPA doing some dirty work
2019-02-22T04:10:05 < ds2> bit bang i2s? definition of hard realtime? :D
2019-02-22T04:10:20 < aandrew> ds2: hard as in difficult, yes. :-)
2019-02-22T04:11:12 < ds2> may work nicely on a Cortex-R
2019-02-22T04:13:02 < fenugrec> I'm still floating on an old student verion of ProEngineer 4... it's horrible, and guilty of almost every UI crime imaginable, but still, I haven't found anything to replace it...
2019-02-22T04:13:57 < ds2> isn't the student version file format locked? 
2019-02-22T04:14:14 < fenugrec> yep, but I only use it for personal garbage
2019-02-22T04:14:42 < ds2> can you export to standard formats?
2019-02-22T04:14:53 < ds2> step/igs/sat?
2019-02-22T04:15:01 < fenugrec> step, iges for sure
2019-02-22T04:15:15 < fenugrec> some BS formats like dxf, catia too
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2019-02-22T04:18:38 < ds2> it is not BS when you need that
2019-02-22T04:46:16 < jadew> how do you represent a countersunk screw hole where the countersunk feature is not all the way down?
2019-02-22T04:46:38 < ds2> a note?
2019-02-22T04:47:40 < jadew> yeah, was hoping for something better, so it doesn't gets messed up
2019-02-22T04:47:56 < ds2> how do you want it fabricated/
2019-02-22T04:48:14 < ds2> C-sink often requires a special tool 
2019-02-22T04:49:01 < jadew> well, I expect them to drill it normally and then instead of going all the way down with the countersink drill, go only a little in
2019-02-22T04:49:20 < jadew> enough to hit the radius of the hole
2019-02-22T04:49:29 < jadew> I can calculate and give them the exact depth
2019-02-22T04:49:45 < ds2> you could call out the max upper diameter and force the operator to calc how far 
2019-02-22T04:50:01 < ds2> just need to specify the angle (90, 82, etc)
2019-02-22T04:50:39 < jadew> good to know, thanks
2019-02-22T04:51:36 < ds2> or be annoying and call out - c-sink sufficient to be level with a #XXXX screw ;)
2019-02-22T04:51:51 < ds2> and hope they don't bill you for the purchase of the machinery handbook
2019-02-22T04:52:03 < jadew> heh
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2019-02-22T05:01:32 < upgrdman> anyone know of a wifi module that can do high speed and doesn't require a whole os/kernel to talk to it? e.g. i want an esp8266 but able to do real-world 100Mbps worth of transmitted UDP packets.
2019-02-22T05:02:07 < upgrdman> im thinking the easiest way might be to use a fucking SBC with 801.11ac, but i'd prefer a module that my FPGA can talk directly to
2019-02-22T05:18:24 < dongs> a SDIO wifi module should be able to do 
2019-02-22T05:18:39 < dongs> and sdio shouldnt be too hard to do on fpga
2019-02-22T05:19:12 < dongs> make sure and don't pick LANTRONIX XPIco wifi or you'll end up like zano
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2019-02-22T05:25:45 < aandrew> you want 100mbps out of a spi port?
2019-02-22T05:27:20 < dongs> aandrew: sdio is commonly used to connect wifi to phone chipsets
2019-02-22T05:27:40 < rajkosto> thats sd, not spi
2019-02-22T05:27:51 < rajkosto> SD has separate cmd/data lines
2019-02-22T05:28:07 < dongs> sdio can also be as wide as 8 bit
2019-02-22T05:28:19 < rajkosto> yes 8 dat lines
2019-02-22T05:28:25 < rajkosto> and they are bidirectional vs spi unidirectional
2019-02-22T05:28:55 < rajkosto> anyway you totally can get 100mbps out of a SPI port
2019-02-22T05:28:59 < rajkosto> not even sdio
2019-02-22T05:28:59 < aandrew> yes 
2019-02-22T05:29:15 < rajkosto> bunch of spi nor flash memories can operate at that rate
2019-02-22T05:29:38 < rajkosto> and some provide a 2-bit parallel mode where MISO and MOSI are switched to one direction and you get 2 bits per clock too
2019-02-22T05:29:46 < rajkosto> that way*
2019-02-22T05:30:46 < aandrew> there's qspi too
2019-02-22T05:35:00 < rajkosto> sdio is used to connect everything to phone chipsets as far as i know, they have lots of ports for it
2019-02-22T05:35:21 < rajkosto> only reason people would confuse sd with spi is because MMC have a slow SPI compatibility mode the arduino people keep using
2019-02-22T05:37:28 < aandrew> nah I just completely forgot about sdio
2019-02-22T05:38:00 < aandrew> but beyond that I don't know of an off the shelf sdio module that doesn't need some kind of big driver to get running
2019-02-22T05:41:34 < ds2> isn't there royalties due if you implement SDIO in a FPGA?
2019-02-22T05:41:53 < dongs> if you scream in a forest and noone is around to hear you
2019-02-22T05:43:21 < rajkosto> is there a stm32 with native high speed usb already
2019-02-22T05:43:37 < dongs> there has been, you still need a phy
2019-02-22T05:43:45 < rajkosto> thats what i mean by native
2019-02-22T05:43:46 < rajkosto> f phys
2019-02-22T05:44:33 < rajkosto> st-link v3 does usb2.0 hi speed thats why i ask
2019-02-22T05:45:02 < dongs> uh
2019-02-22T05:45:05 < aandrew> rajkosto: apparently 7x3
2019-02-22T05:46:56 < dongs> rajkosto: thats what they used
2019-02-22T05:46:58 < dongs> F723
2019-02-22T05:47:30 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/6JZxh5L.png
2019-02-22T05:47:34 < dongs> backside of stdink
2019-02-22T05:48:11 < rajkosto> wonder if that stm32 can ever saturate the hi speed bus
2019-02-22T05:48:18 < rajkosto> like fx2 can with its auto modes
2019-02-22T05:48:50 < aandrew> that's a lot of stm32 for a swd interface
2019-02-22T05:49:00 < dongs> maybe they're finally serious
2019-02-22T05:49:08 < dongs> and support something better than 1mhz swd speed
2019-02-22T05:49:53 < dongs> The protocols and functions supported are:
2019-02-22T05:49:54 < dongs> • SWD with SWO (up to 24 MHz)
2019-02-22T05:49:54 < dongs> • JTAG (up to 21 MHz)
2019-02-22T05:49:54 < dongs> • VCP (from 720 bps to 15 Mbps)
2019-02-22T05:50:01 < dongs> well, slightly better than V2
2019-02-22T05:51:19 < rajkosto> how do i activate VCP on my homebrew stlink
2019-02-22T05:52:07 < rajkosto> 24MHz is decent but the ft2232h could do 30MHz like 10 years ago
2019-02-22T05:52:23 < rajkosto> probably still faster on the stlink cuz it cna have smarts
2019-02-22T05:52:42 < aandrew> how much is that thing
2019-02-22T05:53:06 < dongs> $35
2019-02-22T05:53:11 < dongs> same as old stdink
2019-02-22T05:53:14 < dongs> (iirc
2019-02-22T05:53:16 < aandrew> oh that's not bad
2019-02-22T05:53:28 < dongs> i may add this on to my next mouser order
2019-02-22T05:53:48 < rajkosto> dongs, i see no real benefit of keeping j-link firmware on this especially since i have to use SEGGER's gdb which means no hacked 128KB stm32f108c8
2019-02-22T05:54:21 < rajkosto> (it also makes modal progress bars appear during firmware uploads lol)
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2019-02-22T06:50:34 < rajkosto> anyone here have a nucleo with st-link2.1 with uart working ?
2019-02-22T06:51:31 < rajkosto> nvm
2019-02-22T07:04:30 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_06-04-27_V1ZlbNhRl.png hoo
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2019-02-22T07:11:52 < ds2> what's the advantage of stlink over a jlink?
2019-02-22T07:12:02 < rajkosto> virtual com port
2019-02-22T07:12:16 < rajkosto> that weird partition where you can drag bin files i just showed screenshot of 
2019-02-22T07:12:20 < rajkosto> im not gonna be using that tho
2019-02-22T07:12:37 < rajkosto> and you use openocd instead of segger j-link proprietary gdb
2019-02-22T07:12:51 < rajkosto> and stlinkv3 supports jtag too apparently
2019-02-22T07:12:54 < rajkosto> and is high speed
2019-02-22T07:14:28 < ds2> seems it like ability to use it with other vendors would cancel out those advantages
2019-02-22T07:14:51 < ds2> how does virtual com port work? does it burn a UART on the target?
2019-02-22T07:20:26 < rajkosto> no theres just pins on the stlink that are RX/TX
2019-02-22T07:20:29 < rajkosto> and you see it as com port
2019-02-22T07:20:31 < rajkosto> i like it
2019-02-22T07:20:35 < rajkosto> saves me from using another usb device
2019-02-22T07:20:53 < rajkosto> if you want output-only from your target you dont need it
2019-02-22T07:21:06 < rajkosto> SWO can be written to and received by stlink
2019-02-22T07:23:50 < ds2> that is nifty
2019-02-22T07:23:58 < ds2> can the stlink act as a power supply?
2019-02-22T07:40:32 < emeb_mac> not reliably
2019-02-22T08:04:12 < ds2> that's my other sore point with the JLink...it really insist on power on before hand
2019-02-22T08:04:56 < ds2> hey emeb_mac, are there still many things that use FSK thesedays?
2019-02-22T08:07:25 < emeb_mac> ds2: sure - mostly low rate stuff that's got some history
2019-02-22T08:08:48 < ds2> as in old stuff that work like a 1200bps modem?
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2019-02-22T08:18:37 < cdnChrisDvo> good day all.  Can anyone lend a hand with a PWM output problem ? trying to enable PWM output on PB3 and modify it's duty cycle via DMA .  CubeMX has helped and this worked find when PB6 was used.
2019-02-22T08:18:43 < cdnChrisDvo> stm32f103x
2019-02-22T08:20:53 < cdnChrisDvo> I realize that PB3 is also used for JTAG, but that is disabled (I'm using SWD) and the JTAG related functions of that pin have been disabled
2019-02-22T08:22:32 < rajkosto> emeb_mac, you can make your own that does
2019-02-22T08:23:14 < rajkosto> cdnChrisDvo, you called setPinAlternate (jtag off whatever) ?
2019-02-22T08:23:55 < rajkosto> you called set gpio on PB3 to be AF_PP ?
2019-02-22T08:24:01 < cdnChrisDvo> HAL_MspInit() has the macro:   __HAL_AFIO_REMAP_SWJ_NOJTAG();
2019-02-22T08:24:16 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : AF_PP, correct.
2019-02-22T08:24:26 < rajkosto> what is the timer used
2019-02-22T08:25:23 < rajkosto> TIM2_CH2
2019-02-22T08:25:23 < cdnChrisDvo> TIM2_CH2
2019-02-22T08:25:38 < rajkosto> and it worked when TIM4_CH1 was used
2019-02-22T08:26:05 < cdnChrisDvo> correct, (TIM4_CH1 was the default for PB6) 
2019-02-22T08:26:10 < rajkosto> did you change the DMA channel ?
2019-02-22T08:26:18 < rajkosto> specific DMA channels are used for specific peripherals
2019-02-22T08:26:39 < rajkosto> also, when you are initing the frequency, you now need to init TIM2, and when initing the output, you now have to init OC2
2019-02-22T08:26:59 < rajkosto> check if you can change the duty without dma
2019-02-22T08:27:25 < cdnChrisDvo> k, good call will try that first.
2019-02-22T08:27:57 < cdnChrisDvo> the dma handle is called: hdma_tim2_ch2_ch4 -- I'm somewhat confused between the ch2/ch4 
2019-02-22T08:27:57 < rajkosto> RM0008 chapter 13.3.7, page 281 for DMA channel mapping
2019-02-22T08:28:18 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : copy that, will do also
2019-02-22T08:28:55 < rajkosto> TIM2_CH2 is on DMA1 Channel 7
2019-02-22T08:29:04 < cdnChrisDvo> correct
2019-02-22T08:29:22 < rajkosto> did you enable the correct DMA request in TIM2
2019-02-22T08:30:26 < cdnChrisDvo> 		__HAL_TIM_ENABLE_DMA( &htim2, TIM_DMA_CC2 );  
2019-02-22T08:32:42 < cdnChrisDvo> I'm getting the DMA interrupts (half & complete) so I assume the DMA xfer is working
2019-02-22T08:32:45 < rajkosto> aandrew, get stlinkv3, dump stlinkv3 (not directly via jtag/swo as its protected, you have to trick the bootloader into running your own firmware that will dump it over uart or something), clone stlinkv3 onto your fpga board, and then you have everything
2019-02-22T08:32:49 < cdnChrisDvo> what I don't see is the actual pwm output
2019-02-22T08:33:06 < rajkosto> show TIM2 and OC2 code
2019-02-22T08:33:17 < rajkosto> also HAL is cancer
2019-02-22T08:34:12 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : I'm very quickly learning that... 
2019-02-22T08:34:25 < rajkosto> stdperiph much better
2019-02-22T08:39:50 < rajkosto> use a pastebin to paste code
2019-02-22T08:40:14 < cdnChrisDvo> k, let me edit the code to remove comments and error checking, stand by
2019-02-22T08:40:30 < rajkosto> dont
2019-02-22T08:40:40 < cdnChrisDvo> ok
2019-02-22T08:44:04 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : https://pastebin.com/6DYKmGT3
2019-02-22T08:44:30 < rajkosto> why such a tiny prescaler and period
2019-02-22T08:45:13 < cdnChrisDvo> 800khz only
2019-02-22T08:45:22 < rajkosto> nop
2019-02-22T08:45:48 < rajkosto> this means you can only set your "duty" between 0 and 29
2019-02-22T08:46:15 < cdnChrisDvo> correct, I have only 2 duty cycles (9,21)
2019-02-22T08:46:18 < rajkosto> and your frequency is APB2Clock/(2*29)
2019-02-22T08:47:43 < rajkosto> why linking both CC2 and CC4 to your dma handle
2019-02-22T08:48:03 < rajkosto> also your direction is peripheral to memory
2019-02-22T08:48:06 < rajkosto> not memory to peripheral
2019-02-22T08:48:39 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : the double linking confused me too -- it's what CubeMX did... 
2019-02-22T08:48:53 < cdnChrisDvo> (I can see very soon I shall have to ditch Cube / Hal) 
2019-02-22T08:49:22 < rajkosto> you want to write duty to timer ? you use DMA_MEMORY_TO_PERIPH
2019-02-22T08:50:30 < cdnChrisDvo> rajkosto : good catch, I've re-generated the from cube many times while playing, I clearly set that wrong.
2019-02-22T08:50:44 < cdnChrisDvo> I will quickly change that and retest.
2019-02-22T08:52:13 < cdnChrisDvo> okay, well now it's working 
2019-02-22T08:52:49 < cdnChrisDvo> I suppose I confused myself right out of the game, by changing more things at once than I have brain power for.
2019-02-22T08:52:59 < cdnChrisDvo> I really appreciate your time in taking a look -- 
2019-02-22T08:53:30 < cdnChrisDvo> thank you very much!
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2019-02-22T09:06:26 < rajkosto> https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/269/332/a19.jpg
2019-02-22T09:16:47 < karlp> rajkosto seems to have weird ideas of how stlink and jlink work 
2019-02-22T09:17:14 < karlp> ds2: (yes, it burns a uart on the target, but there's jumpers for it if you wanted them)
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2019-02-22T09:17:47 < tjq> Guns
2019-02-22T09:19:01 < karlp> rajkosto: you can use jlink with oocd directly too, segger even helped a bit with some docs on apis, there's a libjaylink that can talk to both usb and tcp connected jlinks, used by oocd.
2019-02-22T09:19:46 < karlp> the ubs-uart com port provided by the stlink v2.1s is pretty flaky though, it's not a good choice for regular use, vs  a cp210x or ft23x
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2019-02-22T09:23:47 < dongs> karlp, does it actually use native jlink driver
2019-02-22T09:23:48 < dongs> or needs libusb
2019-02-22T09:23:54 < dongs> because if libusb, fuck outta here
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2019-02-22T09:27:38 < PaulFertser> dongs: you're saying that as if vendor jlink software is not using libusb (on everything but windows).
2019-02-22T09:28:02 < PaulFertser> dongs: also, libusb is not a driver, it's a userspace lib.
2019-02-22T09:29:48 < rajkosto> its a driver on windows
2019-02-22T09:29:50 < rajkosto> and it succ
2019-02-22T09:30:03 < dongs> PaulFertser: jlink has its own driver.
2019-02-22T09:30:07 < dongs> libusb on windows is a non-startetr
2019-02-22T09:30:10 < rajkosto> libusbk best because it lets you interface with libusb driver, libusbK driver (better), or WinUSB drivers
2019-02-22T09:30:13 < dongs> due to usage of zadig and unsigned drivers
2019-02-22T09:30:15 < tjq> Window
2019-02-22T09:30:21 < rajkosto> theres also some libusb filter driver abomination that ruins whatever you attach it to
2019-02-22T09:30:28 < dongs> yes this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
2019-02-22T09:30:37 < dongs> i installed that once and had to wipe windows
2019-02-22T09:30:40 < dongs> because it permanently fucked anything USB
2019-02-22T09:30:41 < tjq> Lol
2019-02-22T09:31:25 < rajkosto> openocd has switched from supporting the FTDI CDM driver stuff on windows to requiring you to replace the ftdi driver with libusbk/WinUSB
2019-02-22T09:31:28 < rajkosto> on windows
2019-02-22T09:31:42 < rajkosto> luckily the driver stuff is per channel so you can still use the other channel normally
2019-02-22T09:31:59 < dongs> for real? are tehy STILL fighting over that gasrbge?
2019-02-22T09:32:06 < dongs> i thought libDxx shit was fuckign done and solved
2019-02-22T09:32:07 < dongs> holy fuck
2019-02-22T09:32:11 < rajkosto> yes its solved
2019-02-22T09:32:13 < rajkosto> its not used anymore.
2019-02-22T09:32:20 < dongs> thats not a solution
2019-02-22T09:32:20 < rajkosto> no d2xx even on windows
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2019-02-22T09:32:23 < dongs> thats a step backwards.
2019-02-22T09:32:41 < rajkosto> its NON FREE
2019-02-22T09:32:50 < rajkosto> cant eat your foot fungus while having non free libraries in your software
2019-02-22T09:32:53 < dongs> :rolleyes:
2019-02-22T09:33:53 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: no, libusb is not a driver on windows
2019-02-22T09:34:00 < rajkosto> yes, yes it is.
2019-02-22T09:34:01 < dongs> it most definitely is
2019-02-22T09:34:11 < dongs> some shitty versions of it use winusb
2019-02-22T09:34:17 < dongs> soem attach that aids filter driver
2019-02-22T09:34:19 < dongs> to all devices
2019-02-22T09:34:24 < dongs> i dont know cuz libusb development is a fucking mess too
2019-02-22T09:34:27 < dongs> nobodyt knows waht teh fuck they're doing
2019-02-22T09:34:30 < rajkosto> winusb is the best solution
2019-02-22T09:34:32 < dongs> 10 different shitty versions
2019-02-22T09:34:36 < rajkosto> as then you dont have to use libusb at all
2019-02-22T09:34:40 < rajkosto> even as a user library
2019-02-22T09:35:22 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: there was libusb-win32 driver, it was for libusb-0.1 API (and the filter driver dongs remembers is from that era), nobody is anylonger using it.
2019-02-22T09:35:45 < rajkosto> theres also libusbK which is not as bad as that
2019-02-22T09:35:57 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: current libusb-1.0 version for windows just uses winusb driver.
2019-02-22T09:36:06 < PaulFertser> (or libusbK driver)
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2019-02-22T09:37:49 < PaulFertser> And BTW that libusb-win32 driver, filters etc were created because Microsoft was too stupid to provide _any_ API to talk to USB devices at all, WinUSB didn't exist back then.
2019-02-22T09:41:46 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: ftdi driver in openocd talks MPSSE directly, there's no need for either libftdi or d2xx, both those libraries are simply useless for the task. The old interface code that tried to interface to ftdi devices via libftdi/d2xx was a buggy mess so it was dropped after a stable (and maintainable) alternative appeared. 
2019-02-22T09:42:06 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-22T09:42:09 < rajkosto> but it means you have to swap driver
2019-02-22T09:42:12 < rajkosto> to libusbK or WinUSB
2019-02-22T09:42:59 < PaulFertser> On windows, yes, because it doesn't have any API to temporarily "unbind" the driver and let userspace control USB devices.
2019-02-22T09:43:38 < rajkosto> the d2xx interface in openocd sucked because it was completely different from the properly configurable libusb one
2019-02-22T09:43:45 < rajkosto> they should have just had both backends in the libftdi one
2019-02-22T09:45:22 < PaulFertser> It sucked internally, it was just buggy and messy. And developers do not like to go through unnecessary abstraction layers, those were more harming than helping. So plain MPSEE it is now.
2019-02-22T09:45:36 < rajkosto> its the same data stream either way
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2019-02-22T09:45:56 < rajkosto> just the find and init functions are slightly different
2019-02-22T09:46:52 < PaulFertser> So why would someone bother to add another dependency and API when libusb already does the job? And libftdi is using libusb anyway, and I would expect d2xx libraries to use libusb with Linux, the kernel, too.
2019-02-22T09:47:15 < rajkosto> because unlike openocd developers, some people use windows
2019-02-22T09:47:39 < PaulFertser> Why do not "some people" ask microsoft for a hassle-less USB API for userspace?
2019-02-22T09:47:46 < rajkosto> exists
2019-02-22T09:47:47 < rajkosto> WinUSB
2019-02-22T09:48:01 < rajkosto> but ftdi devices come with CDM preinstalled
2019-02-22T09:48:05 < PaulFertser> So OpenOCD uses that currently.
2019-02-22T09:48:07 < rajkosto> so thats the driver they should support
2019-02-22T09:49:24 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: why every other kernel is able to provide userspace API without any complicated messing with the drivers and just windows forces the end user to choose? 
2019-02-22T09:49:53 < rajkosto> why linux automatically binds drivers to usb devices that makes them inaccessible to libusb too ?
2019-02-22T09:50:34 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: no, with Linux API libusb just asks the kernel to "leave it alone for now" and the device is then directly accessible to userspace.
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2019-02-22T09:51:22 < PaulFertser> So all the devices are accessible just fine. When userspace app exits, the kernel driver takes it back.
2019-02-22T09:53:22 < rajkosto> the world's cheapest pen ? https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_08-53-17_M44wdb7vP.png
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2019-02-22T09:55:06 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: and btw, I remember ftdi required windows users to install separate driver for d2xx anyway, isn't it the case anymore?
2019-02-22T09:55:59 < rajkosto> CDM v2.08.28 is in windows
2019-02-22T09:56:02 < rajkosto> includes d2xx
2019-02-22T09:56:32 < PaulFertser> Why do they have https://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/VCP.htm for Windows 10 then?
2019-02-22T09:56:58 < rajkosto> https://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/D2XX.htm
2019-02-22T09:57:04 < rajkosto> newer versions
2019-02-22T09:57:47 < rajkosto> and if you have older windows
2019-02-22T09:58:07 < PaulFertser> So they finally changed it to be saner, ok.
2019-02-22T10:02:17 < PaulFertser> Haohmaru: many people stopped buying anything from ftdi altogether after their drivers started to break hardware on purpose.
2019-02-22T10:02:25 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, its inconvenient as it doesnt show up as a COM port
2019-02-22T10:02:30 < rajkosto> you have to write your own software to do it
2019-02-22T10:02:37 < rajkosto> which i did, its not hard
2019-02-22T10:02:51 < rajkosto> HID == you can send/recv anything you want via default driver
2019-02-22T10:02:56 < rajkosto> but it doesnt show up as a COM port
2019-02-22T10:03:18 < rajkosto> a bunch of HID devices have a UART port like that
2019-02-22T10:03:30 < rajkosto> even a silabs USB->I2S device that has HID just for multimedia buttons
2019-02-22T10:03:35 < rajkosto> exposes that UART-over-HID interface
2019-02-22T10:03:45 < rajkosto> it wont show up as a com port on linux either i dont think
2019-02-22T10:03:54 < rajkosto> its vendor commands in order to send/recv arbitrary data
2019-02-22T10:04:13 < PaulFertser> Plenty of devices are using HID just because of the stupid microsoft decision to provide userspace API for HID devices out of the box.
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2019-02-22T10:06:51 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, because Channel B is default set to VCP mode
2019-02-22T10:07:10 < rajkosto> Channel A will only be accessible via libusb in that case (for MPSSE/whatever modes)
2019-02-22T10:07:24 < rajkosto> you can swap either to whatever you want using the eeprom programmer for it
2019-02-22T10:08:32 < rajkosto> then cp2102
2019-02-22T10:08:56 < rajkosto> https://www.silabs.com/products/interface/usb-bridges/usbxpress-usb-bridges
2019-02-22T10:09:38 < rajkosto> silkscreen got smeared on one pcb but its really high res everywhere else https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_09-07-55_Yd52i53mm.jpg
2019-02-22T10:11:16 < dongs> lul thats not highrez
2019-02-22T10:11:35 < rajkosto> i dont see any pixels
2019-02-22T10:12:08 < rajkosto> it can be way worse
2019-02-22T10:12:18 < dongs> .
2019-02-22T10:12:27 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, if you want MASSIVE chips then ft232r i guess
2019-02-22T10:12:36 < rajkosto> enjoy your OLD
2019-02-22T10:14:48 < PaulFertser> Haohmaru: ch34x are available in SOIC I guess.
2019-02-22T10:15:42 < PaulFertser> SSOP-20
2019-02-22T10:16:15 < kakimir> pump in the mornings
2019-02-22T10:17:10 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, then dont use
2019-02-22T10:17:26 < rajkosto> just dont bother soldering the thermal pad, keep it on the pcb
2019-02-22T10:17:38 < rajkosto> its not like its massive heat generator anyway
2019-02-22T10:18:15 < rajkosto> it will make contact
2019-02-22T10:18:22 < rajkosto> but it has other gnd pins...
2019-02-22T10:19:55 < rajkosto> dont do a huge hole like the eagle bois do
2019-02-22T10:20:06 < rajkosto> you can leave it untented on both sides and add some 0.5mm holes tho
2019-02-22T10:20:10 < rajkosto> dense holes
2019-02-22T10:20:15 < rajkosto> that will let you solder it from the bottom
2019-02-22T10:20:52 < rajkosto> you do grid of 0.5->0.6mm holes not huge hole like the eagle bois
2019-02-22T10:21:05 < rajkosto> the solder eventually gets to the other side
2019-02-22T10:21:15 < rajkosto> as its all untented
2019-02-22T10:21:45 < rajkosto> same thing
2019-02-22T10:21:52 < rajkosto> yes thats what i mean by untented pad
2019-02-22T10:22:05 < rajkosto> i have one on my pcb i just took pic of
2019-02-22T10:22:05 < PaulFertser> Haohmaru: have you checked ch341?
2019-02-22T10:29:30 < rajkosto> this pcb seems to have soldermask even on 0.5mm pitch smd
2019-02-22T10:32:59 < rajkosto> r u 4 layer
2019-02-22T10:33:32 < rajkosto> i would equalize net lengths on each layer before swapping layers
2019-02-22T10:33:57 < rajkosto> or make sure your middle layers are both GND when that transition happens
2019-02-22T10:34:50 < Thorn> I though PHY pinouts normally let you connect diff pairs to a jack without extra vias
2019-02-22T10:35:14 < Thorn> also there're probably several resistors/caps missing
2019-02-22T10:38:31 < dongs> why dont you pick something evne more obscure you fucking faggot
2019-02-22T10:50:09 < rajkosto> the worlll
2019-02-22T10:51:37 < rajkosto> need to heat gun the JO crystals to this board first
2019-02-22T11:02:05 < dongs> Haohmaru: you, autisming
2019-02-22T11:03:22 < dongs> https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Ethernet-Connectors-Modular-Connectors_Zhongshan-HanRun-Elec-HR913550A_C163507.html
2019-02-22T11:03:30 < dongs> im gonna guess this is likely hte best choice
2019-02-22T11:03:33 < dongs> since it has the most stock in china
2019-02-22T11:07:18 < dongs> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/487121479130152970/548412062947213332/518c8eb.jpg lul
2019-02-22T11:12:36 < dongs> Haohmaru: no, what you do is use that one , period
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2019-02-22T11:15:49 < rajkosto> does that have magnetics ?
2019-02-22T11:17:11 < rajkosto> the dongs one
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2019-02-22T11:24:16 < dongs> of course it has
2019-02-22T11:24:27 < dongs> chinagirl confirmed, its the most common magjack in chian
2019-02-22T11:24:30 < dongs> not gonna run out anytime soon
2019-02-22T11:24:40 < dongs> so youre one-off prototype isnt gonna suffer from lack of stock, autism-maru
2019-02-22T11:25:03 < rajkosto> dongs, https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_10-24-49_yJJcV0iby.png how do i filter based on selection here
2019-02-22T11:25:32 < dongs> wat is this hat dialog is this
2019-02-22T11:25:39 < rajkosto> PCB tab
2019-02-22T11:25:41 < rajkosto> Components dropdown
2019-02-22T11:25:41 < dongs> also lol how can you function in altium standard 2D mode
2019-02-22T11:25:49 < dongs> looks so fucking bright
2019-02-22T11:25:52 < dongs> maybe you have a shit TN panel
2019-02-22T11:25:58 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-22T11:26:21 < rajkosto> first you want HIGH contrast BRIGHT WHITE
2019-02-22T11:26:26 < rajkosto> now you DONT want HIGH CONTRAST ?
2019-02-22T11:27:02 < dongs> wot
2019-02-22T11:27:55 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_10-27-52_91LCe4bmf.png this is dum
2019-02-22T11:28:12 < rajkosto> why cant i select them from PCB tab
2019-02-22T11:28:27 < dongs> i have never used that workflow so no idea
2019-02-22T11:28:37 < dongs> the only thing i select from pcb tab is like..
2019-02-22T11:28:40 < dongs> nets
2019-02-22T11:28:43 < dongs> so i can color code them
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2019-02-22T11:57:22 < kakimir> _SFR_MEM8()
2019-02-22T11:57:25 < kakimir> what is it?
2019-02-22T11:58:01 < rajkosto> The _SFR_MEM8() is a macro to return a byte of data of the specified address.
2019-02-22T11:58:27 < rajkosto> it also probably sets the gcc attribute for MMIO, so its uncached and volatile
2019-02-22T11:58:41 < rajkosto> _SFR_MEM8(mem_addr) (*(volatile uint8_t *)(mem_addr))
2019-02-22T11:59:52 < kakimir> hmm okay it makes sense
2019-02-22T12:00:00 < kakimir> what is SFR?
2019-02-22T12:00:30 < kakimir> what does it mean?
2019-02-22T12:01:36 < rajkosto> special function register
2019-02-22T12:01:47 < kakimir> nice!
2019-02-22T12:01:55 < rajkosto> because on some 8-bit CPU they arent just memory mapped IO
2019-02-22T12:02:04 < rajkosto> they are special registers in the core itself
2019-02-22T12:02:08 < rajkosto> in 8051 cpu etc
2019-02-22T12:02:10 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-22T12:02:14 < rajkosto> so the compiler needs to use different instructions
2019-02-22T12:02:22 < rajkosto> but not on this platform, its juist MMIO and the cpu has no DCACHE so all you need is volatile
2019-02-22T12:02:44 < kakimir> you know my platform rite?
2019-02-22T12:02:49 < rajkosto> no clue
2019-02-22T12:02:51 < rajkosto> probably stm32
2019-02-22T12:02:55 < rajkosto> in taht case its cortex-m3 or 4 or 0
2019-02-22T12:03:07 < rajkosto> 4 does have dcache so you have to be more careful
2019-02-22T12:03:21 < kakimir> avrxmega3 based
2019-02-22T12:03:29 < rajkosto> get the fuck outta this channel /s
2019-02-22T12:03:46 < kakimir> traitor
2019-02-22T12:04:15 < rajkosto> u r
2019-02-22T12:09:55 < kakimir> what I think is greater sin is that I'm really mediocre
2019-02-22T12:10:32 < rajkosto> copy pastaing arduino code i see
2019-02-22T12:11:36 < kakimir> actually not
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2019-02-22T12:17:33 < kakimir> not xmegas
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2019-02-22T12:27:40 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_11-27-28_U2L2BT6Ub.png why is this the only component (1Mohm resistor) that isnt in a gray anti static bag
2019-02-22T12:27:42 < rajkosto> from lcsc
2019-02-22T12:28:49 < rajkosto> why is that one the only transparent bag tho
2019-02-22T12:28:55 < rajkosto> and it has weird red text on the back
2019-02-22T12:28:59 < rajkosto> the others just have the sticker
2019-02-22T12:29:11 < rajkosto> i ordered like 200 components
2019-02-22T12:30:39 < rajkosto> i like the gray
2019-02-22T12:31:00 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_11-30-57_HRF9YcnJZ.png
2019-02-22T12:32:02 < rajkosto> the 10M resistors are in the same gray bag
2019-02-22T12:32:07 < rajkosto> 199 things are gray bags
2019-02-22T12:32:12 < rajkosto> 1 thing is transparent with red text on back
2019-02-22T12:36:21 < rajkosto> a lemonade ?
2019-02-22T12:38:32 < rajkosto> yeah i hate the residue
2019-02-22T12:38:39 < rajkosto> which turns white if you react it with alcohol
2019-02-22T12:39:40 < rajkosto> i want the amtech tacky flux
2019-02-22T12:39:44 < rajkosto> real version
2019-02-22T12:40:33 < rajkosto> the miracle flux
2019-02-22T12:40:35 < rajkosto> for qfn and bga
2019-02-22T12:40:45 < rajkosto> stannol makes a similar
2019-02-22T12:40:46 < rajkosto> cant get either
2019-02-22T12:41:16 < rajkosto> strange theres only 8 100nf caps on this pcb
2019-02-22T12:41:20 < rajkosto> usually i put like 100
2019-02-22T12:41:50 < rajkosto> each IC pin
2019-02-22T12:41:51 < rajkosto> just in case
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2019-02-22T12:50:14 < qyx> fed it from 2 gpios
2019-02-22T12:56:00 < rajkosto> hmm what series resistor for 5ns rise time
2019-02-22T12:56:06 < rajkosto> can i go higher than 22
2019-02-22T12:57:22 < rajkosto> aint nobody got time for that
2019-02-22T12:57:30 < rajkosto> i know it works with 22
2019-02-22T13:03:29 < rajkosto> 56ohms lets go
2019-02-22T13:03:58 < rajkosto> the entire pulse is 15ns and i cant have it drop that much
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2019-02-22T13:35:11 < rajkosto> what the fuck this crystal has 2 triangle edged pads
2019-02-22T13:36:15 < rajkosto> lol and they are the opposite of what i have on my pcb
2019-02-22T13:36:24 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_12-36-22_ghlxJjS4Z.png
2019-02-22T13:36:40 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_12-36-38_poZdDDpP6.png
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2019-02-22T13:40:06 < rajkosto> but no matter what way you turn the package it should be the same
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2019-02-22T13:54:49 < englishman> standard af
2019-02-22T13:56:58 < englishman> https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/02/my-left-shoe-wont-even-reboot-faulty-app-bricks-nike-smart-sneakers/
2019-02-22T14:01:21 < con3> everyone see this : https://www.st.com/en/microcontrollers-microprocessors/stm32mp1-series.html?querycriteria=productId=SS2003
2019-02-22T14:03:22 < rajkosto> englishman, the ones i used previously had triangle edge on only one pin, and that's what the active one was
2019-02-22T14:03:28 < rajkosto> this one is active on squares
2019-02-22T14:06:46 < englishman> the pinout is the same tho rite
2019-02-22T14:11:28 < rajkosto> yes just the marking confused me
2019-02-22T14:11:35 < rajkosto> its inverse
2019-02-22T14:12:51 < dongs> con3: we saw this when everyone else got the email
2019-02-22T14:13:21 < con3> dongs: just checking :) I'm not the most attentive when it comes to emails
2019-02-22T14:30:03 < kakimir> error: static declaration of 'set_cv_load_voltage' follows non-static declaration
2019-02-22T14:31:28 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-22T14:31:35 < kakimir> it was just a typo in other file
2019-02-22T14:32:26 < kakimir> those things are the best
2019-02-22T14:51:28 < Sadale> I'm wonder what'd powerful microcontrollers like MP1 be used for.
2019-02-22T14:51:36 < dongs> nothing useful
2019-02-22T14:51:44 < Sadale> ...
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2019-02-22T14:51:57 < dongs> what did you think its used for??
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2019-02-22T14:52:07 < dongs> atmel had samad5 or wahtever shit for same purpose for like 2-3 years now
2019-02-22T14:52:16 < Sadale> ooo. "Mainlined open-source Linux distribution with Android support available via partners".
2019-02-22T14:52:22 < Sadale> I guess it's for running... linux?
2019-02-22T14:52:45 < Sadale> wow. It even has 3D GPU on it.
2019-02-22T14:53:35 < dongs> a lot of good that's gonna do in LUNIX ahha
2019-02-22T14:53:35 < Sadale> It's BGA only. How sad. I can't do DIY on this one easily. :(
2019-02-22T14:53:54 < Sadale> right. If it can run linux it can do a lot of stuffs. :P
2019-02-22T14:54:31 < Sadale> perhaps a cheap credit-card size computer could be built with it.
2019-02-22T14:54:32 < jpa-> with external high-speed memory chips etc, it's not really maker-tier anyway
2019-02-22T14:54:40 < jpa-> wait for adafruit breakout board
2019-02-22T14:55:30 < Sadale> Meh. I'd just get a raspberry pi and start hacking :P
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2019-02-22T14:55:39 < jpa-> Sadale: i can't see it possibly being cheaper than what 1) rpi & similar are already and 2) old android phones are free
2019-02-22T14:55:58 < Sadale> jpa-, agreed. It does look expensive to me. And it's even slower.
2019-02-22T14:56:23 < Sadale> jpa-, so what it's used for then?
2019-02-22T14:56:40 < jpa-> expensive stuff, of course
2019-02-22T14:56:55 < Sadale> I'm thinking if it could be used for those multimedia devices like blueray player/burner.
2019-02-22T14:57:11 < Sadale> right. It'll be used for expensive stuff for sure.
2019-02-22T14:57:27 < jpa-> nah, the cortex-m chip wouldn't add much benefit in those
2019-02-22T14:57:28 < c10ud> dongs, sama5 gpu sucks, dunno about this stm one though
2019-02-22T14:57:52 < dongs> c10ud: i was talking about chip in general
2019-02-22T14:58:51 < jpa-> well any 3d gpu is good enough for linux; when the only game is tuxracer, you don't need much tops
2019-02-22T14:58:53 < Sadale> jpa-, I'm thinking what would the processing power be good for :/
2019-02-22T14:59:27 < jpa-> Sadale: eh, high-speed ARM chips with linux find use everywhere, only thing that is (somewhat) unique about STM32MP1 is the cortex-m side and its peripherals
2019-02-22T14:59:49 < jpa-> with rpi & similar you have to add external chips or separate microcontroller to have even half decent ADC
2019-02-22T14:59:56 < c10ud> dongs, alright
2019-02-22T15:00:25 < c10ud> sama5d4 gpu sucked, like, it wasn't a gpu :)
2019-02-22T15:00:38 < c10ud> still gigabit ethernet's missing from this stm
2019-02-22T15:00:50 < Sadale> jpa-, I see. So the main feature is that MCU comes along with the A7 core.
2019-02-22T15:01:28 < zyp> hybrid cortex-a/cortex-m stuff is interesting
2019-02-22T15:01:31 < jpa-> the marketing material focuses a lot on guis running on the cortex-a, which makes sense
2019-02-22T15:01:32 < c10ud> so you're just having a fancy a7, maybe the only plus side is that you will probably have some docs for ti
2019-02-22T15:01:39 < c10ud> *it
2019-02-22T15:01:54 < c10ud> and you can source in little mq orders
2019-02-22T15:03:07 < jpa-> in one work project we have this measurement device that is basically just sensors connected directly to stm32 pins, as the peripherals are flexible enough for that; currently it runs nuttx for gui, but if one wanted a fancier one, cortex-a + linux + qt would be an interesting option
2019-02-22T15:04:33 < zyp> running linux also gets you a decent networking stack
2019-02-22T15:05:10 < jpa-> and lots more options for software
2019-02-22T15:07:30 < jpa-> but in most cases, going for usb-connected microcontroller device and whatever for host may be easier to develop for, as you can more easily test on pc
2019-02-22T15:09:11 < karlp> yar, more flexible host options, more flexible dvelopment options
2019-02-22T15:09:22 < zyp> why not both? just have an IPC layer that runs both over USB and shared memory
2019-02-22T15:09:24 < karlp> putting it into the same part you've got to be at a serious optimization point
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2019-02-22T15:10:51 < jpa-> zyp: just route wires from the cortex-a usb host to the cortex-m usb device!
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2019-02-22T15:17:08 < c10ud> the m4 looks like a real-time extension for the a7
2019-02-22T15:17:45 < jpa-> the a7 looks like bloat gui extension for the m4
2019-02-22T15:18:18 < c10ud> well with a gpu, if they give you a driver, you can do really fancy stuff
2019-02-22T15:18:33 < c10ud> but you need to compare with a rageberrypi0
2019-02-22T15:18:49 < c10ud> pricing et al.
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2019-02-22T16:15:30 < kakimir> apparently these hall sensors like ACS724 have some threshold for current
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2019-02-22T16:26:23 < aandrew> rajkosto: re: dump stlinkv3 to clone my own hw into segger: yep that's the basic idea. not sure if it's worth the effort, what I'm doing righ tnow is "legal"
2019-02-22T16:27:00 < aandrew> cdnChrisDvo: HAL isn't that bad. I don't think stdperiph is much better at any rate
2019-02-22T16:28:20 < aandrew> cdnChrisDvo: my experience (I do a lot with PWM just not fancy DMA PWM) is that if you call HAL_TIM_PWM_ConfigChannel() you MUST call HAL_TIM_OC_Start() again because the former call disables the timer
2019-02-22T16:32:30 < rajkosto> well you cant get the stlinkv3 bootloader any way other than not "legal"
2019-02-22T16:32:42 < rajkosto> stdperiph at least somewhat maps to the registers it modifies
2019-02-22T16:32:56 < rajkosto> either way, avoid either inside interrupt routines, just see what they do and do that inline
2019-02-22T16:34:26 < aandrew> lol libDxx. what an abomination
2019-02-22T16:34:39 < rajkosto> on linux sure
2019-02-22T16:36:18 < rajkosto> it does do some buffering/framing management that makes it faster at some ops than rolling your own though
2019-02-22T16:36:24 < Steffanx> Is your ethernet so high speed that you reallly need the wiggle mr Haohmaru?
2019-02-22T16:36:33 < rajkosto> so using d2xx.lib on windows is pretty normal
2019-02-22T16:36:39 < Steffanx> Or do you just enjoy doing it?
2019-02-22T16:37:18 < rajkosto> youre supposed to match differential pairs
2019-02-22T16:38:02 < aandrew> dongs: why did you bend a penis into that poor cpu
2019-02-22T16:38:21 < rajkosto> its amd who cares
2019-02-22T16:38:25 < rajkosto> also linus tech tips probably did it
2019-02-22T16:42:08 < aandrew> rajkosto: I *always* verify LED polarity - I've had vendors swap things around and you just can't tell by look anymore
2019-02-22T16:43:37 < aandrew> rajkosto: I understand you can't get it legal like; I'm saying for my own shit that's not an issue but on a client board I wouldn't recommend doing that
2019-02-22T16:44:29 < aandrew> rajkosto: there's really no need for d2xx magical buffering; I sustained 2.5Gbps full duplex on fx3 with libusb both windows and linux
2019-02-22T16:45:13 < aandrew> linux tech tips is one of the most fucking retarded youtube tech people I've ever seen
2019-02-22T16:47:34 < rajkosto> thats fx3
2019-02-22T16:47:40 < rajkosto> fx3 doesnt use ftdi framing
2019-02-22T16:47:52 < rajkosto> (for which to support officially in your own driver/winusb, you have to get a NDA datasheet from ftdi, i have it somewhere)
2019-02-22T16:48:01 < rajkosto> fx2/fx3 you define the protocol
2019-02-22T16:48:16 < rajkosto> ftdi you have to follow their weird legacy-serial protocol that has some flag bits at the end of each frame 
2019-02-22T16:48:56 < rajkosto> also wtf https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_15-47-20_K3h2ck6Ef.png
2019-02-22T16:49:09 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-22_15-49-07_LqIOwi1Hy.png
2019-02-22T16:50:37 < aandrew> no, FX3 doesn't use FTDI framing you're right. I was just pointing out that libusb is perfectly capable of saturating USB
2019-02-22T16:50:50 < aandrew> if FTDI fucked something up that necessitated a goofy driver to achieve line rate that's something else :-)
2019-02-22T16:51:04 < rajkosto> ftdi devices have their own fifo and yeah the first open sores implementations couldnt saturate even mpsse
2019-02-22T16:51:14 < aandrew> rajkosto: ah ok, I have never gone that far down the ftdi rabbit hole
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2019-02-22T16:51:46 < aandrew> rajkosto: I have a few cables like that -- basically the plastic key is half size and pins on both sides
2019-02-22T16:52:04 < aandrew> I didn't get them on purpose, they came with my JBL headset
2019-02-22T16:52:05 < rajkosto> it doedsnt seem to pass data
2019-02-22T16:52:07 < rajkosto> why did they dod this
2019-02-22T16:52:17 < rajkosto> i just asked for a microusb cable
2019-02-22T16:52:25 < aandrew> rajkosto: there are MANY cables that are marketed as "charge only" -- when I find one of those in the house I take a pair of scissors to it
2019-02-22T16:52:28 < aandrew> literall
2019-02-22T16:52:29 < aandrew> literally
2019-02-22T16:52:36 < rajkosto> it doesnt say its charge only anywhere
2019-02-22T16:52:55 < aandrew> but I bet it also doesn't say "charge+data" which is apparently the term you need to look for
2019-02-22T16:53:08 < aandrew> I want to find the asshole who came up with that idea and kick him square in the nuts
2019-02-22T16:53:39 < rajkosto> this shit fucking sucks
2019-02-22T16:53:54 < rajkosto> i think it broke my amphenol usb plug
2019-02-22T16:54:02 < aandrew> PaulFertser: if you're still around, what's the fastest you've reliably seen FT2232 in MPSSE with opencd? it can theoretically do 480Mbps but what JTAG clock rate have you seen in practise?
2019-02-22T16:54:10 < aandrew> rajkosto: ugh
2019-02-22T16:54:14 < rajkosto> aandrew, JTAG is 30MHz
2019-02-22T16:54:29 < rajkosto> and i've had 3.5MB/s SPI reads from NOR flash using d2xx.lib
2019-02-22T16:54:45 < aandrew> ok
2019-02-22T16:54:51 < aandrew> I'll have to experiment
2019-02-22T16:55:12 < rajkosto> to get more than that you have tou se the 8-bit FIFO modes etc
2019-02-22T16:55:27 < rajkosto> with 8080 mode you can get like 8MB/s i think
2019-02-22T16:55:35 < rajkosto> and if you use the mode that ties both channels together 25MB/s
2019-02-22T16:55:42 < aandrew> right
2019-02-22T16:55:48 < rajkosto> ft232h doesnt ahve this mode as it has only one channel, neither can you use it on channel B's pin
2019-02-22T16:56:00 < aandrew> I've got a 2232 in MPSSE+serial behind a ULPI PHY with passthrough
2019-02-22T16:56:05 < rajkosto> it also has a much smaller fifo of only 128 bytes i think, which makes it slower at MPSSE reads as well
2019-02-22T16:56:13 < aandrew> it works really well so far with the boards that aren't fucked
2019-02-22T16:56:37 < aandrew> I thought the 232 was also 12mbps not 480
2019-02-22T16:56:42 < rajkosto> no
2019-02-22T16:56:43 < aandrew> or is that the 'h' - 480
2019-02-22T16:56:46 < rajkosto> its a half of a 2232h
2019-02-22T16:56:53 < rajkosto> the 232r is not
2019-02-22T16:56:56 < rajkosto> 232r is ancient
2019-02-22T16:56:58 < aandrew> they really missed an opportunity there
2019-02-22T16:56:59 < rajkosto> h is always high speed
2019-02-22T16:57:02 < aandrew> ft1/2232h
2019-02-22T16:58:24 < aandrew> on the next spin I'm going to try to put hte stm on the jtag chain but also bring out swd completely independently (resistor straps) - I have jtag+swd together right now and I can separate them except for the clock which I didn't think through with routing
2019-02-22T16:58:32 < aandrew> so I can't separate TCK/SWDCK easily
2019-02-22T16:58:56 < rajkosto> swdio is TMS too
2019-02-22T16:59:03 < rajkosto> and SWO is TDO
2019-02-22T16:59:13 < rajkosto> only one that doesnt have swd equivalent is TRST
2019-02-22T16:59:22 < aandrew> yes
2019-02-22T16:59:33 < aandrew> i hae a couple 1G97s used for "steering"
2019-02-22T16:59:34 < rajkosto> (and sRST works the same for both)
2019-02-22T17:00:00 < aandrew> the second channel of the 2232 is a uart, and the RXD (into FTDI) gets SWO or TXD from STM32 depending on the switch
2019-02-22T17:00:16 < aandrew> same with TDO/SWDIO on port 1
2019-02-22T17:00:46 < aandrew> but I need to more better separate swdck/tck because I routed that on inner layers without an easy way to cut them apart 
2019-02-22T17:02:21 < aandrew> anyway time to hit the road
2019-02-22T17:02:22 < aandrew> later
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2019-02-22T17:07:47 < rajkosto> aandrew, just hold trst low while operating swd
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2019-02-22T17:14:39 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwWqOahWEkM
2019-02-22T17:14:52 < jadew> like always, the comments are gold
2019-02-22T17:14:58 < jadew> "Pulsed energy projectiles are actual weapons and from what I've read they can be used from hundreds of yards away and cause things like limb jerking."
2019-02-22T17:15:24 < jadew> can you believe that? a weapon that makes your leg jerk
2019-02-22T17:16:24 < rajkosto> ohhhh he's got that ALLIGATOR JIGGLING FEVER
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2019-02-22T17:29:17 < kakimir> real phoenix contact terminals <3
2019-02-22T17:31:29 < kakimir> should I push an extra hour
2019-02-22T17:31:37 < kakimir> maybe 2
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2019-02-22T19:02:07 < kakimir> babby's first CV load
2019-02-22T19:04:12 < kakimir> cannot believe it
2019-02-22T19:05:15 < kakimir> I dial in 3V to DAC and see then voltage across the load
2019-02-22T19:05:22 < kakimir> 3.00V
2019-02-22T19:05:34 < kakimir> time to go to home>
2019-02-22T19:09:06 < kakimir> it goes only down to 2V
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2019-02-22T19:35:48 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/x7nld51.png
2019-02-22T19:35:49 < bitmask> toasty
2019-02-22T19:37:41 < kakimir> what is happening
2019-02-22T19:38:16 < englishman> is it work work or fun work
2019-02-22T19:38:29 < englishman> you don't do half day Fridays?
2019-02-22T19:39:49 < kakimir> who?
2019-02-22T19:39:52 < bitmask> printing labels with qr codes for my components.  I scan a qr code with my phone and it shows a toast (thats what the labels look like) and then loads the datasheet
2019-02-22T19:40:17 < bitmask> on my laptop obv
2019-02-22T19:40:24 < bitmask> remote qr scanner
2019-02-22T19:40:35 < kakimir> QR codes has such data structure?
2019-02-22T19:40:55 < bitmask> they can store a lot of characters, I'll have the android app parse it
2019-02-22T19:40:57 < bitmask> into a json
2019-02-22T19:42:05 < bitmask> never done os x or android dev before, its fun :)
2019-02-22T19:42:20 < bitmask> ive done iOS once years ago so os x isnt very different
2019-02-22T19:45:21 < Steffanx> Using swift or what bitmask?
2019-02-22T19:45:52 < bitmask> obj-c
2019-02-22T19:45:59 < Steffanx> Meh.  :p
2019-02-22T19:46:04 < bitmask> you prefer swift?
2019-02-22T19:46:11 < bitmask> I thought swift was shit?
2019-02-22T19:46:54 < Steffanx> I played with it years ago, didnt dislike it
2019-02-22T19:47:08 < bitmask> whats wrong with obj-c? I kinda like it
2019-02-22T19:48:46 < Steffanx> Weird syntax :P but i never really used obj-c :P
2019-02-22T19:48:58 < bitmask> just hating on what you don't know? :P
2019-02-22T19:49:18 < bitmask> does swift have regular c like syntax or something?
2019-02-22T19:50:47 < Steffanx> No, not really
2019-02-22T19:54:29 < jpa-> it does have the same bitmask operators though
2019-02-22T19:55:06 < kakimir> guise hello
2019-02-22T19:55:25 < kakimir> what is your recommendation for test connectors for really small board
2019-02-22T19:55:32 < kakimir> size of the board is about 1euro coin
2019-02-22T19:55:37 < kakimir> and it's packed
2019-02-22T19:55:54 < kakimir> could castellated holes be good?
2019-02-22T19:56:01 < jpa-> make system test itself?
2019-02-22T19:56:29 < jpa-> untented vias work also
2019-02-22T19:56:51 < jpa-> and are smaller than castellated holes + can be readily pogo-pinned
2019-02-22T19:56:57 < kakimir> you know.. I doubt I can make facilities for self test to the board
2019-02-22T19:57:26 < kakimir> what I'm interested about is minimum pitch for test points
2019-02-22T20:00:29 < englishman> whoa
2019-02-22T20:00:34 < englishman> dual row qfn
2019-02-22T20:00:45 < kakimir> pics
2019-02-22T20:00:49 < englishman> VDAP1000
2019-02-22T20:00:55 < englishman> google
2019-02-22T20:01:38 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-22T20:01:46 < kakimir> dongs-stuff
2019-02-22T20:02:10 < mawk> I sorted a box of around 80 disco board in the lab
2019-02-22T20:02:19 < mawk> students are so careless with them
2019-02-22T20:02:26 < kakimir> you have 80 discos?
2019-02-22T20:02:30 < mawk> they lost the boxes, bent the pins
2019-02-22T20:02:40 < mawk> in the school lab
2019-02-22T20:02:49 < mawk> which I'm in charge of
2019-02-22T20:05:10 < mawk> I found a box of UV-EPROMS, a box of components ordered in 1980 from a supplier that went bankrupt since
2019-02-22T20:05:54 < kakimir> how many?
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2019-02-22T21:04:37 < catphish> morning
2019-02-22T21:09:03 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1cRGVaJF7Y musics
2019-02-22T21:09:17 < kakimir> I have seen front 242 performing
2019-02-22T21:11:26 < kakimir> sceneparty probs late 2000's
2019-02-22T21:20:59 < aandrew> rajkosto: yes, that would work
2019-02-22T21:21:07 < aandrew> there's also some "SWJ" mode I have to read about
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2019-02-22T21:33:24 < invzim> zyp: got a user friendly wording for the 'bring blandede formater' shipping option I can steal?
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2019-02-22T21:48:01 < englishman> SJW mode
2019-02-22T21:57:27 < Cracki> "mixed format" is a shipping option?
2019-02-22T22:03:57 < invzim> it's Norwegian postal system thingie, you pool together shipments and pay 'bulk', but doesn't really work for single shipments
2019-02-22T22:06:35 < Cracki> uh... meaning a discount if you give them a whole bag of parcels at once?
2019-02-22T22:07:51 < invzim> basically
2019-02-22T22:10:16 < qyx> speaking of shipments
2019-02-22T22:10:26 < qyx> whare are my chinapcbs
2019-02-22T22:10:44 < rajkosto> my local customs office is still inspecting them
2019-02-22T22:10:52 < rajkosto> try again in 15 days
2019-02-22T22:16:46 < Steffanx> .bg rajkosto loves china i see
2019-02-22T22:16:56 < rajkosto> .bg ?
2019-02-22T22:19:19 < Steffanx> oh not .bg?
2019-02-22T22:19:53 < rajkosto> background ?
2019-02-22T22:19:58 < Steffanx> .rs :P
2019-02-22T22:20:14 < rajkosto> chyna will grow larger
2019-02-22T22:21:36 < antto> Steffanx pls, .bg is in .eu
2019-02-22T22:21:44 < antto> (still)
2019-02-22T22:21:51 < Steffanx> surprisingly, yes.
2019-02-22T22:23:01 < Steffanx> its antto that is .bg indeed. 
2019-02-22T22:25:07 < antto> i heard you love kicad around here, here's a pic: https://i.imgur.com/VtmFetN.png
2019-02-22T22:27:16 < kakimir> I see amps
2019-02-22T22:27:47 < kakimir> what is that so16?
2019-02-22T22:28:22 < kakimir> why there is DIN connectors?
2019-02-22T22:30:59 < antto> yes, there are opamps, a SOIC16 (but i might get rid of it), DIN-5, audio jacks, USB, powah
2019-02-22T22:31:30 < antto> DIN connectors coz it's for MIDI and DinSync ;P~
2019-02-22T22:34:09 < antto> gotta check this ch341 chip
2019-02-22T22:34:40 < qyx> so the G0 line has a CAN-FD periphjeral apparently
2019-02-22T22:34:58 < rajkosto> eww, socketed dip chips
2019-02-22T22:35:23 < kakimir> that is how you connect precious audio chips1!
2019-02-22T22:38:16 < antto> nah, only one of those is an opamp
2019-02-22T22:38:31 < antto> teh other DIP-8s are dumb opto isolators
2019-02-22T22:38:45 < antto> oh, and the mc33063a ;P~
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2019-02-22T22:54:15 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-22T22:54:53 < jpa-> eh, these greenpak timers.. they can count either up from X to 255, or down from X to 0.. but not up from 0 to X :D
2019-02-22T22:56:43 < kakimir> spam email offers me jobs
2019-02-22T22:56:55 < kakimir> they just don't get my name right
2019-02-22T22:57:22 < kakimir> interesting phenomena
2019-02-22T22:58:16 < kakimir> job spam
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2019-02-22T23:12:50 < antto> better than spob jam
2019-02-22T23:13:07 < kakimir> https://www.commitstrip.com/en/2019/02/22/why-check-for-incognito-mode/?
2019-02-22T23:20:12 < zyp> invzim, I call it «batch shipping»
2019-02-22T23:20:55 < zyp> Cracki, discount and also you don't have to process each shipment individually, you just count them and weigh the total and pay for the average weight
2019-02-22T23:21:10 < Cracki> nice
2019-02-22T23:21:31 < Cracki> but everything still needs a proper label, yes?
2019-02-22T23:21:45 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-22T23:22:13 < zyp> it has a 150 NOK minimum (~15 EUR), which for the size of stuff I send equals around 6-7 shipments
2019-02-22T23:23:15 < zyp> last year before I ran out of stock, I sent around two batches a month, which means that customers might have to wait two weeks extra if they order right after I just shipped one batch
2019-02-22T23:24:26 < zyp> jpa-, comparing to all ones or all zeroes are easier than arbitrary values
2019-02-22T23:25:00 < jpa-> yep
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2019-02-22T23:50:42 < dongs> sup dongs
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2019-02-22T23:58:09 < englishman> hey dongers
2019-02-22T23:58:12 < englishman> you wanna see some gold
--- Day changed Sat Feb 23 2019
2019-02-23T00:00:48 < englishman> https://i.imgur.com/J89RNzI.jpg
2019-02-23T00:02:20 < qyx> skin irritation by gold
2019-02-23T00:02:56 < kakimir> howe much there is total gold content in it?
2019-02-23T00:03:18 < zyp> how did it taste?
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2019-02-23T00:04:28 < englishman> kakimir it is marked on the bottle.
2019-02-23T00:05:02 < zyp> so 31 grams of gold in total?
2019-02-23T00:10:13 < englishman> yeah
2019-02-23T00:10:14 < englishman> like 1500usd
2019-02-23T00:17:16 < Lux> englishman: for gold plating ?
2019-02-23T00:17:28 < englishman> yeah Lux local place installed an enig line this week
2019-02-23T00:18:08 < Lux> cool
2019-02-23T00:21:36 < kakimir> englishman: how many bottles they need to even get started?
2019-02-23T00:21:54 < Steffanx> 0.5
2019-02-23T00:22:24 < kakimir> how does it work?
2019-02-23T00:23:08 < englishman> kakimir for a 70L tank like 5-6?
2019-02-23T00:23:25 < kakimir> nice
2019-02-23T00:28:42 < kakimir> how many panels are run thru that tank?
2019-02-23T00:28:57 < kakimir> is the gold completelly exhausted from the tank?
2019-02-23T00:29:16 < kakimir> or do they like.. collect the residue or anything?
2019-02-23T00:30:40 < englishman> ive already had 10+ panels run thru those tanks
2019-02-23T00:30:43 < englishman> of flex
2019-02-23T00:31:02 < englishman> they have to keep the gold at a certain concentration yeah
2019-02-23T00:31:27 < englishman> also the gold and nickel tanks are 180f
2019-02-23T00:33:09 < kakimir> so all the bottles are not thrown in there at once
2019-02-23T00:33:32 < kakimir> ?
2019-02-23T00:37:38 < englishman> they need to keep some around
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2019-02-23T00:59:55 < banana> >.>
2019-02-23T01:05:43 < catphish> why are DHL moons?
2019-02-23T01:05:49 < catphish> *morons
2019-02-23T01:08:02 < kakimir> why?
2019-02-23T01:08:02 < catphish> i just remembered i had a dispute with them last year about their vat / charges, i made them an offer, rather than accept my offer or argue about it they seem to have just forgotten about it, it's not much money but seems dumb
2019-02-23T01:08:39 < kakimir> you mean they didn't accept your money?
2019-02-23T01:09:18 < catphish> i had a delivery, they paid (too much) tax on my behalf and charged me a fee for doing so, i told them they'd made a mistake and offered to pay the full amount hey were out of pocket if they dropped the admin fee
2019-02-23T01:09:25 < catphish> they never responded
2019-02-23T01:10:01 < kakimir> so
2019-02-23T01:10:08 < kakimir> what did you end up paying?
2019-02-23T01:10:15 < kakimir> and did you receive your shiet?
2019-02-23T01:10:17 < catphish> nothing, they never replies to me
2019-02-23T01:10:27 < catphish> yes, they deliver immediately and invoice later
2019-02-23T01:10:35 < kakimir> nice
2019-02-23T01:11:06 < catphish> i appreciate them paying the fees up front and am usually happy to reimburse them
2019-02-23T01:11:19 < catphish> but on this occasion they seem to be being dumb
2019-02-23T01:11:52 < catphish> it's like they have no systems in plave to handle disputes ns find it easier just to take the loss
2019-02-23T01:12:22 < kakimir> so the mistake was not to reply to you, not that you didn't need to pay the right amount or any amount whatsoever?
2019-02-23T01:12:41 < kakimir> how big amount it was?
2019-02-23T01:12:53 < catphish> well they paid tax on my behaf, and they usually add on a fee
2019-02-23T01:13:12 < kakimir> not so much money can mean so many things
2019-02-23T01:13:56 < catphish> the correct amount would have been like $10 + their fee, they wanted to charge me about $30
2019-02-23T01:14:18 < kakimir> okay
2019-02-23T01:14:29 < catphish> i argued about it, offered to pay the full amount they had paid (but not the fee)
2019-02-23T01:14:45 < kakimir> makes no sense to correct such mistake if those cases are only some marginal percent
2019-02-23T01:14:47 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/pQpwFpo.png
2019-02-23T01:14:51 < kakimir> just take the loss
2019-02-23T01:15:10 < catphish> i guess they decided it wasnt worth their time to argue about it
2019-02-23T01:15:15 < kakimir> keep the machine running
2019-02-23T01:15:16 < catphish> but i literally offered them some money
2019-02-23T01:17:49 < kakimir> but you know
2019-02-23T01:17:54 < kakimir> that doesn't work like that
2019-02-23T01:18:02 < kakimir> that you just offer them money
2019-02-23T01:18:14 < catphish> kakimir: this is what i wrote to them https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/ZfSq2jChTf/
2019-02-23T01:18:29 < kakimir> and they take whatever arbitrary amount of moneyz
2019-02-23T01:18:52 < catphish> kakimir: well that's their loss if they don't
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2019-02-23T01:19:58 < kakimir> conveyor belt needs to keep moving
2019-02-23T01:20:08 < kakimir> it's a serial process
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2019-02-23T01:20:28 < kakimir> stuff in, process, stuff out
2019-02-23T01:20:41 < catphish> indeed, process isn't tolerant of errors it seems
2019-02-23T01:21:05 < catphish> but at the same time, errors happen, so you'd think they'd have a quick way to resolve disputes, even trivial ones
2019-02-23T01:21:33 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-23T01:21:35 < catphish> obviously this amount of money is moot to them, but still seems silly
2019-02-23T01:21:38 < kakimir> they press delete
2019-02-23T01:21:51 < catphish> not worth the admin time
2019-02-23T01:22:23 < catphish> they will probably sell the debt in bulk to a collection agency at some point
2019-02-23T01:22:34 < kakimir> different thing is if you paid them 3000pounds instead of 1000pounds
2019-02-23T01:22:42 < catphish> indeed
2019-02-23T01:23:00 < kakimir> then someone in the office might actually rise eyebrows a bit
2019-02-23T01:24:25 < catphish> on the plus side, i'm in a good mood because i learned today that i unexpectedly inherited a large sum of money
2019-02-23T01:24:44 < kakimir> where is this going
2019-02-23T01:24:44 < mawk> nice
2019-02-23T01:25:12 < catphish> kakimir: it's not going to DHL :)
2019-02-23T01:27:26 < catphish> i should get back to trying to get my head around whether the ft2232 can go i2s
2019-02-23T01:28:04 < catphish> with or without a processor in between the 2
2019-02-23T01:29:35 < mawk> I am doubtful about this
2019-02-23T01:29:46 < mawk> ah, no
2019-02-23T01:29:54 < mawk> I thought it was UART only
2019-02-23T01:30:02 < kakimir> are you making a soundcard catphish?
2019-02-23T01:30:22 < catphish> kakimir: i'm considering doing so, yes
2019-02-23T01:30:53 < catphish> mawk: it supports several protocols including some somewhat arbitrary options
2019-02-23T01:30:54 < kakimir> get usb audio codec ic
2019-02-23T01:31:06 < catphish> kakimir: the problem is i want lots of channels
2019-02-23T01:31:09 < mawk> yeah I saw that
2019-02-23T01:31:25 < catphish> specifically 8 in 8 out
2019-02-23T01:31:26 < mawk> sounds like it's possible after all
2019-02-23T01:31:36 < mawk> even though the timing diagram is strange
2019-02-23T01:32:15 < mawk> it's like mode (0, 1)-SPI
2019-02-23T01:32:16 < catphish> mawk: i'm pretty confused by it, the minimum timing doesn't seem to be specified
2019-02-23T01:32:23 < mawk> with a strange chip-select line
2019-02-23T01:34:36 < mawk> chip select goes down 1 bit after the start, and up 2 bits before the end
2019-02-23T01:34:44 < mawk> it's strange
2019-02-23T01:34:56 < mawk> with a second SPI channel you can work around this, but it wastes a channel
2019-02-23T01:35:54 < catphish> mawk: it has "bit bang" mode and "MPSSE" mode
2019-02-23T01:36:03 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-23T01:36:05 < catphish> i don't know if either or both would be suitable for i2s
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2019-02-23T01:36:10 < mawk> I was assuming you'd chose MPSSE
2019-02-23T01:36:23 < catphish> i was assiming MPSSE too
2019-02-23T01:36:51 < catphish> but it's super vague
2019-02-23T01:37:30 < catphish> a few application are described at https://www.ftdichip.com/Support/Documents/AppNotes/AN_135_MPSSE_Basics.pdf
2019-02-23T01:37:35 < catphish> but i2s isn't one of them
2019-02-23T01:38:12 < mawk> it's closer to SPI than it is to I²C
2019-02-23T01:38:42 < mawk> so, SPI with clock phase, and rising edge clock polarity
2019-02-23T01:38:54 < catphish> but in any case it's a pretty generic syncronous serial protocol as far as i can tell
2019-02-23T01:39:13 < mawk> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a7/I2S_Timing.svg
2019-02-23T01:39:30 < mawk> yeah but see this thing, it's almost like SPI but with a strange chip select line
2019-02-23T01:39:50 < mawk> hmm
2019-02-23T01:40:06 < mawk> the word select goes down with the left channel, and up with the right channel
2019-02-23T01:40:11 < mawk> but it's delayed by 1 bit
2019-02-23T01:40:12 < catphish> there's "word select" which alternates to start the left and right channels
2019-02-23T01:40:16 < mawk> yes
2019-02-23T01:40:24 < catphish> yeah, that's odd
2019-02-23T01:40:32 < mawk> it's an ininterrupted stream of bits then
2019-02-23T01:40:47 < mawk> it's not like SPI which is 8 bits or 16 bits or something
2019-02-23T01:40:56 < mawk> the maths need to hold 
2019-02-23T01:41:12 < mawk> you need to have a multiple of 8 bits, but I guess that will be the case ?
2019-02-23T01:41:28 < mawk> you use like 24 bits PCM
2019-02-23T01:41:31 < catphish> essentially i'm happy just to treat it as a continuous bitstream, my driver an unpick it if necessary
2019-02-23T01:43:15 < mawk> you'll need to do right then left in a single SPI transfer, perhaps using a FIFO if the FTDI supports it
2019-02-23T01:43:26 < mawk> and you'll need two channels, to do the strange word select
2019-02-23T01:43:53 -!- bitmask_ [~bitmask@pool-100-35-68-83.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Gone to sleep...]
2019-02-23T01:43:56 < catphish> i'm fairly happy unpicking the bits, my big question is more "can the 2232 handle this arbitrary bitstream", and at what speed
2019-02-23T01:44:39 < mawk> with 2 output channels it's standard SPI
2019-02-23T01:44:54 < mawk> in the (0,0) mode
2019-02-23T01:45:14 < mawk> I don't think you'll be able to use the chip select line, or at least not easily
2019-02-23T01:45:18 < mawk> two SPI output channels will do it
2019-02-23T01:48:48 < catphish> there's also this bastarization of i2s called tdm that i quite like: https://i.imgur.com/nHKjT3d.png
2019-02-23T01:49:25 < mawk> nice
2019-02-23T01:49:26 < catphish> it fits 8 channels into a single i2s line with nice predictable timing starting on rising LRCK
2019-02-23T01:50:09 < catphish> no weird one-bit-offset, just an easily sync'd 256 bit continuous stream
2019-02-23T01:50:30 < catphish> the only downside, it has to run at 256 bits x the audio sample rate
2019-02-23T01:50:58 < catphish> which means 256 x 192k = 50MHz
2019-02-23T01:51:26 < catphish> or maybe 256 x 48k = 12.288 MHz
2019-02-23T01:51:29 < mawk> yeah that's a bit high
2019-02-23T01:51:38 < catphish> which is still rather high
2019-02-23T01:51:47 < mawk> but 44.1kHz isn't good enough for most earphones and all ?
2019-02-23T01:51:58 < ds2> 8 channels? that's not i2s
2019-02-23T01:52:09 < catphish> yeah, i'd be happy with 44.1/48 at 12Mbps
2019-02-23T01:52:33 < catphish> ds2: no, i2s is 2 channels, this is a comon modification of it to carry 8
2019-02-23T01:52:57 < ds2> catphish: common? how is it different from TDM mode?
2019-02-23T01:53:03 < mawk> it is tdm mode
2019-02-23T01:53:08 < catphish> it is tdm mode
2019-02-23T01:53:33 < catphish> ds2: i'm looking at options to carry 8 channels into USB, i'd be happy with either 4 lanes of i2s, or one lane of tdm
2019-02-23T01:53:49 < ds2> catphish: do you need 32bit per channel?
2019-02-23T01:53:52 < catphish> but having trouble working out what IC can do either of those
2019-02-23T01:54:19 < catphish> ds2: i'd like 24 bit per channel, 8 bits are usually wasted in 24 bit modes
2019-02-23T01:54:28 < catphish> for padding
2019-02-23T01:54:40 < catphish> per https://i.imgur.com/nHKjT3d.png
2019-02-23T01:54:40 < ds2> i2s does funny things with 1 bit of the 32... but hmmm
2019-02-23T01:55:05 < ds2> if you can deal with less then that, there are telco chips that can be married with a USB interface
2019-02-23T01:55:42 < catphish> well i'm up for ideas, but current goal is 8 x 24 bit, 48 or 192khz
2019-02-23T01:55:52 < ds2> otherwise one of those FX chip plus a simple CPLD can do it
2019-02-23T01:56:22 < ds2> 24bit isn't used much with telco stuff
2019-02-23T01:56:42 < catphish> i'd imagine not
2019-02-23T01:56:59 < catphish> i'm interested in seeing if i can replicate pro audio gear
2019-02-23T01:57:16 < catphish> albeit a crappy version i'm sure
2019-02-23T01:57:24 < ds2> easiest way I can think of is a USB to parallel bus plus fancy shift register with some logic
2019-02-23T01:57:57 < catphish> that ft2232h seems like it has promise, but struggling to work out its capabilities
2019-02-23T01:58:43 < ds2> can the ft2232 generate the BCLK?
2019-02-23T01:59:14 < ds2> and will it run ISO ep's?
2019-02-23T01:59:41 < catphish> it definitely generates a clock
2019-02-23T02:00:37 < ds2> does it behave nicely if the FIFO runs dry?
2019-02-23T02:01:53 < catphish> unknown
2019-02-23T02:26:01 < rajkosto> hmm are you supposed to smell ferrite cores when you reflow SMD inductors
2019-02-23T02:30:07 < rajkosto> the ft2232h is not a programmable mcu/usb thingy like fx2/fx3 are
2019-02-23T02:30:12 < rajkosto> theres no iso endpoints
2019-02-23T02:30:27 < rajkosto> theres no customizable endpoints at all, neither are the descriptors (other than the serial/name/vid/pid you can change with ftdiprog)
2019-02-23T02:31:02 < catphish> it seemed to me that while it's not programmable it must be somewhat flexible in some of its modes
2019-02-23T02:31:12 < catphish> but couldn't quite work how how much so
2019-02-23T02:31:18 < rajkosto> you can do SPI-likes with mpsse
2019-02-23T02:31:33 < rajkosto> but you need to flip LR every 24 bits
2019-02-23T02:31:43 < rajkosto> which means pretty bloated command buffer
2019-02-23T02:31:56 < rajkosto> as you will send command to transfer 24 bits, the 24 bits, then the gpio set command to toggle LR
2019-02-23T02:32:38 < catphish> rajkosto: i was thinking i could just divide the bit clock
2019-02-23T02:32:45 < catphish> (in hardware)
2019-02-23T02:32:52 < rajkosto> no theres one clock
2019-02-23T02:32:55 < rajkosto> one divider
2019-02-23T02:33:09 < rajkosto> and thats the clock that will be generated on CLK out pin when data is being transferred
2019-02-23T02:33:52 < catphish> yes, what i meant was that i could divide that clock with another ic and use it as the frame clock
2019-02-23T02:33:58 < rajkosto> the 8080 mode can generate some WR strobes but even that wont do what you want
2019-02-23T02:34:08 < catphish> so it flipped exactly every n bits
2019-02-23T02:34:09 < rajkosto> oh if youre using another IC you can just send SPI with ft2232h
2019-02-23T02:34:17 < rajkosto> and receive that with the other IC
2019-02-23T02:34:21 < rajkosto> and then do whatever
2019-02-23T02:34:23 < rajkosto> but... whjy
2019-02-23T02:35:09 < rajkosto> its a shame the GPIF2 in the FX2 is mostly for parallel data formats
2019-02-23T02:35:32 < catphish> i don't think i'm explaining well, i meant divide the bit clock with a flip flop array
2019-02-23T02:35:59 < catphish> so a frame clock is generated automatically from the bit clock
2019-02-23T02:36:28 < catphish> but i have no attachment to this idea at all
2019-02-23T02:36:50 < catphish> i'm looking for literally any device that can convert several audio channels to usb
2019-02-23T02:46:02 < catphish> so far i think my best bet is a sam e70 or similar
2019-02-23T02:50:24 < catphish> wow https://hackaday.io/project/2984-teensy-audio-library/log/57537-tdm-support-for-many-channel-audio-io
2019-02-23T02:53:17 < catphish> so it's settled: find an mcu with USB 2 and hack something together with DMA and GPIO
2019-02-23T02:54:50 < rajkosto> you wanna be on the bleeding edge ?
2019-02-23T02:55:16 < catphish> well, i really just want it to work and be cheap
2019-02-23T02:55:39 < rajkosto> STM32F723 has high speed usb built in apparently
2019-02-23T02:55:56 < catphish> yeah i spotted that yesterday
2019-02-23T02:56:24 < rajkosto> XMOS is what the audiophiles use apparently
2019-02-23T02:56:26 < catphish> it also has a SAI port that might be able to handle the tdm natively
2019-02-23T02:56:40 < catphish> xmos does look interesting
2019-02-23T02:56:51 < rajkosto> can CM6631A handle the amount of channels you want ?
2019-02-23T02:57:12 < rajkosto> 2 pairs I2S or Left-Justified serial audio output interface
2019-02-23T02:57:12 < rajkosto> 2 pairs I2S or Left-Justified serial audio input interface
2019-02-23T02:57:13 < rajkosto> guess not
2019-02-23T02:57:50 < rajkosto> the weirdest thing about the CM6631A is that it requires... parallel NOR flash
2019-02-23T02:58:10 < catphish> seemingly not
2019-02-23T02:58:54 < catphish> it supports "HDA" whish *should* support loads of sreams
2019-02-23T02:58:58 < catphish> *streams
2019-02-23T02:59:26 < rajkosto> a bunch of these use a helper CPLD
2019-02-23T02:59:42 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_01-59-40_5rXtfdagq.png
2019-02-23T03:00:49 < catphish> as of right now i think my best bet is a high end MCU with HS USB and try to make it handle the i2s using dma gpio
2019-02-23T03:01:14 < catphish> or the st SAI interface that is designed for this
2019-02-23T03:01:24 < rajkosto> lol just use a FX2 and then a 8bit parallel to serial 
2019-02-23T03:01:28 < rajkosto> register
2019-02-23T03:01:41 < rajkosto> as you can configure GPIF2 to toggle a bit every transfer
2019-02-23T03:01:56 < rajkosto> and you can use isochronous endpoints with FX2 if you write the firmware for it
2019-02-23T03:02:19 < catphish> i'm a step beind here
2019-02-23T03:02:25 < catphish> who is fx2?
2019-02-23T03:02:43 < rajkosto> to start with just get the 3$ fx2 chinese boards and then hook it up to a breadboard with some parallel to serial registers on it too
2019-02-23T03:02:47 < rajkosto> the EZUSB FX2 chip
2019-02-23T03:03:04 < rajkosto> the FIRST Programmable MCU with High Speed USB that can even saturate the bus completely
2019-02-23T03:03:16 < catphish> this guy? https://www.cypress.com/products/ez-usb-fx2lp
2019-02-23T03:03:22 < rajkosto> because you dont do anything in the 8051 core other than setting up the transfer details, the gpif2 engine does the actual state machine and gpio
2019-02-23T03:04:31 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1Pcs-EZ-USB-FX2LP-CY7C68013A-USB-Core-Board-Development-Board-USB-Logic-Analyzer-With-I2C-Serial/32840403187.html go nuts if you can figure out how
2019-02-23T03:04:50 < catphish> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CY7C68013A-56-EZ-USB-FX2LP-USB2-0-Developer-Board-Module-Logic-Analyser-EEPROM/273124763479?hash=item3f97812757:g:9pYAAOSwyGZaN8SL:rk:2:pf:0
2019-02-23T03:04:57 < catphish> just found the same board :)
2019-02-23T03:05:11 < rajkosto> for like 5x the price
2019-02-23T03:05:29 < rajkosto> anyway its super popular because its basically what the first saleae logic analyzer was
2019-02-23T03:05:51 < rajkosto> they just set up the gpif2 in continuous parallel sampling mode (free running clock) and dumped that over usb to the PC which did all the actual analyzing
2019-02-23T03:05:54 < catphish> wow that must be able to analyse logic at insane rates
2019-02-23T03:06:01 < rajkosto> just 48MHz
2019-02-23T03:06:13 < catphish> that's pretty fast
2019-02-23T03:06:18 < catphish> for a cheap usb gizmo
2019-02-23T03:06:28 < rajkosto> isnt cheap if you buy from saleae ;)
2019-02-23T03:07:10 < catphish> so can it run a channel at pretty much any clock speed?
2019-02-23T03:07:14 < rajkosto> its a 8051 core so it has basically no peripherals tho
2019-02-23T03:07:31 < rajkosto> you have to be able to do what you need to do either with gpif2 or bitbang (super slow as its a 48MHz 8051)
2019-02-23T03:07:50 < rajkosto> but im sure you can do it with gpif2 especially since it has write strobe gpios
2019-02-23T03:07:56 < rajkosto> you just need to parallel to serial
2019-02-23T03:09:18 < catphish> well there are several ways i can run this: 1 channel at 50MHz, 1 channel at 12MHz, 4 channels at 12MHz, or 4 channels at 3MHz
2019-02-23T03:09:38 < rajkosto> you can have a bunch of endpoints going at the same time with fx2
2019-02-23T03:09:39 < catphish> 1 channel would be TDM, 4 channels would be i2s
2019-02-23T03:09:55 < catphish> so i might as well use standard i2s
2019-02-23T03:10:15 < catphish> and keep it simple with multiple endoints in parallel
2019-02-23T03:10:55 < catphish> see, this is why i pay you so much, you have all the answers!
2019-02-23T03:10:58 < rajkosto> dont some atsamds have basically a gpif2 engine but for serial ?
2019-02-23T03:11:14 < rajkosto> so a hardware state machine you can configure to toggle gpios at various stages of a transfer
2019-02-23T03:11:32 < rajkosto> you might wanna try finding how flexible that is
2019-02-23T03:11:49 < rajkosto> its meant for implementing various serial protocols configurably
2019-02-23T03:11:54 < catphish> so gpif2 is a plc of sorts?
2019-02-23T03:12:15 < rajkosto> its just some silicon they made so that the 8051 doesnt have to be invovled at all for usb transfers
2019-02-23T03:12:34 < rajkosto> its just endpoint -> fifo -> silicon sends it out via parallel somehow accordeing to your configuration
2019-02-23T03:12:37 < catphish> and it handles the parallel sampling and parallel to serial conversion?
2019-02-23T03:12:46 < rajkosto> gpif2 cant do anything serial
2019-02-23T03:12:56 < rajkosto> but atsamd i think has something similar but FOR serial
2019-02-23T03:13:39 < catphish> oh i see so with with raw gpif2 i'd just get 8 bit parallel data and i'd need to rearrange that into 8 serial streams
2019-02-23T03:13:57 < rajkosto> no, youd put a parallel to serial converter after it
2019-02-23T03:14:20 < catphish> where? in the 8051?
2019-02-23T03:14:36 < rajkosto> no...
2019-02-23T03:14:37 < rajkosto> in HARDWARE
2019-02-23T03:14:41 < catphish> oh i see
2019-02-23T03:15:00 < rajkosto> seriously any cpld could do it or you could do it via discrete logic but a cpld would be cheaper
2019-02-23T03:15:03 < rajkosto> and use less space
2019-02-23T03:15:11 < catphish> interesting, i was thinking i'd just use the parallel as 8 serial lines
2019-02-23T03:15:22 < rajkosto> that would require your incoming usb data to actually be interleaved like that
2019-02-23T03:15:33 < rajkosto> if you involve the 8051 in flipping bits coming from usb, you bottleneck the whole thing
2019-02-23T03:15:38 < catphish> indeed, which may be rather cpu expensive
2019-02-23T03:16:51 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_02-16-50_ASJgKCMrb.png
2019-02-23T03:17:12 < catphish> what's that?
2019-02-23T03:17:16 < rajkosto> atsamd
2019-02-23T03:17:23 < rajkosto> full speed usb only ?
2019-02-23T03:19:05 < rajkosto> just use fx2 in some dumb passthrough mode and process the data on a cheap old coolrunner or max2 cpld after it
2019-02-23T03:20:09 < catphish> could equally use the ft2232 in that case right?
2019-02-23T03:20:20 < catphish> or any usb<->parallel adapter
2019-02-23T03:25:43 < rajkosto> not in the same way
2019-02-23T03:25:52 < rajkosto> you would have to use your own software in that case
2019-02-23T03:26:04 < rajkosto> couldnt just write firmware for the ft2232h to be a usb audio class device...
2019-02-23T03:26:32 < rajkosto> also ft2232 was full speed, ft2232h is the high speed one
2019-02-23T03:27:02 < rajkosto> at full saturation you can achieve 24MB/s out of a ft2232h if you tie up both the channels in the fast fifo mode
2019-02-23T03:27:12 < rajkosto> or 8MB/s in the 8080 mode with one channel only
2019-02-23T03:27:34 < rajkosto> but still needs custom software using d2xx or winusb, nothing automatic like you can do with a mcu that runs firmware
2019-02-23T03:27:45 < catphish> ah yeah, i meant ft2232h, but you're right, no usb audio class that way
2019-02-23T03:28:30 < catphish> a definite option is https://www.st.com/resource/en/datasheet/stm32f733ze.pdf
2019-02-23T03:29:05 < catphish> this has USB HS, and 2 x SAI interfces, as well as obviously the possibility of DMA gpio
2019-02-23T03:29:18 < rajkosto> sure
2019-02-23T03:29:24 < rajkosto> but is it cheaper than a fx2 + cpld ?
2019-02-23T03:29:39 < rajkosto> (its probably way easier to develop for, UNLESS it has a fucked up USB library you have to use)
2019-02-23T03:29:46 < catphish> i have no experience at all with cpld
2019-02-23T03:30:10 < rajkosto> time to learn verilog then
2019-02-23T03:30:15 < rajkosto> so much more opportunities open up
2019-02-23T03:30:28 < rajkosto> when you can twiddle data at the same speed it comes in , not in a cpu
2019-02-23T03:31:59 < rajkosto> (you can program cplds in schematic editor mode where you are just placing flip flops and logic gates in, especially if its a tiny one)
2019-02-23T03:32:27 < rajkosto> but i dont think anyone actually does that after they do the very basics
2019-02-23T03:33:43 < catphish> what's a cheap CPLD to play with?
2019-02-23T03:33:49 < rajkosto> get a max2 board
2019-02-23T03:33:52 < rajkosto> loads of pins
2019-02-23T03:33:55 < rajkosto> 3.3v only operation
2019-02-23T03:34:01 < rajkosto> its old so its cheap
2019-02-23T03:35:00 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/ALTERA-MAX-II-EPM240-CPLD-Core-Board-USB-Blaster-FPGA-Programmer-for-EPM240T100C5N-JTAG-PLD-Development/32239076830.html
2019-02-23T03:35:10 < catphish> STM32F733ZET6 - £9
2019-02-23T03:35:49 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EPM240T100C5N-EPM240T100C5-EPM240-TQFP100/32841539031.html
2019-02-23T03:35:51 < rajkosto> 1 dolla
2019-02-23T03:36:20 < catphish> cheap as chips :)
2019-02-23T03:36:22 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Altera-Max-Ii-Epm240-Cpld-Development-Board-Learning-Board-Breadboard-Develop-Diy-Kit-Electronic-PCB-Board/32835195646.html board without programmer is cheap enough
2019-02-23T03:36:26 < rajkosto> but you need the programmer
2019-02-23T03:36:30 < rajkosto> no other way to flash it
2019-02-23T03:37:04 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/altera-Mini-Usb-Blaster-Cable-For-CPLD-FPGA-NIOS-JTAG-Altera-Programmer/32666405755.html
2019-02-23T03:37:15 < rajkosto> guess whats in those btw
2019-02-23T03:37:21 < catphish> cool
2019-02-23T03:37:43 < rajkosto> in the usb blaster is just a fx2 bit banging the jtag out lol
2019-02-23T03:37:47 < rajkosto> the clones at least
2019-02-23T03:37:49 < catphish> lol
2019-02-23T03:37:50 < rajkosto> the proper one is much faster
2019-02-23T03:38:34 < catphish> so one can write a converter from several lines of serial to parallel with the cpld?
2019-02-23T03:38:56 < rajkosto> anyway with a cpld you can convert parallel to serial, you can count bits, you can divide clocks, you can buffer datas in case your other side cant keep up, etc
2019-02-23T03:38:59 < catphish> that's quite the extra learning curve :)
2019-02-23T03:39:23 < rajkosto> you just write code that happens every incoming clock
2019-02-23T03:40:20 < rajkosto> just get the fancy stm32 and try to write an usb audio class device firmware for it then
2019-02-23T03:40:28 < rajkosto> i havent managed to do it
2019-02-23T03:40:41 < rajkosto> but you would need to do that for any mcu you use
2019-02-23T03:41:34 < catphish> i'm just trying to get my head around the clock rate, i guess the serial and parallel clocks can be the same speed
2019-02-23T03:41:40 < rajkosto> nah
2019-02-23T03:41:47 < rajkosto> you would generate a 24x serial clock
2019-02-23T03:41:57 < rajkosto> as you clock out 1 bit at a time vs 24 bits at a time
2019-02-23T03:42:35 < rajkosto> draw some timing diagrams of the data you want out vs data you want in
2019-02-23T03:43:33 < catphish> indeed, i was thinking of the simplistic case of having a 8-bit parallel interface connected to 8 serial lines
2019-02-23T03:43:52 < catphish> it seems the clock rate would be happily identical throughout
2019-02-23T03:43:58 < rajkosto> yes.
2019-02-23T03:44:03 < rajkosto> but you would need to interlave the data
2019-02-23T03:44:11 < rajkosto> per bit
2019-02-23T03:46:02 < catphish> yep, makes sense
2019-02-23T03:46:26 < catphish> sees like something i could write, but i'm more comfortable with the stm32 so might try that first
2019-02-23T03:47:24 < catphish> thanks for all the ideas, seems there's at least 2 designs there i can try
2019-02-23T03:49:02 < rajkosto> with the fancy stm32 i think you would just wait for the usb endpoint fifo to fill then DMA that to the i2s engine ?
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2019-02-23T03:49:35 < rajkosto> no weird conversions needed as the output is also serial
2019-02-23T03:50:34 < catphish> i don't actually know how one streams from the usb on the stm32, will have to look into that
2019-02-23T03:51:08 < catphish> best case scenario i can dma straight from the usb to the sai
2019-02-23T03:51:14 < catphish> and vice versa
2019-02-23T03:51:38 < catphish> and leave the cpu free to do trivial management work
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2019-02-23T03:52:24 < catphish> but that depends on many things including the framing of usb audio class data
2019-02-23T03:53:25 < catphish> plus there's still the choice of SAI vs GPIO+DMA-bitbang
2019-02-23T03:53:38 < catphish> plenty to play with
2019-02-23T03:58:48 < ds2> will a FX2 be fast enough?
2019-02-23T03:59:01 < ds2> the FX3 might have more margin
2019-02-23T03:59:29 < catphish> if fx2 can max out high speed usb then its more than fast enough
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2019-02-23T04:07:01 < catphish> oo this is nice http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/pcm3168a.pdf
2019-02-23T04:07:24 < catphish> i can start with just one of those for 6+8 channels
2019-02-23T04:12:43 < ds2> catphish: do you need both in and out?
2019-02-23T04:12:53 < catphish> yes
2019-02-23T04:13:18 < ds2> why not just use a SoC?
2019-02-23T04:13:29 < catphish> what kind of SoC?
2019-02-23T04:13:46 < ds2> the TI Sitaras can do what you want pretty easily
2019-02-23T04:14:01 < ds2> the McASP or McBSP HW can do the audio stuff
2019-02-23T04:14:13 < ds2> it has USB device HW
2019-02-23T04:14:32 < ds2> for about $30....
2019-02-23T04:16:22 < catphish> well that does sound reasonable
2019-02-23T04:16:35 < ds2> and $30 is mounted on a board
2019-02-23T04:16:43 < ds2> complete with RAM and everything
2019-02-23T04:19:37 < catphish> £30 gets me an stm32, 2 x 4-channel ADC and 2 x 8-channel DAC
2019-02-23T04:20:02 < catphish> i think i'll start by playing with that and see how many channels i can drive
2019-02-23T04:20:04 < ds2> but what kind of digital audio hardware?
2019-02-23T04:20:41 < catphish> STM32F733ZET6, PCM1865DBTR, PCM1690DCAR
2019-02-23T04:20:53 < ds2> I mean on the stm32
2019-02-23T04:22:01 < catphish> it has 2 x SAI ports, i don't 100% understand the specs of those
2019-02-23T04:22:11 < catphish> plus good old fahsioned GPIO
2019-02-23T04:22:22 < ds2> can a SAI port be run in TDM bus mode?
2019-02-23T04:22:31 < catphish> yes
2019-02-23T04:27:32 < catphish> best case scenario is 8 x ADC on one SAI and 8 x DAC on the other
2019-02-23T04:29:52 < catphish> in addition it has 3 regular i2s ports, i can use these for sneaky extra stereo headphone outputs
2019-02-23T04:30:40 < catphish> well i have a plan, i'll see how it goes :)
2019-02-23T04:33:32 < catphish> thanks again
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2019-02-23T06:06:45 < tjq> thank
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2019-02-23T06:34:41 < englishman> zyp: got a new bed, with ikea frame, the most expensive one they make. it broke in the first hour
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2019-02-23T06:54:46 < tjq> do you know how many fucking ikea beds I've broken, mid pump
2019-02-23T06:54:52 < tjq> you wouldn't fucking believe it mate
2019-02-23T06:55:37 < tjq> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88Hk10ejn0A
2019-02-23T07:07:34 < jadew> lol, you watch a lot of shit
2019-02-23T07:12:26 < jadew> speaking of shit, I've been singing in my head "99 dollars, panaaaaanasonic blu-ray" to bed...
2019-02-23T07:12:44 < jadew> got that song stuck in my head even now
2019-02-23T07:36:30 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/6rQrYbi.png
2019-02-23T07:36:42 < bitmask> thank you dropbox, I stole your design
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2019-02-23T08:14:31 < cdnChrisDvo_> good day to all;  what are you folks using for a "viewer" for swd output (printf / ITM_SendChar()) on linux ?
2019-02-23T08:20:25 < zyp> englishman, good thing they have good customer service then
2019-02-23T08:20:40 < englishman> yeah but fuck
2019-02-23T08:21:01 < englishman> that 25 year warranty is there for a reason
2019-02-23T08:21:39 < englishman> the mattress sure is nice
2019-02-23T08:21:41 < englishman> tho
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2019-02-23T12:30:28 < rajkosto> hows it jabling jables
2019-02-23T12:48:47 < Steffanx> its jabling as jablual.
2019-02-23T12:49:02 < Steffanx> there?
2019-02-23T12:52:38 < zyp> https://community.arm.com/processors/b/blog/posts/arm-helium-the-new-vector-extension-for-arm-m-profile-architecture
2019-02-23T12:53:55 < rajkosto> these ARMV8 MCUs are 64bit ? aarch64 ?
2019-02-23T12:54:32 < zyp> no
2019-02-23T12:54:37 < zyp> v8m is stil 32-bit
2019-02-23T12:54:42 < rajkosto> its more thumb instruction ?
2019-02-23T12:54:50 < zyp> yes
2019-02-23T12:55:00 < zyp> all cortex-m is thumb/thumb2 only
2019-02-23T13:02:12 < invzim> zyp: thanks, I will steal that term!
2019-02-23T13:03:49 < invzim> the minimum has gone up
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2019-02-23T13:09:12 < Steffanx> Hmm, damn DHL increased their "advance payment fee" .. cant i sue DHL or something. Since they dont really pay in advance -_-
2019-02-23T13:09:56 < jadew> is that for customs?
2019-02-23T13:10:00 < Steffanx> yes
2019-02-23T13:10:22 < jadew> I got a registration number from the customs department and now I don't have to pay that fee anymore
2019-02-23T13:10:36 < Steffanx> 20 euro bucks fee and 14 euro bucks taxes -_-
2019-02-23T13:10:37 < jadew> I ask them to use my account and the fee is gone
2019-02-23T13:12:04 < Steffanx> i just seems like an entire business case, the fee
2019-02-23T13:12:36 < Steffanx> but yeah, complaining here wont help :P
2019-02-23T13:13:13 < jadew> maybe you can do the same thing I did, but it's not something they tell you about
2019-02-23T13:13:19 < jadew> the thing I got is called an EORI
2019-02-23T13:13:46 < Steffanx> its a company thing? im no such thing
2019-02-23T13:14:09 < jadew> you can get it as a private person too
2019-02-23T13:14:34 < jadew> http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/eos/eori_home.jsp?Lang=en
2019-02-23T13:15:17 < jadew> also, it didn't cost anything to get it
2019-02-23T13:15:59 < rajkosto> Steffanx, you can argue with them for a long time if you want to be the one paying the customs, in which case the 20euro fee isnt there
2019-02-23T13:16:14 < rajkosto> but yeah DHL sucks when they do that, it doesnt happen all the time either
2019-02-23T13:16:30 < jadew> happens all the time here
2019-02-23T13:16:33 < jadew> but only with DHL
2019-02-23T13:16:40 < jadew> everyone else wants your business
2019-02-23T13:17:07 < Steffanx> its not my business, its jlcpcb's
2019-02-23T13:17:23 < rajkosto> how much was the package value
2019-02-23T13:17:52 < jadew> $5 + $17 shipping, so above the 10 euro limit :P
2019-02-23T13:18:16 < Steffanx> 70e or something
2019-02-23T13:18:17 < jadew> speaking of which, I think I dreamt that 1 USD = 1 EUR
2019-02-23T13:18:18 < Steffanx> incl shipping
2019-02-23T13:18:38 < jadew> just checked, yeah, it was a dream
2019-02-23T13:18:54 < Steffanx> its close enough though
2019-02-23T13:19:12 < jadew> yeah, but it's rather stable
2019-02-23T13:19:17 < rajkosto> jadew, to many online shops, 1EUR == 0.7USD
2019-02-23T13:19:56 < jadew> so... buy with dollars
2019-02-23T13:20:04 < rajkosto> (they just use the $ value as eur value, then add taxes on top)
2019-02-23T13:20:12 < rajkosto> no you cant if you are european
2019-02-23T13:28:15 < zyp> invzim, did it? what is it now?
2019-02-23T14:06:12 < qyx> here it is like 20€ for dhl and 150€ for classic post
2019-02-23T14:06:15 < qyx> the limit I mean
2019-02-23T14:21:04 < invzim> zyp: ah you may be right, kind-of, the additional fee for physical size doesn't count towards the 150
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2019-02-23T14:31:20 < zyp> oh
2019-02-23T14:31:32 < zyp> I pretty much never pay that
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2019-02-23T15:49:41 < rajkosto> wheres that guide how to use usb-c with old stm32
2019-02-23T15:52:52 < zyp> use how? device mode only?
2019-02-23T15:53:05 < rajkosto> dunno someone linked the pdf here
2019-02-23T15:53:18 < zyp> just slap a pulldown resistor from each CC line to ground
2019-02-23T15:53:38 < zyp> haven't seen the pdf you're talking about to, but I've read the usb-c spec
2019-02-23T15:53:43 < zyp> -to
2019-02-23T15:54:47 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_14-54-36_VSnF3Sp4U.png is this reallly enough ? why do so many boards use a transistor
2019-02-23T15:59:25 < emeryth> so they can disconnect from the bus?
2019-02-23T15:59:52 < rajkosto> i meant for the pullup
2019-02-23T16:00:00 < rajkosto> on DP
2019-02-23T16:00:07 < emeryth> yes
2019-02-23T16:01:13 < rajkosto> you can disconnect by just setting GPIO to 0 or high impedance
2019-02-23T16:01:30 < rajkosto> transistor is probably there just so it has a known state at power on before firmware runs
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2019-02-23T16:14:31 < rajkosto> aandrew, since stlinkv3 uses new chips maybe they reworked the bootloader to only boot signed firmwares in which case you cant dump it ;(
2019-02-23T16:20:15 < sync> jpa-: is your stm32 price comparison supposed to be broken? :)
2019-02-23T16:20:24 < sync> also can you add the G0 series? :)
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2019-02-23T16:23:52 < rajkosto> when will i reach this level of GUI design prowess https://i.redd.it/jqcsux1ybai21.jpg
2019-02-23T16:24:18 < jadew> what a stupid feature... (which wasn't there before)
2019-02-23T16:24:33 < jadew> when you paste a folder and it looks through the files
2019-02-23T16:24:52 < jadew> if they're too many, it will take a while, so you can go on and do other stuff
2019-02-23T16:25:32 < jadew> well, the stupid feature is that when it's done figuring out how many files are the same, it will ask you if you want to overwrite them AND GIVE FOCUS to the dialog
2019-02-23T16:25:50 < jadew> so if you're typing something... you might just press space, with the YES button selected
2019-02-23T16:26:34 < rajkosto> you dont have to use explorer for file management you know
2019-02-23T16:26:43 < rajkosto> i use total commander usually
2019-02-23T16:26:48 < rajkosto> but wasnt that feature there since Vista ?
2019-02-23T16:26:49 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Cx72rUtMQriZhP3WVOg-zBkIXotnetVc/view?usp=drivesdk
2019-02-23T16:26:55 < kakimir> muh cv load
2019-02-23T16:27:15 < kakimir> set to 3.00 volts
2019-02-23T16:27:16 < jadew> rajkosto, no, I think it was introduced with the last update
2019-02-23T16:27:31 < kakimir> draining 0.5A
2019-02-23T16:27:36 < jadew> I back up my datasheets regularly and it hasn't happened before
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2019-02-23T16:29:16 < rajkosto> as far as i can remember it would spin for a little bit then ask you if you want to Replace files or rename
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2019-02-23T16:29:28 < jadew> rajkosto, yeah
2019-02-23T16:29:32 < jadew> that's not the problem
2019-02-23T16:29:41 < jadew> the problem is that the window now gains focus
2019-02-23T16:29:44 < rajkosto> using latest win10 is stupid for many reasons anyway
2019-02-23T16:29:51 < jadew> so if you're about to press space
2019-02-23T16:30:02 < jadew> ... well, it will just proceed with the replace
2019-02-23T16:30:28 < rajkosto> the last win10 i found tolerable was anniversary
2019-02-23T16:33:32 < zyp> rajkosto, which stm32 family are you designing for?
2019-02-23T16:33:54 < rajkosto> f4 has register to renumerate, i know
2019-02-23T16:34:48 < zyp> not only f4, all the ones with the v2 core also have the pullup internally
2019-02-23T16:35:23 < zyp> the external DP pullup is only required on parts with the v1 core
2019-02-23T16:35:34 < zyp> and the schematic you linked is how I do it
2019-02-23T16:35:45 < rajkosto> is there a non sucky non-HAL driver for v1
2019-02-23T16:36:38 < zyp> you don't need to deal with vbus at all if you do'r're not interested in knowing whether vbus is present or not
2019-02-23T16:37:07 < zyp> dunno, I wrote my own, you're the judge
2019-02-23T16:38:00 < zyp> what sort of device are you making?
2019-02-23T16:42:26 < jpa-> sync: digikey has blocked wget, and i'm not sure if i should just fake user agent
2019-02-23T16:42:47 < zyp> haha
2019-02-23T16:42:52 < sync> jpa-: why not
2019-02-23T16:43:04 < sync> I mean, you already do in the makefile?
2019-02-23T16:49:36 < rajkosto> zyp, HID 
2019-02-23T16:49:44 < rajkosto> with some custom vendor stuff
2019-02-23T16:50:01 < zyp> that's what I've mostly been doing too
2019-02-23T16:51:07 < zyp> I'd say my usb stack is pretty neat, but I'm obviously biased, and I'm not gonna hand-hold you through using it, so please only consider it if you know what you're doing :p
2019-02-23T16:51:36 < zyp> https://cgit.jvnv.net/arcin/tree/main.cpp <- here's an example of how to do HID
2019-02-23T16:52:55 < rajkosto> what library is this
2019-02-23T16:53:03 < zyp> laks
2019-02-23T16:53:09 < zyp> https://cgit.jvnv.net/laks
2019-02-23T16:54:23 < zyp> it only contains support for the peripherals I've needed, and the maturity of it depends on how much I've needed it :p
2019-02-23T16:54:29 < rajkosto> does it all inline into just register writes ?
2019-02-23T16:54:47 < zyp> yeah, a lot of it do
2019-02-23T16:55:13 < zyp> I toyed around with binary ninja recently and looked at the graphical disassembly of the arcin firmware
2019-02-23T16:55:20 < zyp> entire usb stack is inlined into main()
2019-02-23T16:55:53 < rajkosto> i think i should move some of my stuff that i dont want to be delayed into systick interrupt so i have guaranteed 1ms response
2019-02-23T16:56:04 < zyp> more by lazyness than by design though
2019-02-23T16:56:38 < zyp> ideally I should split stuff into more translation units to keep stuff sane, but I haven't needed to yet
2019-02-23T16:57:55 < sync> ah jpa- they have not blocked wget, you just need a cookie from them
2019-02-23T16:57:55 < zyp> there's around a thousand devices in the wild running this code now, and I haven't had any complaints about reliability
2019-02-23T16:59:13 < rajkosto> take some settings from output report, apply them, read some sensors and put them into input report
2019-02-23T16:59:29 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q7sYY6d4gg electronic orchestra is back
2019-02-23T17:05:36 < mawk> it's not blocked for me jpa- 
2019-02-23T17:05:49 < mawk> maybe you triggered the cloudflare and I didn't
2019-02-23T17:06:15 < mawk> no, no cloudflare
2019-02-23T17:25:52 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
2019-02-23T17:26:39 < englishman> jpa-: can you use google search engine user agent? most sites allow that to allow crawling
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2019-02-23T18:09:22 < jpa-> sync: i do?
2019-02-23T18:09:32 < jpa-> hmm
2019-02-23T18:09:53 < jpa-> yeah, looks like i do
2019-02-23T18:10:16 < jpa-> http://jpa.kapsi.fi/jenkins/job/stm32prices/83/console   they've probably then specifically blocked me
2019-02-23T18:10:51 < jpa-> ah, cookie
2019-02-23T18:11:12 < jpa-> would they accept a waffle instead?
2019-02-23T18:15:17 < jpa-> seems to need javascript for setting that cookie
2019-02-23T18:17:29 < kakimir> hah
2019-02-23T18:17:35 < kakimir> trying to install bitcoin
2019-02-23T18:17:46 < kakimir> 100GB of free space available
2019-02-23T18:17:50 < kakimir> 223GB needed
2019-02-23T18:18:40 < zyp> what'cha installing bitcoin for?
2019-02-23T18:19:23 < kakimir> buy my first coin
2019-02-23T18:20:08 < zyp> you don't need to run the full node software, just use a wallet client
2019-02-23T18:20:16 < kakimir> hmm
2019-02-23T18:20:24 < kakimir> installed bitcoin core
2019-02-23T18:20:26 < kakimir> launched it
2019-02-23T18:20:48 < zyp> I'd suggest electrum instead
2019-02-23T18:20:48 < kakimir> it says boi you need to process and store 223GB of data ok?
2019-02-23T18:21:14 < scrts> dafuq?
2019-02-23T18:21:26 < scrts> u just open wallet
2019-02-23T18:21:30 < scrts> and keep bitcoin there
2019-02-23T18:21:40 < zyp> or you can run bitcoin core if you want but tell it to delete the transaction history after verifying it
2019-02-23T18:22:04 < zyp> all it needs to work is the UTXO set, i.e. the record of the current balances, that's only a few gigs
2019-02-23T18:22:23 < zyp> those two hundred gigs are the history of every transaction ever performed
2019-02-23T18:23:02 < kakimir> how it's so small?
2019-02-23T18:24:30 < zyp> each transaction is only a couple hundred bytes or so
2019-02-23T18:25:44 < zyp> also, block size is limited
2019-02-23T18:25:48 < kakimir> so there has only been like 1billion transactions?
2019-02-23T18:25:54 < zyp> used to be one megabyte
2019-02-23T18:26:05 < zyp> and block rate is limited to one per ten minutes or so
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2019-02-23T18:30:41 < kakimir> I don't understand shit
2019-02-23T18:30:48 < rajkosto> dont use the main bitcoin client lol
2019-02-23T18:30:51 < sync> no jpa-, it seems you can do it with wget, although I only spent like 5mins
2019-02-23T18:30:54 < rajkosto> just electrum
2019-02-23T18:33:42 < rajkosto> did i solder good https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_17-33-30_QhCEqYcOl.jpg
2019-02-23T18:36:14 < kakimir> why did you remove it
2019-02-23T18:36:20 < kakimir> 404
2019-02-23T18:38:03 < rajkosto> refresh
2019-02-23T18:40:02 < jpa-> sync: you found a way? please tell
2019-02-23T18:40:25 < kakimir> nice fet bodges rajkosto 
2019-02-23T18:40:39 < rajkosto> no bodges
2019-02-23T18:40:48 < rajkosto> 0805 gate resistor is where the missing leg is
2019-02-23T18:40:54 < kakimir> oh missing leg
2019-02-23T18:45:04 < sync> jpa-: you can first go to digikey.com with --keep-session-cookies --save-cookies waffels
2019-02-23T18:45:27 < sync> and then jam it back in there with --load-cookies waffels
2019-02-23T18:45:51 < sync> but somehow that did not work out of the box, I'd have to look deeper in how wget handles that shit
2019-02-23T18:45:56 < kakimir> rajkosto: U1 is what?
2019-02-23T18:46:12 < rajkosto> cant put that one in until i test stm32 output without it
2019-02-23T18:46:19 < jpa-> sync: yes i tried that, did not work, also it doesn't work with browser if you disable javascript
2019-02-23T18:46:41 < kakimir> rajkosto: half bridge driver?
2019-02-23T18:47:00 < kakimir> some ti jub?
2019-02-23T18:47:04 < rajkosto> TPS61196
2019-02-23T18:47:52 < kakimir> 120V output
2019-02-23T18:48:46 < sync> hmm, I did not notice it needing js
2019-02-23T18:50:07 < jpa-> sync: so uh, does it work for you with wget or does it not? i'm getting mixed signals here
2019-02-23T19:02:12 < jpa-> sync: i updated manually now and added G0; but couldn't figure out a way to download automatically
2019-02-23T19:09:05 < jadew> description on e-bay item: "All were purchased from private as defective / unchecked. We have checked: all broken."
2019-02-23T19:39:00 -!- boB_K7IQ [~boBK7IQ@c-73-193-6-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
2019-02-23T19:46:28 < kakimir> :P
2019-02-23T19:47:18 -!- psprint_ [~psprint@91.245.82.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
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2019-02-23T20:10:51 < qyx> speaking of G0, I checked the subfamily which should include CAN-FD and there is none
2019-02-23T20:11:10 < qyx> there is a * telling me that CAN-FD peripheral is available on SOME product
2019-02-23T20:11:28 < qyx> s
2019-02-23T20:17:26 < sync> hmm, yeah jpa-, I'll figure something out™
2019-02-23T20:17:42 < sync> otherwise you could probably use chrome or some shit from cli to grab the csv
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2019-02-23T20:22:26 < mawk> jpa-: you can authenticate, get the cookie, send it again to download, no ?
2019-02-23T20:22:44 < mawk> you can use a Session object with the python requests lib to do that and magically hold your cookies in a cookie jar
2019-02-23T20:26:00 < englishman> qyx: there's a lot of lines that won't be available until later this year or next year
2019-02-23T20:29:26 < kakimir> kylläpä vituttaa
2019-02-23T20:31:27 < mawk> yeah getting the cookies isn't enough,  you need cookies set live by javascript shit jpa- 
2019-02-23T20:31:41 < mawk> maybe the browser automation solution is the best one
2019-02-23T20:32:11 < mawk> uh nevermind
2019-02-23T20:32:12 < mawk> I did it
2019-02-23T20:32:33 < mawk> you do it once, it fails, you do it a second time and it works
2019-02-23T20:32:42 < mawk> it sets cookies on the first attempt I guess
2019-02-23T20:32:59 < englishman> my IN-17 tubes arrived
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2019-02-23T20:52:07 < mawk> jpa-: https://paste.serveur.io/rQSsUYKv.py
2019-02-23T20:53:49 < mawk> and sync 
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2019-02-23T21:32:35 < Steffanx> lol just a bunch of user agents in one go and they're happy mawk?
2019-02-23T21:32:47 < mawk> no it's the range(2) that's the key Steffanx 
2019-02-23T21:32:54 < mawk> at first they give a 403 but set a couple of cookies
2019-02-23T21:32:58 < mawk> and when you try a second time it works
2019-02-23T21:33:14 < mawk> I'm not sure the UA is required, but it's better so thay they don't block your IP I guess
2019-02-23T21:33:43 < mawk> that user agent is only the user agent of chrome, not several user agents
2019-02-23T21:33:47 < mawk> but yeah it contains a lot of name
2019-02-23T21:33:50 < mawk> web is terrible
2019-02-23T21:34:05 < mawk> they had to do this to overcome sites making bad assumptions about what the UA should look like
2019-02-23T21:34:55 < Steffanx> ah i see chrome doe sthat indeed
2019-02-23T21:36:03 < rajkosto> does st-link ever use the hardware nrst pin output ? seems it can soft reset the cpu always
2019-02-23T21:37:35 < mawk> when I hook up the stlink I don't have to connect nrst rajkosto 
2019-02-23T21:37:45 < mawk> it can reset anyway 
2019-02-23T21:37:50 < rajkosto> i do have it connected, how do i tell it to use it
2019-02-23T21:37:55 < Thorn> you can't soft reset a mcu if swd/jtag pins are remapped
2019-02-23T21:38:12 < Thorn> or if it's in a low power mode
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2019-02-23T21:40:10 < sync> 10/10 mawk
2019-02-23T21:40:23 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: yes, stlink can use nrst pin, it's needed to connect to a sleeping target or otherwise unresponsive.
2019-02-23T21:41:13 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: with openocd it's specified as "reset_config srst_only" (to always reset using hw pin; and connect_assert_srst if you want to connect using it). 
2019-02-23T21:48:23 < aandrew> I think the latter is what I use when I'm working on stm32
2019-02-23T21:58:18 < PaulFertser> It's nice to be able to connect to a target that's stuck in hardfault handler to investigate backtrace.
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2019-02-23T22:09:07 < bitmask> https://youtu.be/idu3eT8vxEM
2019-02-23T22:09:11 < bitmask> almost done
2019-02-23T22:11:05 < aandrew> PaulFertser: yes
2019-02-23T22:11:19 < aandrew> I have adapted a hardfault handler to do the stack unwind so it's easy to see if you break into it
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2019-02-23T22:27:05 < rajkosto> whats the difference between SWD_HLA and SWD
2019-02-23T22:28:45 < jpa-> mawk: nice
2019-02-23T22:29:06 < englishman> looks like some lunix opensores thing
2019-02-23T22:31:38 < jpa-> mawk, sync: now i got it to work also with wget; just such a small little detail, i was trying to load https://www.digikey.com/ first, expecting it to set the cookies; but loading the csv twice was the key
2019-02-23T22:31:43 < jpa-> mawk: thanks a lot!
2019-02-23T22:32:05 < rajkosto> connect_assert_srst seems to make it not work ?
2019-02-23T22:32:11 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_21-32-08_QN45wqHpT.png
2019-02-23T22:32:45 < rajkosto> with reset_config srst_only only (no connect_assert_srst) it works but the srst line is never toggled
2019-02-23T22:35:15 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_21-35-06_3rYVyEfYq.png i hate this line in openocd stm32f1x.cfg
2019-02-23T22:38:46 < qyx> poor bytes
2019-02-23T22:38:58 < qyx> showing config snippet as a picture
2019-02-23T22:39:08 < rajkosto> its png tho, so its pretty well compressed
2019-02-23T22:39:36 < rajkosto> 2470 bytes
2019-02-23T22:39:53 < qyx> we are wasting bytes and children in africa..
2019-02-23T22:40:12 < englishman> print out your pngs and fax them to africa
2019-02-23T22:40:48 < rajkosto> i can copy a .bin file to the stlink 2.1 mass storage device 
2019-02-23T22:40:56 < rajkosto> and it unmounts
2019-02-23T22:43:51 < rajkosto> oh, stlink VCP only works at 57600
2019-02-23T22:44:40 < rajkosto> oh
2019-02-23T22:44:41 < rajkosto> im an idiot
2019-02-23T22:45:07 < rajkosto> i made my boot button... connect to gnd
2019-02-23T22:45:12 < rajkosto> and its high normally
2019-02-23T22:48:09 < qyx> unfortunate, how are you going to fix it?
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2019-02-23T22:48:48 < rajkosto> remove button
2019-02-23T22:48:52 < rajkosto> solder 0805 to gnd instead of it
2019-02-23T22:49:02 < rajkosto> no bootloader button but it will boot firmware normally
2019-02-23T22:49:07 < rajkosto> not like i need the boot button with swd connected
2019-02-23T22:50:13 < rajkosto> i can also use tweezers on the 3.3v pullup resistor if i want to get into bootloader
2019-02-23T22:50:19 < rajkosto> less good than a button but hey
2019-02-23T22:52:51 < mawk> but then jpa- with wget you have that slight encoding error, you have the BOM at the beggining on the file
2019-02-23T22:53:07 < mawk> that will get prepended to the name of the first CSV column 
2019-02-23T22:53:14 < mawk> you will get  at the beggining of that column
2019-02-23T22:53:27 < mawk> but it's still valid ISO-8859-1 so you get no error
2019-02-23T22:53:31 < mawk> just that ugly 
2019-02-23T22:53:35 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: with srst_only it'll pull the reset line when you do any "reset" command in openocd but not on connection.
2019-02-23T22:53:40 < mawk> maybe there is a wget option to force output encoding
2019-02-23T22:53:50 < mawk> or just interpret the file as UTF-8 with BOM and remove the BOM
2019-02-23T22:54:10 < rajkosto> so dont need connect_assert_srst
2019-02-23T22:54:22 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: swd_hla is a transport used by high-level adapters (those that do not provide DAP-level operations, only something similar to gdb serial protocol).
2019-02-23T22:54:49 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: also if you use "tar ext :3333" in gdb you'll be able to use "run" and "start" commands there, that'll reset the target too.
2019-02-23T22:58:37 < jpa-> mawk: for me, the first line is a header that i skip anyway
2019-02-23T22:58:48 < mawk> yeah it's the name of the CSV fields
2019-02-23T22:58:52 < mawk> if you skip it it's fine
2019-02-23T22:59:14 < mawk> since every 256 8-bit character is a valid ISO-8859-1 character you won't have errors; unlike with the other way around
2019-02-23T23:02:06 < sync> ah jpa-, I tried that but it did not work
2019-02-23T23:03:56 < mawk> you need to save cookies in between sync 
2019-02-23T23:04:04 < mawk> get a first request, get 403 but save the cookies in a jar
2019-02-23T23:04:08 < mawk> and on the second attempt it works
2019-02-23T23:04:27 < mawk> if you're using javascript the main page will set the right cookies right on so you don't need to do that and didn't noticed it
2019-02-23T23:06:12 < mawk> digikey sets around 100 cookies with js enabled
2019-02-23T23:06:21 < mawk> various trackers, analytics, A/B testing, whatever
2019-02-23T23:06:23 < mawk> it's monstruous
2019-02-23T23:06:42 < sync> yeah I did put my waffle in a jar
2019-02-23T23:07:08 < sync> yeah, that probably was the issue that it could not set the right one
2019-02-23T23:17:55 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_22-16-50_3GkZuZJyc.jpg rip
2019-02-23T23:17:55 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_22-17-01_t779kkqtg.jpg it has to be this way
2019-02-23T23:21:33 < qyx> your cap is enormous
2019-02-23T23:21:59 < rajkosto> its supposed to be an SMD cap thats wider but shorter
2019-02-23T23:22:09 < rajkosto> (those are correct cap sizes anyway)
2019-02-23T23:24:22 < rajkosto> its SUPPOSED to be massive https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_22-24-03_xwPCrRvuF.png
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2019-02-23T23:49:45 < bitmask> do you call it spade connector or spade terminal
2019-02-23T23:50:59 < rajkosto> ```Spade terminals, also known as spade connectors```
2019-02-23T23:51:51 < bitmask> yea I used google too
2019-02-23T23:52:03 < bitmask> I'm wondering what you peoples pref is
--- Day changed Sun Feb 24 2019
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2019-02-24T00:06:30 < rajkosto> ```Spade terminals, also known as spade connectors```
2019-02-24T00:17:04 < rajkosto> actually stlink vcp seems to work to program stm32 bootloader even at 921600bps so whats the "quirks"
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2019-02-24T00:25:39 < rajkosto> how critical is it to get the crystal load capacitance correct
2019-02-24T00:26:02 < rajkosto> never known how to do that right
2019-02-24T00:26:51 < kakimir> well
2019-02-24T00:27:05 < kakimir> it's not that hard
2019-02-24T00:27:09 < kakimir> even I have done it
2019-02-24T00:27:20 < kakimir> mcu datasheet usually have this simple formula
2019-02-24T00:27:43 < rajkosto> it seems every mcu has its own starting value and then you plug in your pcb capacitance (which i dont know what it is) and your crystal capacitance (which different crystals specify differently)
2019-02-24T00:27:59 < rajkosto> and then theres confusion if thats the total capacitance or for one of the capacitors you put on board
2019-02-24T00:28:58 < kakimir> sounds like a complex approach
2019-02-24T00:29:37 < rajkosto> 22pf seems to be working for the xtal im using dunno
2019-02-24T00:29:46 < kakimir> https://community.nxp.com/thread/388856
2019-02-24T00:30:08 < zyp> rajkosto, how critical it is depends on how accurate you need the frequency to be
2019-02-24T00:30:19 < rajkosto> ST uses a 12pf crystal and their capacitors are 20pf
2019-02-24T00:30:41 < zyp> https://github.com/karlp/zypsnips/blob/master/crystal-load-wisdom.txt
2019-02-24T00:30:43 < rajkosto> they also dont have a 1M resistor parallel to the crystal
2019-02-24T00:31:02 < zyp> so 20pF for a 12pF crystal is good
2019-02-24T00:31:30 < zyp> but if this is just for a typical mcu project, it doesn't matter
2019-02-24T00:31:40 < rajkosto> well it needs to be usb accurate
2019-02-24T00:32:05 < zyp> for FS? was that 0.5% or 0.25%?
2019-02-24T00:32:16 < zyp> either way, not a big deal
2019-02-24T00:32:30 < zyp> I've fucked up crystal capacitance once in a way that mattered
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2019-02-24T00:33:08 < zyp> when I was young and naive, I thought the capacitance number in the crystal datasheet were what I were supposed to use for capacitors :)
2019-02-24T00:33:15 < rajkosto> i did it according to this https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-23_23-33-00_nGi1rlEgB.png but my resistor is 1M
2019-02-24T00:33:23 < zyp> so essentially I were putting half the capacitance of what I were supposed to
2019-02-24T00:33:37 < zyp> on a board with a RF transceiver
2019-02-24T00:33:53 < kakimir> why there is resistor?
2019-02-24T00:34:10 < rajkosto> kakimir, opamp bias
2019-02-24T00:34:14 < kakimir> crystal series resistance also matters
2019-02-24T00:34:24 < rajkosto> some mcus require it so i always have the resistor footprint there
2019-02-24T00:34:28 < zyp> that resulting on the channel frequency being 400 kHz off from where it was supposed to be, on a 1 MHz channel width, at 2.4GHz
2019-02-24T00:34:35 < zyp> IIRC 2466 MHz
2019-02-24T00:34:48 < kakimir> https://www.nxp.com/docs/en/data-sheet/LPC15XX.pdf page 89
2019-02-24T00:35:13 < zyp> that means the frequency was about 0.016% off from what it was supposed to be
2019-02-24T00:35:22 < rajkosto> ok so since my crystal is 12pf i should use 20pf same as ST does and remove the resistor
2019-02-24T00:35:31 < rajkosto> right now i have 22pf and the resistor is there
2019-02-24T00:36:10 < zyp> worse than the 30ppm rating of the crystal by almost an order of magnitude, but not enough to matter much for any other project
2019-02-24T00:37:34 < zyp> on a typical MCU project, the worst thing you'll get from bad crystal loading is probably larger time drift than expected if you try running the rtc :p
2019-02-24T00:38:12 < zyp> and the resistors are just bullshit, you're not designing anything where those will matter
2019-02-24T00:38:18 < rajkosto> ST seems to use 20pf capacitors for both a 16pf and a 12pf crystal
2019-02-24T00:38:37 < rajkosto> zyp, some MCUs will not run if the resistor is missing
2019-02-24T00:38:41 < rajkosto> they require something
2019-02-24T00:39:01 < zyp> I don't really believe you
2019-02-24T00:39:26 < zyp> but what do I know about weird oscillator design :)
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2019-02-24T00:41:01 < zyp> it's not a big deal anyway
2019-02-24T00:41:17 < bertrik> something is seriously messed up with the platformio ststm32 toolchain again ... :(
2019-02-24T00:41:17 < rajkosto> what about the RTC crystal
2019-02-24T00:41:29 < rajkosto> st uses way different caps for that one
2019-02-24T00:41:30 < zyp> worst thing that can happen if you fuck up oscillator capacitance is some confusing debugging, and then having to add some more capacitance
2019-02-24T00:41:32 < rajkosto> i just used same across all
2019-02-24T00:41:59 < zyp> the rules are the same, but C_L might be different
2019-02-24T00:44:01 < rajkosto> and sometimes they include SERIES resistors going to the capacitor pins
2019-02-24T00:44:10 < rajkosto> ive never seen a case where that would be necessary
2019-02-24T00:44:19 < zyp> did you see the link I posted?
2019-02-24T00:46:18 < rajkosto> oh my RTC xtal is 12.5pF load capacitance
2019-02-24T00:46:25 < rajkosto> so 20pf is good for all of them just like i used
2019-02-24T00:46:40 < zyp> yeah, that should be fine
2019-02-24T00:46:57 < rajkosto> well 22p
2019-02-24T00:49:10 < rajkosto> "1M parallel shit" thanks dongs
2019-02-24T00:49:46 < rajkosto> but according to that rule of thumb
2019-02-24T00:49:54 < rajkosto> my C1 and C2 should be 12pf ?
2019-02-24T00:50:09 < zyp> sure, if your C_L is like 7 pF
2019-02-24T00:50:39 < rajkosto> see thats confusing, the guides tell you to calculate total capacitance, and then you add half each pin
2019-02-24T00:50:57 < zyp> the guides are overcomplicating everything
2019-02-24T00:51:24 < rajkosto> the zyp snip just says "C1 and C2" not C1 == C2 == 2*Cl
2019-02-24T00:52:12 < zyp> you can get into a bunch of math to add together different values for C1 and C2 and shit, but it's pointless, just set C1 = C2 = slightly less than 2*C_L
2019-02-24T00:53:07 < zyp> if I meant C1 + C2 I would have written that
2019-02-24T00:53:43 < rajkosto> but muh 1M resistor
2019-02-24T01:01:56 < rajkosto> yeah get rid of it, it doesnt do anything good if the manufacturer doesnt say its required
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2019-02-24T02:08:26 < Cracki> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0Evvm7VsAEadyS.jpg:orig
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2019-02-24T02:23:26 < oz4ga> https://twitter.com/Claudia_Jones/status/1093509939971133441
2019-02-24T02:30:15 < Cracki> kurwa
2019-02-24T02:31:11 < Cracki> https://cdn.funpic.us/kurwa-54-223011.jpg
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2019-02-24T05:58:36 < cdnChrisDvo_> greeting everyone.
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2019-02-24T06:00:16 < cdnChrisDvo> oops, I double instanc'd myself.
2019-02-24T06:02:44 < cdnChrisDvo> any eclipse guru's here ?  I would like to use the J-Link debugging Eclipse plug-in (for SWO output), but I'm using the AC6/SW4STM Eclipse package.  I cannot see how/where to activate this plug-in.  Must I switch to Eclipse-MCU or is there a way to "manually" add / activate this thing ?
2019-02-24T06:10:37 < cdnChrisDvo> I guess the easiest is to ditch AC6 and go with GNU MCU Eclipse, as this appears to have it ... gawd there seems to be a helluva lot of eclipse variants, what a mess.
2019-02-24T06:14:47 < Cracki> it's like linux. everyone does his own shit and gives it a name.
2019-02-24T06:15:04 < Cracki> underneath it's mostly standard components and configuration
2019-02-24T06:19:15 < cdnChrisDvo> my only need right now is the SWO Viewer (I don't care if that's integrated with eclipse or not) -- but I've found nothing outside of J-Link plug-in w/ Eclipse MCU or a separate windows app ... 
2019-02-24T06:19:25 < cdnChrisDvo> do you know of any linux utility to view SWO output ?
2019-02-24T06:19:27 < jadew> and to keep the analogy going, most of it sucks
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2019-02-24T06:48:01 < cdnChrisDvo> okay, so -- turns out you can select ONLY the jlink stuff from MCU and it appears to work with AC6 ... another problem solved
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2019-02-24T07:46:41 < dongs> wat
2019-02-24T07:46:44 < dongs> > ac6
2019-02-24T07:46:56 < dongs> > lunix utility
2019-02-24T07:46:56 < dongs> haha
2019-02-24T07:47:03 < dongs> why are you using pro tools on luniux
2019-02-24T07:51:23 < rajkosto> linux for battle royal when
2019-02-24T08:32:20 < cdnChrisDvo> sometimes I wish I had an extra box running windows ... some things are just retardedly difficult with linux.  I would love to download / install and have something "just work" sigh
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2019-02-24T08:46:33 < Cracki> virtual machine perhaps
2019-02-24T08:47:39 < Cracki> windows only gives you a different tradeoff. way more uniform system, but no package managers,...
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2019-02-24T08:49:23 < Cracki> I find msys2 quite nice tho, except for them using pacman, which has such a retarded command switch "syntax". reminds me of vim users... all of them can go to hell.
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2019-02-24T08:50:44 < cdnChrisDvo> well... in the end you *can* make everything work with linux of course... I'm still salty it took as much time and effort as it did.  Basically, I can code now for this little stm32 board.
2019-02-24T08:52:17 < rajkosto> msys2 is actually so much better than wsl for that use case
2019-02-24T08:52:23 < rajkosto> for other use cases you need full linux in a vm so whatever
2019-02-24T08:52:35 < rajkosto> the pacman in msys2 works really well too
2019-02-24T08:53:08 < rajkosto> as for windows not having a package manager, thats kindof a blessing, as you dont have package dependency hell if you want to install something and it doesnt try to upgrade some lib that 70% of your other packages depend on
2019-02-24T08:54:35 < rajkosto> (basically, if you want a newer version of some software, better go through a distribution upgrade, boyo)
2019-02-24T08:55:34 < rajkosto> (that will likely make your system unbootable after the reboot)
2019-02-24T08:57:53 < rajkosto> obviously every piece of software should run in a docker container each with its own package manager and fullfilled dependencies ;)
2019-02-24T08:59:39 < cdnChrisDvo> yup! bandwidth and disk space are not issues anymore.  Every "program" should be a giant ball of everything it needs.  Like to see some 700MB exe's :)
2019-02-24T09:00:04 < rajkosto> and they are all sandboxed for your own protection
2019-02-24T09:00:10 < rajkosto> so nothing can interact with anything on your workstation
2019-02-24T09:00:12 < rajkosto> great for your workflow
2019-02-24T09:04:57 < Cracki> microsoft seems to have solved the dependency hell... windows can just keep around all versions of a DLL so whatever program gets whatever api
2019-02-24T09:05:19 < Cracki> at least for their own shit... and not even then it always works
2019-02-24T09:05:44 < rajkosto> ugh, manifest files
2019-02-24T09:06:11 < Cracki> keeping different *package* versions around and making sure a dependency sees the right one... shouldn't (hah!) be that hard
2019-02-24T09:06:22 < rajkosto> and an absolutely massive winsxs folder
2019-02-24T09:06:35 < Cracki> things such as "search paths" need an upgrade
2019-02-24T09:06:45 < rajkosto> most package managers arent that smart
2019-02-24T09:06:49 < rajkosto> they just unpack a tar file
2019-02-24T09:07:03 < rajkosto> and you can get them stuck really easily, borking your entire system
2019-02-24T09:07:33 < rajkosto> also any "default" package manager in windows -> hordes of neckbeards screaming MONOPOLY
2019-02-24T09:07:36 < Cracki> on windows, you have to get every directory containing DLLs into %PATH%, or the depending program itself knows where to look, or -- as everyone seems to do it with Qt -- just bundle a jiggabyte of dlls
2019-02-24T09:07:45 < Cracki> software needs to evolve
2019-02-24T09:07:53 < rajkosto> you can staically link to Qt if you have the licence for it
2019-02-24T09:08:02 < rajkosto> thats why everyone gorillion dlls
2019-02-24T09:08:02 < Cracki> it won't as long as we still think of software as text files
2019-02-24T09:08:05 < rajkosto> no licence
2019-02-24T09:08:15 < Cracki> static linkage is just as retarded
2019-02-24T09:08:28 < Cracki> who wants to have dozens of copies of Qt on their disk?
2019-02-24T09:08:53 < rajkosto> its actually not a full copy
2019-02-24T09:08:57 < rajkosto> especially with lto
2019-02-24T09:08:57 < Cracki> if a program depends on say qt 5.6, then I want to install that once, and the program is supposed to find 5.6.x and use it
2019-02-24T09:09:08 < Cracki> you're missing the point
2019-02-24T09:09:18 < rajkosto> a statically linked qt exe is only like 3-10MB vs the gorillion dlls being 100s
2019-02-24T09:09:41 < rajkosto> also, you can solve the gorillion dlls issue by having deduplication at the file system level ;)
2019-02-24T09:09:41 < cdnChrisDvo> Cracki - I actually feel the opposite ... why do I care how many copies of a given .so or .dll are on my disk ?  As long as shit works.
2019-02-24T09:09:51 < Cracki> MSVCRT, all its versions, are just installed on a windows and whoever needs it, will find it
2019-02-24T09:09:56 < Cracki> qt needs to do the same
2019-02-24T09:10:09 < rajkosto> they actually dropped WinSxS for msvcrt beginning with vs2015
2019-02-24T09:10:13 < rajkosto> its just vcruntime now
2019-02-24T09:10:16 < rajkosto> forever backwards compatible
2019-02-24T09:10:47 < rajkosto> im sure that wont bite them in the ass
2019-02-24T09:10:50 < Cracki> just nuke this planet and start from scratch
2019-02-24T09:11:23 < rajkosto> (they seem to have made vcruntime just a minimal C interface and most things they'd want to change are inline/statically linked)
2019-02-24T09:11:28 < Cracki> the "forever compatible" part? the whole company was founded on compatibility
2019-02-24T09:12:23 < rajkosto> kinda dropped with win10
2019-02-24T09:12:33 < rajkosto> they wanna be hip like macOS and break as many things every point release
2019-02-24T09:13:11 < Cracki> yeh, when they have executed the ones responsible for THAT shitfest, I'll take a look at w10
2019-02-24T09:13:34 < Cracki> srsly, harakiri needs to be imported into murican corporate culture
2019-02-24T09:14:42 < Cracki> maybe they pissed off and fired all the gray beards who know how shit works, and now the web hipsters run the place
2019-02-24T09:14:51 < rajkosto> yes obviously
2019-02-24T09:15:00 < rajkosto> with nutella at the helm, who ran nokia to the ground
2019-02-24T09:15:14 < Cracki> very likely, considering how they bought github, push their electron-based editor, submit to the Diversity Industry racket
2019-02-24T09:15:49 < Cracki> is nutella an euphemism for something?
2019-02-24T09:15:57 < rajkosto> satya nadella
2019-02-24T09:16:25 < Cracki> ah, fecal language
2019-02-24T09:16:48 < Cracki> lolwat he killed nokia?
2019-02-24T09:16:55 < Cracki> how the hell does he still find jobs?
2019-02-24T09:17:07 < rajkosto> cuz such things dont matter for CEOs
2019-02-24T09:17:15 < Cracki> nope, no mention of nokia on his wikipedia site
2019-02-24T09:18:21 < Cracki> ah, chair throwing monkey wanted to buy nokia, and nutella kept him from doing it?
2019-02-24T09:18:38 < Cracki> oh, tried to, w/e
2019-02-24T09:18:55 < rajkosto> is this a fuckin berenstein bears situation
2019-02-24T09:19:15 < Cracki> do not mention -stein in my presence
2019-02-24T09:19:37 < rajkosto> i was sure he was ceo of nokia before the acquisition
2019-02-24T09:19:49 < Cracki> I'm sure it's a huge clusterfuck and they all jerk each other off and pat each other's asses
2019-02-24T09:21:41 < Cracki> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Mobile#2011%E2%80%932013:_Partnership_between_Microsoft_and_Nokia
2019-02-24T09:22:05 < Cracki> so... 2014-2017, they bought it to kill it
2019-02-24T09:22:24 < Cracki> fucking morons
2019-02-24T09:22:50 < rajkosto> just like google
2019-02-24T09:22:53 < Cracki> (1) nokia was dead way before that (2) you buy your competition, not the thing you hope to remain relevant with
2019-02-24T09:23:04 < Cracki> *buy and bury
2019-02-24T09:23:22 < rajkosto> https://killedbygoogle.com/
2019-02-24T09:23:31 < Cracki> they're like children with toys. they must have it, and when they have it, they smash it
2019-02-24T09:25:58 < Cracki> basically they bought some executives
2019-02-24T09:26:08 < Cracki> >a number of Nokia executives joined Microsoft: Stephen Elop became the head of Microsoft's devices team (which oversees products such as Xbox and Surface); Risto Siilasmaa replaced Elop as interim CEO, before the appointment of Rajeev Suri
2019-02-24T09:26:22 < Cracki> >major round of layoffs, totaling over 18,000
2019-02-24T09:26:32 < Cracki> (at microsoft)
2019-02-24T09:27:48 < Cracki> oh, TIL, nokias made windows mobile phones, held 90% market share!
2019-02-24T09:29:18 < Cracki> I wish everyone would stop reinventing the wheel every few years. the attrition!
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2019-02-24T13:18:38 < englishman> https://shanghai.ist/2019/02/23/yet-another-passenger-tries-to-throw-coins-into-planes-engine-to-pray-for-a-safe-flight/
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2019-02-24T14:08:27 < cdnChrisDvo> lol, what a moron
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2019-02-24T14:18:59 < rajkosto> > not the first time
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2019-02-24T16:16:22 < catphish> anyone fancy designing and prototyping my sound card for me in its entirety for free?
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2019-02-24T16:19:22 < dongs> my minimum charge to doubleclick altium.exe is $500
2019-02-24T16:19:28 < dongs> we can negotiate up from there
2019-02-24T16:19:35 < dongs> but soundcard? in 2019?
2019-02-24T16:19:37 < dongs> what the shit are you on
2019-02-24T16:19:50 < mtbg> hi
2019-02-24T16:22:26 < catphish> dongs: by sound hard i mean 12DAC+8ADC 24 bit USB2 professional audio interface
2019-02-24T16:22:53 < dongs> cant you just buy some shit from MOTU or somethign
2019-02-24T16:23:00 < catphish> off the shelf ones are expensive so i thought i'd have a play :)
2019-02-24T16:23:02 < dongs> or are you that much of a jew
2019-02-24T16:23:08 < catphish> jew.
2019-02-24T16:24:03 < catphish> interestingly i never came across MOTU when i was looking
2019-02-24T16:25:06 < catphish> motu 8M is exactly what i want, but i bet it costs all the money
2019-02-24T16:25:44 < dongs> $1500 MSRP
2019-02-24T16:26:12 < dongs> defintiely cheaper than what it would cost you to hire emeb to make you one
2019-02-24T16:26:27 < dongs> i mean my enclosure place would want close to that amount for a one-off rackmount enclosure..
2019-02-24T16:26:37 < dongs> with front panel milling/stencil and shit
2019-02-24T16:27:53 < catphish> i'll level with you, behringer sell one for $200 http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Behringer/Computer-Audio/Interfaces/UMC1820/p/P0B2J
2019-02-24T16:28:09 < dongs> ya ther you go
2019-02-24T16:28:12 < catphish> but that doesn't stop me wanting to build one :)
2019-02-24T16:34:28 < kakimir> are you planning to do audiostuff catphish 
2019-02-24T16:34:37 < kakimir> like business
2019-02-24T16:34:57 < catphish> kakimir: i'm doing some hobby audio stuff at the moment
2019-02-24T16:35:15 < catphish> but realised the hardware is expensive and might be an interesting business activity
2019-02-24T16:35:50 < kakimir> what type of audio stuff?
2019-02-24T16:36:01 < kakimir> soundcards?
2019-02-24T16:36:26 < catphish> well pro sound cards, which are called audio interfaces instead for some reason
2019-02-24T16:37:26 < catphish> with that said, right now, i seem to be struggling to play an F chord on my guitar, so not yet a pro
2019-02-24T16:37:55 < Steffanx> Should try a keytar instead
2019-02-24T16:40:20 < kakimir> then you need ASIO
2019-02-24T16:40:51 < kakimir> hey catphish
2019-02-24T16:41:10 < catphish> ahoy
2019-02-24T16:41:10 < kakimir> quality sound bluetooth soundcard with integrated battery
2019-02-24T16:41:20 < catphish> bluewhatno
2019-02-24T16:41:44 < Steffanx> audiphools dont want bluetooth anyway.
2019-02-24T16:42:03 < kakimir> I have nice headphones and nice DAC
2019-02-24T16:42:15 < kakimir> but the cable is only 5meters or so
2019-02-24T16:42:21 < Steffanx> and you get your sound from youtube right?
2019-02-24T16:42:28 < kakimir> hmm..
2019-02-24T16:42:28 < Steffanx> or mp3
2019-02-24T16:42:33 < kakimir> only tubes
2019-02-24T16:42:37 < qyx> haha
2019-02-24T16:42:38 < Steffanx> > audioguys will laugh at you
2019-02-24T16:42:38 < kakimir> *tubes
2019-02-24T16:45:03 < kakimir> I have some flacs of music that I don't listen
2019-02-24T16:49:12 < catphish> the main concern of the pro audio thingy is synchronization and latency
2019-02-24T16:49:26 < catphish> you want your inuts in sync, and your outputs not far behind
2019-02-24T16:49:47 < catphish> so comrade bluetooth is off the table
2019-02-24T16:50:16 < catphish> well i'll build it and i'll see what happens
2019-02-24T16:50:16 < dongs> inuits
2019-02-24T16:52:50 < Steffanx> Yupik.
2019-02-24T16:53:02 < catphish> haa
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2019-02-24T17:52:22 < catphish> wow, the STM32 SAI is powerful, looks one SAI block can handle all 16 of my channels
2019-02-24T17:52:52 < invzim> https://www.st.com/resource/en/data_brief/stm32mp157a-dk1.pdf
2019-02-24T17:53:00 < dongs> old
2019-02-24T17:53:08 < invzim> may have to pick up one of these when they're out
2019-02-24T17:53:35 < catphish> each block has 2 audio data lines, each of which can handle 256 bits x 192ksps (ie 8 x 32 bit channels)
2019-02-24T17:54:19 < catphish> wow, an stm32 A7, that's some nice toy right there
2019-02-24T17:54:43 < dongs> im willing to bet its a multi-die shit
2019-02-24T17:54:51 < dongs> with some F4 bonded together with a random A7 core
2019-02-24T17:55:00 < Steffanx> DB3801 - Rev 1 - February 2019, yeah old.
2019-02-24T17:55:39 < catphish> dongs: well i bet it's not and they integrated the IP properly
2019-02-24T17:56:03 < dongs> i doubt it
2019-02-24T17:56:06 < dongs> or else why would tehre be a F4
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2019-02-24T17:59:07 < catphish> why the fuck didn't this exist a couple of months ago when i spent weeks bitching about there being no affordable properly documented SoCs
2019-02-24T17:59:22 < catphish> on a relatd topic, how much does this beast cost?
2019-02-24T18:01:32 < catphish> ah due in april
2019-02-24T18:02:41 < Steffanx> Get it for free by visiting one of STs workshops
2019-02-24T18:05:14 < catphish> sounds complicated
2019-02-24T18:06:48 < Steffanx> yes
2019-02-24T18:07:55 < invzim> this may just be the excuse to learn DDR routing
2019-02-24T18:10:27 < Steffanx> or not.
2019-02-24T18:10:41 < Steffanx> its not the first A7.
2019-02-24T18:18:25 < Steffanx> oh the RM is actually available and only 4k pages.
2019-02-24T18:19:43 < mawk> you can read it all before lunch
2019-02-24T18:20:10 < Steffanx> Not if your connection is very slow. its 80megabytes.
2019-02-24T18:20:31 < Steffanx> unless you mean lunch.. next year somewhere
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2019-02-24T20:50:51 < arc_phasor> trueSTUDIO is fkn brutal.
2019-02-24T20:53:11 < Cracki> do tell
2019-02-24T20:53:15 < Cracki> haven't touched it yet
2019-02-24T20:53:30 < arc_phasor> where do i begin
2019-02-24T20:53:43 < R2COM> is it eclipse based too?\
2019-02-24T20:53:47 < arc_phasor> yes
2019-02-24T20:54:32 < arc_phasor> Firstly, the cube example projects don't have trueSTUDIO projects yet, and none of them convert cleanly where you can just compile and go
2019-02-24T20:55:44 < arc_phasor> there is like 5 built-in formatters, all crap. 90% of my time has been wrestling with brackets and indentations that happen when i don't want them to
2019-02-24T20:56:42 < rajkosto> do they even let you use the thing that is actually their main feature (real tiem variables, graphs, etc) in the free version
2019-02-24T20:57:29 < arc_phasor> and a bunch of other stuff is just harder than it needs to be. I guess that's because eclipse is used for all sorts of crap
2019-02-24T20:57:30 < rajkosto> the proprietary project format ruined it for me too, also > using cube
2019-02-24T20:58:17 < arc_phasor> rajkosto: what do you use?
2019-02-24T20:58:31 < rajkosto> gcc arm mcu eclipse or visualgdb
2019-02-24T20:58:41 < rajkosto> if going eclipse might as well just go as standard as possible
2019-02-24T20:59:08 < arc_phasor> i did that for my last project, it was a total PITA to setup but was real clean
2019-02-24T20:59:21 < rajkosto> their sample projects are decent, dont use cube generated shit
2019-02-24T20:59:38 < arc_phasor> i have to for now, since i'm still trying to decide on chip
2019-02-24T21:00:03 < rajkosto> pin planning is only acceptable use of cubve
2019-02-24T21:00:03 < arc_phasor> *should* make things super easy if I need to switch to another chip
2019-02-24T21:00:28 < arc_phasor> yea it really is awesome. i wish TI had something like that for msp430
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2019-02-24T21:02:41 < Steffanx> msp430 please :P
2019-02-24T21:03:00 < arc_phasor> ?
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2019-02-24T21:03:35 < Steffanx> i never used it myself, but ask englishman about it :P
2019-02-24T21:03:45 < arc_phasor> fill me in
2019-02-24T21:04:01 < arc_phasor> englishman: ^
2019-02-24T21:05:53 < Steffanx> "there is like 5 built-in formatters, all crap. 90% of my time has been wrestling with brackets and indentations that happen when i don't want them to" > Chaning to "eclipse" wont solve that issue.
2019-02-24T21:06:24 < Steffanx> I wonder what your code style looks like that it doesnt fit in any of the standard ones.
2019-02-24T21:06:47 < Steffanx> or isnt easily solved.
2019-02-24T21:07:41 < rajkosto> the formatters are an eclipse feature
2019-02-24T21:07:43 < rajkosto> and you can turn them off
2019-02-24T21:08:02 < arc_phasor> Steffanx: i'm not doing anything crazy, MISRA-C
2019-02-24T21:08:02 < rajkosto> or customize
2019-02-24T21:09:14 < arc_phasor> every formatter i was using indented the new line curly brace below a function declaration or if/else, super weird
2019-02-24T21:09:18 < Steffanx> No TrueStudio examples isnt TS's fault :P
2019-02-24T21:10:32 < R2COM> rajkosto which visualgdb package did ytou buy? custom or embedded
2019-02-24T21:10:56 < Steffanx> Did rajkosto even pay for visualgdb?
2019-02-24T21:11:04 < rajkosto> fully custom, hand painted, han solo, star wars figurines
2019-02-24T21:11:07 < rajkosto> Steffanx, did you
2019-02-24T21:11:18 < Steffanx> Nope, since i dont use it  ;)
2019-02-24T21:11:27 < rajkosto> embedded is fine
2019-02-24T21:11:39 < R2COM> custom has neat feature of time measuring and couple other things
2019-02-24T21:11:47 < R2COM> its just $189 ill get that one i guess
2019-02-24T21:12:00 < rajkosto> company pays for it anyway
2019-02-24T21:12:19 < Steffanx> "Advanced Arduino Project Subsystem" Help
2019-02-24T21:12:50 < Steffanx> Although arduino users would benifit from it as well, so perhaps its a good thing.
2019-02-24T21:13:11 < rajkosto> not only do i have visualgdb Steffanx, i also have a fully legitimate vs 2017 ultimate licence
2019-02-24T21:13:31 < Steffanx> Good good. 
2019-02-24T21:13:35 < rajkosto> in comparison visualgdb is peanuts
2019-02-24T21:13:50 < rajkosto> but i use vs2017 like all the time
2019-02-24T21:13:59 < Steffanx> Do you make that much that the community edition no longer fits?
2019-02-24T21:14:07 < R2COM> Atmel has IDE for their micros based on VS
2019-02-24T21:14:31 < rajkosto> Steffanx, company just gave everyone licence
2019-02-24T21:14:36 < Steffanx> Atmel also has Atmel Start. Which is even worse than the cube stuff because its fucking online.
2019-02-24T21:14:39 < Steffanx> ONLINE.
2019-02-24T21:14:45 < rajkosto> arm MBED
2019-02-24T21:15:05 < R2COM> i never feel i need cube, all i need is a set of example templates for main IDE
2019-02-24T21:15:10 < R2COM> and im done, i can start from there
2019-02-24T21:15:14 < Steffanx> True
2019-02-24T21:15:21 < rajkosto> you get that with both eclipse and visualgdb and they work well
2019-02-24T21:15:27 < R2COM> i know
2019-02-24T21:15:29 < R2COM> yes
2019-02-24T21:15:45 < Steffanx> but why would you use both?
2019-02-24T21:15:55 < rajkosto> i tried both
2019-02-24T21:15:59 < Steffanx> ah
2019-02-24T21:16:01 < R2COM> i guess i wont use eclipse anymore
2019-02-24T21:16:07 < Steffanx> And sticked with visualgdb?
2019-02-24T21:16:07 < R2COM> visualgdb seems much less clunky
2019-02-24T21:16:21 < rajkosto> and cant be bothered porting older projects from eclipse to visualgdb you need to change stuff regarding semihosting
2019-02-24T21:16:23 < R2COM> especially when you move to debug, all stuff happens in fraction of seconds
2019-02-24T21:16:29 < R2COM> loading, transfer, stepping etc
2019-02-24T21:16:38 < R2COM> in eclise sometimes i get weird freezes
2019-02-24T21:16:41 < R2COM> and have to restart
2019-02-24T21:16:44 < rajkosto> main feature: dont have to click stop before you click reload
2019-02-24T21:16:48 < rajkosto> in eclipse you do
2019-02-24T21:16:59 < R2COM> i think yea
2019-02-24T21:17:01 < rajkosto> or you get healpful modal dialog "DEBUG ALREADY RUNNING"
2019-02-24T21:17:14 < R2COM> in eclipse i do that, and also "cleanup"
2019-02-24T21:17:18 < R2COM> before next debug
2019-02-24T21:17:24 < rajkosto> dont need cleanup
2019-02-24T21:17:32 < R2COM> cuz if i dont do it, sometimes i get weird stuff happening
2019-02-24T21:17:50 < R2COM> by eclipse i mean stm32strudio
2019-02-24T21:18:21 < Steffanx> sounds like that awful "where do i even find the download link" thingy
2019-02-24T21:19:20 < R2COM> anyway its in the past im not going back to those tools anymore i guess
2019-02-24T21:19:45 < Steffanx> but keil.. no keil?
2019-02-24T21:19:55 < rajkosto> keil is only for super pros
2019-02-24T21:20:03 < rajkosto> the kind of pros that would still use msvc++ 6.0 for windows development
2019-02-24T21:20:24 < rajkosto> anyway with keil you get totally locked into their compiler, libraries, etc
2019-02-24T21:20:42 < rajkosto> and the compiler kinda doesnt support anything modern
2019-02-24T21:20:59 < R2COM> c++ related?
2019-02-24T21:21:33 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-24T21:22:13 < rajkosto> i had to use like... uVIsion 5 for some 8051 project
2019-02-24T21:22:18 < rajkosto> because the libs from the vendor were only in keil format
2019-02-24T21:22:20 < rajkosto> and no source
2019-02-24T21:22:27 < rajkosto> and that was sucky
2019-02-24T21:40:40 < arc_phasor> i'm still wondering why msp430 is a joke
2019-02-24T21:52:06 < Steffanx> because its not stm32 and this is ##stm32 :P
2019-02-24T21:52:59 < Cracki> well, lack of a multiply instruction for one
2019-02-24T21:53:43 < malinus> arc_phasor: 1) not ARM 2) 16-bit in 3) price 4) did I mention not masterrace cortex-m?
2019-02-24T21:53:48 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/top/3010494
2019-02-24T21:54:02 < Cracki> it has a multiplier peripheral you use via registers, so it's not *that* bad... but bad is that you can't save/restore those registers, so that means if you use an RTOS (or interrupts in general?) you have to disable interrupts
2019-02-24T21:54:27 < Steffanx> really?
2019-02-24T21:54:34 < Steffanx> damn
2019-02-24T21:55:00 < malinus> haha
2019-02-24T21:55:46 < arc_phasor> but that FRAM tho, amiright?
2019-02-24T21:55:49 < Cracki> yeh, it's ridiculous. a few days/weeks ago we had this discussion and I think someone mentioned this. I only had the datashit on screen
2019-02-24T21:55:54 < Cracki> muh fram
2019-02-24T21:56:42 < arc_phasor> i don't really see any competition in that space, virtually unlimited writes, ultra low power.
2019-02-24T21:57:27 < Cracki> if you need unlimited writes AND retention without battery...
2019-02-24T21:57:43 < arc_phasor> msp430 has FRAM, stm32 has an obviously insane software team, nordic has PPI
2019-02-24T21:58:06 < Steffanx> They bought TrueStudio..
2019-02-24T21:58:06 < Cracki> just get a discrete fram chip with your mcu of choice
2019-02-24T21:58:18 < arc_phasor> Steffanx: so we can blame them for everything :P
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2019-02-24T21:58:34 < Steffanx> ST seems to like buying things lately
2019-02-24T21:58:48 < Steffanx> buy commercial stuff to make it free for ST stuff only.
2019-02-24T21:58:49 < arc_phasor> Cracki: true, that's something to consider
2019-02-24T21:59:06 < Cracki> not bad not bad, I find fram chips with megabits at least on rs-online (first hit)
2019-02-24T21:59:32 < arc_phasor> i wish stm32 had something close to nordic's PPI though, that thing freakin rocks
2019-02-24T21:59:58 < Steffanx> You're taking about this ultra flexible peripheral stuff?
2019-02-24T22:00:08 < Cracki> Programmable Peripheral Interconnect eh? http://infocenter.nordicsemi.com/index.jsp?topic=%2Fcom.nordic.infocenter.nrf52832.ps.v1.1%2Fppi.html
2019-02-24T22:00:16 < arc_phasor> yes, i was able to write 2 automotive comm networks 
2019-02-24T22:00:30 < arc_phasor> on one chip, without the cpu core being active
2019-02-24T22:00:48 < arc_phasor> nrf52 that is
2019-02-24T22:00:53 < Steffanx> I hate their documentation websites though. When i look for something i always endup in some endless loop of links
2019-02-24T22:01:16 < Cracki> event systems are nice, aye
2019-02-24T22:01:35 < Steffanx> and a pain to debug sometimes
2019-02-24T22:02:09 < arc_phasor> larger init sequences, basically wire everything up, and then hit go
2019-02-24T22:02:28 < arc_phasor> i didn't find debugging more difficult, imo
2019-02-24T22:03:03 < Cracki> how is that stuff debugged anyway? what insight can you have into it?
2019-02-24T22:03:32 < Steffanx> "it does not work" > let's tweak the config until it does.
2019-02-24T22:03:37 < Cracki> or is it a kind of black box where you can only observe inputs and outputs and you have to test all that carefully?
2019-02-24T22:03:58 < arc_phasor> it's been a couple years... i'm trying to remember
2019-02-24T22:04:52 < rajkosto> i need to resume working on this firmware instead of fucking around
2019-02-24T22:05:00 < arc_phasor> you get the ability to debug and check out register obviously,
2019-02-24T22:05:02 < Cracki> and I'm trying to remember if I have zip ties... need to tie a breadboard to some two-motor frame to make a balancing thingy :P
2019-02-24T22:05:13 < rajkosto> how do i stop procrastinatin
2019-02-24T22:05:21 < Cracki> find something else to avoid
2019-02-24T22:05:36 < Steffanx> pull your ethernet cable, rajkosto
2019-02-24T22:05:51 < rajkosto> I NEED IT TO USE ONLINE CUBE/MBED ;)
2019-02-24T22:06:12 < Cracki> I guess watching registers for (re)action would be good enough
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2019-02-24T22:09:12 < arc_phasor> let me put it this way, with very little mcu firmware experience, i wired up the PPI to communicate over a CAN network and an older protocol J17xx network
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2019-02-24T22:09:50 < arc_phasor> but i can't recall the trials and tribulations at the moment :/
2019-02-24T22:10:32 < Cracki> the promise is good enough :P
2019-02-24T22:10:51 < rajkosto> is PPI whhat that weird i2s guy wants
2019-02-24T22:11:07 < arc_phasor> it's patented by Nordic, real bummer
2019-02-24T22:11:10 < Cracki> what did communication involve? moving data between bus types like a switch/router?
2019-02-24T22:11:59 < Cracki> the simplest "event" i can imagine would be a simple pulse with no other info attached
2019-02-24T22:12:02 < arc_phasor> basically what would be bitbanging with the cpu to get proper latch signals and what not, i was able to setup the bit banging to happen automatically by wiring timer captures to different GPIOs and what not, through the PPI
2019-02-24T22:12:11 < Cracki> heh
2019-02-24T22:12:21 < Cracki> sounds like it has some DMA flavor to it
2019-02-24T22:12:26 < arc_phasor> absolutely
2019-02-24T22:13:10 < arc_phasor> into the DMA for reading messages off the bus, out of the DMA for sending
2019-02-24T22:13:40 < arc_phasor> so the DMA would send an event when it had more data, and start kicking things off on the PPI event bus
2019-02-24T22:15:09 < arc_phasor> it sounds complicated, but for some reason it just clicked. i was actually a bit disappointed realizing it wasn't like an "ARM" thing, i'm still learning if the stm32 has something comparable
2019-02-24T22:16:04 < arc_phasor> and if you don't get stuck in the endless loop of nordic docs, with versions linking to older versions that link back, it's not too bad
2019-02-24T22:16:56 < Cracki> hehe
2019-02-24T22:16:57 < arc_phasor> englishman: if you get back, i'd love to hear your thoughts on the msp430 :P
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2019-02-24T23:41:38 < englishman> hi
2019-02-24T23:42:33 < englishman> sorry we dont talk about garbage mcus in this fine channel
2019-02-24T23:46:54 < rajkosto> why do these pre-crimped jst cables from china smell weird/bad
2019-02-24T23:47:04 < rajkosto> like those intentionally-terrible flavoured jellybeans
2019-02-24T23:50:55 < arc_phasor> englishman: what makes them garbage?
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2019-02-24T23:59:00 < malinus> arc_phasor: nxp puts their extendedDMA in some of the chips. Neat stuff with more advanced feautres like scatter/gather and such.
--- Day changed Mon Feb 25 2019
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2019-02-25T00:54:24 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-24_23-54-12_ejElfEZAT.jpg long cables dont matter, 66MHz spi still works
2019-02-25T00:56:00 < qyx> whats that library
2019-02-25T00:56:13 < rajkosto> littelvgl
2019-02-25T00:56:19 < rajkosto> lvgl*
2019-02-25T00:56:47 < rajkosto> 30cm funky smelling wires
2019-02-25T00:57:32 < zyp> when you said long, I thought you were talking about meters, not 30cm
2019-02-25T00:57:58 < rajkosto> how long is long
2019-02-25T00:58:03 < rajkosto> ill probably double their length
2019-02-25T00:58:15 < qyx> you'll probably fail sool
2019-02-25T00:58:17 < qyx> soon
2019-02-25T00:59:54 < qyx> go to ~75cm and all your FM receiving neighbors will hear you
2019-02-25T01:00:00 < zyp> at 66 mhz, a bit is around 4.5 meters long
2019-02-25T01:00:38 < qyx> actually 4.5/4 will make a nice antenna
2019-02-25T01:02:04 < zyp> I figure you'd start running into problems a bit over 1m, due to skew between SCK and MISO at the master end
2019-02-25T01:02:21 < zyp> 1m cable is 2m round trip, and then you're approaching the distance between the edges
2019-02-25T01:03:21 < qyx> hes only writing at 66MHz
2019-02-25T01:03:26 < qyx> reading doesn't work
2019-02-25T01:03:32 < rajkosto> zyp, i only said long cables because
2019-02-25T01:03:33 < qyx> iirc
2019-02-25T01:03:34 < rajkosto> Feb 11 14:51:35 <qyx>	then run your SPI LCD breakout multimegaherts fast and be surprised
2019-02-25T01:03:51 < zyp> hehe
2019-02-25T01:03:59 < rajkosto> he said that when i had 10cm cables
2019-02-25T01:05:36 < zyp> if it's unidirectional, cable length by itself doesn't matter, just the amount of noise they pick up
2019-02-25T01:05:44 < zyp> which also depends on the environment
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2019-02-25T02:03:59 < rajkosto> ah shit NOTHING sticks to this teflon wire
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2019-02-25T02:26:40 < Cracki> what did you expect
2019-02-25T02:27:21 < BrainDamage> they put teflon on pans so that food sticks better
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2019-02-25T02:37:04 < rajkosto> Cracki, teflon is the only wire thin enough to go where i need it to go
2019-02-25T02:37:10 < rajkosto> also doesnt melt, very nice
2019-02-25T02:37:13 < Cracki> indeed
2019-02-25T02:37:30 < rajkosto> its 0.8mm OD, the Silicone/PVC one is 1.2mm
2019-02-25T02:37:33 < rajkosto> too chonk
2019-02-25T02:37:43 < rajkosto> (both are 30AWG, same conductor count)
2019-02-25T02:42:51 < Cracki> the finer pitch ribbon cable should be 0.65 mm. maybe rip some of that up?
2019-02-25T02:43:02 < Cracki> 0.63*
2019-02-25T02:43:13 < rajkosto> it disintegrates
2019-02-25T02:43:19 < rajkosto> also inner conductor is smaller ?
2019-02-25T02:43:32 < Cracki> dunno, never seen wire smaller than awg30
2019-02-25T02:44:47 < Cracki> mouser shows me only 30 awg for 0.025"
2019-02-25T02:45:50 < Cracki> anyway, I guess teflon is stronger or isolates better so you can afford more copper for the same OD?
2019-02-25T02:49:21 < rajkosto> what can i use to stick
2019-02-25T02:49:23 < rajkosto> 2 part epoxy ?
2019-02-25T02:52:11 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-25_01-52-03_SPkV4JsSS.png
2019-02-25T02:59:52 < Cracki> "adhesives for ptfe"
2019-02-25T03:00:59 < Cracki> gluing to teflon seems to involve frightening chemicals such as tetrahydrofuran 
2019-02-25T03:01:45 < Cracki> hmhm https://www.permabond.com/materials_bonded/how-to-bond-ptfe/
2019-02-25T03:05:32 < rajkosto> specialized shit i cant just get at a hardware store
2019-02-25T03:08:27 < Cracki> someone showing up asking how to glue teflon, that should make their day
2019-02-25T03:09:07 < Cracki> how about you just envelop the wire with hot glue, or epoxy. it won't adhere, it will slip back and forth, but it'll stay inside the formed eye
2019-02-25T03:23:04 < rajkosto> i just need to make sure the wires dont move from their spot and maybe go over the leds
2019-02-25T03:24:42 < rajkosto> i might just keep it taped up like this
2019-02-25T03:32:18 < ds2> in a nutshell, how does one send output to SWO?
2019-02-25T03:32:50 < rajkosto> ITM
2019-02-25T03:32:59 < rajkosto> https://github.com/PetteriAimonen/STM32_Trace_Example/blob/master/trace_example.c
2019-02-25T03:33:02 < rajkosto> ignore the ETM part
2019-02-25T03:33:05 < rajkosto> you just need ITM 
2019-02-25T03:33:08 < ds2> no no
2019-02-25T03:33:19 < ds2> what do I need to do in the firmware side
2019-02-25T03:33:23 < rajkosto> thats the firmware side.
2019-02-25T03:33:35 < rajkosto> void ITM_Print(int port, const char *p) is in there
2019-02-25T03:33:37 < ds2> I thought the ETM/ITMs are invisible to the firmware?
2019-02-25T03:34:12 < rajkosto> then how would you send
2019-02-25T03:34:43 < ds2> yes, that's exactly the thing I am confused about
2019-02-25T03:35:10 < ds2> otherwise, how does one debug the debug fw :D
2019-02-25T03:35:11 < rajkosto> just linked you code that inits both etm and itm and shows you funcs for everything you can do with them
2019-02-25T03:35:26 < rajkosto> can skip all the etm stuff to just have output from itm
2019-02-25T03:35:30 < rajkosto> on swdo
2019-02-25T03:36:04 < ds2> it looks like only thing I need is ITM_print? or are there side effect inits in the ETM code?
2019-02-25T03:36:14 < rajkosto> theres a little bit of itm init code
2019-02-25T03:36:15 < rajkosto> read it
2019-02-25T03:36:17 < rajkosto> its commented.
2019-02-25T03:37:24 < ds2> it does look more complex then the SEGGER_printf stuff :D
2019-02-25T03:37:36 < rajkosto> its not
2019-02-25T03:37:42 < rajkosto> set a few bits then use ITM_printf
2019-02-25T03:37:50 < rajkosto> segger stuff works identically
2019-02-25T03:38:05 < ds2> does this code work for M0's? comments says for M3
2019-02-25T03:38:14 < rajkosto> m0 has no etm
2019-02-25T03:38:18 < rajkosto> should have itm tho
2019-02-25T03:38:33 < rajkosto> dunno look up code for the m0 then
2019-02-25T03:38:33 < ds2> and that itm is setup the same way?
2019-02-25T03:38:50 < ds2> I'll do that. thanks.
2019-02-25T03:39:15 < rajkosto> "Trace (ETM, ITM, DWT) not available on Cortex-M0" wat
2019-02-25T03:41:57 < ds2> that does explain a few things
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2019-02-25T03:44:29 < arc_phasor> i'm a little bit confused here. I'm playing a 60KB sound file using DMA to DAC. I was expecting to have to setup another DMA for flash to RAM, but it just works without it....
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2019-02-25T03:45:32 < arc_phasor> there's no way it loaded the whole file into RAM since I only have 20KB space. Does that mean DMA to DAC handles fetching from flash?
2019-02-25T03:47:16 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-25T03:47:29 < rajkosto> theyre all on the same address space
2019-02-25T03:47:36 < arc_phasor> woah
2019-02-25T03:47:53 < arc_phasor> so that's not even like a HAL driver thing, that's just the way it works internally
2019-02-25T03:47:57 < rajkosto> you generally dont want to do that since it might prevent cpu from fetching next instruction tho
2019-02-25T03:47:57 < arc_phasor> ?
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2019-02-25T03:48:24 < rajkosto> so makes it wait a ltitle bit
2019-02-25T03:48:45 < arc_phasor> is that the case for any DMA that works with flash?
2019-02-25T03:49:29 < arc_phasor> i wonder if that's why i mysteriously had to increase my clock by 2 in order for it to playback at the same rate
2019-02-25T03:51:37 < ds2> isn't the flash like 1 wait state 
2019-02-25T03:51:44 < rajkosto> 2 wait states on higher freqs
2019-02-25T03:54:02 < arc_phasor> any tips on getting a piezo buzzer louder when tied directly to DAC out?
2019-02-25T03:54:21 < arc_phasor> one thing that's weird, if I lower the sample rate it gets louder
2019-02-25T03:54:30 < arc_phasor> but sound like poo ROn
2019-02-25T03:55:53 < ds2> don't those things want a high voltage?
2019-02-25T03:56:05 < ds2> prehaps a xformer match if there is enough drive
2019-02-25T03:56:49 < arc_phasor> ^^ good idea
2019-02-25T03:58:10 < ds2> wonder if a proper enclosure would help... was surprised what difference a speaker enclosure makes
2019-02-25T04:00:48 < srk> night & day :D
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2019-02-25T04:36:13 < rajkosto> there's no escape
2019-02-25T04:51:58 < arc_phasor> alright cool, so the push button works. What's a good way to notice if the button is held down for x seconds?
2019-02-25T04:53:30 < arc_phasor> ahh, it's called a "long button press"
2019-02-25T04:56:09 < rajkosto> where is it called that
2019-02-25T04:58:56 < arc_phasor> some thread online, and also in app dev it's called that
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2019-02-25T05:06:59 < Cracki> "long" is unspecific
2019-02-25T05:07:02 < Cracki> call it "hold"
2019-02-25T05:07:30 < Cracki> "hold" induces the question "how long"
2019-02-25T05:10:32 < rajkosto> when you detect a press, log the timestamp of it 
2019-02-25T05:10:38 < rajkosto> when you detect a release, lookup the previous press timestamp 
2019-02-25T05:10:54 < rajkosto> if its > some vlaue its a long press otherwise its a regular one
2019-02-25T05:10:57 < rajkosto> clear the timestamp either way
2019-02-25T05:13:41 < Cracki> that's also how you debounce inputs
2019-02-25T05:14:07 < rajkosto> just stick a capacitor across the line for that
2019-02-25T05:14:20 < Cracki> and resistor
2019-02-25T05:14:45 < Cracki> OR DO IT IN SOFTWARE if you're gonna time that anyway
2019-02-25T05:14:52 < rajkosto> or
2019-02-25T05:14:59 < rajkosto> just dont use interrupts nad poll at some slow speed like 60hz
2019-02-25T05:15:06 < rajkosto> free debounce
2019-02-25T05:15:10 < Cracki> lol no
2019-02-25T05:15:23 < rajkosto> unlikely you catch a bounce that way
2019-02-25T05:15:26 < Cracki> you just reduce sampling frequency from cpu clock to 60 hz
2019-02-25T05:15:30 < Cracki> you can still see glitches
2019-02-25T05:15:36 < Cracki> "unlikely"
2019-02-25T05:15:52 < Cracki> sampling theorem, aliasing?
2019-02-25T05:16:36 < rajkosto> its free.
2019-02-25T05:17:06 < Cracki> polling or interrupts is irrelevant to the question of debounce
2019-02-25T05:17:26 < rajkosto> well with an interrupt you will catch every transition longer than interrupt min pulse width
2019-02-25T05:17:39 < rajkosto> for an interrupt i would actually use a capacitor
2019-02-25T05:17:51 < rajkosto> to prevent cpu waking up so many more times
2019-02-25T05:19:49 < rajkosto> why dont stm32 have schmitt input option on gpio
2019-02-25T05:20:10 < Cracki> uh they all have that
2019-02-25T05:20:17 < rajkosto> its always on ?
2019-02-25T05:20:21 < Cracki> dude
2019-02-25T05:20:38 < rajkosto> i know on some mcu its a bit in the gpio config register
2019-02-25T05:20:49 < Cracki> show me a chip that doesn't have hysteresis on digital inputs that aren't specialty (diff or whatever)
2019-02-25T05:21:27 < Cracki> 0 and 1 levels are defined such that you have a dead band between. that is hysteresis
2019-02-25T05:22:30 < Cracki> that is coincidentally why switching a pin to analog input saves power... the hysteresis stuff uses circuitry that uses a little power
2019-02-25T05:22:51 < rajkosto> good
2019-02-25T05:23:14 < Cracki> debouncing has to deal with a wide band of frequences
2019-02-25T05:23:26 < Cracki> the lowest coming from mechanical bounce of the button
2019-02-25T05:24:36 < Cracki> hysteresis only helps you with low amplitude noise, not with full swing signals
2019-02-25T05:30:18 < arc_phasor> i just check the gpio status every loop and increment a variable as long as it's high (resetting if low). If variable reaches 50000 i consider button held
2019-02-25T05:30:29 < rajkosto> thats a long time
2019-02-25T05:30:37 < arc_phasor> comes out to 4 seconds
2019-02-25T05:31:14 < arc_phasor> not sure how exactly, but yea, 4 seconds
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2019-02-25T05:54:19 < jadew> preheating station or hot plate?
2019-02-25T05:55:37 < Cracki> got a hot plate to play and learn with?
2019-02-25T05:55:46 < jadew> I have neither
2019-02-25T05:55:47 < Cracki> might be a nice cheap intro
2019-02-25T05:55:49 < jadew> I want to get one
2019-02-25T05:55:54 < Cracki> got a reflow oven?
2019-02-25T05:55:58 < jadew> I do
2019-02-25T05:56:09 < Cracki> ok, so you wouldn't need a hotplate to reflow pcbs
2019-02-25T05:56:23 < jadew> yeah, it's not for reflowing, but for rework
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2019-02-25T05:56:34 < jadew> so a hotplate would shine at reflow jobs?
2019-02-25T05:56:41 < Cracki> hmmm I've heard people using smallish heating elements for right under the board
2019-02-25T05:57:10 < Cracki> I've seen people use hotplates to reflow "simple" boards (downto 0402, single side)
2019-02-25T05:57:42 < Cracki> combined with IR thermometer because it only had a numbered knob to set the thermostat
2019-02-25T05:57:57 < Cracki> a reflow oven *shines* at reflow jobs
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2019-02-25T07:59:30 < Cracki> kek this goes for boys as well as girls https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0N1v84VYAA6PJw.jpg:orig
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2019-02-25T09:43:05 < qyx> I'm not very familiar with FPGAs and have no idea how I would implement FAT32 on an FPGA so decided to go the MCU/DSP route first but if it's not possible to manually communicate with a SATA device at slower data rates using GPIO
2019-02-25T09:43:09 < qyx> uh
2019-02-25T09:43:11 < qyx> https://community.st.com/s/question/0D50X00009XkYc2SAF/stm32429-discovery-sata-communication
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2019-02-25T09:46:24 < jpa-> one could always use PATA to SATA chip and talk PATA with STM32
2019-02-25T09:50:01 < qyx> I am curious how to get few 100GB storage on a stm32 for long term logging
2019-02-25T09:50:28 < qyx> apparently the easiest way would be using a usb3 raid controller
2019-02-25T09:50:32 < emeryth> sd cards
2019-02-25T09:50:36 < qyx> or a micro sd card
2019-02-25T09:53:45 < qyx> sd cards are about 0.3€/GB, m.2 SSDs are ~0.18€/GB
2019-02-25T09:53:58 < qyx> so it may be feasible to use m.2 SATA SSDs instead
2019-02-25T09:54:43 < jpa-> and spend weeks developing software to run it
2019-02-25T09:55:07 < qyx> jpa-: thats the other problem
2019-02-25T09:55:22 < qyx> I have not searched for a opensauce implementation yet
2019-02-25T09:56:23 < qyx> USB mass storage host should be about 5 lines of code in KEIL
2019-02-25T09:58:14 < emeryth> qyx: or combine both ideas https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10-ports-Micro-SD-TF-Memory-Card-to-SATA-SSD-Adapter-with-RAID-Quad-2/32555370970.html
2019-02-25T09:58:57 < qyx> looks like the thing I need
2019-02-25T09:59:01 < qyx> it has the complexity of both
2019-02-25T09:59:15 < emeryth> it has uart
2019-02-25T09:59:57 < jpa-> you could install linux on a HDD and add uart support to that
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2019-02-25T10:39:58 < dongs> doesnt matter for 10/100
2019-02-25T10:39:59 < dongs> at all
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2019-02-25T12:00:12 < dongs> hmm
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2019-02-25T12:48:46 < jadew> jeez... wtf is wrong with the chinese, I thought they're supposed to be cheap
2019-02-25T12:48:59 < jadew> $250 for a very small front panel
2019-02-25T12:49:47 < jadew> I got quoted 40 EUR by Schaffner
2019-02-25T12:50:14 < jadew> and I bet their quality and service is 20 times better
2019-02-25T12:51:48 < jadew> swiss
2019-02-25T12:52:17 < jpa-> maybe you asked a too large company
2019-02-25T12:52:36 < jpa-> and got a "we don't want you" pricetag
2019-02-25T12:52:48 < jadew> jpa-, maybe...
2019-02-25T12:53:05 < jadew> but it's not the first time this month
2019-02-25T12:53:48 < jadew> the first time was with a custom machined part, which I got much cheaper from Romania
2019-02-25T12:54:14 < jadew> and the quality is fantastic
2019-02-25T12:54:32 < jadew> also the deliver time, had it in 3 days since I placed the order
2019-02-25T12:54:42 < jadew> and no customs nonsense
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2019-02-25T12:57:32 < kakimir> series resistance and uart
2019-02-25T12:57:42 < kakimir> 2k too much for 115200?
2019-02-25T12:59:00 < qyx> a mains connection
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2019-02-25T13:30:40 < rajkosto> kakimir, nope
2019-02-25T13:30:48 < rajkosto> 4.7k should be fine too
2019-02-25T13:30:59 < rajkosto> but why would you want this
2019-02-25T13:31:56 < rajkosto> i guess to prevent the situation i have where connecting swd and uart to the fake programmer makes its pwr led light up
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2019-02-25T13:38:30 < kakimir> rajkosto: production tester
2019-02-25T13:38:58 < kakimir> I don't want fkd up stuff to fry anything on the tester
2019-02-25T13:40:54 < kakimir> better make contactless testing
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2019-02-25T14:15:17 < dongs> lunix nerds
2019-02-25T14:15:27 < dongs> is RTL8152B highspeed or fullspeed USB device?
2019-02-25T14:24:34 < zyp> the tv thing? presumably highspeed?
2019-02-25T14:24:49 < zyp> oh, no, ethernet
2019-02-25T14:25:00 < zyp> still presumably highspeed
2019-02-25T14:25:31 < zyp> yeah, datasheet says highspeed
2019-02-25T14:31:06 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B4tE1JgR2Q musiik
2019-02-25T15:04:42 < dongs> does it?
2019-02-25T15:04:49 < dongs> i see some chinka shit selling it as 2.0FS
2019-02-25T15:05:00 < dongs> https://datasheet.lcsc.com/szlcsc/Realtek-Semicon-RTL8152B-VB-CG_C50656.pdf this datasheet?
2019-02-25T15:07:23 < jadew> dongs, IIRC it has to do 2 Mb/s
2019-02-25T15:07:28 < jadew> so that's > FS
2019-02-25T15:08:09 < dongs> "has to"?
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2019-02-25T15:08:21 < jadew> that's the maximum data rate it supports
2019-02-25T15:08:32 < jadew> but again, IIRC
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2019-02-25T15:10:17 < qyx> I once bought a DM9601 usb-ethernet adapter
2019-02-25T15:10:30 < qyx> you don't want it for sure
2019-02-25T15:12:52 < dongs> lul
2019-02-25T15:13:19 < dongs> yeah i once bought a USB2.0 hub from delayextreme
2019-02-25T15:13:23 < dongs> it was literally 2.0
2019-02-25T15:13:24 < dongs> FS
2019-02-25T15:13:48 < jadew> dongs, nvm, I thought you were talking about the TV dongle
2019-02-25T15:14:00 < dongs> yeah not the RTL8139 or wahtever thing
2019-02-25T15:14:03 < dongs> the dvb shit
2019-02-25T15:14:03 < jadew> just clicked on that PDF and it's something else
2019-02-25T15:14:06 < dongs> yea no
2019-02-25T15:14:17 < dongs> this is usb to ethernet
2019-02-25T15:14:27 < dongs> but i cannot find an official source that says its HS
2019-02-25T15:14:33 < dongs> i see it bundled with some 3-port hubs
2019-02-25T15:14:40 < dongs> but that doesnt mean its highspeed either
2019-02-25T15:20:15 < qyx> rtl2832 is dvb, 8139 is the good old pci ethernet
2019-02-25T15:20:46 < qyx> too much realteks
2019-02-25T15:21:06 < qyx> were wow once
2019-02-25T15:21:33 < qyx> recently I found like 20 such cards in a box
2019-02-25T15:31:01 < dongs> https://github.com/noisymime/speeduino/blob/master/speeduino/speeduino.ino some quality arduino codes here
2019-02-25T15:31:09 < dongs> feel free to like, comment and subscribe
2019-02-25T15:49:52 < zyp> dongs, yes, taht datasheet
2019-02-25T15:50:46 < zyp> section 6.1.3 and 6.1.4 says MPS=512B, that's HS
2019-02-25T15:50:55 < zyp> FS would be 64
2019-02-25T15:51:07 < kakimir> hmm interestings
2019-02-25T15:51:23 < kakimir> when I use DAC output buffer my uart goes ded
2019-02-25T15:52:08 < qyx> isnt your dac output colliding with it?
2019-02-25T15:52:22 < kakimir> I don't see it
2019-02-25T15:52:49 < qyx> which part/port/usart?
2019-02-25T15:53:53 < kakimir> I keep on working maybe I find it
2019-02-25T16:11:15 < kakimir> 	CV_LOAD_NTC_MEASUREMENT_PORT.DIRCLR |= CV_LOAD_NTC_MEASUREMENT_PIN_BM;						//Set as input
2019-02-25T16:11:36 < kakimir> this line.. it wasn't dac after all
2019-02-25T16:16:11 < jadew> there's a minimum fee for those WEEE collection associations :/
2019-02-25T16:16:20 < jadew> 100 eur/3 months
2019-02-25T16:16:37 < jadew> so you have to sell like 500 products to cover that
2019-02-25T16:17:43 < jadew> (to reach the values they advertise)
2019-02-25T16:21:25 < kakimir> pin is XDIR of uart
2019-02-25T16:21:33 < kakimir> apparently it doesn't like it when I touch it
2019-02-25T16:26:33 < mawk> you want to sell batteries jadew ?
2019-02-25T16:30:22 < jadew> that applies to any electronics within the EU
2019-02-25T16:32:41 < mawk> dongs: #include BOARD_H //Note that this is not a real file, it is defined in globals.h. 
2019-02-25T16:32:42 < mawk> lol
2019-02-25T16:37:50 < rajkosto> non programmers shouldnt try to use programming languages
2019-02-25T16:38:01 < rajkosto> without first learning them
2019-02-25T16:45:23 < kakimir> oh wow
2019-02-25T16:45:49 < kakimir> lost actually 2 pins because of the shitty uart periph
2019-02-25T16:45:58 < kakimir> it needs it's all pins even when it doesn use them
2019-02-25T16:46:50 < kakimir> luckily those pins were like safety stuff
2019-02-25T16:47:00 < kakimir> CV load temp etc.
2019-02-25T16:47:25 < rajkosto> kakimir, what mcu
2019-02-25T16:48:07 < kakimir> attiny3217
2019-02-25T16:48:54 < kakimir> CV load get barelly warm
2019-02-25T16:49:20 < kakimir> but sure if connection between sink and transistor is lost it's byebye for transistor
2019-02-25T16:50:49 < kakimir> or probs not
2019-02-25T16:51:15 < kakimir> load is active only for some dozens of milliseconds at time
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2019-02-25T16:53:05 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-25T16:53:30 < kakimir> but certainly if it hangs load active it will become hot
2019-02-25T16:53:36 < kakimir> intentionally or unintentionally
2019-02-25T16:57:50 < mawk> what about a watchdog
2019-02-25T16:59:14 < kakimir> watchdog yes
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2019-02-25T17:03:02 < kakimir> somewhere
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2019-02-25T19:30:43 < kakimir> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tbaDjVSficfNag_Zf2LJJnylzwPFShyb/view?usp=sharing I bought a watch to wear it almost ironically
2019-02-25T19:31:24 < kakimir> should maybe set the time
2019-02-25T19:31:53 < kakimir> man it's comfy
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2019-02-25T19:50:38 < englishman> nice one kakimir
2019-02-25T19:51:01 < englishman> where did you get it
2019-02-25T19:51:55 < kakimir> ebay for sure
2019-02-25T19:52:27 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Casio-F91W-1-Wrist-Watch-Casio-F91W-Digital-Alarm-Stopwatch-3ATM-Water-Resist/153239006309
2019-02-25T20:09:14 < malinus> !report kakimir Terrorism
2019-02-25T20:10:56 < antto> f*ck, i had a watch that looked eggzactly like that when i was a kid
2019-02-25T20:11:18 < kakimir> I had too
2019-02-25T20:11:51 < malinus> osama bin laden had it too
2019-02-25T20:11:58 < antto> wat
2019-02-25T20:12:03 < kakimir> malinus: funny.. friend said that this watch is like totally allahu akbar bombman watch
2019-02-25T20:12:45 < antto> okay now.. i'm sure you've all drank water and osama bin laden has too
2019-02-25T20:19:17 < kakimir> there is a reason for popularity of this watch especially for kids of 90's and people in 3rd world countries
2019-02-25T20:19:24 < kakimir> price
2019-02-25T20:19:32 < bitrot> i think i had a clone of it
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2019-02-25T20:50:20 < PaulFertser> In late USSR these watches were popular: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-d2SwyMYZlEY/U9_E91YZyfI/AAAAAAAAB1A/ABEomPU4Vh0/s1600/montana+w30+5.jpg
2019-02-25T20:50:47 < kakimir> 16 melody chrono!
2019-02-25T20:50:55 < antto> my father had a seiko
2019-02-25T20:51:34 < kakimir> he was a big boss?
2019-02-25T20:52:02 < antto> nah, he woz working on teh ships
2019-02-25T20:52:53 < antto> so he could get fancy sh*t that most peoplez here hadn't seen.. like.. a video camera, lego..
2019-02-25T20:53:10 < antto> ASSOS cigs ;P~
2019-02-25T20:55:17 < kakimir> so he was basically above others in the system in that sense
2019-02-25T20:55:39 < kakimir> > stuff that others can't have
2019-02-25T20:55:43 < antto> nah, he was sweeping the ship floor but he had dollarz
2019-02-25T20:55:58 < kakimir> > had dollars
2019-02-25T20:56:48 < antto> green-ish moneyz with cyclopic pyramids on them
2019-02-25T20:58:47 < kakimir> the paper
2019-02-25T21:01:05 < kakimir> https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2019/02/25/c14059057e27e828.mp4
2019-02-25T21:01:10 < kakimir> internet of the day
2019-02-25T21:13:04 < aandrew> wtf
2019-02-25T21:15:35 < Cracki> so... two-wheeled segway robot... give it an extra servo to lean into curves?
2019-02-25T21:16:49 < kakimir> movie recommds?
2019-02-25T21:26:10 < mawk> my phone is all bricked
2019-02-25T21:26:14 < mawk> I'm going to get poorer
2019-02-25T21:26:39 < kakimir> that sucks
2019-02-25T21:27:00 < mawk> it's the SoC that detaches itself from the motherboard under heat stress
2019-02-25T21:27:12 < mawk> I've seen some people on youtube "repairing" this by blasting it with a heat gun for 3 minutes
2019-02-25T21:27:33 < mawk> myself I've just modified the bootloader to disable the part of the SoC that detached
2019-02-25T21:27:38 < mawk> now it boots, I hope it will work
2019-02-25T21:28:03 < kakimir> you did what?
2019-02-25T21:28:14 < kakimir> you actually tried to repair it?
2019-02-25T21:28:17 < kakimir> :o
2019-02-25T21:28:18 < mawk> yes
2019-02-25T21:28:20 < mawk> lol
2019-02-25T21:28:28 < kakimir> I just throw mine away when it's done
2019-02-25T21:28:42 < mawk> my bank account is dangerously close to negative
2019-02-25T21:28:48 < mawk> I can't buy a new one yet
2019-02-25T21:28:56 < kakimir> usually crack in screen and then water gets in
2019-02-25T21:29:03 < kakimir> or faulty usb
2019-02-25T21:29:10 < mawk> for me it's a known issue
2019-02-25T21:29:14 < kakimir> and also water from there
2019-02-25T21:29:15 < mawk> they didn't bind the SoC properly to the motherboard
2019-02-25T21:29:23 < mawk> there has been a class action in the US, users got a refund
2019-02-25T21:29:26 < mawk> but I'm not in the US
2019-02-25T21:29:28 < kakimir> what phone?
2019-02-25T21:29:32 < mawk> google nexus 5X
2019-02-25T21:29:34 < mawk> built by LG
2019-02-25T21:29:37 < mawk> some other LG phones have that issue
2019-02-25T21:29:53 < malinus> mawk: pleas just stop being poor
2019-02-25T21:30:06 < mawk> lol
2019-02-25T21:30:16 < kakimir> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2019-02-25T21:30:27 < kakimir> team samsunk here
2019-02-25T21:30:44 < mawk> I want the true google experience, that's why I went with nexus things
2019-02-25T21:31:00 < mawk> every line of code away from the google android release is a sin
2019-02-25T21:31:01 < kakimir> lenovo moto?
2019-02-25T21:31:11 < kakimir> is moto still pure android?
2019-02-25T21:31:23 < mawk> I don't know about them, I guess
2019-02-25T21:31:34 < kakimir> how about sony?
2019-02-25T21:31:37 < malinus> mawk: that's why I'm running lineage os on my galaxy S5
2019-02-25T21:31:51 < mawk> yeah you can always hack around
2019-02-25T21:32:01 < kakimir> should I lineage my samsunk s7?
2019-02-25T21:32:02 < mawk> but for the nexuses google offers you a way to hack it on a golden plate
2019-02-25T21:32:09 < mawk> it gives all the tools and image files on android developer
2019-02-25T21:32:11 < malinus> kakimir: probably
2019-02-25T21:32:33 < kakimir> I had sony and sony gives unlock code for bootloader
2019-02-25T21:32:37 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-25T21:32:43 < mawk> Mi does that too
2019-02-25T21:32:44 < mawk> it's terrible
2019-02-25T21:33:01 < mawk> they have you write a wall of text for the reason of wanting the unlock code
2019-02-25T21:33:11 < mawk> like if it's not a device you bought and own
2019-02-25T21:33:52 < malinus> what are consoles?
2019-02-25T21:34:14 < kakimir> mawk: they just void your warranty that is why you need to type the serial number
2019-02-25T21:35:33 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-25T21:39:07 < kakimir> I don't remember but were you SA or French mawk?
2019-02-25T21:49:45 < antto> french
2019-02-25T21:50:27 < antto> mouque
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2019-02-25T22:20:35 < mawk> french kakimir 
2019-02-25T22:20:37 < mawk> what's SA ?
2019-02-25T22:20:54 < mawk> South Asian
2019-02-25T22:20:55 < kakimir> south african
2019-02-25T22:20:58 < mawk> ah
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2019-02-25T23:03:28 < rajkosto> Stupid American
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--- Day changed Tue Feb 26 2019
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2019-02-26T00:14:07 < englishman> i had a seiko
2019-02-26T00:14:08 < englishman> then it broke
2019-02-26T00:14:13 < englishman> mechanical watches are fucking crap
2019-02-26T00:14:39 < malinus> people still do mechanical timekeeping?
2019-02-26T00:14:52 < englishman> old people and vain people, yes
2019-02-26T00:15:19 < rajkosto> lol what is the word for "feature" that they use when describing super expensive watches
2019-02-26T00:15:26 < rajkosto> like a calendar would be another one of those
2019-02-26T00:16:03 < englishman> complication
2019-02-26T00:16:10 < rajkosto> Yes. I knew i hated it
2019-02-26T00:17:13 < englishman> https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20190225005195/en/Western-Digital-Unveils-World%E2%80%99s-Fastest-1TB-UHS-I
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2019-02-26T01:11:01 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-26T01:11:24 < zyp> the DMAMUX peripheral looks a bit cute, anybody used it?
2019-02-26T01:11:49 < zyp> or rather, have anyone even seen it?
2019-02-26T01:12:02 < zyp> stm32wb got it, I haven't seen it anywhere else yet
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2019-02-26T01:19:34 < zyp> stm32wb has a ton of oscillators too, no less than five internal RC oscillators
2019-02-26T01:20:01 < zyp> there's two LSI oscillators, an MSI, HSI16 and HSI48
2019-02-26T01:21:10 < aandrew> wtf. I have an entire bag of ssd1306 128x64 hotbar oled displays. can't find the fucking bag
2019-02-26T01:21:21 < zyp> I assume the first one is the good old LSI that's wildly inaccurate and thus useless for anything but IWDG
2019-02-26T01:21:50 < zyp> and then they've added another one that's trimmable
2019-02-26T01:22:29 < zyp> they both feed into the same mux, so you can only use one or the other, makes me wonder why they bothered keeping both
2019-02-26T01:22:58 < zyp> only sane reason would be if the first one is lower power, I guess
2019-02-26T01:23:27 < rajkosto> aandrew, 0.96"
2019-02-26T01:23:28 < rajkosto> ?
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2019-02-26T01:24:22 < aandrew> yeah
2019-02-26T01:24:28 < zyp> and then there's quite some overlap between MSI, HSI16 and HSI48 as well
2019-02-26T01:24:29 < aandrew> everyday standard 30 pin shits
2019-02-26T01:25:35 < zyp> (and since this is an RF chip, HSE would be required when using the radio anyway)
2019-02-26T01:29:40 < aandrew> ordered some more off eastrising. should be here within a week or 3
2019-02-26T01:29:50 < aandrew> in the meantime since I ordered more I'll find the bag within 24h guaranteed
2019-02-26T01:40:41 < zyp> that's how it is
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2019-02-26T01:42:40 < zyp> hmm, guess I should pick up a stm32wb nucleo now
2019-02-26T01:43:13 < zyp> I need to buy shit for another $12 to get free shipping, what should I pick up from farnell for $12?
2019-02-26T01:43:26 < zyp> sorry, $14
2019-02-26T01:43:51 < qyx> G0 nucleo?
2019-02-26T01:45:10 < zyp> it's only $11 and not in stock
2019-02-26T01:45:17 < zyp> (and G0 seems boring anyway)
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2019-02-26T02:10:03 < dongs> sup speeduino coders
2019-02-26T02:13:01 < zyp> still looking for cool stuff for $14 to add to my order
2019-02-26T02:13:38 < dongs> buy the new stlink v3
2019-02-26T02:13:42 < dongs> with F723
2019-02-26T02:13:44 < dongs> and HS USB
2019-02-26T02:15:25 < zyp> cute, but what does it add over other stuff?
2019-02-26T02:15:32 < dongs> nothing :p
2019-02-26T02:16:04 < dongs> https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/particle/progshield/?qs=GZwCxkjl%252bU0QyXFn%2FO53qg%3D%3D&countrycode=US&currencycode=USD
2019-02-26T02:16:10 < dongs> this is a nice FT2232H breakout
2019-02-26T02:16:21 < dongs> if you ever feel liek dicking with openocd / jtag shit
2019-02-26T02:16:45 < zyp> probably not :p
2019-02-26T02:17:14 < zyp> anyway, I'm ordering from farnell as they seem to be the only one with stm32wb nucleo in stock
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2019-02-26T02:48:57 < mawk> I tried to blowtorch my phone's processor
2019-02-26T02:49:06 < mawk> it made it boot a little further, but it froze again
2019-02-26T02:49:12 < mawk> so, I bought a new one
2019-02-26T02:49:22 < mawk> but I have to live 1 week without a phone until it arrives
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2019-02-26T02:58:19 < bitmask> why does my car have to use such a huge battery
2019-02-26T03:00:27 < bitmask> Ive carried it up and down the street and a flight of steps like 10 times in the past year and it sucks each and every time
2019-02-26T03:06:13 < dongs> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/uAopMH83.html so fpga pros... how can i make that psync signal delay by another clock cycle so that its edge is aligned with dout? https://i.imgur.com/inhU7LS.png 2nd signal from top = PSYNC_OUT, hex is DOUT, and bottom one wiht red marks = psync_in
2019-02-26T03:06:43 < dongs> i dont think this if psync_in and !psync_old thing is working correctly
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2019-02-26T03:09:52 < dongs> er, assign PSYNC_OUT = psync[7]; this was the right way, but its still one clock cycle early
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2019-02-26T03:17:46 < dongs> hmm
2019-02-26T03:17:53 < dongs> post route sim is shittier
2019-02-26T03:19:51 < dongs> https://i.imgur.com/xiREur0.png wtf is going on here?
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2019-02-26T04:11:49 < mawk> my blowtorch reparation worked after all
2019-02-26T04:12:06 < mawk> when I tried to power it on with the back-cover put (without the back cover some components aren't powered on), and now it works
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2019-02-26T08:33:31 < dongs> jadew: my SMA shit is here'
2019-02-26T08:33:49 < jadew> the adapter?
2019-02-26T08:33:55 < dongs> y
2019-02-26T08:34:22 < jadew> is it male to male?
2019-02-26T08:34:36 < dongs> well it fits to stuff so yes
2019-02-26T08:35:03 < jadew> that's good, let me know when you get the thing from me
2019-02-26T08:35:05 < dongs> i also got SMA to F
2019-02-26T08:35:13 < dongs> ya i need to stop by the office to see if it arrived
2019-02-26T08:35:19 < dongs> ill give it a bout a week before i head there
2019-02-26T08:35:20 < jadew> why SMA to F?
2019-02-26T08:35:36 < dongs> so i can plugin random TV antenna to stuff
2019-02-26T08:35:43 < jadew> ah, got it
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2019-02-26T08:56:21 < dongs> oh wow
2019-02-26T08:56:34 < dongs> plugging F into SDR through adapter is way better than just plugging center pin
2019-02-26T08:56:35 < dongs> lulz
2019-02-26T08:56:40 < dongs> i can actually tune FM radio
2019-02-26T08:59:01 < jadew> heh
2019-02-26T09:03:08 < rajkosto> who would have thought you need 2 wires to complete a circuit
2019-02-26T09:03:47 < rajkosto> (even though antennas are magic)
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2019-02-26T09:12:38 < rajkosto> a capacitor is a wire.... at high enough frequencies
2019-02-26T09:17:55 < jadew> I think I'm going to buy this: https://www.banggood.com/Mini-V3-0-T12-Digital-Temperature-Controller-Soldering-Station-Soldering-Iron-Tips-T12-K-p-1338117.html
2019-02-26T09:18:04 < jadew> anyone else got that?
2019-02-26T09:18:28 < jadew> apparently it kicks ass
2019-02-26T09:18:42 < dongs> why not just get a cheap metcal
2019-02-26T09:18:51 < jadew> is there such a thing?
2019-02-26T09:19:00 < dongs> i got my basestation for $99 on ebay
2019-02-26T09:19:01 < jadew> (as a cheap metcal)
2019-02-26T09:19:12 < dongs> t hen bought the themaldongs handle+tips from digikey
2019-02-26T09:19:15 < jadew> dongs, that would be a good deal for sure
2019-02-26T09:19:50 < jadew> which one do you have?
2019-02-26T09:19:57 < jadew> and how much do the tips cost?
2019-02-26T09:20:41 < jadew> so far... I can't find anything between the performance and price of the one I linked and the JBC stations
2019-02-26T09:20:43 < dongs> hm the one with old metcal logo
2019-02-26T09:20:47 < jadew> not for europe anyway
2019-02-26T09:21:06 < dongs> https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/fs-uk-eu-metcal-power-supplies-stss-ps2v-02-mx500p-and-stands/?action=dlattach;attach=204914;image
2019-02-26T09:21:18 < dongs> the one in center
2019-02-26T09:21:22 < dongs> i donno wat that other thing is
2019-02-26T09:21:25 < dongs> on the left
2019-02-26T09:21:31 < dongs> its liek dual tip but you have to switch one or another
2019-02-26T09:21:37 < dongs> i never used t he 2nd one
2019-02-26T09:21:47 < jadew> and how much did you pay for the handle & tips?
2019-02-26T09:22:23 < rajkosto> jadew, https://www.banggood.com/Mini-V3-0-T12-Digital-Temperature-Controller-Soldering-Station-Soldering-Iron-Tips-T12-K-p-1338117.html
2019-02-26T09:22:25 < dongs> wahtever the price on digijew is
2019-02-26T09:22:36 < rajkosto> dont be tempted to get ones with a similar enclosure, they can be crap inside, but that one should be good
2019-02-26T09:22:39 < rajkosto> but its out of stock right now ?
2019-02-26T09:23:00 < dongs> rajkosto: isnt that what he linked
2019-02-26T09:23:20 < jadew> it is
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2019-02-26T09:23:59 < dongs> oh dk had it under easybraid
2019-02-26T09:24:00 < dongs> i forgot.
2019-02-26T09:24:30 < dongs> oh wow
2019-02-26T09:24:35 < dongs> $100 bucks for EasyJEW handpiece
2019-02-26T09:24:36 < dongs> lmao
2019-02-26T09:24:38 < dongs> https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/menda-easybraid/EBSHP-1/EB1235-ND/2404646
2019-02-26T09:24:47 < dongs> i donno what i paid tho, i mean this was like 10 years ago
2019-02-26T09:25:05 < dongs> judew, get that china shit.
2019-02-26T09:25:13 < dongs> metcal is out of your budget
2019-02-26T09:25:27 < rajkosto> that china shit is just a decent power supply for T12 tips
2019-02-26T09:25:37 < rajkosto> basic controller with display
2019-02-26T09:25:41 < jadew> well, I could spend 250 maybe for this
2019-02-26T09:25:48 < rajkosto> get dat china shit its good enough
2019-02-26T09:25:53 < rajkosto> or maybe TS80
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2019-02-26T09:26:18 < jadew> but yeah, from what I'm seeing that china shit should be enough for what I'm trying to do
2019-02-26T09:26:43 < jadew> I also like the fact that the tips are cheap
2019-02-26T09:26:48 < jadew> ~$4
2019-02-26T09:26:58 < jadew> you can go through them like they're nothing
2019-02-26T09:27:13 < rajkosto> https://www.banggood.com/MINI-TS80-Digital-OLED-USB-Type-C-Programable-Soldering-Iron-Station-Solder-Tool-Built-in-STM32-Chip-p-1330060.html what about that fancy thing
2019-02-26T09:27:28 < rajkosto> uses custom tips tho
2019-02-26T09:27:43 < jadew> rajkosto, yes, custom tips and I don't have it has the same power
2019-02-26T09:27:52 < jadew> the one I linked I think it can put 70W into the tip
2019-02-26T09:28:02 < rajkosto> the custom tip is efficient
2019-02-26T09:28:14 < rajkosto> it can heat up ground planes pretty good
2019-02-26T09:28:54 < jadew> I'm going to use it with this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pcs-lot-Hakko-T12-D52-Soldering-Iron-T12-Solder-Tips-For-FX-950-FX-951-FM/32575615780.html
2019-02-26T09:29:03 < jadew> I'm getting it for a very specific job
2019-02-26T09:29:29 < jadew> I don't think the TS-?xx ones can deliver the power I need
2019-02-26T09:29:45 < jadew> Haohmaru, yeah, I have one too, for the hot air
2019-02-26T09:29:50 < jadew> it's decent, but it's not direct heat
2019-02-26T09:30:11 < jadew> so it's recovering slow - not great for large ground planes
2019-02-26T09:30:34 < jadew> Haohmaru, the one I linked has the heater and sensor inside the tip
2019-02-26T09:30:41 < jadew> they're not two different things
2019-02-26T09:30:50 < jadew> you change the tip, you change the heater with it
2019-02-26T09:30:53 < rajkosto> TS-80 is direct tip heater
2019-02-26T09:30:57 < jadew> I know
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2019-02-26T09:32:55 < rajkosto> (TS-100 is direct tip heater too but the tip is weird and long and i dont like it)
2019-02-26T09:34:23 < rajkosto> AI-inside
2019-02-26T09:34:40 < rajkosto> thats not innovative enough
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2019-02-26T09:36:20 < jadew> dongs, how do you set the temperature on those metcals?
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2019-02-26T09:43:03 < jadew> anyway, I'll get that one, seems to be best value for money
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2019-02-26T09:52:18 < jadew> ordered
2019-02-26T09:52:55 < jadew> heh, yeah
2019-02-26T09:55:30 < jadew> I don't know why all irons come with the wrong tips
2019-02-26T09:55:58 < jadew> that blade tip is just silly
2019-02-26T09:56:10 < jadew> what is it good for?
2019-02-26T09:57:30 < jadew> which is never
2019-02-26T09:58:05 < jadew> I actually tried using it a couple of times and it's just... not very useful
2019-02-26T09:58:45 < jadew> the 1.2mm chisel tip is my fav
2019-02-26T10:01:58 < jadew> why don't you get a proper station?
2019-02-26T10:02:12 < jadew> especially when really good ones seem to be so cheap now
2019-02-26T10:03:24 < jadew> 50
2019-02-26T10:03:48 < jadew> and it's going to be a lot better than what you would have bought several years ago with $300
2019-02-26T10:04:19 < jadew> ah
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2019-02-26T10:24:42 < jadew> is the silicone you can buy at the hardware store as heat resistant as the one in those heat resistant mats?
2019-02-26T10:25:20 < jadew> I want to put silicone jaws on my vise and I can't find any, so maybe I'll create a mould and make them myself
2019-02-26T10:27:13 < kakimir> pretty high heat resistance
2019-02-26T10:27:25 < kakimir> it's inherit property of silicone
2019-02-26T10:27:42 < jadew> yeah, I'll have to give it a try
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2019-02-26T11:05:33 < kakimir> silicone is just not that good structurally
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2019-02-26T11:28:10 < jpa-> jadew: you can get high-temperature silicone meant for sealing fireplaces, it's cheap also and specified to 350C or so
2019-02-26T11:28:45 < jpa-> also if you want to make thick pieces, remember to add corn starch (as in oogoo)
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2019-02-26T11:53:11 < jpa-> any idea what this means? "Yes,it's indicated to be 3.5mil in the web. But the production claims to compensate the line width, then we are not able to proceed."
2019-02-26T11:53:37 < jpa-> i made a board with 3.5mil track/space because jlcpcb website claims to support it, but apparently they don't
2019-02-26T11:54:03 < jadew> jpa-, thanks, I'll look for it
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2019-02-26T11:54:45 < jadew> jpa-, it means it's not supported
2019-02-26T11:55:19 < jadew> probably because your 3.5mil lines get thickened or something and then it violates other clearances
2019-02-26T11:55:24 < jpa-> yeah, just seems strange why they would list it as such, i.e. in what cases could they "compensate" it
2019-02-26T11:55:41 < jadew> odds are that if you had a single 3.5mil trace it would have gone through
2019-02-26T11:55:51 < jadew> but it wouldn't have been 3.5 mil
2019-02-26T11:56:44 < jadew> I guess that's the "compensation" they're talking about
2019-02-26T11:57:12 < jpa-> hm yeah, so basically 3.5mil track or 3.5mil space, but not both
2019-02-26T11:59:04 < dongs> jpa-: my flexpcb was ok with 3mil trace
2019-02-26T12:05:55 < kakimir> if I scale resistor divider
2019-02-26T12:06:09 < kakimir> and want to keep the filtering properties the same
2019-02-26T12:06:31 < kakimir> do I scale cap in another direction in same factor?
2019-02-26T12:07:17 < kakimir> well i'll simulate to see
2019-02-26T12:07:56 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-26T12:08:00 < kakimir> it's true
2019-02-26T12:13:40 < dongs> > resistor divider
2019-02-26T12:13:41 < dongs> > cap
2019-02-26T12:13:44 < dongs> pls make sense
2019-02-26T12:16:07 < zyp> farnell has pretty fucking useless webpages
2019-02-26T12:16:15 < dongs> surprised?
2019-02-26T12:16:45 < zyp> no, just annoyed
2019-02-26T12:16:56 < qyx> I just stopped using it
2019-02-26T12:17:03 < qyx> no web, no profit
2019-02-26T12:17:13 < zyp> I never really started, only ordered once from them before
2019-02-26T12:17:18 < qyx> bad web < no web
2019-02-26T12:17:38 < zyp> and then I ordered stm32wb nucleo yesterday, they seem to be only one with it in stock
2019-02-26T12:18:05 < zyp> that said, even if mouser/digikey had it, ITAR would probably prevent them from selling it to me
2019-02-26T12:18:09 < qyx> they also have some EU-centric things like eurocard subracks
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2019-02-26T12:24:46 < qyx> why are pressure transmitters so $$
2019-02-26T12:37:01 < zyp> not enough price pressure? :p
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2019-02-26T13:05:57 < qyx> even on aliexpress they are at least $20
2019-02-26T13:07:38 < zyp> sea freight
2019-02-26T13:08:30 < rajkosto> Haohmaru, what's the opposite of a sieve
2019-02-26T13:10:16 < qyx> a mixing bucket
2019-02-26T13:22:32 < englishman> jadew: thermaltronics gave me a free base station
2019-02-26T13:22:36 < englishman> so, cost is not really an issue
2019-02-26T13:22:45 < englishman> also digijew discontinued their clonertronics tips
2019-02-26T13:24:18 < jadew> right, I forgot about thermaltronics
2019-02-26T13:24:37 < jadew> damn.. farnell sucks
2019-02-26T13:24:50 < jadew> their site is down so often
2019-02-26T13:26:40 < jadew> TME has them, they're rather reasonable
2019-02-26T13:26:48 < jadew> (within the budget)
2019-02-26T13:27:01 < jadew> but I already ordered that thing from china...
2019-02-26T13:27:29 < jadew> I'll see how that is when it arrives and if I don't like it, I'll get the thermaltronics
2019-02-26T13:28:04 < qyx> jadew: it gives you a fobidden error if you are not logged in and you are browsing ~fast~
2019-02-26T13:28:24 < jadew> qyx, for me it just doesn't work
2019-02-26T13:28:33 < jadew> it says the site is down
2019-02-26T13:28:38 < jadew> probably mouser DDoSing them
2019-02-26T13:29:02 < qyx> apart from that, it is down for maintenance usually in early morning hours
2019-02-26T13:29:11 < jadew> I know
2019-02-26T13:29:14 < jadew> that's also annoying
2019-02-26T13:29:25 < qyx> idk then, I went full mouser
2019-02-26T13:50:52 < englishman> just email thermaldongix and ask them who your local vendor is
2019-02-26T13:51:02 < englishman> mine has amazing pricing and promotions like FREE headunits etc
2019-02-26T13:51:58 < englishman> oh you bought stuff
2019-02-26T13:52:07 < englishman> idk i'm 100% done buying anything from china
2019-02-26T13:52:17 < englishman> except maybe for hand waving golden cats
2019-02-26T13:52:19 < jadew> I'll drop them an e-mail, thanks
2019-02-26T13:52:36 < jadew> one question tho - can you set the temperature?
2019-02-26T13:52:42 < englishman> yes, by changing the tip
2019-02-26T13:52:49 < englishman> long answer is, you dont need to
2019-02-26T13:52:51 < jadew> ah ha
2019-02-26T13:52:54 < englishman> you choose a tip appropriate for the job
2019-02-26T13:53:13 < jadew> yeah, that's fine
2019-02-26T13:53:35 < englishman> my vendor had some nice tip suggestions too
2019-02-26T13:53:41 < englishman> i was using the shit all wrong apparently
2019-02-26T13:54:33 < jadew> in what way?
2019-02-26T13:58:43 < jadew> their tips are really cheap
2019-02-26T14:02:24 < jadew> I wrote them
2019-02-26T14:03:16 < jadew> multiple soldering stations are always welcome
2019-02-26T14:03:25 < jadew> I need one close to the microscope anyway
2019-02-26T14:04:55 < jadew> maybe I'll find a way to hide the hot air station too, or replace it with a lower profile one
2019-02-26T14:05:15 < jadew> it's smack in the middle of everything and it kinda gets in the way
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2019-02-26T14:07:07 < dongs> d o n g s
2019-02-26T14:21:25 < zyp> hmm, the supplied CPU2 firmware .bins for stm32wb seems to be encrypted
2019-02-26T14:21:53 < dongs> nice
2019-02-26T14:21:57 < dongs> DRM warez
2019-02-26T14:22:01 < zyp> yeah
2019-02-26T14:22:23 < zyp> shame the radio registers are not documented
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2019-02-26T14:23:15 < zyp> all the CPU2 stuff is documented, so you've got all you need to run your own firmware on it, except for how to interface with the radio
2019-02-26T14:23:59 < zyp> and the radio firmware apparently only comes as a whole blob that runs independently on CPU2
2019-02-26T14:24:10 < zyp> so it's apparently one or the other
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2019-02-26T14:30:07 < dongs_> well good job, freechoad
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2019-02-26T14:31:32 < zyp> at least the good thing is that the code to interface with the stack running on CPU2 doesn't look too thick, should be easy enough to integrate
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2019-02-26T14:40:11 < BrainDamage> daily shitpost link https://twitter.com/tenderlove/status/1100105108631609351
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2019-02-26T14:50:48 < qyx> zyp: how does it communicate?
2019-02-26T14:51:17 < qyx> is there some shared memory or are they totally indepoendent and connected with spi or what
2019-02-26T14:52:42 < zyp> shared memory
2019-02-26T14:54:33 < Thorn> why no stm32g in lcsc
2019-02-26T14:55:17 < Thorn> hope it's nothing to do with 'measures against technology transfer to China'
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2019-02-26T16:11:33 < bitmask> ahoy there mateys
2019-02-26T16:12:10 < jpa-> hello our bit wielding friend
2019-02-26T16:18:22 < bitmask> https://imgur.com/a/0IM7L0z
2019-02-26T16:18:41 < bitmask> what box should I get to store my 5x3 ESD bagged components
2019-02-26T16:19:10 < jpa-> get a folder
2019-02-26T16:19:23 < bitmask> how would that work
2019-02-26T16:19:33 < jpa-> punch holes to bags, put bags to folder
2019-02-26T16:19:43 < bitmask> oh a binder?
2019-02-26T16:19:47 < jpa-> yeah
2019-02-26T16:19:52 < bitmask> hmm
2019-02-26T16:20:02 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
2019-02-26T16:20:03 < bitmask> I purposefully bought esd bags with hang holes
2019-02-26T16:22:26 < bitmask> how long does a car battery take to charge once it switches to constant voltage mode, go faster!
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2019-02-26T16:29:38 < bitmask> :)
2019-02-26T16:29:58 < jpa-> if it switches to constant voltage mode, isn't it mostly full already
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2019-02-26T16:33:27 < bitmask> 'mostly' but it can go a long time at CV, I guess it doesnt really matter as long as its enough to start the car but I want to see if I fixed my parasitic drain problem so I want to start with a fresh battery, plus I'm not sure my battery isn't damaged
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2019-02-26T17:29:46 < mawk> labour wants a second referendum
2019-02-26T17:29:46 < mawk> lol
2019-02-26T17:47:38 < kakimir> shitshow
2019-02-26T17:50:34 < kakimir> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/jetperch/joulescope-precision-dc-energy-analyzer
2019-02-26T17:50:44 < kakimir> worth the mooneh?
2019-02-26T17:51:15 < kakimir> the paper
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2019-02-26T18:03:50 < mawk> not even usb C
2019-02-26T18:04:08 < qyx> nobody uses usb c
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2019-02-26T18:07:32 < mawk> usb C is the future qyx 
2019-02-26T18:07:33 < mawk> surrender or die
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2019-02-26T18:21:07 < rajkosto> get an oscilloscope instead
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2019-02-26T19:15:05 < englishman> usbC is awesome
2019-02-26T19:15:20 < englishman> there should be no other usb
2019-02-26T19:16:09 < rajkosto> except for anyone implementing devices that use it
2019-02-26T19:16:32 < kakimir> I wish I knew how to usb
2019-02-26T19:17:14 < englishman> that's literally your job
2019-02-26T19:17:55 < kakimir> it isn't
2019-02-26T19:18:51 < kakimir> something I should do is to get one silabser demo board going
2019-02-26T19:19:08 < kakimir> and get it to enumerate and usb bc
2019-02-26T19:19:15 < kakimir> and whatever is involved
2019-02-26T19:20:31 < kakimir> it doesn't need to "talk" anything but some power stuff
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2019-02-26T21:21:38 < Cracki> halp! where to get an UN-geared dc motor WITH optical encoder? https://i.imgur.com/Zsv9Qfu.jpg
2019-02-26T21:21:51 < Cracki> (got this from boss, who got it from an old butchered printer)
2019-02-26T21:22:29 < Cracki> aliex only has geared motors (ugh backlash) with hall sensor encoders (few pulses per revolution)
2019-02-26T21:22:55 < kakimir> interesting
2019-02-26T21:23:09 < Cracki> they have separate optical encoders, with certain rotor axis diameters, but I haven't found corresponding motors
2019-02-26T21:23:12 < kakimir> you need more specs than that
2019-02-26T21:23:22 < kakimir> axis diameter
2019-02-26T21:23:24 < kakimir> motor diameter
2019-02-26T21:23:27 < Cracki> I know, people want torque and such
2019-02-26T21:24:04 < Cracki> oh well, axis 4-5 mm perhaps? nema 17 steppers use 5mm, the geared motors with rubber wheels I got off aliex use 4mm
2019-02-26T21:24:59 < kakimir> what are you doings
2019-02-26T21:25:01 < Cracki> don't care about motor diameter, just want *something* that's ungeared
2019-02-26T21:25:11 < Cracki> I wanna build a toy segway
2019-02-26T21:25:22 < Cracki> backlash/slip is fucking awful
2019-02-26T21:26:16 < Cracki> if I had another of *those*, I'd be happy... it has a module 0.5mm 8mm diameter gear on its nose I can just print some plastic wheels to fit onto
2019-02-26T21:26:56 < Cracki> the encoder wheel is 100 PPR, the electronics are 3.3v and give quadrature
2019-02-26T21:27:15 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=dc+motor+encoder&_sacat=0 did you go thru these already?
2019-02-26T21:27:37 < Cracki> first result is the right principle, but tiny as fuck
2019-02-26T21:27:53 < Cracki> #2 and 3 are even tinier because they're supposed to be servos for camcorder optics or something
2019-02-26T21:28:20 < kakimir> why not just rc car brushless?
2019-02-26T21:28:26 < Cracki> I searched aliex, ebay, amazon, ...
2019-02-26T21:28:30 < Cracki> those high current fuckers?
2019-02-26T21:28:47 < Cracki> if they had a little axis on their ass end so I could fit a code wheel on it...
2019-02-26T21:29:14 < kakimir> there are big
2019-02-26T21:29:17 < kakimir> and there are small
2019-02-26T21:29:18 < Cracki> I can find motors with single ended axis, or with long axis both ways
2019-02-26T21:29:39 < Cracki> yes sure but do they have encoders or at least a bit of axis on the other end?
2019-02-26T21:30:04 < Cracki> I haven't seen single-sided axis long enough for both wheel AND load to be mounted
2019-02-26T21:30:16 < kakimir> rc car motors have some sort of encoder
2019-02-26T21:30:29 < kakimir> not very high resolution though
2019-02-26T21:30:40 < kakimir> it's just for driving the motor
2019-02-26T21:30:49 < Cracki> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1-set-2-set-Mayitr-DC-6V-210RPM-Encoder-Motor-Gear-4mm-Shaft-With-Screws-Mounting/32823003082.html
2019-02-26T21:30:55 < Cracki> this is what I got, but it's geared!
2019-02-26T21:31:27 < Cracki> rc motors are likely geared too, unless you mean those propeller motors for quads etc
2019-02-26T21:31:37 < kakimir> no
2019-02-26T21:31:41 < kakimir> rc car motors
2019-02-26T21:31:56 < Cracki> oh, now I see something...
2019-02-26T21:31:57 < kakimir> inside rotor bldc
2019-02-26T21:32:05 < kakimir> but those things should do
2019-02-26T21:32:33 < kakimir> wheels and all
2019-02-26T21:32:40 < Cracki> uh
2019-02-26T21:32:48 < Cracki> you see any that aren't geared?
2019-02-26T21:33:31 < Cracki> :/ thought I saw something, but it has one of these poor resolution magnetic encoders
2019-02-26T21:33:52 < Cracki> I've seen those torus magnets upto 24 poles, maybe more, but that's about it
2019-02-26T21:34:54 < Cracki> I guess what I'm asking is... how to get in contact with chinaman to find me this stuff
2019-02-26T21:35:14 < kakimir> is this like a hobby project?
2019-02-26T21:35:35 < kakimir> alibaba
2019-02-26T21:35:48 < kakimir> taobao or whatever it's called too
2019-02-26T21:36:04 < Cracki> definitely hobby
2019-02-26T21:36:19 < kakimir> oh you don't need sourcing
2019-02-26T21:36:28 < Cracki> when I tell them "2 pieces" they will show me the door
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2019-02-26T21:36:39 < kakimir> why you need encoders to the motors?
2019-02-26T21:36:49 < Cracki> because that's how you sense position and get feedback
2019-02-26T21:37:33 < Cracki> doing this with just an IMU... uh I'd rather not
2019-02-26T21:37:55 < Cracki> the only way to remove drift is with encoders
2019-02-26T21:38:07 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-26T21:38:42 < kakimir> how good are those "robot wheel" units?
2019-02-26T21:38:57 < Cracki> hmmm this looks suitable. if only they'd sell them for less than 40 bucks a piece https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-Motor-DH053-060E3N01-Shinano-Kenshi-Robotics-CNC-w-optical-encoder-H9700/332532189660
2019-02-26T21:39:51 < Cracki> those aliex wheels I got, they have 5 degrees of slip. that's 2.5 mm on the wheel
2019-02-26T21:40:52 < Cracki> serviceable but not as nice as no gears at all
2019-02-26T21:41:45 < Cracki> hmhm 15 bucks a piece, but 2mm shaft diameter
2019-02-26T21:41:53 < Cracki> could work with that
2019-02-26T21:42:34 < kakimir> https://www.ebay.com/itm/AlexMos-32BIT-BGC-Gimbal-Control-w-GBM5208H-200T-5208-Encoder-Brushless-Motor/232826260658?hash=item363586ccb2:g:ULQAAOSwWDBbAnzt:rk:12:pf:0
2019-02-26T21:42:47 < kakimir> interesting approach to encode bldc
2019-02-26T21:42:49 < Cracki> bldc definitely
2019-02-26T21:42:54 < Cracki> how do they encode?
2019-02-26T21:43:01 < Cracki> just imu?
2019-02-26T21:43:07 < kakimir> angular magnetic sensor
2019-02-26T21:43:18 < kakimir> you can see the bottom plates
2019-02-26T21:43:23 < kakimir> with chip in the middle
2019-02-26T21:43:50 < kakimir> so the axle will have spinning magnet at the short end
2019-02-26T21:43:55 < Cracki> ah yes, that fancy stuff
2019-02-26T21:44:10 < Cracki> you get sin/cos, not just binary quadrature
2019-02-26T21:44:39 < kakimir> https://www.melexis.com/en/product/MLX90316/Absolute-Rotary-Position-Sensor-IC
2019-02-26T21:45:21 < Cracki> very nice stuff
2019-02-26T21:46:35 < Cracki> thanks for pushing me to browse ebay some more... I only browsed the national site upto now. maybe they don't charge too much for international shipping on that result I see now
2019-02-26T21:48:43 < rajkosto> ebay is full of chinese just using it as another aliexpress
2019-02-26T21:48:59 < kakimir> but they are all in taobao
2019-02-26T21:49:27 < kakimir> if you really need to get down to sourcing stuff
2019-02-26T21:49:37  * Cracki takes notes
2019-02-26T21:50:27 < kakimir> learn mandarin
2019-02-26T21:51:01 < Cracki> kurwa
2019-02-26T21:51:04 < kakimir> write it down
2019-02-26T21:51:36 < qyx> that was not mndarin
2019-02-26T21:53:37 < Cracki> tons of offers asking 100-200 bucks for used "servos" without electronics, which are just a reasonably non-shit motor with a proper optical encoder...
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2019-02-26T21:54:58 < kakimir> so you plan to make direct drive?
2019-02-26T21:55:05 < kakimir> no gears or anything?
2019-02-26T21:55:28 < Cracki> fuck gears
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2019-02-26T21:55:58 < Cracki> _maybe_ some belt drive but likely not
2019-02-26T21:56:21 < kakimir> bldc boi
2019-02-26T21:56:25 < kakimir> go bldc
2019-02-26T21:56:40 < Cracki> and 14 bit fancy encoder IC, eh?
2019-02-26T21:57:10 < Cracki> what's the cheapest I could get away with for a bldc motor, suitable driver, and encoder?
2019-02-26T21:57:20 < Cracki> (well encoders I know, cheap)
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2019-02-26T21:59:13 < kakimir> not cheap
2019-02-26T21:59:57 < kakimir> I would be most concerned about driving solution
2019-02-26T22:00:04 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-26T22:00:10 < aandrew> so I got my rctimer order today 
2019-02-26T22:00:18 < aandrew> got some 5ghz video tx/rx shits
2019-02-26T22:00:25 < aandrew> I just realized they're all compose-shit out
2019-02-26T22:00:39 < Cracki> at least the cost is capped at "hack a hoverboard"
2019-02-26T22:00:50 < Cracki> yay compost
2019-02-26T22:00:59 < aandrew> I wonder if my Commodore 1702 monitor is still around
2019-02-26T22:01:09 < Cracki> composite usb grabber maybe
2019-02-26T22:01:15 < Cracki> those are 10 bucks maybe
2019-02-26T22:01:36 < aandrew> yeah
2019-02-26T22:01:48 < Cracki> ok 15 bucks
2019-02-26T22:02:21 < kakimir> it turns out that those shit the video
2019-02-26T22:02:35 < kakimir> because cameras have much higher line count etc.
2019-02-26T22:02:45 < aandrew> yes
2019-02-26T22:02:53 < kakimir> directly connected to flat screen it looks incredible
2019-02-26T22:02:58 < aandrew> I have some cx93610 stuff around somewhere
2019-02-26T22:03:07 < aandrew> spit out mjpeg heh
2019-02-26T22:03:11 < kakimir> I shitted my tx
2019-02-26T22:03:38 < kakimir> it said something like 6-24v
2019-02-26T22:03:47 < kakimir> I was like okay yes
2019-02-26T22:03:56 < kakimir> connected it to 22v
2019-02-26T22:04:24 < Cracki> and then?
2019-02-26T22:04:41 < kakimir> it took 2seconds maybe 5 for it to push smoke out of regulator
2019-02-26T22:05:00 < Cracki> why'd it say -24v then
2019-02-26T22:05:15 < kakimir> because LDO datasheet says so
2019-02-26T22:05:32 < Cracki> bbbut ldo smoked at 22v?
2019-02-26T22:05:47 < Cracki> reverse the polarity?
2019-02-26T22:05:53 < kakimir> but different thing is when you pull half an amp thru sot23-5
2019-02-26T22:06:10 < kakimir> or then it was just mislabeled
2019-02-26T22:07:08 < kakimir> I just know that it was burning hot even @ 9v
2019-02-26T22:07:23 < Cracki> grml the only cheap servo I saw (2mm shaft) has just 22 (max eff) upto 160 (stall) g cm of torque
2019-02-26T22:07:28 < PaulFertser> Who of you guys can say with confidence that he/she can't add a bug like the one in Lime's electric scooter firmware?
2019-02-26T22:07:41 < Cracki> what's a lime
2019-02-26T22:07:55 < kakimir> Cracki: hack a digital rc servo
2019-02-26T22:07:59 < Cracki> is that like the thing you get on slot machines?
2019-02-26T22:08:16 < PaulFertser> Cracki: they build and give for rent electric scooters.
2019-02-26T22:08:16 < Cracki> ;_; no can haz cheap
2019-02-26T22:08:30 < Cracki> and someone told it to kill all humans
2019-02-26T22:09:04 < malinus> How does a I2S peripheral usually handle power-off in the middle of a transfer (while being master)? Is it possible that a slave just keeps waiting forever, because transfer has been stopped? Or do slaves (sensors etc.) usually have a timeout? This scenario isn't specificed for neither the mcu or sensor.
2019-02-26T22:09:15 < Cracki> hahahaha sudden excessive braking
2019-02-26T22:09:18 < PaulFertser> And apparently they have a bug so that when you go downhill on maximum speed and hit some kind of a bump the front wheel might start emergency braking!
2019-02-26T22:09:41 < PaulFertser> And of course almost nobody wears a helmet riding those.
2019-02-26T22:09:42 < Cracki> malinus, does that stuff have a chipselect or anything that would deassert upon death?
2019-02-26T22:09:52 < malinus> Cracki: nope
2019-02-26T22:10:00 < Cracki> yay untested control loops
2019-02-26T22:10:06 < malinus> Cracki: just SCL/SDA
2019-02-26T22:10:11 < PaulFertser> https://www.li.me/blog/safety-update-february-2019
2019-02-26T22:10:25 < Cracki> they should have theoretically analyzed the properties of that control loop
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2019-02-26T22:10:52 < Cracki> limit on accel/decel should have been a basic feature
2019-02-26T22:11:05 < kakimir> Cracki: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jajnIBX2cU beafy control servo would maybe do it
2019-02-26T22:11:43 < malinus> Cracki: also I meant I2C and not I2S. But same/same ;)
2019-02-26T22:11:44 < Cracki> those rc servos use gears too...
2019-02-26T22:11:51 < Cracki> not quite
2019-02-26T22:12:02 < Cracki> i2c is shit, i2s is closer to simplex spi
2019-02-26T22:12:08 < malinus> I know, that's the joke. Anyway, it's on I2C.
2019-02-26T22:12:24 < Cracki> does i2s even have cock stretching like i2c does?
2019-02-26T22:12:38 < Cracki> good q...
2019-02-26T22:12:39 < malinus> nope
2019-02-26T22:12:46 < Cracki> if I were to implement the slave, I'd give it timeout logic
2019-02-26T22:12:51 < kakimir> Cracki: and those servos are pretty fast and torqy
2019-02-26T22:13:09 < Cracki> hmmm might have to take a look then
2019-02-26T22:13:32 < Cracki> I know those analog (poti) servos you can hack for continuous rotation. maybe "digital" ones are less shit
2019-02-26T22:13:46 < Cracki> backlash is shit for control loops
2019-02-26T22:14:38 < Cracki> my problem isn't solved by using different geared motors
2019-02-26T22:15:01 < Cracki> malinus, if the datashit doesn't say, i'd expect it to wait forever
2019-02-26T22:15:31 < Cracki> but, if it's a microcontroller, i2c is probably implemented as a state machine anyway, so merely that isn't progressing anymore
2019-02-26T22:16:13 < malinus> Cracki: meh I found it's pretty common scenario: http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/I2C_Tips#External_Slave_Device_Hanging_the_Bus_by_Holding_SDA_Low
2019-02-26T22:16:14 < Cracki> a master hogging the bus is definitely a problem, which is, iirc, why i2c isn't considered hard realtime
2019-02-26T22:16:46 < Cracki> you can do nothing if a master decides to hold sda, OR if a slave decides to hold/stretch sck
2019-02-26T22:17:16 < Cracki> you can consider the bus dead... but there's no way to "throw" anyone off the bus
2019-02-26T22:17:27 < Cracki> that'd require some logic on every end
2019-02-26T22:17:46 < Cracki> *sck/scl watev
2019-02-26T22:18:20 < qyx> there is
2019-02-26T22:18:33 < qyx> even the linux kernel has a 9-scl-clock cycle workaround implemented
2019-02-26T22:18:53 < qyx> to unbrick slaves stuck in the middle of the transmission
2019-02-26T22:19:15 < Cracki> how does it unbrick a slave, except for forcefully resetting it off-bus?
2019-02-26T22:19:44 < qyx> the problem is when master-slave clock sync is broken
2019-02-26T22:19:58 < qyx> thats usually the case of "broken" i2c
2019-02-26T22:20:16 < malinus> Cracki: by bitbanging the SCLuntil it releases as far as I understand
2019-02-26T22:20:21 < qyx> yes
2019-02-26T22:20:24 < Cracki> uh
2019-02-26T22:21:02 < Cracki> who releases what? master releases sda, or slave releases scl?
2019-02-26T22:21:11 < Cracki> a slave can hold scl for any reason
2019-02-26T22:21:15 < tjq> blxtr
2019-02-26T22:21:25 < qyx> master releases both and makes scl clocks until all slaves releases sda
2019-02-26T22:21:28 < Cracki> and a master can't do shit (on the bus)
2019-02-26T22:21:33 < malinus> Cracki: slave that holds the SDA
2019-02-26T22:21:47 < Cracki> uh, that sounds like a nack condition
2019-02-26T22:22:16 < Cracki> oh right... slave might send data...
2019-02-26T22:22:36 < Cracki> so toggling clock until slave is done talking... can work, or might not :>
2019-02-26T22:23:47 < malinus> Well nothing new about that!
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2019-02-26T22:24:19 < Cracki> :>
2019-02-26T22:25:04 < Cracki> for one project at work, I used a spare wire on the bus (ribbon cable) as "everyone, reset yourself" signal
2019-02-26T22:25:28 < Cracki> tied to chip reset where possible, or exti where not
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2019-02-26T22:26:37 < Cracki> anyway, now I'm aliex'ing for "double shaft" and it actually yields results! the term didn't come to mind before
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2019-02-26T22:27:17 < malinus> Cracki: yeah a fet for turning the sensor on/off would be optimal. But ain't nobody got the money for that.
2019-02-26T22:27:43 < Cracki> oh, cutting power would be even more reliable
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2019-02-26T22:28:07 < malinus> yeah
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2019-02-26T22:39:06 < kakimir> fet for sensor?
2019-02-26T22:39:13 < kakimir> how tight the budget is man?
2019-02-26T22:39:29 < kakimir> I mean it's like under 10cents for sot23 fet
2019-02-26T22:40:38 < kakimir> I think this thing has been a topic more than once
2019-02-26T22:41:04 < Cracki> hah! now I know the logo on my boss's motor, it's mabuchi
2019-02-26T22:46:04 < kakimir> isn't 9scl clock cycles the general reset for i2c?
2019-02-26T22:47:32 < kakimir> but yeah what do I know.. I don't really play with i2c
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2019-02-26T22:58:48 < qyx> whats Dual mode Quad-SPI
2019-02-26T22:59:40  * qyx downloading RM
2019-02-26T23:01:14 < qyx> na ja, dual flash mode
2019-02-26T23:01:37 < qyx> I was hoping for a quadspi slave
2019-02-26T23:01:40 < Cracki> macaronix knows http://www.macronix.com/Lists/ApplicationNote/Attachments/1899/AN0251V1%20-%20Macronix%20Serial%20Flash%20Multi%20IO%20Introduction.pdf
2019-02-26T23:01:51 < malinus> kakimir: not just the fet man. thinking about all the SPACE!
2019-02-26T23:01:51 < Cracki> or what are you into?
2019-02-26T23:01:57 < malinus> kakimir: *not just the price
2019-02-26T23:02:28 < Cracki> oh, they consider "dual mode" to be DSPI
2019-02-26T23:02:47 < aandrew>  heh found this completely by accident (looking for a bs20a ESC manual) http://img.banggood.com/file/products/20180404070139GEPRC-STABLE-MANUALS-EN-V10.pdf
2019-02-26T23:02:50 < Cracki> can it read from two qspi flashes at once?
2019-02-26T23:03:00 < qyx> seems so
2019-02-26T23:03:04 < Cracki> nice rack
2019-02-26T23:03:04 < malinus> kakimir:  sot23?! do you think I'm making electronics for gigants?
2019-02-26T23:03:45 < malinus> giants, even
2019-02-26T23:04:04 < Cracki> fascinating, dual qspi means talking to two flashes at once
2019-02-26T23:04:23 < Cracki> so 8 bits at once... now does it do that on rising or both edges
2019-02-26T23:04:38 < Cracki> heck it does!
2019-02-26T23:04:41 < qyx> yeah basically you could do XIP using that
2019-02-26T23:04:52 < Cracki> 8 bit per edge wew
2019-02-26T23:04:54 < qyx> 8bit DDr at 54mhz or so
2019-02-26T23:06:07 < qyx> now I need to know if I am able to record and compress 4 48kHz channels on F7 using opus
2019-02-26T23:06:34 < malinus> qyx: what's opus?
2019-02-26T23:06:39 < Cracki> audio codec
2019-02-26T23:07:11 < Cracki> it can certainly do fixed point, not even sure it can use floating point
2019-02-26T23:07:28 < qyx> I used it once and I remember I did some benchmarks
2019-02-26T23:07:32 < qyx> but I cannot find anything now
2019-02-26T23:07:37 < qyx> maybe internets have some
2019-02-26T23:07:45 < Cracki> there are benchmarks, iirc for cortex a but for CM maybe as well
2019-02-26T23:07:56 < Cracki> it certainly does. ciph wants to push opus
2019-02-26T23:08:29 < Cracki> I got to compile the library and make *decode* on some kinetis a few years back
2019-02-26T23:09:33 < Cracki> someone's 2014 ballpark numbers: http://lists.xiph.org/pipermail/opus/2014-November/002725.html
2019-02-26T23:10:28 < Cracki> https://www.adaptivedigital.com/opus/
2019-02-26T23:10:57 < Cracki> 20-60 MIPS for cm4/7
2019-02-26T23:10:57 < qyx> yeah I remember that when I did it I was able to encode 32kbit/s 48kHz on F1
2019-02-26T23:12:49 < Cracki> so... 4 channels might be 4*60=240 mips, I think that's feasible
2019-02-26T23:13:17 < malinus> just get a 600mhz m7
2019-02-26T23:13:24 < Cracki> yay headroom
2019-02-26T23:13:27 < kakimir> malinus: I know man
2019-02-26T23:13:32 < qyx> malinus: where
2019-02-26T23:13:40 < Cracki> not st ;)
2019-02-26T23:13:41 < malinus> qyx: nxp 
2019-02-26T23:13:51 < qyx> sdfgsdf
2019-02-26T23:13:57 < malinus> :)
2019-02-26T23:14:04 < kakimir> drive it directly with GPIO then if it doesn't use much of power or if voltage tolerance is not strict
2019-02-26T23:14:04 < qyx> not going to do that
2019-02-26T23:14:06 < Cracki> M7 has what, 1.25 or 1.5 DMIPS/MHz?
2019-02-26T23:14:13 < kakimir> then it's only copper space
2019-02-26T23:14:44 < qyx> F7 has ~462 DMIPS
2019-02-26T23:15:03 < qyx> F722 datasheet says so
2019-02-26T23:15:05 < malinus> Cracki: daily reminder that we get neon (helium®©) on cortex-m now
2019-02-26T23:15:09 < malinus> what a time to be alive
2019-02-26T23:15:21 < Cracki> hmm heliumm
2019-02-26T23:15:22 < malinus> now = in a few years ;)
2019-02-26T23:16:12 < Cracki> reading https://community.arm.com/research/b/articles/posts/making-helium-why-not-just-add-neon
2019-02-26T23:17:16 < Cracki> I guess that's also why they push DNN inference for their cortex M offerings now
2019-02-26T23:18:12 < malinus> gonna be great for RT stuff
2019-02-26T23:18:53 < Cracki> rt dsp anyway. the realtime I do is mostly "wiggle this I/O line within given time limit"
2019-02-26T23:19:49 < malinus> yes
2019-02-26T23:21:50 < fenugrec> englishman, did your driveway look like mine https://framapic.org/random?i=RRUsvhd6Yu4G/Bx9SPbWJYLZG
2019-02-26T23:22:13 < englishman> no
2019-02-26T23:22:20 < englishman> lol
2019-02-26T23:23:54 < qyx> did it show?
2019-02-26T23:24:01 < qyx> here it was 16°C today
2019-02-26T23:24:58 < englishman> cool bug PaulFertser
2019-02-26T23:25:00 < fenugrec> it's a warm, sunny -16 now
2019-02-26T23:25:20 < englishman> 16C is cold brrr
2019-02-26T23:25:26 < englishman> -16C is much better
2019-02-26T23:25:46 < aandrew> we're supposed to get another 15cm tonight
2019-02-26T23:25:56 < aandrew> wow that guy's a little snowed in
2019-02-26T23:26:13 < aandrew> if you'll notice though he's got his wipers up so they don't freeze to the windshield
2019-02-26T23:26:16 < englishman> i got to use the ariens fenugrec
2019-02-26T23:26:24 < englishman> because the tractor was broken
2019-02-26T23:26:50 < englishman> god damn assdroid update is so fucking slow
2019-02-26T23:26:57 < englishman> can't even type
2019-02-26T23:27:03 < aandrew> android detected
2019-02-26T23:27:05 < englishman> I have to wait for the text to appear
2019-02-26T23:27:06 < aandrew> found your problem
2019-02-26T23:27:13 < englishman> plz
2019-02-26T23:28:38 < fenugrec> aandrew, "he" being me, yes I was expecting something of the sort P)
2019-02-26T23:28:45 < englishman> ah There just have to reboot it
2019-02-26T23:28:49 < englishman> fucking lunix
2019-02-26T23:28:58 < englishman> stealing windows features
2019-02-26T23:29:05 < zyp> haha
2019-02-26T23:29:37 < fenugrec> englishman, is your ariens wheel or tracked ? wheels are useless in 1m snodrifts
2019-02-26T23:30:01 < englishman> tracked
2019-02-26T23:30:11 < englishman> I didn't want any amateur shit
2019-02-26T23:30:18 < englishman> it still slips too
2019-02-26T23:30:30 < englishman> also climbs stairs nicely
2019-02-26T23:30:36 < fenugrec> smart... I think I'll upgrade next wintah. chained wheels just not cutting it
2019-02-26T23:34:13 < aandrew> fenugrec: heh where do you live that you got that much snow?
2019-02-26T23:37:33 < fenugrec> aandrew, QC
2019-02-26T23:42:09 < englishman> wtf
2019-02-26T23:42:22 < englishman> the hamburger menu in assdroid is now vertical
2019-02-26T23:42:35 < englishman> probably so people stop calling it the hamburger menu
2019-02-26T23:42:44 < rajkosto> BURGER
2019-02-26T23:42:45 < englishman> literally the only feature in assdroid 9
2019-02-26T23:43:03 < englishman> they moved the clock into the notification area
2019-02-26T23:43:11 < englishman> so there is always shit there
2019-02-26T23:47:46 < aandrew> fenugrec: ah, you're in englishman's territory? QC is an awfully big province
2019-02-26T23:48:10 < englishman> he's across the street
2019-02-26T23:54:00 < aandrew> haha srs?
2019-02-26T23:54:11 < aandrew> that's awesome. I don't think I've ever had a neighbour that shared my interests like that
2019-02-26T23:55:22 < zyp> I think you overestimated the degree of seriousness
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--- Day changed Wed Feb 27 2019
2019-02-27T00:09:16 < rajkosto> french canada ? ze best canada in ze land
2019-02-27T00:11:02 < fenugrec> word
2019-02-27T00:15:57 < mawk> indeed
2019-02-27T00:16:11 < mawk> whoever doubts that shall rot in hell
2019-02-27T00:16:48 < zyp> wtf
2019-02-27T00:17:08 < zyp> according to farnell the stm32wb nucleo I ordered is backordered now
2019-02-27T00:17:16 < zyp> it said it was in stock when I ordered
2019-02-27T00:17:39 < zyp> fucking bullshit store
2019-02-27T00:21:01 < mawk> lol
2019-02-27T00:21:08 < mawk> it was bait
2019-02-27T00:21:20 < rajkosto> what are these weird fuckin hairs in this adhesive thermal pad
2019-02-27T00:21:27 < rajkosto> i cant cut it properly and they get everywhere
2019-02-27T00:38:17 < Steffanx> awh zyp :P
2019-02-27T00:38:35 -!- tjq [uid339161@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bfuvvvdevvnsszbz] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
2019-02-27T00:44:47 -!- fenugrec [~fenugrec@24.105.71.66] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2019-02-27T00:52:33 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP55r5CDjI8 musics
2019-02-27T00:56:21 < qyx> weird muziks
2019-02-27T00:58:29 < kakimir> I just wanna
2019-02-27T01:10:36 < Steffanx> want attention? :P
2019-02-27T01:11:33 < kakimir> I have it all already ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2019-02-27T01:11:46 < Steffanx> yw kakimir
2019-02-27T01:12:30 < Steffanx> shouldnt you sleep mr kakimir?
2019-02-27T01:13:04 < kakimir> shouldn't you
2019-02-27T01:13:11 < Steffanx> perhaps.
2019-02-27T01:13:12 < Steffanx> Yes.
2019-02-27T01:13:56 < kakimir> I need to think
2019-02-27T01:14:00 < kakimir> meditate
2019-02-27T01:14:30 < Steffanx> weed time
2019-02-27T01:16:40 < kakimir> I wish
2019-02-27T01:17:05 < Cracki> TIL: that fork thingy with LED and photodiodes(?) that's part of that quadrature encoder and slitted wheel... they call that "optical switch"
2019-02-27T01:17:31 < kakimir> concidering legal implications and how it would affect my work performance I think I will pass for now Steffanx
2019-02-27T01:17:47 < kakimir> *pass to Steffanx 
2019-02-27T01:17:57 < Steffanx> i dont smoke
2019-02-27T01:19:35 < Steffanx> Good night kakimir
2019-02-27T01:24:27 < kakimir> hmm not sure if stef going to sleep or gives me a hint to afk
2019-02-27T01:25:40 < kakimir> Cracki: problem with those encoders can be that those can be incremental type
2019-02-27T01:25:58 < kakimir> I don't see 2 tracks of slits
2019-02-27T01:26:05 < kakimir> oh wait.. dumb me
2019-02-27T01:26:07 < Cracki> I'm looking for two-eyed ones
2019-02-27T01:26:22 < Cracki> yes, the simple explanation is a derivation of absolute encoders, having n tracks
2019-02-27T01:26:30 < Cracki> and in-phase eyes
2019-02-27T01:26:34 < kakimir> there are sensors that can detect direction from single row of slits
2019-02-27T01:26:47 < kakimir> like in mouse wheel
2019-02-27T01:27:03 < Cracki> quadrature encoders use in-phase track(s) and shifted eyes... so eye shift has to match wheel PPR (or pitch)
2019-02-27T01:28:00 < Cracki> or, if the eyes are in-phase also, one would have to turn the detector slightly so eye axis is off slit axis
2019-02-27T01:28:16 < kakimir> indeed
2019-02-27T01:28:30 < Cracki> "aperture" is also important. too large an aperture and you are looking at more than one line at once
2019-02-27T01:29:06 < Cracki> mouser doesn't attribute its offers by mounting style. majority are basically limit switches, both arms sticking straight up from the PCB
2019-02-27T01:29:18 < Cracki> I need them going sideways if the PCB is to sit on the ass of the motor
2019-02-27T01:29:34 < Cracki> glad they have "by image" listings
2019-02-27T01:29:46 < kakimir> are you making now an optical encoder
2019-02-27T01:29:57 < Cracki> I guess I am... at least looking into it
2019-02-27T01:30:03 < Cracki> so far, looks to be cheap as fuck
2019-02-27T01:30:15 < kakimir> why you need to do that
2019-02-27T01:30:19 < Cracki> because why not
2019-02-27T01:30:24 < kakimir> you have motors with optical encoders already?
2019-02-27T01:30:35 < kakimir> or have found the matching pair for what you have?
2019-02-27T01:30:41 < Cracki> no, i have ONE such beast, and two with shit ass gears and magnetic encoders
2019-02-27T01:31:19 < Cracki> getting just a motor with "dual shaft", mabuchi seems to do 3.16mm shafts, I see 2.16mm and 2.0mm too
2019-02-27T01:32:00 < Cracki> and code discs with 100 PPR and 4mm bore... the motor I have uses plastic nuts/washers/whatever to hold the disc on the shaft
2019-02-27T01:32:11 < Cracki> so I guess some careful gluing is involved
2019-02-27T01:32:27 < Cracki> the parts are there mostly, a little 3d printing to help with the rest
2019-02-27T01:33:02 < Cracki> I'm amazed that I haven't seen exactly this *sometime* during my search
2019-02-27T01:33:03 < kakimir> does the axle have key?
2019-02-27T01:33:11 < Cracki> the ass end doesn't, needn't
2019-02-27T01:33:16 < Cracki> the front end usually does
2019-02-27T01:33:35 < kakimir> encoder wheel is press fitted?
2019-02-27T01:33:40 < Cracki> looks like it
2019-02-27T01:33:57 < Cracki> as much as plastic on metal can be pressfit
2019-02-27T01:34:26 < Cracki> I see no glue anywhere. I'll have to glue my version tho because the 3d printer I can get time on might not play along
2019-02-27T01:35:43 < Cracki> so this might also involve making a dumb little PCB to hold a connector and the optical switch for a particular motor (looks like those PCBs are usually soldered to the power tabs of the motor)
2019-02-27T01:36:13 < Cracki> on my motor, I see a cap and resistor and that's it
2019-02-27T01:37:00 < kakimir> you cannot glue to hardened polished axle
2019-02-27T01:37:13 < Cracki> I might have to plan this and then leak it to the chinese so I can get two dozen of it cheaply so I can resell that to my cs dept as edu toys :>
2019-02-27T01:37:25 < Cracki> wat is loctite
2019-02-27T01:37:51 < kakimir> hmm maybe you can sufficiently bond it
2019-02-27T01:37:51 < Cracki> it only needs to glue to the code disc, which is maybe 0.3mm sheet metal
2019-02-27T01:38:32 < Cracki> the interface to the shaft can be pressfit because the plastic encircles it, but the two halves that sit under and over the code disc have nowhere to push off
2019-02-27T01:39:23 < Cracki> I'd much rather just buy this shit, or have someone who figures out what parts to get where and gives me a kit ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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2019-02-27T02:33:55 < Cracki> ... always read components before going wild. that cap is through hole, but 100 nF
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2019-02-27T02:56:05 < Cracki> hm, these buggers actually have four photodiodes(?) https://eu.mouser.com/datasheet/2/365/GP1A057RBKLF_Spec-194995.pdf
2019-02-27T03:00:28 < mawk> yes Cracki 
2019-02-27T03:01:37 < Cracki> I was trying to figure out the exact positions of the detectors but the "optical center" seems to be enough for them
2019-02-27T03:06:04 < englishman> rajkosto: the best france too
2019-02-27T03:34:21 < Cracki> oh looky, broadcom (now avago) sells code wheels and stuff for motion control encoders
2019-02-27T03:38:54 < srk> https://wiki.base48.cz/File:F7Cluster.jpeg
2019-02-27T03:40:20 < Cracki> give it power then we'll see
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2019-02-27T03:41:16 < srk> not sure if 3 phases are enough
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2019-02-27T03:51:33 < englishman> almost as much computing power as a shitberreypi
2019-02-27T03:56:16 < srk> 500Mbps!
2019-02-27T04:00:54 < rmaw> bet that chipboard is nice to use a mouse on
2019-02-27T04:02:02 < srk> usually I'm using my trusty extralarge steel series mouse pad but it's at home now
2019-02-27T04:02:05 < rajkosto> he can have a mouse pad
2019-02-27T04:02:29 < srk> I'm mostly using keyboard anyway except for CAD work
2019-02-27T04:03:02 < srk> and killing n00bz in quake
2019-02-27T04:03:52 < srk> hax http://en.eurny-rc.fr/diy-dominator-module-58g-24g/
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2019-02-27T04:08:18 < aandrew> there we go, down to three bad boards (and one incompetely stuffed one)
2019-02-27T04:08:43 < aandrew> 2/3 have the same weird issue where the first 16 bytes of every 32 bytes of flash writes fine, but the next 16 bytes is all ff
2019-02-27T04:08:55 < aandrew> the other one is just not letting me read any memory at all
2019-02-27T04:09:15 < rajkosto> spi flash or stm32 flash
2019-02-27T04:09:31 < aandrew> the other board I had that was showing the same 32 byte issue wouldn't work when reflowed a few times. replaced the stm32 and it came right up so I wonder if that's a failure mode whcih permanently damages the chip
2019-02-27T04:09:35 < aandrew> stm32 flash
2019-02-27T04:09:36 < aandrew> internal
2019-02-27T04:10:57 < rajkosto> how do you manage to do that when i use a shingle heat gun and dont have any issues
2019-02-27T04:11:24 < aandrew> I *think* that they didn't profile the board correctly and there was an incomplete reflow
2019-02-27T04:11:53 < aandrew> I think that devices are generally a lot more tolerant of the reflow profile than we think, and when you're heatgunning it you're way overcooking them but you're getting complete reflow
2019-02-27T04:12:21 < aandrew> CMs will stick to a profile to specifically NOT overcook and that's causing incomplete reflow in heavier copper areas
2019-02-27T04:12:41 < rajkosto> why would that mess up the internals
2019-02-27T04:12:55 < aandrew> this is all just guessing
2019-02-27T04:13:14 < aandrew> I'm thinking if not all the power/gnd balls got reflowed it's causing weird current flows internally and potentially damaging things
2019-02-27T04:18:11 < Cracki> that's it, I'm never eating chips rare again! only well done!
2019-02-27T04:18:39 < Cracki> with ketchup as the god imperator intended
2019-02-27T04:18:58 < Cracki> *emperor :>
2019-02-27T04:28:04 < aandrew> ... rare chips?
2019-02-27T04:30:07 < Cracki> uncooked
2019-02-27T04:30:16 < aandrew> why would you do that
2019-02-27T04:30:31 < Cracki> because why would your assembly house undercook your boards
2019-02-27T04:32:22 < aandrew> well like I said I assume it's because they are trying to adhere to the recommended profile but didn't properly profile the board before doing so
2019-02-27T04:32:33 < aandrew> so the coldest part of the board didn't hit the reflow temp
2019-02-27T04:33:23 < Cracki> indeed
2019-02-27T04:45:08 < rajkosto> > not cooking your boards yourself at 300oC for 10 mins
2019-02-27T05:10:18 < Cracki> britbongs explain this garbage https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0XPhlKXQAAzKgL.jpg:orig
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2019-02-27T05:44:26 < englishman> beep srk
2019-02-27T05:44:39 < englishman> im pretty sure i read that TUTORIAL in 2012
2019-02-27T05:45:02 < englishman> fatshart doesnt do any different, they buy that shitty chink $4 module, slap it on a pcb and charge $90
2019-02-27T05:45:29 < rajkosto> fatshart ?
2019-02-27T05:46:28 < englishman> a garbage china company pressing plastic floor-sweepings into video goggle shaped garbage for losers
2019-02-27T05:50:29 < rajkosto> your sentence was too obfuscated for anyone to understand
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2019-02-27T06:07:12 < dongs> pal's looking for a robotic arm thing to move shit around, whats cheap/shitty these days
2019-02-27T06:17:35 -!- [7] [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
2019-02-27T06:17:53 < aandrew> can't you hire like a dozen chinese kids to do that cheaper than anything else you could find?
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2019-02-27T06:18:37 < dongs> no, it needs to be precise
2019-02-27T06:18:42 < dongs> its for stereo camera calibration
2019-02-27T06:18:45 < aandrew> ah
2019-02-27T06:18:51 < dongs> so it needs to be able to move the camera around to different spots
2019-02-27T06:18:57 < dongs> that would need to be repeatable
2019-02-27T06:18:59 < aandrew> yeah at $detroitjob they have some precise alignment shit
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2019-02-27T06:56:03 < Cracki> so... reflective optical encoders cost 5-10 bucks a piece, and I mean just the IC that contains a LED and some photodiodes and a bunch of overkill features
2019-02-27T06:56:23 < Cracki> but if you buy them on a breakout from china, they're 2 bucks a piece
2019-02-27T06:56:57 < Cracki> maybe I should order a ton, cook them off their boards, then resell
2019-02-27T06:58:57 < Cracki> dongs, get him a 3d printer, then cut a hole in the bottom
2019-02-27T06:59:27 < Cracki> aren't there a bunch of maker-grade robotik arms out there? half of them use hobby-rc-grade analog servos for joints
2019-02-27T06:59:45 < Cracki> he shouldn't move the cam, he should move the calib pattern
2019-02-27T07:00:13 < Cracki> forget "repeatable" unless you go for proper mechanics.
2019-02-27T07:01:14 < Cracki> interestingly, he could just point it at a flatscreen and flash "ideal views" at it
2019-02-27T07:01:47 < Cracki> _if_ he could figure out the optical center, that is :>
2019-02-27T07:07:41 < Cracki> kek someone made a 100 ppr encoder and wheel using a 45 ppi pickup. 45 ppi pickup out of stock, use 150 ppi pickup. now you have to make new wheels... which are 334 ppr, which is what can be found on the internet
2019-02-27T07:29:24 < Cracki> dongs, is that dude maybe involved in some autonomous drone racing competition? a few days ago someone like that showed up elsewhere and definitely wanted a calibration rig
2019-02-27T07:32:52 < aandrew> what is this person trying to do
2019-02-27T07:33:09 < aandrew> can you work with an xy mover rather than an arm? that would solve a lot of complexity and repeatability
2019-02-27T07:38:13 < Cracki> camera calibration involves waving a chess board pattern in front of it
2019-02-27T07:38:35 < Cracki> stuff needs to be oblique
2019-02-27T07:39:09 < Cracki> think "bouncy 3d shapes screensaver"
2019-02-27T07:39:50 < Cracki> xy + z-rotation of an obliquely mounted board, so you get tilts in all directions
2019-02-27T07:40:55 < Cracki> maybe I should contribute a more robust calibration method... opencv is very picky about what it likes
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2019-02-27T08:49:17 < tjq> goy
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2019-02-27T09:04:04 < qyx> any idea how to terminate multiple thin coax pigtails on a pcb?
2019-02-27T09:04:33 < qyx> not the kakimir style
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2019-02-27T09:05:09 < jpa-> bunch of connectors seems the obvious choice
2019-02-27T09:05:11 < jpa-> u.fl or sma
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2019-02-27T09:05:16 < qyx> impedance matching is not that important, those are electret mic inputs
2019-02-27T09:05:26 < qyx> I have like 40mm of card edge space and there are 8 coaxes
2019-02-27T09:05:33 < qyx> maybe right angle mmcx
2019-02-27T09:05:43 < jpa-> yeah, that's nice also
2019-02-27T09:06:11 < qyx> I am browsing multiport coax connectors now but they are all $$$
2019-02-27T09:13:43 < qyx> jpa-: micro d-sub!
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2019-02-27T11:00:20 < jadew> finally increased my resolution on my 4:3 monitors from 1024x768 to 1280x1024 and I'm super happy that I found a scaling factor that works
2019-02-27T11:00:33 < jadew> everything else made it look weird, which is why I didn't switch until now
2019-02-27T11:01:09 < jadew> it now looks exactly the same, except higher resolution
2019-02-27T11:03:55 < jadew> haha, yeah
2019-02-27T11:04:12 < jadew> don't know what I'll do when they'll stop working
2019-02-27T11:04:20 < jadew> I guess I'll fix them :P
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2019-02-27T11:04:48 < kakimir> 1920 man
2019-02-27T11:04:56 < kakimir> you need to see it
2019-02-27T11:05:09 < kakimir> it's incredible
2019-02-27T11:05:26 < jadew> you mean 1920x1080?
2019-02-27T11:05:41 < jadew> I have one like that
2019-02-27T11:05:44 < kakimir> I mean 1920 x X
2019-02-27T11:06:10 < jadew> there's really not that big of a difference between 1024 and 1080
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2019-02-27T11:06:24 < jadew> 66 pixels...
2019-02-27T11:06:37 < kakimir> you need to compare rows to rows
2019-02-27T11:06:46 < kakimir> not rows to cols
2019-02-27T11:06:55 < jadew> ?
2019-02-27T11:07:22 < jadew> my two 4:3 screens have almost the same vertical resolution as the wide, HD one
2019-02-27T11:07:29 < jadew> I'm comparing rows to rows
2019-02-27T11:07:35 < kakimir> I see
2019-02-27T11:07:42 < kakimir> I was mistaken
2019-02-27T11:08:19 < jadew> there is a difference between HD and Full HD, that's for sure
2019-02-27T11:08:32 < jadew> I mean, everything is more defined now
2019-02-27T11:09:14 < jadew> and again, I already had one monitor on Full HD resolution, I'm not coming out of the dark agaes
2019-02-27T11:10:50 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-27T11:11:21 < jadew> but still, I've been using them a lot and it's a huge difference
2019-02-27T11:11:33 < jadew> feels very satisfying
2019-02-27T11:12:34 < jadew> reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-wbWGwZ7_k
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2019-02-27T11:32:21 < dongs> code::cocks
2019-02-27T11:32:37 < dongs> holy shit waht teh fuck is that code
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2019-02-27T11:35:12 < kakimir> Haohmaru: why not atmel studio?
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2019-02-27T11:37:15 < qyx> ugh font without antialiasing
2019-02-27T11:37:21 < qyx> wtf in 2019
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2019-02-27T11:37:56 < dongs> thats just fucking courier
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2019-02-27T11:38:01 < dongs> what is so special about that gay font
2019-02-27T11:38:16 < qyx> I don't even recognize ( and <
2019-02-27T11:38:39 < qyx> it is not just a fucking courier
2019-02-27T11:38:40 < dongs> ( { < all looks fucking terrible
2019-02-27T11:38:47 < qyx> it is some shit bitmap font or a fully hinted one
2019-02-27T11:39:00 < dongs> i'
2019-02-27T11:39:02 < dongs> d guess bitmap
2019-02-27T11:39:30 < dongs> theres so much shitty coding style in tehre tho i dont eve nwanna read it
2019-02-27T11:40:36 < kakimir> everybodi gay
2019-02-27T11:42:32 < kakimir> my atmel studio session is at 600M
2019-02-27T11:42:35 < kakimir> not 1GB
2019-02-27T11:43:02 < kakimir> sure it might peak to 1GB when compiling or something
2019-02-27T11:43:30 < qyx> 98MB here
2019-02-27T11:43:32 < qyx> who is less
2019-02-27T11:43:49 < qyx> and it is not even vim
2019-02-27T11:47:50 < kakimir> why not update your computer Haohmaru 
2019-02-27T11:50:03 < kakimir> but you clearly have a problem still
2019-02-27T11:51:12 < kakimir> yes yes
2019-02-27T11:53:23 < kakimir> but if you make 1GB of memory use a problem
2019-02-27T11:54:15 < kakimir> totally arbitrary limit to how you do stuff
2019-02-27T12:04:02 < zyp> not arbitrary if your computer only got 1GB ram :p
2019-02-27T12:05:15 < kakimir> having only 1GB of ram in computer is arbitrary limit
2019-02-27T12:05:24 < kakimir> *an arbitrary
2019-02-27T12:06:05 < zyp> haha
2019-02-27T12:07:41 < kakimir> do you agree?
2019-02-27T12:08:20 < kakimir> excluding some special cases like living outside of 1st world
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2019-02-27T12:17:23 < kakimir> kicad.exe 45MB ram used
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2019-02-27T12:17:45 < kakimir> well that isn't much at all
2019-02-27T12:18:06 < kakimir> schematic editor is open with my bloat
2019-02-27T12:18:31 < kakimir> I think the files of schematic and layout are multiple megabytes
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2019-02-27T12:21:13 < tjq> anime
2019-02-27T12:22:04 < kakimir> Haohmaru: I didn't say it was a problem
2019-02-27T12:22:08 < BrainDamage> you can always zip stream a text format if you want smaller binaries
2019-02-27T12:24:21 < BrainDamage> also, code::blocks? more like cock::blocks
2019-02-27T12:26:13 < kakimir> unfunny :|
2019-02-27T12:26:39 < kakimir> I need to tell you laurencer misses us
2019-02-27T12:26:53 < tjq> i want laurence to come back
2019-02-27T12:27:01 < tjq> and tell us about blaxit
2019-02-27T12:27:03 < tjq> i mean brexity
2019-02-27T12:27:06 < tjq> -y
2019-02-27T12:27:16 < kakimir> he sends me unfunny dm every day
2019-02-27T12:27:56 < tjq> sounds good man
2019-02-27T12:29:39 < kakimir> sometimes funny
2019-02-27T12:30:12 < kakimir> he has developed humour.. you wouldn't believe
2019-02-27T12:32:23 < tjq> other channel exist?
2019-02-27T12:33:59 < BrainDamage> iirc dr jeckyll was british
2019-02-27T12:36:51 < tjq> Steffanx: do you want to make some 239
2019-02-27T12:40:20 < tjq> hi sir
2019-02-27T12:41:54 < Steffanx> BrainDamage wants it
2019-02-27T12:42:19 < Steffanx> Awh he stopped sending me DMs, kakimir :)
2019-02-27T12:42:49 < tjq> as  in you blocked him lol?
2019-02-27T12:43:37 < BrainDamage> don't put words in my mouth
2019-02-27T12:45:18 < Steffanx> BrainDamage doesnt want to go nuclear?
2019-02-27T12:45:35 < Steffanx> And no i did not, tjq 
2019-02-27T12:47:02 < tjq> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_decay
2019-02-27T13:01:00 < jadew> Haohmaru, nice bg, you're saving power too?
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2019-02-27T13:10:41 < jadew> the black background
2019-02-27T13:12:34 < Steffanx> More than text
2019-02-27T13:14:51 < PaulFertser> Haohmaru: you can capture SWO with a regular UART too.
2019-02-27T13:15:48 < emeryth> you don't even need reset
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2019-02-27T13:27:05 < englishman> only if your swd pins are set to something else
2019-02-27T13:27:36 < englishman> tho maybe atsmeg dicked that up somehow
2019-02-27T13:27:47 < englishman> they don't have a lot of experience with onchip debugging
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2019-02-27T14:53:47 < jadew> guy from china called me about the front panels
2019-02-27T14:54:00 < jadew> asked me why I didn't answer back to their quote
2019-02-27T14:54:29 < Steffanx> englishbot why arrow is screwing with me? 
2019-02-27T14:54:46 < Steffanx> englishman *
2019-02-27T14:55:40 < Steffanx> Selected Fedex, got an email from arrow with "Carrier: Fedex" but the track and trace code is UPS. Whyyy?
2019-02-27T14:58:27 < Steffanx> (only selected fedex because it was free and ups wasnt, but...  Meh)
2019-02-27T15:20:12 < zyp> haha
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2019-02-27T16:46:18 < englishman> lol Steffanx
2019-02-27T16:46:24 < englishman> they pull that shit all the time
2019-02-27T16:46:44 < englishman> I complained to the salesman and he blamed it on me somehow
2019-02-27T16:47:04 < englishman> cuz ups sucks dick here
2019-02-27T16:47:19 < Steffanx> Doesnt matter to me. Its not dhl
2019-02-27T16:49:39 < aandrew> I'm interpreting VT100 codes on USB CDC. how fucked am I?
2019-02-27T16:50:46 < fenugrec> So, arrow has free shipping, but they don't charge tax, they let fedex do that and make their money on that instead. Clever
2019-02-27T16:51:15 < aandrew> I've had good support from arrow and verical
2019-02-27T16:51:22 < aandrew> digikey is still the #1 best 
2019-02-27T16:51:30 < aandrew> mouser used to be total shit but has stepped their game up quite a bit
2019-02-27T16:51:47 < aandrew> TME takes forever of course
2019-02-27T16:52:00 < aandrew> there are a couple oddball places I occassionally get parts from too
2019-02-27T16:53:33 < fenugrec> aandrew, "good support", do you always get this COD tax bs ?
2019-02-27T16:54:36 < aandrew> if I order something where there will be duties/taxes yes but both fedex and ups have good systems in place for that. I get a text, I submit cc info, shit's fine. sometimes the driver doesn't get the notification in time and I have to give him CC info again but when he gets back to the depot they see it's been paid and I've never been double-charged
2019-02-27T16:54:43 < aandrew> hell DHL even does this
2019-02-27T16:55:05 < aandrew> there's a weird new little carrier that amazon is using a lot, they have a great system but their drivers are shit
2019-02-27T16:55:26 < aandrew> the address clearly says 50-123 mystreet (it's a UPS store in a strip mall)
2019-02-27T16:55:57 < aandrew> driver calls and is like "where the hell is 50-123 mystreet" while in the parking lot there, and I say "look at the doors, each is numbered. look for #50"
2019-02-27T16:56:06 < aandrew> "how the hell am I to know it's a UPS store?"
2019-02-27T16:56:12 < aandrew> "you don't need to. Look for the number"
2019-02-27T16:56:16 < aandrew> fucking numbnuts
2019-02-27T16:56:18 < fenugrec> hahaha
2019-02-27T16:56:29 < aandrew> that's bad driver Type A
2019-02-27T16:57:01 < aandrew> bad driver Type B doesn't even attempt delivery, just says "nobody answered" -- unfortunately for them I get realtime updates and call the courier office and tell them their driver's a lying sack of shit
2019-02-27T16:57:18 < aandrew> I don't have that issue with fedex, ups or dhl, only intelcom
2019-02-27T16:57:39 < fenugrec> well, CP has been pretty dumb here too. They've returned some packages once claiming "recipient does not live there" ; and another time "nobody at home" after some fresh snow and I had photo evidence that nobody had walked up to the door P)
2019-02-27T16:58:20 < aandrew> however, intelcom is the only one which emails you to say "your package is on the truck, the driver is Sadith who is delivering #5, you are #18 on his list"
2019-02-27T17:01:14 < BrainDamage> I routinely get bad driver type B with ups
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2019-02-27T17:10:55 < qyx> there are no bad drivers here
2019-02-27T17:11:15 < qyx> aandrew: where are you that TME takes ages to deliver?
2019-02-27T17:11:43 < qyx> they are doing next business day delivery if you order before ~~noon
2019-02-27T17:15:19 < jadew> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fV8R3wq3utA
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2019-02-27T17:37:26 < aandrew> qyx: canada
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2019-02-27T17:44:33 < rajkosto> how do you increase resolution by adding white noise again
2019-02-27T17:45:29 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oversampling
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2019-02-27T18:02:06 < rajkosto> yeah but i need a dithering upsampler or something
2019-02-27T18:02:50 < qyx> aandrew: explains a lot
2019-02-27T18:05:31 < Steffanx> fenugrec: for me arrow does do VAT et all. Even some duties paid thing
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2019-02-27T18:07:55 < aandrew> rajkosto: basically you add a little bit (1/2LSB?) noise to create lots of transitions, and then with oversampling you get better than 1LSB resoution becuase you are averaging
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2019-02-27T18:09:32 < aandrew> dithering always takes me a bit to grok; I think it's mainly to prevent "cogging" around the LSB 
2019-02-27T18:09:51 < aandrew> probably oversampling already takes care of that anyway. I'm not a signal measurement expert
2019-02-27T18:10:30 < kakimir> leaky fets
2019-02-27T18:12:17 < fenugrec> Steffanx, interesting, I wonder why they didn't do it for this, pretty typical US->CAN purchase
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2019-02-27T18:36:19 < kakimir> oh amateur mistake
2019-02-27T18:36:28 < kakimir> fet is wrong way
2019-02-27T18:36:38 < kakimir> bodge fet
2019-02-27T18:39:14 < kakimir> that was fun
2019-02-27T18:39:38 < kakimir> it worked like it should until certain voltage
2019-02-27T18:50:04 < kakimir> wow
2019-02-27T18:50:24 < kakimir> thing I made worked better than expected
2019-02-27T18:50:52 < kakimir> I simulated 10ms for step response
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2019-02-27T18:51:52 < kakimir> then tester tells me it's 10ms measured
2019-02-27T18:52:56 < kakimir> it doesn't only test that there is no shorts
2019-02-27T18:53:43 < kakimir> it also measures that step response of capacitance/resistance is within thresholds
2019-02-27T18:54:10 < mawk>  I found three boxes full of the same card at my school lab, they're pretty heavy, contain each a like 300W power supply, then a big pcb with hdmi, peritel, composite RCA, sound, SPDIF, and two ethernet ports
2019-02-27T18:54:15 < mawk> I found no useful ref on it
2019-02-27T18:54:26 < mawk> what could it be ? some pro stuff for tv broadcast companies or something ?
2019-02-27T18:54:50 < mawk> someone put a FLASHED sticker on each board
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2019-02-27T18:56:40 < mawk> there's a STB7100 chip on it, which is a video decoding chip
2019-02-27T18:57:49 < fenugrec> mawk, pic
2019-02-27T18:58:34 < zyp> fpga devboard?
2019-02-27T18:59:04 < mawk> I left the lab already
2019-02-27T18:59:21 < zyp> fpga devboards tend to be full of logos though
2019-02-27T18:59:32 < mawk> doesn't look like to be fpga, it sounds targeted at video decoding
2019-02-27T18:59:43 < mawk> the chip on it is a H.264 decoder
2019-02-27T18:59:46 < mawk> made by st
2019-02-27T19:00:13 < mawk> https://www.cs.indiana.edu/~geobrown/publications/stb7100.pdf
2019-02-27T19:00:25 < zyp> that the only major chip on the board?
2019-02-27T19:01:39 < mawk> the board is big like a A3 paper, there's a ton of chips
2019-02-27T19:01:45 < mawk> but it's the major chip apparently
2019-02-27T19:01:53 < mawk> since it's written directly on the side of the board
2019-02-27T19:03:45 < zyp> maybe somebody picked apart a couple of STBs :p
2019-02-27T19:04:10 -!- c10ud [~c10ud@emesene/dictator/c10ud] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
2019-02-27T19:05:01 < mawk> it's solidly bolted to a large metal plate, with a large power supply
2019-02-27T19:05:27 < zyp> STB prototype then?
2019-02-27T19:07:30 < mawk> maybe
2019-02-27T19:07:35 < mawk> maybe learning boards
2019-02-27T19:07:45 < mawk> but I have so many of them now
2019-02-27T19:07:49 < mawk> maybe I can sell them
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2019-02-27T19:31:54 < englishman> fenugrec: sign up for a FedEx account
2019-02-27T19:32:00 < englishman> it's free
2019-02-27T19:32:04 < englishman> no more brokerage fee
2019-02-27T19:32:33 < antto> aandrew no, dither doesn't really help
2019-02-27T19:32:45 < fenugrec> englishman, did not know that. they probably need a cc # on hand though ?
2019-02-27T19:32:50 < antto> you can't CSIMIAMI more information than the input had
2019-02-27T19:33:22 < antto> dither works in the other axis
2019-02-27T19:33:26 < englishman> yes they do
2019-02-27T19:33:53 < englishman> and you can get any package rebilled on that acct as long as the addresses match
2019-02-27T19:34:14 < englishman> the fee is really for prepayment and collection
2019-02-27T19:34:21 < englishman> with a CC on file they just bill you
2019-02-27T19:34:23 < englishman> but no fee
2019-02-27T19:35:50 < englishman> aandrew intelcom has been great
2019-02-27T19:36:08 < englishman> far more reliable than cp
2019-02-27T19:36:14 < fenugrec> thanks for the protip, will check it out
2019-02-27T19:36:20 < fenugrec> yeah I believe that
2019-02-27T19:39:11 < englishman> always happy to help out a neighbour
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2019-02-27T19:49:17 < aandrew> antto: CISMIAMI?
2019-02-27T19:49:36 < antto> no, CSI miami.. i used it as a verb ;P~
2019-02-27T19:49:55 < aandrew> oh I got it now
2019-02-27T19:50:08 < aandrew> it's not so much about getting more info than was there I don't think
2019-02-27T19:50:42 < aandrew> oversampling trades more bits for more time
2019-02-27T19:50:44 < antto> you know, their magical algorithm can "enhance" a 4k turbo-HD crystal-clear picture out of 5 noisy pixels
2019-02-27T19:50:48 < aandrew> yes yes
2019-02-27T19:50:55 < aandrew> I remember that show well
2019-02-27T19:51:03 < aandrew> didn't watch it much but the memes
2019-02-27T19:51:41 < antto> dither helps if for the bit depth, not the resolution
2019-02-27T19:51:49 < antto> --if;
2019-02-27T19:53:30 < antto> you could encode a grayscale image as 1bit (monochrome) and if you put a gud dither - it works (but it works in a way that it requires a bit of blur, so if you keep the resolution the same - you loose some high frequencies after the blur)
2019-02-27T19:53:41 < antto> encode? i meant convert
2019-02-27T19:56:44 < aandrew> what is the difference between resolution and bit depth? that's the same thing is it not?
2019-02-27T19:56:55 < antto> no
2019-02-27T19:56:58 < englishman> no
2019-02-27T19:57:23 < englishman> bits per pixel, dynamic range, however you want to call it
2019-02-27T19:57:32 < antto> bit depth is within one sample/pixel, that tells you how accurate you can represent its value (be it amplitude, luminosity, or whatever)
2019-02-27T19:57:45 < aandrew> bit depth isn't about accuracy
2019-02-27T19:57:58 < aandrew> bit depth is how many discrete steps you can resolve the analog signal in to; which is resolution
2019-02-27T19:58:53  * antto drops a monochrome image on the concrete floor
2019-02-27T19:59:19 < bitmask> https://i.imgur.com/5nLLjNI.jpg
2019-02-27T19:59:24 < aandrew> monochrome image is 1 bit
2019-02-27T19:59:27 < aandrew> well
2019-02-27T19:59:29 < bitmask> drunk on bags
2019-02-27T19:59:51 < antto> * warning: plastic bag fetishist detected
2019-02-27T19:59:51 < aandrew> grayscale can have any number of bit depths, including 1 bit which would be monochrome
2019-02-27T20:00:10 < bitmask> ;)
2019-02-27T20:00:58 < antto> image resolution is usually given by amount of pixels, while the bitdepth is given sepparately since that tells you how much dynamic range you can have
2019-02-27T20:01:19 < aandrew> ok but now you're conflating image resolution with converter resolution
2019-02-27T20:01:27 < aandrew> 1024x768 vs 16 bit adc
2019-02-27T20:01:32 < antto> converter?
2019-02-27T20:01:37 < antto> what converter?!
2019-02-27T20:01:48 < antto> who said anything about a converter
2019-02-27T20:01:51 < aandrew> we are talking about ADCs
2019-02-27T20:02:06 < aandrew> or at least I started by talking about ADCs, perhaps I wandered into a completely different discussion
2019-02-27T20:02:08 < antto> i thought you were talking about images
2019-02-27T20:02:50 < aandrew> I apologize, I was probably not being clear at all
2019-02-27T20:03:13 < antto> then yes, dither helps in audio (or signals) whenever you have to reduce a signal's bit depth and you want to avoid the quantisation noise sounding like quantisation noise
2019-02-27T20:04:05 < antto> and audio is sorta like an image with less dimensions ;P~
2019-02-27T20:04:10 < antto> (kinda oversimplified)
2019-02-27T20:04:48 -!- m4ssi [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2019-02-27T20:04:48 < antto> and one axis is akchually time
2019-02-27T20:05:36 < englishman> the ADCs in CMOS sensors are pretty trick tho
2019-02-27T20:06:00 < englishman> there are new sensors that can detect less than a single electron
2019-02-27T20:06:13 < antto> #homeopathy
2019-02-27T20:06:16 < antto> >:)
2019-02-27T20:09:52 < kakimir> less than single electron?
2019-02-27T20:09:57 < englishman> ya
2019-02-27T20:10:24 < englishman> 0.7e- sensitivity
2019-02-27T20:10:34 < antto> crezzi
2019-02-27T20:10:45 < antto> but is teh noise level low?
2019-02-27T20:11:02 < englishman> yeah the various noises are below that too
2019-02-27T20:11:09 < antto> kewl
2019-02-27T20:11:17 < englishman> new stacked BSI shit is crazy
2019-02-27T20:11:31 < antto> i'm happy with my camera, but afaik there are newer sensors now that absolutely rock
2019-02-27T20:11:35 < antto> sony BSI stuff
2019-02-27T20:11:38 < aandrew> right ok that is exactly what I was thinking... dithering reduces "cogging" which the proper term is quantization noise
2019-02-27T20:11:54 < aandrew> and oversampling gives you more apparent resolution at the expense of reduced sample rate
2019-02-27T20:12:07 < antto> wat
2019-02-27T20:12:18 < englishman> sadly there are no global shutter BSI (Exmor R) but anyway for my application BSI isn't necessary
2019-02-27T20:12:26 < antto> oversampling.. doesn't reduce the sampling rate, it.. makes it bigger
2019-02-27T20:12:39 < antto> i also drool over global shutter
2019-02-27T20:12:39 < englishman> wut
2019-02-27T20:12:41 < antto> i want :~(
2019-02-27T20:12:45 < aandrew> antto: well what I'm saying is that if you're not oversampling, you get 8 bits at 1Msps (an example)
2019-02-27T20:13:22 < antto> not sure what you're doing tho, i'm mostly talking from the perspective of audio signals
2019-02-27T20:13:35 < aandrew> with oversampling you're taking every 4 and /16 so now your resolution is what, 10 bits (you now have "quarter bits") but your effective sample rate is now only 250ksps
2019-02-27T20:14:48 < aandrew> because it takes 4 samples to get you your data value that you're using (data = (s1 + s2 + s3 + s4) / 4)
2019-02-27T20:14:53 < antto> oh, you're talking about reducing the sampling rate while using the extra data to improve the amplitude resolution
2019-02-27T20:15:02 < aandrew> yes, which is oversampling
2019-02-27T20:15:05 < aandrew> you're essentially decimating
2019-02-27T20:15:19 < antto> mmm.. in my world oversampling has other meanings too
2019-02-27T20:15:25 < antto> but anywayz
2019-02-27T20:15:41 < aandrew> yep just wanted to make sure I wasn't completely out to lunch
2019-02-27T20:16:13 < antto> that would work if you resample properly (otherwise you also introduce aliasing, so who cares if you got more bits)
2019-02-27T20:27:30 < aandrew> yes, your antialias filter needs to be moved down as well
2019-02-27T20:28:02 < antto> u mean resampling/reconstruction filter
2019-02-27T20:28:43 < antto> this one is usually always at the lower (of the two) sampling frequencies divided by two
2019-02-27T20:29:26 < antto> you could put it even lower but then you start loosing high freqs
2019-02-27T20:42:31 < malinus> remember you want 192khz and 32bit audio. Muh golden ear
2019-02-27T20:43:30 < antto> now now
2019-02-27T20:49:24 < malinus> I don't care about the SnR, I want my 32bit audio. I want my full dynamic ear and instruments tuned to the frequency of the universe®©
2019-02-27T20:50:12 < antto> bluhblah, bloh bleh blih
2019-02-27T20:57:25 < mawk> some guy just told me about the magical universe vibration frequency malinus 
2019-02-27T20:57:51 < mawk> and started sending me videos about vibrating sand and talking about the magical 432Hz "tesla frequency"
2019-02-27T21:02:14 < aandrew> antto: re antialias/reconstruction -- If you've bandlimited the input do you need to software filter the output of the ADC as well?
2019-02-27T21:06:55 < Cracki> you guys...
2019-02-27T21:07:20 < aandrew> HAY YOU GUISE!
2019-02-27T21:07:26 < aandrew> fuck now I gotta watch the Goonies
2019-02-27T21:08:23 < Steffanx> Enjoy
2019-02-27T21:09:00 < Cracki> btw, quantization can give you a _lack_ of noise if your signal is right in the middle of the LSB, so sampling that signal however often will never give you different values
2019-02-27T21:09:07 < Cracki> that's what "adding noise" is all about
2019-02-27T21:09:23 < Cracki> I would stick to calling it cogging or whatever, not quantization noise
2019-02-27T21:10:10 < Cracki> so... yes it's noise, but only because it's a distortion of the true signal
2019-02-27T21:10:44 < Cracki> I'm sure you both meant the same thing :P
2019-02-27T21:11:23 < aandrew> right, the audio people complain because it makes the audio sound a little funny if it's just the right level
2019-02-27T21:11:43 < aandrew> so you add a bit of noise so the signal isn't sitting inbetween bits
2019-02-27T21:11:49 < aandrew> makes it sound more natural
2019-02-27T21:12:02 < aandrew> or at least higher resolution even though it's not actually 
2019-02-27T21:12:24 < Cracki> audio ppl complain too much. they should all be forced to listen to cassette tapes
2019-02-27T21:12:25 < rajkosto> ah youre talking about doing it in the analog domain then sampling
2019-02-27T21:12:29 < rajkosto> what about the other way around
2019-02-27T21:12:37 < Cracki> wat
2019-02-27T21:12:46 < rajkosto> DAC not ADC
2019-02-27T21:12:48 < Cracki> yes analog domain, after sampling you're fucked
2019-02-27T21:12:50 < malinus> mawk: huw. The funny part is how they claim that 432hz is the frequency of the earth, because of the 7.83Hz frequency of the earths magnetic field... But 7.83Hz and 432Hz?! 
2019-02-27T21:13:26 < Cracki> sell them gold foil hats to listen to the earth's song
2019-02-27T21:14:56 < malinus> you mean golden TOSLINK connectors?
2019-02-27T21:15:27 < Cracki> no, literally gold sheets folded into a hat
2019-02-27T21:15:41 < Cracki> must cost something or it's worthless
2019-02-27T21:15:47 < kakimir> platinums
2019-02-27T21:16:46 < malinus> that sound exepnsive. Can't I just have chinese find a method to produce something metal-like as cheap as possbile, and color it?
2019-02-27T21:17:58 < malinus> well thinking about it, I could just have these gold sheets produced in china. Pay for the price of gold, just to realize after a few production runs, that it isn't gold. And they just found a method to produce something a bit similar.
2019-02-27T21:17:59 < Cracki> yes you can use that copper-nitrogen catalyzer the chinese made
2019-02-27T21:18:20 < Cracki> try brass
2019-02-27T21:18:32 < malinus> brass pretty expensive though, no?
2019-02-27T21:18:50 < Cracki> less than gold afaik
2019-02-27T21:19:00 < Cracki> besides, you could just use tin and gold-plate it
2019-02-27T21:19:13 < Cracki> tin or alu or watever's available
2019-02-27T21:21:30 < Cracki> oh goy gsoc applicants... I tell him the email addresses are on the same page yet he doesn't think to ctrl-f for them
2019-02-27T21:25:38 < kakimir> what is cracki planning now
2019-02-27T21:26:10 < Cracki> me? dindu nuffin
2019-02-27T21:26:15 < kakimir> magnetic field has frequency?
2019-02-27T21:26:23 < kakimir> wut srly?
2019-02-27T21:26:26 < Cracki> can has. or can be "dc"
2019-02-27T21:26:37 < Cracki> all light is wiggly electro-MAGNETIC waves
2019-02-27T21:27:01 < kakimir> everything is a wave
2019-02-27T21:27:15 < Cracki> you might be tickled to know, muscles (or the nerves controlling them) also create magnetic fields (in addition to electric fields)
2019-02-27T21:27:32 < kakimir> ye
2019-02-27T21:27:37 < Cracki> there are some diseases of the heart you can only pick up well with a big fucking magnetic coil
2019-02-27T21:27:55 < kakimir> interesting
2019-02-27T21:28:04 < kakimir> biomagnetic sensing
2019-02-27T21:28:06 < Cracki> on a ECG they are removed because you have to remove common mode (or something)
2019-02-27T21:28:29 < Cracki> aye, "bioelectromagnetism" is the book one dude wrote
2019-02-27T21:28:49 < Cracki> with magnets you can pick up fetal heart beat
2019-02-27T21:29:18 < Cracki> can't do that with electrodes because the mother's belly electrically isolates you from the child. something about fat lining of whatever's there (normal thing)
2019-02-27T21:29:56 -!- hetii [~dev@89-74-254-63.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-27T21:29:58 < hetii> Hi :)
2019-02-27T21:30:05 < Cracki> ave
2019-02-27T21:35:35 < hetii> I start design some handy device that will allow me flash and fix avr fuses in HVPP, HVSP,ISP mode, also write spi flashes and uv eprom. This part will be handled by atmega128, in addition my plan is to use stm32f103c8t6 blue pill to have JTAG, SWD, SWIM?, uart support. The problem is that I found different implementation of JTAG/SWD for blue pill and don`t know with one Is the best to grab.
2019-02-27T21:36:01 < hetii> One of shoot is Black Magic Probe  firmware
2019-02-27T21:36:20 < hetii> and i`m not sure if st-link is open sourced?
2019-02-27T21:36:52 < hetii> My plan is also to add usb blaster protocol to handle FPGA
2019-02-27T21:37:05 < hetii> How do you think is it doable?
2019-02-27T21:38:47 < mawk> I'm sure there are better parts than the « blue pill »
2019-02-27T21:38:51 < qyx> sure but it is easier to buy jlink
2019-02-27T21:40:25 < Cracki> prototyping, use whatever works
2019-02-27T21:40:41 < hetii> qyx, well it`s not the point to order ready made device but to learn something when doing this, beside that my plan is to add there also esp8266 or esp32 so will have connection over wifi
2019-02-27T21:43:09 < PaulFertser> hetii: maybe port full openocd to esp32?
2019-02-27T21:44:37 < qyx> or to stm32
2019-02-27T21:44:41 -!- gsi__ is now known as gsi_
2019-02-27T21:44:42 < qyx> I would appreciate it
2019-02-27T21:47:27 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/new/3023071 hmm south of france
2019-02-27T21:48:15 < kakimir> is that normal?
2019-02-27T21:54:14 < Cracki> oceanic climate
2019-02-27T21:57:40 < mawk> yes kakimir 
2019-02-27T21:57:46 < mawk> south of france is hot
2019-02-27T21:57:49 < mawk> I never go there for that reason
2019-02-27T21:57:51 < mawk> I like cold climates
2019-02-27T21:59:37 < kakimir> it looks okay
2019-02-27T21:59:40 < kakimir> at the moment
2019-02-27T21:59:46 < kakimir> https://pr0gramm.com/new/3022577
2019-02-27T22:01:12 < Cracki> good movie
2019-02-27T22:02:33 < Cracki> https://pr0gramm.com/top/3022990
2019-02-27T22:03:51 < kakimir> that is how you get job at NYT
2019-02-27T22:06:07 -!- fenugrec [~fenugrec@24.105.71.66] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
2019-02-27T22:19:36 < rajkosto> https://images.sshnuke.net/2019-02-27_21-19-32_sq39smfLM.png what are these called
2019-02-27T22:20:29 < hetii> rajkosto, maybe fpc connector?
2019-02-27T22:23:25 -!- renn0xtk9 [~max@ipbcc068ba.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-27T22:24:40 < qyx>  if((Fs!=48000&&Fs!=24000&&Fs!=16000&&Fs!=12000&&Fs!=8000)||(channels!=1&&channels!=2)||
2019-02-27T22:24:45 < qyx> fuk laurenceb style code
2019-02-27T22:26:45 < Steffanx> Lol mathlabcoder
2019-02-27T22:27:29 < kakimir> math
2019-02-27T22:27:42 < kakimir> not even once
2019-02-27T22:31:59 < Steffanx> did you have a good sleep kakimir?
2019-02-27T22:34:54 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-27T22:35:05 < kakimir> your good sleep wishes did magic
2019-02-27T22:35:13 < Steffanx> Good good :P
2019-02-27T22:35:24 < kakimir> bliss
2019-02-27T22:37:05 < mawk> I HaCkEd my feature phone
2019-02-27T22:37:12 < mawk> because I'm bored waiting for my new smartphone
2019-02-27T22:37:19 < mawk> I made it send SMSes through the usb cable
2019-02-27T22:37:27 < Steffanx> Damn the hacks.
2019-02-27T22:37:34 < mawk> using shady unsigned drivers I found on a russian forum I exposed the phone as a COM port
2019-02-27T22:37:42 < mawk> then tried common AT commands, and it was the modem
2019-02-27T22:37:46 < mawk> so I could send SMSes
2019-02-27T22:37:48 < kakimir> wow
2019-02-27T22:37:53 < kakimir> that is real hacking
2019-02-27T22:37:58 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-27T22:38:03 < Steffanx> Back in the time i used my Siemens S35i for that.
2019-02-27T22:38:19 < Steffanx> soldering wires to some pads in your phone <3
2019-02-27T22:38:19 < qyx> it works with most of the phones out of box
2019-02-27T22:38:24 < qyx> on normal operating systems
2019-02-27T22:38:27 < Steffanx> talk uart to it
2019-02-27T22:38:29 < kakimir> download shady files from russian hacker forum and throw them at devices
2019-02-27T22:38:41 < kakimir> protection bypassed
2019-02-27T22:38:52 < kakimir> we are in
2019-02-27T22:39:01 < mawk> if they decide to get a standard serial chip qyx 
2019-02-27T22:39:10 < mawk> something that windows or linux knows of out of the box
2019-02-27T22:39:19 < mawk> or even go with the standards of the standards, CDC-ACM
2019-02-27T22:39:20 < kakimir> do the modems still talk AT in year 2019?
2019-02-27T22:39:29 < Steffanx> ya
2019-02-27T22:39:55 < qyx> yes
2019-02-27T22:40:16 < qyx> even the new bluetooth and lora things
2019-02-27T22:40:20 < mawk> yeah
2019-02-27T22:40:26 < mawk> the sigfox module I played with takes AT commands
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2019-02-27T22:42:08 < mawk> fenugrec is a plant
2019-02-27T22:42:18 < mawk> my irc dictionnary even knows about it
2019-02-27T22:42:21 < fenugrec> I most certainly am not
2019-02-27T22:42:38 < mawk> so plants talk
2019-02-27T22:42:42 < mawk> what will vegans eat next
2019-02-27T22:43:08 < Steffanx> hedde drugs op mawk?
2019-02-27T22:43:55 < mawk> nee
2019-02-27T22:43:58 < mawk> :(
2019-02-27T22:44:13 < mawk> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fenugreek
2019-02-27T22:44:30 < kakimir> https://www.bike-components.de/en/Schwalbe/Big-Apple-28-Wired-Tyre-p30616/ planning to switch 622-50 -> 622-60
2019-02-27T22:46:16 < mawk> apart from the AT modem the phone exposes a second serial port, and it spits out messages that gets me 0 hits on google
2019-02-27T22:47:07 < Steffanx> Do you still need spikes in your tires or is the snow/ice gone kakimir?
2019-02-27T22:48:02 < kakimir> I don't use my spikes currently
2019-02-27T22:49:30 < kakimir> because of storage solution of my bike - also I'm just cruising
2019-02-27T22:58:49 -!- mode/##stm32 [-bbbb *!~root@168.235.89.* *!80f3021d@*.2.29 *!~Streaker@unaffiliated/streaker *!*@host86-141-2-42.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] by ChanServ
2019-02-27T22:58:52 -!- mode/##stm32 [-bb *!*@cca100-pool11.nottingham.ac.uk *!*@81.141.246.111] by ChanServ
2019-02-27T23:18:51 < mawk> I think I've stepped foot inside a ring of chinese phone stealers
2019-02-27T23:18:55 < mawk> while searching for drivers for the phone
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2019-02-27T23:20:28 < malinus> people still steal phones? in 2019?
2019-02-27T23:20:32 < malinus> is this 1999?
2019-02-27T23:21:07 < malinus> mawk: next you tell me you found a car stereo theft
2019-02-27T23:21:18 < rajkosto> theyre pretty easy to steal
2019-02-27T23:21:20 < emeb> rip off a phone and just as likely to end up with a worthless android as a top-line iPhone.
2019-02-27T23:21:24 < rajkosto> and considering they can go 1000-2000$
2019-02-27T23:21:45 < mawk> they're discussing softwares to disable the remote blocking things and how to change IMEI to resell
2019-02-27T23:22:16 < malinus> and ask about car stereo unlock codes
2019-02-27T23:22:25 < emeb> rofl
2019-02-27T23:25:53 < Cracki> you don't believe people steal phones? haha
2019-02-27T23:26:26 < Cracki> in germany it's absolutely expected to get your phone robbed and your teeth knocked out if you resist, if you frequent the right place at the right time
2019-02-27T23:27:17 < emeb> unpossible - Germany is a progressive paradise where bad things never happen!
2019-02-27T23:27:41 < Cracki> progressive dystopia if anything
2019-02-27T23:28:08 < Cracki> since 2015, if you voice a common sense opinion, you get unpersoned out of all social circles
2019-02-27T23:28:50 < malinus> Cracki: I live 200km from germany and I've never heard of anyone (I know) getting robbed or having anything stolen, ever.
2019-02-27T23:29:06 < malinus> I guess that's far enough away, haha.
2019-02-27T23:29:39 < Cracki> I know someone who got robbed three times when he was in high school... but not by school mates, but random diversities in and around public transport
2019-02-27T23:29:54 < hetii> Could someone explain me why baite stm clone need such amount of different resistors? https://wiki.cuvoodoo.info/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=jtag:baite-v2a.pdf
2019-02-27T23:30:09 < Cracki> he lives in the "Ruhrpott" tho, that's a ratty part of germany
2019-02-27T23:30:19 < Cracki> wat resistors?
2019-02-27T23:30:42 < Cracki> ah, it "needs" them to DO something?
2019-02-27T23:31:14 < Cracki> what are those labels? "221" is supposed to be 22e1 ohms?
2019-02-27T23:31:37 < Cracki> wouldn't make sense, they label things "100" which would be 100 ohms... that's a little tight
2019-02-27T23:31:43 < Cracki> *10 ohms
2019-02-27T23:32:06 < hetii> Ye, but for what, ok I can understand those for current limit  but wonder why firmware need to have PB8+PB9+PB10 etc or PB12 + PB14
2019-02-27T23:32:07 < hetii> etc
2019-02-27T23:32:08 < Cracki> oh, "22" ohm at usart pins. maybe that schematic is just shit
2019-02-27T23:32:27 < Cracki> using two pins because those lines are a bus
2019-02-27T23:32:40 < Cracki> you need one pin to drive, another to sense if you've been talked over or the other side is talking
2019-02-27T23:32:56 < hetii> he? 
2019-02-27T23:32:56 < Cracki> (regularly)
2019-02-27T23:33:03 < Cracki> point at specific pins pls
2019-02-27T23:33:06 < hetii> but those ports are bidirectional
2019-02-27T23:33:08 < hetii> :)
2019-02-27T23:33:19 < Cracki> pb8-11 look intertwined
2019-02-27T23:33:33 < Cracki> oh boy that's some nasty schematic
2019-02-27T23:33:58 < Cracki> b7,b9,b10 tied together with nothing in between
2019-02-27T23:34:47 < Cracki> does this abomination have any comments to it? source code?
2019-02-27T23:34:50 < zyp> I assume those are coding pins
2019-02-27T23:34:59 < hetii> to get 7 signals exposed by jtag connector it consume most of pins in my blue pill boards so I really wonder why someone design it such way
2019-02-27T23:35:29 < Cracki> maybe they copied stlink reference... that's what I would hope at least
2019-02-27T23:36:00 < zyp> hetii, what's your goal anyway?
2019-02-27T23:37:10 < hetii> In black magic code it seam that not of all this pins are used: https://github.com/blacksphere/blackmagic/blob/master/src/platforms/stlink/platform.h
2019-02-27T23:37:15 < hetii> it make more sense
2019-02-27T23:37:36 < Cracki> BMP is its own firmware. stlink is under noone's control but ST
2019-02-27T23:37:50 < rajkosto> hetii, you have 2 pins connected to the same wire so that you can read and write at the same time
2019-02-27T23:37:56 < Cracki> what zyp said, it might be keying the firmware checks to know what version of the board it's on
2019-02-27T23:38:15 < hetii> zyp, well my goal Is to get knowlagde with one of those pins I really need to use.
2019-02-27T23:38:43 < zyp> that sounds like a means to me, not a goal
2019-02-27T23:39:19 < hetii> Global goal is to get as much pins as I can as I will need them for other purpose on my programmer :)
2019-02-27T23:39:31 < zyp> what programmer?
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2019-02-27T23:40:31 < hetii> zyp, let me repaste for you: "I start design some handy device that will allow me flash and fix avr fuses in HVPP, HVSP,ISP mode, also write spi flashes and uv eprom. This part will be handled by atmega128, in addition my plan is to use stm32f103c8t6 blue pill to have JTAG, SWD, SWIM?, uart support. The problem is that I found different implementation of JTAG/SWD for blue pill and don`t know with one Is the best to grab."
2019-02-27T23:41:06 < zyp> uh
2019-02-27T23:41:25 < zyp> so basically you're putting an avr-based avr programmer and a stm32-based stm32 programmer on the same board?
2019-02-27T23:41:47 < hetii> yes + esp8266 or esp32 for wifi
2019-02-27T23:44:32 < zyp> what benefit do you think putting multiple independent programmers on one board will have?
2019-02-27T23:45:05 < hetii> Also I notice that different st clones use different pinout, so i`m not sure if the mapping  inside is accelerated by hardware like SPI or just bit banged.
2019-02-27T23:45:25 < zyp> mostly bit banged, I believe
2019-02-27T23:46:57 < zyp> anyway, if you're just looking for a design to copypaste, I suggest going for the blackmagic design
2019-02-27T23:47:09 < hetii> Well, idea is that I want to reduce amount of wires and dongles in my desk, so I prefer to have one device that I will now how work and can add my stuff if needed.
2019-02-27T23:47:11 < zyp> forget about the stlink stuff
2019-02-27T23:48:01 < hetii> ok do I will lost something if decide use black magic instead st-link?
2019-02-27T23:48:33 < zyp> yeah, you'll lose some frustration :)
2019-02-27T23:48:44 < hetii> hehe, ok I can deal with it :)
2019-02-27T23:49:04 < zyp> well, dunno
2019-02-27T23:50:28 < zyp> stlink combined with openocd might give you some extra features like rtos support or flashing of external memories or whatever else openocd can be configured to do
2019-02-27T23:50:45 < zyp> but on the other hand, it'd also need openocd to do anything at all
2019-02-27T23:51:01 < zyp> blackmagic probe just works without any extra bullshit
2019-02-27T23:52:23 < hetii> zyp, well I like the idea in blackmagic that expose /dev/ttyACM device to talk with, so as I will need add my custom handlers then probably will be easier for me.
2019-02-27T23:53:02 < hetii> Not sure If I will need register some separate usb endpoints but I hope that It can talk via existing one 
2019-02-27T23:53:52 < hetii> but step by step, first need finish my hardware design.
--- Day changed Thu Feb 28 2019
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2019-02-28T00:14:11 < Rickta59> sounds like you just need a rpi + openocd + gpio pins
2019-02-28T00:14:22 < Rickta59> already done
2019-02-28T00:14:29 < Rickta59> avrdude can use rpi gpio
2019-02-28T00:14:37 < Rickta59> openocd can use gpio
2019-02-28T00:14:49 < Rickta59> it can do swd or jtag
2019-02-28T00:15:10 < Rickta59> @ hetii 
2019-02-28T00:15:37 < zyp> good suggestion
2019-02-28T00:16:05 < Rickta59> in fact you can make it network accesible so you can use your desktop and gdb rpi:3333
2019-02-28T00:16:26 < zyp> does the wifi also, so the esp32 is eliminated as well ;)
2019-02-28T00:16:51 < Rickta59> arm-none gdb -ex 'target remote rpiip:3333'
2019-02-28T00:16:58 < Rickta59> arm-none gdb -ex 'target remote rpiip:3333'
2019-02-28T00:17:04 < Rickta59> bleh
2019-02-28T00:17:20 < Rickta59> arm-none-eabi gdb -ex 'target remote rpiip:3333' 
2019-02-28T00:17:27 < Rickta59> arg nm
2019-02-28T00:17:31 < Rickta59> you get the idea
2019-02-28T00:19:40 < hetii> heh ...
2019-02-28T00:23:19 < Rickta59> i use mine with all those + mspdebug so i can debug msp430 chips
2019-02-28T00:24:34 < hetii> I get it :)
2019-02-28T00:24:49 < hetii> But still preper to play with discrete components :)
2019-02-28T00:25:22 < Rickta59> then i load this up on a blue pill to get 3 usb ttl serial ports https://github.com/satoshinm/pill_serial
2019-02-28T00:25:38 < Rickta59> and plug it into the rpi
2019-02-28T00:45:43 < Steffanx> Fucking hell arrow. How can they afford to ship a 26 dollar order in 3 different packages.
2019-02-28T00:45:57 < Steffanx> Im on the othe side of the globe..
2019-02-28T00:45:59 < emeb> volume!
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2019-02-28T00:46:52 < Steffanx> Its just stupid. Especially since one package is like 100 capacitors.
2019-02-28T00:47:01 < Steffanx> 0603.
2019-02-28T00:48:25 < zyp> haha
2019-02-28T00:48:41 < kakimir> somebody else pays your shipping Steffanx 
2019-02-28T00:48:45 < kakimir> it's true
2019-02-28T00:48:51 < kakimir> or at least part of it
2019-02-28T00:49:30 < Steffanx> I guess
2019-02-28T00:50:24 < kakimir> I bet they don't even look at stuff in one order level
2019-02-28T00:50:57 < kakimir> automated systems just spit packages
2019-02-28T00:53:12 < kakimir> hey steff
2019-02-28T00:53:25 < kakimir> I once had package from mouser with 2 caps in it
2019-02-28T00:53:27 < kakimir> not joking
2019-02-28T00:54:04 < kakimir> I had a bunch in my order and 2 caps went to backorder
2019-02-28T00:55:04 < kakimir> at least you can trust distributors to deliver every single part ordered!
2019-02-28T00:56:41 < Steffanx> :)
2019-02-28T00:57:34 < kakimir> I think the package came like 2weeks later
2019-02-28T00:57:38 < kakimir> I was like wat this
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2019-02-28T02:05:16 < Cracki> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NtRGESjKT6M
2019-02-28T02:05:38 < Cracki> I have never heard anything narrated like this
2019-02-28T02:07:02 < kakimir> have you done processor in the loop simulations?
2019-02-28T02:10:41 < Cracki> me? no
2019-02-28T02:11:20 < Cracki> stuff-in-the-loop is a big deal in industry, at least those companies that aren't behind the times
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2019-02-28T03:25:45 < englishman> https://youtu.be/Oe_zzTQFV3o?t=856
2019-02-28T03:25:52 < englishman> chernobyl being used to make stm32
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2019-02-28T03:41:43 < aandrew> nice. how'd you come across that
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2019-02-28T03:51:00 < englishman> was an open tab, probably a related Video I clicked on
2019-02-28T03:52:30 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-28T04:24:59 < englishman> related: 5-10% of all electricity generated in the USA between 1943-1944 was used to enrich uranium
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2019-02-28T06:10:43 < dongs> how the fuck do i make assembly variant in altidumb, i have a main board with some blocks that I want to make NC
2019-02-28T06:10:53 < dongs> so when I do bom/xy i can output one or another
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2019-02-28T06:16:54 < dongs> got it
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2019-02-28T06:43:51 < aandrew> so... what should I buy from LCSC
2019-02-28T06:43:59 < dongs> everything
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2019-02-28T07:41:28 < R2COM> yo
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2019-02-28T08:28:11 < tjq> LCSC stm32?
2019-02-28T08:33:09 < dongs> only if youre ok wiht getting relabeled clonez
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2019-02-28T08:40:07 < tjq> Lol clones are best
2019-02-28T08:46:23 < qyx> is it ok to hotair bga25 1.0mm?
2019-02-28T08:49:20 < aandrew> so what is the point of having a dual cortex-a beside an m4
2019-02-28T08:50:20 < qyx> to have lunix & realtime?
2019-02-28T08:50:39 < aandrew> you still need to wire up ddr3 
2019-02-28T08:50:48 < aandrew> I don't know. seems goofy 
2019-02-28T08:51:09 < qyx> which one?
2019-02-28T08:51:20 < aandrew> mp1
2019-02-28T09:05:16 < dongs> lunix turds never make sense
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2019-02-28T09:19:03 < qyx> reading toshiba nand flash datasheet
2019-02-28T09:19:27 < qyx> it is full of shit like "may fail", "do not necessarily mean", "should", "may change"
2019-02-28T09:19:50 < qyx> "the block may become usable again"
2019-02-28T09:20:00 < qyx> "read may disturb data"
2019-02-28T09:20:56 < qyx> seems to me nand is a voodoo
2019-02-28T09:21:14 < qyx> it sometimes works as expected
2019-02-28T09:22:45 < qyx> uh and the pdf has "Tentative" as its name
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2019-02-28T10:17:57 < tjq> any nigger can make it niggerlicious
2019-02-28T10:34:12 < Steffanx> Try ##electronics tjq
2019-02-28T10:35:15 < tjq> in'nt that a little honey?
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2019-02-28T13:42:17 < jadew> are people playing on lichess super good or are they using programs?
2019-02-28T13:42:56 < jadew> I just played with someone and he seemed to have had several moves figured out
2019-02-28T13:43:01 < jadew> several moves ahead
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2019-02-28T13:52:08 < jpa-> what's the difference between UADD8 and SADD8 instructions? isn't wrapping unsigned/signed add the same operation?
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2019-02-28T14:14:48 < zyp> jpa-, register output is, but flags are not
2019-02-28T14:16:14 < zyp> SADD8: It sets a GE flag to 1 to indicate that the corresponding result is greater than or equal to zero.
2019-02-28T14:16:27 < zyp> UADD8: It sets a GE flag to 1 to indicate that the corresponding result overflowed, generating a carry.
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2019-02-28T14:32:22 < Cracki> so Greater-or-Equal sometimes means Overflow/Carry...
2019-02-28T14:33:24 < Cracki> nvm
2019-02-28T14:34:44 < dongs> the hell is lichess
2019-02-28T14:44:41 < Cracki> sounds like a game about zombies
2019-02-28T14:44:53 < Cracki> oh, li-chess
2019-02-28T14:45:12 < Cracki> yeh I'm sure people run their chess programs on that
2019-02-28T14:48:48 < jpa-> zyp: ah
2019-02-28T14:55:13 < jpa-> i never use the flags anyway because it gets annoying with C intrinsics
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2019-02-28T15:37:24 < kakimir> babbys first bitbanger
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2019-02-28T15:46:47 < justMaku> hey there, i'm fairly new to the embedded things (ios developer professionaly, but inherited a embedded project that i have to basically do from scratch), the task at hand is to poll the adc data periodically and save it into an array
2019-02-28T15:48:12 < justMaku> i got 16 adc samples per reading, i have 16 "sensors" connected through gpio where I enable a given port, do the adc read, disable port, rinse and repeat
2019-02-28T15:49:59 < kakimir> hello
2019-02-28T15:50:01 < justMaku> here's a code excerpt of the adc+gpio setup and main loop https://hastebin.com/tuhiruhosu.c
2019-02-28T15:51:11 < kakimir> do you have a question?
2019-02-28T15:51:12 < justMaku> the issue is that for some reason first two sensors take almost 1/3 of the time of the adc_read when compared to the rest
2019-02-28T15:51:15 < justMaku> https://i.imgur.com/ovAMFYr.png
2019-02-28T15:51:38 < justMaku> now, the question is: do I even do this thing correctly? I want an uniform sample time
2019-02-28T15:52:02 < justMaku> I assume a timer is a solution to this problem, but i'm not even sure what exactly to look for
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2019-02-28T15:53:57 < justMaku> but this could be also an issue with adc configuration, most of the parameters of the adc init struct sound like a black magic incantation to me
2019-02-28T15:54:25 < justMaku> so i'm looking for tips on how to do it properly or validation of my current solution
2019-02-28T15:54:45 < fenugrec> justMaku, read the RM ?
2019-02-28T15:55:01 < justMaku> RM?
2019-02-28T15:55:28 < kakimir> reference manual
2019-02-28T15:56:32 < justMaku> well, i tried, but it's a little bit above my level to understand everything
2019-02-28T15:56:44 < zyp> justMaku, it's a bit unclear to me what you're actually doing
2019-02-28T15:56:50 < zyp> with the gpio stuff and all
2019-02-28T15:57:02 < zyp> are you controlling an external mux or something?
2019-02-28T15:57:38 < justMaku> zyp: kinda, i have a sensor board with 16 enable lines, one output line, resistors in between
2019-02-28T15:58:19 < justMaku> so i enabling PA0 puts the signal through sensor 0, which i then read with adc
2019-02-28T16:00:28 < zyp> hmm
2019-02-28T16:00:41 < zyp> you probably don't want to have it run in continous conversion mode
2019-02-28T16:01:01 < zyp> not that I see how that would cause that output
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2019-02-28T16:01:49 < zyp> when you're controlling muxing manually, you need to make sure conversion doesn't start before the mux is set and settled
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2019-02-28T16:10:20 < justMaku> thanks zyp
2019-02-28T16:10:26 < justMaku> ill look into that
2019-02-28T16:10:52 < justMaku> i'm also thinking that PA0 and PA1 might have some other function that overrides me switching those pins
2019-02-28T16:11:14 < justMaku> chip is STM32F038x6 btw
2019-02-28T16:13:58 < Thorn> https://www.st.com/resource/en/datasheet/stm32f038c6.pdf page 27
2019-02-28T16:14:14 < Thorn> tldr: they don't
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2019-02-28T16:30:08 < justMaku> Thorn: yeah, saw that, but like i said, total begineer, better ask than to be sorry
2019-02-28T16:30:31 < justMaku> anyway, zyp, adding a 200 cycles delay between the pin setting and adc_read seems to fix the issue.
2019-02-28T16:30:56 < justMaku> since this is a prototype it will have to do until we get a proper embedded engineer onboard
2019-02-28T16:32:11 < justMaku> now to get that to that over i2c to the master nrf controller
2019-02-28T16:32:14 < justMaku> that will be fun.
2019-02-28T16:39:23 < qyx> sounds like btle
2019-02-28T16:39:41 < qyx> bt is no fun
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2019-02-28T17:08:54 < aandrew> PA0 has special modes depending on the family
2019-02-28T17:10:23 < qyx> yeah, wakeup/tamper, but otherwise it can be a regular analog in
2019-02-28T17:10:58 < qyx> I usually use PA0-n foir ADC
2019-02-28T17:18:25 < justMaku> i went with this setup, so i can use the bitshiffting to address the output pins easily
2019-02-28T17:18:52 < justMaku> i wanted to use all 16 pins on port A, but run into problems so I had to split it two
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2019-02-28T17:26:10 < Thorn> pa13/pa14 is swd
2019-02-28T17:27:32 < justMaku> yup, that's the problem :D
2019-02-28T17:36:22 < rajkosto> yeah you can DMA into a gpio register to do parallel outputs
2019-02-28T17:57:36 < aandrew> you can also DMA to the bitbanding addresses to do tat for single pins
2019-02-28T17:57:44 < aandrew> never had to do it but that's actually pretty damn handy if it's needed
2019-02-28T17:58:26 < aandrew> this is one area that cypress did right with their PSoC family... any pin, any (digital) function, and almost any analog function
2019-02-28T18:12:00 < aandrew> Haohmaru: nice, what's it do
2019-02-28T18:13:48 < rajkosto> for what tho
2019-02-28T18:26:45 < qyx> oh no wiznet no wow
2019-02-28T18:27:03 < qyx> and stm32 neither
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2019-02-28T18:33:20 < englishman> gpio to ethernet adapter
2019-02-28T18:33:24 < englishman> why not use esp32
2019-02-28T18:36:35 < englishman> more reliable than his irc
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2019-02-28T19:46:43 < rajkosto> is there a way to tell stlink to always start in swd mode ? it needs me to fail debug once then it reenumerates and next debug works
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2019-02-28T19:59:40 < srk> reflash it with blackmagic
2019-02-28T20:00:06 < englishman> rajkosto: https://www.worksonmymachine.pro/
2019-02-28T20:00:24 < rajkosto> i lose VCP with blackmagic
2019-02-28T20:00:31 < englishman> are you using inferior opensores tools or something
2019-02-28T20:00:46 < rajkosto> openocd first time triggers it into reenumerating
2019-02-28T20:00:52 < rajkosto> then next time it works
2019-02-28T20:03:41 < qyx> idk, worksforme
2019-02-28T20:03:55 < qyx> if swd is selected, it does swd 
2019-02-28T20:05:16 < rajkosto> yes
2019-02-28T20:05:17 < rajkosto> it does
2019-02-28T20:05:29 < rajkosto> someone with st-link v2.1
2019-02-28T20:05:38 < rajkosto> the first time you plug it in, does VCP show up immediately ?
2019-02-28T20:05:44 < rajkosto> or does it wait for you to "activate" it by starting a debugging session
2019-02-28T20:06:03 < rajkosto> maybe i just need a different driver that activates it immediately
2019-02-28T20:07:04 < rajkosto> yeah mine swaps from 3748 pid to 374B pid once activated
2019-02-28T20:07:06 < qyx> mhm I am hitting similar problem sometimes
2019-02-28T20:07:11 < qyx> yes it is 2.1
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2019-02-28T20:07:27 < qyx> yes, the acm device shows immediately
2019-02-28T20:07:33 < rajkosto> swaps from STM32 Stlink to ST-Link Debug
2019-02-28T20:07:49 < qyx> but it is not possible to connect to it with a serial terminal
2019-02-28T20:08:01 < qyx> it responds with device or resoiurce busy
2019-02-28T20:08:13 < qyx> it does not depend if you run openocd or not
2019-02-28T20:08:31 < qyx> it becomes usable in ~~ 15 seconds
2019-02-28T20:09:11 < qyx> I don't remember if it reenumerates or what
2019-02-28T20:09:50 < rajkosto> maybe i shouild flash the firware that doenst have mass storage support
2019-02-28T20:09:54 < rajkosto> doint use that anyway
2019-02-28T20:10:22 < qyx> ie after plugging in,openocd flashing works immediately while vcp don't
2019-02-28T20:11:33 < antto> englishman muh IRC is gud, i clicked "disconnect" fyi
2019-02-28T20:27:32 < Steffanx> Can you do it again antto? 😘
2019-02-28T20:27:46 < antto> yes
2019-02-28T20:27:51 < antto> tomorrow
2019-02-28T20:27:53 < Steffanx> Now?
2019-02-28T20:28:00 < antto> it won't work
2019-02-28T20:28:20 < antto> my irc body will remain
2019-02-28T20:28:56 < antto> wut, do you not believe me?
2019-02-28T20:29:22 < Steffanx> So will your soul. In our(read: my) heart.
2019-02-28T20:29:33 < antto> :/
2019-02-28T20:34:19 -!- massi_ [~massi@host138-130-static.62-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
2019-02-28T20:39:17 < mawk> 😘
2019-02-28T20:39:49 < mawk> https://pix.watch/BWrLRg/XVltFb.png
2019-02-28T20:40:33 < BrainDamage> noto-fonts-emoji and you'll get svg fonts for colours
2019-02-28T20:40:47 < mawk> ah
2019-02-28T20:40:52 < mawk> but I'll keep my primary font ?
2019-02-28T20:40:59 < antto> i've been trying to get rid of these "noto" fonts
2019-02-28T20:41:11 < BrainDamage> sure, fontconfig automatically picks up fonts as fallback for specific glyphs
2019-02-28T20:41:12 < mawk> like I'll use noto thingie only for characters in the emoji unicode range
2019-02-28T20:41:15 < mawk> nice
2019-02-28T20:41:59 < BrainDamage> unlike android, since those are rendered by a sane font engine they'll have the right aspect ratios and sizes
2019-02-28T20:42:07 < BrainDamage> so no giant oversized emojiball
2019-02-28T20:43:25 < antto> how is "emoji" in the dongsish dialect?
2019-02-28T20:44:07 < antto> hm, i think i know
2019-02-28T20:44:08 < mawk> emojuice
2019-02-28T20:44:26 < antto> nah, i was thinking "gaymoji"
2019-02-28T20:45:52 < antto> this channel needs to have a translator bot, which accepts queries
2019-02-28T20:47:24 < antto> ENDOgsifier and DEdongsifieR (ENDODER)
2019-02-28T20:49:11 < BrainDamage> mawk: you should only need to restart the program btw
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2019-02-28T20:51:39 < Steffanx> An deanttofier (or dehaosomethingifier) would be cool too
2019-02-28T20:53:00 < Steffanx> *A
2019-02-28T20:53:38 < mawk> nice
2019-02-28T20:53:50 < mawk> thanks BrainDamage 
2019-02-28T20:54:06 < antto> but i thought i'm easy to understand
2019-02-28T20:55:03 < antto> okay, sometimes i say "microsh*t" and "crApple" but i think it's obvious ;P~
2019-02-28T20:55:49 < antto> oh, and "facepuke", "schmwitt0r"
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2019-02-28T21:05:14 < aandrew> antto> ENDOgsifier and DEdongsifieR (ENDODER)
2019-02-28T21:05:18 < aandrew> I think you mean an endonger
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2019-02-28T21:13:42 < mawk> I was about to get my new phone
2019-02-28T21:13:51 < mawk> then I saw "returned to sender" on the tracking log
2019-02-28T21:13:55 < mawk> amazon put the wrong address
2019-02-28T21:14:03 < mawk> they put "Code 1175, Bâtiment du fond, interp, 75011 Paris"
2019-02-28T21:14:14 < mawk> you don't have to be a french expert to notice this is not a correct postal address
2019-02-28T21:14:38 < mawk> nobody is named "Code 1175", it's obviously the code to the door
2019-02-28T21:15:09 < mawk> then I called the support from the sender, I was greeted with a low quality pre-recorded message in german
2019-02-28T21:15:17 < aandrew> heh
2019-02-28T21:15:24 < aandrew> it sucks but it's also kind of funny
2019-02-28T21:15:40 < mawk> :(
2019-02-28T21:15:53 < aandrew> which phone are you getting?
2019-02-28T21:15:58 < mawk> google pixel xl
2019-02-28T21:16:05 < mawk> it's not very new, but it's still maintained
2019-02-28T21:17:50 < aandrew> nice
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2019-02-28T21:30:47 < bitmask> herro
2019-02-28T21:38:56 < bitmask> if I want to make a temporary bench psu with my old 3d printer power supply, is there anything cheap I can do to clean up the output? Would it just depend what buck I choose to vary the output?
2019-02-28T21:39:43 < bitmask> is it worth post regging it?
2019-02-28T21:41:24 < rajkosto> just hook up any input to one of those cheap bench power supplies on aliexpress ?
2019-02-28T21:42:21 < bitmask> how cheap?
2019-02-28T21:42:28 < rajkosto> 30$
2019-02-28T21:42:29 < bitmask> I was trying to use what I had on hand
2019-02-28T21:42:31 < bitmask> oh
2019-02-28T21:42:32 < bitmask> hmm
2019-02-28T21:42:36 < bitmask> links? name?
2019-02-28T21:43:44 < rajkosto> its the one with the weird open back let me find it
2019-02-28T21:45:33 < rajkosto> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/High-quality-Display-DP50V5A-Constant-Voltage-current-Step-down-Programmable-DC-Power-module-buck-converter-voltmeter/32656651549.html these
2019-02-28T21:47:07 < bitmask> ahh ok, thats the one I was looking at because of EEVblog and then someone showed me eevblog testing it out futher and it caught fire haha
2019-02-28T21:47:15 < bitmask> but yea probably just a bad one he got
2019-02-28T21:48:13 < rajkosto> there's a buck boost version for 35$ in the details
2019-02-28T21:48:20 < rajkosto> has a fan 
2019-02-28T21:48:31 < rajkosto> but they are open which probably would short stuff out on your desk if stray wires happen ;)
2019-02-28T21:48:51 < mawk> put some tape around it, then it's not open anymore
2019-02-28T21:48:53 < bitmask> I would build or buy or 3d print a case for it
2019-02-28T21:49:28 < bitmask> probably the third
2019-02-28T21:49:45 < bitmask> I just want something to get me through until I get a job and can get something decent :/
2019-02-28T21:49:58 < bitmask> its annoying not having something quick to connect to 
2019-02-28T21:51:48 < rajkosto> the electronics on the 35$ one look fancy
2019-02-28T21:54:39 < rajkosto> the aluminum case makes it cost extra 20$ lol
2019-02-28T21:55:00 < bitmask> PETG is cheap :)
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2019-02-28T22:49:21 < rajkosto> how the FUCK do i swo with openocd
2019-02-28T22:51:42 < kakimir> you don't
2019-02-28T22:52:29 < kakimir> you may ask further clues from jpa- and PaulFertser 
2019-02-28T22:52:30 < rajkosto> youre supposed to do tpiu and then its available via rcc
2019-02-28T22:53:12 < rajkosto> but all the tutorials just use j-link
2019-02-28T22:53:53 < rajkosto> and since that is custom gdb it has swo on its own telnet port
2019-02-28T22:55:19 < kakimir> http://essentialscrap.com/tips/arm_trace/ jpa uses fx2
2019-02-28T22:55:40 < rajkosto> i dont want actual trace
2019-02-28T22:55:40 < rajkosto> just itm
2019-02-28T22:56:08 < kakimir> anyhow
2019-02-28T22:56:17 < kakimir> it's easiest with seperate adapter
2019-02-28T22:56:25 < kakimir> separate
2019-02-28T22:56:34 < kakimir> if you want to go open source tools way
2019-02-28T22:57:32 < kakimir> but I have not done any swo stuff for a while so
2019-02-28T22:59:25 < kakimir> the fuque.. youtube just removed favourites
2019-02-28T22:59:53 -!- Lux [~Luggi09@parabox.it-syndikat.org] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.4]
2019-02-28T23:00:15 < kakimir> my life is erased
2019-02-28T23:01:11 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: openocd captures swo with stlink or jlink and you can save it to file or a named fifo and parse with itmdump or other software.
2019-02-28T23:01:34 < PaulFertser> rajkosto: have you tken a look at the corresponding manual sections?
2019-02-28T23:01:48 < rajkosto> i want parsing and for it to show up in the debug console
2019-02-28T23:02:08 < rajkosto> apparently attolic truestudio has a parser as an eclipse plugin
2019-02-28T23:02:09 < Cracki> you have any idea how much data that is?
2019-02-28T23:02:25 < rajkosto> all others just use j-link stuff for it
2019-02-28T23:03:31 -!- Lux [~Luggi09@parabox.it-syndikat.org] has joined ##stm32
2019-02-28T23:04:11 < kakimir> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bFNJEukV2o musics
2019-02-28T23:04:26 < rajkosto> Cracki, max 2mbaud ?
2019-02-28T23:04:54 < Cracki> that /tips/arm_trace/ video uses 100 Mbaud for uart decoding
2019-02-28T23:05:07 < Cracki> so I guess he used a better LA than fx2
2019-02-28T23:05:15 < rajkosto> trace != itm
2019-02-28T23:05:18 < Cracki> of course you might not need that bw
2019-02-28T23:05:25 < Cracki> he picked itm
2019-02-28T23:05:33 < Cracki> pls watch it
2019-02-28T23:05:55 < Cracki> it's all "trace"
2019-02-28T23:06:07 < Cracki> etm is the high bw thing
2019-02-28T23:06:44 < rajkosto> you can get itm out of Swo with just a simple uart on the swo pin
2019-02-28T23:06:44 < Cracki> itm is instrumentation, i.e. function entry, jumps, or just enough to reconstruct control flow (piping out control decisions)
2019-02-28T23:06:52 < rajkosto> i mean itm_sendchar 
2019-02-28T23:06:53 < rajkosto> etc
2019-02-28T23:07:06 < Cracki> sure 1 megabit is plenty for many uses
2019-02-28T23:07:43 < zyp> and way too slow for others, it depends what you want to do
2019-02-28T23:09:04 < Cracki> that particular video didn't do instruction tracing but it emitted enough info to see active interrupt handlers
2019-02-28T23:09:14 < Cracki> (at 100 Mbit/s)
2019-02-28T23:09:43 < Cracki> just sell your grandma's organs and buy a jtrace :>
2019-02-28T23:09:58 < rajkosto> i dont. want. trace.
2019-02-28T23:10:28 < Cracki> i know i know you just want putchar for some low bw output
2019-02-28T23:10:34 < Cracki> *sendchar
2019-02-28T23:10:37 < zyp> the problem with parallel trace is that you then also need to get those signals out of the chip and off the board
2019-02-28T23:12:20 < zyp> so it has design costs as well as tool costs
2019-02-28T23:13:04 < zyp> swo in comparison is almost free
2019-02-28T23:13:34 < rajkosto> free 2mbaud uart with fifo
2019-02-28T23:13:37 < rajkosto> thank
2019-02-28T23:15:22 < rajkosto> guess im reflashing the stlink back into a j-link
2019-02-28T23:16:48 < kakimir> oh youtube didn't remove favs.. it just glitched between users
2019-02-28T23:16:54 < kakimir> I just took a look into future
2019-02-28T23:24:25 < Cracki> in the future you will watch what they want you to watch, when they want you to watch it
2019-02-28T23:24:37 < Cracki> it's called Demand on Video
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2019-02-28T23:26:14 < kakimir> it's called netflix
2019-02-28T23:27:21 < Cracki> I only know netflix from liberated copies
2019-02-28T23:29:01 < antto> it's called Crakimir
2019-02-28T23:38:54 < kakimir> crack kaki
2019-02-28T23:39:53 < rajkosto> tpiu totally works but i dont have it in a console window
2019-02-28T23:41:10 < kakimir> so can you get it in separate command line?
2019-02-28T23:41:14 < kakimir> sorry
2019-02-28T23:41:15 < kakimir> terminal
2019-02-28T23:41:24 < rajkosto> yeah i can cat the file openocd makes
2019-02-28T23:41:49 < rajkosto> after running it through itm decode whatever
2019-02-28T23:41:54 < kakimir> so you probs need a program that prints data of the file as it written
2019-02-28T23:42:14 < kakimir> then call it in your ide when debug session is started
2019-02-28T23:43:43 < kakimir> I mean define the session to call it and somehow
2019-02-28T23:49:14 -!- gsi__ is now known as gsi_
2019-02-28T23:53:16 < kakimir> oh
2019-02-28T23:53:19 < kakimir> tail -f
2019-02-28T23:53:30 < rajkosto> its encoded in itm
2019-02-28T23:54:04 < kakimir> yes
2019-02-28T23:54:11 < kakimir> you need something to decode it in fly
2019-02-28T23:54:31 -!- fenugrec [~fenugrec@24.105.71.66] has quit [Ping timeout: 259 seconds]
--- Log closed Fri Mar 01 00:00:11 2019